The Young Turks - TYT's Juneteenth Special - Part 2

Episode Date: June 19, 2021

Part 2: Join hosts Ben Dixon and Jayar Jackson as they discuss the issues impacting the black community the most. Panelists include Bridget Todd, Kenya Evelyn, Dr. James Q Simmons, Dr. Rashad Richey, Jason Carter, Charles Coleman, Wosny Lambre, and Wisdom Cole. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

You're listening to The Young Turks, the online news show. Make sure to follow and rate our show with not one, not two, not three, not four, but five stars. You're awesome. Thank you. Welcome back, everyone, to another section of our Juneteenth special here on TYT. I am J.R. Jackson. Very excited to be here. I understand it's a little bit later than we had expected, but that also builds up a little bit of the anticipation to make sure that we have a good conversation to continue on.

And if you guys have been watching since the beginning, it has been a fabulous conversation, a lot of historical context and information that maybe a lot of people didn't know about this. Now, federal holiday in the United States, as of just yesterday, I believe. So as we go into the Juneteenth celebration over the weekend, Joe Biden signed his law, of course, the Juneteenth as a federal holiday, to, I guess, to have another notch in what he's been doing with a bit of diversity and recognition of black. Black Americans in the country, maybe things that weren't always done in a way that we had anticipated before. But I did want to get into a lot of the breakdown of what that is.

And also, we've been doing the historical part of it. I like to talk about where we are now because there's such a connection between where things started versus the where we've been and where we're going and how we get there. And honestly, how we've even gotten to where we are now. So I'm very excited, very excited to have Charles Coleman Jr. join me today. He's a civil rights attorney and legal analyst. He works in politics and law and race and social justice, civil rights. All these things that I think are going to be very, very, very good parts of this conversation.

So, Charles, first of all, thank you for joining me. This is going to be excellent talk. Super excited to be here, JR. Thank you for having me on. Really, really looking forward to tonight's discussion. We had to round off all the shows that you've been on with TYT because the damage report. What did you say? The Power Panel on the main channel, you've been on between me and Uyghur.

So, I mean, you're familiar with us. You're good. Oh, yeah, absolutely. The conversation, I started on the conversation, moved over to the damage report between me and Yugar, you know, so I have been making the rounds of TYT and really enjoy every opportunity I have to talk to you guys. Excellent. It'll be fun. So I want to start off just because how did you take? I mentioned the fact that it's now a federal holiday. Of course, many black Americans celebrate it every year anyway. Of course, I'm in Los Angeles and there's an area of Limerd Park where It's always a huge celebration.

I would be there tomorrow, actually, with my wife and kid celebrating. And you find it in a lot of circles, but it's not always been this world or countrywide type of conversation. When Joe Biden signed it into law now as a federal holiday, what is the response you had? Because I feel like it could be a little bit back and forth with a lot of people based off of what he's done and said. Sure. I can appreciate that question, JR. Ultimately, I really won't be impressed until. until Juneteenth moves from being a black holiday

to an American holiday. And I realize that a lot of people may feel like because it has now been made a federal holiday, well, of course, now it's an American holiday, but that's not exactly what I mean. What I mean is until people consider Juneteenth a part of the American story, it is not an American holiday, as far as I'm concerned.

We know the story of July 4th. We know the story of America. We know Paul Revere and his ride and the land. We know that in 1492, Columbus sailed the ocean blue. We know that George Washington crossed the Delaware. We know about Lewis and Clark and the bravery of westward expansion and the 49ers in mining for gold in California and the railroads. Why?

Because we're taught that as part of learning the American story. So until Juneteenth, And everything that led up to it and the denial of this information from those African slaves becomes a part of the American story, I cannot consider this, even as it has been federally legislated, an American holiday. For America to have a conversation about black narratives and progress of black America within this space, there is no way. that you can omit narratives like these, narratives like Tulsa, narratives like Rosewood in Florida, narratives like so many others that are critical to explaining the story of our journey in America

and fully tell the American story. To make a parallel, JR, it would be like trying the crime of American racism in court. And yes, I am a lawyer, so I am making a legal analogy. Yeah. But it would be like trying the crime of American. and racism in court, but not telling the jury about the first 15 minutes of what happened. So we're going to talk about a bank robbery, but we're not actually talking about when the

robbers entered the bank and the stuff that they stole and so and so forth. And you want people to have a complete picture. It's impossible to do. Yeah. So you talked about all of those different things that we learned just general in school. It had the rhymes of it. It sailed the ocean blue, and then we got the 14, in 1849, all these things happen with, and it's just, there's this pride behind it. But we always notice, and I love the point you made about the fact that it needs to become an American tradition, an American holiday, something that's celebrated by Americans, and not something that we go, oh, black Americans celebrate that, and then this type of Americans celebrate that, but when we were taught about Christopher Columbus for some reason,

and when we were talked about the Wright brothers and everything, anything that happens in the country that's to be proud of, any progress that we've made, it's never under the guise of So do you know where the Wright brothers were from? Did you know what their parents were white? I mean, we don't want to point out that they were this particular race to this particular background because that would cause you if you don't appear to share that type of background. Maybe you don't care as much.

