The Viall Files - E583 Vanderpump Recap with Gabby Windey

Episode Date: May 16, 2023

Welcome back to The Viall Files: Vanderpump Recap Edition! Today we are joined by our pop culture correspondent Natalie Joy, and former Bachelorette Gabby Windey, to talk all things Vanderpump. We discuss the drama of this season versus past seasons, the fact that this week’s episode was supposed to be the finale, and what Katie told Natalie about the conception of the show. We also pull up proof that the Toms were on a double date with Jo and Raquel right before the “Something About Her” opening event.  “I think Raquel is extremely produced.”  Start your 7 Day Free Trial of Viall Files + here: https://viallfiles.supportingcast.fm/  Please make sure to subscribe so you don’t miss an episode and as always send in your relationship questions to [e-mail] to be a part of our Monday episodes. Join us for our new LIVE show on Thursdays at 9PM ET/6PM PT on Amp, available in the Apple app store. Android User? Listen here: https://www.onamp.com/  To Order Nick’s Book Go To: http://www.viallfiles.com  If you would like to get some texting advice on Office Hours send an email to [e-mail] with “Texting Office Hours” in the subject line! To advertise on the show, contact [e-mail] or visit https://www.advertisecast.com/TheViallFiles  THANK YOU TO OUR SPONSORS: Rothy’s - For stylish and sustainable shoes, shop Rothy’s. Get $20 off your first purchase at https://www.rothys.com/VIALL Nutrafol - Take the first step to visibly thicker, healthier hair. For a limited time, Nutrafol is offering our listeners ten dollars off your first month’s subscription and free shipping when you go to https://www.Nutrafol.com and enter the promo code VIALL Episode Socials: @viallfiles @nickviall @gabby.windey @nnataliejjoy @alison.vandam @liffordthebigreddog @dereklanerussell

you're crazy what's going on everybody welcome back to another episode of the vile files vanderpump recap edition aka freestyle aka whatever the fuck we want to talk about we have a very exciting episode oh by the way i'm nick joined by the household of ally amanda and derek our pop culture correspondent natalie joy and our very special guest today the one the only first time on the vile files gabby windy i'm like former bachelorette former dancing with the star star and Vanderpump

super fan Natalie and I ran into Gabby at some sort of event where were we a clothing event like this weekend how do you describe it I've like talked about it so many times it was like a clothing event like a hangout they like took a bunch of

like vintage clothes from Goodwill and put their own brand on them. And then there were tattoos and tooth gems. Did you guys get a tattoo? We did. Yeah. A little horseshoe. I got the word darling.

Oh my God, cute. You didn't? No. Did you get a tooth gem? You didn't? She's not basic like us. I didn't get a tooth gem either. If they had a tooth gem. I'm like, no. A tattoo at an event? Did you get toothed? You didn't? She's not basic like us I didn't get toothed No me judging both of you

I'm like no A tattoo out of the vent? We ran into Gabby And we were talking about Vanderpump And then I asked Gabby If she was watching And up to date on season 10 And asked if she wanted to recap

And she was like Oh my god yes I say less Love the hot goss We are excited to have you uh what's new what's been going on what's cracking literally i don't know i feel like i have the same spiel which you guys have already heard i'm just like so in deep and decorating my place i can't really concentrate on much else besides vanderpump um vanderpump and house decorating and coffee tables yes like

that is my whole world my place is all like facebook marketplace secondhand vintage i don't want anything new but i feel that's a lie i have two handcrafted things nick and i on the other hand we're like everything is from target and or home goods no we love cb2 restoration Yes. Yeah. Do we have anything used? Nick wouldn't even let me get a used fridge the other day. Well, let's talk about that. Yuck. That's disgusting.

Is that something that you buy used? I guess. Why? Wipe it down. It's a chlor... I mean, that's what doesn't even have fabric. I'm going to back up on this. Yeah.

Would you rather buy a used fridge or a used rug? You guys are like, what, three, two years removed from college? Sure. You still got that college... Driftiness. Driftiness. Don't what three two years removed from college sure you still got that college driftiness yeah don't leave me 10 years removed still have the mindset i'm like we'll drive anywhere in l.a for a pendant when you put the radius on that big like san gabriel valley because i don't respect myself literally i'm like can we meet halfway they're like no i'm like perfect i'm on my. They're like cash.

Like how about 280 instead of 300. They're like absolutely not. I'm like perfect. I was hoping you'd say that. 320 be mean to me. I do think about how I feel like Facebook is not really used that much anymore. The only time I use it is for Facebook marketplace. I'm like this is just like a seller profile where like they can

see every birthday wish I've ever received. You know know like they just have the weird context of my facebook even though i'm not socializing i looked at facebook last night i was at a friend's birthday party to show everyone there the hot guy in high school and the hot girl in high school you know they're like we have to see what they look like now so i used facebook for that reason oh my god and yeah have to see what they look like now so i used facebook for that reason oh my god and yeah one of them she is a um newscaster in tennessee oh yes she is what'd she do to you what'd she do to you she does the news oh she was also nally's high school bully it was right when i started modeling okay and she's jealous they're all jealous. No, get this. This is wild.

This shit is wild. Her boyfriend liked a photo of mine on Facebook and she was pissed. Yeah. And so she, in graphic design class, she had my modeling photo and she wrote, poor, sucks for free, slut, and mean girls did. Printed like 600 out and threw them all over the school she put it on twitter i'm sitting in science class and the girl beside me is like oh my god natalie and i'm like what and she turns the phone and it's that picture on twitter oh my god first of all not even an

original idea like get your own brain like we all know where this is going movie bitch yeah anyway so now she sets up her own camera with like a tiktok light in front of burning buildings that maybe she even burned herself and is like breaking news this house is on fire you know she's like by herself trying to be newscaster oh my god she's like a self-made newscaster yeah she creates her own chaos in the backyard she's like killing someone my dog today it all stems from jealousy i don't care i stand behind it same yeah have you ever had a bully um i am the bully no i just really i'm like great this is so fun we all got scared oh you guys like don't know me enough no i'm like so like docile meek i'm like scared of everything

um no i mean i don't know we could probably leave that oh okay i'll tell you something i was this is oh god i can't believe i'm doing this. I was Miss O'Fallon 2008. I won a scholarship pageant. You were Miss what? O'Fallon. That's where I grew up. It's outside of St. Louis. Despite all the odds, everyone was like, how did that girl win? Like, I have no clue.

Anyways, fast forward. I was like at a high school party chugging from a handle of Captain Morgan. Sending autographs. With my crown. She's beautiful. She's great. She set up one of those little tables with like autographs here.

You waited behind. I'm like 18. There's like hair on my chest. Captain Morgan. Literally, my leg is up and I'm fully in the Captain Morgan stand. You're a representative of O'F Morgan stand. Like, you're a representative of O'Fallon. Anyways, the picture

surfaced on Facebook because this girl I went to high school with, I don't know, I liked her best friend's boyfriend or something, something, and she wouldn't take it, like, she would not take it down. And I begged her, I cornered her out. We both worked at the mall. I worked at this retail store and

so did she. So I was like, me cornering, I'm like, please, please, please, like retail store and so did she so I was like me cornering I'm like please please please please take it down and she was like never I know I'm like you're ruining my life they're gonna take away my crown and the $2,500 they're sending to my college like I literally can't deal with this

$2,500 on Facebook I think no I think she took it down and I kept my crown despite all the hot talk. I am a better representative now. I've learned a lot. I would never do it again. Yeah, that's like one of my deepest, darkest secrets.

Oh my God, thank you for sharing. That was a very vulnerable moment. That makes me so stressed to hear about. It seems like a really worst case scenario when you're in high school like what are you supposed to do you've already confronted her at the mall I know and she like still to my face was like no and I'm like I'm out of options

I'm literally out of options you ever wish you could go back I thought about this all the things that stressed you out in middle school or high school that like you just lost sleep over or just like just to realize you didn't have to give a fuck because none of it mattered yeah yeah i think about that all the time is there one that's like

highlight reel for you of like i wasted so much time i mean just kind of i mean every time sorry but tmi uh anytime like i would go to second base i'd be like worried about i'd get her pregnant well that's just a lack in understanding science yeah I mean I was like 15 or 16 where's sex education when I lost my virginity I was like spider man I remember no I remember like one

time like second base and then I was like psyched out just because like oh you know what if what if what if something got on my hand and then and I remember I called I swear to God I called her up and I was because it's like, oh, you know, what if something got on my hand? What if? And then, and I remember, I called, I swear to God, I called her up,

and I was just like, you know, because I was like checking the calendars at work, and I was just like, so how are you feeling? You know, like. Like, are you nauseous? Yeah, yeah, yeah. You don't have to throw up or anything. I'm serious.

I was just, I was freaking out. How are your tits? Are they hurting? Are you lactating? Have you started breastfeeding anyone yet? No. Yeah.

Anyways, I was in the clear. Yeah, thank God. All right, anything we have to get into before Vanderpump? I don't think so.

It's pretty slow in the whole Bachelor. All right, Vanderpump. All right, wild episodeump. All right. Wild episode. I think it's the first episode that I watched of reality TV in a while where I was yelling at the TV screen. That's a great sign.

That's awesome. That is good TV. It was triggering. I just started watching Vanderpump. Same. So season 10 is my first season and we're kind of going back. Is that the same for you. Yeah.

