The Wolf Of All Streets - How The USA Is Becoming The Bitcoin Superpower Of The World | Bo Hines

Episode Date: June 8, 2025

Bo Hines, Executive Director of the White House’s Presidential Council of Advisers for Digital Assets, joined me on The Wolf Of All Streets to expose the U.S. government’s dramatic shift from fighting crypto to embracing it. We unpack how the new administration is dismantling outdated rules, advancing stablecoin legislation, and laying the groundwork for a national Bitcoin reserve. If you want an inside look at how Washington is going all-in on crypto, this is the episode to watch. Bo Hines: https://x.com/BoHines ►► JOIN THE FREE WOLF DEN NEWSLETTER, DELIVERED EVERY WEEKDAY! 👉https://thewolfden.substack.com/ ►► Arch Public Unleash algorithmic trading. Discover how algorithms used by hedge-funds are now accessible to traders looking for unparalleled insights and opportunities! 👉https://archpublic.com/ ►►TRADING ALPHA READY TO TRADE LIKE THE PROS? THE BEST TRADERS IN CRYPTO ARE RELYING ON THESE INDICATORS TO MAKE TRADES. Use code '10OFF' for a 10% discount. 👉https://tradingalpha.io/?via=scottmelker Follow Scott Melker: Twitter: https://x.com/scottmelker Web: https://www.thewolfofallstreets.io Spotify: https://spoti.fi/30N5FDe Apple podcast: https://apple.co/3FASB2c #Bitcoin #Crypto #investments Timecodes: 0:00 Intro 2:14 White House Innovation Push 5:17 Stablecoin Bill Progress 8:05 Bitcoin Reserve Strategy 11:24 Report, Congress, and Law 14:13 Bipartisan Momentum Grows 16:13 Market Structure Timeline 18:44 Bitcoiners In Government 21:50 Call To Innovate The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own and should in no way be interpreted as financial advice. This video was created for entertainment. Every investment and trading move involves risk. You should conduct your own research when making a decision. I am not a financial advisor. Nothing contained in this video constitutes or shall be construed as an offering of financial instruments or as investment advice or recommendations of an investment strategy or whether or not to "Buy," "Sell," or "Hold" an investment.

This incredible conversation was recorded live in the ArchPublic Lounge at Bitcoin Las Vegas. To dollar cost average into Bitcoin efficiently and to check out all the other algorithms, go to ArchPublic.com. Welcome to Hollywood. So obviously the lowest hanging fruit is stablecoins. The silliest question of all time and lo and behold I can ask that question. I view my office as really being an administrator between White House policy, interagency activity, industry, and what's happening on Capitol Hill. And so, you know, there's a big knowledge gap

that exists with many of these legislators in terms of what this technology does, what Bitcoin is. I literally wake up sometimes at like 3 o'clock in the morning in cold sweats thinking, fire Gary Gensler. The Trump administration is moving quickly to undo the mistakes of the past. As we all know, the Biden administration had a contentious relationship with the crypto industry,

and in just a few months, the Trump administration has begun to dismantle all of the bad policies from before. Nobody is working harder on this than Bo Hein, the executive director of the President's Council of Advisors on Digital Assets of the White House. I sat down with him in the Arch Public Lounge in Las Vegas during the Bitcoin conference to talk about

all of the plans that they have for the crypto industry in the future to make sure that we get sensible legislation and regulation that lasts into perpetuity. Bo Hines is an incredibly, incredibly impressive individual who's clearly gonna go a very long way in politics. If this is just the beginning,

