The Viall Files - E700 Going Deeper with Tom Schwartz and Tom Sandoval & Reality Recap: Bachelor, Traitors, and Superbowl LVIII

Episode Date: January 30, 2024

Welcome back to The Viall Files: Reality Recap Edition! First, the household gets together to talk about the second episode of the Bachelor, including the first dates of Joey’s season! We also talk about Taylor supporting Travis at his latest game, if she can make it to the Superbowl with her Tokyo Eras Tour shows, and recap Episode 5 of Traitors. Then, we are joined by Tom Schwartz and later Tom Sandoval to talk about their friendship, the affair with Rachel, dating in LA, and what we can expect to see in Season 11 of Vanderpump Rules. Finally, we hear from a Texting Office Hours caller who went on a couple dates before the holidays, but needs help asking him out for a third in the new year.  “Are you saying that I’m loyal to a fault?” Start your 7 Day Free Trial of Viall Files + here: https://viallfiles.supportingcast.fm/  Please make sure to subscribe so you don’t miss an episode and as always send in your relationship questions to [e-mail] to be a part of our Monday episodes. To Order Nick’s Book Go To: http://www.viallfiles.com  If you would like to get some texting advice send an email to [e-mail] with “Texting Office Hours” in the subject line! To advertise on the show, contact [e-mail] or visit https://www.advertisecast.com/TheViallFiles  THANK YOU TO OUR SPONSORS: Care/Of - For 50% off your first month’s subscription with Care/of, go to https://www.TakeCareOf.com and enter code viall50. Peloton - Get started with Peloton’s limited time offers, head to https://www.onepeloton.com/deals Terms apply. Nutrafol - Take the first step to visibly thicker, healthier hair. For a limited time, Nutrafol is offering our listeners ten dollars off your first month’s subscription and free shipping when you go to https://www.Nutrafol.com and enter the promo code THEVIALLFILES. Apostrophe Skincare - To get started, just go to https://www.Apostrophe.com/VIALL and click Get Started, then use our code VIALL at sign up and you’ll get your first visit for only five dollars! Thank you Apostrophe for sponsoring this episode. Episode Socials: @viallfiles @nickviall @tomsandoval1 @tschwa @nnataliejjoy @alison.vandam @dereklanerussell @leahgsilberstein

what's going on everybody welcome back to our seventh hundred episode of the Vile Files reality. Well, is it reality? It's a reality recap slash going deeper edition. We got a little bit of everything for you on episode 700 of the Vile Files. Let's just take a moment to let that all sink in. 700 episodes. 700. That's crazy.

It is crazy. As always, I am your host, Nick, host of Vile Files. If Halls. Maybe you're tuning in for the first time ever. I don't know. It's five plus years, 700 episodes later. As always, we want to thank you all for listening, tuning in, supporting our show. Maybe it's the first time ever. Maybe it's only the second episode. Maybe you've listened to all 700. Doesn't matter. We appreciate all of you for listening, tuning in, supporting, critiquing, loving, hating. It doesn't matter we appreciate all of you for listening tuning in supporting critiquing loving hating it doesn't matter if you've ever listened to it we've thanked you we thank you or thanked you or both currently previously currently we have quite the episode for you for episode number 700 the long anticipated episode with tom sandoval and tom swartz i didn't really expect to have them as a duo well you know i had conversations with tom swartz maybe get him in here during scandoval certainly had conversations with tom sandoval never really happened back in the whole scandoval day but then i got a phone call one late December night from Tom Sandoval.

And he called me in a panic. He said, Nick, I need a favor. I need you to come on as a guest to my podcast called Everyone Loves Tom, I believe is the title. We had prior conversations of maybe doing a podcast swap in the past. We were unable to come into an agreement on the content of what would be discussed on my episode if Tom Sandoval would have come on. And so we had tabled that for our time being. But then when Tom called, I said, sure. And at first, I was like, you got to do mine first because I've always, I've been asking you to come on. You just started this. And quite honestly, Tom, I don't know if I trust you to do yours first and deliver on mine. But Tom said, I will do your podcast. Just come over and do mine tomorrow.

I said, sure. I'm going to hold you to it. And so I went over, turned, found out that Tom Swartz was co-hosting or I helping his friend Tom host his podcast. And I had a lovely chat with them. And it was interesting. We refer to it a little bit this episode. So I invited them both on at the time to just come, which we got scheduled. And then it finally happened. It was a little chaotic.

I don't want to give too much away. It was a little chaotic. I don't want to give too much away. But I will say here, the goal of the episode, as I articulated to more specifically Tom Sandoval, so much had happened between now and Sandoval. And I wasn't trying to necessarily re-litigate what happened with Sandoval. But Tom, well, both Toms had talked about how much Skandoval affected them. They claim to have recognized their mistakes and that they have learned. And specifically with Skandoval, I was like, all right, well, why don't you come on and talk about like what you have learned?

What work have you put in? I think a lot of people have anticipating season 11, which, by the way, premieres tonight. We're very excited about Vanderpump season 11 kicking off tonight so let's come in and why don't you come in and i'll ask you some questions about like what you've learned kind of figure out you know is tom sandoval willing to turn a page of his life and use this very unfortunate uh situation as a a platform for change in his life. So that was the goal. And what you're about to hear is the result of that goal. And then you guys can

decide for yourselves what you think about it all. We'll give our thoughts Thursday. For everybody listening on audio, I think it'd be interesting to also after listening to it, do a double check and go to the YouTube version of it. And I think you'll get different perspectives, maybe perceptions of the interview, and you

can kind of decide what you think from there. What did you guys think when you were here? Interesting. Yeah. Yeah. We'll give our thoughts on Thursday. We'll let the people get. Yeah.

We'll let the people form their opinion. Yeah. And then I definitely cracked open like a hard seltzer at the end. And I was like, Justin, don't tell anyone. But I'm'm like i'm too anxious right now drink it on the job yeah we kept it loose um yeah it was uh it was a it was a vile files first i guess just kind of all over the map but anyways uh i'm sure you guys will be discussing it a lot or not maybe you won't maybe you won't be discussing it at all. I don't know, but I did post our nursery reveal and, you know, got a lot of feedback.

Feedback. I did. As you might expect. Most of which I, you know, of course, did not ask anyone for. And a lot of it had to do with the fear of the frames, the pictures, her gallery wall absolutely crashing and crushing her in her crib. And also she'll be standing up soon and she'll pull him down and just a lot of worry. And I just would like everyone to just relax and know that our baby will be so safe. Also, a lot of people commented that it seemed haunted and like maybe a little creepy, like Alfred Hitchcock vibes.

When you say a lot of people, then. Well, I don't know how many I didn't count, but I will say like I kind of see where you're coming from, because at one point when I was recording the rocking chair, I was like, this just needs like some movement. So I did rock the chair and then I was like, like oh it's just rocking on its own so like that is kind of fucking creepy i would love to take that video can i swap out the audio and just see if i can make it seem like horror music behind it no that wouldn't be hard if you do it will feel very creepy yeah it because also like i see where people are coming from and I get it but also

fuck off you know yeah I mean you put a lot of work into that like honestly by time that she's actually probably

sleeping in that room she will want Peppa Pig decorations everywhere and I'll have to redecorate anyways there is that you know yeah

but you worked really hard on it and I think it looks great it's more for me than it is for her it's a pretty nursery it is

it's calming isn't the point to start off minimalistic because you know that people are going to give you like stuffed animals I did. It's more for me than it is for her. It's a pretty nursery. It is. It's calming. Isn't the point to start off minimalistic because you know that people are going to give you like stuffed animals and blankets and clothing like that's why you start like minimal. Yeah. The next time just don't push an empty rocking chair and have it. I know. I know.

I yeah. And I can see how that can be creepy now. But it and honestly, even when I filmed it, I was like, I don't know, but it's all I had. So I think it looks great uh it is monday morning we're recording this and i do just want to send out my condolences to the good people of michigan specifically taylor lautner um who i know has a heavy heart this morning after the loss of his det Lions. That was a devastating loss for the Detroit Lions. And as a Packer fan who had experienced a very similar loss the week before, I'm really heartbroken for Taylor.

We had been texting back and forth the past two weeks about our teams, and in back-to-back weeks had to experience some heartbreaking losses. I'm really sad for Mr. Taylor. There is another Taylor out there who is Very happy when it comes to football Really kind of almost unfair It's really unfair just how Fortunate and privileged and lucky Taylor Swift Is you know for those of you don't know

A lot of football history I'm just saying like The Detroit Lions have never made a Super Bowl They're the only team in the NFL Like boo fucking hoo I'm sorry that the Chiefs have like fucking won the AFC In a goddamn year but like choose a better team then

and her first year of being a fan she's going to the Super Bowl and she got asked to perform the Super Bowl at the beginning of this year turned it down she's like no no

I'm just gonna go with my boyfriend who's gonna be playing hot what a moment but yeah well Taylor just continues to be just

if she can get there what do you mean have you seen all that math taylor yes she's gonna be there she's i know she has she's got to perform in tokyo the night before yeah no no problem whatsoever she's gonna she's gonna land in vegas she ran her entire album on the treadmill while singing out loud she's unstoppable you don't think she can get to las vegas in time For the people who are confused about what we're talking about, she is performing in Japan. I'm assuming Tokyo, somewhere in Japan. It's four shows. But the last one, so she performs Saturday night in Tokyo. The Super Bowl is the next day on a Sunday, except that Japan, for those of you who don't know,

is 16 hours ahead of Las Vegas time local. The flight from Tokyo to Las Vegas is only 12 hours. So when Taylor flies from Tokyo to Vegas, it will be four hours earlier Vegas time than it was Tokyo time when she took off. That makes sense. I mean, she could technically leave Tokyo at midnight after her show, which we've seen her do before because we've seen her board her flight with her vigilante shit garter still on underneath her clothes and land in Vegas at 8 a.m. Do you think she has a shower on her plane? For sure. She's got a. Probably.

Is it like what kind of plane? What size plane does she have? Well, she so like 13 has been her original. I thought she had a second for a while, but maybe she sold that. Anyway, she's going to be just fine. She's going to make it in time. What time does the Super Bowl start? 5, like, 3.30 Pacific,

5.30ish Central. Oh, my God. She'll land at 8 a.m. She'll get a nap in. It starts at, like, 3.30. Start glam, and then, like... She'll have plenty of time.

She'll be great. Oh, my God. She'll be there. Okay, so we don't really know because the queen-size bedroom and the shower are options available on the Dassault Falcon 900, although they're rarely purchased due to the weight of the added water tank. Maybe she gets it installed just for this trip. Well, that would be kind of, I think, a challenge.

Well, you never know. What if she just does like a quick just sponge bath on the plane? She has plenty of time. Like we've already found the internet has already figured it out. She's going to make it, but she might be tired. I think that's what it is. She will be tired. But what a moment for the two of them.

I mean, on the field kissing. Taylor was truly in her element. Did you see that clip of her watching the monitors at the game and telling cbs to go away and then they cut back to coach andy reed she was like watching herself and she let go i don't even please go away please go away and then the camera panned off of her there was another clip of her being filmed uh uh kissing travis and then someone was letting taylor know hey they're recording you and she was like i don't give a fuck well because you can see of her being filmed kissing Travis and then someone was letting Taylor know, hey, they're recording you.

And she was like, I don't give a fuck. Well, because you can see Travis trying to like kiss her on the forehead and she's the one that's like, no, we're doing a full kiss. Yeah. Do you think he's going to go to the Grammys? No.

This Sunday? Maybe. He's off. Where are the Grammys? Crypto. Is that the crypto? Yeah. Have you seen Travis's stats? I saw something this

morning. His last several playoff games, the boy pops off in the playoffs. Anyone who's ever criticized Travis for maybe not performing on the football field since Taylor Swift has been in the picture was dead wrong because he dominated in the playoffs.

So are people still complaining about the whole Taylor and Travis relationship? Did you not see all of the frickin Ravens like slander? They were making all these videos of like this guy first off filmed this whole thing. He was wearing a Ravens jersey. He was outside of a target and he bought in quotes the 1989 vinyl. And he was like, Taylor Swift, like, get off my TV. Like, let's get back to football. And like the Ravens are going to stop you. I'm so sick and tired of seeing you on the TV. So I just bought your album and this is how I feel about it. So he takes the vinyl out and he smacks it on the ground outside Target. But if you know the 1989 vinyl that's at Target, it's peach colored. And what he pulled out was like a standard black vinyl. So I don't

know what he actually bought. So like good fucking try. What about Patrick Mahomes' dad saying he doesn't want to be in a suite with Travis's brother and Taylor Swift. Why did he say that? The only thing that was upsetting during this game is the access that Jackson is getting to Taylor Swift. I mean, he is doing handshakes and hip bumps and it's really- Does she know? Should we tell her? I don't think there's anything she can do about it.

What is she supposed to do? And why is Patrick Mahoney? I also love her relationship with Pacheco. Oh, yeah. Every time he scores, she's 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10. What is what is Patrick Mahoney's dad's problem? I think after Jason took a shirt off and like jumped out of the thing, he was in the suite and he was like, I do not want to be in the same suite as them. He said that publicly. OK, so he was just like too much. And I couldn't focus on the game. Maybe was in the suite and he was like, I do not want to be in the same suite as them. He like said that publicly.

Okay. He was like, it was just like too much and I couldn't focus on the game maybe. I don't know. But he was upset. Things no one cares about

that you could just keep to yourself and then not, you know. File under. Like text don't, just don't go, I guess.

I don't know. We watched Traitors. We did. Boy, Peter Weber really surprised a lot of people. Maybe even Bachelor Nation in this episode. Spoiler alert.

Yeah, spoiler alert for anyone not watching Traitors yet. You should, by the way. Really, really excellent television. Peter basically has everyone figured out already, or mostly. Then set a trap. Which we're pretty sure they fall for the trap. Okay, master trap. Yeah. Okay, mastermind.

Yeah. I think a lot of people, like we said, underestimate Bachelor Nation contestants and thinking that they're just good for their pretty faces and their lack of enforcing boundaries. They had an interesting challenge with the bird calls. I think they stepped so far. They're like, let's not do a typical challenge that you would see on any other show. You know, let's just make up our own challenge. And they did a mimic the bird call and find the bird that can do the same call. Yeah, the challenges really aren't that big of a deal because it doesn't matter what they do.

It's just about a matter of seeing what the players decide to do within the challenges. Are they going to go for the money? Are they going to protect themselves? Are they going to go for shields or the cash? And interestingly enough, this time they chose to not reveal who found the shields. Yeah, which allowed Mr. Peter Weber, former bachelor. Which was Peter's idea. That was his idea.

Peter and Janelle. Yeah. And so they could basically sniff out a traitor, which we don't know yet because it ends on a cliffhanger. But it seems like Peter's plan kind of was executed to perfection.

