The Young Turks - Epstein Rebellion - July 11, 2025

Episode Date: July 12, 2025

Sign up for your one-dollar-per-month Shopify trial and start selling today at ⁠shopify.com/tyt Steven Bannon calls Jack Posobiec a sap for his part in the Epstein binder stunt. Dan Bongino gets into an explosive fight with Pam Bondi, and now he and Kash Patel are considering leaving the Trump administration. Meanwhile, Iran’s enriched uranium stockpile partially survived recent attacks, according to new reports. Democratic tensions boil over as Rep. Dean Phillips declares Zohran Mamdani unwelcome in the party. HOST: John Iadarola, Cenk Uygur, Mark Thompson SUBSCRIBE on YOUTUBE ☞  https://www.youtube.com/@TheYoungTurks FOLLOW US ON: FACEBOOK  ☞   https://www.facebook.com/theyoungturks TWITTER  ☞       https://twitter.com/TheYoungTurks INSTAGRAM  ☞  https://www.instagram.com/theyoungturks TIKTOK  ☞          https://www.tiktok.com/@theyoungturks 👕MERCH  ☞      https:/www.shoptyt.com Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

You're listening to The Young Turks, the online news show. Make sure to follow and rate our show with not one, not two, not three, not four, but five stars. You're awesome. Thank you. 3x5x3, 3x3, 3x3, 3x3, 3x5D, drop it like it was the Epstein file, oh well. All right, guys, welcome to the Young Turks, Jane Uger, John Iderola, Mark Thompson with you guys. Mark's show is called The Mark Thompson Show. Check that out on YouTube. Josh shows Damage Report. And this show, when it airs, it's called The Young Turf. So, no, seriously, guys, we had a bit of a technical issue. Sorry about being late.

But we got a lot to get to. We got Epstein news all over the place. We're going to start with it first. Second hour, we have more updates. We have Marjorie Taylor Green going on the warpath on a couple of fronts against the Israeli lobby. We've, I mean, we got so many stories. Just stay right here. John, go. Okay, in fact, we should just go. We were all told there was more. And now they're telling us there's nothing. And like a sap, you believed them. Damn, that's an aggressive podcast they got going on right there. But that of course is Steve Bannon and Jack Pesobiac, conservative influencer. And they're fighting as seemingly everybody in the Maga world is fighting over the perception that Donald Trump is the head of a massive effort to cover up Jeffrey Epstein and his files and his client list and all of that. And so Bannon is now lumping Pesobic in, not just as a person who had talked about the conspiracy. but that might have actually been a participant in the cover-up himself. And so we're gonna get to that as well as the many other fights,

fights that aren't just imperiling perhaps the MAGA, you know, electoral chances, but might even result in people leaving the administration. And so we're gonna get to all of that, but what, Jenk, are you, are you delighting in all the chaos? I am, but I'm not delighting in, in the files not being released and the government lying to us in preposterous ways. And apparently other people are not delighting in it because one of the things we're about to tell you is, Don Gino is considering leaving the administration.

He's apparently furious. But are they really going to do anything? They can fire Pam Bondi is a scapegoat. Bonino can leave. But unless they release the files and or actually prosecute a single rapist, none of that is going to matter. Anyway, we'll have all those amazing details coming up for you guys, but also the detail of turns out the prison tape that they said

was raw, not raw, Wired Magazine, excellent article explaining that it was edited. I mean, this is an epic disaster for the government, for Trump, for every part of this. And as you can see here, I mean, let Steve Ben in that first video yelling at Pesobiac that he was a sap for participating in the Trump administration stunt about the Epstein files. So that's like MAGA on MAGA crime live on the air. And this is just ripping, it's actually not ripping maga apart. MAGA is almost completely united against the Trump administration.

Yeah. And that is stunning. There's just a few people like Alex Jones that have come up with like a new deeper level of the deep state that Trump is covering this up to help fight as he tries to work through it. Of course. Exactly. Yeah, exactly. And there's the revelations about the tape. I don't find it the tape thing as damning as you do. Sometimes these things happen.

Like most people don't know every Friday. We need about four minutes for the tape to reset before the show. can go live. Yeah, that's why there's a minute missing in every Young Turks episode. Exactly, it's not suspicious. It's just the way it works. Anyway, so we're gonna get through all of them, but why don't we start with Pesobic, who was a couple months ago was one of those right-wing influencers that was brought as part of a PR stunt to meet up with Pam Bondi, who had her Epstein files binders, and every one of them rushed to rumble and wherever the hell they do their shows to say, we're gonna blow the lid off this thing,

And we're going to take down the Clintons and then nothing happened because there was nothing of note in the binders, which in hindsight now might have been the first indication that nothing at all was going to come of this. But so that's Posobic's role, is that he received the binder. And that's what Bannon, I think, is implying that he was a sap, that he was a participant in the cover of not just a guy who sort of is commenting on it now. But that said, now that you understand that background, why don't we get a little bit more between those two? There is an enormous confusion on my part. We're told that there's a list on a desk where, you know, Jack, I don't want to get into your whole thing.

But, you know, how Jack was used. I get told that's phase one. I get told that's phase one. It's not Jack's fault. Jack was used. I hope you guys understand that. Thank you, Charlie. But I was told there would be more.

I was, we were all told there was more. And now they're telling us. And like a sap, you believed them. You're from the intelligence community. Jack Posobic, you're from the intelligence community. They're playing us. They're playing all of us. No, it's just not the media.

