The Wolf Of All Streets - Is BTC About To Finally Break Out To A New ATH ? | Crypto Town Hall

Episode Date: May 21, 2025

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Morning everybody. Welcome to Crypto Town Hall. Happy Wednesday. We are here every single weekday, 10, 15 a.m. Eastern Standard Time. Bitcoin continuing to push upward yesterday, having once again after doing the same on Sunday, having its highest daily close ever. Sunday was the highest weekly close ever. So right now Bitcoin up about 2.77% trading at $107,535. Most of the major large cap altcoins up about the same. So not necessarily suffering versus Bitcoin, but certainly not in a period right now where they are wildly outperforming. There we go. Bitcoin print's highest daily candle ever. New one today. I have no idea. Dave, I know you have to leave us pretty soon. So love for you to jump in here. We can get this started. Talk about what's happening here at

Bitcoin. Yeah, it's it's it's look, there's there's there's this little force meets a movable object there. I read a couple things over the last couple days. People doing on chain analysis saying that, you know, older OG Bitcoin guys selling at 100k. We know the buyers have been mostly, you know, large pools of capital, who have a holding period that's long. I thought that Eric Balconius made the most important point. Everyone who looked at basis trade this, that, fuck that. He basically showed that IBIT is in the top five of ETFs full stop, not ETFs.

And where was gold, Dave? Where was gold? Gold was number 14. And the reason that's funny, for those of you who don't get the inside joke, is that I had to listen to for two weeks Mike McGlone, you know Traveling on about how gold was about to reverse Bitcoin again and be in the ascendancy and get more money coming in

Come on, you know gold is a mature asset gold is almost 22 $22 trillion 90% of which and I and for those who want to understand the math, I actually posted all the math this morning on a post 90% of gold's 22 trillion is from monetary use, not jewelry, not the small industrial use, whatever. Assuming Bitcoin has no use, which of course is not true, Bitcoin has significant utility for for incentivizing energy rescuing standard, and it's changing energy, et cetera. But just assuming it is no utility, that puts Bitcoin when it reaches parity with gold at somewhere around $950,000 for coin.

And that's in 2025 dollars, and we haven't even gotten into talking about what's gonna happen from here in terms of the big, beautiful bill, which isn't gonna cut anything. And so people who thought austerity was coming are realizing, wait a minute, maybe we need to be a bit more aggressive

in accumulating Bitcoin. And I think that's exactly what's happening. I think that the selling is slowing. And I made a joke a few weeks ago, Scott, remember that? I said, hey, maybe we'll never be able to buy Bitcoin under 100,000 again. It's still unlikely to be true. It's still somewhat joking,

but it's getting closer to what seems to be reality until the next big dump, which might be from 200. It might be from who knows what it will be from, but the next big dump, who knows, we'll get a candle that might pierce it. But it looks like there's plenty of demand here. And that's what we're seeing. And even though this morning, I didn't check now, but earlier when Bitcoin first got up over, in fact, it's still true, risk assets today are having kind of a crappy day.

I mean, NASDAQ is flat, Russell's down close to a percent, the S&P is down a bit, and Bitcoin is ramping. So this narrative of Bitcoin as a risk asset when that finally collapses That's when you're going to get the that you're gonna look at that point FOMO is going to be setting in and we haven't had any FOMO. I mean on Monday we looked at it, but have you looked at credit default swaps lately? the The the market certainly not thinking that the United States is going into austerity and going to be fiscally responsible No, of course not because we can. Our political system is so screwed up. I mean, look, the stable

coin bill is a perfect example. Yes, we got the cloture vote, and if those don't change, it will get passed. But the banking lobby is effectively capable of convincing 40 senators capable of convincing, you know, 40 senators that it's okay for the banks to be subsidized by over $20 billion a year that could be going to their depositors in interest. It's okay for that to happen. It's okay for them to get paid their bonuses, and it's okay for the government to provide insurance for the extra risk that the banking system needs because of the way that they handle fractional reserves. If you could convince 40 senators of that, how hard is it going to be, you know, just

think about that. Now, how hard is it going to be for those same senators to be able to cut something that might bother their constituents? The answer is when it's other people's money, people like to spend it. And it's really, really hard to do anything about it. And so that's what's going on. Yeah, I just actually put in the nest above Austin Campbell, who's friend of the show, obviously here, guy all the time, his amazing tweet about what you just described,

I'm assuming that's what even made you think about it. Because I Oh, yeah, Austin and I being, you know, center right versus center left, but we realize we agree on about 80 to 90 percent of all issues. It doesn't matter what our registrations are. And that's really the point. I mean, this is something that we are all in crypto. This is crypto town hall. Why are we in crypto? People will hate to admit the first one. The first one is we're in crypto to make money. Okay, cool. But the other thing is we want, we're in crypto because we believe it's a better way forward. Yes, many of us can't stand the grip that happens. And we don't like when we see bad things

and bad actors and it gets us pissed off. But ultimately, it's a more inclusive system that is more competitive system that provides more power to the user than to the central oligopolistic companies in the financial markets and in other verticals as well. And that's a perfect example of that. But if you want to know why Bitcoin is rising, Bitcoin is rallying because it's the best asymmetric that people can make. You want to know why all coins are rising? Because they're drafting off of Bitcoin. At the same time, people understand that basic narrative. And so yeah, that's what I think this morning. I mean, am I getting excited?

No, I mean, it's not FOMO. This is a mild move. This is a hated rally. It's exactly what we want to have happen. We want it to grind higher. So Bracey, good to see you. I think I just saw you in Dubai for about five minutes. I saw you somewhere recently in person.

You're obviously a CEO of BitGit, you can track what behavior you're seeing from traders. Dave actually been pointing out pretty frequently that the Bitcoin move to the upside has really been driven by spot, just people buying spot and not really crazy funding rates or anything crazy on the derivative side. Is that what you're seeing at BitGit? Well, yeah, again, very happy to see you again, Scott. And by the way, I'm also in London now. So get to travel a lot recently and talking to always, always, always traveling. I think I've seen you everywhere. Every time I've traveled, I've seen you. A little bit too much trouble though. So I get to hear lots of experts from various industries, especially TrackFi and within our crypto industry.

But back to your question, while running a crypto exchange, we actually see both games from derivative side and spot side. So the fact that BigGit were pretty strong on derivatives since 2018 when we started, and we just grow our spot market about two years ago by having more listing strategy, very good on-chain offering to our users, especially this year. So I wouldn't say that what we see

is that Spot is just like leading everything, then derivative we do see growth from both sides. But I think that might be biased due to, you know, who we are and what we're good at. Yeah, that makes sense. I guess then the next question is when we see these sort of lower funding rates, does it mean that there's no major consensus or just like huge FOMO in the market that would be driving everybody in one direction? Because it seems pretty even. Yeah, I agree on that, though.

