The Wolf Of All Streets - Bitcoin Gets Rejected At $112k! Will September Remain Bullish?

Episode Date: September 4, 2025

Bitcoin is fighting to avoid its long-standing “Red September” curse, closing the month in the green for the third straight year. At the same time, BTC’s current “boring” stability is making it more appealing to Wall Street, with institutions increasingly viewing it as a reliable store of value rather than just a speculative asset. On the policy front, trading firm Wintermute is pushing the SEC to classify network tokens as non-securities, warning that mislabeling them threatens innovation and U.S. competitiveness. Together, these developments highlight a shifting landscape: Bitcoin is becoming steadier and more institutional, while the regulatory debate over tokens continues to heat up.

The Bitcoin monthly candle is currently green for September, but it's only been about three or four days. And price just got rejected at a key level around 112. Now, we know that September is a historically bearish month, but 2023 and 24 both had green September. Should we be paying attention to this seasonality or just look at the chart and think with our rational brains about all of the tailwinds that the Bitcoin and crypto industry have in the United States here to all of that and way more is my friend is Sean by Donnie from scribe we're going to get into it right now let's go good morning fine people of the wolf pack if that's a thing don't know

if that's a thing don't know but it is third Thursday morning here. It's 9 a.m. and the summer doldrum seemed to have continued slightly into the first week here of September. But as always, because crypto has become mainstream, we have a lot to talk about. I've got my good friend, Ishaun, here to do it with me. Good morning, man. How are you? Yeah, dude, great, man. How about yourself? I am, I am well. We got a lot going on. Sean and I have a lot going on behind the scenes that maybe you guys will hear about soon, but wanted to bring on him on the show because he's, he's a lot. He's an awesome guest and has incredible insight. And, you know, if you guys are wondering his credentials and how I first heard about him, it was a long time ago, I'm going to take back the OG right here, man. I'm sorry.

John was the first person that I saw very, very publicly on X, not only say that he was super bearish on FTX ahead of the collapse, but that he was going to massively short the token. So I saw a lot of scam, Bankman, freed, and FtX as a fraud. You were the first person that I saw very. openly in a one of 20, you know, thread here, say, I'm shorting the hell out of this broken thing and they are going under. So maybe we should start at your spiky senses on FtX. Yeah, yeah, and for context, that was probably October. I think it was early October. Over 5th or something,

I think, yeah, exactly a month before everything went down. Yeah, I think I've just kind of, I think when you trade markets, it's important to just have a little bit of like pieces of the puzzle around a thesis. And when you start to get that little like spitey tingle or, you know, I've always been a big gut guy. And I think gut is just kind of like a culmination of things that maybe you're not able to articulate. And so, you know, you start to see all these different spiky sense kind of things, right? Top executives leaving and losing market share to on chain derivatives and, you know, the amount of money that they're spending. And you start to put all the pieces together. And then that gives you kind of the impetus to dig in a little bit. And then once you

started to dig in, it became a little more obvious. And so, yeah, then that led to a short that went okay. Uh, and, uh, yeah, much lower than almost zero in this market, but hey, you know, uh, yeah, I think you still might get the occasional pump on FTT every once in a while, but yeah, I think it sells like a $250 million market cap or something. Yeah, like that, which just absolutely boggles my mind. Yeah, I know a lot of founders who would kill just for that. Um, but yeah, going from a couple billion, uh, to, to, uh, 250 million. And yeah, it wasn't a bad trade in retrospect. So, I mean, you were at a fund.