Maybe it's a human reaction just to kind of connect to the type of person or people you've grown up around and seen and are connected with. So I guess the question or at least my wonder is sometimes is how does that then get shifted? It's become such a structural part of our country and the way that kids learn things and adults, honestly, learn things. How does that switch? Well, I think the switch occurs

when you actually invest in what it means to have a multicultural and diverse country. So you can't just talk about America being a multicultural and diverse land in this melting pot of cultural identities and then not talk about the context that is necessary in order to frame what that means. So you have to actually invest in giving meaning to what it is to have a society

that blends so many different ethnic groups, cultures, races, nationalities altogether. You can't just say America is a land of immigrants. What does that actually mean? You can't just say we're such a diverse country and we blend together all of these different people from all of these different backgrounds unless you are willing to explore and unpack what that actually mean. So for me, to answer your question, J.R., it really is about putting meat to the bones when you start talking about these narratives and not leaving these sort of empty and hollow phrases about the greatness of America's diversity without explaining, number one, how that came to be, and number two, how much more we have to do before that is actually achieved and actualized

in a real intangible way for all of us. Yeah. So when it comes to the age of information, because I feel like this is a part of it. I always bring this up whenever I'm on. We have this age of information where everyone basically has an entire information source in their hands as they walk around. Many times we don't use it that well, but things are seen. People are said, again, I didn't learn about Juneteen until I was almost out of high school for the first time, you know. And so the ignorance that comes with not knowing where we came from the history of our country, and again, as a lot of people say, our primary evil of the country, if we don't learn about it until late, we really don't aren't able to have a connection to it. So when we have all

this information coming in, it has to be collected in a certain way, but it's kind of out of control. Nobody controls the way you're going to get it, especially when you're 28 years old now and you never heard about it until then. So I don't want to seem pessimistic, but I've been searching for a way to find how that then gets integrated. I guess, successfully, effectively, that really does turn it into this inclusive nature of a country. Because one more thought I had was we have laws or we have recognition of black folks with certain things. Or we made change things. We just had a law that wanted to make sure that there was, we would criminalize to a larger degree assaults on Asian Americans because they've been spiking for whatever multiple reasons that they have been.

And yet, things that may benefit black folks to bring a level of. equality, or at least continue to keep us from being attacked in certain scenarios, are shunned so quickly and easily. And after they are, there's not as much of an outcry because of how much is baked into the country with just this general thought that, oh, my God, they're complaining. There they go complaining again. Oh, there they go complaining about this again. Oh, it's racism again.

So when we feel it constantly, and I've always said this too, and this is not an original line for me, if you're tired of hearing about racism, imagine what it feels like to continue to see it and be influenced by it every day. So if you're tired of hearing me talk about it, imagine how much I feel tired of actually seeing and dealing with it. No, I think that's a great point. And I think in terms of having this conversation, it's important to contextualize it within the moment in history

where we are around America's racial reckoning. You know, about a year ago, we all watched in horror as a man in, you know, America was killed on camera by law enforcement, that being, of course, George Floyd. And, you know, the country erupted with a number of different protests, and it was the entire summer of racial reckoning that stretched everywhere from streets to the boardroom in terms of corporations and everyone wanting to show up as an ally and seek racial conciliation. And as someone in the spaces that I'm in, who, you know, traverses this terrain frequently, The most frequent and often question that I got, the most common question that I got from folks was, what can I do?

What is it that I can do? Where is it that I can show up? And the answer, there are many answers, but one of the answers that I think about is the direct, it points directly to what you were talking about. It is directly around now that there is a movement in state houses across the country to eliminate any conversation about racism, systemic inequity. inequality, implicit bias. Now that those measures are taking place from a policy perspective, this is the time that you stand up and you say, no, that's not okay. It's not okay that you ban lessons or conversations that are much needed about racism and inequality and systemic injustice in our schools. It's not okay that you take away public funding so that people can be trained and educated on that to create more inclusive and more.

more equitable work spaces. That's how you actually show up. So for me, the impact, if you are 28 years old, or you're 35 years old, or you're 42 years old, and you just are learning about Juneteenth, and you want to find out how you can make an impact, how you can make a difference, what are you doing about contacting your legislator? Who are you supporting in political elections, and are they people who are attempting to further or to silence narratives around Black Lives, same Black Lives. And I think that is sort of a very tangible, very practical question and conversation that can be had that actually has a potential to move the needle and disrupt what you were just talking about, i.e., folks not having this information until they're at a point

in life where it's much more difficult for them to connect with it in a real way. You said you were an ally? Okay, prove it. This is what it looks like to be an ally in 2021, contextually around the things that we're dealing with, and this is how you can make an impact. What are you going to do? Right. So the powers that be the legislative folks, people in Congress, that's where these laws, something may change here, or the influence of that, or just their representation of their people. And I'm glad you brought up the whole thing with bringing in folks that do things the right way, because inclusion and diversity is something that politicians will always talk about. And it's been happening more and more. Of course, before in the past, you didn't have to have

your cabinet, if you're the president, full of diversity with women or people of color at all. It didn't matter because the people that were watching it weren't demanding it. So we moved on and up that we least are demanding it. And both major political parties at least have this approach where they want to show some diversity. You know, we remember that picture.

I can't remember which congressman it was, a congressperson it was, but it was a Republican congressman. They showed a picture. They had their staff behind them in the room. And people talk, you remember this. And people talked about, look at all those white faces, you know? And it was the only thing that was spoken about that picture, and it kind of became a big flub.

But at the same time, is the response then what I've seen? Response doesn't necessarily mean, okay, let me throw on five black folks there, two other women, a Latino, and then an Asian person, and now I'm good. I feel like we miss the, we dropped the ball on the reason for diversity and in conclusion. So we had our first black president and President Obama. And people thought, well, we solved the case. It's over. Racism is done in this country. When, in fact, I think that's the beginning of more of the vitriolic, angry responses to such a thing happening in a country that many people didn't think this would ever happen in. So the fight becomes a little bit more tense after those things happen.