I have high hopes for the crypto industry. Listen to this conversation now. So, Bo, obviously the United States government has gone effectively zero to 100 on crypto, right? To the least. We went from the most contentious possible environment to basically taking the governor off entirely. But I imagine then in your role that there's a lot of noise and it's hard to figure out what the low hanging fruit is,

what the first priorities are. So maybe start with, from your perspective and from the administration's, what are the first priorities, the things you think you can get done the soonest that'll have the most impact? Well, you know, we kind of view this in three phases. We've had the demolition phase

over the course of the last five months, which has been really getting rid of a lot of the red tape, or as we like to call it in the White House currently, blue tape or over regulation, and really just policy that was made through prosecution over the course of the last decade, more specifically over the course of the last four years under the Biden regulatory regime. I feel like we're about 80 to 90 percent of the way home there. And then we'll move on to the construction phase which is really you know we're relying on our colleagues on Capitol Hill to help us out. How do we

enshrine a clear regulatory framework into law and I feel like that's well in process. Obviously the Genius Act is moving full head of steam in the Senate with bipartisan support and then right around the corner will be market structure but you know that gets us to the third phase of this which is implementation. How do we help these TradFi folks understand how to integrate these technologies into their current ecosystems in a way that revolutionizes the financial system more generally? And we'll dive a little bit deeper into Genius, but I think I'd be remiss just not to thank the president for his leadership in this space, giving us the authority to do what we need

to do to clear the deck and create an environment for innovation. Also David Sachs, our brilliant AI and crypto czar, has been phenomenal, he's been the guiding star. And I think we probably should just point back to the first digital assets executive order the president signed on day three, signaling how this is an immense priority for the administration. He created this internal working group,

which shouldn't be lost on folks, because this is comprised of all the relevant interagency actors inside of government that touch anything regarding this space. So you have commerce, you have treasury, you have DOJ, you have the SEC, CFTC. This has created a workflow and allowed us to streamline the process in order to clear the deck of overregulation but also put out fires instantly. Having principle level conversations makes things a lot easier to get stuff done and it allows us to cut through the minutiae that oftentimes is presented with government work. So it's been great. The demolition phase has been a lot of fun to watch. Obviously, for those of us

who were rallying against that for the last four years, all of the obviously regulation by enforcement that you alluded to, you said 80, 90% done. What's the remaining gap there, the things you think that still need to be fixed from previous administration? So you know, as an administration, the president said very clearly, he doesn't believe in independent agencies. And that would include the Federal Reserve.

With that being said, we have Mickey Bowman going in as the vice chair of supervision. She's very pro-digital assets, and we expect them to start issuing pro-innovation guidance in very short order but you know we still expect the Fed to come along but I'd say that there's a little bit of a remaining gap there and look you know in the first digital assets executive order we also had these landmarks that were really important. We had the 30-day

landmark which basically compelled interagency actors to do an internal review or audit of anything they touched in the space, produce that to the working group. The 60-day landmark compelled the same actors to produce a list of recommendations, things that they could do independently to move on creating this more clear environment. And look, you can see what we're doing with this. It's like we're creating this exercise for them to do an internal audit of everything that they've done

over the course of the last decade and try to clean this up on their own. We're working towards the 180-day landmark which will basically be a comprehensive report. I say, I keep saying report, it's more like a book. This will be a book that outlines what is the most robust framework that could possibly exist in the world to permit innovation here in the United States to ensure

that builders can do what they need to do without fear of prosecution. You know, one thing our interagency actors have done is they've been begging us to tell industry, come in and pitch us new ideas. This isn't Gary Gensler's SEC. Come in and register. We've heard that before. Yeah, correct. As they're writing your Wells Notice, as you're sitting there pitching your new idea, before you can leave the building, you've been slapped with that enforcement

action. Those days are long gone. This is a complete sea change in the United States of America. The President understands how immensely. This is a complete sea change in the United States of America. The president understands how immensely important it is for us to spearhead the effort to revolutionize the financial system and really plug these technologies into our current ecosystem as it sits today. So obviously the lowest hanging fruit is stable coins.

