The Viall Files - E895 - Grant Ellis, Ingrid Andress, White Lotus, RHOBH, Denise Richards Premiere, and Stolen Baby Names

Episode Date: March 6, 2025

Welcome back to The Viall Files: Reality Recap!  Get ready to dive into all things Bachelor hometowns, as Grant Ellis joins us for a sneak peek into his process! Also, Ingrid Andress stops by to update us on her life post National Anthem controversy and shares some new music with us. Meanwhile, we get into RHOBH, Denise Richards and her Wild Things, White Lotus theories, stolen baby names, Jax Taylor’s big announcement, Millie Bobby Brown’s clapback to the media, and more!  “Fantasy Suites is really tricky… ” Subscribe to The ENVY Media Newsletter Today: https://www.viallfiles.com/newsletter  OUT NOW! Listen to Humble Brag with Cynthia Bailey and Crystal Kung Minkoff. Available wherever you get your podcasts and YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@humblebragpod https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/humble-brag-with-crystal-and-cynthia/id1774286896 Start your 7 Day Free Trial of Viall Files + here: https://viallfiles.supportingcast.fm/  Please make sure to subscribe so you don’t miss an episode and as always send in your relationship questions to [e-mail] to be a part of our Monday episodes. Follow us on X/Twitter: https://twitter.com/TheViallFiles Listen To Disrespectfully now! Listen on Apple: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/disrespectfully/id1516710301 Listen on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/0J6DW1KeDX6SpoVEuQpl7z?si=c35995a56b8d4038 Watch on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCCh8MqSsiGkfJcWhkan0D0w To Order Nick’s Book Go To: http://www.viallfiles.com  If you would like to get some texting advice on Office Hours send an email to [e-mail] with “Texting Office Hours” in the subject line! To advertise on this podcast please email: [e-mail] or go to: https://advertising.libsyn.com/theviallfiles   THANK YOU TO OUR SPONSORS: Article - Article is offering our listeners $50 off your first purchase of $100 or more. To claim, visit https://article.com/viall and the discount will be automatically applied at checkout Quince - Indulge in affordable luxury. Go to https://quince.com/viall for free shipping on your order and 365-day returns. Mint Mobile - If you like your money, Mint Mobile is for you. Shop plans at https://mintmobile.com/viall  Jolie - Jolie will give you your best skin & hair guaranteed. Head to https://jolieskinco.com/viall to try it out for yourself with FREE shipping. Timestamps: (00:00) - Intro (00:22) - Household Headlines (06:46) - Daily Dilemna (12:26) - More Headlines (26:30) - White Lotus *Spoiler Alert* (28:44) - RHOBH (35:28) - More White Lotus *Spoiler Alert* (41:02) - Denise and Her Wild Things (49:33) - Ingrid Andress Interview (01:31:40) - Severance *Spoiler Alert* (01:34:15) - Ingrid Outro (01:38:10) - Grant Ellis Interview (02:12:40) - Outro Episode Socials: @viallfiles @nickviall @nnataliejjoy @ingridandress @grantellis__ @ciaracrobinson @justinkaphillips @the_mare_bare @leahgsilberstein @dereklanerussell   

What's going on everybody? Welcome back to another exciting episode of the Vile Files Reality Recap Edition. I am your host Nick and is it next Monday or is it this Monday when talking about next week? It's next Monday. Yeah, you're talking about next week, so next Monday. March 10th, so you're saying March 10th. It's coming Monday.

It's coming. This upcoming. This next Monday. It's the next Monday that's coming up. So it'd be the next Monday. That Monday is coming. But at what point in the week, like on Saturday, are you saying next Monday? No, you're saying Monday. That Monday is coming. But at what point in the week, like on Saturday, are you saying next Monday?

No, you're saying Monday. Monday. Monday. So at what point do you need a next or a? Because we're in this week, this like active week. Saturday is this week. Yeah, but we're in like the, like the middle of the week. What's the, what's the?

It's the next week. It's not this current week. So it would be next Monday. But it also could be this Monday cause it's this coming Monday. So really any and all. So really any what point are you I like to pick and choose like if I just said today today is Wednesday if I told you a story about something that happened on Monday on Monday on Wednesday I would say this past Monday this Monday. I went to You said this past or this which one this? This Monday. Wrong. This Monday implies the next Monday.

I have to read you all a DM that I got. Was it on your Instagram story? When was it, was it this Monday or last Monday? Yeah, when you, yeah, was it Tuesday? Was it last Tuesday, was it yesterday? It was yesterday. Okay. Yeah. And on Thursday, will it be, it'll be past Tuesday.

Okay, should I? Okay, should I? This is why people struggle to learn English and I understand. Clearly this is a great debate. So I posted a mirror picture of my outfit. Very boring, very basic, very typical, like throw it on the story type of post.

And I received a DM from this woman and she says- This might be one of my favorites. Natalie from time to time gets an occasional DM from a fan. This one might be one of my favorites. Nally from time to time gets an occasional DM from a fan. This one might be one of my favorites. Sorry, I have to unfollow you. The fact that you post only things about yourself is not for me. Oh, true.

I know a lot of your followers want to know what's going on in your life. I don't care. Oh. However, I do care what you end doors. Endors. E-N-D-D-O-O-R-S. End doors. Are the doors in the room with us?

I'm not sure. And your beliefs. Just a little too much self-centered post for me. Happy life to you. Oh, she wished you a happy life. And then she did in fact unfollow. It was, you know, she wished her well. What are you supposed to post on your Instagram?

What do you typically indoors? I don't feel like I, she cares about what, like the shirt I indoors and like pants I indoors, but if it's me, she's not interested. Oh, she doesn't care about who's in the pants. No, can't. Did you not tag your outfit? Is that why?

I didn't. Oh, it's something. Now you're not doing this for the greater good. How dare you? As someone who's a notoriously bad speller, I know the state of mind that she was in when she sent that, and it was a rush. It was a panic. It was a bit of a rage.

It was like, I gotta get, I gotta tell her I'm unfollowing her immediately. She did not have time to think it through or proofread. It was like, she really needed to get it out. No, she sent in doors with confidence. Yeah. Yeah. We've all, I mean, we have not all been there of like randomly DMing someone.

We don't know to tell them we're unfollowing them, but we have all been on the other side of a, like I did have to unsend like three different things from our group chat yesterday, because I kept like mislinking and misspelling things. You know? Like I did have to unsend like three different things from our group chat yesterday because I kept like Misslinking and misspelling things, you know I mean, I guess I just feel like if you're gonna send someone kind of like not a nice message being like hey What you post isn't for me. I'm out of here. Maybe like spell things, right? Yeah, I don't know Yeah, you're like if you're gonna hate and technicolor, yeah, get the specs correct. Exactly.

I just love the need to tell you as to why versus just doing. I know, one of my favorite quotes is like, this isn't an airport, you don't need to announce your departure. Literally. Do you endorse nipple cream? I do, actually, yeah.

I do. Kylie Jenner and Carrie Coon are agreeing that you should be using nipple cream on your lips. What does a nipple cream do? Yes. Nipple cream is like when. Yes. Nipple cream is what you use when you're breastfeeding

because they're like cracked and hurting and burning. Like my lips. Yeah, some would say like your lips. So they're saying if you put nipple cream on, you don't have to put as much chapstick on. If your lips are chapped, they're not burning? Sure, yeah. Okay.

I don't wanna give people any ideas. Anyways, we have a great episode for you today. Your current batch. What ideas would they get from that? Like you have herpes or something? I don't know what else would cause a deep burn in your lips. Well, when they're chopped, they do burn. Sunburn.

Hot sauce. They're red and burning. Yes, hot sauce. Hot sauce. You just went on an episode of Hot Ones. Pineapples. You need a little nipple cream. Wait, pineapples make your lip burn?

I mean, I guess you have a crack in your lip, for sure. Citric acid. You bit your lip accidentally. Well, we have a very fantastic episode for you. Your current bachelor, Grant Ellis, returns to the show to give us an update on his life, his journey in love and everything that's going on with The Bachelor.

So that should be exciting to hear from Grant. Also, we have a very special interview before Grant shows up. Ingrid Andress is with us. You probably know her from her amazing music and songwriting, but also you may have heard of her national anthem experience during the MLB All-Star game that did not go her way.

She famously now was inebriated and under the influence and it was, by her own admission, a terrible performance and she checked into rehab after that to try to fix whatever problem she had. but she is with us talking about that experience for the very first time. Very excited to talk to Ingrid and that will be coming up shortly. Also don't forget that we have a very special Going Deeper tomorrow with one of your finalists from this season's Traders finale. It's gonna be a good one. Very excited for you to hear it from this guest.

We will be posting the juicy sizzle as the finale of Traders ends tonight. It's gonna be wild, wacky, and fun. Do not miss it. That is tomorrow. Set your calendars, set your alarms. Be with us tomorrow. It is a great episode.

Are you f-ing kidding me? I'm losing my mind. Would you be pissed if you told your best friend like the name for our next baby and then they used it? Livid. You would be livid. Especially our boy name? That tracks.

No, I would definitely be a little upset, but I think also it's like, we'll just have two of the same names, like who cares? Like I love- You confided in your best friend, a friend, a coworker, anyone, and they were like, oh, that's cool. And then you found out that they stole it.

You have to assume that that baby comes first, right? So you wouldn't, this would be a pregnant friend or a friend that has a spouse that's pregnant or something. So you're clearly telling them in confidence, are you not? And you're telling them with the assumption that they're not gonna use it because they're pregnant. Do you have a baby name? And you're like, oh my God, yeah.

And you're like, oh my God. And they're like, oh. And then you find out they take it. That's a violation. Would you cut them off? Yeah. You would no longer be friends with them? It would change the relationship.

This is stemming from, a mom says her best friend stole her baby name and she wants to know if she should cut her off. She said the woman was getting her hair done by her best friend, who's her stylist, and they were discussing her baby name pics as the friend was struggling to find a name. The woman brought up that her pic was Evelyn May.

Fast forward to the friend giving birth and the friend took Evelyn and also May. See? Not also May. The hyphen is what really gets me. I don't know if it's hyphen, I think it is first middle. First middle. Yeah.

Either way. Still two names. That's not just one, that is. That's two. Yeah, that's duplicate. Yeah, and because our bore name, we got the first and the second. Oh, first and duplicate. Yeah, and because our boy name, we got the first and the second.

Oh, first and middle. Whatever. But it's like, I have always loved the name Scarlet and the name Charlotte. I loved the name Scarlet when I was like 10 years old. We shouldn't have been naming kids. And then my sister had a baby named Scarlet. And then my cousin had a baby named Charlotte.

And I was like, oh my God, people, seriously. And my sister was like, listen, name your kid Scarlett. Name your kid Charlotte. That's completely different. Do you think the men should get, I'm not asking you. Do you think the men should get as much say in the baby's name? Because they get last name.

Yeah. And you carry and birth and do everything for the baby. You breastfeed, you go through postpartum. Do you think your names trump dad's names? I think so. It just depends. I feel like you obviously have to be on the same page, but like if you happen to walk out and the nurse comes in with the birth certificate and I gave them the name that

I like the best, what are we going to do about it? You weren't there? You weren't there. You're toxic. Whatever. I'm also like, is it kind of your fault for talking to a pregnant person about your number one baby name?

Like that's kind of like a kiss of death. It's your best friend. That's a circle of trust. I hope she said, you can't tell anyone or like promise you can't use it. Are we workshopping or like, did she ask her to sign an NDA? If you went to a friend's house or something, I don't know.

And you, I don't know, had a envelope full of cash and you left it there. And for some reason, I don't know. And they, and you said, can you watch this or whatever? And then instead they went to the casino and spent it. I mean, I guess you can blame that. You can be like, oh, well, I guess I shouldn't have left all envelope of cash, they spent it,

but like that would probably change the relationship. Would it not? Would you like maybe think of them differently? Which would definitely be like a thief for sure. And this person, Evelyn May, her mom is a thief. She stole a name. Thief of joy. It'd be one thing if you just took the middle name,

but the first or maybe just the first name, like Evelyn, common name, whatever, you could like, you could scoot your way around it, but first and middle is pretty red handed. Middle names are fair game. You don't get dibs on any type of middle names. If she only took Mae, if she was like Mary Mae or Eve Mae, no fucking problem, but Evelyn May, she took the whole thing.

This is why you keep the names and the notes up. That's what I'm saying. Don't let them leave there. Exactly, since their lips see it. No, see, I think you should be able to share it with the understanding that, like, so especially if you ask, if you ask, oh, what are you thinking about for names?

Oh, do you have any names picked out? You're being fucking nosy, by all means, be nosy. But that is you basically saying, you can trust me. There's an implication there that like, hey listen, just wanna, I'm just asking him being friendly. But if you didn't take that name and give it away, tell other friends, same thing, if I tell you the baby name

and then I find out your other pregnant friend that I'm not even friends with stole that name, absolutely fucking canceled. Well, that's the thing. If it's not your best friend, it's the person you drop in your conversation right next to you. You don't know them. That's completely different.

Your babies aren't going to interact and have to like fight because they have the same name. But they might be in kindergarten together and now they're going to fight over having the same name. It's really, it's not even out about the same name because I do think like when we, when River was born, like when we came up with the same name because I do think like when we, when River was born, like when we came up with the name, we thought like, oh, we were like this name and it felt a little unique and yada, yada, yada.

And then like she was born and then realized that like, it's the most popular name of the year. It's like when you start like hooking up with a guy who drives like a white truck and then you start seeing a white truck everywhere, you know, and you're like, oh my God, there he is. There he is. Oh my God, he's at Walmart.

Oh my God, he's at McDonald's. And then it's just a white truck. And it's like, yeah, we saw River everywhere. I am kind of glad though, because like when she goes to school, it gives you character to like have to share a name. It's just like, it's the principle of your friend taking the both names.

Yeah, that actually happened in an episode of Sex and the City. Samantha absolutely read someone to filth because someone took Charlotte's baby's name. Yeah, I remember that. Well, Gabby Wendy married Robbie Hoffman. Woo! Yay!

