The Viall Files - E943 Ask Nick - My Baby Daddy Tried To Hook Up With My Sister

Episode Date: June 2, 2025

Our first caller wants to know how she can stop  comparing her great current relationship to a toxic old one? Our second caller’s boyfriend thinks women's suffrage was a mistake. And, our third caller is wondering if it’s time to cut her deadbeat baby daddy out of her life for good? “The reality that you're gonna have to face is that you will never be able to prevent or guarantee heartbreak." Listen to Humble Brag with Cynthia Bailey and Crystal Kung Minkoff every Monday starting October 21st! Available wherever you get your podcasts and YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@humblebragpod  https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/humble-brag-with-crystal-and-cynthia/id1774286896 https://open.spotify.com/show/4NWA8LBk15l2u5tNQqDcOO?si=c03a23d537f94735   Start your 7 Day Free Trial of Viall Files + here: https://viallfiles.supportingcast.fm/  Please make sure to subscribe so you don’t miss an episode and as always send in your relationship questions to [e-mail] to be a part of our Monday episodes.  To Order Nick’s Book Go To: https://www.viallfiles.com  If you would like to get some texting advice, send an email to [e-mail] with “Texting Office Hours” in the subject line!  To advertise on this podcast please email: [e-mail] or go to: https://advertising.libsyn.com/theviallfiles  THANK YOU TO OUR SPONSORS: SKIMS - Shop the SKIMS Ultimate Bra Collection and more at https://SKIMS.com and SKIMS stores. BetterHelp - Talk it out, with BetterHelp. Our listeners get 10% off their first month at https://betterhelp.com/viall  Caraway - You can shop Caraway Risk-Free! Enjoy fast, free shipping, easy returns, and a 30-day trial. Plus, if you visit https://carawayhome.com/viallfiles or use code VIALLFILES at checkout, you can take an additional 10% off your next purchase.  Cymbiotika - Go to https://cymbiotika.com/viall to get 20% off plus free shipping.  Sundays For Dogs - Get 40% off your first order of Sundays. Go to https://sundaysfordogs.com/viall or use code Viall at checkout.    Timestamps: (00:00) - Intro (00:13) - Caller One (50:40) - Caller Two (01:25:16) - Caller Three Episode Socials: @viallfiles @nickviall @justinkaphillips @dereklanerussell  

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of singles worldwide. Datemyage.com. How's it going? Hi, I'm Josephine and I'm 31 years old and I'm struggling to stop comparing my very old toxic relationship to my very happy new one. So you're in a relationship. I am, yes. What do you compare the most? Like what, yeah, describe what you mean by comparing.

Yeah, I can give some context. So me and my current partner have been together for about eight months. He's amazing. Like he's definitely the healthiest person I've ever been with. He's amazing. He's definitely the healthiest person I've ever been with. He is so kind. It's insane.

I'm so in love with him. But what ends up happening, so my prior relationship that I find myself comparing, he had a lot of drinking problems, to say the least. And I find myself, anytime my current partner is like a little intoxicated, he's, I mean, he drinks a lot, but not in large amounts, if that makes sense. So like, he's like a beer a day kind of guy. And I find myself just getting triggered

by it. Like I get really irritated and I'm not very nice about it. Okay, well, it's good to recognize. Yeah, which is honestly, it's very hypocritical because I'm like, I could probably say I'm a fairly big drinker. I'm in liquor sales, so I am around alcohol like every single day and I socially drink quite a bit. Okay, what else?

I mean, is that the big, is there anything else that you're comparing or is that just the real? I think that's honestly the biggest thing. It's, and then it kind of causes me to spiral a little bit and then I'll like go into like a little hole of other comparisons that I really, in the right state of mind, I don't think are fair.

But when I'm in that spiral moment, I will like go to those dark places and compare really little petty things. Like, oh, he doesn't know how to speak about his emotions or he's not doing this. Or he's like, you know, really honestly, like things that in the right state of mind I know aren't fair to him.

So when you say compare, you know, you're not necessarily comparing your current boyfriend to your ex and missing things, you're more comparing in the sense that like, is this seemingly perfect man and seemingly best relationship I've ever had gonna eventually turn into that dog shit relationship, I survived.

100%, yeah. I'm just, I'm like very scared of heartbreak. I did not handle that breakup well. Like to say the least, it was the darkest time of my life. Yeah, well, uh. Yeah. Yeah. The silver lining is, if that, you know, usually there's always this one, how many other heart

breaks have you had? Quite a bit. I'm kind of a serial monogamous. So when I say kind of, I mean, I really am. I. But what about, it sounds like this heartbreak was maybe the worst or no? Yeah, it was. We were together for four years in like a pivotal time, like 22 to 26, 27, and we moved out of state.

So we moved together and we had honestly like a very lovely relationship up until our move. And then he met a ton of really awesome people. I mean, we both made very similar friends. We're both in the service industry, so bartending, serving, that kind of thing. But he just kind of went down the path of drinking and doing drugs and never coming home

and just like really getting racked up in the town that we lived in, which was awesome to some extent and really negative to another. But when we moved together, it was like really with the idea that we were gonna get married. Yeah, yeah.

Yeah. And so when you started dating your ex, kinda like you said, like it was good, but then it got bad. Yeah, yeah, it was really good for, I would say two and a half years. Yeah. And part of that good was him not seemingly having

a problem with alcohol in the first two and a half years? You know, that's such a good question because maybe it was something I didn't recognize as much. I mean, I was younger too, and I was also working in restaurants and bars. We met at the restaurant that we worked at together. So we were going out quite a bit, like after our shifts. And I think in our move, I was one, working a lot less and more excited to be home because

it was like the first house that was like the dream house and I was more excited to be at home and to be at home and to be a homebody than he was. So I think I honestly just like recognized it more than I did back home in the Midwest. Yeah, that makes sense. Yeah. Well, kind of like you said too, right?

When like, I mean, I've never been a big drinker, but in my twenties, I mean, it wouldn't be that crazy for me to go out Thursday, Friday, Saturday night and two of those nights to get like pretty drunk. Oh yeah. Yeah. Which is like, is a lot more excessive than I drink now, right? But like when you're in your 20s and going out, it's pretty normal for a group of friends

to like kind of, you know, party and party together and go out on a regular basis and drink in excess on a regular basis so it's really kind of hard to tell the difference between the friends who like are just like. Yo loing it and the people who like maybe have a little drinking problem. For sure you know it's actually a really good point when you bring up friends to you ask me anything else is like triggering or like that I'm comparing. And this is something that I'm really trying not to be like, ma, like I don't want to be like mothering him. But I find myself being super protective with some of his friends that do have like legitimate issues. And it's like, blaringly obvious, like at what do you call it? The casino, I almost said the casino's name.

They're like at the casino a lot, and just being unhealthy, they don't have literal jobs. And I find myself being like very judgmental, and I don't wanna be like that. And when he's with this certain friend, it's really one in particular, I find myself like getting anxious and nervous about it. Well, how does your current boyfriend talk about this friend? He's worried about him. He's very worried.

Great. Yeah. That's great. Yeah. But it also, it seems like the only time that they talk about his friend's issues is when they're like under the influence. So I feel like there's not a lot of sober conversations that are being happening. The only reason I'm not looking for your boyfriend to save his friend. It's nice if you can and it's nice if he's there. The reason I asked that question is because I wanted to know what his perception of his friend, if it matched your perception of that problem.

I have friends who I have concerns or have had concerns about their consumption and I still, you know, I hung out with them and they were still my close friends and I spent a lot of time with them and it was more like, well, I know I'm not worried about having, you know, you're worried because like your ex-boyfriend allowed himself

to get caught up with friends or people who influenced or it felt like influenced by his behavior. Yeah, but you got to see the difference between your current boyfriend and your ex boyfriend, which is like he can recognize somehow. He can go out, enjoy alcohol, socially be around people, and he can be aware of of of people's over consumption and problematic decisions and the lack, you know, and be concerned for his friends so much, you know, it would be concerning if he was like, I don't know, like I see it, but my boyfriend just kind of like doesn't, and I don't know, he just thinks his friends is kind of chilling and like, I don't know, like maybe he

thinks he has a problem, maybe he doesn't, he doesn't really bring it up, like that to me would be like a mild red flag. Yeah, yeah, totally. And then I would say, I see why you're concerned, but he sees the problem, and you see the problem. So you're worried about a guy who's worried about his friend, and you're more worried

about this friend he's worrying about being a bad influence, as if this this troubled friend is going to sell him on how great his life is that your boyfriend's gonna be like, yeah, I want some of that in my life. I know. No, you're so right. I know. Can I give you an example of one evening? It was like the only large fight we've ever had. I was in Chicago for the night and my boyfriend was looking after my dog. And like we spend a lot of nights together. He knows my dog very well. I was not even in the slightest concerned or worried.

But I should clarify, like I went out pretty hard and I had a lot of fun. I hadn't seen this friend in a long time and we like we had a lot of fun. So I don't want to sound like a hypocrite because I was out till like three in the morning. But the next day I called my boyfriend just to make sure like that everything was good with the dog. And he was on his way to my place, like in the morning, like at 8 a.m.

And I'm like, what do you mean you're on your way? And he was with this friend that I have concerns about. Basically he left my dog all night. And he's like, no, we walked her at 10 p.m. and now we're on our way back. She's totally fine. And that was incredibly upsetting to me. Like, I've never left my dog overnight

without a human to sleep with, like ever. Yeah, I was really, really mad. And I just don't think he would have done something like that if he weren't with this person, but also that was his choice, so. Yeah, I mean, I get why you're triggered, but. Yeah. But yeah, it sounds like more of a trigger rather than.

Yeah. Like I understand no one else is like, you haven't left your dog, but like I think dogs are fine sleeping by themselves. I know, but like all night she was probably wondering. I like can't. Probably not. I don't, I know, but like all night she was probably wondering. I like can't. Probably not. I know, no like logically I understand

but I mean you understand too, because you have dogs. I'm obsessed with my dog and the idea of her being like alone really upset me. I think if I just felt more like disrespected, I felt like the fact that he had said he was going to do a thing that he didn't really do. Sure. I mean, and you had a right to be upset about that, right? But there's a difference

between being upset about the thing that you have a right to be upset about and addressing that thing and saying, hey, that made me frustrated. I thought I could count on you to take care of my dog and you didn't meet my expectations. And I felt, you know, I just count on you to take care of my dog. And you didn't meet my expectations. And I felt the, you know, I just felt like you over-promised and under-delivered versus getting in your head and being like, what does this mean? You know, are you like,

and acting like it was his troubled friend who influenced him and he chose his, you know, he chose to like become an alcoholic over taking care of your dog. Yeah, yeah. You know. I do know, I do know. I think that's what I'm struggling with.

Like the, like you said, like just like the, I make up ideas in my head and I'm very scared of things going sideways. So I feel like I'm in constant protection mode. Yeah. That's normal. And I just get frustrated pretty easily. And I don't want to be like that because I'm typically a very loving person.

And I think he knows how much I love him, but I definitely feel myself being impatient at times that are unfair. And I see it making him sad. He doesn't even get reactive, but he just gets like sad, which makes me sad and feel stupid. I mean, listen, the reality that you're gonna have to face is that you will never be able to prevent or guarantee heartbreak.

