The WAN Show - I Subscribed To Disney+ - WAN Show August 16, 2024

Episode Date: August 17, 2024

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Every Canadian dairy farm is unique. That's why every farmer takes charge of their own unique environmental farm plan. Also drawing from 57 environmental practices. My plan starts with soil health. And part of mine includes biodiversity. Why care so much? Because Canadian dairy farmers hold themselves to higher standards. That's what's behind the blue cow logo.

Dairy farmers of Canada. What is up everyone? And welcome to the WAN show. We've got a great show lined up for you guys today. Yeah. Oh, ah, okay. There's one bit of bad news. We're gonna talk about this real estate dystopia

Very cool algorithmic pricing means cost of living Basically go up, but this time it's algorithmically also, huh, I Will be eating some humble pie today. We got hacked earlier this week. Control of our Twitter account was lost and it turned out it was my fault. Fortunately, humble pie is delicious. So we're gonna be talking about exactly what happened

and I'm gonna be eating crow, no pie. Pie, not crow. But humble pie. What else we got? I went to Defcon and it was super cool and we're gonna talk about that Eatin' Crow? No, Pie. Pie. Yeah. Not Crow. But Humble Pie. What else we got? I went to Defcon and it was super cool. We're gonna talk about that because it's like actually cool and interesting.

That's the badge. Yeah, this badge is crazy. It has a Game Boy emulator on it. Super cool. What else we got? You know, we were sitting here for 45 minutes and Google's team pixel program changed to require influencers to be biased towards Google. I didn't think you were going to bring up your phishing.

I thought you were going to avoid it. So that was going to be one of my topics. No, I'm not avoiding it. I'm meeting it head on. I encourage people to come out and talk about being exploited, being hacked, and being open about it. So the only thing that I can do to salvage any kind of scrap of pride at this point is practice what I preach and go into it completely kimono open.

Here's everything that happened. All right, so here comes the kimono's coming off. Ha ha ha ha! Band on Twitch. The show is brought to you today by Corsair, Squarespace Bridge, and of course our chair partner Secret Lab. Why don't we jump right into our headline topic for today, which I forget what it is. What was it again? You getting fished?

Disney. Disney. Oh, we didn't even have that as a headline topic. Right? We got to jump right into that. This is crazy. This is crazy. Okay, a 42-year-old woman died after an allergic reaction eating at a restaurant at Disney World

Resort's Disney Springs in October 2023. She was highly allergic to dairy and nuts. The restaurant was chosen because they advertise the accommodation of persons with food allergies as a top priority Okay, a lawsuit was then filed in February of 2024 by her husband for damages of more than $50,000 this was a wrongful death suit now Okay, that kind of makes sense because if you say hey like I'm allergic to this and they're like hey No problem. We got you There are there is some fine print. I think many menus will actually have a disclaimer where even if the server says hey like yeah Sure, there's no there's no nuts in that. There's always the chance of these things that this chance across contamination. However

From the article that I read on this seems to suggest so take this for what it is, seems to suggest that there was a substantial amount of what she was allergic to in the dish. Okay, so this is where things go completely off the rails and is what pushed this to the top of our subreddit earlier this week. Disney filed a motion in May alleging that the husband, okay, so not not the woman who died, the husband accepted a forced arbitration agreement when signing up for Disney Plus in 2019. They also seem to be under the impression that they agreed to an arbitration clause when purchasing tickets to Disney World. The husband's legal team argues that the Disney terms were made effectively invisible. Disney put the link to its terms of use within

another link on the agreement page when you sign up for Disney Plus, and neither of these agreements were necessary. They were never forced to read them to eat at the restaurant because, get this, you don't need to buy tickets in order to access Disney Springs. This is wild. Oh yeah. This reminds me of who was it? This is dystopian as hell. Who, who was it? Who?

Hold on. I'm going to look it up. I'm going to look it up. The soft drink hitman. Yeah. Yep. Yep. I'm going to look it up.

I think it was Coke. Um, Yeah. Yeah, the Coke coke the coke death squads, okay where their defense their defense for this was not We didn't we didn't contract kill people. That was not the defense. The defense was Here in the US you cannot Pursue us for this because it happened outside of your jurisdiction. Yeah.

I mean, I thought the whole EULA thing was kind of settled where they're in a- It's not at all super enforceable. Where they're in this gray area where like as long as everything makes sense within all of the other laws that exist for all the good reasons that they exist, then yeah, you are effectively agreeing not to use the, I don't know, team viewer for terrorism or you know, whatever else the case

may be, right? Like there are certain things within an end user license agreement that do make sense because they're for the protection of intellectual property holders, for the protection of the general public, they're for the greater good. And they're things that you would kind of expect. However, for me to agree, not just to a forced arbitration clause over some issue that I have with the Disney Plus service, because that I could see. somebody were to say for example

Watch some show on Disney Plus and they were to get inspired to shoot John Lennon Who knows right if if if Lenin's if Yoko Ono, okay, we're getting a little off the rails here But if Yoko Ono comes after Disney and goes, okay, you're liable for the shooting of my husband. I can't, well wait, cause did she sign up for Disney Plus? The point is, if you are a user of the service and the issue that you have with the service is related to the service, then okay, no problem.

But if, oh man, I'm trying to come up with a parallel here because this is mind blowing. Okay, so let's take our company. What if it's like. No, let's take our company. Okay. Okay, let's say for example, that you sign up for Flowplain, okay?

So that's our video streaming service where you can get early access to some of our videos, including Scrapyard Wars. You can also get extras for some of our videos, including Scrapyard Wars. I'm not saying you should sign up for Float Plan, I'm just saying. It's got good stuff. But let's say as part of our agreement, we've got, okay, yeah, there's a forced arbitration clause because if for whatever reason, there's a billing error, okay? And you say, I was, it put undue mental strain on me that I was double billed that one month because of an administrative error and I'm seeking $50,000 in pain and suffering damages or whatever else. We basically are going like, look,

our entire agreement with you, our entire agreement with you is over like tens of dollars. This is gonna go to arbitration. You waive your ability to like, make a file it, no not super, but basically a nonsense lawsuit. Like, I can understand that protection being in place. I actually don't know that we have

a forced arbitration clause, do we? Do you even know? I don't think so, I don't know. Okay, well anyway. I haven't read the terms of float planes in many years. The point is, let's say you sign up for float plane, okay? And let's say we have this clause for, you know, maybe some kind of reasonable reason.

But then, you go to LTX, you go to a whale land, okay? But then you go to LTX, you go to a whale land, okay? And we have a gigantic Elijah head that is suspended from the ceiling, okay? Because we think that's funny as fuck for some reason. I mean, it would be, right? It would be kind of funny. If we had a giant Elijah head. It would be pretty funny.

Oh man, what if you had a Whac-A-Mole game and it was Elijah wearing helmets? Thank you, but this is very off topic. Yeah, I like it though. Okay So we have an Elijah whack-a-mole game Okay, and you like hit yourself in the face with you get well No, cuz that's on you you get stuck in the machine you get a staff an LTT staff Tells you to go inside the machine and the machine and you get Elijah whacked to death. You get whacked.

Okay. That's pretty whack. To imagine for- Why are we so far off the rails? Like if you never signed a liability release to ride the Elijah Whacker, wait. Okay, this is starting to get a little weird. The point is that if you never signed a release. What if we just do a direct thing? You ate food there, whatever.

It doesn't matter. The point is if you never signed a specific release for that, if you never consented to anything to do, what does your agreement, even though it's the same organization, actually it isn't because Float Plane is not even the same entity. It doesn't matter. The point is this is insane. This is completely insane. And honestly, I think you and I have had this conversation where like, I remember talking to you about this and I was just like yeah you

know what the legal system needs it needs like a like a common sense filter we've we know so there's like an intervention layer that basically looks at something and goes hey proactively the s detector you know what maybe maybe the law doesn't account for this but we need to get some legislation fast-tracked to deal with this because this obviously makes no sense. Like this is such a bad faith argument that I don't know I don't know how Disney's lawyers can sleep at night. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. I mean, we've had a conversation when we were when we were doing the legal agreements for Float

Plane and a couple other things that we have. We did have conversations because the external contractor legal team that we had handed us like the most legal-ies thing on the planet. And I remember, this was many years ago, but I remember you and I looking at it and being like, this just sucks. Cause it's like impossible to tell what they're trying to say.

So we had to get them to do multiple rounds of like, simple this down, make it easier to understand. And even then, just to be completely honest, ours isn't the best I've ever seen. I've seen some that are like very easy to understand, really, really well laid out, but you have to work with lawyers to get it there. And they don't want to do that.

They want it to be difficult to understand because then it stands up legally like more, which is annoying. I hate that. Jared So there's a few things here. So, alt-okers in floatplane chat says that's what judges are supposed to do, but that's not actually true. Judges are in charge of sentencing and they can interpret the law, but they don't get to look at the letter of the law and go, I don't like that law, it doesn't make any sense. If there is a basis, if there's an argument that has a strong basis in law, they can't ignore it, right? Like,

that's not the judge's role. It's legislators who create laws. Judges just interpret them. And MR Vaney says, term says it covers any disputes with the Walt Disney Company. And that may be true. But what I'm saying is that that's crazy. There is another point here. And this is a really good one from Papo Daca that says, Disney doesn't run that restaurant either. Okay, so I don't actually know if that's true, but it's a really interesting point because here's my problem with that. When you license your name, you are collecting money, you are collecting revenue for granting

the trust that is associated with your name. Because otherwise, the name being on the restaurant wouldn't have any value. I'm eating at it because I trust Boston pizza or Subway or whatever. Here's a question on that topic. You just mentioned Subway. Subway is a franchise system, right?

So if you eat at Subway and you get some, I don't know, crazy food poisoning thing or something that you could sue for, let's just imagine there's something you could sue for. Do you sue the franchise owner of that building or do you sue Subway? So what I s- I don't, I don't know the specific answer for Subway. What I suspect is that there are various agreements depending on who you are franchising from, and depending what exactly the agreement is there, it also probably depends on exactly what happened. If you followed

process that was handed down to you by the, I don't want to call it a parent company, they're not a parent company, by the brand, by the brand owner company, and something went wrong anyway, then I think that's kind of between you and them but it might end up being a chain of lawsuits or Because subway is a bigger better known target with more money. I could see how if someone did encounter, you know Get poisoned at that restaurant. So for example I could see why they would go after the bigger more obvious target without necessarily even considering that they're also probably the better protected one from a legal standpoint,

because they probably deal with this kind of thing all the time. But my point is that you can't have it both ways. You can't hide behind, oh, well, I mean, we weren't even running the restaurant, but then also benefit from your name being put on. You have to take some responsibility for it. I mean, I remember having this conversation

with a YouTuber who famously got into the fast food business a couple of years ago, where I basically said, yeah, I don't know, good for you, but we've never done anything that you can ingest. And the reason for that is that I am deeply, I tend to be pretty conservative when it comes to business risk and liability. And I am deeply concerned that compared to almost anything else we do, like a shirt, or even water bottles, actually, we talked about them a lot before we move forward with them.

Yeah, a backpack. What's the worst that can go wrong, right? Compared to anything we do, something that someone ingests has the maximum ceiling for what can go wrong. It could kill them. And even if I'm not liable, even if I'm not found culpable for it, because it's like a ghost kitchen or whatever,

do I wanna think about that? No, I don't. There's a lot of decisions we've made actually, including the Float Plane VPN thing, where it's like, yeah, we just don't really wanna think about this problem at a certain point like we can do it we could have made some type of food product for sure sure there's even want to do there's food products that I'd be pretty interested in making yeah like I think

you know how much I love breakfast cereal I've I've recommended you make cereal multiple times I know I know but like am I a lot of risk with it dude am I gonna be on the factory floor? Yeah, exactly. Am I gonna know if there's toenail clippings in it? The factory floor probably won't even be in this country. Yeah, I mean realistically. Yeah. I don't know. I mean actually I don't know, like green products? There's a lot of green here. No, I think, like where does uh, where the, uh, where does like General Mills make cereal? Where is General Mills make cereal?

Where is General Mills based out of? Headquarters in Minneapolis. All right, yeah, they make Cheerios in North America. Okay, yeah, there you go. Maybe that's a thing. Yeah, maybe that's a thing. Maybe that's a thing. Because I can't imagine shipping basically air and wheat.

Yeah, I just automatically assumed it's a product. It's made somewhere else. Yeah, no, we have a lot of wheat production. But yeah, we do, we we do so that kind of makes sense Anyway in summary I don't like it Yeah, yeah, all right. It's bad. All right unsubscribe. Yeah Well, I mean you've already signed it. Yeah after you unsubscribe. I don't think I don't think that helps I mean, I still would anyways sure but I But, I mean, you do whatever you want.

Yeah, f*** them. Do you really need to watch Mulan that badly? Probably not. There's this whole thing going on with Disney right now where they're losing the war for kids attention. Like, the main viewers of Disney right now are millennials, not kids. Really?

And like, if you look at- Interesting. Is that why Inside Out 2 killed it? Because, hold on, think about it, think about it. Riley, in the film, is what, 13? I'm not sure. I think she's 13, because she's going into high school. She's either 12 or 13. Yeah, we're getting there, we're getting there. So, if I am at the at the the leading edge of Millennials I am in my early 40s right now if I had kids at 28 which is Was a more normal age back then because now people are just not at all and if they do at all

It's like well into their 30s But if I had kids at 28 all of a sudden my kids are around Riley's age Dude, is this just a bunch of Millennials taking the young families to see it probably? Am I a textbook case Luke? Did they case study me because I took my kids to see Inside Out 2. You're probably part of it They've apparently even been making certain changes to the parks to cater to Millennials more because Millennials without kids are currently the main demographic of people going to Disney parks and actually spending considerable money while they're

there, because it's childless Millennials that like can afford it, because if you have kids in your Millennial, you probably can't afford anything So it's really interesting and like they're you say water they're losing a lot of They're losing a lot of viewership to YouTube effectively Yeah, I don't remember what her name is but there's some lady that does something on YouTube that is getting like incredible amounts of views for like kid content Sure someone so I'm only who knows I know but like they're miss Rachel Yeah, someone probably. Who knows, I don't know. But like they're, Miss Rachel, yeah, someone in chat immediately knew what I was talking about. But yeah, Miss Rachel's her name.

There's a bunch of other kids content that's just like exploding, Coco-Mellon, stuff like that. Disney is not super in the picture right now when it comes to kids content. One day ago? Yeah, yeah. Are you kidding me right now when it comes to kids content one day ago yeah yeah are you kidding me right now yeah this chick owns kids YouTube content owns it a

hundred forty seven million views in four months what even is happening right now yeah yeah she's closing in on a billion views on this. I find this interesting. Yeah. Like thumbnail logic stuff, right? She advertises the time of the video as an element of her thumbnail. Uh-huh. So like, I want my kid to leave me alone for an hour. For 35 minutes. Yeah. That is 50 minutes hilarious 60 minutes 85 minutes one hour and it's just it's it's super safe dude she collab with sesame Yesterday are you kidding me? You know what Slay Queen she's killing it absolutely yeah, all right like I don't know anything about her for all I know she eats babies Yeah, that's why she makes videos for them, but I don't know her. I'm not saying she does do that

I'm just saying I don't know her all I know is that she's actually mind-bogglingly successful But she seems pretty beating Disney seems pretty wholesome on the surface. So, yeah, Slay. She's a teacher, apparently. Yeah, not anymore. I mean, still, but I just mean not at a school anymore. Unless she also still is. She might.

