The Viall Files - E910 - Joel Kim Booster, Grant & Juliana, Temptation Island, Summer House, Southern Charm, RHOBH & RHOA

Episode Date: April 1, 2025

Welcome back to The Viall Files: Reality Recap!  It’s the start to an incredible week, as we’re joined by the hilarious Joel Kim Booster to squash some beef with Nick, give his takes on Summer House, Southern Charm, RHOBH, RHOA, and talk about the upcoming hit show Love Hotel! Later, we catch up with Bachelor Nation's newest happy couple, Grant and Juliana, to get their perspective post AFR and how their relationship is doing! Meanwhile, we debate Chappell Roan’s take on parenting, recap the Temptation Island reunion, and more! You will not want to miss it.  “I think I owe you an apology...” Subscribe to The ENVY Media Newsletter Today: https://www.viallfiles.com/newsletter  OUT NOW! Listen to Humble Brag with Cynthia Bailey and Crystal Kung Minkoff. Available wherever you get your podcasts and YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@humblebragpod https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/humble-brag-with-crystal-and-cynthia/id1774286896 Start your 7 Day Free Trial of Viall Files + here: https://viallfiles.supportingcast.fm/  Please make sure to subscribe so you don’t miss an episode and as always send in your relationship questions to [e-mail] to be a part of our Monday episodes. Follow us on X/Twitter: https://twitter.com/TheViallFiles Listen To Disrespectfully now! Listen on Apple: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/disrespectfully/id1516710301 Listen on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/0J6DW1KeDX6SpoVEuQpl7z?si=c35995a56b8d4038 Watch on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCCh8MqSsiGkfJcWhkan0D0w To Order Nick’s Book Go To: http://www.viallfiles.com  If you would like to get some texting advice on Office Hours send an email to [e-mail] with “Texting Office Hours” in the subject line! To advertise on this podcast please email: [e-mail] or go to: https://advertising.libsyn.com/theviallfiles   THANK YOU TO OUR SPONSORS: BetterHelp - Your well-being is worth it. Visit https://betterhelp.com/viall today to get 10% off your first month.  Bilt - Start paying rent through Bilt and take advantage of your Neighborhood Benefits by going to https://joinbilt.com/viall  Cymbiotika - Wellness, made simple. Go to https://cymbiotika.com/viall for 20% off and Free Shipping. Timestamps: (00:00) - Intro (06:07) - Household Headlines (20:12) - Joel Kim Booster Joins (28:58) - Wedding Planning (33:52) - Paige and Craig (35:50) - Southern Charm (49:47) - Summer House (55:09) - RHOBH (01:03:07) - RHOA (01:07:36) - Love Hotel (01:14:18) - Joel Thoughts (01:15:37) - Grant and Juliana  (01:42:03) - Bachelor Thoughts (01:47:50) - Outro Episode Socials: @viallfiles @nickviall @nnataliejjoy @ihatejoelkim @grantellis__ @julianapasquarosa @ciaracrobinson @justinkaphillips @the_mare_bare @leahgsilberstein @dereklanerussell 

What's going on everybody. Welcome back to another exciting episode of the VyLFiles Reality Recap Edition. I am your host Nick and boy every week just gets better and better. Cause boy, we have a jam pack week lined up for you this week. This week we have Joel Kim booster joining us momentarily this episode along with your happy couple, Grant and Juliana to talk about their new relationship, their fallout from the AFR, thoughts on Latia's comments, the diss video that Carolina, Grant had a video, popped up, came down, what's going on?

There are so many burning questions. And then tomorrow, get ready, it's a very special Going Deeper, one that's been in the works, I think for the better part of a year, Tom Sandoval returned to the Vile Files following his, what many call, the most talked about maybe episode of the Vile Files of all time when Tom first graced us with his photograph of a tiger. Was he on time? You'll

have to find out. Anyways, tomorrow also his lady his girlfriend his woman Victor His girlfriend his girlfriend His lover female his Partner his girlfriend his mother Victoria is also with us and it's a nice little glimpse into their relationship I think many of you will be very interested in what Tom has to say I think you should be very excited to hear this episode. I was very excited to sit with him.

It is just me, Nellie was not feeling well when that was going on. Well, it was the day that I had my DNC procedure, so I was not able to make it in the studio. Unfortunately, I wish I could have been called Dude a couple more times, but you know. You know, I would have loved to see you there, because I would have been called dude a couple more times, but you know, maybe next time. I would have loved to see you there because I would have really loved your opinion

whether you've seen any growth from Tom, any maturity, what you thought about the relationship. I thought it was really interesting. Well, I'll have to watch it back and I'll give you my thoughts on Thursday. How about that? Okey dokey. Plus we got a jam packed episode on Thursday

of Reality Recap, so be sure to tune in to that next week gets even better guys I'm telling you so temptation island reunion. Thank you guys. Obviously. I hope you guys all enjoyed it It was a it was a fun ride for all the people who were hoping that Brion and Shantae were there So do we but you know, honestly, I think it kind of worked out It was it was a full room. Yeah, you know, we, I think it kind of worked out. It was, it was a full room. You know, we only had about three hours of recording time with them. I tell you what though, you understand why when you hear about how those like Bravo reunions go and they take like hours and hours of film, I mean, we,

we were pretty efficient. Like we were really going, the conversation was, I mean, it was fast paced. There was really no like, It was hard to get Grant to talk about anything other than Ashley's TikToks, to be honest with you. He was very steadfast on her posting TikToks. Yes, yes, yes, yes. He was like, yes, I know I cheated, but did you see the TikToks?

But you posted a mean TikTok of me. Listen, I'm very appreciative of all the cast who showed up. I mean, none of them had to go, they all put themselves out there and put themselves in clearly a very uncomfortable situation. So we very much appreciate all of them. And yeah, I mean, listen, it was interesting to hear all their perspectives.

When you meet them in person, it's hard not to humanize them. Like you meet them and like they're charming sides to all of them. They may all have things like they're charming sides to all of them, you know? They may all have things to work on, but yeah, that was a... I will say, I don't think Grant was the biggest fan of me after that interview.

I don't know if it was my question about his daughter or if it was me challenging him on Ashley's TikToks, but he did not want a photo with me and he did not want to say goodbye to me, so. You kind of clocked him. It was pretty great, I gotta say. I think he's mad at me. Yeah, he's an emotional guy.

I hope that Grant, and he does think he has more to work on, there's just a little bit of like for Grant, because it's like these past six months, he's like worked really hard, you know? And I think for anyone who's maybe, it was some bare minimum stuff. I think, I understand it was maybe hard for him, but like the way he was describing how meaningful that period of time was where he just wasn't cheating on Ashley. My wish for Grant that is that he keeps working on

himself and he expects a little bit more of himself going forward. As far as Brienne and Shantae have it all, yeah, I mean, my same questioning that I would have asked him was similar to Grant's. It's just like, I empathize with his upbringing, his childhood, but it's just like that was seemed to be shown to us as a way to feel sorry for him about his decisions in the house. It's like, we can still empathize with Breon's childhood and still hold him accountable for how he was or wasn't as a boyfriend. And I still don't really understand why checking a threesome off your list

is such a thing for him and his ability to victimize himself. I would have loved some clarity but. There was a lot of jaw dropping moments. I was definitely very like, ugh, at multiple times. So if you haven't watched or listened to that episode, you very much should.

You should check it out. Shante was gonna come. For a moment, we thought it was gonna be nine of them. And then we had heard that she had opted out because of optics, like she didn't wanna come without Breon, who apparently couldn't get off because of work purposes but we heard they tried so that's just what we heard how accurate that is or isn't we don't know but anyways be sure to check it out wherever wherever you listen to podcast

you can certainly watch it on YouTube as well it is a spectacle and we glad you all for those who you did watch I'm glad you guys all very much enjoyed it. What is going on with Justin Bieber? Is he? No, what is going on with Chappell Rhone? Oh, we won't start there. Mary? Chappell Rhone says that she doesn't know

anyone who is happy with children. Go ahead. She says they're all in hell. Go ahead. I think that Chappell Rhone, here's my thing. Is she kind of a hater in general? Yes. And I think that's a fair, like to criticize her

for kind of just like having it. Exactly. So am I. But doesn't she identify as a feminist? Yeah, I mean, I don't know what her like deep, I think she, Chappell Rhone, I think I relate to her in the way that like she just says shit Yeah, and sometimes I just say shit too. Like just like yeah

I'm not really thinking about what's gonna come out of my mouth before I say it and I don't really think fairness to you You are a budding young You know full of potential young person. Young, hot, young. She is a position of immense power and influence with a very dedicated and influential audience. Yeah, she's also.

And she's out there just winging it. Yeah, and you know what? Respect to that, because I don't know if I would do well in that position getting famous like overnight I think I would probably say a lot of stupid things as well there is that and I understand why people are frustrated with this comment and I Think my take on it personally. I'm not saying it's right or wrong. I think that like she is a 26 year old lesbian who does not like want that in her life

and she's projecting and she's like no every single person with kids is fucking miserable and it made me laugh personally. Do I believe it's true? No. Did I think it was funny? Yes. What are the chances? Because like when Nellie and I first we first we got a dog and then then it was like, ooh, you know? These dogs really come in handy. We wanna leave a party early. You know, it's like, oh, we got dogs. Boy, those dogs, ugh, they get you every time. And then when we had a daughter, it was like,

ugh, we got a daughter, we have to go home. And it was like, ugh, the kids are so hard. You know, so it's like kind of, it's a really great get out of jail free card. Any chance that her friends have been like, kind of like, oh, that damn kid of ours. Oh, it's so tough. And they like, yeah, sorry, Chappell,

we can't come to your party. Or we have to leave early. And they keep blaming it on their kids. And maybe it Chappell's perception of her friends with kids are it's just like, they never can hang out with me. They can't go to the Pink Pony Club anymore. Because they keep blaming on their kids. Yeah.

You think that's maybe it? That could be it. I mean, I don't wanna speak for chapel, but yeah. I do feel like her friends are probably like, what the fuck bitch, I'm not in hell, I'm not miserable. Did I, no, I love my kids. Please don't put that out there. Joy.

I will say I'm in a group chat right now and we're talking about a party and my friend invited one of my best friends' kids as well. And she's like, she said, he said, your son's invited too, didn't have his phone number. And she said, 1-800-possessed-demon-three-nager, send help. And her son just turned three

and he's developed new behaviors, you know? So that's where I'm also kind of like. So maybe that's where Chappell's getting. Yeah, where it's just like, she You know, so that's why I'm also kind of like. So maybe that's where Chappell's getting. Yeah, where it's just like, she loves her son, she's happy, she would never like, wanna give him back or anything. But like, it's just like, she's like,

nope, he's going through stage right now and I don't know if I hate him. I will say Chappell has a really great ability to make being famous sound like really hard work. Mm-hmm. You know, like her plight of a celebrity, she's like comparing it to like some real blue-collar work there. I think people also are, it's not blue-collar work at all. It definitely is a privilege,

but I think what she's saying, like her take on fame is really interesting because it's kind of saying what everybody knows out loud about her level of fame and how it happened and how people treat pop stars, young women pop stars, you know what I mean? I enjoy it and I think people are really, get real weird about her really quick and I don't understand it. I can't imagine if someone looked at Chappell

and was like, oh my God, you're so miserable. You're definitely like in hell right now. Like, and said all of the things that she said about mothers to her, I think she would handle that very terribly. Oh yeah, probably. So it's like, how can she dish out to all of these women that like, yeah, anyone with kids,

like you're probably very fucking miserable and you're unhappy. And it's like, for her audience, like how can you? I do think it is important to clarify that a lot of what she's saying and like recent interviews are just her kind of clowning. Like, yeah, she's not saying things to me. How do you know when she's being truthful? Like, how can you?

