The Viall Files - E716 RR - VPR Lawsuits, Cyrus Drama, Traitors, LIB, Summer House and Bachelor with Brooke & Aricia

Episode Date: March 5, 2024

Welcome back to The Viall Files: Reality Recap Edition! Today, we are joined by the co-hosts of “Even The Rich,” Brooke and Aricia to chat about all things reality television. First, we talk about Kate Middleton being off the grid for months - and the best conspiracy theories we’ve found online. Then, we talk about Traitors and Peter’s mom soft launching his new relationship. We also talk about the Cyrus family drama - including Tish marrying Noah’s ex. Then, we talk about Rachel Leviss suing Tom and Ariana. Next, we talk about Summer House and Lindsay accusing Carl of not being sober. We also touch on Jax and Brittany separating. Then we talk about Housewives and Love is Blind. Finally, we talk about the Bachelor and his hometown visits.  “Love is not blind. But it might be deaf.”  Start your 7 Day Free Trial of Viall Files + here: https://viallfiles.supportingcast.fm/  Please make sure to subscribe so you don’t miss an episode and as always send in your relationship questions to [e-mail] to be a part of our Monday episodes. To Order Nick’s Book Go To: http://www.viallfiles.com  If you would like to get some texting advice send an email to [e-mail] with “Texting Office Hours” in the subject line! To advertise on the show, contact [e-mail] or visit https://www.advertisecast.com/TheViallFiles  THANK YOU TO OUR SPONSORS: StitchFix - Thanks Stitch Fix—they just get me. And they’ll get you, too. Try today at https://www.StitchFix.com/Viall and you’ll get 25% off when you keep everything in your Fix. Shopify - Sign up for a one-dollar-per-month trial period at https://www.SHOPIFY.COM/viall ALL LOWERCASE. Lume Deodorant - Control Body Odor ANYWHERE with @lumedeodorant and get $5 off off your Starter Pack (that’s over 40% off) with promo code VIALL at https://www.LumeDeodorant.com #lumepod MeUndies - Get 20% off your first order, plus free shipping, at https://www.MeUndies.com/VIALLFILES  Episode Socials: @viallfiles @nickviall  @brookesiffrinn @ariciaskidmorewilliamsss @ciaracrobinson @alison.vandam @justinkaphillips @leahgsilberstein @dereklanerussell Timestamps: 00:00 - Intro 03:51 - Where Is Kate Middleton 10:53 - Traitors 20:09 - Cyrus Family Drama 32:54 - Rachel Leviss Lawsuit 54:20 - VPR 01:01:29 - Summer House 01:18:10 - Jax and Brittany 01:24:42 - Housewives 01:36:56 - Love is Blind 01:54:49 - Bachelor 02:07:20 - Outro 

you're crazy what's going on everybody welcome back to another jam-packed episode of the vile files reality recap edition i am your host, Nick, joined by the household of Allie, a sweet, sweet, sweet boy, Justin. And back, Sierra, Robin, what? What, Allie? No, it was when Justin switched to my angle, I was just like

Are you okay now? I just have like the worst, I don't have like a pleasant face. I'm not like a joyful person, so I had to like... I have an unpleasant resting gaze as well, so it's okay. Sierra Robinson returned. She's at the desk today. I'm so excited about this.

So today, your forecast. It looks good on you. You're also drinking Prosecco. Drinking Prosecco. I'm wearing a blazer. Also drinking Prosecco. It does look good on you. Drinking Prosecco. I'm wearing a blazer. Also drinking with Sierra. Arisha. No. You're so close.

I'm thinking Alicia Keys. You're thinking too hard. I am. That is the problem. He said, don't say it. Don't say it. Arisha. Her parents weren't thinking that hard.

Arisha. Arisha. You shouldn't either. Arisha. I got it right. Nailed it. Nailed it. Yeah.

Like Alicia. Arisha. That's all that matters. That's all it is either arisha i got it right nailed it nailed it yeah like ali arisha that's all that's all that matters yeah you got it returning to the show and a much easier name to pronounce brooke her co-host from even the rich uh and also even the royals yeah yeah uh a very popular show Even the Rich, about all your scandalous. Yeah. Deep dive into celebrities' lives. Do you need to wait for the Vanderpump cast to become actually rich

for you guys to cover? We did a live show. You did. First live show ever. About Scandival. About Scandival. It was like a narrative story about Scandival

from Ariana's point of view. From Ariana's point of view. You guys also have Even the Royals. We do. Yes. Congratulations to that. I see that.

I see that charting. Yeah. That was very exciting. Yeah. I posted a screenshot. We were one and you were like four. Oh yeah. I was like,

I'm not cropping this. Yeah. I mean, they definitely, they definitely like, you know, award new shows. My old files is like,

we don't have to take screenshots we're just always up there congratulations yeah congratulations I didn't know we were competing

in this particular episode but like I mean you know okay not your eyes looking like the eye emoji is like

look I will fuck up your you guys have a great show speaking of the royal family just to kick and we have so much to talk about maybe let's just set up some front expectations with our audience what all the things we're going to get into we have where's kate middleton that we're about to talk about we got the cyrus family drama like oh my god yeah wow god i love wow wow. Then we will dive deep into Bravo World, starting with the Rachel versus Tom and Ariana lawsuit.

Just more lawsuits in Bravo Nation. Then, you know, subsequently go VPR. We'll do some housewives. Oh, and Summer House. Summer House. Since we had Lindsay Hubbard on the show, she really made a splash in this episode, on the show. She really made a splash in this episode, gaslighting her former partner and using his sobriety against him for a little spat,

which was an interesting move. Summer's supposed to be fun. Yeah. Summer is supposed to be fun. Supposed to be fun. And then we'll get into Love is Blind and wrap it up

with The Bachelor, I think. Traitors as well. Traitors! Oh my God, we'll start with Traitors. Yeah, so it's just so much to talk about but we are here we are here and we're here for you to get it all into your

favorite content all right where the fuck is kate middleton my i didn't even know this is a thing and then all of a sudden my twitter feed every other tweet was a joke about yeah where kate middleton is are you guys concerned is there something going on with the royal family let me ally has let me know that the all the most important people seem to be kicking it. But it would be a really good time for Harry not to be such a little bitch. Wow. Hot take. Well, that's where Kate is.

She's summering with her in-laws. She's having an affair with Harry? She's having an affair with Harry? That would be good. I like that answer. Can you imagine? Yes. I sure can.

I'm not worried about her. We need Bravo cameras to pick it up. Do they just like the tension? I like that answer. Can you imagine? Yes. I sure can. I don't, I'm not worried about her. We need Bravo cameras to pick it up. Do they just like the attention? Is that, cause like, I think I said this on pop extra, the beauty of very few benefits from social media as it relates to like how it's affected our culture.

But from the eyes of a celebrity, what social media has done is they've at least on, on some level decreased the impact paparazzi has had because you can be like you know what's true this is what i'm doing ah yeah you could just selfie it and you could put it out in the world you can control the narrative it could even be like in your bed in your bathroom like it doesn't even have to you don't have to be full glam you can be like aha hashtag authentic why isn't kate Middleton just like clearing it up, just giving us a little something, you know?

But like, why is it so mysterious? Why is it like she why is she off the radar so much that the world has freaked out? And now it's like BBL accusation. I mean, now we're just having fun. Now it's just like, yeah, you just like you know can you answer that Brooke absolutely Nick thank you so much for asking I think you're right that's a really good point so it's either gotta be something

serious that they don't want us to know about or they just like the drama because like why wouldn't she the royal family is so like particular about their well yeah and they're so controlling over their narratives or they try to be very controlling over their narratives or they try to be very controlling over their narratives that i feel like even if kate wanted to just post like

a screenshot from the tub being like i'm great just recovering they wouldn't let her so she's a prisoner yeah yeah but isn't she their like golden child like compared to megan this is the consequence of the fact that i think Harry and Meghan are no longer there. One, we don't have an extra couple as senior royals to take over these engagements. And two, like they talked about in their Netflix documentary, there's a lot of swapping of stories and things and deals they have with the media between their kind of different houses or camps, if you will. And now it's like we don't have Harry and Meghan to distract us in the press, so it's just, where is Kate Middleton?

Are Harry and Meghan, like, loving this? Oh, God. They have to be. They've never said it. It's gotta be nice to not have a bunch of page six posts about her

for Meghan, I'm sure. I know, yeah. Taking a break, finally. Yeah. But I do think that, because there's that long-storied rumor that Will...

Is his name William? William? Yep. Bill. Prosecco was hitting me. That William has stepped out on Kate many, many times. So it's like, it's one of those things. I really only

just make fun of Harry and Meghan. But like, I could see, you know, maybe this is the final straw and she's like, I'm done. Yeah. I could see something like that happening. He's cheating on Kate? That's been a rumor for a long time. I don't trust that guy. Look at him.

You can't trust love shapes like that. He's shady. And remember, he like used to be the hot one. Yeah. Back in the day. I remember my friend was obsessed with him. And now.

Is he not? This is a genuine question. Genuine question, Allie. And Brooke. And I can't pronounce her name. I'm so terrified. I'm so terrified. Alicia. with an r exactly it's my dyslexic brain i go through like you should you should be inside my head when this happens it's like you got it you got it you got it oh no oh no oh no

and then i fumble the bag why can't he why he's got unlimited resources harry we're talking about harry or william william and and and oh we've done we've come so far in the world of technology when it comes to hair restoration oh yes i mean listen we're not supposed to talk about this anything from a pill to surgery. They're doing great things. You know, some of your favorite actors, you know, who you're all like, wow, they all have good hair genes. Yeah. Can we name one that comes to mind?

I don't want to out anyone. Steve Carell. If you have eyes. I'll out them. Yeah. I mean, like, look at. Yeah. Look at episode one of The Office and look at Steve Carell these days. Look at Chris Evans hairline when he was just starting versus now.

And I love Chris Evans. There's some Bradley Cooper thoughts out there. Either way, they all look great. They all look great. Joel McHale. Joel McHale is who I was going to say. Who is very open. Yeah.

Has some of the best hair in the game. I didn't realize it until he made a cameo in an old season of Will & Grace. And I was like, what? I did a cooking show with him. He hosted it. And like Ben and I were on. And like I had just got done listening to his episode on Justin Long's podcast where he's just like, yeah, I would be bald as shit if I didn't have a hair transplant. And just like as a guy who's getting older and has some vanity. Yeah.

I just was like staring at Joe's hair. And I was like, your hair looks so good, man. Like, that's good for you. You've like. Yeah. Any concerns I've had about aging. Like, thank you. He looks fantastic in person.

Anyway, so why can't. Enough of me like talking about Joe McCarroll. You're like enamored with him. Right? Why? Why doesn't he? Yeah. Well, probably because. I think he would have had to

get ahead of it before now now now it would be way too obvious and then it'd be like he's using the taxpayers dollars because like all of his money comes from tax can he mow some lawns is that what it is he can't wait what well i'm just saying like you know it's like i didn't know if that was like a euphemism for something that i didn't know he has to get everything checked because of taxpayer dollars, can he like have some like, no, this is my money. I can do it whatever I want with it. He has to ask his dad for money.

That's what they all have to do. He doesn't have any walking around money. No. His dad's got him on a loan. Anyways, you would think he could, because you're right. You slap some hair on that man. It's a different. Yeah.

He goes all the way from like maybe a four to an eight. He's forgetting the accent. He has a British accent. He's like five. That's. Oh, you're adding one. One for the baseline. Yeah.

Okay. Well, then the fact that he's a prince. How many points? I mean, nowadays. Yeah. The wool's been. It's not so great. Yeah.

So now he's back down to a four. Now you're just like wondering if your genes are even clean. It's just like how many cousins are in this DNA pool? Yeah. You know. Literally. I also think it's like the genetics as well. It's kind of what MJ said in this week's episode of Traders when she was like, I don't think

what John is old. I think they just don't do Botox in the UK. Yeah. You know. She's never been to the UK. Yeah. That's a great segue too. That's a great segue, too. That is a great segue.

It's so good that maybe we'll just jump around and start with Traitors before we get into the Cyrus. It's the blazer. It's the blazer. Yeah. Traitors, our new favorite show on reality television every Thursday night at nine on Peacock. We will be talking spoilers up into the finale now,

which is great about watching this season for the first time. I don't even know how that ends. I mean, I'm learning about the show as it goes. I don't even know. Like, are there more traitors? I don't know. What is the finale? What does it even mean?

It sounds like this is one of the last roundtables that they're going to have to be able to accuse a traitor. So it sounds like maybe there's one more, if not two more situations. So on the first season, I don't know that it's going to be the same. But when they got to the final four, they have a chance to go around and say if they think a traitor is in. I can't remember if they can call out who they think it is. Okay. And then if they call them out, they eliminate them.

So there were two left last year in the final four. And they were like just standing around a fire. Was it Ari? Ari. But he was like, I can't do this.'t like ari but he was like i can't do this i'm a traitor and he like came clean and the other traitor did not siri fields who's like a legend uh and she she won yeah and the other two traitors because they were normal people on the first season it was like normal people and then like reality stars wait wait what yeah it

wasn't all reality stars on the first season of Traders? Half of them were just regular people on a reality show with stars in their eyes and trust in their hearts. And now they hate the world. And they were devastated because they were both very close to Ceri. Ceri, yeah. Who went on to be a big brother.

Yeah, survivor legend. Wow. My big takeaway from this episode of Traders was we had the pleasure of speaking with Candy the other week, which really painted a picture.

It really framed my opinion of Phaedra. Interesting. But I gotta say, regardless of what I think of Phaedra, I've never met Phaedra, so I can't have an accurate take about who she is as a person, but as a reality TV character,

she is such a good villain. She's fun to hate as a villain, as a TV character. She is so, she's fun to hate as a villain, as a TV character. Yeah. She was like Don Corleone, you know, sitting in her throne of power. Yeah.

