The Viall Files - E987 - Daniel vs Lucy: Perfect Match Fallout, RHOM, RHOC, Tom Sandoval on AGT & The Fake Justin Bieber

Episode Date: August 21, 2025

Welcome back to The Viall Files: Reality Recap!  He said one thing, she said another. And we the people get to hear both sides, as Daniel and Lucy join (separately) to talk about their time together on Perfect Match! Plus, Lucy gets to hear some of YOUR hot takes from the season thanks to our Mint Mobile Hot Take Hotline! Meanwhile, we get into last week's episodes of RHOM, RHOC, Tom Sandoval’s time on America’s Got Talent, the fake Justin Bieber hanging out in Vegas and more! You won’t want to miss it.  “I’m scared…” Subscribe to The ENVY Media Newsletter Today: https://www.viallfiles.com/newsletter  Listen to Humble Brag with Cynthia Bailey and Crystal Kung Minkoff. Available wherever you get your podcasts and YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@humblebragpod https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/humble-brag-with-crystal-and-cynthia/id1774286896 Start your 7 Day Free Trial of Viall Files + here: https://viallfiles.supportingcast.fm/  We’ve partnered with Mint Mobile to open a hot takes hotline to hear your scorching hot opinions! Give us your hot takes, thoughts and theories and we’ll read and react to the best ones on an upcoming Reality Recap episode! All you have to do is call 1-855-MINT-TLK or, if you prefer the numbers, that’s 1-855-646-8855 and leave us a message. Please make sure to subscribe so you don’t miss an episode and as always send in your relationship questions to [e-mail] to be a part of our Monday episodes. Follow us on X/Twitter: https://twitter.com/TheViallFiles Listen To Disrespectfully now! Listen on Apple: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/disrespectfully/id1516710301 Listen on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/0J6DW1KeDX6SpoVEuQpl7z?si=c35995a56b8d4038 Watch on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCCh8MqSsiGkfJcWhkan0D0w To Order Nick’s Book Go To: http://www.viallfiles.com  If you would like to get some texting advice on Office Hours send an email to [e-mail] with “Texting Office Hours” in the subject line! To advertise on this podcast please email: [e-mail] or go to: https://advertising.libsyn.com/theviallfiles   THANK YOU TO OUR SPONSOR MINT MOBILE: Mint Mobile - Get this new customer offer and your 3-month Unlimited wireless plan for just 15 bucks a month at https://mintmobile.com/viall. Upfront payment of $45 required (equivalent to $15/mo.). Limited time new customer offer for first 3 months only. Speeds may slow above 35GB on Unlimited plan. Taxes & fees extra. See MINT MOBILE for details. Timestamps: (00:00) - Intro (04:17) - Justin Beiber Moment (08:09) - Household Headlines (15:25) - RHOC (27:57) - RHOM (38:59) - Lucy Joins (01:10:31) - Hot Take Hotline (01:15:23) - Daniel Interview (01:45:39) - Outro Episode Socials: @viallfiles @nickviall @nnataliejjoy @danielperfetto_ @lucy_syed @scottvds17 @ciaracrobinson @justinkaphillips @leahgsilberstein @dereklanerussell @the_mare_bare  

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What's going on, everybody? Welcome back to another electric episode of the Vile Files reality recap edition. I am your host, Nick, joined by my lovely, gorgeous, beautiful wife, Natalie. Joy. Lovely gorgeous, beautiful. Lovely gorgeous, beautiful every day. LGB. No teeth?

They are in the room. They're going to start the rainbow. You're going to finish the rainbow. Well, we have a great episode lined up for you. As always, what? No? We do have a great episode. Yeah.

Oh, my God, always. It is the he said, she said episode of the week. We always love it. He said, she said. Daniel and Lucy from Perfect Match, your perfect match, the perfect match of Perfect Match. I don't know if they're out. They're the rest of the cast.

It's a perfect match. They won. They at where time were a perfect match and then it turned out. They are no longer together. You can't forget Scott. Oh, Scott, yeah, Scott came. Scott joined. Well, Daniel came with a moral support.

He showed up with his friend Scott, his sister. What was her name? Lovely lady. Julia? I think honestly him bringing Scott, you know, Scott sat where Justin is sitting. There is no camera on Justin, unfortunately. So there was no camera on Scott.

And Scott's facial expressions the whole time Daniel is trying to explain himself. I mean, Scott is just dying, laughing back there, and it makes you think, like, is it a crock of bullshit? You know? Prop, you know. Makes you think. So you think about it. Yeah. Well, we always love to hear opposing viewpoints.

We all, we did, you know, for reference, they, well, we'll let you listen to the episode, but we invited them on together, you know, a classic Sandy Nick. callback from Altamato where we put them on the couch and the tension was palpable at awesome

yeah and you felt listening to it it was the Christmas it was our Christmas gift to you they declined that opportunity

which says something but we did have them back to back to back yeah don't go yeah so we talked to we talked to Lucy

and then we were able to you know maybe pull some things Lucy said and asked Daniel Lucy just said Right, right, right, right, right. Yeah.

Anyways, it's a great episode that is coming up shortly. We also have to get into Real Housewives of O.C. and Miami. We got some great headlines for you. We're about to kick off. Before we do, just a reminder that James Gunn was with us yesterday

for a great going deeper. If you don't know, I mean, most of you do, but for those who've been living under the Iraq, he is one of the most talented, brilliant minds of Hollywood today. He's the head of DC Studios, writer-director of the most recent Superman. Peacemaker is now out. Suicide squad.

Suicide squad. Grimes of the galaxy. Scooby-Doo. Brilliant, brilliant, man. Also, big reality TV, Love Island fan. And he has some great takes. And that is all yesterday that came out. So be sure to check it out. Manali who got mad at me yesterday. I didn't understand.

I actually thought it was like being more manly. Okay. What did you do? Apparently just in Bieber. My wife is she claimed We had yesterday We had coming out next week I have an incredible going deeper

Love Thy Nader Is a new show Coming out on Hulu next week And I think it's gonna be a hit And by I think so I feel like I know so I was the one who jumped on The bandwagon of the Secret Lives

Of the Mormon Wives before you all did Told you it was gonna be huge It was, it is And I think Love Tha Nader is their next Hulu's next big hit It's the Kardashians before You all know Brooks Nader obviously as size swimsuit model, iconic model,

but also recently on Dancing with the Stars, had the whole like Brooks and Glob of it all. She has three sisters. They're all like very close in age. They all live in New York City. They have a crazy fun dynamic. They're from the South. Their parents are lovely.

So we had all four sisters on that's coming out next week. It's a wild, wild episode. Anywho, their premiere, it's premiering this week. They invited us to a little like, cocktail party. Yeah. Last night.

How was that? It was great. Yeah. I just wore the same thing. That he'd been wearing all day. That I wore all day. Which was? Remind us.

Same thing he interviewed us. Gene's in a shirt. Jeans and a shirt. And a boot. Yeah. And a boot. And a boot. And Natalie, as she does, decided to, you know, get dressed and wear a beautiful, lovely

outfit. It was different from what she wore during the day. And then we got in the car and she looked at me with disgust. And she said that I just in Biebered her. Well, it was more so just like, Like, we already were with these women today. Like, they've already seen this outfit and, like, we're all changing outfits. You know, you go from day to night, right?

You change your outfit. Yeah. When you have different occasions. But I'm a low-maintenance girly. That's what I was thinking of. It's just like, you know, don't be too. You're trying to be cool. Like, you didn't care.

I feel like I'd give her the ick if I had to get all, like, fancy. Well, just maybe even switch out the t-shirt. Right? You know? I was like, you've been in this all day. It's like maybe a little stinky. I want to. I didn't want to.

trot too hard. Right. Yeah. Of course. Yeah. Uh-huh. And it felt like I was like glammed and then he was like, oh, that's what's going to ask. Did it look like you guys were going to the same place? No. It looked like he might have been going to the grocery store. Oh, got you running out. That's harsh. Hell, it was. Hey, you look good when you go to the grocery store. And you do look good when you go to the grocery store. I look better than most. Yeah. That is true. You at least open the car door for Natalie. Yeah. He did. But usually, usually when we're getting into Uber's, like I'm, he, he, opens a car door for me and then I have to either scoot or like crawl to the other side, which is just like a nightmare in itself. But last night, he went around both times.

Oh, wow. He got it on the other side. Gentleman. So, yeah. So it was like half a bead. It wasn't closing a car door on her. Yeah. It wasn't closing a car door on me. He definitely remembered I was in the car. And I wasn't wearing a sweatpants costume. He was not wearing sweatpants or crop. I believe you looked at. But here's the real question. Was it clocking to you that he was standing on business you know he was standing on business okay but was it clocking to you i think it's clocking to me currently okay good good good good yeah i don't know if it clock to me presently there yeah but it is right now how's the album doing i mean i enjoy it but is it like chasha period sign i was like does that even is that still exist like do people still go

like platinum with streaming and all of that well yeah they do they just don't get any money from it. Yeah. I do know that a lot of his songs are in like everyone's reels and TikToks. That matters. And Instagram stories.

It has millions of streams. Tens of millions. Tens of millions. Oh my God. So crushing. Yeah. Yeah. He's number two on the U.S.

Billboard 200. How do you think Bustin Geper is doing on his streaming? I mean, did you hear about this? This is crazy. That a Justin Bieber impersonator tricked Vegas club owners

into letting him perform. He also ran up a $10,000 bar tab. Who is it? Can I see a picture? Is it that uncanny? If you look at this man, you're like... Does he have the same tattoos? Yeah, that's the part that really gets me.

He went out of his way to get the same tattoos. But he's like... You look at him and you're like, no, no, no. I kind of feel like this is like grounds for evaluation. You have to find the video because he's pretty... When he puts on the Beeb's cost... Yeah. When he's the gas station sunglasses...

glasses, you know, the baggy pants down to the kneecaps. Like that, yeah. That is not Justin Bieber. That is. It doesn't look at anything like them. It's rough. It's rough. But if you were drunk in Vegas.

Like, Justin doesn't dance like that, first of all. Like, we know how Justin dance. He's also smaller. He's gustin is much smaller than Bustin. Yeah, that is for sure. Well, and then on the real Justin was photographed, like, out in West Hollywood the same night. Yeah.

He was not. Not there in Vegas. And I guess the club owners found out pulled him off. Buston Bustin Gber. Pulled him off stage and then made him pay the $10,000 bar tab and then kicked him out. It's just crazy that this is a thing. I mean, like, you know, there's like the Taylor Swift girl. Yeah.

And it's like, get the Taylor experience. And it'll be like her performing at like your birthday. You're like 12 year old's birthday party. It's just not the same. It's not. It's like, oh, it's so bad. It's just hard for me to believe that somebody went so far as to get identical. tattoos like that man has what over 200 tattoos over his on his body but someone's parents didn't

love him here's here's the thing there are so many like in for like drag queens and stuff like there's like derrick berry who is a very famous like drag queen that specifically impersonates brittany spears so like there are many many like famous drag queens that impersonate pop divas and it's like a thing that you go see like a drag queen that's yeah i feel like drive is so different i know but it's like Like if you're an impersonate, like, you know. If it's a bit, if you're like, hi, I'm a Justin Bieber impersonator and you want to hire me like a cover band. Yeah. Cool.

It's like, yeah. Then it's like that person sounds or looks a lot like Justin Bieber. It's kind of funny. It's like a joke with your friends where like we got almost the real thing. Right. And then everyone's kind of in on the joke. It's really weird when the people who like want to pretend show up at the mall in L.A. At the grove with a lot of security.

sign autographs, hire security, and do this whole thing just so that they can feel and, like, trick people into thinking they met, then that's fucking creepy. But if you're, but let's say, right, you are Justin Bieber, or maybe you're even Nick Viall. You live a very busy look. And if there was someone who looked just like you, that you could, like, hire to do some of the things you didn't want to do, would you do it? Like, let's say Guston Sheber. Wait, what is it? Buston Bieber. Buston Jeeper.