Yeah. It sucks. And as we get older, that gets scarier and scarier. In our 20s, we're kind of like, we don't want heartbreak, but I guess we're meant to experience it. And someone older than me told me, I'm gonna have to deal with it in order to become a better version of myself or really learn about myself

and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. But then when we're in our early 30s and got through our 40s and we're dealing with it, we're just like, what's the fucking point of that? I've already, you know, I didn't need to, I did not need this anymore to learn, you know, type of thing. And like not every bad thing that happens in our life

is meant to be a lesson. I don't think, again, I don't think things happen for a reason. You can still learn a lesson, you know? It doesn't, like it didn't happen, you know, the world doesn't revolve around us. And therefore like not everything that happens to us is some sort of destiny.

It's just dumb fucking luck. It's just life. What you can do though is to control what you can control and not try to over control the things you can't control. And you're doing a little bit of the latter and trying to squeeze and protect yourself from things that are just like outside of your control. Totally.

It's still a really new relationship. It is. And I think the best thing you can do to protect yourself is to just say, you know, this is really great so far and I see so much potential, but let's just enjoy the moment and not think about the future and not, you can talk about the future,

you can talk about your goals, but it's just more like you're gonna have to let it play out. The key to the relationships is showing up every day and saying, this is the person I choose to be with and I'm gonna do the most I can for this relationship today. Yeah. And hope that the other person feels matches that energy.

Yeah. I guess when you say that, cause I 100% agree, I think obviously conversation and when you're, I feel like we just often, me and my boyfriend, I mean, just get into like deep talks a lot. We're very like chatty all the time. So like

future goals do come up often. And us talking about our future together. And there are times too when I catch it and I'm just kind of like, maybe we shouldn't be talking about this. But what what is your advice for that? Because I don't wanna be putting too much pressure on the relationship, but I also don't wanna be shutting down just like natural conversation. Well, I just, I don't know, I think it's a balance. I just think there's a difference between like

being intentional with what you want in a relationship as an early 30 something year old person who's like, hey, I'm not here to fuck around that much anymore. Like I, you know, not sure if you're interested in having children, but if you are, like there's certain considerations you have to make as a woman that men don't.

And that's normal versus, you know, obsessively trying to push a timeline or play house or speed things up because you're 30. And like you talked about, part of the reason why your last breakup fucked you up so much, because like you said, that was a very transitional time in your life. And I bet that you win that relationship thinking,

oh, this is it, this is it. I found my person. And we moved together, we're making big moves and we're making big life decisions. And then when it ended, it was early 30, late 20, it just felt like you lost four years, four pivotal years of your life, you know? And you never thought you'd be a woman

who has to worry about her biological clock, you know? And then it feels like such a fuckin' trope or cliche or whatever. And then we beat ourselves up emotionally by saying, well, I never thought this would happen to me. And then you try to be different, and then you kind of, again, become a little bit more neurotic or intense,

and then you force situations because you wanna make up for lost time. and these are all the things I think you're you're dealing with. You know, you got a shit-ton going for you, you know. You look great, you know, you could be you could have said, hey I'm 24, am I cool? You know, I wouldn't be like, oh well. You know, you're still said, hey, I'm 24, am I cool? I wouldn't be like, oh, whoa. You know, like. You're still young, science is better than ever when it comes to, you know. And you are one of the few people out there

who it was not that hard to find something better and something you're really excited about and something that feels good. I mean, it's like, honestly, like, it's fucking depressing out there, man. Like, people are just so disconnected and men and women, when it comes to heterosexual relationships, have some incredibly valid gripes

about the opposite sex. But none of us, no side is willing to like, do anything about it or, you know, and the world today tells us that we have every right to blame someone else for our problems, and it's a fucking mess out there. And yet, you know, you found a pretty good thing. No, I totally agree with you.

I am so grateful. Like I'm so grateful for him literally 99% of the time. And then I feel myself just like these moments. And I honestly think it's just like when I'm not being nice. Like it's like obvious. It's like, I feel it, he feels it. And I don't mean nice, like, oh, I'm grumpy, I'm hormonal. I mean, when I'm just like, ugh, ew, you're kind of drunk, I don't want to be

around you. But he's not even like, he's so nice all the time. He's not being... I've had exes that were very reactive on alcohol or mean, just straight up assholes. But that's normal, I don't know. When I'm stoned, I can know I piss off. And I do something stupid when I'm stoned. Now it's 10 times more irritated than me. But do you feel, does it hurt your feelings?

Hurt my feelings? No. Do I get frustrated at times? Can it feel a little naggy and a little unnecessary? And does it feel like she's getting mad at me for not the thing I did, but she's just making a mountain out of a molehill type of a thing?

Sure. Yeah, it can feel like that. Okay. Yeah, I think that's what I get nervous about because I don't wanna drive him away because I'm like what you said, like naggy or acting like I'm on this like, yeah. I just don't wanna put myself on like a higher,

like I'm like know everything and he's younger than me and I don't wanna- How much younger? He's four years younger than me, so he's 27. Okay, well, that's something you wanna be mindful of. Yeah, I'm very mindful of it. Yeah. And that's maybe where some of your fears come from.

Totally, yeah, cause he's the age that I was when I broke up with Max, yeah. And that is a risk, that's a risk. You are dating someone, I mean, I don't know, it's a risk I took. You know, I married someone a lot younger than me who I knew still had life to live that I had already lived and I had to be willing to let that play out,

not knowing how that could have, you know, it's just by definition, my wife most likely was going to change more than I was gonna change in our marriage or in our relationship. I'm scared. Well, isn't that interesting though? Cause I bet you have changed a lot and maybe, right? Yeah, I hope that we've changed together,

but I'm just saying it was like a concern of mine and something I had to be mindful of. And you're gonna have to still, you're gonna have to challenge yourself to be good at allowing your partner to help you and to push you. There's always a power dynamic in any relationship and it changes a lot and the goal is to try to have that power dynamic for the most part be fairly consistent.

When I met Natalie, I felt very much, in a lot of ways I felt in control, well a lot of ways, I felt in control, well a lot of which was as a product of me being a lot older and kind of like my subconscious probably felt like I knew better or knew more. And I'm sure at times it came across as condescending and that's kind of natural being older and that's something you have to be mindful of

and it sounds like you are aware of it. I am a lot of your fears maybe come from thinking he doesn't know better and I know better totally yeah like 100% and it's so stupid but I like when we first started dating I and and for a while I've kind of had this idea of like all things, all things come to an end, right? Like, oh, like we're gonna have fun or enjoy each other, even fall in love, and there's just no guarantee. And I was very like accepting of that. I was even in a relationship between these two relationships, and we broke up and I was, I handled it really well. It was like a very healthy breakup,

but for some reason I think I just love this guy so much and so I'm just really scared. It's like I'm on this, I don't know, I'm just anxious. Like I know that if we broke up, it would be like a complete disaster for me. Like I would not be okay. I think you would, you would. Yeah. I'm not saying I would not be okay. I think you would. You would. You would. Yeah.

I'm not saying it wouldn't be difficult. I'm not saying you would have a couple of real bad days or weeks or months. You would be okay. Maybe. Well, I mean, listen, you know, if you tell yourself you're not gonna be okay, then for a period of time, you won't be, you know?

It's like, for me, when it comes to heartbreak, the initial pain of heartbreak never gets easier. It actually gets harder, right? Your first heartbreak, you don't even know what it is you're feeling and it feels like the end of the world. And the scary part about that is you literally don't know you're gonna get over it because you've never even been in love,

let alone knowing how to get over love. The initial heartbreakbreak when you experience it for the second or third or fourth time in your life, the initial pain is sometimes worse because it's like not again, I'm older, I can't believe this happened to me again, how am I gonna actually move on from, you're kind of more worried about the future,

but what you do know is that you can get over it. And so you can consciously say, I'm hurting now, I'm in pain now, I feel all these feelings, but I'll get over it. I don't know if it's a week from now or a month from now, but I do know how to get over someone. I already have done that. There's certain just like steps to getting over someone,

right? Like that's like anything else, right? So you can and you will, you know? And you just don't know what the future holds for yourself. I mean, again, you know, like again, as a woman, it's different than as a man, biological cop, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. But like, I'm sitting here with you today talking,

when I was your age, you could not have convinced me I would be where I'm in today. And that like, you know, a guy who hosts a pop culture podcast talking about reality TV and Real Housewives and Bravo and like The Bachelor and like interviewing celebrities that I like saw on TV. It's like you just never could. So instead of being afraid of the future and what you don't know, the better part of maturing about is this knowing

how you're developing skills to adapt and to be resilient. And if I were you, I would embrace your resiliency and try to think about what allowed you to get over that very painful breakup and know that that is in your bag of skills, so to speak, that if you ever need in the future, and maybe you'll never have to be emotionally resilient when it comes to your romantic life, maybe he's your guy.

But you're gonna have to be resilient in other aspects of your life. There's other forms of heartbreak that aren't just romantic relationships. Oh yeah. You know? Yup, mm-hmm. No, I agree.

I really appreciate everything you're saying. It's like, I feel like the advice that you're giving me right now is like what I say to my little sister. Like, every time we have a deep conversation and it's so much easier said than done. And I know, like, what do they say? Like talk to yourself, like you would talk to a friend.

Sure. But yeah, you know, you don't, you're, you're, well, I mean, you are invested in your little sister's outcome, I guess, to a certain extent, but like you're more invested in the outcome of your life and you're emotionally connected to your life and your ego, you have a very loud ego as we all do. And when you're talking to your sister, you have a very loud ego as we all do. And when you're talking to your sister,

you're not, you know, you're just, it's very pragmatic and you don't have to like, you're talking to me, hearing what I'm saying while you're still hearing voices in your head in a way. You know? And that's why it's easier to give advice than take it. Totally. I was listening to one of your episodes. And to be honest, I kind of forget which caller it was, but you said something along the lines of like, oh,

like, you know, I have all these callers, they're listening to me in the moment, but then they take that advice however they want to look, because we remember things the way that we remember them in our point of view. And then, so I was thinking about that a lot while I was in the little waiting room, thinking like, okay, how am I going to take Nick's advice very seriously and logically and not twist it in my head? because I love doing that. But I think no matter what, I'm just going to struggle with accepting my boyfriend in the moment of this. I guess I just don't know how to get out of my head in those moments when he's reminding me of my ex. I don't

know how to talk to him about it. And when I have talked to him about it, I think he thinks I'm saying he has a drinking problem, which is- Why are you talking to him about it? What's he supposed to do? Yeah. Yeah. I guess that's another question of mine. Is there anything that he's supposed to do or is he, like, should he be aware that I'm having these feelings? Cause it's... I think there's a difference between having an awareness and communicating to your partner things that trigger you

or insecurities that you have, but it's a fine line between I don't know if you need to like bring it up to him and then especially if there's nothing for him to do about it. You know, because it sounds like as you workshop this problem in your head or talk with me about it, you're like kind of recognizing that like he doesn't have a drinking problem. And while he doesn't even drink more than me, he just has a friend that is struggling and he does enjoy spending time with that friend. And every once in a while, he might do something that irritates me,

but it's definitely not a sign of any type of over consumption or anything like that. So like bringing it up to him, right now it sounds like you're bringing it up to him, expecting him to like say or do something to make you feel better. Yeah. And if he's not doing anything wrong,

like what is he supposed to say or do? I know. I think it's also like I am an over communicator, like whether that's a good or a bad thing, like in every area of life, like work. Probably both. Yeah, yeah, I communicate a lot. And I feel like I always have this desire to explain

like, oh, this is why I was rude or this is why my document was late, which is probably just the most obnoxious thing in the world. But especially when it seems like my boyfriend's feelings are hurt. And I feel like a dumbass. I'm like, okay, I need to explain to him why I was spiraling out a little bit. What was the last time you said, without an explanation, I was wrong, I'm sorry. I don't know if I've ever done that. Give it a shot.

