The Viall Files - E556 Ask Nick - My Boyfriend Scammed Me Out of $400

Episode Date: March 20, 2023

Welcome back to another episode of The Viall Files: Ask Nick Edition! We’re back to answer your burning questions about the world of dating and relationships. Before getting to our callers, we discuss friendship and how hard - but rewarding - it can be to find your people. We then get our latest Breakup Song of the Week submission. Our first caller has a friend with benefits that has a list of “girlfriend criteria.” We go through his list and find out just how ridiculous his expectations and requirements are. Our next caller has a crush on her co worker’s client, and isn’t sure how to shoot her shot without stepping on toes and making work awkward. Is her friend being an unknowing obstacle, or is she interested in her client, too? Our final caller’s boyfriend scammed her out of $400 and refuses to give it back. How has he continued to dodge her requests, and why are they still in a relationship? We get into all of the details.  “If you don’t take big swings in life, you won’t have great things either.”  Start your 7 Day Free Trial of Viall Files + here: https://www.viallfiles.supportingcast.com Please make sure to subscribe so you don’t miss an episode and as always send in your relationship questions to [e-mail] be a part of our Monday episodes.  Join us for our new LIVE show on Thursdays at 9PM ET/6PM PT on Amp, available in the Apple app store and https://www.onamp.com for Android listeners. To Order Nick’s Book Go To: https://www.viallfiles.com  If you would like to get some texting advice on Office Hours send an email to [e-mail] with “Texting Office Hours” in the subject line!  To advertise on the show, contact [e-mail] or visit https://www.advertisecast.com/TheViallFiles  THANK YOU TO OUR SPONSORS: BetterHelp - This episode is brought to you by BetterHelp. Give online therapy a try at https://www.betterhelp.com/VIALL and get on your way to being your best self. Rakuten - Cashback rates change daily. See Rakuten for details. Go to https://www.Rakuten.com NOW or download the Rakuten App today. Noom - Stop chasing health trends and build sustainable, healthy habits with Noom’s psychology-based approach. Sign up for your trial today at https://www.noom.com/VIALL Tushy - Go to https://www.hellotushy.com/VIALL and use promo code VIALL for 10% off your first order. Episode Socials: @viallfiles @nickviall @alison.vandam @liffordthebigreddog @dereklanerussell

you're crazy what's going on everybody welcome back to another episode of the vile files ask nick edition you said ass i said ass it doesn't Nick. Doesn't matter. It's fine. Amanda. She's with us. Allie and Derek as well. Welcome to our household. Aww.

I want to give us a little map. It makes me so emo in the best way when you say household. Because I'm like, we've been together a while and it is a household. We're a little fam. What's going on? What's new? Well, Amanda and I were just discussing St. Paddy's Day. So we'll start with St. Patrick's Day, yeah, which is this Friday, which will have been in the past once you're listening to this.

And Amanda said- I said, some holidays are for fucking. Yeah. And the St. Paddy's Day is top three. So basically anyone that has a lot of alcohol. No. Once that's centralized on going out, like out like you know what i mean it's less making bad decisions fourth of july yeah where there's a little bit of like raucous energy i

would say halloween top fucking holiday halloween hottest holiday by saint patrick's day then fourth of july or fourth of july and saint patrick's day fourth of july it's more universal not everyone like if you're from the midwest like for the st patrick's day out in boston oh my god actually it's better in milwaukee and chicago than boston okay actually no actually yeah i've been to the chicago st patrick's day and i've been to the boston one i've been to milwaukee one milwaukee one's nuts okay i believe you i haven't been to the boston one but i have heard from people like i because i think boston gets too much clout for being Boston and having the Celtics and obviously a huge Irish community. But I think the Chicago and the Milwaukee ones, pretty top notch.

This is all to say that the Los Angeles one, dog shit. Subpar. Oh my. Not even subpar. Guys, I am telling you, we are going to an Irish pub at 4 p.m. on Friday and we're all going to have a great time. We have us in Pasadena. going to an Irish pub at 4 p.m. on Friday and we're all going to have a great time. We have us in Pasadena. And I don't know if you're ready

because I do feel like St. Patrick's Day is like the full moon for Boston werewolfness where like I feel like people see a side of me. And Griffins of Kinsdale is ready for you. They do not need to see. Let it out. Everyone grows a Red Sox hat. Yeah. Okay. Wait. Derek has celebrated St. Patrick's Day in Boston. Yeah. Because he went to school there.

What are your review? I'm half Irish and I was intimidated. Are the bars open at 6 a.m. with full of drunk people? Well, that's a normal. That's a fucking Patriots game. I went clubbing on St. Patrick's Day in Chicago. Like you walked out at noon and it felt like it should have been the middle of the night. Oh, St. Patrick's Day.

It can be a great holiday if you're in the right city. Amen. I ended up in a baseball game not knowing it was going on. Our friend group tried to cut through a baseball field to save time because we were drunk on St. Patrick's Day. We did not realize until we were halfway in it that the game was going on. Have you fucked on any of those three holidays? Oh my God. I, on one St. Patrick's Day.

Sorry. I'm like, this should not. Say more. No, no, no. Say more. Let's just um how many leprechauns no it was that no it was like there's just dicks everywhere okay i'm just like i'm a little red one okay you know what i'm sorry to future me i am sorry to the version i'm sorry to my campaign manager if i am ever running for office and this story is out there in the world i will never run for office don't worry i you're well past that yeah gosh i could not be rude i'm well i'm just saying you know please continue i'm the campaign manager you

would be a great campaign manager yeah i would also you would be a great leader my voice broke because i meant it so much i would like you to be governor all right anyways continue my boyfriend was playing like a show at this like record store there was a bathroom in the back let's just say someone entered the bathroom and i bumped my head on his chin yeah on a more wholesome note i threw a porum party which is like a jewish holiday that celebrated like halloween is that a fucking holiday is that a fucking holiday i mean well yom kippur or any of the jewish holidays is the opposite of a fucking holiday yom kippur is like you fucked up think about that okay in silence a tone and then having sex in a confessional

yeah it's like it's like a very reflective serious day yeah but porum is like if for adult i feel like it's a very i keep thinking you're saying porn porum porum porum you really don't want to enunciate that but i will say porum is like it's a lot of times it's celebrated like big family like big family carnival vibes but i threw a party that was like all my friends costumes. The theme. OK, so the theme was kind of, if I do say so myself, a little bit epic because it was. So the whole story of Forum is that kind of honestly, The Bachelor, where there was a king looking for a wife. One of the women, Jewish, did not tell him. Meanwhile, different person trying to kill Jews. She secretly wins the king's heart and then is like, surprise, I'm Jewish.

Can you not kill everyone? And he's like okay and I butchered that and so shout out to anybody who knows more about Boram than me who could do a much better job that is my brief summation and so you do it's very fun like you do a whole like play and whatnot at the party which my improv friends fucking ate up but the theme was dress up as a character in disguise or like their alter ego so like prison mike from the office or like 21 jump street like them as high schoolers so it's kind of meta and people just came up yeah people came up with some good stuff and i was um val who is abby's alter ego from broad city when she'sout drunk, she goes to a speakeasies and becomes this jazz cat lady.

That's so fun. You also dressed up this weekend. I did. Murder mystery. It was murder mystery party. And it was honestly the best. My cohort helped with all the food and drink. The guy whose house we used is also a great planner.

We went all out. Everyone went all out. Everyone went all out. Everyone had accents. And we like ended the night like I jumped in the pool in my full dress. Like we ended with like a dance party. We were like chugging straight out of vodka bottles. Like I tried to do a lift with my friend Diego and we fell on the floor. When you say a lift.