If we look at Bitcoin price when it was 75k, which was just slightly more than a month ago. At that time, we see a much clearer direction. Everyone, especially who are more like traders and experts, do think that's very much like the bottom that we see in this cycle, which I personally agree. I also bought lots of Bitcoin that day. So glad that I did that. Me too. Kudos to that. So at that I did that. Me too.

Kudos to that. So at that time, the direction was much clearer. But once Bitcoin surpassed 100k, which is psychologically a very important point, since last time, the all-time high was pretty much here. We never really surpassed 110k, which again, we see lots of resistance now. So in terms of funding rate and we measure direction and how people think about the market,

I think right now it's much more vague. There are slightly selling pressure, especially from the OGs who hold lots of Bitcoin from early days versus lots of institutional adoption. So one interesting data I want to point out is that if we look at Google search on Bitcoin, right now it's actually at a five-year low point. In like 21 May-ish, it was like 100 in terms of the Google index. And now it's only 25. So as a comparison, Bitcoin price is at its all-time high. Very much like the all-time high. But the interest from the retail side is actually pretty low. So I think that also points out to the fact

that the current adoption is very much driven by institutional and also national adoptions like US passing Bitcoin as part of strategic reserve, as well as some states and some other nations versus just retail users buying like the previous cycle that we saw. Yeah, we keep discussing this narrative that the OG whales are selling.

What do you make of them deciding to sell at this point? Don't usually, I mean, maybe they're just funding their lifestyle. It's a great price. They've been in since it's pennies. So it makes a lot of sense. But it seems when you see it as a trend, it's worth watching. Yeah, why they are selling, I would say people, there are still people who think that Bitcoin will just act as the four year cycle as we saw previously. However, I don't really agree on that. I think, like I said, right now it's largely driven by M2 supply and institutional adoption,

which doesn't really care about the four year cycle as we did before. Previously Bitcoin price was largely affected by mining, which will be affected by the four year cycle. So, so I think this is a mindset shift and also within the past two years, one or two years after the ETF was approved in the US by CC, we also kind of see this shift from, again, the previous OGs, Wells, retails, to institutions. So it's a shift of users and adoption that we are seeing. And I kind of see this becoming like a shift part is very much towards the end. Lots of users exiting or have exited in terms of retail users

and lots of institutions are coming in. And another data I wanna share, as you know, I'm a statistics person. And the data I wanna share is that in the US, oh sorry, in the world, that by end of 2024, there are actually 75 public companies in the world that by end of 2024, there are actually 75 public companies in the world, including US, Canada, Japan, various jurisdictions who hold Bitcoin as part of their company's reserve. And we are seeing a lot more companies doing that this year, just like MicroStrategy, which everyone, you know, respects the microsailer.

We think he's a little bit crazy buying a lot, but also what he has been doing for the past few years after the pandemic is a miracle, which I have to admit. And lots of other companies using spec, ETF, are also trying to mimic that. I guess, since I have you, one last question before we kind of go to the rest of the panel, what kind of behavior are you seeing in Bitcoin versus altcoins right now? Because I mean, anecdotally, this move we saw sort of from the mid-90s on Bitcoin up to where we are now,

actually, as big as it was, it was the first time in many years really that altcoins performed stronger sort of on that move. Bitcoin dominance went down, Bitcoin price went up. So what do you make of sort of that interplay between Bitcoin and right now the altcoin market? Does that indicate maybe there's actually new money coming in or there's more speculative interest?

How are you viewing that? Well, from a larger aspect in terms of the whole industry, I think Bitcoin is very much dominating. And since there's mainly institutional adoptions coming in, they are comfortable holding, you know, BTC, ETH, Solana, but they may even not feel comfortable holding Trump, Bitcoin, and a lot more other coins. So from the, you know, the general perspective, not feel comfortable holding Trump, Mimicoin, and a lot more other coins.

So from the general perspective, I would say we still see a lot more trends in terms of Bitcoin dominating the user's interest and user's attention. However, since I'm running Ascent Traces Exchange, which offers more than 700 tokens in the world. We are not an ETF provider. We are not. Also, we don't have like a listed company spec, etc. So we are still targeting mainly retail users. And from their behavior, they are very much interested in altcoin. And we are probably one of the major altcoin exchanges providers in terms of that. Again, I think this data is biased.

That's why I kind of want to divide that into two categories. Like if we look at the industry as a whole, or if we look at the central exchange business as itself. That's really interesting. But we don't often get the perspective from the CEO of a centralized exchange to share it with us. So I think that that's really valuable, even if it's not necessarily reflective of the entire market. So interesting to hear what you're seeing there. I would love the rest of the panel as well as feelings on Bitcoin's current price, where we are now.

I think we have this split and Gracie said it even anecdotally from what they're seeing on the exchange. But I think there's a lot of people saying, hey, we're going straight to 150 here. It's pressing up against resistance. And then flip side people say, we're at resistance, this thing's about to drop. So it's one of those moments

where it feels very 50-50 in sentiment. Mark, go ahead. And then Joe, I think I saw you lift your mic as well. So after Mark, go ahead, Mark. Hey, Sky, thanks. And thanks for that. Glad we got you up here. Yeah, I know, I know.

Grace, thanks for that insight on the retail side. So I'd like to share sort of a barbell approach from my aspect. More on the institutional side, that's where I grew up. And now I'm speaking to both, the registered investment advisor community, but also traveling. I'm here in Texas following a couple of events

that Adam Back's group is hosting. And the one comment I'll say is, Adam Back, one of the nine people mentioned in the Bitcoin white paper, in my opinion, a credible guy, he knows what he's doing, he's been in the Bitcoin white paper, in my opinion, a credible guy. He knows what he's doing. He's been in the space. It's drawing like as if there was a minor league baseball player coming to town. It's still not getting the throngs.

So we are still early in that realm when we're hitting major cities and you're getting real people in the room, but they're only like five or six managing directors from banks or it's not drawing everybody So it's growing but totally not there um on the other side Bitcoin is dug in in my opinion like a georgia tick into our system now and I think the the the most

Impactful statement came from besant On sunday. I don't know if you guys saw that jake tapper interview. And Dave, I don't know if he's still on the call here, but anyone who ever managed or risk managed an institutional portfolio, when you have a portfolio manager come in your office and say, I just inherited a portfolio, which is what Besant said. I inherited a 6.7% deficit. His words. I just inherited that. I think instead of trying to reduce it, which is what you want to hear out of your portfolio manager, I have a problem. Things are not going great.

