The Watch - Live at ‘Everybody’s Live’ and ‘The Studio’ Season Finale

Episode Date: May 22, 2025

Chris and Andy talk about their experience attending a taping of ‘Everybody’s Live With John Mulaney’ and how the sort-of late-night show has evolved throughout its run (6:21). Then they discuss the final two episodes of ‘The Studio’ and how the show pulled off the difficult feat of satirizing Hollywood (31:48). Finally they talk briefly about the new Max (or HBO Max?) show ‘Duster’ (47:08). Hosts: Chris Ryan and Andy Greenwald Producer: Kaya McMullen Video Production and Editing: Jon Jones Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Hello, and welcome to The Watch. My name is Chris Ryan, and I am an editor at the ringer.com. And joining me in the studio, having imbibed in an old school Hollywood buffet, it's Andy Greenwald. Nice. So far so good. What's up, man? Thursday in America. It's a hot one out there in Los Angeles.

Today on the watch, Andy, a little bit of everybody's live with John Malaney, which we attended last night. We were live. So some on the ground reporting from us. We're going to talk a little bit about. the final two episodes of the studio and the studio first season. It's been renewed for a second season. So I'm happy about that. And a couple of thoughts on the HBO Max show Duster, which aired its first episode last week. Long in development. We're just going to chat about that broadly. Greenwald, it's great to see you. Do you want to say it or do you want me to say it? Like, what's different today? There are a couple things that are different today.

Go ahead. Well, one, I want to note that you have taken. the note that Bill Simmons gave to Amy. He didn't give me the note. It's my thing. He gave it to Amy Polar. And you listen. You know, and you're like, well, if he's coming for Amy, he's coming for me next because he's doing it in terms of like new hire. And eventually he's going to get to you. And the note was no laptops during a podcast. Yes. So currently, for those of you who are not watching this video. She defies him though, right? She has kept the laptop. And she talks about it in every episode. It's a recurring bit. Yes. So, and by the way, Kaya, great podcast. I love good hang with Amy Poehler. This episode with Mike Scher and the gang, the Philly Justice gang, it could

have been four times as long. So good. Also, I feel like I can hear Kyle laughing sometimes in the podcast, which is our love language on this podcast. So it's great. Check that out. Anyway, so just for the update, before we get into the TV talk, Chris currently is at laptop closed. Yes. It's Jedi Blasheel down. Do you notice? Yeah, that's right. That's right. And do you notice what I'm doing? The worst of all world's as usual. Half and half. I can't see it. And yet it's open. This is really, this is really us. You're taking a melatonin, but you're staying up, you know? I've had some wine and I've had a coffee. This could go in any direction. Fantasy loves a Pilsner and a black coffee at the same time. No, this is what I called, this is, first of all, I feel like I invented this. This is,

Andy, you got to let people have some stuff. No, absolutely not. This is called the gentleman Speedball. At 4 or 5 p.m. You have a espresso and some wine. And then you just see. That's something that ended for me, I would say, three to four years ago. Okay. But he's younger. So he can, you know what? He can Columbus that. Okay. If he wants, that's fine. I'll allow it. Just like he Columbused having Chris on podcast.

You know, no problem. No problem. We are going, we are going to talk a little bit about TV. Is there anything else you wanted to get off your chest before? we get into it. I know everybody loves the 10 minutes of free Andy fire. So, okay, so I had a, charming anecdote to share, I thought, that apparently is potentially rubbing you the wrong way. It's not rubbing me the wrong way. I just wish you would have given me a heads up, but go ahead. Well, first of all, ever since we've started being on video, there's a whole list of things that we probably should be discussing that, but we don't. So I feel like I could be forgiven for not doing like fit checks with you before we show up. The issue is, uh, we are currently wearing

clothing from the same store. Yeah, which happens sometimes where it's like two guys both wearing J. Cruz stuff. I mean, shocking. Yeah. But this is a very specific outlet. So, but for me this was a good story because the other week, last weekend, I went into a wonderful

independent boutique in Los Angeles called Brother Brother. Yeah. Because, I went because you go and other people like a guy Greg from Los Alivas. What? It sounds like I made it up. I'm just shouting out Greg. Okay. He loves the store

Bell's restaurant You know, good stuff So I stopped in with my children And I walked in It was like Pope Bob going to Villanova No, Pope Bob's friend Because I walked in and Gary The guy who owns a place was like

Any friend of CR is a friend of mine That's really nice It was wonderful Gary's a great day And you are an influencer and I felt like lucky I'm not an influencer You influenced me And I was basking in your race

you know, and so I'm wearing a shirt. I think that's fine. That he gave me. You're also wearing a brother, brother hat. Which I do almost every day. First of all, you haven't, I looked on Monday and you weren't wearing it, and I was like, must be not be that week. Second, he gave me a hat.

Am I wearing it? No. Because I respect hats are your thing. And I think that the color hat that he gave you, the chalky kind of brick hat that he gave you is good for your skin tone. Thank you. In terms of your color story, it works. First of all, that's beautiful and you're my best friend.

But second, hats are your thing. so I'm letting you have that. But like white... Well, no, you don't tend to come in here wearing white t-shirts and carties. I'm like, we got to have brand identities now. That's what I'm saying. So what's the problem?

But what do I... Like, it's... You look great. I'm not... I'm just like it says... It just makes it look like we are sponsored by brother or brother. Say it again.

Look at camera one. Should we just start being sponsored by fake things? Should we bring back Halliburton Energy? I would like... First of all, Halliburton Energy wouldn't sell well in New York right now. Two, I would love to be sponsored right now

because we have to be on camera so I feel like this is a fine thing. But once you open up those doors you can't control who it could be full Abercrombie and Fitch if they had hit our number. My number is very low. That is not a big deal. Also, I mean, we have

Kaya, we have John here. They can comment on our visual brand identities. Do you think, Kai, is this clashing right now that one letter of a logo is visible on my T-shirt that is not on Chris's hat, which has Chinese characters. No, it makes it look like you guys, you know, coordinated.

You guys texted this morning and said, I'm going to wear my brother, brother, brother, shirt. I'm going to wear my brother, brother hat, and all is copacetic. I see you at dawn for a duel. I think Chris is just gatekeeping. I am gatekeeping. I'm not gatekeeping John Mullaney's talk show, though. Now, we went together.

Everybody's invited because it's on every Wednesday on Netflix at 7 p.m. Pacific, 10 p.m. Eastern. one more episode to go in this first batch. He'd obviously done everybody's in LA during the Netflix and there's a joke series last year. He's done, how many? Like 10, 12 weeks? 10, and next week is the 11th and final.