And we have multiple bills on the floor. As you said, it looks like it will likely be passed. We have genius in one house and stable in the other house. First of all, maybe we should discuss how you can have two bills coming from two houses and how eventually those will have to merge. But B, we had a little bit of a scare not so long ago when a few Democrats wrote a letter

and even two actually Republicans got on board, Holly and Paul, and basically were able to pause the cloture vote. So is there a chance this doesn't pass? I mean, is that still on the table? So basically what they did was an effective filibuster, right? A lot of this was political posturing, which is unfortunate because at the end of the day,

digital asset issues should be completely nonpartisan. I mean, we're talking about updating an archaic system in which our plumbing of our financial system needs to be completely overhauled. And that's what stable coin legislation does. It creates a pathway for more expeditious payments, instant settlement times, more cost-effective payments. It obviously secures U.S. dollar global dominance

for decades to come. Whether you're Democrat or Republican, I don't know how you fight against that. With that being said, we've gotten past the cloture vote now. We actually picked up numerous Democrats in that process. I think it passed with 69 votes in the Senate. Getting anything done from financial or from Senate banking in a bipartisan way is a monumental feat.

I mean, it hasn't been done in years. And so I think that folks should be conscious of the fact that things are progressing very quickly. I am very optimistic that we're going to get genius passed in the Senate next week and it'll be on the President's desk in short order. That'll give us an opportunity to move towards market structure.

And to answer your question about how this process works between the two chambers, well, the Senate in this particular case has done a lot of heavy lifting in terms of updating their bill, working with their colleagues to get to a place to produce the best product that was much more reflective of what was in the House. And so they working with their colleagues to get to a place to produce the best product that was much more reflective of what was in the House. And so they brought the bill to closer alignment.

That gives our colleagues in the House the ability to put this on the floor and get it on the President's desk, in my opinion. And look, I think that it does everything that we need it to do. It provides the regulatory clarity. It ensures that these issuers are one-to-one backed with US Treasury notes,

which is good for the American economy. It also ensures that they are audited from one of the big fives and basically everything that people were begging for so that banks can actually implement these new payment rails into their systems. And this gives way as the foundation for everything that can be built on top of it.

You're talking about tokenization of public securities in 24 seven markets. If you wanna access those 24 seven markets, you're gonna have to be using a dollar back stable. I mean, you're talking about tokenization of public securities in 24-7 markets. If you want to access those 24-7 markets, you're going to have to be using a dollar-backed stable. I mean, you're talking about pouring trillions and trillions of dollars into the U.S. economy. You're talking about trillions of dollars of U.S. debt being purchased overseas. I mean, this is extremely exciting stuff. And for Bitcoiners, we try to just emphasize how important this is for that ecosystem, because as this money is coming in, and you're able to go in and out of asset classes at will, there's naturally going to be capital

that flows into Bitcoin. And we love Bitcoin. I mean, we've said it repeatedly. We believe Bitcoin is digital gold. We want to harness the asset for the American people. We understand that it's unique, which is why we set up the strategic Bitcoin Reserve the way we did. It's a commodity, not a security as in terms of stored value. As David and I say repeatedly, it has the immaculate conception, right? These are all things that meet a decentralization standard that currently no one else has developed in the ecosystem. It does, in my opinion, to the same way. But that being said, we also have the digital assets national stockpile and this was

our recognition of a lot of the technology that's being built across other ecosystems. We still want to encourage that and foster that innovation here in the United States and allow people to continue to build whether it's in DeFi or beyond and so you know we're extremely excited about where we are. I think that we've you know delivered on many of the president's promises thus far but there's still a lot of work to be done. Let's talk about the strategic Bitcoin Reserve. So obviously we have an executive order but you've alluded to the fact that we need these things

codified in law to make sure that if there ever is regime change that they last. Sure. What's the path to that happening? Obviously Lumis has presented the bill, Nashville, everybody was there when President Trump went off stage and Senator Lumis was obviously one of our favorites to talk to her so many times.