You know, like being the one who's like, I didn't know that wasn't me. You know, I don't, I'm just, I'm just here. Meanwhile,

she's just planning hit after hit. And she has all these housewives who are only voting Peter out because he i know he's not a housewife i mean she by sheree is it she by sheree yeah yeah joggers she's sweet summer winter is she there's a you know what i mean you know she's sweet well there's a meme going around right now and it's of the moment of sheree asking phaedra if she's a traitor and they're like ah the moment that it clicked that this is what you're supposed to be doing on traitors right as her plane was boarding her big plan

to try to uncover whether Phaedra was a traitor or not was to ask her you know what are you a traitor and a traitor she can't be she cannot possibly be well and they edited it to make us think that

maybe Phaedra was going to come clean and tell her, you know, like they're not allowed. Peter is also apparently dating Ekansu. I saw.

Yeah. Oh, Lord, not Ekansu. A soft launch by his mom. Wild. I thought Johnny Bananas was the one that.

No, it was Barbara posted a photo of yeah, the mom posted a photo of her out at lunch with Ek and Sue and her daughter. And it was just very like, Peter's not in the photo. It's not other cast members. It's very clear that it's like, you're having lunch with your son's girlfriend. What is your guys' lasting impression of Peter Weber?

Here's the thing. This should be studied because the survivor to traitor pipeline really changes my opinion of bachelors like ari for example after ari season let's be honest are you trying to say the bachelor world doesn't accurately represent the full character of its cast i refuse to believe it just kidding um and yeah exactly it makes and i like watching the bachelor this week i was like they seem so boring. And then you see them on The Traitors and they have personalities and they're likable. And thoughts and opinions.

And thoughts. Like, Peter, he's a strategic icon now in the reality world. He is flying the biggest commercial planes you can fly. He is flying to, like, South Africa. It sounded like a euphemism or something. What does that really mean? And I just, you know, you hope that Peter has the wisdom of a trader, like someone on Traders and not someone on The Bachelors. But, you know, the problem solving skills that are required to be a pilot.

Yeah. Peter also like, Peter has game. Oh, yeah. As the kids say, he has the Riz. Is it the Riz or is it Riz? Just Riz. It's just Riz. He has Riz.

I literally didn't know i hate it it's short for charisma i know i still hate it yes you didn't know that i did i also think it's a british like slang thing that like and when it comes over here it's not natural it's like the whole fetch thing like it's like oh we're gonna try to say riz over here i always think of like a reservation at the ritz when i hear riz for some reason and i'm like this is such a stupid thing to say on Putting on the Riz. Yeah. Peter's gotten a lot of, you know, as many Bachelor alums do,

has gotten a lot of from fans. You know, he had a very complicated ending to his season. Barb is his mom. That complicates things in itself. You know, when she's soft launching their relationships and he loves his mom, obviouslyitionally as he should yep yeah it's just like it's just a tough look when you're when you're 30 years old and your mom's soft launching your relationships you're taking too long uh that being said like peter has swag he's got riz and i'll never forget the first time i met tyler cameron uh we were out to lunch in lunch in New York and it was the season had not wrapped.

And Tyler is Tyler. Gorgeous. Good looking. Obviously very charismatic. He's just like, how could you not be? You know, like I'm reminded of pretty privilege when we're watching Joey. Joey acts like a guy who's just been hot his whole life. And I think that's where the charisma comes from.

It's just like, I know. But Peter, I'll never forget. Tyler was like, we're at lunch. And he's like, you know, who's got like the most game in the business. He's like Peter Weber. And you say Peter's I'm every time I see him out, he's like the always this affable fun guy. He's always around women. He's just like, yeah, he, he does.

He does well with the ladies. Whatever you might think of Peter Weber. He is not suffering in the attention department when it comes to the ladies. So he's the ultimate bachelor winner. He seems to be. I was going to say, did you remember from the interview when he said that he thought I can see when they pulled up in the SUVs was his ex-girlfriend? And then I was like, well, made her your new girlfriend real fast.

No, didn't you? That's right. You did say that. He's smooth then I was like well, made her your new girlfriend real fast now didn't you? He smoothed. I'm just gonna date her. I was terrified it was my ex and now I'm like great new girlfriend. And now she will be at some point. Well, when you have a type, you know, you're just basically trying to swap personalities. Which is wild because I watched an episode of Naked Attraction and she got rid of one of the guys

because her girls No, just a different girl. Someone show no just a character was a person was like i can't i have to eliminate you because you remind me too much of my act well that demonstrates the emotional intelligence that women have over men yeah you know like yes you know women will be like no i'm gonna help myself from my smell so men are just like no no i can do this again this isn't. It'll be different this time. It'll be different this time. Yeah.

But anyway, I am sad to see Peter go. Me too. He had a good run. I was. And I was so disappointed on why they voted him out. There's too many. It's too much Bravo. Too many Bravo people.

They got to rein that in next time. And just final thoughts on just the CT of it all. I mean, that man is a perfect combination of like part brute, part teddy bear and just a really good jawline. Yes.

I love him so much. When he did the cheers for John leaving, I was like, and he does accents too. What can't this man do? I love him. I love him.

It's the CT and the ladies and they're like, we just need one man around to jump on the logs and that's it. Yeah. We'll kill the rest. When they're like, we just need one man around to jump on the logs. And that's it. We'll kill the rest. When he did that challenge where you would just think he wouldn't be able to. He's been doing challenges for, what, 20 years?

Since I was a child watching him on television. And legitimately just soared through there. And I was like, oh, my love for CT. I knew he was going to. Did you? I knew it. I was like, get CT out there. Enough of this.

No, he was like, this is made for me. Yeah. You could see just the joy in his eyes. And Trishel, too. I mean, she's been doing the challenge for years. You know, they both killed it. Yeah. Yeah.

And then MJ made it. Finally. She did her. When her life was on the line. She was like, I'm going to do it. Do or die. They really milked that. You know the power that Andy Cohen has over Bravo Nation

because he is conducting the reunion for Traders. I love Andy as the host of all the reunions, but Alan Cumming. Right. Why isn't he hosting it? I've always wondered that too. It seems like an obvious he should be hosting it, and the fact that he's not,

Andy really has a stranglehold over that gig because like, you would think that Alan would do it. I looked it up and Andy's been with them for 20 years. Bravo?

With Bravo, yeah. Wow. Good run, Andy. I mean, he's made Bravo, though. That's true. Like, Housewives, Andy. All right. Well, anyways,

catch up on Traders on Peacock Thursday night at nine for the finale, so we can stop saying spoiler free. All right. The Cyrus drama. Cyrus family drama. So bring us up to who knows what's happening.

We have to talk about this today on our show. Yeah. It's wild. Really good and prepped. Allie. Okay. So have you ever thought to yourself, Hmm,

what if I was dating slash, you know, maybe more of a friends with benefits situation with someone and then you end things and then suddenly your mother is engaged to your ex fuck buddy. It's

truly wild. Is it Noah Cyrus is the one? Yes. So Noah Cyrus and Dominic Purcell were seeing each other prior to her mom marrying him. So they were seeing each other as friends of benefits off and on. They stopped seeing each other and Tish started something up, a source said, adding that Tish knew he had been seeing her daughter. Tish never gave Noah the chance to talk about all this before they got married. And they said, I do in Miley's backyard. Miley was the maid of honor. Noah was not present at the ceremony. And Miley Cyrus has since come forward saying she had no idea

about the dating drama surrounding Tish and her mom around the wedding. And the source said that Miley confronted her mom about it. She thinks it's a strange situation, but loves her mom around the wedding. And the source said that Miley confronted her mom about it. She thinks it's a strange situation, but loves her mom and wants her to be happy. That family competes. I know. My eye is twitching. Over the most ridiculous things.

There's no family bond. There's just a bunch of people who think they're forever competing for status. Which is crazy. But it makes sense, though. It's kind of sad, though. Imagine having... Well, it makes sense. First, you have Billyy ray in his heyday he was yeah mr country music yeah he was a list yeah and then his daughter his daughter yeah even bigger yeah and then you have

the rest of the fam who like it must it must be tough you know and they're just all competing they're all competing for status and that that's how this happens, right? I just love that. Like, Miley's, like, the star of the family, though. And she's just like, I'm going to disappear for six months. And everyone else is like, by the way, here is the drama. And we're like, wait, what? Well, Miley Cyrus doesn't bring drama anymore.

So they're like, we'll make our own. Do you think each side is like, we got to get Miley? Otherwise, no one's going to take our side seriously side Seriously they're like we need Miley on our team I will say Miley is picking sides though She's picking Tish right? When she got her award I think it was the Grammys She didn't say her dad She said everybody and she said and I'm not forgetting people

And didn't say the dad Is it Noah and dad's team? Yeah so Noah and Billy Ray they've been Publicly on one side Versus Miley Cyrus sides with her mom pretty much all the time. God, how sad. Just the whole thing. Also, it's like a reverse porn situation.

Because don't you usually start with the elder? Mm-hmm. Yeah. You usually don't start and go to mom? Well. That's definitely a kink. It's definitely a Law and Order SVU plot line at least once a season. I was going to say Jerry Springer.

Like, I was like, I'm not, you know. You guys, guys, stop taking it away from porn. Let's get back to that. But you're right. Because, like, well, no. Because it's like, oh, stepmom. Yeah, I guess. I guess nowadays it's all gotten really weird.

Yeah. Yeah. There's something for everyone. Nowadays. I imagine. I mean, how do you move forward from that, though? Like where it's just like, hey, mom, I've slept with your husband or hooked up with. We don't know. This is their, this is what they call their family dynamic.

Oh. I don't know. I don't think they care. What would you umbrella that as? I think there's, yeah, just it's all competition. It is all about winning and losing. Yeah. There's no family. There's no yeah just it's all competition it is all about winning and losing there's no family there's no family that's sad it is sad i feel like we're looking at it through like the context of like our families like oh i would never do that that's

insane but i feel like they're for their family like what you're saying like they're all kind of this is how their family functions like this seems almost almost. Their currency is fame. Yeah. Yeah. And like, if my, we talked about this, like for Miley to publicly, I don't know what her dad did, you know, and probably a lot of shitty things,

you know, but to publicly use that platform is a, is an opportunity to just take a jab at your dad who gave you life. Her first Grammy win to win to like make that. Is a choice. Yeah. And it just says that there are no limits to, or boundaries.

There's no boundaries in this family. It is just about winning and losing. And then when you have Miley, the matriarch of the family. Portish. Portish. Portish. Yeah, Portish. You know, picking a side,

she's publicly saying, you know, whose side are you on? To her family. Yeah. You know? I think I fell for it a little bit because when we first talked about it

before we knew this part of it that he had dated Noah or hooked up with Noah, whatever. And what's his name again? I just know him as Guy from Prison Break. Dominic. Dominic Crusoe. I was like, team Tish. I was like team Tish.

Cause I was like, Oh, whatever. Let her live her life. But now I'm like, I don't think I can say the same. I feel the same way. I was very much like,

let Tish have her happy ending. It sounds like the relationship with Billy Ray was tumultuous. They were separated for a lot longer than they were divorced. And so I was like, by the time they were divorced, they accepted it. So I was like, yeah, get your hot man and wake up and live your happy life. And so I was like, by the time they were divorced, they accepted it. So I was like, yeah, get your hot man and wake up

and live your happy life. But I'm like, that would be like one little detail I don't think I could live without. Yeah, that's kind of a... It'd be a hard detail. Or if my daughter came to me

and said something and for me to be like, well, we don't need to talk about this until after I say I do. It's a little... She's like, that sucks, but have you seen his abs? You know?

Come on. Get over it. Do you think they swap notes? Ah! No, no. Maybe not right now. Maybe when they come back together. He hates it when I did this.

Don't go near his earlobes. He hates that. Hey, mom, he's not much of a giver. Like, you're going to have to coach him up. He does love when you recite quotes from Prison Break, though.

He'd love me then. Love that show. Poor, poor... Poor who? Poor fam. Poor everyone. Except Dominic Persall. He's doing fine. No one's mad at him. First time I learned his name. Ever.

I still don't know what he looks like. If you brought five guys in here and said, pick out Dominic. Damn it, I wish we would have done that. Yeah. Too bad we couldn't get him for this show. Well, we can do it right now. Bring up the cast of Prison Break and see if we know the names. The only one I know is Wentworth.

Which one do you think is Dominic Purcell? Michael Schofield. Was he the brother in Prison think is Dominic Purcell? Michael Schofield. Is he the one? Was he the brother in Prison Break? Dominic, yeah. Mama Cyrus was sleeping with which person? No, no. That one before.

That one. Go back. Go back. Close your eyes. There's a whole cast photo. There you go. Right there. Which person?

It says all their names. Yeah, that's why I didn't say it. Don't look at their names. I'm trying to not look at them. Don't look at their names. Don't look at their names. Just give me like a... Oh, there you go.

Do you want to make it bigger? There we go. Yeah, right there. I would guess... Can you even see them? I can't really tell. Can you make it bigger? Yeah.

Oh, no. The other photo. The other photo. Oh, my God. The internet is killing me. Okay, I'm going to guess that Dominic is... No, the one...

Yeah, this photo. There you go. Thank you. The guy in blue? Or maybe the guy in silver. Blue? That one's wearing blue. Between the girl with the white dress,

one of the guys on either side of her. No. Okay, so I'm going to say no to that one. Second guess? The guy in blue jeans with the black leather jacket? Nope. Nope. Who has the most obnoxious outfit?

It really is kind of obnoxious. The guy with a gray jacket. Yeah. And sunglasses on. That's Dominic. That's him. So the last. This man should not be sleeping with a girl in her early 20s.

I am concerned. How old is he? 50. I don't know, but he's like white. His facial hair is white. Wait. He's like 54, I think. Oh, my God.

