The Viall Files - E668 Going Deeper with Aly & AJ Plus Special Forces Death Letters, Mysterious Murders, and RHOBH

Episode Date: November 16, 2023

Welcome back to The Viall Files: Going Deeper Edition! First, the household gets together to discuss some recent experiences - like this week’s episode of Special Forces, a nearby mysterious murder, and Real Housewives of Beverly Hills. Then, we are joined by sisters, actresses, and musical duo Aly & AJ. We talk about pursuing a career in entertainment at a young age, what it was like being a part of The Disney Channel, and their experiences acting and producing music. We also ask about what works in their relationships, red flags, and stage parents. We also have a Texting Office Hours caller who is wondering if she can shoot her shot twice - she went on two dates with a guy but needs help asking him out on a third.  “I love that we’re a part of the Mandela Effect.”  Start your 7 Day Free Trial of Viall Files + here: https://viallfiles.supportingcast.fm/  Please make sure to subscribe so you don’t miss an episode and as always send in your relationship questions to [e-mail] to be a part of our Monday episodes. Join us for our new LIVE show on Thursdays at 9PM ET/6PM PT on Amp, available in the Apple app store. Android User? Listen here: https://www.onamp.com/   To Order Nick’s Book Go To: http://www.viallfiles.com  If you would like to get some texting advice on Office Hours send an email to [e-mail] with “Texting Office Hours” in the subject line! To advertise on the show, contact [e-mail] or visit https://www.advertisecast.com/TheViallFiles  THANK YOU TO OUR SPONSORS: Beam Organics - If you want to try Beam’s best-selling Dream Powder, take advantage of their biggest sale of the year and get up to 50% off for a limited time when you go to https://www.shopbeam.com/VIALL - the discount is auto-applied at checkout, no code necessary.  Helix Sleep - Helix is offering 25% off all mattress orders AND two free pillows for our listeners in honor of Black Friday! Go to https://www.HelixSleep.com/VIALL and use code HELIXPARTNER25. This is their best offer yet and it won’t last long! With Helix, better sleep starts now. OneSkin - It’s time to get started with your new face, eye, and body routine at a discounted rate today! Get 15% off with the code VIALL at https://www.oneskin.co   Vessi Footwear - If you want to be ready for anything rain or shine, head to https://www.vessi.com/VIALL and get yourself a pair today. Episode Socials: @viallfiles @nickviall @nnataliejjoy @alyandaj @alison.vandam @liffordthebigreddog @dereklanerussell @genevievegoodman 

what's going on everybody welcome back to another exciting episode of the vile files going deeper edition i'm your host nick joined by the household of Allie in St. Paul, Minneapolis. No, St. Paul, Minnesota. I don't fucking know. Twin Cities. You're not here. The Midwest. You keep saying Minneapolis as if it is the state. Like he said so many times. He's like, well, St. Paul is the capital of Minneapolis. I can't be the first one who fucks this up. But there was a lot of comments about fellow Minnesotans and people explaining the Twin Cities and how there's a river in the middle. There's a lot of buzz online. Oh, and I could find this in the YouTube comments?

Okay. So if you want a little history lesson on Minnesota and the Twin Cities, go check out what episode is that? Somewhere. Go look for it. It was Monday's Ask Nick. Amanda's back from her wedding. Yeah. You got married? Almost.

No. Nope. I went there to see my cousins get married. It was really beautiful. It was a really good wedding. Did they choreographed dance? Yeah. And it wasn't cringe.

It was so earnest. It was so fun. Everybody was like freaking out. They did a really good job. It was the perfect combination of like they were trying their hardest and it was so earnest it was so fun everybody was like freaking out they did a really good job it was the perfect combination of like they were trying their hardest and it was like it wasn't like oh they're professional dancers flexing on you but like they had their shit together i was not worried for them what was the song you know people have asked me that i don't remember and i think it's because i didn't i i recognized it but i didn't know the name

i should know and then we we have Justin at the controls. Everyone say hi to Justin. Hello, Justin. Everyone in the audience. Sweet boy, Justin. Sweet boy, Justin. Sweet boy, Justin. And just so people know, he's wearing a good sweater.

A good sweater. He's wearing a good sweater and he deserves credit for it. I go in and out of hating this. And I'm afraid to wash it. That particular sweater? Because it's, I don't know, it's weird. No, it's funky and fun. I. And I'm afraid to wash it. That particular sweater? Because it's... I don't know. It's weird.

No. It's funky and fun. I don't know. I'll take it. Oh, my gosh. Yeah. I mean, I feel like of all your outfits, that's right on track.

Okay. That's a classic Nick. I don't know if he's complimenting me. Well, because we all dressed up for you. Like, for Halloween, I would be really curious to see like your impression of your employees individually like what you would wear what i would wear

next year and then our lovely uh pop culture correspondent ally joy hey baby hello how are you i'm stunning how are you? I'm stunning. How are you? So good. All right. Well, lots to get into. We have an amazing episode for you. The iconic duo of Allie and AJ are with us. What a lovely pair. Amazing. That is truly iconic. A nostalgic episode. I know Amanda was over the moon. I was losing it. You behaved yourself quite well. No, I was so excited because I just had that level of not only are they these figures, but in my personal life, I sing a lot of like, whoa, in my basement with the Disney sing it. And so I was like, I just, you know, that thing where you're like, if I could tell childhood

me about this, she would freak out. Then it makes me very sentimental very quickly. So I can make your dreams. They're so cool. It's a good episode. It's amazing. What was the movie on Disney where they set their house on fire? Cowbells.

Cowbells! I was like, cowgirl? Cowbells. That was so fucking good. That's an iconic moment for them. We should rewatch that tonight. Really? You're not interested?

No, I'm so down. What a polite no. Really? Really. How about we watch it and what I'm sure will be a movie marathon during Christmas? Because Natalie and I are not traveling for Christmas. It's Christmas at home with just us and the pups and the baby. Wow.

Yeah. The baby that will still be in my belly. Still in the belly. It's like we're getting close to like that time where, you know, like we probably could travel, you know, like our doctor might not say no, but it's like, is it really worth it? You know, Natalie doesn't want to have the baby on a plane or in Wisconsin.

Oh, you having a baby on a plane. Could you imagine? That would be my luck. All right. Special forces. Anything to cover whoa big episode recently natalie what was it like for you to watch the death letters horrible honestly it was so fucking sad i mean like obviously everyone's was really sad nick sent me a photo of the letter while he was still in New Zealand. So he was like coming back, I think, the next day.

He sent me photos of all the letters. So everyone wrote multiple letters. Like, obviously, when you watch it, it looks like we all wrote. I mean, they made it. They showed the letters. It was clear we wrote a lot. But everyone wrote like read like what seemed like two or three sentences. Right.

You know, the most sentimental parts. But I wrote a letter to Natalie, I wrote a letter to my parents, and then I wrote a letter to my daughter, unborn child. And between the one between Natalie, my one to my parents is very sweet. Like, I owe you everything.

You're the greatest. I love you. It wasn't terribly long, but the one to our baby was pretty good too yeah i kind of wanted them to yeah we what were some of the because i was so curious like i i figured they cut a lot of stuff just for like privacy sentimentality or for time but like what were some of the other things that you said in your letters that you're cool with sharing uh i just kind of talked about you know i i was earnestly writing it as if like

she would get this letter after she was born so it was a lot of like you know i think there was a line like protect your your character over your ego and things like that and i was giving her life lessons and little shit like that it was pretty i think now i have it let me see if I can just find the messages that he texted me. Oh my god. There's a lot of nudes in here. Nude. Nude. Nude. Dead letter to unborn daughter.

Nude. Nude. My titties. My ass. Nick's dick. Oh my god. Oh my god. Oh, I think we're getting there. Okay. Did you guys see my coochie in my ass say yes if you did say yes if you did okay found him oh god can I

be excused for a second okay oh my god it's getting hot in here now do you want to that's the one to the baby I don't want to... I don't want to read it. Okay. I'll read it.

You read it. Well, if you just... I really wanted Natalie to be like, that's my favorite nude. I'm like, okay, everyone. Here's a picture of Nick's penis. Doc's Nick. Literally.

Okay. Oh gosh, it's so sad. you uh he addressed it to baby which sad dear baby or just baby just baby baby yeah um i'm so sorry i'm not there for your first step your first word and and every first that comes after. Oh my God, I'm kidding. Oh my God. Oh my God, honey. I'm gonna cry. Oh my God. Oh shit. Okay. A few lines down.

There is so much I wish I could teach you and I know I can't write it all down, but I want to share a few lessons with you. First, always know you are worthy of love. Second, surround yourself with people who make you feel that. You're special. Don't let anyone make you feel like you're not. There's a lot of scratches out and like writing above it.

Protect your character, especially in the difficult moments, because doing the right thing is often the more difficult choice in the moment. But it's the one that will protect you in the big run, big run or long one. You don't know. And he ends it with. Learn to control your ego or it will control you. Remember that feeling in love doesn't always mean love. Love isn't feeling validated. It's feeling fulfilled. Make sure you find someone who loves you as much as you love them. Take care of your family. With all my heart, Dad.

Oh, my God. So, you know, he threw in a couple of life lessons in there, stuff that he couldn't teach him because he wouldn't be around anymore. It's so sad. He signed his, to me. It's so sad. Okay. He signed his, to me, your chicken, Nick. But they cut out your chicken on the episode. Thank God.

What? Yeah. So sad. I was a couple, I guess, BTSs. Behind the scenes for anybody. They really are like Tom's getting an amazing edit

it's kind of crazy I mean like whatever everyone they're not there to make anyone look bad that's not the show you know what I'm saying

like the show is about overcoming adversity they obviously cast Tom based off the Scandival drama also did we did I tell anyone

this but like they tried hard to get Raquel on they were trying to cast both Tom and Raquel on Special Forces what? based off the Scandaville drama. Also, did we, did I tell anyone this? But like, they tried hard to get Raquel on. They were trying to cast both Tom and Raquel on Special Forces. What? You've never dropped that?

Yeah. Why did I never tell anyone that? Wait, how do you know this? Tom told me. Yeah. I don't know how far long in the process it went. I don't even know if

really it went anywhere. I do know that there was an earnest attempt to get them both on Special Forces, which would have been awesome. Wild. Yeah. A real bummer really it went anywhere i do know that there was an earnest attempt to get them both on special forces which would have been awesome wow yeah real real bummer from a rating standpoint but i am really shocked that the show like again there's just so many behind the scenes and like we're i was talking with the executives uh yesterday i mean it's an only an hour show so they're so

limited in time so limited time and even like the cool shit that we had to do or the that this the beatdowns like so much is this not shown so i can understand why they're not showing a ton of like just little shit that you know little moments but tom just got yelled at all the time time would get worked up and when he'd get worked up he would kind of lose focus and he wouldn't listen you know and and so when we were doing the helicopter drop and you you hear rudy joe just kind of fucking around a little bit and you hear rudy yelling at her that wasn't rudy yelling at jojo that was rudy ds rudy yelling at tom because every time we got in the water like because it was frozen cold water they would have you know in uh i think it

was episode two when we all went in we had to say these words and we all went in the tent and changed well this time there was a tent there for emergencies but they were like you know what fuck it change out here you you don't get to go in the warm tent and change um and that's something they decided so uh tom went first and they were like no one's going in there and changing and so just change out here and like tom's looking at rudy and like hearing them and then as soon as rudy got done telling us no one go in the tent and change tom runs into the tent and we were just like what are you doing tom and rudy was this like you filthy creature you know just like you disgusting creature like you filthy animal he was really laying into him so sound bites of that are are from him yelling at tom he never jojo doing the shuffle

it's just like why do you make it seem like they're yelling at sweet jojo like no because you can clearly tell that like even though they're like being like tough and hardcore like i'm like they i feel like they love jojo like they just like they respect her deeply oh they love they appreciate her hustle and her work ethic like she was awesome she was absolutely dynamite on it but i will i have to watch it twice because you know i will say going back on special forces i've mentioned this already but it really does make me empathize with you know anyone goes on the bachelor or love is blind or these shows because we're still going to cover it the same way you know but it makes me

i see both sides because when you watch it like it's you know i watch it because i went through this personal story and it's like my story so every little thing that doesn't that has shown that i don't remember it that way i'm always like oh but it was this way and it was that way and then i have to watch it again chill the fuck out and realize that you know they have to tell that I don't remember it that way. I'm always like, oh, but it was this way and it was that way. And then I have to watch it again, chill the fuck out and realize that, you know, they have to tell everyone's story. It's not just about me. It's about me and Jojo and Tom and Tyler and Bodhi

and Aaron and Jack and all those things. So it's just like, you just have to like, chill the fuck out. But nevertheless, I can understand when we talk about these people and we frustrate them by sharing our critiques that it can rattle their cages because it's their personal experience.

And just going back on the show just reminds me of the sensitivity behind doing something that's intense, like going on these shows and then have other people talk about it. Yeah, could you imagine if there was another podcast and they covered Special Forces?

I'm sure there is out there. Dude, fucking Nick, he looked like such a pansy. He couldn't even carry Tom. Literally, JoJo had to carry Tom all the way to the edge. There is a podcast out there that literally is saying that right now,

I'm sure. Oh my gosh. Yeah. Something that really rattled my cage, did you see that horrible murder story in Encino? I heard about it because we went to Jack's, had a little birthday party, and he's like, oh, by the way, there was a fucking torso. Jeffrey Dahmer cut up bodies.

Like fucking body in a dumpster in Jack's neighborhood. Somewhere in his neighborhood. Do you have the, can you tell us about it? Okay. Well, I saw, so I saw a clip from the news and it was it seems as though allegedly a man killed his wife and her two parents who were living with them oh and now he's it was his day i found this guy's instagram oh and it looks like he hasn't posted since uh 2014 but it's like it looks like a movie poster and they're

sword fighting and it's called Demon Hill. And this guy is the son of like some what is referred to as like a Hollywood super agent. Like who? It's just crazy. This is the parents fault. It has to be the parents

fault. How do you? Their dad's a super agent and their son grew up to be this sociopath i don't know anything about this family other than like it must be somewhere the parents failed the kid okay well if our daughter one day is just like a little cookie like it's on me me no it's i i'll take that i'll take that bullet if my daughter cuts up her family and dumps it into a dumpster, I'll tell you what. Women in murder.

