The Worst Idea Of All Time - After The Laughter 1

Episode Date: March 12, 2026

Guy and Tim are BACK after a far longer absence than you may know. United in the bounds of fatherhood in a post-Joker 2 haze, your brave boiz are swapping stories of writers who insist on writing stories about writers, Guy's upcoming gig hosting a comedy show headlined by Tiffany Haddish, and Tim being on lots of drugs. Most crucially though, this is an opportunity to get another Hall of Famer piece of mail from the Great and Wise Chris Marlton. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Tim here, if you want to see me in the flesh and you're in New Zealand or Australia, good news. I'm coming to Adelaide, Brisbane, Melbourne, Sydney, Auckland and Wellington for the comedy festivals. Please buy some tickets now at timbat.com.com. Hello, Guy Montgomery. Tim, honestly, it's my pleasure to see you, brother. It's been, Lord knows how long. It's actually been ages. It's been a really long time.

Four months, four months between drinks. And like, you know, sporadic communication via messenger, a couple of phone calls peppered in. Not enough, though. No flesh contact. Not enough. It's been lacking. I feel like I'm a friend down.

Actually, to be fair to me, I've been living in a small town at the bottom of New Zealand since November. so I'm not just a friend down. I am what we'd call a community down. But it takes a little bit more than absolute social abandonment to keep going Montgomery down. Well, God bless. How the hell are you, mate? I've missed you.

I miss you. It's so exciting to see you. I know. I've missed you to actually, I'm getting a body memory of when we last spoke. And I was out with my sleeping baby. I was strolling around the Arrow River, which was a very beautiful and picturesque sort of four and a half kilometer loopwalk around a stretch of river. And we had a lovely catch-up, you know, just between friends, what we'd call, sadly, offline.

And I mean, that feels like a lifetime ago, really. A lot's, not that a lot's changed, but a lot's gone on. I'm sure. So I'm really good, brother. I've got a almost seven-month-old baby in my life. Wow. I know. I know that I know the exact math on it

because you did a really kind of thing and made it very easy for me to remember your daughter's birthday because we shared a birthday. Damn straight. But that is crazy. Seven months, far out. And you're doing well? everyone's okay

Monty's all right heads are above water everyone's yeah yeah everyone's good she is she's got two teeth she crawls

well she navigates the floor she puts solas into her mouth she shits feces now or is it used to be sort of like a fluid you know

sort of output and she smiles and laughs and I am enamored by her I'm madly in love. And Chalph is down here working hard on her telly show. They're a remarkable place today. Playing the role of Detective Innaeus Mallory.

So by day, I look after Baby and Chalph goes out and solves murders of which there are many in the Beautiful Lakes District. This feels like it could be a secondary television show. You know what I mean? We're in the derivatives market of storytelling now. We're by... Big time. The plot of your life. kind of pegging off the plot of Chelsea's TV show is itself quite an interesting terrain

for a TV show to exist in, I think. I think so. I think to really sort of, to put a button on the pitch, to elevate it from just like it's just a guy parenting, I think in the world of this show, I'm still me, and it's the same baby, but Charles is actually the detective, Inas Mallory. So it's me in a relationship with a detective. of who has a new baby. That's what I'm thinking.

I think it is more interesting as a show. I always get a little bit frustrated when people will write a book, centered around a writer, or make a film about filmmaking. It's like, mate, have a second idea maybe. Like just brainstorm for more than 30 seconds would be pretty cool. It's so interesting you bring that up because I am, I've got to get the author's name. I'm actually currently reading a book called. the memory police rather sorry the memory police by a Japanese author I just want to get her name

Yoko Ogawa and it's really it's sort of like this dystop it's quite it's both quite ethereal but also dystopian and in it it's one of the few instances where the the the books about like they live on this island and the things Things like just disappear and like physically disappear like, say, fruit disappears. One day it's like all the fruit drops from the trees and then everyone's in everyone's memory, like the fruit becomes soft focus and they can't remember about fruit anymore. Oh no. And yeah.