That guy was hooking up with Noah Cyrus. And that's what I'm saying. I think she's 24, 26 or something. He's got grandpa. He doesn't have daddy energy. He has granddaddy energy. I think he's 54 now and if it was a few years ago, I'm giving grace at 50. I think the hair, I think the white beard is, I think he looks

younger than that picture is indicating just because of the white hey guys love more compete less cyrus family genuinely have one life you know yeah yeah of course plenty of other guys from prison break what was that are hot there's plenty of other guys from prison break that are just as hot that they could date truly truly yeah i listed them all what happened to the main guy on the way back are they bringing them back i heard they were bringing it back he's still around he's still around is he married

making good choices I don't know if he's partnered up he's gay he's openly gay now well they can be married heartbreaking day for me he's been for a while

yeah god oh I was so in love with him I've seen prison break like three times all the way through yeah interesting I'm on well

okay I just watched breaking bad for like the fifth time really well now it's a hard show to rewatch.

Really? Yeah, I don't like how it ends. I need there to be actual justice, not self-justice. And that pisses me off. Wow. Hot take, I couldn't get past the first three episodes. We don't have time to argue about that. It's a hard show to get into.

I can't. No. Better Call Saul is hard to get into. Oh, that's even harder. It's impossible to get into. Okay. You're that's even harder. That's impossible to get into. Okay. You're throwing me off here. Stitch Fix.

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Shopify.com slash V-I-A-L-L all lowercase. I was going to say speaking of getting into should we get into the lawsuit? Yeah, we should. Oh boy.

Speaking of. Time to put on our lawyer hats. Raquel is suing Tom Sandoval and ariana maddox i'm just gonna start by saying my take overall is that rachel slash raquel continues to simply just get really really really really bad advice from people who don't care about her well-being her mental health really her at all and she is easily persuaded yes you know i think she was easily persuaded by producers when she was on vanderpump one could argue she was easily

persuaded by tom sandoval when she was in that. Not to take anything away from her responsibility in that relationship because she tries hard to shift the blame solely on Tom Sandoval. But nevertheless. And now she seems to be just persuaded by either the people of iHeartRadio and or any lawyers. Bethany Frankel. Bethany Frankel. And it just seems really, really sad. I think we can all agree, everyone in this room, that revenge porn is disgusting.

Absolutely. It's awful. There's no place for it. I am glad that this great country of ours has come down hard and created said laws. And just disclaimer for all the people out there, it is alarming. If you send your friend,

if you send someone a nude, watermark them. As who so famously said in our show, Lala. Wasn't it Lala Milan? Yeah, Lala Milan said it on this very show. I don't know if she coined it on this show, but she gave us the insight that the only way to send a nude is to watermark them with the person's name you're sending it to. Oh, wow. Interesting. That's like when studios give us.

Exactly. Yeah. Exactly. So that way, if it gets out, you know exactly who leaked it. Yeah. Yeah. I'll probably just not send nudes. Well, there's that too.

But I, you know. But if people want to send nudes, they should be able to without their DNA. I just remember growing up and just being alarmed by the amount of, in my circle, guys, who would unsolicited show the annuit of their partner. And I would say, I don't know, 15, 25% off the top of my head. So just, you know, at your own risk. But it's a disgusting behavior, revenge porn of any kind. I think that goes without saying. I don't know if that's what we're dealing with here.

And just the fact that this is coming out now, just the timing of it, it's my understanding that she is being represented by the same lawyers who are all part of this whole bravo yeah reality reckoning reality reckoning and so uh and just the timing it i think ali right there's a statue of limitations on on revenge porn is that correct it's one year that seems short by the way very short. Now, one year from the act? No.

So one year from when it was discovered that it was either recorded, sent out, like from when it was discovered, which if you remember, Ariana found it on the phone on March 1st, 2023. When were these cases filed? February 29th, 2024. 2024 yeah which any other year right in march 1st yeah well i think also it's interesting that she is uh going after tom sandoval and ariana because well i don't know the inner workings of how revenge porn works from a legal standpoint it doesn't seem like she has a strong case on either of them as individuals and it's almost as if like together there seems to be a case because tom allegedly recorded it without her knowledge right and we are dealing with two people who we have known to be

liars so now it's a he said she said situation with that yeah and then you have ariana who allegedly was the one who distributed and it's my understanding when it comes to revenge porn it's more about the distribution of the content she has them like she has four kind of things that she's suing for it's revenge porn invasion of privacy eavesdropping and intentional infliction of emotional distress in my mind the revenge porn has more to do with distribution because you can actually sue someone for revenge porn, even if you were at one point, okay with them filming it. Yeah. So it really, I mean, you can't also see someone who filmed you

without your consent, but I think that would fall more in the invasion of privacy and eavesdropping cases. Yeah. So it's almost like Tom is being sued for eavesdropping and invasion of privacy and ariana is being sued for the revenge porn aspect so you could sue someone for revenge porn if one of the cases they listed as an example was if you were filmed without your knowledge and then it was distributed so it's almost like tom and ariana together yeah are that example of a revenge exactly and it just seems like there's and clearly this is coming from a bunch of lawyers who have convinced her to do this and it goes seems like there's and clearly this is coming from a bunch of lawyers who have convinced her to do this and it goes against everything she is claiming to stand for in terms of like wanting to take accountability to move on to protect her mental health and this is coming

from a person raquel rachel we want to respect that she wants to be called rachel yeah just for for people are still confused we're still calling twitter twitter though yeah we are and we never will stop we'll never stop ever ever i don't know what actually went down uh with uh with rachel and sheena at the night of uh but let's assume there was some kind of physical altercation yeah my point is is is that Rachel has shown a willingness to use the legal system for retaliation purposes because whatever happened

between Sheena and Rachel then, clearly the filing of a restraining order, Rachel did not think that her safety was at a continued risk from Sheena. Right. After Sheena did whatever she did

in a moment of shock and rage that was a payback yeah for sure right yeah I think and then she dropped it so clearly there wasn't a strong case there because like why do you do it and then drop it it was this she was making a statement so Rachel has already proven to use the legal system for that's true revenge or for payback. So now you have this situation. And also, by the way, Ariana has publicly claimed to have not distributed this video to anyone other than Rachel. Well, they're including that. They're counting that. She sent it to herself, allegedly, and to Rachel. And then Rachel's heard, at least according, like they word it obviously better in the lawsuit, but basically she heard that maybe she sent it other places sure so she doesn't clearly seen proof it

seems unclear and something that her lawyer said was rachel believes that tom has multiple recordings and ariana has distributed multiple not just this one and this belief is based off of what that was their statement hears? It's got to be. You see it. You see the phone. That Sandoval possesses multiple illicitly recorded videos that depict her in a state of undress and engaged in sex act. And that Maddox has obtained at least two of the videos and she then distributed or showed them to others without Levis's knowledge or consent. Well, I mean, if she goes through with this lawsuit, that can be proven.

Yeah. Pretty easily. Yeah. Pretty easily. Yeah. Pretty easily. Pretty easily. Yeah. But as far as we know, it's just assumptions on the part of Raquel. And I'm guessing these assumptions are coming from a bunch of people in her ear. Yes. Telling her what she should do.

But I'm just thinking, again, just like Rachel. Like, again, this wasn't actually distributed in a way that like people who have been victims of revenge. Yeah. I mean, oh, my God, there's some terrifying and horrific stories of people who have been on the wrong side of that. Yes. And had these videos distributed and the effect it's taken on their mental health. And to my knowledge, that doesn't seem that what's going on here. No one's ever seen this video.

Thank God. Because it's not all right to see it. Right. Right. And then just think about like. So.ana has claimed to have not sent it but let's for the sake of argument say that maybe she did send it to a friend or two yeah so it seems as though ariana so she finds out about this affair via the video. And for anyone who's never been cheated on, I'm here to say, when you find that out,

it can be your lowest low. Your world truly crumbles down on you. Doesn't make criminal activity. I mean, people have been murdered. People have found out. And that's wrong, to be clear. But just to emphasize what it can do to someone's world. And Ariana finds out, sees this video.

Yeah. And sends it to what I can only assume is her support system. Yeah. Oh my God, I can't believe this happened. Someone's just like, oh my God, are you serious? I don't believe it. Here's the video. Oh my God, I saw the video.

And so here is Rachel, whose actions played a significant role in destroying Ariana's reality. And in a moment of sheer panic and her world crumbling down, maybe, maybe sends it to a couple of friends. Again, we can only assume it's her support system. And now Rachel is coming after her for that. I mean, imagine the precedent this could send. Think about anyone ever having an affair. Now all you have to do is make a sex tape with your adulterer and then conveniently let the

person you're cheating on find that. And if they send it to anyone, including yourself, you then can go after them for revenge borne purposes. It feels like entrapment. It feels like the people who slam on their brakes in front of you and you run them. Yeah. And then you are able to. It just reeks of that. And it's especially I mean, I still remember catching my boyfriend at the time cheating and like not like in the moment but like i saw emails and the

first thing i did was like i gotta take screenshots yeah because i need proof i gotta come with these receipts and this was like 2011 so this was before people were like really with evidence so it's like i if i were in that scenario i wouldn't think twice about like i got it because it's like people delete shit all the time i don't trust anybody right especially tom sandoval And like I would take screenshots and like I don't know that I would necessarily. I could see her sending it to Raquel and be like, what the fuck is this? Like that seems normal to me. Yeah. And I think that she's co-opting something that's a legitimate thing that happens to usually women.

And I don't think that that's right. Like I don't think that that's fair to call that this that. and I don't think that that's right. Like, I don't think that that's fair to call that this that. But I do wonder if it's like they have played this kind of smart from the beginning because I think it's almost like we have a breadcrumb of like legal action in the fact that like way back when, when this was getting spread around, suddenly Raquel's team is sending out, you know,

like all of these legal paperwork to Lala and everybody else that was the whole send it to Daryl situation yeah so through that lawsuit does that not kind of indicate it was spread around the group and then even like a lot of this stuff for you know especially like the emotional or like mental health ramifications that she's had a lot of the times like they're able to ask for proof of you know a psychological breakdown or treatment or something like that what do we know about raquel she did like not one stint but two in that like inpatient program so it's like all of these things have been in the headlines and now it's like we have all of the proof to kind of prove her ace or at least make

a case maybe maybe make a case i don't know it seems weak because again it's all i mean well again it's they can phone records if they can they can prove but it just seems really icky to take advantage of someone's world collapsing on them and you being the one who did that and then to go back uh and then try to further destroy their life it just seems a bit icky and again i the the benefit of the doubt i'm giving rachel is that i just i think she's being taken advantage of by people around her yeah because rachel she doesn't seem like she i mean it's i want to know why are you doing this? She needs money. I guess. Well, she's got that $200,000 tab for the place. Well, I mean, I know I Heart doesn't pay their people very well.

No, her tab for the Meadows was $200,000 because she wanted Bravo to pay for it, and they refused. Oh, so maybe she has to do that. But it does seem like that's the motivation. Well, the lawsuit mentions, and Tom Sandoval also mentioned this, about how everyone's capitalized on Sandoval also mentioned this about how everyone's capitalized on Scandival, but him and Rachel. And it says something like that in the lawsuit. So it's very clear that everyone's pissed that Ariana's career boomed from this.

And she's allowed to sue like for kind of any missed opportunities. So it's like she could argue, oh, I was getting these brand deals. And then the second that I didn't, so she can sue on behalf of kind of those missed payments. 20s she's still very young she could very much use this as a as a platform as a launching pad for real change and positive change and everyone everyone would give her people are waiting for someone from scandoval to like be a better person from it truly i mean people would be lined up out the door if rachel really did the work to be a better person but instead she's just taking the bait you know what it reminded me of? It was an episode of season 10 on Vanderpump. Remember the scene where it was like the girls trip?

And they all kind of got drunk. I don't know if it was Vegas. I'm not sure. It was. It was Tahoe in Vegas. Well, it was that where Rachel got drunk, and she said to one of the ladies, maybe don't leave your man. She said it to Lala. She's like, well, I guess it's a good thing you don't have a man then. Which was a really terrible thing to say. A really bad look. She said it to Lala. She's like, well, I guess she's like, I guess it's a good thing.

You don't have a man, which was like a really terrible thing to say. A really bad look. She came across poorly. And yes, Lala and the rest of the girls spent the rest of the night talking shit about Rachel. Yeah.

And I think as viewers, we all like are watching this episode and thought to ourselves, Rachel is going to wake up, feel mortified by our actions, come out and apologize for, you know, looking like she's a homewrecker Yeah, yeah instead. What did she do double down double down and she was like you guys treated me poorly and blah blah blah so like the Willingness and ability and again does it come from Rachel or does it come from a producer being like hey?

You know what they were talking shit about you fucking last night and blah blah blah They were saying X Y&Z and I think that's pretty fucked up, and, hey, you know what? They were talking shit about you all fucking last night and blah, blah, blah. And they were saying X, Y, and Z. And I think that's pretty fucked up. And I'm guessing that's what happened. And so it just, I think it's really sad to see someone like Rachel. And Rachel, if you're listening,

because I've heard you listen. I just, I feel bad. I feel for her because I think she doesn't know any better. And I think she's being taken advantage of. And I think now she has lawyers up her ear. And I think they have a bunch of people saying no you're the victim you're the real victim here yeah when she's clearly not and instead of launching a podcast about like overcoming

this type of adversity she is on vanderpump via her podcast yeah yeah that's all it is yeah i did find it interesting and brooke maybe you did as well like with just the wording that her team which also it's the same lawyers who were working with bethany frankl on investigating the reality tv this is bethany written all over it and bethany has proven to be not give a shit about anyone else but herself all while pretending to give a shit but even their language it's like they're literally crafting it so that we view her as the victim of the situation it literally says she was the victim of the predatory and dishonest behavior of an older man yeah and then later on said she was subjected to a gag order prohibiting her from discussing sandoval's gross invasion of her privacy implemented by the

shows bravo and evolution media like it's the the gag order the older man like it's just the way they craft the statements even just like oh very poor raquel poor raquel yeah like again this is not defending tom sandoval in any way but clearly he has been the easy target for everyone yeah yeah and anyone in and rachel's camp is just like no let's just shift to blame to tom because it's very easy to do that. Yeah. And again, there's just no accountability on the part of Rachel, an adult woman who entered into a relationship on her own devices. And, you know, and she is like.

