The Weekly Planet - The Hobbit: The Battle Of The Five Armies - Caravan Of Garbage

Episode Date: September 22, 2022

All journeys must come to an end. Some with a whimper. Some with a bang. Some do the cinematic equivalent of dragging the audience through broken glass in the third entry of a trilogy for two hours and twenty four minutes. Which coincidently is the runtime of The Battle Of The Five Armies which sees Bilbo, Gandalf and various Dwarfs/Elves go up against the forces of somebody over something. Thanks for listening to our Caravan Of Garbage review!SUBSCRIBE HERE ►► http://goo.gl/pQ39jNVideo Edition ► https://youtu.be/bJG1okIbHUEHelp support the show and get early episodes ► https://bigsandwich.co/Patreon ► https://patreon.com/mrsundaymoviesJames' Twitter ► http://twitter.com/mrsundaymoviesMaso's Twitter ► http://twitter.com/wikipediabrownPatreon ► https://patreon.com/mrsundaymoviesT-Shirts/Merch ► https://www.teepublic.com/stores/mr-sunday-moviesThe Weekly Planet iTunes ► https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/the-weekly-planet/id718158767?mt=2&ign-mpt=uo%3D4The Weekly Planet Direct Download ► https://play.acast.com/s/theweeklyplanetAmazon Affiliate Link ► https://amzn.to/2nc12P4 Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

FX's The Veil explores the surprising and fraught relationship between two women who play a deadly game of truth and lies on the road from Istanbul to Paris and London. One woman has a secret. The other, a mission to reveal it before thousands of lives are lost. FX's The Veil, starring Elizabeth Moss, is now streaming on Disney+. Will you rise with the sun to help change mental health care forever? Join the Sunrise Challenge to raise funds for CAMH, the Centre for Addiction and Mental Health, to support life-saving progress in mental health care.

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Welcome back, everybody, to another episode of Caravan of Garbage. Now, like the third Hobbit movie, which we've come back around to, Mason, let's make this a really strong opening and then just, I don't know, nothing. We'll do like two good minutes. Yeah, terrific. And then just an extended kind of waffle. Maybe we'll bring in some characters that aren't normally in these videos,

you know, some guest hosts. Yeah, for sure. And people are like, what's this? What's happening? I don't know. Just slap together some kind of narrative. Give us some, we'll bring in some characters that get a lot of screen time,

but they don't have an arc. Oh yeah. For some reason, they're just in it for a bit and then they're gone. We could all get a nemesis that like our own individual nemesis. That's just a vague guy. Okay. We could get an,

an orc each. All right. All right. Just a weirdly mutilated orc that comes at us. And you're like, did we switch orcs a minute ago? Was this the orc I was fighting in the previous movie? This is a different whitish orc.

Anyway, leave a like. It's a long movie, isn't it? No, it's not. Isn't it? Well, it's the shortest of these three. I don't mean as compared. I mean, as compared to other movies. Well, not nowadays, basically.

This movie could have been wrapped up in a webisode. This trilogy. It could have just been delivered to everybody's phones like that U2 album. Remember? Is that the modern landscape of media still? Correct, yes. Great, terrific. Anyways, the modern landscape of media

also demands that people leave a like. But you know what? The first 10 minutes of this, the opening action sequence with Smaug, and look, I forgot he doesn't use the big tower. I think last video I was like, ooh, I wonder if he uses the big tower that they've got. Ooh, I wonder if that big tower's going to come back.

No, he uses his sunners Defying Arrow at the dragon. A more normal thing. A more normal thing. I think that's so cool and so great. And would serve as a perfect finale to the second movie. There should have been two movies and then no more movie. But you're right. Now, the last couple of weeks you've been banging on about how you read a book.

You read The Hobbit. Is this how The Hobbit ends? Yeah. Like second act ends with the dragon and then they just mill around for a while? Well. Just some armies. This movie's called The Battle of the Five Armies. And you'd be like, that might be a bit thrilling.