Steve, screw the media. They're part of it. So, yeah, Bannon's really on fire pointing out that Pesobic was from the intelligence community. He means naval intelligence, not that he's an intelligent person. So don't worry about that. But anyway, they were doing that at this Turning Point USA Student Action Summit. They have these summits seemingly every single weekend. and they go there to all stand rather than sitting while doing these shows.

But anyway, they're not just mad. The attendees were mad too. And so let's turn now to some of that. We want to put America first. We're here for the Republican movement, right? But we aren't really seeing it with this administration. I mean, why are we going to get what we voted for? Yeah, we're getting lied to.

The pedophiles aren't being rounded up. The people aren't getting deported. We're not getting what we asked for. Do you agree with a special prosecutor has to be an independent special prosecutor has to take over. Do you believe that DOJ and FBI right now with the guys who were all close to, Pan Bondi, Dan Bongino, Cash Patel, do you think they have any credibility left to pursue this? No, and I'll tell you exactly why, Steve, because in 2016, we trusted the plan with Trump. But now Trump has become the deep state. The exact thing he, we voted

him in. Why do you say he's become the deep state? What is more deep state than covering up for pedophiles? Why would you go to that island? Why? Tell me, why would you go to that island? Looks like that guy might be choosing the Elon Musk side of the split. But yeah, they were very fired up against Donald Trump and not just, Donald Trump, I would

imagine, is going to, to end up trying to save himself, he's gonna start pointing the finger. He always does say, throws people under the bus and that might even be what's happening, which we'll get to that. No, it's not actually him, it's these other people, but all of those people are his people. Trusted people on the right, trusted people in the Trump Orbit Pan Bondi's his personal lawyer. Is that a holdover from the previous administration? He specifically chose her after Matt Gates got rejected, but either way, he loved both

of them. And so there's still a little bit of weird cognitive dissonance when you have like the second guy who talked, who's like, well, I don't know, we're not getting. and what we paid for, and he's like smiling while talking about the fact that the guy he trusted most in politics is covering up for elite pedophiles. Like that on some level, this is still kind of a game in some way. But at least you did have people willing to say that they feel betrayed and not just by the potential scapegoats, but by Trump himself. Guys, if you're on the left and you're not seeing it, and I get it, you might not see it

because of the different media that you consume. No, 90% of MAGA is in rebellion. And So this is not like, oh, yeah, they're full of crap and it's not real and they're all line. No, no, no, no, no, this is not close. Those guys are real. And you can tell when they're real or not when they say things like, yeah, what the hell, man? They didn't round up all the stupid immigrants. Like you could like they still have their points of view that we can't stand, right? And that we totally disagree with.

But this is, the Epstein files is the very, very core of MAGA. So like when this is now MAGA versus Trump and if you're not, like so are some MAGA making some small excuses for Trump? Sure, right? And are some of the influencers trying to misdirect like Alex Joe's, oh, oh, they were too big to jail. So that's why we should let the rapist bankers go. And Trump is being a genius by letting him go. Well, he's saying that he's using it as blackmail material over the world leaders. Yeah, whatever, like some nonsense, right? But nobody's even buying that, not in core MAGA. Later, they will change their excuse and a lot of people will buy this later and it's begun, which is,

oh no, Biden got rid of the evidence. That is why we could not what didn't want to Trump doing his first term. But overall, my read of it online in everything I've seen, and that's why Dan Bongino is apparently so furious, he took today off in protest, he apparently had a huge shouting match with Pam Bonnie. Is any of that stuff relatively real or yes? Is he trying to protect himself, yes? Is he trying to make it seem like, hey, look, it's not me, it is Pam Bondi, and it is definitely not me, yes, all of that. But the reason he's doing that, the reason why Steve Bannon is calling for a special

prosecutor in the Trump administration, unheard of, unheard of. Like we don't trust Trump, we need a special prosecutor. That's Steve Bannon's saying that. And then the reason why almost every host, Charlie Kirk and the others, you could tell They're super reluctant, right? But they're like, yes, this is really bad. The girls didn't rape themselves because their audience is going, are you kidding me?

Are you kidding me? Now you're going to turn around and say that there were no clients? You're not going to prosecute a single person? And Andrew Schultz, which we'll talk about later in the show, in one of the many things that he said on the Flagramp podcast was like, Wait, so you're saying that like you ran on Epstein Trump. You ran on I'm Epstein as being, you know, the files and I'm gonna release them, et cetera. And you already had one term.

So like you, if there's something incriminating the files, you would know. And then you ran a whole other campaign saying there was. There definitely was and you were going to expose it. So now when you come out and say, oh, there were no clients. And there is no list. No, you're compromised in one way or another. Like, it is absolutely inescapable. So more of that evidence in a minute. But Mark, what's your first take on this? Yeah, I think that you do a good job of decoding what are sort of two aspects to this. One is the political mega world and the damage potentially to Trump as a result of that

political world turning on him. You saw bits of it. And I think also the reputational problems, the stink reputationally for Trump. I thought that was a great question. Like, what are you doing going to this island over and over again? What are you doing sort of hanging out with this guy? It's undeniable that this guy is what we know. And so even if we don't get the files or the list or the black book, it's you Donald Trump who reputationally pay a price. And the reason you additionally pay that price is because you are with helping to withhold this information. So I think, you know, that which we knew, that is to say that Trump was tight with Epstein, I don't know to what extent he was involved with all of this, but, you know,

it becomes kind of hard to push away when you're hanging out with a guy on his jet all the time, going to his island, going to the different properties. You're doing that enough. I think it turns the focus back on to Trump. So reputationally, he has done some harm along the way as well. On the political stuff, Jenk, I yield to you because I think you have a better sense of what's happening with Maga Nation than do I. I always feel like they'll rationalize their way out of it, but there may just be too much going on here for them to do that. And guys, so Mark, to your point real quick, I lived through all the different stages, right? So I would tell MAGA, you know, five years ago, four years ago, one year ago, hey, you know, Trump said that Epstein's a terrific guy and they were best friends for 15 years. And Trump even said, hey, everybody knows Jeffrey likes him young.