I want to reduce my risk. He said, I want to grow us up. We're going to grow our GDP. He is hammered down. Deficit's getting bigger, GDP is going to try to grow his way out of the debt. That is, I think, one of the top three statements I've heard out of an official that has a decades long implication. So I don't know the near term directions to the team here about where Bitcoin's going, but you know, use leverage at your own peril in Bitcoin. But hold on, because it has a ratchet one way, Scott, I think, given what Besim said and the realities of the debt. Yeah, I agree with that. Joe, did you have a comment? And then after Joe, David, Gary. For sure. Yeah. Morning, Scott. And yeah, I think we got to, Gracie, we got to get your data updated.

We can't just use Google search. You got to use lunar crush data and understand how many people are talking about Bitcoin on social. But the sentiment is still right. We are seeing an all time, you know, in term low of how many people are talking about Bitcoin and specifically altcoin. Don't want to be on the meat rabbit hole, but it's absolutely silent over there right now compared to where the market is at, which is pretty incredible to be honest. And then, you know, looking at Bitcoin Treasuries, it's a great point, right? Three or four, well, at the moment, certain companies that are holding Bitcoin, how you have or your public companies. Hey, Joe, your mic is super glitchy.

Can we bring you down and up? I can't hear what you're saying. Unfortunately. Is that, is that for everyone else? It might just be on my end, but I think I'll try Scott. Thanks. Yeah.

Okay. Yeah. David, go ahead and then we'll bring Joe down and up. Yeah. I just wanted to dovetail on the remarks about Scott Besson. There is a G7 finance ministers meeting this week up in Canada. And you know, if if Besant wants to try to grow the economy, it seems to be part of the policy of the administration to talk down

the dollar. The dollar on its own has been at 20-year high levels previously, weakening during the early days of the administration. I think it's got further to go. One might argue dollar hedges historically would be seen as perhaps being gold. Obviously, this is the time for Bitcoin to actually move into that space as well. So I think in terms of the call being up and to the right, can't disagree at all. I actually think it's better for positioning.

Yeah. Florian, where do you stand on the current Bitcoin price action? Thanks for having me again. Well, I think it looks all pretty promising here. As you know, seasonality should be good into mid-June, I would say. So I think we're going to see a new all-time high rather sooner than later. And my price target, best case, 125-ish, I would say that's the target out of this big cup and handle pattern. And then we should get a summer doldrums pullback towards September, October, and then into the last quarter. Yeah, I guess the, the,

the grand finale of this cycle. So that's my take right now. Trying to get Joe back on stage. I'm a tail. I can't hear you either because it's X Joe. Go ahead and try again. Can anybody hear Joe? Or is this just a game of testing? There you are. I mean, it's almost as I wonder.

Sometimes I wonder if it's the tech or if you guys just like have a call right before to fuck with me. Whenever you close and open the app too, it messes with it. So it's like you can't check anything else. You have to just be completely focused on this space when you're on here. So that's what you got to do. Yeah. It's basically like you guys all get together and say, hey, we're going to not answer anything Scott says. Just as many awkward silences as possible. Okay. Go ahead. Your mic sounds great.

Sorry about that. Yeah. I mean, something that's interesting that we're looking at too is a lot of people are, it's all about Bitcoin right now and Bitcoin treasury companies and sovereign entities. Everyone's buying Bitcoin and everyone said, oh, there's not gonna be this rotation into all coins.

Bitcoin treasury is everything, but lo and behold, Bitcoin being up 30 to 40% in the last month, Ethereum is now up almost 60% in the last 15, 16 days. And we are going to see some sort of rotation into the rest of the market. It might seem small to a lot of institutional folks, but adding $160 to $180 billion in market cap to Ethereum is a pretty big impact, can have a pretty big impact on the rest of the market and the rest of the utility tokens that are going to be launched. And it's a lot of money locked and loaded with really interesting, a lot of cool startups

that are going to be coming out. A lot of stuff we're seeing on gaming, a lot of stuff is focused on Bitcoin specific technology and payments. You're going to see as Bitcoin gets adopted more, you're going to see cool technologies come out around payments. Lightning Network is out there. We're seeing some fast food chains adopting that. People are going to be able to pay in Bitcoin and they're going to start

bypassing this other fiat system pretty easily and utilizing stablecoins, utilizing Bitcoin specific. You know, Gemini launched a credit card, you get 4% back on Bitcoin. You know, you're going to see the integrations happening where people are just going to tap their phone and pay with Bitcoin, they're going to pay with Ethereum, they're going to be able to pay with 10,000 other different cryptocurrencies. And that's a really interesting place for the technology adoption that everyone keeps having questions about.

You know, these are all things that it's kind of all things that like tried to be long four or five ago, but the adoption isn't there. But now we're actually seeing the adoption happening. Yeah, your mic was starting to glitch there again at the end, but we caught all of it. But I actually something just you made me think of this. It's kind of not directly related, but I hadn't even seen it now. It's a friend of a friend of mine uses Robinhood as his main platform for effectively everything.

I guess taxes just rolled around and he looked at his account and he's holding, you know, a multimillion dollar portfolio we'll say, but primarily crypto, primarily spot crypto, a lot of mining stocks, and then maybe 40% of it other securities. And he was able to take a cash out margin loan at sub 5% for the entirety of his tax bill against actually his spot crypto holdings on Robinhood. And I had zero idea that that was possible on Robinhood now.

And he said they just launched that. I haven't seen the announcement about that. I haven't seen that mentioned, but we're sitting here talking all the time about like, what if you were on Schwab and you could just put your Bitcoin holdings on Schwab and like the rest of your portfolio, take a margin. And this isn't even just like margin on the platform.

He was literally able to take the cash out, pay his taxes. Then everything went up 25% right after he did that. He paid back the loan, had profit and his taxes were paid. There's too much news. You can't, there's too much happening where you can't keep track of it. I mean, even some of the DeFi protocols, I mean, that's been possible for a long time. You just had to make one more little jump.