How exciting, they did it in a $799 Las Vegas wedding. And it looked like it was just the two of them and I guess a priest and I guess a photographer. That's how you do it. A priest? Maybe Elvis, I don't know. I didn't see. I was guessing a priest didn't marry them, but I guess. photographer. That's how you do it. A priest? Maybe Elvis, I don't know. I didn't see. I was guessing a priest didn't marry them, but I guess.

In Vegas? You don't think it'd be someone dressed up like a priest? When you say priest, I think Catholic priest. If you say presider. Why would I say presider? Because that's what it is. I don't know, preside over the wedding, isn't it? Officiant?

Oh, officiant, yeah. I just love it when a hot couple gets married. I'm really happy for them. That's $799, I feel like, with Gabby looking the way she did, AKA stunning in an amazing dress. I feel like I looked for that dress for my welcome party, so glad she found it. I'm very on brand for Gabby Wendy.

To like look so stunning and be like, it was $799. Yeah. Natalie, similar to the baby name stealing, what would you do if somebody stole your dress? Like if you showed your friend and you were like, this is my dress. And then all of a sudden they have the dress. Well, first of all, Nellie would only get her dress

from the great ladies at sync. And they are very original, very custom, and very hard to replicate. That's not true. They have dresses that they're not all custom. You can make a custom if you wanna like pay for it, but they have a lot of dresses that like everyone else wears. And I remember I definitely,

I would get like mad at them, like play mad, but also like if you bitches don't lock it the fuck up, because they would be like posting my dress on their Instagram being like, oh, the Gale is like so beautiful and this and that up because they would be like posting my dress on their Instagram being like, oh, the gale is like so beautiful and this and that. And I would be like, stop it. You're showing people my dress.

And it was like, I was the only one who knew that it was my dress, but I definitely would get mad at them for sharing it. So, but I would be just as pissed, I think. I did not realize that Adrienne Brody's a girl, is it girlfriend? We still don't know. Girlfriend. It's girlfriend though?

It's confirmed girlfriend. They are not married. Not married because her ex-husband was Harvey Weinstein. Are they even still officially exes? Has he signed divorce papers in prison? I don't know, but I think so. The kids he referenced on his speech. Are Harvey Weinstein's kids? The kids didn't do nothing.

No, no, no, it's just. I just feel like we should make that clear. Or her. Or her. From jail? They were, apparently, Adrian Brody and his girlfriend did allegedly get together when she was still married to Harvey Weinstein, but I don't imagine she was happy. And I don't feel bad for Harvey Weinstein, so.

No, me neither. Yeah, I don't either she was happy. And I don't feel bad for Harvey Weinstein. No, me neither. Yeah, I don't either. No. Yeah, I don't think Harvey's gonna get the Ariane American treatment. No, the way that this headline starts is disgraced film mogul and convicted rapist Harvey Weinstein

reacts to Adrian Brody mentioning his children with ex-wife. I hope it brings him great distress. But he did have a response to Adrian Brody's Oscar speech in mentioning his children. So Weinstein's rep told the Post on Monday, Harvey's happy for Georgina and grateful that his kids are being loved and cared for as they deserve to be. He didn't say that. He definitely did not. His PR said that. His publicist said that. He said fuck that and fuck them. Imagine what's a worse job than, okay, okay question. Harvey Weinstein's publicist.

What is a worse job than that? No one's making them do it. That's true. There's plenty of worse jobs. They could quit. They could quit. They could quit. They don't have to do it.

No one's making them do it. And like, I don't know, keeps them busy. Maybe they find it fun. You're getting paid. How do I spin this? Did you see Millie Bobby Brown shut the fuck? I'm really proud of her. Did you see Millie Bobby Brown shut

all of these journalists up? Mm-hmm. She named names. She named names. And Matt Lucas, we think he's in a position to talk about anyone's appearance. Have you seen this man? Well, what he was saying in his apology

is that he didn't mean, he posted a quote of like a character from a sketch that he did that she kind of looked like, and then he didn't mean it, he said he didn't mean it as a joke. Oh. Or he didn't mean it as like an insult to her appearance. What's going on here?

This is the man who she, one of the men, who she called out, Millie Bobby Brown, for commenting about her appearance. This is, oh my God. People are saying that Millie Bobby Brown, since she's dyed her hair blonde and whatnot, that she's aged herself and is having this mommy makeover, even though she's what, 23, 25?

21. It's honestly, the comments she's been getting are so bad. They're really, really mean comments. And it's crazy because I saw these two, it was like back to back. So it was Millie Bobby Brown, and then it was Pamela Anderson, who's like gone very natural.

She like doesn't wear makeup on the red carpet anymore. And to Pamela Anderson, they're all saying like, oh my God, like you've got to put on makeup. Like this is you like are aging yourself. You look so old. This is this like it's ugly. Millie Bobby Brown, it's like, she's doing too much, she looks too old, you know, just like the hypocrisy of that.

But Millie Bobby Brown posted a Instagram video saying she wanted to take a moment to address something that I think is bigger than just me, something that affects every young woman who grows up under public scrutiny. I started in this industry when I was 10 years old. I grew up in front of the world and for some reason, people can't seem to grow with me. The fact that adult writers are spending their time dissecting my face, my body, my choices, it's disturbing.

Disillusioned people can't handle seeing a girl become a woman on her terms, not theirs. I refuse to apologize for growing up. I refuse to make myself smaller to fit the unrealistic expectations of people who can't handle seeing a girl become a woman. And then she basically calls out every, not every, but a few. Yeah, read the headlines that they wrote and then the person who wrote it was pretty good. Yeah, and she was disgusted because it was a majority of them were women

writing these articles with disgusting titles. It's gross. It also reminds me kind of of Britney Spears growing up where it was just like the second that it was like a midriff or whatever. She's 16, she's 18, she's 22. It's like, it does not matter how old she got. Everyone was criticizing, you're too sexy, you're too this.

And it's like, why can't anybody, like why can't a woman that you've seen since she was a child, why is everyone else allowed to grow up, but they're not? And like, why are we allowed to comment on like, how we think that they should be presenting themselves to the world? You're following it.

So like, just be a consumer. Just remember, fan is short for fanatic. And at the end of the day, you're following it. So like, be a consumer. Just remember, fan is short for fanatic. And at the end of the day, fans, like the most hardcore fans feel sometimes a sense of entitlement of like, I've supported you and therefore you owe me. Like I'm allowed to stunt your growth as a person? Like that's wild.

I don't think there's a lot of thought. There's not an objective thought. Mrs. Indoors, you know, like I don't think she's sitting there thinking, does this make sense? Should I be doing this? He just decided that she has something to say. She wanted to say it, and Nellie was her subject.

And it's like, but. It is crazy that Matt Lucas' response is, I would not have posted it if I had thought it would have upset you. But I realize it has, and for that, I apologize. It's like, really? You wouldn't have posted that if you thought it would upset her you, but I realize it has, and for that I apologize. It's like, really? You wouldn't have posted that if you thought it would upset her?

You didn't think a mean comment about her body and about her would upset her? Yeah, you kinda just have to own it, right? I mean. Yeah. You're like, I fucked up, I thought it was funny, definitely not funny, my bad, I apologize. He also said for that I apologize, which means he's not apologizing for what he did,

he's apologizing for her being upset with what he did. So that's where it's like. To some degree, it's like, we would give commentary on the show. I'm assuming at times we say things that offend people or rub people the wrong way, but to that end, we do have to own it. It's one thing to say it and be like,

oh my God, I didn't realize that would hurt your feelings or upset you. Sometimes you have to say, I'm sorry that upset you, that necessarily wasn't my intention, but you kind of have to own it in a way. Like this guy, it's just like, just fucking own that you said it and apologize for hurting her.

But like, yeah, it's, I mean, say it with your chest. It is wild that he thinks he's in a position, I mean, that's the thing, it's just the, like, just comment on someone's look. Looks. No, it's crazy. And like not look in the mirror. To think that you're in a position

to come after a 21-year-old woman's looks, and it's him is... Someone who has been in the limelight since they were 10. You know? The world is crazy. Can only imagine what the internal mental struggle might be for Millie Bobby Brown to decide what she wants mental struggle might be for Millie Bobby Brown to decide

what she wants her look to be. Because she has all these voices of, god, this is probably 1% of all the trash that has been written about her or comments. These are headlines. Imagine what her DMs look like or comments on Instagram. It's atrocious, I'm sure. People love to troll Millie Bobby Brown too.

Ever since she was little. Since she was a kid. Like even just from my perspective as a queer person, people love to throw around like, oh, Millie Bobby Brown is homophobic. She hit me with her car and it's like, she did none of that. She did none of that ever. People just love to like, her specifically.

Yeah, just like became a joke. Who knows? Because the internet loves to troll her and that's what's unfortunate for her. It was just like someone was like joking and lying one time and then like on the internet and then it caught on and became like a thing. And it's just, yeah, you would think that like

with how many child stars have come and gone and like experienced so much trauma and had their lives ruined, that people would be a bit more careful nowadays, but it's just the way the world works. Are these British headlines? Because they are notoriously cruel to most celebrities. It's the humor.

More lack thereof. Humor with a U. Monica Garcia is pregnant. Congratulations, Monica. She posted a very beautiful little spread with People Magazine celebrating her pregnancy. Is this the same guy that she was talking about when she was with us and talked about her then pregnancy,

which sadly she lost that pregnancy? So congratulations to her and her rainbow baby. I learned what that was, sadly, when Natalie and I experienced miscarriage. Very beautiful that Monica and her partner are now expecting a child. So congratulations to her. We got a, I DM'd her.

I haven't heard back from her. I gotta find her number. She's busy responding to all the comments. She's really supportive to her fan base. I love it. Oh, that's sweet. Did you respond to my comment? Did you comment?

I did, I said congratulations. Oh yeah, maybe you need to comment. She comment like congratulations, check your DM. One of those. One of those? Yeah. Jax Taylor. Jax Taylor is in the news again,

and what is not shocking news. Telling Page Six. That he has had a cocaine addiction, cocaine? Cocaine. Cocaine. For what, 10 years, he said? He said, on and off since I was 23 and I'm 45. I mean, it's great of him that he's able to come out and admit that.

I'm sure that was very hard for him to do. I feel for Brittany, I feel like she is finally able to kind of like speak more honestly about their relationship. I'm sure she was like protecting this for him. So she actually did come out and say, I'm glad that he finally admitted to what was really going on. For the first time, I can speak openly about the extent of trauma he's instilled on our family over the years. I've tried desperately to help him without success. I pray that one day he

completely knocks this addiction, but I'm skeptical. His behaviors are still alarming and his treatment plan seems to be the bare minimum. I'm trying to navigate this as best as I can for my son and I, but every day is still a challenge and very difficult. Jax has caused an enormous amount of damage, and I have very little trust in him at this point. My only hope is that one day

he will be a better person for his son. That means he sounds like a monster. And also like it just, the time, when do we know when the valley comes out? Not announced yet. It's not announced but in spring. Yes, quote soon, end quote. It just always feels like self promotion, you know?

Who, Jax? Yeah. I mean happy for him that he is at a point in his life where he can get sober, I hope it continues, you know? I mean he's admitting in this kind of conversation with Page Six, he's saying that like, he lost it and went crazy in the car with his son Cruz in the backseat, which is why he went back to rehab.

That's when he said, shit, I have a problem. It's still there. And that's after seeing a man's name on Brittany's phone, that like he had his son in his car and lost it and went crazy in the car. I will say that in Vanderpump Rules, you can see, I think it was Jax's wedding, but there's a dish on a counter that while they're getting ready for the wedding,

then it's just kind of like, if you see it, you saw it. Must've been missed in the editing, but yeah, it's just like, it's number one guy in the group. Infamous pasta situation. The amount of people who put Jax Taylor on some sort of pedestal during Scandival just because they hated Tom Sandival so much, and like, for a brief moment,

everyone was like praising Jax because he decided to ride the hate Tom Sandival train. That always really just irritated me, because it was all bullshit, and it was just people just like, looking the other way way because it was like in vogue to hate on Tom But like why they forgot about all of Jack's past transgressions clearly he had never changed There was no evidence that he made any attempt at any type of changes in his life And now we are reminded of that. Well, I was like, I don't know if you remember

But during that period of time, Jax obviously wasn't on television. So Jax was crusading, starting his podcast, talking about like fatherhood and like how he's such a changed man and marriage. So it was like, he was very much promoting himself as a family man while Tom Sandoval. So he felt like he was the authority to speak on it

because he knows firsthand who Tom Sandoval was. He was the one that was also furthering that narrative. But then clearly behind closed doors was treating his family like shit and doing drugs. Absolutely. He has only shown us that he's a terrible person. There's never been a redeeming moment since he's been in public.

I mean, what are his name one redeeming moments? He checked himself into rehab. I mean, bare minimum. I mean, even Britney is like, this isn't enough. You're doing the bare minimum. Yeah. Are you guys watching White Lotus? Yes, I am.

Yeah. Who did it? Who do you think? Monkeys. I think it's the monkeys. Spoiler alert. No, I think it's the monkeys. I think a monkey got a gun and I think they're trying to kill the monkeys.

And I think it's representative of like how they're all animals in there. Well, off of yours, and I'm thinking that maybe a monkey got a gun, and I think they're trying to kill the monkeys, and I think it's representative of how they're all animals in there. Well, off of yours, and I'm thinking that maybe a monkey went crazy in the gunshots that we heard is them trying to kill the monkey. Well, and they're leading us to think that the mom is the one that might've been killed, right? Is one of the people that might've been.

Yeah, the mom, the therapist, the masseuse who's there for training. But it's definitely one of the white guys that have the gun. Like it has to be one of the white guys. Well, because it's Tanya's ex. No, it's definitely not. I know. It's definitely not Gary.

Greg. Greg, Greg. I was like, they all have the same name. She did think his name was Gary though, wasn't it? He like changed his name, right? Or was it always Greg? I think it was always Greg. Oh. Maybe.

I fell asleep during this episode, so y'all are just ruining it for me. I'm an episode behind, actually. I do think we need to do spoiler warnings. No. Oh, we're just speculating. We haven't talked about anything in the last episode.

We thought we'd do it. We're just literally just speculating who might've done it. Okay. I was like, maybe one of the housewives. It's like, finally it's time. I actually hate you. I don't think it's any of the old white men.