Yep. Just because she might just. That's crazy. I gotta tell ya, I don't really see, I don't really see the I don't really see the, I can't tell the difference between the kids content that works and the kids content that doesn't work.

But yeah, I'm sure she's doing great. Anyway, point is- As far as my understanding goes, a oddly high percentage of Miss Rachel's success has been word of mouth. Because all the parents are telling each other, like my kid really likes this one, also I've like watched some of it, it seems really safe.

I've overheard conversations of parents telling other parents about Miss Rachel. And then what, is she just like less annoying than Blippi? So, win? Maybe, yeah, I don't know. I don't know anything about Blippi, but. Someone in Float Plane Chat, I have no idea if this is true, someone in Float Plane Chat said the studio that owns Blippi, but Someone in flow play chat. I have no idea if this is true someone in flow playing chat said the studio that owns Blippi was

Sold for three billion dollars Wow Freaking wild dudes, okay, oh Sick yeah Harlem shake plus Blippi Luke watch later. I don't think we need a piece of cake to bake a pretty cake Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha Blippi and was part of a three billion dollar acquisition by Disney. Oh, Disney bought it. Because they're trying to fight for kids. They're trying to get the kid viewership. That's crazy.

Oh, man. Wait, what? They made $17 million and sold for $3 billion? Oh, man. I don't know, dude. What? Was part of a three billion dollar acquisition All right anyway, yeah man

I If I remember back in the day like looking at some aspect like have you seen any of the weird like Russian channels? Like Russian like one of the biggest channels in the world is like as far as I can tell just these Russian kids that are being exploited for views on YouTube like it's probably Frickin wild I'm not saying that cuz they're Russian I'm saying that cuz like there's a lot of kids that are exploited for views on YouTube. It's just a thing Yeah, 100% Yeah, anyway, I I remember looking at stuff like that as I was sort of like going through like top channels by country and like

I just see these just Explosive view counts. I'm sitting here going Dude we do so much work To reach like a million people Because just frankly not that many people care about how many platters are in a hard drive or like whatever the shit is We're talking about like yeah, and I could I so I could just I could just do I could sing songs I taught swim lessons Teaching swim. I think that's almost like there's a fishy in the middle and he can't get out. No, he can't get out No, he can't get out. Don't eat the thermal paste

Subscribed dude, I would watch it I can't even sing on tune! Let's go! Subscribed, dude. I would watch it. You would get an amount of people that would subscribe and watch. Dude, and like so many of these songs are just like, what's the term, public domain and stuff?

Oh yeah, totally, a lot of kids songs are. Dude, whatever, I could make up songs about Sherlock Holmes. Who's also public domain? Okay, probably not for kids. See, this is why I can't handle it. I think I'd get bored. Moriarty and the... Nuck? Sherlock Holmes in the case of the stolen pinkie or something? Oh my goodness.

It was in the power supply! Mom opened it and then... Unfortunately, Mom isn't around anymore. The stories of hard times. Explaining difficult things to children. I would not tune into your channel. Good. That's right.

Um, alright. Anyway, speaking of fishies in the middle. Ah, the segue. Uh, I got fished. Yeah. Basically, I think the, so the so okay earlier this week actually I will man last weekend so almost almost an entire week ago. We were having a pool party at our place Make his advertise said Luke's channel is the one you get if you leave YouTube on autoplay. Oh

Yeah, that's way too real play oh yeah that's way too real angel now and came back to earth as Elsa Elsa's building a computer she beats spider-man I want to go home and start filming this immediately anyway we were having a pool party and I got an email that basically was like someone logged into your Twitter account From some IP address in Russia. Okay, so I'm gonna I'm gonna interject as you go through this Yeah, but you're referring to as Russia is in fact Russia plus yeah, exactly. Well, or as I've taken to calling it Russia plus Turkey Russia plus Ukraine. Wait, sorry Carry on. So did you do all of this on your phone?

So, no. Okay, so you got the alert and then you ran to your computer? I did. Okay, okay. And basically it dropped me on a page that was like, hey, reset your password. And it's one of those things where I like to think, I like to think that I am better than this, for real.

I like to think that I can do better than this. I know better than to click a link in an email. You navigate to the site manually and reset your password that way. So this is the, so John Hammond, he's a YouTuber who does hacking and security content. I shared some of the details in the email with him and then he did this like really sick deep dive. Yeah. So I'm going to kind of go along with your story with with breadcrumbs that John

Hammond has. So this is, this is actually just the screenshot from you. So this is the email that was sent to Linus. It shows like the location being Russia, which for most people is gonna instantly click as something is very wrong. It says that this account has logged in, and then there's a link to secure your account now. And then when you clicked that link, it would have brought you here. Here we go, yep, right here.

So that's how they got the password. And then once I entered it. Here's a quick question. When you entered it, did it say that it was wrong? Uh, I don't think so. Don't remember. Because when John Hammond was poking through the site, he found that it will automatically tell you that you entered it wrong

because they can't actually check. Yeah. So they tell you it's wrong so that if you did actually enter it wrong, you'll hopefully correct it. Interesting. And they're just trying to gather as much info as they can. That's possible, that's possible. But like the thing is, they caught me at exactly the wrong moment. And that's what I was about to say,

because like I'd like to think that I'm better than this and smarter than this. But I had just lit the grill. It was hot. I was supposed to go and get food to put on it. There was kind of no one else to do that. It was kind of Yvonne's event. And so I didn't want her to have to cook.

And so I was like, I was Russian. Thanks. And I was like okay well I just need to get this locked down nothing else matters other than just like getting it locked down I don't ultimately I think part of it is I I don't really care about the Twitter account. I think there's a combination of things going on so yeah distracted time pressure from the barbecue yep there's a combination of things going on. So, distracted time pressure from the barbecue. There's the don't care as much about the Twitter account. Like I've had multiple conversations in the last six months

about just not bothering with it anymore. We don't get a ton of engagement there compared to Instagram, compared to TikTok. Our social team has mostly been redistributed within the company anyway, because we're looking at it going, what is the ROI here exactly? Like tweets?

Yeah. And Twitter has been a big part of that because it just doesn't move the needle for us. We can tweet about a new video and we'll get like four referrals. Like okay, why are we even bothering with this? So the last one, which I think you mentioned at one point in time publicly, was that with the YouTube hack, there was some takeaways, and one of the takeaways was act quickly. So I think taking those things combined,

it was a bit of a perfect storm. Sorry, keep going. Yeah, so basically the next thing it prompted me for was my my 2FA which If I thought about it, no, I don't need my 2FA To reset my password because it should just go to my email to reset my password. So what started happening was At some point I I made it to my desktop. I don't know if it was

Sorry, I'm gonna I'm gonna timeline us a little bit. Sure. So this is the page. You're not on your screen. Sorry. This is the page that you would have gotten after you entered it one time. So maybe that is where I went to desktop then.

Cause I don't remember exactly. Like it was happening really fast. Yeah, yeah. There's a couple, okay, actually I'll go into ways that you could have figured out that it was wrong, actually, once we're done. So this page comes up, and then the two-factor page comes up, which... Yes.

I'll find that, you keep talking. Yeah, so basically, I'm not gonna get into too many details because that's, you can tell, I'm fuzzy on it. I was distracted and I was in the middle of something. But what started to happen was I started to get real password reset things that I was also doing mixed in with some of the fake stuff. And that's where I got really confused. Because I would get a real password reset email, but like it wouldn't work. But then that's so

confusing because it was clearly still tied to my email by that point. Because that real password reset email was probably the hacker setting things over, but those emails are still going to you. That makes sense. I never really thought about that. So long story short, I got disconfubulated and I guess it happens to me once every eight years.

That's the last time I got phished. When's the last? Oh wait, not eight years ago. No, the last time, the last time I got bamboozled into clicking something on an email was the last time I lost control of the LTT channel. Oh, that's really old. That's older than eight years ago. Yeah. Hold on a second. I'm going to find out when it was. I think that's closer to like 12 or 13. In the meantime, why don't you walk us through this and all the ways that this really, this hurts, right? Because I know very well, I know better. If you sat me down and told me, I'm going to give you a security test, and you asked me, hey, if you get a password

or a email, should you click the link? I'd be like, no. Yeah. No, you should navigate to the site manually. I've even heard you say this before just to back you up so first off if you really want like hold on a second while you're while you're hosting this part you're gonna eat a humble pie I'm gonna bring out a special treat for the show this is my humble pie which was meant to be a surprise for my co-host that I will be

that I will be eating humble pie on the show today. Well, you announced it earlier in the show. But I also talked about it earlier on the show now. So I'm gonna get this going, A, because I deserve this, B, because it's the right thing to do. When something like this happens, the best defense we have is to own it,

publicly own it, use it as a teachable moment, so that hopefully someone else will avoid a similar attack. And reason number three, cause I'm actually really hungry and I could really use some pie right now. I've actually had kind of a hard week. Nice, nice. Do you want some pie?

I assume not, but I should offer it. Dan, would you like some pie? Yeah, sure. I thought you were gonna just eat the whole thing on Wanshow. No, yours doesn't have to be humble. Yours can be just blueberry pie. Oh, I see. Only mine's humbleberry pie. I mean, I can go leak the Twitter account again if you want, and I can have some pie? No, that would be stupid pie.

Malicious pie. Yeah, yeah, yeah. 3.14, I fired. 3.14. No unemployment insurance pie. Yeah, yeah. If you want the best public breakdown of this, there's a couple, but if you want the best one,

I would check out the phishing website that hacked Linus Tech Tips video from John Hammett that he posted two days ago. I'm not going to play it for the stream because you should check that out. What I will go through a little bit though is his Twitter thread, which is also a good breakdown of events, but not as good as his video. His video has extra little tidbits, including a conversation that John Hammond had with the person who did this to you. Oh, nice. That's included in the YouTube video. So you should

go check that out. Tell him he's a that out. It's a really interesting conversation. John Hammond was quite diplomatic about it, I think, in an attempt to try to get more information, but didn't get a ton of information, but there's an interesting back and forth that happens, including some like, you should go watch it. It's really good. Dan, I I

Went I fell just short of putting this in a blender But I think they heated this up or something because it's falling apart. That's okay. My mouth does that anyway. Here's your pie Okay, so I'm gonna go somewhat through this Twitter thread Okay, so I'm going to go somewhat through this Twitter thread. This we can't see in this screenshot, but the sender email or the from for this email was like x-login.com or something. Can I interrupt for a moment? Can I interject? The email you're referring to as x-something.com is...

Sorry. referring to as xsomething.com is, sorry, no. I don't remember exactly when it happened anymore, but at some point in the interest of simplifying the UI, mobile mail clients stopped showing the email address by default. There's a lot of things about this. When did this happen? When did that happen?

Cause it was years ago. And why? Yeah, I don't know, probably space savings like couldn't condensing things. I remember thinking it was stupid back then. And I, I own part of the stupidity. I hold on, let me get my humble pie. Let me get my humble pie. I own part of the stupidity here. But can that not be a thing? Like, why is that a thing that would have definitely helped because I would have seen that it would have been front and center hold on hold on I'm also gonna get that date for you of the previous the the YouTube one from way back yeah I literally think it was like 12 years ago or 13 years ago but yeah okay all right carry- Okay, all right, carry on, carry on Luke's laptop.

The from, which isn't on screen right now, but the from was info at x-logincheck.com. So that's your first, if you check that, that's your first flag that something's going wrong. There's a couple other things that are wrong with the email, but it's gonna be really hard for you to be able to tell. This is not an exact carbon copy of X's actual, we noticed a login. It's pretty close, but it is different. But if you highlight over this secure

your X account now, that's the next kind of somewhat easy tell that this is wrong because the link that I went to is this one this u45827238.ct.sendgrid.net and then it wasn't an x.com domain so that's that's another giveaway once we get to the This page, there's a few things wrong with this page already. Old password is a little bit weird. All these links at the bottom aren't actually links. That was a fun one that was figured out is that these don't go anywhere. They're just text that you can highlight with your mouse. They don't do anything. And this like old password, new password, new password is kind of a weird way of writing this out. This is like kind of a weird English way of doing this. Also, some of the UI design just like doesn't feel 100% right, but it's not super obvious. It's just... Thanks for throwing that in for me. It's just a little, it's a little weird. Moving forward, he like looks into the,

this is really interesting. He looks into the actual code, figures out how things actually work, finds the API requests, different things like that, finds that the comments are all in Turkish, does some more poking around. Where is the login failed? Here it is.

Okay, here's the next one. When your first login fails, every login that you do here is not real. When it actually works, it just offboards you to X's actual website because it's like, whatever, we have nothing to do with you anymore. But after the first time you put in your data, it's going to ask you to do it again, and it's going to say that it's wrong at this point in time You've already given them your information like it your I don't think you've given them your two-factor at this point But you're already kind of screwed things that stand out here though Even if this image loads

I think the reason why this image didn't load at the time was because the account was set to private So I think when you get it the image would have loaded to be clear just didn't load for John Hammond private. So I think when you get it, the image would have loaded to be clear. Just didn't load for John Hammond. This change password button, actually going flush against this bottom line is probably not something that developers would have done there, but also look at things like this. Your old password is incorrect space, comma space, please double check it. No punctuation. Nice. Little things like that can, can tip you off that something's going wrong.

I don't know if he has the screenshots of it in this thread. I know it's in the Video but when it asks for the two-factor code, yeah, it it says to fac It doesn't yeah, I don't think it's in here day Interesting, but he has it in the video. Yeah, but the, the text for the two factor is like pretty bad. Um, cause it just says like two fact and it's, it's all written oddly. Um, but really like the easiest way to get around this stuff and then, and an automatic default, and you should apply this to a lot of different scenarios,

not just potentially fishy emails. Um, is when you're warned about something like this, like if your bank calls you and they're like, oh my goodness, something terrible has happened. Tell me what number I can call you back at. No. Yeah. And then you check it.

Then you Google the number. You can check it if you want, but you just Google the number and call them anyways. You don't, you never call the one that they tell you on the phone. Unless you Google it. And it matches perfectly. And it matches, yeah. Or like, sorry, extension is what I would ask. Okay, yeah, extension makes sense. Because you need to be able to get back in touch with the person, obviously, but you

don't talk to them yet. Yeah, don't talk to them on the phone. You want to be the person who reached out, and you want to be able to verify the contact that you're going to reach out to them at through entirely your own methods. Don reach out to them at through entirely your own methods. Don't listen to them telling you to Google a specific thing in order to find them. Don't don't do any of that stuff. Find it completely on your own. In this case, what you do is, oh, there's a weird breach with my ex account. Close that email, load up the app if you're on your phone or go to the ex website directly yourself, so stop and then reset it that way.

This is one of the things that really screwed me here. I'm not logged into that account on any of my devices. Not a single one. So sorry, I want to point this out really quick. Someone in the full plane chat said, you don't even trust that the caller ID is valid. That is true. You can absolutely fake caller ID. Don't trust it at all, no matter what it is, and then find another way to reach back out. So if I had been logged in to my Twitter account, I would have just used the app to sign out all other sessions. Yeah, but I wasn't. Yeah.