Right. Back through a stable coin to, to, to Fiat. Robinhood is going to make it a lot easier. But the adoption is coming once the banks let you hold Bitcoin, that option is going to be there. They're eventually going to let you hold a lot of the altcoins, especially some of the more decentralized one. You can take margin out there. It's just going to happen. Robinhood is a bank. That was the news last month. Robinhood is a bank, right? And then that was effectively missed. Coinbase obviously is going for a banking charter. I mean, this is the absolute future is that this just becomes a part of your overall portfolio that you can use in all the ways that people, especially wealthy people, have

used to, you know, be tax efficient and move their money and grow it in the past. Mark, go ahead. Hey, Scott. Yeah, I was saying that is the financialization of Bitcoin is something that Maxie's a little nervous about, et cetera. It's gonna happen. And it's one reason why people say, not your keys, not your coins and hold your Bitcoin

because eventually you can borrow against it and move it. and you can't do that with an ETF as easily. And what you're saying now is that if you have that ETF at Robinhood, you can borrow against it. It wasn't even an ETF, Mark. He's spot Bitcoin on Robinhood. That's awesome. At sub five. Yeah. So same as it. So like he did, I asked him, he's actually getting it for me. I was like, he said he didn't really look. I was wondering what the breakdown was on the interest rates on the different assets in the, in the portfolio. But he said that more than 50% of his assets were spot crypto assets.

And unless this is anecdotal, so I'm going to get the evidence, but still absolutely crazy to me that he was able to do that. And it was about 50% of his portfolio he was able to take. So I mean, it's wild. Yeah. That's just going to... People say spend Bitcoin because that's good. Borrowing that's a...

Buy, borrow, die. Yeah. That's... Right. Well, not much I can say after that, Scott. That's exactly the answer. And one other anecdote is you know We all talked to our friends normies about Bitcoin, etc

One of my good friends said yeah, I bought two I'm like, that's awesome You bought two Bitcoin went, you know, and he didn't he bought two million dollars worth the other two like the other two The other two and he said like, the other two. The other two. And he said, when it went down to 75, I got a little, so now you have normies who took a 30% or, you know, they've already endured it over the last little while. So I'm very constructive again on that barbell approach, like Grace was saying, retails in, if you make it easy for me to borrow against it, they've endured a drawdown.

We're going higher from here. It's a, it's a pretty constructive environment. I just, who said it's the news? There's too much news? I don't know. I found Joe jumped in and said there's too much news. It's true. I mean, you can't keep up with what these platforms are doing.

I mean, somehow it was only our topic for like 20 minutes that JP Morgan is opening, you know, Bitcoin trading to 90 million customers. Yeah. Yesterday. But great. Well, always begrudgingly, but they love money. Gary, you had your hand up. Bitcoin trading to 90 million customers. Yeah. Yesterday. Always begrudgingly, but they love money. Gary, you had your hand up. Go ahead. Yeah, I love the comment Mark made about the tick, the Jarja tick. The analogy I use, when I met you, Scott, three or so years ago, the analogy I use is, oh, Bitcoin is like mercury. It's going to find every big crevice crack and inefficient margin that's being taken by a monopoly construct,

and it's going to eat it up. And that is exactly what's happening. This lending thing, I've been shopping these lending rates around for 12 months. I have literally seen rates go from 15% From a Bitcoin company. I just said don't ever fucking call me again. Your offer is so antithetical against Bitcoin It's like it's so obscene 15% I'm now getting rates below 8 and everything you guys are saying is it's 5 and 6 and and everything you guys are saying is it's five and six and this is most certainly happening. We're at 107, 800. MetaPlanet had a 50% move today. They're trading at 53.54% move today. They're trading at what?

$11.00. Saw $12.00 print. You know, there is so much news here and I well Eleven dollars saw twelve Grant you know There is so much news here, and I don't think anyone's in this I think there's a lot of players to your point Scott hey he bought two or whoever shared that story hearing that story all the fucking Yeah, put 40 to what about 40 is 40 million. That was his first entry 400 million, you know billionaire so My brother sitting there. He's gonna do 13 of these funds. He's gonna have to buy a thousand Bitcoin at some point You know and he's just seen a 30% move against him

So it's wild. We are living in the middle of history and this is happening right now. The tick is so buried in. This is the greatest Trojan horse story in probably 4,000 years. I, it's just amazing. So thank you for letting me share. Yeah, I agree. And Gary, to your point, the crypto and I guess we'll call them crypto

native, even with their Bitcoin native, but Bitcoin lending, from what I've seen primarily the ones I've talked to and I've tested it actually, primarily it's your Bitcoin gets converted to wrapped Bitcoin and then it goes into DeFi, Aave or some secure kind of OG protocol for the safer ones. When you go from that, even at 7%, 8%, that's good, but regardless, you, the platform may not have counterparty risk, but you always have some sort of DeFi or smart contract risk. I'm not saying that's not worth taking, but it's there.

When you're on Robinhood or Schwab and it's just bundled with the rest of your portfolio at sub 5%, you're, I don't know what they're doing with it precisely. I can't tell you what they're doing with spot Bitcoin or doing it, but seems like a safer bet in the legacy system, even than probably being on one of the native platforms. I'm wondering how they actually are able to do the lending on that on a Robinhood or something similar. Amitai, go ahead. Yeah, I just love these comments. I think in the short term, as we push through all 10 ties, we'll get a big push off and then we'll get one of your classic bearish divergences, Scott, but I don't think it's going to be much for a long-term timeframe.

Yeah, exactly. So I mean, I think we're starting to print that in, which will cause a little bit of a correction and we'll probably get a lot of noise that the top is in. I just don't think the top is in. I don't think anyone here thinks the top is in. The headlines definitely don't communicate that. Another piece of news that had happened was that Bybit was getting approved to allow equity trading with USDT. And I think

ultimately what we're going to start to see is this embedded element of where Bitcoin becomes hyper-functional with all the other assets. And then we get real world assets become on chain. And then you have this, you know, an actual commodity that is digital, that is secure, that replaces gold, that can be borrowed against, that can actually be leveraged into the rest of the economy. I mean, that's just remarkable. And when you look at the BTC market cycle ROI from the bottom, one of my favorite charts into the cryptoverse chart, we're way under trend.

And even if you assume diminishing returns with how much liquidity it takes to move this thing, it just shows that we have such a long way to go before we start to print to top here in this cycle. I don't think the headlines are slowing down. I don't think the integrations of Bitcoin into the global economy is slowing down. And certainly, corporations, sovereign wealth funds acquiring isn't slowing down either. I mean, as you're talking, I'm really quickly scanning through the news headlines in our group. And I had to the point of there's so much news that we can't even keep up with it.

There's things in here that I literally had no idea had even happened that in and of themselves in a vacuum or two years ago would have been massive stories. For example, according to a recent portfolio filing, Blackstone's alternative multi-strategy fund disclosed holding 23,094 shares of iBit. This marks the first time Blackstone has publicly reported a Bitcoin related position. I did not see that. We've barely even been talking about the fact that the Texas House of Representatives has passed the strategic Bitcoin reserve bill in its second reading. We've obviously talked about Arizona and New Hampshire, but Texas is very, very close to getting this done. And then I don't know if you saw Vivek Ramaswamy's strive, plans to establish a Bitcoin reserve by acquiring 75,000 Bitcoins, that's $8 billion, from claims related to the Mt. Gox bankruptcy.

