The Watch - Our HBO Max Prime-time Grids. Plus, Time Traveling with TV and ‘Top Chef’

Episode Date: May 29, 2020

Revisiting a beloved TV show that you haven’t seen in a long time can almost feel like traveling back in time (1:54). Plus, once you figure exactly what HBO Max is and how to get into it (21:05), there’s a bounty of streaming options. We craft our prime-time grids of what we’re watching from 8 p.m. to 12 a.m. (36:12). Hosts: Chris Ryan and Andy Greenwald Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

What's up, guys, it's this Kelly, and welcome to the Ringer Podcast Network. Launching this week on our podcast network is a new show from Van Lathen and Rachel Lindsay called Higher Learning. Two times a week, they'll be dissecting the biggest topics in black culture, politics, and sports, and wait into the most important and timely conversations. The first episode is out now, so make sure to subscribe to Higher Learning with Van Lathen and Rachel Lindsay on Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts. I ain't sports to have to clear the room. Stand up and walk. Hello and welcome to The Watch.

My name is Chris Ryan. I am an editor at the ringer.com. Joining me on the other line. He comes free with your service provider. You just have to know where to look for him. It's Andy Greenwald. I feel like we haven't done this in a while. Well, we miss Monday show.

We usually, we have not missed a show in a long time. Full on. I mean, we didn't miss it. We just took Memorial Day off, as everybody, I hope, did. And I hope everybody had a nice long weekend. It's keeping it together out there. raw out there right now, but Greenwald is great to see you as we gather here on a Thursday for the watch Max. Yeah, I'm excited. I feel a little out of practice, you know, ever since we last

spoke, like, I don't know what's going on anymore. I think I talk to you as much as I talk to anyone in the world, so I feel like we could probably slide back into it. We can probably figure it out. We are going to talk a lot of HBO Mac stuff, including a riveting 20 to 40 minute story about me trying to log in for the first time, which I think is really going to keep a lot of our listenership right where we want it. But there are a couple other things out there that I wanted to throw at you first, including, you know, obviously we've started, we've become a top chef podcast, and that's generally what we've been talking about on Mondays. We have not talked about last week's episode. There is a new episode tonight, Thursday. But we have to talk about Last Chance

Kitchen. So, but before we do any of that, I got, I got two things for you. Okay. one, and I know that our listeners are hanging on this, but I wanted to let you, and mostly them, because they are all in my quarantine pod now, I wanted them all to know that I finished Thomas Mons, the Magic Mountain, all 706 pages. And I got to tell you, it really picks up around page 500. Like, the last two Hundo are real wild and really good. And what I want to I want to say is I don't know how many people are going to be reading the book after this or consider you really are leading with the most the trending topic well I want to get this out of the way yeah because I thought it was really interesting I did and you can say it isn't and

kaya probably hasn't hit record yet like this all might just go away which is fine I get it that may have been a directive from from bill do you think that the population of monington island is greater or smaller than daddington island oh monington like the real watchmons Watchman, by the way, that is the season two pitch that HBO needs. Come back to the negotiating table, demon. We got it. What I'm saying is you may have an impression of this impenetrable 706-page book about a young German man's seven-year idol in a sanitarium in the Swiss Alps in the years leading up to World War I.

I get it. Everybody's got a take on that. And if your take on it consists of thinking that 450 pages of the book are essentially pedagogic arguments between an Italian Freemason humanist and a ideological bomb-throwing Jew turned Jesuit while they go on long strolls about the nature of free will. You got it. You got it. So you're right. But what I'm here to tell you people is on page 500, there is suddenly in the midst of this ocean of just intellectual thought exercises, there is a very much of, you a fucking seance where a dead guy comes back to life.

Uh-huh. And I was riveted. Really? And the reason I was riveted was because I could not think of anything except maybe Radiohead's paranoid android that surprised me so much that deep into it when it then became something else entirely. Interesting. So Gothic Greenwald came out.

You put on the black velvet. You fired up Bauhaus. Wait, wait, wait. The issue isn't whether Ouija boards are real, which, by the way, we could chat about because I'm super into pedagogic arguments now. But my point is I was trying to think of large pieces of work that hold your hand as one thing for the majority of it and then radically pivot 90 degrees and become something else entirely. Like what is a movie or a TV? Or a TV show that changed genres in midstream like that. Friday Night Lights season two. When it became a murder mystery. Great call. This is a great question. You say you don't like to be surprised, but here you are just pulling rabbits out of your hat. Let's distinguish this. We're not talking about twists. This is not a twist. It is a gear shift on a massive level, on a structural level, right? I cannot stress enough how this book is just people talking about the world and like the fallen world

and how man or Mon exists within it. At no point are they like, by the way, people can have access to spirits and communicate with the dead. And then literally on page 506, Mon or the narrator is like, oh, and then there was Ellen Parker, who I guess we haven't mentioned,

but we should because Home Girl can black out and summon the dead, and that's what we're going to do for the next 20 minutes. Man, I'm trying to think now. This could just be, I don't want to put you on the spot. I feel like there are movies, you know, there are movies with twists that suddenly become something else. There's like Truman Show or something. I don't want to say a twist because I don't want to spoil things for people.

But like, for instance, there is something like Atonement that changes very close to the end of the book. That's a great example. But it's still kind of within. But that's like the final nail. Like when you find that out and there's like a page left. And that undoes your perception. of what came before, but it's not fundamentally saying, oh, this sweeping emotional war epic

is actually a slapstick comedy. I'm just looking at my books. This is riveting podcasting right now. Kaya's videoing us. I don't see anything. Honestly, I know what you're saying, and I know I've experienced it, but I can't give an example of it.

So let's throw it open to our listeners. Hit us on Twitter, hit us on the Facebook group. I'm really curious because, just, I mean, just the gall to pull something like this off. But also you have to almost, I feel like in order to do this, you have to really, really, really, really lay a lot of track, right? You have to really have committed to being one thing before you suddenly become something else. Maybe part of the reason this was successful is because Armand in Germany wrote this book over a period of 17 years. I think the only thing I can think of to compare this to is that moment in newsroom where

Don tells the pilot that they got bin Laden. that's just your that would have been your answer to anything I said about culture what's the other that you wanted to spring on me because you said you had two surprise topics to lead us up we've already started off

with Thomas Mann so I think we are flying like watch out call her daddy because we are coming for the top spot it's fun by the way so the other one call her daddy yeah it's thank you Potter

it's HBO adjase and I know we're going to be talking a lot about HBO Max So let me paint another picture for you. This is another thing that a long time watchheads will appreciate. Last night, my wife and I had our, you know, by now standard 26 to 32 minutes of free shared time before lights out. And we realized, this was after I attempted to log in to HBO Max for an hour and texted Chris as if he was tech support, realized that we had an unwatched episode of Curb Your Enthusiasm Season 10,

because as sharp-eared listeners may remember, a certain member of my household made us skip forward to the John Hamm episode. Yes. Thus leaving the Nick Kroll, Ugly Section episode in the Hopper. So we watched that. And what a silly episode of television, but very enjoyable. We're not going to cover that. what that led to was making sure we hadn't missed any others from the season.

