The Watch - What Spotify’s Rap Caviar Says About the Music Industry; Spoon's Britt Daniel Returns to Form (Ep. 185)

Episode Date: September 14, 2017

The Ringer’s Chris Ryan and Andy Greenwald examine the current state of the music industry and the breakout success of Spotify’s Rap Caviar playlist (2:00). Then they are joined by Ringer staff writer Shea Serrano to discuss ‘Sons of Anarchy’ and what he needs in his television-watching experience (15:00). Finally, Andy sits down with Britt Daniel of Spoon to discuss life on tour and his enduring musical career (33:00). Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Stand up and walk. Now. Hello and welcome to The Watch. My name is Chris Ryan. I am an editor at the ringer.com and joining me in the studio, Little Uzi Greenwald. Ooh. What's up, man? Hey, buddy.

Thursday, we have a couple of special guests on this one today. Got Shea Serrano stopping by for a few minutes to chide us for not watching Sons of Anarchy. Yeah. I actually feel like, you know, weirdly enough, I think Shea actually sent in a question about this very topic. during our Emmy's broadcast from last year. So it's nice to come full circle. Shea wanted us to, we talked a little bit with Shea about Houston as well. So check out that.

Then afterwards, Andy has an interview with Britt Daniel from Spoon. Old friend Britt Daniel. Nice to talk to him again. I don't know how much we harped on this in the interview, but it's worth mentioning. One of the reasons he's, Britt loves doing press. Let me say that first and foremost. Is that true? No.

But he's always fun to talk to. And I love talking to him. But one of the reasons he was doing press again, it's not just because Spoon put out a great record earlier this year called Hot Thoughts, but there is an anniversary re-release of Gaga, Ga, Ga, Ga, Ga, Gha, the Spoon album that is... GX-5 to some of us. Oh, that's good. Yeah. Coming out October 29th, a lot of bonus stuff, remastered, one of their best

records. So we talked about that, but we also talked about being in a band for this long and why he doesn't like to impress interviews, and it was a good time talking to him, it always is. What's up with you, man? So we have... I know we wanted to talk about a couple of of things. There was a really, really interesting article in Vulture, written by Craig Marks. Old friend. Yeah, we both worked with in the past. I know you worked for him at a juke. Yeah. Who owned Juke? CBS Interactive. Okay. That was a music website that I worked with Craig and a few other very talented people to launch a month. We were going to launch the month the economy crashed.

Which time? Great call on that. No, honestly, I was working on this for the summer of 2008. Yes. And then heading into the fall, you know, three things happened that year, 2008. Yeah. Philly's won the World Series. Barack Obama was elected president. And TBS Interactive pulled the plug and I lost my job. I just want to say, as I said many times since then, I would take those same two out of the three every time.

Sure. Every time. But Craig, veteran music journalists worked with him at Spinn. I mean, I met him almost 20 years ago. It's been, and this is such a great piece. So I really wanted people to read this, and I wanted even you, my podcast partner, to read it. because I, you and I have been talking about, we always talk about music, obviously. It's part of our lives, part of our career.

We've been talking about it more in the podcast. And I realized that as we've been talking about it more in a quasi-professional setting, we are actually pretty removed from boots on the ground covering the industry that maybe we had when we were working in the industry for various parts of it. And one question has remained prominent in my mind, which is I actually don't understand how any of this is working. It's a very big question. How any of it is making a profit?

Because if you're not doing the usual, like, you make $7 on a CD you sell. Right. So who is making money? How are they making money? How has the industry adjusted to the new reality? And the one constant that I've carried with me from my time as a music journalist is the music industry has no idea what it's doing. Now, apparently, according to this story, that may be outdated thinking. So the picture I wanted to paint to our listeners, and we can have a conversation about it, is the music industry of the 80s and 90s.

was very similar to the major motion picture studio industry of the last few decades, which was a blockbuster model, right? Yeah. First of all, they were just thought they could just print money forever because they were pressing CDs that cost $3 and charging $19 for them. So that was obviously a profitable. They're not even factoring in what those plastic cases cost. The long boxes.

Oh, the jewel boxes. Yeah. Oh, you mean the storage ones. The actual security thing we flipped through them. Remember that sound? That's a very like proustian sound of the click click. But the point being, they would, major labels would throw out advances and sign tons and tons of people. And then five records at the end of the year would pay for everything else, including the A&R budget and the dinners and the drugs and all the stuff that was still carryover to botry from the 70s and 80s.

And can I, just the side story to that is that at that very same time you had the blossoming of the American independent music movement, which essentially was a do-it-yourself selling something. stuff out of the trunk, selling stuff on tour, making your own merch, driving your own van, booking your own tours in houses and small clubs in VFW halls. So even, and that punk spirit kind of informed what then became indie rock and alternative rock. So it's like two tracks. Yeah, and basically both were livings. They weren't necessarily comparable in terms of the amount of money you made, but you could

do something as a band where you're just like, we're in control. And one of the hallmarks of the music industry in this century that I think in part, I mean, other things factors too, but I'll speak for myself, certainly drove me out of wanting to be a part of it and covering it was just this big feeling of being swamped in a failure in that the internet and piracy seemed to have caught everyone completely off guard as recently as like the emo boom, which wasn't even a boom. It wasn't even a big bang. But that was sort of the last feeding frenzy of major labels hoping to have one last heart. basically of a scene to prop them up for another five or ten years and, you know, help prop up the expense accounts. It didn't really happen that way, but they were just unprepared for it. And so I then I checked out and had basically been operating under this assumption that Spotify and streaming services have completely upended the revenue models to a degree that has not allowed the business to thrive in the same way and people are still reeling from. What's so interesting to read Craig's article because that is not the case. That is

inaccurate. Now, there are still, for many bands, like the bands we cover, like we had Katie Crutchfield on Waxahatchee, I'm sure if Britt would say this too, if I had asked him, should have asked him, frankly, but I did the interview a few weeks ago, that most of the money for bands still comes in an old-fashioned way from touring. Touring and Merch. The record sales are now, you know, almost like lost leaders, basically, which is the name of a song that I he lectured Britt into please returning to their live set, and he's just gave me a flat no. In fact, the no was so flat. Producer Zach Mack may have cut that entire exchange, but no that I did it.

Anyway, so this story is about a playlist on Spotify called Rap Caviar that has close to 8 million followers. Yes. I am a subscriber. And it is the biggest arbiter of breaking success in pop music these days. And it's fascinating. It's fascinating because record labels, first of all, have completely – I mean, I guess they – When I say they shed dead weight, I mean, good friends of ours were laid off. I mean, everything was total turmoil.