And then once it does, we're trying to include people more on one side. but do you really trust every time say, okay, President Biden has tons of diversity in his cabinet? Again, he signed the Juneteenth bill. But does he really know what it means? Are the decisions really being made in a way that will affect these folks and have them represent the communities that they came from? So that's why, you know, this is a problem that, in my opinion, is actually greater on the left than the right. And the reason I say that is there is a need for progressives and so-called progressives. and so-called progressives to re-examine and we imagine what it is that we think that we know

about racial injustice, racial reckoning, and what it is to be both diverse and inclusive. Because diversity, as you said and as you alluded to, is just a snapshot. It's a picture of what you look at on the surface if there's no context or captioned placed in terms of what people can see around representation. Diversity does not mean inclusion. It does not mean that those people are being able to participate within systems and conversations in an equitable fashion. And I think that that is a big piece of understanding it. And part of what falls on us, and when I say us, I'm referring to black Americans,

is the need to remain uncompromising in our insistence that it is not only diversity, but inclusion and equity that we choose to value. Because the problem that has erupted is that on the left, we have allowed symbolism to supplement substance in terms of what actually has to happen in order to move the needle in a room of diversity. I actually care less about who's in the room than I do what is actually going on in the room, what conversations are going on in the room. Because quite frankly, if you put Tim Scott, J.C. Watt, and, you know, someone else, and Clarence Thomas in a room, for example.

you got diversity, but are you moving the needle in terms of what the needs and concerns are for many black Americans in this country? Probably not. And so part of that setup falls on progressives because for far too long, the left has been extremely eager to sort of show diversity without actually modeling inclusion. The DNC is reprehensible for this on a number of levels and not showing what equitable, you know, involvement and engagement looks like. And I think that, you know, that's something that has to catch the attention of progressives, of the left, of Dems, in terms of modeling it before you start talking and pointing the finger about the fact that the other side doesn't have it visually. Because ultimately, what you're accusing them of

is just a matter of not having the visuals when what we need to be concerned about and should be uncompromisingly insistent upon is having the substance. That's the question that comes up to then. So when those fights have to happen or when those discussions, forget fights, I don't want to be to that degree, the discussions need to happen within these rooms that have to give people an actual reason to do things a certain later, actually reason to have a representation come in for certain folks. So when we have that there, you end up having to fight within, say, whatever party you tend

to vote with. In this case, maybe Democrats are showing a little bit more diversity, but it's not always concrete. But then people worry, well, if we're fighting within the party, oh, my God, now the Republicans are going to say, there's this intra-party fighting going on, and now we're high-step, and look how unified we are. And it scares people off from actually doing some work. And it leaves people to step back and say, well, we got some diversity-looking things, so maybe we'll get elected, and then slowly we'll figure out some ways to actually represent the people that we say we're representing. Where do we find that balance?

Well, as radical as it sounds, to me, that's not the job of the consumer to sort out. That's the job of the establishment. And when I say the consumer, I'm talking about the voter. So, for example, it's not the voter's responsibility to go into the voting booth and say, well, if I'm not comfortable with what I'm seeing as unsatisfactory representation within the party that I like to support. I still need to support them anyway in order to make sure that the other party doesn't end up victorious in terms. of seeing a split. Because if you do that, ultimately, the only thing you're going to get is what you had, which is nothing, because you've now given your vote and your support away

without making a demand. The pressure needs to be felt by the establishment to make the changes. Because ultimately, as the Democratic Party, whoever's involved, whoever's in charge, they're the ones who are making decisions about not only what it looks like, but also what it feels like within the party. So that, so solving that problem, solving for X, if you will, is on the shoulders of people who are the quote unquote leaders of the progressive movement. And the pressure has to be kept on from the standpoint of, you know what, we may lose some of our base. We may lose some of our voters. Some of our support may shift or not show up or turn out in the ways and numbers that we need. And in order to prevent that from happening, we've got to make

some adjustments. So I think the answer in terms of finding that balance, that's not the responsibility of the voting and the electorate, that's the responsibility, the voters in the electorate, that's the responsibility of the party to figure out. And it's our responsibility to continue to put pressure and apply that pressure until we have an inclusive and equitable party that functions the way that we want. I want to tap into some of your legal prowess and the approach to some of these bills, because as we're talking about, you know, shifting the needle and pushing things a certain way, we've got plenty of states. that are controlled by Republican governors

and Republican Congress people that are passing these voting restrictive laws to make sure that whatever numbers of people that did have opportunities to vote, of course, shrinks. We've known forever that the Republican Party is based on making sure that fewer people vote because the fewer people that vote, the better chance they have of winning

because it's pretty obvious that the large majority of the country actually believes in progressive-style policies because they want things to move forward and actually make sense. The younger generations are always looking for ways to change things. It's just a natural, progression for human beings. So in order to keep things a status quo or even push back and

let's go backwards in some ways, they need to limit who's there. So I want to go to this first graphic about what's happening. So this is from the Brennan Center of Justice between January 1st of this year and May 14th, at least 14 states enacted 22 laws that restrict access to the vote. So the United States is on track to far exceed its most recent period of significant voter suppression, and that was in 2011. They went on to say more restrictions on the vote. vote are likes to become law, as roughly one third of legislators are still in session, and indeed, at least 61 bills with restrictive provisions are moving through 18 state legislators.

