The Viall Files - E680 Going Deeper with Justin Sylvester - RHOBH Dinner Parties, Richards Sisters, and VPR Love Triangles

Episode Date: December 14, 2023

Welcome back to The Viall Files: Going Deeper Edition! Today, we are joined by E News’ Justin Sylvester to talk about his time working for Kyle Richards and being on Real Housewives of Beverly Hills, including the infamous dinner party. We also watch the Vanderpump Rules Season 11 Trailer and discuss our predictions. Then, we have a Sweating The Wedding caller whose fiance recently ended their engagement, and she isn’t sure if she should try to save it. Finally, we discuss Kat and John Henry’s break up, and some new pop culture headlines.  “I would rather be Joe Biden at a press conference than be a Housewife at a dinner party.”  Start your 7 Day Free Trial of Viall Files + here: https://viallfiles.supportingcast.fm/  Please make sure to subscribe so you don’t miss an episode and as always send in your relationship questions to [e-mail] to be a part of our Monday episodes. To Order Nick’s Book Go To: http://www.viallfiles.com  If you would like to get some texting advice on Office Hours send an email to [e-mail] with “Texting Office Hours” in the subject line! To advertise on the show, contact [e-mail] or visit https://www.advertisecast.com/TheViallFiles  THANK YOU TO OUR SPONSORS: Quip - If you go to https://www.GETQUIP.com/VIALL RIGHT NOW, you’ll get 20% off any Electric Toothbrush or Mint & Gum Dispenser  Shopify - Sign up for a one-dollar-per-month trial period at https://www.SHOPIFY.COM/viall  ALL LOWERCASE. Rocket Money - Stop wasting money on things you don’t use. Cancel your unwanted subscriptions – and manage your money the easy way – by going to https://www.RocketMoney.com/VIALL  Lume Deodorant - Control Body Odor ANYWHERE with @lumedeodorant and get $5 off off your Starter Pack (that’s over 40% off) with promo code VIALL at LumeDeodorant.com! #lumepod Sundays For Dogs - Get 35% off your first order of Sundays. Go to https://www.SundaysForDogs.com/VIALL or use code VIALL at checkout.  Episode Socials: @viallfiles @nickviall @nnataliejjoy @justinasylvester @alison.vandam @liffordthebigreddog @dereklanerussell 

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Oh my God, I haven't worn any of these in a long time. Welcome back. This is great. Yeah. Yeah. Oh my God, you have a great voice. I hate my voice. Really? Hate it. I you have a great voice. I hate my voice. Really?

Hate it. I've never watched my show because I hate my voice. I've never sat through a whole episode of my show because I can't stand my voice. It's a little raspy right now because I'm sick. Oh, so it's hot. I was sick. I was sick. I'm getting over it.

No, I was sick. And now I have like this residual thing. I would never come here sick. So now it's hot. Now it's hot. Okay. Tomorrow I'll sound like fucking Mariah Carey in Christmas. What a great place to start.

Are you ready? What's going on, everybody? Welcome back to another episode of The Vow Files Going Deeper Edition. I'm your host, Nick, joined by the household of Amanda, Justin, Allie. Are you alive? Are you better? I've risen from the dead. Yay. A little stomach problems? Yeah.

Yuck. What made me feel really bad, is my 93 year old grandmother was like now i'm not feeling well and there's nothing worse than getting did you kill gam gamma when they're 93 you killed her wait you went around gam gam with your bad stomach because i host i wanted to show her the barbie movie so i did like a big like barbie movie night with her she's not die you and i are gonna fight. I can't believe that. You are, how old are you? 26. Old enough to know better. Of course.

You are 26. It's your goddamn generation showing up coughing on motherfuckers, getting everybody sick, like cancel the goddamn Barbie movie. Y'all could have watched on Zoom. She can't figure out Zoom? You could have helped her figure it out.

She definitely won't figure it out if she's dead. Oh my gosh. Ali, did you know that you were sick when you saw her? No. There we go. Ali, I'm looking at your tweets right now. Look, you tweeted that you knew you were

sick and that Gam Gam was coming over, but you were going to power through. We found your old tweet. Got to watch this movie. Don't care about gammy. That gorgeous voice that you are hearing is none other than the one, the only Justin Sylvester. You probably know him from all his time on E! News, pop culture, just a pop culture king or queen. Are you a king or a queen?

You know what? I'm either. You're either. You're versatile. Some days I literally feel like a queen and some days I feel like a king. And I'll take them both. Honestly, Sam. As you should.

Yeah, I'll take them both. Honestly, as you should. Well, we figure we just include Justin in our intro. Justin, we usually will do an intro without our Going Deeper guests and then talk shit about them. No, I'm kidding. We don't have to talk shit about it. We love it. But you being who you are and just

so well-versed in the pop culture space, this is usually the time that we would rift about some of our favorite topics out there in the old pop culture world. But we figured, why don't you just sit on the whole episode? Let's talk it out. Let's talk it out. How you been? I've been good. Just kind of chilling. Working, trying to keep it together for the holidays.

You know what I mean? You know. Having dinner parties. Having dinner parties, trying to keep my childhood trauma at bay. Well, do you want to talk about it? No, I just said, like, I'm very aware that the holidays can bring things up in people. Sure. You know what I mean?

Like, I'm very empathetic and I feel my friends, like even when they don't know that their childhood trauma is rearing, I can feel it. Like, I know when you're about to go home because everyone tenses up. Everyone's relationships

get a little dicey around the holidays and people don't realize it's just their childhood trauma. Yeah. It's just coming up to like haunt them. That tree comes up and you get triggered because mom wouldn't let you decorate it back in the day. 100%. You got to see that

one uncle that made your life a living hell. You know what I mean? It's just like, ugh. A little touchy. Ugh. Anyways, Nellie and I were watching Housewives. We were watching the dinner party and I was just like, wait, fucking Justin. We got to get fucking Justin on here.

I was like all the you know, he didn't sign any. Did you have to sign an NDA to go to that dinner party? No, I'm like a brick wall, though. Yeah, I'm like a brick wall. What does that even mean? I've been in it for 15 years. Like I've been in for 15 years. I know the jam.

I know the shuffle. That's why I pick a seat in the corner and listen. I just listen. I let my subtitles do the corner. And listen? I just listen. I let my subtitles do the talking. I don't say a word. I'm not getting paid. I'm there as a supportive friend. I'm going to shut my ass up and take in all this shit.

And it was great. Honestly, it looked great. Yeah, it looked like a lot of fun. I wish I was there. The only problem with those dinner parties is that they don't feed you. The plate does not hit the table until the drama is over. So sometimes. So they like starve.

Well, it's not even that. It's not even that. You can't eat until you make a fuss. Yeah, pour glasses of wine and yell at each other. No, it's not even that. It's the continuity. You know, I used to be a TV producer. So if you serve the dinner before the fight starts and the fight, you know, begins and then you have to go back and cut.

It's like a whole thing. So normally I'm at this place like trying to speed the ding up. I'm like, let's go. Which is why you often see housewives like Crystal bring up things at a dinner table because they're ready to eat and they're ready to go home. Because it's like it's wild. It's very tense. It's very all cast events of a house. I would rather be Joe Biden at a press conference than be a housewife at a motherfucking dinner

party. Say more. One hundred percent. It's just I think being a housewife is one of the hardest jobs in hollywood because i i would agree but i'd love to hear it from you i think that being a housewife is like being a witch during the salem trials with twitter with twitter i feel like i was i started you know my journey on housewives you know, working with Kyle as Twitter was coming about before it got to 140 characters like TBT days and people were a little bit nicer. where people realize they can have 15 minutes of fame. And when the retweets started, they can get more notoriety by being mean

and it started a shit storm. So I think when you're on a TV show and you're playing or you're a personality playing yourself, A, people think they know you a little bit better, but B, people think they can be meaner to you because you are a reality person. Yeah. They see you as a character, not a person. They see you as a character as a person, but they also want to let you know because you said something to their friend in their mind.

And it is, it is nasty. It's really nasty. I would not want to be, yeah, I could not be a housewife. How did you meet Kyle? It's so funny. I met Kyle through another girlfriend of mine who's from Louisiana. Her name's Allie Landry. And she was like, I have a girlfriend who's starting a reality show and I think she's going to need an assistant. You should move to L.A. And I was like, oh, OK. Like like in a month or, you know, in the summertime, she was like, no, no, no. You should move like next week. And I was like, oh. And then she goes, but I don't know if she like, you know, she doesn't she didn't tell me she needed an assistant. I just think that you should move here. I might introduce you to it.

I think you guys will hit it off. So I like a big dummy, pack my shit and move to L.A. without a job. Obviously, on this promise of this dinner. You bet on yourself. I bet on myself. But in the meantime, she was like, oh, let me hook you up

with this other actress. I'm going to, you know, I'm going to set you up with this other actress. So I go and interview for this huge Hollywood actress. And I walk into the interview and she is topless.

Oh, okay. She will not be named? She will not be named. But I immediately know that she's playing a mind game like she's trying to freak me out throw me off my game okay and i'm watching the housekeeper like watch me as if like this is like a reoccurring thing yeah and i'm like oh fuck that like first of all i'm not scared of a pair of titties like i'm a gay man like i am not as scared of a pair of titties. I'm a gay man. I am not scared of a pair of titties.

Especially some nice ones. And I'm talking to her like her two nipples aren't staring at me. You know what I mean? I'm just having conversations. Like, you know, going on and on. And I leave the house and I know I kill it. And the manager calls me and says, oh, you should go back for another. She wants to meet you again. She's not going to wear her pants next time. Oh, me and says, oh, you should go back for another. She wants to meet

you again. She's not going to wear her pants next time. Oh, I'm like, oh, I don't even care if I don't get the job. I'm definitely going back because I want to see what this bitch pulls out of her head. So I go back to this interview a week later and she again is like putting on the show like she's like moisturizing. She's like, tell me what you think about my face. I'm like, Oh, I think it's so gorgeous.

And I love when the camera hits you from this side because it shows this. And she's like loving it and living in the, and I'm like, Oh, I'm getting this fucking job. I don't care if it pays $4 and 75 cents. I'm taking this job just so I can say I did it two years with this person. What's it rhyme with?

Can you tell us afterwards? Maybe I'll tell you after. In the meantime, Allie sets me up with this lunch with Kyle. And I'm sitting at lunch and her three kids, two of her four kids are there. One of them's like a one-year-old. The other one's 10 and staring me down. The one-year-old's climbing on my back and staring me down the one-year-old's climbing on my back playing with my hair and we're talking and we're getting along and she's like yeah you

know i think i'm gonna i'm gonna need somebody for like three months and i was like okay all right but in the back of my head i'd already accepted this job with this a-list actress who you know shout out be named but i was like i going to take the job of this woman. It's like, it's a job. So I get in the car with Allie Landry and I will never forget this. I was like, I can't take the job with Kyle. She only needs someone for three

months. She's like, get in there and make yourself indispensable. She goes, this other job is going to be fun and you'll have you know fodder for a book later on in life

but if you work with Kyle you will get like a master's degree in TV so I was like ugh Ali's always right

so I show up to Kyle's house and on the first day of filming keep in mind she didn't tell me what show she

was filming. She just said, I'm filming a reality show about my life. And when I showed up, they were like, can you sign this release? And I read the title and I was like, three months, bitch, I'm going to be here for like two goddamn years nonstop. And I'm like telling her, I'm like, you have to film the season. Then you have to do pickup interviews. Then you have a reunion. Then you're going to have a press tour. This is going to be like a nine month process. She in her mind hadn't realized what she signed up for. Plus, everybody was waiting for Beverly Hills. Like Orange County was the test run. New York was like, you know, the appetizer. This is the goddamn entree. Oh, period. And she's like, oh, I don't know what's going on. I'm like, well, that's a problem. So three years, three months turned into five years. Five years. Wow.

Five years. It was wild. By her side. And Kyle's, what she thought was going to be nothing turned into 14 years. 14 years. And every year we're like,

are we going to do this again? Like we have this conversation like, are you doing this again? Like in my head, I always said, we're going are we gonna do this again like we have this conversation like are you doing this again like in my head i always said we're gonna do 10 let's do like let's do a cute eight because if you get to 10 then you're stuck and then eight turned into oh well i have to do nine because you know eight was so fun and then when nine went to shit then we have to do 10 to redeem ourselves and finish the story now Now we're on damn near 14. And she's, I'm pretty sure she's going to die on that show. It's like Don Corleone in Godfather or whatever.