This is Strive obviously trying to compete as a Bitcoin treasury company, but finding a more novel or interesting way to gain that exposure than just through the debt offerings that we've seen from others. This news is crazy. Blackstone, Did anybody even see that Blackstone news? This thing's embedded deeper than a Georgia tick, Scott. That is a Georgia tick the size of a Godzilla. I'm using that, by the way, Mark. I'm sending that to a bunch of CEO banks in Georgia this afternoon. I'm using that line. Good.

Scott, while you're talking, you're at 108.4. There you go, 108.4. Alternate expression might be dug in deeper than a chigger as opposed to a Georgia tick. We talk about chiggers a lot more in Florida, to be honest. We got ticks too though. Yeah, but chiggers. I haven't heard those mentioned in quite a while. But this is, I mean, I think that really is just a huge story right now, the velocity

of news and that there's no way to keep up. Yeah. And Scott, on that point about Vivek's buying of the Mt. Gox paper at a discount, back in 23, Fertree wrote something out against GBTC. They were buying this stuff at discount They were trying to force a you know, a collapse of the discount a lot of folks bought all those Claims out of the Celsius stuff. So Wall Street started getting involved in 23 through the distress guys because distress guys go I don't know what frickin Celsius does but once it goes through a

bankruptcy claim court and goes into their process then they can see it in that language. So you have these firms like Blackstone and other ones they've been doing work for years because their turnaround groups got involved through the distress process in the last winter. So now when summer comes it'll go to the liquid folks to the current current guys. They'll pass along the information. So it's already in the system through the distress cycle. So this is phenomenal. So it's news, but it actually has been happening for a few years. Yeah.

I mean, there's a guest we have quite often, Thomas Brazile, who's been here and just specializes in those bankruptcy claims. And they just absolutely cleaned up on those FTX claims. Because if you remember in the early days of the FTX claims and to your point, there was a lot of institutions that cleaned up as well. Those things were selling for I think less than 10 cents on the dollar. Before Anthropic and before they managed to find $8 billion and all the investments went well and Solana obviously went up.

I mean, those claims ended up paying you at par or something and they were buying up 10 cents on the dollar. Yeah. So Wall Street, the Distress Guys bought those claims at 10 cents on, they got paid out 10 times their money. The people who lost obviously were the people who put their coins in at FTX at full par, and they got $16,000 back. So they got paid the cash value when it went under in November of 2011, but the Wall Street

guys got paid 10% of 16,000. So it's just classic how fraudsters just destroyed retail and then Wall Street came in and cleaned up. So when Wall Street comes in now, their eyes wide open, they know it and we should all be paying attention. I mean, the bankruptcy process is the biggest scam. I mean, speaking of those claims,

I think I've shared this story before. Charlie Shrem, both of us were involved in the Voyager bankruptcy, sadly, had a large amount of assets on that platform. He calls me, it must have been November 2nd or 3rd of, I guess, 22, and says, listen, I just sold my Voyager claim to this guy, Thomas, the same guy. He says, they're selling at 75 cents on the dollar or something. They're buying them up. I was like, wow, that seems really high.

Let me talk to the guy. So I'm walking down the street calls me and he says, yeah, we can do that. I said, okay, I'm out. That's great. Let's do it. Let's go through the process. Let's circle back tomorrow. FTX collapsed that day.

And then the claims went to like 20 or 30 cents. They're offers. So I missed it by 24 hours on the exit. But I did get a window into the fact that that was wildly popular and will continue to be but I didn't know that the mount gox claims were still out there like this because there's been so much promise of the payback. I don't understand why at this point, would be selling a Mt. Cox claim. Where's the market for that? Yeah, when you find out, just drop that phone number in the chat here. Exactly. When you find out, call me and let me know what the discount is. Yeah, it's interestingly, I mean, do we have any indication, I think, of why Bitcoin is pushing so hard right now? I mean, Gary, like you said, it's at it's 109 i mean it's 108.851 uh is what i just saw the 108.824 we're gonna test the all-time high today i don't see like i mean it's there it depends on the exchange but that it's too much momentum here yeah it's crazy i great gracy you're not watching this in real time, I assume, on the exchange to see what's happening, right? You're a little too busy for that.

I'm not. But yeah, exchange, the ETF institutions are also adopting a lot. Depends on what time. Right now, it's basically driving by the US market since Asia is sleeping already. Yeah it feels like the big price moves actually generally happen on US hours now which is a big change because I remember always you know like I was going to sleep and I would see a huge move because Asia had just opened up. Yeah that's a quite clear shift. What do we pick in the all time high, I guess? I mean, it was over 109. Yeah, I think it won't even. Yeah, there's there's been liquidations above 109.3 on Binance.

Yeah, Scott, I think, you know, something people aren't paying attention to. I mean, that's, you know, so much news, but bringing it back to macro a little bit is bond yields. Right? Like we're seeing these bond yields specifically in Japan, just shooting through the roof. And, you know, where's the rotation? Where's the safety? And, you know, Bitcoin is it now. And, you know, the Bitcoin Treasury companies, it's a huge diversification and everyone's adopting as fast as they can. You know, we kind of pegged back to that MicroStrategy or that strategy conference in Florida. It was insane what was happening and how many people were down there trying to adopt the strategy.

Every phone conversation I have now is not even just about adopting Bitcoin. It's about which company is going to be the strategic reserve for all the different layer ones that are out there, the mature ones. You talk to any of the heads of some of the foundations at a lot of these layer ones and that's what they're talking about. Then you've got other foundations that hold a shit ton of Bitcoin too. Look at people like Tezos? Look at people like Block One, right? They're going to... Some of this deployment is going to go out there.

Yeah, there's a great website. I don't even know what they do, but it's just Bitcointreasuries.net. And it's kind of people are... That's where the people are going now to kind of check who's got what. Block One blows my mind, man. Yeah. I mean, 160,000 Bitcoin. I mean, there's...

160,000 Bitcoin because of the ICO for EOS. Hey, more power to them. Every max in the world would love that. They still have 160,000 in Bitcoin and I'm not sure if you, and this is not fun, I literally have no idea if EOS still exists or is built, is that the thing? You would know. Yeah, they exist still. They run like Bullish.

I know they run Bullish, which owns CoinDesk and all of those. I just didn't know if EOS as a chain was something that was still in theory being built. I don't know how much building is actually happening over there, but it's definitely, people still buy and sell. I'm sure Gracie knows how much volume is over there, but it's definitely, you know, people still buy and sell. I'm sure Gracie knows how much volumes over there. Scott, do you remember their social platform that they tried to launch? Which one was that? I don't know.