I mean, just if you know Chappell, you know her. Like, just her presence is to be like. So is this one of those things where it's just like the comedians are like, well, I'm a comedian. No, I mean, when she was on the red carpet and everyone was like. So that means I mean, it's a bit. It's a like, well, I'm a comedian. No, I mean- So when she was on the red carpet and everyone was like, So that being said, I mean, Was that a bit?

It's a bit, but also to answer your question, I don't think she's like grumpy about being famous, but if you watch how she like presents herself in like interviews, that she's uncomfortable. Like you can tell she's still like getting used to it and like kind of like overwhelmed by it. Oh, she was like belting out singing songs

on that interview where it's like, if I'm uncomfortable, the last thing I'm gonna do, I don't care if I'm like the best singer in the world is sing in front of one person. But she is a singer. So like for her to sing, it's different from her to like present her life. She mentioned remembering to eat being like a real chore. Yeah, she did.

But that's her thing. Eat, eat, eat, I have to eat. She's just saying things to say things though. She's not being like, this is like literally like true. But that's dangerous as someone who is in a position of power, like she is famous. She does have all these young fans and to like not take that role seriously,

like you are given this platform and to let it just like say shit to say shit and be like, ha ha ha, don't take me serious. I actually don't have a problem with her saying shit to say shit. It is long, it is chapel, doesn't come for anyone else for saying shit. Yeah. You know?

You can't be mad at a paparazzi for whatever the fuck they said that one time. If you wanna be goofy and messy, I'm like ah. Go be goofy and messy and ah. But you don't, you do not get to criticize others. I enjoy watching her figure it out. And I don't, I think that she's a real true diva that we're getting in pop music and I love a diva Mariah Carey says shit you

know Lady Gaga says shit Chapel Rhone says shit I just don't think the young generation is listening to Chapel and being like that's Jesus like what she's saying is you don't think so I mean that's Jesus. Like what she's saying is true. You don't think so? That's how everyone treated Britney Spears. That's how everyone treated Lady Gaga. It's like any pop star. Maybe we shouldn't be treating. Well, of course not. Of course.

I don't think that, I don't think like how, I don't think they, you have to be a role model. It is different though. Like you can choose not to be a role model. Britney was like America's sweetheart. So of course they're gonna look at her and be like, she knows everything. But Chapel is like, she's here to troll.

Troll. So it's like. And trolling she is. Yeah, she's here to troll. Troll. Like, so it's like. Well, and trolling she is. Yeah. She's making compensations. I think people need to put Hailey Bieber in the category of leave them the fuck alone.

Hailey Bieber specifically. Agreed with that one. It will never end. I just don't care. These people are just like constantly trying to tear Hailey Bieber and Justin Bieber apart, and it makes zero fucking sense to me. I will say, he didn't help with the post of her

with Irreplaceable playing over it. Have you seen that? No. On his main feed, he posted a photo of her. It's an amazing song. Irreplaceable. Is that a song that you're gonna miss on? I would be on same, but it's like, you must not know about me.

Like, to the left, to the left, all the things you've owned in the box, to the left. Like, it's pretty much a breakup song, but he posted it about her, because I think he just was like, she's irreplaceable. The amount of songs that I like haven't fully like listened to the lyrics that I love. Nick posted a video of some fucking wild turkeys

to Heidi Montags, I'll do it. That's kind of hiding some love. Wait, that's kind of great. But to wild turkeys, like, okay. No, I see the vision. I see the vision. I see the vision. I'm the same way. It's the vibe, not the lyrics.

It's not that deep is really the answer to that. So Justin Bieber, it's not that deep. Oh, it's definitely not that deep with Justin. I am a little concerned about his internet engagement. He's trolling. Deactivate the account. And that's fine if he's trolling, but what if he's not? Oh, wow.

It's like these people are professionals. They've been in this business for so long. You don't think they are aware that if Haley unfollows Justin on Instagram, that it's going to be a national story. Like, you don't think they know that. You don't think they're having a conversation about that. Like, I think everything they do, they're like aware of what they're doing. But he did post a story that said really tried to to play nicey nice, nicey nicey.

Where I'm like, who do you think he's talking to? What if that's lyrics to his next song that's coming out? He was on live, like playing music that's unreleased that was maybe not the best music. He's trying new things. He's being experimental. Yeah. A lyrical genius. Yes.

He was very kind to us at a Christmas party. So we were here to- Yeah. He seemed super sweet, yeah. Very sweet. I mean, the amount of like, this man had zero reason to even look in my direction. And he like complimented Nick and I. He like danced with me.

He gave us hugs goodbye. A real pleasure. He's a good person. Kind of man. Would die for him. Just hope he's doing well. Never say never. And listen, I think he has a son.

I think, remember when, right after we had River and we're recording and everyone in the comments like, oh my God, Nick looks so tired. He looks fucked up. Why does he look like that? And it's like, well, we have a newborn. Like we're not sleeping. And it was just like, everyone's like,

worried about Nick, hope Nick's okay. Were some people worried about me? You remember that, don't play dumb. You were like, do I really look that bad? Like why is everyone saying that? I look so tired. I'm not playing dumb. I do not remember that, but. You dumb. You were like, do I really look that bad? Like, why is everyone saying that? I look so tired. I'm not playing dumb, I do not remember that. But when I was born?

Yeah, we had a whole conversation about it. We were like, everyone keeps saying I look bad. Oh, and I look tired. You're being a good father. I think it's like, he's probably a little delusional. He's not getting a lot of sleep. Like, they have a newborn. All right, up next, Joel Kim Booster joins us

to talk about his new project, Love Hotel. Also get into a little bravo with us as well. I'm curious if he has been watching The Summer House. The Craig appearance with his bros on Watch What Happens Live was interesting. I will say Craig right now thinks he's winning this breakup. Yeah. Which is interesting. I think say Craig right now thinks he's winning this breakup. Yeah.

Which is interesting. I think Paige thought she was winning it before. I think the real winner of this breakup will eventually be the person who stops talking about it. First. First, yeah. Well, I mean, when do you stop talking? You can only stop talking about it

when people stop asking you about it, you know? No, I think you- What's he gonna say on live television with Andy Cohen? Like, I think I'm done talking about it. He could. But it was so funny when he was like, you came in backstage, when they asked him like what he's annoyed about, and he's like,

well, you came in backstage and said, you don't want this whole thing to be about Paige and the breakup, and this whole thing has been about Paige and the breakup. Like every question somehow went back to, and like, so how did, did Paige cheat on you? Like, he was just like, I don't fucking know. Yeah.

Anyways, let's get Joel's thoughts, and that's up next. This episode of The Live Files is sponsored by BetterHelp. Listen people, we get it. Listen, therapy can be inconvenient. It can be pricey. It can take a lot of time, but like so does a lot of things that you do that go into your life in terms of self care,

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Join, build.com slash V-I-A-L to sign up for a build today. Joel, welcome to the Vilephiles. Oh my God, thank you so much for having me. We're so excited to have you. We're all very big fans of you here. You know, it's interesting you bring that up, Nick. Because, no, no, I mean, we chatted about this a little bit before I came on. But there were a few episodes, I think,

where you, where my name was dropped, and you, in fact, said the complete opposite of me, of you being a fan of mine. And we sort of worked it out on the remix over DM, but so no hard feelings, and also I kind of like, if there's anyone who understands popping off in the moment and not me. That's what I was hoping for.

Not me. I think I completely understand that and I think, yeah, no, and listen, I, you know. What did I say? Because I do, I think I owe you an apology but I want to know what I'm apologizing for. You said that is not the kind of person I would want in my orbit.

I used to be a fan, I am no longer a fan. And when I did the apology, this was the only thing that was a little confusing to me. You said it was a weak move and like, little boy shit or something like that. And this is what I will say about that, is that like, and I'll show you the text messages from executives asking me not to apologize

and let it like die on its own. So I did genuinely want to do that because I did genuinely like took the time. It was a lot going on after that all went down and it took, trust me, like no one was more upset with me than my fiance and that was like a really rough time. And so I regretted it pretty much immediately,

but it took me like those two weeks to sort of really find the words to really like, how do I accept responsibility for this and take accountability for this without trying to like shift it in any sort of way. And you know, maybe I wasn't super successful in that, but it was not a mandate for me to do that. And it was something that I did want to genuinely do because, and I said it like, listen,

I'm not gonna sit here and say that's not me because clearly it is, that is a part of me that is not a part that I wanna access all the time and I work very hard not to access. And so that was the only thing that you said, because when you were saying the other stuff in Shannon's presence, I was like, well, you kinda gotta play ball in that way.

But that was like, I was like, I think I really did want it to come off like I was taking responsibility for it. And so. I was taking responsibility for it. So. I was too harsh. No. No, listen, we had just met Shannon and we were coming off of that season with Shannon.

She had the amazing season. I was triggered by John Jansen every episode. I think I was just having my girls back. Listen, like I said, Listen, like I said, it was precipitated by real things, but the stuff that I said, I was going, I was saying shit that I didn't mean, of course I'm not feeling for John Jansen. He's a monster.

That's so clear, but I just was saying the most deep to say the most hurtful things I could in that moment and you know it just wasn't um something that I'm proud of um and it's like an unfortunate like little asterisk now to my like entire career like I'm I think the first host of a reality dating show that has um come after a contestant before the show has aired and that's always going to be on my Wikipedia now and I have to live with that and that's a bummer for the show has aired. And that's always gonna be on my Wikipedia now, and I have to live with that, and that's a bummer for me. Well, I'm sorry that that happened. But at the same time, if it was gonna happen on any show,

to any group of people, I feel like you will survive this. Yeah, listen, amongst Bravo fans, my inbox was crazy. And it's and actually the trailer dropping has reupped that. But like the Venn diagram of like Bravo super fans and people who want to bring back the word Mongoloid is much bigger

circle than you think it is. They were like people were really upset and I think with good reason, and especially I mean, you can't watch that season of OC and not like Be a little bit of a Shannon Stan I mean I went into filming the show like a huge Shannon Stan because I that half the season had aired already by the time I got there and she was having an amazing season in part because so many of the other women were such assholes So like how could she not, you know?

And yeah, so I think it's interesting. I don't know how much it will affect the show and if I regret it mostly because the show's going to be really fucking good. I definitely don't want to watch any less. Yeah, no. And like, well, and unfortunately for people who are expecting to see conflict between me and the women, there is no conflict between me and the women.

It all happened after we were out. In fact, I think there are moments and scenes where I connect deeply with each of them, and it is very genuine, and that is, you know, it's a small part of the show, but it's, you know, the feedback I've gotten from the, like, the people who are cutting together these episodes, I start getting episodes this week,

so I'm gonna see it. But is that, you know, they're happy with the job that I did, and I think, like, the show is gonna be really good. And I think it bums me out when I see people being like, I'm not gonna watch this because I hate that guy. And I'm like, you know. We're watching, everyone. We're watching, everyone. We're watching, guys.