Oh no, it's definitely one of them. The creepy one going to Bangkok or the one that has a scam that made him $10 million? I definitely don't think it's either of them. Walter Goggins is not doing anything wrong, he just wants to smoke weed. It's too predictable, it's too... It is, but they're both hiding too much.

They're all involved in something, something much more insidious. I think they could be the reason maybe something escalates, but I don't think they could be the reason maybe something escalates, but I don't think they're the one doing the shooting. Okay, so then it's either the bodyguard or the manager of the hotel. The bodyguards are definitely somehow involved.

They definitely whip out their guns for sure. Wait, no, I think that Greg did change his name because she calls him by the name that she met him. Was it Gary? Kim, and the whole thing is that Tanya, Jennifer Coolidge's character was with that man in the last season. That was season one though.

Season one and then he hired people to kill her in season two. I never watched season two. Greg's been in every season. Yeah, Greg sucks. He's the number one white lotus op. Anyways, moving on. Well, what I did watch is Beverly Hills Housewives.

We finally got to see the scene of Kathy walking on the runway. And it was just as iconic. She's so beautiful. She's awesome. Her limping coming out. I think I broke my knee. Of the thing.

Sutton, Sutton. Do you wanna have to read and see? Do you wanna have to read and see? You know, as nervous as Sutton was, you know, she was like, get the fuck away from me. Like, no! But also, Cathy, making amazing television, like, oh, you're gonna, do you want to read

the person you hate the most to narrate and star in your fashion show? Oh my God. No, go find your seat, Cathy. Also, when they're like, her and Kyle are getting mammograms and they're talking about Moe, and she's like, you know there's way we could find this out. So much. And Kyle was like, no, no.

She's like, who has bigger boobs? Can you remind me, Sierra, because you've been watching this longer than I have, like where did the like kind of vitriol and hate from Garcelle and Sutton start towards Doreen? Like when they had this lunch, right? And it seemed like, or dinner or whatever, and it seemed like a very fairly civil lunch

between Garcelle and Dorit. And then at the end, Garcelle's like, well, I'm still gonna keep one eye open. And it was like, one eye open? Like what has Dorit done that makes like Sutton, Garcelle act like Dorit is like untrustworthy or like she's up to no good or like she's, I mean, yeah, like she's been a little petty these past couple episodes and maybe kind of instigated

fights with Sutton, but like, you know, this all stems from how, again, how Sutton and Garcelle have constantly treated Dorit. I mean, there's a part, there's a point in time where Sutton and Garcelle both were the new person and to Justin's point a couple of weeks ago that it was like, Dorit was a part of the meme girls. The Fox Four.

The Fox Four, like Lisa Renna ruining lives. Like she aided in that. So it's like she would always be making comments and things to where it's like people... Dorit's smarter than people give her credit for. And that's kind of what Sutton says. It's where like, you know what you're saying when you say it. And Dorit's like, I didn't realize

that that made you feel this way or whatever it is. And it's like so many times you can take hit after hit and be like, you know what you're saying when you say it and Dorit's like, I didn't realize that that made you feel this way or whatever it is. And it's like so many times you can take hit after hit and be like, you didn't realize, like you didn't realize. So they're just defensive against her because she was a bully. She was? Yeah, she was a part of the group of the girls that were bullies.

And now that like- But why doesn't Kyle get that same treatment? Because Kyle's the star of the show. This is the first season I've ever seen where Kyle even kind of had a bad edit in the beginning of the season where I'm like, I Kyle even kind of had a bad edit in the beginning of the season where I'm like, I was like, Oh my God, I think Bravo turned on her because she did that interview with Mauricio show because like you've never seen a bad edit

or like somebody bringing up Mauricio's cheating allegations that would have been cut from a season. And then we had it just like an abrupt, well, your husband has some infidelity rumors and she was clearly caught off guard being like, what are you talking about? And they would usually edit that out, but they kept it in. So that's where I'm like, Kyle, Kyle's getting hers too, but it's just, I understand Garcelle and Sutton

not being able to fully trust Dorit. Does that make sense? Yeah. I would say season nine or 10. I mean, I think Dorit's like made her bed and now she's sleeping in it. Yeah, and I mean, I think with what's going on in Dorit's life, it's like now she's, you know,

forming her own personality and her independence outside of PK and the mean girls, and she's standing on her own, which is really great to see. We've just never really seen an authentic Dorit. I haven't liked Dorit until this season. She's also very long-winded, and I think that's what Garcelle and Sutton

always return to is like every time they try to have a conversation, she dances around the point of it and never actually has the conversation. So that's where she says like, let the mouse go. I mean that makes sense, is this more like, well yeah, like I get that she was part of this like Fox group or whatever, but so is Kyle. I will say nothing brings anyone closer than shit talking

and her and Garcelle being able to talk about and Maurice Yeo and this woman, they were like, we have problems? I don't even remember because she's at a Morgan Wade concert. Also, Garcelle is the one that is going to bring up the Morgan Wade rumors. Everyone else kind of like tries not to, but Garcelle's like, well, let's not forget.

And I really appreciate that. I say this every week, but like, just get divorced or not get divorced. But like the fact that they keep pretending that there might be some reconciliation. I love the way Cathy calls him Maurice. Nice. Maurice. Maurice.

Maurice. 1000%. Yeah. 1000%. That's what it was. 1000%. I just like, I don't. And then it's like Kyle taking wife out of her bio.

It's like, you guys have been separated. He lives in his own condo. What do you think he's doing? I actually appreciated that scene because I do think as trite as it might be and I think the show made it seem like why does this have to be such a big decision? But the reality is that people do pay attention to that.

It became a headline. Kyle knows it's a headline. Kyle knows the super fans pay attention to shit like that. And you know, those are decisions that like, you know, I mean, shit, I mean, Nellie and I have had to have conversations like that that seem like who gives a fuck kind of thing. Like, why do we even care?

Should I do this? Should I comment this? Should I write this? Should I caption this? Should I do that? Blah, blah, blah. You know, it was definitely a little bit of like an insider look to like, you know,

actual conversations that like Kyle and all these women kind of have to consider and things that like affect their lives that might seem trivial, but like, yeah, people do talk about them. People do pay attention. People do like, you know, going back to the Millie Bobby Brown,

like they analyze and break down and speculate and create rumors and yada, yada, yada. Like sometimes it's the question do like, you know, going back to the Millie Bobby Brown, like they analyze and break down and speculate and create rumors and yada, yada, yada. Like sometimes it's the question is like, you know, like Kyle even said, you know, when talking about this photograph, like she, she even speculating the authenticity of this photograph. Like she doesn't think it's Moe who staged it, but like the paparazzi and, you know, this, I don't, I don't remember the photo, but apparently there's like a heel kick and like, you can usually know like if someone called the paparazzi on this, I don't remember the photo, but apparently there's like a heel kick. You can usually know if someone called the paparazzi

on themselves. And the biggest takeaway is like, is it a nice picture or does it look like someone took a picture of you without you realizing? Yeah. And if it's like, if you are in any type of pose or romantic, if you look pretty good, you might've called the paparazzi on yourself.

Right. You know, and if you look like you are stuffing your face with a sandwich, like- You did not. You probably didn't. Or if you have this kind of like confused look on your face, you know, probably didn't. Yeah, and she's a young model, so I'm like,

I'm not shocked that she could call the paparazzi on that situation. It's a plausible situation that could have happened. Especially since Sutton was like, I've been to that airport a million times and Jennifer Anderson was there and there was no paparazzi. Yeah. I love how they all kept comparing him to Brad Pitt.

They're like, he's no Brad Pitt. It's very, everyone kept saying that. It's very Shania Twain that don't impress me much. It was that generation. It's like, no matter what, Brad Pitt will always be, him and George Clooney will always be the number one guys. That's a beautiful thing. Can we go back to, I got a question about White Lotus.

Yeah, please. Spoiler alert. The three ladies, the friends. They hate each other. How common is that in friend groups? Oh my God, it was so funny. The first time that I was watching the first episode with Connor and they're talking being like,

oh my God, you look so good, you look so good. And Connor's like, what the fuck is going on here? And I was like, she's asking about what work she's done. He's like, how the fuck did you get that? And the next thing that comes out of her mouth is, so who's your doctor? But I was like, yes, it's like, that is unfortunately toxic female friendships.

There's a lot of underlying notes covered in niceness. The chills that go up my spine every single time I watch it with my friends and we're just constantly like, oh! During every conversation. They all talk about each other and then catch each other talking about each other and they're just like, well, we all do it.

Yeah, they all hate themselves and each other. Yeah, so yes, common. Not for me, but common. Have you ever experienced that? Oh my God, yeah. You have to choose not to in real life. Guys don't do that. Well, we know. But why do you ever experienced that? Oh my God, yeah. You have to choose not to in your life. Guys don't do that. Well, we know.

But why do you all do that? Guys love to gossip too. Not like that. No, Nick is bad. I'll be like, oh my God, like he was just with a friend and then it'll be like, did you hear like what happened?

And he'll be like, I don't know, I didn't ask. Like we're- Guys talk, I mean, my guy friends, we talk shit to each other's faces. We give each other shit, we tease, we make fun, we give each other a hard time to each other's faces. We don't do it behind each other's backs. And we definitely don't do it

like the way it's portrayed in the show where you have like this group of friends and then like as when the groups together and everyone's hanging out It's all like these pleasantries and these exchanges and when the group divides into individual little groups Like they start talking shit about the person not there Like I I am not familiar with that type of behavior in a group of guy friends. You are? I mean, I think everybody gossips. I'm like, we all talk about each other behind their backs. I'm not saying I haven't gossiped, of course,

but I'm just saying in a male group dynamic, that behavior is not common. I'm like, Maybe with the gays, is that different? I don't know. What do you mean? I don't know. I don't know what the gays do.

I don't know them. I don't know them. I wasn't making a sexuality thing. I was just like, guys like to gossip too, as much as women do. I've had some of the biggest gossip sessions with my guy friends. It's not just about gossip.

This is about friends treating each other. Like, I mean, yeah, sure, I like to gossip as much as the next person. But like, about my closest friends, about like my boys, like, you know. Well, the thing is that they're not the closest friends, even though they're like best friends, they all live in different places. So Well, the thing is that they're not the closest friends, even though they're like best friends, they all live in different places.

So this is the first time that they're coming together, which means like FaceTimes and like kind of catching up. But like, this is the first time that they're like all together. And I've had bigger groups of friends where it's like, not everybody is as close. Like you have people that you're closest to and then people that you're like kind of forced

to be friends with because this person's friends with them. So they're always coming around. Yeah. But it's like, I don't like them, but I can't, I'm not going to cause an issue with this person because we're all friends. So I'm like, and that's why the whole like girlies posting, keeping your circle close and like finding three good friends. Like that's why we get to that point because you go through so much toxic shit with women

that I'm like at their age, it's sad that that's still an occurrence, but like, yes, as you grow up and have groups of friends, your circle gets smaller and smaller because of shit like that. And it's all, you can tell, it's like all underlying jealousy. 100%. Which is always what it is.

Yeah, they all are jealous of each other for different. Having real good girlfriends or people that are happy for you, that support you, that like literally lift you up. Girlfriends like this are the people that are praying for your downfall, being like, no, you got this, girl. Yeah, you tell them something that's exciting,

and they're like, oh. But what if this happens? Someone hit her car on her way to that meeting. Literally. Just like Mike White is maybe one of the most genius writers. Absolutely. It's the, he's incredible. Do you think that's why White Lotus is so popular

because I feel like it's a scripted television show written like a reality TV show. We obviously know that the family in the show has been inspired by basically Southern Charm and that entire cast. But I think that's why a lot of people, that's like the crossover between reality TV and scripted television.

And obviously Mike himself is a reality TV star from Survivor and he seems to also, I bet he's, I wonder what other shows he watches. I think the thing about Mike White is like, it's so obvious he is just deeply, deeply interested in like human behavior and how people act and interact with each other, which is what reality TV is.

When did he, I wonder like when did they film this? This season? deeply interested in human behavior and how people act and interact with each other, which is what reality TV is. When did he, I wonder, when did they film this? This season? This past. But like the Trump conversation, obviously I'm not trying to get into politics here, but like. It was brilliant. There were, I didn't see it.

The timing, like huh? How did he, like, huh? But that's why I think people, that's why people do love White Lotus though, is that he always does incorporate what's really happening in the times and the conversations that we're having. So we are seeing a reflection of ourselves in the TV show.

It was very, I had fallen asleep, so I didn't see this, but I did see a clip of it. And it was someone saying like, this is the most perfectly acted, like the facial expressions where she's like talking about the people in Texas, like being Republican. She's like, well, they're nice people. And she's like, wait, are you a Republican? She's like, well, they're nice people. And she's like, wait, are you a Republican?

She's like, no, I'm an independent. I'm an independent. I'm an independent. The independent. The Davidist. The Davidist. It's like the most like pitch perfect. Like that scene is what's gonna win an Emmy for right.

100%. Yeah. It was awesome. Also premiering last night was Denise in the Wild Things. Her Wild Things. Her Wild Things, fun little television show. We watched both episodes. I mean, it's early, so I think they're getting their

Their feet wet. They're getting their bearings. I love it. It's all the scenes of Beverly Hills Housewives that I would watch. So it's like, I get a full episode. It's like Beverly Hills Housewives. And like, I used to, like, I grew up on reality television,

but like teenage, so it's like the Hills, Laguna Beach, pretty wild. And I'm like, so seeing this like aspect of the two teenage daughters, it's just like giving me life. Like if I was saying to Nalia, look, imagine if we're lucky enough to have a child and River and let's say we have another daughter, and they're relatively close in age. Like if they grow up and one has an only fans mile and River and let's say we have another daughter, and they're relatively close in age.

If they grow up and one has an OnlyFans smile and the other one is a hardcore Christian, who is just like, I'm with God. It's the way she was like, I woke up and God told me to go to the beach today. And then you find out she's been religious for six months. It's awesome. It's like since I was 18 and a half.

