The Viall Files - E842 Ask Nick - His Secret Double Life

Starting point is 00:00:00 Hey moms, looking for some lighthearted guidance on this crazy journey we call parenting? Join me, Sabrina Kohlberg. And me, Andi Mitchell, for Pop Culture Moms. Where each week we talk about what we're watching. And examine our favorite pop culture moms up close to try to pick up some parenting hacks along the way. Come laugh, learn, and grow with us as we look for the best tips. And maybe a few what not to do's from our favorite fictional moms. From Good Morning America and ABC Audio,

Starting point is 00:00:29 pop culture moms, find it wherever you get your podcasts. You're crazy. How's it going? Hi, I'm Brooke. I'm 31. I'm a mom. I'm a mom. I'm a mom.

Starting point is 00:00:42 I'm a mom. I'm a mom. I'm a mom. I'm a mom. I'm a mom. I'm a mom. I'm a mom. Hi, I'm Brooke. How's it going? Hi, I'm Brooke. I'm 31 and I'm a police officer and I'm trying to shoot my shot with a district attorney. Okay. All right. Scandalous.

Starting point is 00:00:57 We love this. What is the HR policy? Well, so I work for a sheriff's office and technically, you know, district attorneys that work for the county, we're all kind of under the same umbrella because we all work for the same county. So there's not really like an HR, anything in place with if we're allowed to date or not, I guess. So I think the only thing that you can't do is you can't data or superior can't be with somebody that they have that they're a boss over, obviously,

Starting point is 00:01:25 which makes sense. So we're under the same umbrella, but we're not under the same like entity. He's the courthouse, I'm patrol, essentially. So is he the DA or is he like... No, he's not the, he's not the deputy district attorney, not the head honcho. He's just a district attorney. I think he's on misdemeanor crimes right now. So he's not the deputy district attorney, not the head honcho. He's just a district attorney. I think he's on misdemeanor crimes right now. So he's like low level crimes, whatever. So his name is, we'll call him Max. And it's kind of like in my email, I said we're friends, but like, it's not like we hang out outside of work. It's like when I see him at the courthouse, when I go

Starting point is 00:02:01 to do trial for whatever case I have going on, and he sees me, he like approaches me, we talk, and we follow each other on social media. Okay. So that's kind of it. Yeah. So not much to work with. Not much. He, he not really, he's liked my stories before, which I feel like, which sounds really stupid,

Starting point is 00:02:22 but I feel like you don't just like, I don't know, people's stories for no reason. I think, but that's probably really stupid, but yeah. Stupid might be a little harsh, but I, and I agree. I don't think people like it for no reason, but that reason might be just because, you know, your friends. Yeah. Or casuals, you know, it's just like, I don't know. And I'm buddies.

Starting point is 00:02:43 I'm buddies with another district attorney who's married, who's just like a nice guy. And me and him have like briefly like chatted on Instagram before about like, like super not like a thing. Like he, he'll reply to like a story and be like, oh my gosh, did you, where did you hike? I went hunting here. Like kind of stuff like that. So I feel like I could like reach out to his friend

Starting point is 00:03:05 and kind of be like, hey, what's Max's deal? Like is he, and he's not super active on social media. So- Do you know anything about Max's relationship status? I mean, I'm assuming you think- No, no I don't. For all you know, he has a lady, he's just not like putting online.

Starting point is 00:03:25 Yeah, he doesn't wear a ring last I saw him, but yeah, for all I know, he could be in a committed relationship and I have like no idea. How sure of the friendship between Max and this other guy you're friends with? Like do you know if they're close or do you know if they're just like casuals? Man, I don't really have anything. I don't know.

Starting point is 00:03:45 Okay. I don't know. And I just feel like Max will come up and like I've been sitting waiting for trial, not on like his case, like another case. And he'll see me and be like, oh, what's up? Blah, blah, blah. And he'll be like, I saw that you went to

Starting point is 00:03:59 the Taylor Swift concert or I saw that you did this. And he like brings up stuff and we sit and chat for like 15 or 20 minutes and then I will say that's only happened like three or four times in the last like two three years because the off chance that I see him It's not like cops don't go to trial like every day, you know I mean like I've been a I've been a cop like seven years I think I've testified on the stand like eight times so it it doesn't happen. Like a lot of people take plea deals, trial gets canceled day of.

Starting point is 00:04:28 I'd love for you to figure out a way to pull them over and then ask them out on a date. That'd be kind of cool. Oh, that would be kind of cool. But I don't know how, like I don't even know where this man lives. I'm gonna assume like obviously in the county somewhere, but I don't even know.

Starting point is 00:04:41 And we're like, we're kind of in like the county that I work for is in like the major city in the state that I am in. So in that metro area centrally, so he could be anywhere. Just out of curiosity, what is your like, what is your interest in him? I don't know. He just seems like really nice. You just like you seem like you don't know much of anything about him. So do you think is it what is the biggest draw? You think he's hot? Do you think it's like a brief interactions that I think he's funny? Yeah, I think he's attractive.

Starting point is 00:05:07 I think he's really nice. I'm also like, I'm in like my single era right now, like just like back in the summer got out of like a somewhat serious relationship that I thought was gonna be kind of end game, I guess. So I think I'm just kind of casting reels, I guess. Like I'm just kind of open to dating and like finding like i'm trying to be intentional with you know i see like he likes my stories and i'm like why isn't max like ever like i wonder what's going on with him he's always kind of been this like what if. Even the times like he first interacted with me i was like oh this guy like came up and talk to me that's kinda cool. But then I didn't think anything of it. I was just like, whatever.

Starting point is 00:05:45 And so now as I'm like, I feel like I'm in the most confident state I've ever been in. So I'm just kind of like, well, what's the harm in like? How, no harm. Yeah, that's the answer is that. How old do you know, how old is Max, do you know? I think he's about my age, 30, 31.

Starting point is 00:06:02 Well, the good news is, like you said, you're kind of in this kind of single era. Nothing's gonna hurt other than your pride and your ego if it doesn't go your way. Yeah. There's that. I'm just wondering, like, if it's like, is it cheesy for a girl to like,

Starting point is 00:06:15 the only access I have to him is the county email, which I don't wanna do it on that, and then Instagram. Instagram's not the worst, you know? It gets a bad rap for whatever reason. I don't know why. It just does. But that's how people are meeting. Online. Because you have the access to...

Starting point is 00:06:38 You don't need someone's number to just say hi or ask them out. Have you ever DM'd each other? So you guys have sent messages back and forth? need someone's number to just say hi or ask them out. You know, have you ever DM'd each other? So you guys have had, you have sent messages back and forth. Like, no, also not me and Max. Max's friend that also works for the district attorney's office.

Starting point is 00:06:54 Me and him have messaged back and forth because that was kind of like, could I do it through him? Like he's a little bit more outgoing, I would say his friend, but his friends, I'm not interested in his friend. His friend's like, Mary, just a super outgoing, nice dude. And so I'm like, I wonder if I could somehow let his friend know, hey, I think Max is cute.

Starting point is 00:07:13 So I have a suggestion. Before you go to the friend, right? Because you don't really know much information. I mean, listen, at the end of the day, we're just having fun here, I'm giving you ideas, but do whatever the fuck you want is the real answer There's no really harm in this, but if we're gonna like try to figure out the the safest You know create the least amount of ripples. You know type of thing

Starting point is 00:07:36 I have an idea that doesn't include you reaching out to the friend first and because you haven't DM'd him How often is he posting on his stuff? He does not post a lot, but he's active because he I mean, like at all. Like, I don't know if I maybe one post maybe like a story. OK, but not a lot, but he's active because every time I'm not saying I post stories all the time, but whenever I post a story, he's I can know he's seen it. How often do you check your DMs?

Starting point is 00:08:04 Like normal, like, I don't know, like if I go on, I have a notification. I'm looking. How often do you check your DMs? Like normal, like I don't know, like if I go on and I have a notification, I'm looking. Oh, so you will, okay. I honestly don't know because like someone in my position who uses social media for work, like it's, you know. Yeah. I'm very active, or I have other people do it,

Starting point is 00:08:19 but like I don't know how, there's definitely a world where he never does, right? Anyways, my idea is for you to DM him, not to ask him out, but like kind of just basically see if the phone's on, so to speak, right? Yeah. So you send him a message. I don't know, ask him a random question, maybe go find an old picture and ask him a question.

Starting point is 00:08:39 Right. Yeah, that's what you should do. I know that he likes college football and his brother played for a major university in the state that I'm in. And he was like a legit football player. So I kinda, and we've talked about that in person. So like I could be up for it. I don't even care about that. Find a random old picture.

Starting point is 00:08:58 Okay. You wanna slightly be obvious that you were stalking his social media. Right. You know, and then find a picture that you can ask him a question. Okay. So you go on, you find the picture, and then how do you do it?

Starting point is 00:09:13 You like reply to someone or something? So yeah, you press that arrow button, and then you send it to him. You send him the picture, and underneath ask the question. Who gives a shit what the question is? You're doing this because you wanna see if he's checking his DMs.

Starting point is 00:09:28 Okay. Right, because what we don't wanna do is have you shoot your shot in the DMs and then he never checks it, period, and you're just like, did he read it? Did he not read it? You know? Is he ignoring me?

Starting point is 00:09:40 Is he just, does he unaware? So you know what I'm saying? You wanna know if he's checking your DM So send something to him that is very easy for him to reply to Because as far as you know like it's like kind of random that you send him this message, but at the same time Whatever is it dumb if I do it like doesn't matter What this is gonna sound so like? Microscopic like why am I focusing

Starting point is 00:10:06 on this? But is it cringy if I do that like in the morning or should I wait like later in the evening like I've, you know, maybe had a couple drinks and I'm just feeling flirtation? You know what I mean? Yeah, I think you're overthinking that. This is, we're not flirting. Yeah, probably. Sorry.

Starting point is 00:10:20 We're not flirting here and we're literally basically, we're pinging him. You know, we're seeing if this is on. We're sending a signal and we're seeing if we can get a signal back. Because again, the worst thing you could do, not the worst thing, it doesn't really matter, but I'm sure you would hate to shoot your shot, not get a response from him,

Starting point is 00:10:39 but have really no idea if he saw it or not. Because we are talking about a guy who's not very active on social media and it's not a crazy thing to think that's a very busy, ambitious district attorney who is not active on social media, is probably maybe not checking his DMs all that often or ever, right? Or maybe he is, we don't know.

Starting point is 00:10:57 So this is just, we're just kind of seeing first if he is, right? Let's assume he replies, right? And then at that point, I don't know, you could just ask him out. If you're like, hey, totally random, have no idea. Here, also the good, one benefit for your ego, that is, for the fact that you don't even know

Starting point is 00:11:15 if he even has a girlfriend, is that you can give him an easy out, right? If he doesn't want, for whatever reason, maybe he doesn't wanna cross, mix business with pleasure, who knows what is, you have no idea what's going on in this guy's personal life, maybe he just got out of a relationship,

Starting point is 00:11:31 maybe he's kinda casually seeing someone you don't know. So when you shoot your shot, you can say to someone, like, listen, totally random, but I have no idea whether you have someone or not someone, but if you're not, let's get drinks sometime. Just keep it cash, right? Right. That's honestly, that's all you have to do.

Starting point is 00:11:45 Right, I like that. If he doesn't, you know, if he for whatever reason doesn't wanna go out with you, he can lie to you and be like, oh yeah, I'm kinda seeing someone, whatever. Right, right. You know? Right, okay. Yeah, which is totally fine.

Starting point is 00:11:57 I'm just like, I'm in this, like I said, I don't really care if he rejects me. It's just kind of whatever. I feel like I'm in this era of like, I'm very confident in who I am and I feel good about myself. So it's like, if it doesn't like work out, I have a lot of other prospects. Like I'm on dating apps and all, and all the good stuff. So I'm just, yeah, I just didn't know.

Starting point is 00:12:16 Like, yeah, I just didn't know what was kind of like, what would look stupid or whatever. But you're right. I kind of like that idea of pinging. I like the term pinging him, like just letting him just, and just to see like, yeah, if he's even on his Instagram or what, if he's checking DMs or whatever. Yeah. Now let's say you send them this ping and he doesn't reply and then you need a new strategy, right? Because then it's like, oh, well he probably didn't read it, right? Because like we're going to send him a message He probably didn't read it, right? Because like we're going to send him a message that's.

Starting point is 00:12:45 He's going to have no problem replying to. Yeah, you know, and on it, you can see when people read when they read them. So if he reads it and ignores me, then that's kind of my answer, I think. Yeah, but I don't think he's going to. I don't think he's going to ignore the picture you painted. I don't think he's going to ignore you the first time. I don't think. Yeah, I don't think he is either. And even though if you keep it casual, don't overthink he's gonna ignore you the first time. I don't think, yeah, I don't think he is either.

Starting point is 00:13:05 And even though, and if you keep it casual, don't overthink it, don't try to be funny, you know, don't, you know, like, you don't, he doesn't know you, he doesn't know your sense of humor, you don't know him, like, hey, totally random, not sure what your relationship status is, but if you're free, we should grab a drink. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:13:21 You know, listen, I don't know what his, like, to me, that's very direct. That's what I would say as a man to a woman. I think it's kind of hot when women do that. And you know, I do too. You're a cop, right? You're a cop. So you have no business, and I'm assuming interest, in dating a man who's intimidated

Starting point is 00:13:38 by a strong personality, right? And I'm assuming you have a fairly strong one. You're a cop, right? So like, I don't think you should overthink whether you should be direct or indirect Just be who you are because the last thing you want is to misrepresent yourself early on You know totally and and hide who you are So like be direct, you know and then be direct because you know, that's probably who you are, right? I mean, I don't know. Are you a direct person? Are you more are you are you?