And then, of course, you know, on the HBO Go or whatever. Is this going to be like you found out you missed a season of the Sopranos or something? No, no, although that would be a good story. Oh, I would, that we could do our own podcast, just of that. That could be its own Spotify exclusive. No, I was scrolling down below and, you know, the first episodes it suggests under Kirby Enthusiasm are Kirby Enthusiasm Season 1. And just for the hell of it, I clicked play on season one, episode three, the beloved aunt, or episode four.

And it was one of the most surreal and discomforting experiences of my life. And I really encourage others to try this. It was time travel through my television set. I cannot think of, I'm not a big rewatcher. I'm not, I never rewatch anything, really. You should, you should come on this podcast that we have at the Ringer. No, this podcast is the watchables, and I'm good. I'm contracted for one, one watch.

And so I'm not used to having my memories or perceptions of a show when it's frozen and amber, like jolted. Season one of Kirby Enthusiasm was 20 years ago. Yeah. And the show is still on the air. Obviously, there were many breaks. But to watch it was fucking crazy. Now, here are some of the reasons why it was so crazy. Number one, Larry David has not aged at all and looks exactly the same.

That in and of itself is shocking. Okay? Two, every episode appears like it was shot on the stage set preserved from small wonder and or an outback steakhouse. the budget for the show appears to be approaching zero dollars. Adjusted it for inflation, yeah. Adjusted for inflation. Three, Larry David had no idea who the character of Larry David was. He's just kind of this sour-faced post-Sinfeld schnuck.

There is no merriment. There is no glee. There is no, I am the social disrupting monster that everyone now expects him to be. And in addition to that, I mean, everything is just slower and blah, blah, blah. But it was so, so, so bizarre to realize how much this show has changed,

obviously in 20 years and how long ago you can go back in it. What it felt like to me was, because it's not just going back in terms of this show and who the characters are, it's time travel in terms of how TV comedies are presented. Yeah. And it reminded me of the episode of Mr. Robot

when, for a laugh and to showcase Elliot's mental state, Sam shot the episode like it was a 80s, very special episode of a sitcom, and Alfa's in it. Yeah. So it's like the people you recognize performing in an unfamiliar way. That's what this looked like. It looked like they were having a laugh and doing a bit in a style of an old sitcom, and I was totally floored.

And what made me wonder is if you have had an experience like this, I'll take my follow. I'll take the answer off air because then I have a follow-up. Well, I think that this speaks to the very different relationships you and I might have to television at this point in our last. lives because TV for me, as it always really has been, has been a little bit of a nightlight. Like, you know, I used to live, when I lived alone in Boston or New York, I would like, the first thing I would do is turn the television on just to have kind of like sports center going on in the background. So I'm, I'm kind of used to television as a passive experience. And because of that, I think, you know, my wife watches Golden Girls.

Like, she'll just sometimes, if she's like sleeping in a little bit, she'll like turn Golden Girls on. on her phone and just kind of like have it lightly playing in the background. So like I feel like I am pretty familiar with the idea of TV just being on and because of that and because I've seen Golden Girls episodes or how I met your mother episodes or modern family episodes or Cheers episodes or Friends episodes dozens of times just because they're on. I don't ever really like notice that thing that you're talking about, which is, I mean, when I went back and started watching friends a little bit when people were like friends, you know, a couple years ago. I was like, holy shit, the clothes, they don't know who these characters are.

You can tell, like, this person's supposed to be cool. And then they've decided that they're not cool. So they make them the, like, the run to the litter and the group. But yeah, I think that if you have those shows on, like, if you, if you're a person who has the office on all the time or has curb on all the time, that stuff doesn't really, like, jolt you at all. Yeah, I think you're right. I think you've absolutely pegged how I experienced TV, which is really just, you know, me, I'm all about the now. I'm just, what have you done for me lately? No, but I think that you are like, I noticed that when you and I have conversations about TV and you're just like, what should I watch or like, is there something you're watching that I like? This is just even like as friends. I think that

you're like, I would also rather be doing, I would rather be reading a book if not. This isn't good. And I'm like, oh, well, just put it on and like, blah, blah, blah, well, look at your phone and stuff. And it's like, you obviously have a different home life than I do. But I think also, I've always had that attitude towards TV where you're like, subpar or average TV is actually not my bag. Yes. Also, I think you're right. I mean, in my household, like, putting on the television is a political act. Yes. Like, it cannot be undone. Yeah. We are trying to, like, most parents in today's world, especially during this time, like, trying to be in some ways careful with screen time. Is now what I mentioned that I've been playing Red Dead revolver online with your kids?

I, by the way, if you want to go down this road, I can't wait to tell you about glitter force on Netflix. I have a lot of thoughts to share. But because of that, there is no casual TV watching in our house. There isn't even, I mean, obviously it's easy now because there's no sports, but even putting on a game has become fraught because then they just want to watch the commercials. And I'm not sure what they're getting out of that other than maybe a good deal on a new Hyundai.

But so you're absolutely right about that. But it did make me think, and this is the sort of thing, I'm just going to throw this idea out there. We could do it on, you could do it on the ringer. We could do it on this podcast. But you know the, you know the chart, the evolutionary chart of man, not on in this case, where it's just like, you know, walking a certain way and a little bit, little bit monkeyish and then stand it up, stand it up, stand it up. It's like, what's up? Yeah. I'm pretty much a person now. And then it's just the dude from the 1975 at the end. Yeah. The final form of final boss level. But then getting a little older and whatever, applying that evolutionary chart to TV

shows because I promise you there's probably more overlap in this than we may expect that there is a version of beloved shows that is probably shared among all of us that is the frozen version, like the peak version of it. So when we think of Breaking Bad or Mad Men or Cheers or The Office and we haven't watched it in a while, we are specifically thinking of a moment, an era, a season, maybe even an episode where it was in its full glory as what it was. And for example, with curb watching the season, we are past that now. We are like old friends. We've been through it together.

It's clearly a very different show now. It's batting average is not terrific, but it's, you know, it could still lead the league. You know, it's like still batting like 300, 350. And what's carrying it is our relationship to it and in our relationship with Leon and Lewis and the gang. So there's a there's a pre-evolutionary version. there's the peak version of a show, and there's the post version of the show. And when you're watching it in real time,

you are not necessarily aware of where you are in the chart. But looking backwards, I think it probably would be interesting to look at. You know, it's funny. I was just reading this article about the band The Fall. It was on a website called Quietus. And it was basically about whether or not the first fall record you hear is your favorite one. You know, whether or not your first experience with something

winds up being what you think of as that band. And this guy, I'm sorry, I don't remember his name, but I can put it in the show notes. But it's a great article. And it's all about this one year in the fall's career where they put out a bunch of really, really amazing singles and wound up setting up their long, long run that came afterwards. But he was like, it's this year is my version of the fall, even though that's not the first version of them I heard. It's fascinating to interrogate.