Like, so he knew definitively. And back then the reaction from MAGA was, F you, you don't know anything. He did it out. It's Clinton covering it. I was the Biden. And they just deflection, deflection, never acknowledged it. Now when I do the same thing, they're like, yep, you're totally right. What the hell?

Why don't, and I don't know, I would love to ask some of them, bunch of them, like, guys, what did you, like, why did you not believe it before and now you do believe it? Like, isn't it obvious you were wrong earlier, right? Yeah. And I don't, but we don't need to even get into that. The fact that they now do believe it makes a big difference. Does everybody think that Trump did something with Epstein? No, okay, do a lot of them now wonder if Trump did something with Epstein? Yes, yes.

Yeah. And they're taking that quote a lot more seriously now. Because guys, remember, the core of MAGA, whether we like it or believe it or agree don't agree. They think they're anti establishment. Like they think we're going to go get the elites, right? They talk about the elites all the time, et cetera. So they really, the reason they loved Trump and believed in Trump was they thought, it's not true, but they thought he was anti-establishment. They thought he was anti-elites. And what do we say on the young Turks over and over again? He's a fake populist, right? He's, he plays a good populist game

that's smart politically, and the Democrats are knuckleheads for not doing the same thing. but he doesn't mean it, he already had one term. He was already best friends with Jeffrey Epstein. He already, he loves the donor class. He all, what did he do in the first term in the second room? Giant tax cuts for rich and the corporations, right? He's a fake populist. And now when he does the same exact thing that MAGA accused the deep state of doing,

the establishment, the elites of doing, and the very core of it, Epstein vise, the very core, that's what broke the camel's back. So it doesn't mean that they don't trust them on anything else. But this is massive damage to Trump's credibility with MAGA. Yeah, and it's gonna have much more consequences for other issues as well. They confuse the fact that he has a lot of enemies and some of them are elites with him being an enemy of the elites, which is not. Yes, and I think that's right, the reason that he has been so like caught flat footed on this thing, like the only other time that sort of reminds me a little bit is the vaccine stuff where like he says things, they mean it. like the base, like he'll say, stop the testing, COVID's fake or whatever, but he still thinks

we should have a vaccine because he's not actually a colloidal silver Instagram zombie or whatever. And so he has a vaccine come out because he doesn't actually mean the anti-vax stuff. He eventually caught up because he was getting booed at rallies and everything. And I think this is an even worse example where, yeah, he mentioned Epstein in his rallies. He doesn't actually believe the QAnon stuff. And he doesn't get that it's a helpful game to him to get people fired up, but there's millions of not just Republicans, but predominantly Republicans, that believe it more than they believe literally anything else. And so for him, it's like, yeah, we had fun with that during the campaign, but now I'm in power and now it's about tax cuts.

So shut up with your stupid conspiracy theories. And he doesn't get that they believe that. Even inside of the Trump administration, prominent members of MAGA are roiling with this whole Epstein thing. And we want to start with this guy first because Bongino apparently got into a big tiff with Pam Bondi. And as of right now, at least, he's off the job. He took the day off. I guess, which is a thing that you can just do abruptly, even when you have a really important job. And a source close to Bonjino said he ain't coming back, which is not a guarantee, but sources are now saying he is considering that if Pam Bondi doesn't go, he'll go. And I hope somehow all of them, but it's not up to me. Now, Caitlin Collins reports, it's accurate that

Dan Bongino has told people he's considering resigning in a major clash between the FBI and the DOJ. over the fallout from the Epstein memo. Apparently he got into it with Bondi about the missing minute in the tape. And so he apparently is mad because he's been taking some of the blame for not catching the fact that it had the missing minute before they put it out. And Bondi's mad at him because he's been telling the press that he and Cash Patel have been stopped from releasing more information about the Epstein files, but they're not releasing that additional information and he has a lot of power unto himself, let alone Cash Patel. And so people are saying he's not happy with the way that Pam Bondi has dealt with the Epstein files. And I think all of this

is fascinating, but I also think that it's convenient to just assume, oh, wait, maybe Pam Bondi's the cause of the cover up. And actually, Bongino and Cash Patel, who made a name for themselves and tons of money before entering the administration talking about this story, they're secretly fighting the good fight. But the thing is, they've been participating in the early steps of this cover for literally months. They've been doing those interviews and going on with Joe Rogan and going on with all these people and being like, I haven't seen anything and there's no evidence yet, the guy killed himself. And like maybe they have an issue with the tape, but they haven't, what have they been saying over the past few months while these files have been sitting waiting

to be reviewed. They've been like mums the word in any of their public comments, I think, are totally consistent with either a cover up or that there is in fact nothing. And I want everyone to bear in mind, this just me, feel free to disagree. It could be that both of them are and always have been true believers on this stuff. And now they're aghast at the fact that either nothing is coming up, in which case one would think they would perhaps apologize for leading their audiences on for literally years as they soaked up the money from it. Or, that it is important as they watch, as Jake points out, MAGA, 90% in revolt over this, they're thinking, okay, I have this great job.

