The Way I Heard It with Mike Rowe - 449: Theo Von—A Troubled White

Episode Date: September 9, 2025

Comedian, podcaster, and self-described "troubled white" Theo Von joins the party for a candid discussion about the bone he found on his way to the studio, what he was manifesting during the Lion's Portal, and why he loves 'Merica. There's a little wrestling, a little recovery, and lot of talk of a new Mike and Theo Antique Road Show-type show featuring American-made entrepreneurs. It's patriotic, hilarious, and it might just be the start of something strange and great. WARNING: THIS EPISODE IS MARKED EXPLICIT FOR LANGUAGE AND CONTENT.

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Hello friends. Mike Rowe here. Chuck Klausmeyer sitting across from me at the MicroWorks World Headquarters where we are now recording. It is nice to do this in person, isn't it? I think this is the best way to do it, honestly. It's the only sensible way to do it, especially when your guest is the one and only

Theodore Capitani von Kurnatowski The Third. Yes, yes. Other, aka Theo Vaughn. A.A. Or A.K. Also known as, I guess it's A.A. also known as a troubled white.

Yes, right. Self-described. Self-described. I don't know if you know Theo Vaughn or not. I suspect some of you probably do. He has the fourth or fifth largest podcast in the world. Yeah. I met him a couple years ago.

No idea who he was, but I was invited to be on his podcast, and I happened to be in Nashville where he spends most of his time, and we got along great. And then a year or two later, he invited me back, and I said, sure. Yeah. And that was here in Los Angeles. And that conversation was, well, a ton of fun, but memorable for me anyway, because I really learned some things about the guy

that I didn't know. First and foremost was he cares an awful lot about this country. He's determined to do his part to reinvigorate manufacturing. Yes. He cares about the country and the people in it. And maybe not even in that order. You know, two things. This is what you call a restricted podcast. Is that what we're doing? explicit. It has to be marked explicit because, you know, he uses, he's a little fast and loose with the swear words. And actually, I think we both were, we all three words. We might have been, yeah. We might have been. Apologies if you're put off by that sort of thing, but this is an unfiltered American original. His story, I'm not going to tell you the whole thing. He'll tell you a part of it,

but he came from a poor part of the country for sure. And he has risen to become one of the most popular comedians in America. Like I said, he's got one of the most listened to podcasts anywhere. He does a lot of good work. He's helped a lot of people, too. His own path to recovery has led him on kind of an odyssey and a big chunk of his audience really calls in and shares some surprisingly personal things. And he's, I just think he's occupying a really unique piece of real estate in this weird industry of ours. Yeah, he is. And like you said before, He really does care about people. And he's the kind of guy who, he's the kind of comedian who, it seems to be, doesn't tell jokes or doesn't need to tell jokes.

He tells a story in a funny way. And he just phrases things in such a funny way that you just can't help but smile. I mean, I think you're going to hear me just laughing in the background quite a bit because I couldn't keep quiet. He's funny in a strange way. He doesn't fit. And what makes him interesting is that he doesn't. care. He's just who he is. And this kid from a border town between Mississippi and Louisiana has interviewed the president of the United States, the vice president of the United States,

ranking senators. He's an American original. In fact, it probably would have been more respectful to call him that in the title. But since he invoked a troubled white, we can quote him directly. This is Theo Vaughan. He is by his own admission. A troubled white, and he'll prove it right after this. Do do do do do do do do do. I love stories like this. Seven years ago, a guy named Ben Still was a musician. He had zero interest in running a food company, but he was annoyed that so much imported meat was being deceptively marketed and labeled as domestic and decided to fix The problem. The result was a company called Good Ranchers. It's a completely honest, totally transparent meat company that deals directly with American farms and ranches and promises

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Hey-ha! Mike, thanks so much, dude. Are you kidding? So cool. It's so crazy this week. world that we're in, you more so than me probably, but the business of being a guest on a podcast, if you host a podcast, it's part of the bargain. I didn't really understand that when I sort of forest gump my way into it. But what is it? Quid pro quo. I think it's pretty understood,

kind of you want to be supportive of your friends' podcasts. I think there's people sometimes that you want to have conversations with. So, yeah, I guess sometimes it's a trade-off. Like, why did you call me? And just so people know, this was over two years ago, I happened to be in Nashville, full disclosure. I had heard your name. I didn't really quite understand who you were or what you were doing. Yeah, I was just another troubled white, you know? And I think I was having a tough week and I was like, oh, I know who troubled whites reach out to. I can help.

Mike Rhodes. I can help. No, I mean, obviously I knew so much about you. You know, I worked on a farm growing up, not forever, but I worked there for two summers. and in Louisiana, right on the Louisiana and Mississippi line over there, like outside of like Faradie, Louisiana, which is I think where Jerry Lee Lewis is from. So anyway, you know, people then would like talk about, you know,

episode that they'd seen, like, you know, different stuff that they'd witnessed or whatever. Louisiana was very good to dirty jobs. Yeah? You ever been down a cutoff? No, I knew a girl from there, though, and I quit knowing her, thank God. You cut it off. I mean, I guess I did. I think it's a lot of ex-wives down there, you know?

is it's part Everglades, part Redneck Riviera. It's shot through with the level of consequence. Like I knew an alligator farmer down there named Jerry Savoy. And it's such a kick. I mean, you travel everywhere. But when you get into a town that you've never, A, you've never been to and B, you didn't know existed. And then you meet a guy who raises alligators.

And then you're in like a homemade helicopter. And he's flying you around and you're throwing spears with e-perbs and radar-guided stuff. into alligator nest so you can come back in an airboat and rob the eggs. Like all the- Yeah, it all happens very quick and it's very consequential because you can be cut in half and cut off. Easy. Well, I-b. What is it? E-perb is an e-perb is an electronic something beacon. Check it out for me, Chuck. It's an acronym. All boats have them. If you go, say, on deadliest catch and you fall overboard, and you've got a survival suit on.

There's an e-perb on your suit. So it sends out some sort of signal that lets people at least get close. Yeah, like Ricky's drowning or whatever. Ricky's drowning, and the water's 38 degrees, so we've got to get there in about three minutes. Yeah, emergency position indicating radio beacon is a device used to alert search and rescue authorities.

In maritime emergencies, it transmits a distress signal on a designated frequency. There you go. Why would you guys use that from the air, just like a locator to come back? Yeah. I think the Coast Guard first introduce them because, you know, up there guys are overboard a lot.

You really don't have much time. If you're in a suit, you can survive for a while. But it's like the most desperate thing you'll ever see. Is it Jayhawk being scrambled, right, filled with Coasties who are deployed in the middle of the night because a boat went down somewhere off the Pribil off islands? And the E-PURBS are going off, and you know you got dudes in the water.

water. And it's just, I mean, it's just, you know, it's intense. Anyway, I'm sorry. Just another white boy in trouble. There you are on the border of Mississippi and Louisiana. Yeah, and I think your show just always made people feel like I was doing hard work even if I wasn't, you know? It was like, I'd even like, uh, clocked out at the end of your show. I'd be like, oh, shifts over, that type of stuff, you know, or something or something or, um, just slam a door and just like scream out the name of a TV dinner, just that kind of shit, you know? Well, you know, when I first, first met you, again, just so people understand, I'm in Nashville. I'm meeting, I think, John Rich and shooting something and my office calls and said, yeah, this guy, Theo, here's the

address. So I get over to your place. And I don't know how long you'd been living there, but like you answered the door, like you're in your bathrobe and your boxers. You're like, hey, come on in. And I'm like, oh, God, what is this? Oh, Kevin Spacey's here, huh? No, I think I just was running late. I've always run late, you know? Or the clocks, a lot of these clocks are fucking, they're fast, huh? Well, what's going on in the solar system now? What is it? The lion

thing? The lion's portal or something? Oh yeah, the portal was just open. There's a cosmic, I'm gonna totally botches, but I know it's a cosmic time where there's some alignment, I think in Orion's belt, the lion's portal is open. It's like the hottest

time of the year to get out there and manifest to, you know, just to kind of shake your chakras for the Lord out there in the moonlight kind of. And so somebody sent me a link to it the other day. And so then I was just out there manifesting and just like... Explain what that means to you. Like when you manifest the thing, has it happened in your life before? I will say this. I felt good the next day.

But that could have been, it could have been from peptides I was on. It could have been different things, you know? Like, when I say it, like, I try not to exact. exaggerate. Mm-hmm. As a rule. Really? As a rule, I never exaggerate.

I mean, there are things that I feel confident are going to happen that haven't happened yet. And sometimes I'll say they've happened because I actually believe that saying they're going to happen. And I'm not a big supernaturalist, but will in some way reframe the world order. Like, my whole foundation was based on, I just started talking about it before I had it. Works, you mean? Yeah. Micro work started and then I started, I mean, and this sounds kind of gross, but I was saying we awarded a million dollars in work ethic scholarships before we had. I felt like we were gone out that year and we did. Right. Yeah. And so I don't know. There's just occasions where you say a thing out loud and all of a sudden it's made real. Well, I think there's definitely when I think back in my life there's been things that I think it felt that way. But I think it's almost you feel like if you had said them at the time, we'd feel kind of egotistical maybe like just little daydreams or something. Yeah. But it kind of makes. sense, like, say if you had like a piece of metal and you loaded it up with like, whatever like

the one half of a magnet is called, like one side of it or something? A mag. Yeah. So if you like how, you got your mag and you got your net. You got your bag and your net. Got heads and tails. But it's like if you stacked a mag with everything, with all your dreams in there, you think like the way a magnet works that a net would eventually, if you load a mag up enough with enough mag, a net has got to come. It's got to fly literally because of the power that would be, the pull that would be in it at that point, something would fly over immediate, you know. So you think maybe on it, like from a cosmic universal sense, if you look at it through the lens of magnetism, then the argument is there's always a positive pole and a negative pole. And there are times when those poles can reverse, which is going to usher in a level of chaos that the astronomers freak out when they talk about.