And so things just keep sort of disappearing and the memory police are on the lookout for people who remember things. but in it this the sort of protagonist and narrator is also an author and like in between the story developing you get excerpts from a novel she's working on and I was reading a chapter this morning and it was like a chapter almost exclusively of the book within the book and it was one of the few instances where I was like this fucking book within the book is awesome I was like I want you know it's actually it's almost distracting and that I want to pursue this second novel in addition to the novel I'm currently reading. So I tend to agree with you that I'm like, whenever in texts or, you know, movies or

television shows when it's about a television show, I'm like, give me a little more than that. Yeah. But in this case. It's being pulled off in front of my very eyes. There's enough cool sci-fi and sort of philosophical stuff. It sounds like going on your book to really, you know, get away with it. And a skilled writer, by the sounds of it.

Yes, brother. Yes. proud of me. I'm reading a book at the moment guy. I'm reading some Philip K. Dick. Spot goes to the zoo. I'm getting some dick in me right now. Hell yeah. Philip K.

Dick, that's a name I'm familiar with without knowing any of the actual output. Tell me a little about Phil. I don't know tons about him except that he is, you know, lord it is one of the true great sci-fi literary forbears. Yeah, too. You know, one of the true O.G.

So I'm reading a book, which is, I think, one of the more sort of famous sci-fi novels to Android's dream of electric sheep, which is what Blade Runner is based off of. And it's good fun. That's awesome. Dude, sci-fi is, you know, I don't know if it's a global reckoning or if it's just I'm coming around on sci-fi. I've been dicking around with sci-fi and loving it. You know, it stands for science fiction. Fuck, really. I just thought it was like, it sounded cool.

You know, like high-fi. There's just some rhyme. There's sort of like imagined futures, you know, that trade on a certain, you know, a certain amount of scientific speculation or information. It's pretty clever. Damn, that makes sense now that you're putting it together for me. Yeah, dude.

I never would have thought of that if you hadn't put it together for me, man. I never would have occurred to me. I never would have tripped over. that. I think God. Rom-coms are like... Dude, I've had such a confusing, vulnerable time with you not in my life.

I've been like opening doors wrong, fucking up the plot of movies because you're not there to explain it to me, getting genres incorrect because I don't understand the etymology of them. It's been a hard time without you in my life, man. A hard time.

It's really, I know that you're, being facetious and hats off to you, very fun. But it's funny, I can really relate to describing periods of life as vulnerable. It's like I feel like I'm in a really vulnerable moment of my life. That's certainly how I felt straight after. You are in a vulnerable time of your life at the moment. Very vulnerable.

And that you'd be incredibly easy to defeat. I actually am in a vulnerable period of my life. And I forget, Charles catches me out with it. I forget, like, if I don't spend enough time around. you know people not even practicing conversation I guess just having it I forget like um how much information it's normal to divulge like I forget how familiar I am with different people of course I didn't want to bring this up like even in conversation with you but I'm about to on the podcast because we're sort of wandering into this neighborhood but you're you are

pretty soon you're going to emce a comedy event that Tiffany Hattish is headlining and I was just wondering how you're feeling about that because I anticipate you probably haven't been doing a Tana stand-up recently. Yeah, we're treating that one in terms of prep if you're curious. It's called Gala on the Green. It's in Sydney on, I think, Saturday April 18 or whatever the Saturday nearest April 18 is. And I've got no idea how big the audience is, but I assume it's pretty big. So the way we're approaching that one is we're just not thinking or worrying about it until um that's good and i'm sorry for bringing it up but i just was kind of curious it's so funny it's like um i have not been doing any stand-up i am arguably going to be in like the worst

performance shape of my life but there's a small arrogant part of my brain that is like i think that could be good i think like you know that that that that live energy you get from not being especially slick or well-heeled might mean that I can rise to the occasion. It could of course mean I completely underestimate my responsibilities and bomb and do a bad job. Even if you do. I had