All my friends who have been watching it forever were like, you have to go back. Like the first initial seasons were like, I guess, historically some of the best reality TV. I don't know. I do this with some TV shows too. It's like I actually do better if I fast forward a little bit because I can understand their character development more and then go back. Like when I'm watching, when the show's more and then go back like when I'm watching when the show's just beginning and everyone's new I'm like this needs to go faster I need to know like your insides already and I think season 10 did that so then I've been I

watched like some of season one season two jumped to season five went to 10 I'm back to nine okay I didn't watch a full season of any of them. Only season 10. But I'm like, still enjoyable though. I think season 10 is the best. It's really hard to compete with season 10 because the drama is so real. It's not contrived. It's like very authentic and you're buying it.

It's like, this is why housewives Bravo so good on housewives. Cause those women are bat shit crazy and will confront each other like on real shit. When I think the earlier seasons of Vanderpump, it's like they're in their early 20s. You don't really have like a sense of self yet. Your problems aren't really like that real. So I'm just like not buying it that much.

No, totally. I mean, there are a couple of times we're watching this episode. And I'm curious from your point of view, just because when Ariana and Tom were having their fight, I like paused and I was like, just to understand the landscape here. On the couch? Yeah, because you know how filming these shows work, right? So to know that they had this very real and raw fight,

but they were willing to do that. They had to get mic'd up and there was camera people there. It's not the Truman Show. But they're probably so used to that i think so yeah i think about that a lot too because we've never been on a show where they follow our lives like that and like in your own home so yeah part of me is like how would you get used to it but you could even tell by their body language that they're so used to it like she was was fully laying down on the couch. I'm like, I would never unless I was like 10 champagnes in. Like you still, which I was, but you would still kind of have like a sense of awareness. But you can, you can tell they're just like so used to it, which thank God for us.

Like as the viewers. That's so interesting you say that because I noticed in the scene with Raquel and Charlie in that boutique when Raquel buys the jewelry that Charlie is so focused on the way that she looks. She's constantly fixing her hair and I think she's just new to this. Speaking of that necklace, that was another thing. There's three scenarios to look at that. The necklace, that fucking lightning bolt necklace

that costs $700 by the way yeah that feels aggressive it does yeah is it some sort of I guess real gold Charlie said it's real gold babe Charlie was doing the most sorry I'll let you finish but we got to talk about the way Charlie was being an absolute salesman but here's

the thing so there's three scenarios there's one Raquel is having sex with Tom Sandoval. At this point in time. Where she's buying this lightning bolt necklace to match Tom Sandoval. So one scenario is she knows she's doing this. She's also filming a show and deliberately talks to production and saying, hey, there's this necklace I want to buy.

Let's just do this scene at some jewelry store. saying, hey, there's this necklace I want to buy. Let's just do this scene at some jewelry store. That is so sadistic, knowing that you want this recorded on camera to be played earlier so that you know that you're getting a matching necklace of the guy you're fucking, who's also the boyfriend of your best friend. Then there's also a theory that for all the people who wondered, is production in any way in on this i have some things to say about that too i feel but also do you think there's a world where i think raquel is

extremely produced i think you can feed her anything watching her confessionals her itms you can tell she's being fed lines in some instances like because they they want to feed you like a bite i and you know us we're like okay whatever the they want to feed you like a bite. I, and you know, us, we're like, okay, whatever the fuck.

But other times you're like, no, I would never say that in real life. We, as people have a filter and know ourselves enough to know what we would say and what we wouldn't say. She doesn't know that about herself. She's like young, not that young.

I'm trying to like, not, I'm, I came in being like, we know what it's like also to be talk shit on on reality tv it's something that whatever you sign up for when you go on but like i just i like to talk shit but i don't call it talking shit i'm just stating the facts we are we as well you may not know this gabby but on this show when we talk reality tv

we're we're breaking down people's behaviors yeah because we don't know these people in real life and we recognize that it is at times edited so we're talking behaviors, not people. Yeah, definitely. We're just rationalizing with ourselves letting go away. It's like, what the fuck, Raquel? Right, literally. So with that

being said, don't send her death threats but I'm back. I feel like you can tell i think she's easily produced in the same vein going on reality tv you do have free will whether you want to admit it or not there's no gun to your head you are the ultimate you're the last line of defense and you can and there's a way to do things that are true to you with all of that being like being kept in mind i think she is easily produced i think she's willing to give them that but i think it shows her level of intelligence that's like what i'm kind of gathering anyways back to the jewelry store do you think there's a way in which they were like

okay why don't we do a scene where you guys go shopping, you talk about some things, whatever, it's for this episode, they have like planning a date, like they have a layout. And then she herself, she just doesn't have the wherewithal or it's probably some malicious intent where she's like,

I'm here at a jewelry store, I can buy this necklace. Do you think this scene was set up for her to intentionally buy the necklace or do you think she was there and was like, oh, I'll do this necklace. Do you think this scene was set up for her to intentionally buy the necklace? Or do you think she was there and was like, oh, I'll do this. Nobody will notice. Because how are they letting everything hang out? I just don't understand.

It's so in everyone's face. That's the thing. Because to make this show very different than The Bachelor, right? But even on The Bachelor, when you're in the bub at the bubble. The bub. There are conversations, right? You don't know about it. You're in the bub at the bubble the bub there are conversations right you don't know about it you're like if you're like in your situation you might say hey there's i was thinking about this and you might pitch an idea to the producers and they might say

that's great and whatever so even and vanderpump i'm sure there's a lot of conversations between cast and production about like well there's this jewelry store like what do you want to do and then producers might have some ideas. And I'm sure there's a collaboration, right? And so it's kind of fascinating that this must have come from Raquel. Knowing that she wanted to, she could have bought anything. It was such a random, kind of not really meaningful scene. It's only meaningful now because we now know the backstory behind it.

Right. It's just like whatever them being spotted at the Abbey. It's like it all makes sense now going backwards. But like in the moment, they just never thought they were going to get caught. It's like she thought she could legitimately get away with buying a matching necklace on TV. Like what do you even call that? What trait is that? It's not just, like, not being smart.

Well, hubris? Like, overconfident? Yes, yes. It's like she could have seen that necklace and been like, okay, I'm gonna come back and buy that when I'm not being filmed. Right.

Because, like, I want the necklace. I want to match my... Yeah, secret lover. Secret, yeah. Sickening. But, like, I don't want... I don't need my secret lover. Yeah, sickening. But I don't want, I don't need to broadcast it. I don't need to put it on national TV. So I'll just come back and get it later.

But she didn't have that thought. It just immediately happened. No, there's like, listen, people make mistakes. People fuck up, you know. But like, it's now that we're watching it back and whether it's the necklace or the scene at the end with Katie and Tom and Katie's mom, I completely agree with you that she does seem heavily produced, right? Because I'm watching it and I'm thinking to myself, literally, what is Raquel thinking? And it's kind of fascinating because Katie's reaction was like, you felt her pain her anger her frustration her like

what the fuck is going on to have a person like raquel sit down and and say i'm oh by the way i'm disappointed in like the dog situation i would have lost my fucking mind yeah i'm disappointed with how you're texting your husband if like someone was literally none of your business like how do you even say that in so many words? Like, it has nothing to do with you. Nothing to do. But I guarantee, I'm sure that they're at this party and like probably some producer was like.

Yeah. Because that's what I've always described and let me know what you think. People always ask us about producers, whatever. They're just, they're the devil on your shoulder that tells you that every emotion you feel is valid. Yeah. Whether you're excited, you're valid.

You're angry, you're valid. You're sad, you're valid. And they amplify that feeling to say you have the right to feel that way. Yeah. And I want you to express that feeling to its maximum level. I would agree. I think we also do that to ourselves I think there's psychology of a camera that like knowing that you're being filmed and being watched that makes all of these feelings elevated because I do kind of have a hot

take on on production producers too they have a job to do they are bringing money home to their families like I know it's not the same but I was a nurse for eight years what we did was hard at some points it was literally torturous to our patient I know it's much different but like I was inflicting pain but I had to because it was my job and my job is how I literally pay my rent like that is like a to b in your mind I know production there's like more involved obviously they have a fascination with tv with people with watching them in these settings. But a producer would be remiss not taking advantage of somebody like Raquel. Yeah.

Who they're like, we have a TV to show to make. Vanderpump is up for three daytime Emmys. The whole world is like obsessed with watching. They're creating amazing TV. And that's what they do. And she puts up no fight whatsoever. It's like, we want you to say that. She's like, all right, I'll definitely literally.

And I think it is now that you say like the hubrisness, the over, she does this season, especially. I remember watching her in the beginning when she just came on with James Kennedy. I was like, who is this girl? She was young. She was literally in college. That's been on for 10 years. Like she has no place in TV.

She's like way too young. She doesn't know what's going on. Then to watch her, you kind of see her in her natural state then and then to watch her now, it's like, where's this? This confidence isn't coming from within. It's coming from a different source

for you to think that you can get away with this kind of behavior. Yeah, it's like she's like mimicking people without having like the same character development they've been through like the way she like claps back like and I'm sure we'll get to this so much when we talk about the conversation with Katie and her mom but like she tries to like have the same attitude and energy and passion that Katie has but with Katie it's like I have been going through this for years and years and years. And this is like hard fought personal development that I've finally come around to. And so when I say words like this,

like there's an underlying, like an emotional meat to it. I know what they mean. Yeah. Not just saying words, like I have a relation to it. Katie's always been a strong personality and strong character on the show.