So even more specifically, 31 have passed in at least one chamber, while another 30 have had some of the committee action. So overall, these lawmakers are introduced at least 389 restrictive bills in 48 states in the 2021 legislative sessions. So that's what could scare a lot of people. And I don't like not one of those things where it's a force. afraid of what's happening. But there needs to be like a direct and immediate response to this that has to have a collective unifying message. And honestly, legislation to do such a thing,

where do we find that? Because they're moving quicker. You know when things are looking to change, the folks are looking to push back spring into action. If you ever need to know who to challenge, they'll show themselves. So I think, I think, you know, again, part of this is holding folks accountable. Everyone who is connected to this conversation about civic engagement has to be held accountable for where they are. So voters have to hold the elected officials accountable. And then, you know, party members have to have the fortitude to hold their colleagues accountable. So you say that you're about inclusion. You have this huge racial reckoning in America. You have this conversation about Juneteenth, you cannot allow for these integrity gaps to show themselves

in such blatant ways and be silent about them. So you have to be very clear about holding people accountable where folks stand up and say, and while it may be symbolic in nature, or while they may say, well, that's just word, or that's just business, or that's just politics, the reality is most of the people say those things are not affected in the ways that our communities are. So what you are talking about is the need to hold accountable white nationalism, what you need to hold accountable as white supremacy, and what you need to hold accountable is intentional systemic disenfranchisement of marginalized communities. So if you're not able to call your colleagues on their face about that and you just sort of pat them on the back and say, oh, they're a good

person, they just have terrible ideas, but not willing to really put, you know, the rubber to the road and calling racism out for what it is when you see it and being clear and drawing a clear line in the sand, well, then people think it's okay. There aren't any consequences for that. There are not any consequences in the court of public opinion because you as a gatekeeper and someone who was supposed to understand how important this is has given them a past. You're not willing to sort of denigrate them, and I'm not talking about in a personal way, but certainly professionally, you're not willing to denigrate them in that manner. You're not willing to call them out as being a racist in that manner. You make it about ideology when, quite frankly, for me, as a person who is affected by this policy or these policies, it is a matter of humanity. And I think that a lot of times when we get into the political realm and the realm of elected officials, even as there is a, desire to sort of talk tough, there's still the need to play nice. And I think we see a lot of that on the left that's not necessarily a condition of being on the right in ways where they're

like, we don't need to play nice. Right. And for any sort of real progress to be made on that, those people have to be taken to task unrelentingly. Hey, well, let's have the poster chaff of that, because you talked about playing nice and relenting to opposition. Senator to Joe Manchin. Let's go ahead and start. So Joe Manchin has become what I think he expected to become in the position that he's in. And he, I think, feels that he feels he's thriving in this position of doing these types of things, of blocking this type of legislation in a roundabout way because he's looking to preserve the filibuster to this degree. Now, we were talking about voting rights, and Stacey Abrams is a big face of exactly what we need to do and hard work

that has been pushing this type of thing. This stuck out to me today, and I really want your thoughts on it because I took to Twitter on it earlier because Ms. McConnell had a press conference and he stood there and he talked about this latest compromise that Joe Manchin said he wanted to put forward for voting rights. And Stacey Abrams said, absolutely, we'll take that as a first step and we'll move on for the next things later. Now they're calling it the Stacey Abrams substitute for the voting rights. And now because they put her face and name on it, now suddenly it's something to oppose. They want to eliminate Joe Manchin from it and put her face on it to make sure this happens. And in my mind, that's racist playbook 101 in politics. Hey, this is the person

we've turned into the boogeyman. Aren't you afraid of the black woman who's smart and moves quickly and actually got things done? Aren't you afraid of her? This isn't a Joe Manchin policy. This is a Stacey Abrams policy. We got to fight back against that, but then in what way without also letting Manchin off the hook? So it is, you know, this is a, indicative of the old adage that a people who do not understand or know their history are doomed to repeat it. This is the same thing that occurred, if you think back just a few short years ago, with respect to the moniker that was given around the Affordable Care Act that became Obamacare. Once Republicans saw that by attaching Obamacare and the label of Obama

to the Affordable Care Act. You saw the shift in both politics and the Court of Public Opinion began to move away from it in ways that the GOP needed, and that's what they used, and that's what they sold. We're just seeing a repackaging of that. As you said, this is sort of one of their racism moves 101. I think part of the problem with respect to how you combat that is they know that they're dealing with an apathetic in many respects

and disengaged voting populists that is not necessarily going to take the research and the time to necessarily connect the dots and understand how that takes place. Again, it is a matter of, you know, how do you continue to press forward and keep the pressure on maintaining accurate narratives without alienating people who you think are allies? The trick, JR, is that these people actually weren't allies ever to begin with. While Democrats are so concerned about how do we sort of navigate this relationship with Joe Manchin, who at this point, you cannot convince me, is not simply seeking a whole bunch of national attention for what purpose I do not know in terms of like, how do we sort

of talk tough to him and hold him accountable as someone who's essentially obstructing an agenda from within versus we may need that vote later on. end of the day, either folks are with you or folks are against you. And I don't know that it is worth the investment or the cost in terms of a benefit that may, quite frankly, never materialize. And I think that Dems spend a lot of time sort of trying to hedge their bets by playing nice in the sandbox. And this is an example of it. And again, not putting the pressure around that narrative, accurate and correct. And being very, very clear and very, very frank on news media in public on social media

about what has actually happened in labeling it what it is. Everyone is too gun-shy about, well, we don't want to call someone a racist because, you know, they may not be or they, you know, then that's going to put the spotlight on me, so and so forth. Ultimately,

what type of relationship are you trying to preserve? Call this person to task, and if they're with what you're trying to do, they're going to get on board, and if they don't, they were never with you to begin with. stop playing both sides in this middle of the road, sort of moderate, moderate space that's not going to move us any. I appreciate those words because it's an ongoing struggle. And it's one of those things.