11 weeks in shooting over at Sunset Gower where we used to work at the Ringer in the early days. Did it remind you of the old days being there? It was really nice. It was kind of weird to see other production companies occupying the Ringer's old offices. Similar aesthetic, though, I would say. no matter what is being filmed there

or being worked on there, whether it's any given Wednesday or everybody's live. Yeah. Or this podcast, the offices are all the same. I will say that, you know, I've watched, I think,

half of the episodes of Mullaney this season. And it was one of those things where when you see it produced live, it kind of feels like this, like when you go to a Broadway show. Like, if I go to a Broadway play, I have like already I'm at a 75 because I can't believe

human beings do this. Oh, because, right, just a spectacle of this. The level of production, the level of coordination, all the people you can see behind the scenes are kind of moving around doing stuff. I mean, everything about it is just kind of mind-blowing when you consider like it's really hard to just like put on clothing and drive to work in the morning. Like how to be- Not if I just copy you, but I get it.

But it was an incredible experience. Last night's episode featured obviously Malini and Richard Kine, a sidekick, but also the guests were Sigourney Weaver, Natasha Leone, Amy Sedaris, who is sort of a Hall of Fame late-night talk show guest. We'll get into that in a second. And a woman who was a public transportation advocate. Yes, who announced on the show that she had taken public transportation to get there. To Sunset Gower.

Which prompted John Mullaney to say, like, are you fucking serious? Yeah, she took a bus and a train. I do want to say, this is a little bit of, you know, only people on site could report this, is that when I was driving away from Sunset Gower, I saw her. walking on sunset towards the bus stop. She practices what she preaches. I mean, nothing but respect to her. The musical guest was Yule.

And let's talk a little bit about it because I think there was a piece in the New York Times a couple of days ago by Jason Zineman that was sort of a reappraisal of the season as it was winding down. And I thought Jason had a bunch of really good ideas in the story that I'm straight up just going to jack for our conversation purposes. By the way, you're going to jack them off the dome. Because just to remind people, we're doing this whole episode without laptops. But I wanted to see you just in general as somebody who was a huge fan of the show this season and probably will wind up in your finagle top 10 of TV the year, right? Not that you're bitter.

What did you think of seeing it live and what did you think of the episode? It was so fun to be there live. I think the Broadway analogy is the right one to make because it was just kind of exciting to be there. I'll say that as someone who has, this is not even intended as a brag, but like I've been to other late-night shows with Conan's show on NBC and Letterman, it did feel bigger than I expected. I mean, it was in a soundstage, and the set itself was also bigger than I thought. Maybe that's why they have all those glass grapes

to help fill the space. I thought that the thing that ultimately, like Zinaman makes a lot of really smart points about how just the attitude of like, what the fuck, let's try this is just so missing from our comedy, from our late night, maybe from our lives, that this show is filling an important void.

I think that's absolutely true. And, you know, There was a moment in this episode when Renee Elise Goldsbury of Hamilton and Girls 5 Eva Fame stood up from the crowd dressed as Mrs. T. Yeah. And sang a really quite long and involved musical number that had been apparently written by the brilliant Lankston-Kerman in like 48 hours before this performance. Where I was like, have I left Earth? Have I left my body?

This is so surreal and I love it. All that is there. But my favorite thing about the show, ultimately in person, was how warm. and kind it was. Like the people, it was a great panel of yes. Everybody was in on it. Mullaney was really sharp,

really funny, really good at very old school, like ringleadery characteristics. But everybody seemed to be having a lot of fun. And that translates when I watch the show, but it felt really palpable in the room in a way that was both exciting and affirming. Yeah.

So a couple of observations are just that like, I think there's something really cool about being there, obviously, this's not something that lots of people can do, and I'm not trying to be like, you guys got to go to John Mullaney if you can, because obviously it's one more week. Also, next week he's fighting 314-year-old,

so that's going to be a tough ticket. I felt like, very much like it was like a safe production of a completely unsafe treatment, or rather like an unsafe treatment of a very safe format. The late night talk show format is very durable. It's been going on for decades. Obviously, it's sort of the bedrock of prime time.

and entertainment in some ways and leading up to Carson, leading up to Leno, leading up to Letterman or whatever. And I thought it was like interesting to see someone who clearly somewhere inside of him is kind of like, I kind of want to do this.

Yes. But I also don't want to do this. And like watching him sort of fight the impulses between really reliable, pleasing jokes and then throwing out a joke that is intentionally unfinished.

and when someone laughed being like, why did you laugh at that? That didn't make sense. That was a test. It was to see if you would laugh at something. I only did that for the cadence, which is really funny in the moment. I don't know whether or not, like, everybody watching is like, oh, cool,

John Mullaney is, like, experimenting with format here. I think that you're onto something because the growth over the 10 weeks of this version of the show really, and we talked about this last time we checked in on the show, like, four or five weeks ago, that, like, there were things about it that felt smoother,

like it was sort of relaxing into being. what it kind of needed to be in terms of one guest at a time. And like, let's do an interview before we just crowd the panel. Like, if the calls aren't working, don't do the calls. Like, let it be a talk show if that's just naturally what it's going to be. My takeaway from watching this one, I think it would have been the same if we hadn't been watching it in person, was he's really good at this. And not everyone is good at this.

And he is so quick and he was so attentive to every aspect of the show that the idea of not fighting it did feel kind of evident. It did make me think, I feel like we're talking around this again, and maybe this is a very Malini type digression, it did in some ways remind me of the pavement documentary that we keep saying we were going to maybe talk about that is, I think, playing in some cities now.

I kind of wanted to wait until it's available to people to watch. But I'll say the thing about that when I was watching it, and it's very, very, very 90s in the larger sense is that watching that documentary is like watching kind of like being a fan of a band in which the band is running a race and the band is fast enough to run the race but they insist on running

with their feet tied together just to make it harder to keep getting in their own way to avoid being successful or popular or whatever the case may be. Watching Mulaney be like, I kind of like being the mad ringleader of this bizarre circus

even though maybe his vision of himself was like, I am alone Ronin. That's actually the correct chef pronunciation of the word of comedy. Then I can dip in here, dip out, but I'm always a solo practitioner. I liked seeing that, even if it's just totally analyzing it from a, you know, from a bird's eye view. Well, so, okay, I'll say this.

I thought that the formal inventiveness really worked when he's doing like a 10-minute monologue at the top and doing like a stand-up routine. Yeah. The challenging part, I think, is when he goes to the panel talk discussion and has people joining him because not only is he pretty much throwing away the traditional, like, you're here to promote something, and I have three bits prepared for you and you have four stories prepared for me. Didn't even mention that Natasha Leon has a new season of poker face that he is on. Yes.