You were trading your own money. You've been through basically every iteration of the trading journey and then ended up at media and PR. Yeah, not your traditional, you know, journey. But I think, you know, my kind of thought has always been just like, look where the inefficiency is in the market. And so, you know, at one point the efficiency was trading. I think there's a lot of really great traders. I think crypto is a pretty efficient market. I generally have this thesis that crypto is where the frontier of market efficiency is going

to be just because there's the lowest barriers, there's the lowest latency. And so crypto will always push the highest levels of market efficiency. So I think things that you see happen on chain are going to solely trickle into like traditional media and traditional mind like trading mindset in the future. But it's always just about like finding where the inefficiency is and finding, you know, where you can kind of leverage your skill set. And I think at one point it was trading in the trenches and doing defy and defy summer. And then later it was kind of, you know, building, you know, media and media relations in a

marketing company. And, you know, in the future, you know, God knows what else, man. Yeah. So let's talk about what's going on the market now. As you said, you always kind of as a trader with that mentality, you create a thesis, you build on that thesis as you start to really see something coming and then you act on it. So obviously we have our title here. Bitcoin rejected 112K, well, September remain bullish.

We take a look very quickly. I mean, Bitcoin set to beat red September dip for third straight year. It's literally September 4th. So like sometimes I just don't know where these stories come from. But to the point, right, we have September, as you can see, until 2022, there are only two green September's literally ever. Now we have a 4% up 23 and a 7% up 24. Interestingly, when I read through this, they were floating the ETF approval as the reason.

that we've had green september's but last i checked there was no etiap in 2023 so i don't know once again i don't know where these people get their ideas but you know we had we kind of survived the summer which uh was better than i think most would anticipate now we're an environment where people are watching the fed for rate cuts they're watching all of the legislation and regulation that's coming and bitcoin treasury companies right and this kind of sustained non-stop bid so you can dig into any of those and we can just take a bunch of directions here i want to thinking for the fall yeah i'm more of a fundamentals guy personally um and so i like to look at things from just like a fundamental basis and fundamentally i'm pretty bullish um you know i think range bound is good um not that

i'm super big of a chart guy but i think you know like when numbers go up significantly i think it's important to consolidate and i think we're in this like 108 to like 1 15 kind of consolidation range, which I think is good. And I think it gives you a cool opportunity to just like, I don't know. I think like general sentiment has been like, we'll get to 115 and everyone to be like, oh, we're going to a million bucks. And then that's probably a good time to like, you know, take some exposure off. And then we'll get down to 108 and everyone will be like, oh, it's so over like we're going to zero. And that's probably a good time to put some longs on. And so that's always good. But I think structurally from a fundamental perspective,

I think the debt inflows are just like incredible. I mean, Scott, you and I talked about this. like you and I are both seeing so many deaths come and go. Companies now hold a million Bitcoin. So that's a really shitty math if they think that's 5% of the total supply. And I think there was 20 million Bitcoin. Yeah. I think three percent almost five percent, you know, almost four point something percent since there's 21 million.

Now it's probably like eight or nine percent of the actual supply if you consider lost Bitcoin, but it's just hilarious to me when I read things like that. But yeah, a million Bitcoin in treasury companies. And we know that most of them have not even gotten the green light to start buying yet. Yeah. And I think that's like Bitcoin is one. But like you look at Ethereum, which is like what a third of the market cap just about. And you look at like, I mean, from what I've seen and what I've heard, I think there's probably about 15 Ethereum Dats that are coming in the next month.

I mean, the inflows are going to be incredible. And all of these guys are raising between, you know, 200 to like a billion. and then there's your current debts that are continuing to raise capital. And then you're also starting to see like the alt debt, right? You saw Athena do one, but then you're seeing, you know, I've seen some finance ones that are going around, which I think is like one of the better ones to kind of do. There's an avalanche one. There's a few avalanche ones that are coming around.

