The Wolf Of All Streets - Ethereum ETFs Launch Today: Will ETH Skyrocket?

Episode Date: July 23, 2024

It's a historical day for crypto: Ethereum ETFs are launching today! What does it mean for Ethereum? Will it skyrocket and repeat the success of Bitcoin ETFs? Mark Yusko joins me to discuss this and more!  Mark Yusko: https://x.com/markyusko My friends from The Arch Public, Andrew Parish, and Tillman Holloway, are joining in the second part of the stream to provide an update on the $10K algorithmic portfolio.  Unleash algorithmic trading with The Arch Public: https://thearchpublic.com/  Andrew Parish: https://twitter.com/AP_Abacus  Tillman Holloway: https://twitter.com/texasol61  ►►JOIN THE CONVERSATION HERE, WE'RE DISCUSSING CRYPTO AND MORE! 👉https://roundtable.rtb.io/shortUrl/yjZ4h6h ►► JOIN THE FREE WOLF DEN NEWSLETTER, DELIVERED EVERY WEEKDAY! 👉https://thewolfden.substack.com/   ►► The Arch Public Unleash algorithmic trading. Discover how algorithms used by hedge-funds are now accessible to traders looking for unparalleled insights and opportunities!  👉https://thearchpublic.com/  ►►OKX SIGN UP FOR AN OKX TRADING ACCOUNT THEN DEPOSIT & TRADE TO UNLOCK MYSTERY BOX REWARDS OF UP TO $60,000!  👉https://www.okx.com/join/SCOTTMELKER  ►►TRADING ALPHA READY TO TRADE LIKE THE PROS? THE BEST TRADERS IN CRYPTO ARE RELYING ON THESE INDICATORS TO MAKE TRADES. Use code 'TENOFFSALE' for a 10% discount. 👉https://tradingalpha.io/?via=scottmelker  ►►NGRAVE This is the coldest hardware wallet in the world and the only one that I personally use. 👉https://www.ngrave.io/?sca_ref=4531319.pgXuTYJlYd  ►►NORD VPN  GET EXCLUSIVE NORDVPN DEAL - 40% DISCOUNT! IT’S RISK-FREE WITH NORD’S 30-DAY MONEY-BACK GUARANTEE. PROTECT YOUR PRIVACY! 👉 https://nordvpn.com/WolfOfAllStreets   Follow Scott Melker: Twitter: https://twitter.com/scottmelker   Web: https://www.thewolfofallstreets.io   Spotify: https://spoti.fi/30N5FDe   Apple podcast: https://apple.co/3FASB2c   #Bitcoin #Crypto #Ethereum The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own and should in no way be interpreted as financial advice. This video was created for entertainment. Every investment and trading move involves risk. You should conduct your own research when making a decision. I am not a financial advisor. Nothing contained in this video constitutes or shall be construed as an offering of financial instruments or as investment advice or recommendations of an investment strategy or whether or not to "Buy," "Sell," or "Hold" an investment.

The Ethereum spot ETFs are finally set to launch today, further legitimizing the crypto space with legacy markets and institutional investors. And it's launching to such fanfare and excitement. And actually, nobody's really talking about it. They're all talking about Donald Trump and the fact that he's going to be in Nashville for the Bitcoin conference this week. Why is the excitement so muted for the Ethereum spot ETFs? It should absolutely be a huge day with eight issuers getting these approved and trading. I'm going to talk about this and likely a lot more with one of your favorite guests. I would say my favorite guest, but it's also one of your favorite guests. Mark, you just go today.

Of course, you got the Arch public guys on the back half. Let's go. Let's go. What is up, everybody? I'm Scott Melcar, also known as the Wolf of All Streets. Before we get started, please subscribe to the channel and hit that like button man this is a huge week i'm so excited i'm gonna bring on mark right now mark i got you today i got scaramucci tomorrow morning and man do i have questions for him yeah right and not announced yet but live on this channel and in person from Nashville tomorrow, I'm interviewing RFK. And that's the first time I've mentioned it. It's just official.

And I can tell you it is going to be an explosive conversation based on what we've said so far that might get Tim in a lot of trouble. All of us in a lot of trouble. Who knows? But today the topic is Ethereum spot ETFs to start. I think you and I both and basically everyone didn't expect these to get approved in the first place, right? It was this sort of like one hour turnaround and then this weird process of getting the S1s approved. But they are going to trade. As Matt Hogan pointed out, now these investors effectively have access to

70% of the crypto market, right? Between Bitcoin and Ethereum, you've got 70% of the market. So what does this look like to you? These were launching today. Like I said, not much fanfare. It's kind of weird. Not much fanfare at all, Scott. I think it's really interesting. So when they were announced that they were, quote unquote, approved, which meant a few steps left to get launched for trading, price of Ethereum actually went down and actually down reasonably sharply, which was a little bit surprising, but not completely surprising because the trading hadn't started and people hadn't actually started buying Ethereum. But now with launch imminent and real dollars going to be in demand, the only thing I can come up with is the economics of Ethereum or tokenomics of Ethereum are, or tokenomics of Ethereum, are modestly different, right? It claims to be deflationary like Bitcoin, but it's probably not quite the same.