I think you could even do that for the shows that we have talked about in the course of our two pods, both Hollywood Prospectus and the Watch. like if I say Breaking Bad to you, like what iteration of Breaking Bad? Because when I was kind of doing a lot of Saul stuff, I went back and watched a lot of Breaking Bad. We did that a lot for the best 100 episodes of the century. I went back and watched a lot.

There are a lot of different versions of that show. And I realize, like, what I think of as Breaking Bad has almost nothing to do with the first two, two and a half seasons of that show. Absolutely. Absolutely. It's all post-Jane. It's like almost entirely post-chain.

And it's really, it's really fascinating to kind of think when you're saying like, oh, and I think now especially, and we'll get into HBO Max, as these libraries become more and more formalized and more, you know, something that we actually like advertise that I'm going back and watching all Sopranos or I'm going back and watching all of Sex in the City and that these shows become contemporary by their sheer placement next to our current TV lineups, how people will interact with. Season 1 of Sex and the City versus Season 4. You know, how people react to Season 1 of Sopranos versus the end of Sopranos. And what winds up being, in your mind, the Sopranos or Sex in the City off of that? Yeah, for me, I mean, USWR Breaking Bad, it's actually the last season.

It's that's the moment for me when you, it's inextricably linked to my experience covering it and recapping it in a rush on Sunday nights without the benefit of screeners, and feeling like everything that had come before had built to this. This was the final, like, luge run, and now we could just, like, let ourselves go in it and feel completely realized.

Because, like, the show had held back on all of its biggest secrets and reveals and, you know, Hank finding out, for example, and everything else that followed. That show was uniquely built for that sort of feeling, though. But my memory of that show essentially is the end of it. And I don't know if that's the case with other shows. I mean, if you look at something like The Office, which I'm the only person in America, I think not to re-fall in love with again, which doesn't mean I don't think it's great,

but it's just I know it's there. Maybe someday I will watch it again or watch it with my kids for the first time. But, you know, the post-Corell seasons, which I was recapping, essentially don't exist. You know, it's like we don't even consider them. Or I don't when I think about the show. It's absolutely not that. I think probably like the Michael Scott Paper Company arc. Like that's the that's the zenith of that show.

And it went for four or five years after that. Yeah. Yeah, I did an online quiz the other day. Somebody had played. You really live in your best life in Quar, buddy. Put it in our Slack where it was basically a personality quiz to find out which Don Draper affair are you? I got Fay, which was correct.

But it was, I was like, oh yeah, I forgot. Like the comedian's wife. You know what I mean? like all these all the people yeah because like basically that was how people did guest runs on madmen was they had affairs with don draper for three to six episodes yeah Abigail Spencer as the teacher yeah Elizabeth Reiser yeah what's her name too uh oh gosh um siff yeah yeah anyway it is interesting it's another way to kind of it's just something to think about maybe we should we could continue to consider it because i do think that despite

my aversion to re-watching, there's just no way to avoid the fact, especially as these streaming services rise up and crush us, that contemporary TV watching is now unstuck in time. Well, it's a perfect segue to talk about HBO Max. So HBO Max came out on the 27th. It is, I would argue probably the most significant launch we've had. Well, certainly in 2020, I think immediately, with all due respect, dwarfs out. Apple in terms of its usefulness, of its necessity, in terms of its utility, you know, I think that it becomes a major player. It launched relatively hiccup free, I think, in terms of watchability, like what people got into the service and were able to kind of root around in there. They were

like, oh, okay, I see how to find stuff. I see how to save stuff to my list. I see how to, where the movies and the shows are. I think people had a lot of a very hard time figuring out whether or not they already had HBO Max, which was obviously a pretty complicated thing. I think, did you text me the joke about, like, if I need an explainer to tell me if I have HBO Max, it means it's not working correctly? Yeah. I mean, it's not great when the number one article on Vulture is, what is the difference between HBO Go, HBO now, HBO Max, and HBO, and how do I know what I have?

They put out, HBO actually, made a perfectly legible video about this. where they're like HBO Go is HBO for your Apple TV and your computer or wherever you're all your devices if you have HBO through your cable provider. HBO now is HBO if you don't have a cable subscription. Over the top, yeah.

And now HBO Max is HBO, whether you have a cable provider or not, you can sign up, and all of this Turner stuff and all of the Warner Media stuff. I have to say, you know, we'll see the long-term results of this because this is, of course, a long-term play. This is the major play that this media company is making for its future. So I obviously take this with all

the grains of salt about the decision to name the service, what they named it, and there have been articles written about it, and people have gone on the record talking about why it is what it is. In this moment, it feels like a colossal mistake to me, more so now than I thought a few weeks ago. One of those reasons may be that because of the pandemic, it is, launching with essentially one original series, right? Which is the Anna Kendrick show Love Life. Yes. Because of that, what it feels like is truly what it is, a gigantic repository for stuff. And that's not a bad thing. People, we were just saying, people love stuff. They love old stuff. There's a lot on here. And we're going to, obviously, in this conversation, talk about things that we found and things that we like and things that we recommend on it.

but it is absolutely confounding me why it's called HBO Max because HBO is the least prominent part of it as far as I'm concerned. It does not feel like the place where you can watch The Wire and, you know, Sopranos and Veep and all this other incredible legacy of shows, even though you can. Now, part of that reason is because I still have an app on my Apple TV that's called HBO Go that just has the HBO stuff. Yes. They didn't migrate into one thing. Two, it feels weirdly afterthoughty,

since these are such incredibly treasured jewel box properties for them to just be sprinkled in with all the other stuff, good and bad. Three, one of the most exciting things about the HBO Max interface, which, let me say again, once I got in there, was that it has their, like, collections. When you scroll down the menu list,

and it has Turner Classic movies or DC Universe, Studio Ghibli, which is, I'm going to talk about, that's by far the biggest reason if you have children or if you're young at heart, unlike us, to get this service. So you didn't show them Dark Night Rises last night? Joker. Batman Forever is on there as a kid's movie, by the way. So the fact that they are already like kind of like Disney Plus being like here, is the, here's Star Wars world. Here's Marvel World. There should have just been HBO world within

the service that was called Warner Media or Warner Unlimited or whatever. Because it just, it's very confusing to me. And then once the spigot is fully open and production is up again, shows like, like for example, DMZ starring our good friend Rosario Dawson, that's just going to get sort of dumped into this giant ocean. Yeah. As an HBO Max original. Now, that's, hopefully it's great and hopefully people see it, but I truly don't understand the difference or the value. I get what you're saying. It feels like it is devaluing one brand and not communicating new value in the other direction. So devil's advocate, HBO Max is definitely a choice, but I don't know necessarily what the other option was. I read a pretty convincing article. I think Lucas Shaw wrote this about this. I mean, he's been writing