You know, what are the odds of that getting passed? It seems like there's a hierarchy here, stablecoins, market structure, as you said. I'm hearing people talk less about the actual legislation on the Strategic Bitcoin Reserve for now. I think we bought ourselves a little bit of time there just through the executive order. I mean, we've shown what our views are on Bitcoin itself and recognizing it as being unique for what it is. And I think that was a very clear landmark that we've laid down. And so, you know, with that, I think that just providing the clear regulatory framework more generally for everything happening in the digital assets ecosystem gives us the momentum that we need

in order to enshrine the strategic Bitcoin Reserve into law. I think our Democratic counterparts certainly recognize that we have to harness this asset class for the American people and they're certainly going to be countries overseas that are racing to accumulate as much as they can. And I've had this question asked to me repeatedly by journalists like how much do you want? I'm like it's the silliest question of all time and lo and behold I can ask that question. I was going to ask. I mean, I will say very clearly, we want as much Bitcoin as we can possibly get. We have to do this in budget neutral ways that don't cost a taxpayer a dime, but there are countless ways in which we can do it. And you know, if you read the fine print of the executive order, it kicks these innovative ideas over to commerce and treasury to come up with, but we'll flesh these out amongst

our working group actors. We will move expeditiously on those that can be quickly implemented. But it's not one size fits all. It's not like we have to do this in one singular format. There can be hundreds of different ways we do this, if not thousands. And so we talked about this in different verticals, whether it be through mining activity, whether it be through bit bonds. I mean, there's tons of creative things we can do.

Collect taxes in Bitcoin. Yeah, I mean, it's endless. And so people ask me to give clear examples. And the reason I don't want to tell you what we're going to do first yet is because I really don't want to poison the well. We want to do something that's going to be the most effective in the United States. And so when we're ready to announce that,

which I'm sure we will be in short order, I think that this community will be extremely pleased. You talked about the report, which is effectively a book. So you write this book, you go to every agency, you get all the recommendations, you get everyone in line, but you still need to then go to Congress and the Senate and get bills passed. So what is that process like? What impact can you have, you know, without being a congressman or a senator to actually

make sure that the legislation gets done and that they take the recommendations? So I view my office as really being an administrator between White House policy, interagency activity, industry and what's happening on Capitol Hill. And so there's a big knowledge gap that exists with many of these legislators in terms of what this technology does, what Bitcoin is, I mean, even things as simple as that, what blockchains do.

And so just mending the gap in terms of that knowledge gap that exists is extremely vital for us. And so we've really helped with our counterparts in Capitol Hill just in the process of educating. And it's really that simple. As people start to understand how important this is for the American people, they come on side very quickly. And that includes our democratic folks.

There's no reason that this should be partisan. It just so happens that our president is the first Bitcoin president. He's the first crypto president. And therefore naturally there's hesitation from the other side. The system's meant for gridlock. But I'm still confident we're going to deliver on the president's wishes to get both stable coin legislation and market structural legislation on his desk before August recess.

And if we do that and parallel to this 180-year report, hopefully we can use that as a backstop to fill in any remaining questions that might exist within our agency action. I asked David Marcus the same question today, but now that we're getting legislation, you alluded to the fact that we're getting legislation from legislators who aren't necessarily educated on the space. So even if they're making their best effort

or trying their best, isn't there a chance that we get some serious unintended consequences from legislation, things that we don't see that could be coming down the road from the way that these bills are presented, maybe actors that we would like to participate are locked out because of some clause. How do you make sure that the legislation,

I guess, is broad enough to guarantee that it's usable in the future? Yeah, you know, I think that they've done a phenomenal job of that with the Genius Act. Just watching the process unfold, and when I say process, it's more the procedural process and the sense of how this works, how folks interact with one another, how they plug in advice and guidance from the White House and our policy team. I feel as if this bill is truly in a remarkable place.