Buston Jeeper. Sorry. Is this person making decisions on my behalf? Vic Nile. Let's say Vic Nile. Vic Nile, yeah. Vic Nile was like, hey, like, there's an event you really don't want to go to. Should we have asked Nick?

Nick seems to be Vic Vial. Yeah, I don't like do meet and greets, though. But maybe you could. I don't do things I don't want to do. But maybe you can make more money and you don't have to do the things you don't want to do. But Justin is not making money from Buston. Well, what if, but what if Justin hired Buston is what I'm saying? Maybe he's missing up Justin's tab.

He's missing out on a business opportunity by bringing him into the fold. Kind of like how people- Are you saying that Nick should hire you to be Vic Nile? No, I could never land that. I can never sell that. I'm not that good of an actor. What is Vic Nile doing on my behalf? Vic Nile is maybe, you know, like going to a premier.

He's-hung-out-Rose. Yeah, he's getting paid like a good, solid-self. Oh, Vic would do that. Such a Vic move. Vic. He would be like, will you accept this rose to the cashier at a whole move? Vic is, like, come on, Vic. Vic is so obsessed with stobing on The Bachelor.

Like, he's really good. Why would I want anyone to believe that I would even, could you imagine? I can't. I know there's a lot of bachelor's. Vic Nile is really being like Peter from Vanderpump. Yeah. I don't know. Just think about it.

Do you think, what would Tom Sandoval's alter ego be? Oh. Himself. I think he is like, he is his own role. He is an alter ego of himself. A lead singer of the cover band. Yeah. Yes.

But also doubles as a reality TV star. He had his, uh, America's Got Talent debut. Well, because we all just like a fifth time on. Is it his fifth time? He's in the quarterfinals. How's he doing? Well, not great. Well, I mean, you made it further.

He did make it further. A questionable performance. He had, he still never, whatever we think of it, he got enough of, he got enough of Yes, Simon Cowell was the only one that wasn't happy with his performance, so it seemed. He said it didn't sound amazing. Simon Cowell also didn't think Jennifer Hudson had what it took. So is he really... That was an L.

Yeah. So is he really the person we want to base? I'm very confused by this show. It's not good. He's made it past multiple rounds. I guess so. His take on me was pretty decent. I will give him that.

Decent. Do you know how many decent people don't make it past the first round? Yeah, but are they... I don't watch it. Are they international super-scent? No. Sophia was trying to dance along. She was like, she called it entertaining. Mel B. from Spice Girls said, you make me smile. I've said it before and I'll say it again. And then Howie was like, you know what? You guys are great up there. Like, people would hire you for their private parties.

You could perform at weddings. Yeah. Yeah, they would. What if we find out that this entire time, Tom Sandoval has actually been the real Tom Sandoval is. is Somm Tandeval. Sam Tandeval. And what we've been seeing is actually what happens when an alter ego or a clone takes over.

And it's not good. It's like an Averillivine situation. That's kind of a good movie idea. And somewhere in that body is like this very sweet, very just like progressive. You know he would be like, that was my alter ego

who cheated on Oriota. It wasn't me. No, maybe he has the real Tom Sadevall like trapped in a basement. he's kidnapped him he's kidnapped him Howie Mandela is not team Ariana I know that I think that much

is clear here's Tom Sandoval's redemption arc I guess I mean listen he's gonna get paid 15 to 20 grand per wedding yeah that's true

that is true speaking of Ariana this is flawless we're still in Scannibal we're still in Scannibal we're still in Scannibal we have the Love Island Reunion trailer

that has dropped I don't expect that we're going to get much. I don't know. I think Jeremiah and Ace go at it. I am looking forward to it. So we need a full trailer drop, guys. All right. So we get into a little Housewives of O.C. Are we doing

to start with a rapid recap? So if you did not watch last week's episode of the Real Housewives of Orange County, here's your rapid recap. Okay. So a reminder, the girls are in the birthplace of Lil Wayne and Stacey Schroeder, which is, of course, New Orleans. Tamara wants to fight like the Mormon wives. No alcohol needed to destroy

women emotionally. Shannon can't believe anyone is friends with Katie because she's done illegal things recording conversations. Gretchen reminds Shannon that driving drunk is also illegal. But according to Tamara, Katie told a blogger that Gretchen told Katie that Tamara roofied her. While getting ready for dinner, Tamara drinks strangely yellow water. Also, Shannon has an amazing moment with her hair extensions. By the way, Shannon and Tamara are cool again. Then Katie promises Gretchen she never told a blogger that Tamara roofied her. Gretchen feels bamboozled, which is the second time the term bamboozled, has been used this season. Not that we're counting. At dinner, all hell breaks loose. Here's what went down. Tamara has

a meltdown when Gretchen believes Katie, Ruffy rumor. Shannon screams, calls Katie the leak. Jen pops in and demands to see the fatty photos. Tamara showed everyone of her, causing Tamara to fully crash out. Gina tells Tamara she's drunk. Shannon agrees that the yellow water was not in fact water, but she still hates Katie. Tamara then storms out and quits the show via Instagram post. Overall, does this count as quiet quitting from Tamara? Find out next week on the Real House wives of Orange County. Do you think it was champagne, tequila, or dirty water? I think it was either a shitty chardonnay or tequila. But I'm like... Tequila would be wild. Well, I don't know if you guys saw... I think she admitted that she mixed Xanax. Yeah, yeah. She posted on her story

apologizing to Heather and saying she also was like, she was like, yeah, at that time I was going through something dark, I was making Xanax and alcohol. I find it to be a little like, I don't know, I feel like a lot, you know, obviously fans have a... strong opinion about Tamara. I always get a little uncomfortable when people, like, say things like, oh, like, Tamara's using Teddy's diagnosis to, like, benefit. Like, why is not, whatever you think of Tamara, isn't she just, her friend has a serious diagnosis. She's literally fighting for her life, Teddy Malencamp. And it just, it feels weird when people are, like, critiquing Tamara for struggling with this thing as if, like, I don't know, I just. I think it's valid that, like,

Tamara's real life is like clearly bleeding into filming this reality TV show to the point where she's obviously like trying to cope in different ways and trying to get through filming in different ways and then to like I mean I think we talked about this when we saw the initial Instagram post of like I'm I you know and now watching it back of like Tamara sitting at this table having all these people yell at her about this and about that and she's probably like I have my real friend like real shit going on I'm not putting up with this, I'm done. And I think it's valid for Tamara. I mean, I don't know. I feel like I definitely I don't disagree with that at all. But at the same time, I'm also like Katie, I don't know,

I feel like Katie's kind of getting done dirty by this because it's like Katie hasn't done anything as nearly as nefarious as some of these other women have. And she's being held to like that same standard. Like I kind of feel like she's kind of the, they're projecting a lot of shit onto her so they don't have to like deal with their own shit. And they're pretending that what she's doing is a lot worse. Yeah, I was going to say where with Tamara, it's kind of difficult because I'm like, we just have so many years of her not only like poor behavior, but also claiming that like I'm changing. I'm going to be different. I watch the women get baptized and then throw wine in someone's face. So it's like when you see somebody's behavior like that,

I can also understand as a viewer being like, well, why this time? You know what I mean? Where it's like right now you have something to hide behind where it's like, but you're still throwing grenades at like Katie where it's like not saying that she shouldn't be on the show by all means, but it's like also if it's too much, then maybe like take yourself out of it. But I'm like at the end of the day, your job is to show up and and these women go for the jugular. So I'm kind of like there is no mercy and it's kind of like Tamara, even like last season,

she came for Shannon during her lowest time over and over again. And so people are like, why do you deserve that grace, but you won't give that grace to other people? Yeah, but don't you think it's different for, I mean, Shannon did what she did. And I don't think, I don't think you can compare what Shannon did versus Teddy fighting, what's happening to Teddy. 100%. I'm not trying to compare in the sense of, like, gravity. I'm just saying that I'm like, there's so many situations throughout Tamara's history of her kicking people when they're at their lowest. So it's kind of like, people are just kind of, I can see why people would also be like, I don't really have that grace for Tamara.

I do also think what the Katie talking to these bloggers You know it's like These bloggers aren't Real journalists Like they have no reason to like Keep their sources The bloggers are fans

Anonymous you know So it's like these bloggers are starting to come out And say like oh no I got a call from Katie And it was she said this Which you know can you believe the blogger Can you believe Katie? It's like It gets messy

The lines get blurred I think my thing with that is just like This is not the first time a housewife has talked to a blogger. And I think the way these, like, specifically, like, Shannon and Tam are acting about, like, Katie talking, and even Heather, like, acting about how, like, Katie is talking to a blogger as if she has, like, violated some, like, sacred trust or act. Meanwhile, I'm like, I know you're all talking to these bloggers. You know what I mean? It's just, like, for the sake of the story, like, I guess. I don't know.

It does feel weird, though, because it's like Katie's second season. So it's like, you know, if you want to be friends with these ladies and, like, you don't want to have them coming after you all the time, then like, why are you going to bloggers and saying like, oh. I mean, like, this roofied thing is like not a little hop, skip, jump in the park. Like, that's a big allegation. I don't, I don't disagree with that either. I don't know. I just, I have a soft spot for Katie. I really do like Katie.

I do like Katie. I don't... I just feel like if this stuff is true, I definitely don't agree with it. I also don't... I mean, it's hard to, honestly, have favorites in the show. They all suck.

Gina's my favorite. That's it. Gina's chilling. I do feel like Katie's mistake. Whatever Katie did or didn't do, I feel like she did what she thought she should do. Right. You know?

Like to, like, to like, earn her spot almost. Yeah, I mean, because like she... I think it's safe to say she is was a fan right before she came on it's almost impossible unless you're both of men yeah you know clearly has a schedule that does not permit you sitting and watching hours of housewives yeah yeah i just feel like i feel like women like her or just you know are hard to find uh in terms of like someone who really you love what they're doing and respect what they're doing and they're like they really are just like this could be fun to do i don't need it i don't want it we're like katie i feel like it's

more the norm to like be casting you know women who just like know the franchise and like it's a big opportunity yeah and i feel like she's kind of operating in a like well as i think this is i feel like i feel like what am i doing wrong i feel like katie if whatever she's doing wrong i think it's i feel like she is surprised by the vitrials she's receiving yeah i agree with that and doesn't really know how to handle it and you know right and she doesn't want to say the quiet part out loud like are we not all doing this? Like, wait, why? It is also crazy that Shannon's like, I'm not going to be in the same room as you. It's like, Shannon, you were in the same room and on trips with Alexis, who's like literally suing you and dating your ex. Like, I wouldn't share a table with my ex's

new person. Like, are you joking? I do want to shout out Gretchen really quick from when Shannon was like, I would never, I don't think any of us should be friends with someone who is doing things that are illegal. That's a criminal. And Gretchen's like, well, didn't you? kind of do you why isn't that illegal and i love how she just kind of moved on and she's like so tamara what do you think and then tamara's like moving on yeah that's kind of what i love about uh shannon she commits yeah whatever she's doing she you know i will say it's uh hather's um metaphor comparison with the dog with the frisbee though i was like nope that is 100% because i'm like how long and how many times and how many instances are we going to bring up this

situation and make it about you and how you can't be around Katie and it's just like sit at the opposite table and just don't talk to her. That's like the whole, that's why it's like I have such a hard time with Shannon sometimes is just like, I know you're a good housewife because you make everything about you. But at the same time, I'm like, it's the same, like find different things to make about yourself instead of the same thing over and over and over again. She is a woman of God and they walked out of the voodoo thing and I thought that was hilarious. I would never do that Oh, that was so great when she was like, you are an observing participant. And they were like, Gretchen goes, okay, well, then I'm leaving.

Sorry, thank you, bye. It also. I kind of respected that. Same. I did the same thing. But also Gretchen's whole thing being like, I'm a woman of the Bible, so I will try to forgive Tamara. And then immediately being like, nope.