So she like knows where she comes from. Katie's my favorite, at least this season i also like i relate to katie i think the most of all the characters yeah just because she she usually has a strong point of view whether you agree or disagree with her she has conviction and she's willing to pick a side and she roots a lot of her decisions in what she believes are your character or just like you. There are certain things you do and don't do. And again, you have the right to disagree with her.

But she she stands by like, you know, how you treat people. She observes people and she will kind of judge you for that. Yeah. Listen, we love Ariana. Yeah. We love her. I love her. You know.

Yeah. We can't say anything about Ariana. She is off limits. Except, I, listen. Hey, there he goes. There he goes. Here's the thing. Here's the thing.

I'm really, I can't wait to have, whether it's on this show or just in person, when we get to run into Ariana, I'd love to ask her because she's kind of been notorious for being switzerland she's always the one who's just like you know i'm cool with everyone it's chill and i have a lot of those friends people have often at times have been frustrated with the they haven't done anything to me people where they're only kind of prerequisite for someone being their friend as long as like they're cool with me i don't really care how they treat other how they treat other people even people they are friends with and there were several especially this episode when ariana's so upset that her friends are fighting i want to ask ariana before all this before you found out that tom was fucking raquel why were you friends

with raquel like what was it you know i know i get she was nice to you and i understand but you yeah you see these examples of how she is treating other people and how she is so dismissive of other people that she's friends with and and in life, I would always have these situations where I'd tell a friend, I'd be like, why do you hang out with so-and-so? They're like, well, they just never done anything to me. It's just like, well, they're going to. It's like on a grander scale, like character.

It's like, oh, they haven't done anything to me, but what's your character like? That's how I want to surround myself with people who I know have good character. I always have a saying, I can't trust them as far as I can throw him. It's like, even if you haven't done anything to me, I'm going to keep you at arm's length because I cannot trust you as far as I can throw you. I can't throw you very far. You see these things?

But I do. Yeah. I do kind of also like my wheels are turning because I wonder just watching the beginning of the show. They always. That, they always that's another thing that's like it's another layer in kind of breaking this down because everybody fucks everybody on the show. Everybody has been is their incestual. It's their only they've only been around each other for these last 10 years. They go in and out of relationships. The girls are constantly fighting with each other, coming back.

I think they're a little bit deconditioned to maybe like not judgment, but like assessing someone's character because like I think Lala stand out in this season. I love that she's sober. I think she's grown so much since the beginning. She really has learned. She like admits her wrongs. She holds people accountable, but she also gives them grace

because she knows she's gotten grace in the past. So to watch it come full circle is like, holy shit, this is amazing that we've seen this woman develop and her style is insane into this woman before our eyes. And she's learned from experience and people like I can assume assume but it's like people

who are sober have to go through a lot yeah to like kind of reconcile with yourself and your past so that automatically comes with character development insight but anyways so i wonder how much of ariana's stance with raquel is just she's just kind of numb to all the bullshit of the show. She's like, okay, they'll leave, they'll come back. They'll make up, it's fine. Yeah, totally. We've all done some pretty nasty shit to each other. Raquel, her demeanor

is kind of sweet, so I'm just going to give her a chance. Also, she might have something for the wounded. You know how some people are like, I always want to take in the wounded because like i truly don't see a real connection between ariana and raquel like a friendship like connection i also wonder like two things because i think one like compartmentalization is a term that gets utilized so much when you're talking about people behaving with others who are

like i find this person horrible i feel like they have horrible vibes and they're consistently like rude to me how are you and they're like well i compartmentalize like our dynamic is separate from that and so i think that's how a lot of like really smart people who you feel like you have so much alignment with them in all areas but then you have this huge disconnect you're like how do i not fuck with this person that you fuck with like how are we here and i think a lot of times the answer is like oh well i compartmentalize and like i keep these things separate yeah but even if i don't mind her being friends with her because i i think i think being a good friend is accepting your friendships like weaknesses and faults and shortcomings and just

like challenging them like i wanted ariana to be like raquel what the fuck are you doing you know instead of lala saying it or katie right like have the friend who's actually like friends with both of them say girl what are you doing because when when lala says it ricalza sees it as someone who hates me yelling at me yeah and when katie says it it's like someone who hates me yells at me but when if ariana was saying it it might be someone who's just like babe as a friend right you're fucking up right now yeah yeah and i'm just like it was frustrating to not have ariana speak up in that moment yeah she does have kind of like gabby like you were saying like this mindset of like helping the wounded do you think some of it comes from the like raquel can't feel like everyone's her enemy raquel already has all these people who are so

signed up to play bad cop i can't join that list because then it comes everybody versus her yeah and this is it like all comes down. I think this is how I look at it. Like this is their job. This is work. They film for two or three months out of the year. She's like, I'm going to have to just like make it work for this. Like who knows if they actually hang out like outside of this, you know.

So she is so good at playing like the neutral kind of matronly. She's like, I can push through. It's fine. We can't have everyone hating Raquel. I just think it's that shit that not only did Raquel act like that and fully talk to Ariana about the sex life between them and Tom Sandoval

that is what I took away from the episode that was jarring before this party did you notice that the Toms were a little late to the something about her sandwich situation yeah yeah you wanna know why yeah they were on a double date with Joe and Raquel the four of them went to an event. They're all wearing the exact same outfit.

Remind me who Joe. Oh, Joe. The like female roommate of Tom Schwartz. Oh, the one he said, I love you too. Correct. That no one really talked about in the middle of the season. He loved. He was like, love you too.

That was like, and it wasn't like love you by that. You say to a friend, it felt like a very like endearing. I love you. Also, Tom has said it himself. And why are you living with somebody who's sorry a woman like i can't there you why does the apartment look like that yeah we talk about why is the ceiling so low why is there shit everywhere boxes everywhere no art on the wall no woman is living like that and as a guy i am capable of of allowing my apartment to look like that but he he i yeah i am you're like where

is this going i'm capable but but is he just that's that while watching that i was like is he doing this so is he so willing and generous for the show that he's like you know what i'm gonna be the guy who looks like he's emotionally damaged fresh off the divorce but there's just boxes stacked everywhere because he could have cleaned yeah again like there's cameras oh my god that like also blows my mind i'm like how is there a mess when you know cameras are coming and you could do so much damage in 20 minutes of just picking up you just put it in that one like one, don't go in that room and everything else looks fairly like picked up. But like outside of his front door,

there's just stacks of boxes everywhere. Everywhere. There's this joke on TikTok going around that Schwartz always looks like he is on vacation and like forgot his suitcase at the end. And he's just like trying to survive. He's like always like a little disheveled. He's like cast away.

We're like, where is your volleyball? Meanwhile, I feel like with Ali's apartment, I'm always like, damn, she did a deep cleaning before this, like before they shot here. Like you can tell she just like everything is in place. They can open any drawer in any like Ali's apartment and it would be perfectly organized. Like and then you see Schwartz's and you're like, what the fuck? Like what? You get away with this because you're a man and people are still like Schwartz is kind

of hot. It's like, no, he's like lost all of that. But do you think this is part of it? Like where it's like, you know how, like what I remember, like Lala specifically will always be like, they're like the biting my finger, like, oh, so unbecoming, like feel bad for me. Do you think this is just part of the victim complex of like, I've learned which things if I don't do it? Yeah. It's a a little bit lame but it's also like people pity me and

then are nice to me and then expect less from me like do you think this falls within like how deep is it yeah i don't know but i can't imagine i'd love to ask tom that it's just like why did you let your apartment look like why are you doing crunches on the carpet with your beets? That's for sure. That's what I was thinking. You're telling me that apartment doesn't have a gym? Bullshit. Why are you sweating into a rug? And you're mid-conversation. I'm stretching. What should I do before my friend shows up?

That was TV. The push-ups were for TV. This is B-roll. He's like, okay, what do you want to do while you're waiting? Crunch. You can pick up and clean or you can do some push-ups. Or you can do push-ups with beads on with a wire. It's like 2023. Literally unhinged.

I also think he can't really see beyond his nose. So I don't know. I feel like he's not that deep. Sandoval walked into his apartment and goes, Jesus Christ. Yeah. When a man with that big a coffee stain looks it walks into your space and he goes you look like a mess did you hear schwartz he said is that self-tanner

like shorts not calling your ass out like on tv yes and those painted nails i can't that a couple episodes ago when shorts was like you didn't't, or maybe it was season nine. I'm getting all confused. But like they didn't make a meeting for Sandy and shorts. No, that was this season. Because he was getting his nails done. And he wasn't kidding. He wasn't kidding. He was like, I can't walk around with chipped nails.

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promo code V-I-A-L-L. That's Nutraful.com promo code V I A L L. So Sandoval shows up to Tom Schwartz's apartment. So we now know that they go on a date. They went on a date. A double date. Yeah. Where are you getting that information? Oh, don't you worry about a thing.

So they went to an event for Kyle Chan, I believe his name is. And so there was a lot of like press photos that were released way back when they were in the same outfit. But they're wearing the exact I mean, they literally both have floral shirts on. Tom's wearing the red suit over the exact same outfit. Those shirts, by the way, were just terrible. And so they went to this event with Joe and Raquel. So Raquel basically goes on a date with Tom Sandoval and then has the balls to show up to Sir and start talking to Ariana about why don't you

want to fuck him? She's like, wait, so like you're sure you don't like like you want to be with him, right? Ariana's like, babe I'm just talking about like a little fight we had. She's like, but do you want to break up with him? Yeah. You guys hate on me. And what do you have sex with him, right? Yeah. Literally, I do. If a friend was like right, backing me into a corner kind of

saying this, I'd be like, where's this coming from? Chill the fuck out. We have a small little argument. Yeah. And this is like, what do you mean? Am I sexually attracted to him? Like, obviously, are you my boyfriend of 10 years? Like, why? What do you what are you getting out of this? And she was explaining she was like, I don't feel an emotional connection right now. So like, I haven't been feeling it with sex. That is the most relatable thing in the world. Everybody understands that when you feel like even if you're like think someone is so hot, you just feel like you haven't been connecting with them. And so it doesn't like intimacy doesn't feel accessible.