Guys, guys, you're, Joel and I made up. We're best friends. You have to, you have to watch it now. Yeah, adding you back to the wedding invite list. Well, kind of to your point, I mean, it's just like, I obviously had a reactive reaction and said some harsh things in the heat of the moment of having our girls back. You said some harsh things in the heat of the moment of having our girls back.

You said some harsh things in the heat of the moment. We've all said, you know, it's like, sometimes you need to apologize for shit and move on. You know? It's not. Where do you and Shannon stand today? You know, I did send her a personal apology as well because, you know, inevitably,

we're all doing press for this show right now. I don't think I'm doing any, like, duo press with Shannon anytime soon. But you know, I understand her reticence to, well, wanna take that at face value. I of course understand that. And I think like we can probably coexist. I think we'll have to in the context of this show

and doing the work for that. I think part of the reason why they were like trying to be like, hey, maybe don't publicly apologize for this is that the news cycle is quick over there at Bravo and people, I'm sure she will find someone to be way more mad at than me. And any time soon. In the history of the internet, we joke about this.

I have never seen anyone on the internet go, oh, that was a good apology, thank you. Yeah, no. Yeah, well, I'm over it. No one, everyone's like, oh, an apology, let's pick it apart, you know? And like, yeah, I think, yeah, no, so I think it'll be whatever.

I don't travel to the OC very often, I don't think we hang out in the same circles, so I think it's probably something that I will be able to leave behind. And again, it's just gonna be this weird asterisk. Shannon's had to ask for grace before too. She has said and done things that, well, we've also been hard on her too.

Yes, yeah, yeah. And that is the thing is that like, there were ways I could have addressed the behavior that precipitated this in a professional way and not given her the opportunity to be, you know, sort of added on top of like all of the other shit that she has been, you know, been piled on her. And yeah. Well, thanks for addressing. I do respect you so much for just coming on the show after hearing us being very critical.

He's nowhere to come now, he's nowhere to come. Of you, which is rare in this business. There's a lot of people who are like, fuck that podcast, fuck those people. They said I was a fuck boy. And it really hurts their feelings to the point where they won't call. No, and the thing is, I think I would have had,

I'm glad that we talked about it before I came and there was a part of me that was like, maybe I'll just go and bring it. But I was like, I also just like, I wanted to know that this wasn't gonna be some sort of like ambush or something like that. And I wanted to explain myself to you specifically because I think that what you said is not unfair

given the context that you had. Yeah, I was a little anxious coming here. But yeah. More than I can say for other people. You mentioned before we started recording that you were in the process of planning a wedding. Yeah, we spent all night. My sympathies, we spent all night watching Real Housewives of Atlanta while creating a wedding website and sending out the Save the Dates to all of the many people, the much larger list of people that we ended up.

How, yeah, it always happens. How, where are you in the planning, wedding changing process? Just sent out the Save the Dates, it's a New Year's wedding. So it's this New Year's. And yeah, so that's kind of like, we're kind of good for now. We've like, at the venue, you know, we're just sort of figuring out all the food now. But it's, you know, 276 days away or something like that.

What's your relationship with all the vendors? It is gonna be interesting. We have a really great wedding planner and she is sort of dealing with a lot of that. But it was funny, because my branding rep and my PR person, as soon as I announced that I was engaged, were like, how much of this wedding do you want? And I was like, huh.

I don't necessarily want it to be Joel and J.M.'s wedding brought to you by Clorox, you know? But like, if, you know, a liquor brand wants to pay for the bar, then like, I will post an Instagram story about it. I'm not too... The price tag on this thing is wild. And we're fine.

It'll be... It's coverable. But it is like, kind of fine, it's coverable, but it is kind of like, oh damn. One night, huh? Maybe we should just go to the courthouse. Regular mornings. I will say the things that you put, you think people are gonna care about, they don't care about.

We've just done our circuit of weddings and it's weird, because most, I feel like my friends who stayed close with their friends from high school go to weddings constantly. And I speak to no one from high school. So I've only been to a handful of weddings in the last couple of years, God bless.

And it did sort of, we were taking notes a little bit and from some of these weddings, but again, it was like, oh, I don't care. All I cared about was like the food. And so like, you know, the snacks are really important. The meal is really important. And it's like, just as long as like creating, cause for me, it's like, I just wanna like throw,

have a really good experience for the people that I'm asking to fly to San Francisco for this wedding, you know? And like, it's gonna be a really good party. I will say, like as someone who like, if Nali would have been like, hey, let's go to our card house. I'd have been like, great, awesome.

I'm so glad, like once the wedding got done, it was like, it was so worth it. Like you really, I was like, cause I was the person, it was like fine, more, fine, fine. And then it was magical. Neither one of us when we entered the relationship were like gay marriage guys. I think the expectation for a while

was that we were just gonna be those weird 55 year old boyfriends who've been together for a million years. And I think like there's something shifted when I think we realized like to say in front of like it's like when you tell your friends you're writing a book it's like well now you have to write the book you know because they will they will ask about it forever and it is that thing of like when we really decided that like you know because my assumption for so long was that I would meet someone, I would fall in love with that person

and be in love with that person for the rest of my life. But we had this conversation three years deep where it was like, wow, in three years, we have both changed so much, and you are not the person that I fell in love with. You are different, and I'm still in love with you, though, this version. And I am pretty confident I'm gonna be in love

with the next iteration, and like, iteration four will suck, but we'll ride that out into iteration five. And once we had that realization, it was like, oh no, I really wanna stand up in front of my friends and say I'm gonna do the work. Falling in love was not my choice, it just sort of happened, but the work of staying in love. These weddings that we've been to

over the last couple of years, that's really a powerful thing. We're not religious people. It's not about that. It's about us asking our friends to keep us accountable for the promises we make. I did not expect how much I'd enjoy saying my wife. I fucking hate saying fiance though. I hate it.

Fiance sucks. Fiance sucks. It's a mouthful. I just like, no. My husband is gonna rank. My husband is gonna be great, yeah. Also, Nick and I do say that all the time, of like, we work so hard on our relationship,

and I think that's like why we're almost to year five, is just like, you wake up every day and you choose each other, and you do the work, and it's not easy, and it, you know, some days are easy, but a lot of the days aren't and it's like you just gotta choose that person every day. So.

Do the work. Yeah. Like how you get your Craig used to. Oh God. I don't know how much communication was going on in that relationship. It seems unclear. Did you see the watch what happens live appearance

of Craig, Shep and Austin? I missed that one unfortunately. have you seen some clips? I think I have. Do we have some clips for Joel? I would love to see a clip. He once again really gets into the relationship with Paige. It is so frustrating because like last season with Lindsay and Carl, we knew that relationship

was dead on arrival, you know? But it was still fascinating to watch. Unfortunately, I don't find the cra- I just want Paige's single season now, you know. But it was still fascinating to watch. Unfortunately, I don't find it, I just want Paige's single season now, you know. Like, I don't, it's just so frustrating to watch him not hear any, like not absorb anything that she said. So you're definitely team Paige?

Oh, for sure. I'm with you two, where it was just like him being like, he's not watching Summer House. So for him to be like, oh no, she doesn't mean that. We had a really great relationship. It's like, no, listen to what she's saying in the episode. It is very Shep and Santa in a small way. The only reason I would disagree with that,

because yes, I mean, from all our perspectives, watching these shows and this relationship with the benefit of the Bravo callback, it's like, it's so easy to nitpick and pull calls with the hindsight of 2020. But when Craig says, I didn't see any signs, I believe him, you know what I'm saying? This is where I will be on your side a little bit,

is that I'm not sure, I do think she was pretty clear in the conversation they had at the Australian restaurant about her career and stuff like that, but she is being way more forthright in that fucking bed with those girls than we've seen her be with Craig. And we don't know what those conversations off camera actually were or how much she was like being as direct as she is when she's with her friends or on camera

with him. So like there is there's a chance. But like, I don't know, Craig, Craig does not have a lot of credibility, especially after this last season. I will say getting into the Southern Charm reunion, I will say I think Craig was grasping at just anything that Paige would give him. He was looking for the littlest amount of reassurance. The fact that he said publicly at the reunion that Paige would give him. He was looking for so, like the littlest amount of reassurance.

The fact that he said publicly at the reunion as like backup for himself was that Paige said, "'Keep the ring, maybe we'll get married at BravoCon.'" Was the most laughable sentence I've ever heard in my life. Like no one's getting married at BravoCon, especially not Paige Disorbo. And the fact that he heard her say a Paige joke and was like, oh my God, there's chance.

She wants to get married. Okay, maybe it's a parvakan, which wants to get married. I think he was taking anything she said, whether it was a typical Paige joke or whatever, just he needed some sense of reassurance that he would take any, it was like he wasn't listening. Don't we think though that if the roles were reversed and Craig broke up with Paige and handled himself

the exact same way that Paige is handling this breakup, I feel like this would be an Ariana Matic situation. I just, I listen, I think there's a lot to be gained nowadays in winning a breakup. I mean, yeah, especially when it's so public. But it is sort of like, I don't know what she gains from winning the breakup, honestly. I see what he is like, the flailing that he's doing.

He's still trying to win it. I think like, he's like losing the breakup more than she is winning the breakup, if that makes any sense. All right, let's play this clip. Talking about what he... Are you dating? I am. Okay.

And I'm really happy. Okay, are you dating anyone specific? Are you dating? I am okay, and I'm really happy Are you dating anyone specifically now I will say if I'm the new girl I definitely want them to stop talking about yeah Yeah, I mean but come on that's not gonna happen No, the way summer house I hear you're saying this the way he is talking it's just like well, you don't know how she felt even of what and and the way Summer House has to end. I hear you're saying this, the way he is talking, it's just like, well, you don't know how she felt, even of what, and I just give him grace for like, maybe wasn't being totally on him.

It's tough to be honest in a relationship. The thing about Craig, and we saw this a little bit in this last season of Southern Charm, is that he does lie a lot, but the thing is, is I think he's not intentionally lying. He is like, I think that's a lie. I mean, I think that's a lie. I mean, I think that's a lie. I mean, I think that's a lie. I mean, I think that's a lie. I mean, I think that's a lie. I mean, I think that's a lie. I mean, I think that's a lie.

I mean, I think that's a lie. I mean, I think that's a lie. I mean, I think that's a lie. I mean, I think that's a lie. I mean, I think that's a lie. I mean, I think that's a lie. I mean, I think that's a lie. I mean, I think that's a lie.

I mean, I think that's a lie. I mean, I think that's a lie. I mean, I think that's a lie. I mean, I think that's a lie. I mean, I think that's a lie. I mean, I think that's a lie. I mean, I think that's a lie. I mean, I think that's a lie.

I mean, I think that's a lie. I mean, I think that's a lie. I mean, I think that's a lie. I mean, I think that's a lie. I mean, I think that's a lie. I mean, I think that's a lie. I mean, I think that's a lie. I mean, I think that's a lie. I mean, I think that's a lie. I mean, I think't say that Ms. Pat was a bitch. He just didn't, you know? But I know that Craig really deeply believes in his heart that he did. Do you think it's one of those things

where he'll hear something? Like, to Nellie's point, we all assume that Paige clearly was sarcastic about it and made some remark, and Craig's just like, no, you said that shit. I mean, it's him being like, she said, he remembers these vivid moments. She was in my pool, she said she wanted to get married and have kids, you said that shit. And like, I mean, it's him being like, she said in my, like he remembers these vivid moments.