Plus he suspected that Dan and... Parvati. Parvati were traitors. And then Dan was like, literally said that he doesn't think Peter's smart enough to come up with this plan because Parvati sniffed it out. She's like, I don't know, this sounds like a lie. Dan's like, no, Peter's too stupid. Kevin is an actor and he thinks everyone is against John because he's a politician. Yeah. And then Kevin, because he's an actor.

Kevin loves a good label. Like if you were an actor, then that's who you are. Whatever Kevin thinks, he should always do the opposite. That's how you would survive traitors. But once again, they were wrong. They were so close to sniffing out the traitor. They had Dan and Janelle and they were so close and they voted Janelle off. It seems so obvious to us when we're watching it. I know. I don't know. Especially because the new, the girl Kate from Below Deck. Kate Chastain. Yes, they brought her in.

Yeah. Has like a new one, a new character in the castle. And she came in right as the round table begins where everyone votes off. Came in as a faithful. Yeah, she came in as a faithful. And she had an interesting note where poverty was like does anyone want some wine i'm gonna like pour some wine she was like no and then poverty walked away and she was like you don't take wine from anyone like what the hell is she like are you

kidding and it was so interesting because the last episode poverty poisoned eck and sue with the glass of wine yeah poverty trying to act like a faithful tamra is gone she got killed r.i.p r.i.p for tamra but i think that's a smart one i mean tamra seems the most capable housewife but i think it also made the most sense to get fate the heat off of phaedra because to break up the housewives yeah but i also think of the housewives that they could have killed tamra seems to be the sharpest you know and they're always trying to take out qualified people.

I'm excited to see when they finally vote out a traitor and get it right. I don't know when that will be. I feel like Dan's got it. I mean, I was going to say, do we think it's Dan? The big question is, will Dan be able to pivot? Will he be able to take some? Because depending on how it goes, Peter told Parvati and Dan the truth. So it'll be interesting to see no lie the lie yeah

i'm sorry he told dan and parvati that he found the shield yeah and really it's bergie yeah and trichelle who found the dan wants to vote off the episode ends with him wanting to vote off bergie so but but the question will be when they do try to vote off Bergie, how will they be able to figure out, was it Parvati or Dan? Yeah. So that will be the question. And will Dan be able to basically get them to vote off Parvati and not himself? That'll be the question.

Mm-hmm. But- We'll see. Interesting stuff. Who are your favorites? Probablyaedra honestly uh i like ct uh anyways another great episode of traders you guys uh need to check it out reminder it's on peacock every thursday at 9 p.m eastern so check it out with us catch up because we'll be talking about it. Anyways, real good stuff. All right, Bachelor.

I mean, you know, it's episode two. They're really working, Joey. And it's working. Jesus Christ. Oh my God. The amount of like heavy stories. They're really leaning into... How many like confessionals did Joey have to listen to this episode?

I don't know. But I think the most confusing was Jess's. Yeah. What was she even saying there? All I got was her ex cheated on her and she like has trouble opening up and so the women telling her to just chill

is like hard for her. It made sense to me. Like she said it without giving specificities to her experience. She's like, I lost myself in the fact that I was with this toxic person. And then I was single for a little bit, found myself, now I'm here. And I'm afraid to like open up and the women are getting mad at me.

I did find it so funny though. When Joey was like, she's like, so it's just like, it's been a struggle because in the past I've had infidelities. And she was being super vague vague and he finally was just like so on his side or on your side he's like what are we talking about here it was very confusing at first and i get it like hey listen these women have a limited amount of time so like make an impression as fast as you can clearly the the the majority of these women are major fans of the franchise boy the reaction that that that happened when they saw their first day card is it was if you know taylor swift walked through

the doors they freaked the fuck out you know um these women are fans they are fans of the franchise first and foremost which i i get you know um but i honestly kind of hate it. And I hate it because of what that basically tells me is that like they're just too aware of what they think the show should be. I also think tying into that, like the drama with Maria and Medina and Maria being like, this is the stupidest fight in all of Bachelor Nation history. It's like, because you have watched every single fight that has ever happened and you are aware, you are a fan. Yeah, but they all are, you know? Yeah.

I mean, and I just, like, I guess I'm glad they're fans, but now I feel like most of the reactions are more inauthentic, you know? More rehearsed. More, this is what I think should happen. And that kind of, we saw that with episode two Like most of the reactions are more inauthentic, you know, more rehearsed, more. This is what I think should happen. And that kind of we saw that with episode two, with all the dramatic stories, just one after another.

Who else? You know, so you had Jess told a story. Lauren. Lauren and her dad. Which I'm going to go ahead and say his giving Jess the group date rose because Jess, I don't think opens up about much. And Lauren is sitting here being like, this was a really hard, like I lost my father and like being in a wedding dress and she was so vulnerable and open. And it was for him to give the rose to Jess. I disagreed wholeheartedly. You know, we've said this in other seasons you know the group date roses

they're either validation roses or drama roses and this was a drama rose and usually the roses that are given off on group dates early are usually drama roses they aren't based off of who had the best connection they may or may not

be a collaborative decision between Joey and the producers potentially you know if joey was like truly like i want this person to get this rose they really made an impression he would probably you know give that rose to that person there's also the possibility that early that joey's like i don't fucking know man i am tired on these group how many women are on these group dates you know there's still 22 women left. Think about it. Think of how hard it is to go on a date. Conversation after conversation, and they sit down and they're just like, let me tell you this heavy story. You know nothing about me. And all these women are just assuming that Joey,

like Joey is the perfect guy. I just, I just, I just know it. I just know that you are special. I just know you're a great guy. And I'm Joey seems like a great guy, but based off of what? I mean, that's a, these are all connections based off of chemistry. Uh, and they all just assume they're compatible. Uh, but then they come down and sit down and throw out these heavy story. What, and there was, it was more than just those two.

What else? There was, I think, a couple other heavy stories in there. We had obviously Daisy on the one-on-one, but then also after the second group date, Edwina got the special time. She talked about growing up in an African household, being the oldest daughter,

and all the responsibility there. Yeah, everyone's coming with their first conversations of telling Joey their heavy shit. And the only person who is not who he wanted to hear from is Maria. He was like, I want you to tell me. I want to learn more about you. Tell me something about you.

And she's like, I'm going to slip into something more comfortable and then we're going to make out. What did we think about that? Because her whole angle was like seduction, right? But then he was like, well, she also was like, I can't breathe in this dress. You know what like i can't breathe in this dress you know what's more comfortable nudity like you know what's more comfortable i don't know a tighter top and a tighter skirt like sure i guess um it didn't seem like my stomach can breathe like and the girls definitely seem to have uh a reaction to that which i feel like i would you leave in a dress and you come back in a completely different outfit. Like, first of all, you didn't want to tell anyone else

to pack a second fit. You didn't want to tell anyone. I don't know. Interesting. Daisy's my front runner. Daisy wins the show. She's they're so in love. I just I see it from a mile and a half away. I love Daisy. I have a good feeling about Lexi. Yeah, Daisy and Lexi are definitely top two. You think that's Lexi's top two? Yeah, he like loves. I mean, the golf.

Are you kidding? Then that her like painting, which she really sold it. I was like, she's going to be really good. I was like, she might be really good. Like a little Picasso. Like a Michelangelo. Turns out. No, not good at art. It was giving Picasso. It was giving a little picasso like a michael angelo turns out no not good at giving picasso it was it was giving a little picasso yeah you could argue it was giving a little picasso

do you have any thoughts on evelyn like jumping over the table in the love interest loved yeah commitment loved loved that commitment but she didn't even end up next time yeah that's usually how it works yeah yeah those like challenges on group dates give the perception of being rewarded something that's not really on the table but they don't know what is not available to them if i'm making any sense uh i love a good michael bolton little michael you know little do you know who michael bolton is singer on the bachelor that i've actually recognized their song you right you knew Michael Bolton was. Yeah. Nally did not know who Michael Bolton was.

The second he started singing, I was like, oh, yes. Hello, my good friend. Well, you have kind of an old soul. In like a good way. I don't know. Nick was like, come on. I even know who Michael Bolton is. And I'm like, yeah, you're 43. Of course you do. But none of the other women, they were all like,

hmm, interesting. Also, Daisy. Daisy. She's like... They definitely had to reshoot that scene. No, for sure. He's like, we're going to go see Bahamas from...

She's like, I love Bahamas. No, she said, I love him. She even knew that it was a person. Not a band. Not a band. It was just one guy. It was just one guy. What chances are...

Yeah, I would have been screwed. I would have been like, oh, Tommy? Like, I would have been like, where are we going? Oh, did you believe Daisy's acting? Do you believe that she knew? Or do you think that was a pickup? I think that was a pickup for sure. Yeah.

She's like, oh my God, I love him. Yeah. Have you heard of that festival? No. I've never heard of it either. I was thinking about that. Because it was like country vibes, right? Yeah.

Yeah, they love a good country artist on that show. I looked him up on Instagram because I was like, I wonder if she actually, if this is like just, I'm just stupid and this is an actual he's got 75,000 followers and he is known as a Canadian indie rock

artist. But back to that, why did this, any of this reminded her of being cheated on? Just like watching Joey make out with other chicks or something? Well, it sucks to be the other woman and have to like kind of just be fine with it. She's already upset about the other one. Babe, it's the second day. Like this happened. She was saying that the woman were mad at her for opening up, but opening up is something she struggled with. So she's like, it should be be empowering but i'm getting crucified she wasn't opening up she was

saying i just got a little smoochie poo you're not opening up you're like bragging about what you and joey are doing in your alone time that's you're not being like so when i was younger and they're like babe shut up even like compare that to daisy telling everybody about her cochlear implant before her date and there was even girls after that were like thank you so much for sharing like i think if it was an actual genuine opening up here's something i've gone through i i think the reaction would be similar it's exactly like you were saying it's her coming in and pushing on a pressure point and an insecurity of all these other women who barely get to talk to him that's not opening up that's just like shoving it in their face although thank you for sharing she's definitely watched this yeah they all watch the show thank you for sharing

she's like wait when someone says something deep you say thank you for sharing okay okay uh they all hate each other i'm obsessed with joey though, even though he had to sit through a lot of these, like, I just felt like he handled it all so well. I feel like he's so hot. What did you think of him flipping the tire? Oh, my God. I was like, me next. Me next.

Natalie looked over at me to, like, see how closely I was watching Natalie versus Joey. Well, I actually went to fast forward because I was like, I have to get through this show as fast as possible. And so I was going to skip and then it was that scene and I was like, I'll wait. So that was cool. Yeah.

Yeah. But no, he's a great. Finally, we have a good bachelor. It's been a minute. And what makes him great? Well, he's actually attractive. His ratio of hair to chest hair? Impeccable.

Impeccable. Got a good chest to hair ratio. Okay. I don't know. He's just like, he's actually charming. I can see that women actually want to fight for him. Like,

I didn't believe that with some of the others, you know, I just didn't believe that 30 women were there for Clayton. I, it was hard for me. And that's maybe why I respected the women who were like, I'm going to go home. Night one. They're like, like I'm gonna pack it up

we lost a sister already yeah do we think it was dramatic like the whole cake throw and she's like it's not red velvet oh they told her to throw that cake yeah for sure I think Lauren's dramatic on her own I think her exit was all her I think her just being like,

this isn't for me. I can't do this. And at the end, they're like, throw the cake. And she did. I did find it refreshing though, at the fake wedding reception. I think it was Maria who was sitting next to Lauren and Lauren was like, hey, how are you doing? And kind of talking about her being emotional. And Lauren told Maria to her face her face she was like and then it was really hard when you were saying in the limo that like you were gonna have your dad there and Maria was like oh I screwed up I had no idea like that to me was refreshing compared to what we saw later in the episode of everyone just talking behind each other's back because we got to see the two of them basically like say hey you said this out of context you didn't know but it really hurt me and it set me off. I'm so sorry. Great.

I loved Demi Burnett. Welcome back, Demi. Yeah. That was such a... I did not expect it, and I loved it. Yeah, she looked great. All right. Who are our frontrunners? Real quick, before we go.

Lexi, Daisy. Hopefully not Jess. Jess kind of annoys me a little bit jess will be gone in like two weeks i'm sure edwina i did really like their solo time who's the who's the girl who has the siblings and she has a tattoo of four siblings i think she's top four wasn't it kelsey a that gave the nightmare for the net it's all from new orleans oh kelsey from yeah i think kelsey i think kelsey's top four for sure all right well hopefully this season picks up and they have less uh sad stories i don't know i always kind of roll my eyes a lot a lot for joy to deal with early on all right anyways let's get to the

meat of this episode it's time for the toms uh thank you guys as always for listening to this show 700 episodes it's been fun making them. Don't forget, on Thursday, we have Whitney Rose from Real Housewives of Salt Lake City is with us for Going Deeper. It's a good one. Breaking down all the things that happened with this past season, the reunion. Where are they now? Where do they go from here? Her thoughts on Monica, Heather, all the ladies from the show.

Will she be back? What does she think about upcoming seasons? Will they keep it dramatic? All of those questions are asked and answered with Whitney. Do not miss that episode. It's a great one. All right, let's get to the toms. This episode is brought to you by Care Of.

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Okay. It's not looking good. It's not looking good. I don't know if you guys know this about Tom, but yeah, he's like a vampire. It's two o'clock. I know. And I texted him, talked somewhat two days ago yeah with a little he was hyped about it moved it later yeah he never responded to that he didn't

no tried sandoval oh my manager tried sandoval and texted him no answer does he have an assistant who could like go knock on his door and the assistant just resigned last week we're on tst you know what that is what i'm saying of all time oh no i don't like that done you know production like secretly gives him an earlier call time or a late or excuse me earlier call time 30 minutes ahead just knowing he'll be late he's chronically late well we need him to respond otherwise we're just gonna start i mean yeah what do you guys think i'm doing a sledge or mic in yeah i'll call him yeah call him oh it's cozy in here it'll get warm that how you disarm people before you exploit them yeah Tom, do you want to slide your mic in? Yeah. I'll call him. Yeah, call him. Oh, it's cozy in here.

It'll get warm. Is that how you disarm people before you exploit them? Yeah. It'll get warm. Smells good. I feel like I'm at home. It's like a casino. Yeah, like that. There's no clock in here.

No clock. That was really good. You're about to get a massage. A shoulder massage. Three drinks. Where's my cocktail? Yeah. Sorry. Mailbox is drinks. Where's my cocktail? Sorry, mailbox is full. Oh, of course.

Of course. Tom, where the fuck are you? Is Brecken home? Can Brecken knock on the door? Oh, yeah. I mean, I know him through Kelly. I hear he hates fucking Sandoval these days.