Didn't even come up. So he also is quickly, relatively quickly, bringing up the guests one after another, and then they're all sharing the couch. So they have like about five or six minutes of just Amy Sedaris. Then Sigourney Weaver comes out and it's five or six minutes of Sigourney Weaver. then there's a bit, and then there's five or six minutes in Natasha Leon, but they all stay there for the whole show, for all the other stuff that's going on. And the fact that he's trying to kind of undo the celeb promo circuit thing, that was the thing I found most challenging, because you're

essentially just like throwing yourself to the wolves when that happens, because you're just doing chit-chat. I mean, I think he likes the risk, you know? I think that that's exciting. It's also interesting watching, again, in real time, the themes that work and that don't work. Like, the Conan episode from weeks ago when they were talking about, like, our dinosaurs put together wrong was a great theme. Yeah. It was funny and weird. I was going to get to that. Like, and this week was like talking about whether Uber is good. Yeah. And it, not only did they never really get anywhere with it, because most of the panel was like, not only is Uber good, let's eliminate bike lanes. That's not what they said. They were specifically saying that they

thought bike lanes didn't work in Manhattan. I think Natasha Leon was just like fuck bikes. Yeah, but she was like because Manhattan actually works. Like you walk or you take the subway or you get a cab. Right. We didn't need like 17 other transportation options. I think that's fair. Yeah. But I guess

we can talk about the theme, but it was just more like I thought it was interesting and an evolution of his abilities as ringleader to in real time be like, I don't think this is working. Clearly the calls aren't coming in the way that we want them to. So we're not really even going to them for the majority of the show. Our expert is,

seems like a good hang and was very cheerful, but that wasn't necessarily being given a lot to comment on. So we're just going to keep pushing forward. Yeah. Which I think is a separate, it's an interesting kind of skill. Yeah, and it was just fascinating. Amy Zadaris, when she goes on Letterman

or when she's gone on Letterman or when she's gone on other shows, like is one of the great late night guests. She shows up, there's obviously some preparation of what she's going to do. She has like a whole routine. She's got a great outfit on. She was all that tonight, or last night, but it was really interesting to find her in a much more casual.

Like, I don't really know what you're going to ask me. I have a little bit prepared about Uber, but like not in a huge, like, I'm not shouting it from the rooftops. It's kind of staying within myself. So can I ask you then? So what are your preference? So I kind of want to know what your preferences are for chat shows or chat opportunities. I mean, honestly, it's really not an important part of my life. And I don't mean that in a dick way. Like, it's late night TV even or like talk show TV has never been like a big deal to me. Like even Conan who I like a lot or Letterman who I understand like

the pleasures of like I was not a big like it's time for Letterman. It's time for Conan. I think what's, well, you were busy. He were going to parties. No, it's really actually, I mean, it really has always been like, this is cool. I think I probably would say Saturday Live is the closest thing I get to like appointment late night comedy. Okay. I think that what's interesting also about the Malaney project is to think about it in the context of how, celebrity interviews or interactions are mostly done now. And the reason I say that is because we, it's kind of trying to bridge the gap between the classic chat shows of your and the more contemporary podcast space. Yeah. And, you know, the variance, there's obviously more opportunities

to listen to people promote things or talk about things or be themselves than ever before. And sometimes the highs are higher and sometimes the lows aren't low, but they're weirder. I bring it up because I really enjoyed Sarah Silverman, who's doing the rounds for her Netflix show, which I would like to watch her Netflix special. She was on Marin, and that podcast, which I listened to this week, was outstanding because they kind of found a vein that they wanted to talk about, which is aging Jewish parents, basically. And I was like, can I listen to this at 0.25 speed? So it goes on forever. How do we make this last longer? But then I listened to her also on Conan's podcast. And it was

fine. What you hear in that room is he was kind of trying to earnestly interview her, someone he's known for 30 years, someone who paid tribute to him in the great Netflix Mark Twain thing that was on that we talked about. That interaction was so great and so funny and so on. And then in the casual format, it was just kind of, you could feel them feeling it out. You could feel a lot of courtesy laughs. This isn't bad. It's like you actually get to see the seams. Sure. Melani seems to be the one who has the platform or the juice at the moment to try to merge the streams as best he can for the current moment. Yeah, I mean, there was obviously a connective tissue between him and Natasha Leone that was like...

She was the closer at his intervention. And they were talking about how they first met at a table read for a project that she wanted to direct that never got off the ground. Richard Kind also attended. And like, it was like, and she's like, and Nikki Crowell was there. And Freddie Amoson was there. And she has that kind of like new Hollywood with an old Hollywood voice vibe to her. the one thing that was really fascinating

was watching Sigourney Weaver who... You'll see people come out on late night shows and they'll be like, oh, I'm actually quite shy, but here's like three immaculately prepared bits that I have. Sigourney Weaver was like, I'm quite shy.

And because I think that there wasn't a huge laundry list of like items for her to check off and talk about, her shyness came across in a very like endearing way where she's just like, I really just like to go to the premieres, and then I kind of retreat back to my home life and my private life.

And, like, I live in Manhattan. I've born and bred in Manhattan. I live there now. And it's like, it was kind of awesome. I think I wonder when you watch it on TV, quote unquote, whether it plays as sort of intimately as it did in the room. And the other advantage we had that I really enjoyed was that when he cut to pre-taped segments,

which were almost entirely about the anticipation of his children boy fight that he's doing this up. So this has been a running gag for like half the season. Just to say that when they were, yes, for half the season he said he's going to, in the finale, fight three 14-year-old boys, and they were announcing each contender. And then this week, his staff had him ambushed by three female stunt women to test his metal and his reflexes. When they were showing the video of him being pummeled by three quite petite, I believe, show women, stunt women, we could watch, we were watching it on the monitors, but we could see the panel.

and Sigourney Weaver seemed very, very charmed by this. She seemed to think it was very, very funny, which I thought was sweet. Like, I think that there's an opportunity on shows like this to be like... When she came out, she was like, I am so excited to be here, though. I was like, man, Sigourney's really crushing tape. I can tell she's really into being here. She thinks it's funny.

And so she came on, like you said, there's a freedom without the tether of the promotional tour. Yeah. She's just there. And then she told a funny Jim Cameron story. She did. Yeah, about breaking... sort of like the fake glass that was surrounding an alien nest.

It was very funny. Did you feel like the actress who played Newt should have been more present in these stories? Because Sigourney did keep saying, I don't think she was being disrespectful, but she was like, I was supposed to break the glass

and lift the child. She kept saying the child like she was the mantel of... It was probably a stunt child at the time anyway, right? Like when you're yanking a kid. No, I think the real Newt was committed. I think that's probably why

she doesn't work as much anymore. But yeah, he's going to fight boys next week. You know, one thing that Jason Zidaman wrote about in his time's piece was the idea that shows need to find a rhythm, which is something that we've talked about, not necessarily about talk shows,

but about sitcoms, about other series where... Podcasts? Well, I mean, I think that there's really... It's a really under-discessed part because it's such a consumer-oriented business that it really is not... If I'm just watching a TV show,

it's not really my concern whether or not you guys have your sea legs yet, right? And that's what makes it show business, right? It makes it hard for these things to sell It makes it hard for these things to stay on the air because you may be like, hey, I think we're pretty close. And I think we've dialed all the dials right here with the characters are here and here or the host to figure out how he wants to approach this. And then it's too late. I think it's like something that you and I will observe and be like, this is really cool to watch people get their sea legs or figure out the show or decide where, you know, Amy Puller's Parks and Rec character needs to register in like her kind of social acceptability meter.

But for consumers, I think they're like, you guys have like two episodes. Well, also, the time I'm giving you out of my life is negligible between week one and week 10. It's still time in my life. Yes. I didn't invest in a, this isn't a growth opportunity for me. This is my entertainment where I just have to wait for the long gains to hit. Are you willing to talk more about your portfolio now? You brought it up. I just feel like you keep teasing it.