It's not, is it? No. Not really. It took so long. I'm like, are they sure there's going to be five armies? Well, here's a question for you. Orcs. Yep. That's what I was going Oh, here's a question for you. Orcs. Yep, that's what I was going to ask.

Dwarves? Yeah, orcs, dwarves. Elves? Yep. The townsfolk? Yep, the mens. Is there another set of humans? Well, there's different...

Those big worms that show up, do they count as an army? No, Mason. I'm already lost. Depending on what version or who you believe and whatever, it's the eagles are the fifth one. And there's also some people who say the Orcs are actually in the book. It's like it's two different armies. There's different schools of thought.

And also in the book, which I don't know if you mentioned it or I mentioned it, but I have read it, Frodo Bilbo, the guy. Yeah, the main guy, sure. Sort of the main guy. He was the main guy. He was the main guy, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, for two and a bit movies. But in this one, we've got a couple of main guys. Yeah, the main guy, sure. The main guy. Sort of the main guy. He was the main guy, wasn't he? He was the main guy, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, for two and a bit movies. But in this one, we've got a couple of main guys.

Yeah. We'll get to the other main guys. But if you were going to say something about Frodo or Bilbo? Yeah, he gets knocked out. So you don't see any of the battle. And he does get knocked out in this, but we still see a bunch of stuff happen because there's a bunch of battle.

He gets knocked out. And there's cameramen. There's cameramen. They film all of it, what's happening. Exactly. But in this, we have two other. we have a bunch of other main characters we have thorin comes to the fold again because he's gone he's gone treasure mad yep and he's got to get over that by getting over it he's having a bit of a think and a little dream yeah like a little

golden dream and then he's like now i'm over this he borum is it yeah and we've got another main character in that like that weird boogity guy from the previous one. You know the guy who's like, oh. Yeah, the worm-tongue guy. That guy, and he's all like, I'm going to keep getting my eyebrows touched. Luke Evans is going to be like, hey, go and do this, and then I'm going to subtly betray him, and then he's going to be like, well, actually do this, and I'm going to subtly betray him again.

And everybody's like, I certainly was like, when's this guy going to get his comeuppance? Or when's he going to become a hero? Neither. He doesn't. Nothing happens with this guy. Well, not in this version. In the extended version, he gets thrown from a catapult or something. That's fun. His greed takes over.

Have Stephen Fry be the guy who's like, have him be the guy who's in and out of the movie. Or both of them at least. He was probably too busy filming QI or whatever. He was probably filming QI, Mason. Anyways, yeah, you mentioned Thorin. He's drunk. He's just like, oh, Jesus.

I love gold and I think I've got a headache. I don't know. He's just not having a good time of it. But no, to answer your question from a bit back, like I guess The Return of the King, there's a bunch of stuff that does happen in the book. After the dragon is killed, there's a bit of interplay between there's the Arkenstone stuff and the armies turn up and there's a bit of a battle which we don't see

and then they all walk home and whatever. Various orcs and goblins and dwarves die and then they have a big wrap-up and Bilbo goes home. I was sad when some of the dwarves died. Which ones? I don't know. Name them. I don't know.

I can't and I won't. The sort of blonde one and then maybe another sort of blonde one. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then like the GQ model one. Oh, yeah, yeah. Yeah, that was in love with Evangeline Lilly. I do want to talk about that, Mason. Anyways, I also want to talk about how during the filming of this,

and I think we talked about this in the first video, which feels like a million years ago,ason when we started watching these movies this was shut down peter jackson was like i don't know what i'm doing i don't know how this action sequence is going to work or any of this is going to play out there's no previs i haven't written anything down uh you know i just i look in various states of disheveled during the shooting of this i've drawn i've drawn a diagram of the battle, but it's just a roundabout, and all the armies are at different points in the roundabout, and who goes first?