Well, it's a love hate. They have a mutual respect, and they are friends, but... I don't know if it's mutual anymore. It sounds like Sandoval's been partying a lot and pissing him off. Really? They had a great rapport going. All right, are we... We'll give him five minutes to call us back.

I was telling Natalie and Nick, we're on tst now i'm saying of all time yeah i don't operate on i don't either i don't either that's why i roll solo whatever we do things together i don't bother rolling with him because uh i like to be early to everything i appreciate that yeah i really do have you ever asked yourself like why you're still friends with that guy oh jesus um yeah yeah i've done some reflecting uh for sure you know i've looked in the mirror no um the pros outweigh the cons i made a list you did yeah do you have this i don't have it i'd like to review it with you um that's funny, Nick. First of all, hi. Hi.

Are we rolling? We're rolling. You know. Hi. We haven't necessarily started the podcast yet. Yeah. I mean, we are recording. We are recording.

I got to say, I'm still kind of on a high. You know, last time I saw you, you told me I was handsome. The best looking guy in Vanderbilt. And, you know. You haven't. It worked like a charm. I was here early. Is that why Sandoval hasn't showed?

I can tell his feelings were really hurt. He was, honestly. It really bothered him. Yeah, it irked him. How much time should we give him? I mean, he lives five minutes away. I know. Ali has joined the Zoom.

Okay. Just looking at that matcha latte is making me have to take a shit. We do have restrooms if you need to. I have like a Pavlonian thing going on. What does that mean? Like, you know,

when they condition the dogs to salivate just by ringing a bell? Yeah, Pavlog's dog. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I've never heard of that. Oh, yeah. That must be like

a 40-year-old thing. It was on The Office. Was it? When Jim keeps playing the windows app and he keeps playing it and offers dwight a mint every time he plays the sound and then eventually he plays the sound and and dwight puts his hand out and jim's like what the fuck such a good reference oh my god by the way i feel like you've set me up for failure us well supposed to be us i guess it's just me now but i'm supposed to follow up Gypsy Rose.

No. No, you won't be following Gypsy Rose. These are big shoes to fill. Oh, I won't? Yeah. Okay. There's like a week. You'll be like five or six episodes after.

Did you guys acknowledge that she's 10th cousins with Stassi Schroeder? I believe Katie, your ex, let us know that on this very podcast. I loved the response online to that. Like in all caps, everyone on Twitter, get her a job at Sir now. Lisa at Lisa Vanderpump. Unfortunately we asked her. She doesn't seem to watch much Bravo.

She doesn't? No, she likes like TLC, like 90 Day Fiancé. 90 Day Fiancé, Married at First Sight. First thing I'm doing after I leave here is I'm listening to your episode. She seems very thoughtful and well-spoken and bright. Very much so.

She is having a glow up right now, man. Every time I open Twitter, Instagram, she's on fire. She's like the opposite of your friend Tom. Yeah.

In so many ways. Like, she acknowledged her mistake, owned her mistake, did some work, and now she is out here showing people how much work she's done

he did that in his own um convoluted way how i fit um well can we get into that later i just got here um yeah gypsy man i'm just learning about her her plight her story it's wild right um do you know what do you think you would have done in her shoes? Okay. I have skimmed the headlines, so I should be careful about what I say, but I think... We got your back.

Same? Same but not same? Same but not same? Yeah. You can empathize 100% with why it came to what it came to. 100%.

Yeah. Do you concur? I couldn't say otherwise. Yeah. You never know what you're capable of until you're? I couldn't say otherwise. Yeah. You never know what you're capable of until you're put into a situation like that.

I'm glad she's getting the fire D now though. Fire D. She is. He's a good dude too. Yeah. We got a text. From?

From. Oh. My therapist. Oh. I don't know where the fuck Tom is. I don't know. He's about to regret this.

If he's double booked himself, if he's sleeping right now, I have no clue. Well, except that he hasn't responded to any of my messages over the past two or three days. Did you respond, Schwartz? Yeah. He did. Always. Nice little thumbs up. Which I didn't need much more than an acknowledgement, which Schwartz gave me.

Yeah. I mean, if it's any consolation, it's great to be here. It's nice to have you. It's great to have you. You're going to throw me some softballs today? Yeah. Listen. We'll talk about your favorite color, your favorite movie.

We'll keep it light, but we're going to question some things. Okay. Let's do that. You just had Katie on, right? We did. Yeah. She actually just DM'd me. I haven't listened to it yet. Are you familiar with her new show? Yeah. Her and that. Yeah. You just had Katie on, right? We did. Yeah. She actually just DM'd me. I haven't listened to it yet.

Are you familiar with her new show? Yeah. Her and Dana. Yeah. I forget the name of it, but it's, it's very fitting for them. Disrespectfully.

Yeah. On the, uh, NV Media, uh, Vow Files Network. She's such a hater, but she,

Her studio's next door. Is it? Yeah. She's a hater, but she, she owns it and she does it with a, an interesting point of view. So it works.

What do you mean you think she's a hater? Well, Katie's just, you know, she's very judgmental. She's opinionated. She's very, yes. I haven't found her to be judgmental. She's a... I found her to be opinionated. I have found her to be on time.

Yeah, I have found her to be on time. I meant to say that with a sense of endearment when I said she's a hater. I mean that. I'm not backtracking. Sincerely, though. Katie taught me that it's kind of fun and okay to indulge in a little gossip once in a while. She gave me a newfound appreciation for sipping the tea in moderation, if you will. Well, I don't think this loser is going to show.

No, God. I don't know what to say on behalf of him. Well, I don't expect you to say anything on behalf of him do you feel like it's your responsibility to protect no i don't tom sandoval i don't he's his own entity his own man and uh i'm not here to defend or speak on behalf of him but you know i do love the guy i don't know where do we go where do we go we're gonna do a deep dive into our dynamic probably i do appreciate you showing up though dude of course i've never missed an appointment or a show or did a part of you know that sandoval wouldn't show no wait yes that's not true was there a there's always a little part of me that worries he's

gonna be late but he you know he usually he almost always shows up fashionably late with, you know, a questionable excuse, but, you think he'll like run in here, like out of breath and like, Oh my God, I just,

the craziest thing happened. I was backing out and this old man's wheelchair got caught under my wheel. And it'd be more like a fresh manicure. I'd be like, sorry, my guy was running late. And yeah, freshly mint was running late. Okay. Yeah.

Freshly minted white nails. Got it. And a coffee in hand. Yeah. I have never in the history of this show. We are how many episodes, Ellie? We've recorded 690 episodes, I think. In 690 episodes, I have never had anyone no show.

No call, no show. A no show, you know, things happen in life. I've had people had a last minute reschedule for emergencies that come up, but I have never had anyone completely ghost me, especially after doing them a favor. Yeah. Yeah. Well, can I just say on behalf of Tom Schwartz, it's really nice to be here. Great to have you. It's great to have you, Tom.

I don't usually refer to myself in third person. It's probably important that you do in this interview. I know I'm not the controversial figure you were looking for, I'm sure. No, I mean, I've been looking forward to having you on. Yeah. I think you are more controversial than you realize. Maybe. Mostly because of your association with Tom Sandoval. Guilty by association. And your loyalty to a man who deserves none. And the couple of drinks you happen to have thrown at some ladies in your past. Yeah, my God. Yeah, I'm not necessarily proud of my past, but I've learned from my mistakes.

Tom Schwartz, welcome to the show. Thank you, guys. Thank you. Appreciate it. It's nice to be here. Lovely studio. Do you want to sit next to... No, I think honestly like having the empty seat. Having the empty seat. Should we make something real quick

that says like a ball? A sign that says Tom Sandoval. Put this little hat there. No, I don't want the negative association with the bar. We've had enough hate. Okay. We've become, you know, it's like he's the face. That's the place. We've actually put hate. Okay. We've become, you know, it's like he's the face. That's the place. No, we've actually

put a lot of work into revamping and we're going to pivot and I'm excited to get some new fresh energy in there. You are going to pivot. Yeah, working on it.

Is that breaking news? Well, no, no. It's just like we're incorporating our music program finally. We're going to have a new sound system, live music,

and a lot of cool stuff I'm excited about. Are you going to change the name? I don't know. Is Tom Sandoval still part of it? He is, but he's sort of taken a step back. He's been mostly a silent partner. But he's still financially involved? Yes, he is. Do you think until that is no longer the case

that people will feel compelled to support this venture of yours? There's been a shift. Honestly, we've got doxxed. I mean, I'm not here to throw a pity party, but you know, it sucks that this business that I put my heart and soul into and so many people put so much time and energy into, you know, came crashing down because of one person's actions, you know, in their personal life. But we suffered dearly, you know? Yeah. We really did. People have been coming in. There's been like an outpouring of support lately and it's been a nice change of pace, you know? Are you going to get real ketchup? Oh, yeah.

Nick does not. He's not a fan of the ketchup. The cherry ketchup? What the fuck is that? I know. I can't even tell the difference. It's ketchup. Honestly, when I first... How can you not tell the difference? I objected when I first saw that. I was like, it seems unnecessary and pretentious maybe, but it works and now I'm in love with it. It's like one of my favorite

things on the menu. Fine. Keep the cherry ketchup. Can you also just have like regular fucking ketchup? Just for the record we have Heinz now. You do. I got it just after that moment. There's one bottle of Heinz. It has your name on it. Thank God. Should we call Tom one last time? I think we should.

Okay. Let's call him on air. Do you think he would be more likely to answer you or Nick? I think probably you. Probably Nick. In this moment in time, knowing that he was supposed to do the show. When was the last time you talked to him about doing this? While we were in Singapore. When was that?

That was three days ago. Silence is loud. Yeah, definitely. Hey. Where the fuck are you? We're recording. Yeah, definitely. Hey. Where the fuck are you? We're recording. Oh, shit. It's 219.

Oh, my God. It is? Yeah. Yeah. Wait, this is... Tom, we're live right now. We're live. We're recording.

Get your ass over here. It's like five minutes away. Okay. All right. I'll be over. I'm coming over. All right. Send me your address.

Text me your address. I'm coming over. I'll resend it. Okay. Bye. All right. Send me your address. Text me your address. I'm coming over. I'll resend it. Okay. Bye. All right. All right. Bye.

Motherfucker. Oh my God. It's 219. No, it's not 219. You think you just woke up? Probably. What is wrong with him? I don't know, man.

I'll be honest. I hate when people start sentences like that. I'll be honest. Yeah. No, don't. With all due respect. With all due respect. Let me finally be honest no offense no offense i want tom sandoval to succeed in life i do yeah i want him to use this tragedy at least for ariana and tom has been tragic other

people i think they've pretended it to be tragic while like scrooge mcducking in their beds full of cash yeah um i got a visual on that sheena just basking in her bed cash and having like uh brock just throwing up dollar bills can you picture it you guys come on no comment no but but no anyway a lot of people profited a lot of people made a lot of money off of that i want there to be good in this yeah i mean that this is what the show is about you know it's about you know learning from our mistakes you know most of us don't make the type of mistakes that tom has yeah but tom isn't the only person who's ever been unfaithful he's not the only person who's ever been unfaithful. He's not the only person

who's cheated. Sadly, what he did, so many people before him, even your peers have done. And yet what's been so frustrating is to see your friend, Tom, just be so resistant to owning what he did. And even conversations I have with him now it's a real challenge for him he's uh very susceptible to like indulging in what about ism you know what do you mean by that just like uh instead of you know facing the issue head on he has a tendency well he's gotten a lot better about this because he's self-aware now but um you think he's self aware more self-aware he's got a lot more humility and uh you know he's he's self-aware now, but more self-aware. He's got a lot more humility. He's been humbled on a massive

scale here. Let me make sure. This is almost too perfect. I know. It's 2019? His tone and everything. Hey, man. He answered as if you were just calling to see if he got home

all right. Just shoot the shit. Hey, man. What's let's go let's cook it he didn't sound that groggy or like panicked you know yeah um anyways what was i saying you've suggested that he's been humbled and that he's more self-aware yes and i had a point i forgot where i um where was i going with that i say we just keep fucking going We're not on Tom Sandoval time Why the fuck are you friends with Jax Taylor? He's coming Tom Sandoval's coming You can put it there for now

With the mustache Why am I friends with Jax Taylor? Yes What I know about him He's only ever lied and I think he's still lying didn't he say something that his wife had to correct in the media I don't know anyways he's done some shit and I say this having watched and and I told you this last time when I saw you yeah that I have more empathy for Tom Sandoval having gone back and watched old episodes of Vanderpump. Not I have empathy in the fact that like I think many of his peers are hypocritical and

very conveniently forgetting their sins to take advantage of Tom's. Jax Taylor is the ringleader of that nothing matters but me energy. Yeah, he was villain numero uno for a while there. Yeah, he had a dicey character at best. People are going to roll their eyes, but Jax has a really good heart and he's been a great friend to me. He's one of the first people I met in Los Angeles when we were coming up. We went going on auditions together. He got me one of my first agents. He's just always been a great friend, very supportive of my family. There, if you need anything, any time, money, you know, a shoulder to cry on. He's never wronged you. Well, have you been on the receiving end of

a Jax Taylor? Oh, I've been Jaxed. You've been Jaxed? Yeah, I've been Jaxed for sure. Loyalty matters to me. It's a quality that I care very much about. Loyalty is one of those characteristics that everyone says they care about because who would ever be like, yeah, I don't care about loyalty. No one one would say that but very few people are actually prioritized being loyal yeah being there for you you seem to prioritize that are you saying i'm loyal to a fault i would yeah but i'm just also wondering like yeah how how do you tom schw, like, what does loyalty mean to you? And how do you implement it in your life as, since you've been surrounded and you continue to be friends with people who not only wronged you, but other people you care about to the point where their actions not only have hurt

them, but truly damaged lives and mental health and done some things that you can't take back. Oh God, this might seem like a cop-out, but it's almost like when you do reality TV, it's like you're sort of existing in a parallel universe with a slightly different set of rules and ethics. And I hope that doesn't in any way, shape or form detract from the authenticity of our show, because I'm so proud that we've never soft scripted or contrived any moments. We have a deep well of history, and most of us were friends before the show started.

I think you guys know that. You know, I was roommates with Jax and Tom. That's when he was dating Kristen. Jax was dating Stassi, and then I was dating Katie. We were one highly dysfunctional, fucked up family, but we loved each other, And that was the beginnings, the Genesis of, uh, Vanderpump rules and everyone working at, sir, you know, that was the glue that tied everybody together. But, um, so many of those people have grown up. Yes. And it sometimes feels

like some of the guys listen. I mean, I had a good trajectory going 2019. I really felt like I had my shit together. You know, I was happily married. We had just bought a beautiful home, my dream home in the Valley and you know, Tom Tom's thriving, just about to open our second bar, all kinds of other business opportunities burgeoning. And then I don't know, after 2020 things got weird. And what role do you think you played in that? In regards to the downfall of the relationship? Life. I mean, you made it seem like life in itself was...