That's on me. That is on me. There's a women in murdering just as much as men these days. Did she have a good reason? Yeah. You know? I don't know. If it was a human trafficker.

Yeah. This guy's Instagram is wild. Sam Haskell Jr. is his name. If anyone wants to go look it up. I have a question for people who consume like true crime stuff. I like hearing this story, knowing it is real. I do not feel well. I feel very scared.

Yeah, people do this shit. People do this stuff. But why? How do people consume this kind of content, like all the true crime stuff, without being horrified and terrified constantly? They've got to think that it's just a story. Storytelling, you know? Yeah. I don't know.

Because this feels really close to home. This feels like it's right here. Literally. It's like 15 minutes away from us. That's a nice neighborhood too, right? Yeah. Because they always say a lot of crimes are in nice neighborhoods. He lived in Tarzana and then he dumped the body in Encino.

In like a dumpster? Yeah. Well, not even a body. It was a torso with no arms and no legs and no head. Just a torso. And Jack told me this, that he committed these crimes around Halloween. And there was like blood everywhere. And he was telling people it was part of like decorations.

No, he was putting their limbs in the grass. Yes. And he was telling people that they were decorations. Limbs? Yes! Their arms and legs. That's the rumor. Halloween's ruined for me.

If I ever see one of those again. Yeah, I'm going to be waving them around. Especially in Los Angeles, because motherfuckers have some pretty crazy Halloween directions in this town. Yeah. They're like, everyone just assumes it's like, oh, that guy works for the fucking movies. Turns out it might actually be a fucking arm. Well, it was also something about the news. In the news story, they were saying that he hired people, I think the equivalent of task rabbits, to carry trash bags with bodies.

And I'm like, could you imagine me in that fucking task rabbit showing up? Could you imagine if you get charged with accessory? Accessory, yeah. It's like you carried the body. They didn't know though, right? They didn't know. Those are just the decorations. They can't have known.

The heavy, warm decorations. So a guy I went to high school with. Yeah. We actually like dated for a moment. Oh. Yeah. Did a modeling little shoot. We did. We were on the cover of a magazine together as a married couple.

Yeah. In high school. Yes. In high school. He was the bagger at Kroger. Oh. Super cutie. And then he moved to Florida to go to college.

And friends with the wrong group of people. You know what I'm saying? Oh, super cutie. And then he moved to Florida to go to college. That's where it all went wrong. And friends with the wrong group of people. You know what I'm saying? And he had, it was him and a roommate. And then they had a third roommate who was kind of like in and out. And he wasn't really paying rent. So they decided to kick him out. When they kicked him out, he stole the other roommate, not my friend's, Xbox.

Oh, okay, okay. Stole it. So the friend is pissed, right? He's like, I'm so pissed. Let's invite him over to go to a party and let's beat him up. Let's fight him. And my friend is like, not that big of a deal, but like, okay, I guess if you want to, like, sure. So they invite him over to this party.

My friend is in his bedroom. The roommate that didn't pay rent walks in to go to the party. The other roommate stabs him. Oh, no. Kills him over and over and over again. Stabs him. My friend then, like, hears the ruckus, comes out of his room, sees all of this. a ruckus, comes out of his room, sees all of this, and someone else comes in to, it was like a lot of people in and out of the house.

So some person comes in, sees it, turns around, runs out, calls 911. The person who stabbed him looks at my friend and goes, bag this body. Put him in a trash bag. So my friend's like, he's standing by the front door he's like you just killed someone like okay does he still have like a knife in his hand yeah like panic so he starts like putting him in this fucking bag and police show up the guy who stabs him runs my friend like hides in the bathroom they're both in prison now. This one got life. My friend got like 10 to 15 years.

But it's so sad because he like literally was just like, I don't know. Okay. When I met Natalie, she'd get a call and she'd be like, it's my friend from prison.

From the prison. Except the call. We always talk on the phone. Yeah. That's right. And I kind of felt, I felt like she told me the story. I'm like,

yeah, all right, well. Yeah. I felt, I felt kind of bad. It's so sad because he was so sweet

and then he just like, people murder people. It's crazy. It could be anybody, yeah. Truly. It's crazy. I have a wild story.

So I went to Davis two years ago, but over this past year, there was like a lot of stabbings happening. Like a serial killer was running loose and like, didn't shut down the campus they didn't know who it was then after like the fourth person that had passed away unfortunately they found out it was one of the students who was a medical student who wanted to be like a surgeon and he was just

like he would go out stab people and then come back into his apartment with his roommates and act like nothing like ever happened. Is he trying to do procedures on them or something? He just went crazy, I guess. I don't know. So he really can be anybody. Welcome to Ball Pals, a true crime podcast. It's like we're usually more reality TV. Taylor Swift.

Taylor Swift and Travis Kelsey heating up. Did you see that Gigi commented on that Us Weekly post or something. It was like, didn't y'all try this last week with Selena? Give it a rest. We're all happy for our girl. Good for you, Gigi Hadid? Yes commented on that like Us Weekly post or something it was like didn't y'all try this last week with Selena like give it a rest we're all happy for our girl

Oh good for you Gigi Good job You know what way to clap back Yeah You know what I love that Yeah

Yeah And Gigi if we said anything Yeah I think you did I think you kind of came for her I didn't came for her I was just like calm down Gigi you took Travis to

I mean Tyler Cameron to your you know grandma's funeral but I was Tyler Cameron to your, you know, grandma's funeral. But I was just protecting our girl Taylor, you know? Whatever. Wait, did you see about

Kyle and Mauricio? How they're the latest drama, Kyle Richards grabbed frozen yogurt with Morgan Wade? Didn't her castmates kind of accuse her of faking this? But it doesn't seem like,

we're, by the way, Natalie and I are bald. Balls deep in Beverly Hills our ball balls deep in beverly hills i'll show you balls deep we're deep into beverly hills housewives how far in are you like what's the most i just we just i i'm i'm fairly i mean i've watched episodes here and there but like we just sat down and started watching the current. We're up to date. We're up to date on the current season. Where Sutton walks out of the Magic Mike.

Yeah. Sutton, by the way, just like just calmly get up and say, hey, not for me. Ladies, have a great night. You know, I don't think that's real because I've met Sutton before a couple of times and she's not like that. What do you mean? Like she's very like free, open to like the stripping. Like she's in WeHo all the time.

Like, well, that's what they were saying on the episode. She brought a fucking like block of dollar bills and she was definitely the whole pants drama. She was ready to party. She's on the board of the American ballet. I'm on the board of the American ballet. She just kept saying that.

Like, I feel like I don't care. To be fair, I would say that too. If I were on the board of the American ballet, I would like get stopped. Any chance To be fair, I would say that too. If I were on the board of the American Ballet, I would like get stopped. Any chance you could. You would just say that.

They really kind of, they are, this season's kind of, they're editing it almost like, that Kyle's the one kind of almost having the midlife crisis, not Mauricio, right? Well, she's also the longest standing housewife on the show now. Because she's been there since season one.

So I think, one, she's trying to like secure her spot and then also i think two they're like well if we're gonna like make noise we're gonna make her noise yeah so much noise i mean obviously got marisa on dancing with the stars but they're fighting about like tattoos right yeah and i'm like yeah they're just like kind of bickering. And they kind of still weirdly... I don't know. I think it's interesting, though. They are making Beverly Hills into a dating show, kind of. If you've noticed.

So Sutton is doing her matchmaking. And then there's always some relationship drama now. How do you feel about Erika Jayne? I like her. I think she's good TV. I think she's entertaining. I don't know if I could hang out with her. I was on Dancing with the Stars with her. I think she's good TV. I think she's entertaining. I don't know if I could hang out with her. I was on Dancing with the Stars with her,

and the person I got to meet really loved. She's quiet and reserved, and she comes across the standoffish, which I don't mind because so do I, but if you talk to her, she's quite lovely. But watching her on Housewives, she does things that are just i think it's a last season specific problematic and it's just like i feel like if you deleted her whole like scandal with like the earrings

and the fraud and stuff then she's like really nice yeah there's nothing wrong with that's kind of a big but yeah the whole um magic mike scene really took me out i just that she was spread eagle she was on the ground like this everyone turn into youtube tune into youtube right now erica jaden leather patch and his face was in her crotch and then the guys licking whipped cream off kyle's chest she comes out and she's like i i had someone whip cream off me how was your night she's like i'm the on the board of the ballet it's just like you have a i'm sorry like a stranger is putting his tongue all over your legs and chest like nothing sounds more foul to me than that. Also, I have some questions.

I feel like there's some sticky residue. No, for sure. I think they either did too thorough of a job, which is creepy and weird. That's a lot of tongue action. Or there's some, like, leftover crusty sugar. She came out with a towel. So it was like she was still wiping. Still wiping.

And have you been, like, I haven't been to the Magic Mike show, but I've been to the Chippendales show. Why? Why? Because it was like guys not out. No, my friend, Jared,

my friend, Jared, your, your friend, Jared, uh, performed. He was,

uh, okay. That's very exciting. And so we went to support, but these, these, did you get pulled up on stage? They're like, Hey Nick,

you should do next. I'm like, not my cold, dead body would never fucking do this shit um but they if you ever they're in these like fucking dumps of a room and like they're not it's grimy it's fucking grimy it's like it's if you went to like a basement party on a college campus that's the kind of richards is in her chanel dress on the floor of the stage getting whipped cream licked off of her i was like horrifying never leaves the house without a a uniform that is like some sort of dior or chanel and then when she's and i feel for her like I mean, obviously, the robbery. Oh, the switch up.

And all the things that she has done is horrifying. But when she's in her ITM talking about her PTSD, wearing this Chanel outfit, it is so hard to empathize with someone when they're dressed and decked out in Chanel. Just a note. That's a good point, though. Because last season...

Wear a t-shirt. Last season, after her robbery, she went through therapy on the show. But people were like, hmm, if it's really therapy, are you doing it on the show? Well, any therapy on a show is not real therapy because a real therapist isn't allowed to do that on camera.

It's against the rules. I was going back and watching old summer house and they do it with lindsey it's not real and i was like this is yeah i was like this is not above board so it's always like some fake therapist or whatever i don't know yeah anyways we're into it very quick speaking of trauma being aired out on the screen have you seen there's a ton of interest from ala celebrities about obtaining the rights to Britney Spears memoir? Brad Pitt, Reese Witherspoon.

Margot Robbie. So they're all they all have the production companies like Brad Pitt produced 12 Years a Slave. Yeah. So like these are like legitimate production companies. Oh, yeah. Like this isn't just. I think you want an Oscar for that. Yeah.

I don't know everything Reese Witherspoon has done, but I'm getting. Hello Sunshine did some major stuff. Yeah, major stuff. So these A-list celebrities have A-list production companies, and now they're fighting. They want to make a movie out of her memoir. Yeah, they're fighting for their rights right now. So would you rather have Brad Pitt, Reese Witherspoon, or Margot Robbie be in control of that? I feel like Britney should be in control of it, no?

No, I mean, she doesn't have a production company. I mean, she will be in control of like who i'm guessing i don't know i'm sure she has the right think out of those people will respect britney the most her story yeah i feel like i feel like reese yeah well i actually i'm having a happy moment of being like i think they're all pretty i would trust all of them to like tell this story with dignity and tell it rigorously. My first thought was Margot Robbie. I feel like it's just so consistent.

But then Reese is also great. And then even Brad Pitt. I love Brad Pitt's movies. Can you imagine him active listening to her in production meetings? Just looking her in the eye and really listening to everything she has to say? Brad Pitt could play her dad. Oh. Which is kind of weird. Maybe not because

it's always going to be Brad Pitt. It's hard to hate a Brad Pitt character. So maybe, yeah, it's too, we really need to despise this person.

Yeah, we need like a proper villain. I also saw that they were considering, Brittany was in separate talks about maybe making it more of like a documentary where like she would be interviewed.

Oh yeah. Well, it's unclear if it's even going to be a movie or a TV series. Like it's just, yeah, TBD. Oh, yeah. Well, it's unclear if it's even going to be a movie or a TV series. Yeah. It's just TBD. TBD.

Gut reaction, does either of those seem more compelling of telling it in a more fictionalized format? I want a TV series because I feel like you're going to get more. I don't want to see a condensed, a two-hour movie. I want an HBO Max. Yeah like gritty, like honest. Yeah. Cause it seems like every, all the bombshells. It's Max now, by the way.

Just Max. Someday it's just going to be cock. We're going to be watching Housewives on cock. Oh, from Peacock. I was like, why would Max change to cock? I saw, I saw like a meme that said, your move, Peacock. When HBO Maxes went to Max. Anyways, I'm a child.

I think that about wraps it up. Yeah. All right. Well, it's time for Allie and AJ get ready to be nostalgic, have some fun, some sweet, sweet conversations with the lovely team of Allie and AJ.