Like she was in my pool. She said she wanted to get married and have kids. She said, keep the ring because we could get married at BravoCon. And it's like, I think he's just like listening to her speak and not like listening to her speak. Yeah, I mean, it does sound like anyone who's ever been broken up with with a broken heart.

I mean, I've done that. And then she said this and then she said that and she promised me this and like, what the fuck, you know? I do believe at the reunion when Craig said then I was confused because then she said this and then she said that and she promised me this and like, what the fuck? I do believe at the reunion when Craig said, then I was confused because then she was like, why didn't you fight for me? Like, why didn't you? And I do believe that maybe Paige got a little like toxic

of like, well, why didn't you like try to get me back? Why didn't you? And it fucked up. Yeah, I just think, you know, Craig said it himself, he's a lawyer and a storyteller. And I think he's telling himself- Of course, an emphasis on storyteller. I think he is telling himself a story right now

in order to move on in the way that he needs to move on. And I think that there's probably like a little bit of truth on both sides. I tend to believe Paige a little bit more and like we've seen the way she acted with him on camera. And I just can't imagine that it was such a huge shift from off camera to on camera. I don't know.

I agree with that. I don't think she was playing it up for the camera, as per se. But I think she might have been playing it up with her girls, like once she got with her girls and she got comfortable and she's in that bed and she like starts kinda talking then she starts really talking. And when she's like in Charleston with Craig.

But don't friends do that in real life too? You know, you get together with your girls, you guys talk some shit. But that's recorded. You often break up with someone with your friends before you break up with the other person actually, I think. Oh yeah.

Yeah. That's what I'm saying, even for him, I'm like I understand protecting your peace and not wanting to watch Summer House, but I'm at the same time, I'm like, if you have any questions about what happened in your relationship, you literally have a guide to watch and see how she was talking about you behind your back, how she actually felt about things that you did

in your relationship and to not utilize that. Like, I'm like, of course you're gonna have all these question marks. It'd be so much easier for him to move on if he just watched the season. I can get where he's struggling though, because in some ways ways the way she talks and treats him on cameras is a bit emasculating

and she kind of talks down to him. There were definitely some parts, like when they're sitting in that little dingy boat and she's like, I'll let you know if like you're, I'll give you a year review and let you know if you're fired. And then when they're in the bed and she's like, can you get on your phone and lay back and not talk to me?

And I'm sure he's just like now, he's just kind of like no, our relationship in real life was different and I stood up for myself. You know, it's like he's, I feel like he's almost defending his honor as a guy. You know, it's just like, I wouldn't have let Paige treat me that way.

Things were different, you know, who knows what's true, but I can't help but wonder if he's just more like watching what we're all watching and a lot of people are kind of mocking him for how Paige, I guess, treated him? I don't know. It is that thing of like, I think she needs an alpha,

like for a real alpha. And I think that like part of like him caving and moving to New York, I think like even though she said she wanted that. Like gave her the X. I think, yeah, I think like once she realized she could get him to do that, she was she wanted that. I think, yeah, I think once she realized she could get him to do that, she was like, oh. No, I actually, yeah.

As successful as she is and is becoming and will continue to be, I think she needs someone who's always at her level or above. Yeah, no, and listen, I think she's probably one of the funniest brother people we have now. I love her. Again, cannot wait to see that woman single on Summer House. And it's just so, like, in a different way

than Lindsay and Carl, really hard to watch. And not as interesting as you'd want it to be. Did you see that Craig said he will not associate himself with Vanita after what she said on this show? Was it on this episode, this podcast? This Watch What Happens Live episode. Well, she said that episode, this podcast? This Watch What Happens Live episode, well she said that on our podcast, but on Watch What Happens Live,

he confirmed that she no longer has access to me, that he should have defended Paige, and... I think it went back to the whole, because it was a good, no, it was like the liar, or something, he's a liar. She had Paige's back. She had Paige's back, which a lot of people were shocked by because Southern Charm people.

No, I know, and he said, I don't mind that she said she's team Paige, she can be friends with Paige, but it's what she said after that that I will not associate myself with her anymore. And which was what? Don't remember. But I know it was on this show. Okay.

You have a lot of guests. Yeah. Well, there's also a video of the Southern Charm girls watching back Watch What Happens Live. So you see Vanita's genuine reaction in the moment of the fact that like. What'd she say? She was just like, so you're not gonna talk to me?

You're upset with me? Like this is the first time that she heard that Craig and her are no longer friends or that he will not associate with her anymore. Well, the last thing Vanita needs is to be more siloed on that show, I gotta say. Metaphorically, she needs to get out of the bed. I would love for her to move to New York.

I'm saying she is a dynamic person and I do like her. There's a lot of dead weight on that cast right now. I'm sorry, but what are those two gay guys, how are they getting a check right now? Brian just shows up. The fact that Rodrigo is sitting on the couch at the reunion, I'm like, what did you give him during the season?

What was your story? Nothing. And I like that there are gay characters and cast members on these shows, but I just want them to do the work a little bit more. More than a dog party. Yeah, when Ryan was being confronted about what he told Vanita,

and then Rodrigo tried to chime in, and Ryan was like, actually don't want you in here. The fact that he just left. I was like, no, no, no. You're on Bravo. You're on Bravo, babe. You stay in that room and you yell and scream. Yes.

Get that camera time. Earn the check. I'm still confused by JT's timeline because like, wait, didn't he have a girlfriend while filming, and then we find out that him and Vanita dated after filming, and then like, wait, did he break up with his then girlfriend, and now is he back

with the same girl? But because Vanita didn't respond to him for three days, he then got back with his ex-girlfriend, because he wasn't just gonna sit around and wait for Vanita. We found out that that scene where he tells her that he's seeing someone was filmed after the Bahamas, but placed before the Bahamas,

which is like, that's doing her a little dirty. Doing her dirty, for sure. I mean, the fact is, is like, I want so much more for her than that man, who I do think, like, I don't blame him for quitting. I think he was, I don't like him, but I do think he was given sort of a raw deal in certain situations.

Like the, some black girl comment, like clearly I don't think he said that. And like clearly that was like a thing of telephone. But he did admit to saying like, cute black woman. Oh, did he say that? He said, I said, the barber's on the phone and he's like, it was like a cute black girl. And he was like, when then he related to Vanita was like,

I didn't, I said a cute black woman, woman is what I called you. So now I'm sort of, I did, I must've been on my phone during that moment because now I'm sort of switching. It felt like he was admitting to saying the word black, but he was trying to figure out what he Could put around it.

Put around the word. When, yeah, yeah, yeah. When he could've just said, a cute woman in Venita, I cast me. I assumed that he showed the barber a picture and the barber extrapolated, oh, didn't remember Venita's name and was like, you know some black girl. And that was his addition to the phone tree.

But I don't know now, you really rocks my world with that. I know, I know. I mean the fact that Vanita is fighting for this slime, every time I see JT I just see like a ball of slime. Yeah. You know, like the kids play. And then when he compliments Vanita,

it just feels so fucking condescending. And oh, she's, I have nothing bad to say. Well, you're just saying that because you don't want her to roast you and call you out for playing her. Well, you might not have anything bad to say about her, but your girlfriend did, and you said, I won't defend you.

I can't do anything about that. Crazy. You know? It's just so sick to see a woman who's that beautiful and the great personality. It's so successful. Be so enamored with this guy. It's just so crazy.

And I, yeah, I want better for her. I want better for her. Roni Reboot, Recast, throw her up there. Do you think Cierra needs to get over West, period? I actually think that she's moving at a pretty, a better pace than I thought she would going into the season. I don't think they're ever gonna,

she's ever going to be good friends with him again, as she stated, but she's not been, I don't know, she hasn't been dwelling on it past where she's like, hasn't brought it up herself, unless other people bring it up. And she's like, coexisting with him. I think she's at a fine level for me now. If she was really making this her storyline for the season,

I would be annoyed, but I don't think that's the case with Ciara. I think she is genuinely like, sort of like now getting over it at a reasonable pace. Did y'all see a lot of people are criticizing the fact that they are in that bed with their shoes on and that dried paint all over Sierra's legs from being the parrot and to go food bags and everyone's like,

this is where you, your bed should be the cleanest place. Why are you? It's been said so many times by so many people, but ladies, you gotta get out of the bed. You gotta get out of the bed. It's like you don't put your suitcase on your bed to pack your clothes. It's been under a plane.

It's been thrown on the ground. It's been on the dirtiest surfaces ever and you're gonna lay it on your bed. It's like when Nick gets in the bed with his outside clothes on, you don't do it. You don't do it. I'm reminded of how disgusting my body is anytime I sit on the bed.

He's like, oh my God, what are you doing? I don't know, what? Like get naked, like why are your clothes that have been like sitting on a chair? I think it's a boy thing because I've never even thought about my outside clothes being on the bed like shoes certainly never never I have like but I am reminded of it, but like I don't think I've ever thought about

Outside clothes it makes sense She's not your airplane outfit No, if I got home, and I was like oh my god. I need to like lay down This is coming off these are coming off. I'm putting on a robe. I'm putting on sweatpants I'm putting on something and getting under the cover. I would never, ever, ever put clothes that have been on the outside world in my sheets. Yeah.

I'm gonna think and meditate on that for a long time. And I want you to do that. And I do. Moving forward for sure. You'll think about it the next time you go to get in bed. I'm now suddenly like, oh my God, these are my outside clothes? Literally, it's like they'll think about where they have been. I really am in bed. I'm now suddenly like, oh my God, these are my outside clothes? Literally, it's like, they're thinking about

where they have been. I really am obsessed with your outside clothes today. You found those on Instagram? Yeah, no, I was saying before, like Instagram got me again, girl. And- He wants you to read that tag on the back of those pants and give him the label.

We will get, I'll figure it out. Oh, I think it's like costs actually. Oh. I think it might be as simple as that, yeah. Simple. Yeah. But we'll confirm after the podcast. Have you ever had your toe sucked for 37 minutes? Ew, no, never.

I am not a geek guy at all. And also like- What are you doing in there, Jessi? They really got him when she was like, why did you take your socks off? And then like- Because you know it makes sense. Like sure, if like he got his toe sucked,

he would take off one sock. Yeah. Right? Why were both socks off? And if you did something where you would have, I don't know, taken all your clothes off, you would just put your pants on and your T-shirt on and walk out.

You wouldn't, you would forget your sock. And he was carrying his shoes at the end of it too, where he was carrying his shoes out barefoot, and I was like, huh. I gotta say about Jesse, it's frustrating. I preferred Jesse so much more last season when he was like, I am a fuck boy, this is who I am, like this is, and like was so charming,

and like you didn't care, cause it's like, at least he's being honest about who he is. I think this season, I think because of the cancer stuff from last season, he has made this arbitrary decision. He kind of even admitted to it with that conversation with Craig and Amanda, I think, when he was like, well, isn't it time that I start to do this?

And it's like, no, baby, it's clearly not time for you to do this. Like, that is not who you are yet, and that's okay. He's still, he's under 30, isn't he? No, I think he's like 31 or something like that. Yeah, but a cancer scare, he's that made him think like oh I should like be settling down now But it's so clear that he's not and here's what I will say I would be way more upset about that conversation with Sierra than I would about the toe

Yeah, like I think like the toe is whatever. I mean, I'm a gay guy So like my bar is set a little bit differently. But that conversation with Sierra, I would, if I, she finds out about the toe on camera, but she's gonna see that. And that would be so shitty to watch. It's on a different level. And I also just, I don't think that he wants to date Sierra either.