Why do you want to know about my finances so much? How much money do you think I have? I'm really curious and I feel like you're extremely liquid I feel like you could go at any moment and I feel like you know something that I don't

about the future? Just maybe I just am a little concerned truthfully when I found out that also Sean and other people were giving you shit about it I was like this is a great

pile on opportunity you can't watch as many bank robbery movies as I do without having your money in the mattress you know sure I'm really modest guy. No, I know.

Yeah. But like, are you the kind of modest? Like, do you remember the woman who had like... Not modest in my like, yeah, I just mean like my finances are just, they're just fine. No, but it's like the woman who had... I don't want to talk about this. I know you're very nervous. The woman who had the, like, the McDonald's fortune and then she died and then the

the woman who runs poetry magazine got an email that was like, you have been bequeathed $50 million for poetry? I do want to do that. I do want to do that. But who, like, who are you giving it to? But eyewitness news in Philadelphia for investigations. What's the, who is going to be the recipient of the CR fund? Oh, God, that's a great question.

I mean, now, like, so many different places need it. Yes. Right. I think I would give it to the local NBC affiliate to bring back, what was the entertainment magazine? I was thinking the same thing. Oh, yeah, the one that was on with Ray, what's his name, a name? fancy glass. Yeah.

Evening edition? Yeah. Evening edition, something like that. That would be great. I feel like right now in West Adams, Gary is it brother, brother being like,

rent's not getting cheaper, buddy. Where were we with Mulaney? You were talking about rhythm and modesty in terms of your investments. So there's a self-imposed cap on this series, 11 episodes, and Zendaman was sort of writing about how Malaney had gotten his sea legs.

You know, like that in the last couple of weeks, it seems to have really started, like, hitting a different register. And I was curious whether you felt like, is it ending its season too soon? Do you think that, like, he can keep all of the sense memory if he decides to do this again next year?

That's what's interesting. I think we had a chance to talk to my buddy, Brooklander, who makes the, does a lot of the video direction stuff on the show afterwards. And he was saying that, like, vibes were excellent. That, like, it was kind of like a marathon in the sense that there were a couple weeks

where they were dragging, where they felt tired and like how are they going to find their way through this? And then they figured it out. And just like when they did the everybody's in LA show, right when they figured it out, it's time to stop. And, you know, Malaney does not like to stop. He has already announced like dozens of tour dates throughout the fall. He's acting and stuff.

We were talking afterwards, you and I were talking afterwards, wondering, like, is this, regardless of whether Netflix wants more. And I do think things like that New York Times piece and maybe our 40-minute just post-mortem about watching the show might help as well. I think those things are significant to their investment. Regardless of whether they want more, the question is, does he want to keep doing this? And he has young kids, so maybe this is a nice, like, anchor to have every year. But you're asking the right question. Like a talk show with its rhythms, with the insane schedule of, like, just thinking about things, generating content. It seems like a hard thing to do start and stop.

And there is no version of this for his life, clearly, in his ambition. where this would continue as just a weekly show forever, this would almost have to be a spring fling again. And because of that, are we going to be talking about the next season of this show, should it come, the way we were talking about Last of Us, in the sense that, like, there are good things here,

but they have to be graded on a curve because two to three years between serialized storytelling is not working, or whatever. Exactly what I was thinking. It's just like, have we gone past the point where in 25 years ago, the goal for any actor really outside of major movie start and would probably be to be on something like Grey's Anatomy. And to have a really, really, really solid life and really stable employment for a long period of time on a show that lots of people loved.

And obviously, talk show hosts have like different ambitions in that, one would think. But the model is like, this is a really good indicator of how like all of the paradigm of, television programming has changed. The whole point for a show like this is to be an ad sales cash cow is to be the bell cow of, hey, like this thing is going to be on. Tom Cruise is going to be there to promote Mission Impossible. The musical guest is going to have an album out on Friday. Studio will buy ad time. Everything. Yeah. These things and they're supposed to be, I think they're economically functional because they're so long running. You have the stage. You have your set. It only needs to be built once, right? Like, you can't, if you start like tearing it

or reimagining it every week. And in terms of its creativity, like I said, it's not something I do every night, but when I've checked in on something like Fallon, it's like he's kind of running out bits that are similar to bits

that he did five, six, seven years ago, right? Like there's maybe a new coat of paint. Fallon is rough right now. Yeah, but like, I think that part of that is because it's fucking hard to come up with a soup to nuts creative new show every week. But when,

and that's when the pendulum swings back to like Kimmel is just old school. he's good at this in a very, very Carson-esque way. Or someone like Seth Myers, who is more in the Malaney or the Marin. Almost like Dick Cavett, where it's like he's having like thoughtful conversations. He's a smart, sharp guy, and he's having conversations with people that he's interested in. And it's just reliable in a different way. It's highs might not be as high in terms of star power or ratings.

I love your Gray's Anatomy analogy. Like, do you feel like inside of every actor there are two wolves and one wolf is Ellen Pompeo and one is Sandra O? and which career do you want? Because I promise you, Ellen Pompeo... She could buy the Dodgers. Yes. But she's only ever really going to get to play that part again. Yeah.

Yeah. I think that that's like... You probably ask a stand-up comedian in 2003. What's your dream in life? And they would be like to host the Tonight Show. Yeah. And now I think that they would probably say the Tonight Show would be a little bit of a drag on my podcasting and touring revenue.

Oh, a million percent. A million percent. make one last comment about the show before we move on. The musical guests have been really wild and bold and like very much his personal taste and all over the place. An artist performed last night named Ewell, who I was not familiar with. Uel's performance involved them astride, a motorcycle, well, a fog machine blasted and a drummer, you know, you like drumming a lot. It's like hammering, and then like these dancers were sort of like... Rithing around. Riding around. And it was actually quite bracing for me because I was like, oh, this is what my parents felt like every time I was

like, check this out. That was the most culturally disconnected I have ever felt. You thought it was provocative? I mean, I thought it was provocative, sure. I didn't think it was provocative. Oh. I just felt like, like my EKG meter would have just been the flat emoji. Like, I got nothing from it. I didn't understand it. And I was just sort of staring in like blank slack jawed confusion. I didn't understand any aspect of it. Nothing penetrated. I got some, I got some, I got some vibes from it. Well, that's because you like drumming. No, I felt like it was like there was like some some nine inch nails

to it, a little bit of massive attack. There was elements of shoegays to it. No, yeah, I mean there were elements in the sense that like this table is made out of atoms. I get it. I get science, if that's science. I'm just saying that like, I, I've, and this is not

a, I'm not bragging. I know you're not. This is actually a, this is a self-owned. Nothing penetrated. And that was really shocking. I like I like to feel like I have, you know, I'm at least, if I don't have my finger on the pulse, like I'm at least aware there is a pulse. Yeah. You have your finger on the pulse of Patriot Pascal's Last of Us character.