But now it seems to have balanced out. They now understand that the people they need to pay are the people who whisper sweet nothings into the master curators of these playlists. And, you know, sell their acts to Spotify and Apple Music to get them onto these important playlists, put them in front of people. And then you can make money off of streaming. And not just you can make money, but the people who are best poised to make money off of streaming are people who have taken the DIY, just make it yourself, ethos, of punk and indie, but are, in fact, rappers. Generally, rappers under the age of, like, 22, who, like, you made the joke coming in,

like, Little Uzi Vert, who I have to say I was not familiar with Uzi's work other than Bad and Bougy. Yeah. Spent some time with Rap Caviar this week. Dude single, as you learn in the story, that was just randomly named after the tour he was on when he leaked his own music earlier in the year, has 600 million plays.

Right. And is, you know, was a number one record, because of it. And this money, for the first time the music industry is growing again on the back of this, and it's completely upended things. It used to be feel, right? And Julie Greenwald, no relation, but a nice lady at Atlantic talks about this. I used to go to barbershops and be like, okay, small sample size, I think what's working. Now they have data. Yeah. Like what happened to baseball is like happening to music industry. We just talked about this on Monday with Amazon's shift in programming where it's like these digital companies are going to have, by very nature

of their infrastructure probably have like a really incredible data sets like a really incredible data analytics departments. And it has broken down walls that existed for what we now realize were arbitrary reasons. Yes. The idea that rap and hip hop was the most popular music in the world was anecdotally accepted.

But traditional gatekeepers, whether they were Grammy Awards or radio playlists or what's being stocked in your Starbucks or whatever, would challenge that. Yeah. Now, I mean, again, this is from Craig's story, I didn't even pay attention. Nine out of the 10 songs in Billboard's Top 100

are not just rap. They're these rappers. There's Migos and Gucci Main, and I'm not even going to say Ray Schremard. No, I mean, I think that largely known as like the SoundCloud SoundCloud rap generation.

I mean, like, Gucci and stuff like that is obviously goes back all the way to like Atlanta mixtape scene. But I think that... We bet it all on Gizi, which I stand by, but turns out Gucci's had a long year. I have GZ stock and I have Ridley Scott stock. You're sitting on it.

I'm never selling. What about... What about... It's like Cassio. What about Aaron Eckhart's stock? How are you feeling about that these days? I don't know. I don't know what he's up to.

Is he in that Fireman movie with the Arizona Fire Jumper's movie? You put a lot of made-up money on that. I did. I did. I did pretty well in it last year, you know, with Sully. Okay. All right. We'll come back to that.

No, but what I wanted to say was that I feel like one of the issues that... It's not even an issue, but one of the things that rap does very, very well is it's productive. And people are thinking beyond just like, here's my... 12-song album. And there's still a lot of like event album stuff going on in hip-hop with chants and and and Kendrick and stuff like that. But like for the most part, like people are really very prolific, you know, and that used to be something that, you know, whether it was an indie rock with like I got it by voices or in music with somebody like Gucci where you're just like, this is just like so much stuff to process. I kind of can't get my head around the fact

that move flip put out nine tapes this year. Now that seems to be almost playing into their advantage because you have this monster that's just like feed us. Feed us a new song. It doesn't matter if there's 12 others that go with it. Feed us 10 songs. Feas eight songs. Call it this, call it that. And it's you, you're almost seeing a new town built up on the ruins of the old town, you know, and this, it's not like rap caviar is so much different than Angie Martinez on Hot 97 10 years ago where you were like, if you want to get a sense of what rap music is right now, could listen to her countdown. Her and flex.

Yeah. So it's funny how the more things change, the more they stay the same. I got to say, my takeaway from this was twofold. One, I felt really, made me really happy, actually, that there was someone succeeding in music in this day and age. It made me happy that smart people like Julie Greenwald, but also smart people on the creative side, like DJ Drama and Don Cannon, who own Ousey Verde's label, who we remember from the mixtape era, are figured out how to operate and to thrive in this world.

and it's also exciting to me that there are some constants that though we cover music often as a business story it really is a culture and people's live story and that young people will always do this. They will always thrive on music to define themselves and to define their era and their friendships and that's awesome. The second takeaway was

I've had a lot of the stuff on rap caviar a really tough hand. And I know it's not made for me. Yeah. And it is a bracing slap. And this is the best of the best They put on the back, like the toast. I know.

Right. And it is a bracing, but probably necessary slap for every person of a certain age. Yes. To be like, okay, it's not for me. And I accept that. And so my comment here isn't like, this is bad. But my comment is, boy, this passed me by. Yeah.

And I wanted to ask you about some of this because a lot of it, some of it's very good, but a lot of the stuff that was just bubbling up on wrap caviar when I just checked it is very, very, similar. In rhythm and in vibe. I would not say that these are rappers who have bars, but that is not a priority anymore. Boy, that's the oldest head thing I've ever said in my life. But you know what I mean?

I can't believe, but you're just start telling me about flow soon. No, I am not the dude who was trying to get you to listen to Leris Lounge in 1997. I don't care about that. No, you were the opposite, I think. I was very much the opposite. I liked ignorant stuff. Yeah, yeah. But I wonder, is the way to think about a lot of contemporary post-drake, whatever you want to call it, SoundCloud

Rap, is it to think of it purely as lifestyle music in the same way, like, I don't get jam bands, but I bet it sounds great in context. You know, I don't know, because I don't know whether, are we just doing what people who were 40 when we were 20 doing, like, where they were intellectualizing, like, be like, it's not for me, but let me intellectualize, like, what this stuff is, you know? I mean, I think about stuff that I listen to voraciously and, like, self-importantly when I was in high school. You and I were just lionizing 50 Cent is the Future and Lloyd Banks.

Well, I was going to go further back. I was going to go 20 years back listening to Cypress Hill. Yeah, but we're talking about 15 years ago now, right? And I'm like, think about it now, I'm like, I don't know how much of Black Sunday is really like Desert Island disc material. You know what I mean? But in that moment, at 1718, driving around, it's, you know, someone's mom's car. Yeah. I'm like, this is right right now.

This is my life right now. Was I Be Real? Am my friend Matt was Sendog or was it reverse? I don't know. Yeah, it's hard to tell. It's really hard to answer questions like that. I was definitely Mugs, no matter what. You were just the mastermind.

