The Viall Files - E827 - Love is Blind’s Marissa - Liam Payne, RHOC, RHOSLC, Raquel Stops Going Rogue, and Ozempic

Episode Date: October 22, 2024

Welcome back to The Viall Files: Reality Recap!  The season finale of Netflix’s Love is Blind is airing this Wednesday, and boy are we excited! Marissa joins to dish out all things Ramses, their relationship, and Hannah breaking up with Nick D. Before Love is Blind, we jump into Project Runway being renewed, Raquel Leviss canceling her podcast, Jen Pedranti confronting Tamra Judge, Bronwyn Newport’s family history, Britani Bateman vs Jared Osmond, and Alexis Bellino’s texts. “This is unhinged behavior all around”  OUT NOW! Listen to Humble Brag with Cynthia Bailey and Crystal Kung Minkoff. Available wherever you get your podcasts and YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@humblebragpod https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/humble-brag-with-crystal-and-cynthia/id1774286896 ALSO… Buy our exclusive “The Podcast” merch: https://viallfiles.myshopify.com  Start your 7 Day Free Trial of Viall Files + here: https://viallfiles.supportingcast.fm/  Please make sure to subscribe so you don’t miss an episode and as always send in your relationship questions to [e-mail] to be a part of our Monday episodes. Follow us on X/Twitter: https://twitter.com/TheViallFiles Listen To Disrespectfully now! Listen on Apple: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/disrespectfully/id1516710301 Listen on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/0J6DW1KeDX6SpoVEuQpl7z?si=c35995a56b8d4038 Watch on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCCh8MqSsiGkfJcWhkan0D0w To Order Nick’s Book Go To: http://www.viallfiles.com  If you would like to get some texting advice on Office Hours send an email to [e-mail] with “Texting Office Hours” in the subject line! To advertise on the show, contact [e-mail] or visit https://www.advertisecast.com/TheViallFiles  THANK YOU TO OUR SPONSORS: Chewy - Right now you can save $20 on your first order and get free shipping by going to https://www.Chewy.com/viall Huckberry - Be sure to go to https://huckberry.com/THEVIALLFILES so they know we sent you! OneSkin - Shop SKIMS Bras at https://www.SKIMS.com  Episode Socials: @viallfiles @nickviall @nnataliejjoy @rissa.george @ciaracrobinson @justinkaphillips @leahgsilberstein @the_mare_bare @dereklanerussell  Timestamps: 00:00 - Intro 00:25 - Vibes Or Knowledge 01:09 - Crawling 02:19 - Holiday Cards 04:01 - Housekeeping 07:29 - Costumes 09:48 - Household Headlines 11:15 - Sean Combs Update 12:50 - Jennifer Lawrence 13:12 - Phone Parenting 16:36 - Project Runway 18:31 - RHODubai 18:54 - Nobody Wants This 20:45 - Rachel Went Rogue 22:08 -  Kordell 24:03 - RHOC 44:21 - RHOSLC 01:13:18 - Love Is Blind 01:32:08 - Marissa Interview 01:52:12 - Post-Interview Chat 01:56:29 - Outro

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Merchants Bank is a proud member FDIC. What's going on everybody? Welcome back to another exciting episode of the Vile Files Reality Recap Edition. I am your host, Nick Joy, and by the household so much to get into. Speaking of which, I'm 2-0 this week and very excited about that. Knowledge won over the weekend. The Minnesota Vikings triumphed. Oh no, they lost actually. They did lose.

You guys. I actually watched the end of that game. Close game, yeah. Yeah. And then the Niners got spanked. Well, I think it's really because you were behind at one point and I think collectively we felt bad. Yeah.

What do you say? We made a pact. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. No, it's a long season. What's the record right now? I think I've kind of pulled away. Maybe I'm up by three games. Knowledge is eight and six, vibes are five and nine.

Interesting, yeah. Ugh. Yeah, you guys need to come back, but it is a long season, so. Hey, anything can happen. I mean, the Vikings were undefeated until they weren't yesterday. There you go.

River's crawling on her knees now, very exciting stuff. Not really. Sure she is, she did. I put her down, I was making coffee. Every morning I wake up and then I make me coffee and I make River her bottle, then I feed the dogs and then we have a little morning snack. River didn't want, she usually she jumps.

She jump, jump, jumps and while I make the coffee in the bottle. But it was bounce, bounce, bounce. Bounce, bounce, bounce, yeah sorry. Bounce, bounce, bounce. Jump, jump, jumps felt wrong. Yeah, it did felt wrong. But she likes Bounce, bounce, bounce. Bounce, bounce, bounce. Yeah, sorry. Bounce, bounce, bounce. Jump, jump, jumps felt wrong. Yeah, it did felt wrong. But she likes to bounce, bounce, bounce.

This morning she didn't want to bounce, bounce, bounce. So I had to hold her while I was making coffee, which is hard to do. So I popped her down on the kitchen floor and she quickly got on her hands and knees and crawled a little bit. I think she's over the weekend, she started getting on the knees.

She drags herself like a little. Army crawl. Army crawl really fast, but she wants to use those knees. We're very excited for her. The way River loves Natalie, she's definitely in her mom era. It's a really beautiful thing. Honestly, it really is. Am I a little jealous? Yes, of course.

Wait for the teenage years. Oh, please. Sure, but right now when River sees Natalie, it's like... She gets happy. Oh my God, she is instilled with all the endorphins that you could possibly instill in a child. She really loves her mom. See, I don't get baby fever, but I want to be a PTA parent. Like it's one of my life goals. I'm like, I need a baby to be a PTA parent.

I can't wait to be PTA parent. Decimate those meetings. You want to be a PTA mom? Oh my God. Yeah. And she'd be good at it too. Right? What do you wanna do? Are you gonna go on a field trip? No, one of my, I've thought my whole life, is this crazy? I've thought my whole life about my first

family Christmas card. Wow. Please do tell. My whole life. I've been like, I wonder what that's gonna look like. And now this year we get to do a family Christmas card. So is it like? And send it to friends and family

and they put it on their fridge. Are we doing Kyle Richards vibes? Are we doing Sears photo shoot? I'm thinking Christian or on the stairs, everyone slaying. Matching pajamas? Maybe. We don't have stairs.

You can get an Airbnb, do it in a little hotel room or something. Yeah. I want matching outfits. Matching outfits? Yeah, I thought about my first family's Christmas card too. I don't know if I get a say in this, but it had matching outfits.

Color coordinating maybe. You know how everyone did, did y'all see that like everyone see the like family on the beach with jeans and a white t-shirt? Yeah. That was you. That was my boyfriend's family. No, no.

Connor's family. Yeah, and I was like, huh. Yeah, we did that one year. It was khakis and black shirts. I wanna do matchy match, but like not, I wanna go for it. So exactly, the same outfit. Nick loves to match. One thing about Nick is he will like beg me

to match with him. It's funny. You are matching right now. I'll put on an outfit and he's like, what if I put on that same outfit? I'm like, that would be something. It's cause he appreciates your outfit. It's kind of cute.

It's a conversation starter. I don't, you know, listen, it doesn't take much to get me excited, but like when we're both wearing, you know, black Converse, I'm thrilled. You know? It's true. It take much to get me excited, but like when we're both wearing, you know, black Converse, I'm thrilled. You know? It's a little things.

It's true. What can I say? Well. What can I say? I love my family. We have a great week lined up for you. Joining us later this episode, Marissa from Love is Blind. Lots of questions for her, like what she thinks of Ramses.

I think a lot. Cause we all know what Nick thinks of Ramses. So, I feel like. Where do people fall on Ramses, like online? I think especially after this last batch of episodes where he was talking, where she was like, I don't feel good. And he was like, well, is this gonna be like

an all the time thing? I think that really rubbed. He lost support there. Women of the nation. Yeah. He does have some support though. Even the last conversation too about the wedding

and what not where she was like, I don't wanna feel like I'm doing this all by myself. I was like, I feel like that's such a relatable thing. Cause you're like, yes, it might be for me in theory but it is both of our days contribute. He gave off behavior that like, I knew what Ramses doesn't appear to know. Like when I was an 18 year old boy

back in like the early 2000s, when men weren't having the type of conversations that Ramses looks like he wants to be a part of. We're talking about basic birds and the bees stuff. No, if we are lucky enough to have a boy, I can't wait to have the like, I will like spell out periods. Like I'm gonna be like, this here is a tampon.

This is what happens. Like they're gonna be so well versed in womanhood that whenever they do get into a relationship, it's not gonna be like, oh, what is this mood you're in? Is this gonna last a whole month? You want me to go in the grocery store and pick up what? You don't think that? You can't.

And yeah, we'll do that, but like I was raised that way and I don't understand, is that not happening? Like I remember, I have a pretty good understanding of my girlfriend when I was 18 of like, you know where I needed to step the fuck back and shut the fuck up. Once a month. You know, and it was like,

Rams is out here being an adult man in 2024. It's just like wild. Well, we'll ask Marissa about it. We'll ask her about it. This week we have a really, really special going deeper that I'm very excited for you all to listen to. Your golden bachelorette Joan is with us. And boy, what an episode.

It's very emotional. Very emotional, very sweet. One of my favorite Going Deepers we've ever done, it's a really great episode. It's what exactly what Going Deeper is meant to be. We really go deeper with Joan. She opens up in ways that I think most people haven't had a chance to get to know her and would definitely want to hear these stories with Joan. She opens up in ways that I think most people haven't had a chance to get to know her

and would definitely want to hear these stories from Joan. It's just really in depth about her life, her relationships, everything she's dealt with, her struggles. You really get to know your golden bachelorette with tomorrow's episode of Going Deeper. So I hope you guys tune in for that. That is tomorrow. Also, Humble Bragg is now out.

Released on Monday Monday the new hit podcast with Cynthia Bailey and Crystal Minkoff. Hear all about their lives, their stories, why Crystal is no longer on Real Housewives of Beverly Hills. That and so much more. It is out now. Be sure to check it out. Subscribe. Tell your friends. All that fun stuff. So anyways, yeah, great week lined up for you. More guests coming down the pike as well. Plus we got Vilephiles Plus available. You can either go to Vilephiles.com or if you listen to this show on Apple Podcasts, you can sign up directly from there. You do not need to sign up in both places. It's the same content. Either way, if you love your ASNIC updates, if you love your Pop

Extra roundups where we talk about the pop culture talk about, so we didn't get to talk about in reality recap, or you love your Van De Puppet recaps, those are all great reasons to sign up for Vilephiles Plus. It's free to sign up, you get to try it for a week. Check it out, either vilephiles.com or on Apple Podcasts, you can sign up directly from the app. Should we tell everyone we're vampires and that's why Justin and Mary and Sierra are bleeding? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Everyone's a vampire. I didn't want to put blood on my mouth for, I just thought out of context at mine. Obvious punch lines. It would be salt burning. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

It's a little too much. Online when we post these cut downs and it's just like, ah. Yeah. I didn't know we were dressing up. Mary had a really rough time. Why is the blood coming out of your eyes? You know, sometimes your brain just bleeds.

Bleeds. Vampires are sad sometimes. Yeah. It's like giving more zombie than vampire. Is it? I feel like it's giving that girl, did you guys watch American Horror Story? Which one, yes.

Coven. Yes, Coven where the little Farmiga, every time she has sex with a guy, it gives him a brain aneurysm and he dies. I forgot about that. Yeah, that's how the show opens. That's, I'm like the guy. Oh.

Wait, what? I'm dead from a brain aneurysm. Every time she has sex with someone, I got it. They die, they have like a brain aneurysm. Is it coming from your eyes and your nose or is that just like the drippage down? The drippage. The drippage.

It does look a little too little. It looks a little too much. It definitely looks like I just like the drippage down? The drippage. The drippage. It looks a little too much. It definitely looks like I just like am really having a rough day. You know, like you're crying, you're snotting everywhere. Yeah. You showed up. I'm a heartbroken vampire.

It's also true for true blood vampires. They cry blood, cause remember they don't have water in there. So yeah. That's so sad. There you go, Sierra. Bring it back. What age would you want wanna become a vampire?

Good question. Probably now. I think at the end of my life, right? Because they live forever, and then they're gonna be old forever. No, I think the question is like, what age do you wanna freeze in time? Oh, now for sure.

Yeah, you know? Actually, can everything happen still, and you're still the same? Like, say if, say, okay, okay, pre-baby, for sure pre-baby. Or wait. Back when I had like, yeah. You-baby, for sure pre-baby. Or wait. Back when I had like- Yeah.

You stay 22. You just wanna make sure you have a baby. You're not wishing River. No, no, no, I would still want River. I just wouldn't want the body, the depressiveness, the body. Are you depressed? No, no, no, I was at one point

and after postpartum depression is a thing that some people do talk about. I really haven't talked about that much, but yeah, there was like a moment, it was like split second that it was. Anyways. Bella did give birth to Renesmee and her body was snatched after.

Renesmee. Yeah, that vampire gene. Yeah, I'll take that. Yeah, well. It's time for Household Headlines. Sad news is upon us. Obviously the passing of Liam Payne happened last week. Very, very, very

tragic. Obviously our hearts go out to him and his family. Sounds like a very tragic story. He's someone who seems like he's been, you know, struggling with some, you know, stuff since One Direction broke up. And if you are struggling with your mental health, obviously reach out to friends and family if that is the case. What really like upsets me is there's you know, all of these

Witnesses speaking out and the the video footage or the the video recordings from the hotel calling 911 is all leaking and to me it seems so obvious that this person needed help and no one Called to get him help. It's like he was doing things in the lobby. They'd send him up to his room, he'd come back down, he'd do some stuff, they'd send him back up to his room, and it's like he clearly needed help, and you just like kept sending him away. And that I think is like the saddest part. It's a sad story. I mean, it sounds like he was in a very volatile state of mind. I don't know what was going on when that was all happening, but some reports suggest that maybe he seemed to be, yeah, in a state that other people felt maybe unsafe around him, so who knows what was going on.