a sensational bomb in Adelaide. I've just got back from the Adelaide Fringe Festival. Yeah. I want to know how it was good. It was great. Man, I like, I was leading a very this is a callback to a lunch I had with some comedian. So I don't

know who this references for, but I was leading a very monastic experience. Cameron James, if you're listening, my use of that word was just for you. But it was really like, you know, do my show, go home, go to bed, get up, work on the show, do fucking admin and emails. And just that was, that was kind of, I didn't see a single show that I wasn't in. I did like some late show lineups. I did a slide show comedy show, which I've bombed the fuck out of. that's fucking awesome tell me about the bomb a portion responsibility for why it went so poorly and describe for us like late night PowerPoint or something so everyone presents a slideshow

you got it is it is there a universal theme or is it open brief open brief so there's two lovely dudes um invited me to come on the show who i'd never met before just sent me a message like a dm on instagram maybe maybe like a week prior or something i was like you're yeah I'll do that that's cool and then um sort of day before I was like I've got to make that PowerPoint and I spent ages on it bro and what I would so you get seven minutes and I decided that instead of doing comedy I would take this this platform as an opportunity to explore a thesis I have which is like a real you can pinpoint a real low moment of our culture like potentially the bottoming out of our current societal collapse started on,

from memory the 24th of January 2022, which was Paris Hilton's appearance on Jimmy Fallon's Tonight Show, where the two of them were hocking NFTs of board ape, Yacht Club monkeys. And it is, it's just, it is, ever since it happened,

it has just been living rent free in my head as this, horror moment of like we're completely lost as a society like we are we are just a drift and the existence that we're living in is a sort of horrifying lovecraftian absurd sort of evil reality and it was just such a that tv appearance is such a distillation of like we're fucked so i did a slideshow about that awesome and um i kind of like forgot to put jokes in it. And I also never finished it. I just ran out of time.

So it was just me playing clips of this really fucked up thing that happened. And in terms of apportioning blame, that one's on Timbo. But I will say, for a different audience, I could have kind of like rolled with them a bit. But they were just, they were there for like very normal sort of stand up comedy. They were not a crowd that wanted anything diverging from sort of puns and set up and punchline. Yeah, I think There's one thing I'm disappointed in is that You didn't

It doesn't sound like a pure bomb Because by rights you couldn't expect laughs If you didn't burn a shit with jokes I had a few I had a couple of jokes at the start But not not at the end Right As long as those bombed

Then I'm happy I uh Yeah That is just all on you I mean it's like Come on dude Follow the brief Strangest

Yeah I guess so Well I listen to the slideshow portion of it and probably not enough to the comedy portion of it. So, you know, I did part of the assignment. Yeah, we're doing late night earnest slideshow presentations. I don't know if you're interested in putting one together for us. But it is a funny concept, you know. And so, sure, was it lacking in jokes?

Of course. Of course it was. Totally. Totally. You know, it's an interesting thing that happened that I did want to explore with a crowd. I agree. I actually feel, which is probably happening on a similar timeline. I think like the first AI, which I know is not factually accurate, but to my mind the first

AI, like the reason we're in the position we are now is when we let copyrighters and like brand development people start writing like blurbs in the first person for like protein shakes or any sort of food that started addressing us like they were sentient. And I think ever since we let that over the line, we've basically got everything we deserve, which is like, I don't need a fucking protein shake talking to me. List the ingredients. I'll make a decision. I don't need to know that you're an adventurer and you've got a sassy side.