I think he's just somebody who needs a lot of attention. It's like, would you rather have the person you've been hanging out with for three weeks watch a threesome for 37 minutes? Let's assume that's all he did. He just stood there and watched with popcorn. Would that be cheating? Like if you watched, if you just sat there

with a front row seat, do a conversation there. I don't think I, yeah, if you're in a room with two naked women and like watching them, and he literally said, oh, I'm hard now. Yeah. Like we have that on record. And then also he didn't sit in the corner, he laid on the bed, but don't worry,

he put his foot by their faces. Okay, well, so let's assume he only did watch, and I doubt he did, but would that be harder to Joel's point than watching him talk to this beautiful person and to say like, I've kind of always had a thing for you and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. That's the thing is I think like most monogamous couples

are like, there's this line and as long as I don't cross this line, it's not cheating, I'm good. And I think he did cross that line with a toe. But I think like, looking at your relationship from a 360 perspective, like so many people just think as long as they don't cross the sex line, they're good. And for me, I'm in a non-monogamous relationship.

It's so much more about the emotional and the connective stuff. I could care less who sucks his toes, honestly. But if you were sitting down with someone being like, wow, you're the one that got away, I would be like, okay, fuck my drag. Like. Yeah. Did Lexi put out a statement or a story?

I kind of felt like. Well, you find that I will say they were teasing this threesome all fucking year long being like, and a threesome happens on summer house. Emeril, I think is so interesting. I love that he operates like a gay guy, but it's straight. But I will say he gives the energy of a B-tier level Netflix dating show,

like a Too Hot to Handle or something like that. That's where he belongs, because right now he's using the show as a platform. We don't even see these women. Talk about getting him. that's where he belongs. Cause right now he's using the show as a platform. Like we don't even see these women. Like talk about getting him. He's covering the camera. He needs to get out of the bed too. And like, I just, you know, he had that,

like it sounds like he has a very interesting backstory that I'd love to hear more about, but he doesn't talk to anybody else. He just goes out and brings back strange girls that we never see their anything. No one's signing any releases. But you know, haven't they just blurred faces in the past? Yeah. strange girls that we never see anything of them. No one's signing any releases. Yeah, yeah. But haven't they just blurred faces in the past?

Yeah. You know what I wanna know watching Summer House? Who ends up at these parties? You can invite, is it Summer House weekend soiree? They sort of gave us a peek behind the curtain last time when Carl was like, she was on my list last weekend. So it sounds to me like they each get an allotment of people they're allowed to invite. And they're on so-and-so's list. So, I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point.

I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point.

I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point.

I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's just those people. No music, crickets. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, yeah.

I love watching the parties to where it's like somebody else is having like a really fun time and then somebody else is fighting and they have no idea. Like that's the type of parties I want to see, not like sometimes housewives where you're just like, well, this is the center entertainment for tonight. Right. And it's just like you're like checking in with the randos at the table. You're like, what's your experience of this like? Yeah. I'll go to summer house party any day over like a housewife sit down dinner.

Yes. Are you team Sutton or is it justice for Sutton or are you more like finally we're calling out Sutton? I think she's having a really tough season. Now I've met Sutton out socially and she was so nice and so lovely, like surrounded by gay guys. And I think she thrives in that environment and Is just the best version of her experience. Yeah. Yeah, I will die hard for her. Yeah, I

I don't love what's happening on this season with her a lot and like the Garcelle leaving because like she's so clearly much More interested and invested in a friendship with Kyle and she is with Garcelle is like kind of a bummer. I think Garcelle though is leaving quite honestly at the right time because I think the the tide was about to turn on Garcelle a little bit too and I think yeah I think she's leaving at like the height of her popularity and that's the smartest move that any housewife has ever decided to do for themselves. Makes sense, yeah. No, they do say it's like, you're never safe on that show,

and the next season you might be the favorite, and the following season everybody comes for you. You're right, I mean the writing is on the wall for everyone to kind of turn on. Garcelle. Garcelle. Like, this is Kyle's season, she's taking a little bit of a beating, but not even that much, but it's Kyle.

She never gets that of a beating. And Garcelle kind of has gone for Kyle, so I could see next season all of a sudden. And Dorit. And Dorit, and I think what I read was that Boz really comes to her about the staged break-in of it all, and that really comes back to bite her at the reunion, is that they all sort of go in on that sort of comment.

Which is, she says some pretty shocking things sometimes in a way that is like, Garcelle. In a way that's like, I'm glad she says most of the stuff she says when she's like, can we just call you a lesbian? Are you? It's like, let's talk about it. At least someone said it, but it's harsh. We know that Garcelle isn't the only one in that group

who suspects foul play when it comes to Dureet's breaking. Well, I'll say, I don't think Dureet knew anything about it, but it is a little sus. I don't put a pass PK, and don't sue me, please. Allegedly. Yeah, allegedly. We don't put a pass please. But. Allegedly. Yeah, allegedly. Allegedly, we don't put it past PK, allegedly. Allegedly. But yeah, I think she was voicing

what a lot of people were thinking. Now do I think she should have? That's a different question. I'm not sure I'm equipped to answer yet. But to answer your question, I'm not necessarily Team Sutton right now. I, again, in real life, I hope to run into her at high tops again. But I just think like, I really didn't love the like wallet comment.

That's tough. And like, and like, listen, do I, do I stand to read in any way, shape or form? No. Do I think we're finally seeing a little bit of like who, like when she lit that cigarette, I was like, that is who you are. Finally, we are seeing who you are. And like, I'm glad for that, like at the very least, because this was kind of a boring season. Yeah. What did you think of the impersonations, the mocking?

That was mean. I don't think there's ever a time in which you can like impersonersonate someone where they're like really that's how I sound. No, it's never now is not calling anytime soon either It was like not a good impression even but yeah, I it is strange like I just think that like Sutton really wants to be friends with Kyle and I think it drives her nuts that she can't get in there. And I think like, it's very much like Cool Girl Table. Like it's a little Heather Gay, you know, too.

Like in the way that she sort of rides for Lisa in a kind of like transparent way. Yeah, it has a really good comparison. Yeah, I hope for and pray that like, it'll be interesting, in the same way it's been interesting to see Gisele without Robin, I think it'll be interesting to see Sutton without Garcelle for a minute and see how that sort of plays out.

It is so true when Dorit said Sutton condition and she cannot take it. Oh my God. It's so true. The fact that she could sit at that table and give that wallet sentence and then for them to be like, hey, so you're not really nice and she's freaking out and then for them to be like, hey, so like, you're not really nice and she's like freaking out and she can't, it is wild how some people are built like that.

It is. And I think like, it's so sad that Crystal never really brought it in the way she needed to bring it because knowing her in real life, she's very funny and very sharp. And I think like at the beginning of the season when she had that little tiff with Sutton, I was like, yes, okay, this is going to work. And then I think she got so scared because Sutton was so much more popular than her that she really dialed

it back. But I was like, oh, you're that girl? I was like, yes, get in there. Let's really unpack this. But then she really just, I don't know. I think she like dialed back because she got spooked. But yeah. I mean, there's a level of winger that to do what those ladies do, it's like, do I need this in my life? The drama, the messiness, just the toxicity.

It's not for everyone. I want Crystal to go back to House Five so badly. I do too. I talked to her, I guess part of the reason was, and I don't know if this is like the complete full truth, was that they really wanted a season of all single women. And that didn't necessarily play out or pay off in an interesting way. Because that was technically this season.

Yeah, that was. Nobody's married. Yeah, nobody's married, everybody is. We really missed out on a direct date of some kind. Yeah, and I kind of like missed like missed out on a direct date Some kind yeah And I kind of like miss like even like the couples trips and things like shit always used to go down and now I just feel Like everything is just like you they're like yeah, you know that point It's just like Kyle this is the whatever's going on with Morgan or not going out with Morgan

Can't we at least fake a date? Yeah, can't we at least well we we did see that and we did see the tattoo Parlor she was on FaceTime all over last season. But I wanna see Kyle go on a date with some guy, or I wanna see the single life, I wanna see, or three. That's the problem is that, I think they wanted the fun single season to be this season, but none of them have worked out their exes yet. They're still in divorce mode.

And so I am hopeful that maybe next season we'll see. I think Boze is a fun addition. of them have worked out their exes. They're still in divorce mode. And so I am hopeful that maybe next season we'll see. I think Boze is a fun addition. Like she finally broke the one season wonder curse on that show, I think. She is awesome. I've never seen a housewife I agree with unanimously. I do think they got some backlash, her and Erica,

when they were on Watch What Happens Live together. A lot of the response was like, this is very mean girl. Like they did not come off very well. What were they saying? The whole Garcelle peaked in the 90s. They were just like, they were bantering in a way that was very like negative. And then Garcelle also at the same time was like, I'm leaving the show.

Yeah. It's also like, that's not even the best dig. Talk about making someone. Hey, Erica, at least someone had a peak. I mean, that's one of Garcell's peak is like. Yeah, yeah. And like, I missed. And now, like she is like doing like she's back in a big way.

And like that's part of my frustration, honestly, with Garcell's storylines. It's like, I don't need to hear about another movie or how busy you are. Like I am. You're at work now, you know, like focus on that. But but I'm so happy for her success. You know, like I'm glad that she's leaving the show and will probably make the human we're happy for her choices like the housewife. Yeah, exactly. And that the the central conflict of any of watching any of these shows is like do do you want like an interesting person or do you want like

an a cool nice normal person no I would be devastated if Lisa Barlow left I know and I don't know if I could I don't know if I trusted to be her friend. You know? Right, exactly. Yeah. Well, you said you were wedding planning, watching Real Housewives of Atlanta. How are you loving this new season? I am so stoked about this season. I think the soft reboot is exactly what it needed. I think Shamiah, I'm so, I don't know why I'm surprised,

but her being sort of the center in our entrance into this new era of the show, I think it's like she's great. She's like put in the time. I think she earned that peach and like she's been doing like I think I find her to be wonderful. I did not know that HVAC sales was so lucrative. Right. Truly. We all learned that. And I have not yet learned or been able to like,

remember most of the names other than Brit and, Brit, Angela, Kelly, right? I know Kelly because of the 17 designer bags for her 17th birthday. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Angela in a marriage that is again, like, doomsday. Angela and Charles. Doomsday. Like that conversation was hard to watch.

When they say things on camera like, oh, 10 years is a long time, I'm like, babe. What? Mic off. That's your on camera filter. Yeah. And like, what are you saying to this woman behind closed doors?

Calling Carla Toya Jackson was the shadiest thing I've ever heard in my entire life. I know. And I cannot believe that they just moved past it. Were able to squash it. I love Portia Williams, she's one of my all time faves. And I am really excited for a new season with Portia. Yeah, are you team Portia when it comes to?

The Drew stuff? I mean, yeah, you gotta have to be, because it's like, again, Drew seems fine as a person, but like, I don't like engage well with her storylines on the show. I'm worried for her ankles constantly. I'm like, what bone is she going to break next? She's always broken. It does make sense.

