The Zac Clark Show - Building a Multi-Million Dollar Empire with a Mental Health Mission: Rhone CEO Nate Checketts

Episode Date: February 4, 2025

This week, Zac sits down with Nate Checketts, founder and CEO of Rhone, a brand that combines high-performance apparel with a strong sense of purpose. They explore how mental fitness plays a central role in both Nate’s personal journey and the mission of his brand. Nate shares how Rhone is committed to inspiring men and women to take care of their physical and mental health, going beyond creating apparel.  From growing up as the son of the former president of the New York Knicks to navigating a diabetes diagnosis and building a business with a deeper purpose, Nate discusses the importance of vulnerability, authenticity, and surrounding yourself with supportive people. The conversation touches on overcoming public stigma, cultivating real friendships, and the role of mental health in leadership. Zac and Nate also dive into Rhone’s partnerships, including their work with the NBA and LPGA, and how the brand integrates mental health initiatives that support athletes and the community. This episode offers an inspiring look at leadership rooted in mental health advocacy, genuine connections, and empowerment. Tune in for an authentic conversation on vulnerability, overcoming challenges, and supporting each other on the journey to mental fitness. Connect with Zac https://www.instagram.com/zwclark/ https://www.linkedin.com/in/zac-c-746b96254/ https://www.tiktok.com/@zacwclark https://www.strava.com/athletes/55697553 https://twitter.com/zacwclark If you or anyone you know is struggling, please do not hesitate to contact Release: [phone] releaserecovery.com @releaserecovery

All right, welcome back to the Zach Clark Show. I'm fired up. Anytime I get to spend with Nate Checkett's is a blessing. And so the fact that you're here and we're just going to be able to talk about all the things that we're both so passionate about as a gift. Nate Checkett is with us, the founder and CEO of Roan, R-H-O-N-E, just an amazing active. I mean, like, tell people what Roan is, Nate. Well, I mean, can I just start by saying I feel like when I walk. walk in the walls of release, there's like a spiritual moment here, you know, like you feel it

in the room. And that's only cultivated by the fact that you're such an amazing guy and a good leader and the people that you attract here. Like, you know, people would call it vibration. Some people could call it spirituality. Whatever you want to call it, it's here. And you can feel it when you walk through these walls. So it's a privilege to be here. So Rhone, my day job is, we're a performance-driven apparel company. And we make product for men, for women now. As of May of last year, we now have women's. And we started as a digital-only e-commerce brand.

We now have 16 stores. We're opening another eight this year. And then we sell to select wholesale accounts like Nordstrom and Equinox and others. and I'm very, very proud of the quality of the product we make, but our mission is to inspire people to live better mental fitness and to practice better mental fitness, which I know is something we share in common and something we talk about and that we're still on the journey on.

Yeah, the thing I always say people, when they ask about Rowan, oh, do you know these guys? And I say, there is no brand that I know of that the brand embodies their founders There's more than Roan. I mean, you guys, you go to your website. I was just on it preparing a little bit for this talk, not that I don't know you were good friends,

but mental fitness is right there in front and center. And for me, as a consumer, I'm like, I'm in. I'm all in on this brand, you know, immediately. Well, what was so cool is, I mean, I think you might be the only person in my life that I consider to be like a really good friend. And we met because you sent me a DM on Instagram. Yeah.

I mean, and that's like, When there's so many negative things about social media, there's some, there's a few, like, positive things. And, um, you basically said something like this. And, you know, I, I don't wear this as like a badge of honor. It's just a fact. I've never seen the show, the Bachelor. So when I, when I, when I sent, like, the DM to my brother Ben, who's like an avid, like probably hasn't missed an episode. He's like, oh, he's one of, he's like actually one of the cool guys. We should meet. And then we hung out and I was like, I did not. expect to like you as much as I did because I'm like anybody who's on the show like we're like

we're going to have nothing in common yeah but from that very first meeting and I'm like oh this is a guy I would go to war with dude I was you know it's funny you say that because um I feel embarrassed even having this conversation on a microphone but it's like it's just it's just how we talk it's how you and I mean dude I was going to launch into one of my insecurities I mean like one of my insecurities in life today is I was on a reality television show There are certain public stigmas around that and the type of people. And like I met a lot of amazing people on The Bachelor and in their franchise and some of them are still friends today. But the public is what the public is.

And they love to tear folks down and being a CEO and an owner of an organization that, you know, is focused on behavioral health care. It's like those, a lot of people say to me, I bet being. being on TV really helped your brand. And I think, sure, it did in some ways. But in some ways, you know, the family Googles me and says, oh, like, send your child to, like, some reality television rehab. Yeah. That's my insecurity.

So, like, you bring that up and. I'm sorry to make, I call that up. But it's like, you know, what it, what it teaches you is that, like, no matter where you are on this journey, you're still going to make these mistakes. By the way, there's another guy who's been on the bachelor, should call him out, Dan Cox, who, I love. Love. He's like one of the most quality, high quality guys. His wife, Natalie, they're expecting their first. Maybe they've had their baby at this point. She was on Survivor. Okay. Like they've both been on reality TV shows. And so whatever the perception is, like it was just wrong. Yeah. Like some amazing people have been on that show. Really good high quality people that I love. What's your connection to Tyler Cameron? How do you see he's just a friend of the brand? Was Tyler on The Bachelor? I don't even know. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. He's just. He's like the. OG number one.

Like, I don't know. I mean, like, I just, everyone loves him. Like, all the, all the women love him. I didn't even know that. I thought he was popular because he was, like, a model or something. I don't know. Sometimes the team just, like, is like, hey, you should meet this guy. Like, they're wearing the brand.