But anyways, very difficult situation, very sad, obviously to his fans and family. His girlfriend. His past, his child, very sad story. Continuing with the sad stories, P. Diddy continues to face more and more charges. We're not gonna get into the details because quite honestly, they're kind of disgusting

and horrible once again, for all the people who are involved in this story, may they all go down and pay the consequences of their terrible acts, especially P. Diddy. There was a video that I think, you know, a bunch of stuff is resurfacing now. And there was a video that is resurfacing of him with like Martha Stewart and Snoop Dogg and-

Oh my God, stay away from those two. Like a bunch of people, a bunch of people, and he pulls a card and it's like, right before you die, like what would be your last words? And his is, I did it. And it's just like all of this, it's like all the signs were there, but it's like none of us could see it,

and now that all of this has come out, it's like, this was so obvious. Well, I think what's even more disturbing, forgetting about us fans who should have been like, oh, we could have saw it. It seems like there were a lot of people who actually did see it, witnessed it, were involved in it, participated in it.

And I think it's a long spectrum of people who are also guilty of the things that Diddy is being charged of. And then just people who were willfully aware of what was going on and chose not to say anything or were too, I'm sure we'll claim they're too afraid to come forward, but it seems like way, way, way too many people, I think we can all agree on that,

were well aware of some of these disgusting behaviors that P. Diddy and his circle of friends and influence were participating in. And again, may they all burn and face the consequences of their actions. On good news, Jennifer Lawrence is pregnant with baby number two. Congratulations, we love that for her and her family.

So am I. Very exciting. We need to get her on the pod. She's a big Bravo fan. You're pregnant? What? I was like, wait a minute. No, no, no, absolutely not.

I'm wearing all leather today. There's no way you could be pregnant with all leather. You would be. Yeah, absolutely not. Eva Mendes reveals extreme reasons. I don't know why we call this extreme. I feel like this headline is unnecessarily and unfairly judging Eva Mendes and her parenting style.

Eva Mendes reveals her extreme reason for her and Ryan Gosling's daughters are forbidden from using smartphones. Well, maybe she was like, and it may be a little extreme, I don't know. Was it though? Did she call it extreme? Because I don't think we should be judging.

It is, extreme is in quotes. So I would imagine that may have been something she said. Well basically what she said was putting my kid on the internet and being like, oh, search something that to me is equivalent to telling her, okay, just go down the street in the middle of the night, you'll be fine. So that's like a chronology of like,

let me just remove the phones because if so. Eva Mendez is ahead of her time and she is a very mindful and present parent. And as two parents who are new to this thing, we're very mindful of, obviously, Nellie and I, we're both on our phones. And since we've had River, we know we're both on our phones too much.

We challenge each other to get off our phones when we're around River, but when we turn on the TV in the background, it's crazy just how instinctive River is. And she doesn't even know what a TV is, but she just immediately knows what it is. And it's hard, it's hard being a parent. I mean, that's the thing.

I can imagine any parent out there is gonna be like, well, tell me what you do when life gets hectic. It's very easy to put a screen in front of your child because it can be overwhelming at times, but good for Eva Mendez for taking up that challenge. I don't know. I don't think she's saying they don't watch TV. I think it's more like they don't have phones.

I'm just saying screen time in general, it's very easy to iPad it or to give your kid a phone or give your kid an iPad. It's a challenge not to do that. And I think we need more awareness about that and it needs to be more than norm and we have to stop calling this behavior extreme because I think it gets easier

when your community of parents all get together and limit your kid's access to a phone. Because I think, especially when our kids get older, I think what we've seen is like when it comes to kids going to like elementary school, middle school, high school, I think kids nowadays see the problems with phones, but you know what their biggest fear is? Missing out. FOMO. They're afraid of what conversations are happening online with their friends. So if their friends are online, if their friends have phones, it's even harder for parents

to have their kids not be on the phone. Anyways, good on Neva Mendez for being ahead of her time. It is an interesting analogy though, where she's like just searching anything on the phone. Anyways, good on Eva Mendez for being ahead of her time. It is an interesting analogy though, where she's like just searching anything on the internet is like going down the street. It's true. I think about it of like Instagram, like a feed is insane where like if I go to my explorer page, it will be housewives

and then like thirst traps. And like those thirst traps, everybody has an Oling fans nowadays. So it's like that thirst trap is linked to an Oling fans. And if you swipe from that thirst trap, you're gonna get like, who knows what? So it's like. Thereirst Trap is LinkedIn only fans. And if you swipe from that Thirst Trap, you're gonna get like, who knows what. So it's like. There's, it's unlimited access.

Even if you have parental controls, God only knows. I mean, parents nowadays, I mean, when, you know, rewind 30, 40 years ago, everyone was afraid of all the potential predators out on the streets, you know, who potentially could, you know, put your kids at risk. And those people still exist. But the reality is more of those predators are online.

They're not on the streets, they're not in the malls as much as they used to be. They're online, waiting for your kids to get online as well. And I think Eva Mendes' analogy is a perfect analogy because that's what the internet is. It's when your kid has a phone that's giving the world access to your children. And it's a scary world out there.

So good on even Mendes. Anyway, Project One Day is coming back. Well, it's coming back, but not on Bravo. So now it's going to freeform. I hate the name freeform. ABC Family. I'm like, I'm still not over it. It's like freeform.

Oh, my God. That's all. What does it stand for? Free formatting? I don't know. It's just like they rebranded abc family as freeform and i'm like It's because they wanted because abc family was supposed to be family content freeform is supposed to be for young adults teenagers but abc family had like like um Pregnant joe the girl that was pregnant switched at birth. They had like the fosters. They had it was like always like that And then they would do like hocus Pocus, 13 Days of Halloween.

Secret life of an American teenager. Yeah. Damn, that was a good show. It was great. Is anybody excited for Project One Way? No. Because I realized that I confused it with America's Top Model. If America's Next Top Model came back, that would be a little bit more exciting.

It would be exciting also, like how could they? But that's the thing. Because that one's also like low more exciting. It would be exciting, but also, how could they? But that's the thing. Because that one's also, like, low key problematic. So it's like, can we even bring back that one? Well, obviously, we'd have probably, like, a different line of... 100%. Judges and stuff. Not Janis Dickinson?

I don't know if Janis Dickinson's the same girl like that. Which one was Janis Dickinson? What did she say? Very scary. She's the harshest judge on America's Next Top Model. She was actually- It wasn't Tyra Banks? No, I mean, Tyra said a lot of problematic stuff too,

but I'm like, Janice was the one that said things that would scar people for life. She also cameoed on this past episode of Passive Villains. I started watching. Oh, really? It's a really fascinating show, actually. Oh, it's so good. Cause it's like all the people with the best soundbites,

throwing soundbites at each other. And fighting each other and having to vote each other out and they're all like inspiring and dirty and they play into it and it's so fun. Well, thank God for Project Runway. It is hard to say. It is kind of hard to say. Project Runway.

Project Runway. Interesting. Well, pop off. Housewives of Dubai season three is finally renewed. That I'm excited. Because Dubai has this weird thing, and I love all the Dubai people, one of my favorite franchises, where it takes forever to get renewed between seasons.

So like season one to season two took a while. Season three, like they wrapped this show months ago, and now it's renewed. I mean, usually they renew it right away. I would love to see more of Caroline and Sergio back on the screens. If we're throwing out other things that got renewed. Please do.

Nobody wants this, got renewed for a second season. I don't know if you guys started watching it. We started watching it last night. Obsessed. So cute. Obsessed. I just finished it last night. And what's so crazy is I was talking to our friend Shug about this this morning, and it's like me and her have been on the Adam Brody train. And I feel like there are so many people who like haven't or have, and now after watching this,

they're like, no, and I love him. And it's like, well, we've loved him all along. Me, Psycho. Welcome. Gilles Morckels, Jennifer's body. Seth Cohen. Yeah. Thank you.

Yeah, it's... I'm surprised he had, yeah, I mean, when I was in college, he was very popular with the ladies. Also married to Leighton Meester with like two children. Yeah. They kind of disappeared. Yeah, because they just, I mean, when I was in college, he was very popular with the ladies. Also married to Leighton Meester with two children. Yeah. He kinda disappeared. Yeah, cause they're normal people. Him and Leighton are such a normal couple and don't do all of the celebrity stuff,

but I'm glad that he's finally having his resurgence cause he wasn't appreciated enough. He wasn't. No. The Adam Brodessant. Same charming character. He played basically 20 some years ago. A thousand percent. Sierra was saying earlier when we were talking about topics to talk about, she goes,

I don't know, nobody wants this, but was renewed for another season. And I was like, nobody wants this. In my head I was like, what do you mean nobody wants this? It sounded like a game of who was on first? Yeah, literally. And then I was like, oh, that's the show. Nobody wants this.

Nobody wants this. My favorite Adam Brody character, Fight Club. No, I'm sorry, not Fight Club. Mr. and Mrs. Smith. Mr. and Mrs. Smith. I was like, whoa. Mr. and Mrs. Smith where he's wearing the Fight Club t-shirt of Brad Pitt

in the movie with Brad Pitt. He was in Mr. and Mrs. Smith? Yeah, it's great. It's a great cameo. He was, and he was amazing. It's really funny. It's a great moment. And then I, honestly honestly like after Fight Club,

then he just like kind of disappeared. After Mr. and Mrs. Smith. Thank you. I keep thinking about that. I love Fight Club. And Mr. and Mrs. Smith. You know who is disappearing? Rachel Lovis is no longer going rogue and she's leaving the podcast.

Is she? Is she finally going rogue? That's true. And leaving the podcast. Did she give it a reason as to why she's leaving the podcast. Is she? Or is she finally going rogue? That's true. And leaving the podcast. Did she give it a reason as to why she's done? She is... Moving on. Once again, trying to focus on her mental health. Oh.

She said like the taking the other foot out. No, no, no, no, no, now here comes the book. Yeah. The memoir. The tell-all memoir book. Is the podcast still being recorded? The Tell All memoir book. Is the podcast still being recorded? It is the last time I listened for a headline. It was just her publicist or producer

that was hosting it by herself. So I don't know how long that's been going on if Rachel's been a part of it or has stepped away for a while and now it's finally being announced. Is she gonna walk away from the lawsuit next maybe? You would hope so. That would be nice, but I don't think so.

I think that's coming up in November. She's taking time off of her podcast to focus on her lawsuit. Yeah. I mean, basically. She's like, I'm not making money doing the podcast, but like, ta-ching. Yeah, to be a professional lawsuit. I do wonder though, if her podcast was like,

incriminating her and then her like lawyers were like, girl, you gotta stop. And then eventually she's like, you know what? I'm just not gonna speak. Probably. Yeah. Well, it sure felt like Rachel was being fed lines on her own podcast. Yeah, I did tell you that.

By the people making the podcast. Which given how I know those podcasts made over there on iHeart, it makes sense. Speaking of the whole Sandoval Raquel situation, Cordell, a fan favorite from Love Island USA, was in a interview on a red carpet and the interviewer asked, can we as a nation ever forgive Tom Sandoval?

And he responds with Tom who? And I think that just goes to show you that like no one ever really gives a fuck. Like there are so many people in this world that like it's really never that big. Never. You know? Like there's a whole group of people who have no, a huge amount of people who have no idea

who Tom Sandoval is and don't give a fuck. Yeah. This is really just a lesson you're saying, I'm assuming for Tom Sandoval. I'm saying for everything. For anything that you think is like a big deal for you, it's like, it never is. For you but for not someone else. Yeah. It's like, it never is. For you, but for not someone else.

It's like, oh my God, everyone thinks this about me or everyone said this. It's like, no one really knows who that is. Some people thought that Cordell was being shady with this when he said Tom Who. No, he literally doesn't know. She responded going, exactly. And then he goes, oh, I don't know what that is. So then he says that. So then people were like, oh, he's being extra shady.

No. But he genuinely did not know. He genuinely didn't know. And I think he was being, he didn't want to be quoted on a topic he knew nothing about. And he was making it very clear that whatever you're insinuating or whatever headline you're about to give me, I have no fucking clue what you're saying.

He's like, I don't need the next headline to be Cordell and Sandoval at war. And he's like, who? Who? It reminded me of like the Jimmy Kimmel interview with RuPaul when he was like a drag queen. And then RuPaul was like a drag queen. That was Jimmy Fallon.

Sorry, Jimmy Fallon, I get the mix up. But he goes, a drag queen. And then he was like, and he goes, queen of drag. But like you could see it in their eyes when someone's like. Jimmy Fallon thought he was over. Yeah, he thought, yeah.

That was so close, give me some energy. I'm the queen of drag. Queen of drag. So there you go, yeah, no one cares, just remember. Should we get some Raul's vibes? Can we? No. How do we, which should we start with?

Start with Salt Lake City. Salt Lake City. You wanna start with Salt Lake? Okay. I don't care. Actually wait, do we save the best for last? Don't we usually save the best for last? That's true.

Okay, go to OC first. Okay. Good episode for OC. I felt like OC was better. OC was so good. It can never be better than Soly. I mean, they're both good. I mean, just in general, I think Soly.

I officially followed Jen after this past episode. All in my respect. Everybody loves her now after this episode. The last five minutes. Is that just because she went after Tamara? Probably a part. A, it's the arc of seeing her come up after last season, coming off a little weak, I will say.