It successfully captures everything that we are looking for in a sense of providing the clarity, providing a framework that makes sense for traditional financial players to be able to plug into their current ecosystems as well. Because the process is so rigorous, I think that it's actually a healthy exercise because it prevents some of the harm that maybe you might be describing. There are countless eyes that look at this legislation, and I'd be remiss not to, Luke Pettit and really Senator Hagerty, Luke works for Senator Haggerty right now, they have done an incredible job of pushing this thing home,

pulling their Democratic colleagues on board, and really working with Senator Gillibrand on the other side as well. Her team's done phenomenal work. And that's something that I was extremely pleased by because if we build this momentum across the aisle, heading into market structure, I think, the sky's the limit in terms of what we can do, and the sky's the limit in terms of what we can do and the sky's the limit

in terms of what Bitcoin can do and what the other ecosystems can build. Yeah, I think Tether alone is the sixth or seventh largest buyer and holder of United States treasuries, right? So as you said, everybody should be interested. It's in the interest of the country, national security, everything for stable coins to exist. What do you think the stable coin market looks like

if the best version of this bill is passed a few years down the road? Do we have a few huge winners? Do we go into a world where it's private stable coins for every single bank and institution and tech platform? Well, look, I mean, we believe in creating a fair marketplace. The president believes in fair market competition

and more capitalist at the end of the day. I think that's what this bill provides. It provides that fair market competition. It allows other actors to enter the space in a competitive format. We don't believe in anyone in the industry building regulatory modes around themselves. And that's a problem that you can run into.

Oftentimes when industry is out over its skis in terms of the legislators actually being able to provide that clarity, I don't think we're at risk of that now. You know, I think there's folks that do phenomenal work in this space and we want to encourage them to continue to build. I think that there will obviously, you know, be Goliath in this industry like there is in any others, but that'll be a testament to their technology and their teams and the way that they're able to do things internally.

So market structure is next? It's next. I've heard people say that can be done as soon as August. I'm not going to ask you for a specific timeline, obviously. Our goal is to get it done by August. The presidents articulated this at the first ever White House crypto summit. He wants both pieces of legislation on his desk

before August recess. So market structure seems a bit more complex. I think everybody understands stablecoins inherently, at least to some degree. But market structure, we're starting to define what roles custodians will play, what roles exchanges will play, a definitive taxonomy of these assets, what's a security, what's a commodity. It seems like that's much further down the understanding rabbit hole for the people that are going to be doing this legislation.

I'll say this. It is and it isn't because with Genius, there's many other industries that have interest at play, including like the banking lobby and folks like that, and rightfully so, on yield bearing interest provisions and all of that good stuff. And so we had to find the right place to land, which I think we've done on Genius, to foster innovation in this space while also protecting

other parts of the US economy. With market structure, this is more industry specific, so there's not as much outside noise that's there. And for us, because we've had so many meetings with industry folks and continue these conversations on a daily basis, we have a pretty good idea of where folks want to land. And so, you know, that's certainly a leg up for us

as we head into this next phase. And the House moves into markup on their market structure bill on June 10th. I'm sure we'll see a draft from the Senate here in the next couple of weeks. And we'll do the same thing we did with Genius. We'll work to mend the gap between the two chambers and find the right solution, get it on the President's desk. It's interesting you have these working groups, obviously, with the industry.

So we saw, I would say, for the first time in history, the very fragmented crypto industry come together for a singular purpose, obviously, which was to help President Trump win, right? And I think backed him heavily. Now it seems like we're going back to Lord of the Flies, where the lobbies are fragmented and everybody's in their own interest. So how, when you're crafting legislation or advising, do you basically accommodate everybody

while making sure that it's actually the interest of the country and the industry and not of the individual players who are lobbying for their own tokens or projects? I'll say this, the warning that was given to me before I stepped into this role was there's gonna be a lot of fragmentation, there's gonna be a lot of factions that spin off,

and there's gonna be a lot of infighting in the industry. I want people to realize with Genius, it's the first time ever, that all three major trade associations came out and supported the bill, including the Goliaths in the space that stepped up and obviously, you know, played a huge role in the political process in the last few years. That's what it takes to get things done in Capitol Hill. It takes, you know, the industry maturing and saying, look, we're legitimate players in the financial system. We're going to be treated as such. We deserve this regulatory clarity. They did that with Genius. I expect to