Starting point is 00:14:07 Surprisingly a sheepish person. We don't have the badge have the badge on yeah no I'm very direct very direct and I don't really have a problem like I don't know I just am very not confrontational but I can bring things up very easily and I'm not necessarily like get I don't get embarrassed that much I'm just kind of like be like you know so I like if I DMed him and he was like, hey, I actually have a girlfriend, I would have no problem seeing him at the courthouse the next day and just small talking him. You know what I mean? Like I would just be so, it would be easy. Like that wouldn't be a thing for me. I just didn't know the way to approach it since like he's not, it'd be easier if he was active on social media and then I could like reply to a story or something. But I don't. Yeah. So if you don't get a reply, then maybe you...

Starting point is 00:14:47 And I wouldn't message your friend, the other guy. Okay. Okay. I mean, you could. If you're anxious to do this... I'm not mega anxious. I went on a date last night with another guy. I'm kind of talking to two or three other dudes.

Starting point is 00:15:02 I'm just kind of like... So yeah, if he doesn't reply... I think you're better off just if you, when of like, so yeah, if he doesn't reply, I think you're better off just if you, when you see this other guy, if you want to be like, hey, do you know what Max's story is? What's the situation? Does he have a girlfriend or not?

Starting point is 00:15:14 You know, I don't know. Yeah, I'm down. I'm going to send a DM later, I think. Or you could just randomly show up at the courthouse, you know, just. Yeah. I know where his office is at. I have have like I can get it and do all that stuff So I mean, you know if you're that anxious you could just walk by his office be like, yo check your DM and then walk away

Starting point is 00:15:32 I know that That'd be kind of crazy, but I would do it. I mean, I don't think it's crazy You just gotta keep it short and sweet. You just don't like don't be like hey, yeah, yeah and stand there it's kind of Sweet. You just don't later. Don't be like, Hey, check it out and stand there. I agree. That'd be kind of fucking crazy, but yeah, I agree. Actually have one more question about dating apps and dating. If you have time. I would consider myself kind of a modern woman, right?

Starting point is 00:15:57 Like I, and I think a lot of chicks feel this way, whatever. I have my own career. I'm buying a house right now, whatever. So I'm doing all these things and I don't find myself to be very, very needy when it comes to dating. And so like, I went on a date with a guy, he's 30. We just had one date, and then he's been gone last weekend, we're probably going to see each other again this weekend.

Starting point is 00:16:18 Really nice, attracted to him all those things. But how do you like lay a boundary down that you don't want to text all the time? Because he's like very texty. And the more I learn about him, I found out that he was in a 10 year relationship. Six months ago. So he met this guy. So his Yeah, I had I had drinks with him two weekends ago. Okay. And he's like, like really nice. We actually have like mutual friends. Oddly oddly enough i went to the police academy with his brother like seven years ago which is kind of a weird small world. Nice guy and just sent me that he's like kind of i guess i just don't know like. How picky and bitchy can i be i guess like he seems like he needs a lot of validation because he's new in the dating game and so he's like texting a lot and i'm like hey dude like. because he's new in the dating game. And so he's like texting a lot and I'm like, Hey, dude, like, I'm in the middle of my work week. I'm coaching recruits. I always have a recruit

Starting point is 00:17:08 in my car. I work for a very busy county. Like I don't have time to like sit here in small talk, text you. And I feel like it ruins in person conversation. Like if we're always attached at the hip, it just feels like very needy and like I get over it pretty quick. I could tell he was kind of offended by it, but he was just like, did you say it like that? No, I was very like, I told him this in person too, cause we were texting, we met online and then we chatted online and then we exchanged numbers, which I was okay with. And then we were texting, leading up to our date.

Starting point is 00:17:41 And then at our date, I was like, Hey, I'll be honest with you. Like I'm not like the biggest, I like a check-in text like every couple days type thing or if you have something that you need to tell me about our upcoming date whatever but I don't want to just sit here and text a good morning how are you what are you up to you know what I mean so like he was doing after one night of drinks yeah and leading up to it was very like like I tried to like let him go a couple times so like leading up to it was very like, like I tried to like let him go a couple times. So like leading up to our date, I was like working and it was like a Friday night or

Starting point is 00:18:10 something and I was like, Hey, like I'm going to let you go works pretty busy. I need to like, I so as a coach, like I ride in the passenger seat of the patrol car and my recruit who's in training drives my car and I grade them all day. They call us FTOs field training officers. So I have the luxury to text if I want, especially if it's a little bit slower overnight, but like I'm in and out of the car. I'm monitoring my recruit to make sure he doesn't die. I don't die. All that kind of crap, right? We're not violating someone's rights. So like my brain is occupied and this man is like texting me. So I just kindly was like, Hey, work's kind of busy.

Starting point is 00:18:42 You know, I'll catch up with you later. Have a good night. And he's like, just text me when you're not busy. Like he wouldn't end the conversation. And I was kind of like that immediately. I hate the word the egg. And I know you hate it too. But it gave me the egg. I was just like, let me go work my job. And like, we don't need to be talking all the time. And then on our date, when I first met him, he disclosed to me like it all made sense. He's like, I was in a 10 year time. And then on our date, when I first met him, he disclosed to me, like it all made sense. He's like, I was in a 10 year relationship and as of six months ago, we mutually broke up. And I was like, so your entire 20s,

Starting point is 00:19:12 you were with the same gal. And he was like, yeah. And I was like, that's all adding up. Like it's making sense. I don't know. I just don't know how to like nicely, yeah. I don't know, go ahead. Well, I think you're overthinking that part,

Starting point is 00:19:24 which is a bit, it's probably a little bit of a theme for you. Okay, yeah, I don't know. Well, I think you're overthinking that part, which is a bit, it's probably a little bit of a theme for you. Okay, yeah, yeah. I mean, listen, I just want to emphasize, in early dating situations, that's what this is, it's really important to do what makes you feel the most comfortable. And we, as a, I guess, society, or just, I think,

Starting point is 00:19:43 modern daters, seem to really ignore that part. Right. And they do what they think will make the other person happy, or they do what they think will not make the other person sad, or disappointed, or whatever. You guys don't know each other, you're total strangers, you didn't even have this background

Starting point is 00:20:00 that you have now on this guy, so it is really important for you to just set your boundaries, or set your expectations and communicate those early on in a respectful way, which you did, you know? And if- Yeah, I was super, I wasn't rude. I was just super like, this is like, I'm a busy gal.

Starting point is 00:20:18 Even when I'm like hanging out with my family and friends on my weekend, like I like to be present. I don't want to be glued to my phone. And how did he handle it? Did he? He was like very, I could tell like he understood. I could tell he didn't like it. Like he was kind of like, I think he read into it maybe a little bit much. Tell me as much as you can remember. I really like you.

Starting point is 00:20:36 Tell me as much as you can remember exactly what he said. He was like, oh yeah, like I feel the same way. I don't like to text a lot either, which I immediately was like, but you do, you literally like, you wouldn't let me end the conversation like four times in the last week. Every time I tried to say, hey, I'm doing stuff, I'll talk to you later. It was always just text me when you're ready.

Starting point is 00:20:58 Like text me when you're done with what you're doing. I don't mind, like that kind of thing. So he was respectful and he's like, hey, I totally get it, no big deal. And then the next morning after our date, he was like, Hey, I'd like to see you again. I said, yeah, like I'm open to another date. Totally cool. Whatever. The next morning he snapshots me. I fucking hate Snapchat. I don't know why I still have it, but he snapshots me. So like, I, of course I open it and I'm like, okay, I have to reply to him or apply back. And then he's like, that's a meaty bitchy comment. Like, oh, he was going camping this

Starting point is 00:21:29 last weekend. So he was going to be out of service. And he was like, I'm packing for camping. I bet you're so excited to get rid of me. And I was like, I just kind of messaged him back on Snapchat very respectfully was yes, I messaged him back. And I, my last boyfriend used to do that shit all the fucking time. And I messaged him back. I said, Look, it kind of sounds like you're feeling like you need some validation. And the like, if I want to text you department, I literally said that. And I was like, I just want you to know, like, I told you, I wanted to see you again. I just laid a boundary out that I don't like the text all the time. Nothing to do with you. It's just how I like to live my life. And then he texts me, he got off Snapchat and texts me and was like, this long text, like, I read your Snapchat message.

Starting point is 00:22:09 I just want you to know, yeah, sometimes I do need validation. You seem like a catch. I really am attracted to you. I really want to see you again. And I am kind of worried that going out of town for five or six days, you're going to forget about me. And I'm like, dude, it's been one fucking date. One date. I'm just like, oh my God. It just seemed really intense and aggressive. Yeah, listen, a couple things to remember. A couple things to remember. All right, slow down for a second.

Starting point is 00:22:35 All right, one, I just want you to remember this guy and his behavior after one round of drinks. The next time you meet someone that you're really excited about, who doesn't give you the same attention. I just wanna point out to you and everyone listening, this is how men behave when they're really excited and really like someone.

Starting point is 00:22:57 Right. And I just like, so I just wanna point that out to everyone listening when they're like, why doesn't he call me back? And you get together with the girls and you're all like trying to make up a bunch of bullshit excuses as to why he hasn't reached out or to why he hasn't, you know, and you're like,

Starting point is 00:23:13 well, he's busy, blah, blah, blah. I'm just saying this is the energy of a guy who's excited about someone new. And so just remember that when you're wondering about someone else, right? That being said, like, listen, the way you remember it, yeah, one, he sounds like a guy who, like you said, doesn't have a ton of dating experience

Starting point is 00:23:33 and is used to having a partner, right? He's used to having that companionship, you know? That neediness, right? Like, not neediness, but just like, he's used to having someone, right? I don't know how his relationship ended ended and you don't know that either, but six months, not a ton, you know, maybe there's some trauma there. Maybe I mean, if she left him, you know, he's probably feeling a certain-

Starting point is 00:23:54 He makes it sound, this was weird. He was like, it was mutual and we're actually like this. Yeah, I don't know. He's just like, it was mutual. We just like grew apart, whatever. And then he was like, but I don't know if this is like weird for you, but we are kind of still friends. I was like, what do you mean?

Starting point is 00:24:08 And he's like, well, we have the same friend group, so I see her. And I was like, I didn't even ask any details because I didn't feel like I had the right to ask in that moment. I was just like, I was just kind of like. I would, with that information, I would go to Vegas and probably put a large bet down

Starting point is 00:24:23 that she broke up with him if I could somehow get the facts. That's kind of what I was thinking too. I was like, there's more to this story. Like this is not... And maybe the more of the story is like, you know, listen, after 10 years, for example, one of my serious relationships,

Starting point is 00:24:37 my last serious relationship in my 20s, we dated for two and a half years, so it wasn't 10 or anything like that. And when we broke up, it was mutual. We were at each other's throats. We were like, we need a fucking break. We agreed on that. But at the end of the day, I was more of the driving force.

Starting point is 00:24:53 And she was more interested in getting back together, and at that point, I had a little more dating experience. I had gotten back together with other girlfriends in the past, and I was kinda done doing that. So I was very much like, no. So it was me who really ultimately ended that relationship where she was probably more willing to try it out and restart and figure it out and I just wasn't, right?

Starting point is 00:25:17 So I'm sure there's a little bit of truth to it was mutual, they did it for 10 years, right? Lot of history there. Maybe they were probably fighting for a couple years and they finally just got exhausted, but it's never totally mutual. And it sounds based on what you're telling me that maybe she was more the driving force

Starting point is 00:25:33 of the breakup than not. And the fact that they have mutual friends makes a lot of sense, they did it for 10 years. I guess my point of this guy is, it's like, I don't, you know, listen, I don't know if you want to date him again, I don't know if you're not. It sounds like so far, you know,

Starting point is 00:25:44 he didn't ace the test, but he didn't fail it either, you know? Yeah, he's not like a bad guy. I just like, I know I'm so critical. Like he, we talked about habits, like lifestyle stuff. I would say I'm pretty active. Like I live three to four times a week. I walk a lot.

Starting point is 00:26:00 I don't drink and get like crazy drunk all the time. Like I'm pretty conscious about my alcohol intake. And this guy kind of sounds like he's like, Oh, you don't go to the bar. And I was like, dude, I can't tell you a lot. I think the last time I thought a bar was a bachelorette party like a year ago. And he's like, Oh, like, you know, me and my buddies, like go to the bar a couple of times a month. And I'm like, to do what? Just hang out and drink like that, that kind of shit. Like, a couple of times a month is not a lot for a guy who's, how old is this guy?

Starting point is 00:26:28 I know he's 30, but like, I'm just like, it just seems like, and then like lifestyle stuff, he's like, he doesn't eat fast food all the time, but I know he's kind of like, yeah, I go out to eat a lot. I do all that stuff and I'm. All right, so let's just pause that for a second. My thing is right now with this guy or any of these other guys, this is called dating for a second. My thing is, right now, with this guy, or any of these other guys, this is called dating.