about this a lot in Bloomberg, but a bunch of people have been covering this. the story. I can't remember exactly where I saw the quote or even where I saw it. But essentially it was like Warner Brothers while within Hollywood has like a sort of reputation for quality outside of Hollywood, nobody is like, ah yes, Warner Brothers TV. I'm not going to get a new app that's called WBTV and you need it. Explain to me that Game of Thrones is on there. So there's this was in that big, this was in that big feature story we talked about. Right, right, right. I think it was a variety. So then there's also like nobody wants to buy AT&T TV. You know, nobody, nobody feels, that's true. That's an affection for a global telecommunications giant,

even though that is essentially what HBO is due. HBO still has that sort of patina of quality. And I think that that was like, we own that patina. We're going to use it. We're going to use it. I think you're right. I do wonder whether or not this is,

we'll look back on this podcast and remember it for two things. One, you opening with a long soliloquy about Thomas Mann. And two, this will be, where we find out HBO is going away, you know, like down the line. Not ever totally, but just in five years, whether or not HBO Max is all of it. I think that's everything. I think you said it. And I think without realizing it, that's probably why I was caveating this so much about what it'll look like in a few years. It actually, I think it's probably the long-term play to preserve the brand. Yes. And because you and I both know, Go is very much tied to

very intricate and complicated rules about carrier fees and about these cable providers throughout the country who have rules about things needing to be on linear television before they can go on go and have rules about whether or not they get two feeds of east and west and then show something on digital. So it's going to be a process before you are thinking of HBO Max as what I do. I turn it on on Sunday night and it's there. but I think it is going to happen sooner than later. I agree. I guess maybe this is just an old-fashioned concern. This is probably the way it played out in the internal conversations about it too,

which is when HBO Prime goes away because cable essentially will go away. I mean, even if it doesn't go away completely for decade, it's rain on the top has come to a lot of time. Yeah, that's why all these cable companies and all these providers are getting into the content business. So then the question becomes, how do you continue to preserve the HBO brand of quality within the new HBO Max ecosystem? And the answer to that probably is, who cares, grandpa? People want Game of Thrones. It's there.

Well, I think that they made a very conscious choice to not open the original content floodgates on opening day. So it's worth noting that a lot of these other services have launched essentially off the back of a promise of, all this new content, whether it's Quibi, whether it's Apple Plus, Apple TV, whether it's Disney Plus. Even though Disney Plus only had one real, I mean, show for adults, I guess, one show that you and I talked about,

which was The Mandalorian. Manalorian was still one of the biggest shows in recent memory, if not, you know, even larger than that in 2019. You know, Disney Plus obviously had a full suite of shows, or sorry, Apple has a full suite of shows and really only has that. You know what I mean?

Like they are a TV channel, almost in a traditional. additional format. And I would say their output has been so limited that it almost feels old fashion the way that they, their production line seems almost old fashion. It's bizarre. I mean, they're not competing with anyone. They're not even attempting to. They just seem to be exist as kind of a honestly, in some level, it's like they exist as a stalking horse for agencies to drive up prices. Because they'll, they, every bidding war of the last six months, this is a generalization, but it seems like every bidding war of the,

last six months for high-profile properties comes down to Amazon and Apple, Netflix and Apple, HBO Max and Apple. Apple's just there. And now they're really getting into buying prestige movies. They bought the Tom Hanks World War II movie Greyhound, and then they just paid, they're co-financing Martin Scorsese's adaptation of David Grant's Killer the Flower Moon. And that's amazing because that seemed like Netflix just had this experience with the Irishman. Now we're getting to the Big Pick territory, but it seemed pretty clear that. that Marty got used to the unlimited paychecks and God bless them for it and turned to Netflix and was like, bail us out. And they may have balked a certain degree because they didn't get the

Oscars that they wanted and there's not going to be film festivals this year. And Apple is like, okay. Yeah, sure. Now, now we're getting off topic. I think for Apple, movies is a better play for them because people are kind of used to renting movies or seeing now playing, you know, that just feels more natural part of their already existing ecosystem, whereas, hey, you could buy a new phone or a new phone case or watch one of these six TV shows.

Yeah. And I think Apple is kind of not, I don't think Apple has done a great job being like, dude, we're already leading from the front because we have the probably de facto digital interface for people to buy and rent television and movies. You know what I mean?

Most people, when they're like, do you want to watch something on a Friday night, I'll go look at iTunes. You know what I mean? And see what's on the front page there. I think. I mean, that's anecdotal, but I think that's the case. So let's get back to HBO Max, though,

because what HBO Max is saying is unlike Andy, they think you want to watch Dark Night and Lord of the Rings and all of these movies because their movie library is very impressive. And then on their TV side, they're like, we have all the HBO titles, minus like a few TaxiCap confessions, not on there. Shockingly. Control F real sex, not on there. This erasure of our adolescence will not stand. Yeah. But they've got everything else,

and they've got Big Bang Theory, and they've got friends, and they'll probably be adding more in waves. I think that they were smart not to dump the entire catalog at once, and it's relatively well curated. It's pretty easy to sort through it and look for different things. Like the movies, I think, are especially well put together, the TV series, I think that any catalog of television winds up getting a little diluted because you're like, man, there's a lot of bad television. There's a lot of shows I have no interest in watching.

But I think that they immediately kind of become a Netflix competitor with what they have in there. Yeah, I think your point about the movie selection is really well taken because it, the amount of blockbuster movies, I guess it's comparable only to what Disney, am I the only one still doing the police joke? I feel like a little bit alone here, but I can begin to move on. You do pluse, and then I'll do Thomas Mann. Oh, okay, and that'll just be a bit. How long was it between, when did Bill say Oklahoma City Thunder for the first time? How many years did he work that? Oh, Oklahoma City Thunder?

I think he still says zombie sonics every once in a while. Okay, so we can still sprinkle it in. I was going to use that as my benchmark. So obviously a huge number of Blockbuster movies. There's all the Harry Potter's on there, too. but I was very impressed with the restraint and curation on the classic film meat just because they shine more.

It really does shine more because to be going through a menu and see singing in the rain and network and a couple Fulini drops, you know, it's like, oh, this is pretty exciting and it's not dulled in the same way that too much of a good thing is because, you know, I think they've begun to understand

even Netflix in the way that they present their information, that if you are truly honestly browsing, you don't have anything in mind, you can drown if there are 30 classic movies just laid out in a row. But if there's four or five, it feels like a more reasonable choice

and you'll make the choice and you'll stick with the choice. I have often been like, I remember after once upon a time in Hollywood, I was like, I will just, I really want to watch like any Western. So I was like going through and if you go through like Amazon Prime's Library or Netflix's Library of Westerns,

it's like there's a couple at the front where it's like, oh, Magnificent Seven's here. That's great. Wild Bunch is here. That's great. And then it's like 11 Comancheros to Cheyenne, you know? I'm sure that like if I am really stumping for time, I could knock this out. But you have to sort through a lot of 11 Comancheros for Cheyenne before you get to the next Wild Bunch there. You have to watch the first 10, right?

Yeah, I know. I mean, that's the thing is like you don't want to lose the cannon there, you know? That was a long series. what we wanted to do today to kind of help people sort through HBO Max. I don't know if you had any more big picture kind of conversation topics for this specific service. I'm into the purple. You're into the purple. You like the motif.