And then this season, her going in there and just being like- She raised her voice. That's what it was, yeah. Raised her voice. Tamara's clapping at her. No, yeah, the Tamara being condescending, clapping, being like, I'm so proud of you.

Yes, you're using your voice. If I'm Heather, I'm disgusted of you. Yes, you're using your voice. Like if I'm Heather, I'm like, I'm disgusted with you. Like who, what grown woman acts like that? Right. Yeah. But Heather was kind of aligned with Tamara this episode. It felt like. It did feel like that.

I feel like she was with the whole Shannon stuff, but then it's like to sit here and watch Tamara act that way. When Jin, who hasn't done anything wrong to anybody ever in her life, is standing up for herself and simply just saying, please don't, leave my family alone. My kids are good, we are good, please. And then Tamra just being so, just such a bitch. It's like, how can you back that?

You found your voice. Yeah. She was definitely rude to her. I kind of, did Tamra really do a background check though? She said in her words, my friend is doing a background check and then sent screenshots of said background check. That being said, she can be a little,

maybe not lying, but misleading. So she could have been misleading in her defense, but she said it. Well, Tamara definitely lies. And she said it. Regardless, Jen makes the best point being like, the obsession with my family, my situation, it's disgusting. Like, what is your purpose? You want to blow up my life and then be like,

cool, I'm right, and then what? I don't agree with anything Tamara's doing this season. But if we had a group of friends whose one friend was dating someone we all kind of agreed with was problematic and shady, we would Google them, we would look him up. We would, we would, we would. But that's also like none of your business.

Just because you don't like him, you don't have to date him. I would recognize that someone could say it's none of our business. I get it. But would you get, we would. Would you get a background check on somebody? Again, I don't know if he.

Would you continue to go after them constantly over every chance you get? Be like, after she says, I'm fine, I love him, I'm not the thing? I can't say one, like I hate everything Tamra's done. I am not defending Tamra. I'm just saying that, again, we love, I'm glad Jen finally stood up for herself

because Jen's really mean to only one person and that is herself because she makes a lot of decisions that you just like, oh, Jen. Tamra should be like Emily. I think that's the difference where Emily's approach to questioning her husband was like, well, we would all do. Do you think Tamra's be like Emily. I think that's the difference where Emily's approach to questioning the husband was like, well, we would all do. Do you think Tamra's judgment or questioning

or research of Ryan is coming from a good place? Of course not. I don't. So then how can you be like, listen, I get it, I do the same. If it's not coming from a good place. I just don't think we're all acting like, when Jen's like, it's none of your business,

how could you, it's gross and disgusting that you're just like, I'm just saying like, that's the part we're all acting like, when Jen's like, it's none of your business, how could you, it's gross and disgusting, that you're just, I'm just saying, that's the part we would all do. We would. Well, speak for yourself, I definitely would not. Yeah, that's what I'm saying, at 40, 20 at 40 is two different things, but even then, if my best friend is dating somebody

that I don't particularly am fond of, but I have my own reasons for not liking him and they tell me I'm good, this is the person I choose, it's either mind my own business or there's gonna be a rift in our friendship because I don't like your partner and I make it hard for you to date him. Like I would definitely make it very known,

my concerns, my like worries. I'd be like, listen, babe, I have heard these things about him, I don't like him, but like to then go out of my way and do A, B, C, and D and then like not even tell her about it. She didn't even do the background check and then be like, hey, Jen, like I have to tell you like what I found. Nothing. She just sends it to Shannon to talk shit about.

I'm not talking about that aspect of it. I'm not saying we would do everything Tamra did. I'm all I am saying is we would be nosy. I'm not saying we would deliver it. I think we would be much better friends. I don't think even Tamra is interested in being a friend. I don't even think I don't think we would have the same intentions as Tamra. I just think we would deliver it. I think we would be much better friends. I don't think even Tamara's interested in being a friend. I don't even think, I don't think we would have the same intentions as Tamara.

I just think we would be nosy. I do think that. Am I wrong? I'm just gonna spend hours of my time digging into somebody else's relationship or like who did they date or like what, like are they in mortgages? Like why is that any of my business?

What are you gonna do with that information? If your best friend was dating someone that you thought potentially allegedly was doing criminal things or nefarious things or legal things, you wouldn't be a little nosy? Then I would talk to them. I would talk to her and be like, hey, this is what's going on.

This is what's on the internet. Like, what say you about it? And if they acted like it was all like internet gossip and it was all people, it was just the haters being haters, but you thought there was some truth to it, you would. Back off, because it's none of my business. You know what, in your defense, Nick, I think you're right, I think you could do it,

but I think Tamara was messy, that's when you just say I got a DM. To be clear, I think Tamara, I received a direct message. Of a PDF of some of the top haters. She didn't have to say I went to go get the background check. I don't think Tamara's interested in being a good friend, what I'm saying is you can be nosy and gossipy

and still like at the end of the day, still wanna be a good friend to your friend. I don't think Tamara's being a friend or has an interest being a friend to Jen. I think Tamara is doing what Tamara is doing, which is causing drama and instigating drama and making people feel foolish about their choices they make for themselves.

I'm just saying we would Google. She's not being nosy to be like, Jen, you need to get out of this. He's not a good person. I'm worried about you. She's doing it to be like, I told you all along that he was bad and I'm the one who's been right and I this.

That's the only reason she's doing it. And again, Jen also makes a point. Tamra using somebody else's situation for a storyline. What is one thing that you've learned about Tamra this season involving her personal life? Nothing. Her daughter. She did have a moment with her daughter

where her daughter was like, I'm not performing for this TV like you do. Well, that's what's crazy about it. That's true. Think about it. How do you think Tamara would handle Tamara's storyline about Tamara's daughter? She would blow up every single time

somebody even brought up the name because it's none of their business. Does Tamra use kids? Because obviously that was like a big storyline of Salt Lake City. Why was she removed again? Remember she was put on pause like way back when. Tamra's?

Well Tamra's just probably mine, I can't remember why though. Because they brought her back last season, so that was her return season. I'm once again just disappointed in Heather. That whole scene, maybe I could have been watching it or interpreting it wrong, but when Shannon was pulling out the receipts

and Tamra and Heather were just, it was Emily and Heather, they were kind of like, just got- They made fun of her with their stops. Kind of gave Mean Girl energy. It's just like, they're just laughing at Shannon because it's like, at what?

Because she's supposed to like have everything indexed and organized and like everything should be digital. And here's Shannon out there there ruffling through receipts and they're just kind of laughing and snarking at her because she's giving disorganized. Those are also some big receipts. It wasn't like $5 here or $10 here. It was like 20,000.

It's also interesting to me that they're like, oh, she was struggling to pay bills and she was doing this, but she got plastic surgery. And it's like, if I'm struggling to pay my bills and my boyfriend is like, babe, do you want a facelift? I'll get it. Sure. 100% immediately.

I'm not gonna be like, no, no, I'll wait until I'm financially stable for you to buy me a facelift. Like, no, let's go ahead. Let's make the appointment. 1000%? It doesn't look pretty while I'm broke. It's the same thing with Jen and the dress where it's like, oh, but you only get 6,000

and I'm concerned for you and how you're spending your money. First of all, yet again, none of your business. Second of all, two grand and she just moved into a giant mansion that you guys were just at. You don't think that Ryan is contributing at all. And last season she had fake and she admitted it. So it's like, it could be anything. There's no pleasing you bitches.

People who are bad with their money are often- Good spenders. Yes, they're bifing for other people. They're very generous, they give to their friends. That's not the confusing part. I just, I find Heather to be classy and sophisticated and above the fray, and like we said at the beginning of the season, she needs new friends, and here she is,

just kind of like laughing at Shannon for like not being organized. It just, it's like, it's new friends, and here she is, just kind of like laughing at Shannon for like not being organized. It just, it's like, it's giving like, mean girl. To me it's a little bit, not blaming Tamara, but I'm saying it's the Tamara effect. It's the same way that Gina was like, well when Emily's close with Tamara, I don't recognize you, you're so mean.

And then it's like, Tamara rubbing off on Heather, it's like, okay we laugh, okay we giggle, okay like, I'm not gonna say anything, even though the right thing to do would be like Well, you guys calm down. This isn't that serious or like let's have a conversation Like you would think that Heather would facilitate calm communication and said she was like, hmm Yeah, Heather was trying to also I think no Heather Well, the genthing she was like wait

Don't talk about my friendship with Tamra. That's true. Has Has Tamara spoke any further on her self diagnosis? No, besides the apology we read last week. I know she kind of resented it and was like, I think I spoke too soon on a vague idea of what the spectrum is. That was her apology last week. I feel like the collective take is regardless of what her diagnosis ends up being or not being,

I feel like for the people who are or who are not part of this community, I feel like everyone just kind of thinks, like, you got this far in life, Tamra. And so, regardless of whatever your diagnosis is, no one has the patience or appetite for her to, like, use it as a reason for any type of behavior on the show. We can criticize that when that does become her excuse.

But I think right now it was just her being like, this is what I found out about myself, and now I'm sharing it. And then she got shit for it, and she was like, whoa, whoa, whoa, let me do some more research. I don't think she was like, this explains the whole season and why everyone hates me. It did come right after the laughing at Shannon episode.

And then I think a lot of people connected the dots because Tamra in that message was basically saying like, I lack the ability to empathize or read social situations and it kind of suggested that she was using that as an excuse without directly saying it. I think every episode she could have put that out. I think every episode she's shown some sort of, I don't think it's like a coincidence.

I think every episode she's not been empathetic towards people who deserve empathy. And I don't think it's like a coincidence. I think every episode she's not been empathetic towards people who deserve empathy. And I don't think, I think it was just like, I took this test and here it is. Maybe. Well, in separate from the diagnosis, like in this episode, she did say, oh, I shouldn't have said that.

And it's like- She did? At what context? When they were talking about Ryan in the FBI again. Like it was just a quick one-off comment that she said where it's like, oh, I shouldn't have said that. And it's like, how many times can you say, oh, I shouldn't have said that. And it's like, how many times can you say, oh, I shouldn't say this?

And then it's like, okay, well. It's still. I'm saying this separate from like all of the diagnoses thing. It is also, I mean, the whole like sitting at the dinner table and Shannon's trying to talk about the whole Alexis lawsuit. And she's just like hand in Shannon's face. It's just the constant like disrespect to Shannon that,

and like none of the other women are like, whoa, let's chill out. That's too much. No one ever stands up. You don't even have to love Shannon to stand up. You can just be like, Tamara, put your hand down. What are you doing right now? And no one says anything.

Nobody. The energy that the rest of the cast is giving is that Shannon is just this hot mess who makes endless bad decision after endless bad decision. And the rest of the cast is giving is that Shannon is just this hot mess who makes endless bad decisions after endless bad decisions and the rest of the cast is giving like, we don't feel sorry for you anymore. That's kind of the energy that they're giving. But it's still hard to understand why, to Nellie's point, why they lack any empathy

for her whatsoever, which is weird. It's just weird that they don't think that they could be in need of a little pat on the back at some point in their life. And they're acting like Shannon is, is run out of pats on the back. It looks more like they just don't wanna get involved, is the vibe that I get. I mean, I do finally appreciate a little-

They are. They are involved, I agree. I do finally appreciate Emily speaking up at the table, being like, you pound down on Shannon for like, quote unquote lying about this stuff, but like you give Alexis all these free passes. And like, that's just so weird to me. And like, Tamara, of course, had nothing to say.

Back to that. But I hope this is like the start of them sticking up for what's right and what's wrong. I don't know. I don't think they're ever gonna do that. They probably won't. Yeah, I haven't done it yet. I mean, that's the thing.

It's like, even Emily, who's been the closest thing to an ally to Shannon, even in that scene where Shannon's ruffling through the receipts was like laughing at her as if like she should. That also could have been like a let's like, the context wasn't there. You know, I feel like Shannon didn't seem to like, why the fuck are you laughing at me?

Like I'm being for real. It did kind of seem like a, this is the best way I could have kept up with it. It's like a little frantic and old lady of me, but like. I think it was funnier in the sense because Heather's comparing her to her mom at that point being like she's coming back with files and whatnot for her to come back with scraps of paper

that I think it was just a funnier presentation. And sometimes when things are just silly, you just laugh uncontrollably while trying to take something serious. I guess that, but this whole season, every scene Shannon's in, it's always like, she's down bad, she needs a hug, she needs a pick me up, and here she is, bringing out receipts,

and then you have Heather and Emily just laughing. You know, it's just like, I don't know. I felt more like they were laughing with her rather than at her in that scene specifically. I also think Gina's like her number one ally in my opinion, because I'm like, I feel like Gina's the one that's like, hey, we've had the most drama,

but like, I'm the one that's gonna follow you out after dinner, I'm the one that's gonna check and make sure that you're okay. I'm the one that's like building you up in that situation. And then Emily's doing a good job behind the scenes, I feel like, but like maybe not actually standing up right in the moment. But at the same time, exactly what Gina said when she was here, it's kind of like, I can see why the scenes, I feel like, but maybe not actually standing up right in the moment. But at the same time, exactly what Gina said

when she was here, it's kind of like, I can see why she's looking around being like, why am I the one doing this? Yeah. Like, why aren't, and you all have known her for so much longer, and yet I'm the only one that feels obligated to stand up right now and follow her? Oh, okay, here I go.

It's crazy. And what's the latest on Alexis? She was remarkably absent for this episode. Thank you, they're all, they're still in. They're still in. She was not invited. She did post something on Instagram this past Friday, if you want me to read it. Oh my God.