You should talk to him. So Tyler and I hung out. He came to the store, and he's a super cool guy. I thought, he has his own show, though, doesn't he? It's hard to keep up. I am so bad at this stuff. I basically watch sports and, like, the occasional rom-com with my wife i know nothing about ben is like pop culture guru he could

tell you who was on which tv show in like 1996 yeah ben's the sweetest i love him so much both you guys i mean so i want to start because like the the question i want it like you said you mentioned sports giddell on the sideline in the rhone hat so it's it's it's nfc and a c championship weekend and i'm like i'm a diehard eagles fan i'm gearing up for the game and they show this dude i'm like he's wearing a rhone hat yeah i'm like this is amazing how does that hat get on his head in that i mean it's it i should probably be careful so first of all i worked at the nfl okay um and uh so very close with a lot of people there um you know the chief revenue officer is my former boss the head of all of media is like one of my closest friends in

the world a lot of people think he'll be the next commissioner um Brian Rolap, and he's like, seriously, he's like my sauna buddy. We hang out. He's just the coolest guy ever. But I had a meeting at the NFL offices a few months ago, and it was not related to Rhone. It was related to something else. And the commissioner came in wearing a Rhone quarter zip. And there was five executives in the room, and three of them were wearing Rhone. And, you know, I knew all of them. I had met, I had met Roger when I worked at the NFL. He was always really nice to me.

It was when he was going through a lot of, you know, hate. He probably has from the beginning of his time there. But I brought him a bag of stuff and it included a hat. And he was like, he's like, Nate, I legitimately buy the brand. Like, I love the quality of the product. But that was three, four months ago. I didn't think anything of it. And so I honestly think he wore the hat just because it is a really freaking good hat.

Yeah. And he probably, I don't. I don't know, maybe he's having a bad hair day, but, like, I had no idea it was going to happen. And all of a sudden, my phone starts blowing up, and everybody's like, Roger Goodell is wearing a Rhone hat on national television right now. And second to the Super Bowl, I mean, that probably has 50 million viewers that game. Come on. So, and a couple of my friends who work at the league told me that Nike was pissed and, like,

making a big deal about it. Does that impact sales? Does it, I mean, like... I mean, yes and no, it impacts eyeballs. It impacts traffic, which eventually leads to sales. It's definitely free publishing. but it's also just kind of like a pinch me moment, you know, to see it. I couldn't, like, I kept going back.

I was like, I can't believe you wore it. So, yeah. It was unbelievable. And then I saw you guys start, like, resharing all the people that were posting in. And I was, I just, there are certain people that I root for. And you and Ben and Roan are at the top of that list, just because I know the type of people you are. And I, if you want to know who Nate Checkitz is, I will share this. story with you. And I was actually going back through old text messages today. And Nate,

so it's very well documented. I went on the bachelor. I ended up engaged. I was in that relationship for about a year. And, you know, when those relationships end, which mine did, and the moral of that story is really, you know, two good people don't always make a good couple. It just didn't work, right? And so we played it pretty low key. We didn't do some big breakup announcement. But it started to get out that we had broken up and you sent me this text message that to this day was one of the more impactful text messages I've received. I was working with Roan at the time doing a little bit of work with you guys. And you basically just said, hey, dude, like, I love you. I'm in your corner.

You're worthy. You're enough. And then you told me two stories. You told me the story about when your father was working with the Knicks, the owner of the Knicks. and he hired Stan Van Gundy and they went on this crazy run. Yeah, Jeff. Or Jeff Van Gunny.

Yeah. And there was some, I guess, Pat Riley or who he interviewed? Phil Jackson. Yeah, he interviewed Phil Jackson. And there was a, you as a child, like, had to go to school and face that. Yeah. And you were very, it was very confusing. And then you told the story of your brother, Spencer, who got a very public DUI.

And you basically just shared this experience. and that's why mental health and recovery, we always talk about that. Sharing experience with one another is so valuable. And when you sent that note, I remember tears, like swelling up in my eyes because I just said,

like, he doesn't know how much I needed this text message right now, but I needed it. And I've never forgotten it. And so that's your Nate Checkett is, and no one would have ever known that story if I never told it here. Well, look, I love you.

I'm not embarrassed at all to say that on public air. I'm really grateful for our friendship. And I think I remember you, you came and drove to my house and we had a great chat and um the you know the the nick story is a good one um what happened is is the nicks were the eighth seed in the NBA playoffs and they just kept winning the jeff and gunny had been the assistant coach and um man i hope some nix fan is going to kill me if i mess this up because i was young but i think we fired don't nelson or no no pat had just left to go to the heat and um pat riley had just left to go to the heat and um pat

just left to go to the heat and Jeff stepped in and the Nick started winning and all and but he was named interim head coach and so all these fans started putting pressure on my dad you got to name you got to take interim off and you got to make Jeff the coach but you know Phil Jackson was the coach of the 90s and nice all time yeah and um my dad had a chance to interview him he wanted the job but the nicks were on this tear and so we interviewed him and it leaked it got leaked somebody we think it was Phil Jackson's agent who wanted to make it into a story while the Knicks were winning

and a PR guy at the Knicks told my dad you gotta lie about this. You cannot let it out that you are interviewing another coach while Jeff is having this moment and my dad did and if you met my dad he lied about it. He lied about it on air.

He was being interviewed by WFAN and they asked him point blank did you interview Phil Jackson? He said, no. And my dad is the most honest. The whole family. He's just the most genuine, anything good that I am as a result of my parenting. They're just incredible parents.

But he never forgot that. And so he came clean. He couldn't deal with the guilt of it. So he ended up coming clean to the media and telling the truth after that. But he got killed for it, got killed for it publicly. You know, the New York media is tough. Really tough, right? Yeah.