Starting point is 00:26:48 Stop trying to figure them out, right? He gave you some information about going to the bars twice a month with his buddies. Like, you don't go to the bars. There's a slight disconnect there in terms of compatibility, you know? But now you're, instead of getting his information that he gave you, and then in your own mind

Starting point is 00:27:05 trying to interpret to what you think that means, why don't you just either A, decide whether you want to get to know more or not, right? So if you do want to continue to hang out with him, then you see, you know? Enjoy this period of dating like that you are, that you're comfortable being single that you are, but don't just be a fuckboy in the sense.

Starting point is 00:27:27 Date, like you said, with intention. So date these guys, get to know them. Set these boundaries. You're kind of operating with this kind of like who gives a fuck attitude, which is great, right? So that you can actually be willing to have these direct conversations with these men and see how they respond, right?

Starting point is 00:27:44 Do they respond in a way that makes you go, oh my God, absolutely not, or like, yeah, I don't know. Sounds like a little bit of a lost puppy, but it's kind of endearing, and he does seem to really have an interest in me, and like, you know, I don't know. I'm not sold on him, but like, I'm definitely interested in learning more.

Starting point is 00:27:58 And so you go out with him, and you see if date two was better or worse than date one, and then you go on from there, right? But just stop trying to insert what you think you know about these people with 2% of the information that you've already learned, which is what we all do, and you're doing, right? So just try not to overthink that part.

Starting point is 00:28:16 Collect the data, right? You're learning something about, I guess, men in general by dating this guy because he's admitted to you he's really excited about you, his behavior is matching that. And you've probably been someone like everyone else before you, when we like someone and they don't give us the same energy we want back,

Starting point is 00:28:34 we will make excuses for the behavior. And then we'll give people, you know, and then we'll chase that instead of just accepting how they're treating us, right? Or their lack of interest in us, you know? And we waste a lot of time trying to figure things out because we want that validation. We all want validation.

Starting point is 00:28:49 Quite honestly, I think it was pretty impressive for this guy to acknowledge that he likes the validation that he does. Doesn't mean he's an awesome guy. Maybe he's like, I don't know, maybe he's self-aware, but still really needy guy, you know, which would be kind of, ew. But it showed a level of maturity from him

Starting point is 00:29:08 to not get super defensive and to just simply say, I think you're right. Now, when the funny fact that you said that he went off of Snapchat and then sent you a long text, I could absolutely picture myself or anyone in that position realizing, okay, I should text this on a text because it's a serious conversation. I don't wanna send this over Snapchat.

Starting point is 00:29:27 And then feeling very self-conscious about that, but feeling like I really needed to express myself and get it out because not sending it, she's, you know, we've all, he's overthinking it too. Right? Right. So. Totally. Who knows? Probably not your guy, but like stop,

Starting point is 00:29:41 you don't have to figure that out, right? Yeah, totally. Just go out with them. And again, you're a cop. Like the worst thing that you're't have to figure that out, right? Yeah, just totally. Go out with them. And again, you're a cop, like the worst thing that you're gonna have to deal with them, you know, the more dates you go on with someone, the harder it is to end it if you decide to end it, you know? Yeah, yeah. So, but you're a direct person,

Starting point is 00:29:57 you're not afraid of a little, a man crying. A little conflict. Yeah. I'm sure you see it all the time. I see it too much at work, so. Okay, awesome. Well, thank you you see it all the time. Yeah, I see it too much at work, so. Yeah. Yeah. Okay, awesome. Well, thank you, I appreciate all the advice.

Starting point is 00:30:09 No, my pleasure. Yeah, just enjoy this time. Try not to overthink it. Trust your instincts. Prioritize your needs, especially early on. When you actually build rapport with any of these guys, then you can start, not necessarily change your behavior, but like when you build an emotional connection

Starting point is 00:30:26 with someone, then you know, it makes sense to start empathizing with them, and being considerate for them, and going out of your way for them, and showing them that you're willing to make a priority to a certain extent. After one or two dates, fuck, you don't owe these people anything, right?

Starting point is 00:30:41 I know, you're so right, yeah. So yeah, that's my two cents. But as far as the DA, have fun with it. Just do it. Just do it. Fuck it. Be great if you can pull them over. Before I let you go, give me one bit of advice

Starting point is 00:30:56 in terms of how do I get out of a ticket when I get pulled over? What's one thing? Don't cry. Do not, like when girls cry, I'm like, fuck off right now. Like unless you're 16, I don't, unless you're a teenager who like just got their license, don't cry, but admit that you're wrong.

Starting point is 00:31:15 Admit that and give the real reason. So if you're just like, if I pulled somebody over for speeding, it's like, what are we in a rush for? Like, oh, like I'm running over like to get my mom who felt like some bullshit excuse or like whatever. Just be like, I wasn't paying attention and I was just speeding. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:31:31 You know what I mean? I feel like I'm already doing that. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know. And like, honestly, a lot of cops, like I'm not a traffic unit, so I pull traffic to hunt, so I'm looking for stolen cars, guns, narcotics and and wanted people So I'm not like just stopping people just because like they're going ten over like I could give a fuck to be honest Like unless you're driving egregiously don't really care. You know, I mean is that why I know it gets pulled over in LA because they don't

Starting point is 00:31:57 Have enough cops for that and I just feel like they're probably they're fighting real crime. Yeah Yeah, like I work for a sheriff's office So I'm a solo like, I ride in a solo car, deputy, whatever. And we go to like, we call them house calls. So it's domestic disturbances, stolen vehicles in progress, menacing in progress. Like you're going to all these hot calls, you know what I mean? And then you get slower calls to like, Hey, someone stole my car yesterday. So you take like an over the phone report or whatever. But if I'm driving around, I work 4pm to 2am. So kind of like an early graves, I guess. If I'm driving around at midnight and I'm running plates, I'm not really looking for the like 16 year old kid who's

Starting point is 00:32:33 coming home late from the prom. You know what I mean? Like I'm looking for like legit criminals. I'm not I don't give a shit about that. Like, so if you are getting pulled over, and it's a cop on a motor motorcycle, that's a traffic cop who's probably going to give you a ticket. I'll say that. So most motors, yeah, most like traffic cops ride motorcycles or they have unmarked like challengers or chargers or something like that. Because it's like they're going to give you a ticket because it's like what they do.

Starting point is 00:32:58 Yeah. Like that's their, they're literally, yeah. I won't say they have a quota, but they definitely are, they're supposed to meet like a certain standard, I guess. So yeah, it's sometimes like, yeah, I'm looking for like, if you have no plates on your car, that's kind of, that's a weird, like a lot of stolen cars have no license plates on them, or you know what I mean? So like, there's just certain things that all we need is a violation to legally stop you and identify you. So but yeah, don't be just be honest. Hey, yeah, I was on my phone. I was looking at my maps. yeah, don't be, just be honest. Hey, yeah, I was on my phone. I was looking at my maps.

Starting point is 00:33:27 Like honestly, like just be straight up. And most of the time, regular non-traffic cops are pretty, if you're respectful and you seem like a normal dude in your history, like your license, you have insurance, you have registration, they're probably gonna give you a warning. Good to know. All right, well, thank you for the free advice.

Starting point is 00:33:43 Have fun dating out there. Please let us know once you shoot your shot what happens. Okay, I will. Thank you so much. I love you guys. I've been listening since the beginning. Literally love you guys. Thank you.

Starting point is 00:33:54 We appreciate it. Thank you for your service. Thank you. Talk to you guys later. Bye. Take care. Bye-bye. Parenting never stops even when you have a full-time job, but thanks to our sponsor, Nanit,

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Starting point is 00:39:00 What's your name? So my name is Katie and I'm 28 years old. How can we help Katie? So my boyfriend lived a double life and he ghosted me when I found out and I'm just trying to figure out how I move on without any closure, any answers. Okay.

Starting point is 00:39:16 How long are you dating this guy? Okay, so we were dating for a year and a half. When you say double life, what do you mean? So basically the entire thing is like, we were long distance, we flew to each other. We spent probably every month, if not more, like two times a month together. We spent Christmases, Valentine's Day,

Starting point is 00:39:35 like we spent basically everything couplet that normal couples do. It wasn't like a long distance where we don't see each other. So he also tours for a living, he works for a band. So I would also fly out to a few days of the tour and we basically just made everything work really well. In June, we went on a romantic trip for our one-year anniversary. We went to a wedding together, we met each other's families, we made plans for the remainder of the year. In July, I wrote the bar exam to move to the States with him and everything was kind of just perfect and falling into

Starting point is 00:40:05 place. The day after I wrote my bar, I went to go visit him on the road and we spent his birthday together. We traveled around for a few days. We discussed visiting my family post tour. We were talking about moving in together. I booked a trip to see him the last days of tour, which is like 10 days after that. So just to give you a little bit of backstory before the double life came in, because there's kind of like two part to this. August 10th, three days before my flight took off, we got into an argument and the next day, he just called and broke up with me out of the blue, completely blindsided. I'm like packed to leave.

Starting point is 00:40:38 What were you guys fighting about? So my dog had got into an onion. So she had a little bit of onion toxicity, she was very sick. And I asked him to FaceTime me and instead he went to the bar. So I just thought I'm like watching my dog if she could die and he's out at the bar with his friends drinking. Gotcha. Okay. And you confronted him about that and Yes. It turned into a fight.

Starting point is 00:41:03 And it turned into a fight and it was kind of a texting thing. And I expected it to just be with the next day, Hey, that wasn't cool. We should have done that better. And instead I got a call and he's like, we're breaking up. Okay. How old is this guy? He's 29. How old are you again?

Starting point is 00:41:14 28. Okay. So when the tour ended, I went to his city to talk through everything. We spent like 30 hours together. So after you broke up. Yes, I flew to his city to talk through everything. We spent like 30 hours together. We were talking to- So after you broke up?

Starting point is 00:41:26 Yes, I flew to his city to talk again, to talk through the whole breakup because this was on FaceTime. Yeah, but just to be clear, he knew you were coming. He agreed to have you come out. Yes. You stayed with him. Yes.

Starting point is 00:41:39 Okay, all right. So you flew out there after you broke up, stayed with him, and then for about 30 hours, did you guys get back together temporarily or you fight all weekend, fight plus hookup? What was that weekend like? It was talking for 30 hours about everything. It was the healthiest breakup. We went for dinners, we went for dates, everything.

Starting point is 00:41:59 And then I flew home and then flew back a week later for my birthday. And then we basically decided remain exclusive, work on our issues, see how things go. So this is the beginning of September. So not fully broken up, kind of taking a step back to work on things. Just out of curiosity in that 30 hour conversation, did he acknowledge his behavior regarding your dog? No, he didn't. He didn't? Okay, interesting. No, not surprising, but the gist of it was basically, I'm tired of doing things for you, and I want to do more for me. Okay. Well, that's honest. I think it's important that you recognize that.

Starting point is 00:42:36 Yes. And in retrospect, when I go through it, that's a very important part, that he basically was saying he didn't care. Correct. Yes. Over something that's kind of simple and trivial, you know? Yeah. It was very easy to just give a phone call when your dog is very sick. She's like a little tiny Shih Tzu. She's not, she's not like a big dog that could take it. And, and just, just to verify, I mean, I'm assuming that while there has been the

Starting point is 00:43:03 occasional moment here or there throughout your relationship where you needed him to be a boyfriend and support you, that he wouldn't, who knows what he would say, but it's not as if every week there was a new, dramatic thing you needed him to give your attention. And he, you know, like if I were talking to him, would he be like, oh my God, yeah, sure.

Starting point is 00:43:23 I mean, yeah, I guess I should have done that. But like it was every other day, there was something new with this person. And it was just like, you know, that's not what's going on here to be clear. Yeah. No, there was nothing else. I also don't think that he liked that I was stressed out about writing the bar exam, which I'm sure, you know, it's a 12 hour exam. It's extremely stressful. To be a lawyer for me.

Starting point is 00:43:41 Dependent on that. Yes. When you say writing the bar exam, what do you mean by that versus taking it? Is that just a figure of speech? Uh, just a different phrase. Okay. All right. That's curious.

Starting point is 00:43:50 Um, so what were you saying? You had a certain opinion about what? Um, just that his life was as stressful as mine. He sells t-shirts for bands and I'm writing the bar exam and teaching myself US law. I didn't go to a US school, so I taught myself US law for six months and I'm writing the bar exam and teaching myself US law. I didn't go to a US school so I taught myself US law for six months and I'm writing a 12 hour exam and it would very much be well my life is stressful because I'm selling t-shirts. What did you think about that? I thought it's very dismissive and I mean I tried to not be judgmental because some people have just as tough

Starting point is 00:44:22 but I mean I did need a little bit more support given my circumstance for a few months. Sure, but let's be judgmental for a hot second. I'm just curious about someone in your position who's, you know, investing in themselves as much as you are. You seem like a very attractive young lady. Why are you wasting your time

Starting point is 00:44:41 on a guy selling T-shirts for a band? I think it was just very charismatic, very charming. Okay. Sold me the whole thing and like, I'm sure you understand too, it's exciting. Traveling around, going to visit and like always dreading off. It was like a cool lifestyle. Sure, but it wasn't really his lifestyle. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:45:00 You know? No, correct. It was him working for other people. Yeah. So, I mean, I get what you're saying, but I just want, you know, you called in and your biggest goal when you called in was to find the closure that you didn't think he was giving you. Right? Yes. And you, when you told me the story, and it makes all the sense in the world why you told me the story that you did, but your story was, you listed a bunch of facts about why this breakup was surprising, you know?