I know. I know. I skipped over a lot. Well, Jesus. It's going to turn into a therapy session. Can you be more specific with the question? So I don't ramble? Or go on a...

We certainly have time. Well, yeah, I guess just that. Like what, when you were, moments ago, you went back to 2019 in your head and you visualized your dream home and you visualized those other opportunities and you visualized the success that Tom Time was having and you visualized your marriage.

And now it's 2024. You're in a very different spot. Yeah. My God. On the heels of Sandoval. And I'm just wondering, have you ever given much thought into the choices you've made that got you to where you are at today? For sure.

You know, I take full accountability for, um, well, I don't even know, like some things are out of your control, but I am curious of the things that you have thought you know what that one's on me i could have done this differently what are some of those things if you're uh alluding to like the affair if you're alluding to oh i don't know i don't even know um i don't know honestly much about you and katie um well other than you seem to never want to have her back honestly Honestly. Do you think that is accurate? I don't think it's a fair representation of the dynamic in our relationship. Would you like to add some color to that?

Oh God, me and Katie are in such a good place. You know what I mean? Like I just... I mean, Katie are in such a good place. I feel like we're in a really good place right now. I don't know if I want to do a deep dive and rehash negative aspects of our relationship. Well, you did already call her judgmental well like oh she oh god um but as a viewer yeah

um as a viewer i have yet to see you go team katie really i mean no we're in season three i've seen season 10 one two, two, and parts of three. Honestly, I've lost sleep over the fact that our relationship, I think, overall is perceived in such a negative light, you know? Because there were so many great moments in our relationship, way more good than bad, you know? We've went on so many fun vacations together. We truly loved each other, there for each other through the best of times through the worst of times we started dating when we both had nothing we were kind of like perfectly imperfect you know what does that mean it's like we were by no means a model relationship i never i don't think at any point aside from maybe our wedding season did people

ever look at tom schwartz and katie maloney and say they are couple goals. Yeah. Complicated. Sure. You know, even if, even for the people who are quote unquote couples goals, I mean, what does that even mean? I guess they have a good brand. I guess up until, you know, very recently, I feel like Tom and Ariana were perceived as like the quintessential idyllic. There you go. There's my point.

If you could have changed anything about your behavior in your marriage, what would you have changed? Well, uh. You can totally say nothing. No, no, no. It's okay. This is nice. This is nice, by the way, actually. This is just us chit-chatting.

First of all, early on in our relationship, when I was unfaithful, being a reformed make-out slut, which I know it's not cute to say that but like i dealt with things in a very unhealthy way early on our relationship you know there was multiple times where i thought we were going to break up i had a lot of pent-up resentment and instead of dealing with it head-on having healthy conversations seeking couples therapy i often would just get shit faced. I was a sloppy, immature, lost douche at times in our relationship. That's one of my biggest regrets, you know, just dealing with it like a goddamn fool.

You know, do you think you'd be married today if your behavior was different? I think towards the end we had communication, but man, I didn't want to do this. Um, Tom, where are you? I do not want to do this. Tom, where are you?

This is a cost of being friends with Tom Sandoval. It's just that it's been like, this has been talked about ad nauseum on the show. And we're in such a good place. Katie, love you. I don't know. I would prefer not to go into it, actually. Yeah. Yeah.

Listen, my goal was to have a conversation with you, ask some, I don't even think hard hitting questions, but like some direct questions with the hopes that the two of you would come across as two men who have done some reflecting, have done some growing as they enter into their forties. Yeah. aren't necessarily the Peter Pan, fuck boy, degenerate douches that many of your fans consider you to be. That was my hope. By the way, we're not a package deal.

I'm Tom Schwartz. That's Tom Sandoval. We have a business together. He's one of my dear friends, but we are very different people, and this is not me trying to distance myself. No, I mean, listen, I got to know you. You are such a likable guy. not me trying to distance myself, you know? No, I mean, you're like, I got to know you.

Like you are such a likable guy. You are. I appreciate that. And good looking. Thank you. But you, you know, you,

again, there's a perception of who you guys are. Yeah. And I would love to give you guys an opportunity, especially Sandoval. Yeah. But like, yeah,

you are guilty by association often. And that is something you often choose to be a part of, which i feel like you're kind of setting me up for failure if you're like listen you're perceived as an asshole here's your opportunity uh i'm gonna let you i'm gonna let you just talk prove to the world that you're not a fucking peter pan touche bag like i kind of setting me up for failure i don't think so i don't have a prepared speech. I'm just, I know who I am. I'm a great human being. And, uh, yeah,

I don't know what to say, guys. Are you uncomfortable? Not really. I just, I feel like I'm being set up for failure with questions like that. Why do you think so? I mean,

they're loaded. How so? Because you're essentially saying that I am those things. I indirectly. No, I don't. I mean, you're aware of fan criticism.

I am. I am. For example, like I got to know Tom on special forces. Yeah. And i don't i mean you're aware of fan criticism i am i am for example like i got to know tom on special forces yeah and i don't you know he like everyone else has flaws but i got to know a tom and i got to learn about sides of him that i enjoyed yeah he is you know and i think people are complex and multi-layered yeah and you know i've had like conversations with people who'll be like oh tom sandoval's this this and that i've never met him like listen i have a different experience with him which i can again be critical of him for sure i know tom cares what people think about him he does and yet he acts in a way that i don't understand why he he does and he gets certain criticisms so yeah it's not meant to be loaded It's just meant to be like, I get that all the time. It's like, oh, are you aware of what people think about you? Or you're this or people think that. And I address those questions

all the time. Not to throw a pity party, but I think I'm just, I'd like to say I was thriving in the chaos of whatever that shit storm was. But man, it was a combination of things happening in my life with my family members, my dad being in the hospital, my brother almost dying, my other brother going through chemo therapy. I just like, I kind of feel like I fell apart and I'm still kind of reeling a little bit from the past few years, not to throw a pity party, but I feel like I'm just now restabilizing and sort of getting my, um, my shorts back, if you will. What does that mean? I'm just starting to feel normal again, I guess. I feel like I was just surviving at best, but really drowning the past few years, especially the past year.

Are you on the way up? I think so. I think so. That's good. I think I'm due for a come up right now. I've been working out, eating healthy, started meditating, which all sounds like terribly cliche, but. You dyed your hair back.

I dyed my hair back. Yeah. I got roasted for that. Hair's back to brown now. You got great hair too. It suits you. Yeah. Thank you guys.

The brown suits you. Yeah. I don't know. Sorry, guys. I'm just like. Don't apologize. I don't know, man. He's two minutes out.

It's okay. Yeah. And then we can focus the energy on him. I mean, no, you can focus the energy on me. I just. Do you think I'm just like... Do I apologize? I don't know, man. He's two minutes out. It's okay. Yeah. And then we can focus the energy on him. I mean, no, you can focus the energy on me. I just... Do you think I'm being unfair? No, I don't actually. I didn't mean to get defensive.

I just like... Do you feel like a lot of your castmates thrived throughout Scandival and you kind of did the opposite? You might be the only one to that question that I haven't seen benefit from it. Yeah. I mean, it's unfortunate because like I said before, it's just like our bar, our beautiful business baby that I just sacrificed so much for became like the place where the affair happened. You know, Tom's the face. That's the place. I don't want to be a baby about it, but I've never experienced like hate or vitriol on that level was such a ferocity

yeah intensity and in in person and on the internet it's just like you know it was unrelenting and i and um i felt bad that so many people who had nothing to do with it had to suffer the consequences like who our managers or my partners in the business you know yeah actually he's like having to deal with unruly customers that coming in drunk graffitiing the bath like unhinged human beings just coming in there and like it was it was very strange for a while i've never experienced anything like that in my life it turned into like a like a kind of a circus like a spectacle for a while you know yeah because i guess it's one thing to for people to be able to like come at you in your DMs or in your comments, but for them to like physically show up in front of you at your

place of business, like that could be scary. And for the most part, people were lovely and, you know, nuanced or, you know, a lot of people came in and were like, you know, I went through the same shit. I did the same thing. My friends did the same thing. I had so many people come in there and empathize with me and be like, you know, I went through the same shit. I did the same thing. My friends did the same thing. I had so many people come in there and empathize with me and be like, you are in a horrible situation. You know, you got put in a horrible situation. Maybe you didn't handle it in the best way possible, but like, I've been there. It's a lose-lose in terms of being in a

situation, you know, being best friends with someone who's coming out of a relationship and, you know, they're having an affair or they're starting to, they fell in love with someone else. I mean, I don't know, Nick, what would you have done? What would you have done if you were in my position? I would have done things differently. Yeah. Yeah. I saw it. I, by the way, but I mean, listen, I would have, I would just would have been very honest with Tom about what I thought about what he did. I've had some tough conversations with friends, you know, and I'll say things like, oh, I want to believe that this isn't who you are,

but your actions are saying otherwise. And I would be very honest with how I felt about what they did. I would be honest about where we stand. And then I would be kind of honest about like, as a friend, what I would need to see from him to continue, I guess, being friends. I wouldn't have, I guess, at this point in my life.

And maybe you did do this. I did do that in my own way. But I would love to do a deep dive with that right now. But I know I'll get in trouble as the season's about to air. What do you mean? We go into this in great detail. The new season of Vanderpump Rules. We'll be able to explore the friendship of Tom Schwartz.

I hate to do that to you. We understand the parameters. Come on in. You're welcome to come in. Yeah, no, come on. We're, we have started. You little fuck. Look at that shit eating grin.

I got your picture. No. Oh my God, dude. Is this Thailand? Oh, that's not funny. Why, uh, why are you late? Me? Can you put the mic on so we can hear you? Yeah, that's not funny. Why are you late? Me? Can you put the mic on so we can hear you?

Yeah, yeah. I'm actually glad you brought that, because this was actually, you know what? This was a teachable moment. It was a teachable moment, honestly. And I feel like... Slide the mic. Hi. You were saying, yeah,

this let's just take that down. What? Come on. This, this was a teachable moment because, um, I don't think a lot of people are educated on, uh,

the dark side of that world. That industry. Is this what Lala was talking about? Yeah. Yeah. That, Oh, we didn't fucking know.

I know. We didn't know who she just said my cast mate took a photo and we were like who's this what are they talking about well that i i mean no no no actually actually it is a teachable moment in a sense of like i went to a place supporting uh thailand like we're on the boat the entire day right what what are you trying to say here no i'm saying it's a teachable moment in terms of raising it like that industry is i didn't realize to what length but that industry is rampant with corruption and uh speed breeding and and very often mistreatment of animals yes mistreatment of animals you know this like i'm

just i'm hold on let, I'm leading it. Like very often, you know, they're declawed or they use corporal punishment, negative reinforcement, or they're sedated or drugged. The place we went to supposedly was highly recommended and reputable. It was beautiful. And apparently they contribute a significant portion

of their profits to conservation. It could all be bullshit. Absolutely beautiful. I know that whole industry is sort of. And we didn't like at that point, like we have been drinking all day and like, we like went along with like the tourists who brought us there and we're like,

well, the whole trip was like, do as the locals do. It was recommended as a reputable place in hindsight, a questionable decision. I didn't go in there. I'm not trying to get eaten by a fucking lion i think everybody was more worried about like a tiger biting off my head more so than like who was worried about this schwarz i think kyle like myself your friends

yes okay anyways in hindsight probably a questionable decision but why were you late me no one else was late. He was very early. You were two hours late to my podcast, by the way. No, I wasn't. Yeah, you were. You were two hours late. What are you talking about?

Dude, you were. You're like, I'll be there between 530 and 630. You showed up at like 830. Tom, that's not true. That is exactly true. Dude, you were two hours. Tom, you called me the day before and said, I have a big favor to ask. Can you please do my podcast?

And I said, Tom, I have a busy day, but let me get back to you. But I can definitely do it at some time at night, but I'll get back to you. We definitely did not have a set time. And then I followed up with you. Dude, you were like 5.30. Bring up the text. Wait, this is a perfect example of what about ism instead of addressing the situation head on and saying hey i'm sorry i'm late you say sorry i'm late i'm sorry i'm late see that's why were

you late why was i late yeah um i was hanging out with a friend okay yes no care in the world? No, it's not like that. What is it like? Nick, why were you late? I wasn't. You were. You were. But it's different when it's you. You know what I mean? It's different. I don't know.

I wasn't involved in the scheduling of that. So I don't know. Do you actually believe that? Yeah, it's different when it's you. No, that I was late. Yes. Yeah, you were. Dude, I was literally hanging out for like you literally were two hours

later than you say you have a text message that says i was gonna be there at an earlier time you're like you're like yeah yeah yeah you have the text message i know just say i'm sorry i'm late i'm sorry i'm late nick do you want to fucking rake me over the coals i'm sorry i'm late we're just getting started no okay i apologize you got to respect people's time tom you don't always do that you do not respect it's okay if you don't respect time in general but other people's time you gotta you gotta respect how was thailand other than it was it was great it was awesome it was a great spiritual reset i feel refreshed and excited about life like i haven't been in uh quite some time going back to what we

were talking about. I feel like I've kind of been in a haze. I was a basket case for the past few years and I feel like I had some sort of figurative rebirth. Does that sound like malarkey? In what way? Sounds great. I don't know. Just going. I guess. So my question is now that you're back seeing and you felt this, what's going to be different just going out seeing different parts of the world uh absorbing yourself in other cultures eating delicious food i just i don't know i feel like i've had some sort of awakening my senses are sharpened my ambition is back so what do you think is going to be different now now that you're revigorated and you had this spiritual awakening that you're suggesting i feel like i have clarity of vision my appetite for life is back i just i don't know

man i don't want to sing a sad song but i just turned into like a sad sack of shit for the past few years and um you know seeing me more positive yeah more positive more motivated it was really nice it was really nice for us to like hang out i mean it's been it's been since 2018 since me and schwartz have actually taken a vacation like at all like for me it's been since 2018 but like dude it was really nice seeing you it was so nice like seeing you like in the pool in the infinity pool just like to me that was worth it all to see you saying just like just what was worth it just just just like him seeing me hanging out like just us like looking like looking at each other and not caring about anything like for a second it was

really worth it man you're saying for a second it felt like old times yeah because our obviously our our dynamic has become strained professionally, personally. And I feel like this was a good reset for both of us, for our friendship, for our dynamic, aside from this whole incident. And I don't wanna- You don't seem to be on the same page.

I don't wanna martyr Tom, but I know it came at great cost to your reputation there for a second. But like, yeah, overall, I think it was a good thing. It raised awareness through a questionable industry. And right. What I'm talking about? I was bringing it back to the Tiger King incident.