It's like, once you get out, they pull you back in. They pull you back in. And she's loyal. That's the problem. Like, you know, she is an OG. There's not that many of them, you know, left. There's only two, honestly. Her and Teresa. Teresa. Her that many of them, you know, left. There's only two, honestly. Her and Teresa.

Teresa. Her and Teresa started the, you know. Wow, that's crazy. There's only two of them. When did Erica start? Erica started, like, season five. Like, she came in later. Okay.

Was Atlanta that much? Like, I feel like Candy's been on for a long time, too. Candy's been on for a long time, but Candy came on season three. Oh, she wasn't a first season. She wasn't an original. Gotcha. I think for her, there's this thing in her head that she wants to be the last standing OG. I mean, that's kind of

iconic. Kyle. And I also think that she is, she feels like it's her show. And I actually love that about her. As she should. Yeah. She feels like that she, like, I think she thinks it's everybody's show on the show, but she has like a special attachment to it because she started, you know, on the show at the first air date. Well, also, I think her family, like having Kim on the show and having it start

as like this like real familial relationship, like how did you kind of being on the inside see the way that having like a familial relationship impacted the cast dynamic versus like these other close friendships? I always say this, first and foremost, no matter who you are, I've been friends with this family for 15 years. I am not going to ever understand the true dynamics of it. And I have a front row seat to it. Just as someone coming into my sister and I's conversation for 42 minutes a week, you will never understand the full dynamic. That's why I never get involved in family fights.

Yeah. Because they go way back and they're way deeper than you think. And, you know, for myself, I when the Richard sisters are on, you have never met more funnier care like a charismatic group of people. The Richard sisters together are hilarious. I think Crystal really articulated it well, just because they're just, when they were all on the show, it's a TV show. And obviously we all, you know, the drama comes on, we have our reactions, we get into it because it's fun. But like, it's this family, family fights all the time. and just like yeah you know with i have 10 siblings so it's like there are times where

it's just like i can go months without talking to a particular sibling because they just annoyed the shit on me or vice versa and that's just how families operate the only difference with them is like it's all aired on tv yeah and so when we watch it as fans we're just like oh they're not speaking there's just some giant family feud, they hate each other, and it's like, I don't know, they're just sisters. You know what I'm saying? I think it's more like that, but it just gets blown out of proportion because of the platform

on which we're watching it on. And if you add dramatic music, and you add confessionals, like, confessionals are God's gift to an audience, but they're the devil. Like, you are never supposed to know what other people are thinking about you yeah about comedy like let's like for instance like you should never know what your husband or boyfriend or fiance or baby daddy should ever ever think about you like keep that shit to yourself i think you're amazing no keep on saying that. Let's keep it like that.

I just, it's, it's really a hard, it's a hard job. It would be like if we recorded with you and then after you left, cut in and then commentated on your thoughts

and like every, you know, you would say something and then we'd, and we would cut in in the episode after you left, edit it, play some music

and be like, you know, Justin, you looked a little off today. I don't know. It's like he came from the gym. Did he even work out? Because he wasn't really sweaty. So I feel like he was just like walking around. I would literally die.

I would die. Which is why I got rid of Twitter. I got rid of Twitter for that reason. I don't need people's inner thoughts about me. I have my own terrible inner thoughts. Those bitches are wild enough. Okay? I don't need y's inner thoughts about me. I have my own terrible inner thoughts. Those bitches are wild enough. Okay.

I don't need y'all. Okay. And when you're on reality TV, even when you're one step away from it, like I am not on real housewives of Beverly Hills. That is not my show, but because I'm one step away from it, people still feel that they can say those things. Oh yeah.

And people are really nice to me. Like, why don't you stand up for kyle or why don't you do this or you're like why didn't you say anything and i'm like bitch because i'm not getting paid yeah like and i was high as a kite if i had opened my mouth at that weed dinner i would have sounded like denise richards uh-uh you got high i was high what was your dose well i fucked up because I was like, oh, I'm big. I'll take the whole 10. And then I realized I'm a big man. I was like, I'll take the whole 10. Shit, I need like 25 at this point.

I haven't done weed since I was 23. And you said done weed. So I feel like that alone kind of gets you. Yeah, yeah. I had a whole terrible. I haven't done the weed. Yes, I haven't done the weed. The devil's lettuce. I had a terrible experience at 23 haven't done the weed I had a terrible

experience at 23 and I was like I'm done ate a whole cookie wasn't supposed to woke up hot it was just it was horrible first time I ever smoked a joint was at Elijah Wood's house who? okay flex my good friend Kyle

is good friends with him and I smoked a joint for the first time and I just got My good friend Kyle is good friends with him. And I smoked a joint for the first time and I just got absolutely knocked out. And everything was spinning and I just stood up and announced, guys, I have to leave.

Like the opposite of an Irish exit. And just walked out, ordered an Uber and went back home. Oh no. The, one of the first times I ever got baked. Oh my God. NBC is going to kill me.

Um, I was working for the guy who owned Ed Hardy. His name was Christian. And he was one morning, like in this crazy manic state as he's French. He was like, you're going to go and you're going to pick up Lil Wayne. You're going to pick up Lil Wayne and you're going to blah, blah, blah. And I was like, okay, I'm going to get on a private jet,

go get Lil Wayne from San Francisco and bring him back here. He's like, yeah, yeah, yeah. Just go pick up Lil Wayne. Make sure he gets here. He has to be here at five o'clock. And I was like, okay, okay, okay. And he used to call me Genevieve. He's like, Genevieve, get the fuck out of here.

Why? Everyone in the office had a French name. And Justin, I guess, was not French enough. So he called me Genevieve get the fuck out of here why everyone in the office had a French name and Justin I guess was not French enough so he called me Genevieve until the day he died also left me a check in his will and made it out to Genevieve so could you ever cash it I had to hurry I had to go to an accountant and figure this whole thing out how big was this check it was very good it was he was very sweet he was very sweet call me whatever you want right it was very nice He was very sweet. He was very sweet.

Call me whatever you want. Right? It was very nice. And I went to pick up little Wade and we got in the plane and they started smoking in the plane. And we were. You're like, are we going to go down? I was like, what is going on here? And they had the pilot circle until they finished what I think was a foot long subway blunt.

And also, if you account for like the gas they used to circle, that was like a ten thousand dollar joint. That was a ten thousand dollar joint. And there's no like if you smoke in a it's a it's the hottest box you can get in. Truly. Yeah. There's no like let's put the window down. There's no ventilation. There's no ventilation. There's no ventilation.

Can I tell you, I rode from the PTO, the private jet place to the, where we had to go was this place called Falcon. I rode from Burbank to Hollywood like a golden retriever out the window. I was so high. I just, I needed like the air to hit me. Did you smoke the joint or was it all secondhand? It was all secondhand, but it was enough. It was enough. No. Trust, but it was enough. It was enough.

No trust and believe it was enough. Wow. Wow. Yeah. The first time I got high, it was like the night before and I woke up and I was still insanely stoned and I had to babysit my mom's bosses, kids. I was just passed out on their couch the entire time i had to babysit them they could

have lit the house on fire and i would have had no idea none i was just asleep just dead they're like i was like how was your time with natalie and they're like natalie is roasted she's really sleepy. She moved from the couch. Would you ever go back on a reality show? I just did Special Forces. No, no, like a follow my life. I don't think so. Show me my world. We were talking about this last episode with Charlie Burnett.

I just think, like you said, I think the housewives or any reality TV star who exposes their personal life on the show doesn't get enough credit for just the emotional costs and the mental toll it can take on yourself and your family. And it's just like really, really hard to do. And I think it, you know, for Kyle to be able to do what she's done for 13 years with her kids and her relationship it takes a lot and you know we're we're getting married we're having a kid i'm just especially now when yeah that it's not just me i just wouldn't expose my family to that right now just because i i think it's it's tough it's an incredibly challenging uh situation i mean unless you're on a streamer unless you're on a streamer because unless you're on a streamer, because listen, let me let me tell you my let me tell you my hypothesis. OK, OK. If you can get on

a streamer, that means that people wanted to go see your show. So they had to get on Netflix or Hulu or whatever it might be and go and look for your show. And nine times out of 10, your show hits, it drops on Netflix. You know, it's a hit for three weeks. People are going to stream it. And then it's over as opposed to a Bravo or E where it comes out week after week after week. Then there's reruns and reruns and marathons and marathons and marathons. It's like Law and Order SVU. Like there's always an episode on, you know what i mean truly but as a streamer people have to want to go and find you and i feel like with the streamer you have a little bit more control over your life maybe but it's still a toll i also dived into uh salt lake city yeah and just like with

with meredith you know just hey, I don't like you. I'm going to spread a fucking rumor about your family. Your husband has sex with men, you know, just like that's fair game in that world. Just to like expose your family to some messy person who just decides to say whatever the fuck, even if it were true. Even if, you know, like, yeah, people are just telling your secrets for clout. even if you know like yeah people are just telling your secrets for clout they are people are you know what kyle had to deal with at the dinner party and something's just like tell me why you're you're you're getting in shape it's like holy shit you know like everything is put on blast about your life and it just it's a lot but it seems like and you know i don't know this you

know for certain i just feel like every cast on every show has a conversation before. Like, it seems like kids are off limits. How do we know that? There are probably phone calls that are made. There are conversations that are had. And I feel like every cast has a different thing. Like, you know, Atlanta, too, also kept the kids off off the situation. Now, Jersey, on the other hand, that line was crossed a few seasons ago when Gia became of age to have an opinion and then into the group chat. So I just feel like every reality show has their limits. I think you just have to set those limits going in. Do you think they're usually followed? Like, do you think the housewives of Salt Lake City had that conversation?

Because I'm watching this season and it does not seem like. Well, that's the problem. That's the problem. I don't think they had that conversation. I think they are so fresh in the game and so, so new that no one sat them down and said, oh, you can have hard limits. Because obviously someone, Bethany was on New York before Kyle. They were friends. They probably had conversations about certain things. Obviously, Teresa has been on the show for a very long time. Her kids were never brought up in any situation or anyone's kids are never brought up

in situations. I mean, we were seeing housewives kids get arrested on Atlanta, but no one would ever bring it up because it was an understood respect between each other. Salt Lake City, they don't have a respect for that. They don't care about shit. We'll definitely see because Mary's son was actually just arrested for drugs, I believe. It was a DUI and then he fled his court date. It was like a whole warrant for his arrest. Yeah.

But like, I think I just feel like, yeah, I just feel like there's like, you know, with every, you know, there's hard limits. I bet those three sisters in Calabasas know so much more

about one another, but also have hard limits. Yeah. You know what I mean? I feel like it was a hard limit until Erica told Garcelle's son to fuck off.

She was like, you can fuck off. But still, a but yeah like i feel like you know for her in her head i think she was so lit that she didn't realize like the gravity of what she was doing but you know quickly came to the realization that she crossed a hard limit yeah that's true so do you feel like kyle with this season going in knowing that her marriage would be center stage Yeah, that's true. for Kyle Pickett. It's like now that more and more stuff is getting leaked, you know, I don't know when they filmed this season, you know, it seemed to be having problems while they were filming. And then now they have since been separated. I think they filed for divorce. And now, you know, he was on Dancing with the Stars. And it feels like a lot of her castmates now have the benefit of saying, see, I told you so, even though at the time, you know, I feel like

Kyle had the right to certain privacy that the other know, I feel like Kyle had the right to certain privacy that the other women didn't feel like she had the right to. Well, if you actually go back and watch the season, what's really interesting is if you go back and watch the season on the first episode, they all get together at Eagle Woman's house. And I'm pretty sure that woman gave them peyote but i'm not gonna say anything but she said this has been a very hard year of my life you know and she alluded to you know this has not been an easy year for my marriage for myself for everything there was no follow-up to that no one called her and said hey i know you alluded to this like do you want to talk about it like you, you know what I mean? Are you OK? Are you OK? She like kind of put it out there like,

oh, this is this is what's going on when somebody comes at you with like that kind of and I'm only speaking from my own experience. Like if somebody comes at me a certain kind of way and it's like, oh, you just you completely missed the opportunity when the door was open to talk about these things. And now you're trying to accuse me in front of a group of people. You automatically get defensive. But I don't think the thing I love and I hate about Kyle is that she is so open. Like, I'm like, damn, girl, you ain't got to tell everybody everything. You know what I mean?