I'm sorry, but let me explain why isn't an apology. Yeah. It's I'm sorry you're mad, but let me explain why isn't an apology. Yeah. It's I'm sorry you're mad, but let me explain why you should be less mad. It's like, well, I don't even care about me being mad. I just wanna know that you're not gonna do this again. Totally. Yeah.

So when you're sitting there trying to explain to your boyfriend why you got triggered and why your frustration, how you treated him what it's you're you're justifying your actions you're explaining what he can do differently so that you don't feel that way so that you don't do the thing that you had to apologize for so in a very passive aggressive way you're kind of blaming him yeah for the thing that you're apologizing for you're kind of blaming him for the thing that you're apologizing for. Totally, yeah.

Just be wrong and move forward. Totally. I think too, it's like, I have to, I just have to figure out how to like emotionally remove myself from a moment, if that even makes sense. Like I just need to not engage. The other night, he does open mics. He plays guitar at open mics, and it's the cutest thing

in the world. But he came home kind of late, which really isn't a big deal. By the way, we don't live together, but we stay together quite often. And he came to my place. And I am happy that he's out and about. I'm not like checking in on him. I'm not like texting him. But it was the fact that he was drunk when he came over that irked me. And he was being so sweet. He didn't do anything wrong. He was just telling me about his day and telling me about his night. But for some reason, I was like, Oh my God, I think I said something like, dude, I just am not in the mood to talk right now. I just want to go to bed. We can talk about your day tomorrow. And I was really short and rude. And I know that it hurt his feelings because he was excited about his open mic. He was excited about it. And I was just kind of like shut him down. And I was tired, but I was also just like annoyed.

And I felt like maybe he shouldn't have been driving either. I don't know. But. Can you just say, like the next day, were you like, I'm sorry, I was so dismissive? I think I said something like I was in a bad mood. Like I apologize or some, I said something like that. But I think like last night he said something like, I feel like I'm being a bad

boyfriend. And I was like, no, you're not at all. Like he was just feeling kind of like stupid. Like I could tell he just felt kind of dumb and I don't ever want him to feel that way. And I just, how often do you thank him or show appreciation or compliment him or make him feel good or just say, you know, every once in a while, I'm really lucky to have you and I'm grateful for having you and I don't know. I'm a big complimenter.

That's good. Like it's my favorite thing to do is like lift other people including him. So I definitely give a lot of compliments. It sounds like honestly part of some of your anxiety and fears is like the fact that like you said, like he's the same age that you were when you started, and so you are a little older than him.

I mean, you are in some ways maybe more mature than him. And your boyfriend's still like at a stage of his life where it makes sense that he's still going out and staying out a little later. Yeah, he's learning. And that is a product of you having to accept dating a man who's four years younger than you. And that's where some of the grace for yourself and for him.

And so you need to acknowledge that as a choice you made. And you might have to, at two in the morning, when he comes home a little buzzed, minus the driving aspect of it, bite your, bite your tongue and recognize that you are in a bad mood and maybe you're not in the mood to deal and still deal and put on the happy face because like you chose to date this person and you are going to date this person both for their benefits and accept their shortcomings. And the good news for you, some of his shortcomings are a product of his age, which actually might and probably will change as opposed to dating someone.

You realize, you know, like when I had met Natalie, I was like, sorry to break it to you, but I'm probably gonna leave cabaret doors open for the rest of my life and do a bunch of dumb shit that's absent-minded, that's gonna drive you fucking nuts, and it's almost certainly never gonna get much better than it is today. Yeah, I mean, obviously we all have

our annoying little habits. I mean, I'm severely ADHD. I am all over the place all the time, like quite literally. So I know I'm annoying to deal with friend-wise and relationship-wise. So yeah, people have to be patient with me. Yeah, I mean, so listen, as far as like you're gonna be triggered by your ex,

you sound like you ruminate a lot and overthink, which is fine, but like just get better at doing that by yourself without projecting that onto your relationship or your boyfriend. And when you're like, when you can tell yourself he's not doing anything wrong, it sounds like you're still treating him sometimes like he is. And that will, you know, and if you get frustrated at your boyfriend for things that he's not doing wrong and you're not even asking him to change anything.

And that's why he probably said, I feel like I'm being a bad boyfriend, right? Because you're treating him a certain way and you're expressing a frustration but you're not giving him a, men are very solution oriented for the most part. And it was like, well, I don't know, I don't want you to feel this way.

I don't wanna keep doing what you're doing but I don't even think that you're even asking me to change anything. It's like, you know, you're not being like, I don't think you should hang out with Max anymore. Right, right. You know, it's like, you, that would be,

you know, that would be like crazy because like, you're not going to stop, you know, it's just like anger. And he's like, well, do you want me to stop hanging out? I don't like, is that what you're asking? I don't know. What am I supposed to? I don't, what the fuck?

Like, I don't like, am I a bad boyfriend? Yeah. So. Yeah. So. Yeah, and he's so, like he's, he probably would. I would never ask him to do that, but like that's how he is. So I. If that's the case though, then I think that, that's not a positive sign.

That's not a green flag, that's a red flag. That means that you hold a little too much power in this relationship. Yeah, no, I honestly agree with that. And that's why I think that's something that I'm trying to balance is like, I am nervous that he would do too much for me. And I care about him so much too

that when I'm anxious about our breaking up, I actually am anxious about him getting hurt too. It's like, it's not just me. I'm like, I- You can't, you can't, you can't. I know. You have to let go of some of this control. You have a control, you have a control problem.

Your heart is gonna be broken in the future, I guarantee it. I don't know how, I don't know why. You're gonna experience, you're gonna experience pain again. You're gonna, you're gonna feel victimized again. Yeah. But that's a guarantee. So just let that go.

Accept it. Because you are doing a little too much and you're gonna have to let go of some of that power that you think your boyfriend should have in this relationship because you're not letting him have it. Yeah, I definitely, I mean, he also was like so sweet and was like willing to be on this phone call, but, and this is like another control thing.

I was like, I just don't know what you're gonna say, like you're gonna be. And I was just like, I mean, he ended up having to work anyhow. But he- So you didn't let your boyfriend come to this call because you were afraid of how he might make you look in front of me. No, to be honest, I would have let him be on it. I hate using the word let. I was excited at first when he was like, I will do it.

But then when I was like, OK, like, what like, what do you think about the situation? He's like, I don't know, we're just going to have a conversation. like what do you think about the situation? He's like, I don't know, we're just gonna have a conversation. And I'm like, well, yeah, that's good, but like. Well, I honestly think as much as I love a mediation, this is a you problem, not a we problem. Right, right, right, right.

I don't know what he's supposed to do. Yeah, he would have just been like a sweet little baby, and just like sitting here. You gotta stop talking about your boyfriend like that. Uh, yeah. You know, he's not your sweet little baby. Sweet, sexy man. Yeah, you gotta let go of some control.

You can't make him embrace the power dynamic in his favor, but you at least have to allow him the opportunity to take the shot, so to speak. You know, right now you're not passing him the ball. You're kind of the ball hog. And you can't make him shoot, you can't make him drive the lane, so to speak, but you have to pass him the ball

and see if he has the guts to take the shot and take the lead. And part of your fear of heartbreak, I think, is you trying to control this relationship and he's more malleable than, and then as a young man who is a well, he's a well-intentioned young man, it sounds like. Yeah, he is.

He's very well-intentioned. He's incredibly sweet. Someday this man is gonna get older. And he, whether you let him have more power or not, eventually he's gonna want more. You're far better off to allow it to happen rather than make him resent you for realizing you didn't let him have it.

Totally, yeah. And that you were a little condescending and acted above him at times, where right now he's just kind of excited that he's dating a mature hot woman, he was older than him, and he feels kind of like good about himself, and he kind of likes that.

But that will fade. And event, and it's only been eight months, he's gonna, every day that you're in this relationship, he's gonna feel more like you're equal. And you're, make sure he doesn't have to take that power back. Yeah, I'm so happy you're equal. Yeah. And you're, you're make sure he doesn't have to take that power back. Yeah. I'm so happy you're saying that. It's, I do not want him to ever feel like that ever. Yeah. That would be terrible. Well, it starts by how you talk about them to yourself and to your friends

and to others, because I don't think sometimes you even realize the things that come out of your mouth. because I don't think sometimes you even realize the things that come out of your mouth. No, that's true. I think also because I've dated so many like people who are just so opposite of him and opposite in like he's the opposite in a good way. But yeah, I definitely, I think I think of him as being like really innocent, which maybe accidentally turns into like naive in my mind, which is probably like you're saying like very belittling. Yeah, well to say it like that is this, yeah. It's like he doesn't know better to be a dick. Yeah.

Or maybe he's just not, you know, maybe he's just not. You know. Like I asked him the other day if he's ever had a fight with his parents or his dad and he was like, no, I've never ever. Like he's like, I would never do that. Like what's the point? And I'm like, that's amazing. Because I, I still fight with my parents to this day.

So good for you. Like he's just very even keeled. Like that's just his personality with everyone in his life. Yeah, it is. I think you need to be open to, I don't, I'm being willing to bet that you haven't mentally even been open to the possibility that you can learn a lot from your boyfriend. I think you have almost minimized his,

what he brings to the table and again, thought of it as like this sweet innocent boy who doesn't know better or whatever, but like I think you need to be open to the possibility that your boyfriend who might be four years younger than you has a lot to teach you. And that maybe I think you should be open to taking his lead and allowing him to lead.

Because right now, you're too much, you're too afraid of this thing going south, that you've really taken control of this relationship. And because he is younger, and because you're so kind of confident, you're just generally, you can tell, a generally confident person, he's okay with you being in the lead right now. But that will definitely change. Yeah. Yeah, totally. Okay. I'm really glad that it got to this point because I feel like I was trying to figure out the root of the issue.

So I definitely don't want that to happen. I don't wanna be like this ewe gross little naggy lady. Okay. Yeah, it's less about you being a nag. It's just you just have to, it's your big problem is control and he's been through a lot so i don't want to diminish him like down to his age obviously like to an extent age matters but he's been through so much um so i don't want to diminish that either uh i think you try to

compliment him on things that he has done for you like Like I'm willing to guess that your compliments are more like, I don't know, like a mom child. Like, you know, it's like you put a gold star on their fridge, like not that, you know, like you're proud of your kid, but you know you could do it and you're complimenting him because he's doing the thing that you did four years ago and you're proud of him from learning. I want you to look for things to compliment him on,

things that you're like, you know, since I've been with you, you've taught me a lot about this and since I've been with you, this is something you've helped me with. How does he help you be your best self? I hate the phrase, he helps me be a better person because that's entirely up to you. But does he help you be your best self? I hate the phrase he helps me be a better person because that's entirely up to you. But does he make it easier or harder

for you to be a better person? So much easier. And how does he inspire you? And those are the ways you should compliment him. Things that he doesn't get from you, you're not proud of him that he's taking your advice, like a parent would say to a child. You're not proud of him because he's taking your advice, like a parent would say to a child. You're not proud of him because he's cute up on stage.