Like Ariana beautifully articulates this thing that is also very vulnerable to talk about on TV. And then Raquel is like, oh, so you feel bad about your body. That must be the end. Like Ariana's like, I mean, it's kind of an ever present part part of womanhood but like not what i'm talking about here bitch it's so wild because they both raquel and sandoval both like do this thing where they're about to cry and then they're like like when sandoval is having the conversation and they both cover their face and then they're like anyways they're back to normal literally he like passed passes I like this and all I can look at is like his painted fingernail. And I'm like looking for one tear.

I'm like, nothing. Yeah. Come on. That that fight, though. I mean, take out the fact that Tom is sleeping with Raquel. It was a fairly relatable like fight between two people who have been dating for for nine years in terms of like not feeling connected or being on the on a different page it is kind of fascinating to have these two people who have been dating so long have you know willing to have this very real fight on camera to talk

about you know how they do you think they really don't ari Ariana did not like call him out for any type of exaggerating when he said they only had sex four times a year. That's a very vulnerable thing to kind of put out there in the world. And just like whether, you know, it puts them kind of both on blast. You know, it's just like, are they not having sex because of what Tom is doing? Is it Ariana? Is it the couple? Like, it's a very vulnerable thing to put your sex life out there with your partner yeah but they do all the time like not them but these people on vanderpump

it's wild to me it is yeah because i'm like oh like how i feel like that is somewhere like i really wouldn't go on camera especially with somebody who i had a very private personal relationship like off camera in my real life and then i'd be like oh you want to get into this now like you're gonna regret it so what's your definition of quality time Gabby I cannot I literally can't his I was like watching because my I feel like my love language is quality time so and obviously his in the way I love when Ariana was like no that's the definition of quality time i'm like yeah you fucking tell them because there's not much wiggle room and then in his interview when he's like mushrooms at sunrise like hang gliding hang gliding skinny dipping

taking some mushrooms and watching the sunrise skinny dipping in the pool hang gliding i don't know i like stimuli literally make it make sense no you're you're describing a fantasy world and like you trying to like tell us this with conviction you know that you're full of shit this is what i can't handle quality time to him is him describing things he likes to do for fun right is it is adrenaline adventure sports it has nothing to do with like that's not a love language doing what your partner likes that makes your partner feel connected to you that like the concept of that is just completely over his head yes your partner's literally saying we don't ever have sex and she's just like well i don't feel connected to you actually it was tom that said the word we've

been less connected so he acknowledges the disconnect between the two of them and she's just like what i'd like more time with you I can't just have sex with someone who just like comes home at two in the morning drunk and just like wants to fuck and he's just like well I don't want to sit down and like just be with you and talk about

stuff he's constantly gaslighting her which like I know we just use that word but I do think this is can we just use it gaslight gaslight gaslight gaslight we've accepted that it's now just the internet one yeah whatever I truly think he

is gaslighting her into thinking that she is the reason like like they don't have a bad relationship or he's always coming to the relationship with the problems like oh well this this this and this which his even his like what he's saying doesn't have any meaning behind it. Like there's nothing tangible, like he's just saying things to say them all the while fucking Raquel. So it's like you are creating these problems, making it seem like it's Ariana's fight and like issue.

You're not willing to see the other side how can you sit down with someone and be like like what is our love language let's like do this together and him be like i want to hang glide it's like meet me fucking halfway but there's like come on there was a part where they're fighting and it almost seemed like tom was looking at what would have been like a producer like on the fourth wall we We've been on these fights. We've been on both ends, everyone, where especially if you're Tom, right? Like deep down, you don't want to be in the relationship. You kind of want out and you're willing to have this talk.

But what you're really doing deep down is trying to convince them to break up with you or convince them to want to not be with you. And that was exactly what Tom was doing. Because no matter what she said, he was like, but I just don't feel connected. And when he said that, he was almost looking out of this corner of his eye where he was just like, she keeps trying to work on things. And I keep trying to convince her that we're not good. Yeah, because Ariana is of sound mind. She is.

She's articulate. She's really smart. You can't pull one over on her like she gets it and she doesn't want to put up with your bullshit so when he's like pushing it's like overwhelming i feel like the theme underneath is like be a fucking man and break up that's all you need to do you don't need to like have this affair with her best friend you could have easily solved the problem because it wasn't like whatever it was like a one one-time thing or it was like really convoluted or like they really were and like i

know their relationship isn't good but ariana's willing to work on it clearly he doesn't want to be in it it's okay it happens you guys have been together for 10 years why aren't you married even like clearly there's something that's like he's like fertilizing her eggs yes all yeah while like cheating on her yeah like you went to the sperm that's how much of a coward he is you're telling me you can't sit down with a woman and say i don't you i don't want to be with you that is too much for you to do so instead you're going to fertilize her eggs because you're that passive the only eggs that she has frozen now are fertilized oh my god so she has to have your fucking kid oh my god i would light that on fire actually and also just because it's come to light like his shitty fucking behavior and like it is very obvious for like

everybody who like tunes in like oh boy this guy's colossally in the wrong oh boy undo like all of the hours that ariana has spent like really negotiating with her intuition trying to like understand why there's this disconnect with this man she loves like no matter how much after the fact she can know that she is right and correct like she has spent so much like that damages your relationship with yourself when you have to spend this much time with someone you've invested so much of yourself in and who you trust and who you give benefit of the doubt. And then to have to have those kinds of crazy making conversations like regularly, like really diminishes you in a way that like you don't just get back instantly the second everyone realizes he's a huge idiot. Right. And I do wonder how that affects like her other relationships and conversations like if she's constantly fighting

this thought like no never never don't listen to it so i wonder if that's even why she's more like tolerant of raquel because she's dealing with this separate side of her that's going through so much ariana's having a bad fucking time this season overall even before it was unfolding we started getting clues with skandaval she was down bad like she looked sad her dog her grandma she was always crying like always leaving i'm like god ariana can't catch a break like in earlier seasons you would like really watch her have fun and it just seems like she didn't have the light that she used to and i feel like you can't help but think like it was all the subliminal messaging and like her fighting herself on it i just can't get over that conversation with raquel at the bar i'm like

you have to put this bitch in her place because she knows how to didn't mean i don't know if i should be calling people bitches but like you know because you know she has like the wherewithal and the capability to process the information that's given to her and articulate it. And I feel like she would have in any other scene. I hope at some point whether it's the finale or the reunion, Ariana does call Raquel out for that. I'm sure.

You stood there. I think she called her subhuman. Yeah. Oh, my favorite. That trailer. Poo-poo heads. You're both poo-poo heads. That was the best. Psychotic. James Kennedy. Outrageous. Such good TV. Hisoo-poo heads. You're about poo-poo heads. That was the best. Psychotic. James Kennedy. Outrageous. Such good TV. His one-liners.

I like them. I really... He's a hoot. Yeah, he really is. Also, the show kind of did him dirty when he was talking about... My name is right next to Cascade. Their editing is unreal, I think.

It's so cheeky. It's like a little wink. This guy's been on your show for 10 years you can't do him a solid no and they're still making fun of him which i love because like why are we djing sorry come on get out of that you don't think there's hope for uh no uh james no he i mean i will say he did a remix of the Boys a Liar song that's been on the radio. And he took the mic at one point and he goes, Tom Sandoval's a liar. Tom Sandoval's a liar. And it's like, it's pretty catchy. Yeah.

He doesn't really rhyme. It's like a weird Al Yankovic type of DJ where he just kind of throws in random, you know, like, it's funny. I enjoy it. It is. What do you make of, like, him and Ali's relationship in the show? Also, it feels so weird saying I'm like the other Ali. But like, do you know, there was at one point there was the line where it was like, well, he views Ali as his future wife.

She views him as his current boyfriend. How did that sit with you guys? Do you agree? I don't know enough about the relationship to agree or disagree. I'd love to ask James and ally that if they ever come on the show wink wink um but yeah i'm sure i'm curious i don't know what do you think abby i i think he's like a hopeless romantic and falls really hard and like loves to be in relationships i don't know because then he was like cheating on raquel I feel like the whole time so like is it like his

like schtick a little bit I don't know he is over the top I think they're an unlikely match from the outside but I do think there's like from what I can see on the TV I feel like there's connection she seems pretty grounded yeah that's what I'm like I'm pretty surprised

and Lisa when she was talking to Allie and like Lisa seems to and lisa when she was talking to ally and like lisa seems to have this like almost surprisingly surprising affinity to james like she likes james way more than the toms i feel like it's because he's british and that's not true at all yeah i don't know i'm like it's because what is it though like what is it about the motherland literally i think because james has a personality and he gives and lisa vanderpump is like literal icon queen like she's the best i feel it is it's like her british chic roots like um she's crude but in such a posh way she's a businesswoman she's so fucking smart she literally vanderpump like she it's her name but she's never in it she comes in for five seconds

always above the fray yeah always airbrushed to hell her lighting the way they light her it's like she came from heaven and it's glowing yeah when you see her you're like damn like this is like royalty like what is she doing but created like a dynasty 10 years of tv you know she's getting a huge cut of that. I think she makes like 90 mil or something. I don't even know. Yeah.