Do you mean in terms of like a writing style that advertising undertook or is this specifically something to do with AI? You think that's like the sort of harboringer of the AI age was when ad executives started you know, personifying the product? Yes. Because that arguably could be traced to. fucking what's his name Sigmund Freud's nephew

whose name is Edward Benais the godfather of public relations there is an absolutely fascinating documentary series made by oh god what's his name the fantastic British BBC

documentary maker who just makes nothing but solid gold hits I know who you're talking about I couldn't pluck his name for you the series The series is called Century of South. The documentarian is a man named, yes, I am Googling it, Adam Curtis, of course. And I think all of it's on YouTube, man, I've probably mentioned it on the podcast before,

but that was an awesome watch. Well, I also, before we sort of launch into the outside world, which is those of you listening, getting in touch, more broadly a review of I'm like so excited for you to be putting a solo show together again. I'm excited that you're back on Mike and you're doing comedy. And the premise you have is, you know, as I understand it, is really, it's a great hook from which to, you know, structure an hour but also hang a lot of jokes off it. So I'm interested how you're enjoying performing an hour and how are the shows, how are the audiences?

It's a funny thing that's happened because I didn't know really what this show was and then I've done a week of it in Adelaide, because I'm going Adelaide, Melbourne, Sydney, Brisbane. And I am going to be touring around Australia, yelling at people about politics in New Zealand to Australians. And so that's what I've been doing to the fine people in South Australia thus far. And I will continue to do it for the next few months. Did you find the sort of somewhat niche? or obscure nature of what you're addressing to a South Australian audience impacted their ability to invest or do you think you were getting it over the line?

No, man, I was getting it over the line because a few things. Number one, I think it's emblematic of just the absolute, you know, bun fight that we're in globally at the moment. And number two, it's just good to see someone talk about something they give a shit about, always, you know? So I think from that perspective, it's like, well, I wouldn't have bought a ticket. to a show that said on the till, you know, that it's about the New Zealand political scene. Well, I'm excited to see the show.

And for anyone listening who lives in those parts of Australia, it's called Eternal Optimist. And I suppose you've got a glimpse behind the curtain in that the show absolutely does not do what it says on the poster. It sounds like it's Tim railing against the current state of affairs and nature of things. There's other stuff too. I'm freaking, yeah, of course, of course. There's thirds. It's a third about the New Zealand political scene, a third charming drug stories from Timbo

and a third about fatherhood, I would say. Oh, beautiful. Can I ask? Does a trip to Las Vegas get a look in at all? Blue Man Group night? No, it doesn't. But I was thinking about putting that in. That seems crazy to me.

Oh, you wouldn't believe how much drugs I've been taking the last 12 months. It's been a lot of good times, man. A lot of good stories, a lot of good experiences. Well, I'm bloody happy to hear it. But I really do think that being called upon for one of the few audience involvement portions of a Blue Man Group show while flying high... Yeah. ...is inarguably, you know, you talk about a universal access point in terms of understanding exactly how insane something is.

that's what I reckon's going on there. I know you've got you've got to deal with something and that's cool with me. Sorry, I'm just messaging to try and deal with that thing. But yeah, guy, here's a wild thing. The timelines are pretty weird at the moment because like we recorded the Joker 2 season. I was trying to remember it.

It was before Billy was born. So that means we recorded it in July or in August. July. It was July 6 to July 10. That's so mental because I forgot sort of how long I was sitting on it, editing it. It was, I mean, dude, hats off to you. I actually, I played along with the season that came out

because I really do remember, and we sort of teased this when we were saying, when we announced what we were releasing. There was a genuine curiosity about where we went to. And hats off to you, dude, like the, The edit was fantastic. Huge thank you to sports team. Annabelle and Callum for the work they did as well. I know that you wrangled the entire post-production thing.

But like, I think that was a real, like, to me, which seems, it's sort of, I don't know if it's recency bias. I think that it's like a watermark season of the podcast. I really did. And also, I don't have the memory of previous seasons because I haven't listened back to them. But I really thought we went somewhere and we got somewhere too, which. there was no guarantee. Yeah.