Well, I think and something else is interesting because like in this lawsuit, it very much like you said, is like she was taken advantage of. She was a victim. He was telling her what to say she was being coached blah blah blah but then she says in her interview with i think bethany or somewhere and she's like if he would have asked to record i would have said no it's like so are you a person that would have stood up for yourself and said no or are you someone who was being told what to do at every turn and being taken advantage of how do you know what she would say or not say at this point? I think she's been coached. But I mean, the show's been on for 10 years. How long has she been on the show?

Longer than a year. Season 5? It's one of those things where it's like at some point you have to take accountability. You're not 18. You are almost 30. Almost 30? Yeah, almost 30. You are responsible for what you do in these situations.

And it's like, yeah, Tom Sandoval is an older man, but you're also not a child. You're an adult. You are responsible. And it just seems like it's I like just nobody on this show in general seems to love to take accountability for what they've done. And this just seems to be another example of that. Well, and it's also like in a court of law, criminally, like you have to prove the intent. And it's just like with the situation, the circumstances as to like how Ariana came about

this video. If anything, it says a lot to me that this video didn't get leaked. Yeah. That this video isn't out on Reddit threads or whatever. People would have been dying to find it. If it was revenge, then it would be everywhere. That's a good point. So it's just like for me, I'm like, where's the actual like you taking responsibility? And then how did you get scorned in the process? Because I'm like, yes, you made a choice. Unfortunately, the man that you trusted recorded you against your will. By all means, do whatever you need to do there.

Go for that. But then coming for Ariana in the sense of, oh, she found a video and maybe showed it to a couple of people. If we all haven't seen it. At her lowest low. At her lowest low. And exactly. That's the interesting part, too, because when you're suing for someone for intentional infliction of emotional distress, it has to meet certain categories. And one of the categories is reckless disregard. And a way to have reckless disregard is the defendant gives little or no thought to the probable effects of their conduct. So Ariana's team could say she just shot it off.

She didn't even think. But that's like. But yeah, so her like Rachel's lawyers are literally saying we don't give a fuck how how she took being cheated on or the affair or how far the distribution went we don't care what mental state that ariana was in when she discovered this the fact that she was in this mental state proves that she was reckless with the content that she sent yeah which sounds so fucking icky and against the spirit of what revenge porn is yeah and this is such a bad look for Rachel. And like, well,

what's going to happen? Is this going to get settled? Is this going to go to court? Are we going to see this? They have their first hearing date set for July 7th. Well, that's, I mean,

all these, anytime you have someone going after some sort of celebrity with money, the goal is always to settle. Yeah. The goal is that the, you know, the idea is the celebrity doesn't want this to continue to be in the public eye in the press and that they will just pay for it to go away

that's why you you do have a lot of innocent celebrities do not always but sometimes there's a lot of bad ones too yeah there's a lot of that one too uh but the lawyers who are representing people like rachel that's that's their end game that's what they're counting is to they're counting on people like tom and aria willing to settle even if it's for like 50 or 60 50 000 or 100 you know and what are they suing for i heard it was at a really a billion dollars it's undisclosed i thought but maybe yeah i didn't see an exact number for the monetary oh what if they're like, fine, you can have this house that we're trying to get rid of. If you just leave us alone, you can have that house.

It just seems so icky. Yeah. And I think people want to root for Rachel. Like, I feel like if she just chilled, it'd probably be okay. Literally two weeks ago, we're like, Rachel, come on this podcast. I wanted Rachel to come on this podcast and do the very thing tom sandoval couldn't to come on here and answer some what i consider softball questions yeah about like reflection and growth yeah and where are we now and how have you used this like terrible thing is like a

platform for change and what do you want to do with it and blah blah blah blah blah and like she she had to do the bare minimum to seem like a rock star yeah juxtaposed to like how tom came across in this podcast and now i'm like ew yuck don't don't even bother we know where you stand yeah and that is someone who's like just wants to be the victim yep yeah it's tough zero accountability on both ends i will say to that note though i'm like i've been watching this season of vanderpump and same i I'm like, I feel like I'm siding with Tom. And I'm like, I'm such a sap for productions, like for them, because it's like, it's like, guys, just give him a break. He made a mistake.

You're not wrong. Here's where I'm curious what you here's when it comes to it sounds like you've also been Shijin on. Yes. Yes, I have too. So fun. Here's the thing thing we love relating on that note there's this thing there's this thing that people do when their friend is a part of a infidelity or cheated on or people love to make someone else's pain about them they love to co-opt someone else's pain and figure out how to be like, well, how was I victimized?

How did this affect me? Classic Sheena. It's like, they'll never understand how this affects you. I know! But like, in this particular episode, I was very much like Team Tom in that sense, where it's just like, Tom doesn't have to answer to any of these fucks.

Yes! He cheated on Ariana.'t have to answer to any of these fucks like yes like he cheated on Ariana he has to answer to her like all these people acting like they all have a one-on-one to have a Tommy like so how are you gonna make amends with me yes like that's what I'm like chill out it's like a weird like high school mentality of a group knowing that all of these people are in their 30s and 40s but it's like the like well you broke up our friend group so now you must repent and it's like y'all can't have separate friends outside of each other like you can't decide how you feel about this individual it has to be a collective we agree or we disagree on this person like that it's it's kind of bizarre that's why i can't wait for next week because we saw the teaser of sheena being like i can't hate

tom for you forever to ariana so I'm like, it better be good. Let's get into it. Sheena really can't get out of her own way. Ever. Well, it's all happening. Is she the one whose baby got blocked? Yeah. What?

Her baby got blocked by Tom. Blocked by Sandoval? Tom Sandoval. He blocked? Remember, she was like, how do you block Summer Moon? And I'm just like, who cares? Who cares who your baby is being followed by? That's so ridiculous to me. Or not followed by.

He was probably like, she can look at my profile from this one. So I'm going to block the baby too. I will say, Brock and Sheena's being a new father. Yeah. Very relatable conversation between a young couple. I can see. I definitely see Sheena's side of that. As a super anxious person,

I'd be like, I can't leave this child with anyone. We just had our daughter, River. Natalie's mom has been with us literally from the beginning. We're very blessed.

Both Natalie and I are very blessed in the in-law department. Both of our parents are just like, they're not there to parent. They're there to be grandparents and they don't share opinions

that are not asked. Love that. We're so lucky. And Natalie's mom is just a gift. We're so grateful to have her. But as Brock pointed out, it's just like, your mom's here every day. I know. So there's

an element to that. And again, it's been a joy having Natalie's mom here. We've gotten her on dating apps. It's been fun. She's out there dating. She's on The League. I'm coaching her up because she just got out of a a little of a bad relationship is she on raya no because they still won't accept me and they accepted somebody and i'm like i have an actual podcast you don't want uh you don't want so does everyone i now just want to be on it just to be on it you know i'm so sick of all these idiots getting on that are nobody you're still

getting to mention it so at least there you go yeah this this better be it's still working out for you but to your point brooke i understand i empathize with the, you know, it's like, I don't want anyone else, like some stranger. Yeah. I was like that with my dog, let alone something that came out of my body. I empathize with Sheena's plight. Every time Sheena, and that being said, every time Brock and Sheena do a scene, and listen, I get it. These are tv makers you know we mentioned last week that we get with the beverly hills housewives especially with the

kids like as someone who has been a part of creating reality tv and i do think the bachelor is the most authentic show in terms of like what is our real conversations like every time i see brock and sheena like have a dispute I'm convinced that when the camera stopped, they high five. Great scene. Excellent job. Really be in it. Like,

I just, it seems like, like Tom Sandoval, love him or hate him. That's Tom Sandoval. Yeah. That man is not acting. He's consistently his life to the screen.

And I, I can can't help but feel like brock and sheena are rehearsing their scenes well especially i don't know i can see it yeah in in regard like when you juxtapose what's the word i'm looking for the juxtaposition of scandival and then brock and sheena arguing over a nanny is like, who cares? I don't know. That's when I check out. I'm like, this isn't good enough drama for me. The bar is too high. We're talking revenge porn and lawsuits

and we got Ariana suing Tom for there's lawsuits on lawsuits. I mean, that's what's been like, I mean, it's terrible for Bravo and all this other, but like just the zeitgeist of the show isn't just the show. Yeah. It's everything. It's the podcast.

It's so. Everyone's got a podcast. Vanderpump is such a, it's the greatest reality TV show maybe of all time because of the generosity of its characters. True. And the botchery of its characters. And like Bravo, just all these lawsuits to me. Like, I mean, who knows? Like, I do think reality TV has cast some really good people, some high character, solid people.

And then they also cast truly deplorable humans. Yeah. It's a mixed bag. Yeah, it is. Just like the world. And it feels like most of the lawsuits are coming from the the latter of the people who you know and and no surprise i think the people who are the most deplorable the least likely to take accountability yeah yeah that that you know yeah um and and now you

have this whole like reality reckoning and and it's all gone nowhere and like it the the messiest bravo characters are the ones who seem to be ones taking legal action against bravo and it's all gone nowhere. And like the messiest Bravo characters are the ones who seem to be ones taking legal action against Bravo. Yeah. I don't know. It's just, it's also great to,

it's just, that's what I'm saying. Like, I feel like these lawsuits almost help make Bravo more interesting and they probably love it, you know? Yeah.

Yeah. Their goal is to keep their name in our mouths and they're doing a great job. Every day. They're crushing it. Well, that's what I also love when you talk about people, the deplorable aspect of it. But I'm like, I love like going back and then watching these people who are now coming forward being like, I was taken advantage of. I wasn't like, no, nobody told you to get drunk, take your clothes off and throw a tiki torch in the pool.

But you did. And then ask the producers, did we get it? Yeah. Did we get it? But then go on an interview saying i wasn't coerced and then two years later you talk to bethany and you're like i would never have and it's like why why are we now all of a sudden causing an issue where there's not i was also gonna say i do think it's the doth protest too much where it's like the people that kind of claim that they have their stuff together and then it's like when things don't work out their way, it's like, whoa,

the other head is turned. Oh, yeah. And that's for me, this week's episode of Summer House. Did you watch? Yes, I watched. Lindsay and Carl, like, we've been throwing Carl

to the dogs. I wasn't. We had Lindsay on this very show. I know. And obviously, you know, we would, we're gonna hear Lindsay out. And Lindsay went on a little bit of a PR tour before

her season came on. She was trying to get the Ariana treatment. For sure. I was gonna say, she's also an ex-PR girlie, so I'm like, she was like, get ahead of the story. I think her email still has PR in it. Yeah. Hubhouse. I think she still has. in it yeah um hub house and she still has yeah no well that is that is an excellent point um i think there have been a handful of bravo

celebrities who have tried to create their own scandal yeah oh yeah uh kyle i think uh we're trying to create one and we're not even on bravo so i'm sure lindsey I think is definitely one Taylor Shep Austin Olivia with the Taylor and Shep and Austin of it all was hoping to have a little bit of scandal sympathy it just goes to show these things have to happen

organically you can't create a scandal on your own it can't be manufactured which speaks to all the accusations and all the conspiracy theorists of was Scandaval the creation of producers? Yeah. There's just no way. No. They could do that.

I think that I think the actual act wasn't produced by the producers but i think everything that happened once it came out was it has been what specific well just like i feel like i by my conspiracy theory is that ariana saw the video and the she might have sent it to the producers i'm like i'm uncovering this how does how do we play this out like that's like i don't think that they were like tom go cheat sleep with r Well, she's also. That's what I mean. I mean, like, is that is that possible in the way the reality TV world works?

Yeah. Could I for sure. Yeah. Where there are meetings and conversations after Scandival was uncovered in terms of how do we film this? Sure, sure, sure.

Of course, they're making a TV show. I just mean the conspiracy theories that this from the jump. They were like once. Yeah. like producers were observing Tom and Rachel and they caught wind of the affair before the affair got uncovered. And this was awesome. Sort of perfectly crafted master plan to have Scandival become a nationwide, if not a worldwide sensation that has really,

I mean, it's like, it's still like, I thought a few months ago i was just like i don't know maybe it's just not worth having tom on the show like we talked about it so much and yeah yeah and for him to come on with with with schwartz and have it just like almost like read like we are like i feel like scandoival has never been more talked about and relevant now with all these lawsuits and the fact that Vanderpump is back on. And it's like this season of Vanderpump on its face is not that interesting.

It is. And yet every week I am just like, fucking cannot wait to turn it off. I cannot wait. Okay. When are we getting to the nitty-gritty right well you know one of the not to go back to the lawsuit but one of the things she's alleging is that ariana knew about it and encouraged it because vanderpump was gonna was doing terribly and she was in danger of being fired and i was like there's no way that is 100 coming from someone else who's planting that idea in Rachel's mind without question.

And Ariana also did say, like, because of her relationship with Sandoval and whatnot, that the second that she found it, she did send it to producers because she was like, I don't want this man to be able to talk to me out of it. Yeah. So it's like once it's been committed to and production has to pick back up cameras, it's like, no, we're going through with this because the truth is already out there. So I'm like with that, like, I don't know. I respect that. I think it's a bit of a if you need to get out of a situation and you know that this person has a hold on you, like by all means,

bring other people in. So I'm like, is that revenge? Which is why I think Carl had his breakup with Lindsay on camera, because I think it was the same thing. We saw Lindsay go on a whole PR tour. He knows her well. Babe, I lost my mind. I lost my mind. It was the it was the same thing we saw lindsey go on a whole pr tour he knows her well babe i lost my mind i lost my mind it was the it was the doubling down the next morning yeah people who don't know what we're talking about uh lindsey and carl were engaged lindsey came on the show and very much you know we appreciate her generosity and her telling her side of the story and again from our when listening to lindsey it was like, yeah, I mean, there's making reality TV, and then there's your life. And Lindsay's

big thing is, how can you break up with me without any heads up on camera and take advantage of the thing that's most sincere to my heart, like our relationship? And yeah, on its face, it sounds pretty fucked up. Meanwhile, while that was all going on

every one of her castmates seemed to be a united front being like just wait just wait just watch yeah you know and so we and so here we are and i watched you just waited you just watched episode two episode two like we we usually have to like kind of get a little lead in we're like four episodes and we're like all right finally we get to the nitty-gritty yep yep no they were like hi episode two minute like she could it was her first weekend in the hamptons and she couldn't keep it in the box like that was wild and then to go on she accused him of he's been sober for two years she accused him of well they seem to get in a bit of a spat usage yeah we don't see that we don't see they're fighting as couples sometimes too yeah it's probably like dropping the ball a little bit like on just like where i'm like you you don't see. They're fighting as couples sometimes too. Yeah. Is Bravo like dropping the ball a little bit?