And they don't have roundabouts in the US, so they'd be confused. They've got stop signs and street lights and traffic altercations, I assume. That's right. So, yeah, he closed it down. He was just like, we're shutting it down. I need to figure this out. And also, apparently, a lot of this is also from like the expanded history of middle earth and maybe some stuff from like return of the king the book as well so they're just so they're just like what have we got oh god

okay um can we put legolas in this i guess he could have been there i guess can you do that weird thing where he video games up those falling falling steps and whatever which does a little defying gravity i mean i get it there the hell is a thing of that. Does a little defying gravity. I mean, I get it. The elf's a fleet of foot and probably have hollow bones or something. There's a moment in, I think, first Lord of the Rings, Lord of the Rings 1, where they're all, like, trudging through snow, and he's just walking on top of it.

He's like, I love being enough, and I'm not cold, and I'm not cold. I think that's a thing I can do as well, not be cold. But, no, you mentioned the dune worms show up. First apparently seen in the video games, but Bilbo maybe mentioned them in passing in the book. He was like, I think there's big worms, but we never see any of that. I keep having nightmares about these big freaking worms

I saw this time. Yeah, exactly. Billy Connolly's there. He's like, hello. I'm not real. I'm a CGI man or whatever. Was he ever on set? Yes. He was. So here's the thing, right? Yes. They'm a CGI man or whatever. Was he ever on set? Yes.

He was. So here's the thing, right? Yes. They got him in makeup. Okay. They filmed it all. And then the official explanation for this, and this is obviously bullshit, is that they thought the Billy Connolly-isms of it all got lost in the makeup.

Oh, I see. So to bring more of him to the forefront. They ping-ponged all his face. Maybe. I don't even know if they did that. But he looks like the way that how, you know, occasionally you'll hit a CGI orc. He just looks different.

He just looks way too different than the others. I don't understand. He looks like some kind of supporting character in the most recent God of War game. Oh, okay. He just looks like a guy who'll maybe sell you a shield or something. Oh, okay. That'd be fun, wouldn't it?

Yeah, yeah. So he's there as well. But whilst all this be happening, there's five five armies and i'm sure people have got the explanation for what officially the five armies are mason because i don't know if you know this mason there's a lot of discourse around middle earth at the moment a lot of people have really fascinating opinions that i'm interested in oh yeah you're just yeah i love it people should leave them in the comments i reckon or, or tweet at you maybe. Definitely. But there's a side mission going on. Not me, though, because I agree with them. Whatever you're going to say, I agree.

Even the racist stuff? No, not the racist stuff. Anyways, on the side quest, Mason, we get basically some original trilogy characters like Christopher Lee pinwheeling about fighting some ghosts. Oh, yeah. So that's happening. They got his, I presume they got his Star Wars prequel

like action figure, like character model, and they're just like, have him do some flips, I don't know. Yeah. If I may, the Wikipedia page for this film says, in the battle between these heroes and Sauron, it says Galadriel defeats him in a duel of wills. Yeah. Does she, or does she just stand up and point?

Yeah, she goes, I'm the girl from the ring now. I hate you. My hair's wet. I don't know how it works, but she sort of does it in the other movies. Oh, like a battle of wills. Yeah, in a way it's a battle of wills, isn't it? And Christopher Lee's like, don't worry, I'll take care of this.

I'm going to follow up with this. I'm just going to see what happens. Don't mind me, wink. Okay, but now you would know, James, of course, because you read the book The Hobbit. Yeah, love it. Does he then go and become corrupted by evil, or was he always evil in the first place?

No, he does get corrupted. Interesting. And that's why when Gandalf turns up and he's like, I'm Christopher Lee now, bitch. I'll kill you. I'm the white wizard now. What do you think of that? So yeah. So he was originally supposed to be a good guy, but wizards like all things in Middle Earth and not the Harry Potter universe, they have free will.

You know what I mean? That's terrific. And they can choose to be evil if they are so inclined, which Christopher Lee did. So, you know, that's great. Anyone else is free Will Mason? What's that? You're a big Lee Pace looking elf and yet you're riding a big elk and he beheads six orcs at once.