Did you correctly identify the murderer? Yes. Oh. Thank God. But it was just like one of those moments where i was just so grateful and like i've just been looking back at the photos of it and we moved here in the pandemic and like my first like few months out here were so hard my first year and a half was so freaking hard because i didn't have any friends there didn't have any way to meet people like i remember my mom like i

was saw i've been sobbing to her so many times within my first, like, three months out here that she was like, just come home and you'll try it again another year. Like, it was so bad. And I didn't have any friends. And it took me a full year and a half to meet this friend group. And I just feel like that should be talked about more because I think it's like it takes a long time to, like, put roots down. Especially in L.A. Yeah. Or just any city.

But, yeah, especially in L.A. I feel like in L.A. because there's, like, people are always Especially in LA. Yeah. Or just any city, but yeah, especially in LA. I feel like in LA because there's like people are always working on projects and gigs, there's this like illusion of like closeness because I've had some

of the best conversations at parties here like become such like quote what feels like fast friends where like you have this amazing connective night, but then like because everyone is so busy

and the city is so spread out, like it just feels like it's really hard to actually follow through and put in the work that it takes to have a relationship and the fact that it's like you're selling yourself constantly means that it can be really hard to like admit loneliness yeah totally and it's just like finding people because there's so many like empty people out here it feels like where i'm like

we're like networking this doesn't feel like i'm like i have a deep rooted connection with you and like i want to like just be chilling with you in and like at the very I have a deep rooted connection with you and like I want to like just be chilling with you in and like at the very end of a night or an early morning or like sleep on your couch like I want that level of closest and I feel like it's really hard to find totally yeah it's like the friends who are like close enough to like check on you proactively like I have tons of friends in LA who I love and who I like see regularly and it's always so fun and I feel close to them then but like they don't like reach out and check on me in that way and it sounds like and i feel like you go to bat for your friends like you really don't do friendships by half and so i think it's really

hard when you don't feel that like i don't know it's like also we start with our like best friends from when we're younger like i will always have my first best friend's phone number memorized because it is like she is that person to me okay i was thinking about that because i'm like i'm convinced at some point i'm gonna end up in jail and do they let you look at your contact book because i don't know my best friend's phone number and who am i supposed to call what numbers do you know what are the options like of the numbers you have memorized like my parents my sister like childhood friends but everyone else i've met in like the texting era i don't know anyone's number but do they let you check the contact book on your phone so you can make your one phone call?

This keeps me up at night. Probably. That's a great question. Who am I going to call? I know, I don't, yeah, I don't even know my parents' cell number. What? What? What about your home phone as a kid?

I don't know Natalie's cell number. Yeah, my home phone number as a kid. You should memorize Natalie's. Just for safety, if you end up in jail. I think everyone should get a new phone number every six months oh that's aggressive phone numbers are meaningless that's not true it's so easy to change your number but the area code that gives a shit but then you're gonna have people texting the wrong number you know how many times you give out your number to you write down your number in an age where, you know,

identity theft and things like that, or anyone has access to your number. I just think like all these scenarios that you guys are bringing up with, like they're just never going to happen. And. That's not, that's not true. I will go to jail. My phone's dead. So remember one, have one, like the one number you need when you ever go to mythical jail. What if it's yours?

Fine. Would you come get me? Memorize that number. And if I get a new number, you have you ever go to mythical jail, whatever. What if it's yours? Fine. Would you come get me? Memorize that number. And if I get a new number, you have a new number to memorize. But like we should all, in an age where it's so easy to get a new number and you're, so many people who don't need your number have your number. You have written down your number so many times of people who just don't need it anymore. And you should do like a hard reset every six to 12 months.

And it's great because that's a great way of like reevaluating who are important people in your life. And so every time you get a new number, you send out that mass tax of like, hey, got a new number, save this number. And it's a great way to like, you know what? You know what? Janice doesn't need my number. I can't text your ex happy birthday if they change their number. Exactly. I just think I think it's a great exercise every every year or every two years at least or like some period people nostalgically hang on to their number because they think it like I never want to get rid of it.

I never want to. Or like it has like three zeros in it or something. I don't know what it is, but who gives a shit? Okay. So I will say the area code thing is because like I am so proud to be like a Bostonian from Boston proper who has a 617 area code. And it's a really fun conversation starter. You know, when you get like added to a group chat for like intramural soccer and you have no one's number saved and it's like a sea of things. And you're like, oh shit.

Is that from Kalamazoo, Michigan? Like, I feel like that's so i feel like area code needs to stay that would be my fine get a new number with the same area code i also just like the like occasional like hey this is so random but this made me think of you like i had our sorority sister who i haven't spoken to in years send me a tiktok the other day because she said it reminded give her your new number but i wouldn't get i wouldn't naturally like text lauren out of the blue and say. She can DM you. She can Facebook message you.

If she really needs to get a hold of you, she will. To each their own, Nicholas. Pop off in the comments if you disagree. Drag him to hell. Yeah. Well, to each their own. Speaking of today, March Madness Love Song Edition is live. We know. Thank you.

There's the hype. We know we'll get to our breakup song of the week in just a moment. But we know we talk a lot about a lot of sad songs, about a lot of songs about things that didn't work out. So this is your chance to have your opinions stated and count about the love song. So it's going to be on our Instagram story, Vile Files. There will be polls. You can just vote for your favorite one. There will be a bracket so you can keep up with it.

Go to bat, tell your friends to vote and we will crown a love song champion. Amazing. Love that. Well, we have a great week lined up for you all. We have some great colors to get to. Don't forget vile files plus is now available.

We have a brand new update episode available to y'all, which includes that amazing call from the Raven episode when her friend was cheating on her boyfriend and they're all going to take a trip together. So a great update there with more. In addition to that, we have another episode of Better Date Than Never live at 9 p.m. Eastern this Thursday. If you can't listen to it live, all of those episodes are available behind Vile Files Plus as well. We also have some great rom-com recaps. We have pop culture roundups. We are going to be getting into breaking down Vanderpump from season one. You get a free trial,

a seven-day free trial. So just go to vilefiles.com and there's a subscribe to Vile Files Plus button right there on the homepage. There's also a tab for Vile Files Plus as well. Rachel Bilson joins us this week who recently just talked about getting her first orgasm from sex at 38 years old. I saw that. So maybe we'll talk about that. Mazel tov.

Mazel tov for Rachel. So that should be great. Looking forward to that. We have another, we got fantasy suites this week. So is Zach fucking? I don't know. He says he's not going to, but we have another uh we got fantasy suites this week so is zach fucking i don't know he says he's not going to but we shall see he's definitely going to be breaking up with someone and our breakup song of the week is comfort by julia jacklin uh the person who submitted this says i was listening to the second caller on the february 13th episode that's called my mom runs

my dating apps if you would like to search that. And I really related to her story. A few months ago, I initiated a break with my boyfriend, and this song really helped me through my feelings. The lyrics that stood out most to me were, you'll be okay. You'll be all right. You'll get well soon. Sleep through the night. You'll go outside. Enjoy the sun. Soon you'll feel fine to see everyone. He's going to thrive. He'll be just fine. Hurt for a while. Cured with time. Don't know how he's gonna thrive he'll be just fine hurt for a while cured with time don't know how he's doing but that's what you get you can't be the one to hold him when you were the one who left big boom boom boom we'll go check out that uh it's on spotify

yeah it's on spotify and it's a highlight on our instagram story for you to click, have an easy link to the playlist. This show is sponsored by BetterHelp. This episode is brought to you by BetterHelp. Hey, we all need a good therapist in our life. I just, I'm a big advocate of therapy. We talk about being our better selves all the time and we talk about getting in the gym and eating right. Well, take care of your mental health because if you're not,

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also go to vilefiles.com to procure that. Let's get to our callers. How's it going? Hi, I'm Courtney. I'm about to be 41. How are you? Good, Courtney. How can we help? Hi, I'm calling in today because a man I'm in a situation ship provided me list of criteria in order to be his girlfriend, but I have a problem with every single item on the list. Okay. All right. How long have you been in the situation ship? A little over two years. That's a long time. Yes. And lots of bumps in the road. Yeah. That's a long time. Yes.