And I don't want to say anything that's going to get Donald Trump to be mad at me. But Donald Trump's heart could explode in his chest in about six months. And I would like to have a media career for the next 20 years. And this is perhaps a moment where if I'm not seen to be on the right side of this, that's it for me. And MAGA will never trust me. Yeah. And we know how powerful audience capture is for a lot of these people. And so they have a ton of loyalty for Trump, but they also desperately want more mansions and fancy cars in the years ahead. Yeah, so that is exactly right. So there's two different issues here. But before then, we're doing a poll in the live chat. Watch this show Monday through Friday at 6 o'clock. I love you guys participating in this. And this is now a really good question. Who's out first? Bonjino, Bondi, or Cash Patel?

Well, Bongino seems like he's halfway down the sword, so that's why he's winning. But Pam Bondi is going to be the scapegoat. So let's get into that. So the two different issues are, why is Bongino freaking out the way that he is? And he's taking the day off, saying that's it. I'm considering resigning, not just considering resigning, but apparently telling almost everyone in the MAGO world behind because there's leaks everywhere, right? And he's like, oh, yeah, I might quit.

Oh, remember, I'm the good guy, I might quit, right? So we'll see if he does or he doesn't. But so that, that's point one. And the reason he's doing that is because the MAGA base is like, F, this, all of you have zero credibility left. It turns out your compromise. Look, you egg on conspiracy theories for 10, 20 years straight, 10 years, let's give them, right? The Bonginos of the world. And then when that Frankenstein turns on you, you're going to be surprised.

Like, especially the core Frankenstein you built, right? Now, in this case, though, to be fair to MAGA, they're a thousand times more right than Bongino, Cash Patel, Bondi, and Trump, right? Because what's the actual conspiracy theory that hundreds of girls raped themselves and that there are no clients and no one should be prosecuted? No, that's not the conspiracy theory. So that's the conspiracy theory. The government position, the Bongino position right now is a wild, ludicrous conspiracy theory.

The idea that it's nefarious forces our government is covering up for is the leading theory. And by the way, that's not just a MAGA theory. That's also the left wing theory. And then by the way, the middle wing theory, no one thinks those girls raped themselves that there were no clients and we shouldn't prosecute a single person. I don't other than mainstream media reporters and politicians, I don't know a single person who believes that, left, right, right? So the government's position is a lunatic conspiracy theory. Maga agrees with all of us, BS. And the fact that they were at least like not, you know,

they were objective enough to say, yeah, no, this is wrong. And the Trump team is lying. I don't know why they're lying, but they're definitely lying. That is why Bongino is jumping out of his skin. Because you're right, if they keep going like this, Cash Patel, Bongino, Pam Bondi's already got. She has no career left in the right at all anymore. There's not a single, the right wingers will never vote for Pam Bondi.

She's gone, gone, gone. That's why she's going to be the first one under a bus. Bonino might leave earlier, but Pam Bondi's, like, her new nickname could be road bump, because she's going under a bus. There's no question about that they were all referring to her as Pam Blondie, and the whole thing about the FC files are on my desk and then giving out the binders. And now she's saying, no, nonsense, puts out a total BS tape, et cetera. So she's a goner. What Trump would love, that team would love is, oh, it was all Pam Bondi's fault.

It was all, and hell, no, no, not Palgino, not Casual, not Trump, not any of the rest. It was Pam Bondi, right? But here's where it all breaks down, which is the core of the issue, the second issue, the more important one. Yes, but Bongino can leave and Bondi can get fired. But where are the freaking clients? If you're never going to release the client list and you're never going to tell us a single person who did this and you're never going to process, anyone and you're going to stick with your lunatic conspiracy theory that the girls raped themselves, it's not going to solve anything.

Yeah, it's not going to solve Bongino's problem with his career. If he comes out and goes, no, no, no, they're right. There was, he killed himself and there weren't our clients, it's no one in MAGA is going to listen to him, not one person. So the quitting and the firing is irrelevant, are you actually going to do it or not? Look guys, I think this is so big, this is not like, oh, hey, that's an interesting, amazing story of MAGA turning on Trump and blah, blah, blah. No, like this to me feels like somebody taking the finger out of their dam.

Because now, like across the board, F the government, F the establishment, we don't believe a word they say anymore. So you can yap on CNN or the New York Times and call everybody conspiracy theorist, et cetera. But I've seen, and these very rich and powerful clients did rape underage girls. None of them have been prosecuted. And the American government, at a minimum, is definitely protecting the rapists. So now, and by the way, Trump did it, Biden did it, Trump did it, every president did it. So don't tell me it's not an intelligence agency. Like, yeah, maybe every president raped an underage girl, and that's why they're all not releasing the files or the evidence.