And especially in sports media. And I remember it was brutal. Like I had teachers, I had coaches, I had friends who were giving me grief. And it is so hard. Look, nobody should be complaining about having the ability to have attention in a platform. On a relative basis, there are far bigger problems. But it is really hard to have. either you or someone you care about dragged through the mud publicly and

unless your dad yeah well and for someone who like the person who deserves at the absolute least you know and and so when I heard that you are going through this my heart ached for you because I know what kind of person you are and yeah I've seen it with my brother and and my dad and you know good people can say terrible things and be complete cowards online, you know, in a moment of like keyboard courage. But, you know, I'd never heard the keyboard courage. No, there's a lot of that. And I, to your point from earlier, there was some good, I mean, I remember sending the DM to you and Ben about like, hey, I'm a huge fan of the brand. I had like this old school

roan shirt. One of the first ever, I've convinced ever bought on a shelf. My mom got for me. And I was a fan. I still have it. And so social media, yes, can be positive. positive, but in this instance, and in many instances, it gives people power that they don't, that they don't necessarily not deserve, but they don't want to do with it. Yeah. Because if you comment and you're funny or you're witty and then all of a sudden you get liked all over the place, you're going to keep doing that. Yeah.

Yeah. I think the challenge is that you have these people who, there's a cry for desperation to matter, to have that relevance. And in one arena of your life, there's a level where it feels like to a degree there's an equal playing field. It doesn't matter whether you have the blue check or not. You can comment and your words are going to show up. And for some people that matter so much, they use it as a way to, you know, as to tear people down. And the hard thing about that is, you know anyone who is taking the time to do that in reality is hurting a lot.

What's your policy at Roan, say someone, a customer comments on one of your social media posts or is unhappy with the brand or they complain? Are you someone that hits that head on? Are you deleting those comments? Like, what is the – Gosh, I admit I'm not sure if we ever delete comments, but I know we respond to every comment that is made. I generally don't think we are deleting comments, especially on public posts, on ads. I don't know what the – but, you know, in the end, we will have we've even found and tracked competition people who work for competition will come in and try and lay negative comments on things and you know oh it's i mean it's embarrassing it's like

you know but it what do you do with that information you know laugh yeah you there's i will say that they're what i've learned over 10 years and starting this brand is 2014 right so yeah Two and four, ten, ten plus, you know, we're in our 11th year. That's awesome. Is, you know, what really matters and what doesn't matter. Because I am sure in the moment, you get a really hard negative comment, and you know you shouldn't read them. You know that you shouldn't spend time on them, but you're human and you do. And you know, and then it's hard to get some of those words out of your head.

Yeah. I'm, um, nine point nine out of ten times. I'm, I have a pretty good armor, but every once in a while, I've never clapped back. Like, I've never responded. I'm proud of that, but I'll let it get me. Yeah, like, is this person right? Yeah, an arrow gets through every once in a while. Yeah.

And I think that makes you human. Yeah. No, for sure. So prior to 2014, because I do, like, so what we try to do here is tell stories of exactly what you are. Grit, resilience, mental health, recovery. purpose, right? Like we get one shot at this life. And so you are born and raised in Utah?

Is it? No, I was born in Boston. Boston. We moved to Utah when I was three, and we were there until I was about eight. Somewhere between two and three when we moved there and moved to Connecticut when I was eight. And raised Mormon? Yep. And so as a kid, are you proud of this?

Are you just getting in line with? with it? Is it something that... Well, I mean, living in Utah, it's like, you know, you're one of the crew. The whiplash of going from that environment to Connecticut was pretty abrupt. You know, all of a sudden I'm the only person I know who's Mormon in my entire school. And, you know, there's so many misconceptions about our faith. You know, people are like, oh, well, so are you going to have multiple wives? I'm like, no, that's not a thing. We don't do. that you know oh well I mean it sucks you can't you can't drink alcohol and you know you can't drink coffee and you know do you have to grow a beard and I'm like that's not a thing like we don't

you know but but yeah it was it was definitely tricky but I never felt disadvantaged I in some ways I was so proud of my faith and still am very proud of what my faith teaches and stands for and you know we certainly don't have a monopoly on good people but I think you're more likely to find someone who's a good person in our faith than not. And, you know, somebody who's focused on being oriented and on service and, you know, teaching and espousing the values of Christ and faith. And, you know, I certainly try and live by those things today. But it was, it was a unique experience to go from that Utah where, like, you know, 70% of where I lived was a member to my school where I was the only person I knew.

Yeah, I'm laughing at myself because I might ask for, I might ask for some explanation because when I was first going up to see you and your wife in Connecticut, Dana, who's just the best. Yeah, she's the best. I love your family, dude. And I called Ben. I was like, what kind of wine do they drink? He was like, dude, you're a little off here, you know?

And so, like, I learned in that moment that you don't drink alcohol. So what is, I mean, I don't even know what I knew that you're Mormon. Like, yeah, like, I don't want to call them rules, but like, if you are raised Mormon, what does, what does that mean to you? Yeah, yeah. Well, because I have a God and a belief and I was raised Presbyterian and my sobriety also speaks to a lot of my religion and spiritual experience and that kind of stuff. Yeah, well, I think one of the biggest misconceptions that people think is that Mormons aren't Christians, that we worship Mormon, which isn't true. Mormon is a nickname that was given to our faith because we have a second book of scripture outside of the Bible called the Book of Mormon. And so people started calling members of the church.

The real name of the church is the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. So we are very much Christians. Christ and God are the same God to us as they are into almost every Christian faith. But we have, you know, we believe in a living prophet. We believe that there's a prophet on the earth like there was in the days of Adam and Moses and, you know, all throughout biblical history. And in the early days of the church, the prophet that, you know, founded or kind of restored the church of Jesus Christ, his name is Joseph Smith. And what's amazing is unique, a little bit unique, is Joseph Smith, his brother, Hiram, is my fifth great-grandfather. So I am like, to say that I am in the faith is, you know, is an understatement.