And it's not as widely held. And therefore, there's probably some fear and trepidation about whale dumping and things like that would be my hypothesis. Yeah, I agree. I mean, if you look at what happened with the Bitcoin spot ETF launch, and certainly doesn't have to rhyme, but you had this quick move up 47, just under 50, and then sustained selling from gdbtc and way down you know 20 plus percent down to under 40 000 over the coming uh weeks right and e-fee i mean we should talk about this because i know i have it somewhere here with it with the fees but let's take a look at the the fees that have been proposed here right we got uh the ether etf fee Everybody, 25 bips, 15 bips, fee waivers. I think there was a story here that Bitwise giving 10% to core developers like they did with Bitcoin. And then you have Grayscale, 2.5%. That's 10x the highest competitor like BlackRock and GBTC sold off for weeks sustained to the tune of billions

of dollars when they were at 1.5%. So explain to me how this is not mega selling pressure into an asset with more volatility and less volume. Yeah, well, so the only reason it's not mega selling pressure is taxes. So the average holder, meaningful holder, has been in the position for a while. If they sell, they're going to get a big tax hit. So they're like, well, do I just suck it up and pay the fee? Or do I take the massive tax hit and get a lower fee at one of the others? And what we saw with Grayscale was the vast majority of holders said, nope, not going to take the tax hit. And I think in ETH, it's even worse because it had more of a parabolic move. So those early investors, there's no incentive for them.

And the discount's already closed. So people were waiting on, since GBTC was such a fast process, they were only really able to get out and take advantage of the discount right at launch. Here, you've been able to sell EFE for quite a while now with a closed discount. Yep. And the other thing I think is, this is my theory. That's all it is. I don't have inside knowledge, but it's my theory that I will argue that Grayscale is in a controlled demolition liquidation. They basically were, well, again, my thesis. I don't get no inside knowledge. And Barry might smack me if I said this, but I think that someone came to him and said, you know what?

We got you. And we could go after and cause a lot of pain in your life. Or you can slowly feed the beast, which is BlackRock, and just hand over your Bitcoins to the new big dog in town and charge a really high fee while you're doing it. That's my thesis. Yeah, it makes a lot of sense. Of course, they have the ETH mini product this time, which wasn't there last time.

But to my understanding, you can only move 10% of your ETH into that. So for people who are saying, hey, they have this other product with lower fees. Okay, it removes 10%. That said, let's exist in a vacuum here. Let's not worry about what may or may not happen with Grayscale. I tend to agree with you.

The consensus is that parts of Grayscale's business, or DCG's business more specifically, have had some trouble. I mean, we know about Genesis. Everybody knows they sold CoinDesk, all of the above. And that these have been their cash caps, right? Because everybody's been trapped. They have high fees. They've been, and that's not going to exist in a competitive environment.

So they need to do some calculus as to how they're going to wind that down and survive. But let's exist in this vacuum. He's launched today. Everybody's excited. What kind of expectations do you think we should have? A lot of people have said, listen, it's a third the size or 25% the size of Bitcoin.

It'll get 25% of the inflows. Simple math. I have my doubts. And look, I have my doubts too. I think it's a logical argument. I think the difference is for most of the biggest dogs, right? So, you know, this is the wolf of all streets. So if you go down all the streets in the back alleys, right?

You find Black Rock. Yeah. At the end of all. Yeah. And you look at all the different types of buyers. The individuals probably will migrate here because they believe, particularly if they're listening to Raoul and others, that ETH has more upside than Bitcoin. So, okay, fine. I mean, mathematically, that's true. I can poke some holes in that and people

are going to do a good job poking holes in that the next three days when we're in Nashville. But as you start moving up the value chain of larger purchasers, I just think if I'm a big institution, a big sovereign wealth fund or a big pension or an endowment. And I've had to go to my board and convince them that this crypto stuff isn't for drug dealers and criminals and that it's really an institutional quality investment. I don't know if I want to go through the whole story again and convince them that, oh yeah, Ethereum is, it's kind of like Bitcoin, but not quite. And it's about a quarter the size or half or third the size. And so I should have three quarters Bitcoin, one quarter Ethereum. I don't know. I'm going to take the under on how many people are willing to go through the brain damage.

I think we also have a cycle issue, right? I mean, this is just that part of the cycle where nothing moves price. I was talking about this yesterday. It's kind of astounding. Bitcoin sitting now at $66,300, right? We've had all this talk about the thawing of the White House to crypto, which we all know is nonsense. But we've certainly seen Donald Trump make a wholesale reversal.