I'm trying to remember. I think it was connect something, but, uh, they invested a lot into it. It wouldn't belly up. And after that, it just seemed like they, they pivoted to sort of building on chain to building the reserves and going a different route. One billion dollar market cap with 200 billion traded daily. So you know that all that market making money is just getting pumped right back in

to maybe buying other assets. Incredible. What a time to be alive. What did they raise in their ICO? Six billion, eight billion, something like that. I mean, and then that money just gets to sit there at $160,000 Bitcoin. Abhatel, I think you just gave me the greatest segue because I see that we have a wonder social on stage. Obviously, EOS had that social network. We've seen quite a few attempts, I think, over time at decentralized social networks to some degree.

And you guys are here, I see you on stage. And aren't you literally launching today, or at least token? We certainly are. Four o'clock UTC. For doing this timing. Amateo, you're hired for doing these segues. Well, since we have you guys here, obviously as a sponsor today, maybe you can give us the breakdown.

I'm reading right now on your page. Decentralized social platform has launched its native token empowering creators and users to own their identities, earn rewards and shape a community driven web three social ecosystem. There's a movement to redefine the internet with user ownership at its core. As I'm going through here, you guys raised a ton of money.

It's very real, right? You raised like $50 million more. Yes, we went for an initial equity round at the start just to get us off the ground. And then we launched initially as a Web2 initiative. And then to tackle some of the issues that we're facing or that we're trying to sort of tackle, we then looked down the Web3 route and just the sort of use of the issues that we're facing or that we're trying to sort of tackle, we then look down the Web3 route

and just the sort of use of the Web3 technology. So that's when we decided to launch Token. But yeah, the funding side of it has been quite... And what is the issue that you saw on the Web2 side that Web3 actually solves? Well, the whole idea came around actually during lockdown to myself. It was, you know, I think everyone sees it in the paper, Well, the whole idea came around actually during lockdown to myself.

It was, you know, I think everyone sees it in the paper, in the news every day, just regarding sort of toxicity around social media. It's just turned into a bit of a cesspit. So it's like initially we looked at why the big boys weren't doing much to tackle these things. And we did a hell of a lot of research with the first investment round to try and establish why they weren't doing anything, what we could do about it, what was out there, what Gen Z initially were looking for, where their pain points were. So we feel like a lot of the toxicity and authenticity will be based around our fully verified element.

So to get into our platform, you have to be fully verified. That's something that none of the big guys can just pivot on and do straight off the bat. They'll lose a lot of users and most of them are public companies and that's just not viable. So when you look at verification, SSI is obviously a great way to get around that. There's other elements. We've got money moving around our app, giving back to users in the form of our ad share revenue, which they can then pay forward to good causes.

We share revenue with creators. So there's money flying around. So the web 3 tackles a lot of those elements for us. So effectively, it's adding the ability for someone to actually monetize their own work and data to some degree and earn rewards rather than a centralized company like a Google or someone like that. Is that correct? Yeah, in a nutshell, I'm sorry, Kayden here.

I'm like, damn, your voice just changed dramatically. I was trying to, how many, can you just give us a preface? How many of you guys are there? I just wanna... It's three of us, yeah, we got Ryan, the CMO, myself, Kayden, I couldn't just write you guys all up, but I love this. At the end, if you guys don't do a Backstreet Boys song,

I'm gonna be very disappointed. You don't wanna hear that, believe me, you don't wanna hear that. We're all. At the end, if you guys don't do a Backstreet Boys song, I'm going to be very disappointed. You don't want to hear that. Believe me, you don't want to hear that. We're all had around the mic. We got together for a big week for TGE, so we thought we'd just jump on one space with you guys. So yeah, you're not. Continue on. You just threw me off there for a second. I love it. That's all right. Well, yeah, so basically it's all driven by the wonder identity. So the premise of it is give people power to own their own identity. Don't give that to the centralized organizations.

We're all guilty of doing login with something at some point or another, whether that be Facebook or Google or whatever platform is your preference. But you're handing over the power of your data to those platforms, and it's exploited. We've seen it over countless time over the last few years. It all started with the big Cambridge Analytica scandals,

and then we're seeing more and more whistleblower stuff. You're handing over the power to your data, to a centralized organization to exploit. The thing is, all of that is driven by the fact they want to sell your eyeballs. They sell your eyeballs, they get the data, they repump that back into the platform, they give that to support their ad spend

and so on and so forth. It's a perpetual cycle because the whole model is driven by that ad revenue. There's no alternatives. So they can't step away from it. By introducing blockchain technology, we provide additional revenue streams, not only for the creators, but us as a business.

And then we don't have to sell our soul to then sell your soul. You know, we can approach it in an entirely different way to the rest of the market. We can say, OK, we'll provide the conversation space. You bring the conversation, and you own the conversation. We're not here to be draconian. We're not here to mute you, shadow ban you, silence you. You're in your own communities.

You support one another, and you make the decision. But ultimately, all of that data resides with you. Now that can then be further monetized and we do have mechanisms in place to monetize that data. But it's all done in a revenue share model. So if we sell the data, then we share that revenue back to the data candidates, you know, you ultimately own it. And it's all done on chain. It's all done with secret contracts, because we've partnered up with the guys at Secret Network and with the guys at SilentSwap. So all of it happens under the hood. And it's all kind of between you and... Wait, you said Secret Network and SilentSwap? Those are both effectively privacy protocols, right? So clearly that's an important element

if those are the partnerships that you have. 100% yeah, it's privacy driven, privacy first, right? It's all about giving privacy and ownership back to the consumer. So we were using a secret network, secret AI, we're leveraging that to create a secret algorithm. So you privately own your experience on the app, what you see, how you see it, you create your own social graph. It's nothing to do with us. If you want to expose that social graph, you'll get paid for it. Right? It's as simple as that. And you'll share in the revenue from it. If you want to stop other AI bots training their data on yours, that's what our AI is all about. It's all about having an agent-based AI that wraps up your privacy. We're doing this from a protocol level and social, Wunder Social itself is the first outlet for that,

but we expect in the future, once we've built this social experience for everybody and people have their Wunder identity, we'll be opening up that protocol for other platforms to then come on. So, you know, as an example, once you've got your Wunder identity, which is delivered via a ZK proofs method,

you own that in your wallet, so it's held inside your application locally to you and obviously on chain You then can use that to get in and out of other platforms What like traditional SSO platforms in the web to world so we'll be bringing people in but you build up a reputation Score over time and you build up information that's all done on zero knowledge proofs So if another platform comes on and says which is a big talking point at the moment You've got to be over 16 to be on our social network. Okay, great. Boolean goes across and says, this person's been verified, they are over 16.