Like when the, when the Earth's poles, they say when, because it's going to switch. that once our magnetic field. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it's not going to happen today, Theo. I don't think. No, I know that, but I'm just like, fuck. My mom's going to be fucking pissed.

Look, mine's livid too. I narrate a show called How the Universe Works, which ought to be called A Thousand Ways to Die. Because every single episode talks about either a magnetron or a quasar or a pulsar or a supernova or, you know. Or just a batch of gay dudes coming and scooping you up. That's one of my biggest fears. I feel like if you're in a park or something,

because a lot of gay men are way tougher than they used to be. What happened do you think? When did that shift? Because I remember watching a, what was the, you and I used to work in a theater years ago. Oh, you guys. Yeah, tell us more. No, not that kind of theater.

No, it was a movie. It was called Cruising. Oh, my gosh. Hips or lips. Hips or lips. Yeah. Yeah. And I remember watching that movie thinking, you know,

this is, this is not at all consistent with the image I had of that particular lifestyle, which I don't, in no way, care to judge or way on. But it was just, I mean, it was a risky business. It was a rough movie. Yes. Yeah, it was. It's cruising. It's called. It's called cruising. It stars Al Pacino. Yeah, yeah. Something a lot of you guys can watch on your lunch break out there. Is it that kind of thing? Does it go with lunch? No, I wouldn't recommend it. No, I don't think it's going to help with your digestion. What sandwiches does it go with you think? I'd say a hoagie. A foot long. Foot long. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Well, I got a four-inch around, you know? That's the best I can do, dude. It's something a bun over here.

But yeah, I think that's when I, you know, like, that's when America really, you know, yeah, there was something about your world that was just fun. It was kind of fascinating to follow and look and see in all these spaces and stuff like that. Well, see, this is how like the wheel of Fortuna spins, man. I'm fascinated by your world. I'm fascinated how this, would you call yourself Troubled white boy? Yeah, Trouble White. Yeah, a T-W. Yeah, T-Dub. Right. I mean, I know kind of the story. I know it was road rules and TV and stuff. And then really, I think like what I'd love to get into you with you, and I want to talk too about the big idea that you and I have been kicking around later. Yeah, sure, man. Let's just say that for a second. I just want people to like you first. I mean, not that they don't already like you. Well, thanks, dude. Because your charm is palpable on TV, but, you know, people just might not be watching. They might just be listening. Yeah, I don't know. I think, I think, I just.

just feel lucky that this job kind of came along where you can work for yourself with podcasting. Yeah. You know, I had a tough time like, I didn't want to count on anybody else for myself. I think that's something that's always just been a part of me as a human, you know. And I think that's kind of what led me like into comedy because it's just you. It's you up there. Your dad can't get you that job. You're fucking rich, whoever.

Some guy can't get you that job. Some guy with a mustache or whatever can't get you that job. Yeah. You got to get up there, you know. I think that's something I like comedy. And then I was fortunate that podcast and came along. And, you know, it's been kind of a neat. I feel fortunate that this is when I'm alive so that I can, you know,

just to have this job and it's been fun. Theo, you've got the, it's like the fourth biggest podcast in the world, man. I mean, that's a crooked line from the border of Mississippi and Louisiana. You know what I mean? That's a crooked line. And I didn't realize it either when you answered the door in your underwear and let me in your house in Nashville for a church. chat two years. Now, they were thick underwear. I don't want people think I was wearing something,

you know. I mean, whatever. I didn't linger. I just was like, all right, well, this is, this is what we're doing. Well, they were wool, that's all I'm saying. Hey, Matt, you know, wool is an underrated fabric. You know, it's almost always associated with the winter, but it's one of the most breathable, sensible thing. It'll keep you warm when it's wet. Hmm. Which, if you think about it, it's thoughtful. I mean, from a utilitarian underwear standpoint, it's an interesting selling point. Yeah, you can be wet and warm. Oh, yeah. I would stop by that.

I'd stop by that. Yeah, that's great. You can be wet and warm. All right. I'll take a little, you know? I think that's how I feel about that, I guess. But anyway, I think we're talking about nine things at one. I've had some coffee, too.

We are. And that's okay, man. That's what this job is, dude. You know what, though? I was listening to you interview Donald Trump when you walked in 20 minutes ago, which really, that was an awkward meet. You know, we sort of hugged and you knocked my glasses off my shirt. And then you bent down to get those.

I'm trying to introduce you to Chuck. And meanwhile, I got you in my ear and Donald Trump is talking to you about how to reform the trial lawyers association. Oh, yeah. He said that the lawyer lobby is a really big lobby. I don't even know that existed. Massive lobby. That's crazy. And it's got to be the worst one because they have all the lawyers.

They're very hard to sue. Yeah, you're like, oh. You can't see yourself. That's crazy, huh? Dumb? Well, are you sick of it yet? Are you sick of AI hogging up all the headlines and sucking up all the bandwidth? You find yourself wishing we lived in a simpler time? Do you miss a rotary phone?

Well, get over it. The genie is out of the bottle. The poop is out of the goose, I'm afraid. AI is here to stay. And every business in the country is asking themselves the same question. How do we make it work for us? Well, the answer to that question varies. But you'll find it.

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Learn more at net suite.com slash Mike. And while you're there, pick up their free business guy, demystifying AI. It's filled with super useful information. And again, it's free at net suite.com. slash mike. That's net sweet.com. I want to know. Is it okay on this? Are you good brother? Okay, cool.

Oh, he's always good. Yeah, that's Taylor. Taylor's a guy on a poster there right behind you. He worked on dirty jobs with me and somebody's going to do it and all these other shows. Yeah. Handsome. He is handsome. Whatever, dude.

I like chicks. You know what I'm saying? Stay away. You know? God, huh? So you're a comedian and you're a comedian. and you're funny, but now you're an interviewer, and now it's J.D. Vance, and it's Bernie Sanders, and it's Donald Trump.

And of course, it's also all the comedians in the world. And then there's your listening audience, who I know you love a lot. Yeah, a lot of great people out there, probably folks that are similar to you. That's one thing that's about podcasting, I think, because a lot of times you'll meet the person, you'd be like, I would talk to this person for a long time, you know? Yeah. Because they're similar.

They're probably, you have to be, probably have some similarities to people, I think, to consume them in like a longer format maybe. I'd just like to know though when, when's the last time you were nervous? That's a good question, actually. Not counting today. Oh, I'll tell you actually, dude, I'll freaking just forget about this. I found this freaking bone on the sidewalk. You found a bone on the sidewalk and you picked it up.

Yeah, you think I'm fucking leaving out there, dude? In some circles we'd call this. evidence. Yeah, I have no idea. It was the only one. I looked like in a 40-foot radius. That was the only one they had. What do you reckon it is? I don't know. It looks like part of the spine. Like a vertebrae. Yeah. That's what I would go with. You might have found a vertebrae. Where were you? Just right across the street where I was parking. But anyway, yeah, I didn't mean to bring that up. I just felt it in my pocket. I think that's worth ruminating on a minute, you know? Dude, we found some bones when I was a kid in these wish and wells in our town. They had like this

youth group it was like through church it was kind of through the church it was after school like on wednesday night people would meet up and they'd have like a religious guy who was like and he'd play fun games with everybody but everybody's just trying to sneak off in the dark and kiss or whatever or just fucking even just rub their fucking front of their body against the damn tree or whatever yeah it's mississippi louisiana border you know oh yeah and if they border i want to you know that's my was my motto oh our states are bordering we should you know um but That's a good pickup line. Thanks, dude.

They look great on a T-shirt, man. That's pretty amazing. Yeah. But anyway, oh, yeah. And then, so anyway, they had this thing where they had like six or seven and wishing wells in our town and a group of kids you'd go clean them out in the summertime because people would put all kind of stuff down there. And some of it was hopeful stuff.

It was wishes. And then some of it was just people would put recyclables or used plates and dinnerware, stuff like that, stuff they didn't want. luggage, stuff like that. We found a sword out there and they had some finger bones one time that somebody found in there. Phalanges. Yeah, phalanges. In a wishing well. Yeah.

That's amazing. Yeah, that's the only time I've ever found human bones. I have always wanted to find a body. People want, I feel like everybody wants to. Do you feel like that? I did once. Nuh. Yeah. Mike. Yeah. Oh, thanks.

It was a big day. It was a big day. Good work, dude. And the crazy thing is a couple weeks after that, I found a mannequin. And I thought, I can't believe I found another body. And you thought it was another body? Yeah. And it was just a mannequin hiding?

Yeah, it was actually down where we took our trash every night. And somebody, not one of our neighbors, we lived on like a country lane and there weren't a lot of people around. So like we all knew each other's trash. And it didn't seem like any of the. few neighbors we had would throw a body out. Yeah. But it sure, it was a body, you know. But of course, it turned out to be a mannequin.

It was a sidebar. My mother took this thing home and she put it in my bed. And I was about 17. I came home. I think you and I were probably hanging out back. As a prank. Yeah. As a prank.

Yeah. She had a sense of humor. Yeah. Still does. Still does. Yeah. Terrible woman, though. I mean, she put this thing, put a bandana on its head and tucked it into my bed.

I was living in the basement at the time. Oh, you have a hell's angel sleeping over or something? No, I would come in late, and I'd like to, I didn't want to wake them up. There were times I would come in through the window well on the back side of it. Oh, yeah. You know, yeah. She had this mannequin in the bed and had it tucked in, and I came in, got halfway undressed and turned around, and the body was in the bed.