He doesn't seem to be very on the same page as you. Okay. Did you just wake up? No. He was hanging out with a friend. Who's your friend? Also, I do. Girl, guy, dating?

No comment. Oh, guy, dating? No comment. Oh. Yes, of course. I will circle back quickly and just say that I do have a text from Nick at 6.52 saying he was done with your podcast and he's heading to Whole Foods at 6.52. Yeah. Yeah, he was supposed to come over at 5.30. Yes, that was after the podcast ended.

So when I was done. That would have been like an hour and a half later if you recorded. I'm pretty sure. Let me check my messages to Tom. Dude, we were sitting around for a long time. We were sitting around for a long time, man. I text you at 4.48. When do you want to do this?

Question mark. I can be over at 5.30. You wrote, that works. You sent me your address. You did not come over at 5.30. Please don't act like you did. You texted me at 650. I'm pretty sure I was probably at 540 maybe. You were not over at 530. You were over at way after six.

Like to the point where like Jason and Jason were like, so when's Nick coming? When's Nick coming? How long is your podcast episode with Nick? That's an hour. Oh, so. Let's not digress here. We've already digressed. Nick nick let's get back on track

i know why are we talking about this well because you showed up 45 minutes late yeah i'm sorry about that i apologize and we just didn't even know you didn't know if you're coming you're just like it wasn't like hey you're gonna be here or just you just we didn't know i apologize you know don't need your apology yeah what do you want then? I just was asking, why are you late? It was just a simple question. I didn't ask why you were late. Because I wasn't.

What about us? You are though. What about us? You're an hour late. Nick, you're an hour late. I swear to God, dude. We were sitting there. God's going to be disappointed.

Who? God? Who did you just say? He said, I swear to God. Oh, God. Dude, you were. sitting there okay god's gonna be disappointed who god who did you say where's the god you were you're like i'm on my way i'm on my way you know what's scary though i believe that you believe that that's not scary i'm not the only one you can ask jason and jason jason's like are they come is he coming is he coming is he coming because we were worried we were worried because we were also like under the gun we're like is he really gonna come you're a hoot come dude so how about that special forces yeah

how about that special forces how about that special forces no well on special forces i had the pleasure of a few jeep rides with mr sandoval i enjoyed getting to know him and we had about an hour conversation about sandoval yeah and uh my hope of that conversation about Scandival. Yeah. And my hope of that conversation was just kind of like, I was just curious. I mean, I had just gotten to know you. The time I was getting to know during Special Forces, you know, you really stepped up in a lot of cases.

And as I got to know, it's like, who is this guy? You know, like, does he really regret this? Has he learned from this? Is he going to do it again in the future? And I'm just curious kind of where you're at now these days like what have you been up to well nick all bullshit aside man like it was actually really nice getting to know you i saw everything you went through like literally like went through you deserve to finish and to win i thought you did fucking great you carried me on your shoulders which i was really honored and i felt bad about like i felt fucking i'm confused about the depth of your guys's bond are you guys are you guys tight do you guys text each other on a regular basis did you guys

really develop a a special bond during that I think everyone just special to bond. I don't think Tom and I like got super close. We were hanging on a regular basis. I haven't spoken with him since. Oh, okay. So I had the pleasure. No, we,

we, we kept in touch. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. I was just curious. Yeah. The magnet Tom gave Nick is on our fridge.

It is true. Nice. Yeah. It is on our fridge. Tom gave us, uh, gave me a magnet that memorialized our fridge. It is true. Nice. Yeah. It is on our fridge. Tom gave us, gave me a magnet that memorialized our experience

and his special face. Would you set your friend Tom up with a lady? That scares me. No, no, no. Let me, let me expound. Well, does that bother you

to hear? No, no, no. I've said to Tom Sandoval's face. Like, I wouldn't set you up with my sister or friend and tom you said i i agree i i hear you do you want him to that was not said for shock value let me let me explain uh i would never want him to set me up with someone i don't want anyone to set me up with yeah no guy likes to be set up i'm just asking you would you trust someone you care about to date tom sandoval today it depends on the person my answer is it depends on the person do you think you should be are you like are you ready to protect someone's heart am i ready to

protect somebody's heart yes of course i am i don't know what to say except that like i fucked up and i know that i did that it doesn't matter the scenario it doesn't matter I fucked up and I know that I do love hard I really do and a being vulnerable and in a situation like got me to throw you know logic and everything out the window and people's feelings and ariana's feelings you know and i regret it hardcore i really do i can't do anything about it except just try to. You can learn from it. Yes, exactly. I've learned so much.

Like what? Like what? Yeah. For instance, you know, to take a page out of Katie's book, like with Schwartz, like Ariana was, you know, she was like, I, she was, you know, she was was like i don't know what my life will be without you know all this stuff and like i could have i i should have i don't know man i don't know dude i'm just trying to be a better person i swear to god like i really am like i like i don't i don't know what to say like what have I learned what have I learned

to not ever do that again to not ever be in a nine-year fucking relationship and end it that way to not ever like cheat that way like dude I'm never gonna do that what do you mean she's never gonna happen what do you mean cheat that way to what do you mean like well you when you say cheat that way it implies that you might cheat a different way. To have an affair. To have an affair. I'm just clarifying. That's good.

That clarification was good, actually. Okay. Okay. Yeah. Sorry. Sorry. Yeah. To ever like ever do that.

I'm not even trying to like be hard on you. I have people I care about who have been unfaithful to their partners. You know, people who are close to me, they remain close to me because those people truly show that remorse and that regret. They got into therapy and it was more than just being like, Hey, I'm sorry I fucked up, but they kind of identify those triggers, you know, things that in the past. So for example, they, you know, learned about why in those critical moments did they choose one path versus the other, you know, so that in the future they could say, you know what, I'm finding myself in a similar situation that urge for validation that whatever whatever it with Ariana because I don't want to dishonor her. But there are a lot of things that was going on with our relationship that I don't want to talk about. We're not allowed to talk about.

I would love to talk about it. No, I'm allowed to talk about it. Not right now. I can say whatever the fuck I want. Of course you can. But I'm not going to. I just, I'm not going to. Well, we've.

I don't want to. I don't want to. I don't want to. I just, I'm not going to. Well, we've. I don't want to. I don't want to. I don't want to. I was in a relationship that was. You fell out of love and you handled it in the worst way possible. Exactly. It's a cautionary tale. I will say on a positive note, so many people have come to me at Tom Tom Schwartz and Sandy's and confided that they were in a similar situation because of, last time I'll ever say the word,

Skandival, you know, they had like an awakening and they're like, we need to seek couples therapy, sit down, have that conversation we've been dreading, finally end it, or find a way to make it work, deal with it in a healthy, productive, constructive way as opposed to, you know, having an affair. I'm talking like hundreds of people. Oh, I imagine.

Small sample size but still i'm a huge believer that there's always a positive to be gained from a negative situation you just have to be willing when you when you're like when you're like i was i had such low self worth and when this whole rachel raquel thing happened logic went out the window, like fully went out the window. I like was a slave to my emotions in that aspect. And I couldn't, that's the big question, right? Because in the future, at some point you will be in a situation where you might be a slave to your emotions again. That's the big question big question you know the next time you feel that am i gonna am i gonna do it again am i gonna i've never experienced that like overwhelming

feeling that i had at that time and in a nine year nick have you ever what's your longest relationship eight years eight years okay you know like i don't dude i don't know what to say man what's your longest relationship? Eight years. Eight years? Okay. You know, like, dude, I don't know what to say, man. Like, I really don't. Well, in your defense, you've had to talk about it so much, your mind probably goes blank at this point. It's just like, I think you're, listen, by the way, I'm not here to be a Sandoval apologist.

I'm very critical of him. People don't see that on the show, Tom. Yes? and we have great conversations like one-on-one behind closed doors you say all the right things and sometimes on a public forum you you have a tendency to get defensive yeah that's it you have you have a tendency to get a little defensive but like i i know as a dear friend of yours you regret everything you did on a deep fucking level you know you completely turned your whole life upside down and um yeah i mean but you're trying to move forward it seems very easy for you to say that shorts why does it seem so hard for you to

say that what me yeah of course i fucking regret it dude no i believe you regret it it's just you have a hard time articulating like i don't like i can't it's been so long it's been you know it's been 10 months i don't know what to say except that like i was you did a great job of well you did a fair job of articulating and we we had Dr. Drew on the show. Yeah, I was a slave to my fucking emotions. No, no. And, like, that's, that's, like, and I was in, unfortunately, like, didn't know how to, like, did not know how to. Yeah, you didn't know how to deal with those emotions.

I totally get that. And I have had. And I didn't know how to, like, you're with somebody that you want to, like. I don't think it's like necessarily i mean of course the act of it is terrible but i think a lot of people have done what you've done i don't think it's you're the only person in the world who has cheated on their significant other but i think it's just the way that you have handled it since or just what you've said or how you come across.

Like as a friend, I told you, one time I said, do you understand why your critics still criticize you? And I was curious. Ross, if you want me to be fucking honest, I love Ariana. I do. I really care about her. But like this person fucking throughout our relationship talked to me like I was down here all the fucking time. And it's unfortunate that like my way of acting out against that was like me also like just getting belittled, belittled, belittled all the fucking time.

Like, dude. belittled all the fucking time like dude and i hate that i hate to say it but like i acted out because i had such low self-worth and somebody like raquel somebody's in her 20s like doing the the essentially the fucking whipped cream fucking bikini thing like like to me like like in varsity blues like i i couldn't fucking like i i i had i was like wow i have really like oh my god like i'm attractive to somebody like i'm i'm serious like i get all that this might be construed as you saying she made me cheat that's no that's not what you're you don't want to be that guy. I'm not saying that. I'm not saying that. I know per our conversations. No, not at all.

It sounds a little bit like that right now. Just so you know. Yeah. It does sound like that. I'm just saying. I'm letting you know. You're talking about somebody who wouldn't have sex with me for a year. I get all that. I've been in toxic relations before.

But I loved For like fucking a year. Yeah. No. Yeah. I get all that. And I've been in toxic relations before. And like. And I. But I like. Loved Ariana. I really fucking did. And. The whole process of breaking up with her. This.

This happened over four months. Like this wasn't like. I don't know man. I don't know what to say. Is there a point. When you look back. And reflect on what you would have done differently. Yes. Hold on. Let me finish. Let me finish the question. Is there a point when you look back and reflect on what you would have done differently? Yes.

Hold on. Let me finish this and ask the question. Was there a moment where you realized this was the moment I should have brought into the relationship? That moment was probably, geez, a year before we broke up. It just was like, I woke up before her, went to sleep after her, wake up and make her a dumpling latte. I instigated the happiness in the relationship. Always.

I was the fucking only one, man. So if it wasn't reciprocated, why not break up? Because it's not that fucking easy. You're with somebody for nine fucking years. You don't... Sometimes the right decision is hard, Tom. Great. Great. Thank you. I get Sometimes the right decision is hard, Tom. Great, great. Thank you.

I get it. It's fucking hard. It's really hard. And I didn't know how to fucking handle it. I didn't know. I fucking handled it wrong. I know I did. I fucking know I did, man.

I fucked up. What is this that Ariana is now suing you? Oh, she's not suing me. Clear it up, because that's what every headline that Iriana is now suing you oh she's not suing me clear it up because that's what every headline that i read the other day said i think that's a little clickbait i think it's just a motion to expedite the sale of the house uh okay it's it's um i forget the legal term for it so um yeah because thank you for clearing it up because every headline was we were in new york and we were like oh fuck ariana is suing tom yeah so that's not happening so ariana

is trying to make it out that i am a psychopath for wanting to keep the house that we have meanwhile why do you and how so how is she doing that she literally said that to you no no you can watch it on the trailer she thinks i'm a psycho for like wanting to keep the house gosh okay yeah she literally said that okay meanwhile like you know when my mom and dad got divorced my dad kept the house when my stepdad and his wife got divorced he kept the house and when ariana's mom and dad got divorced she kept the house okay but ariana is making it out to be that um me wanting to keep the house is a psychopath move but it's not she's like oh um he gave me a shit offer i gave her an offer of 3.1 million dollars we bought our house for 2.050 2 Okay. So you're saying you gave a top market. Yeah.

Top market. And you split it? Yeah. I gave her an offer to buy her out. She bought a $2 million house. You both paid a million? We both paid like 250 down payment. Down payment.

And then you split the assets 50-50. Yeah. So you both own half of it legally. Yes. Okay. And then you offered her $3 million. 3.1. 3.1.

3.1 as a buyout. Okay. And then you offered her $3 million. 3.1. 3.1. 3.1 as a buyout. Okay. And how does that work? So basically it's like. But seriously, for people who are going through this, explain how. Closing costs. I mean, Ariana hasn't paid a single bill for this house in eight months. She hasn't paid the mortgage.

Has she lived there? She hasn't lived there in two or three months. Okay. I didn't live there for the first two months okay yeah all her shits in the master bedroom like sure yeah she comes and goes shows up whatever i gotta say to both you guys credit i feel like you've handled it up until now it's getting a little messy but you've handled it in a very mature way because it's one of the biggest investments of your life. It's a major asset. It's not a great time to sell. It's not.

Do you think Ariana's being petty? Yes, big time. Do you think she's wrong for that? I put solar panels. I've done construction on this house. Yes, she's being petty and she doesn't want me to have the house. That's it.

I've offered her a million dollars over what we bought into it three years prior. Do you think she should accept your offer? If she doesn't want to accept my offer, then she should take the house. What if she doesn't want anything to do with it, but doesn't want you to have it? Then that's the petty, like I'm breaking up with you and I don't want anybody to have. No, it's the flipping over the monopoly board that's it it's like it's like I'm losing in monopoly so I'm gonna flip the monopoly board over that's what it

is yeah but do you think you're entitled to her reasonableness I think that like considering what most people like go through like again I'm going to give the same example. When my parents got divorced, my dad kept the house. When my stepdad and his mom got divorced, he kept the house. When Ariana's mom and dad got divorced, Ariana's mom kept the house. So, like, somebody always keeps the house unless they can't afford it or unless they want to be petty. Well, me and Katie, we mutually agreed that we wanted to sell it. But don't you think Ariana is entitled to be petty?

Yeah. And she's doing a good job of it. If I were in Ariana's shoes, I could see myself doing exactly what Ariana is doing. Do you think Ariana understands what she's doing? Yes. She knows exactly what she's doing. Do you fault her for it? I mean, I just.

You seem upset about it. I mean, considering that, like, dude, she literally, you know, was part of a cheating scandal and now has everything going for her, I think she's being petty. Do you think she should be grateful for that?