What what threw me off was that you had said that you didn't click anything in the email. So I didn't think I did. I didn't think it was phishing. So I was trying to figure out like what the heck would have happened because from my perspective, I'm trying to think about like, okay. I mean, the first thing everyone assumes I'm at Defcon was it me, right? But I can rule that out pretty quick because nothing weird is happening to my stuff. And if they got into any of my things, why would they go after the X account? It's like one of the

least valuable things I have access to. There is so many bad things that could be done. Like that doesn't make any sense to me. So, okay. So I rule that out pretty quick. You say you didn't click on a link. Okay. So I rule out phishing. Turns out it was phishing, but I rule out phishing at the time. Then I'm trying to figure out, okay, if they got into like our password manager, again, why would they go after Twitter or X or whatever? It's like, it's, it's oddly low value compared to the other things that they would able to get if they had these other potential attack vectors. So I came down to assuming, poor Sammy, I came down to assuming that like Sammy logged into the account from a personal

computer that was compromised or something. Cause I was like, that's really the only route I can think of that would have worked for this. And my brain is just completely on fire trying to figure out like, what the heck, how did this happen? And then I think it was John Hammond reached out and was like, Hey, it kind of looks like it's fishing. And he pointed out a few reasons why. And then I think it was John Hammond reached out and was like, hey, it kind of looks like it's phishing. And he pointed out a few reasons why. And then these are, again, things that wouldn't have been super obvious in the moment,

but are ways that he was able to verify that it was a phishing email later. So one, this Android thing is not an Android version. So that's interesting. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He also noticed when he did get emailed by them that the Android version changed. So he thinks it's just like a random number or something,

not entirely sure. And then if you look up the x login account device email thing or or make it happen somehow, it is a little bit different. So he could he was able to verify that it was a phishing email there so I looked back into it and I had Linus send me the email and then oh yeah okay. I realized before I even click send to you that I was done. Absolutely was like, oh crap. Absolutely wrecked. Yeah. Someone asked how many followers does the Linus Tech Twitter account have? They could just want exposure. Sure. But again, if they had any of these other methods, why

just take the X account? If you had our password manager, you could take the X account, you take the Instagram account, you take the YouTube, and then hit all of them at the same time. Just taking the S account is pretty low value if you have actually breached things that we have. But it makes sense that if it would be a phishing account, but yeah, I don't know. So yeah, that's the phishing topic. Nice. Be vigilant, watch yourselves.

Always vigilant. Yeah. Yep. And check out John Hammond's video because it's fantastic. Yep. Alright, apparently it's time for us to do some merch messaging. No, it's not. It's not.

I don't know what it's time for. Go up to the fishing topic at the very top. There's this. Oh, uh, oh, then announce. Oh yeah, hey. Yeah. Oh yeah, we have, do you wanna go to the thing? Sure.

So, do I have to read, all right, you know what? I can't, if you want. No, no, no, no, no, hold on, let me get some of the pie. Get some of the humble pie. Eating the humble pie. What better way to commemorate Linus getting got than with a limited edition t-shirt and hoodie? These are print to order, so yeah.

These are mock-ups of what the design will look like, but you guys know we do a great job of our merch Got fish Is it the whale and whale but without the jewelry yeah, which we know a whale is not a fish calm down Yeah, yeah designed by Sarah. These are a reminder to always be vigilant about the emails you receive clearly it can happen to the tech tippiest of us thank you for that team but the best part is we are donating all of the profits from the shirt and hoodie to the electronic frontier foundation a nonprofit which defends internet civil

liberties that says Luke should be able to talk more about the org since he picked it. They are now available at lmg.gg.gov. If you Google EFF, you're probably not going to get the EFF that we're talking about. So Electronic Frontier Foundation. Yeah. So look that up, not the acronym. But yeah, they seem pretty cool to me. I don't know a huge amount about them, but they have like three different parts of their organization. I don't remember them exactly. One of them is a legal base

where they try to jump in on certain trials and help in whatever kind of way benefits civil liberties for people, because their biggest thing is, I don't remember what they call it, but it's where they try to jump in on cases where like precedent is being set. Cool.

And they try to make sure that the right precedent is being set in these cases. They also develop things. So if I remember correctly, it's like privacy badger or something is made by them, which is cool. And there's other stuff that they do. That's that's cool as well. We were trying to pick a like Kind of somewhat hacker centric

Organization, so thought this made sense cool. Yep So we're gonna we're gonna turn this L into a W as best we can While you're on the store this week, we've actually got some pretty exciting new products. Oh my goodness, they've got a whole thing for me. Okay, so first of all, Scribe Drivers, which I wish we'd called the write-off, but hey, the name is done, the packaging is printed. We're going to the Linus Cam.be drivers our pens that are made out of failed screwdriver shafts from our original supplier that kind of jerked us around screwed us over I think that's the word I was looking for they are not knurled

enough for a screwdriver but they are knurled enough for a wonderful little writing implement with a cool bolt action, pen action, so you guys can check that out. We've got 10,000 in stock, which is a lie, because we actually have... Oh, yesterday before end of the workday we were already on 50% of that. Yeah, I know. Hold on, hold on, hold on. 60% or something? Let me check, let me check. So if you guys are wanting to get in on this shipment of Scribe Driver, you might want to move pretty fast, because we've already sold through 6200 of them, and we restocked them yesterday a little before noon, I think.

So cool. Yeah, go check it out. It takes standard, it takes standard ink things from, what are their names again? LMG.GG slash pen here you go Where is it? Yeah Parker G to refills These have been really popular reviewed really well From our first shipment people are friggin loving this thing to carry the refills No, I don't think so because people could just like order them from Amazon or wherever.

Like uh, maybe, maybe not, I don't know. And you can use whatever you want. Yeah, like that's the thing, right? That was kind of the whole point is we're not selling you a subscription for a pen, we're just selling you a pen and you can put whatever refills, whatever color, whatever it is you like. I'm just thinking if I want this pen long term, I might buy the pen and some refills whatever color whatever whatever it is you like if I want this pen Long-term yeah, I might buy the pen and some refills I know thing but then we have to like find a supplier for refills and stuff. You're not you're not wrong

I the team knows yeah, yeah, they're they're working on it, but either way you can get refills from wherever you want cool Oh apparently we changed the print on the boxes from gloss black to white to make it read a bit more easily anyway, it's available with a brass or stainless steel accent and Enjoy the bigger one is guys the laptop bag The laptop bag is finally here have you actually been hands-on with it yet never Genuinely not once which which terrifies me, because he always uses this as a way for me to show it off, and I don't know what I'm doing every time.

He's the worst Vanna ever. Yep. And I kind of love it about it. It's just so awesome. Here it is. Oh, it's full of stuff. Meet the off-site. We're going to the loot cam.

Oh, okay. Here we go. Oh yeah. It's an off- storage reference, ha ha, or offsite work reference. I mean, I wasn't involved in the naming on this one. At least it's better than what we normally do, which is, which would have been laptop bag.

Laptop bag. Yeah, so you know what? Baby steps, baby steps. Anywho, we're going to the loot cam. Even though it looks like one, it is not a sleeve. It holds way more and already wants us to zip the laptop pocket open. Which is the one on your left. The one by the little handle.

Sorry, I was inspecting the zippers for a second. Okay, so first, you've got a laptop pocket. It opens up way deeper than that, sir. Oh no, that one doesn't. No, no, no, the other one does. Sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry. First you get the laptop pocket, which is lined in microswade, and is divided into two sections. One, where most laptops will fit, and then the other is a snud pocket for smaller laptops and devices.

Okay, he wants you to zip the laptop pocket back up. Wow, Artie's got all these instructions and everything. Direct instructions. He knows both of you very well. He works for Creator Warehouse now, our old social lead. Okay, but then you unzip the primary storage compartment. No one can see what you're doing, Luke, God. How do I even?

Unzip the primary storage compartment, okay? You gotta unzip it all the way. And there's a pocket for just about all of your smaller electronics and accessories. Dude, this is crazy. Like the number of laptop sleeves and stuff that don't have a place to hold a charger is absolute madness to me.

That's the mouse pocket. Okay. It's the big one. This one? So you can hold a real charger. You can hold a real freakin charger Anyway, we're supposed to highlight the laptop charger pocket the mouse pocket Okay, cuz like we understand we understand and respect that you need to carry a mouse. We've got our cable loops There's a microswade tablet sleeve so you can carry a tablet around with you as well and we even have a hidden air tag pocket. Did you catch for the oh yeah. I only knew that was there

because he showed me before the show. Nice. But this thing which could hold a scribe driver you can like roll that away and then fit it in in there. Best thing about it is everything's in sight everything's easy to reach no rummaging around inside your bag and then there's a smaller pocket at the front. That was just a lot bigger of a book than I expected. Heck yeah. There's a smaller pocket at the front, you can close it, for like your passport or wallet or any other small objects. Oh whoa, there's individual little sleevey things in here as well. Yeah, heck yeah. Heck yeah. So I've seen a lot of people commenting that it's really expensive.

It's like, yes. Do you know how much those YKK zippers cost? Do you know how much all these pockets and all of this construction costs? I don't make the rules. It's one of those conversations we've had a lot of times. Expensive versus overpriced. Yes, it's expensive.

No, it's not overpriced. All right, let's go back to the loot cam. You also have another pocket in the back here that magnetically opens and closes. So that that pocket that that was in is magnetic, which is kind of nice, because it just will hold it closed, and pulls out the shoulder strap. So this has a wide padding that's very similar to the straps that you'd find on the LTT backpack, and it secures onto the laptop bag with two locking carabiners. If you're not into that, it is completely detachable. Available in two sizes, small and large for $99.99. Check out which one your laptop fits through the size guide,

lmg.gg slash laptop bag. Yeah, so if you were tossing this in like another bag or just wanted to carry it by the carry handle that I don't know if we mentioned, you could take this thing off with the locking carabiners and then repurpose this back sleeve for whatever else I guess. Yep. Considering that they're not shipping yet, so they're expected to start shipping by the end of this month, these are actually moving pretty well. I'm very very excited. It's a luggage strap? Yes. Oh yeah. Cool right? Yeah. It's a luggage strap? Yes. Oh. Yeah. Cool, right? Yeah. It's a pretty featured laptop bag. It's like the... A lot of people saw our backpack and were like,

who the heck is this for? And then the tens of thousands of people who know what it's for bought it and loved it. This is like the same kind of deal. It's the same kind of deal. It's the laptop bag for people who have actual, like, f***ing work to do and have stuff they need to carry, you know? Like she's she's kind of thick when she's loaded up actually if you kind of show that. That's with a laptop and a tablet and the charters and the mouse and the books and and the shoulder strap and everything.

Like it's not Harry Potter technology. But it can get relatively thin. Yeah things things take up space But it's it's designed to be able to fit stuff very Very very very excited to be launching this one. I'm webbing on the sides I don't think you would call it webbing, but they're like loops. There's loops here Yep, so and right here. There's another loop. It's currently being used for the the Luggage strap, for the luggage strap. But this luggage strap is Velcro on. So you could remove it if you weren't

going to use that feature. Cool, right? And then it's the same two loop on the other side. So if we ever have accessories, they might attach to the loops there. Or you could just hang cute little crystals or figurines off of it. I don't care.

I suspect that'll be the most common use case. Yeah, oh yeah. Oh yeah. Oh yeah, oh yeah. Oh yeah, but, cool. What is the Mac size of laptop? We have a size guide on the site. Cool. Yeah, go check it out.

I wanted so badly for it to fit the Framework 16 with the GPU hump, but it's the weirdest shaped laptop ever. And I was like, sorry, Framework, I love you guys very much, but it's not gonna fit in our laptop bag. Yeah. Yep. I know, framework, I love you guys very much, but it's not gonna fit in our laptop bag. Yeah. Yep. I know guys, I know.

Believe it or not, my investment in framework does not actually guide the decisions we make as a company. If it did, that would be a big problem. Yeah. All right. What else we got? What do we wanna talk about? Oh, oh, we're supposed to explain Merch messages. All right, so yeah, if you were going to order something,

hey, now's the perfect time to leave a Merch message. Don't do super chats, don't do Twitch bits, do Merch messages, because that way, you can throw money at your screen, you can interact with us and support the show, and you can also get great products in the mail. So all you got to do is go to lttstore.com and in the cart, you'll see a little box

that gives you the option to fill out a merch message. It'll go to producer Dan. Hey, look, there he is. Wow, he's real. I mean, this could be prerecorded. Dan, prove it's not prerecorded. Hi, Linus. See, if I leave this long enough,

it'll loop, it actually is prerecorded. No, I can't. So it'll go to producer Dan, who will reply to it himself, forward it internally, pop up your message down there like that, or, well, that's his message. What are you, who are you replying to? Who are you replying to? Thick, what are you even talking about?

Anyway, or- I probably liked it. Or he'll send it to me and Luke for, as a curated merch message, and we'll talk about it on the show. What do we got, Mr. Dan? Oh, well, we have loads of merch messages coming in today.

We've had so many people buy pens. Oh, it's pens. It's pens, it's a lot of pens. Oh. We've done- How many though? Whoa! Luke, how many though?

Do you know how many pens? Yeah. Just through merch messages. Here, hold out your arm and I'll write how many there are. Okay. Use the pen. Okay, here we go.

Where do you want it? You want it inside? Yeah. Okay. Oh no. I know what's happening. I've just embraced it at this point Luke you moron

I only got it when you started writing on his head. I was like what does he mean how many? Why would he write it? Oh man, okay The second thing? We just tell the people people yeah that many pens 15 15 pens 15 pens The second the second he started right I was like I just Was the first line is there like it's better than just embrace What's the first line is there like it's better than just embrace it? Oh yeah.

Yeah, exactly. Oh. You know I actually feel a little better. Are you sure you wouldn't like some humble pie? It wrote, no I'm good, I deserve it but I don't want to. It wrote pretty well for a pen on... Yeah, it comes with a quality refill out of the box. Yeah. But then you can put in anything you want after you put in a crappy one if you really want.

If we ever do a promo on the pen it should totally be... Pen 15. But then you can put in anything you want after. You can put in a crappy one if you really want. If we ever do a promo on the pen, it should totally be. Pen 15. 15% off. 15% off. Yeah. Oh man. All right, yeah, so.

Yeah, we're probably gonna do it. Are we a pen company now? I know, right? Like what the heck? Dude, I don't even understand. What even kind of what even kind of company are we? Do you know how many of those PTM 7950 thermal pads we sell? Probably a ton. On a random day, like earlier this week, we didn't have any promos running, we didn't have any product

launches or anything. We sold 100 units of that. Like, do you think it could be like, builders in one day? Yeah. Like, so what I'm saying is is like are there single orders of a bunch of them? Oh that I don't know Cuz that would be interesting to me. I know they can just be like really annoying to get you know What our timing was great because even though it took us forever from the video we made about it to getting it in stock There was a recent article on I think it was Igor's lab where he was breaking down like bad thermal paste that GPU Igor's lab where he was breaking down like bad thermal paste that GPU manufacturers have been using. And then he used PTM 7950 or maybe it was a separate article about PTM 7950.

Hold on, I'm just gonna bring it up. Yeah, 7950. Either way, he's been he's been talking about it. There you go. Not so overhyped. They are they are freaking awesome. So it's been like in the news and being discussed a lot especially lately and as far as I can tell we're like no one ever mentions us for some reason which is weird but when

people go looking for it we are like the go-to for reasonably priced, well packaged PTM 7950. Someone in chat said I bought seven of the smaller pads when they were on sale. There you go. Yeah. But I'm just wondering if there's if there's like actual professional builders that are just getting it from there like because I don't know. Maybe they buy much larger sheets. Combat Jam says for the PTM, there's a cooling dude on YouTube who does consoles

and stuff who talked about your PTM and how it's just easier to get and you know it's the right stuff without going through China. Like that was my big problem. When we were trying to get it to make our video, finding a reputable source for it was a nightmare. And I was like, this is just, this is stupid

because this is a quality product from a brand that everybody knows. If you've never heard of Honeywell, like you've been probably living under a fricking fridge that was made by them. Like it's, like they're just one of those companies that makes everything, right? And it seemed so ridiculous to me

that counterfeits existed of a stupid thermal pad. And that not only did they exist, but they were so convincing while not having the performance characteristics that it was almost impossible to determine which one was good and which one was bad. And I was like, okay, well, we just need to get in touch with Honeywell,

which by the way is a lot harder than you would think. Like, Honeywell does not care about your $50,000 order of ThermalPad. Zero. This is the number of F's that they give about our business. But fortunately, I believe it was a connection through a viewer who worked for a distributor who was able to get in touch with Honeywell. So that was how we were ultimately able to get definitely, absolutely, PTM7950. Actually real. Yeah. And yeah, it's super cool.