She said try. She did try. And she did try. Okay, yeah. Gretchen, you are blessed and highly favored. To Gretchen's point, kind of what I was saying earlier is that it's like because of knowing Tamara's behavior in the past and the amount of. of lies and evil things that she has done to other people, that even Gretchen was like hearing

that off the bat. Of course, she's going to freak out about it because she didn't say it, but then it's also kind of like, I have to consider the source. Why are you telling me this now? Katie's never done anything to me to make me feel that kind of way. And I don't like that, you know, argument when people get fucked over by people and being like, well, they never did anything to me. But Tamara has done so much to Gretchen that I'm like, even the naked wasted episode. Like, it's dark. It's like Tamara and Vigie are like finding joy in trying to to get Gretchen drunk so that they can expose her for the person she really is and not this person she's pretending to be on camera. And it's like, I know that was 17 years ago, but it was

fucking dark. And also like, 17 years ago. But Gretchen has every right to like remember everything that Tamara hasn't changed that much. 17 is a long time. And it was like a different world. But if you, but if that person did that to you and then they continue to do things that over the years, then you're like, you're just. I mean, like, I don't fault Gretchen for not. making Tamara. I'm not saying Tamara should be over it. But that's what Gretchen keeps saying to her is like you haven't changed and it's unfortunate you're still making these choices and that you're still fucking with people essentially. Like mind your own business. Try to be a nice person. But instead it's like you're

just constantly throwing people under the bus and it's like, okay, for what? Yeah. I just think it was also shout out to Jen for seeing her moment of like being the timing. None of it was about her. This was all specifically about Katie. This was about the roof. thing. And then Jen's like, hey, reminder, I hate you. But also, didn't we, I feel like we saw this fatty photo last season. Wasn't Tamara showing this photo last season as well? Of like, look how much she's changed. There were other photos. Yeah, there's always, there's a ton of photos. Also, like, one, she didn't look that bad in that photo. Like, she didn't look fat in that photo. Also, it's kind of giving like a, when you turn the camera to the side and people take a group photo,

So something happened on Apple phones for a period of time where whoever's on the end stretched. Also, you know what I'm here to believe because it's happened to me? Tell me. Is that you take a group photo with someone and maybe you're not the one in charge of the photo. Uh-huh. They do a little face tune on themselves, a little pinch of the waist. And who does it stretch out? Oh, the person beside you.

Your elbow. My sister on Thanksgiving posted a picture of all of us. And I was like, why do I look 100 pounds? Oh, well, I am 145 pounds. Why do I look 500 pounds? I was like, and then I said it to my brother because he was on the other side of her, so we both got like the short end of the stick.

I'm like, what the fuck? I just know. Do I look like this? Yeah, I'm like, so that 100% could have happened. Yeah. It's been kind of iconic for or evil of Tamara like made herself look skinnier. Yeah.

And then started showing it around, being like, wow. Evil, despicable. I just know being, if I were. ever to be on Housewives, I would have a, like, body dysmorphia-induced mental break-up. Oh, for sure. Like, it's crazy. That's crazy. We also have the Rural Housewives of Miami two episodes.

Yes. Huge. Two episodes last week. We had episode 10, The Thrill of Savi. And if you didn't watch the last two episodes, here's your rapid recap. The Thrill of Seville. No. The, I feel like Alexia is pissed at me right now.

Let it be met. Hey, you're doing, you're doing your best and thrill and Seville rhyme. So go for it, Mama. The thrill of Seville. Dr. Seville. What is it supposed to be? Sevilla. Sevia.

Sevia. Well, it's not Italian. It's not a Italian. Okay. I think they title this episode, knowing that no one pronounced it. That's why they put thrill. That's why they put thrill.

The thrill of Seville. Uh-huh. Okay. Go ahead. Stephanie is the Oprah of Private Jet Gifts. Lisa still has an unfollowed Larsa's ex-boyfriend. Lisa missed her original flight and didn't text anyone. then ended up on a train.

Larsa has a stalker who has a crush on her from different numbers. Only bad things happen after 10 p.m., according to Stephanie. Larsa and Stephanie laugh at the flamenco performance while Alexia and Marisol appreciate it. There was a weird private plane vibe versus the normies at dinner.

We got a, ooh, I'm Alexia, which was incredible. Alexia accuses Stephanie for buying people with her riches. So, like, she accusing her of, like, human trafficking? No, she's saying you try to buy your friends by giving us gifts and taking them on your private jet. Yeah. So she's generous. Yeah, yeah.

Literally. She's Crystal Minkoff. And also, yeah, she, like, doesn't have a girlfriend. So that's what she's saying. Like, she's like, I don't really know how to do this. But, like, okay. And, like, when she was on the phone with her husband, I was just like, y'all are so cute.

I know. Her being like, I want to be with him every moment. Has she ever thrown her money in the faces of her friends that she is being generous to? No. Not that. To be fair for Alexia, it makes sense, though. Because she was fighting with Alexia. And she's like, well, actually, do you want to be on my private jet?

And she was like, girl, no. Yeah. I'll go business class. They look like, they had a great time at business class, though. Like, that still looked nice. But that's a nice gesture. It was.

Like, I don't want to shout out Southwest. Love you, but, like, I would rather just go PJ. Overall, should Larson stay away from athletes, be a milf, or trust the universe? I have to say also in this episode, when Alexia arrives and Julia immediately gets up, and she's like, we were just talking about you. Crazy. And then tries to play it off as like a, no, no, no, I saying like, oh, we were just talking about you. She's like, I didn't tell you to talk about me. I told you not to talk about me.

And I was like, oh, shit. But also Julia is stepping in it this season. She really is. Girl, she really is. Zip it. The thing is she is the villain. It's so hard for me to actually, like, be mad at anyone in Miami. Like, they could do terrible, awful things to each other.

And I'm like, I said this to my boyfriend, too. I said, Salt Lake City in Miami are my face. Oh, my God. My fiance. I'm so sorry. Yeah, so sorry. Yeah, you earned that shit. I know.

And I'm like, it's still, it's still getting, I'm still getting used to it. But I was telling him that I was like, my two favorite franchises are Salt Lake City and Miami because these women are so fun, but so unhinged, but also, like, can go from screaming at each other, throwing glasses at dinner. And then the next day they're all in, like, dress up costumes, like, okay, let's go. And that's why it's so fun. There is such a great balance. We also had episode 11, unfollow or unfriend. Then we have flamenco dresses galore. Kiki lovingly brought five of her cousins to America and then received death threats from other family members. Alexia started wearing her wedding ring again. Larsa is mad that Lisa is still following Marcus. Larsa would unfollow her grandfather if he broke up with her grandmother because women's stories matter. Meanwhile, Lisa asks, how much can a man take?

There's some spiritual flamenco singing and emotions from the soul, but Stephanie laughed. Uh-oh. In general, Seville has been amazing. Besides, two people, Larsa and Lisa. Meanwhile, Larsa is going to remove herself from Lisa's life. Overall, how do we eat ice cream, lick or bite? Is it sexual? Find out next time on the Real Housewives of Miami. Really quick from the last episode, I just want to say that Adriana's whole thing about... Yeah, I'm so sorry. Really quick in the last episode, Audreyana's whole thing about the man she met with the private jet, then like crashing the private jet

and dying. I died, yeah. Oh my God. I love that woman. She's the funniest person in the world. It was giving Erica Jane when she was talking about the car going off the cliff and rolling. I'm just going through a lot right now. The car got the house got broken into. Well then also,

Adriana also just having like random fun facts about everything. Like the reason Barcelona is Barcelona so smart is because the king had a lisp and which is track no yeah it's yeah it's my aunt lives in uh belinthia which is like we say valencia but he couldn't save valencia as it was valencia yeah because he had a list saying i also knew that pop off geography thank you well less about geography and more about like just knowing lore lore yeah of other yeah yeah i actually

felt really bad for lisa this episode i might be a alone here, but I'm just like, what I really put into context that, like, this woman's father has just passed, she's going through some of the worst legal to have Larsa be like, I can't even look at her, I won't even talk to her, and then chooses to sit directly across from her, and then cause this whole thing while she's getting an affidavit sent to her that she needs to get signed and notarized within an hour. And it's like, there goes Lisa, making everything about herself again. And I was just like, I just want to shake you because your concept of reality hurts. Yeah, it's tough to take Larsa's side over, over Lysas, knowing that they were

friends. After talking to Lisa, like, some of these like marriages slash divorces are just devastating. Yeah. Like when you have these certain type of people, mostly men in positions of power, who you come to find out are kind of monsters when it comes to like their views on relationship versus like Larsa who seems to be winning whatever divorce she had from Scotty only to then date. her ex-husband's ex-teamate's son and whatever drama is going on in their life she really Larsa seems to be more in control of her life and props to her for like controlling the situation

but like how do you not have empathy for what Lisa is going through all while having children with this man and being emotionally tortured by this guy um well she's like but you're so following Mark and then to call her biggest problem is her ex-boyfriend And then to call Lisa a groupie And then Lisa's whole thing being like You're the one that dated them

You're the one obsessed with the 90s bulls Like follow the Kardashians Yeah I also I respect Lisa for taking notes I think we've all been there with like if someone's Like if everybody's not believing you Everybody's scream at you I'm taking notes I also respect her saying to Larsa

Like I will have this conversation with you When I have like my thoughts gathered But like right now I'm not prepared to have this conversation with you and it's just going to go chaotic. So, like, let's take a beat. And she was like, well, I never want to speak to you again. And it was just like, Larsa's reactions to things are just so frustrating. Even when she said that the paparazzi told her and Jodi that Larsa was the one that called the paparazzi on Marcus to get that photo of him doing Koka.

I'm like, and then she goes, you're lying. You're a fucking liar. And it's just like, that's not what she said. Like, that's not even a proper response to it. She said, that's what the paparazzi said. You're fucking liar. I realize when it comes to Housewives, I'm a big hypocrite. Okay. Say more.

Because I just like Tamara. But objectively, I know, like, because she's wrong. And like Larsa, at least my perception is, Larsa seems like I said, to be in control of her life. And like she, I bet like it seems like Larsa is more playing whatever character she thinks she's supposed to play to be a housewife and blah, blah, blah. And yeah, she's dramatic. And like, like Tamara, it feels like Tamara has her real life that she knows how to severing. And I think the struggle with Tamara with OC is you see her real life bleeding into her housewife life with her friend being sick and having those issues. And then you have people like, for example, like Lisa, where it's just like they or Shannon and OC where they're just kind of messes. You know, their life's a bit of a mess. And and they are gracious enough to let us in on that mess. And sometimes I have a lot more empathy for like Lisa where it's just like, help the sister out. And then other times I'm like, I love the way she plays the game. You know, and I'm like, and I'm way more team Lisa, but I'm also like team Tamara than I'm just a hypocrite.

I think you're a fan of Housewives. I like who I like. That's what I said you about are you team Lucy or team Daniel? Oh my God, Lucy. Yeah. I mean, you guys judge for yourself. They're coming. I mean, Daniel seems like an all right guy.