Like, but that's her thing. She is open with the audience. And I think once you watch the season, like you'll see that there's so much more going on. Like, you know, she lost her best friend. She lost her childhood best friend. That's a lot to go through, you know, and she talks about it on the show. But, you know, people knew that on at that dinner and no one no one brought that up. Like, you know what I mean?

Like, I know like, oh, you're working out. You're you're not drinking. You're trying to keep a clear head oh you're working out you're you're not drinking you're trying to keep a clear head because you're going through a lot and when she said i don't want to drink because i'm gonna be depressed no one said why why you know what i mean like it's like you know like you know it's like whoa i'm like okay like she's right here yeah she's telling you like i don't want to be depressed and you know they're, they're all just like, you know what I mean? Like, but again, I sounds like, well, because like I'm going through something, too.

Like I'm getting more money and more time with my kids. But like, it's a real burden on my heart. Right. But I just think that people don't know sometimes don't know how to react to certain things. Like, you know what I mean? If it's not black and white, we don't want to really talk about it. But that's like, that was real. Like, she was like, I don't want to be depressed.

That was real. Meanwhile, I'm like, I know, like, I'm good. I know what's up. You know, I talk every day, but no one's asking. What was, we tried to like, I think, figure it out a couple episodes ago, but what happened with Faye and Camille? Like, when she saw

that she was sitting across from camille she was like absolutely the fuck not i'm getting up i will be moving like i know it was years ago what like listen first of all let me let me go on record i'm gonna go on the record and say that camille grabber was the greatest housewife that ever lived. The first season of Real Housewives, Camille Grammer was the goat. Okay? The fucking goat. What a statement. And I was working.

Is Kyle okay with that statement? I don't know. We'll find out. We'll find out in my tournament. Actually, she says the same thing. She always says Camille season one was great TV. She she will back me up on that. I've heard her. I've heard those words come out of her mouth. I'm going to go on record again and say this is where Twitter fucked things up. OK, the Bravo Bravo used to have a blog and the comments under the blog, you know, were very were a big thing.

People used to comment under your blogs. I think early on in in Housewives, people didn't realize it wasn't like it was where if you're a housewife and you're getting comments, no matter if they're bad or good, the network loves it like that. People are responding to your story. But Camille was like kind of like the first one to ever get the heat people thought she was mean but i thought she was great tv so on that first season at that dinner party from hell camille called faye the morally corrupt and it didn't sit well with Faye I don't blame her why did she say that though

she said it because Faye went and did Playboy that's why? yeah Faye did Playboy it's very judgmental but Camille didn't like the circumstances that it was done in like Faye did Playboy you know Faye had a friend that, you know, passed.

And then months, years later, Faye did Playboy. And they mentioned the friend in the spread. But it was just funny because Camille's done much worse things in her career. But it's just, it was humorous. But to Faye, it was not. And she still gets the morally corrupt you know now she can laugh about it but i think it's still birds i mean that would piss me off i mean i love i mean i wouldn't want to sit across from somebody yeah yeah yeah we can be in the same

room but i don't need to look at you in the face no meanwhile i'm like listen bitch we got to make sweatshirts we got to get some coffee cups out here. Yes, morally corrupt. We got to start like, yeah, let's start. Right? Like, Faye should have a whole merch line, morally corrupt. I would die. That would have sold. It's a label.

We should make some of those. No, we're going to make them. I'm actually talking to her right now about doing it because I feel like she's finally over it. But to your point, she didn't want to sit across from Camille. She shouldn't have to. Meanwhile, I'm like, I'll sit there. I love season one. Camille was the shit. Season across from Camille she shouldn't have to meanwhile I'm like I'll sit there I love season one Camille

was the shit season one Camille was everything would you like to have her back on I would like Camille back on but Camille again Twitter touch Camille and you'll see that have them stay offline they can't

how can they not I mean that's what I know what it's like I know what it's like to go on these shows and expose yourself and have the internet just talk about you and say some nasty things. But you know what helps? Just staying off your fucking phone, not reading Reddit, not reading your comments, all that shit. And it is so amazing just to like not give a shit. And then when your friends and your family send you shit and they say things like, can you believe what so-and-so said to you? You just reply respectfully. I don't care. Never send shit like this to me again. And it is so freeing to not have to worry about that shit. And you can do it. It's just a choice. I don't know. I've done it. Yeah, you've done it, but you own a cute show on ABC that's formatted You've done it, but you own a cute show on ABC that's formatted that you go on hot air balloon dates and you go to dinners and like, you know, you get a rose and you do this. And your audience is probably around 48 to 63. So let me go ahead and just say that you have a good audience.

And I'm not saying the Bravo audience is not bad. I'm just saying they are an opinionated people well i don't know if you haven't met bravo uh bachelor nation they're both pretty toxic and opinionated love them both love them both but let me give you an example i got to work like i want to say like a week ago and this girl that i work with was like hey my sister's friend said she tried to dm you and she wanted you to know that she tried to DM you. Can you look at your DM and look for this girl named Lacey? I'm just making up a name. And I was like, yeah, yeah. Go to my DMs, find this girl. And it's like, Crystal Minkoff brought up your name on the Vial files. What was that about? Are y'all beefing?

And I thought to myself, first of all, thank God I listened to the show. I'm like, this is bullshit and ludicrous. But you went out of your way to call your friend whose sister worked at E and have her find me in the hallways to tell me that you think I'm beefing. That's what I'm saying. No, that shit happens all the time.

I mean, that's... We'll talk about Bachelor people. We'll talk about Housewives. We'll talk about all these pop culture people. And it's the same thing. We'll make some sort of remark. And maybe it's like

objective shade. I don't know. It's not even that bad. But yes yes it will be some fan of theirs who's hyper defensive who maybe wants to start some drama will dm some person be like nick's talking shit about you and immediately it'll be a trigger response for that person they won't have the guts to go listen to it and honestly i respect it because like you know you're just making a bad situation worse yeah but yeah but that's the thing had you not i can't think of how many times that i've been

triggered by going into my dms or my comments and seeing stuff like that saying so and so said this about you and just like how many times i thought to myself had i just not looked i would have never have known because getting like finding out about it and then getting over it like nothing happens. And what I mean, you know what I'm saying? Like you go through this process. You have to comes to like, you know, collected debt. You know what I'm saying? Like you just you just get over it. And had you just not read it, you just would have not had to get over it. Yes. But that is one person trying to get in contact with me to let me know that they thought somebody shaded me. Imagine if I had been on the show and had actually had an opinion about what was going on could you imagine if i was a cast member on that show that means that you're getting a million times more dms and people being

like oh this happened and that happened like even the amount of people and this is what's really great about housewives but also like it's scary like i'm on the Today Show three times a month. I have a talk show. I mean, a TV show from Monday through Thursday at 11 p.m. on E! called E! News. We see you. Thank you. Nobody wants to stop me and talk about what happened with this person last week or on E! News or on the Today Show or like the miracle we did on the 10th hour and the fourth hour, people want to talk about the dinner party from hell. They want to stop me. They want to get, you know, like, and it's crazy because I'm like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. Like I'm at dinner right now with a friend of mine. Like, like this guy doesn't even know I'm on a date. I'm trying to get this dick. Like,

this guy has no idea I'm on Housewives. You just blew up my spot. I told this guy I sell soybeans. This guy has no idea I'm on Housewives. You just blew up my spot. I told this guy I sell soybeans. Like, like you need to like check yourself, lady. I got to tell you, I literally like I have had like, you know, I've had situations where like this, like these women come up and I love it. It's so nice. But like, I'm at Gay Pride.

I have my shirt off. Like I am talking to a sweaty man. Okay. And this woman comes up to me. She's like, I turn around. I'm like, listen, you and I can take this picture over here right now in front of this man, or you can help me out. Meet me at the bar. I'm going to order us two shots, the most expensive tequila. We're going to take them together and make a video, but give me 10 minutes. I'm trying to sell this deal. And she's like, okay, okay, okay.

sell this deal and she's like okay okay okay i'm gonna i'm gonna i'm gonna i'm gonna act and i'm like don julio two of two of them and the guy's like what was that about i'm like oh everyone thinks i'm wayne brady it's like the whole thing like it's a hair back to you where were we where were we i have this thing where like, I'm like, you know, I go to St. Patrick's Cathedral in New York and I always go and light candles for people. And I'm sitting having a moment because all the white ladies were in retrograde, I say. All my white ladies were like losing it. I have a friend who has cancer. I have this woman going through this and a divorce. So I went to church and I like lit a bunch of candles for people.

And I was honestly having a moment where I was like, I was bawling. I was like, literally losing it. And this woman's like, oh my God. She's like, I'm so sorry. Oh my God. In the middle of your prayer. No, no, no. I'm listening to music, bawling, praying for people.

And she's like, oh, I know it's a bad time. I just, I love you on Housewives. Can I just, I'm like, listen, if you give me two tissues and give me five minutes, I will literally, I would dry it up and take photos with you. Just throw me three tissues in five minutes, please. She's like, okay, I'll be on it. Her husband's like, I'm so fucking sorry. And I'm like, it's okay, it's okay. She came back and she gave me the tissues.

And in the five minutes, I took the photo and I was like, I'm blessed to be here. I really am. It's such a blessed space to be in, but that's the power of housewives. And that's why it is such a blessed space to be in, but that's the power of housewives. And that's why it is such a beautiful vehicle for women who are out there, who are ready to get their lives started, who are ready to leave their husbands, who are ready to start companies, who are ready to take their music to the next level. Like if you go in there with a purpose, I'm here for it.

It's like sports, I think, in a lot of ways. I always felt like Bachelor was Monday night football, like especially when it was in its heyday and everybody would watch because it's like just like with sports, it's like, you know, the various plays. It's like you can sack the quarterback in football and then housewives, you like start a rumor that their husbands is cheating, are cheating on each other. So it doesn't need to be new or innovative. It just needs to be like within this world that everybody knows. Yeah. But the fucked up part about it is Bachelor is like the Olympics, because because once you're on the bachelor it's like going to the olympics every four years like you get that one shot and like there's maybe one or two people out of this the

1200 that are competing that pop like you're lucky whereas housewives is like a sport like it is like but it's like wwe like you have your wrestler she's getting in the ring you love her and only her and even if she does the wrong thing and says the worst things in the world you still go back her up also you you don't just like rooting for your team you You like rooting against the teams that you hate, just like in sports. So to your point, yeah, if someone goes after your person, it's like it's fun to hate on your like. I don't just love the Green Bay Packers. I love hating the Minnesota Vikings. So just when you're watching, if you love Kyle, you might want to love hating on Sutton or anyone else.

Like it's fun to have someone you don't like. It's just as fun as watching someone you do like on these television shows. And it's fucked up because I like all the ladies. I love them all. Is there not a single woman where, if someone in the wild came up to you and was like, this woman is my favorite,

you would kind of view it as a red flag? No, like, I, like, I, every woman on this iteration of Beverlyly hills is in her own right a g like i'm in if you're a g i'm into it and by the way lady richards has been on the show for 14 years that bitch is she is thanos like she is the like she has that that claw she got that glove so if anybody's gonna step to her balls and i'm like good for you good good for you for holding your own because i know like she is like the g so i just think that beverly hills is full of g's right now i mean obviously there are women that

come in like that are one or two season housewives which i think is like kind of the worst thing you could be like i would rather just be a friend for 13 years than be a one or two season housewives, which I think is like kind of the worst thing you could be. Like, I would rather just be a friend for 13 years than be a one or two season housewife. One and done. And be like, no, thank you. Because that's your life. That's it. That's your legacy. Can you help us settle the debate? We were talking yesterday. Yeah. I felt like Dorit knew what she was doing when she let Denise know about her upside down shawl. She did it in such a classy way, but I feel like that's Dorit. She knows how to be classy all while throwing some shade.

And other people in this room feel like that was Dorit really genuinely trying to be nice. And I'm just like, there's no whispering on reality television. There's nothing about being discreet. Like everything's on camera. Nick said she could have taken Denise to the restroom. I was like, you think Denise was going to go to the restroom?

I'm just all not bringing up. All not bringing up. Denise was not doing shit. But you know what? You are. I do agree with you. It was nice, but subtly shady. But by the way, you're on a reality show.