Starting point is 00:45:27 And so when you listed that off, you were basically saying, you know, we celebrated our anniversary, we went to weddings together. You essentially told me a bunch of nice things about your relationship, right? Which is normal, I get that. You're painting a picture of why you were as upset

Starting point is 00:45:44 or caught off guard as you were. So I understand that context that you were, why you said that. But part of that context that you are leaving out when you're telling the story of your relationship are things like, you know, the, he didn't give a fuck when my dog was dying type of things. I know you shared that story,

Starting point is 00:46:01 but I'm just saying as you remember your relationship, it's really important to remember everything about your relationship. And in addition to that, see it with a little bit more honesty than you did. When you were dating him, it was easier for you to kind of overlook the fact that you weren't dating the musician in the band or the manager or some high level person.

Starting point is 00:46:27 You were dating someone who wanted, like you quite honestly, to enjoy this very exciting lifestyle. So he agreed to have this basic job that literally anyone can do with any education level. So that he, you know, and I'm imagining he didn't make a ton of money because jobs like those are just like, hey, if you wanna ride with us, if you wanna hang out with us and travel,

Starting point is 00:46:48 and we'll give you incredible access, and you can sell T-shirts for us, you can have this job, right? Cool, right? And that's great for like a young person, you know, fresh out of college, in college, whatever, you know, guy's about to hit 30, and you're going to school to be a lawyer,

Starting point is 00:47:04 and you're investing yourself, I don't know, like maybe I'm 30 and you're going to school to be a lawyer and you're investing yourself. I don't know. Like maybe I'm being hypercritical here. I'm just saying it sounds like maybe he wasn't your equal and it went in the department of careers. Right. And I don't know what his career plans were. I don't know what his future goals were.

Starting point is 00:47:19 Doesn't sound like he had a ton of plans or specific ones. I mean, for him selling t-shirts was, I guess, complicated. I don't know. Totally. For some reason. Yeah. So listen, I don't know how you've been listening to this show. You don't need him for closure and we can just have a fun little exercise to figure it out. There's even more to the story to this. Oh, well, tell me, share, share, share the story.

Starting point is 00:47:36 We haven't even got to the, to the part yet. Okay. Um, so all of that said, September, he goes on tour and it's all normal. Face timing, good night, morning, et cetera. Basic relationship stuff. Nothing's changed. We booked a trip in October for me to go visit. We booked concert tickets.

Starting point is 00:47:57 We planned to open the bar results together, which was the most important day of my life. September 28th, we FaceTimed. Everything is great, we made plans for dinner the next day, I think nothing happens. That night I go on Instagram and I see that his ex is moving to a city and we've had issues with her the whole time. So I simply say, hey why didn't you tell me your ex was moving to your city and I didn't have to find out on Instagram? And thinking it was a basic respect thing, I just don't want to find that out on Instagram. He got very

Starting point is 00:48:27 aggressive, he got very rude, a lot of mean things were said. Then the next day I said, okay things have cooled off, can we have a sober conversation? And he replies, he's not super stoked on a call right now and I had never heard from him again. And I tried to message, figure everything out. I had a flight book 10 days later, I had concert tickets, just completely ghosted. He replied to zero, but he sent me money on PayPal to buy Sabrina Carpenter tickets, but couldn't send me a sorry or apology or anything. What do you mean to buy? Like he just paid you for your half of the ticket type of thing?

Starting point is 00:49:00 Yes. Okay. So I started racking my brain and kind of thinking, well, it's the ex, is it somebody else? Is it like like what could have happened? So then I thought back and looked where he was when this happened and our fight had taken place in the same city where he Was previously linked to another girl This girl had messaged me back in April saying that she had a relationship with him when he posted a photo of us on Instagram He swore it was a flirty friend that went too far one time

Starting point is 00:49:26 and it was a drunk kiss, swore up and down, and I was just so distraught over this. So I just assumed that that's all it was. I forgave him, I worked through it. I just, I was in love. I tried to move past it. Okay, fair enough, but... So we got to talking and the girl had sent me

Starting point is 00:49:42 over 30 screenshots over the course of 11 out of 14 months that that were together of him telling her he's in love with her. He was playing her out to see her. He had her meet his family. There's photos of her together. She would be flown out a few days before he would see me. She was flown out to different tour dates. So he had an entire second girlfriend, basically our entire relationship, and I had no idea any of this. And I put them both. Well, yeah, actually you did. You did, actually. Each year, the whole entire time.

Starting point is 00:50:12 No, but I want you to recognize that for part of this relationship, you actually knew the truth, you just chose to ignore it. Yes. You know? Yes, I did. And I only point this out because it can be very scary to be ghosted in the manner in which you did, and it can be very scary to be ghosted in the manner in which you did, and it can be very scary to be in a relationship

Starting point is 00:50:27 with someone, seemingly trust them, only to be blindsided to find out they had this whole secret relationship that you didn't know about, right? And then you can spiral and be like, well, how can I trust anyone, all manner of pieces of shit, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah? How could I even, I had no idea,

Starting point is 00:50:44 but like you did, you had an idea, right? And I had a feeling. Not only did you have a feeling, she reached out and told you, and you were like, nah, I don't believe her. I know. And like that was nuts that you didn't believe her. You didn't wanna believe her was the truth.

Starting point is 00:50:59 Like how, I mean, listen, like think about it, right? This random girl reached out and says, I'm in a relationship with this guy, right? You confront him. And his response isn't like, I don't even know who that fucking is, which it still could have been a lie. But like, I don't know.

Starting point is 00:51:13 I don't even know what a valid excuse would be because it's like, why would someone like this reach out? That's the obvious question, right? So it could have been like an absolute crazy person. But his response was, oh, this was like a flirty friend, but it's like it's not what she thinks it is? Like what? Like, he's a, what is he?

Starting point is 00:51:29 Is he flirty friends with someone that should be in a mental hospital? Like, why would someone think they're in a relationship with someone when they're not? That's crazy, right? You know, what's more believable, that he's friends with someone who should be in a mental institution or he's lying, right?

Starting point is 00:51:44 And it was obvious, but you just didn't wanna see it, you didn't wanna believe it, who should be in a mental institution or he's lying, right? And it was obvious, but you just didn't wanna see it, you didn't wanna believe it, you just completely chose to, in your mind, it was easier for you to tell yourself that she was crazy or that she had some sort of problem and you just chose to believe him, not based off of anything that made sense or evidence.

Starting point is 00:52:01 Your gut didn't even tell you that he was being honest, but you were just like, eh, fuck it all, I'm just going to lean into this thing, right? Yeah. Yeah. You can say that now with kind of honestly like, oh, well, I was, this is, you know, a big part of this is kind of on me. Not to make yourself feel bad, but now it's a lot more empowering than just be like, well, fuck, how can I prevent this in the future? This won't be the last guy who lies to you, and this won't be the last person who is capable of things that you don't think you're capable of,

Starting point is 00:52:29 but you still can prevent this stuff from happening by just paying attention and trusting your gut and not being afraid of the answers. Recognize that, listen, unfortunately, people do lie, and in a long distance relationship, it gives people opportunities that people in not long distance relationship, it gives people opportunities that people in not long distance relationships would have. Doesn't mean they're all cheating,

Starting point is 00:52:50 but just being aware of that. Or just being aware that in the first six months, you don't really know anyone. So if someone, in the first year, when someone gives you weird behavior early on, it's really important to follow up on that. To not give them any benefit of the doubt. Because keep in mind, especially in the first few months of dating, these people are total fucking strangers. of your early on, it's really important to follow up on that. To not give them any benefit of the doubt,

Starting point is 00:53:05 because keep in mind, especially in the first few months of dating, these people are total fucking strangers. Yeah, totally. And so they don't deserve the benefit of the doubt. They don't deserve your trust. You can choose to trust someone when you start dating someone, but when something comes up that raises a bunch of red flags,

Starting point is 00:53:20 you don't choose to trust them. You're just like, all right, well, I was going to trust you. Something came up, I have to quote unquote investigate this or follow through on this and ask some questions. And at that point, you need to trust yourself more than you trust them. You need to trust your instincts. When their answers don't make sense,

Starting point is 00:53:37 you need to ask follow-up questions. You need to dig deeper. And the more direct and more tougher the questions are, the easier it should be to answer if they're not lying. You know? You're going to law school, you don't need me saying this to you. So yeah, I mean, listen,

Starting point is 00:53:53 you do not need closure from this guy. And I want you more than anything to do have to call and stop telling yourself that he has something that you need. He doesn't, right? Think about it, right? Let's say you got your way. Let's say, I was like, hey listen,

Starting point is 00:54:07 I have the power to make him answer your call and I'm gonna give you what you asked for. Let's say I was a genie and you're like, Nick, I just really wanna talk to him one more time so I can get the closure that I need. I'm like, all right, all right, I'll make that happen for you. What could he possibly say to you

Starting point is 00:54:21 that would make you leave that conversation feeling better than you do now? I think that what I was thinking about this, it's not so much apology, it's just now I feel like almost the year and a half that I spent with them, all the memories are like tainted. It's either he was cheating or he was not, or it was post-cheating.

Starting point is 00:54:39 I understand that, but I want you to think about my question. And you're right, that's true. That memory is tainted. Do you really want the past year and a half to be nothing but great memories? Like listen, you're a young enough person that a year and a half of your life,

Starting point is 00:54:52 I'm sure you had fun times, I'm sure you had great experiences, you got to see some cool shit, you went to some concerts, you got to travel. It wasn't a total waste. As far as the memory of you two, yeah, I don't know. It's not what you plan on it being, right? Like, who gives a shit?

Starting point is 00:55:07 But the point is, back to my original question, what could he have said to you that would have made you leave that conversation better than you felt going in, and as if you could move on with a full heart without any, what could he have said? Yeah, I guess maybe that he did care about me the last year and a half, but I guess it doesn't matter

Starting point is 00:55:31 because he disrespected me. Yeah, so that's a role play there. He's like, oh, but I do care about you. And like our memories are, they mean so much to me. It's like, yeah, I was definitely cheating on you. But like, don't you just know that like those moments we had when we were together, they were really special. Would that have made you feel better?

Starting point is 00:55:47 No, probably not because they were still, you were still cheating the whole time intentionally. Exactly, so like that's what, listen, it's a rhetorical question I'm asking you. The answer is he couldn't have said shit to make you feel better. In the history of these closer conversations that everyone like you thinks they need to have

Starting point is 00:56:01 in order to move on, no one's ever had that conversation and been like, I'm glad I had that conversation to move on, no one's ever had that conversation and been like, I'm glad I had that conversation. The only time they're glad they had that conversation is when it goes so badly. They're like, oh my God, you know what? Honestly, I don't know why I wanted that conversation in the first place,

Starting point is 00:56:15 but you were so off putting in this conversation, I finally realized, I'm just totally glad to be done with you. That's best case. But you don't need to have that conversation with him in order to get to that place. You have all this information, you have a track record of behavior. At this point, all you need to do is be grateful you found out that you didn't waste one more time with him.

Starting point is 00:56:35 Thankfully, it doesn't sound like you opened the results with him. No, there are the next two days actually, so I haven't even found out yet. All right. Well, good luck with that. Regardless, whatever happens, you won't have that memory of sharing it with him. So that's a plus. True, yeah. Right, like you have the reason to be sad and you have a reason to have this affect you

Starting point is 00:56:54 because it's a shitty situation. But when you go down memory lane, don't make a bad situation worse by feeling like, I don't know, you lost something meaningful. You didn't. You found out the truth that quite frankly you were given months ago but you just chose to ignore it. This is a second chance at knowing the truth. So it's an opportunity. So... And why do you think that people like just ghost after

Starting point is 00:57:21 such a long time? I don't know. I mean you. Rather than just break up or something. Look, all I could do is guess. You and I aren't capable of doing what he did, right? Yes. I don't know, why did he do it? I don't know, he's a liar. Maybe he has some past childhood trauma. I don't know, maybe he's just trying to impress his band,

Starting point is 00:57:37 the people he works for. Maybe they're all young musicians who like, think it's cool to have multiple girlfriends. I don't know why he did it. Point is, he did. And it has nothing to do with you is more important. And your ego probably doesn't even wanna hear that. You wanna feel like you're so beautiful

Starting point is 00:57:53 and so intelligent and so wonderful that even if he is a piece of shit with everyone else, he's gonna treat you like the queen that you are. But that's just not how life works, right? Like he is who he is and you wanna find someone who sees that in you, because you're not for everyone, no one is, right? You know, like, do you wanna find someone who just like thinks you're really pretty or was smart,

Starting point is 00:58:15 or do you want someone who just really sees you for who you are, really feels grateful to have you in your life, wants to make you a priority, does more than just fly you out occasionally, things like that, you know? I'd be willing to bet if you were to go down memory lane and nitpick some of your memories, there's probably a lot of other moments

Starting point is 00:58:34 that were kind of funny that you brushed under the rug that you could go back and be like, well next time someone does that or when I ask this or when he does this or yada yada yada I should ask more questions because that might have meant they had another girlfriend. Yeah totally. Right? So like there are a million other things you just chose to ignore that next time don't choose to ignore. Look into them. You know you can't control other people. There are unfortunately people out there that you

Starting point is 00:59:00 know they I don't know why people do what they do. There's a million reasons why. Their own insecurities, their baggage, maybe you know I don't know. None of it's really a valid excuse but everyone has their bullshit know why people do what they do. There's a million reasons why. Their own insecurities, their baggage, maybe, I don't know. None of that's really a valid excuse, but everyone has their bullshit reasons why they do shitty things. But what you can control is how you respond to these people. You can get better at setting your boundaries,

Starting point is 00:59:14 you're communicating your expectations, trusting your gut, asking follow-up questions when things don't seem right. Those are all things you can get better at, and now is an opportunity to do that. And those are the things I would reflect on right now so that when you do get back right, you know, those are all things you can get better at, and now is an opportunity to do that, and those are the things I would reflect on right now, so that when you do get back out there and date,

Starting point is 00:59:30 you can still go after what you want, and not necessarily be a cynic, but just be like armed with a little bit more awareness and knowledge to better protect yourself against people like him. Yeah, because I definitely don't wanna be in this situation again. And next time, don't have a 30 hour conversation about something that isn't a hard ask. When he

Starting point is 00:59:52 acts the way he did when your dog got sick, like that should be kind of a deal breaker for you. Totally, especially like she could have died. Sure, yeah. And even whether she did or didn't, like this was something he should have made you feel like he gave a shit, and he didn't. He made you feel like you were inconveniencing him over something that you made very clear was important to you. Hey, this is, I'm sad here,

Starting point is 01:00:17 and I want some emotional support from my boyfriend. You shouldn't even have to ask shit like that, and you did. And then when you did ask, he made you feel bad for it. That should be enough for someone like you to say, who is this person I'm dating? What is this type of behavior? And you wasted 30 hours of your life, not even mentioning you got on a plane,

Starting point is 01:00:36 went to go visit him to have this conversation. You didn't even get what you wanted out of that conversation and you still chose to continue the relationship. So clearly you need to do a much better job of holding people accountable for how they treat you. And again, you need to do a better job of trusting your gut. And when someone does something, you say to yourself, this is fucked up. Like I would not treat someone like this.