Don't forget to send your questions at asknickatthevilefiles.com for all your Ask Nick texting office hours, mediations, you know the drill. Also, programming note for next week, Thanksgiving, enjoy your families. We're only going to be dropping two magical episodes on Ask Nick on Monday,

a reality recap with your favorite Susie Evans is joining us as well. So that's Monday and Tuesday next week. And then take the rest of the week off. Enjoy your families. Have a safe travel. God knows you haven't listened to every single Vile Files episode. So if you're thirsting for more, go back and check out maybe the Lindsay Hubbard episode, some Ask Nick's. And if you are up to speed, well, it's time to sign up for Vile Files Plus. So many update specials available for you behind Vile Files Plus. It's a seven-day free trial. Check it out. Go to vilefiles.com. We have our pop extras. We'll probably be talking about

Patrick Mahomes not washing his underwear and what does Brittany Mahomes and Taylor think about it. So many burning topics we talk about. Plus, your Vanderpump recaps. We're wrapping up season two. So much to check out. All right, it's time for Allie and AJ. Did you know that poor sleep can cause weight gain, mood issues, poor mental health, lower productivity, and so many more

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Half off, people. Nick, you could talk about Helix in your sleep. Yeah, no, truly. Every time we were doing, we're talking about, I just, I beam when I get to talk about Helix. In the past, we've been traveling so much, Natalie and I, that lately every time I get into bed, it's always just like this moment. Getting into bed is the best part of my day. And that's because you've got a Helix mattress. Truly, I think it is so cool how Helix knows that people are different sleepers. Some people sleep on their

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sale period between 11-10-23 and 11-19, Helix is offering 25% off all mattress orders using code HelixPartner25. That's 25% off. That's a huge savings when it comes to mattresses. Again, Helix is offering 25% off all mattress orders and two free pillows for our listeners. In honor of Black Friday, go to helixsleep.com slash V-I-A-L-L and use code helixpartner25. This is their best offer yet, and it won't last long. With Helix, better sleep starts now. Hold on to your kilts, dearies. Peacock original The Traitors is back with a new season of strategy, betrayal, sabotage, and murder. This killer season features an all-new celebrity cast that Vulture hailed as reality royalty, living in a Scottish castle for the ultimate murder mystery competition. We're talking fierce

competitors, reality stars, and public figures battling it out for a whopping cash prize. This season's cutthroat missions are next level, just like whatever Alan Cumming pulls out of his brilliantly eccentric wardrobe. One thing is for sure, these 21 players will do anything to avoid a plot in Alan's graveyard. Find out why critics and audiences alike are raving about the Emmy award-winning series. The New York Times is calling it a murder mystery with clothes to die for and Vox adding that it should be your new reality TV obsession. We are certainly obsessed. Stream every episode of traders now only on peacock ally aj welcome hi how's it going good that's my first i'm doing great my when i was thinking about how i'm going to introduce you guys my first thought was like how much thought went

into and maybe you guys have talked about this already but like ali aj aj and ali how did you guys decide on the order i think it was flow like what sounds better yeah okay aj and ali doesn't quite have the same flow as ali and aj in my opinion maybe also i'm the oldest but is that because we know it now could be you know it's one of those weird it's anyone now versus play cold it's like play cold sounds ridiculous but it's not just because weird. It's like Coldplay versus Play Cold. It's like Play Cold sounds ridiculous. It's not just because we know them as Coldplay. But if 20 years ago it came out as Play Cold, everyone would have been like Coldplay. Right, right, right, right.

No, I think it's a better flow. We honestly, I don't think that too much into it. It's kind of like Ashley and Mary-Kate, Mary-Kate and Ashley. But it's so like iconic now. It's got a good rhythm to it. Yeah, it flows. Yeah, sure does. Well, how are you ladies?

What's going on? We're good. We're good. How are you ladies how what's going on we're good we're good how are you nick i'm doing well yeah we've had a really nice um little sister weekend actually yeah we've been home for a good minute we did quite a bit of touring not not as much as we did last year but we're like done with any you know shows and being on the road and living in a tour bus for a good a good bit of time, which is really nice. So we've been just at home enjoying going to like farmer's markets.

Went to Bar Pilates classes. But still hanging out. It's not like... Seeing friends and hanging out. No, we hang a lot. We see each other a lot. Despite all the touring and the making music

and working together, you guys, there's truly... We're tight. Yeah, we're super tight. She's moving soon, so we're kind of soaking up all of our time together. Where are you going?

I moved only about an hour and a half away. So I'm not like, I'm not down the street, but I'm not too far. So like I can definitely drive in to get to AJ's in an hour and a half, which is great. But like up north. But it's still. It's still a move. Yeah. We literally live, you know, I mean, as of two weeks ago, we lived like four minutes

from each other. Literally, we just drive from one side of the canyon to the other. Yeah. And now you have to make plans. I know. You know? I know. Now it's going to be a full hour.

Who is that going to affect the more? I mean, you in terms of inconvenience. Yeah. I mean, I'll be the one doing the hour and a half drive for like writing sessions and you know. Because she'll have to come into LA more. Meetings and stuff. Okay. But maybe me because I'm the younger one emotionally. hour and a half drive for like writing sessions and. Because she'll have to come into LA more. Meetings and stuff. Okay.

But maybe me because I'm the younger one emotionally. Right, because she's the baby. But I'm prepared for it. I'm ready. We've spent a lot of time together. Why the move? Yeah, we just wanted to like change it up. We were looking for like a little more space.

We feel like we were kind of outgrowing the home that we're in, which we still love and we still own and we're just renting it out. But we were just like, let's just switch it up. Like we've been here for eight years and you know, it's my husband and I and our two dogs. And we were like, I don't know, it sounds like a fun adventure. And it's not like forever. You know, we might only be there for a couple of years and then say, Hey, we miss LA. We want to come back to the canyon. Can I follow up with you? Just because I'm really curious how this goes totally i am too nally and i are expecting a kid oh you are congratulations yeah we're really excited but ever since then you know we've been here i've i've been here for eight years now he's been here for three okay love la you know but

everything you're saying about like i don't know what it makes sense to just get a little bit more out. Yeah. Well, I think as you get older too, you start to realize that like LA is not the main reason why you have to like be tied to living here, especially if you're in the industry. I think as you get older, you start to figure out like, I don't need to live here and I'm not, I don't have to be chained to Los Angeles. Like this is not my full identity. Even though age and I grew up in LA and we're like Valley kids. It does become your identity. It kind of does. And the more travel that we've done over the years, the more like touring and the more, you know, just like visiting friends that live in other cities, the more you start

to realize, well, okay, there's a lot of positives to LA for sure. Don't get me wrong. But there's also like some negatives to it as well. And there's some beautiful towns all over the US that are a lot more affordable or a lot more quaint. I think being able to travel as much as Allie and I do, it's opened up this possibility that there are other options and not to be so stuck in your ways.

Like it's easy to be like, I'm an LA kid born and raised. I can never leave. And it's like, nope, the world is our oyster. We have so many places we can be. That's another thing. Naya and I, the other day, we're having a girl. Congrats.

And so, thank you. Congrats. You're naming her Allie. Obviously. Or AJ. Or AJ. Whatever flows best. I guess not Allie, because that's your name.

Yeah, true. But a couple months ago, we were lying in bed. And I don't know if it was Naya or me. I was like, our daughter's going gonna be a valley girl oh like is that is that are we okay with that is that okay like that's like an iconic like thing you know valley girl you know and then we were like almost self-conscious about it but i don't know youtube at all really but you guys seem wonderfully down to earth your kid can be a normal valley girl thank you yeah yeah definitely. But you guys seem wonderfully down to earth. Your kid can be a normal Valley girl. Thank you.

Yeah. Yeah. Definitely. You know, you guys, you've been in the limelight your whole life. You've had enormous success. And yet you two seem like just wonderfully well-rounded, normal, chill, hang. So it is possible. It's possible.

What advice do you have for Nellie and I when it comes to like raising our daughter, our kids and things that really served you to growing up in this environment? And how like how did you guys stay so chill and normal and well-rounded? Because a lot of people who have had similar paths to you both, you know, maybe more eccentric, more. Yeah. We're kind of eccentric but yeah we at least didn't like lose ourselves yeah it seems like mental you have a good like awareness and relationship with mental health and it's something that like you're very mindful of in a way where some people haven't always been allowed to i think yeah that was that was very much our mom totally our mom was very like, just talked about everything with us. Nothing was like a secret.

Nothing was hidden from us, which I think is really great. And, you know, both our parents, like they're not together anymore, but I think they gave us the feeling that we were unconditionally loved and that we could really like do whatever we wanted to or whatever we set our minds to um which i think just encouraged us to like be brave in the life choices that we made and then it helped i think having like you know not to say you guys should have a second kid but i think having another sibling does really like give you a balance as a child because that's your kind of that's your buddy that's like your sidekick and we had that

with each other, especially because we were close in age. I agree. Is it the two of you? Do you have any other siblings? No, just us. Yeah. We also spent a lot of time outside. Like I do think no matter where you grew up, Valley, Canyon, Flats, Hills, whatever, I think just being exposed to nature and horseback riding and dogs and dance. And like, we were very free to kind of do whatever we wanted in that moment in terms of our passion. And it was really followed by our parents kind of saying, all right, I recognize this in you and I understand it's something you want to do. So I'll nurture it. And then when it came to entertainment, how did you two at an early age, you know, develop this skillset and to the point where like, Hey, this is, this is more than just my kid,

you know, is good at playing the guitar. You know, everyone has a parent and everyone thinks their kid's amazing. That's true. You know, the parents are like, you got to check out my kid's drawing. Right, right. You're like, wow. Great. Yes.

Talent. Awesome. I think they're going to be a star. You're like, meh. But how did that work out for you two? Well, I guess at the time we were living in Seattle. So we were born in Torrance and then we lived in Seattle for really our childhood years. And then we moved back to Los Angeles. And when we moved back to LA, that's kind of because we were taking acting classes in Seattle downtown. And that got us really just into doing improv and scene work. And I just it was like a bug that we got.

And that was at like age like nine and seven. Yeah. And then, of course, living in L.A. gave us opportunity to actually get agents and all that stuff. But we like begged our parents. They weren't really looking't into it looking into they were like us doing that at all i think they were like what like just keep doing these speech meets and these like plays in your school um we also don't have any other entry point into the industry so i think it was weird being the groundbreakers of that at such a young age because our parents were like we have no one to follow like there's no path for this. We have no...

It feels important that it was you two who came to mom and dad rather than the other way around. Very much so. That is honestly the difference. Yeah. There's a lot of stories out there. Yeah. Totally.

Where the kid is pushed into doing the... The more you hear, obviously, Brittany's memoir has been out and there's a lot of devastating stuff. It's absolutely devastating. Yeah. We just finished the Jeanette McCurdy memoir, which I think is absolutely brilliant. And I'm like, I can't get over what this girl has gone through and how she's been able to take it and create something so beautiful and reclaim her life back. But there you go.

Perfect example of someone who was like, this isn't my passion. I don't want to do this. And then you end up providing for a family. And I mean, it's horrible. It shouldn't be that way. I remember growing up, I was into a lot of different things and I was super into sports. But there were times where I was just like, I don't fucking want to do this today. I would lose a little bit of passion. How did you two help each other out? Because I'm assuming as you guys were in your adolescent years and growing up, other things would come in. There would be certain distraction, boys, things like that. How did you two hold each other accountable? Or were there moments where, you know, maybe Allie

or AJ got checked out or the other person had to be like, hey, come on, we have to do this. How did you guys kind of manage like being kids and having fun, but keeping each other accountable to like meet your professional goals and dreams? Well, we always kind of found both to be fun. So I think Allie and I, it sounds weird, but we're both Aries. We're both like type A personalities. We're really focused. We're really energized. We're really driven. We're also really stubborn. But I think having that drive, you kind of have it or you don't in a way. And I feel like the drive was part of the passion. So the two didn't really go against each other because to me, like knowing that we were accountable for showing up on set and working with adults and learning more about our craft and learning,

you know, how to break down a great script and how to kind of witness if a script maybe wasn't to your liking and how am I going to make this more feel like right for me? And I think all those things that build up accountability are part of the passion and they kind of feed it. I think Allie and I actually ended up falling in love with what we do as we got older because we felt accountable for our passion. And as kids, I think at first, it doesn't really feel like work. It feels like fun because you're just, you're playing make believe. And then as you start to get older, like you said, there's distractions that come in. But for us, like at that point in time, we were homeschooled. So there wasn't really a school distraction. It was like us studying at home, getting done earlier or studying on set. And we weren't really boy crazy when we were young.

So we we just kind of focused on like going to acting class, working on set, writing music, making albums. And that was like our responsibility and then you know we had friends that were in the industry and friends that weren't as well um but we also lived a little bit outside of the city like at that point in time we lived in i guess thousand oaks or yeah newberry park thousand oaks and then calabasas but calabasas at this point in time was not cool at all or hip it was not and we had to beg our friends to come out and see us. They were like, we got to drive 45 minutes to see you. So I think that also helped too.

We weren't like in like the, we weren't in the middle of Los Angeles. Crazy. That's great. But like kind of, now that I think about it, I'm like kind of nerds a little bit. Like we were into it because we were like, this is a craft and a passion. And like, we want to make sure we succeed. I mean, hearing you two talk and knowing I have a daughter on the way, I'm like, how do I teach like things?

And I think about this a lot. Like, how do I teach like passion? And, you know, I've always been like a grinder and a hard worker and things like that. But I have 10 siblings. Whoa. 10? 10. Yeah.

And they're all, we're all very different. That's insane. Some of my other siblings, like I would say are smarter than me, but maybe less driven, you know, and there's always a balance, but like, if you start to notice that they're like, really into science, or, you know, they're super great with numbers, or they happen to, you know, love doing art, like, I think just, like, feed into that and let them like, blossom. And even if that's like an extracurricular activity that they just love, or, I mean, I think it's never a bad idea to get your kid involved in an instrument and it can be any instrument really because i think it's like a life skill that you'll just have forever i think that and learning a second language we did not learn

a second language we totally failed at that but the the musical element i think was something that my mom started with us at a young age with piano and then that went to guitar and i'm really glad that were they big into music or they just wanted you to try they just wanted us to they just want with us at a young age with piano. And then that went to guitar. And I'm really glad that we did. Were they big into music or they just wanted you to try it? They just wanted us to- No, they just wanted us to try it. I mean, our dad isn't musical at all.