If somebody walks in like with the backwards you're like and you don't say something like you're not doing your job you're not doing your job like the jacket was bad it's like amanda said it's like having spinach in your teeth like are you gonna tell someone like 100 you know or how how do you like it was so obvious that her jacket was fucked up no it wasn't obvious to me straight her jacket was fucked up. I guess maybe it wasn't obvious to me. No, the jacket was fucked up. The jacket was fucked up. By the way, again, I can't say anything because had I opened my mouth that night, I would have sounded like Denise Richards. I literally would have sounded like Denise Richards.

But she fucked up when she showed up? Listen, Denise Richards had a pre-drink, okay? But Housewives filming, it's a marathon. It's not a sprint. She caught, we had Crystal on, what was it?

Two weeks ago now? Last week. Last week. And Crystal walked in on the phone with Denise. Denise was like, I don't know how I got that fucked up. Because like, I know I had,

I had a cold. Is there codeine like an over-the-counter cold medicine? By the way, and this is the problem because you guys were right. I listened to the episode. If Denise Richards was like, damn, I was lit. I had a funnel time. Like I dressed as the THC I did in the at the dinner party for Halloween. Like that was my Halloween costume was I was the THC that I ate. I was lit. Like, yeah, it is what it is. But I think a lot of times people just get afraid to like, yeah, I would have loved Denise to be like, I understood the assignment. I shut up fucked up

to a weed party. The only thing I would have said was, OK, if I'm going to sit across from these 10 bitches, I'm definitely going to be high. Like I would have just made it like I would have made it. I also love Denise Richards. I do too. Honestly, Denise Richards is a Hollywood icon. Truly. You know what I mean?

Like take housewives out of it. I DM'd her to have her come on the show. I haven't heard back from her. Hollywood icon. Hollywood icon. Hollywood icon. Bond girl. Yeah.

Drop dead gorgeous. What was the other one where she played the teen in Florida who hooked up with her? Oh my God. What is it other one where she played the teen in Florida who hooked up with her? Oh, my God. Wild Things. Wild Things. Denise Richards was married to Charlie Sheen, you guys. No, I was in high school when Wild Things came out.

Oh, I know what you were doing to Wild Things. Nasty Muffa. Nasty ass. Nasty Muffa. Oh, you nasty. What was her first movie? Starship Troopers. Starship Troopers. Starship Troopers.

That was when I discovered Denise Richards. Denise Richards is iconic. By the way, if you look at Beverly Hills, I hate to say this because I love all the ladies, Atlanta, Potomac. You know, I think Every Housewives is pretty iconic, but Beverly Hills is and has. It's the show. It's the flagship. It's the flagship. Yeah.

And they've had the most iconic people, guests, experiences, trips. Yeah. And I feel like other Housewives look to Beverly Hills for their inspo. Like I keep saying, like the women of Salt Lake City, it feels like it's a spoof of Beverly Hills Housewives and they all want to be on Beverly Hills Housewives. And they're just trying to bring Beverly Hills to Salt Lake City, it feels like it's a spoof of Beverly Hills housewives and they all want to be on Beverly Hills housewives. And they're just trying to bring Beverly Hills to Salt Lake City. That's how it feels. Well, I think anytime you see like. I think Bravo is like a like a fishbowl, obviously, like there are people probably on your show who saw something work for someone and say, you know what, I'm going to be that person when I go on.

I'm going to be the lovable blah, blah, blah, blah, who's also that da-da-da-da-da. You know what I mean? Like, they know what they're doing. But I also think that if you watch the first season of Salt Lake, the ladies were less made up and kind of more of themselves. Like, you know, now it's all about the hair and makeup. Like, I love that Heather Gay was a little disheveled, you know, season one.

Now she's gorgeous. Like, you know what I mean? She's like, she's beautiful. Like, she's gorgeous. Like, she's like beat down to the ground. I like, you know, I like when, you know, ladies don't have a glam squat all the time. Right. Yeah.

Yeah. Lisa not wanting to do the drag. And by the way, that was one of the most, to me, love that scene. That was a great scene. I have glam in this city. I have glam. Monaco and Central Bay. Yes.

Whitney too. Also read Twitter. Now she's using all the hot words. She's emotional. She's using all the hot words. But then it just fails. you can't keep that up for a very long time also i feel like fans can tell when people are like reading reddit or reading the internet and bring that on into their character it loses authenticity what are you talking about

meredith and and and monica are now bringing in dms from a fan. Yeah, but that's like response. But I mean like when they, you can tell someone is changing their behavior by criticism that they're receiving. Yeah. That's from like the four people on Reddit. It's not, you know, but it feels massive. It feels like everyone wants you to be this way. So you kind of like shift. You kind of do it.

You kind of respond to like what you're reading. Camille Grammer, season two. But also in Camille's defense, she was also going through a divorce and she couldn't say too much. And I get it. Protect your bag, girl, because listen, I would have protected my bag, too. Yes. If my lawyer was like, you go on that show, you don't say a fucking thing about Kelsey. I would have been like, great.

I'm not saying a damn thing. What is your dream? If you could have anyone on Beverly Hills Housewives, old, new, who would it be? Who's like your seven core best television? We know Miss Camille will be there. You're a casting director. Beverly Hills All-Stars. Okay.

All-Stars. Yes, thank you. I would do Camille. Season one Camille. Okay. I would get Lisa Vanderpump back right now because I feel like she's getting lost

in the shuffle on Vanderpump rules and I feel like Vanderpump rules people are getting too big like you know what I mean like you almost

she almost she's just getting lost in it she's getting a little outshined yeah and I think she's hungry like I think she wants that that spotlight back and by the way

she deserves it sure Kyle duh Kathy Lisa Rinna agree like i think she wants that that spotlight back and by the way she deserves it sure kyle kathy lisa rena i'm gonna go ahead and get erica jane in there yes because that bitch is getting spicy again garcelle and then what i'm gonna do is because i mean i love them all. I'm just saying this is like my, I need like a Holly Robinson Pete on there. Or like, I need like a, I need like a, like a, like a Sherri Shepherd who's like too big for it, but also will do it. You know what I mean? Like, I just need one more, like I need one more hot one in there.

Like, who wants to come in and like show out a little bit. You know what I mean? So you wouldn't bring back a Brandi Glanville? I love a Brandi Glanville. I just don't think that it would ever happen. Because she wouldn't do it or Bravo wouldn't let her? No, I think Brandi for some, I think Brandi, there should have been a, I think if they had done what they did in New York, where they rebooted Beverly Hills. She could be on that because she just felt so much younger than every,

although like she wasn't that much younger than Dorit or she just felt so much younger. And Dorit, I bring Dorit back to it. You know, I need like, I need like not. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Now you're trying not to offend anyone by leaving them out. No, no.

But I also feel like this is my ultimate take. I know Bravo hates, probably. But I also feel like this is my ultimate take. I know Bravo hates, probably hates when I say this, but I think that housewives should be like a presidency. You go on for four years and then someone in that crew has to take a break. You still get paid because you're in a holding pattern and you come back the next season and then somebody else takes a break. You rotate. You rotate the breaks. That way people come back with a little bit more life under their belts. Because I think sometimes when you don't check out a housewife's land, like it could be a lot.

And sometimes you just need somebody. Like Luann, when she went away and came back. She was good. She was good, but she also went live a little bit of life. Yeah. Came back with a new man, even though the man was shitty like she just like got out of her circle and stopped dating people in the circle right i just feel like everybody in reality tv should leave and come back i mean andy cohen has like a statement he's like put him on pause like that's the thing right

like dorinda he was like put her on pause But then she comes back for Ultimate Girls Trip and now she's like golden. Yeah. But you know, that pause doesn't really mean that, you know, that pause, like when somebody says honorable mention, they know you lost. You know what I mean? Like, I feel like pause is something that's a little bit different. I think that every housewife should just go live and then come back a year later because a year could make a big difference in your life. If you're disconnected from the group, you might think differently about people. You might have like a new set of friends.

I think there's just something to be said about it. Like when I was on my daytime show, Daily Pop, I always said that we should have four co-hosts and that every quarter we should rotate somebody out and bring somebody in. And I wouldn't mind doing it myself. Just because talking about the same celebrities and the same topics,

you know, your opinion probably will become, like you said, like you just know what the audience wants. Like just go out and live a little bit for three months. Yeah. Go do some commercials. Like I wanted to do other shit. Hold on to your kilts dearies peacock original the

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I have. I think we should all watch it just to refresh. Let's just watch it quick. Because it's an Avengers. It's 17 minutes. Two minutes and 40 seconds. Get pumped. It's a good trailer.

It's a great trailer. The screaming. Yeah, I love it. Just scream. Chills. I've cheated. I was a makeout slut. I made out with Sheena like Vegas.

No. The bomb. It was one kiss I miss who he used to be To me I don't know What the future For me and Tom looks like They're doing a podcast

Together now Who's that Tom and Tom Jesus My lawyer will be Dealing with you The house And my

Children Your children I have never experienced someone who gets cheated on and suddenly she becomes god sounds like lala was mad about it does yeah sounds a little jealous that's by the way that's the only part that i i was like whoa i'm actually gonna tune in for just this i want to see what the context was because you never know. I feel like it was obvious that that narrative was going to get brought up. That the entire cast was going to get envious and jealous of Ariana's fame

and attention that she has been receiving. First contestant on Vanderpump to get on Dancing with the Stars. First Emmy nomination. Did she get one on her own? And I think it's also because Lala's gone through so much shit herself. And you brought this up when we were watching season 10, Nick, as the different treatment of Ariana versus Lala. Like Lala's been through hell and back and she didn't get all these opportunities.

Listen, I get that. But like she's been through a lot. But I don't think our what is Ariana doing wrong? Ariana is doing what any of them would do if those opportunities came her way. I would do it. I also think it's like I imagine Lala would want to get treated better not to have Ariana treated as badly as she was treated. You know, I just by the way, was Lala treated?

Well, yeah, I think she was treated you know i just by the way was lala treated well yeah i think she was treated i think people treated lala like oh this happened to you because you did it to someone else like it was almost like they kept this narrative going that she was the other woman and no one feels bad when the other woman's husband gets taken by someone else or some other circumstance like it's almost like she deserved it a little bit yeah because yeah but the problem is and this is not i think i think this is more to say tom and ariana were more in our faces and they were more of a thing together on the show and the rachel aspect of it i think really you know hit home for a lot of people but also lightning just strikes it was like the word scandaval happened it was her friend they were living together she was freezing her eggs like it was a halloween costume it was an snl skit it just the branding behind it was just so perfect that I feel like Bravo

basically handed it to Ariana to take it. But they all benefited from it. They've all have made a lot of money from Scandival. Like 100%. I mean, that's how Lala

I mean, she put her down payment on her like Palm Springs house was from her merch. Send it to Daryl. Yeah. She launched Sheena and Lala launched podcasts from it from her merch. Send it to Daryl. She launched Sheena and Lala launched podcasts from

it. But it's hard. You don't understand this because you were the guy who won from your season. I don't understand what? You don't understand being on a show and having someone be the breakout? Sure I do. But you were the breakout. Yeah, but I had

my breakout, but i've experienced other people have breakouts around me who had to wait for my time okay so you were on what season i was a two time runner up and so like i went through hell on my first two seasons i was i got bad edits i got internet bullied i was crucified and then around all my peers because in bachelor just like in reality tv like when you're not the cool kid yeah you're an easy target even for the people around you because you know it's a scary world but like a lot of the people who go on the show especially if they don't have experience in it they're kind of cowards so if like the audience doesn't like someone people don't want to be seen

with you they don't want to take pictures with you yeah you know and shit like that and i went through all of that you know and i had other people get you know, and shit like that. And I went through all of that, you know, and I had other people get, you know, and I'm most happy for them. Like my friend, Ben, who was a bachelor before me, you know, like I went through a shit tut and, you know, but he was the rising star and I got shit on. And, and I, you know, meanwhile, like I put my heart out there and I got fucking crushed and then people like mocked me and made fun of me and blah, blah, blah. And then I, you know, then my friend becomes the star and all while I'm just like fucking suffering. And so, yeah, I know what it's like.

Where's your friend now? What? What's your friend doing now? Yeah. He's crushing life. He's happily married, you know, doing his thing. Restaurant-er, how do you pronounce it? Restaurant-er.