I'm glad, you know, I'm glad for the recognition, everything for the holiday. I'm glad you and I got to talk about where it's landing us now today and potentially in the future, because this isn't ending. It's not going anywhere. And in fact, anytime something positive happens, even if it's something that's that's, that's symbolic like this, there's always going to be angry pushback for that because there's always the push for status quo. So I want to thank you for coming on, Charles. It's been excellent. We could do this for an hour. I got four other things I want to talk to you about. I got to be honest. We didn't even touch on Kamala Harris. I would have loved to see what you think about her first few months

as the first black woman as a vice president. But I guess that'll have to happen soon because I mean, you've already been on the network many, many times. Bring me back, bro. I'll be glad to conversation. Absolutely. Let's do that. Coming up next to you guys, we got Jason Carter and Dr. James Simmons to wrap up this hour of our Juneteenth special. They'll be on to bring in another new angle to the entire collective nature of black folks in this country and the things that we see deal with and address as we go forward. So we'll be back with those guys in a second. We'll see you guys. Welcome back to the Juneteen special here on. the Young Turks. How's it going, everyone? I am Jason Carter. Coming to you from Miami,

happy to be here with you guys to celebrate this wonderful day in black culture. And I'm joined by an amazing man himself, Mr. James Simmons. He is a critical nurse practitioner, activist, and a multimedia medical contributor who has emerged as one of the leading voices at the intersection of the black and LGBTQ plus communities. James, glad to have you. Welcome. Thank you so much for having me, Jason. I am excited to be here. And TYT, thank you so much for having me on this, you know, June 10th, first federal holiday special. Right. First federal holiday.

You're saying that, James, it's a joyous, wondrous thing, right? But it's also like, wow, finally it's taken this long for this to come to fruition. Yeah, it's really, I think it's so interesting that this is a holiday that, you know, actually, a lot of the experts, a lot of the people that have been on the network so far, tonight during this special, have been talking about how their particular communities have been celebrating this already for so long, right? This is very prevalent. This was something that was not a part of my reality, not a part of my, sort of how I was raised until I got older and I actually went to Chicago. I am black, but from Omaha, Nebraska. And so I think it's really interesting how, you know, there are so many people who, I was really just fascinated watching all night long. So many

people are like, this is not new in the black community, of course. But if you're black in a place like Nebraska, which is redder than Alabama, something like Juneteenth wasn't really talked about, wasn't really celebrated necessarily back in the day. So it does feel, you know, I understand the gravity and the weight of this. And while I am elated, of course, just like everyone that, yes, there's now a federal holiday and we recognize this. I also, you know, in simplest terms, this is great, but it's not exactly what the community is asking for. There's so many other things that we need for the community now. 100%. Great point.

And also, you know, I am also from Albuquerque, New Mexico. But, you know, on a contrasting note, I grew up celebrating Juneteenth in Albuquerque that back in the 90s or when I was growing up in the 2000s as well, wasn't a huge black community in the Southwest, but yet there was this a awareness of Juneteen. So it's just, it's really, like, as you said, it's very interesting, the duality to what Juneteenth is. how people recognize it and also how people don't recognize it, but now they're becoming more aware. You know, James, I want to talk to you about something, you know, me, you talk a lot,

but we are both of the LGBTQ plus community. And I want to talk about blackness in the LGBTQ plus community, because that is a conversation that, you know, a lot of people who move through the world that are black and our LGBTQ plus have different opinions, have a difference of opinion on what that means and what that represents. Let me, I want to get your take on, on that. because you are biracial, and with that comes a whole layer of complexities that maybe someone like myself who is not biracial and who is of a darker complexion doesn't have to deal with or hasn't had to grapple with for yourself. What has that been? I mean, wow, that's a lot. There's so much that we can unpack there, particularly in terms

of, like, you know, colorism in our community as well and the privilege and the passing that I am afforded, right? Like, it's really interesting how many people do not assume my blackness, right? Black folks always know. White people always assume I'm a white person with a tan. It's very interesting. But something about my being biracial, growing up in Nebraska, having half of me understanding sort of like white culture, white Midwest Protestant culture, there is a lot of privilege to that. It's really interesting. As this relates to sort of the LGBTQ community, so you add in those different layers, right, that I talked about in terms of being biracial and then coming out as gay and even subsequently after that, really I'm more identified now as queer. And there's always this

challenge that happens, I think, a lot that a lot of folks of color who are also queer or a part of the LGBT community really face. And that is doing, representing your community, both of them, right? So is this a black issue? Is this a queer issue? Is this a black queer issue? And if you are championing one cause, are you then subsequently not championing another cause, right? So if you are championing a cause for queerness, a cause for, you know, advancing gay rights like marriage, for instance, before marriage was legal, does that mean you're then putting the racial disparities and the things we need to keep working on as a community from that sense? Second, right? And that's a challenge that I think a lot of people don't necessarily think about that you, we are, you know, we are complex human

beings, we have a complex society, and we come from so many different places, and that multiple truths can exist simultaneously, but at the same time, it is incredibly unique to have the systemic oppression on your race, as well as the systemic oppression upon your socioeconomic status, as well as on your sexuality, and the intersections of all of those are really, really tremendously complicated for a lot of people. They are absolutely tremendously complicated for a lot of people. And I mean, I, you know, It's such a unique perspective. You, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, um, I, I, you know, on the, on the, on the flip side of that, James, I think when it comes to blackness and LGBTQ plus community, there, there also comes the conversation of, of, um, homophobia, you know, that, you know, that, that, that, that be going all the way back to slave days, how.

how slave masters would question and would challenge a black man's masculinity as and as being men, not to enter toxic masculinity into the conversation, but let's go back 100, 100 years, when the essence of who you were, because you had been stripped of everything else, your name, your, your legacy, your history, all you had was who you were as a man and your masculinity. That was put into question and also challenged by, other men by the slave master, right? So, you know, it's this generational thing that's been passed down that about what gay represents, right? What that attraction represents. And it's even in 2021 and the generation that we're in, yeah, we've seen strides and we've seen, and we have conversations

about erasing that and eradicating that out of the community, but it's become more sinister. It's become more covert, at least to me. I can only speak for myself and my experience. But I think now more than ever, or I would hope, I would imagine that the conversation is more accepting. You know, I have family members who are clergymen who are pastors and deacons at major AME churches and major black metropolitan areas that even now still have a, a tinge of that, uh, we're not ready to go there yet. You know, we know what's there, but we don't speak about it. It's like, you know, you have the LGBTQ plus uncle who you know is gay, but you don't talk about it, which is still sad worse. It's still one of those things that's like, well, why are we not talking about this?