I do want to say, I think Andy and I might hit this one a little bit later in, you know, next week or something. But I want to say, Love Life is very good. You know, it's a show from Sam Boyd starring Anna Kendrick. And it is about a woman sort of. sorting through her love life in New York City starts in 2012 with a very, very grounding Lynn sanity subplot. Really? She goes to a bar to watch Jeremy Lynn with her boyfriend.

And it is really scratching the high fidelity itch, really scratching kind of like a girl's high fidelity itch. And it's like it's unexpectedly affecting. And if you've signed up for HBO Max or you have HBO Max and you're messing around, like love life's really good. Really, really good. Second episode especially is great. Scoot McNary. Really coming through with older boyfriend vibes. This feels very servicing that you're supplying this. I had no idea. I'm something of a concierge, you know?

Incredible. If only there was a podcast for you and you alone on that. So Andy and I wanted to do today, and we've done this in the past on the watch, is created a primetime grid. It's 8 p.m. to 12 a.m. Nobody actually watches that much television. Or if they do, they probably start at like 4 p.m. and go until 3 a.m. But this is the old, school, like, it started eight, you kind of get a little, some appetizers going, some amuse boosh to just kind of lighten it up. Nine, ten, typically your dramas, typically your prestige stuff. And then 11 to 12, kind of more late night fare. Andy, why don't you give me your grid first? Okay. I'm going to call it up. And this is obviously all pulled from the HBO Max Library.

Share the screen here. Famous last words. One side note. One side, seriously, one side note. Do you know the Honorable Woman is on HBO Max? I did. It's not on my grid. So what I tried to do here, I don't know if we went by the same rules. I think it's open to interpretation, my guy. Well, I tried to stay away from the most part from HBO stuff. Yes, me too. And well, with some exceptions. With some exceptions. And as I said, not the biggest rewatch person. So I, to please bear that in mind. That's why I didn't put Honorable Woman on, even though I was excited to see it, one of our favorite shows the last few years. And I think one of the, one of the shows that we, the ratio of us talking about to people knowing where to find and watching was probably,

that was probably at one of the widest. I think the numbers bear that out, yes. Second, second only to our deep investigation of the 1929 novel, The Magic Mountain. Okay, so because, as you said, my household runs a little bit differently than yours. I'm actually beginning my grid at a different time. Okay. So my evening begins at seven. Good.

It's only an hour. Only an hour before me. With a bravora. a repeat screening of Kiki's delivery service to include at least one of my children that's still awake. And mainly this is because I said it before, I'll say it again. Studio Ghibli, which is the Japanese studio

created by Hayao Miyazaki and two of his colleagues and filmmakers in their own right, this is the reason to get HBO Max. It absolutely is. So these movies, all of their animated films are available all in one go. They've never been available on streaming before. They only became available to rent or buy.

on streaming, like on Apple, within the last six weeks, I believe. Prior to this, these absolute masterpieces, and I say this not just as in terms of films, but in terms of films to watch with your family and not hate yourself, in which they are unparalleled, they were pretty much you could get them on like $40 Blu-rays at the Japanese bookstore in Little Tokyo. And that was it. And all of a sudden, they are all here, and it's an embarrassment of riches. And I know people say Spirited Away or Princess Mononoke are the best ones. I'm not even going to front. I haven't even seen those because as I've been told that those are a little older for my kids. So we're still in the my neighbor Totoro, Kiki's Delivery Service, Panyu, like the early days. The bank robbery and

spirited away is pretty rough. Sorry. You've seen it? I was thinking of Pete. You've seen a cartoon? Kiki's delivery service is one of their favorites. It's a masterpiece. And no matter how many times I see it. So it's really exciting that that's there. So that's seven to eight 30. Now we're living, in a complete fantasy land where we don't have to take 30 to 90 minutes to make everyone who's younger than 8 go to sleep. And somehow they just vanish off to their rooms. Like their governess takes them, right? And then we can continue watching TV, so let's pretend that's true. We need a pallet cleanser. Maybe even this is a fantasy world

where there's no longer a virus and you're visiting. And we want to like quickly, you know, put down like a tart granita to get the cartoon out of your mouth. Nobody does food metaphors like you. this is when we fire up in Eastbound and Down classic because they're really, I don't know if there's a show that I truly in my heart love more and I have not watched it in a while. There's nothing that binds you and I together

like Eastbound and Down. It's the part of the meme with the arm wrestling where we meet. Yeah. And I love it so much and I would love to watch it again. That would really cheer me up. So that's seven to eight is Princess Monanoque or whatever.

Seven to eight 30. 8.30 to 9. So you're going to go 90 minutes off the top rope to start, and then you're going to go eastbound and down at 8.30. So we're at 9 o'clock. We're at 9 o'clock. At 9 o'clock. You go to sleep.

I'm going to do what comes naturally and fire up Chernobyl. Yeah. No, no, I'm not. I'm just trolling our Facebook group. Guy going to encounter! At 9, I am going to put on Doom Patrol. Okay. reason being

Doom Patrol the only and I'm going to get into this in a moment the only DC universe original that is on the service so far which is totally bizarre to me

but that's where we're at like a whole streaming service right but why I don't understand why and so they put the show on here you could make the case that they put the show on here because it's the one

they're the most proud of it's gotten really good reviews it's apparently kind of off the wall and interesting I think the reason they put it on here is because it is a fucking expensive show to make. I know this just from, you know, looking at it,

there were reports as to why this is the DC Universe show that's on here because they could co-finance it. I also know just from talking to people who worked on it, and we were interviewing some people for crew positions who worked on it. They put a lot into it. It's one of the most interesting comics DC produces. I think it's worth a shot.

It could be interesting. Okay. 10 to 11, I had a classic episode of Parts Unknown, but I don't want to step on you, because I know that you feel the same way. So I have something else in there. Because this is just me in a fantasy land where I'm just ready to experiment,

a beloved show that I've never seen is available on streaming for the first time on HBO Mac. It's called Men of a Certain Age. Chris, you and I are now of a certain age. I know. Do you think it resonates with this? And I wonder if it does. And Mike Royce, who, you know, has worked on a ton of great sitcoms

and now one day at a time, he created the show, Andre Brower, Scott Baccula. Ray Romano, beloved by some when it was out, never saw it. So I feel like this could be a nice thing to watch, especially now that I can get the references. That's a really good pull. And then we're at 11.

I had something from 11 to 1130 that I was excited to check out, which is our friend Justin Halpern's show, Harley Quinn, the animated Harley Quinn show. And it's not on there. It's not on there because of this weird, like, we need to have a separate streaming service, purely for fans of DC comic books. And I'm sure it will be on there eventually.

Yes. But we can't talk it up yet, but shouts to Justin. So instead of that, because, again, I'm pretending I'm you, and I have an ability to watch television in my bedroom and maybe we'll fall asleep with something that's comforting. Some first season, OC, baby. Yeah. Yeah, dog.