We've seen Bitcoin on the main stage. We've seen everybody talk about self-custody and CBDCs and crypto. Price is the same or lower than when Trump made that pivot. That's how strong this part of the cycle is. That's how strong the post-having, boring, nothing happening,

and they're launching ETH into this. The Bitcoin spot ETF launch was the most hyped single launch of any product in the stock market ever. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Well, and it was, and look, it's Paul Romer, famous professor who won the Nobel prize five, six years ago for something called the law of increasing returns. And it basically says it's not the best product or technology that wins. It's the one that gets critical mass first. And so this is, I love to quote Top Gun because it's my favorite movie and Top Gun Maverick is even better than Top Gun. But the original Top Gun has this great line, right, where it says, you know, this school is all about combat.

There are no points for second place. And so it's kind of like that with the ETFs. You know, go big or go home, be first or don't. And it doesn't mean that they won't gather some assets and a billion dollars, a billion dollars here, a billion dollars there, it's real money. But I think maybe the BlackRock gets some because they've done a good job educating a few of their clients that they should have a diversified portfolio fine and maybe a couple of the guys with the low fee will pick up some but i just don't think there's going to be the same demand i mean i so that's just on the supply demand dynamics of etfs first wins first mover especially and yes they're different but but they play the same role in a portfolio yes they're

different technologically and yes they're different as as blockchains but the real issue for me on ETH is I ask this question all the time of people if ETH didn't exist and it was invented today, would anybody use it? And I think that's a hard question to answer because you have things that are better, faster, cheaper. And the argument for ETH, which is a strong one, is, well, it was first and has the most developer activity and the most installed base. And therefore it got critical mass first. So it won. And there you are. Yeah. And the TVL, excuse me. Yeah. Yeah.

So, but I, you know, I'm, I listened to the Solana people and yeah, I think Solana as a network still has a lot of flaws, bugs, but the TVL has gone back up and the price has gone back up. And you can – the experience of moving a stablecoin over Solana versus over Ethereum, way better. Just way better, right? It's cheaper, it's faster, it's easier. I don't even think that can be argued. Like in a vacuum, if you just want to send money to someone, you look at it. And you know what? Even outside of Ethereum and Solana, this theory that people just want cheaper, faster, and easier is proven because most people are sending their USDT around the world in Tron. And nobody cares about it. Correct. Yes. No, that's a great point. That's a really good point.

Faster, cheaper, easy wallet. Do it. Doesn't matter. They don't care about the dynamics or what the platform is or the decentralization. They just send it on Tron, to be quite honest. So, but I mean, I think that Ethereum does, and these ETFs do actually exceptionally well over time. I just think it's going to be a longer educational curve, to your point. I think the pitch is just going to be, you know, look what it does for your Sharpe ratio. As you and I have talked about for Bitcoin, you know, diversify a little bit. I don't think having to educate them on exactly what it is is what's going to do it. But I do want to also talk about the Bitcoin ETFs and BlackRock specifically. I don't know if you saw this, but yesterday BlackRock did $527 million

in net inflow. I mean, the price hasn't moved. And iBit did $527 million. And this one blew my mind. Blew my mind. BlackRock's Bitcoin ETF has surpassed the Nasdaq ETF QQQ in flows this year. Yeah. Yep. This is is in same no it's insane and that's just one of them yeah it's incomprehensible given how people talked about this before they were approved right that these were going to be speculative, flash in the pan, not interesting to institutional investors. And I think quite the opposite, basically what you've created. And so those numbers are a little fuzzy. It's like, you know, millennium, right? Oh, we have, you know, 2 billion of Bitcoin ETFs ETFs. Well, kinda on that day,

the net long position might've been 2 billion, but they don't have to report their shorts. So you don't really know how much they're short other stuff. And so I think what, what's happened is you've, you've created a highly liquid, very efficient trading tool that very large institutional traders like Citadel, which is quietly, I think, scalping in these markets like they scalp every other market because they're geniuses. I think that's the misunderstood part of the story is that it's not that the institutions are buying and hodling. They're rapid fire trading and scalping little pieces between exchanges across blockchains. Arbitrage and cash and carry in a way that they couldn't do it before. So even if we see these huge inflows, there's a position on the other side.

Yeah. And well, the thing that's not moving massively, the spoofing problem is real, right? Which is there is a, I can't remember, I think it's like 10% annualized difference between the spot price and the future price. And that's why if you look at the futures-based ETF products in the traditional world, they're just wealth destroyers, right? Because they have this roll yield problem where you roll down the time curve and you lose money. And so they just constantly chew up your gain. And literally, they destroy 99% over a long period of time. Now, as a trading tool, they're great. And you can use them for hedging and all that stuff. But futures-based products have this rural yield problem. Well, the flip side of that is if I go long the future and I go short the underlying, I can capture that spread and I can do that over and over and over again and basically make free money. Now you have to have money to make money.