But Trump ran on it, man, he ran on it. And so now to come in and go, the thing that you care most about MAGA, I'm gonna, I mean, that is sticking the knife right into their heart, right? It's not- It's a snap at a reporter for bringing it up. Like he personally hates that it's still being talked about. Yeah, yeah, no, he's in a world of trouble. But the entire institutions are in trouble now. Like no one, like Jake Tapper will later write a book about how no one could have seen this

coming. We all see it coming, Jake. We all see it coming. All right, Mark. Well, they ran as outsiders, right? I mean, initially, you sort of suggest this false populism really was something to sell when Trump was an outsider and the Bongino was an outsider and Patel was an outsider. And they could write these books and do their podcasts and claim, you know, those people on the inside, they're holding it back. It's right here. It's at the FBI. Are you kidding? That's where it is. Now you run the FBI, Cash Patel. And you guys are all in charge. And so you're on super or thin ice and you could release something even with redactions so they can redact the hell out of the thing they've done that with other stuff with jfk with MLK they redacted a bunch of stuff we'd

already seen it before but they tried to take a victory lap on how they'd released it you're right jank there is something huge about this and because it's something huge it only gets bigger the more we wait day after day after day i love the idea that they would throw bondi under the bus but that won't be enough for them to skate away from this yeah no way and the And then the last piece is what I promised you earlier in the show. Wired magazine did a terrific piece about the tape that they released. They said that it was raw footage from the prison. And I was instantly amused when Pam Bondi explained, oh, every prison tape has a minute missing.

Do they? Every prison tape does? I'm not sure that that's true at all, right? To say the least. All right, so already it started out disastrous. But now Wired is proven, not raw edited. edited by Adobe Premiere Pro, and there's two clearly distinct parts edited together, okay? Now that doesn't mean that they doctored it, it doesn't mean that, oh, you know, we know

they took out something incriminating. All we know is they said it was raw, definitely not raw, definitely edited, and so we just don't know how it was edited. We don't even know if the edit was around the one minute mark, like that's the edit, or it was a different edit. And there's different ratio problems to the video, the video is a mess. And there is a theory that, well, look, they were just trying to clean it up so it looked presentable, right? But they actually released two different videos, one that was more cleaned up and one they called the raw footage. And it turns out the raw footage isn't raw, that one was also edited.

So none of these stories add up. The stockpile of stuff that is associated with the offing of Jeffrey Epstein, everything from the removal of his roommate from the cell to, well, it turns out, one guard was on, was asleep. The other guard was playing or buying something on Amazon. The cameras didn't work that. And I mean, at what point do we just understand that something else went down? There's just way too much of a constellation of events here for us to ignore it. Yeah. Last thing, Alex Acosta was the guy who gave him a light sentence back in 2008. Remember, Epstein got caught earlier, and Acosta basically slap on the wrist.

Acosta later, even though he's a prosecutor, became the labor secretary for Donald Trump in his first term. So strange. There's so many strange things. If you don't know this, by the way, I don't know if this has anything to do with anything. But you know, Attorney General Bill Barr's dad was the first person to hire Jeffrey Epstein. Not for sex as a math teacher at a private school. when Jeffrey Epstein didn't even graduate college. This whole thing about like he's like a financial genius.

He doesn't know anything about finance. Okay, like this is insane. Like, did you know Galane Maxwell's dad was a legendary Israeli spy? Got a state funeral. Yitzhak Rabin came to it. Did you know that one point Jeffrey Epstein said that he works with the CIA? And did you know that Alex Acosta went challenge? This is according to sources.

It's not, he didn't say it in public or in court. But they said, why did you give him such a light sentence? And he said, well, the intelligence agencies told me to. Okay, so if that source is correct, this thing's, we already know what happened. We don't know which intelligence agencies, but obviously the CIA or the our government is helping either is the intelligence agency or is helping that intelligence agency. So the idea that all intelligence agencies are like a conspiracy theory, no, that is a very, That is a very reasonable conclusion, an eminently reasonable conclusion given the evidence at hand, the idea that there were no clients, cuckoo for cocoa puffs.

Like that, that's no one on planet Earth believes that. Okay, all right, we got to go. We got more amazing news, so stay right here. BEMO V-I-Porter MasterCard is your ticket to more. More perks, more points, more flights, more of all the things you want in a travel rewards card, and then some. Get your ticket to more with the new BEMO VI-Porter MasterCard and get up to $2,400 in value in your first 13 months. Terms and conditions apply.

Visit BMO.com slash V-I-Porter to learn more. Iran has never given up its quest for nuclear weapons and the missiles to deliver them. That's because Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu has been saying this for more than 30 years, claiming Iran is close to having nuclear weapons. Nuclear weapons, nuclear weapons. Atomic bombs. In 1992, as a member of parliament, Netanyahu addresses the Knesset. He says, within three to five years, we can assume that Iran will become autonomous in its ability to develop and produce a nuclear bomb. So perhaps just keep that in mind as we reveal what an anonymous Israeli official is now saying about the status of the Iranian program. So they are saying that, in fact, some of Iran's enriched uranium survived the attacks of. of both Israel and the United States, which there have been prior reports to that effect,

but this is now an actual official in the Israeli military that is saying the same thing. They also said, and again, we're not going to find out of who this is near Times to protect their identity, is that there was near bomb-grade uranium buried in the ruins of one of the nuclear facilities that were bombed, but that the entrances to get into that facility have been destroyed, necessitating perhaps months of digging out to be able to get into there. There, key laboratories at the facility were destroyed by the US, and that if they were to try to dig back into these facilities, that Israel would be able to detect that. And if that were to happen, then there would be time to attack the facilities again. That's what they're saying.