But you could say, I don't have the guts to do what you do. Like open mic, like that takes fucking guts. You're brave. Like honestly, I don't know. I wish I had that and find ways to compliment him like that. Not something like, it's cute that you do that. Like, I don't know. I think it's pretty fucking brave

and cool, and that bravery is going to help in other aspects of his life. Something I find really attractive about you is how much you have courage. Like, you're not afraid, you know, you gotta make sure you wanna, don't say it in a way that it's just like, what do you mean brave? Do I suck?

You're good at complimenting him, but I'm willing to bet sometimes your compliments feel a little condescending. And I say that as someone who has gotten that feedback. Yes, totally. For myself. No, I appreciate that a lot. That's such a good point. Oh my God.

Okay, well, so basically what I'm getting from this phone call and let me know how you feel, if this feedback makes sense to you, that I need to put more of my energy into being thankful and grateful for what I'm learning on a day-to-day basis, what I see in him, why I'm actually with him versus these things like his drinking habits. Like maybe I just need to really practice like similar to practicing like looking in the mirror and complimenting myself, I can look at him and think of reasons why I love him.

Yeah, you said you like to compliment people. You do that as a kindness and it makes you feel good to make other people feel better. I want you to focus on complimenting people from a place of gratitude. Yeah. You are grateful for what these people have done for you and as a result, you want to compliment them

on how what, you know, because you are grateful for what they've brought to your life. I love that. Not because it makes you feel better. Yeah, or not just like something that I think is gonna lift them up in the moment, but something I've actually put thought into. Yeah, because again, when you say that like that,

it's like you're doing the kindness. Here's I'm lifting them up, I'm making them feel good, I'm inspiring them, you know, like again, like a parent. Ew. Not like, wow, I've, you know, thank, it's again, it's coming from a place of gratitude. Not like you're helping. Totally. Okay.

How does he help you? Are you asking me or are you just wanting me to think? It's a general thought. I mean, but yeah, think about it. I'm sure there are lots of ways. Well, it's just, you just gotta tweak your thought process a little bit. And again, it's a relatively new relationship, but you know,

and the fact that you called it, you sense the disconnect. So it's just, you know, but. Yeah, I guess like, it's like preventative. Like I just want to, I think there's like a balance and I am on the complete other end of the balance where it's like, oh, we live and we learn. And then I hyper fixate on what I've learned.

And it's like I'm applying it way too intensely to this present moment instead of living in the moment. Yeah, because part of it is, again, it's control. Like you're hoping that you can learn from past mistakes to avoid ever feeling the mistake again, and that's not possible. Yeah, okay. All right.

Okay, well, I appreciate you so much. Thanks for calling in. Always good to hear a new unique situation. Listen, it sounds like you should be happy for and grateful for and just again, be mindful of how much control you need in any given situation. Allow your boyfriend to take more control

or have more control, but you just have to let go of your control and see, and pass on the ball. Just pass on the ball and shut the fuck up. You know, it's not pass on the ball and then immediately be his coach. You're just- Oh my God, I know, I do that.

Just recognize it, you know? Okay. And then when it comes to complimenting him, you're not complimenting him as a coach or a parent, and you're not doing it to make him feel good, you're doing it from a place of gratitude. Yeah. Yeah, I want him to feel genuinely good about himself.

Okay, I appreciate it. I'm gonna be thinking about this all day, and I'm gonna write a little list of all the things that I love about him. Maybe just think about it for an hour and write it down and then not again because you stop obsessing. Hyperfix it. Okay. Okay. I don't think this is an all day exercise. It might be a five minute exercise every day. Okay. Okay. I like that. Five minute exercise. Okay. All right. Okay. Well, thank you so much. It's so nice to meet you and thank you for your advice.

I'm, as you are aware, I'm gonna really take it to heart and yeah, I appreciate it. All right, I appreciate you. Have a great rest of your day. Okay, you too. All right, bye-bye. Bye-bye. Well, we all know push-up bras came back

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of all the stigmas that still exist around men's mental health. And guys, if you are listening, I can't tell you how much therapy has benefited my life. It's certainly benefited our life, our relationship. I always say, listen, therapy is better when approached like a bicycle helmet rather than reconstructive surgery. It can certainly do both, but like listen, we all have a lot going on, we all have a lot to get out, and sometimes it's just better to get it out

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with a diverse variety of expertise. Talk it out with BetterHelp. Our listeners get tempted to turn off their first month at BetterHelp.com slash VIALL. That is BetterHelp, H-E-L-P.com slash VIALL. How's it going? It's going well. My name's Megan, I'm 26,

and my boyfriend thinks that women's suffrage was a mistake, and I don't know if I should end it. Okay, what do you mean by women's it going? It's going well. My name is Megan. I'm 26 and my boyfriend thinks that women's suffrage was a mistake and I don't know if I should end it. Okay, what do you mean by women's suffrage? His exact words were that the 19th Amendment was a mistake. What's the 19th Amendment? The women's right to vote. Jesus Christ. And how serious do you think he is? We've had many conversations at length and I don't even what even caused you guys to even get to the point where he felt the need to say something as ridiculous as this. Yeah so we were out with a group of

friends getting drinks it was me and a bunch of our guy friends and briefly the conversation about like oh would you be okay with like your girlfriend or whoever making more money than you kind of came up? And so that was already the tone of the conversation around drinks. And then I ended up talking to this guy who's more peripherally in the friend group. I didn't know him very well. Turns out he's has some very conservative views. And he said that he's a proponent of the household vote. That's kind of been floating around in some media a little bit. So I, I'm not familiar. What is the household vote?

The household vote, basically going back to there's one vote per household. So women no longer have the right to vote anymore. And the man votes like for the representation of the household. Where is that being floated around? I mean, I've seen it just floating around on social media and like in some news articles of some very far right conservatives supporting this. Gotcha. All right. Yeah, we just have to be careful to not, you know, that's the problem with the internet is sometimes

the extremes on both sides of which I'm terrified equally of both have way too much of a voice. And because of the shock value of the extremes, they get brought up in conversations and yada yada. Anyways, that being said, your boyfriend sounds like he took the bait a little bit. Well, so yeah, so this guy said that. So I turned to my boyfriend asking him if he believes in the household vote,

thinking it was going to be like a hell no response. And then he said, well, I think the 19th amendment might've been a mistake. And then what did you say? Um, I didn't really say much. I kind of was just like, you really think that? And he was like, yeah. And then I actually ended up leaving. So I left him there with everybody because I didn't want it to turn into an argument, you know, in front of the friend group out in public and thought it might be better to talk

about it at home. Sure. And then you did you? Yeah. Oh yeah. We were up for hours that night talking about it. And then again, next day. I'm getting curious, how did you, when you came home, if you remember, how did you broach the subject or get the conversation started up again? I mean, I was like, I think we just need to talk about what you said at the bar. Do you really think that women should have never

been given the right to vote? Okay, and then he said? And he was like, well, it's a little more nuanced than that. Okay, and then you said. And I was like, okay, so walk me through your thought process. At any point early in this debate, did you ask him what role do you see me playing

in your life if we get married? Yes, so that came later after I had spoken to my therapist about this. Okay. And that didn't go over very well either, to be honest. Like he went over his beliefs in the conversations that we had. And then when we had a third conversation,

that's where I started asking, I actually framed it as like, knowing that you feel this way, what are your thoughts on the fact that women can get college degrees and have like high power jobs? Like they can be doctors and CEOs and attorneys. And do you just envision having a wife

that's barefoot and pregnant? Like she's just a homemaker and having kids and that's what she does for you. And he didn't really like that. He got kind of defensive about me asking, well, if this is your belief, how does that extend into other areas? Was that your version of asking what I asked you?

What do you mean? Well, I asked you at any point in that conversation, did you ask him specifically? Problem is sometimes conversations like this, right? And the point I'm trying to make is, this isn't about the 19th Amendment as far as you and your boyfriend are concerned. And this isn't about whatever radical conservative beliefs

anyone else thinks or feels. This has your concern and why you're even thinking about breaking up with your boyfriend, is you're wondering if these potential radical beliefs that your boyfriend may have, how does it apply to you in your relationship and how he treats you, right? And like, what role does he want his wife to play?

And what role, like what kind of relationship does he want? And what kind of relationship does he want and what kind of dynamic does he want in a relationship? Because sometimes when we have these conversations, it gets into the weeds. And at the end of the day, you just want to know, are you potentially marrying some guy who's been radicalized by some dark web, red pill, fucking aggro aggressive guys who might have some weird fucking demands once you get married of his wife being potentially you? Because that's your concern.

That's my concern. So I did ask him, if we were to be married, would you just want me at home having a bunch of babies? What did he say? That he doesn't, I asked him, do you see yourself getting married? Do you see yourself having kids? What does that look like?

And he didn't really have a great answer. It was kind of just like, whatever happens will happen. I don't really know. He's 33. What's his back? Like what's, what's his child? What's his background? Like what's, um, tough family life, which I think is contributing to him not wanting

to commit to like, I know I want a wife and kids. Okay. How old are you again? 20, 20. I'm 26. 26 is 33. So where are we now? I mean. Now things are just kind of weird.

I mean, he used to, he lives really close to me. So he used to like stay over every night. I've definitely taken a couple of nights where I was like, I just want to be by myself. And the vibe's just kind of off. We've had a conversation about the fact that things are off, but I feel like we haven't fully dove into like, what are all of my doubts in the situation?

Because now it's gone from just this statement or this belief about the 19th Amendment to like, are there all these other incompatibilities? Sure. I mean, I'm assuming you asked, but like, does he like just generally have a less respect for women than he has for men? So I asked and I, you know, said that hearing that, you know, makes me feel like you might think

that women should go back to being second class citizens. I'm not sure I phrased it exactly that way. And we had a whole, cause he's not disrespectful to me. I've never seen him be disrespectful to other women. I think he would give the shirt off his back to anybody who needed it, even if it was like a stranger. And so his behavior doesn't seem to align with this belief.

And so he's like like why can't you just see me for my behavior and get over this belief that I have? Well because it's a it's a pretty radical belief and if you really believe it and it's a hill you're willing to die on then eventually it is going to impact your actions. Yeah that's my concern even though. I mean if it's not that big your actions. Yeah, that's my concern, even though, yes, you're respectful. I mean, if it's not that big of a deal, and if he was saying it for shock value to piss off his girlfriend

at the bars because he just felt like being a little toxic, that's one thing. But the fact that he's kinda like, no, I mean, I really kinda actually think this way, it's concerning. Yeah. So I'm grappling with, like, we have a- The way your boyfriend sounds, you know, it's just like, so why do you believe that?

You know? Yeah. And he says if he read or found evidence to the contrary, he's open to his opinion changing, but all evidence points to, it might've been a mistake in his eyes. Okay. So why, I mean, he's not here to ask this, but why, what is his evidence

that it might have been a mistake? He says things like men used to like listen to women's opinions more before they had the right to vote. So they actually had more of a voice before. And then we get into the argument of like, maybe that's not the case. And just because they can state their opinion doesn't mean there's any power in that without a vote.