Funny how that works. But think about gold. That's why gold prices have been so stable for so long, despite the increasing demand for gold. The price doesn't move because these spoofers are out there clipping coupons. Speaking of having money to make money, let's talk about BlackRock. They've got over 10 trillion in assets under management now. Cool. 10 trillion. No big deal. Right? They're obviously extremely actively participating in this market. Larry Fink continues on the roadshow, seeming to become more of a Bitcoiner every day. But should we be wholly excited that BlackRock is so deeply in this market? That's a great question.

So the answer is yes and no. Yes, we should be excited that the largest manager in the world kind of gets the joke and that they have a product that is increasing the demand for the asset that we all know and love. The no is not all of their demand is real, meaning it's not all for spot. Much of it is in the futures market. And look, I talked about this, you and I talked about this right before the launch of the Bitcoin ETFs, very unreported, under-discussed, on January 10th, was a release of a number of new futures contracts on the CME. And I warned people that that was going to put material downward pressure.

And it goes back to a quote from Leo Melamed, who's the head of the CME from I think 2017 or 18, where he said, we'll tame Bitcoin. And tame is a very intentional word. And, you know, this whole thought that the creation of ETFs and the creation of new products around the asset are only going to be number go up is ludicrous. Because what happens is if everything was demanded to play in the spot market and new capital comes in number go up but that's not the way it works in a futures based market and when in the old days if i had oil to sell to you i actually had to have the oil to deliver to you right because that was the way it worked. I sold you oil, I pumped it out of the ground, and I put it on a truck and I sent it to you. Now I don't have to do that. I can write a contract that says, yeah, I'm selling you this paper oil. And if we settle up the contract before

the delivery date, I don't ever have to get any oil. So you create out of thin air by fiat, it's just like fiat currency, you create artificial commodities. And so you've seen it in agricultural commodities or metals or oil, where you get these weird dynamics around the big money players manipulating, I'll use that term intentionally because they've been fined billions and billions of dollars for that manipulation. But as JP Morgan said, they're going to find a billion dollars. And I'm like, yeah, fine, but we made 20 bill. So it's like 5%. It's cost doing business. Yeah. that leads me to the fact that because I'm interviewing RFK tomorrow, and we'll be talking heavily about the Fed and their policies and how it works. I've,

and Caitlin Long is joining us to give color and fact checking, interestingly. I've gone on a very, very no sleep for the last 24 hours because it's making my head spin kind of deep dive into the Fed. We talk about money printing and holy crap, is it corrupt and insane. I mean, this is one of your favorite topics. This is my favorite topic. Look, I literally just got back. I took this two-week break for the second time in 20 years. But I did it.

And I didn't do Twitter for two weeks. I didn't do email. I mean, I went on break with my family and totally unplugged, which was amazing. But we went to Italy, right? And what people don't understand and appreciate. So we're touring the Pitti Palace, palace right which was the medici's palace and they pilfered the most unimaginable other than the vatican the most unimaginable collection of art and artifacts that the world has ever seen well how did they do that well they did it by being the precursors to central banking, right? They were the original bankers. And it was the

Dutch in 1607 that created the first central bank. And I always say, think about this. So the Portuguese were in charge. They had the Illuminati, the Knights Templar, and they had the most powerful navy. And then the Spanish conquered them. And then the French conquered them. And then suddenly the little Dutch came and conquered the French. Like, well, how can that be? Well, it's because they created this bank based on these ideas that the Medici stole from the the nice templar that you could have this this banking relationship and they created the first bank that could create fiat currency that

didn't have to be backed by gold in the vault yeah and therefore war's a lot war's a lot easier when you can just print more is way easier when I can pay my soldiers. And to that point, the reason Rome fell, right, is not because they were stupid and corrupt and all those things are true. But the reason they fell is the emperors of all the different districts that they had conquered all wanted their own coliseum and their own circus and their own. So what they do is they literally melt down the coins. Those are pure silver, the denarius, and they would add other metals and create more coins. And the soldiers were like, what the fuck? These are not as worth. So we want more coins. And so there was this hyperinflation in the cost of foot soldiers. And at one point, the foot soldiers said, no, you don't have enough bad coins to pay us. And once they stopped working, the Huns came in, end of Roman Empire in 457.

