The Watch - It’s Time to Check Back into ‘The White Lotus’

Episode Date: February 17, 2025

Chris and Andy break down the Season 3 premiere of ‘The White Lotus.’ They talk about what the central mystery will be for this season, Mike White’s specific talent for casting this show, and who on the cast they’re most excited to watch this season. Hosts: Chris Ryan and Andy Greenwald Senior Producer: Kaya McMullen Video Production: Chris Thomas and Stefano Sanchez Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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It's Amy Poehler, and I'm launching a new podcast called Good Hang. In preparation for that, I asked some of my friends to send in some videos and give me some advice. Just be yourself and the guests will come. Just if you're going to do this, really do it. Commit to it. Don't be the celebrity that this is their like sixth thing they're doing. Have a good podcast.

Keep your approval rating. I hear you got a new gig, girl. That's so fabulous. So glad you're working. It's not part for me. I love true crime and cooking podcast. Is there any way you could combine the two? So you're doing a podcast.

That is awesome. Would you happen to know my blood type? I've got to put it down on this form. Hey, I got an email from my agent saying I need to record a video for you for charity, but then I clicked the link and it took me to a GoFundMe page. So I kind of have a bad feeling about this. Well, everyone has an opinion and a podcast. So join me for good hang.

It's rough out there. We're just trying to lighten it up a little. I need sports to have to clear the room. Stand up and walk now. Hello, and welcome to The Watch. My name is Chris Ryan. I am an editor at the ringer.com, and joining me here in the Hotel, California,

it's Andy Greenwald. Feels really good to be here, talking to you about a new season of the White Lotus, and it feels particularly appropriate that we are doing it as our third podcast of the morning in a studio that currently has the humidity levels of Pouquet Thailand. It's great to see you.

We've been hanging out for a while, but we wanted to make sure we did our first episode recap of White Lotus. Before we get into the nitty-gritty of it, how do you feel about being back, man? I thought you were going to make a housekeeping joke because we're doing a hotel show.

Well, housekeeping, I will say, housekeeping, obviously you can watch us on ringer-dash TV. You can listen to us on Spotify. You can watch us on Spotify. You can follow us on Instagram at the watchpod underscore, and you can hit us up with emails at The Watch at Spotify. You can also listen to Bill Mal and Joe recap this episode of White Lotus on the Prestige TV podcast, and I'm sure that's going to be awesome.

We're going to take a little bit of a wider angle here to discuss the return of this show, this unlikely blockbuster, I would say. And Thai politics. Were you not prepared to do that? We should also say that we were recording this early. So if any other news happened, cultural news happened over the weekend, right? We're not covering it. We will talk about SNL 50 at some point, but we haven't seen it. at the time of recording this podcast.

We obviously did that whole podcast about our favorite performers and our feelings about the show. Greenwald, as this episode began, I did think about what an unlikely success story this is in some ways. In some ways, like, yes, obviously

it sort of leans into certain mystery box elements, not in the sort of paradise or severance ways, but there is a mystery usually in each season of who's in the coffin, What's the crime? This season opens with probably the most sort of breathtaking crime.

It's obviously implied that there's a mass shooting going on at the resort. They were right in the middle of it. Yes. And that is sort of, I think gives it a little bit of a different tone. And I think tonally this season felt a bit different to me, a little less fun-loving, or not even fun-loving, a little less comic. I agree with this. but at the same time, very interesting to see

that this is the third season of White Lotus and that there are just things that Mike White is going to do visually, things that he is going to do in terms of this is exactly how these people are going to be introduced to us each time. And this is no way of criticism. It was almost like,

you can almost take the first episode off, not watch it, but your brain can kind of be functioning at a little bit of a lower frequency because there are these familiar dances that these new dancers are doing the steps to it. There's a familiar rhythm to it. And this is the checking in episode.

And we can take our time checking in and spending time with people individually. And even, you know, the show beautifully and brilliantly staggers their arrival off of the boat. So then we get a moment to introduce each grouping and sort of understand the stakes and the interpersonal relationships before moving forward and cross-pollinating.