And, you know, my parents both have deep pioneer roots. And so, but in those early days, he, people drank alcohol and smoke tobacco. And he received a revelation of a code of health called the Word of Wisdom. But it wasn't originally, like, prohibited to not drink alcohol. It was, you know, alcohol and tobacco are not good for the body. And you should eat fruits and vegetables. He might have been ahead of his time. You should eat fruits and vegetables.

I mean, you read this code of health and you're like, this would hold up against Andrew Huberman standards today. So, you know, of course. That's unbelievable. I mean, look at the alcohol is being linked to cancer now. Yeah. I mean, it's, we, we, of course, believe that it was divinely inspired. But it's pretty remarkable what the Word of Wisdom teaches relative to, you know, 200 years later, it holds up as this incredible code of health.

But it wasn't, you know, it wasn't like, oh, you can't drink until what happened is during prohibition, the other thing that's very important to our faith is to obey the laws of the land. And during prohibition, there were people who were creating their own alcohol that were members of the church. And the prophet of that time came out and said, no more. Right now, unless you live the Word of Wisdom, you cannot be a member of the church in full participation, being able to go to the temple and other things like that. So the people who were brewing Jack Daniels and moonshine and other things, some of them left the church,

and those people became known as Jack Mormons. So if you know someone who's grown, this is a little bit of like deep church tribunal. I love it. I love history. Yeah. So if you ever meet someone who grew up in the church but isn't active, some people refer to them as Jack Mormon still to this day.

But since that time, the Code of Health, the Word of Wisdom, has been something that is just part of it. Where do I see the Code of Health? I mean, is it just in? I'll send it to you. Okay. It's, yeah, you can find it on the Internet. It's called the Word of Wisdom.

And again, it was given initially as just advice. Like, here's some things that you should do. to live a healthier life. And there's a lot of really special promises there. But I try and live by that, and I've been enormously blessed, I think, as a result of it. But of course, there are members of the church who do drink coffee, and there are members of the church. We've talked openly about my older brother, and he's very open about his sobriety journey.

He struggled with alcohol for a long time. And I think, you know, there are certainly members of our church, are not excluded from these trials or challenges of addictions. Has he, is he, is he, would you say he is still a member of the church today? Is that, no, okay. It's not something that he practices. Right. And you love him the same as.

Yeah. And, but he's, you know, but he's very respectful of the faith. And, you know, he's, he'll come to church with us. That's so cool. You know, he's a very faithful, spiritual person. And that's what's, you know, I was talking with somebody about this the other day because I saw this documentary about this incredible story of bravery about a Broadway actor who came out of the closet. Yeah.

And, you know, it was hard for him and his family. And he talked about it. And I just said, I could never understand how a family could abandon their child for something like that. Or, you know, because of an addiction or because of a change in faith or because, you know, I just. We make it, I mean, I will say. for me, I push pretty hard to do that. Like my family,

and it sounds like your family with Spencer, no one was going to blame them if they said, Zach, we're done. Yeah, yeah, totally. Because it's, we, there is nothing like a drug addiction and the way that it pushes people away. Yeah, yeah.

Because we want to isolate. I want to be alone and dead. I mean, that's what, I think that's what, and there are families that do do that. that say, you know, but it, there's something about just, you know, I believe in the power of unconditional love. Me too. And that it is not conditional.

I don't love you because you're sober. I love you because I love you. I love you because of who you are because of where your heart is. I, you know, I care about you because you're, because I know who you want to be, even if you're not that person all the time. Right. No, it's interesting when you were talking about the divine. intervention the divine spirit divine divinity like I I think of so Alcoholics Anonymous

which is like a program that has got a lot of people sober and and I've benefited from from that over the years was founded in in 135 by a stockbroker and a doctor who basically were both trying to get sober and got together and wrote this book yeah four years later called the big book of Alcoholics Anonymous and that book today is still getting people sober so and it's deeply spiritual that's my point if I can sit here and be cynical and say there's no God and spirituality's all you know horse crap like what but at the end of the day I choose to believe that there is divine inspiration everywhere of you open your eyes and and are looking for it yeah one of the phrases I love is

doubt your doubts before you doubt your faith and I just think that's such a powerful concept because of course there are things that will make you doubt but in the end of the day and look the Bible and I love I love the scriptures I find such power and joy in them and I find such power and joy in prayer not always but but but definitely enough that it keeps me coming back it's like a tree and if a tree brings forth good fruit then you know it's a good tree and in my mind the fruit that I benefited from the result of my faith and following the steps that my faith has taught teaches makes me believe that it's a good tree

and that it's worth you know coming back to and if and I'll tell you there have been moments in my life where I have decided to say you know I'm not doing this anymore I'm not I'm not going and I don't feel good you know I don't feel right there is something about being attracted to faith and spirituality that just makes me feel so much better service you know and all the things that it teaches and so again from a buy your fruits you shall know them i feel like the things that attract me to make me feel better and do good and be happier i want to i want to draw myself closer to those things and do those things

more yeah yeah and it is i mean so much of this is attraction and not promotion right i don't i've never taking you as someone who's tried to sit me down and convince me of a certain way of living. I mean, as evidenced by the fact that I tried to buy you a bottle of nice wine, but there was something when I met you that was different. Like you say when you walk into release, there's a spirit. When you meet Nate Check, there's a, there's an aura about you that is just special and it's kind and it's loving and all the things that you just talked about. And so I'm going to ask the question that I have to ask, which is this show,

that has come out, the Mormon wives of what you talk, I don't even know. I don't know much about it, but I know that it is not. It doesn't paint the church in a favor of a light. Yeah, what did, give me your 30 second response on it. Well, admittedly, I haven't seen it. Okay. Shocking. Yeah, but.