They haven't had to share any information. They haven't had to infringe on their privacy, and away they go. They do that with wonder off the bat. One of the things we are tackling, because we believe deeply in about it, and we all have children, and we want to protect their well-being in the future, is actually have the right people on the platforms. If this isn't suitable, if we're seeing now the rise of social media from Web2 over the last two decades has had a negative effect on young people, where there is a push to

remove people from those platforms, the platforms have a responsibility to do something about it and they're not willing to do it. We believe without infringing someone's privacy and data, we can do that. And that's where Web3 technology is just so important. And why the Wonder Token is so important, because that powers that entire ecosystem. And that's why we've done it. So we ended up here organically, we never set out to do this. It's just the way it's fallen out. Web3 is the way to combat the issues in the Web2 world. So, you know, we had e-commerce, we've had social media, that's Web2, great. Web3 is the way to combat the issues in the Web2 world. So, you know, we had e-commerce, we've had social media, that's Web2, great. Web3 is about ownership. And that's where we...

So, is this a layer for social platforms or is it a fully built out social platform of its own? Because obviously it says, I'm looking at your site, says you guys are launching June 25, coming up, as you said, 77,000 handles reserved, creators on board 23,432. So is this going to be a full standalone platform? And what's that going to look like in comparison to, I mean, we're on X right now, or an Instagram, or a Snapchat, Facebook, Snapchat, Snapbook, whatever. I'm a boomer. I have no idea.

But. So this is a familiar but different is what we're all about, right? It's Web 2 powered by Web 3. So we're not trying to reinvent the gimmick. What we're trying to do is provide a feature parity experience where you can enjoy social media, the bits that you love about it, without the negative, without having to sow your sow, without having the toxicity, without having the bad side of it, right?

But it's self-governed. This will be rolled out in stages. It will be a fully-flushed social media platform. But when we build out the infrastructure and architecture for what we're doing, that will become available in the Wanda Protocol over the coming years. So for example, a tokenization of real-world assets platform, minting on chain and ownership,

on-chain storage of creator content that can be accessed by a rapid access system, so like putting a caching layer in over the top of it. You then, because you control your data, when other platforms come along, away it goes. If you want to build your own platform on top of it and use your own data, you can do. We're trying to get that Web2 parity experience into Web3,

but our first outlet is Wonder Social, where we bring everyone together, we give them a reason to have the Wonder ID, which we've got lots coming up in our go-to-market strategy, which I'll hand over to Ryan. But yes, in answer to your question, familiar but different, we are in a social media platform.

Why reinvent the wheel? We all like social media, but it's positives, so let's just remove the aspects that people just don't like, and it's all over the media at the moment. And just to jump on there, Ryan, the CMO. I've got rich experience from social media, right? So I was at TikTok for six years from when it just launched in Europe and helped build that business, working across different roles, but primarily as marketing and helping scale and diversify that audience. So I understand how social media platforms work and how they think and what they really want to do.

And it was the exploitation of users and creating an experience that wasn't right for young users particularly that really drove me to leave and ultimately to join Wanda. But when you look back at TikTok, what they really did is they democratized creativity by putting in an editing suite into the platform. So anyone who had no idea about how to edit videos, they were just suddenly given something that was almost comparable to Final Cut. And hundreds and thousands, millions of creators

around the world have learned how to do video editing through TikTok and subsequently CapCut. We believe that we can do the same thing for Web3 via Wanda. So we're here to democratize access to Web3 technology. So all of the things like SSI, decentralization of your identity, the tokenization of real-world assets,

all that stuff that Cain talked about. We believe that Wanda has the power to democratize that and make it really easy and understandable for people to use. Simply by hiding the wires, talking about the benefits rather than getting too hung up on features. The details obviously there, but we'll talk about the benefits. Hiding the wires and just having a really, really slick and sexy UI to you I'd make Scott. Do you care if I ask a quick question?

Yeah, I would love you're the perfect person to be on stage today for this conversation. Go ahead Yeah, just and I know Gary's like harder than a titanium etched seed phrase right now with Bitcoin approaching 110 but You guys social decentralized social has you know, it's it's kind of been out there, you guys, social decentralized social has, you know, it's kind of been out there, you know, no stir, far caster and workcast kind of took a run at it. You know, there's only one new large scale social media network like a decade, right, maybe one or two. And it sounds like if you're a tiktok, you kind of understand that. And it just seems like the consumer behavior is that consumers don't really

care too much about privacy or ownership yet around their social media content. Right. And it's, it's like trying to get people to move over to create content on a new network seems insanely difficult. You know, have you ever thought about potentially just logging the social media content that's created on the other networks to provide some sort of layer, like logging layer for ownership

versus necessarily trying to get like the new algorithm, you know, because cracking that new algorithm to get people, for lack of a better term, addicted to your platform versus the other ones that we all elephant in the room are addicted to. What are your thoughts there? A little bit around, there's only one social media network that comes every 10 years, why is it you guys? It's actually something we did explore, interestingly enough.

When we got through the research, and as Jay said at the beginning, we spent the best part of the initial investment just researching this and talking to Gen Z and spending time with them. The bits that matter, the underlying issue was the privacy and the exploitation because you hear the stories around loss of income, loss of revenue, shadow bands, all these things that impact them and stuff like that. And then they see all the exploitation and they're fed up with it.

And without saying they're fed up with the centralized platform, under the underlying situation is that, the control and the power. But we always realized when we were doing that, that actually trying to shift the entire space, four billion people over six billion people over to a new platform wasn't the way to go.

So from our perspective, it's all about providing creators with the tools to protect their content and their future and get them to work with one of the first and share with us first and bring the communities. We actually have a large amount of people that have left or exited social media for some of the issues that they've been involved in or they've had over

in social media, saying, look, we'll come on board initially and start working with you guys. We kind of admit it with us first, right? Start with us and then push out from there. We don't expect people to exclusively have their content with us. And we do want them to bring their libraries to us, but continue to work with those.