Starting point is 01:01:00 And I don't know why I'm putting up with someone treating me like this. Then you should just trust that you're right. And it doesn't matter what they say or how they respond. If they choose to try to gaslight you or manipulate you or just justify their actions. It's a waste of your time. Like I'm not gonna sit there and try to explain to you

Starting point is 01:01:19 why you handled this poorly. And if you don't think that you did, then like that's all the information I need. Yeah, totally, totally. Especially when it's something very important to me versus going out to a bar. That is a very easy situation to be like, okay, well, it's more important to my girlfriend,

Starting point is 01:01:36 something tragic's happening, or I could go drink beers at the bar with my friends. That's a very easy thing to decide. Yeah, and yet it wasn't easy for you. You are looking for reasons why he made, like it's like, I don't know, this makes no sense to me and I feel wrong, but I guess I'll hear him out because it's easier for me to give him

Starting point is 01:01:55 the benefit of the doubt than, you know, you liked him and I get it, you don't wanna break up with him, but that's how you protect yourself. Protecting yourself is to give people the opportunity to show you who they are. You can choose to trust early in a relationship, but when they start showing you who they are,

Starting point is 01:02:11 you gotta follow up on that. You gotta ask questions. You have to be willing to meet someone, get excited about them, and then sadly be disappointed about them. But that's better in six to 12 months than three to five years. Totally.

Starting point is 01:02:24 What if you had moved out for this guy? You probably wouldn't know it because he had other girlfriends and that would have been kind of hard on him. But you get what I'm saying. And it seems like you understand all this, but someone in your position, when something like this happens to them, it's very easy to victimize yourself and be like,

Starting point is 01:02:42 I don't even know how I'm gonna move forward. I can't trust anyone anymore. I can't believe someone lied to me. I was duped, I was conned. You kinda conned yourself, if I'm being honest. You know, I get it, he was charismatic and funny. There's plenty of charismatic people out there. Beware of the charismatic people.

Starting point is 01:02:58 Like, you know, charismatic people are, you know, they're charismatic. And so they are attractive to, I guess, a lot of people, right, but you need lot of people, right? But you need to find substance, right? Because if you're looking for a fun weekend, you know, with fun people, sounds like the perfect guy. He's fun.

Starting point is 01:03:13 He's funny. He's charismatic. He'll introduce you to some cool people. You'll have a good time. You'll see a good show. Great. Looking for a long-term partner, someone who's your equal, who's like, understands the effort and energy you've put into yourself and your career. He was clearly not this guy. No. And his

Starting point is 01:03:30 job kind of told you that, right? Like you're putting so much effort and energy into yourself. You need to meet someone. They don't have to be a lawyer. They don't even have to be rich. They just have to be passionate about what they do. They have to prioritize themselves in their career. They have to be willing to demonstrate and talk about them setting a goal and going after said goal. And maybe, I don't know, maybe this was, but this doesn't sound like him.

Starting point is 01:03:55 His goal was to hang out with fun and exciting people and he was willing to do whatever he had to do to do that and sell shirts. And then he tried to glorify it by making it sound like he was so busy because he wanted to feel like his job was as important as what you were doing. And he oversold it.

Starting point is 01:04:13 Totally, yeah, it was essentially that. It's, I mean, it kind of also, you don't wanna also judge people and be like, okay, well, we're in a relationship and I'm better. I mean, when you're in the relationship, you don't wanna necessarily say that to someone. They don't wanna say it and I get what you're saying, but the reality is, you do, you should.

Starting point is 01:04:32 It's okay to judge people, to yourself at least. We do it all the time. People want, and again, it's less about judging people. It's just like, you deserve someone who is at your level and he's not, this guy is not at your level. Because you're thinking of long term. You were able to, I guess, dumb yourself down to his level when you wanted to have a good time

Starting point is 01:04:53 and have an exciting life, and he was able to provide that. And you were willing to ignore your long term needs as a human being and what you needed from your partner. Again, I wanna emphasize this less about him selling T-shirts and more about the fact that like, this wasn't a very ambitious person, it sounds like. You didn't have a lot of long-term goals. 30 years old, you should be wanting to do more

Starting point is 01:05:17 with your life. Yeah, and you do, and you are doing that. And so when you get out of the whole, you're still young, so it makes a lot of sense, but eventually life will slow down. You'll get even more busy in your career, and you'll give less shits, because you all have already done it,

Starting point is 01:05:33 about traveling with a band. Because you'll be like, I did that once, it was kind of fun, but honestly, they're just normal people, and they're honestly kind of weird too, and it's not as cool as it sounded when I was younger. And he'll still be doing that lame shit, you know? And if you were in a relationship with this guy,

Starting point is 01:05:47 it would just like, you would get a bigger and bigger ick by the guy who's still selling T-shirts into his 40s just so he can hang out with a band that's not as cool as they were 10 years ago. Yeah, I guess it's like, it spun at like 22, but I was kind of getting sick of it. When I went out, it really wasn't for me, it wasn't that cool, and I was like, kind of tired of it.

Starting point is 01:06:05 Kind of, I was ready to kind of settle down and move. And that's kind of where I was headed. So yeah, that's totally kind of where it probably branched off that where the breakup initially happened is I was ready to start moving in, making steps, getting married. And he wants to go drink at the bar, go screaming at the bar with his friends and go get drunk every night. He also wants a girl who thinks what he does is so fucking cool for his ego

Starting point is 01:06:29 Yeah, well because what he does actually when you break it down isn't and he knows that I bet when you met him You thought he was so fucking cool And you made him feel that way and you gassed him up and you looked at him with these puppy dog eyes And the more you got to know him your're more you're like, I don't know, am I dating a loser? I don't know. It's funny, that's how the other girl, because now like we've talked and we've become friends and she said the same thing like it's like oh like I'm gonna visit you in your city like all of that. We were both kind of like that. It was kind of you're sold this like rock star lifestyle and then

Starting point is 01:07:02 you take it back and he wasn't actually the rock star he was selling t-shirts for them. But if I were you I would want you to have a little more frustration with yourself and less frustration with him. I do feel that because I do feel like looking back I hate that I was so in love that I ignored it because I shouldn't have and I should have just listened to the girl more. What were you so in love with out of curiosity? I mean, the whole time he did when we were together, he treated me well. We would go and he was my best friend. It was very much a best friend relationship and it was

Starting point is 01:07:38 nice times together and he was very caring to me. We got along very well. It was very much someone that I hadn't connected with like that before. So there was good times to be fair. Okay. That's valid. My point still stands, you know, someone could be nice, easy to talk to, but you still have to pay attention to the red flags.

Starting point is 01:07:59 Totally. And I think that's one of my issues that I wanted it so badly that I ignored it. Cause I wanted it to work out. Yeah. So there's a lot to learn here. I look back on my breakup when I was 28, was the person I got engaged to at then, and certainly was devastated when we broke up and it was hard to get over. About six months after that, I quickly thought this was the best thing that's ever happened

Starting point is 01:08:22 to me without being cliché, because I learned a lot about myself. I reflected about myself. I finally looked in the mirror and kind of acted like, what role did I play in this, so to speak, right? What could I learn from this, you know? And I really much, I very much changed my approach to dating, you know? And so I think there's a lot to learn here for you, right?

Starting point is 01:08:40 And, you know. Absolutely. I don't think you need closure from him. I mean, you got plenty of closure, hopefully on this conversation, but I do think there's plenty to learn from here. And going forward, you're a lot more armed, hopefully when you go out there and date,

Starting point is 01:08:55 because again, you know, there's people do lie, people do shitty things, but they usually show you and they usually tell you somehow, you just have to be willing to pay attention and listen and not want to force something that, you know, like it's like, yeah, they're nice, but, you know, and pay attention to the but. Yeah.

Starting point is 01:09:14 And I think that it's also with long distance, it's easier for people to hide it cause they only need to do it in person for so long. So it was, it allowed him to maybe keep up the facade longer than if we were in person all the time. For sure. Because it would be two weeks at a time that he could just ignore one of us

Starting point is 01:09:32 and then go for the other. So it was, I guess, easier to hide the red flags longer not having to see me in person all the time. A little bit, but like I said, this girl a year ago reached out to you and said, I'm in a relationship with this guy? Three months before we broke up. Oh, okay.

Starting point is 01:09:46 Yeah. So it wasn't that long. It was only April and we broke up in August. But you still completely ignored her. Yeah. All right. Well, hopefully this was helpful. It was super helpful. And I mean, it feels better and I feel like I don't need to continue to like message or try to reach out or do anything like that because of truly what could you say? Yeah truly. You're allowed to be sad. That's a normal response to something that obviously was disappointing and I'm sure on some levels traumatic for you to find out. But the best thing you could do going forward is to very much control your thoughts. When you have

Starting point is 01:10:22 those thoughts and feelings of sadness, when you find yourself missing memories of him and glorifying him in your mind, you have to actively tell yourself to stop it. And then you have to actively remind yourself of the shitty things he did. You have to ask yourself, you know, that's like you really do.

Starting point is 01:10:39 You have to kind of have these conversations with yourself because it's your default is to go down that memory lane and to glorify the relationship. This is what we all do and so you kind of have to have to program yourself through just kind of these conscious conversations. You just be like, hey stop it. He did this to me. He did this. I should have listened. I had all the signs. All the conversations you're having with yourself right now are keeping you stuck. You're asking yourself questions that you actually know the answers to, but you're not willing to answer them.

Starting point is 01:11:08 These are all the things that make you wonder why this happened or makes you think that you need to get ahold of them because people shouldn't ghost and I need to have one more last conversation with them. No, you don't need to waste 30 more hours for him to say, God only knows what. This is not someone who ever respected you

Starting point is 01:11:26 or deserved your time of attention, he wasn't your equal, he did you a favor, and now it's time to actually see it for what it is, accept it, learn from it, and move forward. Totally, yeah, there's no going back, so there's no point. All right, well, now just, it's less about the actual, to me it's more about not actual going back, it's about changing your perspective going forward.

Starting point is 01:11:48 I want, in the next couple days, when you get these results, hopefully you get good news, but I want it to be about the result. I don't want a moment during that day of you waking up being like, I wish I was sharing it with someone, I wish, and reminiscing your mind, how you wish you could have called him to tell him you passed.

Starting point is 01:12:05 No, fuck this guy. You know? Like, I don't, you know. That's how I wanna feel. Yeah. That's how you should feel. Yeah, especially it's like, as much as everything in this situation sucked,

Starting point is 01:12:15 I wouldn't have wrote the bar if not. So that is something that I could celebrate and take from this relationship, is that I have a huge career milestone now coming from this. Yeah, absolutely. And you can share it with probably a lot of other people you can call, you know, family, friends, whatever, yourself. You know, you did this, you know, you don't really need to share it with anyone else. I mean, I hope you do, but you don't need to. I will, but yes, exactly. It's for myself, mainly. It's for me to move. It's for me to do better.

Starting point is 01:12:40 It's for me to advance my career. And he was just like something on the side that would have been there. And you know, you found on this side that would have been there. And you know, he found a girlfriend out of it. Yeah, totally. Now, if you do continue to talk with this girl, do not talk about him. One of you two probably will, at least at first, keep the other person in your life

Starting point is 01:12:57 to give yourself the green light to complain about him, talk about him. Listen, do what you need to do to get over him, but just remember, anytime you talk about him or think about him, is energy you are giving him that he's not asking for. It's energy you could be putting into something else, someone else, you know. So just remember that when you talk to her, don't talk about him. I'm gonna give her that advice as well, because that's something good for both of us. Yeah, truly. Yeah, and I just think a lot of times in these

Starting point is 01:13:23 situations early on, it's, you it's you guys obviously understand each other, you have a common gripe. It's just very easy for you guys to get on the phone and talk about him, even if you're talking shit. It's not productive. Yeah, it just pushes us back really. Yeah, okay. Cool.