Because especially in 2020, we saw the unearthing of racial violence and violence against trans, our trans community, which we're going to talk about as well. Also, rioting a pandemic. There were so many things that were, as I like to say, traumatic because let's keep it 100 percent. all the way real, we're 2020, a very traumatic real, I'm sorry, a year for a myriad of different reasons, much like the ones I just illustrated. So I just find it fascinating that we're still shying away from the LGBTQ plus conversation in the black community in some sectors and some sections of our community. And I think that, you know, shying away from that conversation, Jason, is really, is something that happens because, and I'm going to derail us for just a moment

here, but I think it, it, I'll bring you back full circle, I promise, we'll have an Oprah moment with this, that, you know, the masagony that is so incredibly deep and ingrained in what was taught to us from slavery, right? There are so, there are so many, even if you go back into the sub-Saharan, you know, African diaspora in West Africa, there were so many tribal nations that actually revered and understood that there is more than one gender, revered. just like a lot of indigenous American tribes here, actually revered individuals who had a more fluid sexuality and held them up in religious aspects.

And then those, you know, we get brought here against our will, put into slavery, taught Christianity, and then all of a sudden there is something wrong with those things. And then you add the level of misogyny onto it, right? Because let's be real. If we're going to be real about this, part of the reason that it is a challenge, it is difficult for a lot of, unfortunately, men in general

and has been in the black community, though, that's a whole conversation, is acting gay as like acting like a woman. And that equals bad, right? So it's the ingrained misogyny in there that was unfortunately taught to us as a combine all of us together as a race since slavery,

and that perpetuates now. What I do think is really fantastic, though, not to continue to harp on the history is that we're making such incredible strides. I think that there are, tremendous examples right now. Not, I think. I know there are incredible examples now of this sort of tired narrative of the hyper-masculine black man. The mistake, the black mystique, right? Yes, yes, as sort of an anti-gay figure, right? And this hyper-mass, you know, masculine, muscular,

etc. And that can also not be gay. And it's really interesting that that's starting to fade away now. And it is coming because of political activism. It is coming because of ball culture. It is coming because of athletes who have come out, who happens to be black. The entire, like we often do as a black community, we tend to lead that in some ways, lead the acceptance of more gender fluidity, more sexual fluidity as a community. And so, you know, I don't necessarily buy any more into that narrative of, you know, the black community as a whole is less accepting.

of LGBTQ folks. I think that's something that's a narrative that we like to preach and talk about when you really get down to the nitty-gritty and the narrative of it, you know, on an individual basis, it's changing. And I think that's a positive that we really have to hang on to. 100%. We absolutely have to hang on to that.

I mean, you mentioned ball culture and more visibility. I mean, we both work in entertainment outside of here. We both moving spaces that are very entertainment-centric. We have Laverne Cox now being the red carpet hose for e-enertainment, which is history-making, right? Of course, we've had Donald on air at CNN, who has been openly very robust about his sexuality. And thank you for illustrating that.

And the point I was making was not to harp on the negativity of homophobia in the black community, but we have to also shine a light on something that is still there. Want to segue into trends, since we're talking about the LGBTQ plus community and blackness, you know, the HRC has reported that in 2021, we're only in June. of 2021, already 29 members of the trans community have been murdered. 2020, 44 members of the trans community have been murdered. And one thing I noticed last year, because we really didn't have the opportunity to celebrate Juneteenth last year like we're doing this year because, of course, the pandemic and

where we were as far as a nation and the state of the world was in the conversation of Black Lives Matter when you entered trans Lives Matter into that. It was a weird space to be in because I still. think, even though we've had shows like Pose, we have shows like legendary, we have people like Janet Mock, we have Leverin Cox, we have people that are very visible of the trans experience. And also here on TYT, we've had, we've had people talk about their experience of being trans. It's still something that is trans and non-binary. I should also include that non-binary in that as well. It's still something that is very puzzling to people and people

still aren't willing to bring that along. I always liking everything. And people in TYT know I love my Marvel comics. I liken all of us as Avengers assembling to fight Thanos, right? We're all like the Guardians of the Galaxy, the X-Men. We're all coming together to get, to get the infinity gauntlet and get the stones from Thanos, right? And Thanos is the white nationalist. All the, all the egregious people who are passing these bills, eight passed already, 133 in legislation that may be passed across the country that are that are trying to erase trans people and trying to erase trans rights. So I just think it, you know, in 2021, we absolutely need to still be talking about protecting our trans brothers and sisters. And that's something that

people still aren't wanting, not everyone, of course, we're not speaking in general terms, but in conversations I've had with people who are very conservative, they can't wrap their brain around that. What do you think? It is difficult for us. some people to wrap their brains around because of this gender binary that we all grew up with, that we all were taught, regardless of race or whatever, this gender binary that we were taught. I think the issue that this comes down to, I mean, there's multiple issues here, but the dehumanization of individuals solely based on their gender, I think is it's breathtaking how horrible and awful this is. I mean, I think about like Tierra Banks, who was just sitting in her car in Chicago,