I mean, dude, no. I don't know, dude. I don't know, man. I think she's definitely grateful okay i know that's weird to say what you're trying to say is that she it's it's horrible what she had to go through you're you're you're showing reverence for that but she kind of hit she hit the breakup lottery yes she did okay she hit the fucking breakup lottery yeah but i mean i i hear you but do you think that you are do you think because she hit the breakup lottery yeah but i mean i i hear you uh but do you think that you are do you think

because she hit the breakup lottery that she should at least sell you the house that you want to be in i think she should be at least a little bit reasonable why do you think she should be reasonable because that's what we are talking about she is not i would agree with you she's not being reasonable but i also don't think you're entitled to her reasonableness i think you have to face the consequences of her rights and she has the right to not sell you the house because you broke her fucking heart and it's not fair she also broke my heart fine but she you know that's a consequence of moving in and having you know and sharing a house with someone you interfere with and actions have consequences.

Yeah, that's fine. She can, you know what? Let's just get rid of the house. Ariana, just fucking take it. I think it's best you guys just sell the house, move on. You'll both have a nice cash windfall. Just fucking take it. Take it all, dude. Start fresh, start clean.

Don't you want to start fucking clean? I mean, let's just assume that Ariana is just like, fuck it. I just don't want to have it. Those are, start clean. Don't you want to start fucking clean? I mean, let's just assume that Ariana is just like, fuck it, I just don't want to have it, those are my fucking rights, and I can be, I'm being petty, whatever, fuck it. But like, aren't you ready to be fucking done with fucking these types of questions? And storylines like you're

getting sued? It's more, it's less about like, the emotional, and more just about the fucking, the actual like i like paid to build the gym there i like did like i've invested tens of thousands of dollars into building this house into what it is you know what i mean like and i'm just like now i'm gonna have to move into another place. Yes.

And build another gym. And not be neighbors with Brecken. Not be neighbors with Brecken. Meyer. Good guy. Love that guy. Brecken. Would you have liked to continue to live in your house, Tom?

Man. Oh. Yeah. Start tugging at the heartstrings. That was my dream house. Our dream house. Yeah. That was our dream house. Our dream house. That was our dream

house. And I loved that location. We were tight with the neighbors and it just felt perfect. Everything about it. And I miss it. I wish I was still living. Did you invest in it? Yeah. Oh, we split everything 50-50. Yeah. But as a consequence of your divorce. Yeah. But our situation was so different. We had to do repairs on the kitchen after Katie sat me down and said she wants to separate. But it was very healthy and we still hung out and kicked it. It was as healthy as a divorce could possibly be. So our situation is completely different. No, I get that.

But other than just the fact that sometimes it's just not fair. Yeah. And if it was, you would have loved to have kept the house yeah yeah i would have man i missed that house and sub three percent man it's like a unicorn now yeah um this isn't interesting ours is boring it was very healthy and inamicable how tom do you think you can get to a place of peace me yeah i feel like that trip helped yeah it's kind of vague so yeah do you want to expound on that, Tom? And maybe going forward, like how can you have a peaceful, and do you want, do you desire

a peaceful life? Do I desire a peaceful life? Of course I do. I think a lot of people say that and don't show it through their actions. I'm not saying that's what you're doing. Some people thrive in chaos, which is a great biodome reference, Katie. That's for you. I love that movie.

Me too. I love that. It's a good movie. No, I, Katie. That's for you. I love that movie. Me too. I love that. It's a good movie. No, I, like. Sorry. We could watch a lot of movies together, Schwartz. I find peace in my friends and in people that I love, like you.

Like, I find a lot of peace, like. Your family? Yes. He's got a great family. I really do. And I love that. I really love and enjoy that. And I take time.

Like when I went back home for Christmas, my mom gets a Douglas for a real Frazier for like tree. And then go back. That's the type of Christmas tree. Yeah. Yeah. it's like 12 feet tall and there's this like little yellow ornament it looked like tweety bird i used to love tweety bird when i was a kid and my mom has this ornament and it's like i used to rub my face on it

because it looked like a little tweety bird ornament. And she always puts it in the back. She's like, it's so ugly. But she hangs it for me. And I always grab it and move it to the front, the trawler. And I love finding peace, man. I really do. And I hope fucking, honestly, I really do hope Ariana like does fucking well and keeps it going. Go.

I love seeing her thriving. Yeah. Go do it. She's absolutely crushing it. She's like glowing, man. Yeah. Everything she does right now. She's got the Midas touch.

I think her, I think her biggest thing is like, stop like focusing on, don't focus any energy on me leave me behind for you to say i know but like it's not a good look just just fucking yeah i saw i'm just saying like her being so she's been a little spiteful she's been a little spiteful she's been a little spiteful. She's been a little spiteful. She's been a little fucking reactive. She's entitled to her spite. Yeah, I get it. Yeah. When it comes to you, like, I don't think anyone's going to be like, oh, it's time to be. Yes, that would be the bigger person thing to do. No, no, no.

But like 10 months later, let it go. Keep going. Keep doing you. Yeah, but she doesn't want to and she's entitled to that oh yeah yeah she just wants to keep being like oh yeah tom that's a fucking tom like just live your life keep going keep doing you forget me keep going it's just it's not a good look i just want her to like move on you know what i mean mean? She looked fabulous at the Emmys. Should we talk about the Emmys?

We can. Yeah. I mean, we could pivot. Man, that was cool. Why weren't y'all there? Or were you there? Yeah,

we were there. We were presenting. You two presented? Me, Sandoval. Oh, spoiler alert. It airs this Sunday.

Me, Sandoval, Lala, and Sheena did a presentation for outstanding cinematography for a nonfiction program. Okay. And it was awesome. Did you guys win? Oh, this won't come out until after the Emmys.

Okay, we didn't win. We did not win. We got swept by, what's Ryan Reynolds' show about the soccer team? Welcome to Wrexham. Yeah, which I heard is, have you guys watched it? No.

We got swept by them, and they won like seven Emmys. Was Ryan there? He wasn't there. Oh. But the whole crew was and it was a big moment for them. But, you know, it's the ultimate cliche, but it was really cool to be nominated. It still feels like a win.

Yeah. It still feels like a win, man. Remember you got this ring from me at Circus Circus? Yeah. That's a non sequitur. I know. Anyways. I fucking love this dude. Well, a non sequitur. I know. Anyways.

I fucking love this dude. Well, he is unbelievably loyal to you, Tom. I'm unbelievably loyal to him as well. I mean, you can't do anything for my fucking friends. Listen,

he's made some questionable decisions, but I can't abandon them when you're there for the good times. You're there for the bad times. Right. And I have been hypercritical contrary to what people think of me as like a guppy or a pushover or a tom apologist it's not true at all schwarza's literally fucking kicked my ass what's really his foot fucking what's the toughest thing you've had to hear from your friend tom schwarza that's a good question dude you kind of been a fucking piece of shit man oh that's what like schwartz has said to me he's like yeah man you've been fucking selfish you fucking deserve like he's ripped into me how have you worked on your

selfishness how have i worked on my selfishness yeah like how have you made an effort to put others consideration before yourself you have been accused by many people of being a narcissist. I have suggested that you're not, but how is someone who can empathize or show compassion for people and think to themselves, you know what this, in this moment, this,

I would do this, but all my friends, I told my friends to, uh, please speak up if I'm ever being a fucking dick. Okay. And they have. When you're on a reality show, as you know, you get used to people wanting to know about you and everything that's happening with you. And I'm like, hey, I know that I'm going through shit and I'm talking about my fucking self and I don't what's

going on with you what's going on with you please tell me that's that's what I've I've done with my friends Kyle Chan Schwartz like I really have yeah wait so it was sincere I was sincere yeah so if you were to be maybe in this scenario again where you're, you know, feelings. I'll never be in this scenario again. Maybe just like your, what did you say? Your feelings took a, you were a slave to your emotions. Emotions. Thank you.

And one of your friends came to you and they're like, listen, man, this is not the way to go about it. Would you take that advice? Well, I tried that. And he was working towards that in his own time. You're saying while the affair was going on. Many times. Yeah. Multiple times. And he...

No, he was working. He was... I don't know. I don't know his exact plan, but he was working towards that, obviously. I spent four months in therapy with Ariana. While the affair was going on? Or before or after? wow i spent four months in therapy with her and i really like i wanted it to be i had like an image of of it ending

well and i was fucking delusional i really really did. Like she knew, she knew this was ending. Spent months. She knew this was ending. This is not like a surprise. Was there a part of you that thought maybe in therapy was a time to maybe share that you had an affair? Yes, yes. Here's the thing. So we have to do like interviews,

confessionals and all that shit. And I wanted to wait until after we were done doing all of those before I told her. Okay. Because, because how is she supposed to show up and like talk about like, Oh yeah. So tonight on my birthday or like,

you know what I mean? Like you can't do that. I mean, there's no good time to tell someone that, but, but, but like, I can't,

she can't show up and like, and, and do it before then. I go, I'll be honest. I just, I don't know. You,

you can't get brownie points for sounding like you were being considerate for not telling someone about an affair. That's fine. I don't expect, I don't expect that. Yeah. Yeah. You just, I don't, I don't expect i don't expect that yeah yeah you just i don't i don't because there is no good time there is no she would have been devastated whenever yes i don't i get it i get it i get it okay yeah i'm not trying to get like fucking

brownie points i'm like but also you know how fucking reality tv works and there's no fucking way that she's gonna be able to show up and like talk about what's happening six months ago with a clear head knowing that we have already broken up there's no way but here's what I don't get here's what I don't get your friend Tom moments earlier were like hey man I know you don't mean to sound like this but you're coming across like another thing you're coming across as making excuses and you always like you say that it's like this i'm sorry i would never fucking do it i'll never do it again of course i'm sorry and then you like double down and be like but and you go hard

of the paint and say but she would have i did this for her and she did this to me. And it always comes across. And what aspect, Nick, just earlier, you were just like, and what aspect? Because dude, I'm telling you,

like, you don't know our relationship and nobody knows our relationship and nobody knows what the fuck was happening. No, but when you say that, I like, I, all I can say is that like,

yes, I fucked up that. I know I know i did i i will admit that so why don't you just fucking day so do you want to fucking do you want to keep like do you want to keep fucking hammering it down yeah you beat me down i'm responding to you if you would just say what do you want me to say nick don't don't say the other stuff don't say what am i making sense schwartz yeah yeah yeah no i'll never i'll never be able to tell like what was happening i'll never be able to tell that i don't think it matters it doesn't matter exactly you say it like it does well it fucking matters to me because it was my life and i lived through it but it doesn't

defend your actions i get it i get that yeah I get that. Yeah, but it sounds like you are. Okay. Sometimes you vent just to get it out. Regardless of everything that you might spew. We've been through this a million times. He knows he fucked up. Yeah, I know I fucked up. I did it wrong.

Whatever I did, I fucked up royally. I know that. Okay. I do. Listen, I want you to have a great life i really do and i want to be like i got to know tom sandoval and he's not a bad guy and yeah i know i'm not a bad guy i know i'm not a bad guy i want you to learn i'm a really good friend he is i think you can be yeah you I can be? Do you think you don't know me? If you don't like, I'm a fucking really good friend.

Do you think I'm the guy that will literally show up at 3am and bail you out of jail? You can call me anytime. I believe that you're my friend. Do you think you prioritize being a friend over a partner? No, I don't. So you think you're a better friend than you are a better partner? Dude.

At one point, Ariana and I were like best fucking friends best fucking friends and that time went away like it just it just went away and I

fucking handled it fucking poorly you guys were a united front like no one else I've ever met. On the show, outside of the show, you guys were, yeah. Twin flames, man. You guys like, you had each other's backs. Fuck yeah.

To death do you part, or till, you know. Yeah, until I fucking, I'm an idiot. But anyways. Let's pivot to you. Oh, shit. No, no shit no no i was just getting comfortable nick okay hold on a second positive what you know you've been single for a while yeah what does happiness look like for you tom swartz uh in a year or two um and what are your relationship goals going forward you know right now i'm just taking it easy, having fun, you know, hanging out. But,

um, I do want to start a family. You do. I'm so, I'm not jealous. I'm happy for you guys, but like, I want that. And I know I want to, I want to get a house soon. I want to live on a ranch. I want to have pigs, goats, llamas, tortoises. I want to live in a little ranch in Thousand Oaks and I want to start a family and I want to continue to build businesses. Do you think you have to make any changes? And I don't know if I'm not suggesting that you do to have that in your life, or do you think it's just timing from your point of view? I don't think I'm quite ready to dive into a relationship right now, but the next time I do you know i wanted to hopefully be the one um i'm not getting any younger let's i'm no spring chicken you haven't lost your eight

your looks though thank you nick have you uh recovered from me saying that tom swartz was the best looking guy in vanderpump i have not were you late because is that why you were late that's why i was late i was like fuck this he said schwartz is better looking than me some sort of subcontract that i don't really say he's better looking than you i just said he's the best looking guy on banner pump and he doesn't get enough credit for that he's cute as fuck i think me and nick are approachably handsome but you kind of have sinister good looks thanks yeah my plastic surgeon would love that you said that. Who? My plastic surgeon. You have a plastic surgeon? Yeah, like

eight of them. Oh my god. I'm just kidding. What, eight for just like all different things or we don't trust one to do? Have you had any plastic surgery? None. Okay. Nothing. I woke up like this in life. To wrap up that thought, I sure as hell never thought

I would be at this point in my life single. I feel I believe that. It's not just you. Yeah, yeah. But we learn from all our relationships, even the ones that don't work out. What did you learn from your relationship with Katie, both good and bad? What are aspects of your relationship with Katie that you'd want to bring into your next relationship? What are aspects of your relationship that you're just like, listen, I had to learn a tough lesson here,

but I want to make sure that, whether it's something you brought that you can affect or just the relationship in general that you just want to avoid from having in your next relationship? Well, I've learned that I need to, this is so stocked,

but just I'm the ultimate fucking people pleaser. And I did that in my relationship with Katie, often with friends, and then especially with the businesses, which you have to do when you open a new business. Bars and restaurants are one of the most demanding businesses there are. I mean, it's unrelenting, the hours, missing holidays, stuff like that. But this sounds terribly trite, but to prioritize the person,

your partner, the person you love most. I feel like a lot of time, Katie would get my leftovers after a long day at the bar, working on construction shorts and sandies. And then maybe we'd go out for drinks afterwards and I come home and I'm like half drunk and I got nothing left for her. That happened too frequently, I think. Be a better communicator. I think everyone by now who's ever watched Vanderpump Rules knows that I'm very non-confrontational and I like to sweep things under the rug. It's no big deal. It's fine. And usually it is fine. Live and let go. But it starts to pile up and eventually it does fester and then it manifests itself in some ugly ways, which you guys have seen. We don't have to get into specifics. I appreciate that very vulnerable answer. Yeah.