Yeah. Yeah. That was it. Sorry for the spoiler. The playoffs are here and you can predict the action all the way to the finals with Fandul predicts. Follow all the playoff dishes, swishes, wishes, and misses. predict the spread, the total points, and even the game winner. Sign up for Fandual Predicts and predict it from the couch.

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Restrictions apply. Services not available in all areas. Let's talk about the studio. How about that? It's another kind of comedy. It is. And it really is a comedy. And you love comedies.

Well, when the show first came out And the first episode debuted. Not only was I, like, struck by this cinematic, visual urgency of it, the sort of just momentum and verve to like the oneers and the flying around and the jazz score. And I was like, man, they really thought about this from all four directions about what they wanted

this show to feel like. And, you know, there's obviously the built-in joke that it is a TV show on a tech company's streaming platform, about saving the cinematic experience. And there are multiple jokes throughout the series that allude to that. But as a television show, it was like real good. It was really good.

I really enjoyed it. I think that there was an element of the early season where I thought it was going to be a more probing character study of Matt, the Seth Rogen characters running a film studio at a moment of pure chaos for the seemingly every day for this studio and for the movie business in general. And I thought, perhaps a little bit more of a character study, a little bit more of like a, I don't know whether it was sober is the right word, although maybe it is after the last two episodes of the season, but a little bit more of an accounting of like what's going on in the movies.

Or maybe more of a sharp satire rather than a farce. Yeah, and I became much more of like a farce where it was like curb your enthusiasm on a Coke. It was like very awkward situations that kept getting turned up and turned up and turned up until everything is like exploding everywhere. and I liked that version of the show quite a bit. Yeah. But did you ever have like this show pivoted for me in a way that I didn't expect moment? I think we both had a similar arc in that when it turned into in the middle episodes, just kind of a, you know, a riotous slapstick leading up to a massive fall, literally,

like him falling into a table of something every episode. Or, and I think we referred to this a couple weeks ago, that like the joke of the the first episode with the Kool-Aid movie was that Art House movies can't be made, but then for the purposes of Matt destroying a oneer, he's also funding a Sarah Polly art film starring Greta Lee that's a period piece.

Which kind of undoes the premise of the first episode. I felt then, as I feel now, which is Seth Rogen and Evan Goldberg need to play to their strengths because their strengths are particular to them and they're very strong. They're really, really, really funny filmmakers.

So by the time, we got to the end, the, like the almost, almost on the line of too muchness of, you know, of Brian Cranston high on impossible amount of mushrooms and cocaine, fillating a statue outside of a Las Vegas. Affordite. Yeah. Going down on Aphrodite. I was like, okay. I see, I see what we're doing here, and I get it. All of that is to say where the season ends in episode 10 with an absolute catastrophe being

saved by Matt, the Seth Rogen character, leading the nation's cinema owners in a, at first, sort of pathetic, but then ultimately rousing cry of movies, movies, movies, was kind of sneaky smarter than any more cerebral satire could have been. Yeah. I think it's important to remember that this entire project, like, it's a call for help from the inmates who are in the asylum. So their perspective on the industry is very particular. it's not a cutting, like, I mean, there's an element in the player of like Michael Tolkien who wrote it, who wrote it, right?

It was a journalist who had written about, and a screenwriter, but who had written about the industry and had been burned by it in certain ways. And Altman, who made the movie was always the perpetual outsider. So there was a little bit of, a little bit more teeth there. Rogan, the movie business and the streaming business, Platonic Season 2 coming to Apple next year, has been very good to him. Yes. They are doing this from a place of... Yeah, they have like 14 things in production on the air. So they're doing this from a place of comfort and security.

and love. I would say they have been point gray, which is his company with Evan Goldberg. Right. So I think that it was ultimately that sense of like this crazy business of show is going to be less barbed.

Yeah. But the whirlwind that he created and the chaos when taken in total, I think does paint a really shockingly accurate and ultimately sympathetic portrayal of

a well- meaning potentially doomed industry in a kind of freefall. I wonder whether or not there was some element of when it first began. I mean, nobody really starts TV shows anymore like this and certainly not on Apple, which is like routinely I'll get notifications that it's like season six of this show is on Apple. And I'm like, where were the other five seasons? You just say the foundation.

Just say it. Say the name. But, you know, obviously the show has been renewed and frankly. Not obviously. We weren't sure what the project was. I didn't think that Seth Rogan was going to do nine episodes about this unless it was like about the death of movies.

What if I told you he did 10 episodes? Was it 10? Well, you don't have your laptop out today. Oh, right. You know what it is? It is a two-parter. Yeah. So I felt like, yeah, there was a version of this show

that was like the rise and fall of Matt Remick's studio head and it's like this guy who gets everything he's ever wanted and it gets taken away from him because of the natural disaster force of making movies. but to have it just be like, you know, Matt goes to a fundraiser and gets in an argument with a bunch of oncologists about who's got a more important job,

a movie studio head or a cancer doctor, is really funny, honestly. It is. I mean, and it helps for me, it takes away some of the saccharin notes of the like, what matters to me most are my friends. Let's bring out all, because as much as like,

especially in interviews, Rogan is talking about like, A lot of this was inspired by the well-meaning, but absolutely handcuffed executives that he's worked with. And I've met many nice people who work in Hollywood. I don't know any of them who would get on stage at CinemaCon and be like, and my junior executive's assistant, I don't talk to you enough. Well, if they were tripping on mushrooms, would they do that? Oh, great, great, great call. It is really, I assume most executives are microdosing at this point, but he was macro-dosing, which is a different vibe. I want to shout out a couple of things. Number one is that, uh, Seth and Evan probably are our greatest chroniclers of drug binges. Up there with McBride, but when they introduce a bunch of chemicals into any situation,

whether it's what's the stuff in the boys, V? Oh, yeah, sure, V. Whether it's that kind of drug or whether it is mushrooms and cocaine, they just have a blast. And that kind of chemical influence really, I thought that the style that they make the show and really met that where it wanted to be. Yeah, you know, and running through all these sweets at Caesars to document like Zoe Kravitz's ego death and stuff like that

was just really great. She really bought in. I thought Dave Franco, honestly, it was like, I laughed so fucking hard. He was so good. And the fact that he kept referencing, now you see me as like how he was going to be a card sheet. Yes.

Did you, I don't know what your experience was watching it. I don't know if you watched the screeners that Apple weren't kind enough to provide us. but when I fired up... Sorry, I watched it. It was just like a regular Joe. Joe 50 bucks. That you were just trying to like... You were Thomas Friedman in a cab in Mumbai.

You were like, how do the pores watch television as you sit on your mattress full of money? I get it. I watched also like a normal. I fired up the finale on the actual service and did you watch the recap? Yeah, where Franco's doing...

Franco narrated the recap. Fantastic. Yeah, sorry, I cut you off. I thought, He was also great. He was fantastic. Zoe Kravitz was really good and really a good sport. And I thought grew into the over the course of the, she was in like three episodes, right? She was in Golden Globes. And then she shows up in cinema.