Those were good records. But it's pretty, I guess my takeaway is this. I think people should check out the story. It's really interesting. Yes. But for two reasons. One, because it is great to read a story that's like, no, the music industry is doing great.

not just because we have friends who work in an industry, but like, okay, what does this mean now? What, have we turned a corner? And now what? And that puts the music industry, instead of being a bastard stepchild of the other media, to be like, just like TV, like or just like movies, we're writing these interesting articles, reading things, seeing things,

wondering about, forgive me for this disruption. Yeah. But like, okay, so are we turning the corner on the future? And now we're getting a handle on it. And that's kind of an exciting time to be. The other one was just purely like, music's super weird and people are really into it again. And none of this is reflected in my conversation with old friend Britt Daniel, who made a great record.

But it's like it's a whole other living beast that's like Pacific Rimming out of the ocean right now, you know? I probably shouldn't say Pacific Rimming. Sounds like a porn film. Before we get to Britt Daniel, let's talk to Shay Serrano. All right, Andy, we are joined. Is this the first time you've ever been on the show? Yes. For the first time you ever invite me on anything.

No, that's not true. I listen and I listen. Shea Serrano is here. And never get invited. We are so excited. Bestselling author. Yeah. Correct.

Basketball columnist. Correct. Social media maven. Incorrect. Man about town. Correct. And incredible fundraiser for his local community, Che Serrano. Yeah, that's my favorite title.

We got to ask you about that. You're here to say hi because we like hanging out with you. And you're also going to try to correct a historic wrong in our television watching. That's affirmative. So we're going to get to that. But before we do, we have. to ask you, since we have you in front of a mic, you live in Houston. Yes, sir.

How is Houston doing? And what should people be doing now a week or two later? You raise an enormous amount of money for charity through your F-O-H Army. F-O-H fund. I've never said out loud before. It sounds ridiculous. It's not weird. If you say it out loud, it's impossible to say without sounding.

You've done incredible stuff. What should people be doing right now? Just paying attention. That's really all we need. It was very easy for everybody to pivot away from the Harvey stuff when the Irma stuff started happening. I mean, that's an exciting thing. If you're watching from outside, the destroyed stuff is not as exciting anymore.

So that's really all we need is just for everybody to know that that shit is still going on. There are still people who are not in their homes. There are still people in shelters. There are still people whose lives have been pulled apart that they've not been allowed the chance to put it back together yet. It's going to take months and years before all this stuff is fully corrected. Just pay attention. Okay. And we'll handle the rest.

You're talking to two people who have not spent time in Houston, but I really want to. I don't know if you've heard us talk about how much we love Anthony Bourdain's episode of Houston, where he took parts unknown to Houston. Yes. It made us realize in a deeper way than I think we could have, the depth and breadth of the city, the culture, the diversity, all the people who live there and make it their home. It's one of the most fascinating places in America. And I hope that if anything comes to this, right, people will pay attention to that.

Yes. I've worked with Christopher, Abernathy Ryan, for several years now. You can even call him by his full name. And he's only emailed me twice in my whole life. And one of them was to ask about the Bordane. Did I watch it? That's on brand. That's really good. And then sometimes I'll just email just like I'll YouTube of a DJ's group track.

But I won't give it any context to tell him why. No words or anything. Like at 3.30 in the morning. That's accurate to my experience. That's accurate to my experience. All right. Yeah. with eyes emojis.

So moving on to a definitely less important topic. I'm already mad. You've only sent us, I'll use eye statements. I think you've sent me under a dozen emails. Can I say one of the best things about an email from Shea Serrano is that the subject line is always says, from Shea. That's correct. I appreciate that.

It does not beat around the bush. Because, you know, your name shows up in the Gmail. Like, I can tell it's from you. But then when I get to the subject line, I'm like, two-step, two-step verification. No question. Actually, if that actually ever stopped, I would be convinced that you were hacked by it. A Nigerian prince was said to me. It's smart.

Okay. So now you know how to hack Shay. But moving past that, I would say a third of the emails have made, have thrown passing shade at the fact that, though we claim to be, I don't know if we do. But we. Completeists. Completeists. We cover television. We cover peak television, the best shows of this young century.

There is one show that has not really been given its fair shake. In fact, has been, I'm going to say it, completely ignored. Disparaged even. I feel like we talked about Sons of Anarchy a little bit. To say, I would say, I didn't watch it. To say, I didn't watch it. No, man, I watched the first season. And you know, the funny thing about this, this is one of those shows that you watch the first season or two.

And then you fight, you know, it was on five, six seasons? Seven. Seven seasons. Around five, if you look at some of the plot synopses, you're like, yo, shit got really intense on Sunday's anarchy. I will say this, and I'll cede the floor to you. I almost enjoy my ignorance of sons of anarchy because it allows me to go just Wikipedia surfing. And I'll just, like, stumble upon a character. And I'm like, oh, so this is the character that was played by the creator of the show who, in order to avoid turning rat, bit off his own tongue in prison.

And I'm like, I'm going to. I'm good. Now I know that and I'm good. So that's me. This is my snarky West, I used to say East Coast now. I can say West Coast. Bias. Bias against the show that's set in Northern California. Is it set in Northern California? Yeah, man. That's the Redwood thing. Yeah.

That's the Redwood original. Okay, I've never seen a frame of the show. So tell me why I'm wrong. That's so bad. Tell me. Just make the case because part of the joy of being a TV fan today is you can dig in the crates. Like you can start it today. It is accessible to people. I didn't start watching it until, like, I don't know, a year ago, two years ago. Oh, probably.

This is why it's still fresh for you. So I've been arguing so hard for it. The passion is real. So why he has the Charlie Hunnam tattoo on his back. The full Hunnam. Jacks. Brants. I started to watch it.

Actually, it's my dad who told me to watch it. Okay. He is a sparkling track record of a regular media show. Because he was the one who told me to watch Breaking Bad. And I was like, I'm never going to watch Breaking Bad. That sounds like a terrible show. He explained it. to me.

Yeah. And then I watched it. I was like, oh, fuck, he's a genius. We should have him on, I feel like. Yeah, he would be, he would be on it. He watches everything. He's a completest. So your dad is more voracious television watching than you are.

Absolutely. So what buttons does Sons of Anarchy hit for you just because pretend that everyone listening, this is not true, but pretend everyone listening is as naive as we are. We don't know why we need to watch the show because it is, this is true, is not mentioned in the conversation as much as some of the other shows, as Breaking Bad, certainly. Right. Well, let's be clear here. It's not as good as those shows. And cute's closed.