She's there so, it's like the perfect, it's the perfect sister dynamic for TV. It feels like watching an old MTV show. It's great. It's so funny though, cause I remember going through that stage myself of being like super, super Christian. I remember my older sister, Caroline,

and I like told her, I was like sitting on the couch reading the Bible and she comes in like, bitch, are you serious? And I was like sitting on the couch reading the Bible and she comes in Like bitch, are you serious? And I was like, well, that's why you're going to hell I definitely had that stage of my life and it seems like Lola is giving that kind of energy to Sammy. Yeah the cuts between like her getting Like we have Narcan Crazy and then the sister in her bra group, I'm like this.

Eating the tacos. Thank you. Like that, you die from shit. Like Narcan, like isn't that? Narcan saves you. Narcan saves you. So if you're doing drugs, if you have pro tip, I don't do drugs, but if you do, always have Narcan around

or you think somebody might be doing drugs at a party. Is it like how you like, is it like the fentanyl saver kind of thing? It'll bounce them back if they're going to overdose. Yeah. So you can like have time to take someone to get help at a hospital. If your friends are making sure they have to bring that, you're hanging around the wrong people. But at least they're thoughtful.

Yeah. They're being safe enough. In college they give it to everybody just in case. So I think it's a matter of just like- Who gives it to everybody? Well, I don't think it's a bad thing, but the universities are like, if you need it, or like if you like wanna have it, like they provide it. Really?

Because you're going to parties, like even if you or your friends are not doing it, if you see someone else- Somebody is, yeah. I definitely won't be the parent giving my kid condoms at 13. Well, yeah. Yeah.

It's kinda the same thing, like just be safe. I think we're gonna go with a different approach. I mean, like, yes, it won't be like the scare them out of doing things, but like, I don't know. I feel like maybe a different parenting method can like maybe avoid having to like, yes, it won't be like the scare them out of doing things, but like, I don't know. I feel like maybe a different parenting method can like maybe avoid having to like make sure your kids condom up that early

or like bringing Narcan. I don't know, I feel like there's like a way to like be like, oh, I'm a progressive parent, but also scare them being like, so this is Narcan. This is when somebody overdoses is about to come to death, which you might be responsible for. So you need to be able to administer this. My fear is a very powerful parenting tool.

Like, yeah. Like that's what I'm saying where it's like, cause I would be thinking if somebody's showing me what this is, I'd be like, well, I never want that to be used on me, let alone do I want to be responsible to use that on someone else. My parents were always like this, this, it'll kill you.

Don't do it. Okay, say less. I think it's just like teaching someone CPR in case you're ever in the situation. A lot of like teaching someone CPR in case you're ever in the situation. A lot of people have Narcan in case you're ever in the situation. Cause it's like, you could be at a party with a bunch, you're not doing drugs,

but there are people around you that are, even if you don't know them, if you're at a big party, especially in LA, and especially like at a rave and the type of places that I'm assuming that some shit happens. Sammy's going to and stuff. And it's just good to know that it's there

so somebody can be safe. If anything bad happens. I guess I hate that for the kids these days that they have to worry about stuff like that. That is sad. But anyways, congratulations to Denise and her show. We'll be following along. I will say a lot of people are talking

about the purse conversation where her chain got caught in the table. So a lot of people have been reposting it. That's the most relatable thing of like. It's awesome. There's nothing that eats my purse faster than a picnic table. Yeah.

I just love that she's trying to like defuse a situation between her daughters while like all of a sudden being like, like turning a plastic knife into this like. She is, I love Denise so much. She is everyone's mom in that moment. She's so honest and so, I mean, like, no disrespect to most of the housewives

that just kind of came from money and their biggest moment of their career is being a housewife. But Denise is like Denise fucking Richard. She's literally like a Bond girl. She's a movie star. And she's incredibly down to earth. Like she's one of the more down to earth,

I think, housewives out there. Like she's just so like whatever. Like that scene where she was just like. The plastic? No, where she broke the fourth wall and she's like, and that's why we have a TV show. Yeah, yeah. It was amazing, it was awesome.

And then when she's on Tori Spelling's podcast and she's like, people wanna see my boobies, and thank you. Yeah. Oh yeah, he'll cut the diss if you don't want that out. That was great, yeah. I just like love how real she was too and she was like, what the, it's a picnic,

what do you mean bamboo and sugar products? I'm bringing plastic. She's like, what are you gonna make it? It's so family. It's funny, it reminds me of Meghan Markle's like little documentary she's come out with or show that she's come out with. And it's, she's obviously.

The opposite of Denise Richards. Well, no, well, she talks, the amount of just like plastic Meghan Markle uses in her home and it's supposed to be very like earth friendly and all this stuff. And everyone's like, the amount of just like plastic Meghan Markle uses in her home and it's supposed to be very like earth friendly and all this stuff and everyone's like, the amount of plastic bags that you're using right now and like the amount of balloons, are you serious? Petroleum, like that's what we're doing?

Poor Meghan, she can't catch a break. She is still rich though. All right, up next we have a very great interview. Now it's time for Ingrid Andress. We talked about Article a lot on this show because we love all the furniture they are making for our home and yours. I've been an Article customer since 2019.

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returns quince.com slash viall. Uh, my, my parents homeschooled some of my siblings. For real? Why not you? Uh, I was, I'm one of the old, I've, I've 10 siblings. Okay. I didn't know that. Yeah.

So they were just trying new things out. Yeah. You know? Dipping in different ponds, you know? Totally. Yeah, literally. Was it like culty vibes or like, okay. We're pretty normal for being freaks.

Yeah, I totally get that. Do you feel like they're as smart? Yeah. Okay. I think they're as educated as I am. I was just about to say, it's probably the education level is probably up there, but street smarts is where we lack at the beginning. Well, I lack in all of it.

So it's okay. You're in safe company. So no street smarts. None of it. Or idiot. Yeah. Oh my God. She's lying.

She's very... That is so... She moved in New York as a teenager, so you can imagine her street-smarts. Oh, girl, yeah. Oh, please, okay, yeah. She would run circles around, yeah, she's fucking with you. Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly.

Ingrid, welcome to the show. Thanks for having me. We're so excited to have you. So excited. I'm excited to be here. First podcast back from my being off the grid. Where did you go when you went off the grid? Well, I went to rehab and I went to,

I went back to Colorado, which is where I'm from and spent a lot of time in the mountains. Is your family still there? My brother is, but everybody kind of dispersed. I have sisters in Seattle. My parents live in the Northern woods of Minnesota. My youngest sister now lives in Nashville with me. So we're all kind of just all over the place.

But yeah, I spent a lot of time with family and then I was like, okay, I think it's time to re-emerge. I mean, how do you wanna talk about that experience? What's your comfort level? Just ask. Honestly, I'm so comfortable with it. I know it's such like a taboo thing for people to want to discuss, but to me it shouldn't be because-

Yeah, I mean, have your friends been like, so like, what? That's been like the best part is like, some people are full on like, what was it like? Like, did you have outfits? Like, what was the thing? And then some people are just like, I'm just glad you're better now.

I was praying for you. Exactly, like, I'm so glad you're okay. Lots of prayers. Yeah. So I'm fine talking about it because to me it was such a needed experience for me based on the dark trajectory I was going down. So I feel like even if you don't have a substance issue,

disconnecting and asking yourself where you're at in your life and really getting down to, you know, your emotional wellbeing and like slowing things down, I think is essential, especially for pretty much everybody in this country. So. How did it get to that point? Like, I mean, I got to assume a lot of things kind of have to go wrong for you to walk out

on into the pitcher's mound. I don't know exactly what you're saying. I'm really glad I didn't have to walk all the way out. The baseball bat. A long walk out. And a long walk back. I probably wouldn't have made it to the pitcher's mound in my condition, let me tell you.

Yeah, like how does that happen? How aware were you like in that moment, like I'm really fucked up, but here we go, you know? Or were you like, do you remember it? Like how inebriated were we? So that day started as like a very, what seemed like a normal day. It was really more,

it's more about all the days leading up to that or like all the weeks. So at that point, like that day, I knew that I was drinking, but I was really loving like the numbing feeling that I was having. And so I just didn't stop. And so it wasn't until I woke up the next day

where I was like, okay, this is so unlike me. Like, this is not okay. Like I need help because I actually walked out and like did not care. I was just like, I don't care. I don't care how this goes. Like, I'm just, I was so fucked up. Sorry, messed up.

You can swear. Oh, you can swear. Oh, okay. Yeah. I was so gone that afterwards I thought that I like kind of nailed it. I was like, oh, I feel like there were some hiccups in there. I could have sang it better. You're more like, not my best. Yeah, literally.

We did good. I called my best, my best friend called me after I got off the field. And I remember briefly talking to her. She's like, so how do you think that went? And I was like, I feel like it wasn't my best, but you know, like that's how gone I was. But- And then that particular friend like break the news or?

She was very delicate. She was like, are you sure you think that went well? And I was like, yeah, yeah, I'll talk to you later. And it wasn't until when I woke up the next morning, one, I was like, it's terrifying that I don't remember how it went. And then that's when I called management and was like, hey, I need to go, I need to check myself in somewhere.

Like this is not like me. And I feel like I'm at a point where I don't feel like I can get out of this myself. Was that your first experience with recognizing any type of issues when it came to abusing substances? Yes, that it was the first time because in my mind, I'm like, oh, I've had this under control for a very long time.

And I think after I parted ways with my first and ever manager and broke up with my, you know, very serious boyfriend, like all at once, and I didn't realize how much I didn't let myself process those emotions of grief. And I think at that time, everyone says, oh, just keep moving, keep moving, keep busy. And because I didn't process all that, I didn't realize how much it was starting to creep in in other ways, which I was increasing. It happened really

quickly. It was within three months, I was drinking way more than I ever had ever. And just loved that numbing feeling because that's why we abuse any substance. It's like, and really anything can be- To not feel the feelings. Yeah, it's like shopping, eating, gambling, sex, like anything can be an addiction and we all have the ability to abuse substance when we are trying to numb something.

So that's when I realized, I was like, I don't actually know how to get out of this. How quickly did it escalate into a problem now that you look back and reflect? So my youngest sister lived with me for a while, like trying to get back on her feet in Nashville. And then she moved out in May. And that's kind of when everything started hitting me.

Like I was alone in my house and like all those feelings of what I had, you know, all the people I had to say goodbye to before and just everything hit me. And so like beginning of May is when it just started spiraling so quickly. So then by July, I was just like, I don't feel anything anymore.

And it's kind of nice. Like it's great. And to me it worked out great. And it only took, you know, global humiliation for me to be like, this is a problem. How, I mean, I definitely remember when it happened. Good, everyone does. Yeah. I'm a baseball fan happened. Good, thank God. Everyone does, yeah.

I'm a baseball fan. Thank God. I'm a baseball fan. So really. I mean, I was and now I'm never showing my face in a game ever again. But like how big did it really feel like the world found out?

It did. And luckily the world was finding out as I was on a plane to rehab, which is when I made my statement and posted online that I was going to rehab. I didn't realize how much the video was going viral because I wasn't, I'd never experienced anything like that. I just figured like, oh, like people will make fun of me and then people will forget. And like the fact that everyone was picking it up and everyone was, you know, you know

doing reaction videos on TikTok. And like, I didn't realize that until right before I got to rehab and I'm like, thank God they're taking my phone away because I've never one experienced this much hate on such a massive level before. And that's when I realized I was never, one, experienced this much hate on such a massive level before. And that's when I realized I was like, oh, I don't think I can handle this right now. Well, I will say I'm chronically online

and I had never seen it or heard of it. Oh, wow! What a relief! There are some of us out there. Oh my God, so you just know you and love you for your music. Oh my God. And again, I know. Who just know you and love you for your music. Oh my God. And again, I'm just a baseball fan,

so it was probably like I was just watching All Star coverage. Yeah, exactly. Well, I didn't think they have the audacity to play the clip on MLB. Right. I was like, oh my God. But I will say, at the time,

I know politics was really bubbling. And I feel like there was just a lot of angst in general during that time. So if anything, I feel like, at least, if anything, I'm fine with being America's punching bag because for one moment, everybody was united in the fact that that was awful. So I feel like I united America.

You're welcome, America. In a way. But you said you got hate. Is that, you know, and I'm sure any form of criticism, I'm sure feels heavy, especially when it's directed at you, but were people like really coming at you? Because like, you know, I didn't know much about you when I saw it, but I was more like, oh, poor thing.

You know, like what a bummer. But I didn more like, oh, poor thing. You know, like, what a bummer. But I didn't like, I didn't have a problem with you. You know, it's like you didn't do any, you know, you didn't do anything to me, but like, were people like personally triggered in coming at you or did you kind of- Did everything just feel loud? Yeah, or just at all, it just felt loud?

I think the biggest backlash was when I, because when I posted like, hey, I'm sorry, I was drunk, apologize to MLB and like, I'm checking into rehab. Like that was the most vulnerable I think I've ever been on admitting something like that. Cause like, I had the thought of like, well, maybe I won't tell anybody that I'm going and I'll just like disappear and then come back.

But for some reason it felt like I got more hate from saying that I was going and I'll just like disappear and then come back. But for some reason it felt like I got more hate from saying that I was going to rehab of just like, oh, you're blaming it on being drunk when you're just a bad singer. And like, it was really, it showed me a lot about, one, how sensitive I am, and two, just the lack of empathy in general, which I didn't think, I don't know,

I guess I hadn't been exposed to that at that level before. But I hope it's not pointed at me as a person. I think there's just a lot of anger that people need to get off. Yeah, well, I'm often reminded, I don't know how much you know about me or like I was once on a reality TV show. I do know that.

I've told this story a few times, but it was like, I don't know, maybe it'll help you, but like I got trolled a lot at times when I was on the show and then at first I blocked a few people. I was like, you know what, this person's mean, I'm not gonna listen. Few years later, I got a few people's like, you know what, this person's mean, I'm not gonna listen. Few years later, I got a message on Twitter and it was a young lady saying,

hey Nick, can you unblock me on Instagram? I really apologize for calling you, I don't remember, like a ugly troll, blah, blah, blah. But in my defense, I was 12, she writes. And it was like, I really like, I'll always remember that moment because you just never know who's writing it. And it was like, I really like, I'll always remember that moment because you just never know who's writing it. And it's just like, if you knew that all of your critics

were 12 and 13 year old girls, just like. That would make, I would be like, okay, if that's what you need to do. Yeah, right? Like, I'm here for you. You're not here. Yeah, just get it out, sister. But whether they're 12 or 13, or they're an adult human,

like chances are like when it comes, when it feels like, what? This doesn't even make sense. Like, why are you, why is this directed at me? Like, I know I fucked up, but like it's always, it's some version of a 12 year old, you know, basically. Totally, which I feel like, I mean, that's so great that you recognize that, you know,

relatively early on in this process for you. Because for me, it's, it is new. And so I'm learning new boundaries of what I will read and what I won't, which I never had to worry about before. But it's kind of, it's kind of freeing in a way because I do care what people think about me, but I'm realizing that I care more what they think about my music and my songwriting and that, I mean, they can judge how I look, what I wear, like all these things that, I mean, are kind of pointless.