You know what they call that? She did an arc. She did. And she was great. I saw a Hollywood Reporter article interview with her where she was like, I would like seriously love to come back and do that again. It seems pretty fun. Yeah. Have we talked to our ringer colleague Matt Bellany about his experience acting with these people? Matt, Matt, on-screen cameo multiple times or just the one scene? No, multiple times and referred to constantly. Yeah.

They keep yelling about, don't let Bellany see this. How did you feel about that? Well, should I say that I turned it down? You can say it. Is it true? I mean, I think that we should have more podcasters and journalists on screen generally. I just think that's a win. We're a photogenic bunch.

I'm so glad we're on YouTube now. I'm thrilled about that. No, I thought he was pretty good. And I especially thought it was remarkable that he maintained during his last appearance, which is when they are trying to weekend at Bernie's Brian Cranston through the casino floor. And the mania leaching off of those, I mean, it's hard to be in a scene with actors. It's hard to be in a scene with actors of that caliber doing something that big, like with Rogan and Berenholds and Cranston, who was just dining out,

respect. Yeah. Respect, Matt. What else did I really like about it? Oh, you know what? The writing, there's a part of me that kind of rejects the, it's all improv. Like, let's just try six lines. And I'll do one in this script and then five my way.

I've laughed very hard at largely improvised or rewritten comedies in the past. But there was something structurally really sound about even though the chaos is happening, like the, what's a, is it a runner? Is that what they call jokes that kind of keep a piece? appearing throughout. Chase Sui Wonders' character is like trying to complete her film education. Because like, you know, she's like, you guys are referring to these things as cinematic classics, but they're just movies that you got out on videotapes when you were young, which is essentially the rewatchables. Yep. And, but she's like sort of piecing it together. And she's the one who

comes up with the weekend of Bernie's plot. Like, she's like, I have seen that one. I think there's a lot more going on behind the scenes in the show that I hope we get to talk to people involved in the show. Because if you notice, I feel like people who listen to this podcast do notice these things, every writer on the show is credited as a co-creator of the show. That is both generous and rare. Every writer on the season of the show who is a co-creator is credited with writing the finale. Yes. There is a sharing of credit, which is just nice.

It's bring your assistance out on stage at cinema con level nice. Right. But it also seems to be thoughtful in the sense that... It's don't gatekeep a Los Angeles boutique from your best friend. It's brother, brother, brother, sister brother, is what it is, what it is and how it should be. I'm glad we could bring that back. Now it feels more relevant. It's called a runner.

They, no, just that like if you're doing something this high pitch, like have a core group of creative people and have them work on the show and keep it consistent. And especially when your other co-creators, one of whom is starring in the show and both of them are directed. every episode. Another thing that I learned that I thought was really fascinating about the show is that the studio was edited by an old college friend of mine named Eric Kisak, who's done great work. He worked on Veep. He worked on The Good Place. Because the nature of the show was so specific, and there were so many oners, even within each episode, not just the episode that was a oneer.

Seth and Evan asked Eric to be on set for the entire show so that he could say, I can't do that, actually. Here's what I need. here's how I'm going to do it. And that's a thoughtfulness and an inclusion that's very cool. Doesn't often happen if ever. I was going to make a stupid joke about like that must have been an easy gig for Eric. He's like cut and cut and I'm done the episode. You think I've not spoken to him about it. I apologize if you're listening Eric. Let's text about this. But he mostly an editor, you know, comes in and is handed the, it's not, it's now all digital, but like theoretically is handed just like a pile of stuff. It's like a thumb drive and you go play with it. And you just piece it all together. One of the benefits of that is, you know, you can keep your own hours and you can work in like, you know, air conditioned piece. Being on set every day for a TV show is a different job. Sure.

I would love to know more about the production of the show, like how quickly they shot it. Yeah. Like, you know, obviously they did Cranston for the first episode, bring him back. But that, I imagine they shot that on stages in L.A. But did some exteriors in Vegas and maybe like one or two minutes of. I don't know. This casino stuff was casino stuff. I don't know where they shot it.

or how they shot it, but I'd be curious to know how long it took. You know, how many takes of various sequences did they do? Or how much time they were required of the people? Yeah, right, exactly. And like, did Cranston come back for like one and then come back later in the season? Or did they just shoot him out, like, in the beginning or what? I think the other thing that, again, like you wouldn't give a lot of, you wouldn't necessarily think to give a lot of credit for this.

But everyone who has worked in Hollywood for 20 years has relationships. But how many people are as able to call in favors, call in friends, and create an atmosphere of, you know, just collegiality and goodwill that they seem to have been able to create with a really wide variety of celebrities from, you know, from Martin Scorsese to, I don't know, pick your poison. Nick Stoller. Nick, the great Nick Stoller, exactly. Who has obviously an amazing sense of humor about himself because it views as like getting kicked in the dick like for nine hours. Repeatedly. I also, we didn't, because we kind of skipped over it before talking about the show.

in total, the Golden Globes episode was the one that was promised. I thought that was so, so funny and so accurate about neediness within the industry. Also a reminder. Also, for me, it was great to see

because some people who listen to this podcast may know that I was a little mixed on Severance season two. Adam Scott remains one of my favorite actors and especially comedic actors. Yeah, I missed him. That episode gave me a little bit of Eastbound vibes. Yes, he's so...

Him showing up with the black card and he's found. I mean, that's... Was he from Tampa? Is that what he claims to be? Yeah, he was from the Tampa Rays scout. I think they can't say Rays. He just says Tampa. Yeah.

Because he is a fake scout offering key bumps and black card access. Go figure. Even the Tampa Bay Rays drew the line somewhere. He was awesome on that. It was a great Barron Holtz episode. That was awesome. Barron Holtz was fantastic the entire season. I'm very happy that the show is renewed.

Do you think that the second season of it will be like, now that people have got... gotten a chance to see it, like more and more people are going to be like, I want to be on the studio. Yes. One gets the sense that it wasn't really a hard ask. You know, like they were filming the Golden Globe stuff at the Golden Globes, right? They were doing some of the carpet stuff in camera, I think, I mean, in character. Yeah. So I feel like they have the relationships already, but I would imagine, yes, more people will want to play themselves and show what good sports they are. Should we wrap up by talking about Duster? Yeah. Briefly. So I wanted to have more of a general

conversation about a quietly ending era of TV than I did about the show itself. People can check this out. It's a show from Latoya Morgan and JJ Abrams that's on Max. It stars Rachel Hilsen and Josh Holloway. Look at you off the dome. I can't believe it. I almost feel like I'm getting stronger as the episode goes on and I want to go back to the beginning and do it again. Which is incredible because I was sitting here. I took out my laptop for people not watching because I was like, you know, I'm always, I'm always thinking like you. I'm dressing like you. I'm just really just trying to, what's the word, be you? And when you were, I was like, if he's really going to just name the actors here,

there are a lot of pitfalls because Rachel Hilsen is close to both Rachel Billson and Kerry Hilsen. You had some hits in the knots. I was a Carrie Hilsen aficionado. Were you? Yeah, I was, I found her quite charming. Knock you down. It's still a great song.