Starting point is 01:13:38 All right, well take care. Thank you so much. All right, good luck. This was very helpful. Let us know if you passed or not, okay? I will, hopefully the next two days, it's like this week, so I've been waiting since July. So it's taken long enough.

Starting point is 01:13:50 How do you feel? You feel confident about it? I walked out thinking I passed, and I taught myself, because I wrote the Canadian bar, and I taught myself the US bar by myself. So I feel good about it, as good as I could hopefully feel.

Starting point is 01:14:01 So best case scenario, I pass and never have to look at it again. Well, hopefully that's the case. And if not, you'll do it again and you will certainly eventually pass. Totally. That's just another test over and over again. Yeah, there you go. All right. Well, good luck with everything. Keep investing yourself. Start looking at dating your equals because you definitely weren't. You're not the 22 year old girl anymore who gets excited about like shiny things. Yeah. And musicians and all of that. It's not that fun. It's like, you saw how the sausage just made it.

Starting point is 01:14:26 It's not as cool as it seems. Truly, and you know, listen, I don't know. Listen, if you meet a professional athlete or another entertainer, buyer beware. Just know that is a lifestyle that is a breeding ground for this type of behavior. I'm not saying that everyone in this space does shit like that, but you know,

Starting point is 01:14:43 if you are gonna date an athlete or a musician, better be prepared to ask a lot of tough questions and know that these guys are used to facing these types of questions. And when things smell off, they almost certainly are. And they're more likely cheating than a different type of professional would be. Sure. I mean, anyone can cheat in any profession. Just like, just know that this space, you know, gives these people a ton of

Starting point is 01:15:03 opportunities to do that. So again, just a ton of opportunities to do that. So again, just don't be afraid to question people. That's not you being whatever you think it might be. Yeah, it's not being judgmental or rude or anything like that. It's just asking questions together. Someone asked me a long time ago on my questions like on Instagram, what's the difference between

Starting point is 01:15:23 trusting your gut and, you know, being crazy or paranoid, you know, trusting your gut is following up on situations that like they present to you. Things come your way, things show up at your front door and you're just asking follow-up questions for things that don't make sense. Being crazy is looking for things to be mad about, you know? To making things up in your head when they're actually not doing something. But when they do something that seems a little bit off, it's not crazy to check in, ever.

Starting point is 01:15:53 Yeah, and that's maybe something why I didn't look into this April situation more, because I didn't trust my gut. I just thought, well, it's crazy he said this, he said that, I should believe my boyfriend, and obviously I should have trusted my gut there. Yeah,, well, it's crazy. He said this. He said that I should believe my boyfriend and obviously I should have trusted my gut there. Yeah. I mean, it was kind of crazy that you ignored her. Yeah.

Starting point is 01:16:11 I mean, think about it. Like what was she would have had to literally be crazy. Yeah. Or he's lying. And this is also somebody claimed to also be friends with. So it's like, are you your friends with a crazy person? I mean, if I were him, if he was telling the truth, wouldn't he be really mad at her? He would have moved differently.

Starting point is 01:16:27 And when you get in these situations, ask yourself, what would I have done? What would I have done if someone reached out to my boyfriend and said, I'm in a relationship with him and made up some crazy rumor, how would have I moved? What would I have done to make sure, knowing that you did nothing wrong, that this person on the other end was

Starting point is 01:16:45 just making up a story out of nowhere, what would you have done? I'm guessing you wouldn't have done what he did. I would have called that person, I would have yelled at them, I would have freaked out, I would have made it known they're a liar. And then I would have made sure those two interacted and be like, no, tell them the fucking truth, do it. Not like, did he do that? No, that's a good point.

Starting point is 01:17:03 He had just ghosted her and she just kind of went away because she was nervous exactly she's hoping she'd move on of course she's young yeah you know he's he all he's doing is just recycling you know again he's looking for young girls to impress yeah and get validation for his t-shirt sales. So again, lesson learned. You don't want to judge a book by its cover. It has nothing to do necessarily with, you know, there's exceptions to every rule. Doesn't mean like every, I mean, obviously I'm married to someone a lot younger than me, you know?

Starting point is 01:17:34 But like, again, how do they operate? How do they move? It is fair to ask follow up questions because if people aren't hiding shit, they don't have a problem with you checking in. When they're hiding shit they get defensive they get like why are you asking me this shit? It's just like I don't know like people are happy to explain what you have nothing to worry about. Yeah I guess that he did like explain for months like I would call in the morning be like I'm having anxiety over this and be like well it was just one kiss like please

Starting point is 01:18:01 don't freak out like just groveling about it so. That's not explaining that's downplaying and then asking you to ignore. But that's not explaining, that's downplaying and then asking you to ignore your instincts, that's what he did. Please don't freak out, it was nothing, just trust me. That's not explaining it, that's not going out of his way. That's not what you would have done. That's dismissing and hoping, and that's not it.

Starting point is 01:18:19 Hoping it goes away, putting your head in the sand. Yeah, so next time, stuff like this happens, what would you do? Again, all you have to do is be willing to be disappointed. That's it. That's your shield. Because that's what got you into this place in the first place.

Starting point is 01:18:35 You were unwilling to hear the truth because you just wanted everything to be fine. You wanted him to be Mr. Perfect, even though you already knew he wasn't. He was selling T-shirts for crying out loud It's true. All right. Well good luck out there. Let us know if you've just the bar and hopefully this was helpful Thank you so much. This was absolutely helpful. All right. We'll take care. Thank you. All right. Bye. Bye. Nice to meet you You too. Bye. Bye Helix sleep what more can we say about the greatest mattress ever?

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Starting point is 01:22:28 to break up with him 10 times. Isn't this good news? So it is good news. It was just really shocking and out of the blue. I'm just calling to ask about my boyfriend breaking up with me after I tried to break up with him 10 times. Isn't this good news? So it is good news. It was just really shocking and out of nowhere. You're upset about it now because he broke up with you?

Starting point is 01:22:54 Well, so I tried to break up with him a bunch of times because he treated me horribly. But then for the three weeks between, he was super awesome. And then out of nowhere, like five days before our vacation, and the day after he told me to get early bird check-in, he broke up with me after work one day and just said he didn't like me anymore. Okay, well I'm sorry. What are you struggling most with about this? Probably just that it was just like he was begging me

Starting point is 01:23:19 to stay with him and not leave him. And then suddenly it wasn't like we're fighting or anything like that. It was like, I just don't like you as much as you like me. Well, I mean, it sounds like your ego is very bruised right now. Yes. And I knew you were going to say that. Okay. Well, at least you knew, you know, there's that. I mean, speaking of what you think I was going to say, like, what do you think I'm going to say? I think you were going to say you should have been broken up anyway. And you already tried to

Starting point is 01:23:44 break up with him. So this just makes it easier. He's not begging for you back this time. Yeah. Well, there's definitely some truth there I mean that being said like what are you struggling with the most like what's driving you nuts? Why are you having a hard time getting to the place where you know, you need to be and you know, I'm gonna say it I guess it's just kind of getting fucked over like we had never gone, we'd been dating over two and a half years. We'd never gone on a vacation together at all. And then we had this trip plan to a place I've always wanted to go really bad. And we didn't even plan it that long ago. So it's not like sticking it out because it's been planned for five months. It's just crazy that right before we were about to leave and actually we had a smaller vacation plan the next day.

Starting point is 01:24:25 This is like a side note, but this just really pisses me off. He makes way more money than me. And I had it all on my Airbnb and all of that. And he didn't even offer to refund even though it was past the cancellation date. And so it's like, I don't really care about the money or anything. Just everything was like a big fuck you All right. Well, I can tell you that you're not really mad at him You're mad at yourself. Tell me all the other times you say you're gonna break up with them What was it the bad behavior that he was demonstrating where you were like, I don't deserve to be treated this way

Starting point is 01:25:00 He basically was just like super selfish and it was even weirder because he would say, I'm so selfish. I'm a weak man. Like I'm a bad man. And I'd be like, okay, so what are you going to do about it? And he would just be like, I'm going to change. And I was like, okay, I guess we'll just try this out. And I kept telling him every time, which is my fault. Okay, I'm not going to do this again.

Starting point is 01:25:21 And then I just kept on doing it. But for example, like this is like a really severe example, but I had someone in the hospital and my family for like nine months and we'd already been together for like a year and a half at this point and he would literally get pissed off that I would want to stay the night at the hospital all the time and we don't live together or anything. And he would just be like, this is just too much for me. And I was like, what do you mean? It's too, like I still hung out with him all the time and everything.

Starting point is 01:25:47 So it was just a bunch of big selfish things and little selfish things also. Well, like I said, I think deep down you're frustrated because you're mad at yourself because you know better, you know, and you knew then, you tried to break up with them. But instead of following through with knowing that

Starting point is 01:26:05 like being a guy who honestly like sucks and even admits to himself that he's weak. It's like you decided in that moment to take it as a pity party on his part. So you could be like, oh, you're being too hard on yourself and then you could be like the supportive girlfriend. In reality, he was just being honest with you, you know?

Starting point is 01:26:24 Right. And now that he's broken up with you, in the manner in which he broke up with you and the timing that he broke up with you, there's this couple extra of little like fuck you's look, you know, little kind of jabs on the side. And your ego is just like, fuck man, I wouldn't feel like I did now. Like it's like you're mad at yourself

Starting point is 01:26:42 for allowing him to steal your opportunity to feel empowered by standing up for yourself when you try to stand up for yourself and say, I'm not going to let someone treat me this way. Fuck you. You're out. Instead, you chose to believe something you knew deep down you shouldn't believe and he played you for a fool. And you're kind of mad at it, you know, honestly I didn't know you were gonna say that I Believe you though. That's true. You didn't think I was gonna say that

Starting point is 01:27:12 I just I thought of all the things you would possibly say cuz I listened to all of these and that one didn't come to My head. Oh, yeah. All right. Well, I'm glad I still got it, you know, but yes, that's I mean deep down That's what's going on. It sounds like to me Well, the worst thing to me I still even am like thinking about it at all is because it wasn't like oh We're fighting or anything like that It was like I've never even said I love you to him in over two and a half years and he's literally like just out of Nowhere you like me way more than I like you. Okay, but this is like Your this is all your ego talking.

Starting point is 01:27:45 So like what you need to do, it's like you can recognize that, you've listened to this show, like, oh, Nick's gonna tell me it's my ego. But like it is, right? And now you need to do something about your ego, because right now, everything you've shared with me in this call tells me that you very much

Starting point is 01:28:02 are allowing your ego to drive your dating and relationship decisions. And that's never a recipe for success. You are basing your decisions on who you should invest your time and energy with based off your ego, not your heart. You're not asking yourself, what makes me happy? What makes me feel good? Am I dating someone who makes me a priority,

Starting point is 01:28:25 who treats me a certain way, who treats the people I love a certain way? Do I feel lucky to have them in my life? It didn't sound like he did much of any of that, right? He played some games, he sounded like a mess, he did give you an opportunity to feel like you could fix him. You know, he made you feel bad for him, type of thing.

Starting point is 01:28:46 But every step of the way, your ego was like, hey, we could do this, we could do that, this sounds off, but there's an opportunity here for us to feel special in the long run. And every step of the way, you chose that path. And so now, you can't do anything about him, but you have to get better at, you know, controlling your ego, you know?

Starting point is 01:29:08 Because some of those things that you're caring about now, who gives a fuck? That's true, I guess I shouldn't care about it, but I'm just, well the other thing is, I was pretty much fine, it sounds weird, but I sent that email like a week ago, and since then I've been fine, except for we're both in the same career and like our town isn't small

Starting point is 01:29:27 at all or city but a career you're gonna see each other all the time and so I went to an event for this career and he was there and then I was miserable again for like two days and there's literally, I know there's always a way to avoid it but like in this situation there's really not a way to just never see him again. So what, who cares?

Starting point is 01:29:46 You need, well, right now it doesn't feel that way because you are right now, it sounds like kind of a victim to your ego, right? All this man had to say, despite telling you how much he loves you throughout your relationship, and you never reciprocating that, all he had to do is say something superficial. You have no idea whether he meant it or not.

Starting point is 01:30:05 He just said it and you chose to take it as truth and that is you like me way more than I like you. With such, it's kind of just a mean, dirty thing to say. And he said, he sold it, he pitched it, he delivered it. You took it as fact and now your ego is just losing its fucking mind because you're just like, did I, am I? Is that what he really thinks? Can I, you know? And it's just like, did I, am I, is that what he really thinks?

Starting point is 01:30:26 And it's just like, who gives a fuck? Who gives a fuck whether he actually thinks you let, you know, it's a great opportunity to show him that you don't give a fuck. Showing up to these places where you know he'll be and treat him like someone you went to high school with 20 years ago and you kind of remember their name and you don't want to be rude, so you go and say say hi you give them the casual like hello and you don't like really

Starting point is 01:30:47 care and you you don't change your behavior and yada yada yada you don't let your ego get the best of you and worry about if they're dating someone else and how that makes you look and yada yada yada like the best way to show them that you actually don't give a fuck about him and you didn't like him more than you is to show them by that you'd like that actually don't give a fuck about him and you didn't like him more than you is to show them by that you like that you don't give a fuck to be indifferent around him to not care. You know, right. That's how you do it. The other thing is, I know this was just another ego thing, but it was just crazy.