I mean, obviously when when on these types of like love island or love competition shows are bachelors, I do think men, it's like we oversimplify these characters. And it's just like, if you don't like a guy, he's just like a narcissist, you know, like these, you know, think of all the terrible tropes you say about men and we a larcissist yeah a larcissist right um yeah i just i think i'm putting daniel in the bucket of like i think men in 2025 are even slower to mature emotionally and i think men have become more awakened to their feelings and that's that's great like it's like i feel like a lot of young men have taken like don't be a toxic masculine man which means just like makes their feelings more valid and them talk about their feelings more and almost like use that as a way to like weaponize whatever situation and I don't

because I don't think I don't know you guys judge for yourself but definitely team Lucy yeah across the board women's stories matter what does that mean that's the Reese Witherspoon quote French I mean sure yeah she's taught it's just an interview with Reese Witherspoon where she's like women's stories matter and it just like entered my brain yeah well up next well he said she said for you. We love point, counterpoint. And that's up next. Up next, we have Lucy. And then after that, we'll be diving into our interview with Daniel. And we have some exciting news to share. Lucy won't just be answering our questions, but yours as well. Thanks to the Mittmobile hot take hotline, Lucy will respond to a reality TV hot take. Since this episode is sponsored by Mittmobile,

we want to, again, shout out their deal for everyone heartbroken by their current wireless carrier, break up with your old wireless bill, and join Mittmobile. Get the new customer offer in your three-month unlimited wireless plan for just 15 bucks a month at Mintmobile.com slash V-I-A-A-L. That's mintmobile.com slash V-I-A-L. Like what you hear and want to give a take of your own. Give us your hot takes, thoughts, and theories, and we'll read and react to the best ones on an upcoming reality recap episode. All you have to do is call 1-855-Mint T-L-K, or if you prefer the numbers, that's 8-5-6-4-6-4-6-8-8-5. And leave us a voicemail. And leave us a voicemail.

Again, just call 1-8-55-Mint-T-L-K or 8-5-6-4-6-8-5 and leave us a message. Welcome to the Vile Files. How are you doing? Hello, I'm really good. Yeah, I'm good. I'm excited. Why are you scared? I don't know.

I don't know. I feel like, I'm not like, I don't know. I get really nervous. I'm like, oh, God, what word vomit's going to come out of my mouth. You shouldn't be scared. You're like in love with Freddie, you know, you shouldn't be scared. Oh, are we, we're starting there. Sorry, I just, sorry.

Yes, okay. We can definitely start that, put the rumor to, I don't say to bed. that sounds like end the rumor I love ready to bits but we are just friends like nothing going on we basically just became each other's photographers that's kind of what's happened um we both work with the same brand and we both needed to get content so i'd be like right i'm going to do content he was like okay i need to get content too so we'd end up like doing content in the same spot he'd like take it for me and then be like oh that looks cool actually do you mind doing it for me so yeah but okay but just friends that's fair that's fair friends yeah that being said like why why why why not i just

freddie's so lovely as everyone knows like he is just yeah he's an angel um i just don't see him like that like i don't think we've ever like even on the show like we had that like one conversation that was aired but we just never we've just never had that kind of relationship like it's just always been friendly. Like, I've met up with him before in London, with it went walking around. And it was kind of just, like, walking around with my brother. Do you like him a little toxic? Do I like people? Um, I think maybe if you watch the show, you could say yes. Well, you know, I, I wonder because, you know, Freddie has gotten a lot of fanfare for his, what seems to be amazing personality and just, like, unproblematic personality. And yet,

And yet the ladies are just all like, yeah, he seems like a cool brother. I mean, I think he does pretty well, to me fair. I think I don't think he's, I don't think Freddie struggles. I'm sure there's, well, I bet there's loads of girls that like, oh, I'm sure. So I don't think he's struggling. I think it was just maybe us girls on the show. Gotcha.

But he came in a little bit later as well. So, like, we'd already kind of made, a lot of us have, like, made our matches. We made them very quickly. And I think in those scenarios, like, you just kind of know, like, if you have that connection with someone so quick. Like, you either have that, like, whatever, you know, chemistry or it's just friendly. For sure.

Well, congratulations on being the perfect match with Daniel. Yay. Yay. Yay. Yay. Yay. Yay. Yeah.

Yeah. I feel like I can't cheers that because I'm like, yeah. And then it ended, you know, after. And we didn't even go on the holiday. I really do hope they gift that to Adi and Ollie as a baby moon. I was watching and kind of like shocked that they didn't win. I guess maybe let's start there. Why do you think you and Daniel won versus like say the couple that's having a baby?

Yeah, mad. Matt, like, in a good way, mad. Mad that we won, I guess. I think it was maybe like the whole Justine situation. I think maybe because like the other half of the cast were in the hotel with Justine. And I don't really know, but isn't that really bad? I don't know why I won. I'm like, I don't know.

I think people obviously did see that me and Daniel did generally, like, we generally did like each other. But watching it back, yeah, has been interesting. I'm sure I think probably if the people who, like, if everyone voted on the outside, if they all watched like everything that was in the house, they probably wouldn't have voted us to win maybe. Because they only saw bits of each other's, like, they only saw. bits of our dynamic and then he saw bits of ad and ollie's dynamic but i guess they probably

knew more because they had justine to talk to and things so i think maybe i think maybe like friendships came into it it wasn't just maybe who's the you know who's the perfect match so i think maybe that will play a little part in it was it harder living in the moment of daniel and his issues with you doing anything or watching it back It was hard of being in it. However, I have to say, watching the boys' day back, I, like, my jaw, I was like, whoa. Because obviously, I know what I got told. And, like, AD, like, was amazing and, you know, told us everything.

But she told us everything she saw and she relayed it. But equally, like, there were just things that were said that I was, I was really shocked by, I have to say. Like, the bit where he said, like, I don't know the boys were all egging. him on but saying like oh like Olivia's like so much hotter than lucy or whatever like you know she's so much sexier and he's like yeah yeah that was true i was like cool okay and then poor jalen's like oh lucy's turned too though thank you jalen yeah yeah that was nuts yeah i was like oh that's cool watching it back was the first time daniel made you cry how how did you like what did it feel like watching back did it seem because i think us watching it the first time he seemed kind of

ridiculous and jealous and kind of just uh it came across as him kind of taking out his embarrassment on you when yeah ultimately like you didn't really do anything wrong other than like you know i guess you gave him the wrong score which he's still got a nine like he got a nine And I generally, I know people think, I've seen TikToks and people like, how does she not know? Like, I know Juliet says in the show, like, you know, like, Ollie has a beard and you don't. And but in that situation, we had a song blaring in our ear over and over again. I was really panicked anyway to make sure I didn't get it wrong. And Ollie then kissed me, really went for it because he obviously thought he was going to win, you know, want to win.

And but then he like hugged me at the end. And I just in the heat of the moment was like, like 10. And then I realized straight away, I was like, no, no, but like that, that wasn't actually Daniel's beard. Like, that wasn't him. So then I asked to rescore. I'm like, with everything and going, can I rescore? Can I rescore? Can I rescore? And I just heard no, no. And I was like, but I knew straight away he was going to take it really badly. I cried before we even left the challenge. And I told all the girls, like, I know he's going to take this really badly. Why did you think he's going to take it badly? Like, I just think the kind of way he is.

I knew he'd be really embarrassed and I knew he'd be really upset about it and I knew he'd be annoyed. I don't know how I knew. I just knew. I guess because even at that point, I think could kind of tell like most of the guys, I don't want to say the word possessive, but like openly kind of shutting things off. So I think I already knew that, yeah. I just knew I knew that would hurt his ego. Do you think you have good intuition and do you follow your intuition? I think I have good intuition. I don't think I always follow my intuition at all. Yeah, because I was just wonder, like, wouldn't that be a red flag?

If you, whatever Daniel, whatever energy Daniel is giving you that told you, this guy is going to freak out if on a game where everyone kisses each other and is blindfold with music blasting in his ear, if I get it wrong, he is going to lose it on me. And then he did. Like, what does that say to you about, I guess, Daniel? I mean, it probably should have been a red flag, to be honest. I think my biggest concern with that whole situation was when we got back. I don't think you see part of the conversation when I asked to speak to him.

I had already asked to speak to him once, and he said no. He refused to. I'd like cried the whole journey home. Rachel had been holding my hand in the van. We just met and she was like holding my hand. Like, it's okay. Did Daniel see you cry? the whole time yeah he saw me like get he he saw me upset in the van but then i think that we

had to then we split i think the boys went in a different van um but he wouldn't be he just wouldn't speak to me he wouldn't say anything he just was ignoring me so then when we got back to the house i already asked him hey like can we have a chat and he was like no i'm going to go i'm like i'm jimming with the boys basically leave me alone so i was like okay like i'll give you some time and then obviously i went to try and have another conversation and they don't put this in the show but i remember the reason i walked out of the bedroom was because I said to him, I'm so sorry, like, honestly, like, ask all the girls. Like, I got, I already got really upset.

And I cried because I knew that this would really upset you. And I'm so sorry. And he was like, Lucy, to be honest, I really don't care that you cried. I don't care. And that's why I walked out the bedroom. I didn't, like, storm out. I just, like, I heard that. And I was like, oh, okay.

So then I went, I think I went over to Louie first and then the girls. And then I think Louis told him, told Daniel, dude, she's really upset. Yeah. But I kind of felt like he only really wanted to comfort me, like watching it. I'm like, I think you just wanted to comfort me because everyone else knew I was crying. He wanted to look like the good guy around all the others. Well, it was like the second time he like wipes away my tears. And I was like, in the moment, like you don't really know.

I don't know. You don't put two and two together. But then in the moment, I was like, you just told me that I've embarrassed you again. And then you're the one wiping my tears away. It was all a bit. I mean technically he embarrassed himself I mean shouldn't he just be a better kisser than Ollie or I mean yeah you definitely think

well he kissed I kissed him after Ollie no I know I mean I'm just teasing but like I mean I just don't did did Daniel it's just a game yeah but that's what I'm saying did Daniel ever come around I mean we've all been embarrassed in the heat of the moment we've all felt like a little silly when our egos or our pride or whatever it is that's taking over But did he ever, like, I don't know, wake up or just, like, have, like, cooler heads prevail where he was, did he ever, like, sincerely apologize for being like, hey, listen, I really overreacted. My feelings were hurt.

I was embarrassed. But that being said, I shouldn't have handled it that way. I'm really sorry. I let my pride get the best of me. And I took it out on it. Because that's what he did, right? He just took out his feelings on you. You didn't do anything wrong.

you know, regardless of what your answer was, it was meant to have you not know who you were kissing. I mean, beards aside, like, you just, you didn't know. And did he really think that you were doing it to, on purpose, to fuck with him? I mean, is that what he thought? I think he generally did believe that, like, yeah, that I knew it wasn't him.

And I guess I did know, obviously, like, in the heat at the moment, I, yeah, I got it wrong. And then obviously, like, literally a few seconds later, it just I think in my head not everyone was obviously going for it because they were just kind of like making sure they gave their match the best score some people were going for it

and some people weren't and I was kind of like just trying to see who was Daniel to be honest I wasn't like probably doing it properly in that sense so yeah but I do think he does that that didn't make sense to me as well because people have said that

like he said that and then people have said that in TikTok's like she clearly knew and I'm like why would I score someone else like intentionally attend like I just wouldn't do like I mean yes I would do the game but equally like well I mean trying to to get it wrong if he really thought you knew then I guess that would make you a little toxic and then maybe he shouldn't have just maybe he should just moved on from you if he thought yeah if he really thought that you scored him deliberately lower than Ali just to fuck with his ego then jen just say that rather than yeah that didn't make sense to me

because I was like, I get, I get where everyone was like, how could you get it wrong? But I was like, I did get it wrong and I didn't mean to. But why would I do that on purpose? Like, that's just causing like, do you mean? That's not the kind of drama you want. Yeah. Well, that was good drama. I mean, it also like, even the second time he makes you cry is over literally nothing.

I mean, it just seems like he would get upset over the smallest things that he felt hurt his ego and, like, quote, unquote, embarrassed him. I mean, when he told you that you were laughing too loud with another man, what was your reaction watching that back? Yeah, my decimals were too high. Okay. AD you to be like, not too much, too much, too loud. Real it in.

I think the thing with that all is, like, I don't agree with his reaction at all. I do think the boys kept trying to wind him up. And I did have a conversation with Louie at one point that wasn't aired because I was like, can you guys like stop trying to like rile him up as well? Because I think they had a little conversation before I come over and they're like, oh, yeah, like she's very loud, Daniel. And whereas some of the other guys I think can take it as a joke, I was like, that's not the kind of thing that Daniel would take as a joke.