And now like households are more divided between like husband and wife. And this is in like a very much like traditional husband, wife household kind of lens, but they're less united. They're not focusing on talking things through and coming to a mutual decision. It's more focused on partisan politics and maybe they vote against each other

just to cancel each other out versus like having those conversations and being a united front. That's crazy. I mean, listen, like Natalie and I, we're not very political in general. We have very similar beliefs in a lot of things. We don't talk about politics almost ever. I'm pretty sure it's safe to say that we're not completely aligned on every topic,

but we don't give a fuck. And we very much, when it comes to our household, I like to think, I don't like using the words conservative or progressive because now everything else has become almost radicalized and triggering for people. But we very much focus on being a team and we very much focus on being a partnership. But like, we just don't allow politics to dictate our,

you know, like, I know a lot of people out there, you might even be listening, it's like, oh, that's such a privilege to, you know, it's like a lot of people, you know, that's, yeah, maybe it does come from a place of privilege, but politics are not my religion. And I do think, you know, I'm going on a bit of a tangent here, but I do think as human beings, we need a belief system.

We need to believe in things greater than ourselves. You know, we need a purpose in life, you know? What is that purpose, right? And I'm not much of a religious person anymore. I grew up very religious. I'm very familiar with a religious household. I'm comfortable with it. And unlike other people,

I generally had a pretty positive experience with my religion. My reasons for not being very religious are just like, I don't know, I just, yeah, it doesn't really matter. But my point is, we, us humans, we need a belief system. And we've replaced traditional religion with other things. And one of it is being politics. People now treat their politics like a religion.

Like it's, you know, you're gonna burn in hell if you believe in one thing or the other. I think that's absurd. I think, you know, I think that we're worrying about so many things outside of our control and we need to worry about what shows up at our front door. And I think a lot of partnerships, boyfriend and girlfriend, husband and wife, whatever, spend too much time arguing about things like politics for the sake of being a right,

and they're wasting all that energy when they could just be taking better care of themselves and each other or their children. And it's not coming from a place of privilege. It's just coming from, like you got one life. I mean, you're gonna spend most of that life arguing with your neighbors. You can be involved.

You can have a political belief. You can even stand up for those beliefs and debate people you disagree with. You can vote and you can do your part and it doesn't have to consume and control your whole goddamn life. And that doesn't mean you're just some privileged person who has the benefit of like, you know,

like, and my dad taught me a very important lesson, you know, when I was, you know, a lot of time, you're right, it is all privilege. And a lot of people arguing about politics and a lot of people saying and criticizing other people who say things like, I'm not as political, they're privileged too for having that belief about the other privileged people.

Because most of the time, if you have the benefit of arguing about stuff like this, that means that you're not worried about how you're getting your next meal and if you can afford your rent and where your kids are gonna get, because most people out there don't even have the fucking benefit to argue about politics

because they're literally trying to survive. That all being said, yeah, I don't know, it sounds like your boyfriend's a bit radicalized or a bit lost, you know? And I can't tell the difference because- Maybe that doesn't matter. Yeah, because like I was having a week where I was busy and stressed out.

So like he's helping me put away my dishes that he didn't even use. And he's taking my dog on a walk and he's doing things around the house to help me out, which I feel like kind of contradicts, I don't know, what you might expect from someone who thinks the 19th Amendment was a mistake. So it's just confusing.

Well, yes and no, I don't know. I think it's a fine line. I think you could find a lot of incredibly conservative, almost radically conservative men, who 98% of the time make some pretty great husbands and who want to help and take care. It's like if you're thinking more traditional men, it's just like a lot of what they do,

it could be very positive in a sense because they are taking care of the people they love. But the problem was when it gets to the extreme, the problem is part of that belief isn't like they're taking care of the people they love because they love to, they think they're taking care of people they love because the people they're taking care of can't take care of themselves.

And is he taking care of you because he loves and respects you and thinks you're more than capable of doing all these things? Or is he doing it because it's his job and honestly you can't survive without him? It's a fine line. Yeah, I think in his case, I think it's more of the former,

but I also feel like he's kind of overcompensating now because we've been having these discussions and we know things are off that I feel like he's almost trying too hard. Well, there are certain just beliefs out there that are pretty messed up. And if you are serious about backing up messed up beliefs, it really just because you haven't done it yet doesn't mean I'm it's okay to still believe in something is as radical as

what you're saying. You know, I guess I'm just confused if you really don't believe it. Why you only to die on this hill. And if we're trying to give your boyfriend the benefit of the doubt, you know It's like what are you trying to say that you're you know what I'm saying? Cuz like maybe it's not about the 19th amendment or this radical like but what what are you trying to say that you're using? This argument to try to make that comes across as radical But like again, I've never you know, I'm dating you and I never thought I'd be dating a radical conservative man, but like, you're kind of sounding like one.

So I'm just, I'm confused, you know? So like, what the fuck are you trying? What, what, you know, why is he dying on this hill? I don't, you know, is it for this, being right? Like what, why? He's always been very firm in his beliefs. You know, I'd rather him tell me than hide it because he knows I don't like it.

That's fair. But like, again, like, if you thought incest I'd rather him tell me than hide it, because he knows I don't like it. That's fair, but again, if you thought incest wasn't that big of a deal, just because you haven't fucked a sibling doesn't make it not weird that you think it's not a big deal. Honestly, maybe that analogy will make him see what you're seeing. You can say, this is what I'm struggling with.

This is why I'm having a hard time letting this go. Because you saying that feels kind of, I mean, I'm having a hard time adjusting. And you're saying, well, I don't act that way. I don't do those things. So why are you making it about me? And you could say, well, if you told me you were okay with, again, using this kind of crazy incest, whatever,

if I told you I didn't think incest was a big deal and that like, I don't know, I just don't think it's that weird. And maybe people, we should allow siblings to like, get married and have kids. Just because I didn't sleep with my brother, wouldn't that bother you knowing I believed that? Yeah, that might be a good way to phrase it.

Because that's how, yeah. And you'd be like, cause that's kind of how you're sounding to me. And I, I don't know. I want to be with the person that if one day they might real, I might wake up and realize that they voted against my right to vote. Cause he says that he doesn't think we should take it away now, but I'm like, it worries me that you might think that if it were to ever come to that. But the fact that he doesn't think it's a non-negotiable is

concerning. Yeah. What about like women only be allowed to vote and not men? How about that? Like if it's a household vote, like why not? He doesn't think that's the same. Yeah. Why not? He doesn't think that's the same. Why not? He doesn't think that's the same. Why not? He doesn't have a great response. I mean, like men have started more wars than women ever have. He made a comment at one point about like women being more emotional than men and that really upset me.

Like because we might be more emotional, we're gonna make poor choices with our vote. I mean, I'm ashamed to say that the younger version of me had thought that way about, not about this particular topic, but so then maybe there's just some immature ignorance on his part. I wasn't 33, I know that, I was more like 19, but.

And that makes a difference. Yeah, but you know, again, if he wants to make a silly argument, again, there are a lot of tropes and stereotypes of men that there's a lot of truth to. Again, the emotional, it's like, how many wars have women started compared to men? Women are more emotionally regulated

compared to their egos. Men have killed millions of people in the name of being right or feeling more powerful or being greedy. So what about that? And the truth is, it's kind of silly for you guys in the name of being right, or feeling more powerful, or being greedy. So, what about that? And the truth is, it's kind of silly for you guys to have this argument. And that's what I wanna know. It's just like, I wanna know, if I'm you,

I wanna know, why is this a hill you're trying to die on? Is it just about being right? And what point are you trying to make, if anything? Because he needs to at least at a minimum for you to stay in this relationship, I think he needs to at least acknowledge that analogy, the fact that he is condoning this thought process that it's concerning from your point of view.

Because whether it's now or later, he's describing a world that you want nothing to do with, and you don't want to contone that type of radical belief. You don't want a little world where it's like women can't vote or are treated like second class citizens. Would you wanna walk around being like, yeah, I love my wife, my girlfriend, she just is weirdly okay with pedophilia. But other than that, she's chill. And by the way, yeah, you know, I love my wife, my girlfriend. She just is weirdly okay with pedophilia.

But other than that, she's pretty, she's chill. And by the way, just so you know, she has not ever victimized a child as far as I know, but she does think it's not that big of a deal. Like, would he, that, would that, is that what? Yeah, absolutely not. Would he be down for that? Probably not.

And he'd come up with some reason why it's different. I mean, that doesn't make it so. Yeah. I don't know. I mean, that doesn't make it so. Yeah. I don't know. I mean, let's like, you might have to break. I don't know. Listen, either, either, either he really means it or he's too, he's too stubborn for his own good. And like, you know, this is kind of silly and we don't even know how

serious it is in a weird way, but like it's weird. And if, I mean, we've probably talked about it for like hours at this point and he's not giving up his stance. He just, if anything seems to think I'm misunderstanding cause it's not as bad as I think. What am I misunderstanding? Because this is how I see it. And then you give them that analogy that we talked about.

And then ask them what, that kind of my point. What is the point you're trying to make? And forgetting about, don't use political terms, forget about the 19th Amendment, what is the point you're trying to make and why? And what's the outcome you're trying to accomplish? Like, you know, if he's just arguing for the sake of being right, then like, this is annoying. And all it's caused me to do is kind of think

you're a different person or less of you, just so you can win an argument. Because I don't know. Maybe he's just so stubborn, he needs to be right. That I wouldn't ignore this. I definitely wouldn't let it go. Yeah. Well, and I think part of the issue now

is just how he's responded to it. Like when I start asking, okay, what, how do you envision your life? Like, do you envision yourself getting married, having kids? What does that look like? He, he basically said that he finds that type of conversation to be completely unhelpful, but he's willing to have it if it's helpful for me. Does it relate to this argument or like, it's just as whole separate? I think in general, like he said that he prefers to just kind of figure out those thoughts and beliefs as you go versus like sitting down and actually communicating like,

this is what I see my life looking like. He finds that to be unhelpful. Having goals he finds unhelpful? I don't know about having goals, but- Isn't that what it is? I guess so. Yeah. And so that's- Like, what do you want? I don't know. Goals might change, so, yeah. And so that's. What do you want? I don't know.

Goals might change, but it's good to have them. Especially, you know. His only goal is that he wants to be extremely independent and live on a farm and grow his own food. And I don't wanna live on a farm. So why are you dating this guy? I mean, he doesn't know what he wants. He doesn't even know if he wants to have kids

or get married. He might be radical. And even his goal is a little radical. I mean, I'm all for, as I've gotten older, I've always liked a busy city. I've always lived in a city. As now that I'm a little older, I've definitely enjoyed a more quiet life. That's cool. But like a 33-year-old man,

all he wants to do is live on a farm and grow his own food in case like, you know, the radical left takes over. Like that's how he sounds. Yeah, I guess that's kind of where I'm at now. Like there's this issue, but it's now spiraled into like, I feel like there's so many incompatibilities popping up, but what I'm having a hard time with is, he treats me well, I enjoy spending time with him, and I'm just grappling with, you know, what's, is it worth it or not?

Yeah, it's a tough situation, but treating you well is nice. Enjoying is, those are good, but like, I don't, his, you guys have to want to set, you got to, you want to have to want the same things. And maybe your non-negotiables aren't aligned. I mean, he's a pretty good boyfriend, but you know, I wouldn't waste these years on someone you're just not compatible with.

Yeah. You know. I thought you might say that. I think to help yourself, you need to do your part in the not needing to be right argument. You need to stop, you know, forget about the 19, I mean, this is a crazy conversation,

but what this conversation has done for you is made you question and made you realize that you don't know if you and your boyfriend want the same things. And you are still really young. But at a very pivotal time in your life that you do not want to waste these these are great years 26 great years and you shouldn't waste it on on people who don't know you know you might you know like yeah so like it's. You just want to be mindful of that. You're going to change this conversation of like, are we compatible? And not throw out an accusation, just be like, I don't know, maybe we're not. Do you know that you want to get married and have kids?