What you're saying about unlikely is really worth a little bit more of a dive into because, you know, I talk a lot on the show about how the entire industry behind the scenes has spent the last year, year and a half, two years, desperately scrambling to future proof itself. Yeah. What can we as an industry do to just make stuff people like, to do, to make stuff that feels familiar, to keep whatever precarious hold we have on people's attention as it is increasingly competed with by literally everything else in the history of time. And, you know, so that's why we get

shows that we love, like the pit, which are doing their best to be like, hey, we're doing ER again, kind of, but legally we're not allowed to say that. Why, you know, I keep making this joke, but it stays relevant. The Jack Donagie on 30 Rock line about making it 1997 again by science or magic is actually the walking orders for a number, a worrying number of development executives. All of this is to say the fact that Mike White stumbled into making the absolute ideal procedural show for the prestige era. It just makes it more remarkable. So historically, the reason we have this show is because during the pandemic, Casey Blois at HBO was casting around desperately for something that he could put into production. Yes.

What can we make? Somehow passed on my idea for a Secret Service agent in a cavern in a mountain in a mountain. and leading a new society after an apocalypse. That was odd. I will say whatever email address you sent your other idea about a Philadelphia crime task force stealing drug money, that email has been compromised. That leaked or was hacked because it seeds spread across town. So in looking for something to do, he reached out to Mike White, who had a, you know,

has already at that point had a successful career and was very well regarded internally within the town but hadn't had like a massive forward-facing hit other than like school of rock I guess and certainly not on TV well in fact I think Mike White had been an example of someone who had really struggled to find a consistent like footing in Hollywood where you know he had the enlightened had been like his baby and was beloved yeah sure yeah but more of a cult hit more of a cult hit exactly but one thing that Casey knew about Mike was that he can write very quickly. And it's his own industry in a lot of places.

Right, he writes and directs and can basically cut down on overhead. He will make something himself. And so the mandate was, can you make something within these parameters? And sometimes even the most wildly creative people do best when they have guardrails. And it was like, I always want to do something at a hotel. And incredible to believe, but the Four Seasons Maui wasn't doing so great that summer of 2020. And here we are. And so they kind of backdoored their way into something that is truly remarkable.

It is autourish. Mike White writes and directs every episode, but it is dependable. The only reason we had this long gap between seasons is because of the strike. It is formulaic in that there is an absolute formula to it. And the star of the show, season to season, is, well, you could say it's a resort, or you could say it's the idea of luxury. Or the thematic, whatever. the distinct thematic ideas of the season itself are.

I mean, I think that was a little bit more clear in the first season than the second season, maybe. Maybe. I see what you're going for. But I find it to be such a great bucket for him to work with. And what I mean by that is, like, we've talked before about this idea that certain showrunners, creators, they'll find a sturdy enough frame to build any kind of house. And in fact, sometimes they'll be like, I'm just. just going to do an addition here because what I like is this idea about gambling or I like this idea about, you know, cheating or I like this idea about crime or whatever. And I thought always,

regardless of whether or not you thought it was great throughout its run or bad or whatever, billions is a good example of this. I've brought it up before where it just was obviously a compliment and Levine where like we can get anything into billions. Like anything that we're interested in, sports, it's a load-bearing vessel. Yeah. And it's like these guys, money has its hands in everything. So through Axe Capital, we can touch on all these different topics and it keeps the show itself interesting.

Mike White has both the ability to do that and also to refresh his cast every year, although it's notable that there is a returning character from the first season back in... Two are great. There's two of them. I wanted to ask you a little bit about... We wouldn't be the watch if we weren't like...

Is there anything about... about White Lotus that you're like concerned trolling? Like even after one episode of third season... Absolutely not. Okay. I am more in than I've ever been. Partly was I thought the first episode of this season was excellent. I also thought it was excellent kind of in the same way that I'm really enjoying the sturdy frame of the pit.