So what kind of company are we? Are we a thermal pad company? We sell a hundred thermal pads a day, Luke. You sell pads and shafts, that's all you sell. A day. You're a weird person. I'm not the one who said that. You're a weird person. I'm not the one who said that. You're the weird person.

It's true. You guys, y'all, flatten around. That's two things you sell, clothes and... Only two shapes. Two shapes. Two shapes, flat or round. Flat or round. Lumpy.

Okay, less than 100 a day, less than 100 a day. In the last seven days. 572. Is this seven days? Yeah, is it seven days? Why what? Just some of these things. There's just a lot of them. Dude, LTD stores are real business. Yeah. Yeah. Wow. I know, right? It messes me up every time I look into it the fact that at one point time We were a water bottle company and there's no water bottle up there. Oh, yeah, there's one Well, most of our water bottles are out of stock. It's a long story. But oh, yeah, that's part of it And then we were we I think we were a water bottle water bottle company and then we were a mouse pad company Yeah, and then overnight we became a screwdriver company and also a backpack company at a very similar time.

They launched almost at the same time, man. I still can't looking back. That was stupid. I ordered $100,070 screwdriver. What the fuck was I thinking? I mean, it worked out. I know, but it was crazy. Yeah. That one, to be fair, that one had a lot of like lore behind it Sure, but logo for the channel and like all this kind of stuff. What if it wasn't good? Yeah, what if project farm had reviewed it and been like, yeah, it's a piece of shit

Like the number of people that I've seen, you know criticizing the price or whatever It's like yeah criticize it all you want But the reality of it is to make a high quality product like that with licensed patents from companies that develop products that you could patent stuff. Like it's not like it's cheap. It's not like I could just turn around and liquidate them for $10. No, it's just an expensive screwdriver. And I'm sorry, that's just the way it works.

So if Project Farm had been like, yeah, it's rubbish, that would have been it. That would have been done. What's this video at now? Oh, I don't know. I haven't looked at it in a long time. The last time I looked at it, which was quite a while ago, it was cooking. Let's see.

4.1 million. He's got a million on the stubby. Dude. That's wild. If you're wondering why these aren't watched, it's just because we're on like the WAN accounts. That's crazy. No, that's not even, that's not even, oh, I use my personal, this isn't my personal.

I use my personal to watch YouTube because I have premium. Yeah, and like, look, like he's not the only opinion that matters, obviously, but he is an influencer in the truest sense of the word, where he influences. Yeah, I feel like he probably wouldn't love that. But I don't- Just because of the- I don't mean it in the derogatory sense. Yeah, because the

association that it has with things. But I understand what you're saying. I mean, he's someone who other people go to for the advice they give to anyone. I knew that is that is influence with a capital I. Yeah. And so he was terrifying. I knew about Project Farm from from years before And so he was terrifying. I knew about project farm from from years before He he reviewed the screwdriver. I Don't remember why I think I found like a video that he did on jeans or something. Yeah, sure. I don't remember what it was but yeah As crazy guy guy cars like everything counterfeit tool batteries like knife sets. I'm just looking through what he's done lately, I haven't checked out the channel in a little while.

Like the best trash bags, like yeah, I need to know that. Yeah, why not? I should probably watch that one. I need to know what's a good trash bag. How else will I throw away my trash effectively? I mean, who likes garbage juice? Who likes garbage juice getting all over your floor? I hate that, I hate that, it sucks.

You do it in the apartment building all the time, it's gross. Yeah, so I don't mean any disrespect when I say influencer. I mean one who is influential. He has influenced me. Yeah. So yeah, that was, that was pretty scary. Have we really spent all this time yik-yaking without actually doing a merch message? Dan, Dan, can you confirm? I, I say. Yeah. The longer that I'm not doing merch messages, the more merch messages there are,

so I'm not really too bothered to be perfectly honest. Cool. Good chat. Goodbye. Can we do a merch message though? I was going to say, I actually do need to do one more. Yeah, let's do like a couple I think. Hi DLL, at work I use an identity vetted email service.

It has zero spam mainly because of the vetting process. Would you consider identity vetting if it meant an end to cheating in video games? Oh, oh wow. That took a lot. It was not what I was expecting either. I think at a certain. Like, you know how they have like casual ranked, if they have like casual ranked? If they have like casual ranked competitive and competitive had like identity vetting,

I think I'd be cool with it. I would do it, no question. I had someone actually email me after the phishing thing. Yeah, I was gesturing with my head. Don't read it. Nice. You're just tuning in now. He's an enthusiast, It's his new tattoo.

They got it from Linus. It was a gift? Oh man. He got it fifteen times. Hey yo. Um. Anyway. I had someone reach out to me.

They're like a security researcher, they do security solutions. Basically they were like, hey yeah, so here's all the stuff that I was able to dig up on you, do you want to know more about this, and here's some potential insights,, here's a device you used in 2019, and here's apps that you've installed, and here's this and here's that. And I'm just like, thanks, all of that's public. You can probably find more info on me on Rocket Reach if you really want it, my privacy's dead.

And he's like, no, it's not dead, it's not dead. It's not dead. I'm just like. It definitely is though. Dude, dude, it's not dead. It's not dead. It's not dead. I'm just like It definitely is though. Oh, dude, dude. It's so dead. It's so dead man. Like it's dead It's been dead for a while. It's been dead for a long time I mean I have lived so much of my life on the internet at this point Like every once in a while, I think about it Someone will talk about OG YouTubers or whatever

that are still active. Dude, it is getting to the point where there aren't that many. Genuinely. From like, Very small amount. My era. I was at DEF CON over the weekend and one of the things that happened was some people that we were hanging out with

didn't know who I was. So I would explain and they'd be like, oh cool, like when did you guys start that? And I'd say the year and they would just be like, like what? I'm like, yeah, not actually the beginning, but like at this point it might as well be. Yeah. The funniest thing about that is when I got started on YouTube. I felt I'm sure it was too late Yeah, I was like no. It's too late. Yeah, I'm like everyone's already established at this point I'll never catch up like I'll be irrelevant in the tech space forever

Same thing with twitch man you look at you look at the popular twitch moves Faster in regards to pushing people to irrelevancy you look at at the top like, X amount of creators on Twitch, even from like a year ago, or two, three years ago, and it's completely cycled. I mean, the whole like, whoever, like, X fell off, you know, asterisk fell off. It's a meme at this point. Yeah.

Oh, only X number of viewers, blah, blah, bro, fell off. Right, like it's. Someone told me recently about the five year rule, where it's practically impossible for any influencer, creator, whatever you wanna call it, to stay at a high peak for more than five years. Can't do it. I call it the curve.

I've talked to you about that before. That's my term for it. The curve has only one shape. That's it. I wonder how my curve's doing. You used to be able to see it all on social blade because that was before. One of the most annoying things YouTube has done. Yeah. YouTube made them stop displaying data that they collected via the API that is over two years old. So you used to be able to look at the entire lifespan of any channel

and you could see the entire like shape of the curve and it was always well and the subscriber numbers also weren't as like chunky this yeah yeah hey hey look at this though look at this we're going up guess who's back back again your hair is blonde blondies back kinda works out tell a friend anyway yeah wait did you just get an LTT store ad you probably didn't see it oh did that happen I don't know I I don't see I close the page yeah nice that's not a very good ad we We paid to show ourselves. What's even happening?

Like, you don't, I can't even fully tell it's an ad. It's just like- What is even the point of it? Random icons. Interesting. So if I click a specific product, does it open that product? Open to tab, yeah, yeah.

Is this water bottle even in stock? I don't, oh, it is. Yes. Okay. So it managed to pick a product that's in stock. That's something that's good circuit desk pad. Yeah, okay It's a nice desk pad quality. So it does open the individual wait. Can you buy that? Is that it? Is that a size we carry? What is this size? Oh, okay. Oh sold out. Okay. Well, yeah, it makes sense We're not gonna restock that size. It's So small. Yeah, it's adorable. But no. Oh, are we not bringing circuit desk head back in? Oh, well, it'd be nice if I could filter by stock. Is that something that the store team could do? Like just so I could say like show only in

stock or something? I think so. That'd be kind of cool. Can someone log that? Arrow on that drop down is also uncomfortably close to the bounds of the box. But yeah, I mean, no professional web developer would ever do that according to your thing earlier. Oh. That wasn't the thing that was wrong. That wasn't the thing that was wrong.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Come on. Um... Oh, Artie says you can. You have to go to all products. Well, yeah, but I want to be able to do it like on the individual thing. Yeah, he needs for variants. Yeah. That might be pretty annoying, but we'll, I'll mess around, we'll look into it.

Yeah, if there's anything we can do, that'd be pretty cool. All right, what are we supposed to be talking about right now? Here's a second merch message. Ah, yes. What about second merch message? Do you need to be home by nine? Yeah. I was not informed of this. I was not informed of this.

Yes you were. Yeah you were. Like halfway through the show. No. Yeah. Yesterday. What? Who was on first? I don't know. I'm just... I have no idea what they did. I didn't talk about it. I don't care. Ah crud.

Yeah. Get wrecked. I don't talk about it. I don't care. Ah, crud. Yeah, get rekt. I don't remember this. Now you're rekt on camera. Hey, do you want some more of that pie? I haven't finished this one because I can't stop typing because I'm up to 187 now. Hey, Dillel, I've been thinking a lot recently

about netbooks and I think the form factor should return besides their underpowered components. Why do you think we haven't seen any recently? You know, that's a funny question. The usability issues with netbooks went beyond the slow hardware, because that's something that is totally solved at this point. You could make a high-performance computer in the form factor of an Acer Aspire 1 at this point. Throw like an AMD APU in there or something like that.

I mean, look at the size of something like the Steam Deck. Absolutely, you could make a netbook. But for me, the usability issue with the netbook was less to do with the performance with those crappy Intel Atom CPUs, and it was more to do with the usability of it. It's not like the form factor doesn't still exist. Like companies like GPD essentially specialize in building products that address that market. Like, look at this. Here's the WinMax 2024 edition here. Let's just fire that up.

I'm gonna click an ad. Let's go. But there, you can't, oh, no, not that one. No, no, not the WinMax. Hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on. No, the one that I want is Uh, is it the pocket micro pc? I think it's the win four. I think it's the win four. Let me have a look here uh

Pocket three no, not the win four. Oh, I can never remember their product naming scheme. Where are the hands for scale? Whatever. The point is that you can definitely get devices in these form factors, but what made Netbooks so special was that they were super cheap. That's what made them sell. That's the only reason why people really wanted them. That's the only reason people cared. So now that we want performance that's decent,

they're not that cheap, and the usability issues that existed for Netbooks, like their little tiny screens and little tiny keyboards, those haven't gone away. And I think a lot of people were kind of tech curious about the category and tried it and realized once and for all that they never need to do that again. There are definitely careers that I could end up in where I could be convinced to use a netbook-like device potentially.

There was one really cool one that I think was from GPD that had an input on it so that you could actually use it as a display and keyboard and mouse for a device, like as a mobile technician or something like that. That'd be pretty cool. Oh, that'd be so cool. But anything I have to type on for any reasonable amount of time, I want it to have a proper size keyboard and I just, I'd rather save my space this way, you know, and have a keyboard than save my space this way and not be able to type on the device. Because you have to put the battery in it either way.

It's going to have to have a certain internal volume if you want to have reasonable battery life. This, so this I don't believe is a topic in the doc, but someone in full plane chat just mentioned it and I'm gonna just say it out loud so you can look into it if you want. But apparently there was a 2 billion plus leak of personal date of birth and social security numbers for US citizens that happened. There's not 2 billion. Sorry, what? It says 2B plus. I don't know. That doesn't make any sense.

It doesn't make much sense to me either. Unless maybe it includes numbers and information of deceased people. Not even then. I don't think there's been ever 2 billion Americans total. Isn't there like over 300 million? Yeah. So if it's cycled, yeah, that'd be a lot of times. Yeah, no. Anyway, big leak. Well, would you cut it in half? 2.7 billion records. Apparently it's, yeah, it's the number of records. Okay, so it's a lot more than half. So it's probably counting a record for a full name, a record for an address, a record for date of birth, a record for social security, et cetera. Yeah.

It's a lot. A lot of stuff. Like I said, it's not a prep topic. The number is definitely wrong, but a major record holder got hacked, essentially. Yeah, okay. Yeah. Also the records are inaccurate.

Okay, cool. Well. Yeah, it'll include dead people, changes of address, all kinds of stuff like that. Got it. Troy Hunt apparently has a blog post about it. That makes sense. He would do that.

All right. Wanna talk about super cool real estate dystopia? Yeah. All right. This is a great article that I read on the Atlantic earlier this week. Just a few months after reports emerged that modern cars were sharing information

with auto insurers, a California woman had her home insurance cancelled because of drone footage. Oh, wait, this is two different. Oh, okay. This is two different things. This is not the Atlantic article. So first is one from Pedipixel. Joan Van Kuren's insurance provider of 40 years, CSAA, dropped her home insurance, citing

unacceptable hazards and liability exposure. Van Kuren was told by a representative that they flew a drone over her house and concluded that the final phase of her home renovation project was hazardous clutter. Now here's, we've talked about this before because this has happened to someone else. But what's interesting about this one to me is that her insurance provider, CSAA, is saying, hey, we didn't violate your privacy. We don't have drones. We just paid someone who did. We used several sources of information to assess the condition of the property, which could include aerial imagery captured by

third-party fixed-wing aircraft and satellites. Sick. And this is going to be a tenuous connection, but this kind of reminds me of the Disney case earlier, where it's like, look, if you're going to have your brand name on it, if you're going to have it as part of your business practice, at the end of the day, if you're gonna have your brand name on it, if you're gonna have it as part of your business practice, at the end of the day, if you're Amazon and you're going, oh, well, those mistreated truck drivers or whatever they are, they don't work for Amazon. Isn't there some amount of precedent for this?

They're contractors. I mean, that's why companies contract, so that they're not responsible for the workers conditions. So that if something goes wrong, they're not liable, they can cut ties and just walk away. Or maybe because they really want to work with that person but that person's in another country and then that's the only way that it can work. We like our contractors so low. Or because they live in Quebec, in Quebec.

It's complicated. Quebec's a whole heck of a thing. But I'm not talking about hiring a contractor here. I know. I'm just... I'm talking about taking an entire division of your business or an entire role within your company. Contracting it to another company or service or whatever.