But to me, what I care about is the things that I really care about, which is music and songwriting. So if, and I realize that some people won't like that either, but I just. Yeah, I was going to ask if you have and what it looks like your relationship with social media today. I think I want to be less precious about it moving forward, especially because. I was so terrified of like fucking up for so long in my career.

And I feel like now that I've done that on such a massive scale, it feels like the band-aid has been ripped off and that I can show that I am a human. And that it's, you know, everyone thinks celebrities are a certain way or whatever, but I'm more comfortable showing up as a human being now, I think. And so, whatever that looks like on social media is probably gonna be more transparent than I have been in the past, just because I was so afraid that somebody would take something the wrong way, or I would offend somebody with something that I wore, or just all those things,

and now I feel like all those voices are not completely gone, but they're not as loud. Yeah, I mean, the more people know that they can get to you, the more they'll try type of thing, and the more you show people, like, you know, just say what you're gonna say, and it doesn't really impact me, then it just becomes boring for those people, you know, do say what you're gonna say. And like, it doesn't really impact me. Then it just becomes boring for those people, you know? So it's really kind of a weird dynamic.

Were there any artists that you are friends with or collaborate in the past that reached out and offered you any type of support? Yes, so that was actually the other really meaningful thing that happened after the anthem I was expecting no one to reach out or like but there was just so much outpouring of love from from female country artists in in Nashville and I actually felt Like so loved and seen like going into rehab. Oh, that's lovely. L. King was like, this is just all part of it, girl.

And she's obviously been there before too. And Kelsey Ballerini was like, welcome to the worst parts of this job. And it was mostly women, and Karen Fairchild from Little Big Town. And that really meant a lot to me, because I feel like women in country music have had to stick together based on very obvious things,

because it's, like, a very male-dominated genre. But for them to be like, -"Hey, like, we've all been there." -"Yeah, you're not alone." Yeah. It was very meaningful. And Carlos Santana randomly was like, yeah, have never spoken to him before in my life. And he asked my management, he's like, hey, can I get Ingrid's number?

That's very iconic. Right? I was like, hello? I was like in rehab. I was like, hi there, what are you, what's up? It's me. Yeah, it's me, your long lost friend. But he was so kind and so supportive and was just like,

you know, if you ever wanna do a song, like you know where to find me and he like sent me flowers and I was like, what? Did you say yes? Yeah, I was like, I will pencil you in, sir. Where you're like, you know where to find me, I'm in rehab. Yeah, yeah.

And actually this rehab has a studio. So if you want to like pop by here, like please feel free. Do you think you would ever want to perform in a national anthem? She redeemed herself. She just did. I did. Where? When?

Last, well, it was very recent. That was like on Friday. Yeah, yeah. You crushed. How did it feel? It was great. And I know- Why hasn't that gone more viral?

Oh, it's always- I wonder why, because I sound better. crushed, how did it feel? It was great. And I know I'm- Why hasn't that gone more viral? Ah, it's always- I wonder why, because I sound better. Yeah. I'm like, I actually sang it, and actually people still are like, oh, she's still drunk, like she's singing it so slow. And I'm like, well, I'm singing it slowly

because it was actually harder to sing this time around because the first time I had in-ears, which is where you can hear yourself. I didn't hear myself the first time because I wasn't mentally there. But the second time they didn't have in-ears, so, and it was in an arena. So you have to sing slower

because the echo is constantly bouncing back at you. So that it has made your comeback even more harder? Yeah. It did. And you still crushed, so. Yes, I did. And it felt, when I tell you, I have never been more nervous about something.

Oh my God. Like, oh my, the only thing getting me through it was the thought like, I never have to sing this song again. Yeah, was it kind of like once I redeem myself and do it once, I'm like, that's all I have to do. Yeah. And was that something that like your team was like, hey, you need to get it back there

and sing the national anthem? Or were you like, no, I need to do this to show myself and my fans and the world that like, I can sing this fucking song. Yeah. It was a bit of both because I'm very, I am a competitive person and originally I told my team, I was like, I'm actually never singing that song again.

And we were just gonna move on and talk about it a lot. But as time went on and we, I was writing more music and I was like, I think. Actually for my own mental wellbeing and to be able to close this chapter, like I need to do this for myself, even though I hate this idea, because if you bomb the anthem twice, your career is over. Like truly, especially after, can you imagine? The stakes are high. The stakes are high.

Very high, like there's really no coming back from that. Yeah. So, yeah, part of me just needed to do it to prove to myself that I could and to show people who maybe didn't know me outside of that. Like I actually am a singer, and I've been doing this for a long time, and it actually does mean a lot to me,

and I take it seriously. So... How long was the, like, ah, after you finished? I, the next day... Okay. Was very different than the next day. Yeah. I, the next day was very different than the next day.

I, the amount of, I didn't realize how much weight I was carrying with it. And so when I woke up the next day and it was gone, I was like, oh, I had no idea I would feel this much relief. And yeah, it didn't, the video didn't blow up as much as the first one because I just think, I just think sometimes people like.

Yeah, they're terrible. Yeah. I'm like, how do I say this without saying people can be shitty sometimes? Nick and I say this all the time. I mean, it's why we don't ever like really open up that much about that kind of stuff is because it will, no one cares.

Like no one cares about the truth. They just wanna run with the fun story that they've made up and that's gonna go viral. Like no one cares about like your apology video. It's never gonna go as viral as like what whatever happened, you know, so it's never worth it, I feel like, because it's just not gonna, it's not gonna go the way that you think it's gonna go.

Yeah, I imagine like when, you know, after the incident, like you making that statement was something that you felt like you needed to do, but like in the history of internet apologies, I've never seen the internet go, oh, thanks. Right, we forgive you. That was well said. That was good.

Really, really thoughtful. Really, really nice. No notes. Yeah, yeah. Never. Oh, yeah, no, that's so true. It'll never happen. That's so true. So it's like, obviously this was a very big thing for you,

so you felt like it necessitated that, and every once in a while, yeah, it might make sense to make a statement, but you never make a statement because you think it's gonna go over well. And if, short like, you never have, you never make a statement because you think it's gonna like go over well. And if short of you like really needing to, I'm just like, I just opt out of not addressing anything. Yeah, yeah.

Yeah. It was definitely more for me to do it. And that way I didn't have to like talk about it as much because I just went back out and did it and was just like, end of story. I did it. You guys can stop trolling me, but it turns out they can still troll you,

even after you nail it. So- Like this was good, but remember last time. Yeah, exactly. I'm like, I do, but I don't remember really, but yes. Well, you have come out with a new song, Footprints. Yes, I have. Was that your plan?

Were you like, I wanna come back and I wanna come back with an amazing song, Footprints. Yes, I have. Was that your plan where you're like, I wanna come back and I wanna come back with an amazing song? Yes. I mean, the significance of Footprints was really more why I wanted that song to come out first. I actually wrote it a couple years ago for my siblings, all four of them. And, cause I was the first one to leave home

and like leave the cult, just kidding. It wasn't to leave home and like, leave the cult. Just kidding. It wasn't a cult. It was a very loving family. Um, and I felt like I had left them behind in a way, and I didn't want them to feel like I was abandoning them. But like, but just to show them like, hey, you can learn from my mistakes. But I also wrote it from on top of a mountain of things were going well in my career. I was getting nominated for things and I was like, oh, see, look, you can do this too if I can do it. But I listened to it again after getting out of rehab and it hit different because I felt like I was listening to it walking up the mountain this time

as opposed to being up there already. And it meant more to me because I wanted them to see like, one, your older sister is crazy but resilient. And like, even after all this, like you can still do this. And if you ever want, just know that like the path that I'm going on is to show that like, you can also pursue your dreams and do things. And so to me, I wanted Footprints to be the first song

because it hit different from where I'm at in life now. And I mean, I tell them all the time, like I try to lead by example, I'm like, don't follow all my footprints, specifically not into the baseball stadium. But I think for me, it's important for them to know, like you can go out and pursue your dreams But I think for me it's important for them to know you can go out and pursue your dreams.

Not exactly in the way that I have, but it is possible. But also just like no matter what hardships you go through, it looks different for everyone, you can come out of it. You can find the light, you can do all of the things because you were able to do it. And you are that example to them of like, it might not be easy, but it's doable. Yeah, exactly.

The good news is, is the only thing Americans love more than a fall from grace is a nice comeback. Exactly, that's what I've been told. Yeah. Does it feel like that right now? I think so. I also love a good comeback story. It feels more like just, I binome,

like no one should take my advice and no one should be like, you know, following my example after I release a song like Prince, but I'm just like, it feels like a comeback, but it's also just feels like a return to something that's always been there. And so, because I think people make mistakes. And so to then come out and be like, I'm different, I'm new, I'm whatever. It's like, no, I'm still me. I'm still like the messy, crazy, No, I'm still me. I'm still like the messy, crazy, you know, introspective me, but I feel more present in who I am as opposed to it being.

That's the thing, because like comeback doesn't have to mean like, oh my God, I've recreated myself. I'm a new person. It's more like I've made a mistake. I've worked on that mistake. I'm still the very talented vocalist and songwriter that I've always have been without like, without the thing that caused the thing. And now I, now I can. Right.

The thing that did the thing, and now we're doing the thing. Without that thing. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, yeah, yeah, totally. You did get to tour with Stevie Nicks. I did. How was that experience?

Pretty life-changing. She has been like my idol for such a long time. How was that experience? Um, pretty life changing. She has been like my idol for such a long time. And she just transcends timelines and genres. And a lot of it is because of her authenticity as an artist and as a songwriter and just as a human. And it's rare that you see that as artists get older, I find, but it's almost like she's really embraced her journey and has really leaned into who she is. And I think that's what makes her so magical is that she does not apologize.

She just shows up as herself and has for decades. And to see that, you know, cause her and I are obviously at very different places in our lives and careers, but it was so inspiring to see her still doing the thing that she loves and like the fans that came out were from all walks of life, like all different ages. Like it wasn't just this one thing.

It was really powerful to see how many lives and how many generations she transcends. And I was honestly shocked that I was there, but I felt very at home, like with her fans. It felt like everybody appreciated storytelling and just being real and truthful. And yeah, it was very inspiring. I definitely wanna be her when I grow up.

Do you enjoy songwriting or performing better or is there a mix of both? They fluctuate. After being on the road, I'll say I can't wait to get back in the studio. Like I am done performing. And then when I'm in the studio for months at a time, I'm like, I can't wait to get out of here

and jump around stage. But I will say, I think songwriting is probably where I'm more comfortable, just because I feel like I can process my thoughts better in the moment, but being on stage has its own energy. It's like, it feels more communal than songwriting does. Songwriting can feel a little isolating, whereas performing on stage, you just,

there's like this energy of everybody in the room that is hard not to feed off of and feels very like life-giving in a way. When you co-wrote Boys with Charlie XCX, like how does something like that come to be? Are you guys like friends? You call up and like, I have an idea for a song, your teams kind of get you together. Like, what does that look like? Because, you know, two different genres. Yeah, yeah. Which I always love.

I always love when like two different things come together. Totally. Oh, this is fun. Yeah. Yeah, so how that happened. So Charlie, she is a very good songwriter. Like she's written songs for like Iconopop and like she's also started as a songwriter

and then turned into artist. And so Boys was actually the first outside song that she wanted to record, which to me was crazy because I looked up to her as a songwriter. And so for me to get the call of like, hey, Charlie actually really likes this song. I'm like, well, does she wanna like tweak it or?

And she obviously added her sauce to it, but it was actually, we never like collabed on it because the song was already done. Oh wow. And she, yeah, it was the first time that she took a song that she didn't write. How does that feel for you to like write songs and then have other artists sing them?

Or like, does that feel good to you? Or is it kind of like weird because it's like you wrote it, but then you're like honored because someone else is singing, but. And are you writing every song with the intention of you singing it or do you sometimes kind of to Nellie's point deliberately be like this is not even for me but I just love what the song is. Yeah so when I started switching or transitioning from just a songwriter to an

artist the whole reason that happened was because I started writing songs that were very personal to me and like my story and artists wanted to cut the songs and I'd be like, no. And then my publisher was like, well then what? You sing. Yeah, or they're just like, well, you're supposed to want other people to sing these songs. I'm like, yeah, but they're my stories

and I'm having a hard time letting these go. And so that was like kind of the biggest reason I became an artist was because I didn't want other people pretending that my story was theirs. But there is there are many songs where I'm like, this is obviously not for me. Like, I would never say that. Like boys being one of them, you know, as much as that side of me comes out a lot, I'm like, I am not like that all the time. And I would like to think I am. It's almost like me talking about somebody

that maybe I'd wanna be one day, you know? But I know at my core, it's like saying that you're a wolf, but really, you know, you're like a fox. You know, you're like, this is me. And you're like, this is not me. This is not me, I'm just joking, I'm just joking. Yeah, I'm joking, no one would believe me, you me, so there are, whenever I write for other artists, I'm always hoping that they can hear themselves in it

because that's what matters to me. I'm like, does this resonate with you? And obviously there will always be a part of me in those songs, but it's almost to help facilitate them as opposed to being like, this is about me. What was the first song that another artist cut? to facilitate them as opposed to being like, this is about me. What was the first song that another artist cut? Oh, what was it?

Honestly, Boys might've been the first cut and then there've been Fletcher has cut a bunch of my songs, which I love her. I'd actually have to look, I haven't looked at my list in a minute. Wow. So humble. So humble. No. No, I haven't looked at my list in a minute. Wow. So humble. So humble. No.