I was like, I know where I am right away. And the... You know you're on to something good when, essentially, you're not even on the journey yet, you're just revving the engine, but the sound of the engine is really comforting and also exciting. Yeah. I love that. I also feel like Mike White himself is now kind of believing in the sturdiness of this frame. I mean, nobody thought the first season was going to be as successful as it was, and I'm sure it took some convincing to be like, you could do this again.

And do you have the ideas for it? It seems like he is gaining strength and confidence as the show. moves forward. And so the things that he is excellent at, which are wide-ranging, but also very specific, he is god-tier in terms of casting, seeing what is within performers, even performers we know, and writing to those things so that they can be at their best. He is incredible at a shorthand of emotional shorthand, basically, like introducing us to a lot of a wide world with a of specifics, but doing it with like a minimum of brushstrokes. We instantly know a lot of these people and we understand both the specificity of their

interactions and their relations, but also the general meaning of it in terms of relatability for humanity. He also is very funny and very campy and is able to almost always, with some exceptions, even within the show, I think to my taste, find the long. between drama and melodrama when he does that. And as a director, he's a very humanistic and actor-friendly director that is also quite taken with location. And there's a version of American director goes to Thailand,

to film Thailand and Thailand's culture that is a little bit appropriety. And then there's the version of it where the purpose of your show is American tourists coming to a curated artificial version of this country and luxury and filmed accordingly. Do you know what I mean? So it steers into itself in a way that allows him to have like, oh, there's monkeys everywhere, but also like, oh shit, there's monkeys everywhere. Yeah, I thought, I mean, just like, you know, and we'll start to get into the episode in a second, but just the level of care that he puts into it, there's a version of this show that is much more cookie cutter, and that is much more turnkey, and doesn't pay attention to the difference in what

it would be like to arrive from the States in Italy versus what it's like to arrive in Thailand. And I've actually never been to Asia, so I'm not speaking from experience, but just the idea of the extremity of the jet lag, the extremity of the weather, the humidity, the conditions, like the wildlife, all that stuff that just immediately, like, he's got an eye for all of it. Obviously, he's doing location shooting. He had this cast in Thailand for months. It was essentially, like, they, one of the... the things that's really cool about this show is that the cast essentially is living out

a version of what their characters are experiencing by this dislocation of being in a foreign country, but also living in and around this resort and shooting in this resort. And I think they can't help but start to have a degree of authenticity to these performances that are sort of driven by that. Does it help or hurt my standing on this podcast if I say that I've written, I've not only been to Phuket, I've written Grantland blog posts from Pouquet. Do you remember what you wrote? There was some, I don't know if it was like a everyone-contributes kind of piece. Did you feel like Bill was not respecting your work-life balance when you were in Phuket?

Well, it's a complicated thing because did I tell Bill that I was in Pouquet when he asked me to contribute to something? No. Was this year one of Grantland like five months in? So I didn't really feel like I had the leverage. P-S, Bill. I got a little vacation plan. But the sound of, and it's the show so brilliant at doing this, the sound of the humidity and the birds and the trees and that feeling of warmth. Yeah.

Jungley warmth did make me think of explaining why Terriers was underrated and should have gotten a second season on FX. Would you go back to Thailand? Are you a Thai guy? I would, I, what do they say? LBH? Losers back home. I might have no other place to go. Yeah.

I'll say that, you know, again, this is like kind of, you know, kind of hackneyed like ball scribe journalism, but I did go, as you said, I did, this is on the other podcast, you said this, I went to the premiere here and I watched the show with our rival podcaster Mallory. It was lovely time together. There's no rivalries at the ringer. No, but apparently between us and ringerverse there is. Is there? Because of Manzukas.