I'm just very interested to hear from the outside world about how our fans think it stacks up at the pantheon of our shenanigans. I've not engaged with any sort of feedback aside from people directing me directly on social media. I've not actually seen what the list is. I see stuff in the subreddit, I will say,

which is always gratifying when there's, discussion going on there someone reposted recently that gorgeous photo i don't know if you'll even remember this but um you and i in bed might be like season two or something and it's very sort of ethereal sun's hitting us it's on a selfie camera so everything's kind of low res and blowing out um and i think we're maybe in a hotel somewhere but you and i just in bed shirtless taking a photo for the episode art. We've shared a lot of beds. We have.

Well, shall we, you know, shall we open the gates and let the outside of the other than? But sorry, just before we do that, I need to address, as you know, guy, as you know, listener, I was very hot on establishing the experiment of getting a control group and a variable group to watch the. the two different cuts of the movie. And I actually, as soon as it ended the season, while I was editing, I was coordinating that with someone who had a job where they were very well placed to help me facilitate all of that. And then unfortunately, that person lost their job. So the wheels sadly fell off that.

And then some other things took priority. So I do apologize that I sort of dropped the ball on that one. but it was a little bit out of my hands. But some people have been engaging in their own experiments and I think we're going to hear from them over the course of the next little while, which is excellent. Yeah, even on the, do you know what's crazy? Because I don't know how to get it on the back,

and I'm actually a paid subscriber of our substack. And so I enjoyed engaging with the comments and following along as the episodes came out. And there were a few people on that episode on the substack. went ahead and did the experiment and wrote up their experience. So huge shout out to Devena and Patrick from memory who fired up a, you know, fired up the movie and let us know what they thought. Yeah, I mean, you were running so hot in the podcast. I remember being like, this seems like a lot of work and you're like, it's happening. And then, you know, life is.

It is a lot of work and it was happening. Yeah, yeah. Anyhow, shall we dig in to... I actually think, Tim, I don't know if you've got it in front of you, but one of our all-time corresponders, Chris Malton, fantastic, Canberra-based comedian, and I would sort of describe as the preeminent scholar of the worst out of all time,

sent us a healthy dispatch over on the Facebook page that I believe you have in front of you. I don't know if it directly addresses the most recent season, but any time I see something coming in from him, I'm always interested to hear where he's at with what we've done. Yeah, preeminent Scholar is such a good description of Chris. First, I think this is, oh no, are these separate? These are separate.

Okay, here we go. In quotes, at first, I thought, this is a fucking stupid idea. And it is a stupid idea. But the more it goes on, the more I'm strangely proud of you too. This is a, I recognize this quote. Do you know who said this to us? No. should I tell you

Alice very close it wasn't even a thing to achieve and you've made it a thing to achieve this never existed as a challenge this isn't a thing anyone has done before or anyone wanted to do and no one should do it

because it's stupid but you've deemed it with meaning you've turned something horrible into a beautiful thing Rose Mutifayo Season 1 episode 25 Good morning evening and afternoon to Mangai.

I welcome you now to a piece of correspondence I didn't think was ever going to exist. My last proper message documenting the fifth listened through all the episodes was from over the last two years. So sorry, guys, I'm reading from a little far away and I think my eyes are not great. Though you did read it out on both January 24

and January 2025, which makes it feel more recent. I've now listened to everything six times. And in my search for meaning amongst the chaos, I have found a new thesis. Life is all about acceptable and unacceptable repetition. Rose, I think life is too short. I've got so many other things to do.

Guy, like what? Rose, lay motionless on my bed and watch the ceiling fan. That's overlooked and undercooked season one. episode four. Brushing teeth, hair or horses, the things that we have, that we know have to be done regularly. Regular, repeated behaviours such as eating, sleeping, showering and crying, we do all the time with rare complaint.

Other things we repeat, but don't want to. Commuting, working, school, exercise. They can be fine, are often complained about, but are not done for amusement and their repetition is also acceptable. Then we come to behaviours that are socially viewed as, singular one-off events, such as graduating high school, shitting our pants, and of course watching films, specifically films we don't like. They are not repeated excessively for joy or necessity. Their repetition is never complained about because it's not actually a thing.