And so you're starting to go further and further out of the risk curve, but just giving public market exposure to more. It makes so much sense, by the way. I had a conversation. It was yesterday or two days ago on spaces with David Namdar, which is the, you know, B&B treasury company that actually we were kind of doing some stuff with here and you just can't get exposure to B&B as an American. So like, you know, like you know, everybody can buy Bitcoin at this point. There's a lot of these assets. B&B actually is a really unique for a treasury company right

now because it's kind of like micro strategy was for Bitcoin before they were ETS. Exactly, right? You can't get exposure to it. Yeah. It's like what better. I mean, crypto has always done exchanges really well. You're talking about the number one exchange in the world with the largest market share and no one can get exposure to it. And so that one's always going to be great. And so you have this like structural underlying bid of majors. And if majors go up, I mean, I'm not a, you know, I'm not a big, I'm not super excited about the alt market, but I do think that's going to create pockets of outperformance and

alt's right. So like, you know, I, in 2021, there was always a look for where's the beta? I think a lot of the beta subsided just because there's so much in the market, right? There's just like millions of alts now versus then there were maybe thousands. But I think there's going to be some pockets where, you know, you see Ethereum start to get a crazy bid. Okay, well, like, you know, a lot of the growth of Ethereum then leads to growth for Athena, right? Through the basis trade and through the stake deed that they hold and things like that. So then that's going to be really strong for Athena.

And so Athena is going to get a pocket of outperformance. AVE, you know, you have a lot of these dats that are looking to go further out on the risk curve and deploy in defy. And so a lot of what they're going to do is they're going to chase yield on AVE, right? And they're going to do looping and stake deed looping and things like that. So that's going to lead to a pretty good bid for ABE because their TBL is going to grow. So I think there's going to be some really interesting pockets of all outperformance. But I think structurally, you throw a dart and everything goes up. Yeah.

Yeah, I hope not. Right. Like I just don't think that's, there's just not enough capital in the world for just like there to be a million alts that all go up 10 to 20% every day like there was in pastful markets. Like the amount of capital you need for that for, you know, know, a bunch of alts to run from 50 million to 100 million from 100 million to 250 million. The capital size is just too large now, but there's going to be some really, really good pockets if you can kind of look and skate to where the puck is going. Let's talk about the treasury companies.

You and I have joked about this on many occasions, privately. Obviously, it's kind of a great thread here from Mark Moss, who was the person when I walked into Bitcoin conference in Vegas who said Bitcoin treasuries are the next thing to me. He was like, there's, and I was like, wow, I got pitched 20 of these things in the first 10 minutes. I had no idea this was all coming. But to his point, they've sold off here 50, 80% over the last 10 weeks. And there's a great thread here from grain of salt, basically talking about how these will almost inevitably, unless the mechanics change traded a discount. Like, which is funny because there's a sentiment that if you buy enough Bitcoin, you're going to have this multiple to nav and people are going to want to pay a premium for your stock as if we never saw GBTC happen.

which had its own mechanics by the way because you couldn't redeem so that made a lot of sense but i mean that thing was training at a 50% discount to the net asset value of the underlying bitcoin so maybe the proper way to frame this is do you think these are a risk or a boon so i think it's actually like a really really nuanced conversation right like i think people just like to like throw the big umbrella on it and it's like they're all going to fall they're all going to compress like um i'm super bearish on mnav right um but i think like what strategy did for bitcoin is really interesting right where like you have a company that has some cash flow and you're going to take a bunch of money and you're going to buy bitcoin then you're going to raise more

money buy bitcoin raise more money by bitcoin right and then bitcoin is just like this treasury asset for everything right and then you're issuing bonds in order to buy more bitcoin and and like i think that is an interesting strategy right and but if there's no underlying cash flow that becomes really hard because there's absolutely nothing like and and most sophisticated traders are either going to a you know just by the underlying themselves or b they're going to do what we talked about which is they're going to long the underlying and short the the treasury company right and to try to compress mnav right and and get bitcoin outperformance right and that's a trade you can put on in size and you can put that on in you know with like with leverage too at least like a little bit and so and so that's not

good for the underlying, or sorry, that's not good for the treasury companies themselves. I think the Ethereum treasuries are, I find a little more interesting because of the yield generation. And then the use of defy and restaking. And so you can see a world where, you know, you have a three to four percent LST yield that you're getting from staked ETH. And then you're using that to maybe loop it up a little bit or, you know, in defy or you're restaking it and things like that. And then you start to see like a seven or eight percent yield. I mean, like a seven or eight percent yield on a billion dollars, it's like 70 million dollars a year in EBDA or I mean, not EBTA, but in total revenue. I mean, that plus a underlying that's going up. And obviously