Oh, yeah. Well, I can't speak to his integrity. Fair. Fair. His honor. And Mike White was obviously in attendance, and he introduced the screening, and it's very, very funny to see a guy

who is so eloquent on the page and his performed life thing. He's very like, I'm sorry. Yes. I guess people who've seen him on Survivor know that that's kind of a thing. It's funny because it's like on one hand, he's like a ball of nerves, and on the other hand, there's like something,

there's a machine turning over his mind all the time. So it's... I think, the thing that stood out for me is, like, you go to one locker room and you're like, hey, everybody likes each other and respects each other. That might not be the whole story. But what was notable was how personal this experience is both for him and for everyone who is there. Because when he was name-checking all the people who, like, saved his life, made the show possible, long list of Thai crew, some of whom who were there, they're doing a second premiere in Bangkok. But when he was, like,

going through the cast list and through the crew and, like, the people who've worked with him forever, there were these shouts and screams in the crowd. And it, It really did feel personal and bespoke, and that may be the best case scenario for the kind of discredited, a tourist model of television, or just a point to what you were saying, which is this is unique, because everybody is equally far away.

Yeah. And that that imbues something different in the production. Before we get into the episode, I will just say, this is a quote-unquote super-sized season of White Lotus. Oh, is it? I think it's slightly longer than previous seasons. I believe it's 10 episodes.

I think that's interesting. I think it's eight. It seems to be eight. But maybe not. Okay. I thought it was long. Maybe nine? Maybe there'll be bonus episodes.

Outtakes. I don't know. Okay. You're looking at the internet. Maybe I'm operating under a misassumption. I was only bringing that up in terms of pacing. And in terms of the sort of like how much ground they want to cover per hour, how much stuff they want to touch on with the mystery. that they introduce in the first scene.

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But before we do, this White Lotus Season 3 recap is brought to you by Coffee Mate. You know, one thing I really love about HBO's original series, The White Lotus, is that it really does a great job creating its own universe and drawing viewers into whichever location, the season is set. I mean, I really do want to go to Thailand now, or just a tropical vacation, you know, minus all the drama. But luckily, a sip to paradise is a quick drive away to the grocery

store with CoffeeMate's new limited time flavors inspired by HBO's original series, The White Lotus, set in Thailand. There's two new flavors. Thai, iced coffee, and peanut colada flavored creamers, and they are the perfect addition to your beverages while watching the show. And now to today's White Lotus recap. Now, as a recap, I thought I would just sort of, touch on each of the groups of characters that we got introduced to because most of the episode is them arriving,

is them checking into their rooms, deciding on their health missions. And you did say, though, previously, that the opening is a little bit of a break from tradition in that I think in past seasons we had the discovery, either the reveal of a body

being loaded onto a plane in season one, a body arriving on, washing up on the beach in season two, where we got a little bit of flavor of the characters we would soon get to know. This is the first one that kind of jumped us in in media res, right? Like something's going on and then we actually don't... I think we're seeing the crime rather than the result of the crime.

Yes, and we don't even know the scope of it. Yeah, it seems bad. It doesn't seem great. That character that we see in the first scene, I think we can make a deduction. I feel confident about that. That it's Belinda's son. Because Belinda is back from White Lotus season,

when Natasha Rothwell, who sadly her own series, How to Die Alone was recently canceled. I hope it finds a new home because I really did enjoy it. It was really good. And she is one of my favorite performers. She's back as Belinda, who people remember from season one is getting not scammed by Tanya,

but kind of hung out to drive by Tanya. Take an advantage of you. Where Tanya was going to invest in her own spa, and they kind of used her as like a sounding board throughout that whole first season. And then the second she had a date, abandoned Belinda, and then decided to kind of squirrel off with her money.

She was obviously going through a lot. Anyway, I suppose we can mention now, obviously, if you're listening to this, you've watched the episode, there's another character who appears from season one. And that is Greg, who was Tanya's date in the first season and is someone who is very elusive during the second season for most of it. And then turns out to have been the architect of her demise. He's back. He's in Thailand. He's at another White Lotus resort and he has a younger girlfriend. He's not at the resort. He is living...