Like that would upset him. So I was like, can you guys stop? Not that he should have reacted the way he reacted, but you definitely were. guys were like hyping him up and making him feel maybe a little bit more validated in his feelings. Yeah. Well, even on the like the boys day and they're like, oh, come on. Like, you're not going to sit on the sidelines. Not that you ever have to do, like, behave how he behaved. You really don't. But I was like, why are you all like, you know, especially like Louis. I was like you all meant to be my friend. Like, we did too hot together. And I really like,

like, I love Louie. Like, we are friends. I was like, why are you like doing this? realizing that you had to do so much work to kind of tiptoe around his feelings or make sure that his feelings didn't get hurt. Did you see any of this as a red flag or were we just kind of thinking he's hypersensitive? I'm just, I'm not understanding like where your attraction stayed with him throughout this process. Well, so we'd have these like arguments, whatever they were, but then we'd go back to the room. It's just due to, it'd be so much calmer, we'd talk about things and he did like he did apologize like after the boys day like it wasn't aired but he did like I mean I know it doesn't make up for everything but he did do a massive apology and like

he laid out candles and got me flowers and wrote me a card and like said how sorry he was and then you know he'd acted completely out of line um so we did we did always have like a resolution in the evening and I think part of me was just kind of hoping that I was like this is a weird situation. Like, if you're quite like a, I don't know what the word is, but if you're someone that, you know, introvert as free spirited as me, I don't know what the word is, but I don't think that situation was very good for him. Like, I don't think that is a healthy place for him to be in because he, he wasn't like wanting to explore. He wasn't, you know, he didn't want me to be open, but then he wanted to be open. Yeah, I don't. So I guess where did it all go wrong? I mean,

The two of you at the little finale, y'all looked in love. You know, you both were like, yep, he's my perfect match. She's my perfect match. And then what happened? We had some, like, well, they don't really show. I don't think much of our good times in there, to be honest. Because there's loads, like, we have loads of downtime. We had a great time.

Like, we'd be at creating films together. Like, we would have, like, we did have really lovely times in there. But I don't think any of that was really show. But I think afterwards it was just so apparent. We all went on a holiday. And I just, I think I thought it'd be so different outside of the, like, the villa. And I was like, actually, I just didn't. I was like, this, let's be real, it was going to turn really toxic.

I was like, this is going to turn into a really toxic relationship. Like, at the time, I was working at a nightclub, don't anymore, but it was then. I was like I was working at a club still we're in different countries we're on different time zones like even like I think once I turn my read receipts off but you know and you can see like oh no like last scene or something and he was like can you put them back on like he wouldn't like if I turn that off

like he wanted like he wanted to reply instantly and I was just like this is going to turn bad like it's just not it's not going to be good so did you guys even attempt to date after a perfect match or after the holiday you guys took right after or did you guys just pretty much end it right away? No, so we had a few weeks after. So we did, yeah, we did like finished perfect match.

All went, we weren't on a holiday. It was me, me, Daniel, Scott, Louis and Sandy, or went on a holiday after. Then went home. Then we're still in court, yeah, maybe like maybe a month, three weeks. And we were planning the trip. Like we were going to go to Zanzibar. Like it was all kind of planning.

But I think, yeah, it just, I just was like, I just felt like it was so wrong to, like, go on this holiday kind of feeling like this is not, this isn't going to work. Like, this just isn't. Were you the one who ultimately broke it off? Yeah. I mean, he, he kind of, like, he definitely agreed as well. And was like, yeah, I do think this is the best decision. But I initiated it.

I just didn't want it to turn really toxic. And I was like, I could see that's where it was going to go. Like, I think as well, the time difference was hard. I think it was like eight hours, nine hour time difference. And yeah, I just, it just wasn't good. Yeah, I was like, this is going to turn bad. And I didn't want it to end badly. I didn't want it to get to that point.

And there were things like on the holiday when we were away in Cancun that I didn't, I didn't like. Like what? No. Like what? This isn't like, I don't want a bad mouth thing. because we're all fine. But like even like we went to the airport and like he pulled my top up and was like, hmm, let's cover you up.

Oh. And I was like, oh, ah, no. Like I was just wearing a vest and track suit bottoms. And I was like, oh, like why? What? And when we're in the house, I asked him once like, I guess these are my kind of red flags. Remember in the house? I asked him one night like, oh, do you think I should wear this dress tonight or this

dress? Like a long one or a short one? And I think his response was, well, let's. be real, like you're going to wear the short one. It's you. And I was like, hey. I was like, no, I think I'm going to wear the long one. Like, what? So you felt like maybe he was a little controlling over like how you looked, how you dressed, how you appeared? I think so. I was like, I don't think we're going to ever align on this and you're not going to, you're not going to change. And I'm not not going to like dress just, you know, differently because you don't like the vest top I'm

wearing. When was the last time you spoke with Daniel? Well, we briefly saw each other at the Netflix summer event but we literally barely spoke like we said hello and then we said hey as well at the event um that was kind of it really he did yeah he did message me to apologize um he's obviously watched it all but i yeah i didn't reply do you not think it came from a genuine place the problem is i was like i don't i thought about replying because i'm not someone that holds a grudge Like I think, you know, that was there and we move on, life goes on, and it's all fine, it's all good. But watching it back, I was like some of the, some of the behavior, I was like, that's actually not okay. Like, if that was like my friend or my daughter or something, I wouldn't, I would be like, no, no, no, like you can't accept that behavior.

So I think, yeah, I didn't want to start a conversation. But it also didn't want to reply and say it. So it's all good. don't worry because I was like actually like it wasn't okay um if that makes any sense I don't know if that makes sense no no it does it does was there anything specific like watching it back besides the like obvious things that we've already talked about that made you you know like say like if this happened to my daughter or my friend like absolutely not I mean obviously yeah the boys day which is obvious but I think it was more like the intention with things like the intention of the boys day

because they all did they all went off and effectively like cheated on all of us and did what they want to do but i think it was just like when he like had that chat with juliet and he was still saying that i'd embarrassed him and i don't know it kind of i don't i was like is this like revenge because i embarrassed you so now you're like right i'm going to kind of like get back at her it just didn't it didn't come from very i felt like it didn't come from a very nice place whereas i think louis yeah i don't you know i don't agree with how he moved but i don't think it came from like a I don't know like a revengeful place or anything I think he was just thought oh great I'm going to do what I want to do yeah what I know what do you think no I mean I definitely

agree I mean the way that Louis handled what happened at the boys mixer versus just the rest of the men showed more of his character you know granted they all fucked up but the fact that he was able to straight and pull like you know have accountability yeah yeah and instead of like the weird like I'm just going to wait and see like are the girls going to tell her we we we begged AD not to tell anyone you know it was a weird like yeah I hated that I hated that I mean they were like oh like Olly like AD's going to tell on us it's like yes also like we're not like 14 like what are you going on about like this is so weird but I think as well yeah like that night they also didn't air but I can't remember the boys came back obviously like you see

me have a conversation with Daniel but then he told me something else at bed when we went to bed he'd like waited until everyone had gone to sleep and then he told me something else I think that's when he told me about kissing Juliet or kissing someone I can't remember which or that it was multiple kiss or something I can't remember what it was but I was like why are you telling me this now like we literally we've you said you told me everything we spoke about everything and obviously everyone had gone to bed, so I couldn't talk to anyone. So I was just pacing around the bedroom because I was like so annoyed. And because he was like, oh, yeah, like the boys on the way home were like laughing so much.

And I was, I was furious. I was, I literally was like, absolutely furious. I was like, don't touch me. Like, I just was pacing. And one of the producers like, yeah, we watched you like pace around the room. So I was like, I was so angry and I couldn't talk to anyone because I was like, why, like, one, this isn't funny. I was like, you all literally like, what found that hilarious?

that you'd all just, you knew you were coming back and going to, like, hurt all of us. Yeah, I was so angry. That's bizarre. When you watched it back in real time, was it worse than you even found out about in real time? No, it wasn't worse. It was bad.

Like, I was like, I was shocked, but it wasn't worse. I think just because I've moved on, like, from it now. I knew it would be bad. I just didn't know it was going to be that bad. And I didn't realize that Daniel was going to be really that bad. Like, he was up in there, you know. Yeah. But I'm kind of like, well, I've moved on with my life.

Like, I'm good. I'm happy. So if you could go, would you have matched with anyone else? Maybe if, like, all of the men got there on the first date, would you have found yourself maybe matching with someone else? I don't, I thought about this. And I don't think so. And I think even if, like, I thought to myself, you know, if I'd have seen on, you know,

seeing how bad the boy's day is, like, would I have, you know, they're not matched with him? And it's really, it's just really hard to know because it's such a, like when you're in that environment, I just didn't have a connection romantically with anyone else. I just wasn't attracted to an else like that. So, and also I think like that point was quite near the end. So it's like, do you, do you kind of throw away what you've tried to build with someone? Or do you stick with it and, you know, maybe they did just make a genuine mistake and they just got silly? But yeah, I don't know what I would have done if I'd have actually maybe like watched

The Boys Day like from AD, you know, how AD got to watch it. I don't know how I'd have felt. Like if they would have had a had a Temptation Island Bonfire moment where they kind of play clips of what happened for everyone to watch back a little movie night-esque, you know.

They should have done that. That would go off. Yeah. They should have done that. That would have gone crazy. I mean, I don't even think they needed to be fair because as soon as the boys came back, I remember I just looked at Louis's face. Yeah. I was like, your face is annoying me. And he was said, what have I done?

And I was like, we know. I was like, we know. He was like, why are you like, you got really, we had a bit of an argument. And then we apologized to each other because he was like, sorry. And I was like, I'm sorry for shouting at you. But I just knew. I was like, I could see it in his face. I was like, your face is annoying me. Yeah. And he's like, why come to me? He definitely doesn't have a very good poker face. And I said, you're all guilty. I was like, you're all guilty. Yeah. Yeah. We talked to Sandy this past week, and you're speaking to your friend, Louis. He's obviously made some waves with some of his, like, off-camera antics, you know, swapping shows and spoiling things before things even kind of had a chance to get out.

Do you have any thoughts about your friend, Louis, particularly about how he's moved in the past few weeks? Sandy felt a certain kind of way. I felt like it was a little selfish on his part to not really consider. consider everyone else on perfect match and just how his how his behavior kind of affected everyone. I was curious if you had anything to add to that. Yeah, I do think it was a, I think it's a shame. I kind of wish he just waited a little bit longer to like go, you know, go public with Hedder. I think that would have been nice if he just waited a little bit because it does,

it does affect like, you know, the whole cast. I agree with Sandy. And I think also like for people that want to. to watch it. I think that was kind of, I saw a few people say online, like, oh, it's just a bit annoying that, you know, we know so much of what happens. Or like, you know, we know who doesn't end up together already. I said, yeah, like, you don't want to ruin it for people. I know he has also done an English TV show recently. I think he filmed it a few months ago. So I guess he could argue that it was already out there that he was single at one point this year, because that

that's just aired now and that was filmed after the perfect match so he is busy I guess yeah he could say well you know people

know that I'm single or knew that I was single because of that but I think maybe yeah maybe if he'd have waited to like go public with his new relationship just so that

also because then he gets to reveal it as well you know do that great are you dating anyone now I am yeah I am dating oh he's not in there

like he's not not not TV not in the TV world very, very, very private. I texted him before this podcast. I was like, are you okay? If I just say like I am in a relationship, just so everyone knows. And also that's why I wanted to put the, like,

the Freddie roomers to bed because I saw someone do a TikTok saying, like, that Freddy's, um, Freddie had his hands on my waist at the Netflix, like, summer break. And I was, and like, my boyfriend saw that. And I was like, oh, like, what? Yeah. So I was like, no, no. Like, I love Freddie.

We're great friends. But, like, also, Freddie's not a touchy-feely person. Like, he's just also, like, I don't, I wouldn't call him like a very tactile person. I was like, that's just not true. Okay. So she's in a relationship and it's not with Freddie. Not with Freddie. Okay.