Our mom grew up in like a Christian rock band and she's like a singer songwriter. She's never like put out a record, but I think knowing that that was always in the house, like her voice, you know, that was very much a part of our life and whether it was like a duet together at church or a school play or whatever it might be but our mom really nurtured that at a young age without it being like this is going to be a professional thing

yeah and then i know it's kind of famously out there that you had the opportunity to be hannah montana uh i think aj was the one that like I think I like one day was just like I don't know I was like it was like a tweet and I was like why don't you just tell people this no and honestly it was kind of stupid but whatever but did you kind of wish she didn't put it out there? no no I don't care

I mean it was so long ago it's like I I mean it's funny it's like you remember certain moments of your childhood and then others feel like it's just like a black hole. And for whatever reason, I definitely do remember reading that script. And I just remember being at an age where I had just finished or we were just finishing Phil of the Future. And I was like, I'm good. Like I did what I was supposed to do here on Disney. And like, they were really great to work with and they were a huge platform for our music, most importantly. And so much of the fact that people thought that we had a TV show when we didn't,

but it was just us and probably commercials and music videos being played. Everyone thinks there was a Disney show called Allie and AJ. Which there wasn't. It's like crazy. Yeah. It's almost like a Mandela effect. Yeah. Everyone does.

It's a Mandela effect. It's so funny. I love that we're's almost like a Mandela effect. Yeah. Everyone does. It's a Mandela effect. It's so funny. Which honestly, I love that we're a part of a Mandela effect. Me too. It's worth it for just that alone. People who we've worked with for years have thought that. And they've known us since we were like teens. Yeah. I definitely thought that.

I was like telling people all the time, you guys, I don't know, like, oh, they had like a Disney show. No, no. We just had a pilot that never ended up going. And then we had like a Disney Channel movie that we were in that we played sisters with. Still a big deal. So it's fair. It fair it makes sense yeah um you've been on the record no regrets about the hannah montana thing is there anything in your lady's career where you know that you went back and thought what if we would have done that or were there were there decisions you

made that you've ever second guessed not that regret it, but maybe wondered what could have been or. We talked about how we wish we hadn't stopped touring. Yeah. I think we took a really long break from music that was not really, I don't know. I don't think it was the best choice looking back on it. I'm like, it would have been really nice to have just kept that going.

Like that's something that you kind of have to nurture and feed and work on your songwriting, work on your live show, work on your, you know, instrumentation and your craft. And I feel like Allie and I ended up taking acting not more seriously, but just kind of focused more time into acting for 10 years. And do you think that was just kind of because jobs were coming your way and you were both enjoying it? Or was it maybe a product of you guys maybe subconsciously saying, we love each other we love working together but we're gonna do our own thing for a minute or was it just we weren't signed we weren't signed at that point like we had left our label so i think a lot of it had to do with that we were a little lost and not having

like a home for our music even though we could have still kept touring and said well we don't have new records out but we'll play you all this music so i think that was part of it yeah and i think like it was taking over the acting was taking over and we were a little lost i think as artists as adult artists we didn't really know what we wanted the sound to be like we felt like we were kind of maybe pigeonholed at certain times when we were on the label and so it took just like time away i think for us to find ourselves yeah we're almost like playing catch up for it a little bit now which is fine you know it's like you can't you can't change the past and you can only move forward but i do think those are 10

years that we could have been touring and keeping up like a very consistent yeah career i've heard from a lot of people i don't know much about the music industry but people who do work in it you know the i remember someone always telling me you got to play your hits so to speak you know yeah no you do uh but do you two as you're developing new music how do you guys do you enjoy playing the old ones because you know potential breakup song and the crowd goes wild or is it just you know there's something to be said about trying to grow from your past or just you know leave things in the past, so to speak. How do you guys balance that?

I think you can always bring back every year old hits as long as you can keep it fresh and still enjoy playing it every time on stage. Once you're not enjoying it anymore, I think it is really hard. I do get excited over people's pure excitement and joy for some of the old material. So it doesn't really get old. I don't feel like, oh gosh, we have to play have to play potential breakup yeah it's like we kind of know we're gonna always be playing that song it's more a matter of like how do we make it new and fresh and feel different and flow without changing the song in its entirety you know but but i i agree with aj i think when we were like in our early 20s we were rebelling against wanting to play some of

those songs but now i think it's like in our 30s we've like comebelling against wanting to play some of those songs. But now I think it's like in our thirties, we've like come around. Yeah. We've come circle. We're like, we get it. We're good.

Let's do it. It's totally different. But I think, yeah, everyone has their, when I started this show, you know, it was like, I don't want to be like a bachelor show or a bachelor podcast.

Like, and so for the first year, barely talked about the bachelor. We didn't recap it at all. We might talk about for five minutes here or there. And it wasn't till the show was like recognized as something other than that that then you're like okay i was like all right we can go back and talk about a little bit more but yeah and then and and then i kind of went through this which made me think about this is i learned to just embrace it in a little bit better i wasn't so resistant to it i was resistant to it

to a fault in a sense where why don't I just act like I do enjoy it because I do sometimes talking about things from the past and like I felt like it connected me better with my audience totally in a way where I stopped being so resistant so then I could appreciate creating the content we were creating rather than being I gotta fucking do this and do that and i think people kind of heard you could kind of feel that through the the mic so to speak the enjoyment out of it yeah it still must be fun to go on stage and have people just screaming it's totally your favorite songs come on yeah also i know what it's like to be at a concert with a band that i love and i want to hear

those songs from that second or third record yeah we're audience be on the seventh one now you know we're audience members too like we know what it's like to be at a show and be like I really wish they had played that song who are you guys the biggest fans of Ray LaMontagne he's like my hero okay I think he's like he's I think he's the greatest living musician right now for our generation we're big we're big singer-song. We're big. We're big. Singer, songwriter. We're big Ray fans. We just saw him and we're big. My Morning Jacket fans. Yeah.

National. Warm drugs. It's a lot of like male rock. Honestly, it's a lot of men. I really like the National. We have too much female energy ourselves. I saw the National in concert.

They're so good live. They are, but it was like a little slower. It's a slower show. Yeah, they're a slow jam. Slow burn. Yeah. You have to be prepared for it. Totally. It's a slower show yeah there's a slow jam slow burn yeah yeah

you have to be prepared for it totally this is a very moody music it is oh yeah yeah yeah you can really get in your feels with the national major feels yeah do you like do you like erin's stuff with taylor padesk i do actually i do yeah i think it's good i think they work so well together and the alcott on their album love the alcott yeah i think i think that that's it's a good collaboration and obviously she's a fan of the national you, and so it makes sense that she would like say, I want to find the guy that's behind the sound. But I think it is really well done. And it makes me think like, oh, wow, she's got really good taste. Like to have pointed out Aaron Desner.

I'm like, that was a very smart. It's very specific. Yeah. Yeah. Is there a song of yours that you feel like people kind of sleep on or like not like you're saying you are entitled to more like listenership to it, but a song that you're really proud of that you're like, I think I don't know. I think this song kind of flew under the radar. And I think if more people gave it a chance, they might really vibe with it. I don't know. What do you think? I mean, I don't know how well you know our catalog, but is there a song that you're like, why isn't this song? It's hard for me to find one myself. I actually do want to know. Yeah.

She's like looking up. She's like, well, I'm because I had this. I sing it. I didn't have Disney when I was a kid. So it was always very exciting when I had access to it. And I had Disney sing it. Yeah. And I feel like there were some.

Well, like, whoa, I feel like that. I mean, obviously, that's like a pretty popular one. But I feel like I'm thinking about that now. And I'm like, oh, like, I feel hyped. Like that was a single but it wasn't like it wasn't like potential breakup song or no or rush yeah i don't know if i none of our songs ever really hit the radio yeah we're not really a radio band yeah for whatever reason potential breakup song did it not really no no it never hit top 40 but i don't listen to the radio like ever no one does now so now it really doesn't matter but I know that song

like so well I think it was like Sirius you know it was on Sirius I mean I think it it definitely didn't hit top 40 no like I was playing it

and I don't know again my fiance Natalie knows every word to every song she put it on she'll sing I'm the opposite

I don't know anything and we were playing your song and I was like I know it I know these words like I know it that well and I don't even listen to the radio so I don't know words that And we were playing your song and I was like, I know it. I know these words like I know it that well. And I don't even listen to radio.

So I don't know. Well, we were wondering if potential breakup song because it feels like fucking birthday was always meant to be the lyric. And we were wondering when you guys originally wrote that and put it out, like, was that was stupid birthday required? Yeah. Was that required by that censored? I think at that point in time age and I were

starting to swear and cuss because we were teenagers and obviously that felt cool at the time but I don't think we ever even thought for a second that we would ever get away with that so I don't even know if we even that wasn't a sense that wasn't even a censored line it was like it was always the label will never go for that so I don't even think we even thought of it and then what was like it is funny how many people release it i know yeah yeah it just feels so right and then what was like what went into the re-release like how did that feel obviously you sing it you know on on your tour and so you get to relive it that way but like re-record it like did that was that just an amazing experience was was that just like so fun to be able to it actually was a cool do-over because

it was like all the things we wanted to do a little differently when it comes to production and vocal arrangement and mixing and mastering. We got to like have our hands in and do, you know, 20 years later. And honestly, TikTok really inspired that re-release because it was doing so well on TikTok. So we were like, well, we kind of have to just give into this. It was weird to like re-record it. To hear some of the original choices that were made that we were like, huh, okay, interesting. Don't know why we okayed that mix, but all right, we're here now. So it was nice to actually like redo it and make it fresh.

It felt, here's the better version of this. It was so good to sing it as an adult in the sense that you could replace the 16 year old vocals. Like that felt great. And some of the heavy auto tune that i know was very much like a style you know so i was kind of like let's let's strip that all down and not not do that but it feels like it's still current you know i feel that way about old instagram captions oh yeah totally or even instagram filters where you're like what is this sepia filter yes 100 that was really in the filters for a while that That was huge, you guys. It was bad. Like 2013, 14.

But I'll have to scroll back just a few weeks to be like, why did I think that was funny? Yeah, yeah. Yeah, you don't have to go far. Yuck. To be like, that's cringe now. What do you ladies do for fun? I mean, you're always creating, you're always together, you're touring. Like, how do you guys, like, when you're not making wonderful content and being with each other, like how do you guys unwind?

Are you pop culture fans? You watch reality TV. Like, what do you guys, what are you guys doing? Are you cooking, traveling? So reality TV,

pop culture is all alley. That's like, not my, really? No, I mean, it's almost like shocking. Like sometimes I'll be like,

like I had no idea you were a bachelor until, until like, like honestly. And then I was like, wait, I was like, I got to tell him that because he might be like, that's refreshing. Yeah. Yeah.

He doesn't know about any really any major pop culture moments. No, except I'm not going to lie. I'm not going to lie. I got sucked into Golden Bachelor. Oh, it's the first season I've ever watched every episode. And I'm loving it. It's endearing and sweet. There's nothing.

There's nothing not to love. It's soaring and sweet. I'm loving it. There's nothing not to love about that. It's so sweet. Yeah, what are we into? We love to travel. So when Allie and I are not working, we're usually planning a big trip. And how did you decide, of all the things you guys could be close

or not close about, how did you get into pop culture and reality TV and you just be like, you know, it's not for me? I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. That's funny. It's it's, I guess it's one of the things that like separates us, you know? Um, she loves like murder docs and like, yeah. Yeah. Cause I was more one of like, for me, I was never into either of them until I was a part of it. And I think more, it was because, you know, just being a guy, I was like just more sports,

but it was like, once I was a part of it, I was like, no, I guess I'm into this stuff. I like it. It was introduced to me. Exactly. And I think part of it is like having like a couple of girlfriends that also are into it. So then I'll be like DMing them like some funny thing or something that they would only appreciate.

It's like a camaraderie thing. Yeah. What's your biggest like guilty pleasure when it comes to reality tv or pop culture like what's the thing that you've paid the most attention to in the past few years most attention to um or like you weirdly just know too much about could give a ted talk on give a ted talk on it's funny like i i there aren't like a million reality shows that I watch. Like I do like bachelor. And I think funny enough,

this season is the one that I've kind of, I bailed out. She's sleeping. And it's the one I'm into. On golden or? Golden. On golden. You're not into golden.

Not really. Not for me. Not for me. I don't know. She doesn't like the older people. I don't think I, no, no,

no. I actually think it's, oh boy. I'm age... No, no. No, I actually think it's... Oh, boy. I'm an ageist. No, I think... I actually think it's sweet. Like, the idea of it is really sweet. But I think, if I'm being really honest, I think the Bachelor franchise...

It's done. It's at its day. You know? There's a lot of people who... I think it's done. I think it's at its day. But they're trying to re-spark it. That's what this is for.

And I think it's working. No, no. And it's smart. It's smart. I think... I really do like Real Housewives. Only of Salt Lake City. Okay. Only Salt Lake. I know. It's really random. Neverark it. That's what this is for. And it's smart. It's smart. I think I really do like Real Housewives only of Salt Lake City. Okay. Only Salt Lake. I know. It's really random. Not Beverly Hills.

Nope. Have you tried Beverly Hills? Never even seen Beverly Hills. I just started watching it. Just give it a shot. Okay. Okay. Like from season one. Well, I actually... I just started season... Is it 10 the most recent? 13. 13. Okay. I just started with the most recent. You can... Like with Vanderpump, I started at season 10. it 10 the most recent? Yeah. 13. 13. Okay.

I just started with the most recent. You can, like with Vanderpump, I started at season 10. You can jump right in. You can always go. It's actually sometimes fun to start somewhere in the middle and then kind of go back and get a little history lesson if you want to like turn on your own episode. Right, right, right. It's like watching Pulp Fiction, you know?

It doesn't really matter what order. You're right. That's a good point. You can kind of go back and forth. Okay. I would be open-minded. I don't want to get myself involved in all of them it's too much

it's too it's too down the rabbit hole for me but I would be open with opening up what's your favorite thing about Salt Lake I don't know

Salt Lake City is so good I think that they have yeah exactly there's criminal behavior Jen saw running from the FBI on camera huh I mean that's

that's I mean that's brilliant television she fled the FBI on camera yeah and there's no way you can fake that that's kind of incredible that is so mean that's that's i mean that's on camera television she fled the fbi on camera yeah yeah that's and there's no way you can fake that kind of incredible that is so good truly incredible maybe that's why it's tied into the the criminal aspect because i watch a lot of you know true crime documentaries there's also mary mary cosby yep she married her grandpa correct huh yes i need to start watching salt lake yeah like you mean she married her grandpa?