No. It's not 90 mil. I don't know. Maybe between I'm like yeah yeah I'm not 90 mil yeah yeah yeah

I've been to the Villa Rosa. It's Okay. I added a few zeros. I meant I meant like five figures. Either way. She's making money

Over 10 years 90,000 90 million who cares It's so wild because I got a drink with Katie A few weeks ago and I was like How did this show even start Like I don't think I know that And she said that they truly were all working there And Lisa was doing Real Housewives

And she like came in with a producer And like talked to Ariana and Katie and Lala. And they were just like, listen, like we're all kind of dating each other. Like we're all. And they just explained their lives. It's a restaurant. Yeah. And they were like, literally.

This could be a show. I feel like, Gabby, what do you think? I don't think they'd ever do it because I think it kind of goes against the grain of their format and love. But. Bachelor. After. Yes. After the life. I feel like there's so many love triangles and people hooking up

and everyone's this pretty messy behind the scenes and the whole influencer world and the stagecoach of it all. Oh, it's the finale episode, stagecoach. There's this weird competition between us peers, but there's friendships because weird competition between us peers. But there's friendships because like we, you know, we have very relatable experiences. So no matter what you kind of go through in the fights, there's always like this. Hey, we're still like among friends.

And I think it would be such good television. It would be Vanderpump. No, I can see the transitions now because we have to edit it very similar where it's like Susie's apartment in like Miracle Mile. And then it's like Natalie's in Valley village like i can see the exterior shot is i don't think it could be produced by the same production company because i think those producers have they're so ingrained yeah with like the bachelor playbook like when they try to do that with the ferguson twins all the way oh by the way congratulations to em, congratulations to Emily Ferguson on her newborn baby. Shout out!

Yay! Pew, pew, pew, pew, pew. I remember they had the twins. I thought they were great TV. It was fresh off of when we were all on Paradise together. And they just kind of, they can't get away from their kind of bachelory, kind of campy, you know, find love. They just don't want to let,

I think it would be hard for them to peel back the layer of the kind of the Hollywood influence-y aspect of it, which would be such a good storyline. They're very protective of that. Yeah. But it would be so good. Yeah, no, I agree, because we're naturally incestual. Yeah.

It's like there's no way to get around it because of all the reasons that you're saying. For some reason, like most people in Bachelor Nation are single. I mean, I feel like that is pretty telling. Hello. Well, embarrassing. There's some deep-seated issues. I'm like, why are we all so single?

Listen, baby, you can't run with the dog. Stay on the porch. Stay on the porch. Stay on the porch, baby. I mean, no, I'm saying? Yeah. Stay on the porch. Stay on the porch, baby. I mean, no. I'm definitely a dog. I am a dog. Yeah.

But like a chihuahua. Like a really cute one. Like very pretty. Yeah. Yeah, like right here. Well, honestly, I wasn't going to say this, but now I'm going to share it with a group because at the beginning of this episode, Natalie, we were talking about dogs and Natalie was like, yeah, Gabby, like we have a dog like you. And I didn't know you had a dog.

And I thought she was just saying like personality wise. And I was like, what an interesting thing to say. I'm like, dog see dog. A player sees game. Bitch recognizes bitch. Literally. We're like inside of us are oh. No, I think that's genius.

And I think it already happens because we just hang out with each other. And it's so, even just like events, you know, like you get invited to the same events. You have one too many cocktails and you're like making out with whoever from season whatever. It would be so good. I wish they would. It's an amazing TV show waiting to happen. I just, I don't know. Why don't we find everyone who's out of contract

and we produce the show ourselves? They would jump on it. I feel like everyone would jump. They tried that with Ashley and Jared and Tanner and Jade, and I had a small role in it. And Ashley and Jared messed it up because they were going to do something.

And then Ashley and Jared signed a new deal with some going to do something and then Ashley and Jared signed a new deal with some other production company for the same. I was like, alright. It was with the same production company as Love is Blonde. So is that still to come? No, this was like four or five years ago. What ever came of it? Nothing.

Because they did like a little YouTube it was a little youtube series and they were gonna see if it got picked up and ashley and jared got really impatient and they they signed with some other it was like their project so i was kind of like they weren't like you ruined it for all of us no i mean it was it was their thing and they were like trying to and i was like i wasn't like sure i was like i don't know if there's gonna be any good so i'm like i'll just i'll show up this is your thing i'll show up right you know here and there if it's good i'll definitely do it i'm gonna definitely take credit but if it's not like this

is a totally you but it was right around their wedding and honestly i think it could have been something but i'm kind of glad it didn't i don't think i would have met natalie we've talked about that oh yeah it would have been kind of a mess but either way it would they need to do it someone like with the new kind of the new recently you know off the show people yeah like fresh out of contract it it has to be like relatively recent people well that's also the thing oh my god now like my wheels are really turning i feel like mess a lot of mess happens with like night oneers it's like well yeah it's like the audience doesn't truly maybe have a relationship with them but they like i break them up in thirds the first thirds the second thirds and like the final like yeah every third is different because the first third they're the there's

the messiest and the sloppiest they will do any interview with anyone yes and they know everything about the show yeah they're experts yeah they have all these stories yeah you're just thinking you were there for two days you were more in it than i was like how do you know yeah i'm like i'm confused where's all this information coming like i just can't keep up yeah but yeah i think production they're so like tied to their like soap opera-y edit it's like filming is actually so fun nobody would ever ever guess that like we have a good time because of the way it's edited but they can't it's always the same storyline you always say i love you during hometowns there's no like other excitement

because they're falling in love right before hometown. I'm falling. Right. I'm falling. I'm falling. How long have you been falling? Just today. Like a damn Life Alert commercial.

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Wow. Dude, stop with the voice. Just keep it simple. I've seen promos on TV, dude. This is how you get the fans engaged. This is how you get listeners. We're trying to get listeners here. If we just say, oh, we're two dudes that talk about Bravo, people are going get tired of it already we need some oomph all right then fine let's try to

do it with your voice bravo bros good job wait speaking of hometowns though like can we talk about the mom fight in detail because in vanderpump because i feel like that was kind of unparalleled reality tv because like you were saying at the beginning about how we have these deep-seated relationships from the history of the show. Yeah. To add the mom to that. Raquel, don't talk about all the post-moms. The disrespect.

Get her name out of your mouth. Yeah. Oh, God. Yeah. But it was definitely a producer who, like, Raquel was definitely three or four drinks in. She was a little sauced. She had her little lemon drop shot.

You know what you should do? You need to go tell Katie exactly what what you know you were wrong don't you think it's a little annoying that katie's making such a big deal about this i mean she's divorced after all like rage texting yeah her ex-husband that's pretty that's basically bullying she called you a whore and you want to be a role model and this girl's bullying basically she sits down she goes amazing sandwiches yeah like what the fuck actually your segues just like don't even she like kind of tries to like be friends she's like thanks i know it's really big i love your sandwiches and i'm gonna say the most

offensive shit you'll ever hear like just skip the sandwich part just like be yourself makes it worse yeah it's so bad but also for me it's like it was hard to watch because and lala calls like calls it out she's like katie what are you even doing like get out of the conversation and that's me always because i'm like i'm just not buying it raquel you have no idea even what you're saying you're like kind of drunk there's no emotion behind it you literally have like no dog in this fight also the whole short stuff was like already so annoying. I'm like, what are you just the way she she says to Katie like, oh, yeah, I would make out with shorts. Like who's telling you to do these things?

And like, why don't you have any filter? Just a normal person wouldn't say that. So I have a hard time buying anything that she says. You would have a more productive conversation with a pig. Yeah. Sometimes Lala says something. I'm like, Oh,

I don't disagree. I don't know that I would say it that way. I feel like she watched the whole fight and she was just like more, more better conversation. I got it. And then she stands up and then she drops the line. She just waits for Katie to go. Are you hearing this?

Yeah. That's my cue. She's like, when watching also what I would give, I love to watch kind of like from what this, because you only see so much of the conversation in the room that they're in, but knowing that Lala's watching

from afar, like sticking her neck out. But also like that entire table of people that when Raquel sits down, like we're talking about eating ass. And then she sits down and then they that entire table is just watching them fight yeah if you live in LA right you know that man you know that man who like thinks he's so fucking charming you walk into the conversation circle he's like hi we were just talking about

which first lady we gray bra up and you're like okay like they think they're so fun and welcoming yeah literally it's like chill we're talking about eating ass like oh my god let me sit down and like get comfortable you're like never mind i'm gonna fucking go yeah i'm like toss salad give me a second i'm sick who has less of a backbone uh and that's what here's the thing about the toms they don't say they only stand up for someone they're not like involved in i don't know if i'm explaining myself well but here is a fight that swartz is involved in raquel's coming up to katie inserting her opinion on a marriage to katie's point like whether they're married or separated whatever the fuck like you're among friends and yeah don't throw it in katie's face that she is out there moving on

and dating other guys that's not the fucking point the point is is that these two were married in this group of friends and the last thing they need is like someone in their friend group like swerving in when it's not even about like love or anything like that katie's just like it's like okay fine if you were in love with each other fine but you're not you're just fucking around and you're fucking around in my face when i don't want to deal with the shit because this is a guy I still have feelings with, despite the fact that I don't want to be married to him because he never makes me a priority. He's my husband, husband, husband.