Wow, good. See, we even shared the same reference points. Anyway, but like here's the thing. Yeah. is I'm just worried that as I get older, my reliance on devices is making it so that I need a teleprompter to have a conversation with you and I don't want to live in that world.

Is that why you keep looking over my shoulder? God damn it. No, the log lady from Twink's fine, too. That's right. I just thought I saw a certain like deadness in your eyes and you're like, and I'm doing my podcast with my best friend. Pause for laughs. Rachel Hilsen plays an FBI agent,

a young FBI agent, and Josh Holloway plays a mob-affiliated getaway driver who becomes her confidential informant in 1970s

Arizona of all places. This show has got the bones of a network week-to-week kind of adventure of the week, crime of the week

show, but has serialized storytelling. There's a plot line with Keith David, the wonderful Keith David's crime boss of Phoenix.

It is a period piece that I would not say screams authenticity or, you know, grit of the area. But I get what it was going for. It's going for like a little bit of like cop solves mystery and a little bit of drive and a little bit of wouldn't it be fun to get like some grind housey black exploitation vibes going.

And the reason why I was bringing this show up in the first place is just that we just did an episode where we talked extensively about HBO Warner Brothers Discovery going away from Max and going back to HBO Max and possibly doing away with the like here there are certain things

that are Mac shows and there are certain things that are HBO shows and then there's all the Warner Brothers Discovery reality stuff that we have and I have no idea if this is actually the case and I'm sure we'll be corrected on the matter but this feels like the last Max show to me. It's also

feels like a show that is one of the last gasps of extended COVID and strike related development. Now, I can be proven wrong by that, and there have been plenty of ripple effects that we've felt on House of the Dragon and possibly even on Last of Us of shows that are kind of like,

we've got to get a season up, but it's not quite where we wanted it to be in terms of the story. I don't know that that's the case for Last of us, but it was certainly the case for House of the Dragon. It was economic as well. This show is like fine, but is not something I'm going to probably keep watching,

but it's just an interesting like kind of neither here nor their experiment. I couldn't agree more. It's an analogy I think I've used before, but it's like when people tell you, see that light you're seeing from the stars, that light is hundreds of thousands of years old. That's what this show feels like.

And it is borne out by those of us who are still laptop bound. I can give you some facts and figures here. The show was given a straight to series order at HBO Max when it was called HBO Max the first time in April of 2020. I think I remember mentioning it on the pod. How cool.

Yeah. And it was notable also because it was, and I know this sounds crazy to say it, JJ Abrams hadn't had shows on TV and still doesn't. And had this enormous deal, which has now been kind of like politely downgraded to a first look deal. But it's also used as like the sort of example of like the excess and largesse of that late teens overall madness that happened. And so just getting something from the bad robot factory like on the air, that was considered both, it was a win for everyone, like including internally within this company that was now trying to pump up its streaming service in a different way.

I think what's, I mean, there's a lot of things that feel kind of vestigial and odd about the show. One of the biggest problems to me, actually, is the JJ Abrams of it, which is no disrespect to him. It's more that it feels incredibly polite for a show. And this is maybe what you meant. Maybe you said it more articulately or at least more. kindly when you said it was felt sort of broadcast networky because yeah i mean i think that almost would

work better as a cb show the the pleasures of pulp fiction quite literally you know are kind of sanded away here with you know in in the visage of josh holloway's like perfectly bright white teeth and the kind of like wink wink we don't have many people who look like you around here agent whatever name is you know but like we're not actually talking about anything we're all just sort of having a good time and the kind of quotes around everything. He's like trying to be a good dad while he's a getaway driver for the mob. Yeah. And the kind of polite quotes around everything definitely put me at a distance. And then there's just other things that feel like older decision making. And I mean that quite literally because the gym character played by Josh Holloway is supposed to be a Vietnam vet, but Josh Holloway is 55 in 1972.

And look, Sawyer's going to Sawyer. Like, I am a big fan. He's got great hair. He's very handsome. Yeah. And you kind of trust him with your children or your money. the car. He does a good job. But you are kind of shooting yourself in the foot for getting a series off on the right first step by casting someone who just kind of breaks the show. Like you make the show because of him, but then the decision kind of has ripple effects that cost you other things down the line. Now, it was still a JJ Abrams, HBO Max thing. And the Corbyn-Bernson Assants continues. He's awesome in the show. Speaking of broadcast favorites, Gail O'Grady shows up. Interesting. Yeah. JJ's guy, Greg Grunberg, going to be in the show.

The pieces make sense in a very 2019. Here's my big flashing green light button kind of way. The bummer is five years later. I mean, it is a wild amount of time for development.

It's not unheard of. And yes, it was COVID-affected and strike-affected and then industry rattling effective. But the bottom line is, when this arrives, I think that we, especially us who loves this type of thing, really would have been open to something just kind of grungy and fun.

And it just feels too labored to be light. And that even though I like all the ingredients, the final dish feels overworked. Well, this goes back to what we were talking about with Mullaney. That's what this is kind of one of the reasons why I wanted to pair these two things is this is a show that I bet, even if I stuck with it this first season, might find its rhythm. I mean, there is an almost internal metric. gnome of forward momentum that's being begged to take it out, they're begging to take it

out on the road and open it up, which is you could do a show and I hate doing this where you're like, what they should have done is this, but you could do a show where Josh Holloway getaway driver in the 1970s goes from town to town because he's got some mission

he's on, but he's also always on the run and he offers his services to various underworlds around the American Southwest as he's being chased by the FBI. So cool. I love it. And you could just basically have it be Kung Fu and he's wandering the earth. There's like a little bit more of a contained setting for this one.

Maybe in future episodes he goes all, he goes to Boise. I have no idea. Well, it's whatever Albuquerque can double for. My old stomping graph. So this is what I was going to say is they're almost, it's a show crying out for an older era of TV production and an older era of TV delivery. It just feels like an on the. road show that's stuck in one place and is instead trying to build like a rogues gallery full of recurring characters who are in that town.

But I wouldn't be surprised if this is something that would have found its legs in a season two or would have found its legs like a tweak of introducing something a little bit later. Instead, it just feels like it was kind of taken off the shelf a little bit. It's a very smart analysis and I think kind of, and I think it's a generous one because there are many, many, many problems of the industry right now that we belabor week to week. That said, there is a different level of rigor being applied to the decision making

and sometimes a lot of good things are just not, you know, are getting snuffed out because of budgetary concerns or whatever. The decision making that gets shows greenlit today, I feel confident saying, would not have greenlit this show at this level with this cast on this service.

Well, I want to ask you another question here. This is like the last thing I wanted to ask you about because you've casually mentioned it a few times about the current state of development, pitching and stuff like that. Are people done with period pieces? Well, period pieces are incredibly hard because they're just automatically more expensive.

Yes. So people, you might not get in the door with the period piece. Right, because any shot that you have, the cars have to be... Picture cars have to be dressed, and the whole place has to be dressed, and everything is more expensive.