Starting point is 01:31:17 I was trying to follow your advice to everyone else by saying like, oh, you don't need to go get your sweatshirt or whatever at their house. So, but I had actually a ton of stuff there. So just right after he initially said it, I was like, okay, I need to come get all my stuff right now so that this isn't dragged out. And I got there probably 20 minutes after him and it was all sitting out in the driveway. So he watched me through the window while I was loading it in my car. And I thought what you would do was be like, okay, I got my stuff, just never talk to him again. But of course I didn't follow through with that. So then I knocked on the door and was like, hey, like that was really weird that you just

Starting point is 01:31:55 watched me through the window loading my stuff. And that's when the whole conversation, because at first all he said is, I think we should break up. And I just didn't say a single word and got out of the car and left But then that's when all of this happened So I guess it is an ego thing because it's just it was all so rude. I couldn't believe it Yeah, I know but that's the thing It's just like there's a there's a time and a place to stand up for ourself

Starting point is 01:32:16 But like this guy's is playing fucking games with you. It's all he's doing You know, yeah And yeah and sometimes you have to be willing to shut your ego down and not convince yourself that you need to call him out and put him in his place and let him know what's up and blah. That's what he wanted. He wanted the reaction.

Starting point is 01:32:35 He wanted to know it bothered you. And that's where egos always fail us, especially in these situations, especially breakup situations. What we really want to do is to, and the thing that will fuck with these people the most is to not give, to immediate let them know that we're over it, that they don't impact us,

Starting point is 01:32:56 that no matter if they're nice or they're not nice, we're not affected by them anymore. They no longer have control or power over us. That is how we fuck with these people even more. And every step of the way, I mean, he barely does anything and he gets such a reaction out of you. Right. You take everything he says.

Starting point is 01:33:16 That's true, he did nothing, literally. You take everything he says is gospel and he's just saying shit just to say it, just to get a reaction. But what if he, I know what you're gonna say it doesn't matter but I'm just saying I literally feel like he was being serious like he wasn't he was like trying not to hurt my feelings like he was sobbing and saying stuff like I wish that I wouldn't make you sad blah blah blah even though he was saying

Starting point is 01:33:40 those like cat phrases that are like listen oh I really enjoyed our time together the only thing he ever said to you that I'm pretty sure was honest that even though he was saying those catch phrases that are like, oh, I really enjoyed our time together. The only thing he ever said to you that I'm pretty sure was honest, that he's a weak man. And instead of believing him, you pitied him. And then going forward after that, that was kind of his get out of jail free card, because he kind of always felt sorry for him.

Starting point is 01:34:01 Why did he cry and feel bad? Because he is weak. Because he didn't want to feel like the bad guy. I don't know. In one moment he says one thing and the other thing he does another. He's not consistent with his behavior. What sucks for you in addition to being a victim of your ego, I'm guessing, based off what you're telling me

Starting point is 01:34:18 that you love, I don't know, a little bit of drama. A little bit of excitement. A little bit of a mess. Because everything about your telling is, it's entertaining, you know what I'm saying? It keeps you invested, it's that toxic simulation I've talked about over the years. How old are you again, 28, 29?

Starting point is 01:34:35 28. 28, I know, you're still young, but you're probably too old to deal with this type of behavior, and you're certainly old enough to be able to suss out this type of behavior and you're old enough to know better and you're old enough to while we all get excited for drama even though we all love to tell people that we don't like the drama you like the drama it's fine we all do to a certain extent but you have to like just look yourself in the mirror and been like why do I keep investing in these people that only bring drama into

Starting point is 01:35:07 my life? And am I actually ready to meet someone who quite honestly, over time might be a little boring, but I'll feel secure. This is another point about that. So I don't know what you're going to say to this. So in like August, that was like a month before we broke up, I am a rover dog sitter and one of the men that brought a dog was really cool. And so the day we broke up, I got on hinge but with like a fake name and no pictures just because I was like, I just want to see who exists out there. And what do you know, the first person on there, I just didn't want anyone to see me on there like that day, you know, but the first person on there is him.

Starting point is 01:35:51 So I hurried up and put my pictures and changed it to my real name and liked him and he immediately messaged me. And the thing is, I know it sounds like I'm like pining over this other man. It's more the ego thing. But now, I actually like this other guy and I feel like that's bad if you just got out of that long of a relationship. Well, why do you think it's bad? I guess it doesn't matter how it looks,

Starting point is 01:36:16 but it just looks bad to hop straight, because I always used to tell people not to do that, to just be single. Who are you worried about looking bad to? Actually, like to just be single. Who are you worried about looking bad to? Actually, I guess just myself maybe. If that's the answer, then maybe your fear of looking bad really is maybe your gut trying to tell you something. Yeah.

Starting point is 01:36:36 You know, I think two things can be true at the same time. I think you can be genuinely interested in this guy, excited about this guy, flattered that he liked you back, interested in getting to know him better, that doesn't mean you're clearly affected by your ex. So to say that you don't care, you're over it and ready to move forward, you're obviously not, right? And I don't doubt that you're actually excited about this guy, but I think what your gut is telling you by this fear of looking bad is to know that maybe deep down while you are excited

Starting point is 01:37:07 about him, you're not ready. That you're the fear of, and maybe you're afraid of looking bad in front of him because you're going to go on a date and knowing that you shouldn't be talking about exes, kind of subconsciously project that maybe you're not over him. I don't know. That's definitely possible. Does it change anything that we've already hung out every day for three weeks? I mean, I don't know.

Starting point is 01:37:29 I feel like that's bad. It is what it is. I don't know, I'm not here to judge it. Why did we spend 20 minutes talking about some guy that is in your past when you've been hanging out every day with this new guy? That's why I'm like, I don't know, because whenever I sent that email, I was distraught. But then, like, ever so that event that I saw him at was Thursday. And aside from that,

Starting point is 01:37:58 since I sent that email, I don't know why, but I haven't been distraught at all besides just that one night and So now I'm kind of like am I just fine right now? Or am I gonna start feeling like how I was feeling you know? But when I sent that email again, I just don't even know well I mean, maybe you need to slow down a little why you hanging out this guy every day well just cuz he asks You can say no. I know but I'm like like, okay. You can play hard to get. I mean, are you? I guess. You've known this guy for how long?

Starting point is 01:38:28 Well, only for three weeks, talking to him, but I watched his dog in the middle of August. Listen, I just think sometimes early on, perception matters a little bit, right? And I'm not saying you should fake it or pretend to be someone you're not. And listen, none of us are as busy as we like to pretend. And it sounds like despite all the other things you have going on in your life,

Starting point is 01:38:49 that you have a few extra hours a day as a single woman. I mean, I'm assuming you don't have kids or. Yeah. So your responsibilities are light. So outside of whatever you do for work, you have some free time. And right now you're choosing to have that free time with him. But you're also kind of just painting this picture of like hyper available for him, you know?

Starting point is 01:39:11 Right. And like not like. Even though he's the one that has to hang out every day? Doesn't matter. No, he's also available, but like you're just always saying yes. Throw him for a little bit, and be like, I don't know, I got something going on.

Starting point is 01:39:23 You being too busy for him will not make him not like you. Right. Eventually you wanna give him time and attention, make him feel like a priority like anyone would wanna feel in a dating relationship, but you don't need to be hanging out with someone new every day.

Starting point is 01:39:40 You're not slow playing it. Now you're at risk of moving too fast, playing house, getting caught up in the moment Advancing the relationship faster than you actually should making it making each other feel like you've known each other for so long when in reality There's still a lot you need to learn about each other, right? Well also probably a week and a half ago we were gonna go to happy hour with the ex-boyfriend common friends and we were gonna go to happy hour with the ex boyfriend common friends and my friend showed up to lunch when i was with this guy and was like she was supposed to meet us though and she was like hey i'm really sorry but you can't come to happy hour anymore he's going like the ex and i was like okay that's crazy so obvious i was really mad. So I went back outside with the new guy and I lied because he was like,

Starting point is 01:40:25 why are you so pissed right now? And I was like, oh, she invited my ex, which that wasn't the lie. But then I was nervous. I didn't want him to be like, oh, you guys just broke up. So I was like, oh yeah, I broke up with him like a month ago. Cause I just looked bad. And so now I'm like, should I say something like that? That's not true.

Starting point is 01:40:43 And what's the truth? Where's the lie? He broke up with me and it was only like a week before he said that. I mean, I don't know. I think it's wrong that you lied. I think it's another example of just how obsessed you are with how you look to people.

Starting point is 01:40:59 You have the right to be upset in that moment. Your friend uninvited you. Your friend didn't even give you the opportunity to be like, I don't care. Right. If he cares, that's his problem. He cannot show up. You had the right to feel that and say that to your friend

Starting point is 01:41:15 and then you could have gone back to this new guy and been like, I'm super irritated. I don't know, me and my boyfriend, we broke up. You don't have to get into who broke up with who, but I don't really give a shit. Obviously I'm excited about you, but she really told me I can't come, because I don't know, I guess he has an issue with it.

Starting point is 01:41:30 You could have just said that. Yeah. There's nothing for you to be embarrassed about, but you're not even, you're so hyper sensitive about looking stupid that you will like come up with a story of how stupid you might look when honestly the truth doesn't make you look stupid at all. Okay, I guess that's true, I didn't think about that.

Starting point is 01:41:48 He looks stupid for making his friend, your mutual friend, uninvite you, because apparently, again, the weak man that he is can't handle your presence, which by the way, speaks to how much he guess still likes you or is affected by you. Honestly, like that's,, how you're so, you can't even see the obvious signs.

Starting point is 01:42:09 Your ego doesn't wanna see the opportunity where your ego can feel better. Like you can be like, oh wow, he's still bothered by me? Okay, I guess, like okay. And meanwhile, you have a guy that you're like into that you say, like that should have been such a validating feeling that it still rubbed him the wrong way. Right. I didn't think about that. I thought it was more like they were gonna be uncomfortable so they didn't want us

Starting point is 01:42:32 both to come but they didn't say that. So who's they? I mean why would they be uncomfortable? They're just other mutual friends. Why does he get the call? Why does he get to go? That's a good point. I don't know. I mean, how close are you with his friend? Well, the one that is my best friend that I was talking to, but the other ones are like our old coworkers. And like both of us, me and that guy worked together at the same place as these other people.

Starting point is 01:42:57 And then we both left to separate jobs. And so it's like, the other ones are like old coworkers, but then that one's my best friend your best friend uninvited you She didn't say it directly like uninvited. It was like hey, I'm really sorry But this guy invited him and so yeah like that and I was like, okay And then she started feeling really guilty about it and was like I'll just go with you But I don't want someone to be forced to hang out with me when they want to go to something else You know so she ended up going and then yeah, it was just we didn't talk about it since well

Starting point is 01:43:35 Talk about it. I think you really need to get over you you have an ego problem for sure great Well, at least listen these are gonna identify the problem and that's something you can control, that's for sure. How do you get over that kind of problem? You just got to be a little more honest with yourself. You have to like take a step back. I don't know, phone a friend, have a therapist, someone you trust, call in.

Starting point is 01:43:56 I mean, it's not sustainable to call here every time, but part of it is just like, again, kind of understanding the principles of like how our egos work or what drives us, what triggers us, or just people in general. You know, it's just all the things that you are saying and doing and how you've reacted are normal things. In fact, it's more common than the way people should act, right? And I've made all these mistakes that you're making now, but I got tired of making those mistakes and I just started, I don't know, just reflecting

Starting point is 01:44:25 a little bit more and applying the common sense I've learned over the years. There's a difference between me and you, right? I guess for argument's sake. It's not like my ego went away, right? It's still there and it still has the same toxic and intrusive thoughts that it had years ago similar to yours.

Starting point is 01:44:45 The difference is, is that when my ego pops up and waves its flag and wants attention from me, I feel the same feelings you feel. I feel that inadequacy or that fear or anxiety or what are people saying and worrying about and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Those all still happen for me. I can recognize that.

Starting point is 01:45:02 I can time out and I can say, Nick, wait, like, why do you... I can ask myself the questions I'm asking you. Why do I care? What am I really upset about? Wait a second. Why is he so bothered by I'm there? Would you have gone knowing he was there? Yeah, because I would have just sat on the other side. I would rather go and be on the other side of the table, like not sitting next to him and hang out, than be not invited in the mall, hang out without me. Okay. I would love you to just go because you don't give a fuck.

Starting point is 01:45:33 But you have to fake it till you make it, right? And so I guess, again, back to my point, it's just like the ego's never gonna go away. The only thing that hopefully happens for you is you just get better at slowing down a little bit, checking in with yourself, asking yourself these questions I'm asking you, and apply the common sense you've learned over the years to say, well yeah I feel this way, but why do I feel this way? Is it possible for me to feel another way? Should I look at this

Starting point is 01:46:02 situation differently? The maturity I've demonstrated in my life and honestly what this show ultimately is all about is just changing your perspective on a situation. That's all I do. Anyone who calls me with a problem, I'm not really giving them necessarily advice or what to do. I certainly don't diagnose people.

Starting point is 01:46:21 I'm not a therapist. I'm just suggesting an alternative point of view and one that doesn't involve validating your ego, right? Or one that doesn't include feeling sorry for yourself and living in your pity party. I'm just offering alternative ideas and approaches to view a situation a little more honestly without involving your ego. And you can learn that on your own. That's what I'm honestly hoping the people listening to this show learn and kind of apply themselves.