Do you remember that? I do remember that, yeah. That's a cool thing that he does. And another cool thing that he does is come around on a love story. He's like, I hate love and don't do it. Don't do it. I don't want to see any of that. Then at the end he's like, nah, it's all mean he's dead now so yeah cool i like it yeah i would

have i would have allowed this actually now that now that it cannot possibly go forward i think it's cool apparently the love don't go look at any other dwarves though i don't know if i'd think that was cool you'd never find one this pretty by the the way. Just FYI. I've seen a lot of them. Ugly as hell. This guy's a solid seven. That's as good as you'll ever get in the dwarf realm. But apparently this whole love story thing was a studio note. Yeah, of course.

Like we need something to. Well, didn't Evangeline Lilly sign on to this trilogy because she was assured that she wouldn't just be given like a romantic foil kind of role that's right actually yeah yeah she was like i'm gonna be in this to be a warrior yeah i don't want to have a romantic subplot sort of just shoehorned in and they're like and now you you've signed on you have no real say in this because the machine will destroy us all if we if we don't go along with this yeah yeah yeah uh yeah you get're going to have to have a boyfriend. That's right.

But Mason, at least it was real. Do you remember they all agree it was real? The love was real. The love was real, yeah. Yeah, that's great. That's really good stuff. Now, here's something that's come up a few times in these movies, and people take great umbrage with it, Mason. Oh, Dolores Umbridge.

Yeah, maybe in a way. So the Uruk-hai in the original Lord of the Rings, and I've said that right. They're like the orcs, but bigger and scarier. Yeah, and they're like mixed with men. They're a big deal, right? Sure. Because they've been mixing with men. Sure, sure, sure.

And so they're bigger, they're stronger, they're fleet of foot mason. Of course. And also they can move in sunlight. And that's a big deal because most orcs, they like, they squirrel away in caves, you know, and then during the daytime they scatter. I see. Whereas these movies, when does the battle take place? That's a great question. Winter.

I mean, yeah. On account of all the snow. What time of day? I mean, just day, I guess. Yeah, just day. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So it's a little kind of like, why is this happening? Why are there so many orcs out in the sunlight?

Do you remember even in the Two T towers when the sun comes over the hill? And they're all like, ah! But here they're just like, they're out and about. Now, I looked into this. Go on, yes. Because I like my Middle Earth lore, and I like people correcting me on things. You sure do. But apparently, it's they can go out in sunlight, but they really just don't like it, and they

get really disorientated and whatever. So considering all of that. Oh, what a brilliant piece of continuity from Tolkien there. I just don't like it and they get really disorientated and whatever. So considering all of that. Oh, what a brilliant piece of continuity from Tolkien there. I just don't like it. Not a fan, really. I will say this, though. I like Thorin's arc of he just gets over it, but then he has a big fight. And I don't mind that fight with the white orc and it's trying to hit him

with the thing or whatever. And, you know, they're balancing on the ice and he just picks up that rock and he's like here you go you know have this rock idiot yeah then he goes through the thing

how does he jump out of the water it's neither here nor there that's not important but I think that whole thing is like it's a pretty it's a pretty it's a clever thing to

do throw him the rock followed by the dumbest thing you could possibly do which is just like stand over that orc that's under the water and be like no way you could kick off the

bottom there I reckon I reckon this ice is too thick for him to stab me through the ice into the foot i think i'm pretty confident about that so that's good but the ending of this though apparently they wanted uh vigo mortensen which is how you pronounce his name yes sure to show up as aragon right because there's a hint towards him when they say like hey go and see aragon legolas can you go and see aragon to connect these movies to the next movies? Isn't he a man, though? Yeah, he's a man, but he lives a really long time.

In Lord of the Rings, he's like 80-something years old or whatever. He looks great. Yeah, he does look great. You're right. And I think that's cool, but he had the sense to be like, these obviously aren't very good and I don't want to do it. Really? Not even for like one second?