Like, Portia's only line is like, do not film with him. Yeah. And that's like- And like, why is this hot dog man like, producing music now? Like it's so- I don't understand it. It's so strange, like, it would make more sense

to be on Drew's side if like, he was a very successful music producer that could like, rocket her career to the next level. Like, I would have a little more sympathy for her, but like it seems kind of random. And honestly, like it does not seem like it's going to be a flexion point in her career working with Dennis. Like Drew's already kind of questionable, like from like past seasons behavior wise and like girls girl. But I'm just like the idea that you're sitting here saying

straight to someone's face that like, no, like I didn't do that. I'm not like, this is, he's just my angel. He's just my friend. Like, I just love him so much. And then it's like, you have the business meeting with Portia and like her coworker being like, yeah, they reached out to me about wanting to film with Dennis and it's like, you're literally saying

you're not doing this. And yet it's being constantly proven that you are. Why would this be the look that you want to go into the season with, especially because we're Portia Stans. Yeah. And next week's the big. We ended with Kenya.

I know, and the thing is, is if Kenya didn't do what she did, I'd almost be on her side a little bit. If I didn't know what was coming after this episode, I would sort of be like, she is doing a lot right now. The ending season of the, or the ending scene of this episode, where it was just like, okay. You know? The ending season of the, or the ending scene of this episode where it was just like,

okay, first of all, we kind of think you're on the wrong show with the whole, like I've got a pistol in my bag like threatening her life. Or I was like, it's giving baddies, it's not giving Atlanta housewives. But it was just like, it kind of is giving a little bit of like rhyme and reason to why Kenya's so like. I know, but she, I mean talk about taking it

to way too far. Like I don't know like how know, but talk about taking it to way too far. I don't know how she goes from marching band to revenge porn. Such a big leap. It's so crazy. Yeah, we had her back for a second. Yeah, if none of us knew, after this last episode, if none of us knew what was coming in the next episode,

I think we'd all be unanimously behind Kenya. Because she, you know, again, lover or hater, like she is great TV. And like, um. She's still tweeting too. My first housewife pairing on Watch What Happens Live. Really? And I'm going on again with an Atlanta housewife

closer to the premiere of Love Hotel. And I, I've been, it will be my third Atlanta housewife that I've been on with. I got Kenya, Marlo, and now hopefully, Hope Against Hope, Portia. But would also love Shemia too, I think. I love those ladies so much. Love Hotel.

Yeah. Let's talk about it a little bit. What can we look forward to? You know, this is like the honest truth. The most pleasant thing, I think, and surprising thing about this show, and I think it's primarily because of the makeup of the women, is you do get to see these women

like really become friends and really like have their back. There is conflict, there is drama, but it is all between the women and the men, and it is nice to see them like just be friends, you know? Like it's nice to the women and the men. And it is nice to see them just be friends. It's nice to not see the conflict between the women take over the show. It's so, that I think people will be pleasantly surprised by.

And I think Luanne is just, it is exactly where you wanna see, you almost wanna see Luanne as like the only one. You know, like she is, there's like, I know for a fact that like the music they will play behind some of her scenes of it will be so goofy because she is like tenfold the comic relief of the show in every episode.

She is just so wild. But yeah, it's interesting to see all of them. I'm excited, like I don't think the show in every episode. She is just so wild. But yeah, it's interesting to see all of them. I'm excited. I don't think the show continues and we get to see Heather Gay on the show and a different mix. Yeah, it'll be interesting to see how this format sort of moves forward after this season.

And I think it's gonna be well received. I think it's gonna be, it's really a fun time and there are some real, real real thing, real shit goes down. When's the release date? April 27th. Okay, coming up. Yeah, yeah, yeah. A few weeks away.

It feels like it's gonna give us like, fill that void that we have from like, Ultimate Girls Trip being shelved. Yeah. So that's what I'm really excited for. And we will get to see these women like, kind of open up about their love lives and daily lives. Yeah, I mean, like I said,

like I have some sit downs with them and it gets real vulnerable from people like Giselle too. I think I've probably not said the kindest things about Giselle in the past and I think she knew that coming into the show and we, by the end of the show, despite the fact that she recently said my dick was too small on her podcast, we are like good. I texted her about that and I was like, hey, what, what, why did you

say that? And like, um, we ended up, but the end of the conversation, I was like, hope the girls are great. Like, it's like, she did really, like we, we, we did really get like much closer. Like she said to me at, at the end of the filming, she was like, I thought you would be kind of a little bitch. And we hugged it out and it was great. And she, all of them I think gave me a lot of grace after it all went down. Do you think it's just hearing you talk

and watching all these women and all these different shows, when you're working with these women, is it almost a little, like, because they say some real direct, and they're professionals, they're out there and they're slinging grenades, is it almost kind of like confusing to how you're supposed to engage with them?

It is much different. Does that make sense? It does feel like I flew a little're supposed to engage with them. In a way, does that make sense? It does feel like I flew a little too close to the center a little bit. It's all fun and games when you're separated by a television screen, but it is a little bit like, and like I said, they were all super fun while we were filming with me.

And so I don't have any direct beef with any of them. But it is just like, yeah. It honestly, I couldn't, when I got home, I didn't really watch Bravo for a second because I needed a minute. Because it did, it just re-cont of contextualizes a lot of what you're seeing and suddenly it's like, oh yeah, you know, it is funny when Ramona shits on the ground,

but then suddenly you're thinking about the PA that had cleaned that shit up. And like, it just, yeah, it changes. I have now since memory holed my way back into loving everything I'm seeing on Bravo, so it wasn't that traumatic. That's awesome. Joel, this has been so much fun.

Thank you for coming. Can we come back? Yeah, absolutely. I love that. Love Hotel premieres April 27th. We will be watching it, checking it out, do so as well. Thank you again, man. Anything else you wanna promote

where people can follow you on any other projects? I have a podcast called Bad Dates that comes out every week. I actually truly don't know what day it comes out. And Loot season three will be premiering later this year as well, which I would love to catch up on. Great show, our friend Nick Lehmann writes for it.

Yes, love Nick, love Nick. In fact, much of my character is based around Nick. So yeah, it's great and this season is so funny and like I'm, it's just a joy to work on. So I'm really excited for people to see that and check out like my Instagram for tour dates here and there. I hate Joel Ken. Amazing. Well, thank you for coming, Joel. You've been such a pleasure. Thanks. Thank you for having me. Just come back. Yeah. I promise you. I promise.

We love Joel. Up next, we got Grant and Juliana. If there's anything I've learned so far this year, it's that small habits make a huge difference. We're still kind of in a new year, and new years are about new beginnings and cutting out those old habits. And I've been trying to get some new healthy habits

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For 20% off plus free shipping. Then again, that's C-Y-M-B-I-O-T-I-K-A.com slash V-I-A-L-L. To claim 20% off plus free shipping. Joel, what a lovely human. I'm glad we were able to. Work out your differences. I didn't feel like, you know, as he pointed out, I said that was very hard on him, harsh even. He had some harsh things to say about Shannon

and it feel like we needed to like beat a dead horse. He seems like, like he regrets saying it clearly. I wanna hang out with him. Me too. I wanted to ask him about if he thought Portia was shading Shemia when he was, when she was like, I thought it was Drew. That's Drew singing, right? I thought it was Drew. That's Drew singing, right?

I thought it was Drew. Which there was no way, Sierra, that she was not being shady. 100%, you know what your best friend sounds like. Yeah. Well, I'm excited to watch Love Hotel. Me too. Me too. And it's like, you know, I think they've squashed the beef,

but it doesn't seem like Shannon and, it's clear that Shannon and Joel will not. I mean, would you? Well, if Shannon, sure, I wouldn't. But it does seem like Joel, I don't know what happened, but I think he very much regrets saying what he said, but it sounds like he does have his reasons, you know? Maybe.

I'm curious what those reasons are. If this is anything like Ultimate Girl's Trip, I'm so excited. Same. Well, up next, we have Grant and Juliana to talk about where they are at in their love journeys as their fire still burn as strong as ever.

Have the comments of Latia from AFR brought trouble to Paradise? We will find out next. All right, well, welcome Juliana and Grant. Why are, is there trouble in Paradise already? You guys aren't calling from the same spot. Is like, do we need to talk about it? No, we're done.

Yeah, I'm going out there on Wednesday to book my flight for Wednesday. So we got a whole itinerary plan of travel. So, okay. Well, first we just want to start by saying congrats. Congrats to you both on a happy ending. And then I buy a happy ending. I mean, an engagement.

Very happy for you both. What has it been like? I mean, so, AFR is a week ago. It's like your first week in civilization. It's a weird feeling. I know. What has it been like this past week? It's been interesting. I finally changed his name at my phone the other day.

I forgot about that. What was his fake name? I followed him back on Instagram. What was his fake name? I followed him back on Instagram. What was his fake name? It was W-P-O-D, Wolfpacker Die. Okay. And then I was a wolf emoji in his, so we were low key not really creative,

but it worked for us. It worked for you guys. Juliana, obviously as the winner of the season, you're in a very difficult position. I think a lot of people often, and maybe take for granted or don't even just fully appreciate because they think winner, so you won the show,

you're in love, but the winner's often kind of alienated from the rest of the group sometimes because they don't know how to engage with the winner and every other woman or man from their respective season can relate to being broken up with by the lead except for the winner. There's a competition element to it. So what has this been experienced like for you

watching it back? Obviously it's never easy in your position, but it seemed like you understand what some of the things I'm saying. What are some of the challenges? What's it been like in your shoes? It's been interesting. You know, I think when we finished filming

and we kind of came back to regular day life, it took me a minute to start like engaging with the girls again. And I had expressed to a couple of them that right there was my biggest fear is because of the end circumstance that like my relationships with them were gonna be not as great as I had hoped for. You know, I was reassured in the moment that it would be fine and that the girls were fine compartmentalizing relationships. But I think,

you know, after AFR and kind of just some things that have come up from that, I've seen like the reality of it, right? And it definitely hurt my feelings at first and didn't quite understand it, but it was a quick bounce back just because, you know, I hate to say like I didn't come in there to make friends, but I was excited about the friends that I had. But at the end of the day, I have, you know, I had 30 plus people fly out from the East Coast

to the West Coast just to celebrate me and I'm good. I'm chilling and I love Allie Jo. So me and her like BFF. Allie Jo, why did we bring that? Did Allie Jo say something? No, I just, I walked away with her. She's definitely gonna be a lifelong friend. Were there any other comments out there in particular

that hurt your feelings? No, I don't think it was really comments. Is that a doubt? Are there any other comments out there in particular that hurt your feelings? No, I don't think it was really comments. I think it was just kind of like actions and just, I think the avoidance of it all. You know, I wasn't super reached out to by a lot of the girls that I maybe thought I would have been reached out to by.

I think when the AFR came and I had reached out to the few girls from my season that were gonna come to the actual live filming of it, I was told that they were coming in support of Latia, and that was kind of, to me, I was like, oh shit, I didn't know sides were being taken like that. I tried to phrase it in a way that was like, the more the merrier.

But that's, I think, when I kind of learned the reality. So when they said that to you, it almost felt like it was implied not only were they were there to support Latia, but they weren't necessarily there to support you and Grant. Totally, yeah. And my stance right now is like, you are either like, if you're pro or for me,

like you're for Grant. There's not like you can be for me and not support him. We're two for one at this point and I draw the line right there. Yeah. You know, Grant, you're obviously, we've met you a few times, we've had you on before. You know how I thought of you as the bachelor.