Like on just like where I'm like, you don't have cameras in the car? Why don't we see that? Why don't we see this? I mean, you can't feel it. Although we know better by now too. I mean, they're in a relationship. This isn't the Truman Show. Yeah.

They didn't agree to have their entire lives filmed from the moment they wake up to the time they go to bed. But I could refute that because in Summer House, they have cameras in the corner of every room. So you are literally being filmed from the second you wake up because all you're committing that because in Summer House they have cameras in the corner of every room so you are literally being filmed from the second you wake up because all you're committing to

is a weekend. When you're in the house. But on Below Deck, also a Bravo show, we see them in the car all the time going to and from the bar.

It would be nice but they didn't have it or they didn't show it. I don't know. Either way. Should we sue for the footage? I'm emotionally distraught.

Because we didn't get to see it. Yeah. That sucks. You know? We are victims. They had a reckless disregard sue for the footage yeah i'm emotionally distraught because we didn't get to see it yeah that sucks you know we are victims they had a reckless disregard for how brooke was going to feel and i need some brand new we're all upset yeah because she makes her pain our pain and then lindsey appears to gaslight the shit out of car Carl and uses his sobriety or more uses his addiction. Yeah. Against him and accuses him of being cocaine Carl.

Yeah. While she's been drinking all day, mind you. So I'm like, your judgment is not clear right now. And so while Carl is out with the boys, Lindsay is on a campaign tour with her friends on camera. Emphasis on camera. Accusing her fiance of relapsing and doing hard drugs. All because she doesn't like how he reacted in a fight, I'm assuming. Yeah.

And then she calls up Carl and Carl could not have sounded more sober. I know. Which I'm glad Gabby was like, not have sounded more sober. I know. Which I'm glad Gabby was like, that sounds like a sober man to me. He sounded like the designated DD who was just like really taking care of his boys all night long. And like just being like, hey, guys, you know, I'm the sober guy. So I guess, yeah, we're almost home, babe. Could not have been more calm. Yeah.

Like, I don't know much about cocaine. It's my understanding that you're not calm on it. Yeah. We've been talking so much about how we couldn't do cocaine because we'd die. Like, it's true. You're not, you would never be that calm. Like, I think he would be talking a mile a minute.

He wouldn't be answering his phone because he's partying. Like, well, and she kept saying, well, now he's sober. As if like, it wears off. So now. Is that how that works with cocaine? I know. Do you sound like.

You snap your fingers and then you're sober again. Do you sound healthy and normal and like in a good headspace? I was like, ask that to anybody who's gotten a cocaine charge.

Like, why didn't you just snap your fingers and say it's over? Has Lindsay come out and made any statements regarding episode two? She posted on her social. She posted on her story.

What did she post? She pretty much doubled down. Go ahead, Justin. I'm sorry. Back to you, Justin, in the studio. Feel free to keep talking while I pull it up. No, we're going to watch you. I do think it's bullshit, though.

Like, I don't like, addiction stuff just really pisses me off. And I know that all these shows love to exploit it in their own way. But just to like, for somebody that you are engaged to, presumably you have a deep love for. You don't just get engaged to anybody,

I don't think, Nick, right? Well, I mean. Oh. I mean. Not anymore. But like, it's like this is your fiance. Yes.

I would hope you have just such a love and compassion when you struggle with addiction because that's such a serious thing for her to just flippantly be like he's off the sauce and they also were on the backtracking a bit so her post said after watching back this week's episode i wish i had used better wording i was emotional and hurt by what had transpired earlier in the night and what i said was meant to be a private conversation at home with one of my best girlfriends i have never questioned his sobriety before this moment.

And from day one, I was his biggest supporter. I've always been transparent on the show about my feelings and I've leaned on my friends for support. And that was my only intention here. Okay. Lindsay, love you as a character. Loved having you on the show. But like you're, you are not stupid.

No. Yeah. You're not naive. Yeah. You knew you were on camera for a pr girly that was like not that's not the response now you're sounding like riley tom sandoval's genuinely and we know you're not that well the funny thing too is that i loved amanda uh the night before she was like i i took notes because i just felt like this was something i needed to remember

because they all know who they're dealing with yeah So she sits there and goes, I was trying to have a private conversation with my friend in our home and it's like, no babe, you got to the bar made sure everybody knew that you were upset with Carl, then got in the Uber and then filmed your conversation over and over again knowing you're being filmed on a TV show for this weekend. If you didn't

want to talk about it, you didn't have to. I would have broken up with her right then and there. In an instant. And like poor Carl, like i can't believe i'm being like poor carl while i was over here like this guy called a production to break up with her and now i'm like oh my god this man like literally is trying to reason with her and it's like i'm just gonna go on a run if you could just leave me alone and she's still gotta worry about his his fiancee at any moment accusing him of falling off the wagon on national television when she doesn't get her way in a fight. It's awful.

Have you guys watched Summer House for a long time? Yes. Or are you like new reviewers? No, I'm new. Okay. All the way. Because I feel like anybody who's seen. Ciara is like an encyclopedia of Bravo.

I'm a Bravo girlie. Yes. I feel like anybody who's watched it knows that that's how Lindsay is in relationships. Yes. Like, I feel like anybody who's watched it knows that that's how Lindsay is in relationships. And that's why when this whole thing came out, I was like, I'm giving her the benefit of the doubt, but I don't buy that she was a victim in this. That's why I feel a little vindicated. I'm learning on the fly.

I've kind of, you know, I've known, I like to give my fellow strategic people the benefit of the doubt I like to think of myself as a critical thinker you know just in life and in general I think that's that's a good thing to be yeah sure I think people can use their critical thinking like anything you can weaponize anything you can abuse anything you know and I think in reality tv generally speaking being a critical thinker is seen as a negative. You're some sort of villain because, you know, a lot of people on reality TV are kind of like, you know, like the critical thinkers, like, Oh, I'm the master plan, you know, but like, I just don't think of being a critical thinker immediately means that you're up to no good.

Right. Yeah. So I wanted to give Lindsay the benefit of the doubt and kind of watching this unfold, like not having the benefit of, of knowing Lindsay Hubbard's past behaviors. It's been fascinating to watch this and to feel wronged by giving her said benefit of the doubt, knowing that this was a lot.

This, this, I don't know how you recover. We're only on episode two which is just wild to me as i said i was like never could i have ever thought and especially because in episode one there was a conversation between gabby carl and lindsey where i was just like oh where gabby goes we were just having the best time we just we don't even know who's missing because then she's like well obviously we are and it's just like you come in and shift the entire

dynamic of this peaceful house and all you have to do is just be nice to your fiance and then it's like you could deal with this all through Monday through Thursday but no you literally came in and were like he's cooking Carl and it's just like honey calm it down

I'm surprised though like you would have thought well to your point it's only episode two. Yeah. And we know the ending. And we know the end. And being that it's only episode two, if this was, Lindsay I guess seemed to be completely unaware or forgetting

that she did this. It's giving PR spin of, it's easy to say that I was blindsided. It's giving reactive and not proactive. Lindsay coming giving reactive, not proactive. Lindsay coming on the show was proactive, right? In the vein of being proactive against thinking about all this fucking shit I did that I have to like,

make sure I have to account for and put a spin on it. She didn't come on here and, and cover that basis. No, which means she, which tells me it was just, she forgot about it or didn't think of it or wasn't aware of it. Cause she could have come on here and be like,

there's a scene where I just like, you know, she didn't come on here and go like, yeah, listen, I've did some shit. And there was a time, you know,

early on where I was just like, I kind of maybe like lost sight of him and maybe like lost Carl's trust because I questioned his surprise. She didn't do that. She could have got ahead of it then, but she didn't, which means that she doesn't realize maybe just how deep her actions go which means that maybe this there could be a lot more of this this season well is it possible she couldn't say it no i don't think lindsey was playing by the

rules when she went on her own pr tour i think she was yeah i mean it's even the her her little follow-up message where it's like i use the wrong words and i'm like what words would you have said like you're not yourself carl like you know what i mean where i'm just like no you you said what you should say raging coquette yeah that's what it's given classic misspeak you know isn't it lindsey's like reputation to be activated yeah that's her thing on the show but now she's activating herself at every single point a thousand percent yeah it's just you know it's unfortunate so that's where i'm like i i feel bad because i'm like we never know the full story when we only get one

side of the story and then it's like seeing this play out where i'm like also like carl are you on a gag order like he said nothing it's like he almost knew he was like no just wait till the season comes out that poor man getting booed at bravo con just like sitting through it had to take that heat yeah i tell you what you what though, but if you know, if you know at the end of the day, it's all about the finish in reality TV. It is always about the finish.

I try to remind people when they're going through it. I'm like, how does it end? Because it is all that matters. The lasting impression. Honestly, Carl probably knew the whole time,

you know, just wait because fans react the most to feeling misled and lied to. Yeah. And so whatever loyalties any fans

had towards Lindsay, if any of them feel misled by Lindsay, the wrath of the fan will be strong. Yeah. So I think Carl will be just fine.

Carl will be just fine. If it plays out, if it continues on this trajectory. I just think that the debunked lie here was that unbeknownst to herself, her engagement ended. Where I'm like us watching from the outside perspective where it's just like Carl's just taken it. Well, you're assuming that Lindsay is aware of how she acts in relationships? I would say that if I had seven seasons of myself in three different relationships and they all didn't work out, I feel like it's a really great like base level to start where I'm like, is there something about me that I don't

know about myself? And she's seen it all. You're confusing your healthy mental state and self awareness with like the world is full of people who have run their 19th bad relationship who have made no changes and are questioning why they're why they can't find any good ones. But they don't have it filmed. But like even if they have it filmed I feel like there are certain people that can watch it and be like I can't believe that this happened. Right.

Versus being like oh wait the common denominator is me. Yeah. Okay. And it's like oh production filmed it this way. That's not accurate i'm gonna take my gold star of being a little too healthy and i'll be okay oh maybe lizzie doesn't watch it i mean that's fair too jacks didn't watch a lot of people a lot of the seasons oh i forgot about i thought we were gonna get right over that jacks jacks taylor and britney are oh yeah real or staged i think that's really a real question here. I mean, it does. The timing is, you know, because the Valley's coming out or whatever.

But also knowing Jax, it's like, this seems likely. He's a horrible person. He is terrible. Have you met him? I have. Once. And that was enough. Well, it's kind of funny because he's the only person I turned down for a photo.

Really? Like in the world? Yeah. Well, no, there was one other time i turned someone down for the photo both during my season of the bachelor the other time it was the very first women's march in la post 2016 election um and i really wanted to go in solidarity and support i was the current bachelor there and i really was uncomfortable and had to get like approvals from the the producers because it's like it was obviously a very polarizing i wanted to go i'm like i'm gonna go

and they were just like yeah just keep a low profile i just didn't want to make the women's march about sure sure and then though and like that was the heat of being the bachelor you take one picture and then all of a sudden everyone's like oh this guy's just yeah so that was one time i was just politely like, hey guys, sorry. I'm just like, just here to support today. Yeah. And then there was Jax Taylor.

That's wild. Also at the Women's March. Not at the Women's March. No, it was at a nightclub. It was him and Brittany and they were very nice. And Brittany asked for a picture. I took a picture with Brittany.

Jax asked for one. I was like, no. And he got really mad. That's wild. All I knew about Jax Taylor at that point was you know he's what we now think of as Tom Sandoval and I'm thinking I'm not going to be in a picture

with Jax Taylor as the current Bachelor while people are wondering is Nick engaged is he not engaged I'm like nah he subsequently blocked me oh my god it's like Summer Rose move right there but blocked by Jax it's not a summer moon

you're mixing his daughter i am mixing these two children's names we are we are watching uh vanderpump going back around season three for all you vi-fi plus people out there if you want to recap with us at vilefiles.com but i'm reminded just how truly despicable and horrible jax taylor is as a human and this is not the edit or whatever. Like, this is a man who's truly willing to victimize people with reckless abandon for the sake of his own attention and fame and use that for TV. And I'm just like...

Well, that's like when he was on House of Villains and he's like, Brittany had a stroke. And then she's like, no, I didn't. It's like, dude, what are you talking about? Why would you even say that? He's doing that right now too with the separation.

He's going around being like, we're still together. And she's like, no, we're actually living in two separate homes. Right. But then she, they both are doing these,

like these Vanderpump personalities who like apparently have TMZ on speed dial. I know. I've never seen anybody have so long of an interview. Like it's like Tom Sandoval outside of his when Sandoval happened and it was like

him packing up like luggage or drums or whatever. Rachel outside of the nail salon. It's like a 20 minute long interview. And then Brittany had the TMZ one and then like the guy knew to plug her podcast, their new show, you know, it's just like, okay, maybe it's i hate to doubt you britney

right i know guilty by association i mean britney's also enabled jack's bullshit for so long so it's like can we really have that thought about her you know going back to like what season six where it was like the faith and sleeping with somebody in hospice like having a old lady in hospice in the room like it's like yeah's like when judgment calls like that and you're still like, I can forgive you. It's like, well, you know,

you get what you pay for. So, so like to recap, Brittany is her reaction. She is said she needs to protect her and her daughter, her son, son's like mental health. Okay.