Ethereum being a, you know, kind of what, 400 billion dollar asset gives it a lot more room to grow versus a billion dollar treasury company is a much bigger deal for Ethereum than a billion dollar treasury company is for Bitcoin. Exactly. Exactly. And, and, you know, and I think it's going bring more institutions on chain, which I think creates like this really interesting flywheel where it's like more people are holding ETH, more people are doing things in the on chain ecosystem with ETH. So the fundamentals for EIT look better because total TVL looks better and total TVL and DEFI looks better. And then, you know, and they're getting more yield and it's getting more people involved, which leads to more people buying more ETH and more treasury companies, etc. And so I think and it just kind of spreads the gospel, right, of just like the Tom Lee gospel, right? Where, you know, Ethereum is like the future of Wall Street and all finance is going to happen there. And I think that is a really interesting story. I think the Solana one is a little less interesting just because of the tokenomics of Solana and the inflation and like the sustainability of that yield, I think is a different story.

But if you're like a Salana staker, I mean, shit, like it's awesome for you, right? I mean, a Solana treasury company can passively earn 9%. Yeah. It's an incredible. But I think there's like a lot more nuance there with the kind of tokenomics versus and the inflation of Solana rather than Ethereum, which is like, you know, as long as the burn is there, it's going to continue to stick around 120 million-ish. And so, if not less, depending on how much it's being used to defy.

So I think, again, structurally and fundamentally, I think that's are really good. And then there's like the big kind of elephant in the room, which is like a rate cut. And so if we get a cut here in September, which I think is like kind of already in the books. 80 percentage, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And so and then once a cut happens, then you get the cutting cycle, right? Or at least the expectation of a cutting cycle. And then it's like, okay, well, now capital is going to take out of bonds. And you're seeing the 30 years still like incredibly high right now. So the fed's in a little bit of a pickle. And so I don't think we're going to get like crazy cuts down to like two or three percent anytime soon. But I think as soon as you see a cut. Yeah. I mean, look at those numbers, right? It's 88% on polymarket. I don't know what Fed funds. watches but yeah i mean i'll you know like that i mean that's a good that's a great number right and so i think once you get a cut regardless of the future expectations of cuts i think the market sentiment changes right and the market sentiment starts to say oh fuck i think we're going to start

getting some cuts let me you know uh you know take my capital and while i'm waiting for rates to cut uh so that i can buy a house later uh let me buy some bitcoin let me put some money in ETFs. Let me go further and further out on the risk curve. And maybe let me play some polymarket bets and stuff too. And let me kind of find where I can get better yield or because the expectation of future cuts, which leads to expectation that other people are going to start going further out on the risk curve, I think that's where you start to get to the banana zone that everyone's been waiting for. I think it's just, I think we're right on the cusp of it. So I haven't been bullish in a minute. I'm pretty bullish right now. Yeah, you,

echo the points I make a lot about the treasury company, so it's good to hear some confirmation of my thesis. I actually have said many times I find the all-coin treasury companies, even though I hate the name. It's just the all-coin hedge funds, right? They're not treasury assets, but if your goal is to beat an underlying asset that you consider to be the benchmark, that's a hell of a lot easier with an ether, Solana than it is with the Bitcoin. That's basically the only point to me. I'm not saying that you should hold chronos or whatever, you know, asset we're talking about for 100 years, like maybe you should Bitcoin, but if in the short term

your stock goes up because you beat the value of the underlying, you just, as to your point, you stake, you restake, you use defy, maybe sprinkle in some NFTs or something that are really high quality here and there. And Salana, there's a million ways. I mean, a lot of these guys are trading around their positions. As I said, they're hedge funds. I call the treasury company, but they're doing all kind of carry trades and such to make a yield yeah i'm i'm old enough to remember when uh the older version of this were like uh you know that like back in like 2020 2020 2021 you'd see a lot of uh founders do this with their treasuries they'd go raise like 50 million bucks and they would think that they were smart enough to just like be buying eth and selling