I jumped so high, I hit my head on the ceiling. Ooh. That's an exciting. Yeah. Anyway, look, I hope you do find a body one day. It'd be good for you. That's the only body you found or you found a real one also. I found a real one, but I saw it at about 30 feet away.

And the cops were there not long afterwards in a stream bed, not far from the creek. Wow. I don't know what happened to it. But the best body stories are our friend Chad Pagraki. Chad runs barge up and down the Mississippi and Ohio. He's like a self-appointed garbage man there. And the stuff he finds. Oh, my God.

It's just cash registers with money. bodies. Yeah. I mean, like cannonballs from Vicksburg. Oh, of course. Yeah, like the rivers are amazing. That's their big thing up there.

They're like, come look at this cannon. You know, in like a lot of the Civil War towns or whatever. Yeah. Don't you want to set the kiddos on this hot cannon or whatever? You're like, this is fucking, this is just a gay bar or whatever. But yeah, there's a lot of civil war type stuff. We used to go to Civil War reenactments when I was a kid. My father would take me over there sometimes.

What side were you on? Let's go to a commercial break. I mean, you got to cheer for the whole thing. Look, Matt. Louisiana, you know. Gosh, Chuck, I don't know if you can find it. I did an episode on somebody's got to do it on Civil War reenactors. Yeah.

And Taylor shot it. Where were we? We're outside of Orlando. Yeah, we're in the south. Really? Is it big down there? Because there's some spillover between CWR. guys, wrestlers,

Renfair, there's some people that work all of that. What's CWR? Civil Reinaxments. Oh, there you go. Sorry. And then, yeah, Renfair, those guys. And then... Dude, you're talking in acronyms. That means you're fully committed to this world. Oh, dude, we spent some time over there. We went from E-PURBs to, you know, CWRs, dude, yeah.

Oh, I'd see them sitting out there eating fucking dirty MREs and sharing spoons and whatever. MREs, again, that's a meal ready to eat. It's tickling each other and shit. Well, this is a terrific segment, and it really gets into the heads of reenactors on both sides, and you really get a look into the world. But right after we edited, we got the whole thing ready. And what happened? Was it George Floyd, or it was before that, but for whatever reason, everybody got cold feet about, about Aryan.

Why? Because when, you mean like when the cops killed George Floyd or whatever? Well, it was just. Or who might think of George Foreman. That's what I'm thinking of. No. He died. Oh, well, I guarantee you.

He didn't die. I like George Floyd did. No. George Foreman, I think, passed in a bizarre grilling accident. Oh. No. He died recently, I think, didn't he? He did, man.

I shouldn't have brought it up. I got confused for a second. I hope he's all right. No, but Mike, the reason that the thing never aired was, I don't think, it was on CNN. But you're talking about when we put it on TBN. Yeah. And the reason they didn't want it was because you were rooting for the home team. Oh, you were over for the South?

I was. You were dressed as a Confederate. I was addressed to the confederate. I grew up Maryland. It's a border state. We never really could decide. Yeah. And it's also like which conference is better.

I don't know. I could see them creating a league out of it eventually once it kind of loses some of the racial stigma and maybe like two more generations. I can totally see that. Yeah. A league. Like how would it work? What would the rules be? I don't know.

And I don't know what the game would be exactly. But I could just see that. Everything even historic eventually over time it turns in. I feel like, you know, it makes it where it can become something marketable, even if it's something bad maybe. Do you think over like enough time? I think you and I talked about this. We were talking about sports in general. Yeah.

And I think I said, oh, I made a game out of catching horse crap in the air because my chores involved picking up horse crap every day. And it was super exciting to follow them around and try and catch it before it hit the ground. Oh, so bad. So bad. Right. Now, that's a ridiculous way to pass the time, and it's probably never going to be an organized sport. Yeah.

You know, sport. But Cornhole is. Darts are, I think lawn darts are too, and horseshoos and botchy ball. So, like, you know, when does an activity go from being a thing you do at a barbecue in your backyard to something that maybe is in the X games, but not the Olympics, eventually to the Olympics and then organized. I have no idea how to make sense of any of that, but those things come and go. All I know is I was riveted to Cornhole. Yeah. Oh, yeah, there's something about it.

There's something kind of nasty about it And there's something fun about it I'm trying to think of what games I like What do you do for fun? I've been sauning Sauna ink Sauna ink Going to the sauna in the morning

Yeah I've been getting out of bed early That's been making me feel pretty good I'm trying to think of what else I've really been doing Manifesting I had been manifesting yeah I did sit out there man

And I did Yeah I'll tell you about that Let me so don't forget to tell you So I sit out there and I just said, like, you know, I accept abundance. I accept possibility. I accept talking to my sister. I accept everything that God wants me to accept, right? And I don't accept bad thoughts about myself, just things like that, you know?

And I'd just never done it before. You know, I thought about it. And you hear about it all the time manifesting. but I thought it was kind of interesting and then I wanted to do it again yesterday I just kind of like had a moment in the day I was like I want to do that again

so I think something inside of me it made me feel good you know what did you think of Tony Robbins hmm I think he would have I think Hogan would have beat him I think

that was my first thought when I saw him that Hulk Hogan would have beat him would have wiped the fucking floor with him to be honest dude that was honestly your first thought when you met Tony Robin yeah

because he's big yeah Yeah, but he ain't bigger than the fucking Hulkster. No, the Hulk's Big Terry. That's what I thought, dude. I was like, oh, yeah, you got all your magic and shit. I'd like to see you take that shit on the fucking ring, boy. So I thought that was my first thought.

After that, I thought, man, this guy is, he's very engaging. I feel like he makes the most out of life. I do feel like he makes the most out of his time. Andrew Stuss to his wife and kid. They were really nice. I thought he was yeah, he's compelling, you know. And he's kind of larger than life.

So there's a lot of like things that are right there, you know. And yeah, I just felt, I felt like he was a neat guy. I'm interested. You know him? Yeah, I went to one of his things back in 93. Yeah, that sounds right. A date with destiny. Oh, wow.

Hot coals and so forth. I was there as a guest, actually. I got a buddy who's like, you know, powder. Remember that movie, guy hit by lightning, and then suddenly he can do all these, my friends, a human calculating. That weather honky or whatever? Yeah, kind of like that, except he's got all the Guinness World Records for math calculations, right?

So Tony hired him to come and, like, warm the crowd up in the mornings. I went along as his guest. And that was the first time I heard somebody talk about manifesting. And everybody in the crowd was nod in their head like you are right now because they're like, yeah, man, I can really see the power in that. And then all these years later, I saw you interview him. But what you did, man, and this is what I was trying to get at with the nervous thing and with the Trump thing and with all these different roles, you know, you became like a lab rat with him. Oh, yeah.

You know what I mean? Like you were so willing to unpack and answer candidly the questions he was asking. And that little clip was, you know, viewed millions and millions of times. Yeah. I love that kind of stuff. I know you do, but that's why you're so hard to nail down, man. I just, it's like comedian, interviewer, podcaster, or troubled white. Duh, do, do, do, do, do, do, do, do.

Well, people are still raving, raving, I tell you, about my mother's performance in the latest Pure Talk commercial. And if you haven't seen it, I encourage you to give it a look on my Facebook page and read the comments. They're hysterical. In this commercial, you'll not only see Peggy Roe gently criticizing her oldest son for his longstanding and well-established commitment issues, you'll learn about the latest offer from Pure Talk, which includes unlimited talk, text, and data for just $3499 a month, with no contracts and no commitments of any kind. You can see why I love these guys. If, on the other hand, you have better things to do with your time,

then watch my mom and me be impossibly charming together, then allow me to remind you, here, without all the cleverness and charm, that unlimited talk, text, and data on a blazing, fast network for just 3499 a month really is an unmitigated bargain from an American wireless company that keeps all their customer service in this country, supports our veterans in a meaningful way, as well as the MicroWorks Foundation, and allows me to exploit my own mother in a national advertising campaign. Do what my mom did. Get yourself unlimited high-speed data for just 3499 a month at puretalk.com slash row. You can switch in as little as 10 minutes at puretalk.com slash row. Pure talk. You wear many hats. Yeah, I like, I mean, I guess I'll always be,

I'll probably always be a trouble white. I don't, I don't know if I feel like an interviewer. interview and never feels fun kind of. It is nice when conversations get into a place where you can just talk. I do like, I would sit in therapy all the time and just have it be podcast. Like, I have some moments in therapy that I think are like, you know, like I'm kind of a late bloomer in life. So it's like I'm like learning a lot of stuff that I felt like I probably should have had more of a understanding of when I was young, but late.

Like I feel a lot of times like a kid, but I feel very kind of childish. energy sometimes. Yeah. You know, and I don't mean that in a weird way or anything. But over the past years, I've kind of noticed that. I'm like, yeah, I think some of that's just still passing through me, you know. It just took some years to get out of the, you know, to get out of the magazine, you know. No, I don't.

What do you mean in the magazine? Or just like out of the way, you know, it just took a few years to pat, you know, out of the magazine, the clip to pass through. Oh, clip, clip, clip, right, sorry, right. No, I think, but yeah, I do. I love that kind of stuff. I love it when, like I go to recovery meetings. I just came from one today.

I love when people are feeling something, you know? Like in our house when I was growing up, we couldn't, like, everything was so intense that you couldn't even let your guard down for a second to have like a feeling. Yeah. Because you were going to be ridiculed or you were going to seem weak or you were going to, you knew that it was going to get you, it was not going to help you, right? you never had a chance to like even your feelings to kind of process sometimes because you were like this all the time and so when I get in chances where I get to have moments like that man I really treasure them I really really love them you're just you're living it though in public in a way that I haven't seen anybody do this yet honestly I pay attention but I mean you're touring and you're a funny guy on stage yeah we do pretty good you do great And you're interviewing some of the most important people on the planet.