That's very serious thing to say. It seems like she's updated her IG bio to change her last name she's moved out but according to the interview she did with TMZ don't worry they'll still do their podcast together yeah the thing we were all worried about right I was

I couldn't sleep last night I'm just grateful no no no don't worry the show will go on Brittany lets us know that her and Jax will still be doing their podcast because they are professionals. To which some of us were like, oh, you guys have a podcast. Yeah. Cool. Yeah.

Yeah. There wasn't a soundbite on Vanderpump up there. So I didn't know they had that yet. Everyone else is. Congratulations. We'll we'll give it a watch, The Valley. When does that drop? I think soon.

Very soon. I think they did it. I think it's the 22nd or something. But I think they've actually accomplished what we would think. Or like they've accomplished the unknown. Because at the end of the day, most people, when it came out, I think we even talked about it. We're like, I'm probably not going to watch that. Now I'm like, I guess I will.

March 19th. I'm tuning in March 19th. It's coming up coming up okay maybe the producers plotted this whole thing too i'm also like jackson knows how to make good tv you can say whatever you want about him he is not a great person but he is the reason why the views for vanderpump rules did what they did with him and stassi with him and kristin with him and britney like i'm like he he's an awful person but he knows how to make reality television it's true but as long as you know like when it comes to like bachelor characters or love is blind characters like we don't know if they're good or bad people these are highly edited shows and in very much

controlled atmospheres and we villainize people like uh nice segue by the way nick for oh no we're not there yet we still have housewives we still have housewives to get to i'm getting ahead of myself but like they make villains out of nothing when it comes to bachelor and love is blind you know yeah like yeah we have a bit like but when it comes to the bravo world and vanderpump that work it's clear it's in some cases illegal activity yeah and in other cases it is just against some of the worst things you can do to another human. It's being done for the sake of television. Yeah. And yeah, it is riveting television.

As you say, and Bravo, I love you. But they reward bad behavior, let's be honest. It's like we have the whole Erika Jayne thing, and then now she's got her own special coming out. She's got her own special coming out. So it's also like this. We're sitting here being like, nope, nope,

you're a villain. Nope. And now it's like, hey, how many times can we watch you tell your story on different platforms? you know, in 2020,

when everyone was getting fired, you know, in the name of activism, and then they just give them a show a couple years later. It's like, I just didn't give a shit. You know,

PR, PC, PC, PR. Beverly Hills reunion part one. I hate the three part reunion because it's just a signal of what we don't have to watch

part one is always like I know we save the best all the forced conversations so there's not a ton to talk about other than

Dorit I have mixed feelings on Dorit I do feel like she is is the punching bag for this season for a lot of I think forced

storylines a bit. That being said, well, I have been critical. And I, again, I am not a fashionista. I don't... I am wearing cowboy boots the first time. What do you think, Justin? Justin is...

Natalie and I stand by it. I love her outfit. I think it's a power move. She came in in red. She has this Mother Teresa facade. Yes. Is it doing too much? It's very much doing too much.

Of course it's doing too much. Fine, but that's very much. Fine. But that's not really my point. He wants to know about his boots. Those are better. Oh, we're talking about the boots. No,

no, I'm wearing comedy. Those are a power move. That's an actual power move. I think I'm wearing it for the first time. It's like, shut up about what we're talking about. Justin is our unofficial fashionista. I try.

Well, cause he wears sweater vests with nothing underneath and pulls it off. Looks good, dude. My little skinny muscles. He's a model. If you can do that, you know. That's my point. When Justin gets dressed in the morning, he gets dressed with purpose.

There's a vision. There's an inspiration. And if you ask Justin where his inspiration comes from, he doesn't just say, fashion, fashion, fashion. And my criticism of Dorit when it comes to her persona as a guy who doesn't claim to be an expert in fashion. But nevertheless,

I don't think you get to just buy expensive shit and then self-identify yourself as some sort of fashion icon. And then when Andy asked Dorit, like, where are you pulling this inspiration from? What were you going for? And she goes, fashion, fashion, fashion. To me, that is someone dressed her who had taste.

And they said, wear this. And Dorit said, okay. And she put it on. And she is, I mean, mean to me it's just like she's copy you know it's like plagiarizing

her stylist Dorit is plagiarizing her stylist the stylist told her say fashion fashion fashion she clearly had no idea

what she was doing I don't have a good answer and I'm gonna say this fashion fashion fashion to me that was her biggest crime all season

I don't even know if she knew like who the designer was because the label wasn't all over the clothing. I was going to say, she's doing cleanup because she got called out for wearing just label and label and label and now it's nothing. Now it's nothing. Now she doesn't know what it is. Now she doesn't know what she's wearing. She's like, I can't read it. It's not on me. It's fashion.

It's fashion. I came around to that Versace confessional look, though, after a while. I liked it. At first, I was like, huh? And then I'm like, no, I think I like it. I think it's something wrong enough you're used liked it. At first I was like, huh? And then I'm like, no, I think I like it. I think it's something long enough you're used to it. Yeah. It's like Stockholm Syndrome.

I was Stockholm Syndrome into loving that outfit. Yeah. But like the reaction of the other women too, you could just tell like this was a miss because any other time

they're just sucking each other's assholes when they come into a room. They're like, oh my God. Oh, you look gorgeous. But she walked in and they were like-

I've never seen you in a dress before. It took too long. Yeah, Crystal did an interview and she said that they all got there at like 8.15 or something and that Dorit wasn't ready

until like 10 o'clock and so she was getting sewed into her outfit and whatnot where I'd be like, this? This is what you bring me after two hours?

I do think Dorit is this honest, like I did, I think she is, I'm probably going to get criticism for this, but I think she's kind of guilty of just being almost too nice. I think she's a bad housewife because again,

she has no real identity. She's a, she probably in life is a sweet, nice friend. She, you know, she's probably fine and she's not good at talking shit. She's not good at like,

you know, really having her good one liner. She's not that creative, you know, she's just nice and fine and has some money to spend, which kind of doesn't make her an interesting housewife. And so now there's kind of coming after for stupid, petty shit.

But I honestly, as a person, she probably is pretty decent. I'm guessing. She does make a lot of shit about herself though, which is annoying. No, like that's the most annoying.

Most nice people are annoying. Yeah, that's true. That true that's true yeah but i just don't think she is i don't think she's one of the deplorables that we're talking about her storyline is to be a friend but she's not even a friend because she has no friends on the flip side someone who is an excellent housewife an iconic housewife someone i've met and i have this like weird loyalty to because we were on dancing with the stars together. Erika Jayne. She's a great housewife. She's an excellent character. But would anyone in this room

stump for her as a high character person? If your life was on the line and you had to advocate for, you know what, Erika Jayne is a high character person, would you advocate for her? Is our life on the line because it's snowing in Pasadena? Because maybe I would then.

I will say, well, I don't know. I was going to say, I think she can be a ride or die friend to some extent. Oh, for sure. But, you know. So would Tom Sandoval. Yeah. He'll pick you up at the airport. He'll bury a body.

L.A.X. He'll also sleep with your ex-fiance. As long as Tom Sandoval one day can say, hey, I picked you up. I need you to lie for me now. Yeah, he will. Those are easy favors. That's a good point.

I mean, she had to learn what empathy meant last season. So, you know, that's not a great... I do think that was edited against her. But recently, I cannot get on the whole earring thing and just her... She seems to be on this campaign trail of like, see, I was right and you were wrong. And I'm like, no, I don't know. Where were you right? Yes, you weren't in cahoots with your ex-husband.

Fine. You weren't part of the scam. Fine. Yeah. But like you didn't handle the reaction. Right. To your husband stealing a bunch of innocent people's entire life savings the best possible way. And no, I'm not sorry for questioning how you handled it. You know? No.

And now she's back in court. Her case. Yeah. This is for it's an old kind of an old one it's resurfaced where she sued her ex-designer for fraudulent charges

on her American Express specifically $787,000 oh yeah was that for her hair and makeup and costumes at least something within that

she sued him originally saying it was fraudulent she got the refund back onto her card and then now he's suing her again saying

defamation of character. That wasn't fraudulent causes. She told me to spend it. Whatever it may be. But she tried to silence it. And the judge was like, no, we're going to go to trial. So that's what it is. I just can't get on the Erica.

Jane, like you're. The hate train? I almost went to Vegas. I would have done it. To see her? Yeah, I wanted to see her. Justin, we'll go. Is she still there? Still performing?

I think it was just a one month residency. Oh, I don't know. Next time. I would have gone. That's a shame. Private performance? I've always been a fan of Erica. I think she's fun to watch. She's an excellent housewife. She's a good villain because she's not terrible but she also... We don't know.

Well, on the show. I like how she speaks. Like where I'm like, there's like Lisa Renna who just like turned me off anytime she would come with venom. But I'm like, Erica's type of venom is like, she's almost smart. Yeah. It was like, and then also like, if you didn't catch that, you thought about it two minutes later and you're like, she's an excellent housewife. I just, again, maybe she's an excellent person who just, right.

Who, but how she's handled this fallout yeah um it's just it's hard for me to get on board they did the housewife and the hustler part two did you see that i haven't seen it yet and she like sat down with some of the victims and was like talking to them so it's like how did it land they were fine i mean they were just kind of stone-faced watching her but, watching her. But she was like, you know. Did you feel like Erica kind of redeemed herself with these interviews? When you say she was like, you know, what do you mean? Was she like, my bad?

Was she wearing the ring she got with her money? The earrings? No. She was very much like, you know, well, I didn't know any of this. It was basically like, we're all victims here. Like, all of us, you know? But again, there's something about erica when she says that shit you're like yeah we are oh we're all victims you're right i don't know i

think it's because if you disagree with her she's good at fighting back and you're afraid of her yeah it's that or what or what i mean i will give her this season she did redeem herself in the sense of keeping keeping it all in the box i was like last last season it was just explosive explosive explosive this time where it was like the sutton said something on the plane i was like well here we go and she goes no i'm not gonna let that bother me i gave you guys up for lint and i was like what she also does like just objectively look great this season. Always. When they flash back to, I think it was last year's reunion, when she goes, I'm ready for you, Andy. And then you flash to this reunion. Yeah.

Nightmare was a glow up. She looks good except for that confessional where it's like a pink latex with like a bedazzled bow tie. That's not the best outfit, but she looks fresh. She does. She does. She looks fresh. She looks good this season. Mentally there. She looks fresh. She looks good this season. Mentally there.

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is it love is blind time it's love is blind time are you ladies enjoying this season yeah I love it I love love is blind I'm sick of their shit.

Who's there? Tell us how you feel. All of their shit. I was really excited for these last two episodes because we had that cliffhanger, right? Where it was like, he was out till 5 a.m. with who ended up being Sarah Ann. Jeremy.

Jeremy. Jeremy. Jeremy. But then it was just, it felt very anticlimactic but then it was just it felt very anticlimactic and it was just kind of like now they're just done yeah

I want more drama is that asking for too much for a reality show well the drama was passed on to Sarah Ann right with the jet skis well also she was yeah

also her walking in just like so unfazed like I sat there and my jaw dropped i was like the the audacity like she's like i'm like you just broke up an engagement and she's like hi everyone so nice to see you i've been up since 5 a.m how do you guys let's i mean how do we feel about her dming him like what are what are the i hate it i don't mind it i don't mind it either i'm not that mad at her like i think she's also part of the experiment.

Yes. It's the same as if we're on Tinder. We're not only talking to one person on Tinder. It just seems fair for her to message. But is this not similar to the Zach and Bliss situation? If she was all in on this experiment and then it didn't work out in the pods, she's probably like, I have a very limited window to get a free ring and a free wedding. So let's go for it.

Right. Well, I also think like she's not dumb. She's seen the show. She knows that these relationships don't go well once they're together. I think poorly executed on her part. Sure. Yeah. But I just don't think it's comparable to like a real life infidelity scandal type of thing.

Yeah, I agree. And that's what I mean. We can when it comes to love is blind and basher criticism. I love all the discourse that we're having, but like it is a different conversation. And we need to like have that objectivity that like comparing Sarah's behavior of DMeremy after the pause it is not the same is a real life affair because it's like the the lines are so blurred yeah in terms of and the timeline is so short timelines are so short and like oh they but they're engaged i'm like okay like half these people are you know you don't know if they got engaged for TV or not.

They're questioning each other's sincerity. They don't even know their middle names. Yeah. Come on. We don't even know if they actually got in to actually get engaged after the text messages. Does she even like, would she have known if they, he had ended up getting engaged? Because he could say, I intend to propose to this person, to her. Yeah.

They definitely keep them in the dark. Yeah. She doesn't know. They probably heard about it, but yeah, she could play dumb potentially like i hate the action of it in general just because like girls girl like i'm like i i don't like the going behind the back and whatever but at the same time exactly you guys are right that it's like yeah the timeline is so short she is a part of this experiment too and clearly there was a connection that was stronger and seeing um laura and jeremy out out of the pods and meeting her family and everything, I was like, this isn't going to work out.

But for her and Jeremy to be like, you know what, should we just go jet skiing? I know! That's a choice. And the edit of going back to Laura and making it look like she's literally watching them jet ski. Have they never seen reality TV ever? And what does Jeremy have to hide? If he is wearing a Hawaiian shirt underneath his vest,

that guy has secrets. Right? Also, what is tatted on that body? Two people fighting over Jeremy. I'm constantly quoting Arrested Development where it's like, him? I'll never understand it, but...

It's like an alternate reality. I assume they just cut out all his interesting commentary and personality i don't know because i feel that way about jimmy and the pods and everything too where i was just like how how are jimmy and jeremy uh chelsea megan fox okay yes but it's like how are these the two guys well you asked jess about that right like what was the big thing about him yeah i think uh he had the wrist he had like swagger he had the wrist he acted and that's i

think that's maybe that's jeremy's big thing is this like not caring yeah you know being messy yeah not caring uh being indifferent you know and laura is it laura yes laura she's no personality prize you know she's not exactly the most pleasant person to be around yeah it's hard for me and i guess it just like talked about this before like i've been cheated on and it's like it's so hard for me to believe and i get that feelings are feelings but like to get this worked up over somebody you've known for like three weeks yeah it's like i'd be like all right whatever fuck that like it's i equate it to like a tinder like a Tinder hookup, or it's just like, I don't know you to get this upset about it.