No, I'm being honest. I'm forgetting. Yeah. Yeah. Back to homeschooling. Oh yeah, let's go. Come on. So were you homeschooled like your entire education system

or was it like, so my parent, I- I was gonna say, tell me about your situation. I have 10 siblings. I was public all the way. They just couldn't afford anything else. It was just like, that's what people did. Homeschooling was very niche back then. If you heard of homeschooling back then,

it was like, what is going on in that house? Yeah, oh yeah. And then my parents, I grew up, became very Catholic. So then some of my siblings did like private elementary school and middle school, and then with the younger ones, my mom was like, I wanna do the homeschooling thing. It was through the education system,

so she wasn't on an island, she was getting curriculum from teachers, and she was sending in papers, and they were getting graded and scored by actual teachers and things like that. And then my younger siblings would go to music classes at the local schools. So it was very integrated with the public school system.

It wasn't on an island, so to speak. And then everyone went to a high school. Like normal high school for just to integrate with society. What was yours like? Very similar. Oh, then that's like, that's normal. Yeah, well, except I started in preschool through like second grade maybe.

I went to like normal public school. But then it was getting harder to pull us out of school because we were starting to learn like pretty important things like reading and stuff. And my dad was a major league baseball coach and he traveled a lot. And, and spring training is a thing every year. He started with the Detroit Tigers and then he was with the Rockies for most of my childhood. And then he ended with the Mets.

Yeah. Hence why the MLB humiliation really stung on multiple levels. Yes. Did Dad have anything to say? Oh, a lot of old retired players reached out to him. Let me tell you, being like, is your daughter okay? And he was like, no. She's not.

She's not. But so my mom decided to homeschool us because we would have to Be pulled out of school a lot to travel with him for like months at a time So that was the reason and it was fine We we did those like for those of you who are homeschooled you'll know this It's like you get this once a week go hang out with other homeschooler classes It was called a k-12 program. So once a week we would out with other homeschooler classes. It was called a K-12 program. So once a week we would integrate with other homeschoolers. And that's when I remember thinking like,

oh, I'm a cool homeschooler because everybody else in the homeschool world, like there was a reason why you got homeschooled. You know, like there was just a lot of stuff going on and a lot of it was like religious repression or like something like that. But then I started playing sports and got pretty serious about it when I was 13 or 14 is when you start doing competitive club sports. And so my parents were like, well, it's time to put you in public school then

in order to like start building that resume. So they actually put me in public school in eighth grade. How did that affect that? You feel like you have a lot of opinions about it. Oh, it would be one thing. Middle school is hard. Yes, especially the last year of middle school. Like it'd be one thing to go to high school

cause it's like you, you know, people are- Everyone's awkward and uncomfortable. Everyone's awkward and like you're coming in from different counties and like everyone's kind of like, it's a new batch of people. But everyone was like, who the fuck is this chick? Yes, like it was, it was like breaking into like the cool kids club last minute.

Like when, when they were about to leave and they were just like, we don't really know what to do with you because like we're kind of done here. And I'm like, yeah, totally. I get it. I get it. I don't need to be accepted.

So that was a traumatizing year for sure because my parents were also very conservative and like sheltered us from a lot of things. And so when I got to middle school, I really had no idea what was going on. And I wasn't allowed to wear makeup and had to dress very, very, very modestly. And I felt like I learned so much

in such a short period of time of like, you know, oh, why is this girl crying in the bathroom over this guy? Like, what happened? And like, oh, like what's a pushup bra? I'm like, what does that do? I'm like, can I have one? And my mom-

You're putting a razor on your legs? Yes. Like what? I'm like, do you do the whole one or just up here? And the knee seems hard. The knee seems- Yeah. I'm like, why are you'm like, do you do the whole one or just up here? And the knee seems hard. The knee seems. Yeah. I'm like, why are you rolling up your gym shorts so high?

I'm like, you're not gonna be able to do anything. I'm like tying your shirt up and making it a crop top. I'm like, does that help you play better? I'm like, I don't know. I feel like that would hurt in dodge ball, you know? So it's just, there was like all these things that I felt like an outsider, which is why I feel like social norms to me are such a is such an interesting concept because they

change so much and like they change based on wherever you go and like they're a constantly evolving thing and and some people take them really seriously and some don't and like as somebody who them really seriously and some don't. And like, as somebody who is still feel, I feel like I'm learning something every day. It is a fascinating concept to me of like, how we choose to interact with each other and like what's acceptable. It will be interesting.

We have a 13 month old daughter and it will be interesting to see like what kind of things she goes through and like, And the personality. Yeah, it'll be weird. It'll personality. Yeah, it'll be weird. It'll be weird. It'll be great though. You were playing the Grand Ole Opry this weekend.

I am. It's kind of a big deal. Have you done it before? I have. Okay. Not in a long time though. Like I've had a lot of great memories at the Opry for sure. But yeah, this will be my first time coming back

in like a couple years. How are you feeling? I'm excited because it feels very familiar but also very accepting. Like the country community is, they're like fiercely loyal. And so I feel like it's kind of a nice welcome back into society because country music bands really want to relate to you and they really want to hear your stories. And I feel like that's what I love about it so much. And I think the Opry has captured that

for longer than I've been alive and has done that for so many people. So I'm excited. I'm gonna play Footprints for the first time there on piano. Oh my God. So we'll see if they like it. Oh, they will, of course.

It says here you're passionate about comedy and comedians. You're very funny, by the way. Oh, thank you. But do you have any fave comedians that you're following right now? I mean, there are so many. I feel like I've watched everyone's new Netflix specials, like when there was the writer's strike, you know, and I feel like Netflix ran out of like, you know, content. And they were like, let's give every comedian a special. And I was like, yes. So yeah, I feel like, well, I've always loved Bill Burr

because he's just, you know, very straightforward, but I also love Nikki Glaser. I've loved her for a minute and I love that she's like finally getting her moment. She's been a friend of the show for a long time and it's exciting to see her. She is, oh, I just love her. Obviously Dave Chappelle is like one of the OG

and Tennessee Man, What's his name? Oh my god. He hosted. Oh, Theo Von, of course. Yes, him. He is wild. I'm really happy. Stuff that pops into his brain. I'm like, you are one of a kind. True. I don't say things. I'm like, I don't think I could say that out loud and get away with it. No. He just has a way of just, okay, I guess so.

Yeah, it's the way that he says it to where you're like, sure, man. It's like he is just asking a question, I guess. Yeah, you're just like, only you could ask that. And it's very, yeah, he's wild. What Tennessee man are you talking about? Nate Bargettsy, yes. Oh yeah, he's wild. What Tennessee man are you talking about? Nate Bargettsy, yes. Oh yeah, he's hilarious.

His dryness gives me so much life and he's also been doing it for such a long time. So I feel like- He's having it, he's really having a moment. He's having a moment too. Which is cool. Did you ever think that was like a path you might take? No.

I feel like there are similarities in songwriting and comedy writing, which is why I think I get into it so much because they're also writing, you know, in country music, you have like that twist at the end or like that wordplay or like how do you tie this up in the end and comedy is the same way to where you're almost like working backwards when you're writing a joke.

And to see like the transitions and like the writing part of it is so brilliant. And I feel like comedians are just as dark as songwriters are sometimes. And so it's almost like your brains kind of understand each other. And at least in Nashville, like a lot of the songwriters and the comedians

like are all friends because there's this understood ability to write in hopes that you're bringing other people more joy or to make other people feel more understood. And so I just love that about comedy. Sometimes it's, I mean, I'm not a fan of all comedy. I feel like sometimes I'm like, hmm, no, that didn't.

No, didn't land. That didn't do that. Yeah, you know, sometimes people have some misses. Agreed. A few misses. Yeah, amen. All our audience loves all kind of TV. Any TV shows you're a big fan of watching right now or anything at the time? Yeah, I'm really into Severance right now.

I was on Reddit the other night. Don't, well, we're caught up. Okay, same. Spoiler alert. What's your theory? What's going on with his wife? I feel like, and this is like, this is, I'm worried to say it because I don't want people to be like, yeah, there's no way,

but there's, I feel like her, she is recovering her brain. And so it's almost like if he breaks out of it, it's almost like they need him in order for her to like build her brain back in a way. Like- Do you think she died or? I think- I think Lumen staged her death to get her.

I think so too. Right? But like- She can't, what she died and that's her ghost and like. I'm gonna be so mad if they leave in season two. Without telling us. Without like, on a major cliffhanger where we have to wait a long time to find out some answers.

I need some kind of answer. Well, do we think she did get in a car? I mean, she had like brain damage and part of Lumen's thing is to like rebuild someone's brain and like. That sounds like a noble thing and they don't seem noble. I, yeah. Also my, the thing I will be so disappointed in

if I don't get to see Heli meet Helena. I know. You know what I'm saying? Because like there's a lot of similarities between the Innies and the Audis, right? Especially Mark, like Mark's Innni and Mark's Audie, kind of the same gentle person, right? But like Heli and Helena polar opposites.

And I wanna see her- How would they do that? I wanna see her severed somehow. That would be incredible. Yeah, definitely not gonna happen in season two. No, no. That's the season five. Give me, yes, but I need some clarity with Miss Casey.

I do too. Yeah. I don't, I, yeah. Something. The fact that she's still wanting to see, yeah. There's a lot going on. I feel like I'm starting to focus on Burt too now. Yeah, is he a part of it?

No, Burt's definitely a part of it. He is because his partner got a little wine, whatever, and was like, oh yeah, you were there 20 years ago. And he was like, oh, you've had too much to drink. Obviously, I was only there seven years. And the fact that before the guy left and he reestablished, he gets confused, it was only. Which means he was part of making it.

And so to me, he must've done something really bad because he was atoning for his sins. True. So many questions. Well, anyway. This is so fun talking with you. Thank you guys for having me. Thank you so for being so open

and just talking about the experience. I know it's never easy, but we're wishing you nothing but the best and great success in the future. Congratulations on Footprints. Yeah, congratulations on Footprints. Please come back and just talk about life and comedy and TV.

Is there an album coming out? There might be. Okay. Yeah. We'll look for that album. In the meantime, listen to Footprints wherever you listen to music, basically. Yeah, pretty, look for that album. In the meantime, listen to footprints wherever you listen to music, basically. Yeah, pretty much.

Thank you guys. Thank you. Thanks. Huge fan. Love her. Even bigger than I was before. Love her. I mean, funny, first of all. Really funny.

Really enjoyed. She's a great, honestly, she's just like a great outlook, I think, on life, and I guess sometimes it takes going through that kind of thing to like, you know. I mean, let's be real. Obviously, like I'm not saying in light of the situation and she got the help that she needed, but like, fuck man, I don't know.

Most of my friends have had an experience via alcohol or some sort of substance where there was a big apology that had to come, you know. There was a moment where they like, ugh, things didn't go their way. I mean, it's not to condone it or anything, but it was a human mistake, and I just loved to see her rising and coming back

and making the most of that situation, so it was great. On my 21st birthday, I was so hammered, and I was crying, because I just wanted to go home, and my brother told me to shut the fuck up and stop crying. And he's had to apologize to me since, so. No, there you go. Well. Even when you're not drunk. Now it's time for our bachelor grant

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How you doing? I'm great. How are you doing? How's your heart, man? It's good. Oh man, I'm going through it now. How's your heart? My heart's good, my heart's good.

It's been a while since I've been on the podcast and I'm really happy to be around you guys and see you guys and I'm ready to get going I didn't get to meet you last time. Yeah, we was raving about you. I wasn't here I don't know what was maybe didn't we didn't have babysitter or something? I don't know, but you're just like no fuck grant And I was like, okay, maybe I'll be there for this one No, it's it's a pleasure meeting you and we had it. we had a blast last time. Can I just say something? You're a really good bachelor, man.

Oh man, listen, there's a lot of mixed opinions, but you know something- Well, fuck them, I can tell, I am the foremost authority on who is a good bachelor and who is not a good bachelor. Your opinion definitely matters, man. You're very good. And when I say that, Joey was very excellent,

obviously fan fave, but like, and I don't even mean whether people, there's so many things outside of your control as a Bachelor, but what I've always been really impressed about watching you this season is your ability to listen and respond to the women and make them feel seen and heard without getting defensive. You've never had to clap back,

or you've navigated very awkward or difficult situations with a very high emotional maturity level. And I also never said thank you for sharing. Oh yeah, that's really nice. It's like so nice. It's difficult. Thank you for sharing is a telltale sign of, I don't give a fuck.

I don't know what to say. Right. And you've always like had something to say. Yeah. And I think that is a great quality and it speaks to your emotional intelligence. Thank you. I appreciate it. You know, it's definitely difficult.

I try to go in there and just lead with love, uh, try to listen and try to have a connection with each of the ladies, regardless of how far along we were, you know, in our romance and that aspect. But I tried just had to have a connection with each of the ladies, regardless of how far along we were, you know, in our romance and that aspect, but I just had to have a connection. I really cared about them and each of their stories because you learn a lot about them, you know, and, you know, regardless of how it came off, you know, I really, I really tried to help everybody grow and myself, I grew a lot on that on the show as well. So, yeah. I'm very excited for this ending. Yeah. Um, probably less excited than you are. Yeah.

But well, let me say why I'm excited because like the best, the best possible season is when you're like the lead, because the leads, they really usually know going into hometown weekends. They, you know, if they don't know, they have a pretty good idea. It's usually the producers like being like, well, just keep an open mind. That's the best to say. well, just keep an open mind. You have to keep an open mind. You're like, yeah, I'll keep an open mind, but I'm picking her. And it really seems, you seem really torn, man. Yeah, I think it's a testament to just how the final two, they were amazing and I had connections with both of them and then,

and they were so different. And it just came down to what I was looking for in my life. Who could I relate to the most? And, you know, there's also an extra added pressure on being, you know, the second black bachelor ever. You know, you think that you have to make a decision based off of, you know, what people would want or this or that, but you have to go with your heart. And I think I did that.

I just need a little extra time to sit and really think things through because I wanted this decision to be final. How much extra time did you get? Like 10 minutes? Yeah, it wasn't, listen, you know, everything's never getting much time. You don't get much time. Everything is, you know, they, it's a lot of drama. It didn't take as long as what they say, but I understand they have to play it up and yeah, it just, it was a really hard decision, but this is somebody who's going to be my wife. So I really

tried to approach it like that. And yeah, we got to see how it ends. So did you really not know in the morning you woke up? Listen, I knew, I knew based off of what I needed. But like I said, it was a mixture of things, not wanting to hurt somebody. You know, you have to stand your ground and really decide what your heart wants.