And lots of bumps in the road. Yeah. Are you the hopeful person in this situation, Chip? Yeah, although hope is very quickly diminishing. But to be clear, you would have preferred it at some point to be a relationship? He's the reason why it's not a relationship, per se? Correct. Correct.

Correct. And we have this list. When did he send you this list so that was pretty quickly into our situation ship maybe two or three months okay and i don't know if you have some backstory there i've known him since high school you've known us since high school okay uh dated in high school you dated in high school okay cute uh and then when did you reconnect like you you're connected a few years ago or has he been in your life this whole time? A few years ago. I mean, over the years, which is 20 plus years now, we've had some texting, happy birthday,

Merry Christmas. How are you? We probably met two or three times over the 20 plus years. Gotcha. So there's been some slight communication. Have you been both single this whole time? Married, divorced, kids? What variables are we dealing with

in this situationship? So we've both never been married. We had the situationship where we're both single. Okay. But over the years, we have had previous monogamous boyfriend-girlfriend relationships with other people.

Okay, but no ex-husbands or wives and no kids. Okay, all right. And he sent you this. How did he send you this list? First in person, we talked about it and then basically I wanted to progress the situation ship

into more of a boyfriend-girlfriend monogamous relationship and he said in order to be his girlfriend, I have to meet all of those items on the list. into more of a boyfriend-girlfriend monogamous relationship. And he said in order to be his girlfriend, I have to meet all of those items on the list. And that's when he presented you the list. Which would be, in essence, me changing myself completely. Gotcha.

Well, let's just go through the list. Yeah. Yes. What a list it is. Number one. Here's a question. Can you give your significant other babies now it's not do you want children he's basically asking about your oven like yeah yeah it's like off the back

he's insulting oh yeah and i guess there's like a way better way to ask that question a million better ways this is him and this is how he talks and he thinks his SHIT doesn't stink and he thinks he walks on water. Okay. Well, let's just go through the list and then we'll ask the obvious questions. Will you be in the gym and see workout results on a consistent basis? Oh my, oh my God. Immediate no.

Immediate ick. We're only at two. There's nine. There's seven more. Oh no. There's seven more. All right. I'm just going to pile itick. We're only at two. There's nine. There's seven more. Oh, no. There's seven more. All right. I'm just going to pile it through.

I think they get worse. Yeah. Will you continue to allow other men outside of your family members to have easy access to you? What the fuck does that even mean? You're not allowed to communicate? I guess having male relations that are friends. The way in which he's asking this shit.

It's so degrading yeah like how about you just assume that the people you want to be in a relationship with want to be monogamous and then if not like just be like hey do you want to have a like what are your expectations in a relationship how about just go there oh like do you are you friends with any of your exes that's a that's a reasonable question. And then you could say yes or no. And if you say yes, you'd be like, well, you know, I'm a little uncomfortable with that. Can you explain that?

Like, tell me more. Anyway. Number four. Oh, boy. Do you have the discipline to not make yourself available to and seek attention from other men outside of your relationship i mean i'm confused wasn't that just covered in three has he been cheated on he says he hasn't but he has been the person people have cheated with well that's ironic he's been the person so he has helped facilitate a cheat several times to my, but he tells me he has never been cheated on.

Well, yeah, because he does it first. I mean, again, just like, do you want to number five? Number five.

Are you willing to invest in a hairstyle that's attractive to your significant other? Oh my God. Oh my God. Oh my God. Are you? Number six. Oh my God. Oh my God. Are you, number six, are you willing to do what's necessary to keep your significant other attracted to you? That is the most ominous thing I've ever heard.

So this whole list is various questions of, are you going to not fuck other men? And are you going to keep yourself hot for me? So far, that's all I've seen. And like, are you going to have my babies? And not talk to any men either. Yeah, like be in the gym constantly and do not talk to any other men. Number seven, will you cut off

unnecessary non-work-related communication with male co-workers? Don't you dare talk about your weekend with one of your male co-workers. Business only. Will you cut off unnecessary? Yeah, I mean, truly. No fantasy football leagues for you. Co-workers. Business only. Will you cut off unnecessary? Yeah. I mean, truly.

No fantasy football leagues for you. Someone's birthday in the office. Too bad. Will you cut off inappropriate interactions with male co-workers? Okay, so he was cheated on by a girl who fucked her co-worker. Yeah. I think what we're getting from these questions. Or he fucked a co-worker who had a boyfriend.

Uh-huh. Or he fucked a coworker who had a boyfriend. Uh-huh. Do you think it's okay to build slash strengthen bonds or connect with males outside of a family? Well, in a relationship. What? That was number nine. Noom.

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hellotushy.com forward slash V-I-A-L-L and use promo code V-I-A-L-L for 10% off your first order. That's hellotushy.com forward slash V-i-a-l-l to stop wiping and start washing okay why do you want to date this guy you were clear that you you were offended by this list he provided this list to you a while back i mean does it sound does it sound worse when you hear me reading it i mean like i know you are offended by it, but like, what the fuck? No. So everything about it is offensive. I mean, I definitely have a disconnect between my heart and my head. I feel like I'm very level headed, but past relationships, I've definitely been in verbally, mentally, physically abusive relationships.

And for some reason, these are the breadcrumbs, him included, that I connect with. And I know it's crazy and it's a weakness but for some crazy are you in therapy yes you are okay do you for years yeah do you like your therapist i do if you talk to your if you talk to your therapist about this list yes what does your therapist have to say i mean she outwardly doesn't give her straight opinion i mean obviously i know her opinion based off a comment but it's me trying to navigate my life and my relationships and building up the strength and not being afraid to move on and be alone um so a lot of building

and working on myself do you feel not alone with him? So like I said, previous relationships have been any little breadcrumb that they give me. I am for it because I'd rather be with the breadcrumb that he allows me than be alone. There's a reason I don't know why loneliness is really scary to me and given my age, never married, no children. I definitely feel like there's something wrong with me. So I think they kind of go hand in hand and having someone to text every day and do things with. Yeah. Well, I mean, there's things wrong with all of us, whatever. We all are flawed. But, and I just met you, but the only thing that I would love for you to fix about yourself is need for these microscopic breadcrumbs, as you describe, from anyone.

I mean, there's millions of dudes and guys out there who would want to have your time and attention. attention but you're just you're just so scared to walk away from these situations for fear of this what loneliness that you're you know so it's like your problem is feeding into your fear you're not giving yourself a chance because also like i think what you're describing with like of like kind of feeling like self-esteem is something that your wish was like higher at this point in time like I relate to that it's so it's such a nightmare to deal with and I think it's really hard when you know that this list is bullshit and you know that this is like a shitty fucking thing to write up and send someone and so it's not only like being on the receiving end of that but then I think sometimes

there can be this added layer of guilt of like I know that I'm better than this and yet I'm not and I feel like you know I think there can be this conflict where it's not even like you're like fuck it I'm I'm in anyway like there's this like you might be in but you have all of these like other feelings and it probably just like creates this concoction of like things that make it really hard for you to trust yourself I don't know why but I owe in my professional career as well as my personal, I always want to know the why behind things. And I don't understand this list, how he thinks it's attainable. He says he had a girl that was checked every single box on this list.

And I just, if I block him, if I tell him goodbye, I'll be like, okay, bye. And I know that's ideal. But I don't know. I guess I want some sort of fight. When he said he had a girl who checked every box, first of all, where the fuck is she? Right. Second of all, it's not much of a list.