And so it was a long time from 457 to 1200 when the Venetians took over the banking system. And then the central bankers in the Netherlands eventually led to the central bank in the UK run by the Rothschilds, which eventually led to the Rothschilds seeding the Fed, literally set up the Fed with the son of Junius Morgan, JP Morgan, and the rest is history. So it all goes back to the Fed is a corrupt political organization owned by a bunch of

wealthy European aristocrats. It is not federal. It has no reserves. It is not a bank. It is not a government agency. It is a corrupt political organization run by the wealthiest, most global families in the world. What if I told you that there are people out there who are actually deciding monetary policy for the United States and earning a 6% dividend for any money that they print and hold in their bank and that the president and government have no official oversight or ability to fire those people would that interest you the truth i mean if only there was you know like just spitballing here if only there was some new asset that was not under the control of these people that was decentralized and you could put your money to and generally appreciate it over time. Well, there is this thing, Scott, it's called gold. The problem with gold is if I had a bar here and I wanted to break it in half and give you half, I mean, one, I'm not strong enough to break it in half. And two, I couldn't stuff it in the

computer and send it to you. So we have had for 5000 years, an asset that breaks that monopoly, which is why they made it illegal in 1933, with executive order 6102. But Bitcoin is better than that, right? Bitcoin is infinitely divisible, infinitely portable. And here's the other thing about it, right? Every dollar sent across international borders, everyone has to go through either one of two banks, both of which are owned by those same families. Why is that? Well, because a treaty from 400 years ago mandates that. People are calling us conspiracy theorists in the chat. Guys guys go look it up literally just read about it read about the uh crash of 1907 when we didn't have a central bank

read about who bailed out all the banks it was jp morgan himself yeah and 1913 the 1913 federal reserve act was effectively a response to that and because there was concern that it would be all entirely private uh private and And because there was concern that it would be all entirely private and controlled by Wall Street, or that it would be so centralized by the government, they made a quasi hybrid model where private banks, the 12 banks. Well, Scooter, you know what's so funny about this is, you know, it's only a conspiracy if it's not true, right? Truth is an absolute defense. If you go back to the founding of the United States in 1776, we had two 20-year periods where we had the first National Bank of the United States and the second National Bank of the United States, both of which boards were

controlled by the same European wealthy families. so andrew jackson right who's the donald's you know hero said fuck to the no i'm abolishing the i'm not renewing the charter for the third national bank and we went through a 40-year period where there was no central bank there was no national bank and we had the what was called the free banking era and again this is not a conspiracy. These are facts. They had wildcat currencies. Yeah.

I mean, everybody had their own money. Good times. Yeah. No, Procter & Gamble had their own money. And Texas had their own money. And GE had their own money. And all these companies had their own money. And it didn't work. And so then they renewed the charter of the National Bank at the end of that, after the Great Depression, like the bigger depression than the Great Depression in 1860s.

They renewed the charter. And long story short, in 1907, there was a trust called Knickerbocker Trust that was taking share from J.P. Morgan. And J.P. Morgan famously said, I like a little competition, but they need to go. And he spread the rumor that led to the picture that we've all seen of the run on the bank with the umbrellas and the people in dresses and ties. And they went out of business. And the Trust Act of 1907 made J.P. Morgan the go-to de facto because he and John D. Rockefeller put up 25 million of their own money to bail out the system. And then John D. Rockefeller's father-in-law was Amory Aldrich, who crafted the Aldrich Plan, which took six years to get through, funded again by these European families. And they established the fed and i love this part

they signed the documents on jekyll island right you i mean you can't make that up the creature from jekyll island um and look you can argue about it and we can say no no no no this is not but it's all just truth and facts and you can check check the links to Junius Morgan and the Rockefeller family. That has nothing to do with religion or pop. It has to do with money. It has to do with money and power. Well, imagine if we had an asset. OK, this is the reason this is what Bitcoiners talk about.

And I have to say, Mark, like I know I'm over time and I'm sorry, but I can't. But, you know, I have to say, like, this is why I don't care who your favorite politician is or who your favorite institution is. But when they start talking about Bitcoin, I get the little like my hair start to stand up. I'm with you. I'm with you. So, look, at the end of the day, people are going to talk about what gets them votes, whether they believe it or not. The good thing is for the next three day, people are going to talk about what gets them votes, whether they believe it or not. The good thing is for the next three days, we're going to be in Nashville with all the people who actually do care about this stuff and a couple of people that don't. They're just trying to get votes. But most of us are going there to celebrate this innovation. What Bitcoin is, it is the greatest innovation that we'll probably see in our lifetimes.

And it simply makes value bidirectional and swaps trust for truth. We don't have to trust the Medicis. We don't have to trust the Morgans. We don't have to trust the Rothschilds. I don't have to trust anybody. You and I can exchange value seamlessly, efficiently in any place in the world. And that technology, that distributed ledger, cryptographic secure technology is a world changer.