He's living on the top of a hill above the resort, but they come down to the hotel for... To use the bar. Goods and services and for food and stuff like that. But let's get into the other cast members that we meet. Okay, because then I do want to talk about the Gregness of it all. Yeah, we'll get to Greg in a second. But Leslie Bibb, Carrie Coon, and Michelle Monaghan are my top three draft picks,

and they play Kate, Lori, and Jacqueline, respectively. They're three lifelong friends celebrating a victory tour, but you could also tell a backbiting Olympics, Like every time one of them leaves the room, they're going to be talking about the other. Michelle Monaghan's Jacqueline is a TV star. Yes. And has bankrolled this extravagant girls' trip to celebrate their long friendship. Yes.

And not seeing each other as much as they would like to in recent years. Yes. And she and Leslie Bibb's character, whose name is what? Kate. Seemed to be in a little bit of a tit for tap, like, who's successful, who's looking their best, who's having the better treatments. Yeah, I think Jacqueline's clearly the alpha, but Leslie Bibb is like, I live in Texas and I'm pretty rich. Yes.

And Carrie Coon, as Lori, is not. Yes, she lives in New York and is struggling in her professional life. And has a terrible thirst for Rose. Yes. Well, whom'st amongst us? In that heat, every shot she's drinking a lot. Walton Gaggins and Amy Lou Wood play Rick and Piper, a couple with an age gap and an attitude gap.

Did you write that or you just... I wrote that. That's really good. That's a CR original bar and she's sweet and he is not. She is a lovely young woman. Walton Gagins seems to, his Rick character seems to be distracted by something at that hotel. Like he seems to be thinking about something else. Are you, I'd never watch, is it sex education that Amy Lou Wood is on?

I've not watched that show. So I've never seen her before. She's awesome. She's a great right out the gate. Yeah, she's fantastic. their relationship in some ways what's going on with Walton Gagins was a bigger mystery to me than the crime in the beginning.

Although it seemed pretty obvious to me after the first episode, but we can get back to it. Jason Isaacs, Parker, Posey, Patrick Schwarzenegger and Sarah, Catherine Hook, play the Ratliff family. Sam Navola Erasure will not stand. Oh my God, Sam Navajo, my bad. Emily Mortimer and Alessandra Naval's son.

Son of my number one, Emily Mortimer. It's funny that that family has two Nepos in it? Yes. You know, like it kind of like it sort of works with the way that this family is constructed. It's like a sort of rich North Carolina family, I believe, of, um... Very much North Carolina. Very much North Carolina. Like, all the kids either go to Duke or UNC. Um, and there seems to be some financial stress on the mind.

It emerges. It emerges. There's quite a bit. Of, of Jason Isaacs' character. Can't really tell exactly what he does. It seems like he does money. Private equity or something. He does money like Ken does beach. Yeah. And then Natasha Rothwell, as Belinda, the returning character, she's in Thailand to learn healing techniques from the staff at the White Lotus in Thailand

and then take them back to Maui with her. I wonder if there's a healthy rivalry between Maui and Thailand in terms of where people are more well. Who gets more well? Yeah. And... What about the staff? Yeah, I was going to say, Lelisa Menobal is Mook, a health mentor who, was working with primarily,

I think she's working with Rick and, with Gaggins' character. At least at the start, and I know you know that she is also, Lisa and Black Pink. Black Pink is often in your area. That's what they say at the beginning of the songs. Where is your K-pop knowledge at? Black Pink.

Okay. And then finally we've got Tame Tempting Tong, who is Guy Toc, a security guard who has a thing for movie. And a motorbike. And a motorbike. He's willing to use it. Yep. So that recap, such as it is, just of all the characters, was brought to you by Coffee Maid.

Coffee Maids, the White Lotus flavors are only available for a limited time. So go try them now and stream the HBO original series on Max. Greenwald, where do you want to start with those characters? Well, I mean, I kind of want to just start globally or locally. And what I mean by that is I loved being in Thailand with this show. I loved the vibes. I loved the very subtle details like the Thai language superimposed beneath the subtitles for when the Thai characters were speaking. I just loved the sense of place and the sounds of the jungle and of the ocean and of the spa.