You can go, you can go, if you look at the whole entire everything of all of the episodes, once it gets to like season five and six, it spins out of control a little bit. But if you've gone up to that point, everything makes sense. It's like you can see this happening. But as far as why would you watch that show, why do I watch that show? It's got all of the main things I'm looking for in the show. It's got a very charming, leading man, very handsome, Charlie Hunnam. The aforementioned Charlie Hunnam.

Jack's Teller, man. Jack's Teller. Teller. Who? Stop trying to be down. I remember. I stopped watching Sons of Anarchy when the IRA dudes stole a baby. Oh, that was tough.

That was hard to watch. That was hard to watch. I feel like you guys could just be saying things to each other, and I'd be like, wow. You could make up the craziest shit, and I would be like, that sounds wild. It probably happened on the show. Yeah. Yeah. That was a super intense episode.

The motorcycle club, they have a relationship with the IRA. They're gun runners is their thing. Okay. That's what they do. And so they have this relationship with them. And they don't like Jacks very much. They like Clay, who's the main boss. Jack's a stepfather.

And all of this crazy stuff starts to happen, whatever. They end up at war with one of the guys from the IRA who's like a point man for them. And it as sometimes happens when you get in a war with one guy from the IRA, the other guys in the IRA get bad too. Yeah. One thing I've learned from television and movies is that the IRA is a free-flowing organization. Like, they are able to be here. They move. It's not hard for them.

They're like the Bill Simmons podcast of... They're a free-flowing conversation of global violence and terror. Yeah. And what's crazy is that so in that episode, the guy, his son has been killed, and he's sort of freaking out already. And he's trying to figure out what to do when he goes to Jack Teller's house. And he kills one of the sons, like who was supposed to be there protecting him. This young guy who, by this point, you sort of falling in love with him. He's the non-threatening baby-faced guy.

He just stabs him. Boom, he's dead. The Chris Ryan of the family. The Chris Ryan of the family. That's right. Sweet-faced. Jack Teller's wife is there, and she's like, please don't kill me.

He's got the knife, and he sees the baby starts crying, and he turns and looks at it. And at this point in the series, you're very much in your head thinking he's going to stab this baby. Like, that's not out of the realm of possibility here. This is a baby stabbing show. So I'm already, you know who you're selling on the show. Yeah, that's what I like.

New dad. New dad. Yeah. But you feel like this can happen, and they just, they set the camera back, and he's just creeping up on the thing real slowly to see the baby, and they don't show what can happen. And you're just, it was super intense. Yeah, it was, it was, it's hard to watch, man. So. And good.

And he stills the baby that go to Ireland. Have you been convinced? No, but so far you said, handsome leading man. Yes. So we got two of the three things necessary for a Shay Serrano. That's right. You've got the group that's sort of operating outside of the law. I always like when you've got a thing set in a small town

and the sons sort of run the small town and they're not working necessarily with the police but the police understand that they're there and they're doing some things that maybe aren't that great. But the whole series is they're trying to tell the police we're not doing violent things. We're not running drugs and nobody's going to get hurt. They keep saying that as people's heads are getting chopped off.

Yeah, yeah. And arms are getting killed. So since the show has gone off the air, what is missing from your life? Like what do you miss most about having a show like this? You know what I mean? What is... Yeah, have you tried to replace it with anything?

No. It's irreplaceable. What about it is irreplaceable? Just the intensity of the stolen baby? The intensity, yes. That anything can happen. The guy bites his tongue off. The baby gets stolen.

I'm biting my tongue off right now. Yeah, it's just... The baby gets stolen. That's the best one. Yeah, anything can happen in that universe. anything. Are you hype for the spin-off? For Mayans.

Absolutely. That's Smiths, right? Mexican Sons of Anarchy. Yeah. Is that Junis Svitz's gang? No. Did they pitch the show directly? Did you intercept the show from your brain?

I sent them 400 emails. Did you really? I need more Mayans. From Shay, read Mexican Sons of Anarchy. Marcus. I need more Marcus. That's the guy's name. So you're hype on this.

Can we make some recommendations to you for shows that you might enjoy then to like replace Suns of Rehry? Sure. Sure. Say Madman. I dare you. I know Shay loves Madman Well I was gonna say that like Narcos has like got the same sort of some of the same propulsion

Did you watch Narcos at all? I did I didn't like it You liked the first season? I liked the first season. Okay The second season they get him Well why we spoiling shows to make him like them? Do you think Shade didn't like narco? Do you think Pablo Escobar is out here stealing babies? Do you think Jake didn't like narcos because he was worried about just the lack of finality? It's a cliffhanger. Why didn't you like narcos? I didn't like they weren't able for me to a establish that

Pablo was that bad of a guy. I mean, like that intense of a guy. There was never a one where I was afraid of Pablo Escobar. Because he didn't take a baby. But I was afraid of clay, for example, or of the bad guys.

Okay, so you need, like, a degree of fear. I need an intensity. What's a movie show with, like, a super intense bad guy? Like, an awful bad guy. I'm too scared to watch those shows. I don't, I think we're chasing different highs, man.

You got to watch it. But that's not the only thing. I'm like sitting here about to make a case for rectify. I'm like, nothing happens, but you can hear it. I think he would like rectify. I make the case. I like the show. I need a show about brotherhood of some sort.

And those relationships get pulled and stretched. Yeah. How far can we push? That's really rectify. I need betrayal in that. I need a bunch of stuff happening. Here's what's really good about Sons of Anarchy. And I'll go back to Breaking Bad.

Because Breaking Bad was very good about laying a bunch of little tiny threads throughout the course of the season that you weren't. paying attention to and then in the last episode they all get pulled together yeah and this big scheme that this guy's been working on for the last six weeks snaps in a place that's exactly what sons of anarchy did for the first four seasons they were very good about that the leading all the way up to the best one we believe it was was season four when they were trying to trap one guy that one of the sons of anarchy hated uh this agent who was evil, who had sort of set up the mom and gotten this woman killed.

Like they had laid all these traps out, and you had no idea that it was going on. You thought they made it seem very much like Jacks had turned into a snitch as a way to save his mother. It was like a super double switch. Rope a dope. Yeah. I love it. That scene happens, like all the cars sort of pull up at the same time, they take the guy off and you're like, oh shit. Jack's a genius.