eth and you know being able to trade the funds that they raised uh and i think it's kind of a little bit similar to that but uh yeah i i totally agree they're basically like trying to be Hedglands. One thing you brought up is you brought up Kronos. I'm super interested in world liberty. You know, I much to people's chagrin. Yeah, yeah. Went on the news and I said, I think it'll do well, like with no particular passion about it. I wasn't like I wanted to do well. I didn't get into the and people freaked out when they saw the clip of me saying, I think that it'll objectively do well. But I don't think that that's controversial when you have the president and his sons behind something with a financial interest?

I think it's crazy. I think it's going to do incredibly well. I mean, if they can build a stable, like, you know, tether's always like the dream. Like, tether is of immeasurable value, right? Like, that is a hundreds of billions of dollars valuation company. Like look at circle, right? Circles, I don't know, I haven't looked at circle in a minute, but it's probably between like 30 and 40 or something like that, if I were to guess, a billion in market cap.

And, you know, and you have like the Trump pump premium. And you have all of this stuff, and then you have like all of the, I don't want to say chicanery, but you know, all the things that they're doing, you know, they launched the token with a treasury company already, you know, built into the stack, right? And they're doing everything that is of value that can be accrued to the ecosystem. Yeah, like the fully diluted is already really high. But from a circulating perspective, I think like this thing has some legs to do really well. over like a long enough time horizon. Like I think, you know, the, the Wiccoffs and you have the Trumps and, you know, the CTO, Corey, I'm a huge fan of Corey. I invested in Dolomite, you know, I think Corey's like one of the sharpest minds in Defi.

And Dolomites, they're decks. Is that right? Dolomite is a borrow lending protocol. One of them, there's a Dex too, right? What's the other one? There's two things that people are very bullish on that are a part of the World Liberty financial ecosystem and my brain just says.

Yeah, I'm forgetting the decks as well. But yeah, like I think Dolomite It's a great way to get, like, maybe some smaller exposure. I mean, I'm an investor, so I do want to caveat that. But, you know, Corey's like one of the smartest minds in Define, my opinion. And him being the CTO and kind of running the show. And it's like you have stable coin, you have a treasury company. Like they're just playing everything really, really well.

And they have like, there's no price you can put in crypto on regulatory arbitrage. And, you know, and that's like such a premium. And so, like, you know, of course, there's like a lot of, like, nuance or things that go within it, but I'm just objectively looking at it from an investment perspective. From an investment perspective, I think like, I don't even want to say fundamentally, but I think it's going to find a floor pretty soon. And I think once it does, I think there's a lot of room to go up. Yeah, I mean, you can see the volume. This is the first day. obviously that's the early investor some sort of unlock for some reason i guess you know in the last

12 hours there's another these are four hour chart so there's another big dump you got to imagine this finds a floor pretty soon as those sellers exhaust because the only people they even have tokens to really sell are the early investors here yeah and and i don't know when to buy it whatever there's no way the trump family can allow this thing not to work like they they're so financially and name wise invested in this that it has to work. They have to make it work and they're going to be invested

over a really long time horizon. And I think it's also just bullish for the industry, right? Like you have like some of the biggest names in the world that are just like so bullish on the industry and you have like Eric Trump tweeting like ETH charts. Like, you know, I think it's all just, it's all good for the bags. Yeah. Interesting tweet here from Max Kaiser,

which we've been wondering who's selling and how can Bitcoin be going down when we have this persistent bid from Treasury companies and others that we know is there. As predicted, $100,000 was the price, Wales would start to sell as Bitcoin begins its transition from primarily a store of value to a medium of exchange. But you can see here that the average Bitcoin supply held by Wales is at the lowest. It's been basically in seven years. So the distribution of tokens, which we've seen very transparently, an 80,000 token sale with Galaxy, guy just yoloing 20,000 at a time off.