It's will you promise to look hot as I see it and how I think whatever I think hot is and and will you never like will you not speak to other dudes anyone can say sure to that like what like fine you like what is that everyone's gonna claim on some level to be okay like to to do that i mean quite honestly all he's really describing is someone who invests in themselves and like wants to be faithful it's how he answers the question and it's it's ironic because he's making such demands and based on everything we've heard from you like what's he bringing to the table like i'm like this doesn't even feel like an equal there's nothing wrong with wanting your partner to like take care of

themselves and be faithful right there's nothing wrong he wants someone in the gym six days a week you know have the perfect hips. He's very primitive. He also, like, thinks you're stupid because he has to answer the same question five times. It's like, I fucking get it. You don't want me talking to dudes. You know, like, I get it. You want me to, like, do whatever you want that looks hot. Like, he wants to own you.

Like, he doesn't see you as a person. He sees you as property. No, it's definitely very controlling. like he wants to own you like he doesn't see you as a person he sees you as properly and you know and being in it for so long i mean i start to believe some of it which is actually sickening you know these answers you know so it's like how do we get you to get to that next step you know how do we how do we get you to you know get that confidence to walk away? Yeah, be a quote-unquote, not even alone, without him. We don't have to get into the details, but it sounds like you've

experienced some kind of trauma and it sounds like you've had some tough experiences as a kid. Have you worked through that in therapy? I mean, I definitely wouldn't say I'm 100% over it, but it's definitely been a work in progress over the years. Have you addressed some of those things from your past with your therapist? Yes. So you have, okay. And sometimes we feel that maybe I am very full of feelings and my family isn't that type of family that expresses emotions. Everything's

very surface. Sure. And sometimes we both think that I was, the stork dropped me off at the wrong door. And so just having relationships with my family members have been, you know, I want more, but it's just not what my family provides for me. Yeah. It's not.

It sucks. Yeah. I'm sorry. Yeah. We can find connections in other ways you know we can find healthy connections with other people you know it's a bummer when we don't have the family family dynamic that we kind of wish for ourselves but there are other ways of doing it but what i'm sensing or what i'm hearing from you is sounds like if you experience a fair amount of trauma from your past.

And that trauma triggers you in various ways. Almost as a kid, you were accepting crumbs because that's all you were fed. And as a kid, you don't have the ability to get your own food, so to speak. So you're literally, okay, you get fed crumbs, you eat crumbs. And you learn how to survive off crumbs. And now as an adult, you haven't figured out a way to break that pattern. You haven't figured out a way that when you do get triggered to recognize yourself being triggered. I've learned this in therapy, but it's like you're your 10-year-old self or your 15-year-old self around this guy. That's the why you can read this list and consciously know how insane it is but like when you're around him it doesn't connect

with you that's why you can hang out with him that's why you can accept the crumbs and it's why the crumbs can feel so good because you become you your brain turns goes in this childlike state when you're around him because it's probably triggering because it's probably connecting from things from your past and that's all you know that's a lot of us are constantly just dealing with various types of trauma that we've had from our past and and if we don't learn the tools to deal with us being triggered we just respond to it how we would as a child. I'm looking up a question. There's a type of therapy I want you to look into. What I'm concerned about is you. And I want you to figure out a way to, in a healthy way, figure out how you can deal

with being triggered and then process in a way that you don't go to 12 year old you or 15 year old you or whatever it is. And so you start having the emotional kind of bandwidth to enforce some of these boundaries and stand up for yourself and actively in that moment, allowing him to be like, this is not acceptable. Like I don't deserve this. And these crumbs aren't good enough for me because I am an adult now and I can, I can get my own, I don't need to. And these crumbs aren't good enough for me because I am an adult now and I can, I can get my own, I don't need to survive off of crumbs. I can control who comes in and out of my life. Just like an adult can go to the grocery store, you can order your own food and you can make your own food. As a kid, you couldn't do that. You know, if we're using the food metaphor,

you know, like literally as a kid, if your parents are saying, well, this is all we have to eat. Okay. I guess I don't, I don't know how to make a sandwich. I certainly can't afford it. And so you, you figure you adapt and you survive, but as an adult, you can go and make your own food. And when you aren't given love and affection as a kid, you learn how to survive off of that and those crumbs. But as an adult, you need to learn that you can recognize that you can, you can go get food on your own. You can seek out healthier relationships. You can say no to unhealthy relationships.

And you can work through and live through periods of, quote unquote, being alone or loneliness and put yourself out there and invest in people who do have the kind of these healthy characteristics. Because I think there's a part of your brain that has become addicted to the collecting these crumbs and hoping that one day these crumbs can turn into something more. And I don't have the answers of how I don't, I don't,

I'm not well equipped to like give you the tools. And I think it's something you want to work through therapy. Do you know how, you know, if your therapist is helping? Well, that was my next question to you. Well, listen, how long have you been seeing this therapist years i don't know years

maybe i don't know like listen there's maybe a new therapist and i'm not trying to talk forget a new one yeah they don't that happens all the time i mean it's just like you should be getting results like a therapist isn't just someone to like talk to. Or like go through the motions with. And listen, maybe they're just not working for you. It's fine. Maybe they're just not connecting. I don't know.

There's a million therapists out there. Some are great. Some are not great. Some are okay. Some of it's just a connection. But it doesn't seem like you're responding to your therapist. Well, I think there's a lot of self-work she would like me to do but for some reason i am just opposed to it i don't know if i just don't want to put in the work what's

that self-work you know meditating or journaling or just getting out there and meeting people going joining a running club or these are all great yeah but i guess to me it doesn't sound like you've i don't know i mean you've been with this therapist for years and i can't possibly cover all your sessions i'm not sensing that you've truly addressed or by the way has anything i've said to you in the past five minutes about your child self and trauma like has any of this come up in therapy it It has. Okay. So it's not necessarily news to you. Okay. It seems like...

No, no, no. It's not news. Yeah. So it's definitely been some trauma. Because if you're like, no, I've never heard that. I'm like, get a new therapist. Yeah. I mean, listen, at some point, like your therapist might be amazing. You're just not doing anything about it. I don't know.

You do have to do the work, you know, just like you could go to the best university or school and have the best teachers. And if you don't study and if you don't invest in yourself, like you could go to the best university or school and have the best teachers and if you don't study and if you don't invest in yourself like you might not learn so there is an element of you like the shit that we deal with it sucks you know so many people out there have to deal with some really shitty things and shitty friends and shitty parents and shitty family members and shitty partners. And, and, and we can experience trauma and it's not our fault, but it's also not an excuse to like not do anything about it. You know, you seem like a really capable, you know, you have this beautiful house behind you. Like you got a job, like you have the means to get help, but you have to really fight

through it. You got to ask yourself, am I willing to do the work? You definitely said something that resonated was, I don't know if I feel the self-worth to work on myself. Well, I'm sorry you feel that way. But you did call. Yeah. No, yes.

And you're getting therapy. You've definitely therapy on my mind for a long time so and i've listened to you when i'm reading your book and there is something inside you that knows you deserve more and that no matter how defeated you might feel right now that like you're still calling in you're still reading the book you're still even in those tiny ways like i i know it sometimes can feel daunting when there's so much that you hope to so many ways that you hope to grow or so many things that you hope to acquire, like in self confidence or wherever it may be. It can just be like paralyzing, like looking up at this huge mountain to climb, but it's like you're taking steps. You know, my professional life, you know, is accomplished. You know, I have a master's

degree. I work as a nurse and I own my own apartment in New York City. And, you know i have a master's degree i work as a nurse and i own my own apartment in new york city and you know i definitely have things that build my self-worth and for some reason in the love and relationship you own your own apartment in new york city have a master's and you're a nurse like you're living the dream literally do you have friends who gas you up like pump me up yeah you know make you feel good about yourself who gas you up? Like pump me up? Yeah. Make you feel good about yourself? Who makes you feel good about yourself? Probably lately my work colleagues.

Do you have people in your life where you can be vulnerable enough to say, I'm not feeling good about myself. Can you help? Tell me something nice about me. Do you have those people? I definitely was texting with a work colleague last night and you know, she's been in my corner and wants to help me through this and understands and wants to get me on the dating apps and be my wing woman. So she knows that's been a difficult time.