He had all this planned. Yeah. And that's really another of the main things. Like, I need a leading man who's smarter than me. Yes. To sort of pull, even though I know he's doing something and he's sort of trying to tell me, I need to not know what it is. I got one suggestion.

Okay. Peaky blinders. I didn't like it. Damn. You've watched it. You secretly have sampled this stuff. Yeah, I'm trying to watch as much stuff. I mean, I was going to say, like, they hold razor blades in their berets.

I mean, I feel like I'm trying to come up with like a buzzword. Isn't that what they do? Like in their little newsboy caps, they're not berets. Boreys? What about French Piqui Blinders? All of Piki Blinders would be so much funnier if those guys were berets. What if Piki Blinders was actually about mimes? Peaky berets?

French mimes. Now you're talking. So basically we have to create our own show. I like Sillion. He's great. Okay. Yeah, he's great. He's cool.

He's very creepy. He's a guy who he can just stare at you and you're like, I'm nervous. I'm not in the way he's going to do. Dead eyes. But you know, he's cool. You know, I don't like, I don't like the accents. Okay. Is that, is that racist?

No. Are you sure? No, because you didn't specify. Okay. You tiptoe up to the edge. You didn't say whether there was me and Andy's accents. You just don't like accents. Yeah, right.

If you had been like, I don't like Irish accents because they're going to steal my baby, you would have been out. We've been kind of hard on the Irish. I mean, like, I am Irish, so it's okay. Oh, so you're allowed? No. I'm going to send an email to FX from Andy. Where's the Jewish motorcycle gang?

What would they be called? I mean, I mean. Sons of Abraham? I don't know. That's good. That's good. You could save all the merch, S.O.A.

All right. Well, I don't know if, I don't, I'd be honest. I don't know if I'm sold, but I appreciate the passion. And I, I'm actually, what's most interesting to me

about this conversation is there is a, there is clearly a void of that type of show, and there's fandom for that type of show. What you're describing sounds like that shouldn't be that hard to do

considering the success of a show like Breaking Bad. That's right. Suns of Anarchy. Huge, huge, huge success. Yeah. And even though Mayans has been troubled in production, they've had to reshoot it, they've had to redo it. They are not giving up on it because they want to scratch that itch.

Is Kurt Sutter behind Mayans? Yeah, he's doing. What was that Viking show that he had? Bastard Executioner. Yeah, that one didn't. Nope. Nope. That was real bad. Okay.

Nope. Okay. Good luck to him. Anything else we should be watching, Shay? No, y'all are good. I don't want that. He fucking said your piece. I'm leaving.

All right. Sheerrano. Thank you so much for finally coming on. the watch after so many times of us asking you. Find She on Twitter and when you at him say your name in the tweet. Yeah, say, Shay, from Mr. Egghead. I hate you. We love you.

All right, that was our good buddies, Chase Serrano making his first appearance on the watch to tell us to watch Sons of Anarchy. Are you going to do it? I have watched Sons of Anarchy. I gave it like the shot. I got the kidnapped babies. I'm good. Yo, I haven't even watched Ozark, man.

I'm not. I'm not driving that far back in the crates. All right, we're going to get to Andy's interview with Britt Daniel from Spoon, but first a quick word from our sponsors. Today's episode of the watch is brought to you by Stitch Fix. You can tell when a guy has got style. Guess what? I'm sitting across

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Get your fix on demand or sign up to receive scheduled shipments. Try them out today. You got nothing to lose. Get started now at stitchfix.com slash watch. And you will get an extra 25% off when you keep all five items in your box. That's stitchfix.com slash watch to get started today. Stitchfix.com slash watch. Today's episode of The Watch is also brought to you by Universal Pictures American Made.

Yes. Tom Cruise reunites with his edge of tomorrow director, Doug Lyman, an American Made based on the outrageous true-life exploits of Barry Seal, a hustler and pilot recruited by the CIA to run one of the biggest covert operations in U.S. history. American Made is in theaters on September 29th. Andy, we're recording. I think it's safe to say that after 22 years, no, 21 years of, you. Us knowing each other. Us knowing each other can now drink legally. 21 years?

Yeah. We met in March 1996. Wait, wait. So what was the first time we met? I thought that... Have we gone over this before? Yeah. Okay.

But this is fun. Okay, well, remind me. We met in March 1996 at the University of Trenton, where you were playing... You opened for Yolotango. In a lounge. Okay, yeah. And you...

This is actually a nice full circle because you were so enthusiastic about newly signing to Matador. Uh-huh. And boy, I was enthusiastic. about meeting a band who had signed to Matador, meeting any band, doing anything, because this was, I don't think I'd ever talked to anyone who had played in a, played a show before. And now you are once again on Matador.

But you also, we talked about this in the last podcast, but you put me on a list for a 21 and over show the next day, which was probably the coolest thing anyone had ever done for me. Somehow I completely have forgotten that. We talked about it on the last time. The statute of limitations for getting me underage drunk at Nick's Roast Beef upstairs. Oh, right. I remember that show too. Jim got mad at somebody up there.

You've been playing show. The 25th anniversary of the band is next year. Unofficially or officially. The what? 25th. Oh, right. Right. Do you remember individual shows from like that?

Yeah, I remember. Yeah, of course. Not everyone. University of Trenton, Yolotango, March. I remember that. Why? Well, because it was our second time to play with Yolotango. We played with them at the Matador show at South by Southwest.

And I had a lot of their records. And so just to meet them at all or be playing a show with them was definitely memorable. What's funny about this, where I was sort of going to go into this sideways, but you were alluding to a time when your kindness backfired. I'm sure the only time in history. You thanked me in the line of your notes to Girls Can Tell. Right. And Spin, the paragon of journalistic virtue that Spin always was decided that they had to kill my review of the record because I found it after I'd written it that you had. nice.

Clearly, Matador is still mad about that. No, no, no. I'm just kidding. But somewhere in there, wait, because Girls Can Tell wasn't on Matador. So this is the thing.

Because I remember in that period, there was some attitude that Matador had, because your first record and EP were on Matador. And you went to a major label that shall not be, okay, we'll be named. And then when we reconnected again, it was sort of a low period. and Madador wouldn't...

And that's the time that I definitely remember meeting you and I was very appreciative and then that's why I thanked you on the... Yeah, which was nice. That was South by Southwest. I thanked you the first time because you got me drunk.