He doesn't really do that kind of stuff. I mean, think of the things he's done post Lord of the Rings. He did the horse race desert movie. Sure. And he's done like some Eastern European gangster movies or whatever. Sure, sure, sure. But he's mostly just like... As women, our life stages come with unique risk factors,

like high blood pressure developed during pregnancy, which can put us two times more at risk of heart disease or stroke. Know your risks. Visit heartandstroke.ca. FX's The Veil explores the surprising and fraught relationship between two women who play a deadly game of truth and lies on the road from Istanbul to Paris and London. One woman has a secret. The other, a mission to reveal it before thousands of lives are lost. FX's The Veil, starring Elizabeth Moss, is now streaming on Disney+. Will you rise with the sun to help change mental health care forever? Join the Sunrise Challenge to raise funds for CAMH,

the Center for Addiction and Mental Health, to support life-saving progress in mental health care forever? Join the Sunrise Challenge to raise funds for CAMH, the Centre for Addiction and Mental Health, to support life-saving progress in mental health care. From May 27th to 31st, people across Canada will rise together and show those living with mental illness and addiction that they're not alone. Help CAMH build a future where no one is left behind. So, who will you rise for? Register today at sunrisechallenge.ca.

That's sunrisechallenge.ca. Just not doing any of that. I think you just made a bunch of money on Lord of the Rings and just went, I'm just going to hang back, I think. Does this mean I have to get another tattoo? If I come in and do this one scene in the Hobbit, are you going to make me get another tattoo? Because I'm...

Not into that. Yeah. Of course, we get the moment where Ian? Because I'm... I'm not into that. Yeah. Of course, we get the moment where Ian McKellen clears a pipe for a really long time. Did you see that bit? No. He sits next to Frodo or Bilbo, and he's just like... How did you not see this?

I guess I disassociated. It's like a minute long. No, I think my brain Disappeared from my body For a while there This is a This is a long movie James I know you said It's not long

But I don't believe you This movie went forever But apparently also This scene that you Definitely remember They did have some dialogue But it was like Ian McKellen's last scene

And Peter Jackson Was just like Let's just have them Sit down and just have A moment of silence So we can all think about What we've done here For sure Yeah And I I enjoy the bit I guess and was just like, let's just have them sit down and just have a moment of silence so we can all think about what we've done here.

For sure. Yeah. And I enjoy the bit, I guess, where at the end of the movie, Ian McKellen bangs on the door and he's like, get out here, we're doing Lord of the Rings. Sure, yeah. Get your boots.

Or you don't wear boots. I don't know. Get a satchel or whatever. Get your ring. I know you didn't lose the ring. I know. Not stupid. You stupid little hobbit. Lost the ring.

As if you'd lose the ring. You'd never lose that ring. No. No way, man. And then Thorin is buried with the Arkenstone. Oh, yeah. That's important. What did it do?

What did it do? Yeah. It's really nice. You didn't think it was nice? I mean, I did think it was nice. Yeah. Do you think it would send you mad? With how nice it is? Yeah. I reckon I'd be above it do? Yeah. It's really nice. You didn't think it was nice? I mean, I did think it was nice. Yeah. Do you think it would send you mad? With how nice it is?

Yeah. I reckon I'd be above it all, actually. You'd take it to like a cash converters and maybe get $600 for it or something. Oh, yeah, for sure. Straight from PlayStation 5. Or on eBay or something. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I reckon I wouldn't be driven mad by it, and I reckon I wouldn't be corrupted by the ring.

Yeah. Yeah, I reckon I'd just be, you know. Yeah. I reckon I'd just hold the ring in my hand, I'd take it out and chuck it in, you know. Yeah, okay. And if anybody's trying to stop you on the way, just be like.

I'd slay him. Oh, would you? Yeah, with a sword, I reckon. Oh, okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay, well, that's cool. Yeah, I think so. I wish you were in these movies.

You'd be over a lot quicker, wouldn't I? Well, not only that, I just think it would be just what a grand adventure. Yeah. To see you milling about in the universe, just not being fussed or affected by anything in it, not getting hungry, your hair's always dry.