And contracting it to another company who then can treat those people however, and theoretically there's this layer of insulation between your brand and your company and what they're doing and it's like I don't understand Why we allow that insulation to exist if you if your contractor is using aerial footage to Why are we getting into this conversation about who's drew the drone belongs to who cares? Yeah about who the drone belongs to. Who cares? Yeah. You are using drone footage that was collected, which is technically legal, I guess, but you're using drone footage

to surveil someone's private property and determine if they should be eligible for insurance or not, it's just, it's freaking dystopian. That's the issue, although it's not nearly as dystopian as this next one. And look, I am NOT a lawyer I'm not a legal advisor So take everything that I'm about to say for the ignorant rants of a lay person that they are but this one really upset me

This one's from the Atlantic here the original article. You should go read it. It's really good It's gonna break it down more than what we're talking about. But in other unfortunate real estate news 30 to 60% of multifamily building units in 40 housing markets are apparently using property management software from the company RealPage to adjust rent prices. Okay, so far, I guess, right? Sure. But RealPage has been accused of antitrust violations and price fixing due to their AI revenue management algorithm see he's starting to I'm starting to get some twitches in the thing basically property owners input their unit prices and vacancy rates, and then the algorithm spits out a rent recommendation based on what competitors are charging.

The lawsuits, actually multiple lawsuits, against RealPage and their lawsuits against similar services, allege that the landlords actually encourage their competitors to also use the service, why? Because if they're all using it, then everyone will get better results. And they can collude without talking to each other directly. And they can all work together to raise prices to, sorry, excuse me, let me use the correct term here.

AI manage their revenue. This is flipping wild. And the reason that I wanted to talk about this is because the tech bro cabal, you know, the tech elite, whatever you want to call them, the people who are out there doing interviews and making arguments about these AI agents or algorithms. I don't really think it's fair to call an AI agent an algorithm. I actually don't really like that term because to me an algorithm is something that can be

expressed as a function. Whereas machine learning is not necessarily simply expressed as a function. You can express the desired outcome, you can express what the input was, but what you can't express is exactly how it achieved that necessarily, because it's going to depend on how many times it has adversarially reinforced itself in order to achieve that outcome. It's not a simple function though. That narrative is used by companies that want to. Well, I'm getting to that.

Act like they have no control. I'm getting to that. Here's my problem, is the people that are getting out there and doing these interviews, making those arguments, I'm really glad you brought that up because that's exactly where I was going with it. They've got to pick a fucking lane because on the one hand, right, they're kind of going, oh, we

couldn't possibly know. It's a black box. Yeah. It's a black box. We don't know how it works. We just try to poke it and hope. Yeah, we just hope for the best, right. And then when they want to train it, right? When they want to use, let's say copyrighted or otherwise, you know, not legally available content, like say from YouTube channels or Netflix or whoever else. Well then now all of a sudden, well, you know,

it's, oh wait, this wasn't quite the argument I wanted to make, whatever. Okay, let's back up a little bit. Let's back up a little bit. So when they's, it's, oh, wait, this wasn't quite the argument I wanted to make. Whatever. Okay, let's back up a little bit. Let's back up a little bit. So when they want to train it, okay, the argument that they make is that it's kind of like a person, right? Like anyone, any, any entity could have consumed that content and learned and everything that it that it produces from that point, whether whatever similarity it bears to what it learned from is just like any person would, right? But then the legal argument around this price fixing issue...

Anytime it does something that they don't like. It's not a person. It's just an algorithm. Yeah. So you've got to decide which one it is. Does it behave like a person taking in information from around it and then black box doing its own thing with it and it's generative? Or is it an algorithm and can't be held accountable for behaving like a person would? Because that's the argument that RealPage is making.

They're basically saying that, well, because none of these people are talking to each other, there is no single entity that is bringing the entire thing together to become collusion. They're all just using an algorithm that is suggesting things to them based on information that it has, but the lawyers who are filing these lawsuits argue that it, like a person who was acting

as an intermediary, has private information that it shouldn't have in order to give those recommendations. Sorry, it took me a while to get there, but basically my whole thing is like, look, you've got to pick a lane. You've gotta decide if they're people and therefore should be allowed to intake any content they want like a person would, or if they're just algorithms, in which case,

well, I guess you can't really do that to train them. They shouldn't be able to take in that information. Either way, it's pretty clear to me that what RealPage is doing is textbook collusion and price fixing. Yeah. It's just that the textbook was written a long f***ing time ago. Yeah, this is horrible. I really hate corporate residential investment.

But that's a story for another time. Yeah, and just again, I'm not a lawyer. I don't know the law, but what I do know is this doesn't seem right. Yeah. And I am, I don't think it's cool. Yeah. Anything else? Is there something that's cool?

Is there something in here that's cool? Yeah, our sponsors. Hey! The show is brought to you today by Corsair. Maybe you're a fashion pioneer pushing the boundaries of style, and that's awesome. Good for you. But even if you're not, it's easy to bring style to your gaming setup thanks to our sponsor, Corsair. With Corsair Custom Lab, you can create a gaming setup that is as unique as you are. You could start with something like their K65 Plus wireless keyboard and find the perfect set of keycaps that screams you.

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Interesting. Well, I can't wait until mullets are not trendy anymore again because... Well I mean Elijah's is... Yeah. Yeah. It's hard to look at man. That one's maybe... Anyway. Our sponsor, Squarespace, ensures your site will stand out in a good way. They offer tons of award-winning templates for all kinds of businesses, whether they have the business in the front and the party in the back or the other way around. You can literally just drag and drop designs with Squarespace Blueprint AI and it's so simple even Dennis can do it. Squarespace is a lot more than just a website builder too. It comes with a lot of features for your business. They have integrated optimized SEO tools that help

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You can do that. Yeah, okay, cool. Oh, okay, I get it. So they're smaller and lighter. I mean, yeah, I mean, I guess that was already in the talking board. I actually haven't seen one of these yet. Okay.

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Wow, that is about as minimal as it gets. You put your cards in, I mean, it's a Ridge Wallet. Do I have to explain what a Ridge wallet is? Okay, fine. Rubber bands. Elastic bands, hard metal plates, or actually all kinds of different materials. They've got like carbon fiber and all kinds of different stuff and it holds your your card securely. They've got these little plastic pieces that make it easy to slide cards in. They also have matching key cases with the same materials as their wallets to keep all of your keys secure in a small profile and they come with a lifetime warranty

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Why? Because I'm trying to figure out, can you buy like swappable plates? I don't know. I took the plate off. They gave you a screwdriver in the box. So you must be able to like swap the plates Um, okay, that's also how you get to the strap crannon float plane chat says i've 3d printed plates for mine

That's cool. Uh elijah said it's to add the air tag thing. Oh There you go cool Neat. Cool. Thanks, Luke. No problem. And also to add the money clip.

Oh. Okay. Dan, hit me. Sure. What's the most unexpected loss leader you ever came up with either for LTT store or LMG in general? Oh, the elemental t-shirt. Remember those shirts that just had LTT logos in the top?

That was turning one of our biggest L's into a W. Because it turns out while people weren't that into the design of just an LTT in a random color on a shirt, people were super into the quad pack bundles that we did of them at a really aggressive price. People liked them so much as a stupid loss leader item that we actually intentionally did I think either two or three rounds of printing those shirts with the intention of selling them for I think by the time we like everything was handled and everything I'm pretty sure they were at a loss. So Good job team. I

Mean it is a thing that businesses do well where they will buy something With the intent of not making money on them with the intent of losing money on them But it doesn't happen that often for us. We're a pretty small company We don't we don't just buy stuff to lose money on it. generally speaking. Isn't that like the whole thing with the Costco food? Yeah, yeah, rotisserie chicken, the hot dog. Yeah, rotisserie chicken is a huge one. Yeah. I didn't even know that the rotisserie chicken was like a loss leader thing until I read some article about it. They are so cheap for what they are. You can't buy a uncooked chicken for less. Which is crazy.

And it's cooked and seasoned and everything. They're really nice. This is just a Costco sponsorship. Val Herrick says the rotisserie chicken isn't a loss leader. Really? That doesn't compute for me. I don't think you're... I'm not sure.

They say they don't waste a single bit of it. Well, yeah, but even then guys, it's just a chicken. They just took a chicken and they put it in a plastic container. Yeah, guys. I Yeah, I don't I don't know. I'm pretty sure. I'm pretty sure. In a 2023 earnings call Costco chief financial officer Richard Galanti said Costco's rotisserie chicken is an investment in low prices to drive membership, to drive sales in a big way.

That's just a fancy way of saying loss leader. It's at the back of the store, like the bathrooms for a reason. Yeah. And the next line of this is almost exactly what Linus said word for word is, that's a fancy way of saying that the product is a loss leader. Yeah. That's hilarious. I wasn't even going to say it. I was like, wait, that's almost right for word. Yeah. Crazy.

Yeah, I mean, I think it is. Or it might even be a thing like maybe they profit like a tenth of a cent on each one. That's still kind of a loss leader in a way. Yeah. Because even just the administration of having that is gonna make that automatically not worth it. Yeah. All right. LMG continues, it's a salt on my wallet.

Linus, did you ever hear from Big Time about sponsoring them? Unless a deal is done, you know, I'm not gonna, yeah, I'm not gonna talk about it. What I will do is I'll reiterate that we would love, we'd love to do a sponsorship with Big Time. There's even if, you know, everyone agreed in principle that that was a good idea,

there'd be a lot of details to sort out. Like, you know, let's say they were like, oh yeah, sure, sounds good. How about $1 billion, you know, for a for a community post, you know, obviously, we wouldn't move forward with that. So there's a and I'm not saying they did that. I'm just saying there's a thousand reasons that something might not go through even if we'd like to and even if they'd like to. So I'm very interested in it personally. But there's also other stakeholders internally that need to be convinced. We don't just operate based on what Linus thinks is a good idea anymore. We have other leadership and that's a good

thing. What a loss. You're a loss. And a leader. I don't think I'm at... Is this loss? Yeah, dude, would you call support departments and infrastructure a loss leader in a company? Oh, they're known as the burden department. Yeah, not loss leader, but they just cost the company more.

Because a loss leader actually has to have the potential to generate profits elsewhere. Yeah, we don't come here for infrastructure. No, but I think that's true because I mean if we didn't have a single server. Think about the infrastructure department. Think about the accounting department. No, you're called cost centers. Burden department. Yeah, I've heard that one for sure. It says the warden.

No, I know cost centers. Yeah. That's a nice name. No, you don't get to be a loss leader. Sorry. I don't know if cost center is a nice name. I prefer burden department because it's way more offensive. Burden department.

Yeah. Like you're a net drain on this company. Keep doing your job, but we're looking at you. It's like, oh, I'm sorry for being employed by you. If you didn't have us, your company would implode, but it doesn't mean it's on your balance sheet is anything good. Investors, what's this?

Well, that's the entire workforce that makes our, well, we got to get rid of them. We'll outsource them and then the company implodes. That's basically what happens all the time. Yeah, lay off. Yeah, we'll just outsource it. You know, we'll get it. The stock is doing Yeah, lay off. Yeah, we'll just outsource it. You know, we'll get in brotherly.

The stock is doing poorly. Fire everyone! I love our world. Who's gonna fix the company? AI! Yeah. That'll make the stock go up. What do we do when that doesn't work? I don't know. That's some other shareholders' problem. I'm selling. Okay, I'll get a golden parachute, move on to the next one. Yay! The badminton center is definitely a cost center not a lost leader. Yeah especially when it takes all of our infrastructure people away. I want to do my job. No I have good news

no it's good news why are you gonna be such a d*** so I had a meeting with the city oh no way I had a meeting with the city. Oh, no way. I had a meeting with the general manager of the city of Surrey. I can't believe I haven't talked to you about this. I didn't know cities had general managers. They sure do. I thought it was just mayor. Well, I mean, mayors have staffs.

They don't just do everything. You sound like one of our viewers who thinks that I like grind the weed, harvest the weed and bake the weed and like have a little red hen over here like No, they have of course they have a whole team. No wheat. Oh, it's the story of the little red hen I know if I said weed. It's like the Canadian version of the little red hen Not the weed you guys The little red hen rolls the joints in her tiny beak You don't bake the weed, the weed bakes you

Never get high on your own supply Linus I'm a beak. You don't bake the weed, the weed bakes you. Never get high on your own supply, Linus. Okay, so. Those eggs would be off the chain though. From high chickens. Okay. Like high chew, but way worse. Um, okay. So we had an important meeting.

Yeah, so we had a meeting with the general manager of the city of Surrey. And in much the same way that, you know, I can't say with confidence, oh, we're going to sponsor big time or, you know, whatever. I can't say with confidence that we're going to be able to move forward with Whalelands at the Badminton Center, I'm just going to start calling it Smash Jams. So that's what it's called, it's called Smash Champs. I'm not saying that we're gonna be able to move forward, but what I will say is that we had a really constructive meeting. We chatted for almost two hours.

So it was, it's never a good sign when a meeting is 15 minutes. It is almost, there's like a happy spot. Like how good of a sign it is. If it's a four hour meeting, it's probably bad. So it was almost two hours, including two site visits. So they went to Smash Champs, and then they also came here to the office

to get an idea of what our operation looks like for like LAN gaming and slash sport in the city. And then what our operation looks like that pays for LAN gaming and sport in the city in order to just like get an idea of what we're about. And I will tell you this, at the end of the meeting, the question, the summary question was, okay, what do you need from us

to get these gaming events going? Oh, that's a nice one. It's not a guarantee. There's, you know, red tape. But it's good. Red tape can't be immediately, you know, cut necessarily, no matter what kind of position of power they're in. But this is really cool for me as a resident of the city of Surrey.

I've observed many times over the years that there is like shit all to do here And one of the big problems is that our previous councils like our city councils have not prioritized it Yeah, so to have fun you have to travel out of the city It's basically for a long time and what's cool is one of the things that he said is that in his 10 years working for the City this is the first council that has come to him with a mandate And what's cool is one of the things that he said is that in his 10 years working for the city This is the first council that has come to him with a mandate of hey figure this out. That's awesome. Actually. Yeah, that's very cool Even not even just the impact on smash champs, like obviously I'm happy about that, but I'm also excited about the idea of Things to do being something that the cities that are out here care about. I'm going

to bundle in like Langley. Stop acting like suburbs. I know Langley's been carrying a little bit more with the Langley Event Center and stuff, but even that, unless you're doing organized sport, I mean, that helps. That's cool. I like Langley Event Center. I'm for it, but we need kind of more stuff like that. Yeah, 100%. And it's funny because one of the things that he also mentioned is, I forget what the timeframe was, but I think it's sometime in the next 10 or 20 years, based on projections, Surrey's going to be the biggest city in the province, not Vancouver. Yeah, I mean, that makes sense.

Because Vancouver's already built up and Surrey's only built out and not even completely built out. And so major inefficiencies like the like the fact that we don't the fact that they have like all the sports arenas and like all the entertainment district and all of that stuff is sort of it's sort of like why yeah why is why is sorry why is Surrey a aurb of Vancouver? Like, why don't we just, why don't we have cool stuff to do here? And I love that mindset. Yeah, that's super cool. No, it's great. And so, yeah, so I was talking to him and I was just like, look, like, I'm, I'm, I like to live my life via improv rules, right? And improv rules is you work together and you can't say no. Because no is not useful. No doesn't

give your partner anything to work with. And we've encountered some obstacles within the bureaucracy. And the answer could be a barrier that's so high that it's effectively a no. Yeah. But no is not helpful. And so, like, okay, one of the concerns that was raised to us was occupancy, and we kind of went, okay. So. What's the limit there? No. And we kind of go, but what if we,

okay, what if as a requirement, all the bay doors are open during these events? Because there has to be a reason. Rules exist for a reason. So tell us the underlying reason, because if we don't know the reason, we can't address it. So what? So it's fire code, but with all the bay doors open,

everyone can leave incredibly quickly. Yes. Okay. But that isn't even the issue because- Sure, I'm just- With the number of exits we have, I think we could do up to like 400 or something like that. So that's not even the bigger issue.