Like I just thought it was a very sensory experience, a wellness experience, if you will, just to be there. Which was exciting. And, you know, and a nice change from everything being shot in Atlanta, Vancouver. or Leaveston outside of London. That's awesome. I will also say that I felt prior to Chelsea, Amy Lou Wood's character, going down to the bar,

what I thought was like a pretty exciting focus and momentum in getting this thing going. I think you alluded a moment ago to saying that you felt it was a little less comedic at first. I thought that everything was clicking. Parker Posey is funny. I mean, yeah. I thought everything was.

clicking in a way that felt a little, not stakesy because the show is always steaksy, but definitely it wasn't as campy. And if, it is a tribute to Mike White that, like, if you remove Jennifer Coolidge, who's next up? We just did a pot on Friday. We were like when Chevy Chase left the show and then Bill Murray stepped in. When Coolidge goes, Parker Posey, we've been waiting for the posisance for a long time. And she is ready for this moment. And she is hilarious.

She's got the southern action. I mean, she's from Louisiana, but she has this accent dialed in. She's incredible. So that is there. But kind of what I was feeling, though, was the lack of coolidge all due respect to her in a positive way. Because until the season came full circle with the gays trying to kill her in season two, she did feel like an appendage. You know, and the show kind of steered into it because she is a more extravagant character. It was hard to have her make sense with some of the more serious aspects of the show.

Her not being there felt really strong. And like, okay, now we're kind of like drilling down a little bit deeper. and then Greg shows up. Yeah. And I am interested to see where it goes, and I reserve the right to be delighted by Mike White's ability to weave these things into each other in a way that it's not expected.

But that was my only bump, and I don't mean to start with the criticism, but I was so locked in to starting a lot of it fresh. Yeah, that was... Going backwards almost felt strange. A little bit, because in the sense that, like, I didn't know, maybe viewers are watching it differently, like justice for...

what's your name, for Jennifer Coolidge. Tanya. For Tanya, wasn't at the top of my wish list for this season, although it may be where we end up. I mean, I think that obviously Greg's presence and Belinda's presence will, there will be a Tanya storyline thing that needs to be settled, whether it's Greg's sort of comeuppance or Belinda's getting,

like, her financial compensation for what she feels like she's owed there. I think that it's a really smart, wise thing that he's doing by having there be some through lines, but maybe not the ones you'd always expect. Yeah, he is really good about it. To me, it was unexpected to have Coolidge come back. I mean,

I know that he's obviously incredibly affectionate towards her, but it also is a testament to his, I don't know, his discipline as a creative person to kill that character off in the second season. Yeah.

That's if you could, there's another world of White Lotus where it's just like, Tanya in different locations doing funny things while other people do stuff. Yeah, you know what I mean? And I think that

some people, maybe even Jennifer Coolidge, might have thought that that was an overly tragic end to her character, and certainly caps the amount that she's able to contribute going forward. Maybe she'll show up as a Force Ghost on season three. But, yeah, I was happy to have some connective tissue to previous seasons. And I do feel like the Rothwell character

is a really good bridge between the staff who were from there and living in Thailand and the guests like in terms of her and her kind of like being in this situation where she is at once dining in the restaurant alone but is also

quote unquote working is an interesting kind of limbo to put that character in. And I think that one of the things that Mike White clearly considers before each season and location is why do people come to these places? Yes. I think that the people, even the characters are kind of

almost openly considering it as well in this season. Yeah, and in this case, are they escaping something, like the friends or celebrating something? Are they seeking something? Which is the case with the Rattler family, specifically Piper, the middle child, played by Sarah Catherine Hook, who's like... A theology student. I'm here to talk to a monk. Yeah. And so I brought my whole family here.