see the same thing from market structure. Sure, there will be wrinkles that we have to iron out. I think that our office is positioned very uniquely to help in that process and get this thing home. There's something I found incredibly interesting about this administration. I think we expected that we would get pro-Bitcoin and pro-innovation people in key roles where it mattered, but it feels like every single role in the administration even if it's health or educate whatever they're all Bitcoiners, right? It's how did that seriously but how did that happen?

You know yet Kennedy at health the guys obviously has a meaningful percentage of his net worth has been a Fan of Bitcoin for a very long time even Tulsi Gabb. I I mean, everybody seems to have a pro-Bitcoin stance across the administration. Yeah, I mean, look, we believe in decentralized finance, and we believe in Americans' rights to self-gustody and privacy. And I think that a lot of what undergirded Bitcoin's growth is rooted in that, right?

And I think that the folks that are in this administration all believe in those same core principles. So why wouldn't they naturally be inclined to be supportive of this ecosystem? At the end of the day, I think that we have literally the dream team built out for digital assets and Bitcoin. I mean, with Secretary Lutnick, Secretary Besant, even Hester and Paul over at the SEC, Brian coming into the CFTC, you couldn't ask for a better group of folks to be in place for this industry to thrive. And thankfully, President Trump's leadership

has allowed us to position ourselves to be the leader globally in this space. If he would not have been elected, we would have found ourselves in a really precarious position, not only for the industry itself, but moreover for our position globally in terms of financial enterprise. So we're just overjoyed with the fact

that we get to do this work every day. And I get to work hand in glove with David, whose reputation precedes him. He's one of the most brilliant people in the VC world. And he's certainly been a guiding light and helped, you know, help us move throughout this process seamlessly. It's been a pleasure. I literally wake up sometimes at like 3 o'clock

in the morning in cold sweats thinking fire Gary Gensler. It's almost like a fever dream that he's not even here. It's I mean it's absolutely 180 degrees. Yeah I mean can you imagine four years ago the chair of the SEC walking into a crypto task force that he's hosting and then giving a keynote speech about how they want to welcome innovation in the space in the United States. I mean that would have been completely unprecedented and it is and it's in the United States. I mean, that would have been completely unprecedented, and it is, and it's happening in real time.

I think that we have to catch our breath and just think about the fact that we've been able to accomplish a lot in the first five months. That's not to say there's not more work to be done, and we certainly recognize there is, but we have very clear objectives and we expect to deliver on them. Obviously, crypto is a partisan issue in the past election.

Do you think that now that it's become so clearly politically unpalatable to be part of the anti-crypto army that we can get to a more reasonable approach where it is truly bipartisan? It feels like we're heading in that direction. Oh, I think, I mean, look, having 69 votes in the Senate for anything is a monumental feat, and I think that shows the direction that we're going. I hope when market structure rolls around, we can be in the Senate for anything is a monumental feat. And I think that shows the direction that we're going.

I hope when market structure rolls around, we can be in the 80s. I think our Democratic colleagues need to understand that this is absolutely crucial for the American people in terms of unlocking innovation here at home and welcoming those folks who have gone offshore. I mean, like my message repeatedly has been, welcome home, welcome back to the United States.

You want access to our capital markets, please come and innovate here. And I've said this too, it's like, if we wanna be the crypto capital of the world, people need to be IPO-ing here. They need to be purchasing other businesses here. They need to be supportive of innovation in every way, shape, and form,

and I think that's the environment that we're building. Well, thank you for everything that you're doing. I think that everybody in this room obviously owes the new administration a debt of gratitude and is exceptionally excited that we are where we are now versus maybe where we were at the same conference last year. And thank you so much for your time. Thank you.

We really appreciate it. Let's go.