And you're being interviewed by some of the more thoughtful people on the planet. And you're talking about things with like such candor. You know, and I remember, you know, another clip. And I know I've said this to you before, but I started paying attention to you about a year after we met when I saw a caller came through. Oh, yeah. I remember you tell me about this. And this guy was, you know, he was struggling. and he was back on his heels

and he was nervous because he was talking to you and you let him talk for maybe 15 minutes and I couldn't believe it honestly it defied what you would expect somebody to do in that quasi live format but you just let him talk

and what got me were the comments under that video from thousands of people who learned or felt or connected so much from watching you listen. And that's, you know, that's an interesting set of muscles you got. Well, thanks for checking that out, dude. I, you know, my brother, like a few years ago one day, I was just having like the worst day.

And we're just similar growing up. We just had like, you know, it was just so intense growing up. You didn't even develop. You know, you just didn't even develop. when you were young you just didn't I don't know and nobody in our family did none of the kids did really

and so you got an older brother yeah I got an older brother he's two years older than me and then one day I was having a tough day and I was sitting in my truck it was a national and I pulled over and I was just bawling dude

I was just like I think I was just kind of at my wit and everything just felt impossible just that kind of moment you know and he was just like hey man if you want I'll just sit here with you for a little while you know he's like we don't have to say anything You know, I can just sit here with you and just be here with you, you know?

And, yeah, and when he said that, dude, I just like, I mean, I think tears came out of my fucking metatarsals, you know? Are this feet? Yeah, I believe they are. Yeah. I mean, it was just like, just because in my life, nobody said that. Like, hey, I'm just going to be here. And that's it, right?

Like, there was no other part to it, you know? and it was just a powerful moment for me. So sometimes there are moments like, anyway, all I'm saying is I learn little things from my brother and sometimes if there's days or moments where I'm even like a tenth of what he's been for me, then that's where some of those like kind of little moments come from. That's why I think I care about that kind of stuff because when you're in like a recovery meetings, you hear that kind of stuff, you know, and you hear people like that have just stuff that's real, you know, and so I really love that.

kind of rambling. No, man. Look, I'm super interested about, I don't know a lot about AA, but I know a fair amount about celebrity, and I've always been interested. Like, what is it like for you, and what is it like for, like, because you can be in a town you've never been into and you can show up at a meeting? What's the dynamic like when you walk in for people who know you? And, like, anonymity is such a big part. I mean, it's in the title of the whole organization. You can't be anonymous if you're Theo Fawn, and yet there you are. Yeah, I think sometimes it's interesting. I used to think about it.

I can tell, like, if I'm worried about that when I walk in there, then I'm not doing well personally, right? Because I'm more like in the like, what's my needs and my image, that kind of stuff. But if I hadn't gone to meetings in a long time and I go in or if I'm in a new city, like whenever I moved to Nashville, I was like worried about that at first, like, or just like, I guess concerned. and also you're going into meetings in a new place. So that feels interesting. But you can kind of map out what's going on, you know? And then also we're all in there because we're something's wrong or like something's awesome about us, but also had drugs and alcohol involved with it.

And so, you know, we're all kind of on the same page. But there's been moments where people like, yeah, I guess we'll want to take photos, at meetings. And so I usually just kind of say, you know, I don't do that at meetings or something like that to kind of keep it cool. Yeah. But then I'll try to check in with that person. too so I don't want them feeling you know like a bummed

out or something you know because alcoholics get their feelings hurt easy sometimes so it's like you know I think it's probably unique for them and unique for me in some type of way and not everybody but sometimes sometimes you go to meetings and nobody knows dude there's some guy in there there's a guy in there I think there was a meeting

I walked in once and I don't even know I didn't go back in but it was just one dude in there and he could have been dead it was an old guy I was like I'm not fucking checking if that you know I was like I'm not EMT or whatever, you know. Well, there's the body you were looking for. I know, I should have stayed.

I still think of it. He had his shoes off. How important is it? Dying with your shoes on has to suck, right? I mean, it would depend what you're doing. What? Who wants to have their shoes on forever? Oh, well, I mean, yeah.

Imagine you have your shoes on in heaven, and somebody has their fucking shoes off. Yeah, somebody didn't get the memo. There's an old song. He died with, his boots on. Famous. Unlucky, dude.

Walking around in boots forever, that would piss me off. I'm not sure that's how the afterlife works, for sure. I mean, you might be right, but I think you're basically transformed. You know, it's not your whole... I don't think your wardrobe goes with you.

But I think you still know how it feels to have shoes on your feet and you die with that feeling. And I think that that stays with you. You do you? I do. Well, I would hate that. Yeah. Unless it's cold.

You know, you want to be barefoot? What if the terrain is rocky? I mean, I'm sure heaven is not typically imagined as a rough-terrined chili place. Yeah, I wonder what kind of land they have up there. Milk and honey is what I've heard. Really? Well, the land of milk and honey is a thing. So you fellows have been friends for a long time, huh?

I've never seen this guy before. First time. How long? 44 years, maybe. God, you perverts, dude. Do not know somebody for that long, dude. Meet somebody else, dude. I know, I'm trying.

Believe me. I'm trying. I know. Get out of the house. It's like stepping in gum, man. I can't shake it. Have you guys ever been on a double date before? Oh, yeah.

No way. Yeah, we went on a double date. With twins or regulars? Regulars. We went on a date. Oh, dear. Can I say it? Oh, my God.

Yeah. Well, yeah, it was Danielle and Terry. That's right. It was Daniel and Terry. Yeah. And until it wasn't. That's your ex-wife? No, no, no. God rest her soul. Oh, someone passed away.

Oh, no, she's just dead to me. Thank you. I'll be here all podcasts. She died with her boots on. And the Spurs. I kid. I kid. I kid. I kid. I kid. We're just kidding, Danielle, and Terry.

Terry's your wife. No, no. That's not true. I haven't seen Terry in years. Really? But she, yeah. But that was a, I'll never forget that night. Where did y'all go? No one will.

We went to Danielle's house. Yeah. No way. In the basement? You fucking creeps. What were you all doing? All right. Yeah.

Just, you know. Talking. Yeah, we were just talking. We were having a chat. But were y'all boozing on there, playing a game? Like, what was like the setup? Was there a reason? Like, was it movie night?

Was it just kind of like? Was it movie night? I don't recall any photographs being. You're creeping me out now, all right? Just tell us what happened. Are these women okay? I sure hope so. Yeah.

I haven't talked to Terry in decades. Let's bring her in right now. She has a tattoo of Mike rolling her back. I'm just joking, Terry, and that's insane. Terry was good. You know, it was funny. I hope she's doing good. There's another night, but I brought Terry back to my parents' house.

I'm still living in the basement, very place where the mannequin was waiting for me when I crawled through the window sill. Oh, yeah, sounds like a John Irving novel or something. Are you a fan of Irving, by the way? Yeah. Prayer for Owen Meaney? Oh. Hotel New Hampshire?

Yeah. Setting free the Bears, dude. So good. Oh, good. My favorite author. First book I read, like, as an adult book. Yeah. Was the World According to Garp.

Yeah, me too. That got everybody in. Garp was early. Well, that was done in, like, 81 or 82, I think. Oh, that was so good. Yeah. Always wrestling. He's like Irving.

was a big wrestler. With Exeter and stuff like that. Yeah. And the bears and the neighbor's dog and just the way he like put life together and stuff. For some reason, it just, I absorbed that really good. He just put out a book a year and a half ago that I got. It was kind of hard to read. It was just a lot of words.

I don't like that. I used to date a real chatty girl. And I fucking, I do not like a lot of that. Hey, Chuck, see if you can find the last paragraph to a prayer for Owen Meaney. It haunted me. Yeah, the book is called A Prayer for Owen Meaney. It's by John Irving. And I wonder if the last paragraph exists.

I wonder if you could read that if it does. And they made a movie called Simon Birch, if anybody ever got to watch that movie. That is a neat movie, too. That's the own meanie take, essentially. That's cool, man. So I bring Terry back to the house. Yeah. And Terry was voluptuous.

Yeah. She's a beautiful, beautiful woman, but she looked like a movie star. And she looked like a, she looked like a. Like a mature 35-year-old... Like Kate Thurtson or something? Movie star. Who's Kate Thurtson? I have no idea.

And me neither. Oh. Oh, God, please. I can't work this thing. Oh, yeah, yeah. You've got to get the whole last paragraph, not the last line. And this is a spoiler alert, by the way. If you haven't read a prayer for Owen Meaney.

Do you use perplexity? No, what is that? Perplexity is a cool AI. Oh. We just live in a constant state of it. Is it weird to love people but despise human resources? If so, well, color me weird. It's not to say I don't respect the millions of people who work in HR departments and companies all over the country.

I do. It's just that I don't envy him. That's why MicroWorks doesn't have an HR department for better or worse. And it's also why I use ZipRecruiter whenever we need to expand. ZipRecruiter has proven themselves a million times over by helping countless employees. get through the hiring process faster and more effectively than ever before. And now they have a new feature that instantly shows you the most interested, the most passionate, and the most qualified candidates first.

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that just happens to be a great fit for your company in 24 hours or less. ZipRecruiter.com slash row. ZipRecruiter.com slash row. Anyway, my mom and dad are in bed and the lights on in the room. In their room? In their room.

And they met Terry before? No. No, they haven't. And she wanted to use the restroom and I wanted to send her home with a bottle of water and so forth. She had left her car at my parents' house. Right. He was kids.