I thought you were an excellent bachelor, incredibly empathetic. I think you should be very proud of yourself for how you handled it. AFR, you know, obviously we anticipated the finale. We knew even from episode one that quote unquote, you had such a hard time picking the finale, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

As someone, I mean, no one knows what it's like to be in Latia's shoes more than me. I was in it literally twice. So like I empathize where she's at. I know what it's like. At the same time, again, trust me, being in her position, I remember being like, but you said this and what the fuck was that? And I can't believe this happened.

And you really feel like you are justified to be not only angry, but like have basically, Bachelor Nation have your back because you really feel kind of screwed over. At the same time, this is the show, you know? And I remember once I became The Bachelor, having a lot more empathy for the ladies that whose season I was on, you know, and realizing the position they were in. And, you know, when it's just

your journey and everyone has their journey on this show, Latia, Juliana, you had a journey, you know, obviously, you know, your feelings feel that much more validated and important than anyone else's. That all being said, Grant, as you reflected back on AFR and what Latia said or implied, more importantly, was there anything in particular or specifically that you might have said to her on or off camera, and I think maybe more off camera that you maybe wish you would have like taken back or thought, you know, yeah, maybe I was the bad sure and yeah, I was doing my job, but I, yeah, I guess I see I could have done without that or this

or yada, yada, yada. Or do you feel like it was like you did your, you really did your best. Obviously there's other people like in your head telling you what to say or suggesting you should do this or do that and you know you you know no real regrets. Listen I express regret in AFR 100% and you know I don't take back anything I said because in my perspective I made sure that I didn't make any promises you know I didn't make any promises to Julian and I understand how certain things could be misconstrued or maybe looked at with hope and maybe that saying I love you and but I did I did and I went there with an open heart. I mean, I feel for Latia 1000%.

I just I would be careful. I'll be more careful with how I was moving with my feelings and not jumping so fast. But you know, like I said, previously, I had been in a seven year relationship, I didn't single for a while. So I was ready to fall in love. And I went in there super open to fall in love. And, you know, I went in there super trusting of everything around me and kind of giddy and happy. And I allowed for yeah, allow for external circumstances to kind of that I thought had my best interest to kind of lead me in a direction where in normal life, I wouldn't I wouldn't normally handle things that way, you know, at a certain point.

But also I was taken by surprise on a couple things and by that time it was already too late to retract. And I was under the mindset that if this is somebody I'm in love with, I'm going to ride or die with them and I'm going to try to make things work. I was in love with two people though and just one person was my person more and that's just the way that the cookie crumbled. That's the to make things work. I was in love with two people though, and just one person was my person more, and that's just the way that the cookie crumbled, that's the way that things happen. So I feel for Latia, you know,

I hope that she does great moving forward, I really do. Well, I do feel like you handled yourself as well as you could, almost to the point where it felt like Latia was almost a little frustrated how well you handled it, because like there was that point at AFR where she kind of just, you were like, hey, I'm just like, really, I got to own this. I'm really sorry for the things I said that hurt your feelings.

And it was kind of a perfect apology where she kind of wanted to keep going. She kind of repeated her gripe against you, but she really had nothing more to say. You know, and in that moment, I kind of, in that moment, I felt for her as like someone who, who's also been a runner up. I was just more like, yeah, I felt like I could put myself in Latia's shoes and say, you're obviously very hurt by this. You felt very wrong by this. And I totally get why you feel wronged.

But as time moves on, to me it felt clear that you really didn't do anything outside of any other lead or bachelor that was, it was just more like, yeah, she felt let on. Of course she felt let on. That's kind of the position, the runner up is always in as they feel like it sucks, but you did the best you could. I honestly felt like you acquitted yourself pretty darn well Graham yeah and at that point AFR like I'm in no position to argue at the end of the day our time was coming with

Julianna and I and that was her time and that was her moment to express how she felt and for me to sit there and argue with her it just wouldn't be it just wouldn't be the right thing to do. So regardless of how the public perceived me, I just had to own whatever she felt and whatever she said, I had to own it. And I'm not gonna sit there and argue on stage. She's the one that I've broken up with. And I didn't mean to hurt her truly.

And that's what I felt. And I allowed her to speak her piece. And I kind of just apologize because what was coming next was my fiance coming out and that's what I really was looking forward to. How have you guys as a couple like stay connected throughout the airing of the season? I mean, it's one thing to film, it's a whole other experience to be an engaged couple and then, you know, they take away the ring, you get to see each other here and there,

then you're watching a whole season back. Juliana, did you watch it back? Did you watch other dates? How did you go about dealing with this very weird experience of watching this journey unfold on TV? Yeah. I think at the forefront of my mind is the fact that this is the bachelor, right? Like he's going to have relationships with other people. He's going to try and pursue other women.

Not like we're out in the real world. We're watching this back. It's like shocking, you know? So even throughout the process, I carried myself in the way that like I was comfortable asking girls how their dates were and hearing how they felt about him. I kind of protected my heart in a sense where I never let the fact that other women are involved out of my mind, but I did my very best

to just let some walls down. And so watching it back, it was, there was a couple of moments where Grant and I were watching together and I kind of shot him an evil eye for a minute for saying certain things. And I'm like, oh, wow that was like, that was weird, you know, but at the end of the day,

like it is what it is and we finished filming, waited a couple of months, talked through things, then like watched it back. It wasn't like anything was surprising to me, honestly. So you still haven't watched finale? No, I've definitely watched it, yeah. It was just that night I knew emotions were going to be high. I knew that it's kind of a quick turnaround from when he has his

conversation with her to when I come out. And I didn't want my head to be in a head space that felt frustrated with the reality of what was said, because obviously things that Grant and I have talked through and I know that I can get a little defensive, you know, for him and I didn't want to come out there with anything other than like excitement for my moment. So I just was like, I'll be in my dressing room, call me when you need me and then I'll have my moment

and then I'll go home and watch it in my own time. I did see you say in an interview that if he like kisses me when I walk in, I know it's me. And then obviously watching finale back, he did that as well with Latia. How did the two of you work through that? I was like, what the hell? That was definitely like, if I had one note,

next time, Graham, if you break up with someone, don't, hopefully you never have to again. It was like, one kiss, oh my God, two kisses, oh God. Yeah, it's a tear, it's a knock. It was like so embarrassing, but you know, it was shitty, it was funny. Like I just say like for painting contestants, like don't think that that means anything

because it just clearly doesn't, you know? Yeah. Sorry, I was wrong. think that that means anything because it just clearly doesn't. Sorry, I was wrong. A lot of shit for it by the way. Yeah, um, you know, Grant, it's, you're in a position to fail, Grant, you know, that's just kind of how it is. That's what you signed up for. Yeah, not, not in every day. I didn't, I didn't realize the fine line of what, what being a bachelor was. And it's definitely in a position where it's very easy to be villainized because you're

dating multiple people, which is something that I've never done and it's something that I would never will do. Like I said, I was in a seven-year relationship. And then I didn't have much experience dating and kind of went in there with my heart on the line. So yeah, just wouldn't recommend it, you know? What have you guys done as a couple that have been kind of fun or like,

have you had any, you know, special moments that you've been able to share with each other? We talked like pretty much every day and multiple times a day. I know that he's kind of connected with my dad a lot, which has, you know, meant a lot to me. We've had a couple

of happy couples trips. I really did not enjoy them all that much because it just felt like PTSD from being isolated, like take my phone away, can't leave the house, can't open the blinds. I was just like, I don't like this. And it was such an unconventional way to have after show get to know each other time. But he really did make them fun. He cooked it up for me all the time. We watched some movies. I got him into reality TV. We did a little Valentine's date.

It was cute. We made the most of it. What'd you get him into? Well, we started Temptation Island and it was just so funny because he's sitting there like, oh, this guy, like, I don't like this guy, you know? And he's like making judgments and I'm like, see buddy, I'll see buddy.

Yeah, but Temptation Island, he's like, Grant's probably like, well, I didn't have a threesome. There's a guy named Grant on there, I'm like, you know, Graham's probably like, well, I didn't have a threesome when. There's a guy named Grant on there. I'm like, fuck Grant. Like, I'm like, oh no, but I understand now, like looking at, but before this, I wasn't a reality. I never even watched reality TV. So coming in here, like I said, my mom signed me up.

So I was in for a shock. And then now, you know, me and Jules will watch the show and looking back, I understand why people come in there with like, it's very easy to be like, uh, to pick sides or to make judgments because your whole persona is out there on TV and people only seen a fraction of you. So I get it. You know, percent Juliana, have you spoken with Latia at all recently?

No. Okay. Have you seen Carolina's diss track? Uh, my friend sent it to me and I had to shut it off after like five seconds. No. Okay. Have you seen Karolina's diss track? My friend sent it to me and I had to shut it off after like five seconds. Did her ex DJ boyfriend help her make that? I'm kind of going to help but wonder. Like, maybe, maybe she's back into the DJs.

We wish her well. One thing about Jules and I, people take low shots. We don't really feed into that. That's too bad. Yeah. How are we going to kill them? We just going to win in life. Grant, what happened to your music that you put up and then now it's gone all of a sudden?

Because I like it. No, a lot of people do. I just feel like at this point in time, what's best is just focus on a relationship. Focus on us. Focus on us building and growing. And yeah, that's the main concern. And you know, I obviously, I, me being in the position I'm in, and some of the some of the way things happened, weren't always the best for coming off the show for our relationship. So we want to just have a fresh light and

paint a fresh picture. And that's just us at the center and everything else whatever comes later comes later but right now we are focused on us we're focused on love and we're focused on building a life so yeah we do love party girls though i love that party girl is great if if i may be able to offer unsolicited advice because i know you didn't ask for it is that listen your relationship's going to work out because you guys choose to work it out or not you know it's like whatever you guys however you guys prioritize your relationship's gonna work out because you guys choose to work it out or not. It's like whatever you guys, however you guys prioritize your relationship. Despite what fans say or other people or your peers

or whatever, is this like, do you, this is an amazing opportunity that you're in right now. Take advantage of this opportunity. Let the haters hate. Let people like say whatever, cause that has nothing to do with your guys' relationship. And like say whatever, you know, because that has nothing to do with your guys's relationship and like everything, specifically you Grant, everything you try, people are going to pick apart. They're just going to, so fuck them. And that's just how it is.

This is how it is, you know? I respect that Nick and trust me, I trade the markets for a living. I started, everybody told me I couldn't do it. My own, some of my own family told me I couldn't do it. And I just put my nose to the ground and I've been able to now provide a life for everybody around me. And yeah, I always, I don't listen to people, but it's just, yeah, we, we, we take things one step at a time and our, our relationship is number one. So that's just the message that I want to get across. Is it true that I heard that

you're going to be moving, Grant? Yeah, of course. Yeah, I know Jules is really, really close to her family out there in Boston. And first and foremost, I want her to be happy. And my dad's out there too. So, you know, I'm going to go ahead and move out there. I'm going out there on Wednesday just to hang out. But yeah, plans to move and be closer with her and just be back on the East Coast. That's my roots, you know? Yay! East Coast, East Coast, baby. Maybe this is a better question for Juliana.

I think, I don't wanna put Grant in this position, but Juliana, anyone from your season that you were on that you think might do well to find love on Bachelor in Paradise? Yeah, I think there's a bunch of girls. I think obviously, Ali Jo is just like a fun, lively spirit and she's gorgeous. I think Parisa is really looking forward

to trying to find her person. So I think that's a great opportunity to have it so isolated. I think Sarafina would crush it. And yeah, I think that that's it really. Okay, love the tension. Yeah. Juliana.