Shouts to friends of the pod, Josh Schwartz. Did you ever re-watch OC at all, or was it just the first time through? I never rewatch anything. That would be an incredible experiment to see how you felt about it going back. I know, because that show, I mean, it's one of the reasons why I don't rewatch, honestly, because it's not just so tied to a time, but it was really felt special and fun. And, you know, like 2003, 2004, we were not in high school. But I remember going over to people's apartments sometimes to watch episodes of that.

And then also, you know, probably drink like we were at a beach party in Ventura. But whatever. that was fun. That feels comforting and it would be a nice way to kind of ride out the night. Oh, that's fantastic stuff. I really like that.

So let's run it back for me. Just give me all the names. Just so people here. Kiki's delivery service. Eastbound and down. Doom Patrol. Men of a certain age. The OC.

8 o'clock, Andy. I've polished off dinner. I've done my dishes. I've made myself a boulevardier to settle in for the evening. By the way, your new presence, a little toasted on Instagram stories, is the best thing that's happened during quarantine to me. I find the community on Instagram to be, has a softer touch. So it's been fun.

It's really, really special to see images of Chris holding a... When I look at my comments on Instagram, and people are like, hey, man, thanks for the podcast. And it's not like, dot, dot, dot, dot, you bald piece of shit. It's actually just like a nice thing from somebody. Yeah, no. The other day I made the mistake of tweeting something. I was like, I just felt like I wanted to be supportive of our friends in the media. And I was like, I just subscribed to the Atlantic, which I did because I want to support.

And they were like, you started the Iraq War, right? Yes, yes, they were. I was like, you guys seem super fun. I'm going back to the gram. All right, eight o'clock. I'm sitting there. I got the Boulevard D.A. and I'm firing up, I'm Alan Partridge.

It's Steve Coogan's groundbreaking, amazing show from the 90s, with Armando Ionucci, worked on it with him. And it is about, I think it was a show that is essentially forecast the office. You know what I mean? And forecasts a lot of sort of the sort of cringe humor that would come from it, come after it, not unlike Curb Your Enthusiasm. it is about a very ambitious but not very talented television presenter slash radio presenter named Alan Partridge who's living I guess in like Norwich

who is sort of in East Anglia and England and has big dreams of making it onto the BBC and it is so fucking funny still I mean it's definitely got it's got a laugh track there are bits of it that are kind of like the laughs are a little too hard on like the the third most funny joke in the scene. But it is, if you like Curb, if you like the office, if you, if you like the trip, which we haven't gotten a chance to talk about yet, the trip series with Steve Coogan and Rob Ryan, it is just Pete Coogan. They have a bunch of series, Alan Partridge series on HBO Max, but you might as well start from the beginning. They're 30 minutes each, and they are so fucking funny. This is an incredibly strong call. Have you watched the trip to Greece yet?

I have not. We're going to watch this weekend. We can talk about next week. Yeah. That other than, other than Chris rediscovering Bell and Sebastian live on Instagram last night, the trip to Greece was the best thing I've seen in the last few weeks. Another one I wanted to bring up, so it's 830, and one that I wanted to sort of mention was, you know, because a lot of people probably will be like, Friends is back. I can start watching Friends. You can. Friends is super delightful to watch and just kind of have it on the background.

But I would recommend another English show for 830, and that's Gavin and Stacey, which is a really, really good rom-com, I think from like early 2000s, maybe mid-first decade of 2000s, James Corden's in it, but is essentially just like the story of two couples, the story of some younger people kind of falling in and out of love, but is essentially a sitcom.

It was on for four seasons. They've got all four seasons on it. I'm sure that there's parts of it that are dated, but I always kind of had a soft spot for Gavin and Stacey, and it's a theme, you know, it's a British theme in the first hour. There was an American remake, right? with Thomas Hayden Church and there was. Yeah, I believe so.

Yeah, and I don't know if that's not that. It's not that. It's good, though. I like that Gavin and Stacey's really good. 9 o'clock, we start getting serious out here. And one thing you may not know about me, Grimwald. Is there something? I'm all in on the greatest generation.

I'm back. This is a wrinkle. I zag. Where everybody else is going one way, I'm like, you know what? World War II, guys, I'm here for you. and I'm here to watch Band of Brothers, which I have not watched in the 20 years since it came on, but I was doing a pod with Fennessee and Manda a week or two ago,

and we were talking about Tom Hardy, and I realized that Band of Brothers is essentially the fount of all acting for the last 20 years. Like every single person on a show or in a movie was in Band of Brothers. So I was like, you know what? I could really go for that. I want to skip the Schwimmer episode in the beginning because I remember that being,

a tough hang. But after that, come on, man, let's go invade Italy. Let's do it. Let's take it back. So Band of Brothers at 9, Andy already mentioned, but at 10 o'clock, I'm firing up Anthony Bourdain Parts Unknown. They have all 12 seasons. Andy, this is probably one of Andy and I's favorite shows of the century. I think it's fairly safe to say. And I would say that I am just now kind of like okay with seeing him again. Yeah, I was wondering about that. I, I, I'm not sure. I have been thinking a lot how much I miss him and how much I miss this show, especially now. You know, I mean, there's something that feels everything about his passing, and we've talked about it, you know, at nauseam, there's no reason to get back into it.

But there is something that feels just so especially cruel at this moment. And this is a very selfish thing to say, because it's, of course, was crueler to those who knew him and to his family. but at a moment like this when we are you know podcasting from our homes in quarantine and the idea of travel the idea of a connected world feels farther away than ever knowing that he's not there to help reopen those boundaries and to

and to take us places again and connect people again it's just it's upsetting but I'd like to think that revisiting some of these shows might help you know rebalance our brains and remember that there is a world out there and that it's adventure like that is possible. Yeah, his two main themes were exploration and empathy, and I think that we could use a lot of them.

And I have a lot of them on my DVR. I think I own a bunch of them on iTunes. Like, it's just something that I would, like we've talked about before, I would watch episodes of Parts Unknown and start to plot out vacations, you know, based on where he went. And I think that that had been,

it was obviously like a really painful loss for so many people and for us. And this kind of happened when Tom Petty passed away where I was just like, I just can't listen to Tom Petty anymore without thinking about this. And usually when I listen to music, I don't want to contemplate stuff like that. And I feel somewhat similar to television.

But the other day I was, I think because we've been talking so much about Top Chef, he's been on my mind. And the other day, a video from the show, from Parts Unknown of Bordane and Sean Brock going to Waffle House came on. And it is two guys

hammered at Waffle House doing the ultimate order. And it was like it was like taking like it was like taking ecstasy. I was like this is so good. This is so fucking entertaining. And I'm so hungry.

And I want to go to Waffle House right now. And these guys are just articulating things that I feel about food and people. And I miss it. You know, I think I'm ready to kind of go back. And it's such a gift that this service has all 12 seasons. You can pick and choose. You can mix and match.

you can jump around or you can watch them in order from 1 to 12, and you will not be sorry. So parts unknown. It's weird, by the way. When I was going through the HBO Max menu in preparation of this podcast, it's weird to say this because there's way, there's way too much food television, but there's not enough at the same time. There's a ton of programming, not a ton on HBO Max, but across all these services, but there's not enough of that. And obviously it's hard to make, to do the very best there is. I think Parts Unknown is probably the very best food show, certainly the best food and travel show. I think ugly delicious, as we've talked about, is the heir to that throne.