No. But you're happy? Very happy. I would like to be engaged in a year. So let's see. All right. We'll circle back. And then just final thoughts on how you feel about Daniel.

Do you feel like overall decent guy, maybe just some growing up to do? Would you, would you be cool with Daniel dating like a girl, you know? No. No. It's really hard because I don't like to ever say anything bad about anyone. And it's like I don't want to like, you know, character assassinate someone.

And if I thought he was that bad, like obviously I wouldn't have, you know, done the whole experience with him. We did have really, really good times. Well, I mean, it depends if he's changed. If now he's watched all that. back and he's changed then great but i just think like his reactions to to things would just not okay and i think i think if if he was yeah like yeah what i guess what's the one thing you think he needs to work on in order for you to feel like he's changed for that answer

to be different i guess just like feeling secure in himself because like that like that's where it all dry it just just insecurity isn't it like if you don't feel you know completely secure with the person you're with it and within yourself then you know that's why i said i think the boys did really affect him and and i said that to louis and louis knew that and he was like yeah you know he he is like definitely is someone that's affected by that that's why i was like i said to the board i said all of them one day i was like can you please stop because i was like he i think he would take it differently i think they would do this especially because a lot of them were english as well I was like, you all have this like English banter sometimes.

Like, yeah, yeah, write each other up. And I was like, I don't think he's taking it as banter. I think he's taking it as like, oh, you know, your girl. Like, I don't, I don't think the boys actually were like meant it to get to escalate how it did. Like when they said to you, I was being loud. I think they were just trying to wind him up a little bit. But it really did wind him up. Yeah, but even then, it shouldn't have, I know, you would think he would have.

No, he shouldn't have reacted the way he reacted. And he didn't let me explain, like even have a chat about it. That was my issue. I asked to explain and he wouldn't even let me explain it. Yeah, that was crazy. You need to give me a chance to explain it. Well, we'll get to hear from Daniel next to see if maybe he has matured a little bit. And we'll have to see.

Maybe. And also like, but equally like it is, you know, it is, it can be a very intense, it is an intense situation. It is an intense environment. And I think he filmed his show quite a long time, like his other show before that. So, yeah. I don't know. I don't want to like badmouth anyone because I just think like...

I thought you were very nice. I don't, well, you know, I mean, like, I don't want to be, yeah. But it was, some of it was really hard to watch. Just because I was like, oh, that, I did think, um, sometimes I was like, kind of going into myself a bit. Yeah. I could see it. And I was like, oh, that's not great.

Well, before we let you go, Lucy, we have a voicemail. We want to play for you. Uh, it's from our Mitt Mobile hot take hotline. It's just a fan that has like a hot take, about perfect match. We figured you could, you know, join us as we discussed this fan's hot take when it comes to perfect match.

And you, the listener, if you want to join our Mint Mobile Hot Take hotline, it's super easy. You just call 1-855-MENT-T-LK or 1855-646-8-8-55. But now is the voicemail. We're about to play. Are you ready for it, Lucy? Ready.

All right. Hey, Nick, big fan of the show. I just wanted to call in and say, my hot take is about perfect match and love island all those shows uh personally i feel like when people kiss other people in the truth or dare games it's definitely cheating um i also know that there are challenges but i think if you go too far in a challenge that's also cheating i'm not sure i wanted to know what you guys think let me know i feel like our call is referring to like the heart bay challenge on uh on love island where like you know challenges like are silly and fun or

Or on the mixer when, you know, like, Well, let's just call it a game. Let's just call it a game. And then I guess it's not cheating. Did you feel cheated on Lucy in that moment? Yeah. That wasn't the only reason you play truth or dare is because you all want to get with each other. And I'm like, and even in that challenge, like, no one chose truth.

Who chose a truth? Yeah. None, no one. Like, you play that because you want to kiss someone and you want someone to be like, oh, I dare you to kiss the person you fancy. I dare you to do this. And you're like, oh, my God, it was a game. Like, they dared me.

Yeah, they might have. They might as well play it, spin the bottle. Yeah, I was about to say. If you're ever at a party and someone's like, let's play spin the bottle. It's like, oh, you want to kiss someone here. Okay, okay, just say it. Yeah. And if you're, like, dating someone and you play spin the bottle, like, I wouldn't agree with that.

I'd be like, why are you in the circle? Yeah. Didn't mean if you're actually, like, locked off with someone, you wouldn't play. You'd be like, you know, hey, guys, I'm going to. I'll watch, but I'm not going to partake. But, babe, they were playing truth or dare. It's just games. It's just a game.

Crazy. That was crazy. Well, Lucy. The phthalic was just a game. It was just a game. Thank you for playing along with us, Lucy. And we want to thank you again. And shout out to Mitt Mobile, the sponsor of this episode, for helping us ask the burning questions and giving you those hot takes. Break up with your old wireless bill and join MintMobile.

Get this new customer offer and your three-month unlimited wireless plan for just 15 bucks a month at mintmobile.com slash V-I-A-L. That is mintmobile.com slash V-I-A-L. Again, if you want to hear us react to your flaming hot take and a future episode of reality recap, all you have to do is call 855-Ment-T-L-K, or if you prefer the numbers, that's 855-6-4-6-8-8-8-5, and leave us a voicemail. Again, just call 8-5-Ment T-LK or 855-6-4-6-8-8-5 and leave us a message. Lucy, can't thank you enough for taking the time. It's been a ton of fun. Congratulations on being our perfect match, regardless of it working out with Daniel or not.

happy that you seem to be in a much healthier and happier relationship and we're excited to see it unfold. I know he's private. So we'll just, we'll just assume you're happy. Yeah. And I met my perfect female match on the show. Rachel. I'm grateful for that. Yeah. I just got back from Ireland with her today. Oh, really? Yeah. We love her. Yeah. She just played back like three hours ago from Dublin with her. She was like, I'm coming to Dublin. I was like, I'm coming. That's amazing. Yeah. She had such a, we enjoyed watching her so much this season. it seemed like she really found herself and really enjoyed the experience

and we love that for her. She's amazing. Well, thank you for having me. Yeah, thanks for coming out. Where can people follow you and all that fun stuff? Oh, on Instagram, Lucy underscore Saeed, S-YED,

and then TikTok, I think, is exactly the same, she would have. And then once I'm in, on Broadway, come see me. All right. Let's go. Well, we heard from Lucy. It's time to hear from Daniel.

Let's see if his version. Is any different? Let's see if he's grown, matured. Maybe he'll just double down and be like, no, you do not rate a guy in nine if you're dating. Lucy can't thank you enough. We appreciate you. Thank you. Bye. Bye. Take care. Bye. Bye. Bye.

Well, we're about to get to our interview with Daniel, but before we do, I just want to say thank you again to Mint Mobile for sponsoring this episode. Everyone deserves to fall in love, so why shouldn't you be head over heels for your wireless plan? fall in love with Mint Mobile, get three months of unlimited premium wireless services for 15 bucks a month at MintMobile.com slash V-I-A-L. It is mintmobile.com slash V-I-A-L-L. Upfront payment of $45 required, equivalent to $15 a month. Limited time, new customer offer for first three months only.

Feeds may slow above 35 gigabytes on unlimited plan. Taxes and fees extra. See MintMobile for details. Daniel, welcome to this show. Thank you guys so much for having me. How are you doing, man? Very good. How are you guys doing?

We're doing great. We are doing great. We are doing great. We just finished perfect match. Did you guys enjoy it? Thank you. We did. Congratulations on being a perfect match, I guess.

Thank you. Thank you. Yeah, exactly. Did that come as a surprise to you as it did for maybe the rest of us? To be honest with you, no. Being there, like throughout the entire process, it wasn't a surprise. I can see how watching this show, it's a surprise to a lot of people. But to be honest with you, being there, no.

It really wasn't. Okay. So like going into the finale, you felt like you and Lucy really were the, strongest couple and you felt you felt really good about it. I don't want to say the strongest couple because I feel like it's different for everyone. But in my eyes, at the time, yes, I thought for sure I was either going to be AD and Ollie or us. And that was really, I think the mindset for a lot of people. Scott's here, by the way. Yeah, he is. That's my guy. Yeah, me and Scott were living together for, I don't know, it's been like six weeks now. Okay. Are you just, are you in town just to kind

check out. Yeah, I just thought why not, to be fair. Like, again, me, Daniel, Louis, and Ollie were really close on the show. He actually came down to Toronto too after we filmed. So he came to my hometown. He stayed on my hall. Yeah. Like kindred spirits. Yeah, exactly. So do you live in L.A.? I don't. Right now I'm currently here. I don't have a visa to be in the state. So sometimes I spend. You're Canadian. Yeah. Yeah. Canadian in Maltese. So got the European passport and Canadian. I don't have the U.S. one yet. But I spend like six months. sometimes here. I've stayed here up to six months with my sister Julia and whatnot, but no. Oh, that's your sister. Yeah. Oh. I did, I did dating. I did dating and related with my sister.

Yeah. No, no, no, no assistance. Oh, no. For sure I did. I did see. He's popping on. All right. Like, things are going well for day. Shown up fashion to be late with my assistant. No, without Julia, I actually wouldn't be here because I did dated and related with her. So that's why I'm here. Oh. Okay. I was like, I kind of forgot. what show you did. I know. Well,

to be honest with you, I think it's the name's fault of the show dating and related, but it was actually... I haven't seen it and I'm just going to make

sure that you guys weren't dating. No, no, no, we aren't. But do you know how happy I'm now to finally tell people? Oh, no, I did

perfect Matt. Yeah. Before I was like, you dated your sister, and I always have to be like, all right. You have to like, explain the show.

What is dating and related? Pretty much it's a dating show, but you bring your siblings. So, unlucky for me, I was with my younger

sister so guys would be hitting on her and you know imagine you just had your brother in there you guys are just doing what you have to do so yeah i feel like i feel like we need to give her mic everyone needs to yeah i want to know if she was shocked by your some of your uh antics on perfect match what do you think your family's reaction to that was um to which which one she reacted to mostly around making lucy cry yeah yeah yeah see well i do want to put it out there obviously it's it's It's not a good feeling when I'm, when I'm seeing it, seeing her cry. And even when, when that did happen, I wouldn't say that was ever my intention. Um, obviously looking back, I don't know, you like, obviously you reflect. This was so long ago. And obviously,

I never wanted that to happen. Uh, did you remember it differently than how you watch it? Because obviously, you guys filmed over a year ago. For sure, being in the villa, like, the emotions are just so intense. And I think at some points, maybe things seem to be a lot more of a bigger deal than they actually are. Um, maybe on the outside world, it, wouldn't even be like that, you know, but, uh, yeah, of course, like, I, I scored a nine on the kissing challenge and it wasn't a 10. Nine's pretty high, man. Nine is pretty high. Um, there's always room for improvement, right? But I really wanted that 10 that day. And to be honest with you, yeah, it was, obviously I didn't feel good about that. Why were you so upset? Um, I mean,

because like from our perspective and maybe it's different, because you don't know what it's like to be there, but like, you know, very much like, a la like Love Island, like the games are the games. and they're not meant to be taking that seriously. No, they aren't. They aren't. And I don't know. I guess I have a competitive nature. I like to think that, you know, maybe I do come across a little bit protective.

I feel like I'm a little bit old fashioned in some senses. And to be honest with you, a lot of us didn't even want to partake in the challenge, right? So going into the challenge where all the couples are like, I don't even want to do it. I don't want to do it. And then sure enough, we get there. And, you know, the point is to immerse yourself in the experience. I get that. I like to think maybe at the time, the reason why I was so upset was.

because the person that you're, you know, you're sharing a bed with each and every day and you're kissing them 24-7 in my eyes. We were just like, we were so confident. I was telling her, I was like, there's no chance I'm going to best you up and vice versa. And I don't know, it's, guys, it's a kissing challenge. At the end of the day, looking back, it's not that deep. But yeah, for one of my boys, he's got a big, big old beard and we're just not really in my eyes similar.