But when she goes down to the temple for the first time, seems like inhibited about... Yes. Like, she's, like, not ready to go and experience that. And then there is... in the form of Greg, and then maybe even a little bit in Walton Gaghan's, like the show is going at the other reason, a large reason for tourism in Thailand, which is either like sort of chancing sex tourism, money tourism,

some piece of that. Say more. I was there to write blog posts about sports and entertainment for the Walt Disney Corporation. I can't. I just go to East London, man. That's it, man. But, so the Goggins character, as you said, is distracted and he's not enjoying anything,

and he seems unduly focused on the American husband of the woman who is the founder of the wellness program and is a former celebrity. It's also unclear where he gets the financial backing to be living like this. Yeah, because it seems like he's basically been bouncing around with this girl in Bali and Australia or whatever and just kind of moving around that way. Yes. And so Lech Patravadi plays Sri Tala, who's one of the owners who is excited to meet Jacqueline the celebrity, but is getting all this attention from Gagins. So my supposition was that the missing American man is his father. Yeah. And that he's real pissed about something, some inheritance, something that is owed to him. And that he's bothered by that.

He's also bothered by Jason Isaacs. They just rub each other wrong. You know? Yeah. Gagins is just puffing on darts in public. Isaacs doesn't like that. Do you remember a lot of outdoor smoking when you were in Thailand? The air is so thick already.

And again, as I said, I was mostly glued to my laptop for a lot of the time. So I can't say I can't really speak to that. But it was real hot. That would be amazing if you have no memories of Thailand because you were blocking. I have no memories of much of that decade. A couple of things I really liked about these sort of opening scenes. one was the the layered

not the class system I guess it would be a class system through the eyes of the hotel owner where it was like Jacqueline was clearly the the golden goose of all of these people arriving and this woman used to be a performer herself and there's obviously like this element

of nighttime, dinnertime performances by the staff for the guests but I thought that was cool how like even the rat lifts sort of feel brushed aside. Oh, yeah, I mean, usually their money... It takes them anywhere they want. And their personal narrative. Like, their brand is that they are golden.

They are likable. They are, look, they have their... The world will be delighted by their little quirks and conversations. Now, one of the quirks that is starting a conversation is that they're real sexy to each other. Yes, that the siblings especially seem to have, or at least the Patrick Schwarzenegger character.

He's the most White Lotus character so far. I would say. The thing I like about this show, by the way. Is that I always start one place with characters. Yes. And they, you know, like the Sydney Sweeney character in season one, you might begin one place and then it kind of evolves over the course of the season. Like there's depth to these people.

So Saxon Ratliff seems just like, you know, Charlie Kirk on stuff. steroids or whatever you think he is. But I think he'll probably wind up having layers. May it may not be layers you personally like, but there's no character. It's just going to be a surface level character. So he's talking a lot about his sister's... Sexual. ...experiences or lack thereof.

He is very interested in his younger brother's pornography habits and considers, at least briefly, putting on a bit of a, like a demo for him. Well, he goes right to the hub. He goes in all senses. Yeah. And then my guy Sam Navola's watching his brother. Yeah. Kind of like maybe that's, again, we're only children.

As only children who can say. We don't know how it's supposed to go, you know, or what happens behind the doers. So that's how they do things in that family. Literally that. But yeah, the rising tension there is that the Wall Street Journal is about to publish an article that will clearly expose Radliff Sr. I feel like I want to talk about Theo Ratliff with the Sixers, maybe be a cousin. Tim Ratliff, Jason Isaacs' character

that maybe his money is ill-gotten or as a house of cards. Jason Isaacs is another example, like Leslie Bibb of the other thing Mike White can really do, which is coach up veterans. He sees market inefficiencies of people who are really, really good

and have high Q ratings, but just, Just not getting the reps. Yeah. Necessarily. He's a great, great actor. I want to talk about Kate, Lori, and Jacqueline really quickly just because they're, they're, where most of my focus was. Okay.

Obviously, love Carrie Coon. And she's actually been in a lot of more kind of small-scale dramas and comedy, not maybe not comedies, but like, you know, from his three daughters to Gilded Age to everything else she's been doing over the last. Leftovers? Leftovers. you know, Bibb is, I associate with being a comic actress. Yes. Largely, and Monaghan is somebody who I think of as like a movie star in some ways. Did you keep your stock?