I just, I think I'm a good lover. I'm not talking sexually, but that too, maybe. But no, but I just, I think I'm okay. I am a good lover. I don't think Katie would say I was a bad husband. Maybe she would, but I feel like the good, I said this earlier, I think before you're would, but I feel like the good, I said this earlier, I think before you're here, but I feel like the good in our relationship far outweighs

the bad. And I'll always love Katie. It was the right decision to end the relationship. And there's still times I'm sad about it and wonder what could have been, but I don't spend too much time dwelling on hypotheticals, which is another thing that I've taught myself not to do. I have a tendency to spiral and dwell on negative worst case scenario hypotheticals. And I've done that for a greater portion of my life. And I spend a lot of time in the future. You guys,

if you do this and not a good healthy way, you know, I'm optimistic eternally, but like I spend a lot of time in the future as opposed to being present and i don't dwell on the past ever but like that's one good thing that this trip it helped me be more present than i've ever been in the past two years going to thailand hong kong singapore is this boring i'll shut up it's not okay but um i haven't felt this present and focused hi hi hi hey bud um i haven't felt this present in a long time maybe going back to answer your question about what like the

any sort of profound impact that trip had on me i just feel present and dialed into the moment as opposed to like drifting off the space cadet five, 10 years in the future. Anyways, I'm going to shut up. I appreciate that. Why did I just very coherent and honest answer? Was it coherent? Yeah. Yeah. I don't know if I like that.

Yeah. It started real strong. You rambled at the end, but it was fine. We can cut. You guys should have cut me off at any time there. Um, uh,

what do you think should happen with Swartz and Sandy? Uh, I noticed that you didn't ask me the same question. Would you like me to? Yeah. I felt like you were tired of me asking you questions about your love life, but you are welcome to answer that question. What is something about your relationship with Ariana that you would like to bring in

to your next relationship? And what is aspects of that relationship that, uh, you think you should change about you so ariana was the very first person that i was with that i like fully valued and uh and held in high regard like her opinion like okay you know what i mean like she's wicked when you're with somebody when you're with somebody that like you really truly deeply respect i used to call her my information booth like so you want to respect your next partner you know when you're in a relationship sometimes and you're like oh he's an idiot or like she's you know what i mean like and you feel like ariana was the first person i was with that like i was like she's a smart, like truly had respect for her in a sense

of like who she was and her intelligence and like, whatever that was not reciprocated. It was not reciprocated in the same way. And having that, like putting her on a pedestal and like looking at who she is as a person. Like, I, I think that like moving forward, I want to have the, the, the same kind of respect in that sense, you know? So you hope to have a more mutual relationship? Yes. Yes. Okay. And how are you going to go about making sure that happens? Like early on, there'll be signs, you know, like moving on when I meet somebody like I'm having that respect for them and them having the same kind of respect for me. Like, I think that that's something that will carry on to a great relationship. At what point did you lose the respect for Ariana?

Honestly, I imagine it was gradual. No. Yeah. As an indie relationship or was oh sorry actually it's not that i lost respect for ariana it's that i had such low self-esteem because i've been belittled so much and uh going going into i've i've fell in love outside of the relationship and like that made me blind to like her feelings that makes sense so do you think it was when you fell in love outside of the relationship that you lost the respect or when you started yeah it was it was like, dude, I completely threw away logic and like everything.

Like I totally like was not myself. I was like a drug addict. You know what I mean? Yeah. So it wasn't about like respect or anything about it. It was just like I was literally blind. Are you still in therapy? Yeah.

How's that going? It's going good. What have you gotten out of it? it was just like I was literally blind. Are you still in therapy? Yeah. How's that going? It's going good. What have you gotten out of it? I've, dude, I finally, finally, I'm like starting to really grieve the loss of my best friend, my brother, Ali. Okay.

I cried so fucking hard last night. Like my eyes were bloodshot. Like I, that's one of the reasons why I was late. To be honest, I didn fucking hard last night. Like my eyes were bloodshot. Like that's one of the reasons why I was late, to be honest. I didn't sleep last night. I fucking cried for like two hours. Okay. Well, we're sorry for your loss. Yeah.

Lost a good one there. He was one of my close friends too. He's one of the most fucking beautiful human beings. He was friends with all of us. Yeah. All the cast and Ariana, everybody was tight with was tight and i came across a picture of him and i like when he died there was so much going on i never truly got to grieve him and uh last night like i literally fucking like i fucking sobbed for, like, fucking two hours. I was up all night.

I was pacing around. I sent, like, Robbie as a sister and was going to text her. And I, like, wrote a text and, like, put it in my notes. But I didn't sleep last night. I taught him to do that. Don't snap respond. Put the message in your notes when you wake up in the morning if you still want to send it i mean this is one-on-one shit but i don't feel like a lot of people don't practice this true do you feel like you're a victim in any way when it comes to you

and your ariana's relationship i'll let's i i don't i don't want to victimize yourself but no you can add nuance i don't know if there's room for nuance. I mean, like, for what happened, like, for the kind of fucking hate that happened, being pushed to almost, like, dude, for half fucking sweet Lady Jane, like, fucking put Sandoval's a liar on fucking cakes. Like, I don't know, man. She did close down.

Yeah, I know. She did? That's fucking, like, fuck them. That was, dude was that was such to put like sandoval's a liar on cakes well i think that this is a this is a classic case of uh uh the straw that broke the camel's back here well we don't want to go to you off no i think i think that he was about to well this is what you told me yeah i don't want to tell your your your story tom but you were on the verge of snapping.

You were at your lowest point. And then for whatever reason, the sweet lady Jane cake, sorry to laugh, was the fucking... That really did it for you. We did get one of those cakes. They sent it.

They sent it. We didn't ask. Okay. They sent it, Tom. That's an important detail. I did not purchase it. That's an important detail. But they did send it.

But they have also closed down. I don't want to prey on anyone's downfall being a small business owner I will never do that that like really really really hurt me I showed up that day Ariana had like I'm literally trying to like make ends meet like and

she doesn't pay the fucking bills and like I'm the only one paying them and like I show up back after tour like and they're doing a photo shoot my assistant is helping like the fire alarms going off and they're like making fun of white nail polish making fun of like everything that's me everything that's me batteries white nail polish anything I've ever said and then I get the sweet Lady Jane fucking text. And I'm like, dude, I literally, I had Kyle Chan come and grab the guns from the house. Yeah. That day.

I was really bad. Yeah. How many guns do you have? Two. Shotgun and a pistol. Licensed? Yes. Okay.

Yes. And just in case anyone's thinking about Rob and Tom he also has nunchucks he has do you still have those size I have a ninja sword

he has a ninja sword very well prepared for anything those are those are pandemic purchases I have Megalodon teeth I have a ninja sword

signed by Randy Jackson he does honestly you're kind of saying things that people might want so maybe you should stop how do you Schwartz think Tom Sandoval is misunderstood?

Good question, Nick. In regards to topical stuff like this whole affair and everything going on, it's weird because it's like when I'm one-on-one with him and we're behind closed doors, he says all the right things. His heart's in the right place. He hates himself for the way he handled it. He's full of regret and remorse. But then sometimes like,

yeah, throughout this, he's had a tendency to, to, you know, to, to say all the wrong things on a public forum. You know,

I know you are a good person. I wouldn't be friends with you if you weren't. I know you weren't. We've, you know, you've done some stupid shit as I have. Do you think, uh, you don't suck. Dude, you've done some stupid shit, as I have. Dude, I suck, man. No, you don't suck.

Dude, you got... Not with a pity party. You don't suck. Oh, dude, I suck, man. Dude, Tom, you don't suck. Listen, you're a great friend. You inspire other people. You're a fucking go-getter, you know?

You got like six projects you're starting. The band is gaining momentum. Dude, by the way it's like people love talking shit about like i hate when people are so hate on other people for just doing and trying you really bared your soul i mean in the beginning it's like you guys have come such a long way and i feel like the band i don't know you should be proud of the band people love hating on tom sandoval and the most extras but that's they have people who it's so easy to hate

while you're sitting behind your computer, but that takes a fucking Herculean amount of energy to do to start a band and to tour. And I don't know, let's try to prop them up a little here. Have y'all ever had an orgy together, the two of you? Hell no. We have a- Y'all kind of give off that vibe that y'all would like probably, maybe threesome. Have you ever had an orgy together, the two of you? Hell no. We have a vibe that y'all would like probably. Have you ever had an orgy period?

No. We have a. I've never had a. I've had a threesome. With Schwartz? No. Oh, just in general. Okay.

You don't give me that vibe. I'm capable. Oh, no, you want the vibe. So which one is it? I thought Natalie offended you. I'm a little offended. Well, I mean, it's, I'm just like, y'all just love each other. So it's like, and like, not on that way.

We kind of have an unspoken sort of promise that we don't want to see each other's penises. You've never seen each other's penises? Never. No, I've never seen a thing. That's shocking. The thing about penises. Almost in a weird way. You guys are so close that you would just like,

yeah. Take your, I feel like there were so many like hot tub parties. No one ever was like, let's get into it. Not even a weird way. Yeah. Fuck.

Yeah. Fucking Stassi. Just like every fucking episode. She's just, she's naked. Even when I got naked on the show, like, uh,

he looked away. I've never seen, I've never seen you naked. I've never seen your penis. Yeah. That's good. I'm happy about that. I know me too. You can't seen your penis. Yeah, that's good. I'm happy about that. I know, me too.

You can't unsee it. Alex, do we still have texting office hours? You want to give someone else some relationship advice? Are you up for that, Sandoval? Okay. I'm so down. Maybe. Is this live?

They're going to call in, yeah. Oh, I would love to. They're calling in for earnest advice. Can you chime in, too? I will lead the charge. Okay. Okay. they're gonna call in yeah oh i would love to they're calling in for earnest advice can you chime in too i i will lead the charge okay okay now sandoval the whole purpose of this is we learn through our mistakes yeah and the goal is to be able to offer words of wisdom by the way we're in on things you've learned tom and i are in on the joke so tom and tom giving relationship advice ha ha ha let's try we try. We do this with every. I know.

We do. I know. You guys. We did it with Gypsy Rose. Oh, yeah. She crushed it. We talked about Gypsy Rose earlier. I don't know if Tom, if you're familiar with her plight, her story.

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So I went on two dates with a guy before the holidays And things kind of fizzled So I don't know how to ask him out in the new year Okay, tell me about these two dates Yeah So we went on, we mountained Went on a first date a few days later Went to a wine bar, hit it off, I think

It was good, Like conversation was easy, good banter. He was a lot more attractive in person. So that was good. That's cool. That's cool. So how did you meet this guy? Hinge. Hinge. Okay. So you met him on Hinge. Then you went out on a date. Did you hook up? No.

No hooking up. All right. How did we leave things after the second date? So I stayed over. No hooking up. Okay. Did we just cuddle? Did we make out? Heavy petting? Yeah, there's making out.

Oh, you made out! Yeah. Okay, cute. He like dropped me off at my apartment the next day. And we didn't like have any set plans. This was like a week before Christmas. And then he ended up going out of town like a couple of days later.

And then he got back the day I was leaving for Christmas for like a week and a half. Have you heard from him at all since the second date? So yeah, so we texted a little bit, like a few days after that. And then I just kind of let it fizzle. Like I let the conversation in because he was like on a trip with his friend

and I didn't, I wasn't going to blow up his phone. And i just figured we would like talk at some point and then we didn't so you were left on read who texted who last i actually didn't respond to him so technically you owe him a response well okay so that's when i wrote the email but then i did text him and he like a week ago what'd you text him i was just like hey like how are how was your christmas how are the holidays something along those lines and nothing very generic i know and he didn't he didn't respond to that no he did he did oh okay what did he say he responded and like seemed enthusiastic and like seemed happy to hear from me. Okay. And didn't respond like a couple of texts later. To what?

What didn't he respond to? I don't remember exactly. It was just something about the holidays. And I, this might be on me. I didn't like ask a follow-up question or anything, but. So one could argue that was this kind of a benign hey how are your holidays conversation with no real necessarily point to it other than you were using the holidays to check in and it just kind of stopped like made plan yeah the hope was you were hoping that you would get

the conversation going use the holidays to check in and that would propel a oh my god we need to get together for sure and have that third date but he didn't do that yeah okay mel what's could i ask you what's um what's preventing you from reaching out again right now like in this moment is it pride or do you just feel like it's his job yeah do you think are you waiting on the man so to speak yeah um no that's like i guess that's why i'm here like it is kind of pride but i'm not totally against it like i just don't want to come across like i don't want to be like needy texting somebody who's not well i mean if you called us up and said hey listen i've texted this guy like three or four times and no response that would be like it's time to move on

and if you were to text him again i'd be be like, that's a bit unhinged. He's made it pretty clear. You know, he's not into you. The only thing he's made clear right now, you guys have had two nice dates, whatever. Like, that doesn't really say or do anything. And then the holidays happen. The holidays are always like a weird time. I've literally experienced what you've experienced, where it's just like you had a couple nice

dates with someone and you guys go home for the holidays, and like, you know, they were nice dates, but you didn't like leave the second date being like, holy fucking shit, I met my person, you know? You're like, I had a nice time, but then you go home for the holidays, you catch up with friends, shit happens, and it just like, you lose that

momentum. And now, both of you are probably just sitting there, eh, you know, kind of like you know kind of like you kind of forgot how nice it was and someone's got to make their move do you like karaoke or darts karaoke not so much okay you do darts yeah

well I think like maybe you should hit him up and be like yeah let's go with like friends multiple people like you can see who he hangs out. Like, so, so she can see who he, like who he surrounds himself with and he can see who she surrounds herself with.

And, and it's safer. There's a buffer. If you're insecure about, it's like, like go do an activity, go do X throwing. I do agree with Mr. Thomas Anival that I think an activity. Yeah. Would be a nice third date suggestion

for sure and then like if you find yourself wanting to separate you're like oh my god if I could just please just get rid of then you know then you know you know what I mean know what no like you know like if you're

like in a group of people and you're like, you want to break away from the group? I just want to break away from the group and make out with you or like whatever. Like then you know. There's some tension. Okay. Yes. Yes.

Wait, I got an idea. How about, how about we workshop hive mind right now? Right now, Mel. A text to him. Yes. We workshop. We get a female perspective. That's as if you listen to the show.

That's what we do. It's called texting office hours. Yeah. Okay. Oh, okay. I text to him. Yes, we workshop. We get a female perspective. That's as if you listen to the show. That's what we do. It's called texting office hours. Yeah, okay. Oh, okay. I do. Good job. Speaking of the mic, Swartz. Hello. Alright, so anyways, let's get it back on track. The overall point is if you're still interested in this guy, you absolutely should reach out to him. Yeah. And instead of being vague and passive-aggressive

and arbitrarily checking in in hopes that he's like oh my god we should get together just fucking ask him out yeah just text me back what that's funny he said yeah just text me back yeah don't send that

do you know if he's back he's home from his traveling his holidays both of y'all are in town currently. As far as I know, yeah. Okay. Okay. So what should we send him, Swart?