And I like to think that you know, for me, I knew everyone I was kissing, but obviously it's not that. what about the part because like when we were talking to lucy she she kind of mentioned and we didn't get to see it but she mentioned that like she was crying and apparently i guess according to lucy you were like well i don't care if you're crying and she was like really noticeably upset and i'm kind of thinking all right fine i get it like i've i've overreacted at times yeah i've been upset but clearly she's upset that she got it wrong and she's clearly sorry and at that point yeah that's obviously when you got to put your pride or ego aside and just kind of handle the situation itself Um, I feel like a switch. I don't know. Obviously, if you watch it, there's definitely like a switch inside where me where I'm like, okay, well, you just made a girl cry. Like, your feelings aren't that. It's not that important. So like I ran out of the shower and like went up to her and, and, you know, try to make things right. But obviously looking back, like I, 100% see that. I was in the wrong and I can own that. I'm not here to make excuses for myself. And that's, that's the truth of it.

What was it about you and Lucy just that, uh, draw you to her in the first place? Um, to be honest with you, I liked her personality and something about her in the sense where that first night, I didn't, we were making, like, eye contact across the room. I feel like I'm pretty good at observing energy. And I don't know, I just felt like it was important. I tried and have a conversation with her. And as much as I always having fun with Juliet and kicking things off with her, I was just like, I got to have a conversation with her. And then she told me the same thing. She's like, I really wanted to talk to you too. And I don't know, just felt, felt right. Did your sister have any comments for you after watching back? Did you watch Perfect Match?

I did watch it, yeah. I think she had multiple, to be honest. What did you think? Yeah, like, he's my brother, so I understand where he's coming from. And I know, like, the emotions that he's feeling. So I understand, like, when he's reacting, like, I get how he feels. I think sometimes we can have, like, big egos, maybe, and we do get a little jealous. So I get it.

And I also think, like, she, Lucy did say, like, she doesn't like confrontation. So I think for her, it was uncomfortable to have, like, someone like Daniel, who's really, like, up front. like tell her exactly what he's feeling so they just like didn't have the best like communication with each other but it's like an intense situation so obviously you know i i know how i've seen him treat girls properly like i it's tough to see people judge like only a part of him and i know all of him yeah she's got your back did you feel like maybe some of the guys riled you up in a sense where maybe do you mean

oh I don't want to put any excuses on the guys I thought you were talking about Boys Day I was going to say 100% for that We'll get Oh no

We'll get to the Boys Mixer I guess I mean more around when Lucy was laughing with Ray Yeah She was laughing Yeah

Yeah yeah You know what's funny I swear That is not the way I remembered it I don't know if it was too many drinks or whatever

But yeah Like again someone's allowed to laugh They're allowed to be loud And enjoy themselves Is like

Can I tell you what the conversation was. You're like, nope. You can. I know. Yeah, looking back, like, I know, and that's what a lot of people are saying to me, like, you can lick a girl's leg up and down, but she can't laugh pretty loud. And I'm like, I see how it looks. Bring it down before. Yeah. I'm not going to lie. Yeah, what was the exact comment? It was like, is that decibel? Yeah. Yeah, no, obviously you don't, you know, I don't really like the way I came across. I take full accountability for that. That is actually not me. It's also difficult saying that that's not me and people seeing that. I understand. You do a reality show. That's what people

see. That's how they're going to judge you. That's fair. But yeah, no, in hindsight, I'm like, that's pretty ridiculous. But I don't know. I wanted to know what they were laughing at. That seemed pretty funny to everybody. Did you ever find out what it was? No, no. No, no. I didn't, I didn't even pry. Like, I'm just kidding. Just in general, though, I mean, Lucy, I guess in the spirit of trying to give you grace was kind of suggesting that like the the british boys one of them over over there were just kind of yeah like i don't know just giving you shit locker room talk or whatever yeah like kind of trying to get on your skin and may and she's thought like maybe in the moment when you're getting know these guys maybe you kind of took it a little too

like you know they have a different sense of humor than you and and you were just kind of getting annoyed and they were i think i think absolutely that happened in in so many cases for different people because you know you're in the house you're kind of asking an opinion and and even take it for for example scott's thing when he walked out and everyone's like oh my god they're holding hands they're holding hands at the time we look back and we're like you know it's it's obviously not that deep but you're 100% right in the moment like for some reason it felt so much bigger than it really was and people are like are you kidding you know like she's just laughing and i know that But yeah, when you're, but we got so close.

So you do value, like, the people around you's opinions. Like, it's like a tight-knit group. And, yeah, I don't want to make excuses for myself. That's that one telling me, though. What do you think, Scott? Do you think you're trying to get under his skin? Oh, yeah. But I also feel for him in a way because if he was acting that way towards

Juliet, for example, Juliet comes back at him and he doesn't look bad for it. But because Lucy's like such a soft-spoken girl and she is quite emotional and all that, as soon as he says something, Lucy is going to get emotional. And instantly he's the villain then. Whilst if you do do it to Juliet, she comes back, you're just having an argument. He doesn't look like the villain. So it is, it is down to him to know what type of girl he's dealing with. But I do feel for him in a little way, the way it's come across.

You're also kind of just like a big. Yeah, I'm going to be honest with you. I feel like I'm actually like a soft teddy bear on the inside, though. So I don't, I don't know if like, I just, I feel bad like that I came across that way. That's all you can do. Yeah, I really didn't mean to. That wasn't my intention. but yeah well since we're just giving you shit right now we might as well just talk about the mixer

yeah get right into it get right into it yeah i mean i don't know like you know you weren't the only one right like all the guys kind of acted like um it was almost as if it was part of their job to take advantage of the women that were casted for them at the mixer as if like you guys didn't want to be rude almost yeah they came all the way here yeah it's like why wouldn't we play truth or dare. Yeah, I will, I will say this that, um, you know, leading up to it, it was like, I'm obviously not going to lie. I did not as much as I cared for Lucy at the time. And on the way back, on the drive back, my tails between my legs. And I'm like, you know, what did I do? That was, that was silly. I can say it. And I mean it in the nicest way, like we were just having a

good time together. And it sounds really bad to say. And I know they got me. on there saying you know hall pass situation it just felt like I was on vacation with my friends and it was a crazy bachelor party it did and it really was and I suppose that is the the show and then of course like when it pants to them they're playing patty cake and we're it's not a good look in at all what what what like conversations you and the guys had is you guys are going to the mixer I mean they kind of sprung the mixer on you fairly quickly yeah so you don't it looks like you leave right away. I forgot who we talked to, but it sounded like you guys didn't have much like downtime to kind of really talk to each other, whatever expectations. You don't. You guys just disappear,

but on your way there, what are the guys saying to each other in terms of what's going to, what's about to go down? Well, I can't repeat all the conversations, but what I can say is obviously there was definitely a big push to be like, you know, Daniel, you really haven't done anything. You know, it's time for you to like, you know, explore your option. And Nick Lechay always, and everyone was saying the producers the entire time. I don't want to throw anyone under the bus, but you know, immerse yourself in the experience. Go for it. And to be honest with you, I had no expectation in my head that I was going to do anything like I did. There was nothing in my head like, I'm going to go do this. It was just like, let's go. And I went and it got

out of hand very, very fast. Is there in a weird way? Because I think in those environments, I've been in them in the past, it's, it's really crazy how high schooly it feels. Honestly, yeah. Do you think, whether it's you or just all of the men, and you can speak to this Scott too, like do you feel almost like you guys kind of gave into the peer pressure, almost like don't be a pussy almost kind of mentality? You can see in the conversations we're having and the boys are like psyching each other are saying like, imagine what they're doing, imagine what they're doing.

Little, they're doing absolutely nothing. And like in every reality TV show where they have this kind of format, it's always the women are just like chilling just waiting for their guys yeah and it's working on their tan it did you guys walk in they're like ew heck and the guys are just always like oh my god women i've never seen them before that's that's what it looked like honestly and you know what's weird we were just having a couple of drinks the girls come and i don't know where it just turns into a game and for some reason that's just what it felt like it felt like you were in like college playing like spin the butt it was just it was ridiculous yeah how whose idea was

it to play through third air um well i think they have me saying something first i don't i'm not too sure but i think it was just i'm not throwing anyone another but i think it was just everybody scott who was it i don't i don't i think this is just like it's a messy show it's not you can't hold it to the standards of i know there's people from the bachelor love is blind which is a lot to do with marriage but it's a messy show you can't hold the people accountable to them standards when they're on here when we went to the boys there we were like a week and a half in no one's in a relationship. Nothing's that serious. Like, if he's having a bit

of fun, he's having a bit of fun. How he went about it, obviously that's down to him to speak on. But I don't think it's that deep personally. I would agree with you. It's a silly show. I think where they get you, I suppose, is, I guess, like, on the way back, where, I mean, to Louis's credit. We come back with our shirts off. Yeah. And then Louis,

you know, Louis, we kind of joke that Louis presents as like an honest fuckboy where it's just like, he doesn't pretend that he honestly like his boyfriend material he's kind of like I'm a menace you know and he came back

and he didn't like but he seemed to be at least the most forthright of the group of guys where he's like oh yeah fuck it I yeah whatever oops and you guys kind of it's like I think that's where they kind of get you is like at least come back and just if it's not that serious

you just be like hey I don't know I made out some chicks yeah I know that is that is true to be fair I think, again, this isn't my podcast, but speaking for me personally, I got to a point where I was like, I don't even care to tell the truth theory. Like, we've been together like two, three days. Like, it's, it's so not that deep at all. You were just more like, I don't want to hear it for you.

Like, it just is what it is. I don't care what you have to say. I've been this too many times now. Okay. Yeah. And for example, like speaking on my, for me, it was just, I don't know. I was more so in shock that like I couldn't believe what went down. And then obviously looking back, you see, I'm sure if, you know, maybe I wasn't

so upset at some of the things with Lucy, then maybe it wouldn't have been such a big, like, well, how can you get mad at someone for that and then go do that? So that's where I understand, you know, where people are coming to me and giving it to me for that. I can understand that. But yeah, it's weird. I did my best to like own up to it. Obviously, I think I did leave out a pretty large portion of the just hanging out with Olivia and picking up and looking like. But to me, again, I didn't view it as like individual thing. I viewed it as like one playing a game and it just kind of went a little bit a little bit nuts you know so you just viewed it as like hey let's just count the whole day out like let's you just assume I did the worst I don't know

like and I don't need to tell you the details but you just like um it was bad I think it was just bad overall like there is no if-ans or buts about it and I think obviously we knew AD was there the truth is always coming out right um that's true yeah I was going to say if AD hadn't been there, do you guys think that y'all would have taken that to the end of the show or would there have been? I think because there ended up being a mix for the next day with everyone, I think those girls would have done everything in their power to let them know because at the end of the day, they're trying to come into the house. Right, right. Because those girls were saying to us every time they met us, like, how were you guys not more open to be in the situation? You know, it's only been a couple of days. And then obviously it came to the end. And, you know, people are saying, I can't believe you were able to go back and, you know, with them or I would like to address some of your comments regarding at the boys mixer

when you're talking about Olivia being so much more oh my my physical type than Lucy okay well I wouldn't say she's so much more attractive I would just say if you know Daniel you know me as a person they would say that Olivia is more my type but no they're both obviously beautiful in their own right we did obviously talk to Lucy and I think she said that that was one of the things watching back that she was like that felt you know a little hurtful and uncalled for i think all the guys kind of were also being like oh yeah olivia this olivia that like yeah obviously that's obviously that's not good to hear i'm sure if it was the other way i wouldn't like it so i don't mean no disrespect by it i think i was trying to just say um you know

physical type she was just more a physical type okay how do you want people since obviously like a lot of you know it's a reality tv show obviously to scott's point you know it is a show and there's some messiness in it and you guys can all yeah so how how would you describe yourself as a partner um now in today's world like what what kind of boyfriend do you think daniel is um i'd like to think i'm a very loyal guy um confident in the relationship willing to do whatever it takes like to make people better i like to make myself better yeah that's that's really what i would say um obviously looking back on the show you know it was so long ago but obviously it's important to reflect in any situation. Would I want some things to go different? Sure. But at the end of the day, I'm also

very grateful I got to do it. I look back to be able to reflect, that's not okay. That is. It's also important, you know, so everything happens for a reason. I truly believe that. And I think I'm better for it now. Okay. Your co-star Hannah, I think, Scott, maybe you know, Hannah a little bit better, but she recently came on social media and said that Louis had a child. Did he tell you about his kid?