You know a bit about what's going on, right? I know more than I should because my cousin is one of the couples on the show. And it's, he's received a lot of attention for it. And I think, you know, I've had very similar conversation with him, because he deeply regrets having participated in the show. And, you know, I think there's a lot of challenging things about it. I think the producers had kind of convinced them. This will give you an opportunity to, you know, talk about your faith and, you know,

promoted. And, of course, you take certain sound bites and you invite certain people from a very select, you can find people in any demographic who will make that group of people look crazy, will make them look irrational. But I think, you know, my hope is that there are enough people who have good experiences with members of the church that they say, this is not what it is like, you know. It's just not what this is like.

Right. And so, yeah, I think it's difficult. You know, it's hard living in New York City, there's a musical that basically, makes fun of our faith that's actually to its credit hilarious you know have you seen it i haven't seen it but i've i've heard some of the songs and i know the premise of it and i'm like yeah i get why people would find this i mean it's book of Mormon and i mean that's like the show right i mean it is totally yeah and it's it's one of the longer running uh musicals what's funny is that um real

missionaries and i was a missionary i served a mission in rome italy um which is a tricky place to served just, you know, just based on the depth of conversion in that country. But real missionaries started going out and proselyting around the show and had record numbers of, like, teaching people and converting people. And so in an odd way, it ended up making people more curious about reading the book of Mormon and seeing, you know, it's like, you've seen the play now read the book. Wow. Yeah.

I mean, all press is good press, right? Or whatever they said. I'm not sure if it's true, but in this case, it was. Yeah. Wow, that's amazing. Okay. I love it. Let's go to a little bit, the diabetes, 25.

Sure. Yeah, I was diagnosed at 25. And where are you in life? I guess when do you meet Dana? So, Dana and I met in college. We were in the, she was in my very first college class at BYU. It was a public speaking class. and you know growing up in Connecticut there was not there were not as many members of the church

in my high school so you know I dated but I didn't generally date girls who were members of the church and in our faith you're generally encouraged to marry other members and faith it's not like written anywhere but you just kind of understand that yeah yeah yeah yeah so when I went to BYU, it was like, man, I didn't know girls in our church could look like this. Right. And I remember seeing her and I was like, man, I want to take her out. And she had, it was my first class, but she had been going to school there for a few months and had already clearly like met someone and was going on on dates. But it was a public speaking class. So the last speech of the semester I gave was a persuasive speech. And I gave it on why a girl should go out

with me. And what was hilarious is that they would pick a student panel to grade your final persuasive speech. And she got pulled up to grade my speech, which was just perfect. She also gave me the lowest grade of the three students. No. Yeah, which I think she did just to like, you know, mess with me. I think she gave me a B plus. But she did, she did agree to go out with me. So we went on one date, and then I went and served a mission for two years. We stayed a little bit in touch. And then I came back and wrote, you know, send this mass email I'm home. I love to see everyone.

She was the first one who responded to the email. And we ended up... Were you waiting for? Was that the one response you were waiting for in your mind? I mean, to be, if I'm like really honest, no, because I had kind of like assumed she would already like, you know, be off with some other guys. So I hadn't given it a lot of thought. But as soon as I heard from her, my, you know, my heart kind of flutters.

And I was like, oh, man, I missed. Like, I miss her. I want to see her. And so we started dating shortly after that. And we've been together every day since. We just celebrated 20 years a week ago. Married or as a couple? Married.

20 years married. Yeah. Three beautiful kids. Three beautiful kids. My oldest is 16 now. And he's actually turning himself into quite the track star. So he's done great. I get some miles in with him.

Yeah. Amazing. So, okay. diabetes is at 25 yeah so about three years later Dana and I decided to take a trip to Europe we had been saving up and we basically went backpacking through Europe we saw 11 countries and 30 days and I came home from that trip and while I was on the trip there were like there's some clear signs of type 1 diabetes one you have excessive thirst the second is that you feel like you have to pee like immediately like you have to go

and you're like, I got to go now. Yeah. And so we would be like up in the Duomo in Florence or like in the Acropolis in Greece. And all of a sudden I'm like, man, I need to find a bathroom like now. And you know if you've been to Europe, like finding public restrooms is not easy. So I got really good. And Dana was like, what is going on with you? Like something's wrong.

And I was like, I'm fine. I don't know. I just think like, I don't know. There's not very many public restroom. Yeah, you're in a foreign place. Maybe it's the whatever. The altitude. The water's different.

Exactly. Whatever it is. Right. And so we got back and we got off the airplane and my parents took one look at me and they were like, what's wrong with you? And I was like, what are you talking about? I was like, I just had the most amazing trip of my life. And they were like, no, something's like seriously wrong with you. They could see physically.

They could see it in my face. And I remember my mom was like, you need to go see our doctor. His mom's a therapist, by the way. So he's got an MBA owner as a father and a therapist as a mother. So you talk about an interesting. Yeah, they're just an amazing, they're just amazing people. So she literally is like, I'm not like, I need you to go see a doctor. And I went and the very first thing they did is like they're taking me and they put me on

the scale and I get on and I've weighed 185 pounds since I was a senior in high school. Like I have my weight. That's your playing weight. My weight just does not fluctuate. And I got on the scale and it's at 154 pounds. Oh, wow. And I was like, your scale is broken. And they were like, no, no, no, that's right.

And I was like, what? So I had lost 30 pounds and not even noticed. Do you, so the psychology, do you, so when you're on this trip, I'm very fascinated by this. Do you think you're so in love that you're not, like that that's clouding the way that you're feeling or this, you're in this amazing place. So you can't, you're not allowing yourself to feel sick or is it? Yeah, I mean, the thing about diet. The mind is amazing. Yeah, it is.

It really is, I didn't even, I didn't feel sick. Wow. I didn't, I didn't, you know, I was like, I felt tired a bit, but I thought it was because we're walking so many miles every day and we're seeing so many places. But when I went and they measure your blood sugars in two different ways, you get your kind of, your regular blood sugar, which should generally be between 80 and 120. Mine was like 450. and then your A1C, which should be between like four and, at five and a half, you're pre-diabetic.