Twiowat has broken this convention by taking a behaviour that is part of, quote, unacceptable repetition and repeating it. And then analysing the effect of the repetition. Obviously the analysis is comedic because at your core you're both comedians. If you were scientists you would analyze in a scientific way and if you were Romans you would analyze it in a romantic way quote guy fuck your spirit is broken bro season two episode 37 i would never claim there has been no science nor romance in the expense of twiwatt but comedy as a subconscious response of unknown origin is the form of analysis that is most tied to the id twiwet's process explores this dark and usually inaccessible part of the self to unacceptable repetition. In doing so, it generates

a raw and unique, sorry, a unique and raw expression of your true selves. This allows for powerful reflection and powerful insight, both internally and externally. 16 August, 2019, Guy to Tim. You've been convinced for a while that Norm MacDonald is going to die young, and that's going to be a bit of a surprise. Cameron James, wait a minute, what? You've been saying this on record, Tim? No, just a guy, but now here it is. Overlooked and undercook season one, episode three, featuring Cameron James. That's weird as well, because I just had lunch with Cameron James, and I haven't seen or spoken

to him in the years. Living is repetitive. The sun rises, we wake, we eat, we work, we play, we eat, the sun goes down, we tell stories, we listen to stories. Around the campfire under the spotlight on the screen from the stage. What we don't do is find a story we don't particularly like. a long and badly told story, and force ourselves to listen to and watch that story repeatedly until the logic circuits in our brain tell us the irony is amusing.

We build on rocks. We build on sand. We build on clay. We don't build on balloons. Until now. Twiowat is, through the study of unacceptable repetition, a study of life. A study of the human experience. A study of how all human culture in society is an endeavored to tame reality's bland repetition

into interesting, amusing, enjoyable, and sometimes painful narrative and super narrative, the creation of meaning. In this way, Twyawet, the brainchild of Tim and Guy, is truly deep, engaging and ultimately profound, something far more unique and important than anyone could have imagined. Say my name, Chris Malton.

And then there's a postscript here. Guy, first thing you're going to do is fill in your belly. Okay. First thing you're going to do is fill in your belly button. That is doing nothing for nobody. concrete, silk, loose hair, sure, fill that hole. Your urethra, push that in. Cover it up with some plaster or sealies, no more gaps.

Smooth the front. Push all your wee so it comes out the back. Tim, can I chuck one thing at you? Where does your ejaculate come out? Guy. Same spot, dude. You've completely rewired the human body. Your bono happens inside your body,

poking towards your butthole. your ejaculate comes out your butthole fact Tim that's how we're impregnating women now guy of reproduction is part of what you're doing as part of what you're going for the one whole movement might not be for you season three episode 45

I have zero recollection of that conversation in any sense I thought when you started reading that it was Chris addressing me directly saying guy what you're going to do is this It wasn't in quote marks. It just said guy and then semicolon and then the rest. And I didn't recognize it as a quote from you.

So that's what I... What would you do? The one whole movement, brother. Well, I don't remember that either. But it's a pretty persuasive case. God, it's a pleasure to hear from you, Chris. I look forward to reading that one again at the start of 2027. It is like, you know, it's interesting, I suppose.

It's nice to have the process and the output digested and then sort of articulated or described, you know, from a, not just from anyone, although anyone's welcome to, but from a professional. So thank you so much, Chris. I really, beyond even the podcast, I think, a lot of what you were saying was resonating with me, which is like our ability to tame. I think that this is our ability, if it's to tame the bland nature of reality or something like that. I've been thinking a lot. I haven't actually read it yet. There's a new Michael Pollan book called A World Awakens, which is about consciousness. And I read an interview with him where he was talking about consciousness hygiene,

which is basically like the entire world is attempting to, he didn't say atomize, but my interpretation is like, There are so many influences now which are basically trying to seize hold of consciousness and, you know, the need to protect it. And it's something that I've been, I think having a baby's been good for because I spend so much time, like, in that liminal state. It's not pure boredom. I mean, occasionally it sort of wanders over that way, but certainly it's like, I suppose it's, working on the discipline in a sense of daydreaming or like just of of absolute presence. It's not meditation, but it's letting whatever's happening pass through you instead of trying to disrupt or stop or redirect it.