Yeah. It's like getting ghosted. I mean, by ghosted, I mean someone who didn't reply to the third message. Yeah. And then losing your shit. Yeah. Yeah. It's weird.

I almost feel like if I were on Love is Blind, which I obviously wouldn't be, but like if it were between me and someone else, I would rather be the one they didn't choose because it usually works out better for that person. Yeah. It just goes to shit most of the time. Yeah. I'd be like, well, good. See you at that weird cocktail party that we're all invited to.

Did not. I'm good. Yeah. I did love how AD addressed Sarah, though. I mean, that was covert. I loved it. Because you didn't know at any moment if they were friends

or if she was like coming at her. Yeah. Which, that's a skill. Like AD. It is a skill. She is one smart cookie.

Yeah. I love that she got to the point but was also like at times switched into like, give me the tea girl. No, I'm on your side. And then she's like, did you really think

that that was? And I was like, that was a masterclass. Literally. Yeah. Let me take notes. I got to rewatch because I was like, that was a masterclass. Literally. Let me take notes. I got to rewatch because I was like, that is the best confrontation I've ever seen. That wasn't negative. It wasn't like attacking, but it was very much like you give me all the information

and then I'm going to tell you why that information isn't right. And yet, and yet she is still susceptible to the fuck boy because those who cannot do teach. Clay is desperately trying to tell her i am not gonna marry you i will cheat on you do not pick me he is doing the classic guy move of i i don't have the guts to break up with me because you'll make me look like a bad guy so i'd rather just be a bad partner yeah and have you break up with me most men do that especially the fuck boys it's like the lesser of two evils like i'll just break up with me yeah

he is begging ad to break up with them and she just can't see it because he can't actually say it so like it's always like the maybes and we'll sees and like i'm gonna cheat on you my dad's gonna cheat on you everyone's gonna cheat on you i'm afraid i'm gonna cheat on you my dad's gonna cheat on you everyone's gonna cheat on you I'm afraid I'm gonna cheat on you but like you're amazing AD like you're the best you've done so and he always finishes it with like

but you've done so much for me and then that's AD's ego being like yeah I have I've done so much for you she's hearing what she wants to hear yeah he loves me I truly like

I saw this I forget the creator maybe there's other people out there but like I think someone pointed out that what the show has taught reminded me that love is not blind. No. Because even on a show called Love is Blind, where people fall in love having not seen each other's faces, you still have selective hearing throughout their entire relationship people cherry picking what they want to hear and not hearing it is amazing just how hard of hearing we become yeah when we have a goal yeah yeah yeah it's like when we see each other too it's like when you're texting

someone that you're interested in and you're like reading their message how you want to hear it yeah and not actually how it's intended it's just it's just, it's the same as that. They're so desperate to like be in love or like find love that they're just cherry picking. Yeah. And then you have Chelsea trying to whine her way into a marriage. Oh my God. A marriage. Is Megan Fox, right? Yeah.

Is Jimmy a fucking saint or does he just really want to see this thing through to the end? Jimmy's an idiot. I don't, yeah, I don't. He's not a saint. He's an idiot. What's his deal though? I honestly, I'm kind of with you an idiot. I don't. Yeah, I don't. He's not a saint. What's his deal, though? I honestly I'm with you, Brooke. I just I think I don't know.

I think we're in an era where, like, if you're a guy in reality TV, good luck. Yeah. He needs to get out of that relationship. You can do no right. And so I think no one's giving him. But like, yeah, he's not the prettiest guy. He got set up by Chelsea, making it seem like he chose megan fox you know uh i will say it was brutal if you look at megan fox old megan there's a lot of

the internet's trying to come around the internet is trying to issue look at transformers megan fox like early days before anything had been done confession i can see it have you seen uh the tiktok where they put chelsea's now face on jay leno's uh face and then how that combination weirdly looks like megan fox i can i think the issue is that if you're describing yourself even if people have said you look like megan fox like somebody on a plane's like oh my god your eyes look like megan fox or whatever and the person hasn't seen you you can't say you look like Megan Fox, like somebody on a plane is like, oh, my God, your eyes look like Megan Fox or whatever. And the person hasn't seen you. You can't say you look like anybody. No, that's attractive because they're only going to picture the attractive person.

You should lie and say someone ugly and see is love blind or not. I look very similar to Joe Biden. And then you go from there and it's like, OK, I look I look like the villain in Ghostbusters 2. There it is. Yeah. Go start with that. And then love really is blind. But if he hears Megan Fox, he's like, i look i i look like the villain in ghostbusters 2 there it is yeah go start with that and then love really is blind but if he hears megan fox he's like oh my god you saw his reaction he's like i'm gonna be mg kelly mg kelly and the way she's like you know mgk's wife as if he's the more famous one in the relationship right yeah jess is like you're

gonna choke on your epi pennies like don't worry megan fox is gonna give you're going to choke on your EpiPen. He's like, don't worry. Megan Fox is going to give you mouth to mouth. Yeah. Joke was. Yeah. I will say Jimmy humbles Chelsea in the fight in this episode. Yeah. Where he's like, you want me to take a step back? Well, I'm not going to take a step back.

And she was just like, gag. He just getting upset about. Okay. The whole thing where it's like, because he slept with a friend. And it was like, you're not. She wasn't supposed to say that. It was revealed. The internet was right. There was coitus in that friendship.

Of course there was. Of course there was. Is that a bad thing? I think it's possible that they're just friends now, though. Oh, 100%. It's just, that's how you know Jimmy's kind of dumb. Yeah, that's what I mean. There's a lot of reasons.

Because you don't go on this show and have a... Jimmy seems like a guy with a lot of friends. He does. He seems like he has a nice group of friends. Yeah. That are all women. And you think, you know what? You know the two people I'm going to hand select to bring on to this show to meet my

fiancee who I've only known for a couple of days is someone who I used to have sex with. Even if... I absolutely believe that this friendship is truly that platonic sure that they could be stuck in an elevator for days and they would be like ew yeah i truly believe that yeah it doesn't matter it doesn't matter like the stupidity yeah the optics of that it's still respect for your partner just like all of that where i'm like you know chelsea hasn't had a lot of legs to stand on this season but i will give her that where I'm like, don't put me in a situation where I'm uncomfortable. I never think it's okay to go through your partner's phone. But the fact that she didn't, she's like, who are you texting all

day? Who are you? And it's like, it's not me. And that's the problem, you know? The thing with Chelsea though, is that she tries too hard to seem cool with it. Like with the stuff with AD, when he was talking about her butt, she's like, you can say whatever you want, babe. She's got a great ass. And like, oh my God god i love your friends we're like gonna be best friends and then she's like but then and like since something turns and it's like now i'm pissed yeah well it's very weird i think she's doing her best in defense to her like she she wants to try to sound cool she didn't ask jimmy to bring girls to meet her. And so like, what is she going to do? Like be a bitch to them in real time?

But then her insecurities get the best of her. She has a few drinks and then she gets mad at Jimmy for going out while she's drunk, which is hilarious. She is the dragon. Like literally is like, you do this, you do that. Where it's like, if you just would have said in the moment, hey, not cool. That makes me a little uncomfortable. Like, it's like if you just would have said in the moment hey not cool that makes me a little uncomfortable like it's like okay now we're establishing boundaries that what works for you and what doesn't but like when you play the cool girl

and are like nothing phases me nothing phases me a couple glasses you're like well guess what everything phases me and you get the round you know nothing's less cool than being like you haven't kissed me once today and him being like well i kissed you in the bathroom and then i kissed the side of your head and it's like it's like if you'll check this whiteboard i know put marks down it's like i've been keeping track because i know you're gonna get upset right that's not healthy and jimmy just trying to convince himself that he's in love with her no i do love you it's kind of sad to watch like it's just like i feel like he wants the experiment to work out so well that it's almost like he doesn't feel like he has another option.

Because he's just like, no, I love you. I've told you I love you. I mean, I love you. And I'm just like, I've never seen someone profess so hardly where I'm like, in the beginning, it was, it's okay. You don't look the way. We can work with that. And now it's like, no, but I love you more than anything. Why won't you believe me?

You're my person. Yeah. But also, could you stop trying to have sex with me? And I'm also not going to stop talking to the friends that make you uncomfortable that I slept with. In Jimmy's mind, he's just like, I'm not going to forgo a 10-year friendship for a girl I just met who's now giving me every indication that you're not the person I met in the pots. I will say, though, I think they've only been friends for like five years. Because when they went to that dinner, he's like, yeah, I met them like five years ago. It's a gray area.

It's still a long time. I know, but is is it a friend for five years versus a girl you've known for a month but like your fiance his person that's just that's what i'm like i don't know how anybody speaks with a straight face yeah it's like i love you i'm gonna i want to die with you like grow old with you and it's like that's why those gold goblets are always full they're delusional like keep it coming so they think they're in love it's like that's why those gold goblets are always full they're delusional like keep it coming so they think they're in love it's true we need a finale how do you take this seriously

who do we think gets married those two whose name I can't remember because they're so in love and boring I don't remember their names they don't have any drama they're perfect that is the only problem with the show is that the only ones who end up together are the people we could give two fucks about. Fast forward their segment.

I know. It is wild that I don't know what bubble Johnny grew up in. And why is it all the J's? It is all the J's. Johnny, Jimmy, Jerry. Jeremy's lack of education and sex ed is alarming. He's the birth control one, right? Yes.

Right, right. He does know what a vasectomy is now, though. He does now, but now it's like, he's clearly like on WebMD. He clearly found, he went down a rabbit hole of a blog. Some guy who was like,

don't do it, dude. Like, that's the information. He did not go to a medical professional and just say, hey, give me the 411 on like the risks and the pros and cons of a vasectomy. He read a blog.

This is why they need to stop cutting funding in schools for sexual education. This is like classic example. You know, like how babies are made, how to prevent them. Like it's just like this is all part of it. And it just sounds like he just hasn't just learned. How old is he? 28. And it's like you just learned what a vasectomy is.

Yeah. Yeah. Yep. Maybe he grew up like very religious because like we didn't have it gives very religion it gives a lot of religion it's very like our school nurse walked in and put up a powerpoint of vaginal warts and was like don't have sex ladies and left johnny definitely johnny johnny gives a lot of like left the church six months ago. Yeah. For this show. It also gives,

I've been told it's a woman's responsibility to, for us to not get pregnant. So why would I know what a mastectomy is? That would align with whatever church you probably left. Right. Exactly. They, they,

they tend not to be progressive in the whole like men and women role dynamic. I, yeah. I, AD and, and, uh, Clay,

I don't think it's going to happen. I think it's going to happen. Really? Really? Yeah. Okay. You think it's going to be, I don't think it's gonna happen I think it's gonna happen really really yeah you think it's gonna be I don't think they're gonna last you think it's gonna be kind of like a couple that shocked me last season um yes I think it's gonna be like that Kwame yes yeah and they're still together are they not

they literally posted on Instagram the other day and I was like anything's possible so maybe maybe they'll go the way of I see them getting together and then like by the reunion being like we're not together Jimmy and Chelsea

I don't think so I keep going back and forth where I'd be like absolutely not I was like their last date I keep forgetting that they're still together every time an episode comes on. Me too. I'm like, wait, you didn't break up after that fight? Same.

I thought they'd broken up when he was like, I'm leaving or whatever. I was like, wow, he's going to hook up with Jess at this barbecue. And I'm like, wait, no, they're together. The next episode comes on. I'm like, wait, you guys are still together? You're on a roller coaster? So who knows? I don't know.

We'll see if something happens with Jess. I feel like him seeing Jess was kind of like... Isn't Jess dating someone else from the season now? Is she? Well, Jess came on our podcast and hinted that she's talking to someone. And everyone thinks it's Ariel. Well, there have been photos on the internet of a particular person in the Netflix. And Pilot Pete's mom took the photos.

Posted it on her page first. I could see Pilot Pete. You know. Co-pilot Barbara. Are we going to see that guy who was like a psychopath in the beginning? Matthew. I don't think so. Are we ever going to see him again?

Yeah, reunion. Maybe the reunion. Just the reunion. Oh yeah, the reunion I imagine. But I'm excited. I was shocked that that was it for him. I know. We needed him around.

I'm guessing he just opted not to come to that lake party. I can't imagine why. He's probably not as bad as he came across. He's probably just kind of an introverted weirdo. He came across terribly. Yeah. And I was like, this editing is heavy. Yeah.

I do, you know, not to be a guy apologist, because there's plenty of bad ones out there. Yeah. But there's also, like, bad women. I just think in the era of reality TV, it's like it is tough being the only one. The only one surviving reality TV is Joey. Segway. Beautifully done.

Yeah. No, it's just like it's hard. You got to pitch a perfect game to be well liked as a man on reality TV. Is Joey well liked? Is that the general consensus? He seems pretty loved by all. He's very cute. I can't wait

to see his personality in Traitors 3. He doesn't have a personality on this show. We have argued we know almost nothing about Joey. All of the shots. Except tennis. All of the scenes are the women trauma dumping on him. Yep.

And him glazed over look in his eyes that I can relate to so hard. Thank you for sharing those feelings of that. That's it. His sister is like, say these six things over and over. I couldn't tell you a single thing about it. I think there's more to them. There's got to be. There is.

Of course there is. Look at Pilot Pete. The Bachelor franchise is notorious for stripping down all the personality and siloing them into whatever narrative they have. They oversimplify their characters. And in some cases, they do have to hide their Bachelor and Bachelorettes from themselves. Clay Neckart, you know, is someone who, you know, nicest guy in the world, but he is not a good decision maker.

Right. Which has been well documented. Joey, on the other hand i think he i think i've heard a lot of good things um but we just don't know yeah we just don't know uh now we are in hometowns i do feel like he showed some wisdom this episode um that's how it ended i i will say i'm watching hometowns through a different lens as a new dad. Yeah. Oh, really? I cried. Oh, yeah. Chelsea's hometown. I was going to say, for which one?