Yeah, sure. And coiffed. I'm loving it, Mason. Anyways, I do want to talk about the original version, the Del Toro version. I've just brought a bunch of snacks from the gas station. Does anybody want M&Ms? But before we do that, before we talk about the original version,

let's talk green trivia, Mason. Let's do it. Billy Boyd. Who did? He played one of the original Hobbits. Nice. He was Mary Andor Pippin, Mason. That's terrific.

I love Mary Andor Pippin. He co-wrote and sings the song The Last Goodbye over the credits. That's lovely. Great. This is actually Christopher Lee and Ian Holm's final movie. Christopher Lee, of course, passed away in 2015 at age 93, and Ian Holm in 2020 at age 88. Oh, good runs.

Stunning innings. Here we go. The Elk. Between them, they killed a whole bunch of Nazis. They did, didn't they? Just fun. Together? No, I don't know. I think it was mostly Christopher Lee. I'm go. The elk. Between them, they killed a whole bunch of Nazis. They did, didn't they? Which is fun. Together? No, I don't know.

I think it was mostly Christopher Lee. I'm just averaging it out. Okay, sure. Well, I guess between me and Christopher Lee, we've also killed a bunch of Nazis, right? Yeah, same. Yeah, yeah. So the elk on which Lee Pace,

Thandrel rides, it's actually played by a horse named Moose. Makes sense. Yep, yep, yep. Horrible as well. I don't think we're really circled back to the elves in general. Get fucked. Awful. You don't like them? No! They're rude and hoity-toity

in their stupid cloaks and their long hair. I don't like them, Mason! I'd probably give them a piece of my mind. Yeah, if I was in Middle Earth. So you're rude and I don't like your clothes. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, this is great. You probably remember this,

but when Viggo Mortensen kicked the helmet in the two towers, you've probably seen this footage, he actually broke his toe in the process, but he stayed in the scene in doing that. So that scream is real, that scream where he screamed, Blue Harvest. That was the real anger and pain that he was feeling. And because of that, that became those words screamed Blue Harvest. That was the real anger and pain that he was feeling. And because of that, those words, Blue Harvest,

became the working title for not only the original Star Wars, but also this movie, Mason. That's great stuff. Isn't it just? The dummy. The Gandalf dummy that's being carried. Remember that? Oh, sure.

When Gladriel's like, Just picks him up like he's a, God damn, I'm strong. Look at me. She's strong as me. And I think she's got the that's being carried. Remember that? Oh, sure. When Gladriel's like, God damn, I'm strong. Look at me. She's strong as me. And I think she's got the ring powers or whatever. Not the ring ring, like the girl from The Ring. Oh, I see. Sure, sure, sure.

Yeah, yeah. The dummy was actually called Michael Gambon because he plays the other wizard in those other movies. Sure, sure, sure. Both of which I've forgotten the names of off the top of my head. I told you these would beat her out, Mason. And I don't know if you saw this as well. There's some behind-the-scenes footage of Legolas

as played by the guy who plays Legolas. Are you familiar with the Hobbits of Going to Isengard theme or whatever? Hobbits of Going to Isengard or whatever. Absolutely not. It's like a techno remix. Absolutely not, no. Anyway, it was a thing for a time and he Absolutely not. It's like a techno remix. Absolutely not, no. Anyway, it was a thing for a time and he sings it. That's terrific.

Let's talk about the Guillermo del Toro version, Mason. Okay, now this is the one that he was going to do, but then he's like, ah, nuts to this. He was going to do it so much that he put in 18 months of pre-production, but then he left. He said, I can't do this anymore. This is taking too long. But I think that's not true. I think his vision of what it was clashed with what the studio wanted

and he was thrown out. Interesting. I suspect because there's a whole lot of politicking behind all of this, Mason. Yeah, yeah, yeah. We talked a bit about it with the union staff and whatever and Peter Jackson came on board potentially to keep these movies in New Zealand. There's a whole lot of things going on. And GDT would have just wanted to make all the characters real yucky.

That's right. Yeah, that's what he does. He makes everybody sticky and yucky. All their eyes are on their hands and whatever. Yeah, right, and vice versa. Exactly. So what he planned to do. What if the elves were yucky, he said.