It's not what we're cleared for now, but looking at the building, it shouldn't be a problem. Got it. The big one is parking. And we kind of go, okay, but what if we worked with our neighbors because these events would be taking place outside of regular business hours and this is an industrial park.

So theoretically, as long as we clear it with them, it should be no problem to have tons of parking. And they're like, no. And we kind of go, but that's not that's not rational that's not that's not a conversation that's just well okay there's a there's a truck parking place down the road like literally half a block away or something like three-quarters of a block away what if we worked out a deal with them or we or we hired out a parking lot a greater

distance away and we arranged a shuttle service, no. So is the issue parking or is the issue that you're just an obstinate f***? What is the actual problem here? What's actually going on here? Let me solve problems. And talking to the GM, he seems like a problem solver. Cool.

And he seems excited to work with- What type of person do you want in that role? Problem solvers. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And so that's my whole thing, right? Sorry, I didn't know your job was just, yeah, exactly. Sounds like you're doing well.

So that's my whole thing is I like problem solvers because this is one of those things that is a net obvious benefit to the city. It brings dollars into the city. It brings attention onto the city, which is what they want. They wanna be treated like a city, not like a suburb of some other city. It brings attention onto the city, which is what they want. They want to be treated like a city, not like a suburb of some other city. And so, okay, well then you've got to have things happening in the city of Surrey.

Surrey's also been historically like the butt of jokes for cities around here. And this type of stuff might be able to help them shake that reputation. Absolutely. Langley too, Cloverdale, all around here. But they've got to have the right attitude But they've got to have the right attitude They've got to have the right attitude in order to make that work and it just seems like we have finally reached the level where it's a get-er-done attitude instead of a

follow the rules attitude. Like one of the things that we ran into is that in an industrial zone you can have recreation but not entertainment. So you can actually get a temporary use permit to do a bingo hall but you can't play computer games. And so that's one of those things. And yeah, so the, so that's one of those things and yeah, so the problem So that's one of those things that's like clearly an arbitrary distinction. Yeah Yeah, someone somewhere in the bingo gaming industry got that pushed through at some point and and so I'm just kind of sitting here going Look, there's a there's a charity event that Yvonne and I participated in where you can repel off of one of the towers in Central City That's cool. Yeah

And so one of the things that if they were if they were seeming like they were gonna be kind of obstructionist One of the things that I was gonna bring up was like look Clearly you guys can do things if if I can repel Down a tower in the middle of the city, if they got a permit for that, then there's no way... I should be looking for a permit to play video games. There's no way I can't play video games in a badminton gym. But it didn't end up getting there.

It didn't end up getting there because it seems like... And this is such a relief because poor Dan and Sean and actually Jake too and the smash champs team and everyone has been working really hard to make these LAN gaming events a possibility and For months now we've been doing so with no solid indication that the city is going to yield and that they're going to allow us To do it. It's been like actually a lot of work. I live there now. Yeah. I know. The IT team, yeah. And the vast majority of what they're doing there. There is some stuff there that is specific to Smash Champs' functionality, but the reason it's so complicated, the reason we have access control everywhere, the reason the Wi-Fi is crazy overbuilt, the reason that we

have fiber and power running everywhere and all crazy overbuilt, the reason that we have fiber and power running everywhere and all these terminations, the reason we have so many security cameras is because I'm not worried about a couple hundred dollar rackets going missing. I'm worried about access control and dividing a group that has $2,000 laptops from just random looky-loos

that are there playing badminton, whatever else. Like it was designed For us to be able to run these events without the cost and time of doing them in a non specialty built facility. Yeah, so we've really thought about it from the very beginning like how do we make this purpose built for LAN gaming on this side without interfering with the regular business over here when we want to do these events and so hopefully that's that helps at least for now I mean I love it it's fun to build things you know yeah but it's nice if people use them after you build them I enjoy the act of building I don't care if it's seen or used by anybody, and it's very important to like that.

I actually believe this. I don't, just for other people listening, I don't think that... I think there's an additional benefit. It always is nice, but it's not to be expected. And if you're out there doing something for the validation from other people, you should probably look into why you're doing it. That's fair. That's fair.

Yeah, yeah. Build something for the joy of building it. Won't it be nice if other people enjoy it too? Yeah, because it costs a hell of a lot of money. Oh yeah, there's that. There's a lot of that. Cran pointed out only an hour left of Luke time. That's not even true.

It's less than that because I have to be home by that time. So I'm going to jump in and can I- Should we do some more topics? Yeah, do more topics. Can I do the be home by that time. So I'm going to jump in and can I do the Defcon topic? I went to Defcon and I didn't know what to expect. I've wanted to go to Defcon since I was a wee lad watching the, the like VODs of Defcon panels on like, I'm pretty sure I think I watched them pre YouTube even but I know I watched some of them on YouTube back in the day I'm pretty sure the reason

why I think I watched them pre YouTube is because I have a bunch of them downloaded mmm like a lot of videos from Def Con downloaded from back in the day nice because I'm pretty sure I got them off of you know before YouTube a lot places you had to download video when it was on the internet. So anyways, I always wanted to go, never really wanted to go to cons by myself and never really wanted to go to DEF CON especially by myself because it's, it feels scary. So this time- There's a lot of hackers there. Yeah, quite a few. This time I went with Theo and Theo's CTO Mark and Ed and not Edzal here, Edzal, a different Ed.

But I barely even ended up seeing Ed because of reasons I'm going to explain in a second. And while we were there, we met up with Thor and or Pirate Software and Primogen and a group of other people that are not as much of a fan of being named or having pictures of them or anything like that. So those guys are also super cool. Everyone that I was hanging out with was were just legends, but I don't I'm not going to name the other ones. What I expected we would do is, you know, go to DEF CON and hang out at the show a bunch. That didn't really happen. I can't even read it.

No, no, you're good. I'm just me. What really happened at DEFCON was we showed up and we went to the show floor for like, I don't know, a couple hours. And then we got an invite from Thor, Pirate Software, to join him in a hotel room where they're doing a capture the flag like challenge. And I was like, Oh, that sounds pretty cool. So we went there and all immediately became obsessed with this challenge called the gold bug puzzle. Okay.

And this is what I ended up spending the entire rest of the event doing. No way. I sat in this hotel room with a bunch of hacker dudes on laptops and tried to solve puzzles. We were up until like six in the morning, basically every day trying to solve puzzles. We were up until like six in the morning basically every day trying to solve puzzles and then we won! We won the gold bug challenge which was amazing. Heck yeah. I don't know how much it's okay for me to say we. They all think

that I can but my contribution is highly questionable compared to certain other people there. But it was really cool and if you're interested you can actually kind of do it yourself still. So the puzzle is still alive. It's bbs.goldbug.crypto-village.org slash puzzles dot html. And you can find all the puzzles. They're all right here. The types of puzzles that they are.

This was just this was so cool. And some of the people there, I felt incredibly dumb being in that room, because the stuff that people were able to pull off was wild. But the main one that sniped me was chess. There's all these different names for these puzzles, etiquette chess, charades, pasta slipper, whatnot. When we started deciding like, okay, we're pretty invested in this,

like Mark, Theo and I, I started to try to figure out what one can I try to contribute to? And I heard there was one named chess. So I was like, okay, I'm going to work on that. I click on the chess puzzle and this is all you get. There's this picture of this girl, some text down at the bottom that reads, a horseman rides across breadcrumbs dropped by a child reduced by one in file. And then a chess game, and you can play the chess game. But like, this is it. The solution for the puzzle, there's just like a text box and you have to type something into it.

That's all, that's all, this is all you have. You have to try to solve what this puzzle is. I could go over all the things that I tried. I didn't even end up being the one who solved this, but I might have helped narrow it down. I don't know, that's questionable. I noticed right away that the knight moves around in a very specific pattern. This isn't a normal chess game. If you don't interact with the knight he just jumps around. The pattern of movement for the knight ends up being important to the solution, but I was thinking like reduce by one and file so I was mapping down the the movement pattern of the knight and then the files are alphabetical and then if you look at like a grid of the spots on a chessboard they're

all letter number so I was reducing by one of each so you end up going down to the left so I like mapped out the knight's movement going down into the left and then I started trying to like okay maybe the puzzle is solved when a certain position on the board is met and this was an agreement that a bunch of people had is like that might be it so I was trying to like leave it says you know breadcrumbs dropped by a child so I tried like putting pawns in the place that the knight was going to move to so it could take my pawns and like all this other stuff none of that ended up being the case. I'm not going to give the answer of how you solve it? If I go into here. Nope. It's not that one. Oh, I thought I clicked on script. My bad. Take back. Okay. This will only take a second.

So you can, you can like reverse your moves. interesting. Okay, so I figured out one thing that we figured out pretty quick was you can make it start to play chess So it has logic for actually trying to beat you But there's only ways that you can even there's only some ways you can do that So if you like heart, oh, did I just break it? No, it's just I bet you a lot of people are loading this right now If you like hard charge down the board, and then just start taking stuff, it doesn't like react right away, but it will react eventually.

This just breaks the game. You put their king in check and it just stops working. There's other ways that you can break the game where you can take over control of black non-programmatically. Like you play chess and you like confuse it in a certain way. It'll do an illegal move. And then because of the illegal move, it passes the turn order over. So you start playing black and the AI starts playing white.

So like, I thought maybe, okay, maybe you're supposed to take over black and then win the game as black. Like I tried all these different things. It ends up not being that type of stuff, but we were working on these puzzles tried all these different things. It ends up not being that type of stuff. But we were working on these puzzles for essentially the entire event. And that was so cool.

Everyone on the team that we're on were super cool to work with. It was very, very fun. It was very mentally satisfying getting the answers to different puzzles. That was a blast. It wasn't even sort of remotely what I was expecting Defqon to be like.

Cool. But it was awesome. Another thing that we did was Theo and I were a part of a TF2 hacking challenge where your team is comprised of two separate units. You have the players of TF2, and then you have a hacking group, and both sides help each other, and the score of each individual component of your team contributes into one pool of points. So by winning TF2 rounds, you gain score and you gain tokens, and the tokens can be spent to get hints for the hacking team. And as the hacking team captures flags effectively, they gain points that can be spent to give

you like power-ups in TF2, like crit bonus and all that type of stuff. So yeah, it's like that was super fun. It was a really, really cool event. And then we come down to the badge. Yeah, okay. Which I don't know how well this is going to, you want to jump to loot cam? This is the badge for the event. So you have it hanging like this.

And if I left it here long enough, it would go into badge mode. It's not in badge mode right now. Um, but you can also flip it over and it turns into effectively a game boy. Um, there's, there's the, a new Raspberry Pi launched on the same day of the first day of DEF CON and it is in here. So it has like a new launch version of a Raspberry Pi. It has a ton of features. It has an IR sensor where you can like put your badges together and like transfer across. There's an SD card reader. There's a bunch of LEDs all throughout

it that are all individually addressable. So you can set up like color modes for your badge. If I try to get in here for a second. Oh, it's upside down, right. Cause you have to put it in like Game Boy mode. They made a game. It's gonna be a little bit hard to see. But as this like scrolls through the game will start and you can like design your little hacker character.

And then you set the date and time and you can go through the DEFCON convention hall. You start in your hotel room and then you go on the monorail and then you end up at the DEFCON convention hall. And depending on the date and time the convention hall is like different and there's NPCs that you can go and talk to. So yeah, I'm setting the date here and time. I'm picking my little hacker character. I'm trying to make sure the screen should see. I'm in my little hotel room now. That's wild.

I can interact with- How is this a badge for an event? Yeah. Defcon is crazy. So I go out the door- Like how many of these did they make? Along the monorail now. That is one thing I was gonna let people know.

If they do decide to go to Defcon in the future, I would pre-buy the badge because you can buy your ticket at the door, but it's not guaranteed that you get one of these. You might end up with a paper badge. That's a thing every time? Maybe not this exact level. I've seen some past badges that weren't as cool as this,

but they always have pretty crazy badges. Okay. You can get into the menus and like, so on here I can change the LED colors. So let me go to the right cat eye, sure. And I'm gonna make sure. There. Okay. So I made it green, but they're all individually addressable or you can do all of them at once.

That is crazy. This is the most, I think this is probably the most extra thing I have ever seen. A lot of things at Defcon are pretty extra. You can update the firmware on it. The battery mount. They just hucked it in there. Yeah. Yeah, that part. Some people manually affixed it they just hucked it in there. Yeah, yeah that part. Some people manually affixed it.

I haven't taken it apart yet. Yeah, okay. You can, there's an SD card, so you can load other like ROMs for Game Boy and you can actually play other Game Boy games. This is a Game Boy emulator. Cause why not? People at the conference, like this turned into,

you know how we took the activity of Gold Bug and that like became our DEF CON. Some people took the activity of Goldbug and that became our DEF CON? Some people took the activity of just the badge. There's tons of different things that could consume your time and some people, yeah, went for the badge and they put Palm OS on it. Because apparently this is a touch screen. No way.

I don't know if it interacts with the Game Boy game. We didn't do anything by default. But yeah, you can you can do I Saw people using like a pen to interact with it. But yeah Badges come with entrance fee. Yeah, I think it's a $20 Riser to to buy it like it's $20 more I think to buy the badge ahead of time Wow, I just got a I got a photo for you in the game. Cool Yeah, all right. I got some kind of prize for knowing that the first defcon was hosted at sans Yeah

So it's like it's like it's an actual game you can save your progress you have inventory of all this stuff I took my inventory I Was in the inventory earlier Whoop, oh well anyway, I closed the game. Oh yeah, that's another point is everyone scared me of like, you know, you can't bring your devices to the show floor because you'll get hacked and all that kind of stuff. So I brought an old Android 12 non-updated phone. Just for lulls. And manually.

And so did Theo. We didn't plan this ahead of time. We just both brought old, not secure phones in an attempt, he wanted to do it for a video. I just wanted to do it out of curiosity. And then I was like, hey, I mean, if we get it to work, you can use mine in a video. Why not?

That honestly would have been pretty funny. And we tried to connect to every open wifi we possibly could with these old, unsecure phones, just to see what would happen. Yeah, I'm assuming some stuff happened. No. Really? Yeah.

They have a- Is it like security through everyone knows that everyone who's here is gonna be bulletproof, so don't bother? No, or what about it backwards? Those would be unsecured devices connecting. If you do stuff to them, they're gonna do stuff bad. Did they like sandbox you?

No, no, no, no. Like Luke would be fishing backwards. Like wanting people to try to attack my phone. Do stuff to my phone and I'll destroy you. Maybe, there's probably a bunch of mind games. They had a wall of like, these people have been pwned at the event. And it was like basically for people being silly.

They had some crazy wifi security thing where on the secure network hosted by the convention itself, you had to register your devices officially so they could track like individual devices at that level. It wasn't just free entry. It wasn't just entry with a password. You like it was wall of sheep, is that what it's called?

Yeah, wall of sheep. And it's like, if you, if you goof and get owned at the event. Um, but yeah, okay. What, what kaboom pow just said ends up being, I think ultimately it, no one's going to blow a zero day on you. Right. So you're like standard devices, like no, no one's going to do something super sophisticated at DEF CON. Right. Because what's the huge value there? But there is other things going on and people do get pwned and there is Wi-Fi networks that are trying to capture you. Like I noticed a trick that people were doing was they were trying to set up Wi-Fi networks that were open that had the same SSIDs that you'd run into at like an airport and stuff like that and devices were automatically connecting

to it. But I don't think they were actually doing things super malicious. They were just trying to catch you to get you on the wall of sheep. Got it. Okay. Like it was a game. Okay. I think. I don't know. I'm sure there's people that go to Defqon and do things that are bad. But it didn't seem like actually a huge deal. So if you're really scared, don't do silly things. I would highly recommend if you go to the show floor with a device, manually turn off your WiFi. So that just in case you've connected

to open networks before and someone tries to get you with the naming a network as the same thing, whatever, you're not going to automatically connect to it because your wifi is just off and you only go off the cellular data. Yeah, someone said, and Bluetooth, yeah, it's a great idea. Just turn off things that are going to automatically connect to networks. But yeah, it was tons of fun.