This is like some House of Dragon shit. Yeah. So like her grandma ran like a cult, in quotation marks, and then promised the marriage of one of her granddaughters to her step husband. Correct. Yeah. There you go. And followed through.

She followed through. The show was originally just going to follow her. And then at the very last second, they were like, let's just make this a Real Housewives. Oh, I didn't know that. Wait, it was just going to be about her? Yeah. Yeah. This feels Game of Thrones-like.

They were like, I think she's too crazy. I think we need other women. Yeah. Yeah. They were like, we can't just focus on her. Like, people will be too disturbed. This is nuts. Sleeping on Salt Lake.

No. So funny enough. So this will be my last comment about Golden Bachelor. I was watching the most recent episode last week with my boyfriend. And I was looking through. I was like, I got to look up every bachelor there's ever been. Because'm like, I have no clue. And that's when I saw your name. And I was like, that guy's interviewing us in a couple days. They're like, do we really want to do this? profiles like we love i think living in la is great because you have access to like you know the lachman the new bev new bev and the academy i mean it's like we have so many awesome ways to like exercise art that might not even be what we're currently doing as artists um so to me it's like you know going to an art show or going to a concert or um binge watching game of thrones that's

my big thing that's your big thing i actually haven't seen Game of Thrones. It's the best. You gotta start. It's like the only show I really care about. I started twice. If I start Beverly Hills Housewives, you're starting Game of Thrones. I know.

I think I'll get into it. I mean, that's not even... I liked more of the... I like that type of stuff. Yeah, yeah. I watched it when it first came out like an episode or two. And then just, I don't know.

I just got busy. I just have to... You have some shows you have to... You have to invest a little like true season one true detective I agree it was great I had to I started watching true

detective season one like two episodes and just got distracted and or just didn't get into it the first season was the best and amazing my dad was like no you got to power through and once you get to like episode five it's one of the best shows ever sometimes you just have to find a way to get into also i will say game of thrones season one is such a good

first season for a show it's insane so i finally just got into house of dragon it took me like a full year oh i don't know why i was just sleeping on it because i think i was so like i'm a game of thrones girl forever and i i can't get into this like the pilot i wasn't into and now i'm like i love so i do have to ask with the whole like love of I wasn't into and now I'm like I love so I do have to ask with the whole like love of Game of Thrones and like Joe Jonas being your first kiss like are we like team Sophie or are we like because we're like we're a team Sophie house oh interesting that's funny I love her I mean I think she's super talented in the show I think she's so good in it she is she's wonderful um but in real life did you ever like wonder what

was behind the ring cam huh the, I've never met her. Huh? The ring cam. You haven't followed the story. Oh, by the way, she doesn't know enough. No, Allie, tell me about this. So she said something on the ring cam. Yeah.

Yeah. And it ended the marriage like that exact moment, which obviously there's other stuff. Doesn't this sound like a stretch though? Like, doesn't that seem like something that somebody like called in and it's total BS? It's a little weird. Well, I don't honestly have a, I don't have a dog in the fight. Like, I can't pick a team because I'm like, I don't really I mean, I know a little bit about it. I only have a dog in the fight just because I met Sophie once at a Dodger game.

Was she sweet? So nice. Yeah, I've heard she's really cool. She seems very normal. And they were like a few rows behind in front of me. And she turned around and was like waving. And, you know, like when someone that they're like, there's no way she's waving at me. So I'm like, and we're at the Dodger game like there's no way she's waving at me so i'm like

and we're at the dodger game and there's always a lot of notable people yeah sure there so she's pointing at me and i'm like there's just no way she's pointing i mean i did not want to wave at her thinking yeah someone's behind her but it ended up being me she was a bachelor fan and she was so nice and sweet that's cute and then I messaged her as a great to meet you. And she responded with like a thumbs up or a like or whatever. And then when the, the divorce happened, I just let her know that we're,

we're team Sophie here. That's hilarious. You're like, just so you know, just, you know, yeah. And she,

she, she responded, uh, just with a OMG. Thank you. She was very sweet. I think that whole story rubbed me the wrong way. I just really hated how his team actively tried to win the breakup.

And I just, breakups are hard for everyone. There's messiness. And if there's kids involved. Kids involved. That even seems kind of weirder. It's like people should just be classy and go their own ways. Everything should be amicable as much as they can. Relationships are fucking hard.

And maybe Sophie fucked up. I don't know. Maybe she did something she has to apologize for. I just think it's so much more wrong to try to win the PR game. I agree. I agree. And it just left a... The priority needs to be somewhere else.

Yeah. So I was immediately like, no, fuck you. Team Sophie, for sure. Like, it's just... I'm sure there's some regret from the team after all the backlash or that team changed and they're no longer

a team yeah maybe yeah anyway was he your kisser we were like 15 we were so young

she's like I have notes I'm like I think we were both sloppy and inexperienced it was such an iconic I feel like Disney Channel era like it was almost both sloppy and inexperienced. It was such an iconic, I feel like, Disney Channel era. It was almost like this capsule wardrobe of stars because it was such a consistent

Camp Rock, Hannah Montana. Were there, looking back, and obviously very happily with partners now, is there, if you had to date someone from that Disney Channel era, is there anybody you were like, I think we would have gotten along well? Looking back, I'm all... I, I think we would have gotten along well?

Looking back, I'm all... But I don't think I would think any of the people on the channel, I would be like, they'd be a great boyfriend. I'd be like, they're probably a terrible boyfriend. Well, it was just so incestual. It was like everyone was dating each other. Like Zach and Vanessa, Miley and Nick, Selena and Nick, me and Joe. It just kind of becomes this pool.

Cesspool. Also, is that what you call Disney Channel? The channel? Is that like what the cool kids call it? Yes, she always calls it that. I do say the channel. That's pretty funny. The channel. The files. The channel.

I mean, if you want to share or just a guess, I know it's fine, but I'm curious with all those memories of dealing with all those child stars and the parents parents do you guys remember any kind of crazy moments of parent and kids interactions you know it just must have been chaos yeah in terms of like stage parents yeah stage parents most of them were i would say about 90 of them were yeah pretty bad yeah and i think because we were on the slightly older end when we I mean not we weren't that old when we exited but like I think when we left the channel um

you know there were still like a lot of you know young talent that were coming in like Disney still mattered for another whatever it was you know 10 years or something after that but I think yeah I think you're right age it was more like just kind of really weird interactions with the parents and how they handled their kid and which to be fair kind of had nothing to do with the channel it was kind of like anyone in the industry at that age most of them had stage parents sounds horrible but like I'd go to an audition and be like oh that girl I can tell is like being coached by her mom and she's crying in the corner. Like it was heartbreaking. Like it didn't even have to do with Disney necessarily.

It was just child actors, early 2000s. I'm sure it still happens. We're kind of being guided by their parents. Like I remember coming to set and there was like a dad coaching his daughter in the hair and makeup chair and like telling her how to say the lines. And I'm just going, whoa, my parents would never do that. Like what the hell is happening? So it's, I think regardless of Disney, it was just the stage parent thing was, we saw a lot. It was sad. I think that's the hardest part about like putting kids in industry is that the industry is not like a safe place for a child really technically. Somehow age and I like were able to, to be a part of it. And I think because our mom was

truly around 24 seven, um, you know, we, nothing happened to us that was, you know, really all that traumatic, but there's so many stories that I know personally of people that were like sexually abused in, within the industry, which is really sad and, and is terrible that people took that opportunity to prey on a young child because of it being a children's show. Yeah. Well, that's obviously horrible, but even all, like anything that bad happened is horrible. But what I'm like hearing from you guys, which is interesting, you guys were so lucky to have the parents that you had because your parents' focus was just supporting the two of you and lucky to have the parents that you had because your parents focus was just

supporting the two of you and trying to have supporting your passions very much and it was your passions as opposed to so many other child stars probably was their parents it was the only way it works and so your mom probably it sounds like she was the one there a lot so she had her radars up she had like she wasn't... Yes. Wasn't the me show. Yeah. Whatever her goals were, she wasn't compromised by like, well, is it worth it? It sounds like your mom's only goal was just make sure Allie and AJ are okay. Yeah.

I'm their mom. I'm here. Yeah. Is this okay for them? Is this not? It wasn't like, did they deliver a line? Totally. Totally.

Because it's like if you, I'm guessing, didn't have a good day at work mom was always going to be there to just give you a hug exactly you know whereas other kids might like that's really sweet yeah go to the corner yeah yeah so it's a good observation yeah i think that's that's the only way i think it worked yeah with um i know you mentioned not really having an into the industry and so sort of just like figuring it out and breaking in i feel like nepo babies was a huge topic of conversation in the zeitgeist like months ago. I'm like, what's your kind of like perspective on Nepo Babies having had an experience that was seems to be upheld as like the more authentic or like the right way to kind of get into the industry? I don't know. I mean, the Nepo Baby thing to me is

like, gosh, it's kind of an incredible, beautiful blessing because you really do have like two feet in the door. It's a matter of can you sustain it? Like just because you're a nepo baby, it might mean your entry point was a little easier. It doesn't mean that it helps you for the whole time. It doesn't mean you're just going to be able to coast and soar forever. I mean, eventually you have to kind of make a name for yourself. Are you actually someone that can show up to work and give the goods and be just as talented as your dad or your mom or your aunt or whatever so to me it's like i've

always kind of been like damn that could have been a way easier entry for ali and i but i'm also like i'm happy that we don't have a lot it feels like it would be a lot of pressure that's i think the downfall of the nepo baby is like a lot of pressure my parent is wildly successful or my grandparent is wildly famous and I'll never be. The comparison. X, Y, and Z. Yeah, that would be really gnarly. Imagine being famous, right? Or just like, it does get annoying to be like, oh, you're from The Bachelor or like, you

know, when you have a new project, it can get frustrating for people to call back something you even did. Yeah. Imagine what it's like to have a callback from something that you didn't do. Your parent did. I just share this last name. I'm on record as pro-Nepo baby. You're pro.

It's just more to that end. I agree. That's why I said they're blessed. There's nothing wrong. It's just a matter of can you sustain the career yourself outside of the name. There's pros and cons to everything. You two didn't have the advantage

of having parents in the industry, but allowed you, you had advantages, you know, and in the best possible way. And every bit of success I'm guessing you had

without, you know, access given to you that you had to earn, you always appreciate the shit that you had to work a little harder for.

I have found that. You don't take it for granted or at least when you get older you start to really a little harder for. I have found that. You don't take it for granted. Or at least when you get older, you start to really realize, wow, that was actually like very unique that I got to experience that or that that job came my way. And just think of how many celebrities have kids that didn't become famous. Yeah. So many more. So many.

And we always focus on the ones that do. We don't know about those kids. Yeah. You're right. I have a lot of friends in the industry who have very famous parents and they've dabbled and they've had some success but didn't really crack,

you know, and things like that. And so at the end of the day, I think if people make it, they make it because they're talented. I agree. Like you said, they might have gotten a foot in the door.

I agree. They might not got a gig here or there, but it was their talent that got them to where they kind of makes sense that they would maybe do what their parent does i mean especially if they're like growing up on sets or on a tour bus or or whatever like yeah that's all that's gonna seep into their life that's kind of all they know so you kind of can't get mad at them for having a passion for the arts if that's what their parent did kind of make sense. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. But I would, I would like to think if I was a nepo baby of a famous parent, I would want to be like, I'm going to do, I think just because I'm someone that wouldn't want to, to fall into the trap of like doing what my parent did,

I would be like, I'm going to do the exact opposite. And I'm going to try to become successful as like something wildly left from center. Yeah. Yeah. I think that's just how my ego would work at least. Well, it's interesting that you say that too, because like, I have a big ego. Sometimes my ego has served me well. Sometimes my ego has gotten me in trouble. And so the way you talk about it, you're like acknowledging that it might've just been an ego driven choice and maybe you would have avoided something that deep down you could have been good at only because you were just trying to go against the grain, which we've all done, you know, and it's kind of interesting

to think about life that way. You both are in successful relationships or it seems like it, I don't know. Are they successful? You're married, you're in a long-term relationship. What works for you guys? Like what are, you know, we talk a lot about relationships and dating. What allows you two to have the relationships that you do have with your partners? Just an open dialogue and open communication. Like I think it's hard when you're touring and you're on the road for three months and you're not seeing your loved one consistently. your loved one consistently, you have to have some sort of connection that you at least build virtually that can kind of be your like, this is sustaining me for three months, even if I'm not

seeing this person. So to me, it's like a constant dialogue. Like my boyfriend and I are super, super communicative and always just like very in touch with our emotions. Like he's been in therapy for like 20 years and he's like, he brings that into our relationship, which I love because it actually really helps me. It's a really beautiful partnership and he's in the industry too. So he gets it even though he's not like a touring musician, he's an actor. So there'll be moments where he's on set for months and yeah, he understands.

What about you? I mean, my, my husband gets to come out with, he gets to come out with us because he's really part of like the team. He's like our creative director and, you know, he photographs and, and, you know, he photographs and, and, um, you know, shoots all of our shows. And so having him out

on the road, you know, obviously I've gotten spoiled having him with us. Um, and I'm never really kind of away from him for more than like two weeks at a time. And that's usually with like shooting a project or something. I think that's probably the longest we've spent apart. But we met when I was really young. I met him when I was 23 and he was 27. And I don't know, we just kind of knew that we were like, we were each other's people. And it was very easy kind of from like day one. So I think when it comes to like our relationship, you know, I mean, honestly, it's kind of sometimes the three of us because he's very much so a part of like a brother. Yeah, he's like a sibling now.