I like, okay, this is how I would present it. Okay, not to overthink this, but I would have something lined up that you're doing with or without friends and be like, hey, I'm doing X, Y, Z. If you want to come, I would love to see you. No pressure. I always end it with the no pressure.

I hate that last part. You do? Should I not? I do that. Yeah. Why? The no pressure sounds like you're adding pressure. There's pressure to hang out with you. You're right. You're right. You're right. Why is spending time with Tom Schwartz full of pressure? I do that in

established friendships and relationships. Okay. All right. All right. Somebody knew that might be a red flag. You're right. Keep it real simple. Hey full of pressure. I do that in established friendships and relationships. Okay. All right. All right. You know, somebody knew that might be a red flag. You're right. Keep it real simple. Hey, no pressure. Don't say no pressure.

I retract. So much pressure. So much pressure. Hey, I'm going to give you all the pressure possible. Oh, I got, I got a better one.

How about this Mel? Or else, or else dot, dot, dot. Uh, no, no no it's perfect hey what are you up to this weekend I know of this really cool

bar video arcade bowling alley dark place karaoke doesn't fucking matter we should go and check it out I'd love to see you again yeah I'd love to see you again is a great way to beautiful but no But no pressure. No pressure. Cute.

Do you know that? Let's just send it right now. Just to think of a place. Yeah, I don't know a place off the top of my head. Google it. What? It doesn't matter. I don't know if like... I feel like a fair compromise. Now she's got to like make a plan with her girlfriends to like

go to a... play fucking darts. We're not inflighting the friends. Throw axes. Oh, this is no friends. This is just one-on-one. I think friends is good. It's fine if friends are there, but I don't think... You want to see who he surrounds himself with.

But it's not that necessary. Sure, it's not necessary. Here's a good compromise. Put the template in your notes. Yes? And then you can fill it out once you get the idea. Okay. Okay.

No? Okay. No pressure to do that. No pressure. Don't text your ex happy birthday. This is fun. What do we got so far? I'm here with you, Mel.

I know this really cool place that I don't know. It can just be a fucking bar. Like it doesn't have to be an activity. Is there a new bar that you haven't seen yet? Tongue punch the far box. Yeah. I'm like kind of new where I live. Oh my God.

You've been great. Have you seen one? Do you live in Los Angeles? Cause I would love to host you at Tom Tom or Schwartz and Sandy's. And I'm serious. I'm a hundred. I will take care of you's. And I'm serious. I'm a hundred. I will take care of you. Okay.

I was serious. I was gonna take care of your tab. They need the business. Set you up. Make you look like a baller. That's a joke. That was funny though. So yeah.

Literally any of these bars that you've driven past in the past couple of weeks, you thought, I should go there sometime. It doesn't fucking matter. Yeah. You can just say saw this bar. I wanted to check it out. I wanted to check it out. Let's go. I'd love to see you again.

Okay. And you have that bar in mind? Not yet. No. Okay. Are you going to send this? I will. I don't know if I'm going to send it right now. I need to think about it. Are you going to send it though? Yeah, I'll send it. Okay. She don't give a fuck. I'm invested. I'm invested in your relationship. I'll never see him again if I don't.

There you go. Or, you know, eventually three weeks from now, he'll get bored and be like, oh yeah, I should reach out to her. But listen, at this point, you've only had two nice dates. You guys don't, neither of you owe either of each other anything. You guys just lost momentum. That's all. Yeah.

And because you're thinking about him and you'd like to hang out with him again it's on you to initiate and get that momentum back and that does not make you crazy it doesn't make you desperate like you had a nice time with him and you'd like to see him again what about for educational purposes we formulate the most toxic thing you could send them right now like what not not to say? Yeah, what not to say. Like worst case scenario, early on in a burgeoning... I feel like y'all would be great at this.

What would you... I set myself up for that. Tell me what... What's the worst... The worst thing is... Honestly, I'm borderline offended that you haven't reached out to me lately. Yeah.

I gave you my lips and you i gave you i don't know i'm that'd be bad that'd be bad yeah that would i want a tongue puncher box oh no jesus no no no no no i'm sorry mel i'm so sorry yeah i, I am. Just cut that out. This whole episode's been a bit unhinged. A bit, to say the least. Okay. Okay, I think we honestly, we have come up with a good text. Are you happy with it? Do you feel comfortable sending it? Does it sound like you?

Yeah, I think so. The big thing is to not worry or judge yourself about acting or sounding a certain way that you just can't possibly come across that way by just simply showing an interest. What is wrong with you? Me? I'm fucked. Yeah, I'm good. All right. Wait, Mel, it's nice to meet you.

Nice to meet you too, Mel. I'm rooting for you. I'm so invested. I mean this sincerely. I'm invested in your, I want updates. I don't know how to get them from you. Nice to meet you. I'm rooting for you. I'm so invested. I mean this sincerely. I'm invested in your, I want to, I want updates. I don't know how to get them from you,

but we'll provide. Oh, okay. Yeah. You'll give us an update. Okay. Yeah. I'll update you and you can update.

Was this helpful? Pretty helpful. I get in my own head a lot. So that's okay. We're here to help. Yeah. You have nothing like this is all normal like i said i think the holiday christmas break for dating is you're not its only victim yeah right now i can

tell you where his head at his head is at where it's just like yeah you're oh yeah she was really a really nice time she was nice i should go out with her sometime he said that to himself you know yeah but he's not like you know maybe he's got some shit going on or whatever. And maybe he's telling himself, I don't know. She didn't seem all that interested, whatever you, cause you're so worried about playing it cool.

Cause you don't want to sound crazy. I don't think I was on the date just more. So now. Sure. Yeah. You've, you've played so cool that he's just like, I don't know.

I haven't really heard from her. I guess she hates me. Reach out, find out, be be direct if he doesn't respond you have your answer move on if not you go out with him again yeah don't don't say what I said don't say what I said all right all right all right we want an update please we

we love we love the shooting of the shots and you know because you never know he could be your person could be be. We'll see. We will take full credit. I'll invite you to the wedding. Thank you. I appreciate it. All right. Thank you very much for calling in. Thanks for bearing with us.

Thanks, guys. Bye, Mel. Take care. Bye. Toms, thank you for coming. I want more. You want more? You coming I want more you want more you didn't want more more of her

well more of you guys too oh no more of I thought I was hoping there'd be more live uh callers final thoughts Sandoval

speaking in the mic you can pull it towards you you're crying can I no I'm not oh I'm not judging you look a little misty

I'm asking if you're crying brother I'm not dude no I'm okay I love a good cry you know nick like it was really cool what we went through in special forces man it was really fucking cool man i agree and uh we'll never we'll never experience that again and uh i i appreciate that and I appreciate like getting to know you, you know,

like I, I do. I, I feel the exact same. Yeah. And I really wish you the best time. I wish you peace. I do.

Thanks man. Thank you. Right now, right now you're not, you don't seem at peace. That's cause he didn't sleep last night. Whatever the reason. Right.

I thought you said that. I wish you peace. You're going to find it. It it's gonna be a good year for you it's gonna be good year for me 2024 great year for you guys I just I feel it like I say that every year I'm like woo I'm excited but I don't feel it they're empty words I'm paying lip service

to the new year this year I'm feeling it alright no more okay you know what else i'm retiring the old schwartz the one that's like ah shucks i don't know i was drunk i'm gonna i'm gonna take a stand are you though no i mean probably not but um uh sheena like did you make out or what the fuck I mean listen I'm gonna have to give you the stock

I'll watch the show and see how it plays out but also could I just give you an eye roll I mean you did bring it up I know

I just that was very regretful here you go here's a question that I think you can answer are you

excited for season 11 are you worried for season 11 and do you think there's a chance that this season won't live up to season 10 i don't think it's there's no way it can live up to season 10 but i think um it's just replaying it in my mind as i'm sitting here right now. It's raw, heartfelt, hilarious at times. I'm just throwing out words, but redemptive. But I like raw. I feel like it's going to be fun for people to watch

how everything played out. Because there was obviously a chasm in the group. And we've never been so cratered as a group of friends or a cast if you want to call us that technically a cast but really we're a group of friends who love each other and maybe that's what i want to end on i love i love my friends and my cast mates even if they don't look back exactly and i understand that but i I, I, I reconnected with a lot of people that I've been on the outs with this past

season. And it felt really good. Um, I had some major breakthroughs with people that I, uh, sort of lost communication with. How many seasons do you think Vanderpump has left? I don't know.

12, 13. No, I'm just kidding. I don't know. I feel like there's, we saw, we were,

we thought we were done after season nine. Season nine was actually... Season nine. Really bad season for us. And then season 10 was 11.5 million viewers. Walking dead numbers because of this shit. And people don't realize... Would you do it all over again for the 11.4?

I mean, surely. If you could time machine. I give you a time machine over again for the 11.4 i mean truly if you could time machine i give you a time machine tom sandoval and everything that you've gained and everything you've lost is available to be you can break up with ariana the way you say you would and season 10 is a bust and there is no tom Sandoval in the... That wasn't... Would you take it all back, or would you... That's a tough... Dude, I quit drinking for eight months,

and I was on a path of not great. I learned so much. This cataclysmic whatever event. What's one of those things? I can't look back and say, would I do things differently? Of course I would. No, no, it's a coin flip. You either never cheated on Ariana, you broke up with her prior to dating Raquel,

but season 10 is a bust. I don't care about, it's not about the show, it's not about the show it's not about anything i think that overall the breakup in this horrible way has benefited her way way more and i think that like i feel like it's only it's we talked about this before you showed up i feel like two people who haven't benefited from it is this guy right here yeah and my And my business, our business and myself. I mean, you've kind of benefited from it. You were a mass singer.

You were on special forces. I got eliminated immediately. A mass singer. Did you make a lot of money? No, I did stars on Mars, which was one of the coolest experiences of my life. Oh,

you didn't do stars on Mars. Listen, let's be honest. It was probably because our ratings are through the roof and all eyes are on us. But, uh, it was very cool I forgot about that you did get to do that yeah I got to do Winterhouse too

but I did that before way way less like less than half of what we got paid to do that's still real money I mean dude I like get paid a lot more than that to do like Instagram fucking things so still? no exactly no i don't

so like no and and here's the thing buddy over here so like what i'm what i'm saying is is like i i can't i can't say that i would i mean everybody else benefited not me not me okay fair enough do you think you should have no okay okay no we'll end there tom nick tom nick this was this has been something uh it really has This is the most unhinged episode we've ever had. Thanks for finally showing up. I'm glad you showed up. Are you still going to hang on to this I was also late?

You were late. Okay, you were on time. I literally was like I could be there at 5.30 and I showed up maybe at 5.35. I don't know it was 536 man it was so late

dude come on alright whatever we were sitting there we were literally sitting there going like okay Nick let's look at the text message oh he's finally gonna pull up a text message hey can I just say before I get out of here I'm so happy for you guys thank you Tom

personally professionally I love to see you thriving and you guys are cool as shit thank you for showing up thanks for answering my questions I didn't mean to get defensive early on I just felt like it's just like when someone presents a question like so the whole world hates you

what are you gonna do to prove them otherwise? Sorry if I phrased it. No, no, no, no, no. That's how I interpreted it. So maybe that's not on you. It's on me. I'm fragile. I just, in my experience,

I know that I have been judged by the media, the fan base, and I have always welcomed, honestly, those types of questions because I have embraced the opportunity to like- Prove them wrong. Not even, it's like, and I don't feel like I have always welcomed honestly those types of questions because I have embraced the opportunity to like prove them wrong not even it's like you know I don't feel like I have to because I put a lot of effort into not wasting my energy reading my shit or whatever and but if I get asked that question and I have an opportunity to answer it and talk about my values or what's

important to me or etc etc like I do embrace that so I wasn't trying to come at you I honestly saw it as an opportunity I like that about you see I have a tendency to sort of shut down in those moments okay and those are I guess missed opportunities yeah I have a tendency to be like see nobody said I'm not going to do that anymore

it's 2024 we're a work in progress after this progress after this podcast you showed up I appreciate it. You were on time. Always on time. I was not on time. I'm always. And I'm sorry for being late.

I apologize. It's okay. I think we've come to the conclusion that you didn't in fact find any text message saying that Nick was too late. He was an hour late. An hour. Yes. He was an hour late.

I told you he was going to give you the what about you. So our podcast was 20 minutes. Dude, you were an hour late, motherfucker. So our podcast was 20 minutes. Dude, you were an hour late, motherfucker. So our podcast was 20 minutes long? Because I text her at 6.52. And you're claiming I showed up at 6.30. I mean, I can pull up Jason's text being like, is he showing up? Was that at 3.30?

Dude. We definitely left it open-ended going into the day. No, I know. And then I text you. I know. I can be there at there at 5 30 and then i showed up at 5 30 you did not show up at 5 30 dude you did not let's end on a positive note how should we end you did not show up at 5 30 i appreciate you coming on appreciate you having me here it's really nice all. It smells lovely. Schwarz, you know he was not there at 5.30. I don't honestly remember either way, so I'm of no use

in this argument. Well, go check out Disrespectfully in case you haven't listened to it yet. Can you please plug your ex-wife's podcast for us? Shout out to Katie's podcast, Disrespectfully. Dana, how you been? Are you ever going to be maybe a guest on it?

If they want me to, sure. Okay. Yeah. I don't think they'll want me to, but I'm here if you need me or want me. Okay. You're available. If you need me, if you want me, if you need me. Oh man. That was beautiful. Bloom. Inner Bloom by Rufus T. Soul. Hey guys, if you're still listening,

thank you for sticking around. Nick, thank you so much for having us, by the way. It was my pleasure. This episode will not be charting. I honestly don't know what it's going to do. Do you have anything else to ask me? No. This was a long time coming.

We've been trying to get you on for a while. I know, I know. I don't know if you think this, Tom, but I have the best intentions for you. I know you do. I don't think we see eye to eye in a lot of things, but we don't, but, but I, I, I truly do believe that. Um, I think you're a good person and I really like, I really like really enjoyed bonding with you. Like I really did. I'm a tough love friend. Yeah. I know you are. I respect that, and

I get it. I get it. Well, thanks for listening, guys. Don't forget to send in those questions at asknickatthevilefiles.com for all things texting, office hours, mediation, Ask Nick, you know the drill. Thanks for listening, guys. We appreciate it. We'll be back on Monday for another incredible Ask nick episode

we'll see you then all right bye