So she basically said, this is a response to Shannon being like, I have a text of you admitting that you're part of the original lawsuit. The smoking gun, as she referred to. So Alexis posted on Instagram saying, I am not a liar, in all caps. Yes, I remember this text. A text is not a legal document, which was the original accusation.

The text did not get the ball rolling. It was my attempt to stop the ball from rolling. It was sent to both Tamara and Shannon at Jim Bilenio's request with hopes that they would stop attacking our family. And at a time where family was already in shambles from six months of our new divorce, our kids were broken. I never supported Jim suing them. And once he began moving forward with the lawsuit,

I told him I will neither condone or support it. I was, in all caps, never a part of this lawsuit. Also in all caps, I am not a liar. Be sure to tune into this reunion as further evidence that I am not a liar is revealed. Be sure to tune into this reunion. Evidence that I'm not a liar is revealed. That's awesome.

Ew. I mean, like, no, it's still evidence. A text is evidence. If you aren't a part of it. Public opinion, not, well, Alexis is saying it's not a legal document. It doesn't record a public opinion. But it's just like, if you aren't a part of it,

then you say like, Jim's attorney, Jim's suing you, Jim is, you don't like just throw yourself in the mix if you've been the whole time like, please don't do it. Let's not, I don't condone this. Don't send it. You don't just we, we, we, we are my, you know, but okay. I mean, I am excited for that reunion. I do feel like it will be off the walls bonkers.

Yeah. So crazy. Well, I heard it was kind of chill until Alexis shows up. Oh, I'm sure. Do you think they, oh no, it's already been filmed, hasn't it? Yeah. I'm gonna say, do you think they ask Jen if she's excited about the Dodgers going to the World Series?

Ryan's like, yes! Sorry, sorry. I won't speak. It took me a second. I was like, Dodgers. Who do you think she's betting on? Dodgers, she asked me. Yikes, yikes, yikes.

I think she does have to bet on the Dodgers. The new Bellino, Alexis' ex, isn't he dating an old housewife or something in the public eye? It was rumored, but then he made a comment saying we're not dating. So I think we're kind of in limbo of like- They were best friends. Weren't they at the dinner or something?

Right, they were at a dinner, pretty close to each other, yes, photographed. What is with these guys, obsessive? I mean, they might not be, I don't know, like a couple. You stand by like a photo says nothing. Maybe they're not, but they are hanging out. What housewife is it, who is it? Well, this is Elizabeth Lynn Vargas.

One hit wonder on a season of Orange County. It's just more like, regardless of their friends or dating or what, it seems these guys of Orange County, they're like housewife chasers. Right. Well, Orange County is kind of the vibe of the men or the unofficial friend-ofs. Like in OC, the men are the unofficial friend ofs sometimes. So like Heather Dubrow's husband, he's kind of like a friend of.

We give sometimes, unfairly, women a lot of shit for their male companions who might be celebrities and we have certain labels and names we like to attach to them. I just feel like these men of the OC should be appropriately shamed for their obsession with riding the coattails of these powerful women. I agree. 100%. should be appropriately shamed for their obsession with like riding the coattails of these powerful women.

And we need a name for the housewife chasers of OC. Yeah, because they're definitely using the clout of their exes. Like I dated her. I was in two episodes. We only know about these guys and all they do is like sue these women and we only know about their relevancy Because of their proximity to these women, you know, there's like single white female. Is there a single white male? Yeah Bring that back there we go If you're a pet parent like us, you know

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I really appreciated Bronwyn's background. Yeah. Like just getting a little glimpse into her past, because you would never think from like how she presents that that's something she's experienced. And to think that it's connected to Lisa is also like an insane connection. Yeah, that was kind of like a she presents, that that's something she's experienced. And to think that it's connected to Lisa is also like an insane connection. Yeah, that was kind of like a very beautiful,

like genuine thing they had on the show that I wasn't necessarily expecting. I wasn't emotionally ready. I was like waiting for, not to- It was really fast too, it opened with that. It opened with that and I was like, is Lisa gonna use this as an angle? And I was like worried and then she didn't.

Lisa was crying. Lisa was crying, it was really nice to see. worried and then she didn't. It was just like, Lisa was crying. It was really nice to see. I can't imagine how Bronwyn felt just being like, oh my God, like this is her dad. And then her being like, oh my God, I know that connection, how Bronwyn must've been like, what the fuck, like this.

She hasn't heard or talked to that family in so long and like to know that he then passed away. It's just like that rush of emotions and even her daughter being like, it's such a vulnerable conversation to have of just like, I want to know that whole part of who I am, but it's like, they don't seem to want me. When she had a comment where she was like,

even if I let them back into her life, her daughter's life, she's like, it will hurt me. So she's facing the whole, like, this is a good thing, but also like they treated me the way they did back in the day. Ronan was talking about, she's like, so many people have made so many decisions about this relationship or lack thereof, and the only person that really has to deal

with those decisions is my daughter. And it's just sad, it's a lot. I think it also shows how selfless Ronan really is, because she's not making it about her. Where I'm like the same people that essentially caused a big traumatic event in your life, like are the same people, the grandparents of your child who you want to help complete her story. So I'm like at the same time that it's like allowing them to come back into the daughter's life. It's like you're still gonna have to be face to face with the idea that the people who treated you this way

or made you feel this way about a very special situation in your life are also the people that might help complete a story about the daughter's dad that she doesn't have the pieces to. No, it must be very scary for someone like Brawn to face because everyone has their truth. It's a very sensitive, obviously, topic.

Brawn has her truth that she is shared with her daughter. And I think often every parent, especially the position that Browen's in, is always gonna be this fear of, how will new information change potentially her relationship with her daughter? Maybe, hopefully, not at all, but you can understand why Browen has a fear of something like that, just because obviously it is such a big moment

for her daughter, and it's unpredictable. And it's, yeah, I mean, very scary situation. I mean, scary in the sense that, yeah, it's like you don't know how it's gonna play out and you recognize the seriousness of it and the importance of it for her daughter. And to be have to relinquish that control for the love of your daughter is very,

it's very difficult and selfless. And I don't think it's something a lot of parents would do. I think a lot of parents in Brawin's positions would use that opportunity to speak ill. Or mislead. Or mislead. And Brawin, quite frankly, let's be honest,

isn't a position to talk shit if she wanted to. Absolutely. You know what I'm saying? Like it would be very easy for her to do that. And I think a lot of parents in her position, unfortunately, take that lone hanging fruit. And you can tell Brawin has a lot of love for her daughter in a way that like it really,

she has to love her daughter so much that she has to like suppress her own needs. And that's one of the most difficult things as a parent to do, to know what is best for my kid might not always be what's best for you. I can also imagine that there's like a part of Bronwyn that's like nervous for Gwen to meet them of like, what are they gonna say about me?

What's their version of these events? Is it gonna be like, oh, your mom wouldn't let you know? She would let this? That's not true, that one story or whatever, it's just like, actually, she did this or acted like this. And yeah, it's- And Bronwyn, she was also 19. That's the wild part.

She's probably traumatized. I mean, this is trauma that she experienced. Yeah, but his family 19. Like that's the wild part. It's like she's probably trauma, I mean this is trauma that she experienced. Yeah, but her, his family. They see it as a different way. God only knows what she's saying. Well, Nisa was saying in her confessional that like she kind of alluded to like the really nice people and they have their own side of the story,

but it's like to that point. I think it's also like you bring the Mormonism into it and there's just like so much to unpack. Bronwyn's definitely in a position where she wants her daughter to be able to experience her full family. But at the same time, I think she's really like, she's scared because she wants her daughter to feel wanted.

And it's like to put your kid into a situation where they may- You feel unsafe. Yeah, yeah. It's just, it's a lot. And I think they're handling it. Well, and then the daughter got the text from the family saying, well, when she's ready, when you're ready.

And the daughter was like, I've been ready. What do you mean? Yeah. Well, the other new housewife, Brittany. Browen's really winning the new housewife Olympics. I'm the team, I've read for her, Charlie. Browen's also a full-time cast member. like she gets more screen time whether that was made retroactive. Is she, does she though? I was about to say I feel like Brittany, uh,

all over. She's on it so much it's annoying the fuck out of Mary. Yeah. Is Brittany, well is Brittany a cast member or is Jared Aubis a cast member? That's the real- Sorry Jared, friends don't send a massive bouquet of flowers, a stuffed animal... No! He's stuck on that. ...a friendship. No, this is unhinged behavior all around. There was a crazy conversation of them sitting down.

And then he goes, I'm a good guy. No, no, no! No, you are not. Self-proclaimed. The level of slime and acting, bad acting, that was happening at that table, because he was like, I'm gonna say this, and then you're gonna say this,

and then when she doesn't say this, he's like, no. What's so crazy about that is it really gave, he got paid to act this way. And I actually don't think he did. I don't think he did either. I don't think he did, but he was so unhinged and so unself-aware of how he came across, I just didn't think that someone of his age, with quite honestly you would think

his background or at least his proximity to fame. PR trained. PR trained. But you would think that he wouldn't come bulldozing into this show and act the way he did. Well remember the Instagram post that we read out loud like weeks ago where he was like, she used me as a story.

Like just the way he talks about her is very much you have. I'm the reason she's even on this show. I think we should make him a housewife. Or conspiracy theory. He's like, because he is the heir of the Osmonds, he's very much like heir. Like the heir to the throne. The heir to the throne, descendant.

Is that how heir is used? Yeah, heir to the throne. Like he's like the heir of the Osmond family. Yeah, the... This is Mormon royalty we're talking about here. Does the heir and sinuate you're gonna inherit some kind of title or? He did it though.

Well, at one point he's gonna be the Osmond. He is the oxygen, he is the CO2. Yeah. I thought he was more like the black sheep. Is he? I mean, I don't know deep Osmond. I also don't, I mean, he's acting like a black sheep. Wasn't it Lisa who was like, he's not even,

she was like Lisa, like least Os sheep. Wasn't it Lisa who was like, he's not even, she was like, Lisa, like, Lisa Osmond. Maybe he thinks he can do, he's spent his entire life being able to do whatever he wants and treat people, women, any way he wants to treat them because he is an Osmond in this community. That's the vibe I got where I was like, I don't know him, but I'm like,

the way you're talking to Brittany online and to her face is giving, I don't respect women. Yeah, like I have had every single thing given to me and like I can do whatever I want. He was saying something along the lines of like, the way you would treat this friendship after like all the time and energy I put into it. He used some other words,

but I was like the way he phrased that I was like. Yeah. It's giving like the Botox has gone to your head and now like you've lost. It's blocking something. Yeah. All he can do is text a brow girl. It's literally, it's just so idiotic for him to be like

I've put so much time into this, you know how much more time I could have been I could have spent texting Angie's brow girl But now I'm dealing with you Just like I was trying to fuck around and you're making me find out Bernie did she did stand up for herself to the degree until he was like and then you let Lisa call me and then she Was like, oh you right let Lisa call me, and then she was like, oh, you're right. My bad, my bad. As bad as he is, it's still all of Brittany's fault. You think so?

As far as it relates to her world and her problems and what's upsetting her, I don't know how old she is, but like I said last week, she's old enough to know better. And I'm sorry, this is absurd behavior by him and someone at her stage in life, old enough to know better. And I'm sorry, this is absurd behavior by him. And someone at her stage in life, he's walking around like an 18 year old fuck boy. He is, he has all the alarm bells.

He is letting everyone know how dangerous he is as a friend or a partner. You know what I'm saying? He is projecting it. He is letting everyone know. Red, he is flying all his flags. She's got all her friends letting her know. He is letting everyone know. He is flying all his flags. She's got all her friends letting her know. She's asking for advice.

And now she's getting mad. She's doing what, again, what 19-year-old girls do. When they get mad at her friends. She's matching his energy. Because she wants to decided to take him back after not officially breaking up with him in the first place. Maybe they're made for each other. Exactly.

I think they're perfect for each other. You're going to talk our ears off. Being a friend of somebody who goes through breakups and on and off and on and off again after a while, you're just like, I don't wanna hear it. I don't wanna hear it because I know the second that I agree that he's a piece of shit, you're gonna tell me, don't say that about him,

that's my man. I agree there's red flags, but I don't think she's at fault because if he's a lot of act immature, she's a lot of act immature. Yeah. So it's like, I think. And that's where I get, I have a hard time going back to OC with Jen.

I mean, this is just, we're just getting a front row seat of Jen and Ryan without seeing Jen and shouldn't that also play to Brittany's defense where it's like she hasn't really had to care for herself till now. So she is technically behind This is our first time meeting Brittany, you know on TV and I can and maybe I'm wrong But I can assume I feel like I can safely assume that the Brittany complaining into her friends and then Brittany fighting with her friends for talking shit on Brittany's male partners is a cyclical problem that happens with Brittany Heather did say she's heard this story before I also think it could be a thing of like this is Brittany's first season on TV It will be very interesting to see after watching this all back, how she will feel and how she will act. She also only got mad at Lisa because Jared like stuck that bug in her ear.

It's just like, and also when you're in that toxic of a relationship and also the way she was raised as like this good Mormon girl to like be do everything from your men. It's just like, I think there's a lot more to Brittany than we've seen so far. And I wish that she would be able to get out of this Jared Osmond hole and like actually show her personality I agree with Nick though too where I'm kind of like at the same time at what point do you just say like grow up? Yeah, I don't think it's an excuse Maybe this is Brittany's willingness to like insert this storyline for the sake of a storyline

And yeah, maybe we'll see like next season, season six or whatever. Maybe Brittany will show the growth that we're expecting her to have now, but she's just kind of willing to show this messy aspect of her life. And maybe it's played up a bit, but I honestly don't think so.