Restaurant-er. He owns a bunch of restaurants. He has a, you know, he's successful. And how many podcast listeners do you have a week? A lot. Okay. And you were just on Special Forces? Yeah.

Oh, okay. Well, no, I'm not. No, no. Justin, I am not suggesting I haven't made it. I'm just saying. My star is still on the rise. I'm just saying. I just chose not to, you know, worry about other people.

And I chose to stay in my lane and focus on what I could control. And I chose not to be envious of the people around me. And I chose to support them. And I just bunkered down and I got through my shit. I think on any reality show there, you play the long game, obviously. But I think on any reality show, especially one where you're on like a Vanderpump rules when you're six people and you all started coming together. I feel like anytime somebody gets a little bit more shine or publicity or a little bit more attention, it then puts a spotlight on them. And, you know, Ariana at some point says, you know, an interview that she feels like people are going to feel sorry for Tom.

And, you know, she knows the pattern. Like, you know, if she didn't go through this and she wasn't getting all the accolades or in all the spotlight, I feel like maybe Lala wouldn't feel this way. But here's the fucked up thing. I just feel like I wish that they would have taken a breath in between. I feel like it was too fresh at the reunion and it was probably too fresh when they were filming this. Like, it's just too like I just needed like maybe another month in between. Like, I really wish like, you know, they would have been like, hey, due to the sensitivity of this, we're going to take a month until we give you the reunion. Because everybody just came in so hot, ready to go after, like, you know what I mean?

Like, it was, it was hot. It was too hot. Nobody was, like, making sense because it was so hot. And I feel like we're probably going to get the same thing in the season where everybody's so hot about it. But you never know. Look, that was a left turn right there. When she said, come out like God, I need to know what you mean. I do, too.

Time to tune in. And by the way, we're skipping over Shayna. What? Shayna Kiss Schwartz? Say Shayna. Say Shayna. And then Shayna replied to some comment being like, you know, tune in, you know, everything will be explained, like, you know, referring to be out of context, which is maybe true. But yeah, she's really putting herself out there.

Or she referred to it like some like she thought that was in the vault or something. Yeah. So she said things that were supposed to go to the grave is how she referred to it. But it's not exactly what you think. Rachel thought that was supposed to go to the grave is how she referred to it. But it's not exactly what you think. Rachel thought that was supposed to go to the grave, too, you know? By the way, that was some real shit. What? Like, that last episode of Vanderpump Rules was probably the best reality TV. She done, Tom?

No, Tom and Rachel, like, talking at the house after the whole. I was like, whoa, this girl has no idea what she's getting herself into. This guy just blew up his life and he knows it. He thinks she's going to stay with him. But that bitch is out when she figures out that this is all like a. It was wild. That was wild. Watching her put the pieces together and going

i can only trust my family and you well i don't even know if i can trust you watching her put the pieces together because you know what i will say this and people get mad at me for this i feel like rachel raquel was again living in a fishbowl like Like, you know, you had one of the Katie's was dating Tom, then Ariana came in, then James was dating this person, and then he cheated on her with this person. So in your mind, everyone in your world is hooking up with one another and getting more screen time. Like, so you're not computing how big of a deal this actually is. And I think when you're coming in and you have, I call it young ho mind because I had it too when I was 24, 25. Like, you know, you're just not computing how big something is when it's in your space. have a friend who's like who likes let's say your friend likes nick and you guys are young and like she likes nick but nick's not really into her and she makes out with derrick one night at a bar so you feel like she's over nick and you're like oh i'm gonna hook up with i'm gonna just make out

with nick and she's like what the fuck were you doing and it's like wait hold on i thought you were over nick because you were making out with derrick yeah meanwhile i know as a 30 something year old that the statue of limitations on a crush is four years. Like, oh, no, I'm not touching you. Like, you know, but when you're 25, like she's sorry, 27. Like, and you think that that's, you know, normal behavior. It's crazy. It's crazy. They were still wrong. Don't get me wrong. No, I we've been watching Vanderpump back ever since Scandal came out and it makes me very much understand, not agree with, but understand why, where, how Tom's brain worked the way it did.

I don't agree with it. I think it's immature. I think he can, he's a selfish person, but I understand why he was like, we all do this shit. What's the big fucking deal? It was the branding. I'm telling you. There's a writer

i'm gonna get her name wrong hannah hannah schellinger i think her name is who coined scandal ball and if that bitch is not getting paid money right now from everyone she should probably get a lawyer like she coined yesterday scandal ballaval and she associated with Bravo or she just no she was like a writer for the New York Times and she wrote about it and called it Scandaval and it took off it just was the perfect storm

for her just like it was kind of the perfect storm trying to think the last perfect storm we had like what was the last perfect storm in reality tv scandal wise well it's not reality tv but i think you could really make the case that like taylor and travis is a perfect storm of like she's on her eras tour and then now she he's having his season and like perfect storm it's just like everyone's obsessed with it and then because everyone's obsessed with it the

stories continue to feed themselves and it's like storm. You can't stop it no matter where you go. You can't stop it. It just it hits. I've been on TV since I was 22. You know, I haven't had that hit yet. You know, I just and I get it. Sometimes it happens for people in four years. Sometimes it happens for people in the first season. I don't want to be the first season hit because that's a hard thing to keep up with. So the fact that I'm almost in my 14th season of being on TV and I'm still on a steady climb, I'm ready for the hit. I just do I have to show my labia to get it? Do I need to like hook up? We're here to help. Should I just like pull my labia out? Your menorah or majora? I was like, happy Hanukkah. I just don't know.

Like, you know, everybody has that hit. I just can't. Like on my show, Morgan Stewart had the hit. Like, you know, she came out. She got married. She had two kids. Like she was a breakout star of my TV show. And guess what?

I loved it. I'm happy to just be like on E! News. Adrienne Bailon was the girl. Like I'm like, yes. Like at least I have someone on the show who's getting it. That's how I always think about it. You're such a team player. Well, Justin, we got some more pop culture burning questions for you to wrap up.

But before we do, we're going to do some texting office hours. Give someone relationship advice. Oh, let's go. And then we'll come back with, uh, and wrap up with, uh,

some Taylor and Travis talk. We'll talk about some bachelor breakups and then some final thoughts about housewives with our boy, Justin. Let's go. All right. Texting office hours. Let's bring them up.

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and I'm trying to figure out if I should save it, kind of what to do. Do you have the option to save it? What do you mean he tried to end it and why? So if you'd have asked me that two weeks ago, no, I wasn't really given the option. We, he tried to end our engagement over the phone. We've been doing long distance for about two months. He is in the military. And so he's been doing training for two months and then he was going to come back. And then basically we got into a small argument.

The week of Thanksgiving turned into now this big thing, apparently not a small argument. And on Thanksgiving, he just kind of texted me and he was like, I don't know if this is for me. I don't know how I want to go forward with this. And then the next day on the phone, he was like, I'm just not happy. This feels forced. I don't think we can do this anymore. When did you get engaged? July. And we've been together for three years. Were you surprised? Were you insisting? How did the engagement come to be?

I was, I kind of knew, like I kind of knew it was happening. Like we had picked out the ring. He knew what I wanted. And I just like felt the vibes that weekend that it was happening. And the point was to with our like timeline, we wanted to get engaged before he went to flight school, essentially. And so then while he was in school for a year, we'd be doing long distance, I'd be planning the wedding, I'd be distracted, we'd visit on the weekend. I'd be distracted. We'd visit on the weekends. But we had so many conversations like, are you ready for this? Are we ready for this? Is this, do you feel pressured? And it was always, we were on the same page. And who was initiating those conversations? Me.

Definitely me. And when is your wedding date? It was supposed to be January 18th, 2025. Okay. So a while out. Yeah. It was going to be, we had a full like year and some change. Yeah. Here's what I would say. You, do you want to save the engagement? Yeah. All

right. In my, I've, I've been in this similar scenario and before we even started, I was talking about how sometimes the holidays can bring out trauma that we don't really even know. And, you know, sometimes when there's so much pressure from work stuff and other things, it could put a strain on people's relationships. If I were you, what I would tell him is I would say, you know what? It seems like there is a lot of pressure on you and there are things that are happening in our lives. And I get it. It's like a pressure cooker. I would say, let's, why don't you and I just put this on hold? Let's not talk about this, our engagement for the next six months. Let's see how we get out of this or three months. Let's just take three months. Let's see how we get

out of this. And like, let's make a decision in three months when we both have both feet on the ground. Because I think if you may try to make a decision right now, you're going to second guess it for the rest of your life. Just be like, hey, let's pause this. It seems like this engagement is causing us a little bit of stress. Put it on both of you and just say, let's put the engagement on pause for three months. Let's talk again in February after quarter one and let's come together whenever you guys are together. When we're in person. When you're in person. Yes. What was that fight about that turned into?

Not something I typically would pick a fight about, but because it was coming towards the end of like our long distance, I hadn't seen him in like two months in person. We were on FaceTime and I was like, I feel like I'm just person. We were on FaceTime. And I was like, I feel like I'm just not getting your attention. Like, I feel like I'm asking you to spend time with me. Because whenever we were FaceTiming, his phone was just like, like faced up to the ceiling. And then he was doing laundry. And then I was like, I don't want to just like talk to the ceiling. And then he was like, I can do laundry and talk to you at the same time. And I was like, you're not hearing what I'm saying. And then he got mad. I got mad. He's like, I can do laundry and talk to you at the same time. And I was like, you're not hearing what I'm saying.

And then he got mad. I got mad. He's like, I don't want to argue right now. And I was like, you're not seeing my side. You don't care to see my side. And his response to that was, let's break up. His response to that was he had gotten off the phone with his parents right before we had gotten on the phone. We've been talking about where we're going to live, if we're going to move closer to

his parents, closer to my parents. He was like, so I'm just not in a good mood about that. And then it just exploded. A lot of pressure. You're trying to force me. There was just it just he was upset about a lot of things. He was like, you're trying to force me to live here. I don't want to compromise. You don't want to compromise. And then he was like, I don't know how I see my future anymore.

And then that was the end of our conversation. How old is he? He's 24. Karen's 25. Oh, you should have started with that, Michelle. You should have. By the way, bitch, you should have started with that. Okay. You should have started with that.

First of all, you're going to put this, you're going to, you're going to, you're not going to talk about big life. You have a year and some change left before you get married. This guy is 24 years old. He cannot make one big, you're, you're a 27 year old woman, which means you're a 33 year old man. This man cannot make big life decisions at 24, especially whenever he's under this much pressure with flight school. And I'm going to tell you this right now. You're going to have to tiptoe around this for a minute. So how long is flight school for? Like a year, year and a half. This

is the hardest part of flight school. I'm guessing it's the getting in the entry. Yeah. Talk to him, figure out like, Oh, what are they saying? Does it get easier? Oh, they do. When does it get easier? Oh shit. Let's pray that you make it to your sophomore year. At what point does this get easier for him? Then start bringing up some of those big life issues. But look, you don't need a, you don't need a pressure this anymore because you're dealing with somebody who's trying to figure out five different things at one time. And as a man, we can't at 24. We had gone back and forth, like whenever this was first happening over the phone, I mean, I did everything. I was like, why do we have to figure this out right now? Why does there have to be a decision like today over the phone? He was like, I don't see me changing my mind. He was like, I'm just not happy. I haven't been happy for it. Like he said really mean things.

He was like, I just haven't been happy for a long time. I was like, can we just wait? Can we see how this is when you get back home? I was like like you didn't communicate any of these concerns to me before and then he was like i thought they were a fluke i thought they were just gonna go away and i was like what part of us being apart for two months made you think this was gonna go away and now we talked yesterday feeling he has so it has nothing really to do with you guys being in the same room or not being in the same place yeah um and so now he gets back on sunday um and we hadn't talked in two weeks and so i was like what is your plan like are you when you're coming back like when are we going to talk in person and then i asked him i was like do you have plans to move out he was like i might move in with my

friend adam he's like but i haven't really thought about it. And he just hasn't thought about anything these whole two weeks that we haven't talked. Well, I'm over here thinking I have to cancel our venue and our food and all of these things. I mean, that should tell you something, though. He doesn't sound like a man who's ready to get married. Yeah. Justin makes a lot of great points. Yeah. And we've talked of great points. Yeah.