We're like sister wives. It's weird. Not bad. But but but it you know, it's it's interesting. It's a unique relationship that we all three have to like get along because we spend so many hours together on the bus, you know, on, on, on the road, you know, flying, traveling. But I think he really gets that, like, he gets what we're after as artists. And I think he wants to help, like, bring that vision to life, like a parent, you know, that he's like, I'm here to help make your dreams happen. I think sometimes at the expense of his own,

which I think is really, you know, selfless, but, but, um, but he's amazing. You know, he's like, he's, he's the perfect half to, it's like the yin and yang. And then AJ is that version, but as a sibling, you know, I mean so much about a successful long-term relationship is the ability to stay connected, you know, day in and day out and to talk to life. Yeah. And life happens. And there are periods in any great relationship where you just feel a little distant sometimes. I don't know if you two have ever experienced that, but if you have, what was something that, you know, how did you kind of bridge that gap with your partners? Because that can be even a challenge to say, hey, I feel a little disconnected or, you know, maybe we just, we've been busy, but how have you gone out of your way to come back to each other always? How have you gone out of your way to come back to each other always? That's a good question. Well, I think a lot of things kind of hinge on what you've seen your parents do and what you don't want to replicate.

And some things you're like, I do want to replicate this. But I think our parents, our mom and dad, you know, over the years, they were married for 23 years. We kind of saw them lose touch with each other and really kind of bringing to the table their personal needs. And I think that to me kind of tarnished the relationship over years where we saw them not really talk or get super real with each other anymore. And so for me, it's about, if you feel those things, it's time to address them. So like, I'm just really real if I'm feeling it. Like, I'll just be like, hey babe, like we feel really disconnected right now. Like, how can we work on this? And we find a way. Do you feel like the fact that you guys do therapy makes it that much easier? I think so. To bring those topics up. Yeah, very much so.

Yeah. How about you? I think for me, uh, when I felt distant, it's usually when I'm really depressed and I'm having like, uh, just a season of like sadness. And it usually isn't related to any specific thing. You know, it's, uh, I, I've always struggled with depression since a very young age. And, you know, I went through kind of a recent, like rough patch where I was changing a medication and it was making me feel really, really, really bad. And, you know, my husband was just there to kind of like hold my hand and get me through it. But, you know, he himself isn't on, you know, anxiety medication, depression medication. So he's also just kind of like there to like listen and not give an opinion, which I also think is really important. Yeah. A lot of guys don't do that. And a lot of people don't want to do that.

Sometimes you just need someone to listen. Yeah. And so he was like, whatever we need to do to like get you feeling better and like get you back to like a place where you feel like yourself, you know, whatever we need to do to make that happen is what we should be focusing on. And, you know, a lot of that was like getting a different psychiatrist, like getting out and walking more and, you know, spending like time out in nature and, you know, just like little small things. And then also just finding the right medication too, that, that, that on its own was, was a big change. But, um, I think that, I think that having like a partner that's willing to like go through the like hard points with you is really important. I mean, that really shows you that they're the right person if you're able to get through that and weather that storm.

Oh, 100%. Yeah. It's easy to have fun with someone. yeah it is really easy totally for the most part but it's getting through those lows that really make that connection that much stronger how long have you guys been together oh i i'm his producer wait why did i think oh my gosh i thought you guys were together and having a baby no that's funny that That's incredible. We're like, we're like, amazing. I was like, how do I not wait?

That's funny. You just missed out. She was here earlier recording. She left. Well, you, she, she's often here on the show,

but because we have two guests today, she'll, she'll usually sit right there. Okay. So she peaced out for us. So you guys are not having a child. We are not having a child. She very much works for me.

That's amazing. Okay. But how long have you guys then been together? Three years. We've known her for four. Baby's kicking, everything. And it's a girl. It's a girl. Do you guys have names? We do have a name picked out. One name specifically. Yeah, pretty sure. We're kind of trying it out. We'll tell you guys have names? Yeah. We do have a name picked out. One name specifically. Yeah.

Pretty sure. Wow. We're kind of trying it out. We'll tell you guys afterwards. Okay. Yeah, please. Afterwards, you can give us your honest opinion. Perfect.

Okay. I'm pretty committed to it. Yeah. What about your parents? Do they know about it? Are you open to like, if you meet the baby and you say the name and it doesn't work out, you're like, this doesn't feel right. I think we're kind of open to that.

We've been kind of trying it out. Not going to force it on the kid. And referring. We call her by her name now. Cute. Kind of trying it out a little force it referring we call we we call her by her name now kind of trying it out a little bit you know because this is fun for me just because like i'm going to and i want i have a desire to be a very like active parent and like i want you know obviously natalie feels very

much pregnant and all those all those things so i'm just trying to find ways to make it real for me sure you're like i'm not physically caring so I'm finding other ways to make it feel. I'm reading Green Bay Packer articles to the baby. We do that. We try to read her every night. And now he has all these like baby books. And I'm like, you know, I don't know. I'm aging myself. But one of my favorite movies back in the day was Three Men and a Little Baby. That movie is so good. So good. And there's a great line in the movie where he's like, it doesn't matter what you read, it's how you read it. That's how you read it. Another movie that I feel like is similar to that

era is Baby's Day Out. I'm not familiar. It's so good. Do you know this movie? It rings a bell for sure. It's so great. Baby's Day Out. It's all about a baby in New York City who gets by himself. It's like Home Alone but a baby? I don't know why. I mean mean I have to do a rewatch

like maybe it doesn't hold up but Aja and I loved this movie as kids okay yeah we just it cracked us up I don't know why

what were some of your faves as kids we loved Hook Hook I saw vivid memory I saw that in the theaters the first time

got the stomach flu that night I just remembered that no yeah but one of my favorite movies I just remember you'll never flu that night. I just remembered that. No. But one of my favorite movies. I just remember going to the theaters, loving that movie, eating McDonald's

and getting fucking the stomach flu. Looky, looky, I got hooky. One of my favorite movies. Oh, I know that movie so well. Actually, maybe that needs a rewatch. Oh, there you are, Peter. I know. Peter. so good. Actually, maybe that needs a rewatch. I don't know. We're into weird. Oh, there you are, Peter. I know. Peter.

Willow. Willow. Willow. Princess Bride. Man, more to get in. Yes. Willow is so good. I need my shit suit, Willow.

We can watch the movies as kids together. We can totally. Princess Bride. What was the scariest movie you ever saw as a kid? Like, that just like was freaky. I have two. I mean, Cujo. Like Stephen King stuff. Like Pet Sematary. No, I'm thinking like it was like a kid's movie, but like was freaky. I have two. I mean, Cujo, like Stephen King stuff, like Pet Sematary.

No, I'm thinking like it was like a kid's movie, but like it wasn't. Oh, Chucky. Chucky. That scared the hell out of us. Oh, but you're not actually talking. That's not actually a kid's movie. I'm thinking Labyrinth. Have you seen the Labyrinth? Oh, Labyrinth.

But you know what? It's funny as we never watched that as children. I scared the shit out of me. We watched it as adults and it scared me. Yeah. Never ending story. Terrifying. Never ending story is definitely scary, but I also love that movie.

Princess Bride. Great. No, I loved it. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I loved it, but it was scary. Princess Bride is so good.

Princess Bride is amazing. Willow kind of has scary moments. Clifford. Clifford's a weird one. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Clifford is a weird movie. Martin Short.

Steve Martin. Oh, that. Yes. Remember that movie? Yes. That was so good. This is not a scary movie, but another movie from our childhood. Three Musketeers.

We love that. So good. Great movie. Yes. Yeah. Three Men and a Baby is amazing wait till you see Baby's Day Out okay

you're gonna love it it's bizarre Three Men and a Baby or Three Men and a Little Lady oh well there you go when they go to England wait I don't know that one there's a second

it's a sequel yes don't know it when you said the title I was like does he mean Three Men and a Baby but you're saying Three Men and a Baby

is the original they're in New York Three Men and a Little Lady she's like five or original lady. They're in New York. Three men and a little lady. She's like five or six. Oh, that's cute. I love with like a British actor. So like there's this whole thing. Do they move?

I have a friend whose kid's name is Lady. So I got to send this to her. Yeah. Well, texting office hour is coming up and we're going to give someone advice. But before we do, I was stalking you guys on this TikTok page and you both playfully did this TikTok red flags.

I think yours doesn't drink too much water or something. I don't know. I was so mad at mine. I was like, mine said I was a flat earther. Yeah, I saw that.

AJ was like, what? I was like, I'm done. Truly offended by that. I was so pissed. I was in a car wash. Maybe something happened. Just a filter. Yeah. But what are pissed. I was in a car wash. Maybe something happened. Just a filter.

But what are you? But seriously, what are your, it could be relationship red flags. It could be just maybe friendship red flags, but what are things that bad habits that you've had to overcome? Or maybe your partner has been like, you know what?

I love you, but you really need to work on this. Like what are, what are some things that you guys have had to identify and address over, over time? So since I was really little, I'm like, I love talking. Like I could just talk, talk, talk, talk for days. And I'm a repeater. Like I'll end up just narrating my day, talking about what I just did, what I'm about to just do, what I'm currently doing. And that gets, that. And that gets a little annoying. I'm used to it on text, but it's annoying.

But I'm just used to it now. She's here to confirm it's annoying. I mean, I guess I do a small version of it, but it's not like AJ. You do it too. In case you haven't heard me, I'm just going to say it one more time. I'm a narrator of life.

I call it a narrator of life. Do you ruminate a lot? Yeah. But out loud. Like external processing. It's very much that. I think that's how I understand how I'm feeling is like when someone asks me how I'm doing, like, I don't know when I start talking than I do by the time I think.

Right. It's a stimulator for me too. I empathize with you. My manager says things everything three times. Oh, so that's like a crazy OCD thing. I think a red flag for me is like sending kind of like slightly blunt to the point semi-harsh emails that have so many typos it ruins its gravitas no offense yeah i i am somebody with typos is there a line from one of those emails like not the whole email but just like one specific

little chunk that kind of embodies the tone that you can achieve should she refer to it i mean i can refer to one i i just sent it, I think, a couple days ago. Fresh. I've sent a couple emails in the past. I'm like, I probably could have waited a half hour and got less angry. We're usually pretty good about that, but. Sometimes I'm just like, I have no patience. Sometimes with Allie, I'm like, this would have been so good had it not had six typos.

Like, it loses its, I wish you would just read stuff before you send it. Because that's when it loses its spice. This doesn't have any typos. it it loses its i wish you would just read stuff before you send it because that's when it loses it this doesn't have any typos it does but i i have so many typos that okay so this is one i mean i don't know i think this is kind of not super i'll take out the names but it just starts with hey let's be on top of who's actually being emailed when it comes to putting peeps on hold like like people in the team on hold for shows so and so has been on cc on recent emails and not so and so they have the same name but different last names also why hasn't so and so advanced the christmas tree lighting show i see absolutely

nothing wrong with that email no i don't think so either it's just to the point but it's not nice it's not it's not like a hey could we and i also didn't even sign anything off i just sometimes you have to be cursed. You didn't sign off. No, it's just, that's it. And I sent it at 410. She doesn't usually sign off. And I haven't gotten a response about it, but it was two days ago.

I don't think that's mean. Yeah. I mean, that's probably on the lighter side. But yes, like I. You can be direct to a fault. I can be direct in a way. Yeah. But I also don't mean, sometimes I don't think it's actually on purpose.

Like I'll just be like, that was just me being direct. Do you think most times you don't mean to? I would say half the time I don't mean some sometimes I don't think it's actually on purpose. Like I'll just be like, that was just me. Do you think most times you don't mean to? I would say half the time I don't mean. And then half the time I actually am like upset and I'm sending a pointed message. As someone who feels like they relate to you a little bit, I feel like 10% of the time I know I'm activated and mad. Right, sure. And like, but 90% of the time I'm just more like. Just trying to write it and get it done.

Hey, this needs to get done. Yeah. Like no hard feelings. I will say I have an easier time writing something like that than saying it on the phone, which also is not great maybe. Like I'm not a confrontational person, so it's harder for me to said that. Like if I was on the phone saying that, I would have worded that totally different. Yeah.

Well, the only problem with written messages too. That's a red flag for both of us. Is that people will read your messages in their tone well in their feelings yeah like whatever mood they end whatever they think of you if they're already like intimidated by you they're going to read it from the point of view of someone that's so true they have like a history of how they view you yeah and depending on the mood they're in like you said emotions you know so it's just like you could be like how was it could be read 50 different ways yeah like, you could be like, how was, it could be read 50 different ways. It could.

Yeah. And like, sometimes you're on the phone with your friend. How was your day? What do you mean, how was my day? My day was fine. My day was fine. Yeah, yeah, yeah. What, do you think it's not?

Yeah. Or like a friend is reading a text and they're putting so much emphasis. They're like, what do you want from the grocery store? Because it seems like your snacks aren't in the house. And you're like, what do you want from the grocery store? It seems like your snacks aren't, like you can kind of tell. Totally. That's so true. It's tough. But like, sometimes I just don't have patience for it. I just got to get to the point. And you're like, what do I want for the grocery store? It seems like your snacks aren't. Like, you can kind of tell. Totally. It's so true.

It's tough. But like, sometimes I just don't have patience for it. I just got to get to the point. Yeah. Well, we might be helping. All right. Well, it's time for texting office hours. Oh, it's time to help people.

Yeah, it's time to help people. Okay. All right. Let's hear them. Let's bring them up. Nick, nobody believes me when I tell them how old you are. Yeah, the other day I went to buy some alcohol, forgot my wallet, got carded, told him I was 43. That made it even more difficult.

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How's it going? Hi, I'm Kayla. I'm 32 years old and I went on two dates with a guy in the Navy and I want to shoot my shot again for a third date. Okie dokie. Well, tell us about the first two dates. How'd you meet? What's the background story? And I guess the big question is, as much as we are excited to help you, why do you feel like you need our help getting this third date?

I mean, this is still somewhat fresh, but I mean, maybe I even don't. I've had time to marinate on this situation and I'm thinking maybe now it's like, do I keep the little tiny sliver of pride I have left or go with it? So I'll see what you say. Yeah.