This doesn't seem like really good acting. This seems like her. This is her. And also if you're in a relationship and you're having your friends grab your phone and text the person that you're dating, like you should not be in that relationship. I do stand by that too.

Yeah. You know what I mean? If you can't text them on your own, this is not your relationship. And now you're gonna turn around and get mad at Lisa for what she said when you were sitting next to her the entire time, could have taken your phone. She should have broken up with him at the Costco comment.

Like. I agree. That was a crazy thing though, you saw when like she confronted Lisa, Lisa was like, hold on, wait, you're mad at who? Yeah, you were laughing. And I'm just saying, if Brittany would complain to me about Jared, I would Google him eventually.

I would. When eventually, especially when Brittany is like, well, he didn't actually do that. And then when she started defending him, I would go back and it'd be like. So would you do a background check or would you get a DL? Eventually with Brittany, honestly,

I probably won't get a background fucking check because it would be like the 17th time that Brittany was like, I'm definitely leaving him and then finally heard it come back and then tell me why I'm being unfair to him. Can you imagine what it would be like to have to listen to Brittany complain over and over for hours and then yell at you

for talking down on the very ground? That was wild, that part one, that was wild. I do kind of love that this is now happening in Salt Lake because we really have not seen that much messy relationship drama, not between the girls. You know what I mean? Just to watch someone's mess in their relationship. They've already attacked the husbands. We're over that.

Yeah. Now it's like, okay, there's no like, you want to talk about the husbands. It's very much like, no, I want to... No, we actually do. We really want to talk about the boyfriends. We're going out, no, I wanna, I am front row eating popcorn for Jared on screen. We're going out for the boyfriends. We're all driving the hate bus. The boyfriend is great to go after, and so I'm enjoying it.

You think we'll get more of him? I hope so. I sure hope so. He needs to be off TV, I'm sorry. No, are you kidding? He was obsessed with the fact that he had a camera and he was at lunch and he was seeing. I think we should make him a huff.

Yes, I think he can help himself. He loved it. He loved it so much. I don't like this man. He will not. I don't think we should make him a huff. Yes, I think he can't help himself. He loved it. He loves it so much. I don't like this man. He will not. I don't either, but he's good TV. He's a terrible human being. But it's like, should we platform these people?

Yes. But I also think. No, because it's okay, because we're platforming him in a universe where we know that we expect terrible behavior. Yeah, we're not looking at to him for influence. I don't want him on the same screen as Brittany. I think we need to ultimate girls trip and like throw the husbands on a trip.

Like that's what we need. That would be great. The way he treats Brittany in like that dynamic. No, no, no, but I wanna be clear. No, I know, I know. Brittany treats herself this way. Well, she deserves some grace though. She was in love.

What grace? We've all been there, we're in love and we're like acting greasy. Yes, we were 19, Justin. Okay, but they do say the older you get, you do turn, you age backwards the older you get. What about the whole, you accept the love you think you deserve?

Well, and she thinks she deserves that. Yeah. That's what she's used to. I think it's just like, I hope that these, it seems like, I hope they don't get so sick of her bullshit that they don't wanna help her. Because I think she does, I mean, and at a certain point you can only offer someone so much help until it's like, okay, this is you.

And my point I'm saying is there's an unlimited supplies of Jermies in the world. Yes. And if you, Jared's. There's an unlimited supply. And Jeremy's too. And he says Jeremy, he can't say Jeremy. Jeremy?

Jeremy? Jeremy? Okay, sorry, continue. Jared, there's an unlimited supply of fuckboy or loser men, I don't care. There are. You know, Nellie's mom out there single, living life, unfortunately it's very easy for her to still meet fuckboys. The goal is you grow up and you learn and you learn from these behaviors and mistakes and sometimes you step in it and you have, you know, you let the world get the best of you.

But Brittany has shown no signs at all. And she's gaslighting her friends who are just trying to help her. And it's like, come on. And if it's not Brittany's fault, then there's no hope for Brittany. You know what I'm saying? Because there is an unlimited supply of these men.

And if it's always these guys' fault, then she will never be able to help herself. At some point she has to look in the mirror and say, I have to stop allowing this type of behavior to get the best of me. I have to stop making excuses for these people. I have to start picking myself, setting some healthy boundaries, identifying these behaviors before I get sucked in. It's just like, come on. Also Salt Lake City, not that big. So you don't even need a background check. Apparently you can just bring up a name and someone will be like, oh my God, my brow girl.

Like, you know what I mean? Like the proof is all there. She needs a hug. That's all. She does need a hug. She needs a hug and some cognitive behavioral therapy. Oh my God. I will say the biggest switch of this episode

was Mary going from like attacking the whole like Heather of it all and then going, or well, not necessarily Heather, but the whole friendship with Lisa. And then she goes, body positivity. And I was like, that was the last five minutes.

I was like, girl. But before we got to that, I just like that Mary actually said what was going on with Heather, which is like she is always, she's always just like defending someone else. Like she's always again, she she's always like the hype man or like the person fighting someone else's fights and it's just like, wait, what? First it was Jen Shah, now it's Lisa.

Like the people who are fighting for like top dog in the group, Heather always wants to be their number two. It's kind of bizarre. And I really like a lot about Heather. I think Heather is smart and intelligent, she makes good points, I really like her ITMs, but I just, I love how Mary called her out for that.

It was just like, so, it was so on point. Well it's in a fascinating position too, because it's like, with Brittany being there, Mary no longer hates Whitney, and with Whitney not being Lisa's best friend, Heather now wants to be Lisa's best friend. So now Mary can attack Heather, or they can attack but confront Heather,

and that's random in this position. But even because when Mary called her out, she's like, you've known Andriy for a longer period of time than Lisa, and you could tell Heather's response was kind of like. Heather went, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, Well, Mary's the one you don't want coming after you. Exactly. So you get to Heather was like. Because Mary will say anything. And Mary doesn't care. Yeah. Heather went, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh come here, let me just, let me just, like, mama-verge you.

I did pay close attention to this. So for context, she was in the front of the, whatever you call that car. And like, so she got all the mud in her face everywhere. First of all, I was like, nobody told her to like cover or that there was going to be mud spotting. Nobody told her. Well, Mary wore white. Then someone said it when she got off of the car. Someone was like, Heather, there's like stuff all over your face.

It looked like she tried to wipe it off, but like, you know when how mud stains your face, like your skin sometimes? It was on her lip. That's what I'm saying. I think it stained her skin and like, Heather's a type to be like, you know what? I'm down for the bit.

It's a bit now. So I think she just was like. I guess. I will say though, I thought it was a really, really cool scene when they were on the slopes and they kind of like paused just to like gossip in the middle of like going down the mountains. middle of like going down. They do it every time They do it every time they're like we're gonna go ski. They're like either at the top. Yeah, like Heather Whitney

They're fucking good. Yeah, like they're just like casually like just slowing down the slopes Yeah, it was kind of just cool. I didn't see Mary being like an adventure seeker Zip lining I was like She loves Miller Highlife the champagne and beers and ziplining. She's a different Mary this season. I know. Because also the dancing where she was like bumping and I was like, good for her. Why do I want to hang?

I feel like she would be fun. And then she was secretive and they were like, where did you see Heather's daughter? At dance class? That was so funny. Workout? The wind? No, she said the wind blew me there. The wind blew me there?

Where did you see her? The wind. Yeah. The wind. I love Mary. It was so funny. It was interesting because, I mean, the whole internet has been like, okay, Heather looks entirely different this season. Are they going to dress it? Are they going to dress it? Yeah.

And you would have thought they would have started this season addressing it because she looks different. No, no, they started the season with the podcast. The podcast. Which was brought up again this episode. Uh-huh. But then Mary was the one to bring up the Azempik, which is interesting. Yeah, I mean, it's like, Mary has made not very nice comments

about Heather's weight in the past, so it's kind of like there is a level of like, to it, but at the same time, Heather has like publicly had this brand of like body positivity and then she's kind of like, I think Heather's just lost in the sauce of her own character on the show at this point. And she's willing to sell out in order to be famous. Can Heather have just changed her mind though about the brand? She could have.

Yeah. Yeah. But Mary had a point where it was like Mary on the show. Yeah. And you too, you had a point too where it's like, people were telling her originally that it was like, you look like you're on Ozempic, which I mean, that's a conversation whether we can question that or not.

But then Heather came out and was like, no, I love my bigger size because I've been criticized for it. This is all me, this is all natural. And then like two months later, she was like, I'm on Ozempic by the way guys. And body positivity is a lie. Yeah, so it's kind of like, so that's where people are like. She's not wrong in the way that she said

body positivity is a lie in the way that it's only positive like, so that's where people are like, mm. She's not wrong in the way that she said body positivity is a lie in the way that it's only positive when your body is deemed as beautiful. Which is true, but it's like, I don't think she stands up for herself enough. She says what she thinks everybody wants to hear. I feel like, kind of going off of what you're saying, though, too, is that it's like, I feel like she wants a brand, but doesn't know what that brand is. So it's like one second it's bad Mormon, next second it's like, I feel like she wants a brand but doesn't know what that brand is. So it's like one second it's bad Mormon,

next second it's body positivity. And now it's like Lisa's number two. But exactly, but it's like everything that she says, and this is why you always ask me why I have an issue with her is because it seems like what Mary said, she's a little two-faced and she kind of contradicts herself year after year. Not Mary on this show, Mary Cosby.

Well, it does play into the, she's always someone else's number two. She's never willing to be her own number one. Like, Heather's not willing to be like, you know what, it's my season. I'm gonna be me regardless. I'm just gonna go for it. She's always maneuvering in a way.

Even the lie about the black eye where it's just like this illusion where maybe a spider laid eggs in it, maybe this, and then it's like a year and a half later, but then Jen Shaw is less of a threat to society than Monica. where it's just like this illusion where maybe a spider laid eggs in it, maybe this. And then it's like a year and a half later, but then Jen Shaw is less of a threat to society than Monica, like that, like nothing makes sense. That's insane.

It is also valid for Heather to have experienced being like body positivity, this and this and this with having a larger body type. And then when she's on Ozimbic realizes like, oh, now everyone's like praising me because I'm skinny. Like all that body positivity is a lie. Like that is valid for her to feel that way. Yeah, totally.

And that is valid for, and I feel like it's not fair for Mary to question that when it is like 100% Heather's experience and she's just speaking on like the stuff she's experienced and the things people have like sent her way, which 100% is about Yeah, especially because Mary like has said negative things about her body to her before yeah And then has said things about how skinny she looks yeah, Heather is literally said

Oh, I'm like thinner now Mary likes me, so it's like I don't know it seems that they're both true Like I agree with you know yeah You can change your mind and you think Heather made a very honest statement about body positivity that obviously is gonna be controversial to a lot of people, but it is an honest statement. I think it's just like Heather's whole existence, I think it just makes it easy to question

her authenticity in general. So now for the people who wanna question this. It also does just feel so icky to have like someone's body type be like a little bit of a storyline. Yeah, I agree. I just don't like that. Then have everyone questioning and talking about it. It just feels icky.

No, it does feel gross now that with the whole enzempic craze, which not even get into whether that's even right or healthy. But nowadays, because so many people are on it, for the people who may be going about changing their body or changing their eating patterns or changing their workout patterns, if they're getting healthy in their own way

or losing weight in what they deem as a healthy way, I don't, it sucks that now the first thing that people go to is Ozempic, and now people feel like they have to explain themselves. And this whole conversation that the internet just jumps on and demands, how did you go about doing this? Even when they're not even necessarily promoting

their body changing, they're just like, they're just existing and being happy in the way that they're existing. And then people are just demanding answers. That just is really fucked up. For now, we have all these different dietary pills, which is like, if that's what you wanna do, do you, you know, whatever.

But I just, there are people out there actually doing it the old-fashioned way, and maybe it's just none of our business. That's where I wonder too, where I feel like we're at a point culturally where it's like, I think it's tacky to question people in Ozempic. You know? Like now everybody's doing to anybody

that's like changing their body shape, whatever that may mean. That it's like either you were on it before, you weren't on it, or now you're on it. And it's like, does it even matter at this point? Yeah, and that's the thing too. It's just like, I agree with you. I think the people arguing or maybe anyone listening

might say something like, well, it's just the people who are claiming to be working out but are on Zempik. I guess that's valid, but that doesn't give the internet the excuse to question everyone just so we can call out people. But also, who gives a fuck? Literally. Who really cares if you're like, oh yeah,

it's people who get a BBL and they're like, no, I was doing squats. Okay, who cares? I just don't care about other people's bodies that much, honestly. I feel like we, I feel like that is a rare. Yeah. To not care what other people are doing in their lives is rare. Yeah, I just wish as a, and it's like, it's not going to happen.

So it's, it's kind of like a useless wish, but it's like, why is it always such a conversation about like someone's body that is literally just like flesh? It's like you can't, you can only control it so much. It's really just like a vessel and like it looks hot a lot of the time. The only that's part of it is this like, because there's people out there who are willing to take advantage of people's desires to look a certain way and then defraud them by suggesting that you can have your dreams come true by spending money in a way that doesn't actually work.

Listen, if you have money, you can be the most, whatever your mind is, picture perfect, whatever. You can buy all the procedures, you can get all the this, you can have the clothes, you can have the jewelry, you can have, you can buy anything with money. Sure, why not? Do it if you want it. It's just, I don't know, it's just really crazy.

Switching gears a little bit before we jump from Salt Lake City, I feel like they're kind of teasing a Monica return. And I say this because Whitney, her friend that she had on the phone, that was basically like, and this is another thing that- We're getting back into the true crime.