And we've talked about this before on our show. And maybe it's a guy thing. I don't know. But if a guy feels very unsettled with where he is in other aspects of his life professionally. When I moved to LA, I was 34-ish. 34 ish. But like I went from this career that I had, which, you know, was upward mobility, condo in Chicago, very settled. And then I just got rid of all that, moved to L.A., lived on my buddy's couch for a year. I dated, but there was no way I was going to get into a relationship at that point because I just didn't feel like I had found my footing with this new life that I was trying out. And until I felt secure where I could take care of the people I loved and I was in a relationship with, I was

never going to be in a relationship. And I think for guys, they really need to feel secure and confident with where they're at in their life to really take that next step and be the partner that you want him to be. Right now, to Justin's point, he's just trying to get through flight school. And then he is still pretty young. So every time he sees other people around him having different experiences and living different lives, he's going to constantly compare that. And he doesn't have the benefit of being like, well, yeah, I've done that. I've been there. Yada, yada, not for me anymore. He's going to be like, well, am I to like, should I be doing that? Should I be doing this? You know? And so you're dealing with a man

who has more questions than answers in his own life. And so you, you know, getting on the phone with them and listen, you have every right to say, I want attention. You're not, you know, you have, you have a right to have your needs met, but you are asking it of a guy who might not be capable of giving what you need in this moment. Yeah. And I think the one important thing that like we need to point out is that I've seen this happen a thousand times where men will fumble their perfect match because the timing was not right and end up with somebody who's not quite their perfect match just because it made more sense in the, oh, well, I guess I'm ready to get married now. Like, you know, it's like a, it's like a thing. It doesn't happen all the time,

but it definitely happens. So you have to realize that this has nothing to do with you. Okay. You're just at a different place than he is and probably at 24 you probably knew what you wanted in life this guy's just starting a journey at this point and that's all he can focus on because the idea of you know focusing on that and a wedding and like if you put too many things in front of us we're men we just pick what you want. You know what I mean? Like, so you just need a, I'd say be the cool bitch and be like, yo, I think don't even give him a question. Be like, you know what? If he wants to salvage this relationship, he'd be like, oh, I don't know what to do. Be like, you know what? Let me help you. I'm take this ring off for six months. Let's go through flight school. You do you'ma do me let's stay connected and in six months

let's come back to the table and see if we want this and then when he goes back to his boys at flight school and he tells them the story they're gonna be like well damn she was real chill about that oh she's a bad bitch she's a bad bitch oh she must definitely know what i've been saying no because i can but either way i can feel the anxiety in your voice because you don't like the unknown you want to know if i can buy your dress if i can put a venue you know what if i were you i would cancel all that shit yeah yeah i would cancel all that shit and if you have to get a wedding venue while you're 29 you're still 29 you're still vibrant you're still bomb like at bomb. Like, at least you will know.

That's pressure on yourself. So get your deposits back. So whenever he gets back on Sunday, not try and figure this all out whenever he gets back, kind of if he wants to move out. No, no, no. Yeah. So just to add a couple of things Justin said,

I think Justin articulated it really well. Yeah. I think just a couple of things, just to simplify what Justin said. First, you need to accept the reality that you're in, right? Like as we've talked about, like I get it. It's tough to like plan something in your head, plan it with your partner and have that plan kind of crumble at your feet. It's discouraging. It can feel embarrassing. Oh, you got to tell your parents and families, oh, like engagement off. But like humble yourself and just accept it at

like maybe you guys move things a little too quickly not the end of the world like you it happens it happens like it happens to the best of us we've literally i've we've some of us have been there so take it upon yourself take control now and like justin said can't like stop wait you don't need an answer from him except where he's at be like this is not someone who's ready to get engaged right now and even if i am like our relationship couldn't handle this type of pressure so yeah take it upon yourself to like make the decision you need to to cancel whatever commitments you've made you certainly have plenty of time to get out of stuff you probably it's probably not going to cost you much of anything because it's so far ahead and give him exactly what he's asking for and what i mean by that is like give him the

space give him more than what he's asking for don't sit around like right now he's got the power because he's the one who's made this decision hey i'm not ready i'll call you when i need to maybe i'll sleep at a buddy's house he knows that you're waiting for answers stop waiting for answers he's you he's giving you an answer and now you're just going to accept it so much that it's going to surprise him and the third part you need to do is be super fucking supportive of him. You know, just be like, hey, you know, like you are going through a lot. And almost even if it feels a little like, say, you know what, can I just say, I'm sorry. I haven't really empathized with what you have been going through.

I know you're going through a lot. Even if it feels like you're laying on a little thick, I think men need a little bit more support than they're used to getting. And I'm not saying they're afraid to say they need more support. Sure. That too. But I think, you know, just really make him feel like you understand where he's coming from while simultaneously not be there for him. You know, you know, and so you just kind of like as a parting gift, you just say, hey, you know, I've accepted your decision. By the way, I think you're doing great. You're going to be an amazing this.

You're going to be amazing that. I'm so proud of you. You've worked so hard. I'm really sorry. Blah, blah, blah. But like, obviously, I feel the way I feel about you. And I hope down the line we can rekindle. But like, and then kind of disappear on him.

Let him panic. Let him think you're gone. Let him think that you accepted his decision. Quite honestly, he hasn't really thought through. He is making a reactive decision, but you don't need, what you can't do is convince him to be with you. You have to disappear and let him realize what life is like without you. Let him figure it out on his own. You convincing him to be with you just makes you come across as weak and powerless and makes him feel like he has power that he doesn't have in reality. Yes. I had to do it to Nick.

Yeah. And it worked. We've all had to do it. I remember this story. We have all had to do it. By the way, the guy I thought I was going to be with, I had to do this to. And honestly, I was embarrassed to get out of the relationship because it was very

nice and it was cute and it was like, you know, he was a big thing, a big name. And honestly, two months into the like, I'm gonna give him space thing ended up being so much better for me that I ended up finding a little bit more of myself and not wanting to go back into that relationship. And by the way, when we had our conversation, because we did have another come to Jesus talk a year later, where he was like, oh, I think I'm ready to be in this. Let's meet up. I realized that he just didn't grow enough for me. And I look at him now in his relationship and I look at the guy that

he's with and I'm like, damn, that could have been me. Miserable. So you got to do what he... I'm all about that. And also let him call you. And if you want to pick up the phone and say hello and not be the one that initiates when he's away and wants to be supportive, you can do that as well. You just can't be the one initiating

saying we haven't had FaceTime, we haven't talked. What the fuck? But like, you know, just lay low. Also, if you miss a couple calls, you're busy. Why are you so busy? You're busy.

My fear would just be if we did reconnect down the road, is this going to happen again? We've broken up one time before. Who knows? You'll deal with that problem if it comes up. You know, right now that's not, we don't even know if that's going to happen. So why are you going to worry about it? And let him set the fucking,

like if he wants to set a second date, let him set it. Be like, you know what? When you're ready, you set the date. I'm chilling. Like, I don't want to go through this again, but yeah. I don't want to do it again. Yeah. That's good.

You're Gucci. That makes sense. I think you've probably accidentally made him feel like there's more on his, yeah. Smothered or maybe a little parented. Parented is what it is. Yeah. It's parented.

And I have that, I have that way with men as well. Cause I need to know what's your sign. I'm a Sagittarian. What do you do for a living? I work in nuclear medicine. You need to know, you need to know what's your sign i'm a sagittarian what do you do for a living i work in nuclear medicine you need to know you need to know you need answers you're assigned like you work in you need work in need of no shit you're not in pr where you can like figure out the situation you're not in marketing where like you kind of throw some shit against the wall

you're in a need to know basis because you're a need to know person i can tell that by your tristmas tree it looks fucking stunning but you need to know where everything's gonna go like i i get i get you i get you so you're just it's a personality thing and it's gonna take some 50 50 you're gonna have to bring it down to here he's gonna have to bring it up to meet you at a place where he can give you answers yeah my guess is you've probably had a little bit more control in this relationship than you've realized or maybe you have realized but i think this is him kind of acting out and and trying to take some of that back and i honestly think let him have it let him feel like he you know this is him trying to figure out what he's you know know, he's working through shit right now. And I think you respecting that and you supporting him will go a long way.

I don't know how it's going to end up, but this is you guys figuring your shit out. And as a guy who's 24, still very much in the middle of what the fuck am I going to do for the rest of my life? Oh, Michelle, you have three more. We thought that was going gonna be a good time to get engaged and that just no michelle did not turn out the way that we planned and by the way 27 he's gonna have the same thing happen to him and then again at third oh you have two more of these things you have like literally like it's just i'm sorry as a man, 24, trying to figure out that next step, 27, because I'm almost 30. Then you're just about to go through some seasonal depression with this man.

I'm sorry. Girls do it, too. But like, but it's quick. It's swift. We get in and we get out of it. OK, like we want to figure it out. But he's just in that place. Damn.

That was good. Yeah, take the lint off. That was good. Yeah, take the months off. That was good. So it's been stressful for the last couple of weeks and then he'll come back on Sunday and then he, whenever we were talking about it,

he was like, I still have a lot to figure out because I was like, are you going to move out on Monday? And he was like, I haven't even thought about it at all. You see, you need to know,

but no, you need to know. That's too much. Is this not as serious to you? No, but like, you're just like, I need to know. I need to know. Like, what are you moving out as serious to you no but like you're just like i need to know i need to know like what are you moving on like you know like you're

rambling like you're like you don't realize that like he's like freaking out because all the unanswered questions and then you're adding that he doesn't have answers yeah and then you're adding yeah yeah you're adding more questions not that it's wrong it's just his personality type means like you need to be like all all right, come in here. He can't verbalize what he wants because he doesn't know what he wants. So you have to walk him through it. And the last thing you need to do is have him go back to that goddamn flight school without a without an answer because you can't handle that. So give him the answers.

Hey, we're taking three months off this engagement. This is what we're doing. Yeah, I would I would more. This is what I'm doing. There's no we right now. He doesn't want to be in a relationship with you. I we're doing. Yeah. I would more prefer, this is what I'm doing. There's no we right now. He doesn't want to be in a relationship with you. I'm doing this. Yeah.

I've decided this. I've accepted your decision. I'm moving forward. I think you're amazing. Sorry about this. Sorry about that. I really support you. I'm proud of you.

You're amazing. Like, be chill as fuck. Be, like, content, you know. But stop making decisions for the both of you because I feel like he, I'm guessing he feels that a little bit and just make decisions for yourself right now and let him realize what life is like without you. But leave one, the one thing you have to leave in your court, the one thing is you have to leave the door open just a little crack and just say, you know what, I'm going to take this ring off. I'm going to keep it in here for a few months i still love you i still love you in three months if you decide that like

if let's talk again and if we decide that we're gonna like you can have the ring like let's just do that let's give it three months you go do your thing i'm gonna do my thing and like whatever don't end the relationship right then and there let him go back and think about some shit and then let him like you know what i mean then have another closure conversation don't end the relationship right then and there. Let him go back and think about some shit and then let him like, you know what I mean? Then have another closure conversation. Don't close the door. Don't close. I don't know about that.

I don't know if I would put a timeline on it. I would. I would. I'm not going to have her sitting there for nine months. She doesn't sit. I don't think she should sit. No, she's sitting. But she's sitting.

I know. But I think if you set a timeline with him, the only person who's going to remember that timeline is you. And then you will sit around and you will pine. So I really think you need to act like because you are single. By the way, 90 days for me ain't shit. I'm still acting like I'm single. I'm young Miami in these streets for the next nine days.

Trust and believe. I'm just giving where's Waldo. Because if you let people just sit on Jeopardy without a time, it's like Jeopardy. If you let people sit without a time frame, they're just going to sit there and be like, fuck that. You have 90 days. But if he knows she's waiting. Huh? If he knows she's waiting. You can get a chemical pill and heal in 90 days.

Like, you know, like chill. Like, you know, like what's another? You're not going to chill and wait and let him know you're going to be doing other things. But fuck it. If you're chilling and waiting, don't tell him you're chilling and waiting fair fair call me on the side so nervous he comes home sunday and then we'll just go from there we'll do what you do not be home waiting yeah do not be home waiting go get a goddamn drink with a friend and be like i'll be

home in an hour i'm just like just go get a drink with a friend okay like like, I'll be home in an hour. I'm just like, just go get a drink with a friend. Okay. Like don't you be waiting on the couch? No, you want to, you don't want to wait for him to walk in. You want to be the one to walk in. Put your dick on the table after two glasses of shortening. Okay. Yes. Yes. All right.