They are huge revenue earners for those, and they have massive audiences, right? And there is an experience there. But ultimately, down the line, what we expect to happen is us to become a conversation piece with all of those other platforms. And hopefully, those platforms will be able to embrace some of the technology to work with them,

because it's not unheard of that these platforms copy each other, become interoperable with one another. So the social platform is one element of it, but actually the infrastructure is the other. And what way that the creators choose to embrace that, that's entirely up to them. We're just giving them the choice to do that. But we do know there is a huge appetite for it when you show them the alternative revenue models, when you show them the alternative to what's there right now. And that's the approach we're taking. We're not unrealistic and we know we've got an enormous task in

our hands going up against these guys. But we think that we've got the right angles and the right approach to it. And it's not you know, we're talking to you guys about privacy and security, because we're talking to a Web3 audience, right? This is a Web2 audience that buying it. If you look at our website, we don't really know that's the next question is why much will that be obstructed? You said it's gonna be a slick UX UI. That's always been the web proof problem, right? Is it's just not abstracted away enough and

grandma's not getting a Metamask wallet? 100%. And the wonder identity, and that's why we've chosen that as a step in the door, is the key to that, right? Because if we unlock that, we make that super enjoyable, and it's like, oh, okay, cool. We obfuscate away all of the stuff that is confusing, we work forwards. We don't want people needing a PhD in how to open up a trust wallet to worry about this stuff. We just want people to come on and enjoy. If we can get that right, we're probably 50, 60% of the way there of getting more and more people engaged

with Web3 technology over time. And that's only going to be positive for the industry. It's not about the 6% that are Web3 natives and that love this already and they know the benefits of it. They're going to benefit from the token because they're going to be in early. Everyone else is going to come on that journey over time. And then they'll move across because we

hope this will be the gateway to other platforms in the future, and we'll start setting that UX experience for others to kind of follow. We're Web2 natives, so we bring that first, and we focus on our Web2 audience, because we know if we get the app right, the Web3 stuff will take care of itself. That's your question, Joe.

Yeah, I mean, it's tough. A lot of the social media networks, the new ones are created, like TikTok, it's 12 to 15-year-olds, and those are the people that can't really be on here anonymously. But that's where the virality kind of starts. But I do, it sounds like you are taking into account for some of those larger creators that logging and, hey, I'm going to create this piece of content so that I can mark back and prove that I was the first person to create that.

And then what can happen when that gets extrapolated out to the other networks is that you can verifiably prove that you are the one that created that and that's your IP. Because I think the huge piece here, and you guys, this may be while you're doing this, is that there's so much AI-generated content and copycatting right now, that you have to have some sort of verifiably provable place that you did that.

And I love Silent Swap. I think you guys should definitely check out Houdini Swap. There's a couple of these kind of privacy swaps coming up too that could be really impactful. But I'm definitely a cheerleader. I love the idea. I want it to be real so bad. It's such a hard problem.

No, listen, we know we've got an uphill battle. We really appreciate you saying that. And I think you hit the nail on the head, right? Authenticity is lost when things like AI take over. And immutable proof of ownership on chain allows us to build things like our licensing and protection platform, our relicensing of content platform to build royalties off of your content.

A secret contract between you and someone who wants to remix your content is there. It's available to you. A brand wants to come in and work with you and do work with you. You make the content with us and where you post it, well, that all creates and builds into the secret contract between you and the brand.

So it's about the tools to give you more protection and ownership of your content as well. And the IP is a massive one. We're even exploring, shall I say, tokenization of future royalties on artists' albums. So you take a band, huge following, wanna make the next album, wanna bring their community closer,

tokenize that asset, tokenize the album, sell off, pre-sell access to that album to their community so they can help fund it, they invest in it, they're invested in you, they're gonna shout about your project because they're gonna get royalties on it, the public buy it. So the revenue comes back through it. And we've been talking to major record labels about this stuff.

We've got artists very interested in it. We're talking to huge ticketing companies about tying this in with on-chain ticketing and that whole reseller market and protecting the public's interest. The knock on effect from proof of ownership is huge. So we've got to start and follow that line, right? This isn't all going to happen tomorrow, but the more and more you explore it, the more and more these large organizations

that we're connected to are kind of knocking on the door, going, could this be possible if you did this? Yes, it is. OK, great. And that's where we're going with it. So yeah, and AI is just, it's almost like the easy win, right? When Facebook turned around and said they didn't want to validate anything anymore,

it was almost like kicking a door open for us. We're like, thanks very much, guys, because that's not what the public wants. They're so bamboozled with fake material and AI and stuff that is really quite toxic, they want to move away from that. We know the market sentiment is there. Thank you very much for saying that because we're going to go the other way. Fascinating. I literally was just reading as you were talking and your token literally launches in like 40 minutes, right? So people want to participate in that. How do they do that?

Yeah, so we're going live across Mexi in, as you say, 40 minutes time. All the info is available on our Xpages, Telegram. So come join the party, yeah, we're going live in 40 minutes. So we've got Herb and after. And as far as you guys know, any final thoughts? I might have missed something important. I don't know everything, obviously. No, I think the only thing I would say is,

I knew from the start that this would sort of live or die based on who we could attract to the project. And we've got some major names invested both from an equity and a token point of view. We've got numerous big-named musicians, actresses, actors ready to join the platform that are completely backing it. I think that's my final word. Yeah. We're just grateful for you guys giving us the space and the time to share the message of Wunder. We do believe we will be the platform that will take Web3 to the Web2 community in its masses. We get this UX right, you know, the world is our oyster. So yeah, we really hope that everyone has enjoyed what we had to say today and come along for the journey.

We appreciate the support we've had today. Yeah, they can follow all three of you together at once here at Wonder of the US. It's my guys. I want it that way. Come on, you can do it. Big moment. The world needs it. Where? Five? Westline? Call the Beedle, Scott. Whatever, man. I know.

God damn it. Hey, Jude. Okay, yeah, that was better. You win. Joe, you win. Sorry, I lose. It's from Liverpool. There you go.

Well, guys, yeah, so obviously check out Wonder, Underscore, Social. They're right here on stage, so really easy to follow. Sounds very exciting. Good luck guys today. I know that's always a big day, but I guess more importantly, good luck in June when you actually start to heavily roll this out. To Joe's point, I hope you beat the odds and become better than your former employee TikTok. Thanks, Bob. I appreciate it. To everyone else, the title today was Is Bitcoin about to finally break out to a new all-time high?

I could not have predicted that that would happen during the show, but Bitcoin did hit a high of about 109,400 or 500, depending on the exchange currently trading at 109,168. If you're the type to fire off rocket emojis and reggae style fog horns. This is the time to do it because we did officially make a new all-time high today. Congratulations to all of you, probably just the beginning.

Otherwise we will be back tomorrow, obviously 10, 15 a.m. Eastern Standard Time. Thank you to all of our amazing guests today. A lot of you stuck around for the last 20 minutes while we talked about British boy bands. Everybody on stage deserves a follow, so please give them all a follow. And I guess most of the people here

will probably see y'all in Vegas next week anyways, right? So until then, see you tomorrow. Bye guys. I wanted that.