So like Whitney's friend that was like, oh, it was a friend that owns an alcohol business. That person has a show with Monica. And like we have the soundbite earlier in the season. I don't know if she's gonna be back this season, but they have a soundbite earlier in like the teaser where it's like, you went to our sworn enemy? And it's like, well, so there's,

we know that like Whitney is loosely connected to Monica and that like also Mary and Angie, that whole, so who knows if she's coming back. She's voicing House of Villains. House of Villains. She's still working with Bravo. So you think it's basically the reveal was meant for us to think that Lisa is the one who sent this DM

about Alibaba? That was part of it, yes. But it's really Monica. Well, no, no, no, I'm saying Monica I think is like she has a segue into the show really naturally So do we know if actually that was Lisa who sent those things? No, it hasn't been revealed It hasn't been revealed but you have Whitney you have Whitney being like I don't have a friend that owns alcohol or liquor business Specifically is what was said besides Lisa if it was Lisa once again, that's just that's some dirty fucking shit That's that's not just some mild gossip.

That is going on a national platform and accusing your quote unquote friend of defrauding her customers. That is a crazy accusation to throw out against someone. And then have your number two, Heather, perpetuate that rumor on a national television show. Well, it's not like Heather was perpetuating that. Meredith, Lisa brought it to Meredith,

who brought it to Heather. Crazy, that wasn't said before. That wasn't said before either. So that's the same blow jobs for jazz ticketing where it's like it was one person, now it's a different person. Now it's like we don't even know who said it at this point. And it's like, it's very interesting

and it's why I love Meredith so much. She's messy. She's messy, but like Meredith does what Heather wants to be able to do, which is like stir the pot so much without being like culpable of anything. Meredith makes it legal, that's the thing. She brings in like timestamps and it's like, and then she's like, it was just a DM.

Meredith brings up that law degree, yeah. She'll give you one word to make you say it. Yeah. And then you'll be like, see, she said it. And then she says it in the cadence of like Alibaba. And you're like, that's amazing. I do think I think Natalie solved the whole AliExpress thing of it last time we talked about it, where it's like, maybe they just stole the images from her website. Nobody's thinking it went the other direction.

I'm like, right. Like, that's what Ali Baba AliExpress. That's what all of them do. They could literally take a photo of this couch with both of us sitting on it and be like, we're selling this couch, here's a photo. Like that's what they do. They take content from other people. And be like, we endorsed it.

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defending Hannah because in this most recent episode, she was very much like. Hannah from love is blind. And the love is blind. Sorry. So from love is blind. She was very much like, now I feel disrespected by you and Katie, which was kind of like a curve ball of like, wait, hold on, huh?

Remind me who Katie is. Katie is her best friend, AKA somebody she just met in the pods. Oh. Because Nick was talking to her for like a quote unquote prolonged time about their experience in the pod and smiling and Hannah was like, so what, what is this? I think the biggest issue here is that her best friend

is somebody she just met in the pods. That was questionable. I think she was trying to really nail in that coffin and be like, she wasn't my friend. That was my best friend that you were talking to. Good. I think she just really wants out of the relationship. Well, and the relationship did end this episode.

I do, to that point though, it really bothers me when people misuse the word best friend. That's a red flag in a person. I can agree with that. Okay, wait, I use bestie a lot. Bestie's not the same. Okay, good. I have a lot of friends, a lot of good group of girls,

a lot of like, yeah, I ride hard for you, I die hard for you, I have one best friend. Same. I have a couple, yeah. I have a very short few. I have a lot of people that I'm like- My closest friends, my dearest friends. My closest friends, my great friends, good friends, close friends, one best friend.

And even if you aren't, even if you're listening and you go, but I have three best, I really have three best friends, that's fine. That's not what I'm talking about. I'm talking about the people who are out there calling every single friend, or more importantly, every person they know their best friend. It's like they hang out one weekend and shared a moment. And going forward, they tell everyone else you're their best friend.

That's fucking weird. Someone you met in the pods, those people aren't your best friends. You shared a traumatic experience with. I was gonna say, because she brought two other best friends later on to their dinner with Nick. Yeah, that's a red flag. There's a level of like, you know,

you've known them for a while. Like you can vouch for them. Like people calling other people their best friend, it's like, I'm immediately assuming something about a relationship that I'm clearly wrong by, especially if you're best friends with someone I know, or don't know, or maybe, you know what I'm saying? It's like you're kind of advocating for someone.

To call someone your best friend, you don't just let anyone be your best friend, you let good people be your best friend. And so when you start labeling people your best friend when you're not really best friends with them, like that's misinformation. It's like blaming somebody and territorial. And you're doing it for a weird reason,

and I don't know what the reason is. I feel like most people don't refer to their best friend as best friend either, or is that just me? You're probably right, yeah, you're probably. Like I'm not like saying, my best friend, my best friend, my best friend. I do if I'm telling a story, if I'm like, oh, and then my best friend and I don't know.

A story, but like when you're talking in the conversation of like you were talking to my best friend, it's like what she did with Nick. Yeah, no. Like if like that's something people don't really do, you'll be like my friend from home or like my childhood friend. Like there's other ways that I feel like people.

I probably would like would have just named her. But like, well, you were talking to Katie for so long, but it's like, I feel like because she kept saying best friend, she was really trying to make him feel so fucking bad. Like you're a piece of shit because that's my best friend. That's what I'm saying. Every time she bonds with anyone for a week and she calls them their best friend.

But it's also just crazy how she's like, and now do you understand how like, and now you might not know this, but she's so good. Wild, wild. Well that's when she sat down with her friends and Nick, if I was in Nick's position, I would be triggered, I'm sorry, like you made me sit here and then you're having your friends lecture me too

that I don't know and they're lecturing me about something that I feel like they haven't even seen. I know, I feel like Hannah could have been like, babe, no, it's like I've already, it's hard enough for me. And I love Hannah, but I was like this, I would have left. And he sat down, he took it. As a human being who we got to interview, we love Hannah.

We don't love Hannah on Love is Blind. Well, and we do, I mean, she recognizes that she was harsh and it was too much. She's on her growth journey for sure. Yes. I would, I mean, listen, like for anyone in a heterosexual relationship, like Hannah is like the blueprint

of what you don't wanna be for the ladies out there. You do not wanna be. The dominant. Not even the dominant. It's just more the nagging, putting down, constantly belittling your partner. Everything they do is wrong. Everything they do is stupid.

And I don't think people like Hannah, like they can't tell when they're doing it. You know what I'm saying? Think about Hannah. She went on a television show where she was miked up and cameras were all around and she couldn't see it. Like you see so many like partners out there, wives or girlfriends out there,

just belittling their men in public constantly. And their boyfriends are apologizing to their friends, like you know, for their behavior and their partners are constantly, I'm sorry, I'm sorry, I'm sorry. Well you can't say that you're doing it out of like, oh I'm teaching you how to be a man or whatever, where it's like, but I don't see any positive reinforcement.

I don't see you ever being appreciative of anything that he does, but you're ready to knock him down for every single thing he does wrong, which is apparently everything, every single moment that you guys are doing. And if they're this comfortable in public, imagine what it's like behind closed doors.

Off cameras. You know? I think Hannah thought that this was gonna go down very differently in the edit. I think she thought that Nick was gonna come off as this guy who thinks pasta's in the fridge and doesn't know how to boil water. And now she's probably watching it back. Well, sure, but that's kind of my point though.

I think even in life outside of a TV show, I think partners who are like this, like Hannah, they always think they're justified. You know, like they, and when it all starts, they probably are, I'm sure, like, you know what I'm saying? Like Nick deserves criticism in this relationship without question. But there's a difference between just beating down

your partner and rolling your eyes constantly and huffing and puffing about them and like acting like you're embarrassed to be around them in public, you know? And then like, and you're so embarrassed by their behavior that you put them down in public because you don't want to be associated with their embarrassing behavior.

Like that's crazy. And that's the thing why it happens in public is because they're so normalized by their frustrations with their partner, they're out there putting them down in public. And again, I'm glad Hannah has recognized that. Like this is probably the best thing for Hannah to have seen. I was just about to say that.

I think she needed to have this, have to watch her actions back to learn that fuck, I have a problem and I can't speak to people that way. Yeah, because I'm sure her friends at the time have been like, you're kind of a bitch to your partner. And they've been like, oh no, he's just stupid. Her own brother, her brother was like, I'm scared of her too. Yeah, true.

Soon as she came back from the bathroom, he was like, hey girl, we're fine. Think about the level of, to do this on camera and not realize, you see yourself. She just didn't know. And you're right, she definitely thought it'd go a different way, you know? But like, I don't think people who are in relationships

criticizing their partners like this, I don't think they who are in relationships criticizing their partners like this, I don't think they ever think they're out there coming across as a mean person to their partner. They all think that they're the smart and funny ones apologizing for their partners. And it's just like 100% of the time, they just look like a dick, always. I've never met someone who's mean to their partner

and people out there being like, I get it. She's, he deserved that. You're either like break up. Yeah. Or stop being so mean. Yeah. It's like, cause you're supposed to be like a united front, a team.

And so it's like, if y'all are going at each other and I'm sitting here like, okay, cool. Then I'm like, what the hell is happening behind closed doors that like, this is okay. I keep thinking about Nick's mom too, watching this. Oh, for a second I thought you were talking about his mom and I was like, what about Nick's mom to watching this. Oh for a second I thought you were talking about his mom and I was like what? I mean like his him being able to finally say like you're always talking down to me

We're not equals here. Like they're not equal. She does not see him as her partner as her equal as her fiance She does as like this small little boy who yeah work Yeah, like I guess I have to teach you how to be a human and it's like whoa whoa whoa did you feel like there was gonna be a fight when Ramses didn't know Marissa's birthday because I did I would have caused one Nick used to every time he'd book my flight to come out and visit him when we were just like seeing each other he'd always be like tell me your birthday again I knew her birthday but it was just like, what? You get scared, right? It's like, if I mess this up, you won't be able to board the flight. You know, like.

I misspelled my own name for a flight once, and I had a hard time getting on said flight. How did you spell it? How did you misspell your name? I forgot to know. Oh, and the last name. I was like, I am dyslexic, whatever. Listen, I have my issues.

He was reading a book to River last night and we're sitting on her bedroom floor and he's reading Peter Rabbit, the tale of Peter Rabbit. Very wordy book. Yeah. He's like, and the- Yeah, that's like- That rabbit's a gabber.

And the moth left of, and I was like, a moth? He's like, sorry, moose. And I'm like, moose? He's like, mouse, mouse, mouse. Like, where did the T come from? First I actually said mouse, and then the picture had a butterfly, and I was like, oh, maybe they meant moth.

So I said moth, and then I re-looked at the word, and I said, maybe it's a moose. Well, that sounds crazy, and I went back to mouse. Poor River is like. She's gonna see butterflies and be like, moose. She's like, what is this story?ose. She's like what is the story? Anyways that's my trauma. I knew her birthday it was just like I wanted to verify because sometimes I'm just bad at

paperwork. For sure. I'm also bad at birthdays so I see you there. I'm really bad at birthdays. I'm afraid to double check when I know it's her birthday. I'm not bad at birthdays I just wanted to make sure. Okay but did Nick almost forget your birthday the same way Ramses almost forgot Marissa's birthday?

Because then also we close this episode with like a fight. Well the first birthday that I actually, Nick and I were like, let's be exclusive. I was still living in Georgia and he was like, you know, he told me, he was like, I'm not going to get you anything for your birthday. And I was like, all right. And he didn't. He actually got me nothing. He followed through.

He's honest. Up from expectations. How were you cool about that? I was like, all right. And he didn't, he actually got me nothing. Followed through. He's honest. Up from expectations. How were you cool about that? You know, it's some trauma that we do work through in couples there, okay? Okay.

She brings it up. Every time. All the time. Every birthday, I'm like, well, do you remember that one where you didn't give me anything? I feel like we do need to make up for that. Make up for last time. Well, we're here.

This girlfriend effort, because absolutely not. You know what I got her for Christmas that year? What? Nothing. Yeah, and I did get him a citizen's watch, like a nice watch. And I also had got him a like housewarming gift and a birthday present for all of those years.

I have truly been paying for it ever since. I understand now why. But I do think that's the difference between like someone who like loves birthdays and holidays and gift giving and someone who doesn't. For sure. Doesn't matter. I'm one of those people where I'm like,

learn your partner and then it's like, if that matters to you, then it's the most special day of the year. I was still learning. I was still learning. Of course, of course. For sure, yeah. Because the next Christmas, I don't know which bag she got.

You went nuts, right? I think she got diamond earrings, actually. Oh. Okay. Yes, it's good. And a phone. Shiny. And a phone. Shiny. And a phone.

Those are different, those are two different years. But yeah, he's done, listen, he made it up. Did she get a phone plan with the phone or just the phone? No, no, just the phone. Okay, yeah. We just got on the same, we just got on a family plan. Whoa. Now you know you're really married.

You're official. Yeah. That's huge. Right? Yeah. I know, and I changed my number. It's a whole thing. Oh my goodness. Oh? I know, and I changed my number. It's a whole thing. Oh my goodness.

Oh wait, so that's why your number changed. Yeah. Thanks, son. Because I had the same one since I was 13 years old and I was like, you know, I probably don't need it. That's a scary thing though to change it. Way too many people have this number that shouldn't have this number.