Do you feel confident in like in y'all's first interaction? No. Maybe maybe maybe after like a couple glasses of wine yes with this yes now that i feel like i have a plan and like how to move forward i was like i don't know if i'm like should be like trying to save this trying to convince him otherwise or if i should just like be like okay you want to leave then go i didn't know i think saving it is kind of what feels like doing the opposite of what you would normally do and you don't have to save it it'll save itself it's if it's worth saving but

right now you guys need to kind of recalibrate the dynamic of your relationship and so you almost have you have to do less than what you would normally instinctually. And give him the space he's asking for. And if that's what he wants to do, then that's what he's going to do. Yeah. This is going to take some willpower on your part because it's going to be so out of your nature. Yeah. I've never lived alone. So that'll be different.

Oh, bitch. This is about to be your life. Michelle, you might not want to get back with him. You know what living alone is like? Waking up. No. Freeing. It's freeing. might not want to get back with him. You know what living alone is like? Waking up, brought off. Freeing. It's freeing. And your next date should be in their 30s and he should know

about it. See, that's also my next nerve. It's like starting over and I'm like, I was getting married and then I'm like starting over and entering the dating pool. Hold on, hold on. Michelle, yes, these streets are hard. Where do you live? Like what part of the country? You don't tell me where. I'm in Florida and Florida. Okay. First of all,

there's some hot men in Florida. Second off, you're 27 years old and you have never lived alone. No. You went from roommate to roommate to boyfriend. Oh yeah. I had roommates in college within a sorority and then roommate whenever I moved home and then he moved in with, she got a popper pussy. Yeah. Yeah. Michelle, She got to pop her pussy. Yeah. Michelle, you got to pop your pussy. Also, you're about to get a PhD in being independent.

And even if you guys get back together, because he's going to be at flight school for a year. Right. You're living alone. Okay. You need to. The joy of living alone. You will never have that joy after you have a child. It's so good. You don't even know.

You don't know what it's like to not answer to anyone, to just be. You need that. You deserve that. I also think it's important to prove to yourself that you can exist alone because then the bar is forever higher whether it's him whether it's somebody else you date you do not need someone to fill this empty spot because it's not empty like you are yeah you have a full home and it's like someone has to bring something to the table in order to be invited oh shit by the way how old are you uh 26 damn it okay she's a bad bitch but you get it bad bitch. But you get it. You get it. All my friends who have never lived alone

that are single right now are literally crawling out of their skin. I am 37. I've been single for a minute and the reason is because I love my space so much and my own mental space that if somebody is going to come in it,

that motherfucker's gotta to bring it. OK, I'm picky, but I'm I'm super when I say I'm good being single, I am good being single. And like you're going to get to that place where like you're you're just not going to settle for the unanswered questions. Or I don't want to bring that up because this person might get offended. Like if you don't want to you know who I am, this is why, Like, if you don't want to, you know who I am. This is who I am. Because you know who you are. You need to be safe. For the limbo.

You need to be. I don't want to be in a limbo. No, you need to be chill. You need to be by yourself. You need to just. Pop that buzzer. Pop the buzzer. You're about to thrive. And also expect it to be kind of weird and bad for a little bit.

Like, you know, I think there will be so much light at the end of this tunnel. Truly. Like, I think you'll get to know yourself in a new way. You'll have so much self-esteem at the end of this. But like, think you'll get to know yourself in a new way you'll have so much self-esteem at the end of this but like expect it to be kind of like uncomfy and lonely and bizarre and like the worse things are the more impressive it is that you're getting through that yeah i mean i've always said i'd be embarrassed to like call off our wedding but i don't want to get a divorce like a year after we get married like if you're telling me like you're forcing things with me and you're unhappy and like not going to communicate

those things with me. It's not that big of a deal. No, girl. You know what's more embarrassing? When people go to your wedding and they're like, ooh, we don't know how long this is going to last.

We don't know how this is going to last. No, that's... They look a little disconnected. Or like you hear a speech and you're like, there was some weird undertones. Did anyone get to hear that? No, no.

Like whenever like a dude gives a speech... I think they hate each other. Yeah, I think they might hate each other. I think they might hate each other. I had a girlfriend call off a wedding three months before it happened in South Louisiana and in a small town in Louisiana, 275 people at this wedding. It was going to be a big to do. And I remember the embarrassment she felt. Six months later, she met her, the man that she's married to,

but they had a baby before and then ended up married. They're happily married. She's living her best fucking life and sometimes ultimately ending something is like the invitation for something new to come into your life and the times that I have walked out of jobs

or walked away from opportunities, bigger ones have come to me. So I think that might happen to you in your personal life, personally. That's what a lot of people have been saying too, that like, if this is like what's gonna happen and be taken so fast and like blindsided, it only has to mean like something that much better. If this isn't like meant to work out, it's gonna happen and be taken so fast and like blindsided it only has to mean like something that much better if this isn't if this isn't like meant to work out it's gonna happen

and come when that may be i don't know when i would be ready to date i don't know you're not even you're not even calling off a wedding you're like you've been engaged for a couple months your wedding's not till like 2025 it's more like an oops it's like yeah just kidding like we yeah you know people ask people ask like we just we like we just, we're on a pause. You know what I mean? We're taking a pause. We're figuring things out. Yeah, we're figuring things out.

Yeah. And don't put it on him. Just be like, you know, we don't really, I don't know what I want right now. Like, it's your decision. You also got to protect, in case you guys get back together, you don't want everyone to hate him. To hate him so you gotta kind of sort of take a little bit of the brunt because you don't want people to remember that he threw you for this loop in december of 2023 because girlfriends have a hard time of forgiving shit i'm that bitch

with everything that's happened with my friends so that might be a little bit of a struggle. But I mean, ultimately, they want me to be happy. But yeah, yeah, they'll be fine. They'll be fine. We gave you a lot of information. I want you to leave with this final thought. The next time you talk to him, I want him to leave that conversation with you, with you basically saying, one, you agree with his decision, even if you don't feel like you are,

because you realize that maybe you guys got a little carried away and moved too fast. So you appreciate him having the recognition for that and show like express that appreciation, let them know that he was right. And that you also realize that maybe because you also haven't lived with someone you've never lived by yourself and that maybe you also need to figure yourself out as well. That'll also scare him a little bit because it's like, well, what do you mean? Like, what do you mean you have to do something differently? Like he's expecting this woman who's like everything's planned out and your uncertainty about your life will be scary for him. But you showing appreciation for him coming up with the idea will make him feel like you know a man all while

scaring the shit out of him so it's like thank you babe for doing this but also i agree i have some things to do as well i love you i really hope we can make this work but maybe right now we need to do our own thing that's the message you should call us in six months i want to know what happens yeah i will i will fill you guys in call us in six months. I want to know what happens. Yeah, I will. I will fill you guys in. Call us in six months when you're dating a 34 year old lawyer for both of us. No, we want an update in two weeks after he comes home. And I want to know what that conversation was.

Are you crazy? I'm coming to Kissimmee St. Cloud. I'm going to go on. I'm coming to your house on Sunday. What are you talking about? We will go to Miami after he leaves. Yes.

There you go. All right. Well, good luck. Love that busy girl. Love that busy. Thank you. All right. Bye, Michelle.

Keep us updated. Bye. I will. All right. Bye-bye. Bye. Damn, where were you guys when I was in my 30s and 20s? Waiting on you.

Damn. I'm going to call in because I got some relationship issues myself. Want to talk about it? No, I have no relationship. no relationship and i love it so you didn't like cook up with the chef at the dinner party no no i shut this bitch down this happened like last like my furnace is off from november to january 1st i'm like yeah i'm like a cold tank don't even touch me dry dry and i love it i really do love it people should try it it's my greatest advice if you're single shut that shit down okay dating is exhausting if you have seasons in which you date i gear up for dating in january i begin dating after valentine's day because i don't want that pressure of trying

to like figure shit out. I date all through end of quarter one into quarter two. Once quarter three hits, if I don't have suitables coming into quarter four, they're cut.

They're cut. Everybody's like, okay, if you're a booty call, you're going to stay in booty call central. If you're this, you're going to stay in that central.

But the summertime, I'm flying out. If somebody says, let's go here, I'm in. I don't want to talk to anybody. I'm popping it. I'm popping it all over Europe. I'm fucking popping it. Leg spread.

All of it. Q4, I'm re-energizing. I'm getting my life back together. I'm drying out. I'm just not stopping it. I'm stopping. I'm not emotionally putting in any because the holidays become a can I find a boyfriend before Thanksgiving? Can I find a boyfriend before Christmas?

I can't believe I'm not having a boyfriend before New Year's Eve. And it's like, no, I don't have one because I don't want one right now. I'm popping it. Some other people who will not go into the holidays coupled up. Bachelor Nation, specifically the Paradise. Everyone broke up. Everyone broke up. Everyone broke up. Everyone.

Yeah. One after another. How much did they hate each other for them to, like, not even spread out the announcements? They were like, first one dropped the bomb

and everyone's like, you know what, fuck it. Let's just get it out there. How many people did it? Three. So there were two engagements and then a couple that left together,

which was Kylie and Avon aven she announced on her instagram that she found out that aven's been cheating on her no not even the black screen yes oh yes can i tell you a secret about breaking up in december sure in media if you're a big celebrity what you normally do is you break up right before a holiday so like you'll see celebrities drop it before memorial day you'll see celebrities drop it at thanksgiving or christmas because the media cycle is very short during these times there are a lot a lot of reporters are working papers are running reruns like there's not a lot of shit going on so a lot of celebrities will break up around december i also think that abc was probably like you know what why don't you break up now because we have this big wedding coming up

for jerry and no one's gonna true about abc they don't they really don't give a shit about those relationships they don't like have a say. In the Bachelor Nation. Yeah. I mean, like if those people call the producers to like ask for advice, they might offer it, but they don't, they're not a part of any like breakup announcements, especially with the Paradise stuff. Like they're pretty hands off. Yeah.

So. Also, like if there's a cluster, there's normally one that's getting a little bit nastier than the other ones. Like, for instance, Hugh Jackman and his wife announced that they were separated. They had been separated for a while. Keep in mind. But the minute Joe Jonas and Sophie Turner started getting kind of nasty and ugly in the press, they were like, OK, just put it out. And then it was like, oh, Hugh Jackman and his wife are getting divorced and they're happily married.

They were happily married for 50 years and it's fine. And it's gone. It's totally cool. And it was totally gone because Sophie and Joe were having a contentious one out in public. Yeah.

So they saw Kylie and Avon getting a little messy and they were like, let's just put it out there. We're just going to throw it right out there. So you just look for it. Like,

like as soon as Kanye West starts tweeting again, people are going to like throw some other things down because people are going to pay attention to what he's saying as opposed to what they're saying. It's really interesting. That is interesting. I learned that working in media. I feel like you know a lot up there in that brain.

Oh, there's a lot. There's a lot. Yeah. There's a lot. I love Hollywood. What was a like feud or scandal or something from way back, like a deep cut that you were personally so invested in that like even if other people like might have forgotten about it, you were like, this was a crazy story. Oh, I mean, I remember being a kid and being obsessed with the Diana of it all. Like I remember. Who was she in a feud with?

Her husband, that royal family, England. Oh, Princess Diana. Yeah. Oh, I thought you meant Diana Ross. No, no. I was like, I don't know. I remember that shit.

Yeah. I remember, like, I also remember, you know, back in the day when the Starlets would fight, like, Paris and Lindsay would be on one day and then off the next day and then, you know this one heidi it's heidi and lauren like the us weekly

the ledoux days were the best days in hollywood do you still do you think kim still owes taylor an apology no why not for recording her without her consent and then, you know, putting it out to the world and causing her to like, you know, have mental health issues. Oh, oh, oh,

oh, yes. Oh, oh, oh, that part. That part. Yeah.

I think that, that things have happened on both sides that I feel like I just need, if everybody's going to tell the story, let's both get it out right now. Let me hear both sides of the story. You know what I mean? Because I often feel there's two sides to every story. I mean, unless you're suggesting that,

what would Kim's side of the story be? I know, I just want to know. Like, I just like, for myself, like, you know, people are like, whose side are you on? I'm like, well, let me just sit and digest both sides of the information. It's like asking a jury for a verdict without hearing the full testimony.