So, hey, I know we're over. Thanks for having me. And I'll see you in Nash Vegas. Because I have bad ADD, Iming you uh person while we were just talking there to say that uh we need to get together do this in person because we're gonna have a setup there so let's schedule time all right i'll do it awesome man thank you guys follow mark uh for more history lessons thanks buddy bitcoin thanks man see you soon bye all right and now obviously for another person who's going to be in Nashville,

cause they're one of the sponsors arch public, Andrew, dude, you got, are you sleeping these days? I mean, you gotta be getting revved up and ready. Listen, man, the, the, the, the, in the last week you've had two guests on and I listened to most of what you just said and, uh, and you know, all the truth involved in that conversation. Between him and Caitlin Long, the value that you're bringing to your listeners and your viewers, however we categorize people on YouTube, is pretty significant stuff, right? I mean, understanding the banking

system, understanding the Fed, understanding the corruption associated with all of it is if you if you're not convinced at that point to buy Bitcoin and as much as don't know what to tell you. Those folks are as wired in as they can be. You used to go on the institutional side and Caitlin Long started an actual bank, right? An actual bank and has tried to push it through the system in the way that it's supposed to happen and has found herself in the midst of the corruption of the Fed itself time after time after time. And so those folks are absolutely to be listened to, to be followed. Whenever they say anything, listen up and be very, very aware.

So kudos to you for having them on your show. It's real, real value. And I literally, as a result of that, thank you very much. As a result of that, thank you very much. As a result of that, I like when got this RFK interview locked in for tomorrow, it's going to be at 530. It'll be live actually here. Awesome.

A whole thing on the street. But I invited, we got permission to invite Caitlin along. Oh, that's awesome. So it'll be me interviewing the two of them. But because the bulk of the conversation will be about the Fed, I wanted to make sure I had a real expert there to vet, confirm, discuss, and make sure. Because one of the hardest parts about being an interviewer or a moderator is you can't know everything about everything. Right. And your guest is inevitably going to say things that you want either vetted or fact-checked or deeper conversation on, and you can watch.

Well, between, um, um, the reason why it's important to have Caitlin in that conversation is, you know, uh, RFK is, is worm brain guy, your podcaster nitwit guy and Caitlin's giga brain. Okay. So that, that So that's the truth of that conversation. All right. Can we agree to that? Caitlin has had such a long history in traditional finance. People don't know this. People think that Caitlin's Bitcoin bank personality. The reality is she spent more than 20 years at Morgan Stanley and even previous to that, Solomon Brothers, which was purchased by Morgan Stanley. All the Solomon Brothers. Didn't go too good for Solomon Brothers.

No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. In fact, all the former Solomon Brothers people hate the fact that Morgan Stanley bought them and still hate Morgan Stanley. A good portion of them left after that transaction finalized. But yeah, she's just, she's remarkable. You know, there's often times where she puts out tweets that should get, you know, tens of thousands of impressions and likes, and they go fairly unnoticed, but they're the smartest, most accurate, pinpointed parts of the conversation associated with what's going on from a financial standpoint in our country. And very, very, very, very, very, very smart and very, very educated, not just from a traditional education, but just experience. Her experiences inside of the system is important. People should really listen. Same with Yosko, right? You know, the guy is, you know, as wired as it gets from an

institutional standpoint. By the way, I 100% share his thoughts on the potential lack of velocity associated with Ethereum ETFs. I think it's great that they've been approved. I think it's great that they're going to trade. I think it's going to be an uphill climb. You also know my thoughts on one of the reasons why it's going to be a bigger uphill climb than people think is because the outflows from Barry's, you know, grayscale product is going to be a problem. They have worked overtime on the PR with their mini trust.

I hesitate to say this because I like these guys, but heaven only knows how much Barry has paid Bloomberg and other outlets to be very complimentary of what they're trying to do with the mini trust. But it's going to be, it's going to be an uphill climb. Cause like Yusko said, and you said, you know, there's a first and best and it's hard to, here's probably a good analogy, right? So there's a lot of people that are comfortable buying Hondas and Toyotas. And then you had Hyundai and like Kia come into the market 30 years ago. Those brands didn't take off in the United States just as a quote unquote proxy as other Asian type vehicle products.

Because, oh, OK, well, if Honda and Toyota are great, then Hyundai and Kia should be awesome, too. Let's go buy some of those because they're a little bit cheaper, but they kind of do the same thing. Korean cars are awesome though. So it took a long, long, long, long time for those brands to get any. I had a Kia Telluride for a while. I think it was awesome.

Yeah. Well, yeah. I mean, it's gotten, that's kind of the whole point. My thesis has always been short and medium term. The Ethereum ETFs are going to struggle. Long term, they're going to do well. So is Bitcoin a Honda and Ethereum is a Kia? Is a Kia.

Yeah, that's right. Who's got like the G-Wagon? Well, I don't. Yeah, that's a good question. I think Bitcoin is. I mean, honestly, like you could say Bitcoin is a Lambo or a Ferrari, but it's not. It's the old, reliable, steady Honda Accord or Toyota Camry. Well, given that the fact that it's stayed in an average price of about $65K for the last four months.

Yeah. You know, the reliability and, you know, sort of tried and true kind of actually works. I will say, though, and I put this out yesterday, the sell in May and go away is over. Larry Fink is back at his desk. And so gobbling up half a billion dollars in Bitcoin in July. Now imagine that it's September and October and everybody- It'd be high not to buy in July. Everybody's going to be back at their desk.