We know that there are some whales selling. This is a pretty serious stat. We talk about, you know, sheer size of these guys' wallets. Once they're done selling, you can't imagine there's much pressure left. Yeah, that's exactly. I think it's just like super, super healthy for a market, right? Where, you know, you have an incredible run up over a decade. I mean, it's still kind of crazy to think about this much, like this much growth in,

in like a little over a decade or maybe 15 years tops and you're starting to see it change hands and i think like you know there's a psychological number there where people have people have been saying bitcoin 100k since day one and they hit it and then now they have billions and billions of dollars and i think right now they're getting off they're probably going to go and buy their yachts and buy their you know all their fun stuff and then they're going to come back because they're going to realize like fiat to basement and you know what do they say uh fiat has no floor so bitcoin has no ceiling, right? And it's all going to come back eventually, or it's just going to change hands to people that you wanted to, people that are now buying today saying Bitcoin a million,

right? And that's just really, really healthy for a market. So I know that you're a massive hyper liquid bowl. Yeah. You've told me, maybe you can give the premise there because I think to be a massive hyper liquid bull means maybe that takes the shine off the centralized exchange conversation to some degree. Yeah, yeah. So this is my general thesis. It's a, it's a, it's a little long-winded. I've been trying to figure out how to kind of shorten this. But historically, where do you look for as the main price for Bitcoin? If you're pulling up a trading view, where do you look? You typically look on like finance, right? You look at finance, you look at Coinbase and you're like, that's the price of Bitcoin today. My thesis is,

and the reason for that is because that's where a majority of the volume is. Why is the majority of volume there is because that's where the arvers go, right? You're arbing against that number, right whatever the finance prices if i have if i find a bigger number somewhere else i'm going to you know sell over there and i'm going to buy on finance uh if i find a bigger if i find a lower number somewhere else i'm going to sell on finance and i'm going to buy over there right and so you the the reason why they become so dominant is because that's like the main global price that you think about right and so i think the hyperliquid thesis is that um in a on-chain world and an increasingly on-chain world, the latency of ARB is too high on Binance versus another sex,

right? Or Binance versus an on-chain decks or derivative decks or something like that, or a perp decks or something like that, right? Because if you want to take your money from one place and take it on to Binance, it takes minutes, right? Not seconds. Or, you know, maybe if you have special trading accounts or you use like Talon and stuff like that. Maybe it will basically be loaded with both assets in both places at all times, but at some point you still need to circulate them. I remember doing this with light coin, by the way, from like Binance to Coinbase in 2017, where there was a 5% difference, but it would take me so long to send one to the other, no matter how much I had, that eventually it would go away.

100%. And so a lot of the hyperliquithesis is where is the tightest ARB loop in the world, right? And again, it's not just spot to spot. It's also spot to perk, right? And so you're looking at like where are the PERP prices and you're trying to loop against, or you're trying to arb against the the perp to spot price as well. So where do you get the tightest spot to perp arb? And also where can you go from one central location that gets significant volume on both spot and perp?

And that has the easiest access to go anywhere else, right? And the thesis is that that's hyperliquid, right? So in hyperliquid, you're going to have between hyperliquid spot, which is like known as unit or hyperunit, and then hyperliquid, you know, the actual exchange itself, the perp Perp decks, you have an incredibly tight ARB from spot to perk, right? Because it takes almost no time to go from spot to perk, right? It's in the same trading window, right? And so that's incredibly tight. But then when you think about how to go to the rest of the places on chain, like Hyper Liquid being in EVM and the hyper EBM, you're going to be able to go to any other chain, right? You can go to Ethereum. You can go to any of the L2s. You can go to Avalanche and like the other EVM chains. You can get to them instantly, right? Like absolutely instantly within seconds. and so that rb loop gets incredibly tight and so and then you can also go to any of the sexes that you want from hyperliquid most of the sexes have deposit windows from hyper liquid now or you can go to Ethereum and then go to a sex which is also really quick and so then the

question is where's all the capital going to sit and i think the thesis is that the capital is going to sit in farming opportunities or on you know borrow lend protocols or where you can get the best yield for your idle capital um on the hyper ebm and so As you said, I don't know that much about it. So with hyperliquid, can you effectively just be sitting in your token position, your Bitcoin or cash or tether, whatever, earning yield and immediately trade with it? Even better, right? So there's hyper core, which is the exchange, the hyperliquid exchange.