And so they are laying out their belief that there's cause to attack the facilities, that this is not simply about worrying about them reconstituting their nuclear weapons program, but that there's stuff right there, right? now that theoretically could justify future attacks. And so again, it's an honest official and the Israeli government is hardly an impartial source for information on the Iranian nuclear program. But that's what they're saying right now, which by the way, also contradicts what Donald Trump would have you believe, which is that everything Iran has ever done in this area was utterly obliterated by this strike. And so, Jank, what do you trust coming out of this?

Why do you think they're saying this now? Okay, so there's two different things. Was it fully destroyed or not? And why are we having this conversation? So was it totally destroyed? How do I know? Nobody knows, okay? The American government doesn't know, the Israeli government doesn't know.

I'm not sure the Iranian government knows because it's, they gotta dig out first, right? So is it possible that it was not totally destroyed? Of course it's possible, of course it is, right? So when Trump says like, oh, CNN is lying, fake news, or we totally obliterated it, and I'm gonna sue them, and make more money bribing, whatever, give me bribes, whatever. Like, no, that's nonsense, right? At the same time, when the Israeli government says they, we did not fully destroy their uranium stockpile, the translation of that 98% of the time is we're gonna go back and bomb them, or we're gonna make you go back and bomb them,

and we're gonna want more war, we're gonna want more money, and so look here, we can have a conversation, maybe a debate, I don't know what you guys think about it, but look, since, Since 1948, the Israeli government has thought we are under constant pressure and stress and threat, and we have to defend ourselves. And the way to defend ourselves is by constantly attacking the other countries. And so, and so, and why do they do that? Sometimes in the case of the Palestinians, clearly to take more land. We can again, we can have that debate, but we all saw it with their eyes.

Oh God, oh, they are, oh, for I am going to attack in self-defense in 1967. Oh, I am doing self-defense in 2023, 24, 25, oh look, I have 70% of Gaza. Oh, look, I have more and more land in the West Bank. It was all a coincidence. No, it wasn't. It was all self-defense. No, it wasn't even close to self-defense. Okay, so now having said that, were parts of its self-defense?

Like 1973 was self-defense? Yes, right? Now, the second part of it is, I believe that the Israeli government leaders because of a deep paranoia, which is an understandable paranoia, think we have to either completely eliminate the militaries of all of the surrounding Arab countries and in the Middle East or co-op their governments. So Jordan fully co-opted. They're not, in Egypt fully co-opted. And in a way that's actually defensible, like that, hey, they got a peace deal and they have peace. Okay, good. Like, I could live with that, as long as we're not doing more wars, et cetera, and everybody's safe

and everybody has their own countries, right? But so I think Netanyahu to some degree is like a Dick Cheney like figure who thinks, if Iran has one vial of uranium left, it is my job to obliterate Iran. And why should I do it? And why should I pay for it? And again, it's kind of a rational thought, like it's nefarious, but it's rational. And why don't I get America to do it? And America is bunker busters, I don't, if I can get Norway to

I'll get Norway to pay for it, but if I can get America to pay for it, I'll get America to pay for it, right? I mean, any other country would love to be in that position, they are in that position, so they do. So like when I see this, I think, yeah, A, two things can be true at the same time. A, could be true that they still have some uranium left, and B, I don't give a damn, and I'm not going to war for Israel, stop the goddamn bombing, and shut up already. How many times do you want us to do this all on your behalf, because there's one via left

left, maybe. Okay, Mark, what do you think? Well, there's no question that when Trump came forward and said, you know, it's all been obliterated, we all knew that he didn't know. I mean, maybe it is, maybe it's not. You certainly can't know 30 seconds after you've dropped this thing. The dust hasn't even settled. So we know that we don't know. This is the first kind of intel we've gotten, although there were fragments of intel, you'll remember just days after U.S. Intel, suggesting that Maybe there were parts of this operation that hadn't been completely obliterated. They built that structure below ground to a point such that it would be able to withstand a bombing of the sort that they just endured. So it makes sense, since it was designed to withstand that kind of blast, that something would survive.

The broader question I'm in agreement with Jankan, which is, to this extent, there's, always going to be a reason to go after Iran. Iran is the provocatory in the region, and that's a kind of polite way to put it. I mean, they've been after Israel through proxies, through Hezbollah, which has now been defanged through the Yemeni roots there that were, I'd say diminished, not completely eliminated. And even in Syria, but of course Syria is now a clean slate. So there is a reset moment here in the Middle East, but Iran hasn't been reset completely. And so this is the part I agree with Jank on completely. They're singing from the all too familiar hymnal, which is these guys are bad news. They're sponsors of terrorism. They want to see

the destruction of our country. And we have to make sure that they don't have nuclear capabilities. As to what they actually have, no one knows. And because of what I just said and what Jank has also said about the fact that they, you know, they sing that song over and over, it's hard to necessarily ascribe great credibility to this intel. Yeah. Yeah, totally agree. So even if it was true, I'd be like, okay, how is it our problem? Like, come on, guys, enough is enough. And by the way, and if last political point is Trump said anti-war. If he goes back and bombs Iran again, then he has no credibility. Because like, like, Matt. I'm laughing because, Genk, he'd lost credibility already. I'm just like, okay, one more. I'll give you that one, but you know, one more.