It was between my head and my heart at one point. I had feelings for both. I was in love with both women. And yeah, it just was, one, it was hard for me to hurt somebody on what is gonna be the most important day. It should be the happiest day of your life. And then, like I said, what you think people want you to do, you have to take a step back and be like,

you know what, this is for me, and I'm gonna go with who makes me the happiest. I wanna circle back to your final three women and then get into your final two. But Dina recently went home and I was bummed for you. I was more bummed for Dina. I mean, I know she spoke on why her family didn't wanna come.

I come from a family of 11, like she does. I come from a very religious family, like she did. And maybe not quite as hardcore, I don't know, like being, your dad being a deacon. That's pretty. That's hardcore. But I was disappointed for her because like, I don't know, like, listen, like she's a 31 year old woman.

She's an adult woman. I'm assuming her parents did a great job raising her. She's very accomplished. And it's like, you know, sometimes your kids are gonna do things that maybe you wouldn't do, but like, I feel like you need to show up for your kids. You know, you need to show up. I'm assuming that like her family just in no way at all

supporting this journey of hers drastically impacted your decision because, you know, as great as, and I've always been a big fan of Zoe throughout throughout this season but clearly there's the connection doesn't seem to be there she in her first one-on-one was a hometown you know you and Dina really seemed it there she seemed to be something there but it seemed like as soon as her family was like you know sorry as much as you felt for her and you know got to meet her friends but I gotta assume that played a major role in your decision.

I'm not gonna say it was as big as a factor, as I really just felt bad for Dina and how she, because you want your family to support you on a big day like that, to show up and rally behind you, especially when you're gonna get, looking at it back, you're gonna get opinions from the internet and your family has to have your back.

But I think the whole situation with Zoe is just to clarify, you know, a lot of people maybe question why Zoe made it that far or things of that nature. I think, listen, with Zoe, she grew up in the South and she's a strong black woman. And the way that she comes across off camera, you know, maybe sometimes she's a little defensive and sometimes things like that come into play. But what I will say is every group date, every situation she showed up and she gave her all. And I see where that comes from.

You know, I've dealt with that in the past where you get stigmas placed on you or things like that, and you have to power through those. So I really wanted to help her grow. And I think that, you know, I have empathy. I'm an empath. So like I saw that in Zoe and I saw a place for me to help her to help build her up. I saw a place for growth where I could say, okay, this person and I could relate and I could kind of teach her or show her not how to be, but like how to grow out of a situation when she spent majority of her childhood going through probably, you know, bullying and, you know,

you could tell that she was, she needed some confidence instilled in her. So I tried to be that person. Yeah, I really liked her on the show. I have enjoyed her. Someone who, she's an engineer or something like that? Yeah, she's a tech engineer. Even that, it's a very male dominated profession. So her whole career, she's inserted herself that she's immediately an outsider as a woman of color.

She has to deal with feeling like that already at times. You know, the bachelor house is a very much like, there's always a handful of people who are treated differently or treated like a household because you're not part of the group is things like that. So I really connected with her on that level. I'm glad she's made it as far as she has, but, you know, I know, you, you can't speak on it because we don't know, but it does seem like clearly the connection with Juliana and Latia.

Like it's obvious, like it's so obvious that those are so strong, but like I usually, I feel like, you know, I've been pretty good, you know, at being like, that's the person, you know? I think I've called it a few times, but I truly like between Latia and Juliana, every time you're with both of them, it really seems like that's the person you're most in love with. Yeah.

They're both bring unique sides out of me. And you know, I think that with Jules, uh, with Giuliana, there was something that we could relate to other Jules. I call it Jules. I called Latia TTs. That's true. He didn't call it TTS. I wasn't sure if he just got a spoiler.

That's true. He didn't call Latia TTs. I was just going to spoil it. That's true. He did call her TTs. I'm just corny like that sometimes. Who likes a nickname? Who likes a nickname? No, but I think that she brought a certain side out of me that was, you know, we really related over the addiction and some of the trauma we went through and how we were going

to build each other up and how we could understand each other. And Latia was really nurturing. the addiction and some of the trauma we went through and how we were gonna build each other up and how we could understand each other. And Latia was really nurturing. She is an amazing woman and she has so much to offer and I saw that. So both of them had different aspects that I kind of, that's why I had such a hard time seeing, going down to those final moments.

I think I might've said that you did her a little dirty with the conversation on the rock where she's like, listen, if it's not me, like I'll go. And you were like, I'm kind of locked in. And then you sent her home that night. Right. Right. I blame producers.

Yeah. Nick thinks that that was a, like a producer, like keep her around for the- Why not let her go in that moment? Did you- Cause he didn't get the bat signal. Yeah. I think that, listen, I'm not going to say, listen, I went in there. I knew that, you know, with Carolina, she, the attitude that she had on the dates, you know, not, not a bad attitude, but her demeanor was kind of like, you know,

she, she was questioning and doubting. And, you know, there were, obviously there was things that happened behind that, the scenes that didn't, that weren't necessarily showed on camera, but going in there, you know, there were, obviously there was things that happened behind that, the scenes that didn't, that weren't necessarily showed on camera, but going in there, you know, I was leaning more towards letting go of the relationship, but when, you know, she started to cry and she started to do things, I just, I, she did her thing, she did her thing and I had to defuse the situation, you know, maybe, maybe it would have been a best idea to, to end the relationship there.

I just, yeah, looking back at it, maybe I was trying to be too, too nice, you know, maybe, maybe it would have been a best idea to, to end the relationship there. I just, yeah, looking back at it, maybe I was trying to be too, too nice, you know, and maybe worried about my appearance or how it would look and, you know, when somebody's crying sending them home. But at the end of the day, we definitely had a connection. I tried to mend that as much as possible, you know, and I tried, because I really did have a connection with her. But all the things that got in the way and just her questioning the process and doubting me, it started to really get to me. And right there in that moment, I was trying to, you know, I went in there with the mindset, maybe this is going to work out, but then I had to remember

all the good things that we had and try to fight for the relationship. So. To Nick's point earlier, because I have to say that like watching your season, this is one of the first bachelor seasons where like I'm not fully sure watching throughout who you're going to pick because you have such good chemistry with these women. Did you, I don't know how I can ask this. And I'm like, did you have a first impression on somebody

to where you thought maybe they would make it to the final two and it did happen or like it was the person that you picked or is it something that you like grew to have a relationship with the person and that's how they ended up being a final? Like, did you know? Yeah, the final two, the final two women, I had a connection with them first night,

night one or even the second episode basically, you know? I think that a lot of people, you know, even I'm gonna bring this, even my connection with Alex, she got the first impression. I was curious what happened there. Yeah, I just, our love languages were very different, you know, even, and I'm going to bring this, my, even my connection with Alex, she got the first impression. I'm curious what happened there. Yeah. I just, our love languages were very different, you know, were very different. And not to say that I was more serious because I know she was serious, but she

was not, she wasn't used to the romance and things like that as much, you know, and I, we were trying to work, but ultimately it was just, I just saw the difference there and like I said, she was great, you know, I, uh, we could have moved forward, I just thought it was best that, like I said, she was great. We could have moved forward, I just thought it was best that it didn't happen that way. But as far as my final two, I thought that yeah, we were right on par. I thought the connection was there from night one.

Love it. Have you spoken on the whole like Carolina and Rose with the Askel and like. Yeah, it definitely comes up. I was team Grant for sure. Cause I, you know, I mean, I know people were like out there being like, he actually did say that, but I was like that, not in the context in which he's being accused.

Do you want to elaborate on that? Yeah, so it definitely comes up in the future, but you know, there's a difference between saying, you know, I'm thinking about giving reassurance to somebody and then saying, listen, when I'm with this person, I'm thinking about you. Like, that's not how I meant, when I'm with this person, I'm thinking about you. That's not how I meant it. That's kind of like, that gives off major player vibes

and I wasn't trying to give that off. So I think, yeah, there's just a miscommunication there, but there's a big difference between what I said and then what was said that I said that I said didn't say. So looking back, do you blame, do you think that it was Carolina being kind of little petty or messy or do you think,

Rose seemed to really feel like she didn't realize what she did. She seemed as confused as you were, you know? Or it's just like, I feel like at first when it happened I was more critical of Rose, but then the more the season played out, I was like, I don't know, like this is a... It was messy, it was definitely messy.

This Carolina just... She's not dumb. Well, she definitely is smart. And I think that at the end of the day, it falls on me. I could have done a better job of communicating that, but at the same time, I think that Carolina started to doubt the process from that moment on. So again, I think that Carolina started to doubt the process from that moment on.

So again, I see both sides of it and I understand why Carolina started to act the way that she did because if you're told that somebody, if you're told that you're going to question. So ultimately I think it falls on me and maybe if I would have worded it different or like I said, going in there trying to reassure everybody and just, because I cared, maybe that wasn't the best thing, maybe, you know, but I, in that moment, I genuinely, I had a connection with Rose, you know, we, our first thing we did the blind date, we did the blind,

we were kissing and well, I mean, I was kissing everybody, but. You were kissing everybody. Kissing everybody, but. You let yourself say to yourself now. We definitely, we definitely had a connection. And I saw something, I saw something with her. And after that happened, it kind of just, it went, it spiraled after that.

So I feel like Alicia kind of caught people the most off guard just because night one you had a great kiss, you had great chemistry and then she kind of disappeared and then she was gone the next night. Was there anything that like happened or was it just like, there's just so many other women here that I'm a little bit good at editing. Yeah, we did have a connection, Alicia and I,

but after the basketball date, yeah, I just felt like I had connections that were better in the house that I wanted to explore more and Alicia's an amazing woman she's she's she's great but yeah just wasn't wasn't for me. We are heading into fantasy suites on your mouth but going into fantasy suites you know it's a lot of pressure it's the hardest week it's a lot there's a lot of expectations from some of the ladies. Some of the ladies have boundaries like Latia, where it's like, hey, I got a very strong opinion

about sex and intimacy. Other ladies are like, ready to go. You know, it's like, this is my time to land, my man. You know? And you kind of have to navigate that and various leads go with various expectations. Did you go into fantasy suites with any set boundaries of how you wanted to conduct it yourself,

specifically around sex? Yeah, fantasy suites is really tricky, but I think I handle myself very well. Regardless, like I said, I was, there's a lot of kisses, but I do feel like fantasy suites, I really reserve myself. And because when you get physical intimacy involved, it changes things. It changes things and you, your connection with somebody

is probably, there could be some red flags there and then you guys have sex and then everything's wonderful. So I tried to handle myself really well and I tried to be responsible. And yeah, my expectation was I wasn't going in there saying I'm not going to, but it had to be, I had to know that this person was my person in order for me to engage.

And at that point, I didn't know who was my person. So he didn't fuck. He didn't fuck. Well, I didn't say that directly. I didn't say you didn't do other things. I didn't say they do other things, but yeah, I handled myself well, you know? And then also too, like I said,

there's always the pressure and the stereotype of, you know, me being the second black bachelor, but yeah, I handled myself well, you know? And then also too, like I said, there's always the pressure and the stereotype of, you know, me being the second black bachelor, you know, people are going to think I'm a player or this or that, or I'm just trying to get my rocks off. And I wasn't, you know, I went in there with real intentions and, you know, prior to that, I had been celibate for a year. So I got, I got out of a seven year relationship and I was hurting. So like, you know, sex is great, but I wanted to make sure it was with somebody who was my person and then we could fuck all the time.

But you fuck sex then. Hey. Yeah, I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. Are you nervous? I mean, obviously, Women Tell All has been filmed. It airs this Monday, this upcoming Monday.

Right. Does it? Is it Monday? This Monday. That was an argument we had earlier. Next Monday or this Monday? This Monday, I upcoming Monday? Right. Does it? Is it Monday? This Monday. That was an argument we had earlier. Next Monday or this Monday? This Monday, I believe.

Well, how would you describe, would you say this Monday or next Monday? Well, I mean, I think, well, what day are we at? Wednesday. Wednesday, so, shit, that's a good question. I would say this Monday. The following Monday has passed, so it will be this coming Monday. Okay. How did that go for you?

Were you nervous? Were you questioned? Were you interrogated? How did it go? I was interrogated. Like I said, I was definitely, some of the ladies had questions for me, which I could understand.

I could understand it's not easy being a bachelor. It's not an easy feat. It's not an easy job. And yeah, I had to answer to some things, but like I said, I just took accountability and the worst thing you could do in my situation is get emotional and you know, emotional to the point where you start to clap back and do something back. So whatever feelings you had, I just took accountability and I'm not perfect. You know, I, you know, I may not be the best, you know, but I did my and I'm not perfect. I may not be the best, but I did my best and I think that the ladies perceived that well. And yeah, I did my best. What's the most surprising thing that you've learned about yourself going through this process?

It was like a therapy session for me, honestly. Situation coming up, you're going to see me reconnect with my dad and me just knowing I had a lot of stuff inside that I was just holding in. As a man, I try to always be strong and try to keep that face, that brave face, but sometimes you got to let it out. You got to let it out. You got to be in tune with your emotions. And I feel like I tried that.

Not that I tried that, but this journey really awakened that in me, my emotional side and to say, it's okay to speak on how you feel, as long as you're not crying everywhere. There's a place and time as a man to let yourself be vulnerable. I think it's a strength. Absolutely. And also, are you surprised that the process worked

in the way that it has? No, I think the process works if you go in there and you're ready. If, well, not to say that, but for there's also external factors. But for me, because I was at a point where I was like super ready, I did my, I did my best to make it work. You know? And like I said, obviously there's external factors, you know, it's both

people that have to make it work. But from my end, you know, I was ready. I've noticed that this season is a bit truncated compared to previous ones. When I was hometowns for my season was week nine to this week six. Did you have any conversations with the producers about this being shorter than previous seasons or did you even realize that? No, I did. I did realize it was shorter.