I think that there is, at least anecdotally, people say that that's also a barrier for entry for some people, some audiences or some segments and just don't want to time travel, which is weird because I would go to literally any other time in history than the one we're living in. For every certainty that people say about what the town is buying,

there is an outlier. Yeah. So you can't actually confidently say, this will not happen. Some things do happen. Often they are unicorns or they are unicorns being ridden by very successful established creators. Right. But to your question, yes,

period pieces are very, very hard to do. even when, you know, they are done at a, what they say, at a price point, which sometimes means in Albuquerque. The thing I was thinking about was, you know, when we were in college, the 70s were very in vogue. Speaking of a period piece. Well, here's my point. When we were in college, the 70s were in vogue, you know,

dazed and confused, like the way that Tarantino kind of had, his, like, roots in 70s grindhouse cinema. And now it's 2025. obviously Duster is not one of dozens of shows set in the 70s on TV, but I almost think you should probably say, hey, man, like, should this be, and I'm thinking of this because Fennacy just beautifully articulated this genre to me when we were doing our Final Destination podcast,

but Final Destination is a product of, I believe he called shitcore limp biscuit dead tech, or something like that. But like maybe that's the period we should be going back to, because that's 25 years ago, which is what in the 70s, it was in the 90s? Sean lost me when he sipped tea

and said Top Gun was bad, actually. I'm back. Sean, you got me back. I totally agree. This is a bigger and deeper conversation also about certain generations stranglehold on culture, let alone political life.

Yeah. That like the culture is still absolutely in a chokehold by people who are... People always ask me what I'm going to do after the ringer. Yeah. And I think like, I'm prime Congress age when I, you know.

Except our generation doesn't get to do stuff. It's boomers and then maybe millennials will save us, but we're out. Prime Congress age. That's so sick. But the culture is still in a chokehold of people a little bit older than us, you know, who, and that's that whole generation of like legacy sequels where it's just like we're going to make things feel like amblin movies from the 80s because we love them. But we're not going to advance them because we're arrested people still in our childhood who don't take our toys. is out of our boxes.

Let's move the Overton cultural window up a little bit. It is hard for people like us to say it. Let's have a bunch of kids riding bicycles listening to Disturbed. There you go. What could be better? No, they'd be riding razor scooters listening to Disturb. So sick. Listening to the first iPod.

A little shoe leather reporting? Yeah. 12-year-old daughter thinks the 90s are cool. She said what she said to me today? She was like, all the good movies came out in the 90s. Like what? clueless and Titanic. And I was like, I had no comeback.

I was like, you know, Uncle Chris does a whole podcast about movies from the 90s, basically. No. With that. Can I just do one last Duster thing? Yeah, of course. Do whatever you want. I just, one more plea.

I don't even know where it's streaming, but the one season wonder Quarry is still the best version of post-Vietnam War pulp that I've seen. And it's crazy to me. It's not crazy to me if the show is underseen. It was a Max. Is it available on streaming anywhere?

You got your laptop right there. I can vamp. Do you want me to Google at the end of this podcast? I want people to have like a service relationship with our pod. It seems to be available on... Peacock? Amazon? We have to buy it?

I mean, it's just crazy. You want me to buy it right now on air? That would be riveting. I don't know. I don't know if it's out. I'll tell you after the podcast. Our listeners are active. I don't care.

I just wanted to make a case for it. You're so certain. Privacy. Yeah, okay. Just Berkshire Hathaway Hathaway podcasting. People make an investment in this podcast. They expect to return. See, that's your investment strategy, not mine.

I just like to VAM until I run out of money. Just that it's crazy to me that Michael Fuller and his colleagues and coworkers and Greg Gattanois, who directed on your friends and neighbors, was the director on it, made a show that did it, like really captured a certain type of fiction that we like and a certain kind hazy vibe and no one else has been able to do it. And clearly there is interest in it still. And that's a bummer. It's a great show. I have one more thing to tell you. Wherever you may be able to watch it. I don't know. Before we go, I have an assignment for you. Now, we're going to be back on Tuesday again. I know people are probably like, what's up with you guys?

You're my Monday. You get my week started, right? I mean, it's a federal holiday. Okay. But like we're also doing it because we're going to try and go see, we're definitely going to go see the final reckoning, Mission Impossible. We're going to talk about that. We'll talk about the season finale of The Last of Us. I do have. I do have. I do have. I do have. I do one thing I'd like to ask of you. Is it what to wear? No. I know that you've been behind on a couple of our favorite reality-based television. I know you're behind on Top Chef. It's okay. We haven't talked about it that much. I do think it got more interesting. I don't know if I would say it's my favorite season by any stretch, but it's interesting what's been going on on that show. I have to ask you to do something for me. It doesn't even matter if you watch the first two. You have to watch the third episode of 100-foot wave, season three. Oh, gosh. I haven't even, yeah.

Just set it up for you. So the first two episodes are still Nazaree stuff and Garrett stuff. The third episode, you're like, okay, maybe Nazare, we've cooked it. You know what I mean? We've got it. Honestly, every time you're watching the Nazaree stuff, you're like, there seems like there's like a thousand people in the water. Every time.

Yeah. And like between, just because like it's become such a destination, third one starts. I'm like, all right, there's a couple of like plot lines that we've got going here. Garrett's had some head injuries. And it's like, is he going to be okay or is he going to, you know, be able to stay out of the water? Yeah. And the episode is called,

I believe it's called the Wall of Cortez. The third episode. The third episode, last season was insane too. That's sort of their sweet spot. Do you know anything about what the Cortez Bank is?

Of course not. Is that where you keep your money? No. Are you finally giving the tips? There is apparently off the coast of California a submerged island in the middle of the Pacific.

So sick. And like fucking long, way from land. Like land is nowhere near. Yeah. But there's just like mad waves because this submerged island. This is crazy. And they go there. Oh shit. And it's like surfing on the moon because like you don't see the earth anywhere else. How do you how do you start? You got to watch. How do you begin your journey? By ship, but you must watch. You must watch it. It's awesome. Wow. This is also giving me like Wakanda Forever vibes like Namor comes out. He's just like you must not surf here. My name is

means no love. Do you remember? Like, there's certain things about the MCU that people are just going to be like, we didn't. I don't know if we really did that or not. I kind of don't want to stop podcasting.

Honestly, I think that I was really nervous about the first 10 minutes without the reference point, and I didn't expect the brother brother bit to go on that long. But now I feel good. I think this is a turning point for us. I feel like you have been shackled

to some sort of, you know, plan, some kind of schedule. Also, now I can just be more, less afraid you just be like, I don't know. I'm not looking at this information and I just don't know the answer to your question. You're like a young Charlie Parker. You just invented Bebop. Thanks to Kay and John for producing as always. We'll be back on Tuesday with a little bit of Ethan Hunt, a little bit at Ellie and Dina probably. We got to trust them all one last time. And maybe Andy will go to the Cortez Bank. I am. Take a little deposit. Just doggie paddle out there. Can I make it?

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