Literally, they were married. I'm so fucked that you would say that. Yeah. There's a lack of self-awareness. What are you talking about? Raquel is so she's one of those scary people. What's so scary about her is her ability to kind of convince herself of any narrative. Like she can come up with anything.

Like when she was talking to Charlie at the jewelry store and convincing Charlie that James isn't over her. You know, like she's so good at laying like, yeah, it's because I, she's her rebound, right? She's her rebound. And like, she is so good at like, she uses all these kind of buzzwords that she hears and then applies it to herself

to make herself look like the victim or the one who's not getting the attention or who's not seen or heard or who's being picked on by the group of friends with no thought of how are her actions affecting other people, as long as she can convince herself that she's in like she's the one who's being wrong right yeah she's like kind of like a chameleon i feel like in that way she just hears things and like morphs into it they're like okay this

is the same language vocabulary that i've heard before this is kind of how i'm feeling so i'm gonna regurgitate it yeah it's like you don't actually know what the fuck is going on it's so wild but back to the tom so anyways tom is not he's nowhere swartz is nowhere to be seen hiding behind a plant but and then his buddy sandoval popping in it's always like when when someone's the toms only stand up for each other yeah but no one else they never know tom stands up for rachel they stand up for each other and rachel yeah that's it it's so nuts concerning you guys are so guilty you act so guilty you're not even trying to hide it sandoval is the type of guy who is he only will be on top during 69 you know he's like you will suffocate bitch you will not fucking breathe you're gonna suck my

dick and you're not gonna breathe that is the energy he gives off literally he's not pretty good I know I'm like trying to think I'm like have I been with somebody like that

no he's like let's do 69 alright balls are snapping around the chair I'm like I'm turning blue I don't know how you're supposed to do it

I'm like calling 911 while he's like he's like I know I'm how you're supposed to do it I'm like calling 911 while he's like I know I'm driving you crazy babe my dick is so big you literally can't even I'm like fully asphyxiating you're just dead

he's like you're crazy literally limp he's like I'll love crazy. You like that. And you're like, no, I didn't. Literally limp. He's like, I'll love you like that. I gave you a limp, baby. If I dig so big, you gotta limp. I made you go limp. No, I'm literally fucking dead.

Like, no, I don't have enough oxygen in my brain. I'm anoxic. Too far. Anyways, put me. I feel like Sandoval the most. I noticed him doing that the most. And I do think it's like kind of a way to deflect from his own terrible traits that he knows is like fully going in on other people and like sticking up for other people's bad behaviors. Because he's like knows he's kind of in the wrong all the time and is just like projecting.

And it's like you know katie had no like her mom getting into the conversation she didn't ask her mom to do that her mom is her mother and so she of course is gonna stick up for her daughter right and katie's not gonna tell her mother to stop talking like yeah so for the fact that tom sandwell be like to have your mother stick up for you is like who's gonna argue with miss maloney it's like she's sticking up for her daughter you dumb fuck fuck. And Raquel is arguing with Miss Maloney, so what the fuck do you mean? She started it when she started it with the, oh God.

Like, that is just so fucking rude. I swear to God if anybody had the audacity. Where were you raised? Where were you raised? She was genuinely curious. Katie was like, no, I really fucking need to know. That's the only logical question at that point. It's like, where did you come

from who taught you who taught you that you can talk to anyone's mother like this like respect your elders I don't think she cares at all and I that's the scary part about Raquel is I don't think she gets it I don't think she sees it I just when she walked went and then you and then Tom Katie Brink grabs

Tom and I was I was infuriated with Tom Swartz at that point where he's, I mean, he's clearly drunk. So he's like laughing about this whole thing. The only defense to Tom is, is like, is that he didn't know what was going on. The problem is because he's so afraid to involve himself in any drama or stand up for something. So that's on him. I don't think he fully realized what he was caught up in at that moment yeah because he just

he was like there was a scene where they kind of flashed him sitting with a group of people where they heard the yelling and he kind of had a look like oh fuck like what is going on and like he you could tell he like wanted he kind of got a little smaller and kind of curled up nothing to do with it no because it's like they need you you need to say something like you're close obviously obviously he wants a relationship with katie yeah that's what's so infuriating yeah totally but he still like won't not that like i know in the earlier seasons like katie does i think she has also had a lot of character development and like what she's asking for in this season makes so much

sense i think before it was like she just wanted him to stand by her no matter what like right or wrong so i'm like yeah maybe but sometimes we can talk about these things like there is a little gray area but like they are so close they obviously want a friendship they care for each other he needs to buck the fuck up and like go you hear someone fighting you know it's Raquel and somebody you can assume it's Katie because of everything that's going on go insert yourself be the mediator like help out and Raquel started it this all came from Raquel sitting down at Katie and Ariana's night to bring up some past shit and throw it in their face and then like the thoughts of like when she comes outside and she goes i am empathetic and she explains her empathy by talking about how

she understands how jealous katie is of her like the insanity when tom kissed someone and the fact that it was me hurt even more like holy fucking shit right that's not you being an empathetic person that's you being hate to use the word a bit narcissistic like it's like even if schwartz didn't know what was going on like he knew there was fighting he knew it was recalling raquel and katie he didn't know what it was about but then when katie pulls him outside and raquel comes up and he's like, no, no, no, no, it's okay. It's okay. Like, no, say, excuse me, Raquel,

I'm going to have a conversation with my wife. Literally, not the time. Give us a moment to just talk. Or just say, not the time, Raquel. Not right now. No. The way these boys like worship the ground she walks on. I don't honestly get it. She's trying to apologize. Yeah, she's not. And this is like if i was katie i'd be so fucking pissed like she had the right to be you need one second alone like emotions are so high and you just need to talk to this

one person who like knows you the most and even still in this instance you're gonna basically choose somebody else over her who Who's clearly in the wrong. Like, I can't imagine watching this back being, being shores, knowing like everything that's going on. It's like, do you feel like shit?

Because I, I'm sorry, but I hope so. Like all you had to do in those like times of conflict was like, listen to yourself and kind of like do the right thing, which is harder, but like it will pay dividends and they just like can't. I feel like I watch this show and I, like Sandoval,

I didn't think everything about him just- Gives you the ick. Gives everything about him. He's a big, big ick. But Swartz, I feel like there is a decent guy there. I want to believe there is. I think he's a little bit like wolf in sheep's clothing, like even too passive to like be a wolf.

So he's just like, I'm going to like skirt around all of this and make everyone think I'm a good guy because I'm like, I just want everyone to be happy. Like, sorry, you made out with Raquel when your wife was on the premise and like you say you're sorry, but you did it twice. And they literally say it wasn't malicious, but she already thinks that we kissed, so we might as well. They've been in a fit. You knew it was going to piss her off.

You talked about it. Yes, actively all the time. They've had multiple conversations about it and still did it. It's like now this is beyond malicious. Like, I don't even know. It's a short game like t-ball. Like in terms of like he's like the guy who wants everybody to have a good time. It's like you put him like he's a dad. You put him at a barbecue. Yeah. He would be really fucking nice to a new

family's kid. Like he would be nice to everyone. There's a few scenarios where like he would be a lovely guy. Everyone would get along. He'd be very caring and generous. But like t-ball not baseball. The second you add any kind of movement he has to actually time the bat with the ball like it all goes out the window because like the second a situation isn't incredibly obvious like and like simple he just goes into like kind of like crisis and blame mode and he always blames like the wrong person well no i just feel like i don't know he has such like the yeah the dad energy and people are like, oh, he's just I think he runs with this kind of like dumb. Oh, I didn't know. But I do think there's a deeper rooted his ability to break specifically Katie down to break women down. And you can see it. It's like he throws something out of, well, you are always the instigator of these things or he says something really hurtful.

And then it just he shoots it out. They have a reaction. He then responds to them of, why are you reacting this way? You're crazy. They leave. He's running after them going, can I get you an Uber, bubba? We've watched that cycle happen multiple times.

I can't deal with the way he'll like piss off Katie and say like really nasty things. Then come back and be like, Hey, can I get you a drink? It's like that. That's not working. Like whatever you're doing, that's his move.

That's his move to like, no matter what, be like, Hey, like you have a drink. L like whatever you're doing that's his move that's his move to like no matter what be like hey like you have a drink lala you're a great mom in the middle of their huge that's what he did the same thing you are an amazing mom yes lala responds yeah you're crazy you're a great mom it's the same it's like it's kind of like that locker room talk where guys can like talk shit and be like hey man but he yeah he can get himself out of anything he treats every serious situation like it's just not that big of a deal and it's nothing that we can't get over over a few drinks right it's like that's not true because these are all deep-seated actual like issues when it comes to marriage and like infidelity and all the things

like it's not you have to kind of stand up and like do the right thing it's like the bystander effect that's what i feel like he is he's a fucking bystander when somebody is really going through some shit and it's your job as a good citizen to like check the pulse like that's all he would never he would never he watches like a car hit a bike and he's like oh my god yeah he's like should we get bike and he's like oh my god yeah he's like should we get a drink he's like maybe a vodka yeah he goes and buys his 12 pack because i want a beer this is really stressful to watch you know wow right yeah yeah like that can only last for so long it did work on me in the beginning he's very charming i will say he is there's something like very charismatic about him and he's almost the most like i guess the guys on

the show are so like eccentric that he's kind of the most normal presenting that you're like this is a great guy by comparison but then you just keep watching like no because he's not a dj the bar is in fucking hell. Yeah. And Tom Schwartz is like in purgatory getting sucked in like with his hands like clawing in.