Got to remember to by in September. Yeah, it is a foreshadowing of the size and scale by which the Bitcoin ETFs will continue to outperform and continue to gather assets. Because again, everybody's going to look at it and say, Ethereum, I don't know, I don't know this. But you know what? I've heard of Bitcoin now for a decade and I know the name, I understand the brand, a lot of reputable people have changed their minds on it. So, all right, you know what? I'm going to throw whatever percentage of my portfolio into it, half of a percent, 1%. Well well one percent across trillions of dollars in wealth just here in the united states is a lot of money it's a lot of money it's a lot yeah yeah

okay so let's talk about uh arch so we shall be buying bitcoin listen to caitlin mark well you'll be able to buy it yeah Dollar cost average at every three milliseconds. So we're going to make an announcement at the Bitcoin conference. I think our press release might actually go out today. It's been under embargo until today. Our Bitcoin algorithm is going to come out. And to be fair, our Bitcoin algorithm is going to come out and then there's going to be a couple other versions that will come out over the coming months as well. But initially, it's going to be a DCA tool. So it's going to be a tool that will allow you down to every 30 seconds to DCA into Bitcoin in whatever percentage of your portfolio or every hard dollar number of your portfolio that you want

it to be. And at the same time, it's going to greatly reduce the cost of making those purchases versus some of the other platforms that are out there that allow you to buy once a day. I can't get into, you know, can't completely pull the curtain back as to the all the platforms that we're working with for this to be able to work on different platforms. But I do believe over the next 30, 60, 90 days, you're going to be able to use this tool to both buy Bitcoin ETFs in a DCA way and spot Bitcoin. We're very, very encouraged with the conversations that we're having and the excitement that we're receiving from those institutions that want to partner with us and give people the opportunity.

Here's the way I used this yesterday in talking to an institution. If you just use this tool and twice a day you were making a purchase. 18 days ago, Bitcoin was at 54, almost 53,000. It moved all the way up to 67. Now it's at 66 and change. In just that time period, think about the smoothed out level by which you're buying Bitcoin versus, oh, no, it's at 54 and it's moving down. Should I buy it now or no? Well, it moved up to 57, but it was just at 54 and it was at 67. Which I buy it now or no? Well, it moved up to 57, but it was just at 54 and it was at 67. Which way is it going to go here? I have no idea. How are you making those

decisions? The ability to programmatically decide on how you're going to buy Bitcoin and almost set it and forget it and create a position inside of your portfolio. That is the most powerful way to buy the most powerful asset over the last decade in the world of finance. So we think it's going to be a powerful tool. We're going to make it affordable for people. We're going to let them use it. And you're not going to have to have a quote unquote minimum amount of investment to use the tool. You've got $200 in your account and you want to buy 50 bucks worth of stuff over the next four days, you can use the tool. So on top of that, our algorithms last week, Thursday, did some really cool stuff.

We had three of our algorithms pop off on the same day. And the interesting thing there, and this is what we tell customers in our upper tiers of our ecosystem here, in our concierge program, is you're going to get uncorrelated results. Well, what does that mean? So you're looking at two S&P algorithms and one Dow algorithm. The two S&P algorithms took a short and profited. The Dow algorithm took a long and profited. So I'm seeing the Dow's in the middle algorithm took a long and profited. So I'm saying the Dow is in the middle here. Yeah, that's correct. Just based on the trades right here.

Correct. The Dow was in and out inside of about 35, 36 minutes. And then the S&P algorithms took about 70 minutes to execute their particular trade. So in total, if you were in those algorithms, as people are in our concierge program, you generated a little more than a six and a half percent return in 90 minutes. So very powerful stuff, uncorrelated results. People continue to be extremely happy with what we do and how we do it. And oh, by the way, you could have been living on the moon

and those things would have still happened in your portfolio. You don't have to be at your computer. You don't have to talk to anybody. Yeah, well, that's a phrase I like to use. Is that going to be one of the announcements at the Bitcoin conference? Yeah, of course it is. Of course it is.

Everybody thinks Elon Musk is going to be there, by the way, which I doubt. Would be cool if he is. I'd take the other side of that. You. I would take the other side of that. You're going to take the other side of that? You might know more than I do. It's still an unsubstantiated rumor, but I think I would take the other side of that.

Well, we are going to hang out with you for a bit at the Bitcoin conference. We're going to have some customers there that are going to enjoy themselves. It's going to be a good time Thursday evening having a dinner with some important folks. One of those important folks being Scott Melker and his wife. And, yeah, it's going to be a good time.

I think she's wearing a cowboy outfit. Oh, wow. Non-sarcastically. Cowgirl. Sarcastically. One day in Tennessee, we're going to karate combat. I'm going to wear a cowgirl outfit. Please.