And they're like, GDT, you have gone. You've gone a bridge too far. Exactly. So his original plan was for a single movie, a single The Hobbit movie, if you can imagine such a thing. I cannot at this point, no. And then a movie that bridges The Hobbit to Lord of the Rings. Then it became An Unexpected Journey and There and Back Again,

two movies. The first one would have chronicled Bilbo's full adventure, the whole thing, from when he leaves his house to when he gets knocked out and then it's over or whatever. Also skip the army stuff. Yeah, yeah, probably. Yeah, right, right. Just a black title card that said,

then there was a battle you would not have believed in. You're the shit bricks. And the next one would have covered Gandalf's adventures. So you know he does his little side mission. Yeah, sure, sure, sure. So that makes sense. And the idea was also, for him him was it begins with like a golden age of Middle Earth and it slowly descends into the horrible kind of like

Sticky and Yucky. Sticky and Yucky universe, which then morphs into the Peter Jackson Lord of the Rings movies. Also, some of his original casting was that he wanted Ian Holm to reprise the role fully, completely. Sure, sure, sure. The entirety of the movie. Brian Blessed was also going to play Thorin.

Oh, that would have been good. I kind of love that. I mean, I think Richard Armitage does a really good job, but Brian Blessed, he was boss Nass. That is true, yes. Also, it would have been like more dwarves, you know? I don't know. We talked about the Lindsay Ellis videos last week where she spoke to one of them,

and they were so shoved aside that by the end, they weren't invited to the premiere, the Los Angeles premiere. They were like, oh, we can't fit you in there, sorry, even though you're in these movies. So one of them reached out on Facebook and was just like, hey, sorry to all the fans, we're not going to be there. And then the studio quickly turned around and was like, hey, what are you so rude for? Fine, you can come, I guess.

And then nobody talked to them, apparently. That's fun, isn't it? Nobody from the studio, I should say. I think it's not fun. Yeah, I agree. So, I don't know, I think studio interference wrangled Peter Jackson into this. They strong-armed him into it,

and then they very slowly wrestled it away from him and, like, stretched it out i assume right and i think in doing so it just broke him because he hasn't directed a movie since like he's done like a few documentaries he did that beatles thing recently that's right but he hasn't done a project he certainly hasn't done a hobbit movie since then has he no he hasn't and that was that was his that was his. Yeah. Just endlessly doing Hobbit movies for such a long time. Apparently Amazon very briefly got in touch with him about the new show and then they just stopped.

Hello, Peter, this is Amazon. Click. That was brief. They told us he would be brief. So, yeah, obviously that didn't end up happening. But I guess the question is to you, Mason. Go on. Was this worth it?

You know, it's 250 plus days of shooting, at least as long as The Lord of the Rings. They were made again in New Zealand and it helps bolster, you know, their economy in terms of tourism. They made a fun little, you know, in-air safety video that they always do and Taika Waititi's in it. He's a wizard and whatever, you know, and they get some cast to come back and go,

oh, Middle Earth and New Zealand and whatever. Is that worth it to you? Nah. No? Nah. Well, what about this, though? Cost $250 million. We're talking box office mason.

But it only made $940 million, which is slightly less than the last one. But that's still nearly a billion dollars. It sure is, actually. Obviously, this was well worth their time and effort and splitting this into three was financially a smart decision yeah for sure but you know critically commercially the time that so many people have sunk into watching this or say editing a video together ben and lawrence maybe other people don't think

it was necessarily worth it you know yeah absolutely yeah final thoughts i probably could have done without this one. Yeah? Yeah, I reckon. Just the dragon bit then. Or not even? Yeah, no. Just imagine the destruction. That's a power move, just to do the dragon bit.

You go and you buy your tickets, you sit in the cinema and you're like, why is there another session like 15 minutes after this? What's going on? And then it just ends and it's like, yeah, we got that dragon, we got them good. I probably would have gone to see the dragon bit for a half-price ticket. I'll see that in cinemas. It's more than full price.