I know that I'd like to be married. I'm very leaning towards the no kids side, open to the fact that I might change my mind. As a general, I'm just generally curious as why. I just, I don't have this burning desire to be a mother. I have a dog. I love being a dog mom. Okay. I just, I was just curious. I just, I, and I don't want to seem like I'm, I'm not trying to push you into any one direction. It's just more like there is definitely a, when I talk to younger people, this mentality that like what's the point because life is trash

and the world's on fire and that I hate for people. Yeah, I don't think I come at it from that view. It's just like, I'm very career oriented and entrepreneurial and I want to travel and I just don't, I don't see like, oh, I have to be a mother for my life to be fulfilling. Great. Awesome. So I don't know, again, maybe in that department you guys are compatible because he doesn't know either, but yeah, I would just pose the question that, it's just weird that he's very stubborn about this topic. And it's crazy, I've never, it's crazy, it's alarming. I mean, I never would have asked him,

I did not expect this at all. I never would have posed the question. I thought he would fully say that was crazy. So I was not expecting it at all. I consider myself to be fairly moderate, you know? Like I have points of view that I think are probably generally more conservative than others, and I have points of view that are pretty progressive. And that sounds fucking radical to me, man.

Like I don't, it's just like a crazy, if someone, I would just be like, what website were you on, dude? Like what do you, like who you've been listening to? You know? Yeah, I don't know where he found this. I've talked about this with very few people, but that was actually a question my mom had.

And she was like, where is he reading this? Where is he getting this idea? And I have no idea. Because if I'm you, that's more of the concern. Because it came from somewhere. And who are his circles of influence? Because maybe it's just like a petty fight now, but if, if he continues to consume or surround himself with the people who are

planting these very radical thoughts in his head, then these radical thoughts for him will only become more normalized. And he's going to start maybe act acting on, I don't know, but like I would find out where this came from. And if he can't acknowledge that it's a radical point of view, even if he thinks he's right, then I wouldn't let that go. Yeah, I don't think I could let that go personally either.

Just like, it's hard to let go of all the good things. I don't know. I totally get it, yeah. It's just, listen, this is a very unique, I'm kind of like, I'm like, I'm kind of wondering if you're fucking with me. No, I mean, I know there's guys- Very much not, I wish I was.

Only because like, yeah, you know, clearly talking to you, like it's, I'm like, how did a woman like this end up dating a guy like that in the first place, you know? Cause that's what's kind of- I never thought I'd be here, I'll tell you that, but I've thought that before, so. Yeah, the best thing you can do is for, in terms of,

you know, cause ultimately you called in trying to get some clarity, right? And I don't know how much I offered other than like commiserating with the shock of your situation. Is you try to have to, again, not make it about this political conversation or the 19th amendment, and you have to try to, again, not make it about this political conversation or the 19th Amendment, and you have to try to not be accusatory or make him feel stupid, but generally curious as to why

he thinks that way and push him when he says, well, I don't know, I just do, and get him to acknowledge, well, fair enough, but like that's the part that is concerning to me because this is how I hear it. And then give him that analogy. And if he just wants to be right, fine, but like in good conscience, you wouldn't want to date someone who thought blank was legal and vice versa. Okay. All right.

I've been kind of dealing with like, do I have this conversation right now or do I take a step back? Cause I feel like I haven't had a ton of time to myself to like even process everything and think about like what I want. Do you think it's more beneficial to sit down and have that conversation first

or to take a couple of days and then have it? I don't know if it really matters. I mean, what's the rush? Yeah, I guess there isn't a rush. You know, if you feel like right now, you know, processing that, I don't know, like I guess if there's no reason to be hasty, then don't be hasty.

And if you feel like you just kind of want to sit with it for a while, then sit with it. But in the meantime, he clearly understands that you're upset about this, and he has the opportunity to try to do something. And maybe that's why you want to sit and wait, because you want to see if he's going to knock on your door and be like, hey, I'm sorry, I was just kind of being an ass and I'm realizing that now and I don't actually think that way. And but I don't know if that's the case.

It's been a few weeks, so I don't think I'm going to get that. I think it's more of like, I might either like eating, working, sleeping, or I'm with him. And so like my head's all like not clear on like, are we even compatible in other ways? Take some time to think about that. And you know, that's the thing. If there's a silver lining here, maybe it's raised some valid questions

that you need to take some time to think over. Because what I'm hearing is maybe if you do decide to end this relationship, you don't want it to be over some random thing he said, right? Because that almost feels trivial. It's just like, and that's kind of how he's acting and saying seeing it is this like, are we really going to break up over this bar conversation? Yeah. And I mean, mean, he was talking to someone a while before he and I started seeing each other and the reason they stopped seeing each other was because she disagreed with his political views so much

and so when this was kind of coming up, he was like, it's happening to me again. And I don't know if I wanna just be like the number two on that list of girls, But maybe I need to be. Well, to me, that's like kind of a red flag. I mean, he's not seeing the problem. If he's acting like a victim here, your views are radical, bro.

Yeah. And most, you know, and then, you know, you need to be around a radical person. Yeah, well, he's not gonna find one where we live, I don't think, but he can try, I guess, if I decide to end it. Yeah, well, he's clearly very stubborn and he's choosing to act like the victim

in a situation where he's definitely not. Yeah, which I think is a bit of a red flag that he's acting like the victim. Yeah. Yeah. All right. Okay. All right, well, take care. Please give us an update. I need to know where this...

Oh, I definitely will. Okay. I listen to you every week, so... I appreciate it. Please give us an update. I need to know where this. Oh, I definitely will. I listen to you every week, so. I appreciate it. I'll send the update when I have one. I definitely wanna know what you end up doing. I'll let you know. I'm very fascinated. I'll let you know.

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Well my question is is it time to cut off my deadbeat baby daddy for good? Okay. Well, he is your baby daddy, so I don't know how much, you know, he's kind of in your life for a while, but romantically I'm assuming you're meaning? No, not romantically. We, I ended things like officially in 2018 due to things I found out that he's done. His character is character is just, isn't the greatest. And there's a lot that came out. I've never even heard a caller like say anything along the lines. I found out stuff that he's done and, um, do you want me to give you some examples?

If you're comfortable with it. Yeah. Well, for one, he tried to have sex with my sister in my car on Mother's Day. We like went to the beach the whole day and then it was a good day. And then afterwards he went to the gym and then he was supposed to get ice cream at the store after the gym for Mother's Day.

And then he called me at like 10 PM and then didn't come home till like 2 AM and come to find out my sister has been going through some stuff and he ended up, he hasn't really been till like 2 a.m. And come to find out my sister has been going through some stuff and he ended up, he hasn't really been talking with the family and then come to find out he ran into her that night. And then they went in my car and I don't know,

that's a whole thing, that's a whole nother story. Another thing is I found out- Did your sister do any, like was she immediately like, no, don't or they messed around? So my sister was like into some drugs at this time. She's a lot better now. We're rebuilding our relationship. But at the time she was like MIA from the family. So about a month after that happened, she messaged me. So it feels like your ex-husband really took advantage of her weaknesses. Yeah. Yeah, he definitely did. I don't know what happened. I don't know that my sister told me all this stuff and I didn't believe her because I'm like, you're a drug, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. But it was true. It's come out that it was true.

Another thing that he did, he missed Thanksgiving one year. And, and also we were never married, thank God. But anyways, he missed Thanksgiving one year. And then I went through his computer and saw that he was posting Craig's ads, seeking sex on Thanksgiving. Not that it matters like what day, but like that was just like a stamp, you know? He loves a holiday. He does. And those just add a little like theme, you know? I've never heard Amy Poehler talk about these things where I'm like, versus weird, you know, another thing when I was pregnant with my son, you know, I was wanting him to like, you know, when we hooked up, like I wanted to down on me, whatever, he

would refuse and he was like, No, that's you know, you're pregnant. That's disgusting. Anyways, now, you know, fast forward, I'm not pretty anymore. But he goes out with his friends, when they find out he hooks up with a pregnant woman in his truck that I fucking co-signed for, not that it matters, but I, you know, and, um, I got him a truck for Father's Day. And on top of it, he did drugs with her and I, he felt some remorse and he wrote himself a letter and I found the letter and in the letter it was like, I don't know why I did this. I was, don't even know what kind of drugs we were doing. She was pregnant. I went down on her, which by the way, he refused to do with me forever. I thank God we didn't have sex and stuff like that. I'll have the letter if you want to please. And then another thing is he went to California and he has

a cousin that's gay, which they're close, which is cool. He was staying with his cousin. When he came home, I clearly had trust issues for multiple reasons. So I went through his cousin's text messages just to see like, oh, you know, guy talk, like, did he hook up with someone, whatever. And I just was flattered and stood by what I read. I was like, not expecting this, but apparently his cousin texted him

at like three in the morning saying they were at a party and they're like, hey bro, wanna have a threesome? And I wanna massage you, can you come in the room? And I just was like, out of all of these things, the one that I left him was my sister. You know, I ended up staying for the other one because I'm an idiot. But when I found out about my sister, that was 2019 and we had a relationship. So those are just a few things. This is like that list of 20. I know. And I've never heard a caller talk about it. Your podcast has helped me tremendously, by the way, when it came to all this stuff,

I like wanna thank you for that. Cause you've got me out of a horrible relationship and all of the stuff that you say for finding a new one has helped me find the most amazing person I could ever ask for. So it's to do to a lot of your podcasts. I think you were saying. Okay, so what I'm hearing is your baby daddy is a mess.

Thankfully you're finally out of it. It sounds like you're even in a better relationship now. So what are you, you started by asking if you should cut off your baby daddy. What does that look like? And what specifically are you considering doing? I just feel like, I'm glad you let me talk about the things he's done.

Just give you a little idea about his character. Cause I know you say not to like, dredge people's character and stuff. But like that to me is just the things he's done. Just give you a little idea about his character. Cause I know you say not to like judge people's character and stuff, but like that to me is just like, he's just had the issues, like he's just, you know, clearly. And I'm just point where he's also never helped. So even when we were together, you know, even after the fact, we'll just say after the fact,

he's never helped emotionally, financially, physically, just he doesn't help. He'd never help. He's never, I've never filed for child support. I think in my head, I'm just like, I would rather have the peace of like, not dealing with it to make, because a judge, you know, he might fight me since he cares more about money than him than anything else. He always says he would fight me since I make more money than him for custody and all this stuff. So I've never filed. But I've asked him like, Hey, I just paid for his football. It's 450. I just paid for his basketball. It's 300. I have to go get this. It's, you know, X amount of money. He's never giving me anything. So I just, and then he only saw him every two hours every Thursday, but it's like, my son doesn't want to go see him, you know, and he's old. He's getting old. So he's like nine years old. And he's getting to the point where he can just, he's not stupid, you know, he can feel the vibes of

him. And he's just not a good person. Whenever I forced my son to call him, the last conversation, my, he was basically telling my son that his brother is moving, and that is the best thing he could ever do. And then he said the best thing that he ever did was move to Utah, which was years ago. And he only moved for like two months and came back. But anyways, he said that was the best thing he's ever done. And then my son goes over having me and then he goes, yeah, sorry, but that's, but it's true. And that hurt my son. And he started bawling and he said, I hate you, hung up the phone. Then my boyfriend came home from the gym who has stepped up as a father, by the way, in every way, like he is basically the father and they asked him to adopt

him. Well, I'm sorry. And that was crazy. And I wouldn't mean it was sweet, but also sad. He refuses to call my phone to co parent or anything to talk. He got my son this gizmo watch. And he only wants to talk through this gizmo watch. And he basically wants Jack to call talk to him through this watch. But I can I show you the last scene?