Kelsey, yeah. I'm carrying it. Is Kelsey the one whose mom has passed? Yes. Yes. I thought the dads, as they often do, shined. Maria's dad and Kelsey's dad. Kelsey's dad got me, and that was the first hometown.

And that was, yeah. That's being a good dad. Yeah. He's had a line that i don't know if it was caught by all but for him to say at the very end of his like confessional something to the effect of of like he's you know he's obviously protective of her and worried but like him acknowledging that she might get her heart broken and that's kind of a part of life and the the bravery as a father to you know that i think that you know, I'm only a month in.

But, you know, you have to teach your kids all these lessons. And then you have to give them a chance as adults to get it right or get it wrong. And when they get it wrong, to hopefully learn from it. Not to be the helicopter parents who won't let them make decisions for themselves. parents who who won't let them make decisions for themselves and you could just tell that kelsey's dad is someone who really given him given her all the lessons he can but is willing to let her you know spread her wings and make her own choices and i just like that relationship just like it i i sobbed watching her and her dad kelsey has a good one that's real support it was real love and it was like i'm not making this about me.

I'm not putting myself in like a, between you and whatever choices that you're making. Just know, like if this works out fantastic, I couldn't be happier for you. And if not, like I'm here for you. And like,

that's what I like to see when it's coming to the parents situation versus the parent acting as if they're on the show being like, well, there's three other women. We all know every time we all know, you know, every time where it's like, no, but support your kid in the choices that she's making. And exactly what you said, if it doesn't work out, I'm going to be here for you.

I do love how Maria's dad handled the three other women conversation where he didn't do the whole classic like, well, you know, there's three other women. He was like, there are three other women. And if you're going to sit here and tell me that you're falling in love with the other ones i'm here to tell you i'm not hearing it i loved that because like yeah this is a guy who maybe has seen this show before he's familiar with the tropes and he's like just don't say that to me don't give me that kind i love how he said that he's just like don't even bother with your bachelor bullshit say something real to me like I really loved how he did that all these women you could tell that

like they've had good fathers because they're able to like make decisions set a good boundary you know enforce a boundary you know Maria's been good television you can see where her confidence comes from you know yeah you just met her dad yeah were you the one saying he's like a mob boss

well they made it seem. It was the music. So you said that, or didn't you? Well, I, I don't know. I was just,

I thought that these were the most, felt the most authentic and genuine hometown visits that I've seen. Yeah. The family relationships seemed, I know that there was obviously stuff productions telling them to talk about, but they all felt like they had healthy family relationships. And I feel like that's not that common on this show. I mean, everyone has their trauma and they talk about, but they all felt like they had healthy family relationships. And I feel like that's not that common on this show. I mean, everyone has their trauma

and they talk about, but I just felt like, kind of like to what you're saying, like the parents, the dads, all of them just seemed very like supportive in their relationships. I don't know, it was the first time that I was like, I feel like this is how I would have with my dad.

I kind of feel a bit lied to after watching an entire season of trauma dumping. And you're like, wait, you guys are all wonderfully loved. You're like, what is going on there? I wish I had this type of love in my family.

Yeah. I can't believe Daisy's family has a Christmas tree farm. Like, is this a lifetime holiday movie? The Kiss in the Snow and I was like, this could be your everyday.

Like, this is not a bachelor made date. This is her family's farm. ABC lost their minds. They were like, this is the perfect built made date. This is her family's farm. ABC lost their minds. They were like, this is the perfect built in setting. Someone's getting a bonus because that budget got a little left. And Joey was like, I'm sorry to tell you this, but my dad is a billionaire. He's going to build a hotel on this property.

She's like, but what about the snow globe falls cookie decorating gala later? What do we think of Joey sending Maria home? I think it was a good choice. She was doing too many power moves. Like even when she said right before the road, she goes, wait, Joey, can we talk? And then she comes back and Rachel's like, what was that about? And she's like, I don't know. And Rachel's like, but you brought him over.

You don't. What is she supposed to say? I am trying to like. I declared my love. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know. I'm trying to stay. It was one final Hail Mary. I don't know. I'm trying to stay.

It was one final Hail Mary. I don't think it's anyone else's business in that moment. I also, knowing how that show works, the show will always steal you. When you say, hey, I really need to get this out. I need to say this. They'll go out of their way to make sure you don't get to say it when you want to say it so that you have to say it when it inconveniences all your other peers. Yeah, I see what you're saying.

Because it was just like, she was like, I should have said it and he left. And then she says it in the airplane hangar and I was like, he should be like, no. I'm not picking you anyway. It doesn't matter. I mean, I just, yeah, I get what you're saying.

But also like when she didn't get it, he sat down with her right after and then she's just like, okay. She seems fine. And then doesn fine even hug just walks right into the yeah did she play a perfect game no do you think she did if she ends up bachelorette yes she is well she's very popular in bachelor nation you can't i can't i'm here to tell you that there are conversations happening i was like even then they did the

and where i'm like i know it means nothing but they did the teaser last week of if you want to be on The Bachelor or The Bachelorette. And what's Jesse did the Canadian accent where obviously they were filming in Canada, too. So there's that. But it was just like, it's giving that there's a possibility. And I'm not really the biggest fan. But at the same time, I'm like, out of the three girls that are left, like, I want Daisy to win. But I'm like, Daisy would be a great Bachel kelsey to win because i think daisy would be an excellent bachelorette that's and i think uh she would be their choice if she doesn't win which makes me

kind of think that daisy does but wait why do you think she'd be a great bachelorette daisy yeah i think they they love a bachelorette in general who is who who is feisty the hannah brown just like that's that's what they love um they like a bachelor who's dumb generally speaking well she's also like overcome adversity with her health situations and whatnot yeah and i don't think daisy's all that polarizing but she is clearly like you know last episode she's i don't know if i'm feeling right falling for you daisy can think for herself she can speak for herself she can set a boundary she knows who she is that i think that rings true with the all these four women um and she has that demure um she has a christmas tree farm she has

her storyline i don't know how what's the right way to say it but her cochlear implants yeah yeah you know that's a compelling storyline there's a you know she's obviously beautiful and i think i think she just is a total package yeah if if daisy does win maria seems to be the next obvious choice because well maybe she you know like maria's big storyline is an accident when she was like two months old yeah um that she doesn't probably remember i don't know but like two years old. That she doesn't probably remember. I don't know. I don't know. But she's also like a fun time girl. So it was the pulling the shots up

for the date where like everybody else was like, oh, welcome to my home. She clearly will speak up when she has she won't be afraid to say how she feels. And more than anything, I think they value that in a bachelorette yeah um i think kelsey's a little more demure and quiet yeah you know yeah uh rachel i mean we don't even

know anything about her relationship with joey so yeah that's you know i don't even know who she is and if kelsey ended up being the bachelorette and i think she's a very sweet girl i love her story but it's like it's gonna give me like becca it's just going to be kind of snooze fest because there's not a lot going on. From what we know. From what we've seen. Right. But I'm just like, it's not as compelling as if you had a Maria being like, hi, everybody, fireball shots from first night in.

You know? Yeah. I think Maria is a better choice just because I think they just need something different. She's good TV. Yeah. She is good TV. I do think if Daisy were to be the Bachelorette, 100% somebody would come

out of the limo with a Christmas tree they already cut. Oh. Or a dress of Santa. I would love it. No, what they'll do, four guys will.

Yeah. One has the sweater. Because they do. They're like, so do you have any ideas? Yeah. That's how it works. And these guys,

you know, who are critical thinkers will all be like, I have the best idea. I'm going to it works and these guys you know who are you know critical thinkers will be like i had the best idea i'm gonna bring a christmas tree you know no one's gonna think of it it's like my you probably don't remember on my season there were like seven wet red dresses yeah and it wasn't like the producers didn't know what they were all wearing yeah um everyone's like hey i have this perfect red dress and everyone was like dope you know no one was like and then dorit came out and that yeah and then dorit came out and i was like oh sorry that's the one sorry i couldn't give you a rose but i'll uh vouch for you on so all the guys will be like no i've been bringing

our christmas tree and they'll be like yes do that and it'll be four of them yeah yeah okay i have a question though is there a world where production is like we desperately want daisy to be the bachelorette so you can't choose her? I suggested that maybe a couple weeks ago that that could happen. To production? You called it up and you're like, I'm telling you, Daisy's the one. In my experience, I think the show, I've always said that, they have two priorities. Their two biggest priorities on The Bachelor, one, make excellent television.

Yes. That's priority number one. And I get it. It's a business more than anything. And two, they do care about their lead finding love. And if they can work in unison, that's always the dream. Ideal. And that often is the case.

If they sense that their lead is torn between two choices, you know, there might be there there uh there have been former contestants who have publicly stated you know that they were that the being the lead on the next season was broached to them before the season they were unfinished um i would definitely prefer to be the bachelorette than the winner of the bachelor i mean when you really think about it like winning the show is uh usually usually you lose that's just like love is blind that's what i'm saying yeah and i say that thinking about two times

where i remember being heartbroken that i didn't win and where my life would be yeah i'm not here yeah i would not be here you're usually outcasted by your peers. Yeah. You know, partly because you have a relationship to hide and you, you know, there's a pettiness. So you didn't really make the friends that you wanted to have typically. Yeah. The relationships usually don't work out. And then you're the forgotten person usually in that relationship. You know?

Yeah. Yeah. It's tough being the winner. Wow. Speaking from experience well well no no but i've seen it but you were the bachelor well yeah well yeah one i consider that winning well yeah i i listen when it comes yeah when it comes to the bachelor i humbly i like to think i definitely won yeah yeah all right well i think that about does it. As always, we appreciate you guys listening.

We are back on Thursday with the iconic duo of Spencer and Heidi. I have been looking forward to having them on this show. I am. I'm big fans of these two. I went on theirs. Yeah. I asked. Did I?

Yeah. I find it to be wonderfully fun and authentic. What's so great about them. They that's the key of being. I would give advice to anyone in reality TV. what's so great about them they that's the key of being i would give advice to anyone in reality tv the key of being having a long lasting career reality tv is consistency and authenticity yeah the first part flip it authenticity and consistency be consistent who with who you authentically are yeah and honestly people will that's it that's all you really got to do good

bad make your mistakes fuck up say you're sorry but people just want to know who you are and what you stand for yeah which is honestly why jack's taylor for all his evilness people still want to give him the benefit of the doubt because they're like yeah but we know he's a piece of shit yeah yeah but heidi and spencer have always been authentically who they are and they've been consistent with it and that's why they've had the career that they've had. I can't believe how much I liked Spencer like when we met him. I think he's great. So likable.

So great. So funny. So interesting. Both of them together. Yeah. Can't wait to have him on and I can't wait for you guys to hear that conversation.

That's this Thursday. Also, we'll get into all the things that we didn't get to talk about in our intro like maybe bits of information and reality recap that we didn't get to talk about.

Tune in. You're going to miss it. Natalie will be here. The gang will be here. The household will be here. Can't wait for you to check it out. Ladies, thanks for coming back.

Thanks for having us. Always a pleasure. We'll have to do this again. Please plug your shows. Okay. We have our daily show, Rich and Daily, Monday through Friday

that we're going to go and record right now. We have Even the Rich that drops on Tuesdays. We have Even the Royals that drops on Mondays. Brooke is at Brooke Sifrin. I'm at Arisha Skidmore-Williams.

Arisha. I had it too before you even said your name. I was like, Arisha, Brooke, thanks for coming. That's why we named our daughter River. And when we named our daughter River, we were just like, you know, that's kind of a unique name. But since we've named her daughter River, everyone's like, me too.

It's like, you know, I think when when my parents named me nick they thought they were being super original and i went to school with like 10 yeah but honestly i'm glad you know because you know you know it's just like has it been tough i'm asking like your whole life oh god yeah and i was very much like in college how was college it must have been brutal the worst was like school before college because every teacher said it wrong and I was much shyer now and so I would just let them say my name wrong. And you were passed out most of college so you probably

don't remember that. Yep. I was. The worst part is my buddy who had his kid like three months ago. He was like, I named my son River. I'm like, oh, I didn't know that. Oh no. One of my cousins named their child Brooke and I was like, no. I guess I'm a bad person. One of my cousins named their child Brooke. And I was like, no. After you?

Do it over. Yes. That's an honor. No. I see it as an honor. It's not an honor. You don't want to get too original with a name. You know?

Yeah. Because then your kid's a whole life is like, no, no, that's not it. I hated it. I like it now. But growing up, I hated it. Because you don't want to be different. And I was different. Yeah.

I was like. You probably learned a lot of patience for people like me who just like who had you on and can't, you know, she's not a patient person. How about that? I am very patient about it. About people saying my name wrong. Yeah, I'm very patient. No, mine's Sierra spelt C-I-A-R-A.

And it was like very confusing when you see it on paper. Well, it's mine. Sierra C-I-A-R-A. That's how I would think it. So people, it's Sierra, it's Clara,-R-A that's how I would think it so people it's Sierra it's Clara it's whatever you want it to be but like my biggest thing

was like trying to find my name in the keychains and being like ah yeah that's always the keychain that was the hard part yeah

anyway Arisha Brooke thanks so much for coming always a pleasure great talking reality TV with you ladies we'll be back again on Thursday don't forget to send in

those questions at asknickatthevalphiles.com for all things Ask Nick, texting office hours. While you're waiting for Going Deeper, go back and check out our episode of Ask Nick that dropped on Monday. It's a good one. You will not want to miss it. And next week on Monday,

it's a special Ask Nick. Dr. Phil joins us for an Ask Nick. Oh my god, he was on Frasier. One episode. That was his big break. That was his big break. How we all know him it was fun to give relationship advice with dr phil i bet i take your advice over his though thank you sam yeah we were pretty in line to be honest really okay is that why you're wearing those boots yeah i got the whole country in me for dr phil

bye for Dr. Phil. Bye.