I haven't changed mine. I'm like, that's your life. No, I know. I was like, and it's weird because you do have like a connection to it. You're like, I can't give this up. It's kind of like the connection I have to my Georgia driver's license. But then it's like, and it's weird, cause you do have like a connection to it. You're like, I can't give this up. It's kind of like the connection I have to my Georgia driver's license.

But then it's like, okay, bitch, like people that you knew when you were 13, like don't need to still be able to contact you. I still have my first number I ever had and my Florida driver's license. I mean, throughout Dating the Alley, every once in a while I've been like, so and so reached out to me from way back when,

and it was never, oh, cool, thank God they reached out. I was always like, oh, well, how do you think you should respond to that or not? Yeah, it would be like my high school bully reached out and said she wants to get together the next time I'm in town. And my abusive ex-boyfriend's mother reached out to ask me if I'm ever gonna come over

for spaghetti again. She's like, these two things shouldn't be happening. Time to get a new number. It's time to get a new number. Do we think Ramses and Marissa are gonna be together? No. Because this ending fight came out of nowhere once again. I think Ramses is kind of a fraud.

I'm excited to talk to Marissa about Ramses. I do think she's gonna like. So far, everyone we've talked to about Ramesses has kind of defended him. It's been like, yeah, he said this, but he's a great guy. I don't know, I just. But Marissa is the one who's living it. So she's the one who like these conversations

are happening with. So maybe she will have a different perspective. Maybe I said this on that Johnny Depp documentary, we love to like people who generally agree with us about things in life. And Ramses says a lot of things that a lot of people like to be aligned with. And I think we don't like to look at what people

actually say and do in life, and really actually hold that to a higher degree. It's just like, this has more weight, what they actually said and did. And I think, I don't know, I feel like his peers are a little too reluctant to actually look at what he said and did and think, well, maybe just, maybe the other stuff is more performative

than it comes across. I mean, I will say, I feel like I got more and more upset with like every scene going forward that the two of them come up in. You know what I mean? Where it's like, last one's like, OK, like, maybe you just really aren't having had girlfriends that have periods. I don't know. It's a different fight.

And now I'm like, you're acting concerned about the idea of like this ending in marriage when you signed up for this show. You know exactly what it was. It's kind of like for me when I stopped watching Bachelor originally was because it was like, how many times are we going to get to the end of this? And then you guys act shocked that we have to get married or maybe we should date. That's not why I signed up to watch this. And that's where I'm like you copping out being like, how many times are we gonna get to the end of this and then you guys act shocked that we have to get married or maybe we should date. That's not why I signed up to watch this. And that's where I'm like, you copping out being like,

well, you know, my family showed up to my first wedding or it's not that important and whatnot. It's like you're minimizing something that's a big deal for somebody else. That's what's fucking crazy about Ramses. He's been married. And I'm thinking about, like I said, early in this episode and I was thinking about it yesterday. And then I thought to myself, like I imagine even people this episode, and I was thinking about it yesterday,

and then I thought to myself, I imagine even people listening, be like, oh Nick, well you grew up with sisters, and be like, so? I didn't talk to my sisters about this fucking shit, or sex, or periods, that's not why. It's because when I was 18, I got a girlfriend, and my girlfriend taught me a lot of things

that I didn't really know or understand. I learned a little bit maybe in sex ed, but she just, being around her and being open to learning about her needs and listening to what she had to say about her POV about life and sex. I learned a lot because I was willing. This is almost a 30 something, I don't know, late 20s, early 30s, he's been married. He has no excuse to have these POVs and thoughts about sex and periods and women, other than he just doesn't give a shit.

He has to, you know, you have to not care. You have to not want to educate yourself. You have to not want to prioritize the needs of your partner to have the point of view that he has about this topic. He's 35. Oh my God, you know what I'm saying? It's not willful ignorant. It's not like he just doesn't know better.

You can't, he doesn't give a shit. He doesn't care. He doesn't think it's important. It's wild. No, I'm with you. What? Since these episodes have aired, I was just really trying to,

it was like, eh. Eh. Please. Since these episodes have aired, has he said anything? Has he posted an Instagram apology story, a black screen, a notes app, anything? Have we gotten anything from Ramses or has he like disappeared?

That is a good question. I feel like I was told, like he's not doing like interviews or anything, so I don't know if he's talking to anybody about it. He hasn't done anything. I know he hasn't done anything. Interesting. From October 12th and behind the scenes with Mars.

That's what he calls Marissa. Okay, well, that, it's just like, goes to show you he really doesn't give a fuck, you know? And to see Marissa cry, seeing herself in that wedding dress, and then to see like another conversation or conflict of their marriage is very much like, I feel bad for her.

Yeah, I think they're gonna break up. I would if I was Marissa, I'd be like, okay, there's five different million things you're bringing up right now and it's like, you keep saying something and to me, it looks like you went out. And like, I love you but I can't deal with this another time.

He's doing the classic thing where he's trying to get Marissa to break up with him. Exactly. He's like, let me be as awful as I can and she won't want to be with me. She won't want to marry me. She'll say no at the altar. It's like, do you remember when Micah,

but she was like, I think the best thing I can do right now is to allow you to answer first. Literally. Although I think she would have said yes though. It was Paul. Yes, Paul. I do think she would have said yes, but I think because she was like,

I think you should go first. And then being like, it's a no for me. She's like, well, it was also a no for me. But also the quote is like, when somebody tells you who they are, believe them. And it's like, he's literally telling you, I'm not sure if she goes through this marriage, there's a very high chance it's not going to work out

because he's already telling you at this point, I'm not sure on you. And he's been through another marriage. So to that point, it's like, you would think he would know for sure his second time around. This is not sold on you. He's been through another marriage, so to that point, it's like you would think he would know for sure his second time around. This is why I think that Ramses' of the world are way more problematic than the Stevens,

because I don't think the Stevens can help themselves. They're just like, yeah, I'm a freaky guy. You know, Stevens' so just transparent eventually, even though he was kind of a big liar. Like, he just, he's not a very good one, I don't think. And I think the Ramses of the world, I think he's very good. Just very deceitful, you know?

It's like he made her believe all of these things in the pods and then you get out and you just like have all of these issues with her and what she's done in her life. And like, it just seems very polar opposite. And he says it in a way where it's again, you know, Steven insists more like, it just seems very polar opposite. And he says it in a way where it's, again, Steven insists more like, hey, everything's cool, I don't judge, I'm a,

Steven just projects this overabundance of acceptance because deep down he has these skeletons in his closets and he's just afraid people are gonna judge him. It's not okay, but I can at least understand that. The Ramses of the world, again, like, he makes you feel shitty for your decisions and he's just always looking at you with shame and judgment.

Yeah, it's like the way Ramses says it is Marissa should be like, I am so sorry that I have a period, fuck, I'm so sorry, oh my God, I have to get it removed. Like that's the way it is. It's like that's how he, yeah. And then like Ramzes is like, thank you for recognizing that and saying that.

Exactly, he would be like, thank you so much for, yeah. Finally. As long as you, yes, thanks for taking accountability. Yeah. It's just wild. Anyways, let's talk to Marissa and see if she in any ways agrees with us. Hi everyone, how are you doing?

Hello. Good, Marissa, how are you? Welcome to the show. Wow, thank you. You look great, you're smiling, you're glowing. I don't know if this means you're happily in love and married, but you look great. Or finally came to your senses and realized

that this is not the best situation for you. Could be either one, we don't know. Who knows, yeah, you know what? You're just got to watch in two days, right? We will certainly watch. Let's just get right into it. I know you have a limited time. I've been hyper critical of Ramses.

I loved him so much, as many people did early on. Seemed this enlightened man, just said all the right things, great looking guy, seemed like he's really in touch with his feelings. And then all of a sudden, the sex conversation with you guys happened, and it just like, he just did an absolute nose dive. I'm curious how you see it.

I think whether it was the birth control conversation or the period sex conversation, I honestly don't know which one was more shocking and alarming. I think we were talking about this earlier. Since I was like an 18 year old boy, if you've had any girlfriends whatsoever, with a willingness to just understand

what's important to them, what they prioritize, their needs, et cetera, et cetera, you kinda learn this stuff early on and Ramses is a married man and he's in his 30s and it just seems like he has no excuse to have this point of view. Ignorance doesn't seem to be a good argument. It just seems like he just doesn't care.

But anyways, enough about what I think. I am curious about what this has been like for you. And I guess when you guys were having this conversation, was it as shocking to hear it out of his mouth as it seems to be as shocking for us to watch it? Okay, so the conversation was not as shocking in person. I think I was, as you can kind of tell, I'm usually very bubbly and I speak without thinking.

But in that moment, I was pretty quiet. That's because I was over here like wheels turning. I was trying to figure out where is this coming from? What are your intentions? What are you implying? So at the moment, I didn't think it was as shocking. I think I was just very annoyed that he even brought this up because we were such a physically intimate couple. And, you know, he knew what was the situation. So I was more like annoyed, not

as shocked. Now, watching back, I will tell you, I was definitely shocked. Like, you know, a third person view is just so different. And so seeing that conversation and being like, oh my God, okay, that did not look good. And I don't think that Ramses meant the conversation to come across that way. I think that his words, the wording and how it came across for him, it was pretty representative. It's not like it's a lie, it came out of his mouth,

but I do think he didn't realize what he was saying. And I think that's where I'm like, I watched back a lot of our scenes and I'm like, ooh, like I think a lot of the times he doesn't realize how it's coming across and I don't know where that comes from, but. Thanks for bringing this up. Cause I guess I just two questions I would want to ask you.

Ramses hasn't seemed to spoken on any of this, but I wouldn't be shocked when he does, as many people in his position before him do, will say something like, it was taken out of context, it was edited, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. But you were there. So just out of curiosity, do you remember it,

how it was aired? Like, is it fairly accurate, or do you think it would be disingenuous for Ramzes when he does speak on this for him to blame the edit. I don't know what he will think about that, if it's the edit or not. I could see how he might allude to that and say it might be the edit.

I personally have sat a lot with that question of like, I don't, I remember the conversation going one way and I remember feeling another way. And then I also see it and it's a different way. So I don't necessarily think it is the edit. I do think that you guys are not obviously seeing the full like the end of the conversation, right? So the conversation about birth control, for example,

you aren't seeing that we talked about vasectomy right following into that, you know? So, and how he addresses like, wow, like I, you know, kind of have this male privilege. I should have like been more aware. So if you don't see that type of context, I think he would probably bring that stuff up for sure and say like, yeah, I sounded like a dickhead

in the beginning, but then I kind of came too. And I think that's what happened a lot with our conversations. I mean, that's fair. I guess I'm just more shocked that, especially the period sex, I think it's just more like, what? But like, this is gonna happen once a month.

Like, I'm not gonna be in my right mind once a month. I just like, short of him being like, surprise guys, I'm a six-year-old boy stuck in a man's body, like nothing else honestly would make sense unless he like, did it for the bit. When I'm first watching this, I'm thinking'm thinking all right maybe just given the situation they're in and marriage being right around the corner they're forced to have tough conversations that might seem a little bit like out of touch but I don't know

I'm sorry I just like he he sounded like a man who needed you a woman to explain to him while he's not gonna get as much action while you're on your period. And that seems, I just don't know what context he could be speaking from is what I'm trying to figure out. How did you feel in that moment when that conversation happened? Well, I was pissed.

I was like, dude, you know I'm sick. You know, I'm driving back and forth from Baltimore. I'm in law school. I'm carrying the weight of the wedding planning at this point. So I was really annoyed I would say that as I look back and I watch it and I remember how I felt in that moment I think that at the time I didn't think there was a

Not that I think there was a problem with the conversation like he's fair to ask about intimacy And he didn't just mean just like he didn't only mean sex like he was talking about Other forms of affection and all that like the the petting thing you know that stuff where I was like do you feel rejected so he was talking about other forms but as I look at it I realize like I'm shocked that I'm not more shocked to be honest um when we're having the conversation and I think it's just to be to be honest like as a woman you're kind of conditioned at times to deal with little like with guys like that where guys are like oh I want to have sex like you kind of I at times to deal with little like with guys like that where guys are like

Oh, I want to have sex like you kind of I don't know. I've experienced that multiple times. I think I was just like, oh great It's just another guy Wanting to be physically affectionate with me when I don't want to I have autoimmune disease that I'm I was flaring at the time I'm pms saying I'm doing all these things and here he is complaining about this That's how I felt in the moment. It's incredibly valid. And I think without the context, it is hard for us viewers to give him any sort of understanding or empathy during both of these occasions. I think another time in which we were a little rubbed

the wrong way was him judging you for your serving this country. Yeah. Yeah. Look, I'll put it this way. It's been a year and I've done a lot of therapy before and after filming. Something I realized that's so obvious is how people-pleasing I can be and how accommodating and I'm compromising to my own values I am.

In that conversation with Ramses about the military, I did not, I was obviously feeling judged, you know, I vocalized that to him. But I was just like trying to grapple with like my complicated feelings as well as the judgment. I just couldn't figure it out in that scene. Like I just couldn't figure it out in that conversation. And it was something that we kind of discussed a little bit off camera, just like, dang, it's a bummer that you don't like want to really support me here. But I also thought it wasn't a big deal because I was like,

well, I'm never joining the military again. You know, you were so gracious to honestly communicate your own issues you had with the military, which honestly, someone in your position is, it's taking a risk to do that on a national platform. You know, I'm sure a lot of your peers and people you serve with might feel a certain way, and yet you were willing to speak on that

and be very honest about that while in addition to still serving your country. And even that wasn't good enough for him. It was like, it wasn't like, hey, I'm glad that you have an open mind to seeing what our government or what our military does and have a more broader approach, but still thank you for your service. Thank you for sacrificing your literal life and doing something like that. Quite honestly, Ramses or myself or anyone

in this room didn't do. And then all the privileges that we all experience are a direct result of your service. Thank you, by the way. It just seemed fucking nuts that he was able to speak on this in such a level of like authority. He doesn't have any authority to speak on, but he came from a place as if he did. Yeah. Kind of crazy. Yeah, he did.