But, um, basically, yeah. So I matched with a guy on hinge in September. So he was 32 as well, worked in the Navy. Even at the beginning, he didn't really seem like a day-to-day texter, but he was good at initiating plans. So he just like made the plan and we went on the date, which I'm fine with I'm not a big texter either so we only went on the two dates the first day went well it was dinner um he paid good conversation he was tall I'm tall so we need tall gentlemen good looking but like didn't know he was good looking I feel like that's the best kind

of good looking intelligent like a lion values it ended with a bit of an awkward kiss. And I will say like, I'm maybe kind of standoffish I can be, or I don't help the guy make the kiss easy, I guess. So if they don't go for it, it can kind of like linger. And I'm just kind of like, what are you doing? But he did, he finished the kiss. It was fine. He followed up after that date and he said he had a really good time. Was it the same night or the next day? So we went on the second date, the next date. So yeah, it was kind of like the night after he said he had a really good time. Was it the same night or the next day? So we went on the second date. The next date. So yeah, it was kind of like the night after he said he had a really good time. And then he planned the next date about a week and a half later.

Okay. Yeah. That's good that he initiated that. The second date. I'm hearing a lot of green flags. Yeah. Well, what happened? Okay, where did it go?

Uh-oh. I thought it was okay. So we went to dinner and then we went to a comedy club and he had booked the tickets in advance. He paid again. He came to pick me up. Very sweet. Like gentlemen got out of the car. There was like some awkward silences at the comedy club portion, but it was kind of, it wasn't terrible. Like it was just one of those moments where it's just like, you don't know where the next performer is going to come on. So you don't know if you start like a big

conversation or not. So I don't know if he also felt that but I was thinking back on it there were some awkward silences when you're feeling awkward silences do you like what do you do like are are you thinking about the awkward silences are you kind of panicking over it or like or do you kind of like you're not panicking but maybe in my head just deciding of like are we comfortable in this silence? Like obviously I wasn't, I was thinking about it, but I was just like, maybe he is. Okay. Yeah.

Like I was kind of like, maybe he's fine with the silence. So I just left it. Or maybe you were just like actively judging your date in real time, you know? And maybe there's just a, not something obvious that either you had to say. So you didn't say it,

which is, I honestly think better than just saying crazy shit. you don't mean you know yeah yeah like filling in the air that was the terrible part like yeah there were a couple of things that like thinking back on it at the dinner before the comedy show i maybe didn't come off great but again this is just me kind of thinking about it now trying to find reasons as to like why he might've ghosted me. What was in your head is why you thought you maybe ruined it. I thought maybe, so we were talking about standards and he was kind of saying like complimenting me in that he said, it seems like I have high standards and I'm really close with

my family, but like, I'm also close with my dad. And I have a really high opinion of my dad. And I feel like in my head, maybe I was trying to say things like, I have a really good male role model and how I expect to be treated. And it probably more came out like, my dad's the best. And we'll see if you measure up kind of thing. And I don't know. This is me going

back and overthinking it. Well, how did you say it? It may have not sounded great. We were talking about like handy work and like doing, I guess, like construction type of jobs around the house. And I was saying how, like, I used to date guys who would tell me to do something with my car. And I'd be like, I would go to my dad and he would be like, that's not what you're doing with your car. Like, don't listen to them. Kind of like those kinds of things. Like I had examples of people who I used to date and then my dad would just like, be like, don't listen to that stupidity.

So. That's fair. I don't think that's the end of the world. No, but if I was this guy, I'd be like, oh, she's got a smart dad. Yeah. Yeah. I think it all really just depends on your delivery.

I like to think of myself as picky or I have high standards. I think sometimes people who have high standards and are picky can come across at times as judgmental. I know I can, you know, and I think, yeah, I think it's just being cognizant of that and being aware, especially on a, in an early dating situation. Yeah. especially on a, or in an early dating situation. Yeah. Cause like high standards are attractive, but someone who's kind of nitpicky and nagging, and you seem like you're just going to judge them. And there's a lot of guys have gotten out of relationships from people who they just felt like, leave me the fuck alone, please. Like say something nice to me. Yeah. You know? And so it's a fine line between coming across a lot of someone who's just has those

high standards and standard high standards, I think are a little more quiet than they are allowed. You know, you show it with your kind of your just, you don't have to, you don't have to explain it over time. If you have high standards, people will pick up on it.

You know, it's, it's a lot, it comes across a lot stronger just by showing people in real time, you know, standards being, you know, at the pace at which you move a relationship or how you expect to be treated, you know, rather than like telling them

and giving them orders and things like that. It's so subtle, but it's just maybe it sounds like you, I mean, I'm hearing from you that, you know, that maybe you have a habit of coming across a certain way at times. I know I, again, I can as well. So it's just being kind of mindful of those little things. I think with people I like in particular as well, like, I can as well. So it's just being kind of mindful of those little things. I think with people I like in particular as well, like, I think it's like almost I liked him. And so I wanted to make sure that he didn't know I liked him too much. So it was almost like I was doing that to be like a little bit like, Hey, you're not,

you're not that great yet. I almost like in my head, never been interested in a girl and thought she liked me too much. my head never been interested in a girl and thought she liked me too much i've pursued girls for a variety of reasons and then maybe got bored from the chase but those weren't girls i was super into that's a good point you know and if i was really of playing hard to get versus like what a man actually thinks about is probably really different. I think for a guy, especially in 2023, to go on a date and then text the next day, I had a really good time or somewhere in 24 hours is a huge green flag. I agree. And I have always done that with women I was really excited about. And if I went on a good

first date, you know, to the point where I was like, hey, I had a really nice time. I'd like to see you again and make another plan. i'm into you i don't know much about you but i'm definitely into you and like you have to go kind of bat shit for me to like to have you like me too much you know like it's got to be stalker vibe yeah was this their last chat yeah where where and what did you send us yeah so so i sent some texts and i'm just pulling up here so yeah so he didn't you said he ghost. Like what do you mean by ghosted? Well, so I texted

him. I waited. So that was on the Friday. I waited over the weekend. I didn't hear from him again. So he didn't text me after that. And then I followed up on the Monday and I just said, hey, just on the journey to work, I wanted to say I had a really nice time Friday night. How was the rest of your weekend? Should we do a reading? Sure.

Yeah. Should we do a one of you two want to read with me? Oh, sure. Okay. Who should be who? Age and you're the guy. Okay. All right. Hey, just on the journey to work, I wanted to say I had a really nice time Friday night. How was the rest of your weekend? Hey, sorry, was

duty yet? Sorry, was duty yet again? I think on duty. Like, was duty yet again i think on duty like it was duty yet again yeah oh hey sorry it was duty yet again this isn't particularly attractive but everyone at work has come down with covid and although i haven't tested i'm a wee bit poorly sick he's british no yeah he's british okay i was like that makes way more sense got it so can you say this in an accent can you do a British accent he can he really can actually

I think you can you can hey sorry was on duty again anyway he says how are you feeling just thought I'd let you know in case you wanted

to get tested and for context you'd sent that first message monday at 7 a.m he'd responded tuesday at 5 p.m so people have the timeline oh i see got it uh ah that's a shame i hope you're on the mend soon thanks for the heads up i'm feeling all right but i'll get tested haha don't worry about the attractiveness pretty hard to miss getting covet and then he doesn't respond to that and then what's today how many days later it says today i didn't know it was about two days later or like up to five days later no response to that particular message isn't that big of a deal no i agree I agree. There was no question. That's true. Sometimes people just stop texting and it's because there's no other way to keep it going.

He's literally on duty. He's not feeling well. There are plenty of text messages. He's British. No, this doesn't hit me at all. I don't want to respond. So then you come back a few days later. I hope you're feeling better. We should go on a third date this week. Love that message, by the way. That's the first shot. That's great. That's the first shot.

That's good. It's very direct and great. I love it. Morning. Sorry, I have been terrible at replying. I've been smashed for work and spent the rest of my time dying. I'm actually up in somewhere. Lossy mouth.

Lossy mouth. Can you do a British accent? I can a little bit. All this week working uh with the raf unfortunately how are you doing and then was this the same day yeah it looks like yeah i think it was the morning after so yeah he sent it late at night i sent it the next morning when i got up oh no hope you're feeling better but you can tell me all about it on our next date oh shot number two love it i'm good sorting out travel plans this week are you heading anywhere soon sounds good

he replies where are you traveling? None for me. Can barely get away from work at the minute. Romania for work, Malaga and Canada to visit fam. Oh, that's a shame. Hopefully it eases up soon. Do you at least get time off for the holidays? That's when the ghosting begins?

Yeah, nothing. And that's been how many days? Yeah, how long ago was this? You said October 26th? said october 26 two weeks ago two weeks ago yeah not great not great but i don't think you did anything wrong if anything i think if there's any reason why this doesn't or didn't end up working out because of work this guy seems like he's maybe really just busy with work even though it sucks it's like make time for me if you like me like fuck work but based on what you're telling he's also on active duty like that yeah but i guess

that's true he's i do think this this relationship isn't totally dead yet though and i'll only say this based on what you're telling me is that like you had two nice dates you sound like you felt like you maybe were a little awkward not your best self there were some moments you look back and thought i wasn't as relaxed and maybe push them away or X, Y, or Z. And chances are, I feel like, I'm sure maybe your friends would be like, oh no, you were amazing. We all know when we're not our best self. I know when I leave a room where I'm like, yep, nailed that.

And sometimes it's like, they're going to be talking about me. So he probably felt what you were feeling. And obviously he backed off a little bit, but he also replied, he doesn't hate you. Nothing bad happened. And he is busy, right? So like there was a, there's a, probably a world in which he might've gone on a third date and then just time passed. I guess what I'm saying is like, doesn't hate you.

He probably didn't actively decide not to see you again but like after you reached out and got busy he got covid he was just more like i don't know maybe whatever yeah in a way it's like you have nothing to lose if you wanted to ask him out again like i don't know unless you were like really really i know that sounds ridiculous maybe but if you were really into this guy and you were like i'm gonna just try again and if he's not into it that's gonna tell me everything in a way wouldn't that give the next version of closure yeah i think the big question is is the new shot just another like hey i don't think she should send uh right no right how about that date i think it's more of a show hey just checking in or i think you kind of almost have to put yourself out there a little bit.

Be like, listen, I had a great first two dates. You can even call yourself out a little bit. And I don't know, like, I think it's subtle. You could, you could, you could say I felt a little off or whatever. Yeah, I wasn't. You could just be like, listen, I had a really nice time. And I've been thinking a lot about our dates. And if you are up for it i i

think um i'd really like to see you again and not i think i'd really like to see you i'd really like to see you yeah yeah also i don't know if this feels like crazy you could wait although i'm looking at this book and it says don't text your ex happy birthday don't don't text this dude happy thanksgiving well he's she's not he's not an ex and he's that's right he's not an ex. And he's British. That's right. He's not an ex. And he's British. He's British. Oh, shoot. Yeah, that changes.

And you're Canadian, right? Actually, I kind of love Happy Thanksgiving. Yeah. Wait, when is Canadian Thanksgiving? It's past. It's past. Okay.

Yeah, that's right. We only have Christmas now to say holidays. Right. That's it. That's all you're allowed. I was asking some of my guy friends this and they were just like,

I would never, like if I didn't like a girl and she texted me again like you come off as the ultimate just like kind of needy person to text again right no there is right which obviously is not that into me yeah i don't know if he's not that he's definitely yes he is definitely not that into you it doesn't mean he's not that into you. He's definitely, yes. He is definitely not that into you. It doesn't mean he's not into you. In my single days, I just remember, especially now, it's hard to really know if you really like someone. And I think nowadays it's harder and harder to get super excited about a first date. And even the ones you get excited about, half the time they're pieces of shit anyways, you find out. So excitement on a first date isn't the end all be all.

And yeah, I've, I've had a couple relationships that like one date or two dates, time went on, you know, and I was like, I don't know. There was definitely nothing wrong with them. It was just more not sure. And like, I needed to kind of be bored again. Sure. To then reactivate. To reactivate it.

Yeah. To go back out. I don't think you overthink it. You know, um, I would maybe take a step back, maybe not do anything right now. See how you feel about him in two or three weeks.

He might text you. He might text you. A couple of weeks. You know, try to go on other dates. And if in two or three weeks, you're still like wishing you could go on a date with this guy again, fucking hit him up. I get that it's like a blow to your ego to have to put yourself out again because it feels like.

It is. But there's so many cases where down the road someone was like, I'm so glad that person did that because we wouldn't have worked. That's true. That's why I'm like, you almost don't have anything to lose but everything to gain. It's kind of like one of those things where if it does work and you were the one that made it work because you've tried again. Yeah. It's kind of great. I mean, and if it doesn't, it's not working now anyway.

Like it's kind of one of those things. It's like your guy friends aren't necessarily wrong. But to Ali and AJ's point, like the only thing that matters is if he does kind of like you more than he realizes or you think. And so, yeah, there's a world where another text is just going to confirm what he already feels. And that is, I don't want to go out with her again. And either way, whatever. You still don't have a date. Do you think about him every day?

Like, because I feel like I've had times where I've been fixated on someone who I've been on like one or two dates with where like I was like multiple times a day. Like, where are you at in terms of how much brain space it's taking up? I think a little bit. And I think it's a little bit too much. Like, I think I realize that. Like, I'm just like, I didn't even really know him right like i don't even really know him after two dates and it's like but i was excited about it i think and that's rare that's all it takes it was a good a little bit of excitement followed by their lack of interest

will make anyone obsessed with anyone yes that's so true like maybe if he was texting you 24 7 you'd be like whoa pump the brakes that's what's so funny that's what yeah works and that's so true yeah like maybe if he was texting you 24-7 you'd be like whoa pump the brakes that's what's so funny about how this works and that's why I say I would wait before you do anything I would just take two weeks off

and try to just put this little story out of your head and put it away for a while and just be like you know what it's time to move on

and then revisit it in two or three weeks don't be like revisit like you're counting down the days like it's Christmas before you get to text him in two weeks

but like just accept that maybe he's not your guy. And then if it does kind of come back out, I think you will even feel more organic. The more I think about it, the more I don't think you should really make a big thing out of it. Agreed.