and someone just walked up and fired at her because she's trans and killed her. Like the, we're allowed to just take people's lives. And I think there are some parallels there in what we, you know, understand a lot of people have been saying today on social media, things like, thanks for the holiday, but we really just asked you to stop killing us as a black people. I would say that as well, trans individuals, particularly trans individuals of color,

are also saying the same thing. And they're saying that to everyone. This gender, not having a gender binary, if that's something that you don't necessarily understand as a human being, it still doesn't mean that killing that person that you don't understand is the answer, right? And I think that comes from that really, really, really deep-seated, obviously transphobia, but homophobia, the prudish nature of our country as well, right? where when we talk about things like sexuality in general, it's something that we don't talk about. People don't like to talk about those things. And so instead of being exposed as maybe a cisgender identifying individual

who is attracted to a trans woman, instead of being exposed for that, you're just going to kill that individual. These are things that actually happen because so much of this violence is like intimate partner violence as well as stranger violence. These are really incredible things that happen. And, you know, I say this while I have an opportunity

speaking to the people watching, it is really important that we as a collective, you know, we throw all these letters out, you know, all the time, Jason, but they really do mean something to a lot of people, LGBTQ plus community. A lot of people, particularly cisgender gay men, just sort of stopped at gay marriage.

And we're like, okay, great, we can get married now. We're cool. I can have my parade in West Hollywood or Boys Town or Chelsea or whatever. All right, I'm good. While our trans family, are out there dying. And to me, this is, this is irresponsible. And, you know, it's, I got mine. So I'm going to make sure, you know, I'm not going to worry about anybody else. And I think that as a community, as a collective, particularly black folks, this is something that we can't, our lives can't

matter. Excuse me, black lives can't matter. Our lives can't matter until trans black lives also matter, right? I will extend that, right? All lives can't matter until black lives matter. Well, black lives can't matter until black trans lives also matter, right? And we have to stop killing black trans women in general. And this is, this is not a challenge to anyone. This to me is just something that is very fundamental in terms of the power and the meaning behind the Black Lives Matter movement. And of course, the great white awakening that happened last summer has to include trans women. It has to include queer folks of color or the movement is null and void, in my opinion. I couldn't agree more. And, you know, it's someone had said T.S. Madison, who is a

very outspoken woman of the trans-experienced, a trans superstar, if you will, she has said that people who fail in the black community, people who fail to recognize trans lives, it's also another form of privilege. You highlighted cisgendered gay white men

stopping at gay marriage, and that's that is a blatant form of privilege. Like, okay, fine, that was our initiative that we fought hard for. We got that. Nothing else matters. And if you want to take them to the black community, not recognizing trans lives being black is just us enacting a certain form of privilege. So I couldn't

agree more. And it's very interesting because during the during last summer when we when when that the height of the black lives matter movement, I saw a lot of and I don't want to say allies because the term allies has become I would say I want to start saying the word accomplices and accomplice because they are helped instead of saying an ally they're they're helping they're an accomplice and helping us getting, get our initiative and our point across, right? But, um, I saw more of our accomplices doing more for trans women of color than actual people of color, which was, which was mind blowing, right? Mind blowing. But, um, I think that it's just, it's something that we need to also keep the conversation going because what, 20, 20% black, black trans women are 20% more

inclined to be harassed by the police. And you being a medical professional, we speak to this as well. also enters mental health, right? Not being able to have a job, turning to sex work. There's all these different, it's a domino effect of things that happen in their life for just how they move through the world that is truly tragic. So, I mean, I can't say it enough, and I'm glad you were able to highlight that to our viewing audience because that's just a conversation that I like to have with people

and that I've been championing on my social media about trans black lies because it's just something that's important. And people, and I think now more than ever, We are so fortunate that we have technology. The way we're talking to each other right now, we have the privilege of Google, what, what, Google, Alexa, Siri, you know, AI, automation, all of it. It's all of it, right?

All the things to educate ourselves on stuff that we don't know, because ignorance is just a lack of education, right? Once you get, and then like, you know, JR was talking to the previous guest and said, ignorance is a lack of education, but once you're educated and you still don't know, you're just stupid. So it's like people are making stupid choices to not support transal. That's all I'm going to say on that. But I want to talk to you about also, I know we're going to be running out of time just a few, but I know you are a medical professional. You're probably one of the smartest people I know. But the disparity of medical treatment and the availability

of quality medical treatment for black women. That is something that has been talked about on the myriad of different platforms here on t yt as well you are in the thick of it you are boots on the ground every day in los angeles seeing this in real time what is going to be the turning point what do we need to do to make sure that women of color are receiving the same type of care that their non-PLC counterparts are i mean serena williams talked about it in her documentary and this is someone that has unlimited resources and even she still felt that she wasn't getting the care that she needed. How is that even possible? Isn't that incredible? For those of you watching who don't know, you know, Serena Williams almost died after she gave birth to Olympia from a

blood clot, which is unfortunately fairly common in women who give birth. And she was complaining of shortness of breath. She was complaining of pain. And the providers where she delivered were ignoring her until finally she literally had to jump up and down and scream and probably be that angry black woman, I'll just say it for you, right? She probably had to be that person that then everyone intimidated thought they're like, oh, well, Serena's being a diva or whatever. They finally scanned her. Turns out she has a very, very life-threatening, critically ill blood, you know, blood clot in her lungs that then sidelined her and made her recovery very, very difficult. So, and this is arguably one of the five most recognizable black women in the entire world,