They even have a section that's just for like kids to learn how to get into security and testing of different things, which is really cool. They had a lock picking village where they had just like a chain link fence with a ton of different locks attached to it. And you could try out all these different lock picks and learn from other people there that would teach you. That's kind of cool.

It was actually a very almost like wholesome event. And I had a ton of fun. And I'm definitely going next week. Hearing you describe it, I'm surprised that this was your first time. Yeah, I've always wanted to go. But no one really wanted to go with me. And then Theo and I were both thinking of going. And Thor was like, no, you guys are coming. And it was like, well, all right.

Sounds good. Do they have social engineering seminars? Yes, they do. How did you meet people? I mean, most- Everyone's there for the same reason, I guess, right? Yeah, and most people that I met while I was there, I was planning on meeting,

unless Thor, who introduced us to that group of people, that again, I don't think they wanna be named, so I'm gonna leave that out, but yeah, it was really sick. Can run Doom, yeah, I'm gonna leave that out. But yeah, it was really sick. Can run Doom, yeah. I'm not surprised. People were talking at the event like, can it run Doom? And the consensus of most people was yes, and it probably already does.

Someone at the event probably made this happen already. Yeah, hilarious. There was some drama around the badge. I don't know all of it, There was some drama around the badge. I don't know all of it, but I'm not super surprised because I think there was a huge amount of contributors and to make something this complicated as just the badge to an event, I don't know. I'm not surprised there were some issues. But yeah, I don't know all the drama stuff. But if you want to look it up I

As far as I know it's like pretty heavily documented on on reddit and other places so you can go figure that out Dragon to night in floatplane chat. No, that sound was my back cracking They thought it was a fart. Oh No, I'm just Apple yeah, Apple is making payments more open I Apple. Yeah. Apple is making payments more open. It's not enough.

Apple needs to do more and it doesn't make up for all their past transgressions. But I do like the new, I like the new Apple. I like the Apple that is constantly paranoid about being investigated for antitrust because they're being investigated for antitrust. In response to the European Commission's

antitrust investigations, Apple is making a host of changes surrounding payments and third-party apps. Apple is allowing developers finally to offer NFC transactions in-app using secure element. That means users can set their double click side button shortcut to an app that isn't Apple Pay. It also means that third party apps can use contactless transactions for things like hotel room keys or transit passes.

This is going to be an absolute game changer and should have happened years ago. Years, so many years ago. The fact that it's happening now means that Apple could have done it anytime they wanted, they just decided they didn't want to. The APIs are open to developers in select countries in the iOS 18.1 developer beta. To use these APIs, devs will need to enter

a commercial agreement with Apple and pay the associated fees, however, and that's where the malicious compliance comes in. Probably we'll see. Apple has also changed their rules surrounding showing pricing and promotions in apps. Developers are now able to inform users of pricing information in the app

and they can make purchases directly from the location of their choosing, be that another app store, website, et cetera, by applying for an entitlement that Apple can approve or deny based on their terms and conditions. However, should an app link to an external payment platform while using an entitlement that Apple can approve or deny based on their terms and conditions. However, should an app link to an external payment platform while using this entitlement,

they will be subject to a store services fee explained by the verge. Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, basically it's a fee. In addition to that, there's a 5% initial acquisition fee that applies under the same terms. So this is Apple complying without in good faith, just dealing with the fact that this is not gonna last.

You are not, it's not gonna keep lasting you guys. There was the whole drama this week. This actually isn't in our notes, but There was the whole drama this week, this actually isn't in our, isn't in our notes, but there was the whole drama this week where Patreon is apparently going to be stuck paying the 30% fee on everything that goes through Patreon, which compared to Patreon's own take? No. No? Oh, what are the details there? Patreon is actually, I think it's-

Well, they're offering the option for- Cool and reasonable how they're dealing with it. Is there offering the option for the creator to eat it or for the creator to pass it on to the user? I don't think Patreon in any case is eating it themselves. No, I shouldn't say Patreon is eating it. That's incorrect because Patreon only takes 8% of the gross. So it wouldn't make any sense.

Yeah, I believe that's their cut. But basically Apple is demanding 30% of Patreon contributions, which is ridiculous and we've talked extensively in the past about how the floatplane model which is very similar to the patreon model Is completely untenable. It gets dunked if you take 30% with a 30% take we don't have 30% for you to take from us. It doesn't make any sense. This is direct funding for creators. And so if you're taking that kind of cut out of it as a platform, like a device platform,

it's not manageable. Yeah, some people are pointing out like other platforms that people could use and stuff. Honestly, I don't think there's a better way that Patreon could have handled this. Just subscribe online, or online. Through the web. Through the web, yeah, just subscribe through a web browser.

I don't have the Patreon app on my phone, but I'm going to assume that if you subscribe through the web you can still access their stuff on mobile. Just do it that way. I think the easiest way to do it is for creators that are offered this option to pass it forward to the users and then hopefully the users will see that and just go subscribe on the web.

Because I don't think it's great for the creators to have to eat that percentage either. It is what it is. Whoa, what is this? Google's team pixel program was changed to require that influencers be biased towards Google? Screenshots leaked from a member of Google's team pixel influencer program. I never even heard of this. Showing a Google form requiring the user to agree to preferential coverage for the Pixel. Oh, look at this.

By opting into this program, do you acknowledge that you are expected to feature the Google Pixel device in place of any competitor mobile devices? Please note that if it appears other brands are being preferred over the Pixel, we will need to cease the relationship between the brand and the creator. Yes, acknowledge our people This looks fake almost. Well, that's just a Google form. No, I know what I know what a Google form looks like I just mean like like this seems so

This seems like something that you'd be too smart to put in black and white, you know It seems like something that you'd be too smart to put in black and white, you know? Like Apple never says this outright. But is this like, we've both never even heard of this. Is this something that they're doing for reviewers? I don't think so. I don't think it's for reviewers. This seems like a product placement agreement,

which wouldn't that make sense? I feel like this is a very unpopular opinion. It would help prevent those really embarrassing, I love my Huawei whatever sent from my iPhone situations. Like I don't think this is a reviewer thing at all. What is Team Pixel? Does anyone know what Team Pixel is? I looked up Team Pixel and I found a Google blog article

that doesn't make any sense at all. It's just about like hashtag Team Pixel and it's if you take photos, but I don't think this is it. That seeds early units to influencers and super fans to drum up interest as brand ambassadors. Okay, so these are not reviewers. Yeah, so it's for brand ambassadors.

It's not for reviewers. This is a totally different thing. Okay, yeah, if you're supposed to be a brand ambassador, then you're a complete idiot if you're gonna like show off an iPhone. Show off competitor products more often than the brand that you're supposed to be the ambassador for. However, okay, I think it's the change that people are upset about. Okay.

Because the program's previous terms, which listed no specific expectations, also said that member content should always be truthful, accurate, and reflect your honest opinions and experiences. What does it say now? Well I don't know that we have the entire survey necessarily. We just have that one question. It says now by opting into this program do you acknowledge that you're expected to feature the Google Pixel device in place of any competitor mobile devices? Please note that if it appears other brands are being preferred yeah again though if you're a brand ambassador that makes sense reviewers are joining team pixel as well oh well I mean that's a huge problem

yes that's like obviously and objectively a huge problem yeah I've never even heard of the thing so I I don't know. That seems like a separate problem, though. Either way, Google gave the following statement to Android police. Team Pixel is a distinct program separate from our press and creator reviews programs. The goal of Team Pixel is to get Pixel devices into the hands of content creators, not press and tech reviewers. We missed the mark with this new language that appeared in the Team Pixel form yesterday and it has been removed. Okay.

Okay. Oh, why was the, oh man, how did this end up as a main news topic? The FTC says no to fake reviews. They have now finalized their rules, banning fake reviews online after spending almost two years working on them. The full text is in the FTC statement,

but PC World has summarized the rules like this. No reviews or testimonials from people who don't exist. That's gonna eliminate a lot of them. No buying reviews of any kind, positive or negative. I actually kind of love this. Does this mean that programs where you like get the thing on Amazon and it comes with like a voucher

and if you post a review, they'll give you something. Can that just go away now? Hopefully. A lot of this, was this not already illegal? Well, apparently not. Even, you gotta remember, the FTC is not necessarily, it doesn't have necessarily much fangs, depending on what the thing is,

and in fact, they've kind of been, their power's kind of been eroded lately which is if this is what they're up to that's a really bad thing for them to not be able to enforce this stuff i don't know what enforcement's going to look like but here let's get through the rest of it no reviews from company insiders like ya obviously no fake review sites oh interesting how do we define that though? That is very interesting. Because we had that whole conversation around

air purifiers a while back and how- House Fresh or whatever they're called. Yeah, yeah, so House Fresh to be clear is not the fake one. No, they're cool. House Fresh blog here, hold on a second. I'm gonna see if I can find it. These guys, yeah, yeah, here we go, here we go, here we go. How Google's killing independent sites like ours. And basically, they talk about how no one's ever tested any

of these air purifiers, but these large media companies have enormous SEO capabilities and relationships that allow them to surface their nonsense listicles above folks who are actually testing air-cute purifiers and dehumidifiers properly. And it's like a whole problem, it's a deep rabbit hole, but it's worth it to read that blog post, because you'll be like, oh my god, I can't trust anything, but hey, at least you'll- At least you'll know that. At least you'll know that.

I mean, I would say that something that sounds like a review from someone who's never touched the product is a fake review Personally, I don't know if that falls under this but should no review suppression Now that's interesting remember remember when Logitech was Blocking reviews on the gCloud if they were in a display reviews on your site. I Don't know. I mean look I haven't I haven't read this yet like as we don't know we take a principled approach to if they were negative. So if you're gonna display reviews on your site, you have to display all of them? I don't know. I mean, look, I haven't read this yet.

Yeah, we don't have a site, no. We take a principled approach to our reviews. On our site, the only things that we filter for are harmful language, hate speech, things that are obvious and nothing to do with people's critical feedback on the product. Uh-oh, what? No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, Yeah, yeah, I got him. Dan has never seen a review in his life, actually. He doesn't even know what they are.

I'm impartial. No, the only thing that I'm worried about is with no review suppression, is would you have to leave that stuff up? I certainly hope not. I hope not as well. But that gets interesting because like, where is the, how do you define

where the line is there? I don't know, but apparently the maximum civil penalty is $51,744 per violation. Whew. The last rule is no buying or selling fake followers or fake views. Good. Dan Ricks in full plane chat says, Yelp tries to extort business owners

to have negative reviews buried. Oh dude, man. Back when I was working at NCIX, I have no idea if this is still the case or whatever, whatever, whatever, whatever. But what I can talk about is the experience we had then. Do you know resellerratings.com? No.

Oh, okay. Well reseller ratings.com either is or was like a third party review site, like kind of a like an independent better business bureau type thing. And basically the only way that you could respond to reviews was to pay an extortionate amount of money to them. That's their entire model, is they collect negative reviews and essentially use them as leverage to make you pay to be able to make them go away. Yeah, so that was a whole thing. That was rough.

Yeah. Yeah. I'm gonna have to go in like a few minutes here fine be uncool You know you hasn't played super checks with me in weeks months Little loser I could I could call back in if you want though. Mmm. It's up to you. Yeah, maybe I'm over you Wow Wow Wow yourself. Oh, this is cool SteamOS

3.6.9 beta notes included added support for extra ROG ally keys. Valve's Lawrence Yang confirms they've been working on ally support with additional handhelds to come. The Steam Deck Twitter account also announced official Windows support for the Steam Deck OLED. The APU, audio, Wi-Fi, and Bluetooth drivers were linked in the tweet and drivers for the original LCD version are also available.

That's it. There's nothing to really discuss here other than that's super cool. What is this battlefield thing here? Does anyone care about this? The largest field for Battlefield? I don't know. I don't know anything about it. Okay, I'm gonna close that. Then I don't think I care about that. I haven't cared about Battlefield in a long time. I just keep releasing worse and worse games. Another long-running site comes to an end. Autoblog is done after recently celebrating their 20th anniversary. Employees were told the site had been sold off and September 13th will be the final day for Autoblog in its current form. This seems to have happened around the same time that Game Informer was abruptly shut down by GameStop. Autoblog has been sold to Arena Group, who used to publish Sports Illustrated. This is really interesting and actually ties into that

Air Purifier story that you guys should go look up, housefresh.com, and then how Google is killing independent site lists like ours. Because you might ask yourself, hey, well, if they're acquiring autoblog, why aren't they necessarily going to keep all the employees? Like, how are they going to publish articles? These guys get into it how what these groups do is they buy recognized brands, media brands, and then they just pump out AI assisted garbage, based on never having actually tried anything, and just kind of ride it into the ground, and then they go find another one. Pretty gross.

I don't know that Arena Group does that. Oh, here we go. Okay, yep, no, yep, okay. Arena Group, during their stint licensing the sports illustrated name, used the brand and at least one publication they owned, The Street, to publish AI generated articles that were credited to fake AI generated people

sick Good job, and that's it for our topics so It's after dark which means I guess you can go anytime you want or you can be cool and hang out with us No, I'm gonna have to I know I he has it he actually has something important to do I just I just like writing these gears and breaking his balls grinding his balls in my gears wait squeezing his I Got a merch message here for Luke Cognitive behavioral torture

I've got a few minutes we can do it. I miss watching your old streams on Classic WoW. I was like... Yeah, why do you have your stream anymore? I was the Shammy that joined your guild as Float Plane. Do you plan on playing the War Within? I didn't have a guild called Float Plane. Who did you play with? No, I think he joined as Float Plane.

Oh, okay, cool, yeah. What did you say, War Within? No, I'm not interested in new WoW stuff. In regards to game streaming in general though my roommate has moved out so eventually we have to do some renovation stuff. Did your roommate come get their stuff yet? Yeah. Nice. It's finally gone. It took like months. Anyways, that's fine. We need to do some renovation things now that he's gone. One of the reasons that we couldn't do them previously was because we didn't want to burden people with leaving our birds at their place, especially because they die so incredibly easily. And I don't want people to Are you starting to wonder if like your birds dying is like a don't even you can stop there That could that could end immediately

Anyways, so but by having by having the roommate God I'm just saying he eats a lot of chicken snacks Oh my god They were they weigh 30 grams each. You gotta think about how much that is like feathers and bones. I mean, you're watching your weight, right?

Oh my goodness. Dan, you know we're not funny, right? Like we're not even a little bit funny. No. I think it's just bullying. Like, I think this is just, it's just being mean at this point. I think that's more accurate. Luke, I'm sorry. You know what? I'm eating humble pie

You're eating like smug pie Yeah, you hacked me well, I'm gonna sell shirts about it I don't even... I'm just gonna give the money money away too. No, we're giving the money away. I'm eating a**hole pie. I don't even need it. Have a member of staff go buy me a pie. Anyways, yeah, now that he's out, we can seal off an area and work on it and have the birds separated from that area so they don't get drywall, drywall dust and yada yada yada. So now we can finally do things that we've needed to do for a while. And then once that's done, we're going to move our desks into that other room.