The second time you gave me a CDR. Right. But Madador wouldn't let you... They had some like code, right? Like they couldn't re-sign you after you had left, but now you're back. I was working with Gerard. He was running a label in Europe.

So in the U.S. we came out on Merge. One-2XU. Yeah, and 1-2XU is what we came out on Europe and so that's why I was in touch with him and he knew this backstory. Okay. Because at the time, even though it wasn't his territory, I told him the story about how Spin pulled the review. Because I'm trying to...

And he got, he was not happy. I'm trying to pull together some meta-narrative about relationships over time, about grudges. Okay. It's not working. Because I, because I, you always stayed friendly with the Matador guys. I know that you played the 21st thing. I saw you in Vegas. That was already seven years ago, which is shocking.

but it took it took time for the stars to line up to put a record out with them again right so it wasn't as big a deal as I'm making it out well no no no grudges no no you know in fact we worked with them in 2005 on give me fiction because they put the record out in Europe it was always you know are you saying my narrative is flawed it might be it might be a little flawed okay that's fair um yeah there's been a you know we've had some false starts with them for sure. I'll say that's true. But we've always, I've always loved those guys and the main, the main guys are still there. And it's, it's, it's, kind of wild. It's trippy to be in, in meetings with these guys. I was in meetings with 20 years

ago. How, how have you changed and how have they changed over the, the intervening two decades? Um, you, you appear exactly the same in person. I think I am exactly the same. I don't know. I think everybody's dress is a little bit better now. That wasn't a thing in the 90s. No. Lombardi really knows how to dress. Well, also, Lombardi likes to dress and, like, I think he likes finer food. Like, I feel like people's, people have expanded there.

Right. But maybe that's just growing up. There's a big difference because, you know, when we first worked together, we had never put out a record. That record didn't do so hot. I think anybody, everybody involved would agree. We could barely sell 2,000 copies, and this was in the mid-90s. Good record, though, for the record. Right, right.

And they were in a different place, too. So now they're with beggars group and we actually can sell a few more records now or stream some records. Whatever the case may be. Okay, let's dispense with my narratives. Okay, all right. You're so eager to do that. How are you? I'm good.

What? I was throwing numbers around. 25th anniversary of the band. We're also here to talk about you have a 10th anniversary reissue of Gaga, Ga, Ga, Gaga coming soon in October. What do these numbers do to you? Do you pay attention to them? Do they get under your skin?

I don't think about them until somebody reminds me. Yeah. You're welcome. Yeah. I mean, that number 10, it's good for motivating people to put together a reissue. Yeah. You know, we did one with Gimme Fiction. And we did a, you know, like a deluxe reissue on that one.

This one's just a remaster and putting – it's got a bonus EP that has never been on vinyl before. It's going to be cool. But I feel like in general, unless you're sitting down with me or someone like me, you don't look backwards that much. Yeah, yeah, no. I never think about those numbers. Never crosses my mind. Friends don't bring them up. No.

Real friends don't bring them up. Right. how do you feel about these records with the distance of time? Because one thing that I'm always, I was going to say surprised by, but I'm not, I'm actually kind of pleased by, is that as a band that has a large fan base, but also a fan base that fans who have come to you at different stages in the band's career, almost every album. And we can debate whether Telephoneau is that as well. counts in this, but every

album seems to have its partisans and its favorites. Right. Every record has the partisans. Do you have a favorite record? Do you look back and think, oh, I see why people would like this one, or I personally like this one the best? I get why people would like all of them other than...

I mean, even the first one, it has some good stuff on it, and I smoked some grass and listened to that record maybe six months ago, and I kind of got it for the first time in a while. What did you get? I just kind of remembered where my head was at. that was sort of a dark and pointed place. I don't know how to describe it out of that. Yeah.

I kind of remembered, oh, okay, yeah, that's, I get that. I get that why Cvantes is kind of cool, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But there is no one record in your catalog where you're like, well, that's the one everyone should like the best. Or is it always the newest? I honestly, you know, I think they're all pretty good.

They are pretty good. This is the thing we talked about last time, which is the biggest knock against Spoon as a band is that all your record are good. Yeah, I mean, well, right now, at the moment, I just remastered gaga, ga, ga, ga, ga, ga, ga. And so I got to listen to that in depth a few times in a row over a course of a couple of weeks.

And yeah, as soon as I was done with the mastering project, I wrote to Laura at Merge and said, damn, this is a good record. Okay, good. I hadn't listened to it straight through for quite a while. When you say that, this ties into something I really did want to talk to you about. Are you responding to just purely,

I wrote some good songs that year or whenever they came together or are you thinking of it as an album as an aesthetic project, which I think you do, where we got the production right to make them sound unified, we put them together in a good way,

et cetera, et cetera. Yeah, I'm thinking of it as a whole. So it's after the whole thing has gone by, what's my feeling, you know. And I don't remember a lot of moments and there may not have been any where I listened back to that record when we were remastering it

and I was cringing. It was all good, you know, and some of it was fantastic. What's the last piece of spoon recorded output that you listen to and cringed? These are tough questions, Andy. Where I cringed? There's not a lot of them. I mean, there's things I know I would do differently. You know, there's things on telephone, well, telephono for sure, but on transference.

I think that's, that record actually has some really, really good songs, but the way we produced it, we wanted it, we wanted to produce it warts and all, a kind of thing where if we were, we wanted to go extreme, you know, it was the first time we self-produced and we wanted to just go full tilt into that, into that world. And if we're going to fall, fall down flat, we're going to fall down flat on our faces in a very interesting way, you know. So some of the songs kind of do that. Do you connect to the potentially falling down flat to the long break you took after that record, or are they totally unrelated? It might have led to that. Yeah. I mean, well, the thing that really led to the long break was that the touring on that record wasn't a lot of fun. Yeah. I wasn't in my best headspace, and we all kind of lost the plot for a second. And it made sense at that moment once we were done with touring that record to start something new and to,

play with some different people, you know. Even if you're looking at the history of just the band's spoon, it made sense. It re-invigorated Spoon to do that. Yeah, I think it did in a huge way. It took a few years, but was a terrific record. I've been remiss. We haven't even mentioned Hot Thoughts,

which is your terrific record from earlier this year. The songs that are on that record, when you wrote them, over the period of time that you wrote them, did you feel that there was something that linked them them them thematically that would fit on a record, or is that the work of the studio? Because even listening to it again this morning, here's the word I want to give you. I think this is a delightful album because it feels so fun to listen to. It's not just because it has great songs, it's not just because it's constantly, it's not just because it's, it's constantly