He didn't tell me about that, no. I just don't really talk about that, you know? It's not really my business. I don't really know. They don't want to talk about it. You got to respect that. Hanna is, is pregnant, though, by the way. She is. Yeah, I think that's I guess. Congratulations, Hannah.

I do, yeah. Another thing, Lucy brought up was that y'all all went on, like, A vacation? Yeah, we stayed in Mexico. Okay. Scott, myself, Louis and Sandy. You definitely sound like your Toronto. Oh yeah.

Is it come out? When you... When you... When you... How do you... It's like, eh? Sorry, sorry. No, no, no.

No, no. No, we're sorry. Yeah, no, we did. We shared... It was actually a really fun time, to be honest with you. We obviously filmed the show in Touloum. We went to Cancun. Stay at a resort.

It was a good time. How did you choose the group that was going? I think. like the people who were sort of in the house most of the time. Because I don't know if the episode's really reflected. Like it was over a three week period. And obviously me, Daniel, Louis, Ollie were really close jaw in it. Ollie and Adi sort of went on, went off and did their own thing.

I was single at the time. So it just left them two in their couples. And yeah, we just ended up. We were flying from Cancun anyway. So we thought, right, we'll do a couple of days. And how was that vacation for you and Lucy? I thought it was really good. I had a good time.

We went out. We went to dinners. You know, it was fun. I enjoyed it, spent some time by the beach. Obviously, that was the trip we went on. We didn't go on the actual trip. But yeah, it was it actually, so it says Fiji, but we actually switched that. It was going to be like a safari, like an Amazon safari.

Zanzibar? Yeah. Well, you know what's up. I take that. Yeah, yeah. But yeah, unfortunately, that didn't happen. But the time we did spend together on the trip was. When you left the show, were you optimistic that things could work out with Lucy?

I was optimistic for sure. At the same time, we both quickly found out, you know, how difficult it is. Just like long distance in general, credit to anyone that's able to do that. For me, it was just we're in different countries, you know, she's going out. I'm inside, vice versa. It's just the time zone. It was just difficult. You like red receipts on?

What's that? You like the red receipts on? Oh, no. I don't need that. I don't need that. Yeah. How do you draw the line between the kind of, you know, I'm a traditional old school guy, maybe more conservative in his approach, versus, like, your critics might call it more like possessive jealousy type of energy.

Sure. I think even Lucy kind of mentioned there was a remark that she didn't love or something about her top or a long skirt or short skirt or something. And she was like, what skirt should I wear? And you said, you're going to wear the short skirt. And she didn't appreciate it or something. But regardless, I mean, I think that it's a fine line, too. Like, I mean, any relationship, you just, you know, I don't know. know, like how our partners dress matters, and I think we're allowed to feel a certain way

within a certain reason, but like how do you, yeah, what would you say to someone who says, oh, that Daniel, I don't know, he's a, he's red flag, he's possessive or whatever. Well, again, everyone's entitled to their own opinion, you know, I think, first off, anyone can wear whatever they want to wear. I think that maybe looking back, um, even in some of the communication, maybe I say some things that I mean in a different way and the way I come across can be entirely different sure um but no um yeah i don't know people can have their own opinion of me i know who i am i'm very confident in that i also think it's important when you do something wrong to reflect maybe maybe change some things but um yeah i don't know everyone's entitled to

opinion i can't i can't change that i don't think it's my job to want to change people's opinion i know who i am and i think it's important to accept responsibility for what i've done wrong and yeah do you think you'll would would you come back if they were like you know what he wants he's And three. Is it three? Would you go back to a perfect match? I'm not too sure. I think I'd love to do more shows, maybe something more along the lines of like a challenge show or something.

Okay. Yeah, dating show, I don't know right now. Not really something I'm thinking about. But I was super grateful for the experience. I did have a good time. Yeah, I don't know. Looking back, I also think it's like trippy for me because, and she, I don't know what she has said, but what she told me, like, we actually really did have a good time.

She said that. based on you know how it looks or whatever i understand why people wouldn't think that but i can only speak for myself i actually did have a really good time and obviously there's moments where in any relationship marriage where we aren't our best self and we don't have good days and you know maybe things get out of hand but uh to be honest with you super grateful to do it with her i don't think i could have done it with anybody else um we both said on more than one occasion that if it wasn't for each that we just walk out and not do it. But yeah, super grateful for it.

I don't look at it as like, you know, my God, I won the show that means anything. Obviously, I think the most important thing is to find more within yourself to be successful at a relationship, you know, like a perfect match isn't perfect or it's different for everybody, you know, so. Is there anyone that you got to know while filming perfect match where you felt like they come across better than you remember? Like, based on if I knew them before or just how they are on the show? I'm a big believer, actually, that most people are made to look better than they are

than worse, where a lot of people on reality TV complain about their edit and things like that. And certainly every once in a while. And I know what it's like someone takes a bad beat, takes the L, you know, context is lost. You look like an asshole. But a lot of times, they're, you know, a lot of people are looking, look great, look romantic, look nice, look fun, and they're kind of pricks in person. Yeah, that's fair.

I would say I think Clayton's a really nice guy I think he's taking a lot of heat Yeah we like Clayton In the conversations I had with them And throughout the entire way He was always just super nice to me And super real even after the show

I thought Juliet was really fun She was funny Anyone you weren't a fan of Not really I think I was surprised here as Sandy He said stuff on your podcast or whatever about me.

I don't know. I think you asked something about sensitive or she said something along the lines of, I don't know, something about her and Louis's relationship or Louis acted a certain way because of me or something. And I found that interesting because if anybody knows Louis, Louis is going to just do Louis.

He's not going to listen to what anyone has to say or does. So you felt like she was blaming you for Louis' actions? Well, that's what she said, and that's fine. But I had a good relationship with Sandy. I had a good relationship with everyone on the show. Yeah. And are you dating anyone currently? Yes, I am. You are?

Yeah. Who? I'm going to keep that one a little bit private for now, but it's not. Is she a public figure? She's not. Okay. Yeah. We love a Normie.

We do. We love a Normy. Yeah, I'm actually really excited about it, to be honest. We actually knew each other a long time ago. She's a couple years younger than I am, and yeah, we're from a similar area. sister approve yeah yeah that matters yeah she's great you like you has always been close you and your sister uh yeah well obviously since we filmed the show together we got super close um but yeah no we are definitely value her opinion and the good the bad and the ugly when i do things wrong and right but yeah

has your girlfriend watched perfect match or did she stay uh yeah she she obviously doesn't really you know want to be too much on social media with with what she's seen from the show but um i also was I'm pretty honest about the experience. And yeah. Did she watch the mixer episode? I don't think so. So I think I told her not to watch it. Yeah.

Yeah, he's never seen any of my work. I haven't. I've never watched any of him falling in love and kissing. Yeah, I'm sure that's, I'm sure that's not easy for anyone to see. Well, anything else you want to leave us with? Thanks for coming, man. You know, we weren't really sure what to expect.

You know, we didn't want to drill you too much. I just want to give you an opportunity to kind of hear your side. Yeah, well, hopefully I spoke, you know, well enough. But I'm sorry I was late guys, by the way. Yeah, that was really your biggest effect. Yeah, honestly. I was trying to get that parking meter to work outside. Oh, it's parking mirror.

Listen, honestly, it's like you have these opinions of people on the show, you know, and you don't agree with a lot of things that they do. But then when they come in here and they take accountability and they like everything that you've done, I mean, there's really not much else we can say, you know? it's like when you say like yeah that was fucked up I shouldn't have done that I've grown from that I don't want to make that mistake again and it's like okay well case closed

easy yeah because if you if you do it again your girlfriend is gonna go on TikTok she's like well you know what fucking she'll keep you in check Daniel I really appreciate you taking the time man thank you guys so much for people find you before we let you go where can they follow you bind me on Instagram

Daniel Profetto underscore because someone took my name but Daniel put her TikTok whatever but yeah Scott what about you what about you Scott I'm just Scott VDS 17 on everything so

okay pretty simple are we gonna see you back on reality TV no I put a post up the other day saying I'm retired now but

honestly god knows no love island games no I won't be doing I won't go I won't go and do anything I've already done

and that's one part of the what was more intense for you love island or a perfect match love island 100%

because I held myself to like a much higher standard the shows I've done since like it has been

a little bit of like a messy for me. Do you keep tabs on Love Island? Yeah, well, the UK one, yeah. The US one, I see sort of clips, but I don't really know what's going on. The UK one I've been sort of keeping up to date with. I don't know if you've been watching it.

We have not. Not the UK, the US version. I am, but I'm like on episode 30 out of 65. I don't know if you agree with this. I think the UK one was way better than the US one this year. I fully agree. 100%. And why do you feel like that?

I just feel like the drama was better and and genuine. Yeah, I feel like it was. a little bit more genuine. Last year the US one was definitely better. Our UK season wasn't a good one. But the UK one this year was quite good. I need to finish it but yeah I'm loving. Do you think it's all one of the influencers now?

Do you think that's what it is? Yeah, it's definitely got to that point. America's having its moment now, which we had in like 2019 with Tommy Fiore, Molly May and all that. That was our biggest season. America's having that moment now and you're going to get people who want to come on and do it for fame, do it for influence and stuff. well okay all right guys well thanks for coming absolutely thanks for having me all right well hope you enjoyed that listen i i tried i tried to get him to

admit some things you know tough cookie to pull things out of but he did i mean he took the accountability i guess he was he didn't try to defend himself he did not try to defend himself he did not pull a t s i don't think he fully owned all the things he did no god no But it was kind of like a high level. No, like when you said Lucy was telling us about a scenario where you, you know, wouldn't let her wear like that different outfits or whatever. And he was like, really? Oh, really?

She said that. No, the red receipts. The red receipts. Because I don't need that. Lucy litter was like specifically, he had a problem with me turning off my red receipts. I'm like, oh, do you like the red receipts on? He's like, no, I don't. I've never cared about that.

Literally never cared. I've never cared about that. Oh, okay. sir. Don't protest too much. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Well, that's today's episode. Hope you enjoyed it.

Don't forget to check out our Going Deeper with James Gunn. Next week, we have a great week lined up for you. Our Going Deeper with the Nader Sisters. Stars of Love Thy Nader is next Wednesday. You're going to want to listen to that. It's fun. It's messy. I really think this show is going to be a hit. We have more in store for you as well next week.

Can't wait. Enjoy your weekend. Thank you to our guest, Daniel, and Lucy. I hope their perfect match is waiting for both of them. out there They both They're matched With someone

They're both matched with people Yeah Yeah We wish you well We do And as I reminded Daniel Hey listen We don't care

But if you pull this shit Whatever shit you did Or didn't do Your new girlfriend I'm sure We'll be making TikToks about it If it doesn't work out

Yeah Who the fuck did I date Part 15 We love love Just go on a podcast If you have to make 15 parts You know

They love it And I come back Well, thanks again to our guest, Lucy and Daniel, and thank you, Mint Mobile. Can you imagine something more toxic than jaw-dropping wireless bills and unexpected outages? Stop getting breadcrumb by your wireless provider and find something you can love with Mitt Mobile. With Mint, you can get the coverage and speed you're used to, but for way less money. And for a limited time, Mitt Mobile is offering three months of unlimited premium wireless service for $15 a month. So while your friends are sweating over data overages and surprise charges, you'll be chilling, literally and financially.

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