Starting point is 01:46:51 That's all I'm doing. I didn't eliminate my ego. I didn't get rid of it. It's not as if these same insecurities and thoughts and feelings that you have right now, they still show up. I just address them differently than you do now. I can check myself quicker than you do now. I can check myself quicker than you do now.

Starting point is 01:47:05 I can do it on my own. And when I can't do it on my own, I have a therapist or a friend. Find someone who can give you the tough love that I'm giving you now. It's like, if you can't do it on your own, find people who are capable of being honest with you that have a little bit more emotional maturity

Starting point is 01:47:21 than maybe you have right now or other people or your other friends. It's never gonna go away. It's just good at, you know, you just have to teach yourself how to control it better. I know. Well now I know that you're telling me. Yeah, so give yourself a little bit of grace but now you just have to be willing to learn from it and if, you know, if we get off this phone call and then you just kind of go about your life, then obviously you don't care. It doesn't bother you that much. If you don't do anything about this and choose to learn,

Starting point is 01:47:51 then that will tell you that ultimately you just kind of love the drama. And part of, and I'm not saying that's the case, but if you don't actually do the work and actually change and check in with yourself and try to shake your ego, even like, and it'll take time to get good at it, but you have to make an attempt, then all this call is, is you continuing the drama.

Starting point is 01:48:12 Right. But hopefully that's not what it is. Hopefully you're actually tired of feeling this way. Hopefully you're actually kind of exhausted and wish that, and hopefully you can recognize that you shouldn't feel this way based off of how this guy treated you. And you're tired of letting a guy like him make you feel the way that you feel now.

Starting point is 01:48:32 And hopefully that you're willing to learn and apply what we've talked about. Okay, I know you're gonna say it doesn't matter, but just maybe you will know the answer to this because no one else does. Is this like a common thing that randomly the two weeks before we broke up, he was just super like overly nice?

Starting point is 01:48:53 Like it was like unreasonable and weird how nice he was being. Is that like a normal thing that someone like feels bad they're about to break up with you? So they're like overly nice? What about this guy's behavior has been normal? That's true. I mean, I don't know.

Starting point is 01:49:07 I don't know your answer. Yeah, and I don't have an answer. Sure, I mean, people do weird things all the time. I mean, you're making too much about a temporary moment in your relationship. What really matters is how this guy was throughout your relationship, which is most of the time he wasn't that nice.

Starting point is 01:49:23 I don't know, maybe he tried out being a good guy and kind of hated it. Yeah. You know? I don't know. I think so because I said he wasn't allowed to watch football six days a week. So I think that that was a big problem. You're wasting again energy on something that, you know, it's not that it doesn't matter. It's just, well, I mean, it doesn't matter. That is the answer. I know.

Starting point is 01:49:44 But the point is you're wasting all this energy trying to like figure out that it doesn't matter, it's just, well, I mean, it doesn't matter. That is the answer. You know? But the point is, you're wasting all this energy trying to figure out something that doesn't matter. And what matters is you've asked a lot of people and no one has an answer for you and you're not willing to accept that. That's your problem. Right. I mean, what were you hoping I was gonna come up with?

Starting point is 01:49:59 I don't know. I think I was just, cause in my head it was just that he felt bad that he was gonna break up with me. So I was just wondering if you were gonna confirm that or not. Maybe, but what does that change? I guess nothing. And then so why are you wasting your energy,

Starting point is 01:50:13 and a lot of it I might add, on things that ultimately wouldn't change how you feel? I guess there's no reason, I guess cause it's an ego hit. We're gonna get off the phone and I'll move on. And you eventually you're gonna have to ask yourself, is this fun because I like the drama or am I just exhausted wasting my energy on these types of people and on these types of situations?

Starting point is 01:50:37 Hopefully saying exhausted. Hopefully, but the answer will be in your actions. So what actions am I supposed to do right now? Just get over it? As far as him, I would, yes, I would stop investing a lot of your mental energy trying to figure him out. That would be step one. And when you do find yourself in your head

Starting point is 01:50:56 asking yourself these questions, because that's normal, you just have to say, stop it. I was gonna say your thing works. I thought it was crazy when you were saying it. I was like, that is not real. I forgot exactly how you said it, but you said, like when you catch yourself thinking about something over and over,

Starting point is 01:51:14 just literally telling yourself to stop. And I always thought you were crazy. Like that's not a thing, but that actually works. Yeah, like why can't, we talk to ourselves all the time. Why can't you tell yourself to do something? Why can't you just, right now, I'm thinking about Justin dressed as a vampire yesterday and now I'm thinking about what I'm gonna have for lunch. Look, I just changed what I was thinking about, you know?

Starting point is 01:51:37 It's not that hard. Like we're so good at convincing ourselves that we have to obsess over these things. Like we're so good at giving ourselves permission to do what we want, it's ridiculous. And that's all that is. Because we like to obsess over things. We love to ruminate. We love to think about this stuff. And we just need to give ourselves more credit.

Starting point is 01:51:58 But yeah, I mean, thank you for saying that and acknowledging that. But yeah, you can do that. The difference between, it's like when I say that, you're taking it as you can't control thoughts entering into your mind, and that's true, you can't. Like sometimes things just pop up. Why did I just think that? Holy shit, that was weird. The difference is how long are you gonna,

Starting point is 01:52:14 how much energy and how much time are you gonna let yourself ruminate and sit on this thing that popped in your head, or are you gonna let it go? And that's the thing you can control. And then what do you do going forward as far as this guy? I don't know, ask yourself, why am I spending so much time with this guy?

Starting point is 01:52:30 Is it because I really like him, or is he keeping me preoccupied, is he distracting me? Do I really see a future with this guy? If so, is it healthiest for us to stay hanging out every day? Maybe I should just say no to him and see how he reacts to that. Maybe I can learn something about this guy by changing how often we're hanging out

Starting point is 01:52:48 and if it disappoints him, see how he handles disappointment. Is he capable of having a mature conversation that goes something like, hey, honestly, I really like you and I've been kinda excited about you, but like, to be totally honest with you, I just got out of a relationship that you know about

Starting point is 01:53:03 and like, I'm really, I moved on from that, but because I honest with you, I just got out of a relationship that you know about and I'm moved on from that. But because I really like you, I kind of want to slow down just a tad. And I don't mean stop talking, but maybe we don't have to hang out seven days a week. Or maybe you don't even have to have that conversation. Maybe you can just start saying, no, hey, I'm kind of busy. And then if he does check in with you and be like, hey, I'm just kind of noticing you're more busy, just be like, well, to be honest, I really like you, I want you to know that.

Starting point is 01:53:27 I just don't want to deprioritize all the other things I have going on in my life, like my work, like my friends, like my family, and I just want to have a healthy balance in my life. But just know, I really like you, and that's mature, and that's a healthy conversation. And he should listen to that, hear you out, he can be like, oh, okay, well, yeah, that makes sense.

Starting point is 01:53:46 But like, yeah, I really like you too and I look forward to seeing you tomorrow or whenever it is. So do you say that out of nowhere or just if he asks why I'm not hanging out as much? You can either address it right away and just tell him or change your behavior and see if he asks you. Okay. Yeah, I don't know if there's necessarily a wrong way.

Starting point is 01:54:05 And then, yeah, kind of stop lying. I don't know, don't lie about stupid shit. As far as- I swear I don't usually lie. I'm a horrible liar usually. I just got nervous. I mean, listen, I don't know if you need to tell him, but you could.

Starting point is 01:54:21 I don't think you have to make it such a big deal. You would just go something like this. Hey, something, can I tell you something kind of weird? I honestly like, this is so stupid, but like technically I lied to you, because technically, well not even technically, my ex broke up with me last. And don't say you tried to break up with him, you know?

Starting point is 01:54:36 You did break up with him. I broke up with him several times, but I just honestly never followed through with a breakup, because he always apologized, and he always made a bunch of excuses, so I always like took him back. And honestly, my ego was just a little bruised by him ending it.

Starting point is 01:54:49 I don't know why I lied about it. It's been bothering me. I like you. I don't want to lie about stupid shit. It's not who I am. And honestly, he shouldn't make that big of a deal. Yeah, he probably will just say, okay. You know, listen, you just met this guy.

Starting point is 01:55:06 So slow down, get to know him. You know nothing about this guy. Still, I don't care that you hung out every day. There is so much about this guy you don't know. You're changing as a human being, he's changing as a human being, so like keep getting to know him. Don't make promises about your future with him. Don't talk about the future.

Starting point is 01:55:26 Don't make plans beyond, you know, next week with him. Just be like, yeah, I really like you today. And I'm really, I really, I am really enjoying to getting to know you. And I really, I just hope we continue on this path. That's, that's, that's the most you can promise someone. Certainly. Okay. Get it together.

Starting point is 01:55:45 All right. control your ego. You can do it. You're just, you haven't done it yet. You've chosen not to do it. Like you're there, you kind of understand the rules. You gotta follow through this time. It's crazy because I hear you say that to people all the time and for some reason,

Starting point is 01:56:01 I just literally did not think you were gonna say that to me. Well, I mean, listen, because we all think we're different and special and unique and when, you know, listen, I am not as good at giving advice to myself when I am emotionally triggered or fucked up or or deregulated, you know, type of thing. That's why I have a therapist. That's why I have a support system, you know. I am not emotionally invested in your life, and then I can see it very clearly. You are emotionally invested in your life,

Starting point is 01:56:30 you are invested in the outcomes, you know, your ego's involved, so yeah, listen, it's normal that way. Your biggest thing, again, is to, when these feelings pop up, is to recognize what it is and not give in to the behaviors and feelings that you're feeling and control those slots and feelings to the best of your ability.

Starting point is 01:56:53 You're just recognizing it and then doing nothing about it. You're just like, well, my situation is different and you're more interested in these random bullshit useless questions you come up with of what does it mean? Sounds like you bought my book. I didn't but I need to. Okay, well, no, it's fine. You were just kinda, a lot of what I talk about

Starting point is 01:57:14 on the show is in the book, but there's a whole chapter on when to ask yourself why versus when to ask yourself what, after a breakup, you gotta remove the why word out of your vocabulary. Why doesn't matter, it just happened. Why, who gives a fuck, you gotta remove the Y word out of your vocabulary. Y doesn't matter, it just happened. Y, who gives a fuck? It did. What happened is more important.

Starting point is 01:57:30 He treated me a certain way. He was inconsistent. He was a weak person. What is very important right now for you? Y, I don't care. That's a good point. You can ask yourself, Y, about this new guy, why do I feel the way I do? You know? Why am I spending so much time with him? Is it healthy to do so? You know? Am I making healthy choices when it comes to

Starting point is 01:57:53 this new guy? Why am I doing it? That's a good time to ask yourself why. You gave me some things to think about because you I didn't think that there would be anything new but you've said what other people haven't said and I thought that I already knew what you were going to say but I guess I didn't. Well, good. It's good to know I'm not a broken record yet. Check out the book, Don't Text Your Ex Happy Birthday and I'm guessing there's a lot of things in there. There's a whole chapter on getting over people.

Starting point is 01:58:20 There's a whole chapter on dating and then this whole like why versus what. I mean this whole book again is just about like changing your perspective on your dating life and I think ultimately your biggest problem is you are a victim of your perspective when you're emotionally triggered. Okay well I'll go order right now. In the meantime you kind of already know a lot of the rules so speak. Now you have to apply them. Okay, I will, I think I know what to do. Just the not ruminating on things and stop asking why. And- I think maybe you need to ask yourself

Starting point is 01:58:53 if you are a little too into the drama, then you'd like to acknowledge. Right, I don't know. I honestly don't know if I am or not. I think you are. Based off what you're telling me. That's embarrassing. You're not not. I think you are. Based off what you're telling me. That's embarrassing. You're not alone.

Starting point is 01:59:07 Why are you embarrassed? I don't get who, you act like you're the only person who has an ego in this world. Stop being embarrassed over silly things. Who are you embarrassed from? Like me? I'm not judging you. The people listening, they don't even know who you are.

Starting point is 01:59:21 They don't even know your real name. You're just a voice. That's true. What are you so embarrassed about? You know, it's. Just being dramatic, that's gross. No, stop it. Okay, I will do my best

Starting point is 01:59:34 because I do not want anyone to think I'm dramatic. You investing your energy in things that ultimately don't impact your life is you being dramatic, so recognize that. Why, again, why, why am I doing what I'm doing now? Not why did he do what he, like, if you wanna ask yourself why, ask yourself why about yourself, not about them.

Starting point is 01:59:57 I don't know why he's doing what he's doing, who knows? I can't make sense of him. You can ask yourself why, and you can have the answers. You have all the answers about who you are and why you do what you do. And if you're willing to be honest with yourself, asking yourself why, you can get a lot of information about why you do what you do.

Starting point is 02:00:13 You just have to be willing to ask and you have to be willing to listen and be honest with yourself. You gotta keep it real. Okay. Okay, I will. All right. All right, well good luck out there.

Starting point is 02:00:24 Good luck with this new guy. Let us know what happens. Okay, well thanks. All right. All right. Well, good luck out there. Good luck with this new guy. Let us know what happens. Okay. Well, thanks for letting me call in and talk to you about it. I appreciate the call. Okay. Have a good day. Bye-bye.

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The Viall Files - E842 Ask Nick - His Secret Double Life

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