Yes. Schwartz needs to fire Sandoval as a friend. I mean that. Are they still friends? I mean, I the preview of the reunion where he's like talking about

when he found out and I was like, oh, you like didn't get your timelines matched up yeah because like that wait swartz says august and then sandoval kind of calls seemingly calls him out be like really and then yeah someone yeah did you see that still shot of it was sandoval and then swartz and then was it raquel and like swartz is in the in between the two of them and he looked like just a defeated. No, it's literally when people wake up in Vegas and they're like, who ate all the Taco Bell?

And you're like, it wasn't me. I don't know. You still have hot sauce coming out of your mouth and like that lettuce. It was kinky. I don't know. Swear to God. Yeah. No, I love like seeing photos from the reunion. There's one.

There's like a group photo. And I'm like seeing photos from the reunion. There's one, there's like a group photo. And I'm like, oh my God, what is going through their mind to all be standing together in one room? Like the most unhinged. They're like trying to make us out to be pathological liars. And it's like, we know that's not true. What about that? That's the scary part. Yes.

And her demeanor, the way she laughs at everything and doesn't take everything seriously anything i'm like oh my god do you see the pain that you're inflicting like there is something a little like very off about it when she talks she you can tell she's like thinking about what she's saying and then she says it and there's like yeah that sounded good yeah okay yeah yeah and like it's like out of context maybe but like in this context like you have to adjust to what you're saying to like what's going on but also a huge takeaway with watching now is these like confessionals where sandoval is just lying i do it's hard i'm sorry i'm always going to choose the man to be the villain

so if i had to pick one i think it would be Sandoval because it's like they're both pretty deceptive. But his level of deception, the way he talks in like an interview to the camera while this is all going on, which I even think were probably like pickups. So it's like lie on lie when like months have passed and he's still like dedicated to the lie. When he was there was a moment this last episode when he was like trying to say, I love Ariana. And he could not say love. He was like, I love Ariana. He couldn't project it. I'm like, this is concerning behavior that you wouldn't just say something else.

You could get you could get around it. I care so deeply about Ariana. That's how I always get out of saying love. I'm like, yeah, babe, love you, too. I care so deeply. I have so much love for you. For you. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Falling. And I guess he can't say that, but it's like there's ways around it. But he still chooses to lie. Also, when he was like, yeah i know what you're gonna bring up go ahead um when he's like you know like we have a lot of issues in our relationship and they're not all ariana's fault some are mine yeah like it's like it's like he was talking to like

all of vanderpump as if like guys I know you probably think this is all Ariana, but I'm here to say I've done a little bit too. I don't watch Love Island with her, but I do listen to Beyonce. He's like, I love Beyonce. And she's like, you don't want to watch 50 episodes of Love Island with me. Yeah, which, sorry, if you don't, we're done for. Done. Done. Like, she has a point. They you don't want to watch 50 episodes of love island with me yeah which sorry if you don't we're done for done done like she has a point they just don't seem compatible they

really their lifestyles seem completely different and they're two just different people she has so much like insight and like she is a real person she's been through some shit and he is so superficial but like thank fuck that he gets batteries and toilet paper yeah his fucking assistant does first of all his fucking assistant according to tom sandoval like doing something nice he does something nice for ariana by getting her toilet paper and batteries yeah he literally said that like how do you even have a conversation batteries and toilet paper and if like when does she ever do anything nice for me it's like holy fucking shit but i think that's like that's the best he could come up with totally batteries and toilet paper and batteries i'm

sorry like how many batteries for remotes and what else what else is using batteries i saw a tiktok of someone stocking up their house with batteries and uh paper towels and whatever and they were like so i don't get cheated on and it was just a montage of them putting everything away and then i tried to text uh my friend's parents housekeeper happy mother's day yesterday and i accidentally copied and pasted the link to that so i was like so sorry estella don't get cheated on happy mother's day also if you like need a tip he probably he probably was thinking he was doing something really nice because the batteries might be for like maybe a vibrator and

he thought he was being like manly enough to be like I got her vibrators for the vibrator that she uses instead of having sex with me yeah he thought he was being like yeah a feminist or something I do think that's one of the dangers of their relationship though is that I think the reason they've made it so long is that they do have like genuinely enriching, happy, positive things in their life.

And I think it's sometimes so easy when you are in a relationship like Ariana has all these friendships that she's nurtured. She has a business that she's starting. She's someone who can like create goals and like fulfill them and find fulfillment in life as a whole. And I think sometimes it can be really dangerous when you're in a relationship with them to then just kind of be like, I'm happy. Oh, and you're next to me. So now it's like I'm going to associate this with you and you can give your partner credit for so much longer than they actually deserve it. Yeah. She has no problem kind of like taking along people for the ride. Totally. Yeah, definitely. Like I can do this for you. Even in earlier seasons, there was an episode when they like first started dating and that's the thing is like ariana will call him on his shit so it's like this is all so surprising to me

like when she had a book a cocktail book coming out and she did like a promo shoot about it and the whole time he was like i can do it better you need to do this you need to give more be extra look at me like i'm the main character it's like it's literally not about you and he can't like support her he can't be a hype man which is clear it's it's clear why you're not getting these opportunities because you're inauthentic and she reads as authentic and people want to like see her succeed and do this for her and she literally will call him out and be like stop being jealous like you're being insufferable and then like walk away. Like she'll just put him in his place. But it's like, so how could you almost not see this coming from a mile away?

How can you? And this was like whatever, maybe season four or five. It's like, how can you not have the same like put you in your place to Raquel? I think she's just so beat down maybe. Yeah. And has like been in it for so long that she like has lost sight because it's the same he's incredibly jealous of her me i can't i can't i'm like if this is where i'm not taking anyone along for the ride this is about me like when tom is this like you never defend me and

like listen i in any relationship i can understand being frustrated if your partner is just like never agreeing with you like katie how katie would feel about schwartz like he never defends her yeah but like tom you know you can't help but say well tom stop saying stupid shit or stop you like he clearly thinks i'm so annoying because you are fucking annoying you do think you're so childish you're like you you prioritize the wrong things you constantly say and do things because you want the spotlight on you. You're constantly going out there. And I love it when she said, when she's like, I don't want every time you're out there peacocking with your friends. That was such a great line from Ariana to talk about Tom because that's what he does.

It's like every time he's out, it's always like he needs to be the center of attention. He needs the stimuli, as he says. He needs to be validated constantly. That's why he paints his nails. That's why he has the lightning bolt necklace. That's why he literally created a band and hired people just to play with him so that people could like go out to these little clubs and have Vanderpump Rules fans show up. And whether they are screaming at him hate or love, he just loves to be the center of attention.

Also, so cringe. Imagine us starting a band so Bachelor Nation could come see us. Like, so embarrassing. You say that and I'm like, I would watch you. I totally could. But I'm like, you don't want to see me sing. What are you guys going to play? I play the cymbals i

play the tambourine she's all she's the tambourine player and the backup dancer what do you think it is gabby because like in my experience being in this world i have noticed and because like the opportunities that come to the women and the men can be different at times. And in my experience, it seems like a lot of the men from Bachelor Nation love to do like the appearances and the event appearances and the bar appearances. I think it's just, because they show up and they're like little mini rock stars that night. And it's not something you don't really see women

from the franchise do all that often, but like the guys love to do it. Yeah. Why do you think that is? I've never really thought about it like that. And I'm like, my skin is a little crawling, but I feel like it's also, it's being on social media is harder for men. Men don't consume the way women do. So it's like, if you're going on a show to kind of like build this other career, a platform, like men don't have the same opportunities in that way. It's easier for women. So I'm wondering if like, that's their only thing.

Or they feel like it makes it worth the whole experience worthwhile. Yeah, like maybe they're getting the same thing out of it. But it is like, it is when you talk about it like that, I'm like, oh no, no, no, no, no. Please don't be doing that for that. You are not a rockstar, sit down. Well, there was Lisa Vanderpump's speech.

I don't know if we wanted to touch on that that was like that was a weird yeah because it was like had like emotional music and it was like a fairly i i liked the speech but just the timing of it all it was like right after everyone just sat there and like watched like people just trying to burn down katie's heart yeah and then editing though i do i'm like there's something off. Yeah. I wonder if the editing, though, I do, I'm like, there's something off about this. So I wonder if they flipped the cap in first. Yes, that's what I almost think.

But she did say wear shorts. No, I think, yeah, because like Schwartz was outside. Also, who gives a fuck about shorts? Let him be outside. Like, ugh, you don't need. When Katie was like, you don't need him. I was like, yes, Katie. Yeah, actually, I'm like, just say what you're going to say.

I don't know, the whole thing was kind of a hinge. Oh, and then Schwartz throws up a peace sign to Lisa. Oh, my God. Meanwhile, Sandoval's calling her dude. And I'm like, what is wrong with these men? I cannot. Put some respect on her name. No, Sandoval calls everyone dude.

I'm like, I can't. That's the lowest level. Like, please think of any other word. Do not call a woman a dude. Especially your boss. Especially Lisa Vanderpump. Yes. Like, are you deranged? Never been a woman a dude, especially your boss, especially Lisa Vanderpump. Like, are you deranged?