Yeah. There's some nice lonely men out there. Just literally millions. Can confirm as during my time matchmaking some like gentle emotionally intelligent kind men who have like done the work to like look inward and figure out their own emotional shit instead of just projecting it onto other people and like they're out there and they're they want to find someone they want someone to like go through life with also in in the times when maybe you can't be with work colleagues or you don't have someone who's right there if your sister's busy or

whatever, one thing I know about the nurses in my life is they care so much about their patients. Their patients are their lives. So I'm wondering if maybe if it's even a little mental switch for you of if you had a patient come to you and tell you all of this, how would you advise her? How would you check in on her? What would you push her to do? And I guarantee if you treated yourself the way you treat your patients, I think things would be a lot different. You got one life.

Your choices matter. I know. And I see it every day at work. Yeah, exactly. And you have hopefully another 40, 50 years left on this planet. You could have two or three great loves left, you know, or maybe one love, you know, like you have so much life left ahead of you. And it could either be wonderful or great, or it could be not so great.

And it's kind of up to you. If you don't do anything to change it, nothing's going to change. And I am really sorry for whatever trauma and whatever shitty people have, whatever they've done to you. I'm so sorry. But I want you to say to yourself, enough is enough. I am in now control of my life and how my life is going to play out is going to be based off the choices I make for myself. And I am in control of my life and how my life is going to play out is going to be based off the choices I make for myself. And I am in control of my life and it's up to me. And if I don't do anything about it, no one's going to save me but me. But I was able to get a master's and have a career. And I was able to buy this amazing apartment in New York City. I am capable of doing things most

people can't accomplish. That's fact. That's a fact. You are doing things people literally dream about. So you'd have to apply that to your personal life. And maybe today is the day I just, you know, needed to hear it again. Yeah. Maybe today's not the day I would honestly, like, I would have a support system around you when you do it. Don't do this by yourself. You have friends, you have a sister, ask for help. Let them know, hey, I'm going through this. I want to block them. I really want to move forward. I really need your help. I need you to make me feel good about myself. I would love for you to hang out with me. Can we go do a spa day or whatever, maybe take a girl's trip, whatever, and then

ask for help and check in on me for the next couple of weeks because I know I'm going to want to reach out. I know I'm going to want to unblock them and just get out there and just keep reminding yourself this is your life and you have to do things differently to change it. All right? I appreciate that.

I think you can do it. I really believe in you. I know I can. I know I can I know I can It's definitely been I'm looking at that kitchen Right now And I'm like This woman's capable of anything

I'm serious Thank you It's a fucking dope kitchen In New York City That's not a kitchen In New York City No it's not If you're telling me

That's your kitchen Yeah There's nothing you can't do i've seen new york city apartments it's a beautiful kitchen well thank you thank you thank you definitely making me blush here but no yeah that was definitely hard lots of years of hard work and overtime so yeah you're clearly capable of doing extraordinary things yeah we to work overtime on how you view yourself and what you deserve. I know.

I know. But like some tough love here. It's like, this is, this is your life. It's your one life and your choices will matter. And you're either going to do something about it or you're not. And if you choose not to do something about it,

then it won't get better. And you'll be 60 and seven you know what i'm saying or where you can do something about you can do the work you can stop making excuses you can you can be so kind to future you thank you thank you did you get the name of the therapy not yet i'll email it to you and also i'm going to be emailing you to see what you're doing. It's EMDR. I've done some of that with my therapist. I don't know why she doesn't continue, but we've done some sessions of EMDR. Does she specialize in it? She's a specialist. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. I don't know. I mean, she knows more. I'm not a therapist. I just know of that type of therapy. And it sounds like maybe you've experienced some trauma in your past and that can help people work through the type of trauma that you seem to have experienced.

I appreciate it. Thank you for the time. Congratulations on your engagement. Thank you. We're going to be checking in on you. Okay. All right. I appreciate that. Don't let us down. Okay. I won't. I'll give you an update. All right. Take care.

Thank you. Bye-bye. How's it going? Great. How are you? Good. What's your name? My name's Jamie and I'm 24. How can we help, Jamie? I need help asking out my friend and coworkers client. Okay.

Your friends and coworkers client. All right. Uh, without giving too much away cause we don't want to, uh, you know, privacy, but what,

what, what type of work do you do? What do they do? Like what's the dynamic here and why is it, why is it complicated? It's complicated because, so we all work in a salon, like in the hair industry. Gossipy. I don't do hair.

Gossipy in that? Very. Very gossipy. Very gossipy. Okay, there's that. Yep. Yeah. Okay.

But we're all very close. We know everybody's business. But one of my coworkers has a very high male clientele. And basically, this client of hers comes in for the first time. And I'm like, whoa, this guy is super cute, has this almost quiet confidence to him and i'm like i'm into him so i'm i'm imagining he you're at work he walks in and like that kind of scene in a movie where everything slows down it was like ryan gosling walking through the door and it was just like some like some cool music and you were just like and felt steamy okay yeah that's that's where you're at okay what happened

after he walked in so i mean you know does his business gets his hair done um and i let my friend and co-worker know i'm like i'm into this guy like i i straight up tell her like you think he's hot tell me more about him yeah and she's like oh his name is let's say john and he's single in you know he has a great job whatever whatever but he's moving of course he is they always do um so he's not going to be here very long but i'm like you know what screw it i'm just gonna i'm just gonna flirt it up with him and uh every single time like he comes in we're always like happy to see each other giving off flirty banter and then like a couple months pass by and i'm like a couple months pass by i'm just gonna yeah yeah you already wait okay when's he moving in like a couple months. You've already wasted half your time.

I know. I know it. Time's a wasted. It's ticking, Jamie. I know. So he knows you exist. He knows you exist. He knows I exist.

He knows my name. And I was like, you know what, screw it. I'm just going to ask him out for drinks. Okay. And I let him know. I'm like, oh, I heard you're moving and he said yeah i was like that doesn't give us a lot of time to get drinks it was so lame like um and he's like oh maybe you said it doesn't give us time to give you get drinks smooth i liked it i love it it

was very clever oh okay and he's like uh maybe i was like oh okay so you'll see me around though like oh and so his his barber was like oh that doesn't mean no yeah yeah you like set him up yeah you really put it out you're like you threw it down the middle yeah that was for him to take and fly with what was his like body like did he seem excited and nervous because like you know yeah i mean his yes he had like his face was all red and like jaw was when did this happen not expecting that at all when did this happen like two to three months ago like right before christmas you asked him out for drinks two to three months ago yeah and he's still here he hasn't moved yeah well we thought we he well that's the thing we thought he was going to move earlier and then he let us know that he's extending his stay

okay um before he moves and then um so he let his barber know that, you know, I'm extending my stay. And he's like, oh, well, I guess I'll stop teasing you about Jamie because, like, she knows that we're, like, Why? Where is the friend in this? Why isn't she setting you up here? What's going on? Like, any stylist I know loves to play matchmaker. Like, well, she was definitely trying.