And yeah, Chris, I feel like you touched on something to do with that. And it is genuinely something I've been thinking about. You think our 12-year project that kicked off with us watching Adam C. Analyst grown-ups two, 52 times in a row, is in some ways an exploration of consciousness itself? It wouldn't have occurred to me, but I think, you know, I think someone else's study of it reflecting that has opened the possibility that in some way. If people listen to it, you know, at the right angle, that's what they can interpret. I think we have moments of touching that void. Yeah.

Like, we haven't really talked to Tim about like, or maybe we have, but like, like, the actual factual reality of grown-ups three being in production. Fuck, I forgot. I forgot. That seems impossible to me. I know that it is in production, and I know Adam Sandler's very good at making movies from the point of view of they come out,

but I just, my body refuses to accept it. You don't believe. I don't believe it. In my core. I'll be interested if our boy Rob's in it because I tell you who's been going through a pretty rough time lately is one R Schneider Asian mama

We do have a lot of news to catch up on don't we Yeah so Rob Schneider Is the divorce finalised? It certainly broached You know A very narrow band of public consciousness Yeah It's just been amazing watching that dude

It's kind of a nice oil down of the whole mega brain effect. And my computer's automatically connected itself to Chelsea's headphones. Yeah. So she can. Yeah, Chelsea can hear you. That's all. Hey Chelsea. You can't.

Here's the weird thing. I can talk to Chelsea, but. Can you hear me? No. You can. Oh, you know, I can. I think the microphone is also flipped over. Are you guys recording?

Yeah, we're on. I don't condone this. Yeah, we're on right now. Okay, well, it's nice to see you. How do I, how do I disconnect? Love you too, Chelsea. Go down to the bottom and, I don't know, actually. I don't know.

I'm trying. I got you. You clear. It's very nice to see Chelsea, first off. And boy, howdy, people underestimate the aggressiveness of Apple taking decisions off your hands. They make good products, but they've just. Like if you are there to do anything deviating from the absolute norm of what like a normal person wants to do with their devices, you are fucked. And it's why I will not buy Apple products.

Well, I don't think it would be an episode if we didn't sort of delve into your relationship to Apple. Yeah, absolutely. Look, I've got to say, brother, I think this has been a stonking catch-up. And I think, you know, that Chris's missive. is ample nutrition for our audience to sit with and digest. I think we call it here. It was so good it would literally be unfair to read any other messages that we've received. Quite.

Chris has cemented himself in such a rarefied ear with that incredible piece of correspondence. So I think let's put a pin in it. Let's reconvene soon. And it's just such a treasure and treat to see you, man and to catch up. And I also actually, I might have already recommended it on the podcast, but I just wanted to plug one other sci-fi book that I read last year, which is in my top sort of three of the year. It's an old one, but it's called The Sparrow. And it's by an author called Mary Doria Russell. It's like from the mid-90s. And it is so nice. Get it in, yeah.

and I will plug having an earnest attempt at some point in the not too distant future to get eight hours of sleep. You have to do it every single night, but just give it a crack. That's what I want to plug out there. And that's coming from Tim. Yeah. And that like that means something. Use the code irony to get 20% off your eight hour sleep. Tell them Tim.

It's the code irony to get 20% more sleep. Yeah, I guess it would be. So maybe like a, maybe nine hours, nine hours out of eight hours. What's 20% of eight? It's a fifth of eight, which is 1.25-ish? Yeah. Nine and a quarter hours. See you, guy.

See you, bro.