Anyway, I knocked on the door and opened it up and my dad's lying in bed. He's reading. He's got glasses down on his nose. My mom's reading too. And I said, oh, I just want to introduce you to Terry real quick. Terry steps in the room and like the lights coming down from above and she's a loom. It's like Glenn Close. in a, what is it, Field of Drees.

Family Man or something? No, no, it's just raiding and beautiful and volumptuous. And my dad still laughs about it. She's just like, you walked her in there, and she just stood there by the bed and smiled. And I looked at you and your mother looked at me and we looked at her. And then we all just kind of looked at you

and said, how in the world, what's going to happen next? And then you just excused yourselves and closed the door. Wow. And we've really never spoken. of it since. It's really none of their business. Yeah, I don't think so, but I think it's nice that they were willing to let you guys stand

in the room for a minute, you know? I think that's where were they in bed? Yeah. Yeah, that's bizarre. Yeah, it was. It was odd. It was like 1230. I was sure, but I saw the light on, which means I knew they could hear me in the whole

business of sneaking in. Like you want to be sneaky. Don't want to be sneaky. Yeah. Sneaky's the worst, dude. I freaking met this lady at a car wash one time. Anyway, it was Tucson. So everything there is a fucking car wash

But I met a woman there And then in the morning She ended up staying over at my freaking house When I was at my mom's house And in the morning I went in the kitchen I was like guess what mom? She's like what?

I was like remember that lady from the car wash And she's like yeah I was like she's here And she's like you are fucking kidding me Does Charlie know Charlie was her husband? He was in the war And I was like I don't know if Charlie

I don't she's like Charlie cannot find out So we had to sneak this lady out of the house. It was so hilarious. How old were you? Probably 34. Really? Yeah.

You were, what's the word? You were emancipated. Like, what, 14 or something? Yeah, got out there pretty early. Kind of a DIY guy, you know? Yeah? I think I was kind of a DIY guy. Your dad had you late in life?

Yeah, my dad was 70 when I was born. And my dad was an older man. Pretty cool, though. But he had like another family of like kids that were well, he had some earlier children and they were pretty well off. And they didn't want anything to do with us. And we were just this kind of, you know, it was tough for him to be a dad as he got older. Yeah. You know, it was kind of weird to watch that, I think as a kid.

And I wonder, sometimes I still don't even know how that formed how I thought about stuff. And do you think that's why your brother was so influential being a couple years older than you? I think there's moments in the past couple years why I've. felt like my brother in certain regards embodied some of the dad I didn't have, you know? Yeah. But he also, I think he was also conscious to make sure that he stayed my brother, like it didn't get into like an uncomfortable space or something, you know? They're good guinea pigs, older brothers.

They are. Oh, dude, shout out to older brothers, man. Yeah. They take all of the shrapnel. They take all of the bullshit. Yep. They take your parents best shots usually. Yep.

And they, some of them are. drug addicts or whatever, felons. Some of them are good. But all of them are out there on the front lines of a family's existence. That's right. And that is a fucking, that is a real thing in the world that does not get shouted out enough.

I don't think so either. But you're the thing your parents are practicing on. They're figuring it out with you. Yeah. Theo, Mike is the oldest brother. Oh, he is? Yes, he is. He doesn't have an older brother.

I would have loved to have an older brother. would have been amazing. I don't know. But I didn't. Oh, yeah. You get to see the things your brother didn't do well or did well or something like that, you know? Oh, God, yeah. But then what if your brother's absolute, like, my brother was certainly, I looked up to him for sure.

But like, but yeah, I just wonder, like, what if your brother was like Michael Jordan or something? Would that be tough, I wonder? I think maybe it would. Yeah. Unless you hate playing basketball and you'd be like, ah, fuck it. I don't know. I mean, my brothers and I are all very different, but I do have one, I think, that is kind of adjacent

in, like, to this career, this industry. And I think I was probably, you know, like what happened with dirty jobs and everything was probably fascinating to watch. I mean, think about the guys you grew up with, you know, I mean, the fact that you got out of that town. And I think it seems mystical to some people. You know, you must be a source of great mystery to a lot of the people you grew up with.

They're on the border of Mississippi and Louisiana to see you out there now. I mean, well, that's where I spent the summers. I grew up down in Covington, Louisiana, which is a little bit north of New Orleans. It's a nice place. It's all a statue of Ronald Reagan, if you want to look that up. Oh, in Covington? Mm-hmm. Well, that's something.

You gave up on the Owen Meaney, last paragraph thing? You can't get it. It's got a, you got to buy the book. You got a copyright? Buy the book, right? quick. Okay. I don't know if that. And I don't want to call him out. I just, no, you call me out. Go ahead. I don't know if that's true. Yeah. Okay. Do you find that hard to believe or not? And I'm not judging anybody. I don't, I think it's highly unlikely

that anything ever written can't be found on the internet with the proper search. I just think it's highly unlikely. Okay. God, I wish we were down there with Danielle and Terry. Man, that'd be something. Boy, it was a, it was a simpler time, Theo. It was before you were born, man. It was probably 1980, one, two. Did y'all have deodorant then? No. Fuck yeah, dude. Deodorant's for pussies.

Oh, yeah, dude. It should have been back then, I bet. That's crazy time, dude. I bet the freaking the, what's it called when you take care of yourself or something? Responsibility. Personal hygiene? I bet the, hygiene. Personal hygiene was crazy back then.

It was loose. It was loose. There was a lot of pechuley in the air. There's Reagan. Down there in Covington? He did not come. Oh, they sent Dole down there. Oh, yeah.

Reglin is huge. He was enormous. Look the size of that guy. That's not even in Covington, I don't think, is it? I don't know. Nah, that's somewhere else. Somebody might have... Is that the wrong one?

Did you just Google? The largest statue? The largest statue of Ronald Reagan is what I Google. In Covington. Yeah. Somebody could have beat us. You know, it's exactly the kind of thing that's fleeting, man. One minute, you're, you know, on Rushmore, and then you're off.

Yeah. Not that he was ever on Rushmore, to be clear. Stand by. I'll get this out of here. You know, one thing that I saw that was interesting recently was they had, we went to Mount Rushmore not long ago. We had a show in up in the Dakota's, a couple shows up there, and we went over to Mount Rushmore.

And there's another face, a native face that's on the other side of that. Crazy horse. Just down the road. And they've never finished building it. Yeah. They were supposed to finish building it. Yeah. The fact that they didn't even.

they took all the land from those people. They're still building it. Gorkchak, what's his last name, Taylor? He passed away. I think his son is handling it maybe. But the fact that they, it's like... You had 13 kids. They should have done it then.

Yeah, 13. That's partly why I had so many kids. Wow. Yeah. Oh, my God. We tried. I wanted to shoot an episode at Mount Rushmore. I wanted to do like a dirty job.

I wanted to sandblast Jefferson's nose. Oh my God, yeah. Right? I thought it would be a really fun way to look at history and get people, you know, maybe interested who otherwise wouldn't be. And, you know, that's a federal park as a federal property. And the feds are like, absolutely not. We would never, ever consider letting somebody film.

Like, I mean, I think I offended them and I didn't mean to. But we reached out to Crazy Horse, like a week later. They rolled out the red carpet. They gave us a whole tour of, I met the surviving kids, repelled down the face of, I mean, that thing's going to, it's going to take another 50 years to finish that thing. Yeah. The work has never stopped.

They've never taken a penny of federal money. Oh, the work has never stopped? No, no, they're still doing it. They're still doing it. But what, how long have they been doing it for? I think they started in the, yeah, it's close to 70 years. But how long did it take to finish Rushmore? About two weeks.

No. No, no, it took. longer than that. But not like a hundred years, huh? No, no, no. So what's the holdup there? And we've moved on from Reagan. You got crazy horse in there somewhere? God, bless America. All right. Yeah. You know what, man? Who's your Jamie? You got to have it. You got a Jamie. Yeah, we got a guy named Zach and Nick. We have two guys. Yeah, I met him both. He went over to your place. Did you know that? Oh, I see what it was like. Yeah. Yeah. They were great, man. They were really great. Showed me everything. Yeah, they're good guys, man. They're hard workers.

I feel lucky to be able to work with them. Yeah. 14 years of our Russian work. Fourteen years. for Rushmore and it's going to take probably 100 for Crazy Horse. Then I don't understand why. Is there just not, are we, are there's no federal money. There's no mandate to do it. So that's the finances.

It's all financing. But the guy, Gorshaw who started it, he was alone. Like there's an old video. You guys, if you haven't seen this, it's on YouTube, but it's like, it's all like color saturated

the way it looks in the 50s, you know? Oh yeah. And this guy is dynamiting himself. He built this. stairs up to the front himself. There it is. Look at that thing. That makes me nervous. Look at that thing. Oh, my God. So they got the face done. I worked on the arm, but when this thing is like the arm is going to go all the way out there. Oh, they're doing all that then? Not all of it,

but all the way to the tip. There's going to be, and I think he's, I think he's on a horse. I mean, well, I'll get you a picture of what it's going to look like. Yeah. I mean, that's his last name, horse, right? So you got to have the. Oh, they're doing. doing all that dude it already looks better than the one of that Miami heat guy that they did a years ago remember that one that I think it was Dwayne Wade maybe oh it already looks better than that Dwayne where was that one in Miami yeah I think so or somewhere yeah that's what it's gonna look like when it's oh my god so they're basically gonna turn this place into a straight up gay mecca dude are you do not put the horse dude that horse looks like fucking it got its hair done

with Michael Landon, dude. You cannot. What are they doing? Actually, you know what? Fuck it. Put it up there. Turn it into a damn. I want a damn gay high altitude.