right? So I think it's pretty incredible that, yeah, I mean, I wish I had the fix, Jason, for everything. I will tell you that all of the things we are doing to fix systemic racism and to fix the system are going to help this. And by system, I mean that there are racist principles that are taught in medical and nursing schools even now to this day, right? The history. That's why, you know, the duality of Juneteenth is so important. It's important to recognize our history. It's also important to say, okay, great, this is a national holiday, but what else are we doing, right? Same thing in terms of recognizing the history. So many people know that Tuskegee experiment, the syphilis experiment, right? But there are so many other things. Even up

until into the 2000s, there are public health departments in major cities in the United States that were intentionally placing black families in homes full of lead paint and then following those families over the years to see what the lead paint did neurologically. Intentionally, in our lifetimes, Jason, and you and I are very young and beautiful, right? So these things are still happening until we fix the system, until we stop teaching these things, until we stop teaching antiquated notions like black people experience pain differently, right, right? I mean, that's just a very common one. Or, you know, you were, I was even taught when I was very young in nursing school in terms of like, oh, if a black woman comes and has pelvic pain or abdominal

pain, you know, you should screen for an STI right away rather than assume like, oh, ovarian cyst or appendicitis or many of the myriad of other things that can be going on in your abdomen, right, like that. So I think even now in 2021, I guess the most recent data we have is 2019's data, but black women are three times more likely to die during childbirth

than white women. That's in the United States. Yeah. And that something like that is just cringeworthy and that's deeply, deeply rooted in racism and the racism of the healthcare system. And so until there is a systemic fix that we have to

continue to work on and continue, it's a multi-pronged approach, right? There isn't a magic switch that's obviously going to turn off racism or we maybe would have figured that out already. Same thing applies in health care. Unfortunately, while we're trying to fix the system, it keeps disproportionately impacting people of color and black folks. Like in L.A. County, for instance, where I am, you were four to five times more likely to get COVID if you were black and you were three times more likely to die from it in Los Angeles County. That's real. Those are facts. And so when the next pandemic, comes, because it is coming, if we don't continue to fix the system, it's going to disproportionately

impact people of color. And the final thing I'll say about that is, you know, I'm elated that California is one of those places, you know, we lifted all the restrictions this week. It's really fantastic from a COVID standpoint. But I have to take a step back and sort of really evaluate where we are because we're only at about 40 to 45 percent of the black population in L.A. County having at least one shot. Whereas about 70% of the overall population in LA County has at least one shot. Well, so we're okay to move forward when the black and brown communities are not yet fully vaccinated. But because the white communities are more fully vaccinated at this point, I mean, it's sort of like a slap in the face without being an overt slap in the face.

So while I'm elated that 70% of the place where I live has been vaccinated. Also, we're once again, leaving black and brown folks behind we are we are it's uh you know i can speak to that as well in los angeles i went to my my primary care doctor and the first thing he asked me is oh do you have obamacare you know and i'm i'm gamefully employed had really good insurance but that was just that was the first thing out of his mouth was how what type of insurance do you have and obamacare was the first thing not that there's anything wrong with obamacare but it was very indicative of how he viewed me as a black man but we we talked about the problems i want to offer a solution to our viewers because there is a wonderful app called Earth by a great woman

named Kimberly Aller Seals who created this app for women of color to be able to rate and find other OBGYNs, other female reproductive health professionals and get the appointments, but also rate them on their experience. It's called Earth because it's taking the bias out of birth, right? So birth, Earth, it's very clever. I am able to go and download the app because she is true. truly revolutionizing the way that we take back the power when it comes to health care, at least for women.

And we're giving ourselves a seat at the table. They're giving us a wrap in just a few. James, before we go, first of all, thank you so much for being here. You are a wealth of knowledge. Such a pleasure to share this moment with you tonight on The Young Turks. How are you celebrating June 10th this year? And how are you celebrating Pride this year? Oh, it's so different, right?

Pride and Jueteenth and everything. I actually am on call at work tomorrow. So I will be in the hospital while folks are having their barbecue and hanging out. I will actually be in the hospital taking care of patients. But I do work in a predominantly black and brown neighborhood. So I'm just excited to, you know, this really is my passion. I love the media, but I also love what I do at work. And so, you know, I think I'm just going to have a little extra pep in my step tomorrow, at least saying like our national holiday. We're celebrating Juneteenth. I guess it's a celebration. And I get to still be, you know, try to impact my community

every day as best as I can. I love that. Before we go, James, what is the one thing you want the audience to know about just your experience being LGBTQ plus and your experience in your experience being a black man of the LGBTQ plus community? I think it's important to recognize that everyone's experience is different with this and unique to their own and that it evolves and changes. Who I identify, how I identify as a black queer man has changed in the 24 years since I came out. wow um you know and so i think meet people where they are i i respect that gender might be confusing for you i respect that you you might not fully understand this but meet me where i am

i'm going to meet you where you are and if we extend that respect to everybody we will continue to move the black and queer communities forward boom there you have it dr james q simmons and where can they find you um on social and online oh very good i'm at ask the n p n p as in nurse practitioner at Ask the NP on Instagram and Twitter or AskTheNP.com. Wonderful, wonderful. I think we're out of time for our 2021 Juneteen special. It's been, as I said, James, a pleasure to share the screen. Our virtual space together here in Miami.

I love this. You and Los Angeles, you guys. Until next time, thank you so much for tuning in here to the Young Church Juneteen special. I'm Jason Carter broadcasting from Miami, Florida. As always, it's been great. Stay safe out there. Be well. and happy Juneteenth.

Thanks for listening to the full episode of the Young Turks. Support our work, listen ad-free, access members-only bonus content, and more by subscribing to Apple Podcasts at apple.com slash t-y-t. I'm your host, Shank Huger, and I'll see you soon.