There's some things with the network, obviously I don't really know, you know, maybe scheduling or things like that, but listen, I was emotionally, I was getting drained. So I mean, I'm glad it was only six, six or seven weeks because I would have started to spiral if it wasn't so. Yeah. I mean, when I, I'm thinking about just like, in terms of like, how does that affect your ability to fall in love and things like that? I think we're, and my guess is probably not much. For me, I kinda knew who I was gonna pick fairly early on and things like that.

And a lot of the other weeks and other dates are more just like the drama and the TV element. So you felt like it didn't really affect your ability to connect with the people that you cared about the most. No, it didn't affect my ability. I'm a lover boy, so I was falling like, you know, it doesn't take me a lot. See, I was falling like week two. So I was like, it didn't really take a lot. But it does. It does. When you start to fall and then you form another connection here, that's where things you wish

you had a little more time to kind of like really figure things out. How scary was hometowns in the sense of like, usually you're meeting somebody's just one set of parents or family or friends and it's like you did four. So like- I did a lot. Back to back, you know, like how did that feel like having to prepare for a diff, was it three?

Well, Dina's family didn't. Well, still friends. Couple friends. There's a lot of friends too. Friends are scarier than family sometimes. Yeah, no, not that I was scared. At first, you walk in there with nerves. You might be a little nervous, but then when you meet the families and they're so welcoming and cool, it's like, oh, this isn't hard.

I'm just being myself. Going in there, I was a little nervous, but I said, if I'm just going to be myself and whoever accepts me for me, that's a sign. When Julianna's dad was like, hey, kissing my daughter, did you get a little tight in the stomach or did you know he was joking? Nah, I knew he was joking. He was such a cool guy.

I knew he was messing around. I'd like to play a little game. Let's do it. Okay, let's do it. What do we got? Okay. And I wanna apologize, if you are in a relationship, I do want to apologize to the one you picked

because I want to ask you to describe what a life would be like with Jules. And then I want you to describe to me what a life would be like with Latia. Titi. Titi. And Zoe. And Zoe.

We still have Zoe. You can pick Titi. And Zoe. And Zoe. We still have Zoe. He could pick. He could. All respect to Zoe, love Zoe, but he's not saying anything. It was true. I was like, there's not.

I'm just not gonna make him do that. Okay. If he wants to do that, he is welcome to do that. And I know he can't say anything specifically, but this is my question. It's my game. Okay, oh my God. And again, I do want to apologize if you are in a relationship with the person you are in relationship with because it's no fun to

Hear grant describe what a relationship would be like with someone he decided not to pay for sure Yeah, so I want to recognize that whoever you are to TT or jewels. This is a me question. Don't get mad at grant You can hate me. Okay Describe to me what a life with Jules would be like. I think it would be very family orientated. I think it would be fun. I think it would be a lot of us building each other up and healing each other from our past experiences

that we went through. And I think it would be a relationship founded in friendship. Where would y'all be living? Yeah, thank you very much. You're welcome. Probably on the East Coast. Okay. Probably on the East be living? Yeah, thank you very much. You're welcome. Probably on the East coast. Okay. Probably on the East coast.

You know, I grew up on the East coast. So yeah, typically maybe in the city somewhere. Okay. What would like your nights look like? Are we like going out to dinner? Are we cooking? Are we watching a movie? Are we hitting the clubs?

Okay. Yeah, we might, we might hit a bar too, but you know, I think wine, some, some great food, some good vibes, some good friends, and then maybe we might go out and dance. How quickly would a relationship with you and Jules result in children? Oh man, I think, yeah, I don't know about immediately. I think that my time horizon is before I'm 35. Before I leave?

I'm 31. Okay. So I think that it would be something that we take on, you know, you can't really say, you can't really, you could plan it out, but I think it would just be something that happens instead of us being like, we want it by this time. Where would your first trip together be as a couple?

Probably, probably Italy. He's Italian. Oh, yeah, so far. Okay. That's a good place. Okay. Titi. Titi.

All right, All right. Yeah. With Latia or TT, I think it would be, um, you know, like another relationship rooted in family. I think that it would be, um, a lot of similar, uh, morals that we have. I think it will be fun, loving, loving, nurturing. I think it'll be very serious. And I think that, um, you know, the family aspect, it would be something that we would be getting into

sooner rather than later. Yeah, her family did very much not hold back that she's ready for children. Are you talking about the kids part? Yeah, it would be like probably in a year or two. And where would y'all be living? But does that work with your 35 year old? Yeah, it's anywhere before 35.

Oh, okay. Yeah, anywhere before 35. So if it's like, you know, if that's 32, 33, then it's that. But if it's 35, it's just whenever it happens. Where are y'all living? Probably somewhere either on the East Coast or somewhere in Utah. Aren't you in Texas now?

I'm in Texas. So you're getting the fuck out of Texas no matter what. Why are you staying in Texas? You're out of there. Oh, I've been there for a while. I have property there, so I can leave that. And for me, I've been alone for a while. So I probably would would go to where my fiance is happy. You

know what I'm saying? And I would build probably build around that. What's Jules's favorite movie? And what's TT's favorite movie? Oh, that's a good question. Um, hmm. I would say for for Latia, I think it's it would definitely be a rom-com, like the notebook. I know that's cliche, but we had talked about that. And I think for Juliana, it would probably be

the Godfather, the Goodfellas, what is it? Both there's Goodfellas and Godfather. She's Italian, it's a Godfather. The Godfather, the Goodfellas Godfather. Who cooks, who's cooking in each of these relationships? I cook, I love to cook. My desk, that's the way that my dad kind of like showed love to me.

He would like make me food and it was weird cause he'd like watch me eat it. I don't know, it was a weird thing, but I probably would cook, but we both cook, you know? There's room for growth, both of us. Room for growth. Room for growth, you know? Room for growth in that.

Who's making the bed? I'm not the best bed maker, so. You know what Nick said the other day, he hasn't made a bed since middle school. I'm with him, bro. My mind is like all over the place, so. You know, I don't make my bed like that, so. What's the point?

What's the point? You're gonna get back in later. You're gonna get back in there. That is not true, because if he gets into a bed that's not made, he's like, really wish this was made. Right, right. Well, now that I have a wife who can make my bed, like, I was like, do your, I'm just kidding. No, but seriously, when you, Really wish this was made No, but seriously when you wait there's something good about getting to a bet it's better sleeping in a bed that's made than when that's not

Right before you get in at night you can like straighten out You just straight it out right I'm sticking with my job. I think he picks jewels well I am I I love Latia so much. So I'm hoping it's her. Jules has been my day one. I will say on first episode, I picked Latia and Jules to the final two. Yeah. So.

She did. What gave that away? She has eyes. It's like really obvious. I actually, I did not. I think it was just, I saw the connection. I think they are both so stunning. I think they're both so smart. I think they're funny.

I think y'all had a good connection. I want it to be Latia just because. She's amazing. I just see it. I just see it. We did say that Latia looks like she is like a creature, like a siren, like a creature from like fantasy. When she was riding that horse in the woods,

I was like, who is this beautiful creature? was riding that horse in the woods, I was like, who is this beautiful creature? Bambi. Mean creature in the best possible way. Like Bambi, like she's like, yeah. Yeah. But obviously if it's Juliana, I also like love her and like wanted you to pick her as well. You know what I'm saying? I am team both.

We have to, we got to tune in and see. I think you had an amazing connection with both. I think you really were torn. And I think as much of a man as a God as you might be, I feel like Latia's faith is unique and different than yours and I can't help but wonder, well, I think regardless, that made your choice challenging, right? Because she's very passionate about her religion

and like you had six or seven weeks to get to know all these women, you know, and both these women. And I don't know, like, I feel like it would be impossible in that environment, in your shoes, to get whatever clarity you would need to know is like, is this something we could make work, we could do? Like you clearly had all the respect in the world

for her faith and her family, and they were wonderful to you and very welcoming, but like, I think whatever decision you made, you made a huge leap of faith because that's the choice. Like it's always a leap of faith. You're saying like in the timeframe that we had, that being a question was a really big-

That's another decision that, that's another decision you have to figure out. That's another leap of faith. It's like, it's one thing, you know, can we are we compatible? And I feel like ultimately that's why you ended up picking Jules. Well, we gotta, we gotta see, you know.

Tune in. Tune in, you know. Team Zoni. Of course. Yes, Justice for Zoe. Have you picked fucking Zoe after all that? That was crazy. Did you see that Alex said that you playing?

Was it Nick? I saw that. Like I said, I tried. I've never done that before. I tried something new. We were in the mall and the producers brought out a piano. I'm like, well, fuck it.

I might as well just go, fuck it. But I don't regret it. I tried something, put myself out there. She's the goofy one. Yeah. I thought you liked fun and games. If anything, Alex was the one that I thought she would receive that.

You brought out a llama. You brought out a llama. But yo, it's not something I, you know, I think it was something that, you know, I tried it. You tried. You win some, you lose some. Overall, just, you happy you said yes to this experience? Yeah, I'm very happy.

I'm very happy. I learned a lot about myself and, you myself and the outcome I'm happy with. When you released Party Girls. Great song. Great song. Great song. First of all. Listen, there's mixed reviews, but I did it

because that's how I was feeling. Did the producers, did they know you were gonna talk? No, I just did it. I went rogue. Did you get a talking to? You know something, the original idea was, because love and music are synonymous, so there was gonna be a story for each episode with each woman, and night one was a party, you know?

But then- They said no. Yeah, and automatically I got so much backlash. They said reel that the fuck in. I was like, pull that shit in. Don't do it. I'm like, oh shit. I mean, that's me.

It was good, man. That's my personality, you know? I'm creative, I like. I mean, that's me. That's me. It's good, man. Like I. That's my personality, you know, like I, I, I'm creative. I like to have fun and love doesn't have to look one way. It's not linear. Yeah. We got to make that a bop this summer. I think you should lean in when you get done to that end.

Obviously, you know, I know when I say what's next, and you're going to be like, I'm going to focus on love and like going back to normal and blah, blah, blah. But like, listen, this is an incredible opportunity. You were gifted. I had turned that opportunity into what I'm doing now. It opened up a lot of doors for me. Like this experience does give you incredible access, right?

So like all the, you know, fans and like pressuring you into like not talking about this opportunity because I think you can both be serious about finding love and take advantage of this gift that you were given. Like what would you like to do next? And how would you like to use this opportunity because I think you can both be serious about finding love and take advantage of this gift that you were given. Like what would you like to do next? How would you like to use this opportunity? You don't get to say give back. No, no, no. Yes, you will give back. I am sure you will donate your time and you will use it for good, but selfishly, what do you want to do with this experience and how would you like to utilize it? Yeah, I think in love, there's a whole, obviously the, the bachelor has a very,

um, they have an audience that's been with them for so long. I think that on the other side, there's people that, that see it a little differently, you know, so in my creative mind, I'm like, okay, well, how could you kind of be the host of a show where you match me, you know, so I came up with this concept, it's called spin the block. It would be a woman or a lady who would be the prize. And then a man who maybe needs an upgrade,

he will come to her. She has a choice to say like, okay, would you want to date this guy? No, he has a chance to spend the day with me being me. And then I would, you know, teach him how to dress, teach him how to talk, you know, maybe I'll teach him how to- Is this a TV show? No, like a YouTube series, but it, teach them how to dress, teach them how to talk, you know, and maybe I'll teach them how to- Is this a TV show?

No, like a YouTube series, but it would have to be obviously approved. But it would, and then after that, after you ever seen Hitch? Yeah. It would be me playing the role of Hitch. And then after that he comes back. And then if they like each other,

after he quote unquote spun the block, it would, you know- I think you should ask for forgiveness and not permission. Yeah, I gotta, yeah, but obviously I gotta, I gotta see what, but that's just a concept, you know? So something like that. You're obviously a creative person

and your creativity has talent behind it. So that's a fun idea. And listen, I hit fuck, man. Like I trial and if that doesn't work out, man, just keep fucking swinging, keep trying things. I was roller skating, doing shirtless Bob Ross paintings. I was trying it all, man. You try it.

You gotta figure it out. Figure it out. And I think that has a cultural relevance to it. Like I said, that's a saying that people say in culture, like I'm gonna spin the block. It's something that, it's culturally relevant and it may be open to a different audience that sees love a little differently than what's presented on the Bachelor.

Well, that's awesome, man. Well, very excited to see how things play out for you. Whoever you end up with, it sounds like you have some great women at the end. And wait, one more question. Go ahead, ask away. How nervous are you to talk to your runner up? I'm not nervous. I think that obviously I'm going to have to answer to some things, you know, which is, it's, it's, that's normal, but I led with my heart and I laid it out there and you can't go wrong as long as you're honest.

And as long as you put it all out there. So I'm not nervous. Do you anticipate hurt feelings? I do. I do. I mean, I'm not nervous. Do you anticipate hurt feelings? I do. I do. I mean, I would be hurt. Have you made any contact whatsoever with that person since filming? No, I didn't. And the reason being, it's just out of respect

for everybody. I just don't feel like it's, I don't think it's the right thing. I think that, you know, things will be answered on that day. To your knowledge, are Jules and Latia close? I don't, I don't, I'm not sure. I'm not sure. You know? Okay. All right, Grant, it's been fun talking to you, man. Wish you the best of luck.

Excited to see if you are with someone I anticipate that you might be. And I'm excited to see who that is. And, uh, you know, selfishly, I do hope you run up a little piss so that we can like, you know, have some drama, but like, listen, man, like you, you, you should be really proud of how you handle yourself. like, you know. I can get grilled at that. Yeah, some drama. But like, listen man, like you should be really proud of how you handle yourself. You were an exceptional bachelor. Appreciate it. I think so. And you know, congratulations on your journey

and excited to see how it ends. Means a lot coming from you Nick, I appreciate it man, for real. All right buddy. Take care. Thank you guys. Thank you. Hope you guys enjoyed this episode. Thank you to our guests, Ingrid Andress and Grant Ellis.

So much fun talking to both of them. Be sure to join us tomorrow for a very electric and awesome Going Deeper with one of the finalists from Traders. It's definitely gonna be the person you want to hear from the most. I promise you that. Also, if you haven't listened to Tuesday's Reality Recap,

Taylor Anne Green was with us along with Carolyn from Traders. It was a wild and wacky episode. Be sure to check that out as well. We'll see you tomorrow. Bye.