I think you wait a few weeks and randomly text them and be like, hey, I know haven't talked in a while. Hope you're good. And maybe have a thing, like a thing that you can invite them to a bar. You've been trying to try a restaurant. Yeah. I've been wanting to try this place. Yeah. I'd love to go. And then maybe while you're on the date, you can, if you get to that date, maybe you can call yourself out or make a joke being like, I'm actually, I at third dates you know and shit like that going back to the kissing you mentioned like you have this pattern like about like not making it easy for guys can you explain that a little bit more yeah i don't know if anyone else can relate to this but it's just like if he was a bit taller so it's like not a

close distance for me to like get to the finish the kiss but it was just like he would go really slowly in to the point where it was awkward like i was just like i was waiting for him to like lean in and kiss but like it was obvious that it's what he was doing and so i just it was too long and i felt like but why didn't you why didn't you want to meet him halfway why didn't you participate rather than stay there and like laugh at him slowly like landing air traffic control let's go yeah it's not the greatest yeah i should that's probably another practice that i should listen again it's 2023 the roles in dating are constantly changing and you know communication is important obviously consent super important it just like a lot of guys out there are trying

to be super mindful to the point of overthinking their moves and i just think the little bit we can do to just say hey green light you know like i want to kiss you too you know rather than being like i don't know are you gonna do it it's like there's a fine line between like does she want me to do this or does she not i don't fucking know and that's him overthinking and all you know that's him going slower so just help help a brother out you know yeah no that was another thing after the fact I like reflected on and I was like yeah I could have done that a different way met him halfway made it awkward and if you're really feeling it maybe you say I really want to kiss you or something like

you know I know we love a guy who takes the initiative but he's already making plans he was doing things like yeah I think a first kiss can really kind of kill a vibe so i don't want to like get in your head or anything but maybe in the future just you know especially guys you like just help them out yeah go easy meet halfway yeah it's stressful dating for everyone not just you you know and the people on the other side of the table are just as nervous, are just as confused, are not sure if they're doing a good job. Every guy's worrying about giving her the ick nowadays. So if you're having a good time, say it. I think if he's into you, it'll make him feel real good and help him relax. And maybe the kisses will be even less awkward.

Lessons learned. All right. Thank you. Don't stress yourself learned. All right. Thank you. Don't stress yourself out. Don't overthink it. Yeah, don't overthink it. Put it away for a couple of weeks. Reach back out and then let us know if he replies. Okay.

All right. Well, keep us posted. We definitely want an update whenever you do reach back out or maybe you decide not to. We'll love to hear about that. Okay. All right. Good luck.

Good luck. Be kind to yourself thank you thank you so much bye bye she was sweet she was so sweet she's being hard on herself so is this is this a dating show yeah nick does all he's like doesn't know i'm sorry no that sounds so ridiculous because i hate when people don't do research on us. And here I just did it to you guys. It's our job to do research on you. Yeah, but it needs to go both ways. Like, this is so, you guys actually have really good advice.

That was wonderful. I feel like that, Nick, like, that's kind of like his whole, like. It's very good. It's definitely like, we do three episodes a week. And, you know, not all of them are. The thread of the show is advice. It's a relationship. You might have to bring some friends your way.

No, honestly. I've got a couple of single friends that need your help. Because she was just so hard on herself. Like she was so. They're going to have to get over the hump of it being me at first. It's a thing. Oh, right, right, right. I went to.

Oh. Well, once I had a kind of great story where my producer for The Bachelor. It's like she was my producer. Yeah. And we just became really close. And then after the season wrapped she was still kind of like my chaperone because there's this weird time where you're an engaged man but no one can know about it and like so going out you have to be kind of very careful your surroundings and

so i just felt safer going out with her just because yeah i know she had my back and things like that and so she was having a girls night out and i was just in la kind of alone and i was like yeah i'll come out and hang out for a little bit and I didn't know this at the time but her friends were so pissed I was there because I was like crashing girls night that's funny they're like get this guy out of here yeah but I remember leaving and a couple weeks later my friend was just like my friend will not stop talking about your conversation with her I'm like what because like she was just going through it was some guy or whatever and i was just i just get interested in that stuff and i like social dynamics but apparently i said

something to her that to this day like after she left like really resonated with her or something that she still uses but at first it was like she had to get through though like why am i listening to the fucking bachelor right about fucking relationship advice to me to me yeah right and then she was like wow wow, that was helpful. Yeah. Huh. But it's been fun, yeah. Has that been a passion for a bit?

I've always enjoyed, I think, well, one, I got into it because of self-preservation. And in my 20s, I was, you know, a relationship guy. I had three serious relationships and it just fucked me up a little bit. I was in my feelings. I was easily activated by my ego. I do things for the wrong reason.

And so I just kind of had to figure myself out. And so that's how I really got started into it. Just kind of trying to retrain my brain how to see different situations. I just realized that most of my happiness had to do with just my perception of how I saw a situation. And I tried to understand my situation.

And I tried to see it from a different angle. It just gave me kind of peace of mind. And then I just kind of became the friend who people would go to. And I'm a little blunt at times. And so I've learned how to do this kind of dance of empathy with tough love. Because sometimes by the time people get to me they've already had the conversations with their friends they're like you're not doing anything wrong it's great i'm like well i'm not saying anything wrong but maybe

just looking at it differently yeah and then i started this show and just got a really it got into it and it's resonated with people that's cool so yeah very cool yeah we try to take the approach of we're just your friend you know and like i i always like everything i've done is just through the lens of mistakes i've made or should i've gotten wrong or you know chasing the wrong thing for the wrong reasons and stuff like that yeah yeah when it just kind of started and then obviously the background from pop culture we kind of intertwine relationships with pop culture and kind of use that as a launching pad for conversations. Yeah.

And I just really like how you guys spoke to her. That was sweet. It was good advice. It seemed helpful. We appreciate it. And you guys were great as well. Thanks. Tell us what happens with her.

Yeah. I want to know. Yeah. Well, we'll get an update from her. And send it to us. We've had some crazy ones. Yeah.

And we really appreciate, you know, when they call in, they're calling in in for earnest advice. Like they truly want. Yeah, I could feel that. Yeah, I could too. And people have really trusted us with some intimate stories.

Yeah. Oh, yeah. You guys are like the new love line, maybe. We had a lovely woman who... Were you thinking about the lesbian? Yeah. Sorry. It's just...

It's an iconic story. it's an iconic story it's an iconic story there was a woman who was like i've kind of done some self-reflection i realized like i am a lesbian like i'm not i'm not bisexual like i am a lesbian and i am i am with a man and we have children together we have children together and so we had couples therapy we had this big call where we're like kind of like okay, okay, the revelation has come up. And then the update that she sends us back was she was like, he proposed and I said yes. And we were like, no. Oh, no.

Now we got through it. She is now dating a woman. Yes. They are co-parenting. Yeah. Oh, wow. We follow this story. So third update is everything.

She's living her true self yeah and she's raising the kids and they're co-parenting with the guy they're co-parenting and he handled it in a pretty good way

because he sensed things he was like something's yeah you're not vibing me but yeah it's a very rewarding wow

that's cool in conclusion can I ask a really sappy question of like what's your favorite thing about one another or like a quality

that you feel like you get a front row seat to that you're so appreciative of for each other AJ has like a really big heart for just people in general but like definitely our fans like whenever we meet and greets I just see that AJ is very touched by their personal stories and I think that they're always very vulnerable about kind of sharing their like experience or um or whatnot whatever it might be that you know kind of brought them to our music or how it helps them heal and AJ's response to them is always so genuine and um so like uplifting and positive and affirming which I think is like a really good thing that she has always kind of had inside of her as a as a young kid um but i think it really like it really hits our fans in in the heart in a really special way

it feels like it's almost something that not only do you appreciate about her but like you almost recognize that it comes less naturally for you in a way that accurate i think it's one of those things where like aj just shyer kind of i'm just a more shy person. Yeah. And I'm more like, even like, you know, she was saying how she can be more standoffish, but it doesn't mean that the story or the experience doesn't hit me really personally as well.

Like there's many times that I've kind of like welled up over something or felt very like emotional, but I'm just somebody that I share that part of myself more easily with my close friends. Totally. Yeah. It's not, it's not that you don't want to, or you don't care. It's just, you know, we all as people just express our feelings differently. And, uh, you know, like with Natalie, I'll see her, I try to take notes from her because she is more natural about that. And she's like, a lot of times I'm like, God, no, this is, I need to channel her energy or she'll teach me. You know, it's, it's, I can tell you guys compliment each other very well.

It seems like. Yeah, very much so. Yeah. I'm kind of someone that like wears my heart on my sleeve and Allie's is just like, just there's a couple of layers, you know what I mean? Just wearing some, a t-shirt and maybe a long sleeve jacket over it. But it's like, it's so accessible. It's still accessible.

I think my like, that was a cute way to put it, like front row view of my sister that maybe other people don't get to see that I get a front row ticket too is like the way Allie is with kids. It's so sweet. It's like, she kind of becomes like a whole other person. Speaking of me, like not sharing my emotions

and then I am with children. No, it's kind of, she's the most like loving and emotional and like open when there's like a little kid around do you guys it's really sweet crying movies or commercials she doesn't i do no very few i mean there's definitely movies that i i cry i only cry in animated movies because i i i'm just i feel more connected to your personality with like having a like I have a hard candy shell

but like yeah but commercials and movies like happy moments absolutely not in a commercial I don't think there's ever been a commercial I've never cried

I have to agree with that I've never cried in a commercial I don't I know I definitely know I have it's not a thing

like home for the holidays like that kind of thing those like just anything happy makes me tear up like that kind of thing those like just anything happy makes me tear up like that's no that's sweet

it was in Amazon honestly animated it's animated movies for me and like yeah about Alexa and the dad drops her off at college and then she's like

hey Alexa play you know and then they like play her dad's song that's actually sweet it's pretty sweet but 99% of the time

you know I come across as heart of stone sure at times yeah oh interesting but it's gotta be the right thing that moves you yeah also means that I come across as hard of stone at times. Oh, interesting. But it's got to be the right thing that moves you.

Also means that you're definitely not faking it. It's like when you're moved, you're moved. That's true. No, I'm not faking it. No one's ever accused me of being disingenuous. Just genuous to a fault. Genuous? Genuous.

Allie, AJ, it's been so much fun talking to you too thanks you too you guys are so sweet likewise uh please plug away what are you working on where can people follow you listen to your stuff see you guys on tour if you get back out there well um all of our touring right now is kind of

set aside and and done uh we'll be touring again for sure but not not in in the not probably till 2025 yeah okay we're gonna work on another album 2024 and then tour in 2025 but we do have a christmas ep out um november 14th and we're really excited about it because it's three um songs two of them are original uh one of them is a re-record of a song that we did like 15 years ago called greatest time of year um which was the theme song for the Santa Claus 2 soundtrack. Funny enough.

And then, which might make you cry. And then the other song is a song called Lonesome Dove. It's an original song that Allie and I wrote this past year. And then we recorded a cover together of Sisters. Amazing. But Rosemary Clooney sang the original. And it's a really, it's a great song. It's a song that's actually not a Christmas song,

but it's in a Christmas movie. And we kind of like this like inside meta. Whoa. It's funny. Yeah. Version. Especially because it's called sisters and it is really about sisters and having to deal with the other one who they're dating if they're approved of.

So, yeah. So that's on our ep called lonesome dove and and then we're just going to enjoy the holiday the new year write a bunch of music all right one final question what does happiness mean to both of you in five years personally and professionally i think happiness is having your health i do think that's something that we all probably take for granted. And like, I'm just talking even basic health, you know?

Um, I think that is, is definitely something that, uh, I always am, you know, hoping and praying about. Um, and then I think when it comes to like my career, it would be that I'm able to like truly make the music that I want to make and that it continues to like resonate with people. And it doesn't mean that it has to be on top 40 radio, you know, or that we're selling out Staples Center. It's just like I can make a living. I can make music that connects with people that I'm proud to play and sing night after night. And the relationships

that I hold are intact and solid. Kind of simple. Yeah, I love that. I think when it comes to personal life, I feel like very content right now in my personal life, but it would be really cool to see Allie and I both in the next five to 10 years raising little versions of ourselves, become best friends. I think that would just be so neat. So for me, it's a matter of building a family and staying healthy and spending a lot of time with our parents who are now in their 60s, not like they're super old, but making sure that we really hold on to the time we have left with them. And then professionally, I would say just continuing. I mean, honestly, I have to agree, continuing to tour. I would say to open up the expansion of where we tour. There's been a lot of places Allie and I have never hit before. And so, you know, we're already two people that love to travel and love to meet fans from all over the world. And I don't feel like we've been able to access that too much outside of the US. So I think to just see different parts of the world

and share our music with many people would be really exciting. That would feel like a goal. It's funny when you've been doing this this long, you totally lose the desire to be like a Grammy, an Oscar, like all that goes away. Like those big goals that you think are gonna be in your life for a long time

become not goals anymore yeah it's like oh if that comes cool well like you said just to be able to make a living doing your love

is crazy there's a cost to fame and attention and like there's a you know it's just like I just want to be able to

all I know is I want to do this do what I love have a normal life have health have a family and things like that and that makes a lot of sense yeah we're really lucky that we can make a living doing like what I love, have a normal life, have health, have a family and things like that. And that makes a lot of sense. Yeah. We're really lucky that we can make a living doing what we love.

It's crazy. That's awesome. Well, thank you both again. It was so much fun. I know our audience loved listening to you both. Thank you guys for listening. Don't forget to send in those questions at asknickatthevilefiles.com for all things texting, office hours, mediation, Ask Nick, you know the drill. And then what? We'll be back on Monday. Follow Allie and AJ, if you're not already. Yeah, Allie and AJ, that's it.

It's pretty simple. There you go. Not AJ and Allie. Not AJ and Allie. No, because it doesn't sound right. Unacceptable. Bye.

Bye. you