If you do, I know where to take the pictures because I've spent more time in Nashville than I should. There's this mural that's a very well-known spot. These big wings. And I kid you not. Cowgirl with wings yeah yeah i kid you not that there's a line of women that that's their victoria's secret moment oh yeah you it's something nashville's nashville's something it's a spot no doubt i love i love my comments by the way people are like dude you're not the right guy for this interview you're too jokey i'm like dude guys i i know this is hard to believe it really is but i'm actually a full

grown adult and i i can like keep a straight face and not make jokes in serious well you know what happens is right here i hope you're not as loud as you are now 10 times louder as your guest it's live yeah okay let me let me explain this to you it's at 5 30 p.m eastern standard time tomorrow i will be sitting with him yeah the sound crew doing production nothing to do with me it will be broadcast live but as an in-person conversation it's always interesting the comments from you know let's call them reply guys that are interested in content and interested enough to comment about the content and will consume the content. But at the same time, you know, complain here. I'm happy. I said, they're here. They're giving me constructive

feedback. I'm just tell the overwhelming point was guys. I got this. I got this. You've been doing this a while. They chose me. I didn't choose that. You know what I mean? Yeah. Our Bitcoin algorithm will be rolled out to our current customers at thearchpublic.com next week. Right when you said it. Yeah.

Perfect timing. Perfect timing. And I will say that people that are just in our entry level product, our $99 product, again, for three successive months have seen very, very positive returns and are up a significant amount. Very, very happy with what we do. And again, the idea here is it's hands-free returns. You're simply, you know, three steps. You set up, you're trading your 10K, and then off you go. You just get updates on your phone. And people have responded in such a meaningful way that we continue to take their feedback associated with,

have you thought about this product? have you thought about this product? Have you thought about that product? We do an evaluation of, you know, is that something that we want to put in people's hands? So love the community that you've built, Scott, and working with your folks. And going to be a fun week in Nashville. I like you a lot.

I like you a lot. Yeah, I can't wait. So guys, yeah, the dinner will, for the few, Thursday, but we're gonna also coordinate a time for me to like come to the booth and hang out there and you know uh you guys and stuff so really looking forward to it andrew and i've never met in person no you could be there for our first uh fist bump i will not be growing a beard by then but it will be we'll make sure that we get a picture of you standing in between tillman and I, because I think that will be a remarkable moment.

You know, kind of look like I'm still six feet tall, but I do find that like but I'm very I'm slender. I do find that I say this every time I go to a conference. It literally pisses me off. Like people in crypto are really tall. Yeah. Yeah. So you talk to a screen. Very rarely is somebody shorter than I think they are through the screen. That's all I'll say. Yeah. I have a couple of female friends that will be joining us at. How tall are you? Six, four. Yeah. And break, man. And Tillman Tillman, six, five. So between the two of us, we are, we're not small individuals.

And the female friends bring to the dinner and then to the conference as well. I'm like, listen, you know, you ladies are single. I'm just letting you know that there's like 90% of the people here are, you know, meat eating, masculine bearded gentlemen. Yeah. So to that end, in theory, I want to

line this up in my brain. With a 10-yard running start for me, how wide of a space do you think I would need to potentially get past you and Tillman? Depending on what we're allowed to deploy to potentially get past you and Tillman? I mean, depending on what we're allowed to deploy to

not get you past. Oh no, it has to be just us. No weapons. No weapons and no means. I've seen that. No physical harm at all? Okay. No, you can physically harm me. Yeah, you'd need a solid 10 to 15 yards. Yeah. Why? Because here's the thing.

Here's the thing. Tillman was an All-American at the University of Texas. I know. The ability for that man of that size to move the way that he does is hard to quantify. And I played Division I basketball. I didn't play football. So I don't know, man. We may, you know.

Oh, so I get to dunk on you instead. Yeah, for sure. For sure. For sure. Tillman is not great at basketball. I've seen him attempt to. It's not pretty. We're going to do one of those photos where, like, I'm on a stool and they cut off our feet.

I'm tall, man. It's awesome pretty. We're going to do one of those photos where I'm on a stool and they cut off our feet. I'm tall, man. It's awesome. All right. I got to go. I got spaces to do. So, guys, listen. Tomorrow, first of all, AP underscore Abacus to follow Andrew, the Archpublic, right there, to check all this out. But tomorrow morning, just a reminder, I have Scaramucci on the normal time

at 9 a.m. Eastern Standard Time that I'm rushing off to fly to Nashville literally five seconds after the show to be there to do an in-person interview with RFK. I don't ask you guys for much. Great stuff. They insisted this be live. Yeah, great stuff.

I would have obviously liked recording and editing. Sure. This will be live. I need you guys. It will be here, but also all over X. I need you guys to share the shit out of it. Awesome.

I'm asking. It's going to be, this is like going to be the big announcement of what he has going on. I need you guys to share it. Love it. People ask you, is this about Ethereum or no? Listen to the beginning.

Yes. All right. That's all I got for you guys. I will see a lot of you in person definitely you in person andrew thanks guys bye