Um, he's my son sent to him. He did a voice memo and I went through it. I didn't know my son did this because he hurt him when he said that conversation. My child's father hurt him when he said I, when moving was better than having you. Sorry, but it's true. And that hurt my son a lot. And so now he will text my son like, Oh, hi, thinking of you. Hi, miss you only on this watch.

But, and then my son responded and said this to him. Hopefully you're able to hear it, but this is what he wrote or said in a voice. No, did you hear that? Yeah. I'll call you when you admit that you hurt me. And then after that, he doesn't respond for a week. And then he goes, love you, thinking of you. That's it.

Doesn't call. And then I'm thinking of you here for you. When you decide to call, hope you're doing okay. Just random texts. It's like, dude, he just said, admit that you hurt him. You know? And so I'm just at a point like, and on top of that, Nick, he's never gone to a school conference, not one.

He doesn't go in that. My son has ADHD. And the principal emailed me and him, the CSEED of a behavioral specialist, the teacher, the counselor, because my son's been talking to the school counselor and they wanted to have like a specific appointment just to help my son with, you know, his ADHD.

He's doing fine, but just use, he needed that we needed to figure out some stuff, which we did. And he didn't respond to one email, he didn't come to the conference, nothing. Just doesn't ask, nothing. So let me add, we've established that your ex and father of your child is an absolute loser.

So we got that. Yeah. So I completely empathize with how you're feeling. So one is your son, cause to me he's the biggest concern in this equation, right? Obviously yours too. And he's obviously old enough and self-aware and I'm pretty proud of him

for setting that boundary with his dad. I don't know where he got that from, but that's pretty cool. Oh, you know, but like, have you looked in any type of child psychology to like just- He's in one. So he, and you know what's interesting is he asked to talk to one. And I will thank you because you've helped me set boundaries and then he

watches me and I think that's why he's doing that. And I'm really proud of him. I will say he, he asked to talk to a counselor. He asked to talk to psychiatrists. Like, so he's talking to people, you know, and he's very aware of her trying to spend that. I was like, Biden's at a point where I just like, everyone's in my ear, like, file for child support, file for child support. And at this point, after what he said, I kind

of want to just because I like, he owes probably so much money. But then the other part of me is like, should I just keep it as it is? And just like, because like, he cares more about money, like, I don't want to fight, I don't want to go to court, what if the judge is like, you like he cares more about money. Like I don't want to fight. I don't want to go to court. What if the judge is like you have to go? So my response to that is like, this is definitely a big case of making sure you're happy and not right, right? Yeah.

Do you understand your rights? Like have you spoken to a lawyer who specializes in custody cases? I haven't been one-on-one with a lawyer, but one of my, I own the business and one of my clients, he owns a firm. And so we've had like multiple conversations, just I asked, you know, asked them about it. And he would give me some advice on some situations he basically said about

the adoption and stuff. And if I did file, it would probably be good because he probably won't pay. And then we have more of a chance of my boyfriend to adopt my son. But I just like don't know what the right thing is to do. You know, I just don't know. I think right now the first thing you need to do is I'm glad you got some advice from someone who seems to know a little bit about this, but I would just go meet with a lawyer

who specializes in this and fully understand your rights. I doubt your baby daddy has done that, right? So he's just making threats to you to try to scare you to, you know, whatever. But like, you need to fully understand what you can do and what you can't do, what is available to you, what risks are, you know, what risks might come up by you taking certain actions.

I just want you to understand your risks and your rights. Right? Yeah. And I did actually talk to an attorney on the phone for an hour, but, and he did go over stuff, but we didn't really go over a lot of the risks and like, there's a lot more to it. I feel like I could know. You know, I'm glad you've already talked to people, but you're here like, Nick, what should I do?

What's the right thing to do? And we can sit here and talk about the moralities of this decision, but this is bigger than just like what, you know, the morality of the choice. You need to, you know, first you need to protect your child, you need to protect yourself. And so, and to do that, you need to understand your rights. And the good thing you have going for you is I doubt based off what you're telling me about your baby daddy, he sounds like a loser and most losers aren't smart enough to like, you know, understand their rights.

And, and he, and if he doesn't have a means to like, you know, understand their rights. And if he doesn't have a means to like, you know, if he's kind of a loser when it comes to money, yeah, he just, he probably doesn't know. So you getting ahead of it gives you advantages that you would otherwise not have. Yeah, he just always threatened to fight me and say that I'm gonna have to pay him child support since I make more money than him.

But obviously at this point, I'm not scared of that. I don't know if that's true or not true, right? You know what I'm saying? Like maybe it's true, maybe it's not true. But yeah, I mean. That's my fear though. Like we go, because I feel like he would fight because he doesn't fight now.

So he clearly doesn't care. But when there's money involved, I feel like he will. But again, that's why you need to understand your rights because you and I are just sitting here guessing about hypotheticals and things we don't know. And you need someone who just fully, all right, here are your options. If you do A, you know, here are the advantages, here are the risks. If you B, advantages, risks. C. Well, one of the risks that Journey did say is if I do file, he could fight and that he could potentially have like been like every other weekend or something. And that's my

concern. That's a risk to me because I don't want, I think it's better my son not to be around him at this point, you know, like that to me is a risk. So I'm like, do I, I don't care. I care more about my son's piece than the money. So what are you considering doing? I don't know. This is like such a big, I honestly feel like I just want to keep going as is. Have, and I guess the part of me want to keep going as is.

And I guess the part of me wants to file because I'm angry, but the other part of me is like, do I just let it go and just let him keep doing what he does, whatever that is? He doesn't, he's not a father, you know? And then I just, I don't know. I guess I just don't know if it's time to find him out and not like, it was like, do I force my son to call him?

Do I not force my son? You know, like- I would defer to your child psychologist, but my very unexperienced opinion is, I definitely wouldn't like it. Your kid seems to be old enough to set boundaries for himself. And I think, you know, a lot of parents in your situation,

you know, I can empathize with why, will project their bullshit onto their kids and fight with their exes through their kids and use their kids as a way to get back at their partner. I'm not sensing that from you. I'm sensing you're almost still trying to do the right thing even though your ex hasn't given you any reason for you to try to do the right thing.

So if your son doesn't wanna talk to his dad, I would respect your son's boundaries, you know? I would also like acknowledge that your son has the right to feel how he feels and that he's okay to feel that way. And as sad as it is, he's also not alone in how he's being treated. You know, sadly, you know, just,

he's not the only, sadly not the only child with a parent like this. You know, you don't want to make sure he doesn't feel like there's something, you something, it's his fault or he did anything. Just making sure your son is okay. And then whatever your son wants to do. Now your big concern is like when your son, if and when he wants to maybe give his dad a second chance

that you don't think he deserves. And is he gonna want a second chance with his dad and make him put him like as a 15, 16 year old young man, will he be more vulnerable? I don't know, but like right now it sounds like your son has a pretty good head on his shoulders and he's got you and thankfully your boyfriend is- And my boyfriend.

Is doing a great job of playing the role he's playing, but I would just, yeah, I mean, my big advice to you is just don't do anything petty. And don't force him to call if he doesn't want to. Yeah. And what's your motivation to potentially force him to call? I don't know. To be honest, my boyfriend thinks I had Stockholm syndrome, pretty in that not anymore. But even when me and my boyfriend got together, like I would make excuses and I don't know why I don't, I honestly don't know why I don't I honestly don't know why I for so long tried their relationship to work

I tried to understand my ex so much I tried I would do things like what you said instead of like coming at them like Just like talking in a way of like just trying to understand him Like why did you do that? It's like what is what's going on in your head? Yeah, but you at this point you trying to understand him as you trying to understand yourself Like you you know when you told me the story about all the crazy shit he did, you had to acknowledge that most of those things

weren't enough for you to leave. It took him trying to hook up with your sister to want to leave. So there's probably a lot of shame or embarrassment or whatever that you're feeling about your choices, and then it's easier to like explain his actions, because if you can justify his actions, then you can justify yours.

That's just my guess. No, for sure. Yeah, it's a lot. And I just, I don't really know. I'm just at a point where, you know, I just am so, I just don't know the right moves and I'm trying to take the steps to do it, but like cutting him out is what I will, if in my perfect world, I would like cut him out, have my boyfriend adopt my our son, cause he's been fed to every appointment, a

school, a conference since we were together. So we've been together since 2022. My son was 6. He's been, and he's going to school for nuclear engineering, and he's going to be graduating in 2 months. And since my son has also seen him in school and doing this work, like, he loves school now, you know, we had such a problem in school before. And since he's came into our lives, his grades went from like Fs to Bs, you know. And I just feel like he's such a better dad and he has the, he can actually like, he's earned that role. But then to actually go through with it just seems like a long, you know, to change his last name and to not cut his fat out. But I really don't, he doesn't even talk to his family. His sister just got married and he didn't go. So I had to talk to his mom, talk to his sister, meet up with his sister.

Why are you doing that still? I don't know. This is where my boyfriend tells me that too. And I think it's just that this family, you know, that's his family too. If his grandma, an aunt or whatever wants to be involved in your son's life and they're proactive about being involved in your son's life, then great. Then if you feel comfortable and safe and you think they're generally good people, then you can allow that to happen. I don't think you need to be going out of your way to make sure that he is. Okay, yeah, I know that makes sense. It's hard for me and I don't know why. I

think I just have like, oh, I care about my son and I want him to have these relationships Yeah, but like, you know, I don't know like how many how many people are like that close with their aunts and uncles? Yeah No, I know, you know, like yeah, but he's nine. So it's like I don't know I know it's his aunt's wedding, you know So as you get in my ex, you know, even told me his sister was getting married and he just talked so down, even on the phone, the last conversation they had, he's talking down about his family to my son. And it's just like, I just don't think that's good for my son to hear these things. And I'm just trying to be that person that's like, this is your family.

Like I'll make sure that you, you know, I got you right there, you know, but you're right. I won't go out of my way to like, for them to have one. You have some, are you seeing a therapist? No, I did. Your podcast has been therapy for me. I get it, but I'm not a therapist and I appreciate you saying that

and I'm glad you find value in it, but like, you clearly have some stuff to work through and unpack and you're doing a good job and you have great intentions, but like you have some blind spots, and that we all do. And don't ruin a good thing by putting too much pressure on your boyfriend.