surprising. Listening to it on a different pair of headphones, I'm hearing these little like disco squiggles. Oh, that's cool. I sit next to you that I didn't even notice the first 10, 15 times. I ain't the one is probably my favorite song on the record and it's like I hadn't considered the drums how and why they come in because it's just something that I've been listening to but these are all decisions these are all decisions that you made

individually on each track and then also added to this idea of this added to this perception that this is a complete work and aesthetically considered work yeah it is there was a question at the beginning of that yeah let's see that was what

yeah what were we setting out to do kind of that kind of thing. Well, it's like how much of it is that these are the songs that came out of you over this 18-month period and therefore they are an album? Or how much of it is, here are the songs, let's build an album out of them with each other and with the studio? Well, we're kind of, we are figuring it out as it goes. It's a pretty organic process where occasionally we'll have a directive, but most of the time we're just trying to make something that feels right and we're figuring it out as we go along. As we were putting this one together, I figured out this is a rock record, but it's a rock record that doesn't have a lot of guitars on it.

And when we sort of... You figure that out. You tell Jim that. No, I didn't say it. You know, I was just figuring it out. You're just feeling it. I'm feeling it. And because Alex and I were getting together to work so much on...

I would sometimes write the songs on acoustic guitar, then I'd get with him and we would... We didn't want to make an acoustic guitar record. So I'd get with him and we'd figure out how we're going to change the song, how we're going to arrange it so that it... feels more like, I mean, the future, you know, than the past. But yeah, we're figuring out as we go. There was a moment where one of the most sort of direct thoughts we had about it was that there was a song that was on acoustic guitar. It was an acoustic ballad.

We worked on it quite a bit. I worked up the lyrics. So I don't always really finish the lyrics until later on in the deal. Usually there'll be about half written or three quarters written. But I finished them all up. I was pretty proud of it. Everybody seemed to like it, but I stood back from it for a day or two, and then I came back to the guys, and I was just like, yeah, but do we want to have an acoustic ballad on this record? I don't know if that's what we want to do. Yeah, so that song's not on the record. It's not. So that one, yeah, it was called Own Your Mistake, and that one we have not listened to since that day. Freudian title. Yeah.

That's really, that's very nice. Clearly it was never going to be on it. Yeah. What part of So in the many years since we first met And you were excited about signing a Matador And the first glimpse of like Oh, I can This is something I'm going to do now is my job You know, at least for this one album cycle

Who knew what the future would hold? It's your job now and has been for a while What part of this What part of the gig do you enjoy the most Or are you lucky that it changes Because you write and then you record And then you tour and there's always something new to do Yeah

That might be the part I like the most that it's always changing. I do always look forward to the part of the cycle where we're about to go do shows. I don't say when you do press. I know that's your favorite. Press doesn't have to be that bad. Sometimes it's fun.

I like going and doing a junket. But I interrupted you. Yeah, so I do like, I love doing the shows. But I've been missing the part where I get to be by myself and come up with something that I get real excited about. And that's definitely how I was feeling

when we were coming up with hot thoughts. I couldn't wait to... I can never wait to finish it because it's a massive amount of work. But it was... I couldn't wait for other people to hear it. I was real proud of it. I thought that we were on to something

that was part of the record went in directions we'd never gone before. And I was just... I felt real solid about it. Ten years ago, with the album that I have the hardest time saying. Not telephono, but gagga, ga, ga, ga, ga.

You said it, right? Yeah, I know, but it's like, I work up to it. You have the two John Bryan produced tracks on there. One. Oh, right, you did the other one with him for the movie, right? They ended up in the movie soundtrack. Underdog is on the record. Underdog's on the record.

Did we do another one with them? Wasn't that one for Stranger Than Fiction, the Will Ferrell movie soundtrack? There was an original song on there that he did. Oh. Yeah, did he produce that? I think it was us. I think we produced that.

You're talking about the book I write? Yes. Boy, that's a good song. Yeah, it's a good song. I think we just produced that one. Okay, so you only did the one with. We did it with Mike McCarthy, the guy who did the rest of Gaga Gaga. Sorry, Mike.

Yeah. Let me apologize. At the time, this is also, this is 10 years ago. But I remember thinking, oh, this somehow signified like you were going for it because he was a big producer at the time. You're going for something bigger or not even necessarily commercial because it was still 2007. It wasn't 1997. But you were pushing yourself in a direction. Regardless of whether that's a true read of the situation or not, I was curious how much of those factors still even play in your mind.

Like what you've accomplished a lot. You make great records. You continue to be inspired by them making the records. But are there commercial things? I don't just mean like selling records. but other avenues that you want to open up yourself to or the band to that are still, that it's still interest you. These still are chasing at this point.

And again, it's not, I don't mean chart chasing because I don't even know what that means anymore. But like, do you want to be scoring things or working with bigger people or collaborating? Are these things, the look you're giving me suggests, no. Yeah, every now and then I think of somebody that I'd like to work with, but, or I'll hear a record and think, hmm, how'd they do that? Very dramatic reaction you have to that record. Typically overstated. With John Bryan, it was a thing where we didn't go to him.

He started showing up at our shows, and I knew who he was, and I never really would have thought of seeking him out. But we had mutual friends. That's right. We had a photographer. We were working with Autumn DeWild, who was good friends with him. And so she would bring us around. He would come to our shows.

and then before we knew it, we were talking about getting together to do a song. And we didn't, and I've said this many times, we almost didn't put the underdog on that record. It was the one song that we didn't record a tape and we were very hung up on that issue at that moment. That sounds like the 90s.

It was the one song that had a different producer. And I thought it was a pretty good song, but I didn't know if it fit in with the rest of the record. So yeah, we almost left it off. It was just in Spider-Man, right? I just heard it get. I think that the, I haven't seen it yet, but I heard that the instrument. It's really good, actually.

And it's a really good. They use it well. The movie's actually good, but it's a really good, really good sync, as they say. Do they use the very beginning of the song? They just use the instrument. Yeah, and then the horns. Yeah. It's a very Peter Parker song, which I'm sure is what you were thinking when you were writing.

As I was writing it, yeah. I was thinking Van Morrison. Well, you know, there's a connection there too, I'm sure. Mm-hmm. If you could probably draw. It's funny, you mentioned Autumn to Wild, and she, in my mind, because I met her years and years ago, that there was. this, well, here's the question. There's a universe of people that are like connectors in each city.