But he's just, like, pain like does not i i don't even know but he was like well i'm extending my stay we all should go out for drinks the three of us he said that not and i was just yes is your is his stylist cute is there any chance he could be into her right well i was the i don't think so they bicker with each other like brother and sister it's very brother sister vibes like they argue all the time yeah it's like that instagram account siblings or lovers yeah their rapport is so good that they are bickering that's tension oh they argue all the time that's tension yeah do you trust her i was definitely wondering that yes i like to think so so you don't know but there's definitely been that thought

no that doesn't mean they're fucking you know for example like uh like natalie has told me that like she has a trainer and like he's very diligent and nally like working out like she's challenged herself to like go to the gym she doesn't like to work out it's not like you know like some people it comes more naturally to them for her not her favorite thing but she's pushing through so to speak and he he's the type of trainer who's very like if you show up you got to finish i don't want to work with people who aren't committed yada yada yada and there's just a lot of like her like i don't want to fucking finish this set or whatever and then he's like he'll argue with her yeah i can there it's like you're working out and i can understand where like the tension is based off the fact that like

she wants to throw up and he's like you got to do one more set but like where is the tension coming with these two people and i don't think it's over his hair you know like what what could they possibly be arguing about they're so different and like she's a little woo-woo if that makes any sense like very spiritual and he's very like he's in the medical field so he's very like two plus two is four do you have his number around it like very yeah yes you do we're in a group we're in the group chat oh my god fuck this group three of us yeah okay i don't care we gotta move we gotta move so we're gonna go we're gonna go ahead and that's what i'm trying to do yeah so we're gonna get we're gonna bust out the phone what time where time is it where you're at um it's it's 12 23 okay it's the afternoon great you can text him let's text him right now let's just ask him out the thing is like i've okay

oh but i'm okay nick i have a question shoot i don't know if he's gonna say yes he might be fucking your friend i don't know that's yeah that's because i don't want to like if we do go out it doesn't work out and then he's gonna move i am responsible right it's like i'm responsible for getting rid of one of my co-workers slash friends clients i don't think you should be weird you're just asking the guy out you're all adults it's up to him of how he handles it and clearly you've kind of like pitched it to him before and your relationship has still stayed pretty normal you're in a group chat if you ask about and he says no and you say fuck you forever then it might be weird like i could picture you this friend of yours getting

off on the fact that she has a vibe with him and she knows you like her and that makes her feel even more validated because she has what you want i wonder if she's feeling very like possessive and territorial i don't know i just think it's kind of odd that the three of you are in a group chat this guy walked in the door you were like hey he's cute what's the tea whatever two months have gone by and all that's happened is you three in a group chat? Like, why is she overseeing this operation? Yeah. No, I mean, the three of us have all gone out. Yeah, sure.

Like, for... But why? Like, are you into throuples? Threesomes? You know what I'm saying? Like, you went to your friend. This is her client. Did she ever go out with him before?

No. Exactly. So you were the catalyst. You went to your friends and I think this guy's cute. And then somehow that turned into you guys going out on dates together, the three of you? Like why? And then that turned into like a group chat? Yeah.

At first I was like, oh, this will be such a cool, casual way to get to know him, and now I'm just annoyed. Yeah. I absolutely think you should ask him out. I think you should prepare your... The risks are, you know, you got work. You don't want to complicate work. Just don't be the drama.

This is definitely possible for a huge drama scenario, especially given that this is happening in a salon. It's just a breeding ground for drama the salons are more drama like i don't why aren't there a reality tv show about fucking salons no i've talked about it we it's i don't know how is that not how anyway i'm gonna create a show but uh in your case just don't you like you're you've you've made it clear to your friend that you think he's cute. So you're not doing anything wrong. I don't know what's going on, if anything, between her and him.

If there is, she's not being honest with you. It's not your problem. I'm just like, this is for you to like, you do the right thing, protect yourself. And when I say don't be the drama, don't engage in any drama that might take place. It's just like, oh, well, I, you you knew I just, I decided to ask him out. You don't need a permission. You know, you're,

she's not your mom. She doesn't own him. As far as you're concerned, they're not dating as far as you're, as far as you know. So there's not, you're not doing anything wrong. So if she were to get frustrated or be like,

well, why didn't you ask me first or blah, blah, blah. You just, you should just act confused. Be like, well,

I mean, I liked him. I just finally decided to shoot my shot. That's all, you know? Right. But, you ask me first or blah blah blah you just you should just act confused like well i mean i liked them i just finally decided to shoot my shot that's all you know right but i don't know yeah it's just there's definitely some like variables in the story that don't add up i don't know what they are maybe it's nothing there's there's a reason there's a reason why the three of you are hanging out and there's a reason why the three of you are in a group chat and i don't know what it is but it's there is a reason yeah he's definitely made the joke like oh i thought the two of you were my girlfriend and so i was like what oh no i don't like that was he joking i mean maybe he's just like yeah yeah he was definitely joking but the two of us

like went up to each other at work and were like, I didn't like that. I didn't like that he did that. Yeah. I mean, and that's fair. And you should tell him that. Listen, I would just shoot your shot. I'd text him and just say, hey, I'd like to take you on a date. I think you need to be very forward.

Especially if this guy is super shy. Hey, I don't know if you've noticed but i've been crushing on you for three months now and i don't know when if you're ever going to move but i think you and i and only you and i should go on a date and and he's gonna get he might yeah he 50 50 he says yes 50 like he assumed that he might reach out to the friend, but I think you should ask him out, and I think you should be proud of yourself that you did it, and let the chips fall where they may.

That's what I think. I think that's the energy you should have. It's always better to know, and then you'll get it over with the first time he comes into the salon. You'll both act normal, even if you're kind of faking it. That'll take away your anxiety. But then you can move on to other people that potentially aren't fucking her or about to move

and you'll just at least know. Or you can have some amazing dates and this is your soulmate. Either way, let's find out. You have nothing to be embarrassed about. You're going for what you want. You should be proud of yourself. It's hard to do.

And when you send that text, the only feeling you should feel is pride because it was a brave thing you did. And what he says, I don't know. And if he chooses her, you know, gets awkward or weird, you know, you can remind yourself of that kind of slightly creepy thing he said about the two girlfriends. You know, like you really don't know much about this guy. So all I'm simply saying is like there's not a ton to be sad over other than like a little bummed that your ego got a little bruised but like you can still be proud of yourself that you had the courage to do something that was uncomfortable and a little scary and a little nerve-wracking because like that's what life's

all about is pushing our boundaries as long as we're safe and and seeing what seeing what we're capable of um we have to stop saying a lot we have to stop doing things just because we're capable of. We have to stop saying a lot. We have to stop doing things just because we're afraid of outcomes that might not go the way we hoped because we're not going to get anything we really want if we're not afraid to take risks. You got to take some big swings in life. And I assure you, when you take big swings, bad things are going to happen. They will. But if you don't take big swings, you're not going to have great things either. And when the bad things happen, you just process, you deal with it, you work through it, you learn from it. So bust out that phone. All right. Right now. Right now. This is about being direct. You could just say,

sentiment text says, it's time for you and I to go on a date. Okay. That's fun. Just say that. Yeah. yeah awesome it will be mind-blowing you could add that you think you think i should why not so yeah be confident be confident okay it will be mind-blowing okay bold what's my go ali and amanda are like maybe not it is bold what's wrong with it and then you're gonna be like mind-blowing how i just don't know if it's too much what what what's wrong with mind-blowing i like this if he's a shy guy hey then i think it's time that you and i go on a date confidence rub him the wrong way you know what i mean like you know how like if you're a

shy person i don't think jamie i don't think all of a sudden i'm talking to jamie for 10 minutes here i just and i mean this with love i don't think that he's don't think all of a sudden, I'm talking to Jamie for 10 minutes here. I just, and I mean this with love, I don't think that he's going to be turned off and think that somehow Jamie has turned into this confidence monster. You know? I'm just, she's taking like four months to shoot her shot. So... I think, I'm not trying to step in to stop it.

I just... I just think a little like assertiveness And confidence I just don't want the Should you think we should go out I wanna you believe it Like hey it's time for we go out You and I go on a date If you don't like mind blowing Jamie

Don't send it but I don't think it's gonna make I don't think it's gonna make a difference Ultimately But it is a conversation starter I don't think it's going to make a difference ultimately. Right. But it is a conversation starter. It's something he can ask about. Mind-blowing.

Ooh. You know, like it could just be a joke you guys literally talk about leading up to the date. That's all it is. It's not going to make a difference whether he says yes or not. It is a potential conversation starter. It's done. Did you send it?