Did you diversify it? I've always loved her. I always wish she made more Lane novels. I wish that they had, oh, yeah, she was great. I wish they did more Patrick and Angie books. Gone Baby Gone, Baby Gone is so fucked up, but was she's so good at it. She's great. And I always kind of was hoping that they would make two or three of those.

You know, she's incredible and true detective season one, but she hasn't really had like the role that I think people are like, that's the Michelle Monaghan signature role. And I'm hoping it's this. I love his perception of the way people who are at once lifelong friends, but also now unfamiliar with each other as person, as people and as adults, as adults, kind of like overdo the affection and overdue the sniping.

But she also goes to, I mean, the perspective, the real perspective we get in the first episode is she's weeping. Yeah. After, you know, putting on a face for that whole day. By the way, jet lag's real. Oh, fuck, yeah. Like, I feel like, no disrespect to anyone, like, but the moment when Jason Isaacs discovers Parker Posey just fully asleep,

and he's like, come on. Like, I feel like that's lived experience for you. Yes. Yeah. Anything else you want to touch on from this episode? No, I mean, I'm curious about. the ways that the show chooses to engage with its setting. The first season didn't really get to do much of that. There was the subplot about the luau dancer and the robbery and the tourism

economy, but that season was also bracketed by the fact that it actually was COVID, so they weren't doing a lot of location shooting outside of the resort. That was remedied in season two, where the F. Marie Abraham Imperiali story, like they were wandering around. Yes, they were trying to reconnect to their own family history. So they were out in. Italy in a different way and it looked beautiful because of it. This season, at least, you know, going from the trailer, this is not a spoiler, this was in the trailer. It appears that Walter Gagg, Walton Gaggins' character goes to Bangkok, which is not, or at least a major city in Thailand, which is not what Buket is. It's an island far from there. You have to take a flight. And then, like you said,

the middle daughter, I promise I'll get these names, Piper, I'll get these names by episode three. We're learning a lot about a lot of people right now. But like her interest, in Buddhism and in the temple and her reticence to engage in it I mean that is an interesting aspect of it because jokes aside like when I wasn't, when anyone goes to Thailand like spirituality and

literal monks and temple like that is, it's like breathing air. It is inescapable. It is not unlike what the brief education Belinda gets before I believe just after the monitor lizard. Like it's all on top of each other and it's all happening and it's very very present in the

live day to day lives of Thai people in a way that, like, church on Sundays is not, that's not the same thing as it is in America. So I'm very curious what he chooses to engage in and what he doesn't and the levers he pulls to get us into that world or to bring that world in because there is that meaningful thing with MOOC and the security. Oh, yeah, no, yeah. With guns. The guys who are like the private security for the hotel. And what they think of as, you know, versus the role they play versus Guy Talk who is basically like the valet. and the role that he plays.

So it's a spicy, spicy curry, if you will. But I thought it was extremely... Spicy time people. I thought it was extremely... I just thought it was really promising. Yeah, I mean, whatever. It's just like, he's one of the best making TV right now, and I've no real concerns about it.

Isn't that nice for a change? Just to take a second and be like, this is a reliable product. Yeah. That is such a rarity in TV these days. And they've already started talking about four, and it sounds like it's... probably going to Europe.

Have you heard this? Well, I mean, there was a rumor online that they were going to do it in Norway, that there was a production notice in Norway. Is that because we were there last year? I think that's why. I think they said, well, Greenwald went to Thailand. Yes, yes, yes.

We'll go to Thailand. Then CR and Andy were in Norway, so let's hit it. So that would mean then season five would be at a hotel near Wembley in honor of your trip for Grantland? Yes. I could show them around. That is exciting.

Thanks to Kai and CT, we are going to be taking Thursday, It's a Spotify Wellness Week. It is Spotify Wellness Week. Andy will be unwell in a pub somewhere. UK Wellness Week for me. Rewatching Super Bowl highlights. I hope everybody has a great week and enjoy White Lotus.

We'll be back a week from today with more Lotus. And I know people just can't wait to hear my severance takes, right? People fired up. Talk to you guys soon.