So now I can stream without being in the middle of the house with the mic picking up anything that you do. And if you want to move around almost at all needing to go on camera. So it won't be like basically just rude for me to stream and then the plan is to start streaming again. But I also don't play as many games as I used to. So it's not going to be as frequent as it used to, but I still want to stream sometimes. Yeah.

Looked purple. I thought maybe I pulled a Jack Warner. Look go home. We thought maybe I pulled a Jack Warner Look go home. We don't want you anymore. Yeah, I think it is about that time All right, see six. Maybe I should stream the end of it. Maybe you should! You walk away. Oh, there's no- You still can. There's no recovering from that. What is that?

98% of his body is covered in third degree burns. Oh my goodness. I would say I'd play it this weekend, but it's probably not gonna happen. Yeah, I know, I know, it's not gonna happen. Alright, it's me and Dan now. Lying to everyone. What's up, Dan? Hi. Just waiting for...

You can call back in if you want some... You want what? Sorry, call back in if you want some... Oh, I mean, you have to call back in to say bye. Oh, yeah, we can call him then. That's legally required. Yeah, don't worry, Luke. We've only got a handful of merch messages

that Dan curated. He apparently replied to the rest of them. All right. What a guy, What an absolute Chad. Yeah. I was talking about your keyboard. Well, yeah, man build it for me. It's got silent keycaps. That keyboard, man, it takes a pounding, you know?

Yeah. Like my self-esteem here. Eyo. Hey, LLD, love the D Google video. With the internet becoming more and more subscription-based and personal info farms, is there a way to make your own internet at home? Streaming, chat, Wiki, et cetera. I mean, I've definitely heard of projects

where people have backed up substantial portions of the internet. I mean, archive.org is obviously an example of that. And there'd be no reason that you couldn't host content locally and then configure... It would be woefully impractical for an individual, but I know that there are companies that do some significant caching of internet resources. Dan, can you think of a practical reason to do that? Streaming? No. No, you wouldn't be able to stream except to anyone who... And there'd be like an intranet on that point. It's not the internet anymore.

Dan Blewett I do know of some like, you know, cities or countries that have those kinds of underground internets and things like that. But yeah, it would be an internet. But then wouldn't that just be what the internet is as well? You know, just a smaller one. I know that a lot of ISPs have clauses where you're not allowed to share your internet with your neighbors. where you're not allowed to share your internet with your neighbors. Yeah, but in this case, like it would be, yeah, you'd have to have... Somebody would need to have an entry point. I know that there's, I think it's in Cuba, where they have like a USB stick, almost streaming service, where everybody just...

Yeah, sneaker net. Yeah, something like that. Yeah. Yeah, there would be, there would net. Yeah, something like that, yeah. Yeah, there would definitely be limitations to something like this, but absolutely, it is the kind of thing that could be built. But the thing you gotta understand is, if your issue is everything being subscription-based, there'd be a cost to hosting and distributing all of this.

A lot of money. And so people would have to subscribe to your... They would have to buy into the system. So it would be like, are you gonna get your own point to point link and buy all these servers? And then all of a sudden you've just built another internet. You've XKCD standards, standards dit.

And then you could brand it. Yeah, exactly. Oh no, you could sell it as an MLM. If you get four people on the network, we'll move you up to gold tier. Dan, like can you... And then you can have 4K movies. Can you try to be ever so slightly less full dystopia all the time? It's the only thing that lives in my mind is how much worse our society could be, and

every day I'm proved right. Okay, good job, Dan. What else do we have today? Also, why am I sitting here? Why am I sitting here the only one on camera? You ruined all my stuff. I had, here, I was like this. Oh yeah, sorry. Now Dan's on the show. Got him.

Cool, let's see. What else do we have? It looks like you closed that one. My bank blocks all international charges. I asked them to unblock a subscription. I was told they unblock for three months because they unblock the entire country. Have you all seen any terrible security? Oh dude, one of my favorites is some of my

information was compromised a while back and I forget whether it was Equifax or one of the other ones. But I had to sign up for credit monitoring and basically I was blown away to discover that at the time, I don't know if they do now, but at the time, they didn't support two factor authentication. Didn't support it. I literally was on the phone with customer service, I linked them to a blog post from their own website on the importance of two factor authentication. And I was like you guys don't have this how is this even possible and they're like is there anything else I can help you with absolutely blew my mind I think that's

probably the worst one that I've ever seen given the industry that they're in and given their company's obvious awareness of the importance of it. Honestly, I actually know I've got more. The fact that social security numbers and the equivalent here, which is your SIN number, your social insurance number, the fact that those cannot be changed or can be changed but with a great deal of effort is mind blowing to me. Especially given that

we've known for so many years now, for so many decades now, that they, with the number of people and organizations that you have to give them out to just to function as an adult, they cannot be considered proprietary information that only you know. I don't get it. I don't get that at all. Hey DLL, why haven't we seen more CAM2 in laptops since JEDEC, what would you call it? JDEC. JDEC officialized it last year.

Also, you ever think one of the big GPU vendors would ever try kind of cam implementation? No, GPUs are never going back to upgradeable memory. There's it's not in it's not a conspiracy theory. It's not an invention of you know, big PCB manufacturer that you can run memory at higher interface speeds if you bring it closer and closer and closer to the die and that the speeds that we're running at now, the shorter you can get those interconnects, the better the signaling is. And so that's the main reason along with the fact that the vast majority of people didn't

take advantage of it, that they moved away from upgradable VRAM on GPUs. It just, it wasn't practical anymore. And so back to CAM2 and laptops, compared to soldering directly to the motherboard, it's, even though it's no worse than sodium, it's still worse than soldering directly to the board from a thickness standpoint. And even though the signaling makes up for the limitations of SODIMM that have kept us from going beyond, I think it's 5600 megatransit per second. It's not a lot. Yeah, something like that. And they've gone way beyond that in some laptop designs by moving the memory either onto the board or even onto the package, like what Apple's been doing. It's still not as good as being on the board,

right next to the CPU and GPU for that matter, depending on the kind of memory. I think you're talking about CPU memory. So next to the CPU or being right on the package. So I don't know how much Momentum Cam 2 is or isn't going to gain. I mean, I know Lenovo has that one mobile workstation I'm hoping for the best

But this this actually was a this was kind of a Controversial point back when we did our what is it Strix point? Whatever rise in AI 300 review and I said that Right now AMD does not have support for non-soldered memory and I can't say anymore. People said, look, hey, it says on their site that they support it. No. Note, okay, I'll say I'll say this note that there isn't a single laptop design

That has so do memory note that Just note it That's all Can't really say more. I Work as a drywall taper I'm wondering if Linus has any horror stories dealing with drywallers at your job as a painter. I've seen some bad drywall jobs and felt bad for you guys. Love the show. I mean, every construction project that we've ever done has had some really questionable drywall work

done. Overall, I think the vast majority of the people we've ever worked with have been Overall, I think the vast majority of the people we've ever worked with have been industrious and tidy, at least as much as you can be when your entire job is to put mud on things and create dust, you know? But it only takes sort of one careless person to just kind of slop something together and go, ah, good enough. I mean, it's not like it's my building, to create problems. I'd say one of the funniest ones that I saw recently was in the Call Me Chris upgrades. So you can actually, I think it's in the last part where I, or no, oh, it's in the, I

think it's in the Float Plane exclusive, where I go after the shoddy craftsmanship of the of the drywalling at her place and just how bad her paint job is, both because the paint job is bad and because the drywalling under it is terrible. Got two for one, eh? Yeah. Hi guys, given how divisive some products can be, are there any tech products that everyone seems to hate

but that you guys actually like? What do you think, Dan, you got anything on this one? I was trying to think of something. Because I feel like it's gonna be a cop-out for me to just say PS portal again. And to be clear, I don't actually like the PS portal. I didn't buy one. I don't even have a PlayStation. But everyone seems to hate it. And it was very clear to me as someone who really liked the Nvidia shield and as someone who likes game streaming in general, that it that it that it clearly had a use it clearly had had a

target audience that that would be very passionate about it and people didn't really seem to people didn't really seem to agree I don't know Dan you you got anything like what is it what does everyone what does everyone hate I mean I liked Vista which yeah yeah I'm gonna come over there yeah there we go no the cameras backwards yeah yeah exactly hmm no I can't think of anything that like everyone seems to hate seems like everybody like likes everything was the call me Chris club three years ago no I was oh my god yeah I've nearly been here three years now seriously oh god Seriously? Oh god. Well, okay, next up. Anywho. Did you guys check into doing a collaboration with Edison Motors? You talked about trying after the Hubba-loo with that grant they didn't get under unusual circumstances.

No, it was only two years ago. Oh, geez. You guys are killing me here. Okay, cool. I think we might have something going, but I don't want to promise anything because I'm not the one dealing with it and I don't know all the details, but I think that they're super cool and I think we're super cool with how super cool they are and we want to do something together, but I don't know when. I don't know when the plan is for that.

Ping Pong Greater Than Badminton. What say you, LLD? I guess it's just LD. Just want to hear your thoughts on table tennis. Table tennis is sick. I've been getting back into it and it's good exercise. It looks like so much fun to play it at a high level, but for me, I just, there's no way that I could justify switching to it right now because the learning curve. You could probably get more courts in Smash Champs. Right, well, I mean, sort of.

It depends on the level people are playing at. Then you see those high level games People are running all over the place. That's true. That's extremely true. Like I know I know like no no like mile Yeah, you probably get the same amount of yeah Yeah I mean yeah most people are basically like standing right at the end of the table until plinky plink plink plink right, but Man, no, I I, for me to get enjoyment out

of it, I would need to play at the same kind of level that I can play badminton at. And for me to play table tennis at that level, I'd have to play for years, or I could just spend those years playing badminton and having fun instead of sort of banging my head against a brick wall learning curve. In 2019, Texas Instrument tried banning assembly coding from their calculators but reached a middle ground with coders after backlash from WAN show viewers. What's your favorite time WAN show caused a good change? Did I know about this? I don't know. Is this a thing? This is before my time. There's no way this is a thing.

I don't think this is a thing. I don't think Texas Instruments even knows who we are. Texas Instruments. Might be in Gaslit. Wanshow assembly code. What? No, there's no way. Does anyone know anything about this? It says TI and calculators. I assumed it was Texas Instruments. Yeah, no, I mean, yeah, that's... I don't think we did that. We definitely give some love hugs from time to time. I remember the time we brought down the Noctuo website, but...

Hey. Look, if you guys know more than I do, and there's any information about this that maybe you can get to us next week, maybe we can look into that, but I, no, no, I don't know. Okay. Hey Linus, how much do you credit networking with your success as an entrepreneur? I help college students with networking

and would love examples that you have to use as examples. I Suck at networking. I I have probably the smallest Rolodex of Anyone that I know of it who sort of has a has a career like mine I literally don't even have contact information anymore for people that I have literally collaborated with before. Like, okay, I just mentioned, call me Chris. I don't have a functioning contact information for her that I know of anymore. I totally suck at like the relationship building side of things. The cold hard truth is I got into making YouTube videos not because I'm a people person but because I'm a computer person.

The rest of it all just happened accidentally. I just liked tinkering with computers and stuff. You are absolutely right to emphasize the importance of networking with your students, but I suck at it. I think Theo is an excellent example of networking done correctly. Basically, hey, I know a guy, you should talk to this other guy. And then you just do that forever. And then everybody knows everybody and you're in the center of everybody's universe. Yeah, yeah just do that forever. And then everybody knows everybody and you're in the center of everybody's universe. Yeah, yeah, I don't. That's a crazy skill. That can be your entire careers just doing that. A big part of

like my approach to the business has been we'll just make sure our product is great and then it won't really matter like if I play the game and suck up and whatever else. You just hire somebody with networking skills to do you a business, right? Well, I mean, yeah, right? That was kind of the plan with Taron. Like he knows everybody.

He knows me. He's one of the few people that like I know, but he has all those connections. Like that's his thing. That's not my thing. Exactly. Support network not my thing. Exactly. Support network is very important. Hey Linus, I'm very late, but just checking in to see if you watched the SEF.

Stanley Cup final. I know you're a Canucks guy when you watched hockey from a prior video. Did it give you joy to see Edmonton lose out? Not even a little. I mean, Edmonton, even going into the start of the playoffs, I think Edmonton had the most Canadians on their roster out of any out of any team. So like while it, you know, obviously wasn't great to watch them beat Team Sweden. No, I was I was I was actually rooting for

Edmonton. The truth of it though is I don't really, I see teams as businesses. So beyond just kind of the fun of being in the atmosphere where everyone's cheering for the same business, you know, let's go team Aqualini. I don't really care. My investment in is pretty low. I tend to get more into the storylines of the players themselves.

Seeing Paul Maurice, for example, who was coming up on or was already the winningest coach in NHL history who had never won a Stanley Cup or something like that or whatever the the kind of story was there, like how many times he'd gotten so close. Like I was kind of able to appreciate it from that perspective even though I was cheering for Edmonton in the final. I didn't like seeing that team who worked really hard and who I'd followed more closely and sort of built a weird parasocial connection with some of those players, you know, get beaten by the players that I didn't really care about even as much. But yeah, at the end of the day, like to me, the jerseys, they're just businesses. These are just,

these are just emblems that are purchased by billionaire business owners. it's not very meaningful to me. Whereas like, you know, some of the individual athletes I can certainly get a lot more on board with, like here in Vancouver, the Sedin twins are like local heroes, not just for what they did on the ice, but for all the contributions that they've made to really meaningful causes for their reputation as being super down to earth people. The fact that they've stuck around and continued to work at the organization, even though they could have just f***ed off back to Sweden the second that their contract was up as players. You know, it seems cool.

You know, it seems like they're members of the community as opposed to just hired guns who play hockey, right? So. And last one I've got today. Oh, and a couple of people have found the WAN clip as well when we're talking about the TI 84. Looks like it was from June 18th, 2020. I know we- Cone Lemon and Noke as well. What does this have to do with the WAN show? This is someone else's video. Developer CE concept. Okay, WAN show. Handle the situation better than TI.

Yeah, I don't think this... I know about the situation with TI, but what I don't know is that TI acknowledged us or that we made any difference in any way. That's what I don't, that's what I have not seen any evidence of. Hmm. Hmm. Okay, whatever. Last merch message I've got for you then. Hope this isn't rude, but since you went and cancelled the Merino t-shirt and MA, MAC address Mach Neck got any recommendations for alternate brands of similar quality to you.

No, actually. Hopefully we can bring back stuff like that more in the future, but apparel sales has been a little rough this year, especially with some of the less boring stuff, anything other than t-shirts, hoodies. It's one of those funny things where I think we have a really strong reputation among our buyers for creating quality products, but that doesn't necessarily mean, how do I put this? creating quality products, but that doesn't necessarily mean how do I put this, that it's easy for us to sell stuff that's a little bit more, a little bit more stylish. So it's something that we're really working on right now trying to figure out, you know, what an

identity is that we can build where we can take advantage of our strength, which is our attention to detail and our uncompromising passion for making high quality products, but also the sometimes kind of basicness of our audience. I mean, the reality is I'm one of you, right? Like I wear t-shirts, I like jeans and you know, like I get it, But there's tough business realities for us to, for us to figure out if we want to do more,

more niche products like that. Yeah. Oh, okay. All right. Thanks for tuning in to the WAN show this week. We will see you again next week same bad time same bad channel Bye Nice thanks Luke. Oh Dan you're floating in the ocean and oh no, I'm drowning in a volcano. Oh, no

What would you say? Luke you're drowning? Yeah, okay, bye. Okay, bye. Thanks, Luke. He really does care. Oh, Luke is a real one for that. I ate way too much pie. That was brutal.