Gay rave, dude. I want people fucking doing poppers up there at 2,000 feet, homie. That's what kind of shit I want. I want people fucking losing their minds and hiding inside of each other's, hiding their hands inside of each other's pockets. You know what you can fit?

on crazy horse's forehead? Let me guess for one second. Let me think this for like 30, maybe eight seconds. I'll give you eight seconds, like a rodeo. What can you fit on his forehead? Yeah. I'll give you a hint. Oh, a Fiat, a car.

Fiat's barely a car, dude. I agree. The answer is Mount Rushmore. No. Yeah. So that's the size difference? Yes. You can put Mount Rushmore on the head.

head of crazy horse. You could put four faces. Yeah. So that's, I mean, this is, it's the ultimate, uh, Sisyphian, uh, quixotic. I love that. Yeah. I mean, it's just, I mean, and the guys, I don't know what it means, but. Well, one is Greek reference.

The other is, um, you know, uh, Cervantes, um, don quix. Don Quixote. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Tilting at windmills. But this guy, I mean, he worked on it, his, it was his, it was his life's, work and he knew with certainty he would never see it finished oh and his kids probably won't either if you have 13 kids they should do it i think you would think but that's easy for me to say do we have any update on the children or any of them in recovery or anything oh no i'll look yeah good don't

what are their names we don't know them no we don't know they don't know they you worked with them i did we don't know kids names we're adults do you freaking crazy god you're a Number nine. Get in here. It's your turn. Get your pickax, buddy. Wow, dude. That's pretty neat.

I'm looking into the mental health of the crazy horse guys, crazy kids. Children. Well, I just want to know if any of them had the ability to get out there and work. I mean, it's just like, I wonder who's still doing it and what their process is. Do they fundraise? I didn't know. I thought when I saw the photo, it was just the same size. I'm like, you wouldn't think it would take 50, 70 years to.

get that done. No, it's massive. Look, this, I don't want to talk out of school because she's a lovely woman, but one of the most alarming things that ever happened to me on a set. And this isn't really a set. This is just us in the Dakota's filming. A woman who's in charge of it is like the fifth daughter. And she's very protective of her dad and the family. And we're there. Our whole crew is there and we're ready to shoot. And I hadn't been weighed and measured yet. Like she hadn't, she wanted to personally vet me. To be up there? Yeah. So we had rigged her Jeep with some cameras because we knew we were going to go for a drive. And so we're ready to start the scene and she gets me in the Jeep and she takes off without the crew. Like borderline kidnapping.

She just runs off with me and she drives me down and around in middle of nowhere. And she's just, she takes me to her father's grave. And we sit there. There he is. Orchak. So how do you say that? Coiski. Yeah.

Zolkowski. Yeah. What a great name. Was her name Monique by any chance? Ah, it might be. That might be. That sounds right. It might be Monique.

Yeah. He died in Sturgis. Probably listening to Kid Rock, I bet. Probably. Do do, do, do, do, do, do, do, do. Dumb. My guest today, Tom Albanyse, is an American giant, and I'll tell you why. Tom understands on a fundamental level that the business of mining is a non-negotiable prerequisite of our civilization and our economic independence, just like the business of making things.

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American giant American made. American giant American made. What's his name? Bob? Bob Richie. Your friends? Yep. Oh, yeah, we are friends. Bob's a very nice guy.

We actually just went to Holokogen's funeral the other day. No kidding. Yeah. Speaking of Terry. Yeah. What was that like? You know, it was a lot of things, man. We didn't stay very long.

wanted to stay longer after, I think. Yeah. You know. Did you know Terry? I knew him. He had come to podcast once. And then I just knew, you know, and I'd seen him two times after that at different events. And maybe we texted a little bit.

Did anyone get hit with a folding chair by any chance? Oh, that would have been interesting. At the funeral? Yeah. Dennis Rodman had a strong moment. I know. He was really, he was pretty heartbroken. Yeah.

by the funeral moment, but at, you know, at the actual service. And, um, his son, Nick got up and made a nice,

like a really cool speech. What you're going to do when Hulk Hogan watches over you, you know, or something like that, like this kind of watching over idea. I thought that was pretty cool. Um, but there was like all my heroes from childhood.

Like not all of them, but a lot of them. Yeah. You know, in wheelchairs and on opioids or whatever. Did you watch a lot of wrestling grow up? Oh, dude. Grow,

grow, Yeah, yeah, because wrestling, dude, wrestling in WA, WWF, it felt like, it felt like, I almost feel like it felt like it felt like poor kids, like it belonged to them. And I don't know if that's a true feeling. It could have just been because in our neighborhood, we didn't have a lot of money and that everybody on our street watched it. Like we would all like be out in the street hanging out and we would all go home to watch it, right? And we loved those guys. Like, I mean, it just felt like even as a kid it gave you somebody to look up to, you know, it's like even if your life fucking. sucked or whatever if some you know if people were just you know just shooting up and just hiding from

each other in the area or whatever that you could watch that and you just felt excited about everything who else was in the the world at that time like when when hulk was at his apex okay was a was Andre the giant was there for sure and then you had like iron chic you had hacksaw jim dug and you had the big boss man you had you still had a little bit of dusty roads you had the steiner brothers he had the Bushwhackers. You had Million Dollar Man Ted DiBiase. He was down there. You had, oh, mouth of the south, Jimmy Hart, Bobby the Brain Heenan.

His daughter was there. That was pretty cool. You had Jake the Snake. You had ravishing Rick Rood, who was kind of like a... Yeah, I remember him. He was a trans or what. I don't know what he was. But he was using something.

He was using Harris Brand steroids, I think. What about The Undertaker? That was later. That was later. Yeah, that wasn't us. Like, I got out of it before that. But you also had NWA. You had, like, Sting.

You had Rick Flair. You had, oh, man, there's so many guys. See, when I was a kid, there was Chief Jay Strongbow. Oh, yeah. The Von Erick's, dude. Yes, yeah. Chuck, see if you can find. Fucking pull it up, Chuck.

Me with the W.E. It was called Halloween Havoc. he'll laugh at this. Sorry to be yelling at you, Chuck. No, it's quite all right. He's used to it, man. Well, we've asked him for some information that he refuses to give us. You just won't give it up. Because it simply doesn't exist on the internet.

It's just not there. Old Epstein Chuck over here, huh? Give us the files, huh? I can't believe pedophiling is becoming a big thing in America now. What do you mean? The government supported or whatever. What do you think? Really?

I mean, I don't know what happened with all that, but it does seem bizarre. Do you think all that stuff is a real? ruse and there was never anything because i mean i've seen had charges against them i mean it's just i think the american people have fucking had it with i think politicians yeah both sides there's a a great phrase in latin and i can't remember it i wish i could make me sound smart but translated it means though the heavens fall and i say let's see it no matter what yeah i want to see it i really do I think you're right. I think that maybe had we not been fed such a line of nonsense for so long on so many different topics,

we might be able to shrug at this and go, whatever. But it's the straw that broke the camel's back. It's like we've been teased with it. And by the way, you're talking about, I mean, that's a real topic. And some real harm has happened to a lot of kids. Yeah. You know, not just on that island, but in general. Right.

So you're telling, it's almost you saying, oh, we don't support this or care about this in a way. That that doesn't mean enough to us. Yeah. And that's fucking crazy kind of. Bananas. Sorry, but that's me 25 years ago hosting a wrestling event. Do you remember what year it was? My God.

No. Halloween. Halloween Havoc. Yeah, Vince McMahon was there. I remember Halloween Havoc. When did Halloween Havoc start? Would you mind looking that up for us? It would be my pleasure.

October 30th. On Halloween, dude. That's your first hit. Start with October, Chuck. And if it's not there, check the portal of Leo or whatever it is. It's going to be up there. The Lions Portal.

It's closed. It actually closed yesterday. No. Damn. So. Give me two more hours. I'll be right there. And if you can't find that.

He's looking at his baby book or something. It's like, what is he fucking doing? Dude, do you have a baby book that your mom made? Oh, yeah. I do. What was that thing? Because my mom made those for us. Is that a big thing that parents still do or no?

I don't have kids. I don't know. You don't have any children? I don't have kids, no. What? No. October 28, 1989. Yep.

Halloween had it. That's about right. And who fought it the first one? Can you check for me? Let's see. Location. Philadelphia. Main event, the Thunderdome Cage match,

Rick Flair and Sting versus Terry Funk and the Great Muta. Oh, yeah. You know who that is? No, sounds Asian. I'm going to go off Asian, you know? Off Asian. What is on Asian? I mean, you know it when you see it.

I'll say that. This is off Asian, brother. I don't even know what we're talking about. Oh, but dude, there was nothing like that. Dude, Terry Fonk, man, what a legend he was. He was also brutal but charming. It was something special about him. I got to end up going to talk to Kevin Vine Eric one time,

and that was pretty amazing. Yeah. last, Von Erich. I'm just realizing talking to you, man. It's like I've been adjacent to a lot of things, but not really in them. I narrated the Ultimate Fighter. I did all the seasons for Ultimate Fighter. Yeah. For Dana White's show? Yeah. Previously

on the Ultimate Fighter. Oh, that's you? Yeah. Yeah. The one that was on Spike TV. And like watching that thing grow as I was doing it, but not in it. It was one of the strangest things. Wrestling was like that for me, too. I was always around it, but never really in it, you know? Right. The contender, do you ever remember that show?

Yeah, I remember the contender. That was good. Yep. So that's just alone and right, um, Sugar Ray Leonard. Yeah. God, that was fun. What show did you like when you were growing up? I remember something that came on that got you just so animated?