Nah. Yeah. Because they know you've got to see it. I guess they do, don't they? I remember sitting in the cinema watching this and just wanting to crawl out of my skin. Which bits? Just after the dragon dies.

And then it just keeps going and going and going. And bits? Just after the dragon dies. And then it just keeps going and going and going. And again, having read the book, a lot of this stuff is in the book. It's just way more interesting in a book. Because of the theatre of the mind? Theatre of the mind, I imagine. That's got a lot to do with it. Is the elf dwarf romance in the book?

No. Yeah, I thought that would be it. There's no women in those books, Mason. I mean, they mentioned some in passing. We've heard about women, they say. And the one who kills the big flying lizard ghost man. Look, I don't want to lean too heavily into gender stereotypes, but if there were any women involved, they'd be like, seriously, you going on this trip?

Are you serious? Just settle down. You don't need this freaking stone, all right? Yeah, you're probably right. Just watch the telly. Yeah, watch the telly. Yeah. Anyways, Mason.

Go on. Do you know this? I don't know yet. We have a podcast called The Weekly Planet. I did know that. Yeah, you can listen to it. It's pretty good, I reckon. And we have our own private Patreon called Big Sandwich

where we do bonus things and there's early things. Very true. If you want a little taste of that, you can go. We were on a little break for the last month, and we put some of those episodes into our regular podcast feed. So if you want to check those out, you can do that. Yep. Or sign up.

I just pay immediately. Sure, yeah. Don't think about it. Just pay immediately. Exactly, yeah. Does everybody, though, want a hint for next week? I can't hear you. Does anybody?

James, there's no one here. Have these shattered my perception of reality? Yeah, I'm not even really here. Oh, wow, okay. Yeah, you called me up and you're like, Maceo, can you click? Anyways, okay, here's the hint towards next week. Hulk stuff, Maceo.

We're doing those two Hulk movies. We're doing Hulk stuff. Yeah, happy with Hulk stuff? Yeah, I guess Ang Lee is Hulk. Yeah, and then the other one. My goodness. And the other one, I'm one of them. I've seen those in ages.

People forget. People are forgetting Incredible Hulk is a Hulk movie. People remember the Ang Lee Hulk more than the regular Hulk. Do you think so? The Incredible Hulk. Interesting. Anyways, as mentioned, if you do want to see that early, bigsandwich.co.

And let's all never talk about this ever again. All right? Let's all agree. You think that's an option? How long do you think the window is before we have to start talking Hobbit stuff again? No, no. The discourse is around the newer thing.

People hate that now. You know? Or upset about it. No, no, the discourse is around the newer thing. People hate that now, you know, or are upset about it. Yeah, that's true. At the risk of getting piled upon from the episodes I've seen, I think it's pretty good.

Why did I say that? There's still the option to cut it out, James. Yeah, but I didn't, did I? No. Yeah. All right, thanks, everybody. I grabbed that gem, you guys.

We'll see you next week. Goodbye. I liked the bit where she ran off the sword, jumped off the sword and killed the troll in the Lord of the Rings. You know what? My favourite part of this last movie, I think, is the bit where Luke Evans...

Are we still recording? I don't know. It's the bit where Luke Evans sees that his kids are in danger from the big orc kind of thing, and he's like, I'm going to roll a mine cart at it. Hey kids, duck. Yeah.

Duck. You're taking a real big chance that they don't just go what? And they're killed immediately, which is what a kid would do. A kid would absolutely do. What are you saying? Dad? What?

I want ice cream. I'm dead. You're like, you don't have a, again, the wife, if the wife were there, she'd be like,

don't even if, even if the kids had survived, she would have been like, excuse me, you did what you drove you drove a what at my children what is wrong with you uh goodbye everybody bye fx is the veil explores the surprising and fraught relationship between two women who play a deadly game of truth and lies on the road from Istanbul to Paris and London.

One woman has a secret. The other, a mission to reveal it before thousands of lives are lost. FX's The Veil, starring Elizabeth Moss, is now streaming on Disney+.