No, no, no, but there is a difference there. So for all of us, you're of course right, Mark, and it's funny, like Trump with credibility. Don't be ridiculous. I mean, that's a pathological liar. I'm talking about his own base, right? And his own base, when he first did the bombing of Iran was like, wait, what the hell? We've said anti-war. Then when he stopped Israel from further bombing and got a ceasefire, then his base flipped

to conjure percent, they're like, Trump's a genius, perfect bombing, right? And perfect way to get to peace. But after he doesn't release the Epstein list, if he goes back to bombing Iran, they're going to be out of all patients. Yeah. Total, you know, and we're, so he's, he's, I don't think Trump will do that. I think that's a bridge too far. I think that's, that would just be complete compliance with Netanyahu and it would

be humiliating and devastating for his base. So whether Israel does it themselves, that's a different question. Yeah, I don't, I'm inclined to agree with you, but he really could use a big distraction right now? No, it would back, I mean, maybe, but it would backfire massively. People would be furious. Now you're going to go back to war and we don't get the Epstein list? No, no. But John is right. He, you know, he needs to order off the menu because he does need a major distraction. I don't know what it'll be, Jang, but it has to be something. Because the Epstein thing is a gift that's going to keep on giving. I mean, this thing is not over. As you suggested, this is radioactivity that is

is spreading and it's reputational radioactivity, it's political radioactivity. So the two things may relate. Yeah, for sure. All right, we gotta take a quick break here. We'll be right back. On Ti-T-Jank John and Mark with you guys, don't forget to check out damage report. That's John's show every day.

When I say every day, of course, you know Monday through Friday at 1 o'clock Eastern and the Mark Thompson show on YouTube as well. All right, John, what's next? Okay, jumping to this. I'm not, I'm not a voter in New York City, and so I have no dog in that fight. And everything that I've read on him, I don't really agree with virtually any of it politically. So that that's just where I'm at as a Democrat. I mean, so he's not even a Democrat, honestly. It's very clear that the GOP are going to use him as their tent pole on their messaging.

And I don't think that's helpful at this point to have that be someone that's been identified as one of the emerging faces of our party. So that is John Fetterman repeatedly attacking Zoran Mamdani, saying that he's going to be used as a tent pole held up by the right to make the Democrats look. bad and he said that on Fox News, which is always happy to have John Fetterman on these days. So a little bit of irony there. But he's not the only establishment Democrat attacking Mamdani. We also have a former representative, Dean Phillips, who had this to say. Is there room for you and Mamdani in the Democratic Party? The answer ultimately I think is no, we do share many of the same values.

In fact, most Americans share a lot of the same values, but as a political party, yes, you want diversity, you want some differences of opinion, perspective, life story, politics, and experience. But when you have socialists, when you have socialists in the Democratic Party, I don't know how anybody could argue that that would be beneficial for the party or for the country. There in lies a great challenge, same thing on the right, Omar, is mega, the future of the Republican Party? If it is, there is going to be a new, grand, successful third party in America because

the overwhelming majority of Americans want neither far left or far right politics. They want decency, they want decency, they want common sense, competency, and cooperation. And no party right now is elevating candidates who represent those ideals. So just speaking for myself, I have a good bit more respect for Dean Phillips than I do for John Fetterman these days. And yet, I mean, so much of what he said is just such. You're still doing this? The, all I have to do is say the word socialist in this conversation should be done.

Why are you still talking to me? I mean, he's a socialist, you're, you're terrified of socialism, right? Because he grew up in a different time, a different economic context, and clearly doesn't understand that when you get past the label, which is supposed to set fire to Mom Donnie, and you actually talk about what he focused on, it isn't crazy, and it's not scary, and it's actually not that different than some of the stuff that John Federman campaigned on before, whatever happened happened. But they want to just shut him down with the label and imply that for some reason being

a socialist is the opposite of being decent and capable and compassionate or whatever. The people of New York have spoken. They think that if they're gonna apply those labels to anyone, it's going to be Mamdani. There were establishment Democrats in that race. If they wanted the same old thing, it was literally running against Mamdani, and yet they rejected it. And a lot of people have been learning at least some sort of lesson from that race, but there are still people that perhaps for ideological reasons, perhaps for monetary reasons, cannot ever learn that lesson.

Yeah, so I agree with John, two different people here with different motivations. So Dean Phillips, I disagree with him on a couple of policies for sure, at least, but he's a good guy. And I don't say that just because I know him a little bit from the campaign against Biden, But he had the courage to run against Biden. And so that's why this one is so ironic, because then he got label an outsider. And he's been on the young Turks talking about it. And he's like, wow, that doesn't feel good when they shun you and make you an outsider. But that's why it's so ironic.

You're doing that to Mom Donnie right now, right? So, okay, we don't have to hate Dean Phillips to think that he was wrong there. And I think he is wrong. In fact, I'll just say more about that. Why is he wrong? Because what do you mean that is socialism, there's no room for that in Democratic Party? No, there's room for whatever the Democratic voters say that there's room for, right? To John's point, that's their job, not your job, right?

And so, for example, I don't call myself a socialist. We've been through this many times over the 20 years we've been doing young Turks, right? A twist on Bernie's Democratic socialism. I call myself a Democratic capitalist. In a lot of ways, the policies are similar. There's some differences, but the framing is, for me, democracy helps to check the excesses of capitalism. And so, and it always breaks down to what do you mean by socialism, right?

So if you mean by socialism, Norway, that's pretty good. Northern Europe has excellent policies, right? And some of the Asian countries like Taiwan, Japan, et cetera, right? Like we're kidding around about my wife is from Taiwan, originally her friends, they're like, Hey, were you worried that Trump's going to deport you, et cetera? Because now the Asian community is a little nervous because a couple of ICE events happened. And they're like, deport me to Taiwan where I would have universal health care. Not that bad, right?