And the chart that they show you in the doctor's office goes to 12. I was a 14-6. So I was off the charts with my A-1C. They told me that they had had a 16-year-old girl come in with the same A1C the week before, and she passed away. Oh, no. Because, so I was, I was probably a week away from going into what's called diabetic ketoacidosis, which your blood sugars stay elevated for such a long time, you can go into a coma and you can die.

I mean, it's incredibly serious. Your mom knew, though. Your mom knew. She knew. I mean, I am telling you, being back in proximity to the U.S. and being close to a restroom, I'm convinced I would never have gone to the doctor. She made the appointment for me.

Wow. I mean, you talk about inspiration and, you know, mother's intuition. She just knew. But I remember when they told me, they're like, you have diabetes I was like how do I get rid of it right like what do I you know what's the okay what medicine do I take and they're like no this is a chronic lifelong condition that you will probably have for the rest of your life you know unless there's a cure and I just remember coming home and there's a brother between Andrew or between Ben and I named Andrew and he and I are

also very very close and he's like that was to me when I saw Superman meet Kryptonite. He's like, I thought you were unstoppable. Like, I never thought anything would ever happen to you. And it was such a humbling experience for me. And I honestly think, feels strange saying this. It's like one of the things I'm most grateful for in my entire life. I'm with you.

Yeah. That's how I talk about my drug addiction. Yeah. Totally. But you, like, you can't explain that to someone who hasn't gone through it. No. You know? No.

Changed my whole life. You know, in so many great ways. Yeah, and again, it's just one of those things that you get to know someone, you know, Nate and I ran on behalf of the Release Foundation, which I'm grateful for, the London Marathon together, and we ran, I'm wearing a Rhone dress shirt, which these are, he pays me $0, but these shirts, the Rhone dress shirts, the commuter shirts, I mean, like, are they still the commuter shirt? Yeah, the, yeah, are the best. I mean, I got to say, have changed my life, but we ran the marathon commuter shirts. I mean, we did it. At the time, I was kind of working as an ambassador for the brand, which I have a lot of ways I can go with this. One, the fact that you're running marathons with diabetes and like you're just still living your life is so beautiful. Thank you.

And two, you know, I did do some work with you guys. And then you and I had a phone call one time and it was like, what if we just help each other? Yeah. Like, what have we just helped each other grow? And it was one of the more beautiful business conversations I had because you're, like I don't know you had had a new marketing guy and budgets and I'm like dude no no no like yeah you were so great about like we're I want to lift you up and you want to lift me up so forget any contract or paperwork or we had a good run we did some cool content and now we're just

going to like be friends and lift each other up which is just so much better so much better yeah and honestly I think chuck's got me pegged for the berlin marathon I don't know if you guys are still doing that but I've got to I've got to get back into running shape but but that was You know, I remember, like, that was the first marathon that I actually, like, really trained for. Yeah, with Mario, right? With Mario, and you were like, what did you do? And so then, and now you're, like, crushing marathons. Yeah.

I mean, like, 3-15ers. Yeah, well, I'm going to try and run a sub-3 in New York this year. We'll see how that goes. I mean, it's Mario's got me training pretty hard. Yeah, you got it. Yeah, I hope so. So the diabetes comes, and then you start Roan at 29 or 30? Or, like, because you work for some other big companies,

NFL, you mentioned Cisco. Yeah. Legends. Do you work for Legends? No, I was basically, it's, no, I did not work for Legends. But yeah, no, I, we started at, I was, I was 32. 32. Yeah.

And this is a part of the story that I'm very interested in because I always talk about Roan being a brand with purpose. And I think all the things that we've talked about on this. chat so far are reasons why we love each other but I think the real reason we connected is our mental health advocacy and how we have both leaned into that in our careers

and you are one of those people where it'll just come to me I'll say hey dude checking in hey dude how are you so when did when did Roan when did you decide when did you and Banner whoever it was decide that we're going to make really badass gear and we're going to to make it cool and we're going to make it look good and it's going to be sharp and we're

going to build a really good business but we're also going to have extreme purpose. I mean the true story of Rhone is it wasn't my idea. It was more Ben and my brother-in-law's idea. I just was the entrepreneur of the family so I kind of got roped in and they were like what do we do about this and then I started doing more and more for it and initially I was I mean this is a funny thing to say but it's true. I have never been a guy who like really cares about clothing. Ben loves clothes, loves clothes. I'm like, it's, you know, it's like food is fuel for me. Like, clothes are clothes like I just want to be dressed. Yeah. Um, which is hilarious because now we've built this nine figure revenue clothing business. Um, but, uh, but as we were

building it and they were like, oh, we want you to, you know, do more here. I just remember thinking like, it just seemed like a hollow existence to sell clothes. And I had made a decision that the next thing I wanted to do, I wanted to have a deep purpose. And so someone had sent me this article about how there was a mental health crisis facing the U.S. that we hadn't realized yet, particularly among men. And there were some seriously. Who sent the article to you? Do you remember?

I don't even remember. Okay. And, you know, or maybe I just, like, found it. But I just remember reading it and being scared out of my mind because, the stats around what was happening around men's mental health. And keep in mind, this is 2013 when we're thinking about starting the brand. I had two boys at the time, and I just thought, how am I going to raise them in this environment? And I was seeing it with friends.

I had lost two friends to suicide. I had several friends, and my brother deeply impacted by addiction. And I was like, this is a very real. real. And so I remember we had a conference call and I was like, guys, the only way, the only way I'm getting involved is if this can be a core part of what we stand for, that we can try and inspire people to take care of themselves, not only physically, but mentally. Because I looked at the competitive landscape and you've got these heroic brands who have been around forever, Nike, Adidas, Reebok, Under Armour, Lou Lemon, Almost all of them were so hyper-focused on, you have a body, therefore you're an athlete, and that's why you matter in the world is because of your athletic performance. Run faster, jump higher, lift more weights. That's how you...