He's not your therapist, and he's already doing a good job of playing the role as a dad, even though that's not his biological son. I'm sure your boyfriend gets a lot of value. I'm sure your son has brought a lot of value into his life, and you've done the same., I'm sure your boyfriend gets a lot of value. I'm sure your son has brought a lot of value into his life and you've done the same. But I'm just saying, be careful of ignoring the help you need and then assuming that you're getting in other aspects of people who aren't

qualified to give it, you know. I wouldn't want your boyfriend to ultimately just feel a little overwhelmed by this what feels like a, you know, I'm sure your ex feels like a virus or this fucking just disease that won't go away as far as he's concerned. He's like a, yeah, he's like a leap. But I don't think you're realizing how much you bring up your ex's drama to your boyfriend out of this guilt that you feel of making sure that your son still has a normal childhood. And this kind of making sure he calls his dad

who's shown time and time again to either hurt your son with his words or give him terrible advice or just kind of insisting he has a relationship with his side of the family. Again, if he wants to, great. If they're proactive, great. And he's still safe. Fine. But like, it's, I'm getting the impression that you're doing a little too much and you're

not sure what's the right thing to do or the wrong thing to do. And I think that's where maybe a therapist can just, you know, someone to check into and who, you know, might help you workshop these things. Cause honestly, like, I just don't know if it's, if your boyfriend's doing most of the emotional regulating for you, it just like, I just, I would be careful not to, to put it all on him. Yeah, no, and I have, I've been a lot better

on the beginning of our relationship was a lot worse. And I do feel like I have finally let go. Like maybe like six months ago, it took that long just to like not even care about my ex's feelings. And that is a little strange to me, it's why did I care? Like why do I, you know, I don't know,

it's a great question, but I am letting go. Like I officially feel like if he was, and I'm pregnant now and I'm four months. And I feel like since my ex found that out too, like he has been a little bit more aggressive with Jack. What do you mean by aggressive? Like he's like the last conversation, he just seemed to be more like,

he doesn't care that he's hurting his feelings. And then he told my son that I bought him a PS5 for his birthday. And he was like, on the last conversation, he goes, you don't deserve a PS5. And so now he randomly goes, I don't deserve this, I don't deserve that. I feel like he doesn't feel like he's deserving.

I'm like, you are deserving, honey. Don't let him tell you you're not deserving. And I tried to tell my ex what you said. He doesn't deserve this. Watch your words. It's like, you know, it's not. You know, I mean, like you're wasting energy trying to like lecture your ex or like coach your ex.

I mean, he's clearly not a good dad. Not even a good person. He wasn't a good partner. He's not even a good sibling or son. He's just kind of a loser. No, and at this point, they haven't talked for a month and a half. Besides these stupid messages,

he says, I'm thinking of you randomly. And that's where I think I feel bad. He messages him on this watch. And he refuses to call my phone though. I mean, have you told your son you're really proud of him for setting this boundary? I'm good. Just keep doing that. It's just like, you know, it must be really hard to hear your dad say those very mean

things that are not true. And I'm just really proud of you for standing up for yourself. And that's very brave of you. And like that's, I don't even know if I could have done that when I was your age. You know, again, like be there to like... We praise him. Yeah. Yeah.

And I think the counseling has helped him a lot too, because he's very like aware of his feelings. I just think you need to do, take your son's advice, follow your son's lead. Your son was brave enough and mature enough to recognize that maybe he needs some help. And I think right now, you have a pretty good head on your shoulders

and you've got a lot of good things going on. But when it comes to your ex-husband or boyfriend or whatever, you're kind of spiraling a little bit, and you're pregnant, and like I just don't want you wasting an ounce of energy on this guy. If nothing changes, do you,

this is like a kind of separate question, do you think it would be wrong to have my boyfriend adopt my son if he's continuously doing the cycle of hurting him? No, I mean, what you're describing, like again, I don't understand the legal ramifications and I know that like, this can be just very messy, but like, it doesn't sound like your son's dad deserves

to have any access to your son. And it sounds like he puts, all he does is put your son in at risk and I think he doesn't deserve the right to have access to his kid. I think he's dangerous. That's my opinion based on what you're telling me. I'm glad you're telling me that. I honestly didn't know what your advice would be.

Like I had two other questions I wanted to ask but I decided not to. But I already kind of knew what you were gonna say to be honest. But this one I genuinely didn't know. So I appreciate it. It does feel like I know the right thing to do. It's just hard to do, I guess.

As far as like, I think you're right though. I think the things that matter, it sounds like you have a lot of those things going for you. And I don't know if the legal system makes your boyfriend and the father of the child you're growing inside you right now, makes him any less of a dad to your nine-year-old son because of what the courts say.

I don't. Yeah, no, a hundred percent. But because the way, what the attorney basically told me is because he hasn't been present or he does never pay a child support for one, that's a big one, we don't need his approval for my boyfriend to adopt him. We can take him to court

and the judge would probably sign off that it's okay. But that's where like all these other people like file for child support. But part of me all these other people like file for child support. But part of me just doesn't even wanna file for it. It's like, I don't even want. Well, I would definitely not do anything you don't need to do just for the sake of being right or petty or to get back at them.

And if you don't need the money and asking for this guy's money puts you or your son at risk, I definitely wouldn't fucking do it. Okay, here, thank you for saying that. You're like the only person in my life who'd say that. Me and my boyfriend are the only ones that are like, let's maybe like look into everything before. Because we want ideally when he asked them to adopt them, like first of all, my heart shattered like for great, it was sad, but also like the most amazing thing. Like their relationship is, he's the best person. And I truly like want to thank you a lot because I know a lot of it was me,

but like your podcast just helped me so much. You know, just the things when even when dating, you know, like dating was the whole thing and then finding my boyfriend and the right boundaries to say for what I want. And then I just feel like it's all it's really all worked out great. And your podcast has been a huge help. So I really, I really appreciate you saying that's It's very kind, but just give yourself credit. You're doing good things.

I really think you should look into some therapy. Yeah. Just try it, you know, and it's not like, oh, you need therapy. You have like, you're all fucked up and you need some work, but like you just, you need to get things out sometimes. And if nothing else, I want you to like not have it just be you unloading on your boyfriend about your ex boyfriend all the time. And I'd like, I want you to like not have it just be you unloading on your boyfriend about your ex boyfriend all the time.

And I'd like, you know, or friends, you know, like, yeah, like we can't do this all the time and that's why you should get a therapist. But like, you know, I'd rather have you get this out with me than just exhaust the people who have heard it over and over. Well, I did have one though, just, you know, I did have one and we also that therapist told me they're like, literally, they're like, did have one. And we also, that therapist pulled me. They're like, literally, they're like, we've never told anyone what to do, but leave him. That's what he said.

He literally looked at me and said, leave him. And that was when that was going on with my sister thing. But then I saw him a couple more times and then we stopped. But I will do it again. And you can find someone else. I'm like, it's just, yeah, taking care of your mental health. I mean, I know that's like, it's like taking care of your mental health. I mean, I know it's like taking care of your physical health. Sometimes you're pretty active at the gym

or pretty active, you hire a trainer and then you stop using a trainer and then you realize maybe I need to use it. Same thing with a therapist. It's not a cure-all, it's just maintenance, right? And I think it's also just a way to alleviate some of the stresses, anxiety and pressure that like you have to get some of this shit out is kind of my point.

And I just would like you to get it out in a very healthy and productive way as opposed to a toxic way. And if you're not dealing with it in a healthy way, you're just at risk of it coming. At some point, you're just gonna have to get this stuff out and you're gonna have to work through it. And I just, you know,

just protect your healthy relationships and don't exhaust your healthy relationships by avoiding, you know, dealing with your stuff in a more productive way, like therapy. Yeah, no, I'll do that. I do feel like I've let go of a lot of things, but, and I don't, it's not like I talk to my friends all the time about this.

I really have let it go a lot, but it is still, it's just more so the custody stuff, but I will talk to someone. It will help me, I know, just to like vent stuff, because he pisses me off. And that will probably always be effective. Listen, you're not the first and you won't be the last person who had a beautiful child with an absolute loser.

Yeah, literal, like he's the worst. Like I've never heard a call, like either is even more, like your mouth would be on the ground. Like I've never heard a caller say anything. And what I find honestly embarrassing is like, when he cheated on me, it wasn't like a normal feeding. Like, at least go to the bar and eat something, but you can't because I think you're freaking,

clearly you have a, like, it's weird. Like, your Craigslist ads and- There's something wrong. I mean, there's something wrong with your- It's freaking weird. It's embarrassing. It's like, what the hell? But it's also, your problem is that you weird. It's embarrassing. It's like, what the hell? But it's also your problem

is that you're still making it your problem. Yeah. And you know, listen, it's, again, kind of like at some of your first calls. I mean, he is the father of your son. So it's just like, you know, if you didn't share a kid together, maybe he still wouldn't be in your life.

But you are making him more of your problem than it sounds like you need to because you do have things working for you that some other parents who are co-parenting with difficult people don't. Is that the fact that your ex is pretty absent and not involved and doesn't try to be and you're actually, you know,

and that's kind of a good thing rather than him going, actually falling through with some of these threats and really making life a lot more difficult. I mean, this situation could be so much worse. And I'm sure there's a lot of single parents out there who are listening, wishing they're in your situation as crazy as it sounds. So-

No, and I know, and there's been people that called in too or have friends that are like going through a battle and four and that's why I'm like, I love the piece. I think I didn't have that for so long. And I don't know why I stayed with it for so long. It's a million dollar question, but. No, it's not. It's not a million dollar question.

Honestly, like, yeah, maybe unpack it in therapy, but you do not have to ruminate over and over. What's important is that you're out of it. You know, what's important is you finally found the strength and you set that boundary. I mean, if you want to understand it a little better, so to make sure you don't make the same mistake in the future, but you don't need to sit there

and analyze it over and over. And then that's what I'm kind of saying is that you seem to be doing it a little bit more than you realize, and I think you're still spending a little bit too much energy worrying about things related to your ex that quite honestly, you don't have to worry about. The problem's almost been solved.

And you're still kind of too emotionally invested. I think you're reaching out and connecting with his family too much. Again, if they wanna be proactive and go out of their way to make sure they still have a relationship with their nephew or their grandson, let them. But it's not your job or your responsibility and you need to focus more on your son and your boyfriend and the baby. Yeah. Okay. Well, thank you. I appreciate your advice. I wasn't sure honestly, like I said what you're gonna say So I knew you're probably gonna say he's a loser and there's a lot of times you're like don't you can't or what do you say?

Like you can't you know categorize a narcissist, but he is one like a hundred percent like Everything under the sun, but who cares? I know it doesn't matter but it just Like he is he isn't, loser, whatever. He's not great, we know that much, but the only thing that matters is that he's in the past as much as he can be, regardless, and that's the part you're still holding onto. You have not- No, 100%.

You still make him more of your problem than he needs to be, and that is something you still need to work through and get a therapist for. No, I do. And I can tell I want to hurt him in a little bit. Like if I file for child support, like, oh, it's going to hurt him. And then I kind of wanted to give his real name, which I didn't. But like, I kind of wanted to just to be like, yeah, you got to like that.

You know, that's that's your toxic trait. And that's the thing that you work on. At least you can recognize it because that's you really. All you need to do for you need to just be grateful of just how much, like, I mean, think about it. You have a great boyfriend, he's, in so many ways, you are so lucky given the situation you came out of. And you need to spend way more energy focused on that

and a lot less energy on all this past shit. Okay, well, that's what I'll work on. And I will call today, I have time, so I'll call and talk to someone. I am proud of myself for being able to hold, like when I did talk to him, I didn't like, he would say really bad things and mean things, but I just always held my composure.

I feel like that's a lot, his help was just, this podcast in general, yours and others, just I've hold my composure really well, but I do need to let other things out and let go of some stuff. So I do need to talk to a therapist. I just think it also, it's hard when everyone is in my ear too, like, oh file for child support, file for child support, like everybody, but I'm just gonna do what's best for my son. Well listen, you're asking a lot of different people their opinion and so

you're getting a lot of opinions, so like stop doing that. Yeah, you're asking a lot of different people their opinion. And so you're getting a lot of opinions. So like, stop doing that. Yeah, you're right. Thank you. All right. Have a good rest of your day. Yeah, you too. All right. Bye bye.