Round of applause. And we're just going to be proud of ourselves. We're going to be confident queens. It doesn't matter what he says. You did a great thing. You shot your shot. Do you feel good or do you feel like you want to throw up? No, I don't

feel like I can. Not yet anyways i i feel fine i'm a little nervous yeah it's okay that's probably come in the salon this week so you probably what even better rip the band-aid off no matter what he responds your anxiety will go away the second that you have a somewhat normal interaction now do you feel like would it be normal like you know this friend because part of me i don't i don't like i don't know your relationship how close you are but it could make sense because there's this kind of tripod like it could make sense for you to control the story, the narrative, so to speak. And by that, you could text the friend saying, I just asked John out on a date,

just to like let her know that you did it. That way, you're getting ahead of any possibility that he reaches, you know what I'm saying? Like there's no way then she's not going to find out from him. She finds out from you. And it would be interesting to what she might say about that anything but like super supportive you have your answer red flag even if it's covertly not supportive even if it's like oh well he's keep in mind she told you he was going to move that was like the

first thing and the motherfucker hasn't moved yet if she is anything like a friend would say, girl, good for you. Oh my God, shoot your shot. That's great. That is the only acceptable answer from a someone who wants to be your friend in this moment. And I'm not saying she's bad or whatever. She just might have other priorities

and she might have a crush and she might be a bad communicator and being a little selfish and a little dramatic or whatever. But if she was being a friend to you in this moment, her only response would be some version of support and excitement for you finally shooting your shot. And if she says like, Ooh, I don't know if that's a good idea, blah, blah, blah, blah. If she does anything else, I wouldn't necessarily respond. I would just kind of take note

about, you know, if she's like, Oh, I would just say, Oh, I'm excited. I did it. Like I, it's something I always wanted to do, whatever. I wouldn't, again, that's where like, I wouldn't like feed into the drama.

I wouldn't get into it with her. I wouldn't ask her why she feels that way. I wouldn't like, she's not, she's not on your side when it, as it relates to him. If she says anything other than I'm excited for you, but I'm not saying you can don't stop being her friend,

but just be careful and just know. Yeah. And when it comes to this guy, she is, her priority isn't simply just to support you. There's something else, but yeah, I actually would text her and let her know that you asked him out.

Yeah. I, I do have to see her almost every day. You text her enthusiastically. I asked him out. I asked out John on a date, exclamation point. Nervous of what he's going to say, but I'm excited I finally asked.

All right. Or actually just, you know what? Just the sentence with the exclamation point. No follow-up. Okay. All right. Keep us posted, please. Yes, please.

You promise? Yes, I promise. You promise you'll give us an update? I think there's going to be a few more updates with this story. This is salon drama. This is not the end. And the final update will be Nick as executive producer of this Netflix show. Take notes of this. Starring Jamie.

I need you to take copious notes about what proceeds from what we just did here in these texts. Because I feel like there's going to be more tea here. I can feel it. There are layers here. It's simmering. Yeah, it's simmering. All right, Jamie. Thanks so much for calling. I hope this was helpful. it this is there are layers here it's simmering yeah it's simmering all right jamie thanks so

much for calling uh i hope this was helpful congratulations on doing something bold and brave no matter what happens this was a great thing and i hope you challenge yourself to do more of it and um yeah i can't wait to hear what happens okay thank you guys so much i really appreciate it thank you take care thanks how's it appreciate it. Thank you. Take care. Thanks. How's it going? It's going good. What's your name? My name's Anna. I'm 24 and I'm calling because I'm wondering if my boyfriend just scammed me out of $400.

Okay. What makes you wonder if your boyfriend scammed you out of $400? So we just kind of started dating about now. It's been like two and a half months ago. Okay. And this person's still your boyfriend, to be clear. Still my boyfriend. Yes. Did he make you sign up for a pyramid scheme?

No, but that's a good question. Valid. But when we first started dating, like the very first week, he asked if I would go on the skiing slash fishing trip. And I have never done either of those. And it was really out of my comfort zone. So I let him know that I have no gear. I would need to stop somewhere to get snow pants, a coat, something to stay warm. So ice fishing and snow skiing.

Yeah. Okay. Yep. That's different than water skiing. Yeah. Fishing and snow skiing not yeah okay yep that's different than water ski like yeah fishing and water skiing but you're hardcore yeah so ice fishing and who the fuck wants to sit outside and fish but anyway you're in a house you're in a little hut so um since it was like five hours from where we, he let me know that there's like an outdoor store closer to like this resort that we were going to go to for all of this stuff. I let him know that, OK, like we can go once we're up there. I just for sure need something to keep me warm because my normal pants won't work.

So once we got there, though, I started picking out the things that I would need. the things that I would need. And he started picking out like a bunch of random stuff, like a lure, a fishing rod, and then like some like ski stuff, I would assume. It looked like just heavy socks and then like steaks, pokey steaks. I don't know. And anyways, he starts frantically looking for his wallet right before we go and check out. And you can kind of tell like if somebody's frantically looking for that wallet. And I just asked, you know, like, do you not have your wallet? And he goes, I think I might've left it in the car. So I said, oh, you should probably go look. And he said, yeah, watch my stuff while I go look in the car. And at this point, we're already like an hour from our destination, comes back in and he says, I don't have my wallet on me.

And I said, that's a huge bummer because the entire way up there, he's talking about how he wants to go to like these restaurants and they have all these cool drinks that he wants to get and all this stuff. So he's not going to be able to do this. Anyways, we're in the line and I'm like, well, why don't you ask them if they can take Apple pay? He goes, great idea. Goes up to their register. Cashier says they do not take Apple Pay. It has to be a Carter cash. And so then he goes, this is a big ask, but would you pay for this? And I can Venmo you. And I said, you're going to Venmo me? And he goes, yes. Right once we get into the car, I can Venmo you. I was like, all right, no harm, no foul. You're going to Venmo me.

You're going to Venmo me. Yeah. Which is like, you could literally do it right there. Right there. Don't have to wait until they go in the car. Yep. So I paid for it and it totaled to be like $430 or something. And I did two separate transactions. So mine was completely separate from his. And I gave him the receipt and I said, this is how much you owe me. Do you want my Venmo at name? And he goes, yeah, why don't you just text it to me? So I sent it to him, and then we loaded everything into the car, and while I'm walking around, he goes, oh my goodness, you're not going to believe this. And I was like, what? And he goes, I found my wallet. And I was like, okay, where was it? Because you found it really quick. And he goes, oh, it was right on the seat.

And I said, well, I thought you looked in the car and he goes, I did. I just must not have looked that well. And I was like, I mean, okay, I guess it sounded fishy to you at the time. For sure. Yeah. And then I asked if he could Venmo me. And he said, since we're an hour from the destination, do you mind if I do it once we get to the hotel? And I was like, you can't do it right now. And he goes, I would, I'd rather just do it once we get there. So I was like, all right, fine. You can do it once we get there. That's fine. Right. Once we get there, I asked again, I said, Hey, do you mind Venmoing me for like the outdoor stuff? And he goes, let me just get settled in. We just got here. I feel like you're kind of nagging me. And I was like, Oh, okay. Like, obviously I didn't

want to start the trip off on like a bad note and we still haven't been dating that long. So I didn't really know how to bring it up like again. So I kind of let it go that weekend, but progressively every week I bring it up and he keeps telling me like, I brought it up like a few weeks ago and it was, I'm at work. Let me do it when I get out. Another time it was, I'm tired because of work. Can I do it in the morning? And then another time he said, I actually don't have Venmo. So I have to figure out how to set that up. And on that one, I got super upset and said, you previously told me you would Venmo me.

So I don't understand why you would even throw that out if you don't have it. And it's easy to set up Venmo. So like. And then what do you say to that? He said that his card is at a bar because he forgot to grab his card at a bar he went to. So he doesn't know the number. Wait, what? You should probably get your card anyways if it's at a bar.