Just do it. Just do it. And so there's, as a guy, that's how I got my value is. How fit am I? How fast am I? and I was at the stage of my life where I have two kids and at some point I don't know when it happened for you but it was late for me like I might have had kids at this point I'm like all right I'm not going to be a professional athlete in anything

like I still probably thought I could go to the Olympics in like equestrian or maybe curling Yeah we always have that dream yeah I actually had the thought at 41 years old the other day I was like if I went on like a long toss program and like really dialed it and like gave baseball one more shot like what would that yeah yeah rookie of the year what would that look like it's a delusion no i mean we are i think you know not to make generalizations but as men we tend to generally uh you know fall into that camp and um but i what i what i what i have my the deepest desires of my heart at that time was i desperately wanted to be a good father i wanted to raise my kids to be good outstanding citizens

and to understand that they could be both masculine and caring and kind because I was raised by a father who worked in professional sports but got a collegiate scholarship in musical theater and so he is the first one to cry at a hallmark card and the one who pushed me the hardest

in my athletic pursuits and I just loved that And I felt like, I felt like because of political correctness and because of, you know, so many other factors, there was this, people were kind of trying to fall into one camp or the other. It's like machismo, masculinity, or like, you know, complete abandonment of that and kindness and, you know, softness and empathy. And I was like, they don't have to, like, they can go with each other. and most importantly, guys just need to learn to talk. They need to learn to connect because, you know, again, generally, women are so much better at this, and you see it in the data.

Men are four times more likely to die by suicide. There's a reason for that. When they go to therapy, 80% of the time, they won't have a second session. And so that was like foundational for me and everything we took. So early social media posts, early events, we just start talking about it. people are like oh my gosh yeah like I connect with you on this and this and this and

and so I started writing about it and you know it's become a huge part of what we do all of our donation dollars go towards yeah you've supported us I mean you supported the Release Foundation and our efforts and we honored you at our gala you know for the for the work you've done and you know one of the one of them I mean at this age for me with life moving as fast as it moves, there aren't a lot of times where I look back and remember memories. But when I think of that flat iron store right here

where we're sitting a block away from, I've shopped there, I've stopped in there, we've hosted runs there, but there was a night where we hosted a mind and muscle event, which are on the website, and you can look them up, and they're in a lot of the major cities. And we did a little workout,

and then all the men in the room sat down for 25 of us, I don't know, for an hour, hour and a half, and your brother led it, and the connection and the conversation and the things that were, there was nothing off limits, we talked about it all, there was no judgment, and I left that feeling really proud to know you. Thanks, man. It's honestly one of the greatest things that I've been able to participate in, and we've seen life change, because the hardest thing, I think for anyone, I think this is true

of men and women, we worry so much that if we show the weakest part of us, we show our biggest vulnerability that people will not love us, that we will lose their respect and their love. If they knew the worst thing that we had ever thought or the worst thing we had ever done or the worst thing, you know, and when you realize, no, that just makes you human and I'm so grateful you've shared that and I still love and care about you and you're enough, even with all of your perceived faults and flaws, that is so empowering. And you leave feeling like I've got an army behind me. And what's cool is oftentimes that's a group of strangers that we do that with that don't know each other. And they will say things in that room. Somebody shared

something that they said, I've never talked about this in my entire life. So I remember another guy I think in that room said he hadn't cried in 17 years. And he cried for the first time that night, you know, and the power that comes from being together, showing vulnerability, and as men, you are taught to associate that with weakness, but it is incredible courage and strength. There's just something so powerful in that, and it makes me so grateful that I have this opportunity to have this platform to, you know, to try and encourage that kind of behavior. It's unbelievable.

I mean, I want to, because I want to ask you, we probably have about five minutes left, but I want to ask you about that because when I take to social media now and I look at there is a lot more chatter about mental health. And I think some of it is really good. And I actually think some of it's kind of harmful because it's a very kind of easy thing for a lot of influencers to grab onto. And there are times like if you're just rolling this stuff out or talking about it and not really offering solution, it can be confusing.

and and I get seeing being seen in the connectivity what what do you do like what do you how do you practice I mean I know we have a special relationship in a lot of ways where we help each other with that stuff but like what are you as a CEO as a father yeah as as someone that has big dreams and goals and aspirations what are you doing to take care of your mental health how are you practicing what you preach at rome well I think there's a couple of really important important things. First, I don't think that we have, 10 years ago, I felt like mental health had an awareness problem. Like if I were a PR consultant for mental health, I would have been like, you have an awareness problem. We got to solve that. We got to get you out in front of more people.

That is no longer the issue. If you watch the Olympics, almost every Olympic athlete is talking about it, to the point now where there could be feelings of doubting authenticity in some of this. I don't because I actually just think it's that big of a deal and we can't avoid it anymore. It's like a tidal wave. You just can't pretend that it's not there. But I think the bigger... Thank you for removing my cynicism.

Yeah. Well, I mean, look, it's easy to feel cynical. And I do think there are probably some people who grab onto it, you know, for maybe the wrong reasons. But the bigger issue that we have right now, the PR consultant that, you know, for mental health needs to solve, is what do we do about it? And the problem is there is no magic pill.

There's no magic pill. There are a lot of little things that I think make a difference. And as you know, I've had my own bout and struggle with this. And what I found is I have developed a toolbox that I can dip into and I can start to try and apply it. But the toolbox can't, you can't just create that overnight. So it's like physical health in so many ways. If you wait until you get cancer, you can't then say, all right, now I'm going to get myself into better cardiovascular shape.