I think it's really, really special. And obviously they're treating it as such and making, you know, certainly a certain number of episodes. But I wish there was more, it doesn't have to be as ambitious. It doesn't have to be as globe-trotting. I would have, I was looking to program my night with something that's my version of escapist, which would be something thoughtful and cultural and food-based. And there wasn't a ton. Yeah.

I hope that service gets more stuff like this, but it'll be hard to top the sort of collective body of work that Bourdain left behind. So that's 10 to 11. And then at 11, I'm going to fire up vice principals. You and I, McBride Brothers forever. I actually feel like I'm not sure if I finished vice principals. Do you ever have that really like? I know I didn't.

Yeah. So, and I also think that this was something that, um, the first time around, I, like, exclusively viewed it through the, is this as good as eastbound lens? And it was tough to live up to that. So I'm, I'm kind of like, I would give this another try. Uh, so, so vice principals at 11 and then 11.30, uh, space ghost, which I have not watched since I was a very young man. Uh, and this is, this is the talk show that the pavement was on and stuff in the 90s. Yes, with Brack. Yeah, you know. That was really funny. Yeah, so it's there. I think I might try it out, see if it's still funny. So my list is I'm Alan Partridge, Gavin and Stacey, Band of Brothers, Parts Unknown, Vice Principles, and Space Coast. So that's two pretty good primetime grids from you and I. That's a good hang from you.

We still have our fastball. And also, like I said, check out Love Life. You want to talk about Top Chef before we go. Just briefly set up. So we're recording this on 30. Thursday, tonight's episode, which I am so excited for, is the last episode in L.A. Before they travel to Italy, obviously, this is something they filmed before the world closed down, which makes it even more poignant. If you have not watched last week's episode and the finale, two-part finale of Last Chance Kitchen, thank you so much for your service, Baranskys. We will see you on Monday. If you have, we're going to talk about it. And the reason

we're talking about it isn't so much because the episode itself was particularly noteworthy. It was good. Good episode. Strong episode. You know, the Olympic theme was unfortunate, but appreciated. I thought it was awesome to see the chefs from Anaka, a restaurant that I have never been able to get into, but wish that I could on TV. I want to talk about last chance kids. You mean get into, like, get a seat? Not like, I've never. Oh, I can't get it. I can't get a reservation. Exactly. You're a little pitchy dog. You sit there at the tasting chicken. I think I could hang with this like Michelin-Start, Los Angeles-centric Kaiseki cuisine.

No, I want to talk about Last Chance Kitchen. There are times when people reach for sports metaphors in discussing reality TV. And all of those times, I roll my eyes until now. What happened on Last Chance Kitchen, which two parts, all told, equaled another episode of Top Chef, so thank you based Bravo Gods for that, was one of the most athletic feats I can remember seeing on television.

It was, and obviously tough year for it, but I would say top five sports moment of 2020. From those other three games that happened? Exactly. Shouts to all the commissioners doing their best. It was jaw-dropping. It was so hype. It was so wild.

So to set the scene for people who don't care about being spoiled or maybe forget, Karen was once again eliminated and went down Orpheus's path to the underworld to find Kevin waiting for her. Tough week for her to be Twitter searching her name. Yes, tough week for Karen's cross the board. Kevin is waiting for her and beats her fairly handily. And then Tom's like, oh, but wait. and then there's the second part of Last Chance's Kitchen where all of the surviving chefs

come down into the underworld which is just the regular set with the lights changed. Yes. And Tom is like for the first time ever this is how it's going to go. You have to fight your way back to the army of the living. And this is, so now you need to have

your second, third, and fourth consecutive quickfires to survive here. And you need to win two of the three against a competitor of your choosing from the surviving chefs, right? And Kevin picks Malarkey first because, obviously,

and just humiliates him. Like, that was, malarkey's like adding extra broth to his risotto. Come on. Come on. That's Tom Colicchio. Show some respects. And then it becomes like an 80s movie, right?

Because then Kevin is like, I do not care about the easy path. What I care about, is honest victory and brotherhood. So I challenge my soulmate, Brian Voltagio, to battle for honor and decency, because all I want is to measure myself against him, and if I lose, so be it.

And he fucking loses. And then obviously. It's one one. He's got to win the next one to get back in. And I could feel Stephanie shrinking from the screen onto my couch to hide. I thought Stephanie was, I really like Stephanie. Stephanie is the best hand.

Stephanie's gaze was such that you would think that arcade fire were performing all of funeral just off the set. She, she was eyes left. She did not want to catch any Kevin eye contact. She wasn't trying to volunteer. She wasn't trying to like go, you know, be like, you got to go through me. She was like, who the fuck?

I'm not doing anything. Chris, I am not talking about coho salmon when I say she wanted none of the smoke. None. And then Kevin, who has got to be just, his body is breaking down at this point, right? And has already, has already, like, fell on his sword. Like, Kevin has gone through it. Everything you could go through on Top Chef, he is, he, like, took the L in restaurant wars. He's fought back in Last Chance Kitchen.

he has gotten to this very point where Tom is like, pick your opponent and you could just wipe the floor with them if you want. Write your ticket. Write your ticket back. He says, I want them to choose.

I want you to put your strongest competitor up against me. If someone doesn't want me back, step up. He just says he wants a volunteer. But essentially what he's saying is, and he says this in the confessional, he's like,

if they don't want me back, they need to step up and stop me. which is cool because I think that like you have to sometimes read between the lines on Top Chef where you're like who is the chef that the people who are on the show are afraid of. And I think that Kevin obviously has a really good reputation

and has been on the show before but I didn't really understand how scared people were of him because this has been a very touchy-feely fuzzy season. I feel like very nice to one another. They were like, yo, Kev can't come back. Like, because my odds are significantly worse if Kevin comes back. Yeah, and Stephanie and Malarkey know that they're lucky to still be in the show. But even Melissa was like, I'm not trying to see Kevin.

No, right. I'm saying, like, the fact that they made it this far, they're like, I can continue to squeak by and maybe something breaks my way. But if this bulldozer, if the juggernaut, literally the juggernaut from X-Men comics... If the country captain comes back. It's a wrap. It's a wrap on me in my pub food, question mark. So, Big G steps up. Yeah, Gregory.

Big Gregory, who is... Gregory is now getting into the Bransky level of must-have guests. Gregory is a... Gregory might be the television character of the year. Like, he is just crushing it. He is so entertaining and kind and great, but he is an assassin. He's so talented.

It's really exciting to watch him. So he steps up in the best spirit of reality TV like, fuck it, let's see. Because he knows he's not going home. You can just throw it all out there. And then they do desserts. I mean, risotto, desserts, the soup Kevin made with just like funk bombs and blue cheese. Yeah. It was so wild.