I think when he says, well, no one put a gun to your head to join, at that point I was like, did you listen to anything I said? I just told you. You don't realize the, it was so complicated. I think, again, at that time,

I was still grappling with my own feelings. And I was like, I want to respect your feelings, but you know, I wasn't receiving the same return. And again, that kind of comes with, I was there for love. So I tried to be understanding and I don't, I wasn't really necessarily receiving the same in return. I recognize that now. So, yeah.

Okay. I think also Nick loves your mom. He was like, this is like a mother should be like these parents being like, oh yeah, for sure. Like whatever you want to do. He was like, I don't stand by that. Have you and your mom had a conversation about her harshness on Ramses, that first meeting? Yeah, we have. And thank you for the kind words about my mom because she is a very protective,

loving mother. She supports me. I love her so much. But you know what? We've talked about it and she's more upset that she feels like she embarrassed me. And I told her she didn't embarrass me. I told her, OK, we don't have to talk about his looks. We can leave that off the table, Mom. But I told her that before filming, and she did what she wants, and she's an adult. But at the end of the day, I prefer to have a parent who asks the hard questions

and sees through the bullshit, because she knows me, I'm a lover girl. I'm a little delusionally romantic. And she knows that I'm just going to accept the person for who they are. And even if it's not that great for me at times. And so I am happy that she asked the hard questions. And honestly, Ramses was very understanding as well.

Like she was like, oh, it's a Hispanic mother who's very protective. I don't have a father in my life. So she kind of takes that role. And I think if she was a man or a dad, and she was saying some of the harsh things, minus the looks, but saying some of the harsh things to him, I think nobody would have.

Yeah, everyone's been standing up and like, oh, we love a tough dad, exactly. I think you nailed it perfectly. And honestly, that was the only time after the pods, because we loved him in the pods, it was the only time I liked Ramses for his willingness to take your mom's criticism because while your mom's criticism was direct,

it was more than fair. And it wasn't like she was like, don't date this guy. I'll forbid you to be with him. She just gave him a hard time. She voiced her very valid concerns, which were, like you said, were more to do about like your state of mind and your kind of like willingness to brush

all the valid concerns out of the rug. And your mom, mom being your mom saw that in her daughter and she stepped up and like said what she needed to say at the risk of you know the love is blind nation criticizing her. Your mom didn't like your mom cared more about being your mom in that moment than anything else and most parents in that position which I've seen firsthand, don't. And I just, I think your mom deserves a lot of credit for that. So. Thank you. We are ourselves.

Like I didn't, you kind of forget the cameras are there and she was like uncomfortable as well. But at the end of the day, like everyone in my family, we're all pretty much the same. We are just who we are and you just, you love us or you don't love us. And that's okay because my family, we love each other. So at least we have that. Okay. Do we have any more questions for Marissa before we have to let her go? I do just outside taking the spotlight off you for a second but who out of the other couples were you most surprised by like watching the season and how their relationships have played out?

Yeah I was so surprised with Hannah and Nick and I I say, I am surprised about like, how she talked to him and you know, Hannah and I were very close and we were very close in the pods and throughout that experience, and I knew that she was struggling. And I knew that there was things going on behind scenes that was causing her to feel like insecurities and things like that. But I also didn't realize she was talking to him that way. You know, there's a difference. You could be having a struggle with your partner, but I was so shocked. Like, I was like, Oh my God, like, it's hard to watch. It is hard. It is, it is incredibly hard.

And there's, I'm like, Hannah, yeah, I don't have much to say on that, but I will say that it was very hard. And I don't like necessarily, I'm not like in love with Nick and his behavior, but I also Don't think anyone deserves to be spoken to that way or treated that way, you know They're supposed to be treated as equal. We had a chance to talk to Hannah last week It seems like she recognizes that too and we were actually saying this earlier Honestly, I feel like maybe this is the best thing for Hannah because I think sometimes People you know who demonstrate the behaviors that Hannah Demonstrated I think often they don't they think they I think often they think they're funny,

or they think they're doing this for their partner, or they think they have the right to because their partner has their flaws. Because we know Nick has his flaws. They're evident, they're obvious. But I think we often don't see it in ourselves when we act this way to our partners, and for Hannah to see it on this stage, if this isn't gonna be a wake up call for future relationships, I don't know what will.

Because, you know, like you just- Which I think it is because she very much said like, guys, it was hard for me too. Like, I will not speak that way going forward. This is a learning experience. So we applaud Hannah for learning and growing from her mistakes. Do you see the change? I'm assuming you hung out with

her. I think you're talking to her. Do you think she will follow through this with this learning lesson? You know, I'm an optimist. So like a discussively positive person. So I hope that she does and I hope to see it. Yeah, I know that she's aware of it. You know, it's a it's different of being aware and then actually doing it. So I just okay, I'm sensing I'm hearing doubt in your voice. You don't have to say anything. She's your friend. Well, it's not. No, it's just she's young and she has like

room to she's not that young. She's not that young. That was never that mean when I was that young either. I think that as long as she gets into therapy and does the actual work, other than just being like acknowledging it, then yeah, I believe it could happen. But I would like to see that, of course. And I don't know if she's heard yet. In the closing scene of episode 11, it ends on a little bit of a cliffhanger with you and Ramzes, him kind of saying saying like, I don't know if

I'm ready for another marriage. Did in that moment, did you feel like you were trying to convince him that he was? Oh, yeah, I've seen some commentary about that. No, I don't think I was trying to convince him. But I am someone who just said like, how I feel is what I'm gonna say how I feel and so in that moment I don't see it as I'm begging him or trying to convince him. I'm just like hey, we're in a partnership We make decisions together and sometimes in a you know in any situation Maybe you're not making the decision the other person is but in that moment. We're together We're talking about our relationship and you know the doubts and you're allowed to have doubts I you know never wanted him to never express any doubts.

But no, I don't think I was begging him. But if that's what it looks like, so be it. That's also bullshit criticism from the audience. Because we're also in a world where one moment you have Ramses giving Marissa this security and assurances, like, oh no, I still wanna do this, because no one wants to be called out for doubting their relationship.

So it's kind of, also in a relationship, what's the balance between being there for your partner? Ramses comes to Marissa as almost as if he's expressing how he's feeling, hoping that Marissa would almost talk him off the ledge. So how do you do that in this atmosphere without, you know what I'm saying? Like he's setting Marissa, you're almost- It's like you're, you're being there for him.

Yes. And people are taking it as like you having to like get down on your knees and beg him to be with you, which- But that's the problem with dating culture this day. Nobody really wants to sit down and like work on something together because they think oh my ego gets in the way like oh my god I would never beg for a man and like don't get me wrong I'm not gonna get on my knees and and and and scream don't leave me but you care and you love about somebody you want to understand what they're thinking you want to kind of reason with

them like hey baby like we've we've been good this whole time you've been so sure like are you sure these people coming in are causing doubts like what what's causing that? So yeah, if people want to think that, sure. Yeah, because also in the moment you don't usually realize that until after the conversation where you sit back and go, wait, were they trying to do that? And I know the episode left on a cliffhanger, so we don't know if you guys are together. I don't think you are, can't have you confirm that. But something that we've talked about, I've said on this show, I'm curious what you think, regardless of what happened between the two of you.

But I think men do this thing, especially when they wanna exit relationships, is that they will behave in a way that makes it easier for their partners to break up with them because they don't wanna be the bad guy. And watching this back, to me it gives Ramses trying to take the easy way out

and he's giving you information and hopes that you end the relationship so that he doesn't have to. And I'm curious if you felt that way, regardless of what ended up happening in your relationship. I don't think I felt that way in that moment. Like maybe, I don't know, watching back, I haven't really felt that way, but I would say that I think you're 100% right.

Most men that I've dated, I've always broken up with all the guys I've dated because it's not because I all of a sudden stopped liking them, it was like their behavior changed and it was to the point where they were just trying to end the relationship, but they were too much of a coward to end it.

And so if that's what was happening, I guess we'll find out, but yeah. Okay. Well, thank you so much for giving us so much context. And it was very much needed. And I'm excited to see the rest of your journey unfold. Thank you so much. Thanks for having me.

This is really cool. What's one thing you want to address with Ramses at the reunion, regardless of your relationship status? I think I would address, actually don't know. Okay. Well think about it. She's thinking about it. The reunion is like. Is it safe to say you have things you want to address?

There are things that I might want to address, but I would say the main thing is I would like my, of things you want to address? There are things that I might want to address, but I would say the main thing is I would like my, like, I don't know, address my mother's comments and how that might've made his family feel. Because regardless of my mom and how much I love her, she was really harsh to Ramses about his looks and his style and that might have upset his family.

So I would want to address that and just know, I apologize for that. I don't think your mom has to apologize for anything. That's just me. I don't think she does. That's Marissa being the people pleaser. I'm working on it. I'm working on it. Yeah, you were great, Marissa.

I don't know. That's just one person's opinion. You were fantastic. We really loved watching you. I definitely think Ramses has a lot to say. I hope we get to hear it at the reunion. I know you have to go. Thank you so much, Marissa, for taking the time.

I hope that you two don't end up together. If you did, I apologize. I'm sorry. I'm gonna go on a limb. I'm sorry. He is denying her core who she is as a person Like why would you want to end up with that person? That could be your husband Anyway, if you guys are together, I apologize

I'll let you know on Wednesday Thank you so much Marissa bye Well that you know, that, you know. Let's all vote. Are they together or are they not? No, definitely not. Definitely not. They can't be, right?

I hope not. I totally, I feel like for her being like in that moment, like I was jaded, I wanted to be a people pleaser, I wanted to like make sure his feelings were valid and then watching it back being like, what the? Yup. So, I don't know. I think this reunion is going to be so juicy and I cannot wait.

I hope she's with Bowden. I really like them together. So, oh, Bowden, he was also he served in the military. Yeah. And then Ramses was like homies with that guy, too. It just isn't. Yeah. They didn't make sense. Yeah. What did you want to cover before you left? Garrett and...

Oh, I just said that we didn't talk about Taylor and Garrett, where they... No, we talked about the fight. They went to San Diego. They met her mom, had a very supportive conversation with them, and then they had that date at the really cool art exhibit place. Oh, yeah, that was cool. The art with the science. Right? I thought that that was really cool.

I don't know. I'm just like a big fan of like where their relationship is going and how they're able to openly discuss what they like, what they don't like, what they're working on, what they like common goals, where I feel like that's something that should be highlighted more so where I'm like, a lot of the times we don't like certain couples because we're like, they're boring or whatnot. But I'm like, no, I think this's something that we highlighted more so, where I'm like, a lot of the times we don't like certain couples because we're like, they're boring or whatnot. But I'm like, no, I think this is a very healthy example of what communication looks like in a relationship.

I think more than any couple that ends up together, and I'm assuming they end up together, they're the couple I'm most interested in hearing from and learning about their relationship. Taylor did post a TikTok of like, the picture we've all seen of Garrett's glow up and it's like her being like the audio Where it's like someone cooked here and it's her being like was it me was it not? That's how together yeah, they have to be it's fine. Yeah, give us something to root for I have a hot take what?

Oh, I think Garrett looked better before oh my god. He looked okay before yeah, I think he was hot before and after I don't know I liked it better before. Why? What? What? What? That's maybe the most unflattering haircut a man can have. The army. I liked it. I thought. I mean, yeah, to each their own. Everyone has their kinks. You know, you know, and Taylor made hers work.

Leah's husband does have like a shaved head, not shaved head, but like a version of a haircut. No, he doesn't. Like a grown up. He did. He grew it out, but he did have a buzz cut for a while. It's her style. Do you hate his hair now? No. I just think- The hesitation.

I don't know. I just liked Garret's look before. I thought it suited his personality. I just liked it. So Garret, Taylor, they're together. Ramszes and Marissa, we think are breaking up. Ashley and Tyler. Ashley and Tyler. They together. I'm manifesting that. They work through it. They seem so strong and communicative.

It's the communication, yeah. And they jumped out of a plane together. They did. They jumped out of a plane together. Hot take. I think the more this person, not even an ex, this alleged friend of Tyler's, the more this person speaks, the more I question them. It's very much giving like clout chasing here.

It's just as very, it's like what are you doing? It's giving Messi that you're hearing about her partner also going and fighting for custody. At the end of the day, there are children involved, and to bring children into an internet war and to have, to invite trolls and strangers to comment on your children is something I will never stand by, and it feels so gross and so icky, and I am not for that.

I think we should pay attention to Ashley and Tyler's silence right now. And I think that speaks to let's wait and see. It's a good point. And I think the fact that they haven't been messy, I think it says something. And I don't know what it says. Yeah, it's giving like, we know the truth.

And like, yeah, that's true. I just think maybe before we jump to conclusions and things like that, we should wait till we actually get to hear from these people who have chosen to be very messy and very silent. And history says those people usually are right. But we'll see, we shall see. All right, well, that does it for this episode. Tune in tomorrow for one of my favorite GD episodes ever.

Nick Cries. Your golden bachelorette Joan is with us. It's just family love, everything you've ever wanted to know about Joan you've learned. It's an emotional, wonderful, happy, just sad episode. And you're gonna love it, that is tomorrow. And then we are back on Thursday for another wild episode of Reality Recap. We'll see you then. Bye.