You know what I mean? I also want to know, like, who was there? Like, you know what I mean? Well, Kim, she tried to, she was like, oh, it's squash. It's over. That was her side of the story by saying it wasn't a big deal. No. You know, I truly think that, you know, I didn't know that part of it for Taylor.

And I think it's, you know, a lot of times big celebrities hide and don't say their full piece, even if like, you know, we get a lot of it in her music. I would have thought maybe we would have gotten this in one of her songs because we often get a lot of her emotions out in her song. And I listen to Reputation. often get a lot of her emotions out in her song. And I listened to Reputation. Like, I didn't hear anything about going away for a year in a foreign country because if I would have, I would have been tweeting it along with the rest of the world. So it just hit me out of left field

because we normally get the ingredients to her oatmeal in her albums. That's true. That's true. Okay. Anything else we want to cover with Jess before we go? Julie and Kevin Costner. Are they dating? dating yeah i kind of love that for them i love it that's such a crush on daddy he's so daddy daddy and you know what if i was his ex ex-wife i would want my ex-husband to date a jewel why because you never want to imagine your husband doing nastier things with someone

else like for me like jeff bezos's wife is probably having a hard time knowing that lauren lauren sanchez is doing some nasty shit with jeff like i just don't want to know you're having a nastier time without me you don't think jewel will get nasty i think jewel's safe i think jewel's safe i think maybe jewel has some kinks that we just don't know i'm just saying i just think that his ex-wife probably had some fun with him you know she had a good old time she was younger she's you know she was younger she was i just need my husband to be with somebody who i can not picture nastier things with that's a good good point. You know what I mean? If I know you're having vanilla shit, I'm

good. I'm good. Bring that bitch over. Let's have a dinner. You know what I mean? Unless it's Irina Shay. Get her away from me. I don't want to know. Do not do it. You know what I mean? I don't want to have to picture that, like my bed on fire.

You know what I mean? Yes. A brunette with blue eyes is unstoppable. A brunette with blue eyes is unstoppable. Also, someone like Eastern European, like, you know, I just I can't I can't do it. And that's my Scorpio in me. I just like can't imagine like any time I've been left for hotter hotter younger men throwing me for a loop even though i know they were broke and like you know it was gonna implode i just the nastier things kill me i wonder how your exes feel not good they're hurting they're hurting yeah i wish them the best no no i wish them the best i often check on them at least once a year i'm fucked up like that i will call them and be like hey how's your arthritis you old fuck like you know like i'm like oh i heard you broke up sorry to hear that thriving here loving life like i i am that bitch who like if you're gonna date me just

know i'm going to circle back circle back because i know I know my life is intimidating. For instance, dating someone like finding someone to date in L.A. after you've been on TV and after people have like this idea of who you are. It's kind of tough. Like, it's really tough. And I think gay men have a harder time doing it. gay men have a harder time doing it. So I think when you have something in your hands, like it's like I look at Hoda Kotb and I'm like, how are you single? Like you are the greatest human being that ever lived. But people are afraid to fumble light. People are afraid to. I just met up with Maria Shriver the other day and I'm like, how are you not married to like, like the like hottest, greatest man ever? You're beautiful. But people are just afraid to fumble the light because they don't want to be the guy who fumbled the dude. I'd rather be with this toxic ass dude who doesn't have a job, who treats me like shit, because if I break up with him, people are going to think it's his fault. Right.

You know what I mean? That's so funny. So I think I just need to be a little more toxic. A touch. Just a touch. A hair. Just a little crazier. Let my Gemini come out. Yes. Be yourself. I want to be myself. Let your inner demons out to play.

No, I wish I was crazier. Because I look at the crazy dudes. I see them. They always have someone. You didn't go through like a crazy phase and then just grew out of it? No, no. I'm self. I'm like a self destructor.

Like I won't take. I won't. I would rather support you and make sure I'm a people pleaser. Like I'm not going to take you down in my own thing. I will take myself down to the nub before I go after you. I'm a self-harmer mentally. That's hurtful. It's hurtful.

But by the way, when you know, you know. No, totally. And that's great that you can recognize that about yourself. Honorable. Nub, the nub. I will also like, I'm like a cat cat you know how like cats won't die in front of people oh like you know how like dogs will like dogs want you to be with them oh cats will like go run off and hide in the woods yes if i'm not in a good space i will go and hide in the

woods get myself together and come back i'm that person you know what i mean like self-isolating self-isolating whereas most people if if your partner is treating you in an unfair way or being a little abusive or like a little manipulative, it's their own shit coming to haunt them. And I'm like, okay, this is not about me. I'm going to go here. Or if it's me doing it to them, I'm like, you know what? This is not about you. I'm going to go hide for two days in Palm Springs. And I'm like, I'm back. I definitely had like the crazy, a crazy phase was definitely had a toxic, crazy relationship. And now that I'm in like a healthy one, I'm like, do you just want to fight?

Like, let's just like pick a little fight about something. And let's just go crazy. She does that sometimes. Yeah. It's just like, let's just see what happens if I, like an ex-boyfriend of mine would sit and play Xbox for hours. And I just started like turning the fucking power, like go into the switch, turning power off in the entire apartment.

Gemini. I was done. Virgo. Virgo. Oh, I know. Yes. No, because there's a Gemini man. That's a Gemini man.

He was. Virgo. Sicko. Fucking sicko. You're a fucking Virgo. I know it. You're a fucking Virgo. Yes. No, because there's a Gemini man. That's a Gemini man. He was. Virgo. Sicko. Fucking sicko. You're a fucking Virgo. I know it. You're a fucking Virgo. Yes, I am.

Are you OK? You marrying a Virgo? I'm straight. You're marrying a Virgo? Yeah. No, but I'm not that bitch. I'm not that bitch. I'm also the girl who's like, and this is like, this is also my downfall.

I dated a guy who was significantly older than me he was 18 years older than me oh my god that's our age gap yeah and i enjoyed him we had a really good time nick's old right i'm young in the first month that we were dating he would not stop talking badly about his ex like he was still incensed by it, but it had been six months since they broke up. But for some odd reason, in my mind, I was like, oh, this is not over. You're not, you're not finished with this. Keep this man at arm's length, but enjoy yourself. So the Scorpio in me is, I'm fully going to marry this man in the outside, but in my head, I'm like, this is not safe. he hits me up like almost

three months to the date and is like i am so confused i don't know what to do this guy is like hitting me back up and like you know i was like well you know i don't know what to say like you and him have been together for 400 years on and off, but it seems like every time you get in a relationship, he comes back and wants to be with you. And then it's a whole cycle. So you know what? Why don't you,

you saw, you saw the shade, right? You saw the shade. Why don't you just say, why don't you just give this like another, why don't you go back in there for like two more weeks or a month and like, do your thing.

Like, I'm like, we've only been together for three months. Like it's meant to be you'll come back thank you so much you're so understanding my friend who's sitting next to me as i'm having this conversation on the phone is like wow you are so mature the scorpio in me knows that this is not gonna work out and then you're gonna come back running to me. Sprinting. And I'm going to fuck with you. I'm going to just fuck with you a little bit.

I'm like, let's take six weeks. Let's take some six weeks. And like, let's like, you know, take some space. You go do your thing. I'm going to do my thing. Book some flights. Went on some trips. Two weeks into it.

He's like, I don't know if this is going to work between he and I. to it he's like i don't know if this is gonna work between he and i i saw this photo of you with this guy on your instagram story who is that i'm like what are you talking about i knew exactly what he was talking about gaslit oh i guess i guess it's a fucker uh-huh and not even gaslit him i took a photo with somebody who i know you lit his fucking house on fire i lit his house on fire because he had he had poured the kerosene and you did it yourself yourself so he's like I don't know I'm like well you know it's only been three weeks we said we were gonna separate for six so like I have three weeks left why don't we meet up at the time that we said we were gonna meet up and talk this through but I have some things to get off you know he said well what are you gonna do

I was like oh I plan to go to Europe for pop my pussy I'm gonna pop my pussy in europe for three weeks like you know i'm just gonna go like and by the way not with any guys like i'm just like going yeah yeah he's like uh i mean i don't know i'm like you initiated this now you have to sit in this thing because your thing didn't work out doesn't give them what they want i have to yeah i'm gonna give you exactly what you wanted i knew it was gonna kill kill him. Yeah. Guess what? He's dead. No, no, no, no.

He came back. He came back in full force. We got back together. It did, in fact, kill him. No, no, no. He was 18 years old. No, no. You know what? It should have took him out.

But like we got back together after that six weeks. And I literally was like, you and I are not going to last because you are not, you're, you're hung up on this guy and you're never not going to, he created this chaotic environment for you. So you only think that you can get love and chaos. And I'm just, I'm not chaotic. I'm not it. No.

Wow. You're peaceful. I'm a peaceful bitch. I really, really am. In a relationship, I am so peaceful. We love that. I'm a peaceful bitch. I really, really am. In a relationship, I am so peaceful. We love that. And I'm really chill. I just think I need to be a little more toxic. Showing. Outward showing. Because you've seen my toxicity.

I've just told you the story about how I fucked with a 50-year-old man. Almost to his death. Almost to his death. Could have killed him. But I think I need like 30s or 40s now. I tried to date 20s. It's not my thing. Early 40s is hot.

Early 40s, you got your life. You might live in New York is probably my sweet spot. And you're probably European. So you appreciate Black men. And I'm into it. Europeans love me. Okay. When I i'm in europe i feel like kim and chloe put together stop oh they really make you feel good there like they are like oh my god you're so beautiful i'm like oh my god is this spain all the time oh they're like it's like it is like they have never seen us before.

Because a lot of times, like, you know, dating in West Hollywood can be a little weird. You know, people want to date their twins. Like, that's why you see a lot of gay men who the boyfriends look alike. And you'll start to notice it. Yeah, now I will. You'll start to notice it. It's really weird. They just look alike.

It's like a weird, weird thing. So, I mean, I think every couple morphs a little bit into each other. Not like gay men. They're good. They're good. Oh, it's like face off with John Travolta and Nicolas Cage. You're like, whoa, like you guys really look alike. You act alike.

You dress alike. Like, I don't want anyone who has gone through the same shit as me. I don't want anyone who's like does my same job. Like, I feel like when I'm learning and why I'm so enamored with European guys is I feel like I'm learning so much. You know, I want us to have compatible baggage. Like, I don't want us to have the same luggage like the same shit in our luggage because if i'm working through mommy issues i can't have you working through mommy because then your shit's gonna get in my shit like i need you to be dealing with some other shit besides raise this that you know what i mean like

i just need it yeah no i get, I get it. Is that wrong? No. No? Damn, I'm really going to therapy here. Damn. I can cancel Dr. Ruth. Sorry, Dr. Ruth. Dr. Ruth.

Love you. Oh, unfortunately. Oh, man. Do we have to go? I think we got to go. This was fun. Did you have fun? I just...

Did I deliver on my promise? You really did. This was really, really fun. You're welcome back. This was great. Please come back. Oh, I will come back. It're welcome back. This was great. Please come back. Oh, I will come back. That'd be great.

You know I'm going to come back. I'm going to come. I'm not even going to say it on air because people are going to hold me to it. And I'm going to tell you off air. Okay, fine. Justin, please let my audience know where they can find you. You guys, I'm on E! News every Monday through Thursday at 11 p.m. And Justin A. Sylvester

on Instagram. What does A stand for? My middle name's Alan. The guy who owns Justin Sylvester wants to sell his to me for five grand and I'm just not doing it. Fuck that. You've been doing fine just without it. I'm fine. I'm at 242. Stuck at 242. Justin Allen. God damn it. Let's get him to 243.

Let's get him to 243, guys. Go follow Justin. Justin, can't thank you enough for coming. You're welcome. So 243. Let's get him to 243, guys. Go follow Justin. Justin, can't thank you enough for coming. You're welcome. So much fun. Thank you all for listening. Hope you enjoyed this episode. We have so many more available for you to listen to,

especially if you're tuning in for the first time to listen to Justin. We had Charlie Burnett earlier this week to talk about all things Vanderpump, a lot of Taylor Swift, a lot of, not a lot, but a little Matt Reef from, I don't know, it doesn't matter.

On every Monday, we got our Ask Nick episodes where people call in just like our texting office hours, share their relationship stories, drama. We offer some advice. People find it helpful. It's therapeutic and fun to listen to their stories. Check it out. Subscribe. Tell your friends.

We appreciate you all. We're back next week. Can't wait to see you. See you on Monday. Bye. you