We're very. What'd you say? Said I love the tension. No, it's not tension, it's just honestly. Like I'm just, I'm honest. You can't, you can't, I'm not gonna. I love it, Lizzie, that's what I love. Whose behavior have you been the most shocked by

post-season, post-airing? You know, I think it's maybe not shocked, I think just my feelings were the most hurt by Lithia. Yeah. You know, I don't think that that was expected in any capacity, I think we've talked, you know, between filming and even when the whole show was airing, I did my best to check in with her.

I thought there was a good relationship, but it seems like actions up until, or since AFR moving forward have not been the kindest, and that took me by surprise, and my feelings were hurt by it for sure. Yeah, I'm getting the sense from you that what you're surprised by is it almost feels like, and correct me if I'm getting the sense from you that what you're surprised by is it almost feels like, and correct me if I'm wrong, that whatever Latia's been saying or doing with some of the other

girls from the cast, it feels like maybe she is kind of, I don't know, like, does it feel a little mean girlish almost in a way where some of the other girls are, I don't know, feel like they have to have her back and can't be friends with you and there seems to be like talk going on behind the scenes, so to speak. That's the sense I'm getting from you. Does that feel accurate? Definitely. You know, I think the first stab that I felt was when she brought my name up in the breakup. I think that that was uncalled for.

And then to continue to make kind of those jabs on stage saying she is glad that this isn't a part of her love story and that she deserves a man that's not so confused up until the last second when Grant and I know the reality of it. And that was strictly a jab at me. You know, I think that those things took me back. And then to see, you know, that I want her to be supported. I'm not saying by any means, like, that I don't want her to feel like she has a girl gang behind her, like lifting her up, because

I can't imagine what it's like to get all the way up to that point and maybe have, you know, your heart and your ego bruised. But I think at the end of the day, like, I had relations with a lot of the girls and no point were they making dig that him, you know, or our relationship where now it's like maybe that's a platform that's being used for whatever purpose it is, but it's hurtful and it's not anything that I wanna surround myself with at any point in my life. That makes a lot of sense. It's a weird time you're going through right now,

both of you. I say this to every Bachelor contestant, cause right now I don't think people know, it's such a high school environment, the show in general. Obviously you guys know that being in the house and even post show. Yeah. You know, listen, the reality is,

I'm sure you felt it, like whether they went home night one or they were the runner up, everyone's trying to make the most of this experience. You know, they just are. Whether they're putting out a diss track or not, they're all trying to make the most of it, right? And then, so now that they're trying to make the most of it, you know, they're trying to fit, who's coattails can they ride, right? They can't ride to make the most of it, you know, they're trying to fit,

whose coattails can they ride? Right? They can't ride, you guys are in love, you know? And like Latia needs like a group, so to speak. And I always say like, you don't really know who your friends are from this show until a year later, right? Because right now all these friendships

are based off of mutually beneficial moments. Like who's like interest best align with mine? And that's how people are making and deciding to be friends. The dust will settle, people will go out, they'll go to their influencer trips, they'll be invited to all these things. You'll figure out who you're friends with and who you're not friends with.

There'll be fallouts and things like that. And if you're still friends with someone a year after filming, then you know it's real. Before that, it's all for show. It's all bullshit, it's all fake. And they don't even realize it. They don't even realize who the real friends are because they're so all consumed

by making the most of this experience that they think it's all sincere and genuine. I only know that because I was a part of it. I know, I realize that I made the same mistakes and same choices. My judgment was also clouded in very similar ways. So try not to take it personally. They literally don't think, realize what they're doing.

Yeah, that's fair. Honestly, I appreciate that advice. There's also like a really awkward situations where you have people that you've never met or never really talked to, who are like, you know, trying to say certain things about you or making certain videos and just like, we're the type of people who don't really entertain that.

If you got a problem with me or Jewel, you say it to our face, you don't make videos about it or take subtle jokes. That's not the reality of it. They like you saying, they want it because- They come out the woodwork. They just want to use your name, man, right? Like everyone, Grant, everyone's gonna you think, you know, they wanna, they want it because they come out the woodwork. They just wanna use your name, man, right? Like everyone, Grant, everyone's gonna be like, yeah.

Oh, I ran into him at a bar and he did this to me or he did that, he didn't hold the door for me. I remember a few of those came after Nick, you know, he slammed the door in my face. Oh my God. You know, this was a huge experience for them. It went however it went, you know, and they're gonna try to squeeze every juice out of that lemon, you know, and you're the person they're gonna

try to squeeze the most. Until you know something, this is gonna pass for us. And like, we're gonna so we don't we, I went in there knowing this and I didn't go in there looking for any type of clout or anything, you know, I went in there trying to find my person. Yes, we have interests and hobbies, but that's just expression. This fades. We're gonna be on a beach somewhere, having some emotions with our family,

and not worrying about guys making TikToks or people talking. That's just what it is. Well, also you guys have the benefit of coming together through this, right? Nothing makes a relationship stronger than feeling like you guys have to have each other's backs. You do in general, but this is a little extra motivation.

Definitely. I just feel like Grant's been getting shit left and right all season, and he's been going through it. And I'm like, it's okay. You can do this. don't listen to them. And then on the flip side after AFR I was like, shit, I'm going through it, what do we do? And he's like, I got you, don't worry.

It's always worse online, especially when it's about you because even if you're not looking for it, you have family members and friends sending you shit you don't wanna see. But I can tell you, as someone who has a more obviously distant perspective of this story, who's not personally involved, Grant, I don't think anyone really cares about the breakup.

And I think everyone's just kinda happy for you guys. No one's really talking about AFR. You know what I'm saying? I really think you- More people are, I think more people are talking about, come on now, than anything other. Listen, I catch myself saying it sometimes too, I get it. Yeah, man, just enjoy the experience. Anything you guys want to leave us with before we let you go?

I don't think so. No, I think I'm good. I think we're good. I just want to say peace and love to you guys. And you know, I've been on your platform a couple of times. You guys do a great job and yeah, just, you know, continue doing what you're doing. And yeah, I really appreciate you having us.

And yeah, I hope to see you guys again one day. You're one of the great ones, Grant. I really respect the hell out of you. You're a really great guy, man. And that's more important than being a great bachelor, which I also thought that you were, but I hope that you had a good experience I think you should be really proud of how you handled yourself that's just my opinion for whatever it's worth and I'm really excited for the both of you you seem

really happy and wishing you both nothing but the best going forward appreciate that Nick thank you take care bye Ooh. Listen, it's gotta be hard. Like she, I totally get where she's coming from. Totally. Of like, yeah, people don't wanna be my friend right now. Like right, you know, it's like they feel like they have to choose sides and they're choosing. And this seems more than usual.

It usually doesn't happen this way. It doesn't always happen where there's a bit of a rift between the final ladies. It's tough, I hope they figure it out. I hope they can work through that. Cause that's, I don't, you know, I feel for Juliana being like, the only person she has is Grant, who is her fiance.

And at the end of the day, that is the only person she needs. But it is tough to like see all these women who you thought you had friendships with and you were excited to get on the outside and go on trips and hang out and do this and do that and no one wants to do that with you. That's tough.

It really is tough. And it's just my critique of Latia's performance was that she kind of suggested she was gonna bring some receipts and then she really didn't. And receipts aren't your- Feelings? Well, your receipts aren't your story. Receipts are receipts and then she really didn't. And receipts aren't your. Feelings?

Well, your receipts aren't your story. Receipts are receipts. Like your story is usually backed up by receipts. And she just brought her version of events, which more than entitled to do. You expected her to like print out a PDF and like read out screenshots? No, it kind of, listen, my critique is she seemed to come

for him and his character, the person, rather than saying, that really hurt me, I know you're a good person, especially after time had passed, she came into AFR kind of wanting to put a dent in his brand or his likability or. Well, I can see how she might not think he's a good person after feeling like she was led on and she, you know,

like how she said where he was like, you know, my character. And she was like, honestly, I don't know if I do. I mean, sure. But again, I just, this is, she's a part of a show. That is, it's a choice. All I'm saying, it's a choice for her to, I have all this time passed, right? To maybe get a little insight in the show aspect

of what happened, let the dust settle, and then still kind of come for his throat. And not only that, according to Juliana, seemed to have some of their peers have to take a side, rather than being like, hey listen, I get you're upset. Well you don't know if that's directly from Latia, or if that's them feeling like they wanna choose a side, and the side that they're gonna choose is Latia's.

But Latia, all I'm saying is Latia did, she was coming for Grant at AFR. It wasn't, there are- That's usually how it goes though. We've seen different versions. We have seen more gracious, more like, and listen, I love the drama, I love that like, hey, it was good TV, I was hoping for it,

but like she wanted the sympathy and she wanted to leave a mark, she did. She wanted to leave a mark. And it's more like, other than feeling let on, what did he do that justifies the last impression you want us to have of Grant being a bad one? I'd imagine she feels lied to. Sure, but there's her feelings and then again,

there's a TV aspect of the show where she is entitled to whatever she wants, but if she kinda, it was a choice she made. And Juliana feels a certain way. Sit your pool and let her know she knows what she signed up for card? Not entirely, but I do think that as time passed, she could have been a little more gracious. Maybe. You don't think so?

I mean, I think she is entitled to say, hey, like you said these four things to me that really had me thinking like I was the one and then like clearly none of that was true. So like, why say those things to me because it really put me. I totally get all that. I think I'm more, it's some of the other,

I think she went a step further than just say, hey, that really hurt my feelings, I felt let on, I wish that didn't happen, and what do you have to say? And then Grant came out and was like, hey, I have to own that, I'm really sorry, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And then she still came for him again,

and I think she wanted to leave a mark, literally. I think she wanted Bachelor Nation to take her side and think less of Grant. And that is a choice she made. But you just told Grant and Juliana that you feel for Letea in that moment and you have this empathy as to why she reiterated herself.

Well, I can completely empathize with how she felt, why she felt the way that she felt, and her justification for it. But you don't think she should have done it? As time passes, she will realize that her intentions were more malicious than she realizes. Maybe. That's what I think. I could be wrong, but I think she will,

I think it was less about him and more about her. That's what I think. Well, I know it's my winner one and I'm happy. Team Jules. Is there gonna be more fallout from this? Cause it really seems like there are some bad feelings. I don't know. It seems like they're unbothered by it, which I love.

And I started following Juliana and I can't wait to see photos from their trips and hopefully they don't get pay any mind to anybody talking shit about their relationship. Cause what do they know? Come on now. Come on know? Come on now. Come on now. Come on now.

I'm giggling after you brought that back up. She literally, like people have resurfaced that video, well not resurfaced, but reposted it so many times, because she switches the level and like the tone of her voice. Everyone was like, she went from kindergarten teacher to kid, so fast. Hi, Cleo. It's when he's about to-

He was saying, he was like, I hope you don't think differently. And she was like, oh, come on. Yeah, it literally went from like, oh my God, I'm so happy to be here. Come on. She was code switching. She was being sweet.

And then she was like, what's this BS? Have you guys ever seen that SNL sketch? It's like old Sherri O'Terry and her whole thing is just saying, Simma down now. Simma down. Simma down now. Yeah. Well, thanks for listening.

We are back tomorrow with an explosive going deeper with none other than Tom Sandoval and his lady, Victoria Lee Robinson. All that tomorrow and so much more going forward. We'll see you then. Bye bye.