You link your Venmo to a bank account. He's lying. So I don't know what to do. I don't know how to keep asking. I don't know. I feel like a loan shark when I ask. First, we're going gonna break up with this guy okay i mean like mentally in your head we're done with him this is weird it's so weird this is so

fishy you know how like catfish people always have like the next excuse it's like like they're always like the reason why they can't meet up is because like they got arrested like their grandma got arrested and their their aunt's sick and then the dog something happened with the dog or whatever and it's always like i guess who would lie about that like okay that's that's what this guy's doing i mean at any point you go like venmo like let's pull out your qr code bam he can pay you also like you've been back home you can go to an atm you go to a bank you can pull out cash you'll take cash you'll accept cash he's deliberately not paying you and he was lying to you i mean is there any what would i say to this is there a way that i should

like ask again no i honestly if you're willing to break up with him if you don't want anything further and it's just about getting the money back I don't know if one you know of any like lawyers or if your friends are lawyers But I would literally say like well I've spoken to blank and they're willing to represent me as small claims court and I will be pursuing legal action That's If you really wanted to just like throw it out there, I don't know if we need to go there quite yet No, okay. Just kidding. Take it back. I think, it sounds to me like

you've been, you know, because he's your boyfriend and this is uncomfortable and I completely understand why, but it sounds to me you've been incredibly understanding so far. Even when it felt very fucked up. You're just like

this is fucked. This is bullshit. I'm being scammed. But to him, you're just like, this is fucked. This is bullshit. I'm being scammed. But to him, you're like, okay, I guess. So I think we need to change that. Your tone needs to just, I need you to pay me now. Okay.

Do you still hang out with him? Have you been hanging out with him? Yeah. I see him a couple times a week and every time when i see him usually i'll say like hey do you can you pay me for this like did you want to do um i usually asked for like venmo and then when he said he didn't have venmo i asked for cash app um apple pay and he's like i don't have any of that set up and i was like well i well, I'll send him now. I think next time you see him, you're just like, hey, I need you to pay me now. And I think you'd be somewhat aggressive. But can we go to like, let's go to the bank, take him to the bank, you know, or I'll help

you set up like, like you're paying me now. You don't even ask. I need you to pay me now. So we can set up Venmo. If you don't have your credit card, let's go to the bank. You have your ID. Like, and then when he comes up with an excuse, you just level them. Why are you lying to me?

Like, why haven't you paid me back? Like, this is weird. Like, are you scamming me? Because you've had all of these excuses is like, this whole thing has been super fucking creepy and weird. So like, what's going on? Do you not have the money? And he might say,

I don't have the money. Be like, well, that's fucked up because you acted like you did, but like, I need you to pay me. You have a job. Like I'm not your banker.

I didn't loan you this money. Like, what are you doing? Do you have mutual friends? No, not really. No, that's too bad.

Cause shame is powerful. I think you just get a little aggressive and start demanding that he pays you. Okay. I can do that. And then if he pays you, then immediately break up with him. Be like, thank you.

All right. Also, by the way, we're definitely not dating anymore. I suspect he's not going to pay you right away i suspect he will this will come with resistance and then i think you could take ali's advice that like once give him that shot and if he doesn't just be like do are you like yeah that should be literally are you going to make me see are you gonna make me like

yeah let's be like my uncle's you know, makes make something up. Yeah. Like make something up. But you're really, really close friends. Just like like I've literally talked like you really want me to like sue you over this. And don't let him flip it on you. Like, don't let him be like, whoa, whoa, whoa. Like, that's crazy.

Why are you being aggressive? You can be like, yeah, this like this situation is absolutely ridiculous. It is ridiculous that i even need to say this like you said you would pay me this money literally the second we got to a hotel this is not hard i have asked you like over 10 times or however many start with start with you're paying me now why are you lying this needs to happen now and then if you go to a if you need a final resort then you can threaten lawyers yeah at any point when he tries to like oh why are you being so aggressive like i'm not being aggressive you've you've been

like this is turn this situation this is crazy this is crazy that i have to beg my boyfriend to pay me money he owes me when he told me he was going to pay me back immediately and then you said you were going to Venmo me and then you lied to me about not having Venmo. And you came up with this weird story about not having your wallet, but immediately throwing your wallet on the top of the car. And then like somehow you were so mentally exhausted that you couldn't pay me back. What is being tired having to do with paying me back? Like you don't get to pay me back at your convenience. Like who taught you how to be this way? Like,

I think you go hard to the paint with this guy. I think you got, you get a little mad at you or he's 100% wrong. You are 100% right. He is no longer your boyfriend. This is some just creepy, weird, manipulative guy who is fucked up.

This is weird. This is just like, it's not normal this isn't like it seemed like a red flag to me oh my god and then it just felt like it shouldn't be this hard to pay somebody back no it's super weird i don't know it's so weird i don't even i could i could i could only guess as to why i don don't, I don't know. He also, I thought this was weird. He would bring up like his paycheck on his phone to his friends. I got the like ski place because he was kind of just bragging. And when he pulled it up, I was like, oh, you're bragging. And clearly my curiosity got the best of me. And I looked over and it was a sizable amount of money. So I'm like, okay, you have like $400. Like if you're going to sit here and brag about your money that you're making, you can

clearly pay me back. That was weird. Who does that? It shouldn't even matter like what the paycheck is. If you are going to spend someone else's $400 on things that you want, you should be able to pay them back. Do you know his friends? No, that was the first time I met anybody.

Do you know him now? Oh yeah, a little bit. I think you should publicly shame him. Should I? If he doesn't pay you back, are you going to literally make me tell all your friends who you bragged about how much money you make that you couldn't pay your girlfriend $400?

How far do your lies go? Do you want me to tell everyone that you're doing this? Like you're being crazy. Like, what are you doing? Make sure you're safe. And I don't know this guy and I'm just, you know,

but make sure you're in a safer, but like you're a hundred percent right. He's a hundred percent wrong. And this, this is insanity and you should treat it as such. Okay. So definitely just be more aggressive and. Super.

I don't think you can be too aggressive as long as, again, don't break any laws or rules or don't resort to violence and don't call him mean name. Don't try to hurt him, but just hit him with the facts. The facts are, this is crazy. The facts are is this is inappropriate.

He's taking advantage of you. He hasn't been lying to you. He's manipulative this is super fucked up this is not how you would treat anyone let along someone you're dating why are you bragging about how much money you have to your friends but you can't even pay your girlfriend four hundred dollars back are you bad with money what is your problem do you have problem? Because it sounds like you have a problem. It does. It does. And these are the things I would say to him. These are fair questions that he is, you know, you don't even have to be mean. You just have to be direct. All your feelings are valid. And so I'm giving you permission to express those feelings to him without questioning your sanity

or anything like that because it sounds like that's what he's seems to be good at doing i agree okay i can do that he's like he's one of those people who clearly lies about crazy shit and then you feel crazy because you're like no one lies about this shit so like they're it must be true but it doesn't add up so like what the fuck i just didn't know if it was rude to like basically make him set up no he owes you fucking money yeah it's not rude no take him to the fucking bank it's your money he is holding on to your money what's rude is that he's not paying you back you're not being rude at all okay good we need it we need an update for sure i'll let you know keep us posted but

yeah i definitely will go uh go bonkers on this guy i will thank you guys for the advice yeah keep us posted we uh go get that go get your money i will all right thank you take care bye bye bye thanks for listening everyone don't forget vile files plus is available now for all Take care. Bye. Bye-bye. Bye. Thanks for listening, everyone. Don't forget, Vile Files Plus is available now for all new updates. Go to vilefiles.com to check that out. We have Better Date Than Never this week, 9 p.m. Eastern on Thursday night. Rachel Bilson for Going Deeper.

We'll see you tomorrow for the recap. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. recap. Bye.