Never been less of a dude. That's why I feel like James has really separated himself this season, which I never, having been just more of a casual fan, not really watching it, but familiar with the characters on the show, I did not expect myself to think that

James is the most down-to-earth guy because we should talk about his therapy attitude though that's one thing we should cover that was wild yeah well classic classic response yeah like not because I feel like this is a place for people who like don't have a exposure to therapy or who it's not normalized for like it's that's why this you know it's not like he's like oh he's stupid and bad it's just like he hasn't been in settings where it's been like an acceptable form of like mental health a class a very classic response to someone who even the way he said it it's just like watch like he's comparing he was literally comparing himself to characters on tv shows and movies of like why they get therapy only because their life is in

shambles, complete shambles. Yeah. And again, Ali was just talking about childhood trauma and he's denying any trauma. And I'm like, listen, we all have some kind of trauma. It's just a, you know, a kind of a spectrum of what that trauma might be. But like, you know, just looking at his, you know, family upbringing, I imagine there's some unresolved issues he might want to work through, some projections he's putting out there. Maybe it's the whole being a DJ, leveling up to his dad's producer.

Yeah, it's like the dad thing. There's like a weird dad thing. But yeah, I actually think it's a perfect example. Like someone who can maybe relate to him and has been shutting down therapy would watch that little bit and be like, okay, I need therapy because I can't be that guy. I wonder if he has the same...

I mean, this was filmed a year ago almost. I wonder what his attitude towards therapy is now. I'm sure it's the same. This was filmed a year ago? It was in the summer. They wrapped almost... But yeah, because we just saw Sheena's August wedding

a few episodes ago I think they're starting to film next season almost as soon as the reunion is done airing

yeah because I think that's when they normally film I know they went back in they heard about all of this stuff and then they

brought back in I heard this week's was meant to be the finale which makes sense at least a speech like she's like this is going to be yes like unseen she's like i can save this i can't and it's like you can't like fast forward to march next week yeah we literally unsalvageable yeah it sounds like next week is basically all post revelation of the affair oh yeah i cannot that's gonna be wild between the fights between the toms and the arguments of when he found out and i want to see sheena's reacting because she know it was you know unable to be at filming because of like illness stuff for this episode but she was someone

who was really doubling down and going to bat for Raquel like we've talked about Ariana like having a lot of sympathy for Raquel like how is she I'm very curious to see what Sheena says in finding this out because it seems like Sheena has been very willing to admit that she was totally wrong like misread the situation I think she did a hard pivot incorrectly so totally she just

kind of owned her loyalty towards Raquel and then just said hey I was dead wrong I was duped yeah that's and that's the only thing you can do you can't go back in time yeah yeah and honestly saying you're wrong is not that hard it's often the best amazing quality yeah literally yeah it's the uh the excuse making that people often get well you know I had my reasons it's Sandoval oh god when you ask him one question he goes on a tangent it's like you're guilty like you're that people often get, well, you know, I had my reasons. It's Sandoval. Oh God, when you ask him one question,

he goes on a tangent. It's like, you're guilty. Like you're literally expressing guilt. Like it was a one word answer. All you had to say was no. I fucked up.

Yeah. I love Ariana. You couldn't even say it. Yeah, you can't even say it. He's like, Ariana, like I can still hear you. You're not like tricking anyone.

Yeah. Where are you guys watching it I'm most concerned about like a watch party or like I was just about to say I

so like Nick and I have been watching it Thursday like when it comes out on Peacock but I think we we have to watch it at 9pm on Wednesday

when it airs on Bravo do you want to come over I do I'm off Wednesday will you bring your dog I will and you promise?

I promise Okay He's like Nardo Nardo Nard He's like the Nard dog Yeah he's like so annoying

But you guys will love it He's gonna run All over your furniture Oh my god He doesn't take direction Gabby this has been so much fun So much fun. Please come back again soon.

Would love to. This is what I love to talk about. What are your hobbies? Non-reality TV. Let's talk about you. Let's not. Anyways. Anything that you want to put out there?

Anything you're promoting? Anything you're doing? No, just the same bullshit. House decorating. House decorating. decorating exciting things to come but that's about all i'm working with a great team so i'm excited um and i'll probably be saying that for months yeah we love that yeah yeah we love things are in motion things are in motion we're working on things. We have projects. I have a lot of projects coming out soon. Stay tuned.

Stay tuned. New and exciting. Like once I start saying those things, like, please, that I know it's over for me and me. That's all I say. I'm like, fuck. Fuck. Fuck. Fuck.

Fuck. Fuck. Fuck. I am. I am her. I don't like it. I love it. Yeah.

And I own it. Stay tuned. Yeah. But do you want to promo your socials just so people on audio can know where to follow you? Yes, I will beg of anyone who's interested to follow me on Instagram at Gabby.Wendy and TikTok Gabby Windy. Don't judge. You know, have you ever, you know, we could start doing I've thought about doing every time I have to go back and look like an old picture of like on Instagram. If you go back anything over six months, it's really painful to watch yourself. Oh, yeah. It's like I was really, I really went for it that day. Yeah.

Or your captions or whatever. Not even six months, like six days. It's all real brutal. Yeah. I mean, like it's all, I take it with a grain of salt, but it's fairly embarrassing. It's cringe for everybody. Nobody is exempt from it. So no, you're in good company.

That's what I thought myself. Yeah. I do think we could have people like read an Instagram caption from over a year ago. No, like 20 years from now, like children have such a lack of respect for their parents just because of what their parents were willing to put out there on social media. Like the Captain Morgan handle chugging photo. A couple of likes or a couple of clicks. Literally.

No one's going to see their parents as heroes anymore because it's only like a click away from just the debauchery that was their parents. Nick dancing in rollerblades. Yeah, roller skates. Sorry. Roller skates. Sorry.

Yeah. Taking it very seriously. Very seriously. Shirtless Bob Ross paintings. Cooking with Nick. Yeah, cooking with Nick. It's like we have parental controls, but I feel like it's going to be the other way around.

Like, you know, there's going to be some kind of like, no. How do I make sure my kid doesn't see me? They can't roast me. Yeah. Really? Yeah. Really embarrassing. You just have to like own it and show them.

Be like, this is how embarrassing I was. You shouldn't do the same. Well, Gabby, it was a pleasure a ton of fun we appreciate you coming don't forget to tune in on Thursday's episode of going deeper we have the very hilarious Angela Johnson Reyes with us to talk about all

things comedy pop culture all the topics well we didn't really get to pop culture or any other what are some things out there that we might get into we might be talking about how Martha Stewart is the oldest ever. On the cover of SI. Yeah.

SI swimsuit model. Wearing some Monday swimwear. Shout out to our friend, Devin. Haley Bieber was talking a little bit about having kids, the way she thinks about it,

getting a little emotional. The Kelly Clarkson show is moving to New York. There's a whole lot of hubbub about what the work environment was like there. But she's a saint. Headline.

The headline is Kelly. Kelly. Everyone loves Kelly. Everyone hates the producers. Andrew McGonigal. Yeah. I'm like, oh, Kelly Clarkson. I can't believe it.

Bye, these guys are lost. Yeah. All right. And then plus, I'm sure there will be a lot of breaking stories between now and then. But Angela, if you don't know who she is hysterical hysterical comedian she's got a Netflix special dropping she's got a special dropping real soon she did a mad TV

so that's what I was wondering if that was her I know her she was a cheerleader yes at your high school what just in general she was an NFL cheerleader you're like wait a second she was a cheerleader she was an NFL cheerleader oh you're like wait a second random fact

she was a cheerleader ah sure cheerleader make it up yeah you were an NFL cheerleader yeah so I relate to her she's with us on Thursday it should be a super fun episode

we also have a live episode of Better Date Than Never Thursday night at 9pm Eastern don't forget to check that out what are we talking about have we decided yet orgies

oh orgies. Yeah. Nudes was thrown around. Pillow princesses. There's a lot of exciting topics in the pipeline. We were going to do orgies because our favorite couple had the Bachelor Nation story that they were going to talk about. Whose name will not be revealed, but we have... A very fun queer couple was like, we have threesomes with

a member of Bachelor Nation, and they're going to tell us the Orgian story. And that member's in this room. Nick. Spoiler alert. Find out all the juicy details live at 9 p.m. Eastern. It should be a ton of fun. Don't forget we have

Vile Files Plus available for all the people who don't get to listen to Better Date Than Never Live. Also, all your update specials. We drop two extra update specials every month in addition to the one that we drop behind Vile Files Classic. We have two extra update specials every month in addition to the one

that we drop behind Vile Files. Classic, we have another one dropping this Friday. Very, very juicy one. Again, it's free to sign up. You have a seven-day free trial. Let's go to vilefiles.com. Click on the tab. You can listen to the Vile Files Plus the same way you listen to Vile Files. It's just easy. There's no reason not to do it. Everyone loves it. It's rated 100% fresh. Certified 100%. Certified 100% fresh and awesomeness. Can't thank Gabby enough for joining us. We will see you back on Thursday.

What about me? You can't thank me at all? Baby, you're just part of the show now. Someone, we were walking, we were shopping yesterday. We had fun. And we... I want Gabby at my funeral. She'll be like, fun.

Fun, you're dead. Fun. And these two wonderful women saw us and they go, we love your show. We love your guys' show. And I was like, excuse me? Do you want a picture? Thank you of me. Just me.

Take a picture of us. Take the photo. Here we are. Anyways, also, we want to thank our pop culture correspondent, Natalie Joy. Absolutely. It's been an honor joining you. Live from the couch.

All right. Bye. Bye. Bye. you