Yeah, I do. And I kind of closed the loop on it. It was the Rockford Files. From the park, the murders in the park? No, no. Jim Garner played James Rockford. He lived in a trailer, not far from here in Malibu, and he solved crimes. His dad was Rocky.

His name was Rocky in the thing. Rocky Rockford? Well, his last name was Rockford, so they called him Rocky. Oh, got it. Yeah. Anyway, no, James Garner in the Rockford Files, it was very big in the 70s. That's Jim Garner right there. Yeah, he's great. He drove

1977 Firebird. Jay Leno called me one day and said, hey, come on my show. I'll get you any car you want. And I didn't know if I wanted to think. I said, I want the original car that, you know. He's going to get you a car for going

on there? Well, what you do is you drive around town in the car of your dreams and Jay interviews you. Oh, got it. As you drive. Okay. So I said, I want a 1977 firebird, like the one Jim Rockford drove. He went out and found the original Rockford car, the actual car that's wired for sound that

Jim Garner drove in the show. And he got the guy to come and bring it. And I drove that thing around for a couple hours with Jay. But that was the show that got me fired up as a kid. I can still hear the theme, man. That's pretty good. That's pretty good. He's got it.

Yeah? Yeah. But then it morphs into Sanford's son. Bam, bam, bam, bam, bam. Wai-w-da-wai-up. Wai-da-wai-up. Shut up you. Did you watch something growing up there, Chuckie or what?

No, we weren't allowed television. He was all hand puppets and interpretive dance. That was it. Just me and Danielle in the basement. God. Wishing Terry was there. When's Terry coming back? A tale of two Terry's, dude.

Holcogh and your Terry. Both Terry's. How about that? And acronyms all over the place from E-Burb to what you called the C-W-Rs. C-W-Rs, I think we mentioned even at one point maybe. We did. We did. We did that ASAP.

T-D-D. Or PD-Q. Hmm. BLM. I'll take mine with cheese. Yeah, I like that. Why do you care about the country in a way that surprised me? I don't know.

I mean, I don't know what else I would care about, I guess. I mean, obviously I care about being alive. I care about my family. So people know. Last time we talked, you were wearing an American giant sweatshirt. Coincidentally. And we talked about the fact that I'm friends with the guy who runs that company and a lot of other companies too. And I had no idea you had a thing for making stuff in this country and to the point where it's like, you know, we've been talking about what do you do with your, I don't know, your platform, your influence.

What should we be doing? What can we do to elevate that stuff? Yeah. Well, I think listening to you and hearing about microworks and putting, you know, record. recognizing that, you know, the country is going to, if we start to build a lot of these AI data centers or if those things start to, if we need more workforce, and especially if they're like, like, kicking workforce out of the country or labor force, which I don't know all the technicalities of that. So I'm kind of just speaking like wildly. But, um, you're going to need like people who are trained to be able to do the jobs. And, you know, and you were telling me that you, you guys is program microworks helps do that. Yeah. You're like 500-something people this year? 526, I think, this year with just over $5 million. Which is crazy because I'm not doing anything different, really, than we have in the last 17 years.

But this year we had 10 times the applicants that we did the year before. That's amazing. Yes, I mean, something has happened. And I don't know. I'm super interested. I mean, we were half joking, I thought, about, you know, the. the old QVC days and the Wayne's world set and the idea of like, like why does it have to be a big elaborate thing?

Why isn't there a dedicated network today where anybody who's trying to make a thing in this country can sit down and have a few laughs and show off their wares? You know? No, that to me sounds awesome. I mean, that's kind of what we're talking about. It was like, you know, I think seeing you on QVC and then thinking about like, you know, I just worried that if we get into a space where people, don't have jobs, right? Or there aren't as many opportunities. Just say we do, right? Or even if we don't,

right? Like people, I'm so sick of like corporations making everything and all these conglomerates and stuff. So how do I, if I want to spend my money, how do I spend it to support a family that's across the country, even across town, right? And so then we were kind of talking about, what if we started like kind of a QVC type of show where we did little installments with different people that made a product, right? Families or a person like this guy. I makes, you know, these, you make 700 voodoo dolls a year and they're the best. You know, they got the most dark magic in him or whatever, you know, or this person makes like, you know, goat milk soap or something.

Sure. You had said that there was somebody who made plant pots out of. Cow crap. There you go. Poop pots, yeah. That's Matt Freund in New Canaan, Connecticut. Oh, really? Matt Freund is an amazing musician, too, I think.

Is he? I don't know. Well, let's find out. Chuck will be back in about a half hour with some non-conclusive data. Nothing on the Internet. about music. Sorry. We've looked high and low.

Your fucking things on the use. Computer's not even on. That's not even a computer. How do you spell Freud? F-R-E-U-N-D. Yep, I'll go with that. I believe it's German. Yeah, that was kind of what we were talking about.

Like, well, would it be neat if we started to get, like, find people who were making stuff and interview them almost like maybe it was like antique roadshow style? See, that, I mean, why did you love antique roadshow? What was it about it that made it work? I mean, there's just something damn beautiful about it. I mean, when you see it, Matt Freund, independent singer. Yeah, it's a musician. Yeah.

Doesn't have anything to do with the Matt Freund I'm talking about. Well, he asked if there was a musician named Matt Freud and there is. I proved that there, that he is. Good work, Chuck. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. And then, let me see that antique road show set.

God, that set is just damn beautiful. Because I was up late one night and they had some guy pulled up with a damn rare viny baby. A very rare beanie baby Oh I mean this was just the damn princess Diana one And it was missing part of his tail It's the um I'm asking you because I think it's one of the most underrated Underappreciated formats

Ever Yeah it pays off every 10 minutes Like when you think of it like what is it Where'd you get it? What's it worth? Could be nothing Could be a lot We don't know.

I mean, it's just an hour filled with little cliffhangers. And the people are all just so random and real. Yeah. Right? It's a lot like, did you ever watch this old house? Yes, with Bob Vila? Yeah. Yeah.

Same kind of thing. Like old 70s style production, super simple, nothing flashy. But you got to see like a magic trick every week. We're going to make something that wasn't. there we're going to use skill and material and and it's going to be great oh yeah it's so satisfying i already was smashing chicks too across the country my buddy's my buddy's dad worked with him did he said he was just yam and clam around the world this old cock you feel me sorry that's an old weiner joke but i will say this no i think there's nothing better than if i could say if

if you could be like well okay well how about this we'll just showcase your product and then then if your company can make enough of it or whatever, I guess the products would have to be vetted or the company, the families that are making them. Yeah, yeah. That would be the tough part. That would be the tough part. But then it would be so cool to know that now there's a family that has a business

and they don't have to worry about there. They could, you can start to support one another. Oh, my God, I wish. Look at that. Look at that. Oh, she definitely is going to. That's T for 200. She's getting paid.

Oh, my God. if you drink out of that, dude, oh my, my God, if you rub on that three times, I bet Princess Diana will come back. Shameless plug. Long before she was Peggy Rowe, my mom was Peggy Noble, daughter of Carl and Thelma Noble. It was her father, Carl, who inspired me to pitch a show called Dirty Jobs to the Discovery Channel and later start a foundation that honored the kind of work. Carl Noble did for a living, trade work, skilled labor. That foundation is called MicroWorks, and today

I'm proud to tell you that we've helped thousands of people get the training they need to begin a career in the skilled trades. In fact, we'd love to help you. You can apply for a work ethic scholarship right now at microwworks.org. We've set aside $10 million for this year's applicants, thanks to a number of very effective fundraisers, including the one with my grandfather's name on the label. of course, to Noble Tennessee whiskey, K-N-O-B-E-L, which is now available in a variety of delicious mash bills, all of which you can peruse at Noble Spirits.com. In fact, if you spend $100 and use code Carl, C-A-R-L, you'll get one tube of orange, bitter-infused sugar cubes for free.

That's code Carl with a C to get nine sugar cubes, ingeniously engineered to make nine perfect old fashions every time. It's my favorite way to support microworks and my favorite whiskey to sip responsibly after a long day of interviewing people on this podcast. Pick up a bottle at noblespirates.com. K-N-O-B-E-L-Spirits.com. Soon may the nobleman come to bring a bottle for everyone. One day when the waitin is done, we'll take a drink and go. We may be good right there, Mike, but I would love to talk about that a Mormon and I couldn't think of anybody else that you know you're like the pioneer of that sort of spirit I think um you Paul Revere Gary Seneese wow Paul Revere Gary Seneas and me and maybe um

Aaron Brockovich are kind of like you guys are the kind of Americana Mount Rushmore I think that's very kind of you but look I think that you could actually tip the scale in a way that I that I can't, you know. And look, what I mean is, like, that guy, Matt Freund, I don't know what would have happened had I done a segment for the purposes of helping him sell his poop pots, right? But because we did a segment on a show called Dirty Jobs that was really focused on a dairy farm that was struggling because the bottom fell out of the milk market, and I had read about this guy who was heating his house with cow shit, right? And it was like, that's...

Well, first of all, a guy doing that is a... That is not a good guy. Well, this is 20 years ago, and he's using the whole biodiesel. I don't care. But, but... That's why you're alone fucking... That's fucked up. You're fucking...

Say it again, please. I'm sorry to get upset. He's heating his house. Yeah, of course this guy is, dude. You kidding me? Yeah, this dude is, dude. With... Basically, he woke up one day, Theo, and realized that the crap, his cows were

producing was more valuable than the milk. Wow. So what he did was he started making these flower pots out of cow crap. And so they would, you know, decompose. And it was built in manure. And so your petunias would grow twice as fast. I mean, he wound up crushing it, in part, a big part, because Dirty Jobs showed up and, you know, put him in 170 countries. But I took him on Larry King a year later to tell that story. And then he got his stuff in Walmart. Fuck yeah. But this is why, like, I think you, with your platform, where are we, Chuck?