So like, if you mean that is socialism, then of course there's room for that in the Denver. You can't say there's no room for that in the Democratic Party. That's nuts, right? So if you mean seizing the means of production, which is something that Momdani did once say, right? Let's put it this way, is there room for people to think like that and still be in the Democratic Party? Sure, why not? Am I going to agree with them? No. Are they going to win overall and like lead the Democratic Party one day? I would be shocked. But maybe I'm a boomer and maybe, you know, one day we'll go in that direction. But even if I don't agree with socialism, I certainly don't agree with seizing the means of production.

We're gonna make sneakers? Is that what we're doing? Okay, so the government? No, it doesn't make any sense to me. But like, But the brother is trying to, Mamdani, is trying to do something. The reason they voted for him isn't because the people, the voters of New York wanted to seize the means of production, okay? They voted for him because he was actually talking about affordability and like, hey, you can't afford food, housing, transportation. And New Yorkers were like, that's definitely true. And the second thing he said was, and I'm going to try something, I'm going to try to do something about it. And all the other Democrats were like, I'm not going to try anything. No way.

Status quo, baby. And that is, that doesn't belong in the Democratic Party, right? Democratic Party is supposed to be for challenging the establishment in its roots, fighting for the average guy, not fighting for the powerful, not fighting for the donors, not fighting for the status quo. So Mamdani is closer than there. So then Federman, Federman is disqualified, I mean, he's a lunatic at this point. So like, he's the guy that they would say about him when he was running in his primary

in Pennsylvania, you know, oh yeah, he's with Bernie and those guys. They're not real Democrats. Now he's turning around and saying, no, I disqualify Mum Donnie. He's too progressive. He's not a Democrat. Okay, dude, I mean, you've lied about everything, but it's just unbearable. So Fetterman is a different animal altogether. Mark, what do you think?

Well, I mean, sadly, labels matter. I like your label, Democratic capitalist, as you sort of label yourself. Socialists still has, sadly, it has some stink on it. And you're right. It depends what you mean by socialism. I mean, communism and socialism, Marxism, these are all different things. So when you talk about seizing the means of production, the Marxist-Communist sort of extreme, that's not really reflected by anything that he says during his mayoral race or even in the primary.

And, you know, even his breakthrough concepts are not so far off of what is being suggested by even Eric Adams. That is to say, complete limit on rents, total rent control in the city and parts of the city of New York, and, of course, taxing the wealthy. These are breakthrough ideas that, as Jank has just mentioned, treat a problem in New York. New York is too expensive. People are suffering there, and under the withering cost of living in the city, comes this breakthrough guy with ideas to address those problems, and that matters. You want to call him a socialist?

Call him a socialist. In the end, those labels will fade, perhaps, and the ideas will carry the day. But labels matter, and when you talk about Dean Phillips' last thing, he's speaking to what he perceives as the appetite in America for these kinds of candidates that have those labels attached. I'd say, look at the ideas before you look at the labels. People are looking for ideas now, particularly as the gulf between the haves and the have-nots increases. I really feel the breakthrough candidates like Mondami, but on a national level, those with real ideas, they're going to carry the day. And these labels, which still,

as I say, are significant, they are going to fade and they're going to fade behind the real ideas for change. And as you know, and you point on TYT all the time, the Democrats have to step up with real ideas. If you want to win power, you need real ideas. You can't just say, look how bad those guys are. Yeah. So super last thing on this on the policies. Like, so let's take three of the policies that he mentioned, rent control freeze. Now, it's, I, I don't think rent control works. So I know a lot of people on the left disagree with me. But he's not talking about making all of Manhattan rent control. He's just talking about the rent control that exists, freezing the increases on that. And that's a much more justifiable policy. Even if I don't

fully agree with it, like it's not revolutionary. Like, so Karl Marx isn't coming to seize Manhattan, right? So like free buses, I wouldn't have thought of that. Although it's closer of what I would have thought of, like I get the idea behind it, but I'm glad he suggested it. It's an interesting idea. The grocery stores run by the city, I wouldn't have been anywhere near my priority list, but an interesting idea. So why don't we try it, and that's what the voters of New York are saying. Why don't we try, we already tried you guys, status quo, status quo, don't change anything.

That didn't work out for us. Now we'd like to try new ideas. And maybe guys, maybe two of them failed, but one is a spectacular success. And then we realize, oh my God, the cities can run grocery stores. And then we realize, wait a minute, actually turns out governments can run banks. North Dakota runs a bank, did you know that? And it's actually very, very successful. Huh.

That's why you don't just stick with the status quo. That's why I'm in favor of Mom Donnie, even though I'm not sure I agree with any of his policies. At least the brother's trying. And I want to try and I want to see if those things work as opposed to let's go back to Andrew Cuomo. and do nothing but deliver for the donors. No, thank you. No, thank you. I agree.

I agree. You start with the grocery stores, then the banks, then the shoes, and then you seize the means. Okay. Or maybe we have public health insurance, which every other developed nation in the world has, and we get to a reasonable conclusion. Okay, guys. Thank you, Mark and John. You guys are awesome.

We've got a whole second hour coming up. I, are we gonna be forced to be on Marjorie Taylor Greenside on one thing? I don't know, I'm gonna put you guys to quite a poll, we got a poll on that, and then we have Captain Underpants in the Epstein story. Who is Captain Underpants? You'll see when we return.