And then there's the hyper EVM, which is like their smart contract platform. And they're both basically, they're the same thing. They're on the same blockchain, et cetera. And so you can be, and there's a lot of applications being built on the hyper EVM. So you can be sitting with your capital being farmed in the AVEC, equivalent on the hyper EVM getting your yield for your Bitcoin or getting your yield on your staples. And then as soon as you see an ARB opportunity, you can then immediately go and take it to an L2 or to the Ethereum L1 or to Avalanche or you can even take it to a sex and ARB against.

And so then the thesis is the ARB loop is going to instead of what previously was you're arbing against finance, you're arbing against Coinbase. Now you're going to be arbing against hyperliquid because the fastest way to get to the next ARB opportunity is there. And so if a majority of that capital that was typically sitting in exchanges, not doing anything, is now sitting and farming in hyper EVM. Then, like, that's where all the TVL is. You're going to see a ton of growth there. You're going to see a ton of applications coming there to use that idle liquidity. And then it's like your TVL goes up and hyper liquid volume is going up like crazy. And then you start to see finance levels of TVL. You see finance levels. Yeah, my bad, man. Yeah. It's a little.

No, no, it's not on you. I just, it's, if you guys actually dig into it, this is for professional and those actually try to make money, this is a much more efficient environment. If you can be earning yield and you're circular within a single ecosystem and don't have to be taking risk and moving tokens around, I was literally like utterly dismissive of hyperliquid, which was stupid because the token did well. It did well. Just the trading part was not on my radar until the whole James Wynn nonsense. I was like, how does this guy have multi-billion dollar positions on some decks?

How is the volume there? how is there that much liquidity? And then it started digging into it. There's actually much more liquidity there than even most centralized exchanges added together. And if you can do all these things there at the same time, why wouldn't you? Exactly. And so to kind of put a bow on it, it's like most of the trading volume, I think, is going to go there. And then most of the liquidity that's not actively trading is also going to go there. And so if that's where all the money is, it's kind of where all the money is to be made. By the way, there's something we have to mention because we didn't when we randomly talked about World Liberty Financial, because

yesterday, Trump backed American Bitcoin went public. For those who missed it, this is their mining venture. And it kept gaping up so much that it had circuit breakers. So if you're wondering how much thirst there is for Trump adjacent investments, here it is, certainly on the public market. So I guess we'll see what World Liberty Financial does. But I mean, this was like the launch of the century. It was, you know, even Circle wasn't getting circuit breaker. I think this went up 59% in a minute or something at one point. it's really wild wild wild yeah i think what what uh what world what um american bitcoin is for the u s investor i think world liberty could be for like the global investor right it's like

how do you get exposure to trump and the trump family if you're a if you're in taiwan if you're in korea and you're trading over there uh you know not many places to get exposure to like america yeah absolutely anything left uh we got like two or three minutes anything i missed no no not really i think uh yeah i think i think i think we hit most of it man, this is fun. It's funny because these are the, like, low news days, but this is still 10 times more news than we had any given time two or three years ago. Yeah, good for news cycles is good for business, man.

You got it, man. Well, guys, Ishaun's information is down in the description. You can and should and must obviously give him a follow. And we're going to have to do this again soon, man. I really appreciate you coming on and sharing your perspective and waking up a little bit early in the morning to do it. always anytime man appreciate guys thank you we'll see you tomorrow for the friday five later