Are we in the top 200, this little podcast? I would say, is-ish. Yeah, I would say, is. Yeah, I think we're. We get our share. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He's like number four in the world. That's pretty big.

I mean, why not just start with your platform? I mean, probably already have. You mean just having people come on there? Yeah. Yeah, I think it would be. neat, but I think of doing it as something new. Yeah. And I think that seems exciting to me.

I think obviously like, you know, you have met so many people and know, you know a man who's burning shit to stay warm. Oh, well, sure. And by the way, there are three billion people in the world doing that. Do you know that three billion people, their main source of energy, is wood or cow crap? Wow. Done. You know that. Three billion.

Yeah. He was just using science to make it a bunch, you know, a lot more efficient. But my point is, I think there needs to be another, there needs to be an entertaining value to it. Right. And I think you do a great job with that. I think maybe we could find a neat way to do it. I think I just, it would be something fun to do. Yeah.

I think it would be fun to do with you. I think because our audiences are kind of different, but probably have similar spirit. and yeah, I don't know. I just, I want people to be able to, if they want to, to be able to have some of their own destiny in their hands if they can. And that's what my audience, I think, is kind of afforded me. And so that's something that I feel like if I could help create for, or be a part of just elaborating for other people who want to do that,

then I think that I'll be even. with life, maybe. Does that make sense or not? Oh. Did that make any sense it did? Yeah, I thought it made sense. It's not listening. It's hard to know. I know. He's still trying to find Gourchuk. That video of him on YouTube is actually worth

a look. The video of The guy building a crazy horse. Oh. It's just amazing. It just looks like an old wonderful world of Disney video. He's freaking watching Dunkirk. What the heck? That's a good movie. That's a great movie. Yeah, it's probably one of the best movies. Probably the top six or seven

movies past decade or five years. I loved it. What were we just talking about. We're talking about how soon we're going to start that project together, I think. Yeah. Or we should think about it at least. Well. Do you think you have the ability or time to do it?

I know the ability. I think Antiques Road Show, old QVC, right? I mean, I'm talking about like middle of the night QVC. Oh, yeah. Back where you had entertainment that was mostly unintentional, right? But people just kind of just love to see the train. Maybe it's going to go off the tracks. Maybe it's not. And you could buy some stuff along the way, too.

I don't think anything that's so overtly focused on a transaction has the same appeal as potentially you and me talking to somebody, either together or I'm not sure how it would work. But what I know for sure from Dirty Jobs is that the country is filled with people who are doing interesting things. that are making things. Yeah. Right? Making things. So I like that.

The question is, how do you celebrate that? And look, Shark Tank is an answer to that question. Yeah. You can do it with venture capitalists and you can do it in that world. But your set reminded me of like Wayne's world, which I love. And it's like I think there's a super modest lo-fi way. In fact, the bigger, the challenge, like reinvigorating manual, manufacturing, in some ways, the more important it is to come at it modestly, because you could never have a production big enough to fully satisfy that, right?

Right. And if you get it going in the beginning and it's going, well, small, then you could stay smaller, you could expand, but I think you'd have a good idea even instinctually then of what the energy is. But yeah, I just, I really like that. I really like, you know, my mother's a hard worker, right? Like I always say the hardest working man I've ever met is my mother, right? I'm sure she appreciates that. I think she honestly does probably, you know, because she just, you know, she did it herself. And so I think she kind of does respect that. I know she was a woman.

But I do want to say that. What's her name? Her name is Gina. Gina, you did good. Look at your boy here. She's a hard worker. And I always, I do, I have always admired that she's a hard worker, you know. So, yeah, I just think like, yeah, I don't know.

If people can, people want to be able to fend for themselves, it's important to them, you know. And I think it's important to the human spirit. And I don't know. I just feel like, I don't know. I think it could get scary if people can't do that. And I feel like people want to be able to help one another and not just keep giving everything to like these conglomerates that they won't break up. You know what else?

I think people need to see proof that other people found away. Yeah. Whether they do or not, they need to see. Like we're products of, what we listen to and look at. Yeah. Right? For better and worse.

Yeah. What's he doing? What's he looking at? I don't know what he's looking at, but look how he is. He's a product of it. He's watching silent films. We haven't heard from the guy. I am.

I actually am watching a silent film. This is great. Put it right up here. There you go. There's your crazy horse. Yeah, man. This thing, I encourage you to look at it.

His story is so unblank. him that's 60 years ago with a jackhammer. Wow. Starting that thing. That's amazing, man. See, I think metaphorically, this is a good place to start to land the plane because this is what we're talking about doing. If you're talking about reshoring, re-invigorating the trades, or like for me, like closing the skills gap, spoiler alert, I'm not going to do it. I'm going to try, you know.

Right. But it's very much, it's a crazy horse notion. We're not going to finish it. That's all right. Yeah. I think yeah. It's kind of like Band of Brothers, you know. Just because you put it on doesn't mean you have to finish it.

Although it's happened to me before. I literally spent the whole day. The whole day went down the tubes because that came on. I know. And you order DoorDash or whatever and you hope you pick the right food to a company that sort of. What does one dime? on as we're seeing the liberation of France. I don't know. I'll probably go. I usually go with like a fish sticks or whatever kind of.

Not French fries. Two on the nose. Two on the nose. But Mike, thanks. But it would be an honor to try and even think about it together. I appreciate you even just listening to me, even think about that. And I know, and I know we were talking about it together and just like trying to figure out, I think like, but yeah, I think people learn that stuff from you and other people that care that other people can, you know, yeah, We just have, it's the same thing inside of us. We want to be able to fend for ourselves, right? And so like, yeah, if we can figure something out to help support that, I mean, you're already doing it.

But I know that I feel like there's a way that I can do it. Well, there is, man. And I like to challenge the fucking big guy, you know. Rogan? No. No, that dude will fucking put me in his cheek like one of those damn Zen pouches. Who's the big guy? Big business, dude.

Oh, yeah, yeah. Look, big business will, they'll follow. Fuck damn, dude. They'll follow the audience. But look, my audience is what it is. Your audience, what if it was a league of concerned podcasters, an LCP? Mm-hmm. This is how we really land the plane. Back, Theo and Mike form the LCP, the League of Concerned Podcasters.

We get Joe. We get a couple of other likely suspects. and then we target people who are making things in this country. My friend Josh, Montana Knife Company, would be great. Josh Smith. Josh Smith. You know Josh? Yeah, I know Josh. I got two of his freaking knives in my truck.

Has he been on your show? Is he taken easy? No, he hasn't. Why hasn't he been on your show? Because we don't really talk about knives that much. A lot of people are in recovery. You know what I'm saying? One thing at a time.

I don't know if you get a whole group, though. I don't know. I think because when you try to get too many people. No, no. they don't come all, no, no, not all the same time. But if, like, if out of collaboration, you find a guy like Josh, okay, somebody who's capable of scaling. Yeah.

And you say, look, the only thing you don't have is notoriety. The more people have your knives, the more people are going to love them. The more people hear your story, right? And in the end, what can we really do, you and me? We tell stories and we help other people tell their stories. And, you know, getting, it just seems like identifying people who prove that you can still make it here. Yeah. You know?

Yeah. I think that's what this country's founded. And I think it's important. I don't know if that's what this country's found out on. I don't know what I'm talking about with that. But I think that that's important to people. It makes me feel like, I don't know, I just know, you know, you know, when you think this is something that makes you feel like it would keep you excited about life,

seeing some family, you know, do something and make something, and then they have like a thing or whatever. That's conviction, man. Yeah. You're convicted. Yeah. I love that. And you're convicted.

Well, look, man, I'm old. I'm old, man. I'm doing the best I can. But people also need to know that you can grow up on the border of Louisiana and Mississippi. And wind up trying to figure out how do you. use your considerable influence to leave the world better than you found it. Good for you, Theo Vaughn. Yeah. Well, thanks, dude. I feel pretty lucky. I'm just a product of my environment, you know, and a lot of fun people in my life. All I am is just little pieces of them. But I do feel

lucky to get to talk with you, dude. This has been a lot of fun. Glad you're here. And, uh, sorry, me too. Sorry to interrupt your. He was watching silent porn. Dude, he's watching. He's watching fucking highway to heaven. I saw him earlier. I knew he was a Victor French fan when I saw that shirt. I know you got to go, but that's a second oblique Michael Landon reference you've made. What's going on?

I just love him. Can I tell you really fast and not to go? Yeah, yeah. And I'll come back another time. I've had such a great time. Thank you, Mike. You're welcome. I really appreciate it, dude. I really do. Thank you. You're welcome. We had a show in Winnipeg, Canada, and after the show, they this is like one month ago they're like some of the cast of the little house on the prairie is here

because they're refilming the show and I was like I had no idea and I love that show growing up dude I'll fucking beat the shit of somebody who doesn't like it dude unless something's wrong with them and they're mentally unwell and they don't even know if they like it or not but I fucking loved it and uh I got to meet a couple of the actresses one of them is girl Crosby Fitzgerald she's playing the mom in it. Laura Ingalls? Oh, no, she plays Laura's mother. Ma Ingalls, Caroline,

Caroline Ingalls. So anyway, but when I saw her, they introduced you, I fucking, she says, she goes, you hugged me like I was your fucking mother. And I was like, A, I am very sorry. I do not know you, ma'am. But B, I didn't even know that I was going to be like that, you know?

But yeah, that was our show, man. That was that pioneer spirit. Yeah. There it is. There it is. That's all we're trying to reinvigorate. That's all we're trying to do. Mike Ro, thank you so much, Jude.

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