And I feel like you've been touring in these cities for a long time. And is it, how has it changed for you to be in certain cities? Is it, is it deja vu where here's this group of people that you met coming to your shows or hangers on that have been at these shows in Chicago or L.A. or Tokyo for the last 20 years? Or has it changed, both because your audience has changed or because touring bands have changed. Is it, is it, is it, is it, is it, is it, is it, is it, is a, is a, somewhat negative, uh, connotations, I believe that that, well, because, cause, cause I, I do like going, I like going to, uh, you know, we hadn't been in Chicago in a year more, maybe two years. I don't know, but we just weren't, we were, we were in Chicago for

a Lollapalooz and we were there for a few other, uh, another show and we, and we, and we're doing a lot of, So anyway, we're there for several days. And yeah, I like that. I like going back, getting reacquainted with the city, seeing people that I haven't seen in a while. And then you're gone, you know, and you stay in touch briefly, but you don't have that intimate connection again until the next time. I think that's pretty cool. I like having all those relationships. It's a good way to manage.

Yeah, because you're not, you're just the right amount of friends with people. You never have to like. I also have a couple good friends, too. That's good to know. Yeah. I appreciate. I think they appreciate. that you said that, because otherwise they would think that.

You seem very healthy about this right now. Oh, yeah? Okay. Do you feel that way? Do I feel healthy? Well, about where you are with your life and your art and your work and everything, you seem good. Yeah. I'm in a good place. I haven't been as healthy since we've been on tour.

Too many funions? Yeah, a lot of funnions. What is your vice on tour? Well, we drank, you know. Alcoholic beverages? Yeah, and sometimes, you know, for me, when I'm on that bus and the bus takes off and we're starting to roll out of a city and the windows are up and you can see the city going by, the last thing I want to do is go to sleep. You know, I'm excited. That's fun for me.

And that feels like no matter what the situation is, I kind of feel a little jazzed. Back to the business side, the Gaga, Gaga, Gagga, Gagga Reissue is out in October. Right. Hot Thoughts is out now. Madador Records. No bad blood, man. No bad blood. With us and Mattador?

Clearly not. I know. I'm just trying to add some drama. You're trying to dig up some bad blood? Always. No, because we started by saying how, you know, maybe they were mad at me, but nobody's mad at anybody. I did not say they were mad at you.

You were like literally, everyone hates you, Andy. This is good. It fuels me. I was saying the other way around. Okay. I hate everybody? Yeah. That's right.

That's what I'm known for. But you're going to be on tour or more, right? You're not. Yeah, we've got a ways to go. we've got up until the middle of December we've got dates. And then I heard about some more coming for next year as well yesterday. But you're excited. Yeah.

As long as I can. Well, you know, it's good to have a week or two off every now and then. So you can do things like this. Yes. Just do me one favor. When you come back to LA, a play metal detector. Okay, we have been playing that one lately. I know.

We played it in Chicago. I got so excited. You put that back in. Yeah. Why do things slip back into the set list? Well, people really like that song for some reason. Yeah, I'm nodding. People who are, that were fans back then and people that have, you know, really dived into the whole catalog.

Yeah. For some reason, they really like that tune. It's great song. I guess it's the one that stands out on that record. I think car radio is real good, too. Yeah. But Metal Detector. And it makes sense to me that that one stands out.

It was the one song that we recorded ourselves. of that album and that when I remember feeling like when I did it like whoa this is something that this feels organic and real and doesn't feel like we've it doesn't sound like a lot of that record

is purely it's so clinical sounding which was kind of what we're going for but it's the sound of us trying to take all of the shit sounds out of the shitty studio we were recording in in the summer of 1997 we were in this terrible you know like

more suited for 90s Austin metal band sort of studio No vibe and bad equipment and so our way of dealing with that was to make everything as dry as possible and everything

get rid of all those effects they're cheesy and the digital reverb is you know making us want to go home so just cut everything you know and that's the sound of that record It's cool. But metal detector is the one that sort of stands out as more of a homemade production.

I love when you dig in the craids. There's no chance of figures of art, is there? No. Definitely not. Sorry, Andy. I thought if we could just make personal requests now. Yeah, metal detector, I can see. Yeah?

Yeah. Let me know next time you're going to be a show and I'll put it on the list for sure. I'll draw up just some thoughts for you. Okay. Not hot, very cold thoughts for you about the songs I'd like you to play. And you can quietly and politely reject them. Well, some of them, figures of art, we're not going to play. Okay.

Yeah. That's a hard pass on that. Yeah, that's, yeah. Okay. Not into that one. All right, we'll negotiate the rest of this off air. Okay, cool. Thanks, Brit.

Every two or three years, we can do this. It's always good to see you. You're still in my top ten. I am? Yeah. Even after this? Yeah. I'm honored.

All right, that was my conversation with old pal, Britt Daniel of Spoon. Just want to say again that the 10-year anniversary deluxe remaster reissue of Gaga, Gaga, Gaga, is out October 20. I'm pretty sure I got that wrong earlier in the show. October 20th on merge, double vinyl. It's going to look great. I love double vinyl. It's a great album.

Nothing I like more than a DJ Night Out where I play Gaga, Ga, Ga, Gaga, and its entirety. Twice? Twice at the same time. I'm cross-fating. Triple vinyl? This is, boy, we're really, I just want listeners to know, like, that's why they come to this show to listen to music takes. Just like from the bleeding edge. We're like, we don't get rap caviar.

What if we played this spoon album on three turned down. You're talking to two guys on the wrong side of 40, well, one guy, and whose most salient music business experience is DJing of disc men at Brooklyn bars. Shotproof, brother. 15 years ago. You came to the right place. Chris, this is our outro. I just want to say, have a great vacation.

Chris Ryan's going on vacation. I am. I'll be back in two weeks. Hold it down for me. We'll have a lot of content, including. No matter what happens on the Emmys, just stand guard. We are going to have some great post-emmy content on Monday. I believe after the Thrones was not eligible this year.

But I'm still going to watch the show and talk about it. I'll miss you. I have a great vacation. I cannot wait for you to hear all the shows I'm going to do in your absence because they're going to get real weird. They're going to get weird. See you later. Today's episode of The Watch is brought to you by Hotel Tonight. Things change.

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Today's episode of The Watch is brought to you by American Made from Doug Lyman, the director of the born identity and Mr. and Mrs. Smith, based on the incredible true story of one of the biggest cover-ups in CIA history. American Made is in theater September 29th.