And at the end of it, Kevin is victorious. Yeah. I do have the only thing, I in some ways find last chance kitchen to me, purely entertaining than the actual show. They do not spend very much time on Tom's judgments, and he tends to be like, those were both really good dishes. Good dishes, good dishes. Good dishes.

Kevin, you win. You know what I mean? And I feel like he did it for the Graham there. Like, they want Kevin back. And someone who now does it for the Graham, I feel like Tom was like, I, if it's a split decision, I'm going with Kevin. I think that's right.

And I think that they probably had, they put a camera on him to talk about it, I think he probably would have said that. It's good they didn't because that would have just opened up this whole like, what's fair here. And it shouldn't be about that. But the tie definitely should go to the guy who's just on four fucking quickfires and is still just crushing it. I mean, can you imagine being put in a situation where you have to do something in 30 minutes? Like, anything in your life? I can't cook a Beyond Burger in 30 minutes. You kidding me? We couldn't talk about HBO Max in 30 minutes. Like, we are, you know, there's no more hard drive space left on poor Kaya's computer right now. She might be in the ocean right now. I have no idea.

So going from ahead of tonight's episode. Which you may have already seen. Okay, so we have not seen it. You may have already seen tonight's episode going into it. You asking who I got to go home or who I got to go home? No, who's your big board? Who is, give me your top three in the order you have them entering into tonight's LA finale. So obviously, I think it's, it's, It's a... Gregory and Melissa, I think, have pulled ahead. For me,

I do think that there is a... There's a couple of examples of late chargers. Of people who... That's a thing. ...have hung around, know they're good, maybe get stymied a couple of times, but then come through in the end and really fire away. I'm going to put my money on Brian Baltasio.

What? Yeah. This is wild. I feel like he has unfinished business on the show. I feel like the edit at least has suggested that he has, he is an important figure in the world of Top Chef. That, you know, he was obviously on season six. He, you know, he serves as sort of like a mentor for Eric.

He obviously gets along really well with a lot of these people. And I just kind of wonder, like, he's been cooking well. He just hasn't had the right challenges. Like, he's, people will often be like, this is the best prepared food, but you didn't do the challenge. So if the challenges start breaking his way, I feel like he could fire, like he could come up from behind. What do you think? I think everything you're saying is true. That is absolutely within the realm of possibility. I think that the last few weeks have suggested that he doesn't

have the sixth gear or the seventh gear to reach out. But I wouldn't have said that about some people who have won top chef. I agree. But generally the people who will have a mixture of consistency and performance that they, you know, they're never at the bottom. They can win quickfires and win challenges and win different types of ways. Yes. But also have an electric streak of innovation, improvisation, just inspiration that separates them at that moment in their career and at that point in the competition. And Brian may have had it at one point, but I just don't know if that's who he is.

I think that his running speed is faster than anyone in the sense that, like, he will run the fastest mile breakdowns in a marathon. Like, he's always operating at a very high level. Yeah, yeah. At this point, it's not a marathon. Yeah, you don't know if he has the yards after the catch, right? He doesn't have the yak. Yeah, he gets a lot of catches.

He gets a lot of receptions, gets his hands on a lot of balls, but he don't know if he can, like, break one. He's in every play. Okay. Well, we'll find me. For all I know, he could be voted out tonight. So who do you got? I have him at four, but four rising and potentially tying in my current big board with Melissa,

who is currently at three. Okay. And then you think it's Kevin and Gregory? I think at this moment it would be hard to discount them. I mean, one thing we don't know about tonight is after doing these four quickfires is Kevin immediately going to have to do a fifth. And then immediately do. And so generally people coming out of last chance kitchen either come in super hot because they are so fired up from.

Or they're exhausted. Or they're exhausted because they left it all out on the field. I think Gregory, just in terms of like the guttiness and the level that he's been performing at is got to be the favorite right now. And with Kevin as number two, just because of everything, the body of work. Melissa is the one that I think we've been rooting for and has had the highest highs in individual dishes. But bottomed out a little bit. And that happens sometimes to winners. There's often a lull.

but I think the combination of having a lull at a bad time, having a lull at a time when two other chefs are getting really hot, and then also, does she want, this is some lame-ass sportswriting cliches. Does she want it enough because of the salad? You know what I mean? I know. Now, I don't think she would make that salad move like in the finale in Italy.

I think that was just more a factor of like. But she had another move that was very gracious, but was also like, you do know this as a competition, right? I can't remember. Was the salad and something else? where she was just like, oh, I can do this. Like, I'll make it work or whatever. And I can't remember what it was off the top of my head now,

but it was right around the salad. And it was essentially like, do you don't need to be this nice. What's concerning about her cooking in comparison to those other people that we mentioned is that I think a lot of it is predicated on precision and execution. Like nailing everything, like from flavoring to plating to consistency of something like a chaw and mushy. And that's kind of been slipping a little bit. Right. Whereas Gregory can, you know, if he's not dazzling with plating techniques,

has been able to reach into this like bag of flavors and just be like, this is what my Haitian childhood memories taste like. And Kevin, because he's done so many things, can just be like, boom, here's my grandmother's table. And like you can just reach, you can just like dig deep and like uncorked at 100 mile per hour heater when you need it. That's usually what gets people across. Okay. So you don't think Stephanie's got it? You don't think Stephanie's got this one?

Anything's possible. anything's possible. I've been really watching Survivor, watching so much Top Chef, I've been really into the, and thinking about a lot of these sports coming back. I've been thinking a lot about

the nature by which we crown champions and different things and which ones are fair, which ones are less fair, and whether less fair often means more entertaining. And Top Chef definitely falls into the category of,

it's more entertaining when the best people win. I don't think upsets are fun in Top Chef. I don't think, They're awful. Yeah. Whereas like upsets are fun in the NCAA tournament.

And upsets are fun in an NFL playoff game as long as it's not the Eagles. But there are certain things where I'm like, once you get to the playoffs in the NFL, anything can happen. But like in the NBA, I expect the two best teams to be in the finals. You know, and in Top Chef, I expect the best chefs to be in the finals. And I expect the best chef to win. Yeah. And it seems like, because Kevin is back into it, that there will be more chefs than usual making the trip to the finale destination. which might mean a double elimination.

We're not really sure, but it does suggest that there's going to be probably, I mean, I'm trying to think back to the first All-Star season, but whoever ends up making the trip after tonight, it'll be the best, the most concentrated assortment of high talent that the show's ever had, which, I mean, look, I never,

clearly you guys know this from listening. I never want the season to be over. I am just, it's really getting me through. I do not want, I mean, like, it's been really great to kind of, like, just absolutely harvest all of these episodes, but I kind of wish I had more to look forward to than I do. So, yeah, all right.

Well, we should cap it there because obviously the new episode's about to go up in about two hours. So Andy, Sterling performance from you today. Criss-crossing time, literature, TV, movies, cooking. It's because I believe in podcasting and I believe in you. Just 1499 a month and I'll keep doing it. That's all I ask.

I'll see you on Monday. Great job, Brian.