Studies and research show if you are in better cardiovascular shape, when you get diagnosed with cancer, you have a much stronger chance of survival. Depends on the type of cancer. Of course. But same thing with diabetes and all these other things. Certainly a disease or a condition physically. can spur you into a better lifestyle. But what if you can live a better lifestyle,

you're more prepared to meet the moment. The same thing is true with mental health. When we think about mental health, we tend to associate it with disease state conditions. You know, when it comes to mental health, it could be anxiety, it could be depression, it could be bipolar disorder, it could be addiction. But the truth is,

if we looked at mental health, the same opportunity that we, look at physical health, physical fitness, what could you do with that? You know, learning techniques to better manage your mental health, daily expressions of gratitude, social connectivity, breath work, exercise, sleep. So the contrast is coming in, right? The hot cold. I mean, that's, yeah. Totally. All these things matter. But to wait until you get to a moment of being depressed and then say, I'm going to start using these things, you're putting yourself at a greater risk. By doing those things, you're not guaranteeing you're not going to have mental health moments

and episodes because no one can predict when something's going to catch you off guard. Eating healthy doesn't mean I'm never going to have a heart attack. Totally. Yeah, exactly. And my mom has this great phrase where she's like, you don't choose your triggers, your triggers choose you, and you don't know when they're going to come. You could lose someone in your life unexpectedly. You could get in a car accident. You could get fired from your job. You could have your, you know, your significant other be unfaithful to you. You could have so many things happen while you're practicing these things,

but you're more prepared to meet the moment if you have a toolbox. And for me, those are basic foundational health concepts. And, you know, in the most recent moment where I felt, honestly, depressed, I feel like my saving grace is that, I had a knowledge of what to do. I reached out to close friends. You were one of them. Somebody I had reached out to.

We had a special morning. We had a special, yeah. And I had a conversation with you, and that helped, and I practiced breathwork. I'd get into ice baths because that helps knock me, knock me out. And I continue to stay diligent with my exercise. And I'd like to think that what could have been a two-year period or a 20-year period felt like more of a two-month period for me. And I'm still working through some of those things.

But the parallels between physical health and mental health are so similar, and we need to teach people to focus on their mental health when they're already mentally healthy instead of waiting until they're sick or they're something wrong or they've broken their leg mentally because it's really hard when you're in that moment. to meet the moment, you can, and great therapy works. All these things matter, but you will prepare yourself better

if you take advantage of it in times of plenty. It's like storing, I mean, I can talk about this forever. No, I mean, yeah. But it's like, think about it before when we would have famines and we would have surpluses, when you have a surplus, you build a storage of surplus so that when the famine comes, you can go to the storehouse and you can draw from it. When you have happy moments, you can experience those, you can write them down, you can soak them in

so that those moments will be there for you when you have times of mental health famine. Yeah. I mean, one of my favorite things that was said to me kind of early on in my sobriety, and it remains true with my mental health. And for me, it's a holistic approach, right? It's mind, body, spirit, all of it. I throw it all in the middle of the table, and that's typically a good temperature check as to how I'm doing. But someone said to me, you know, if you're, if you're covered,

cup is feeling half full or empty, like go find someone that's overflowing. Go find someone that has it, like tap into it. And when your cup is full and it's overflow and go share it. Yes. Go let it spill on to other people. And that just, that visual alone for me has been really at the forefront of the way that I, the way that I think. And I remember, you know, I just shared a little bit more about taking a break back in October of last year. And I'll never forget, I was in a bad spot, a really bad spot and needed to go away for, you know, I went away for five days to on-site down in Tennessee.

And you had an event during that time. And they had taken my phone. And I remembered when I was there that they had taken my phone and I wasn't going to make it to the event that you had invited me to. And I paused. And I said, I'm just going to text Nate when I get out. He'll understand. I didn't want to cause unnecessary, you know, worry. but I got out and I just explained to you what I had done,

a guy texting another guy about a mental health thing that I was somewhat embarrassed about. Of course. And your response was like magic, gold, dude, let's get a run in. Let's get a sign. We did that. And I just, I guess my hope in conversations like this is that some way, somehow your microphone gets bigger,

my microphone gets bigger, that conversations like these are heard by men. You know, or by women that then share them with men. A lot of my following are women. But there's just so much here. And at the end of the day, my greatest strength, like you said, is my mental health. Like that is why I am tough. Yeah.

And I'm sure that's why you are a good business person and father. Well, I mean, you were kind enough to share some of the moments when I was there for you. You were really there for me when I needed you. And you were one of the people that I felt comfortable being. open with because you're so open and because you're you know so kind and thoughtful and receptive and I think I think I think the world surprises me when I see people share how good people really are we like to talk about how bad like people are and like there's so many good people if you want to see that just share something that's that you're struggling with like just go to someone and

I mean on an airplane being like I'm really not well you'd be amazing how many strangers would show up for you. But I'm really grateful to you because you were there for me when I needed you too. And that's what great friendship and that's what great, you know, that's what great relationships are for. And what we do is we live in a world now where isolation and loneliness is probably our biggest problem as it relates to mental health. And I will say when I look at our relationship, we have both shown up for each other. And that's how, in my opinion, really. relationships work. The resentment comes when, oh, I've done so much for Nate. He's done nothing for me or you've done so much for his. And it's, I feel that we are on the same page with that. And I got to tell you, you know, I too could speak about this forever. This is, and I don't just say this. This has been one of my favorite conversations because it was easy. And I think if you're listening, it's going to be helpful to hear a lot of this stuff. Just highlighting a couple of things with Roan just because I care about you and your work. But a partnership.

with the LPGA, a partnership with the MBA, you're now into the women's space, which was a huge win in the last year. Give me a couple minutes just quickly on what's next. Yeah. Well, I mean, we've had, in the last year, we added the chairman of ESPN to our board. We signed a deal with the first ever official apparel deal with the LPGA. We signed a couple LPGA golfers. We actually pay for a therapist to be on staff at tour events, which is really cool. Ronda's, which is just a really unique partnership that we have with them. The MBA, we're not only the official dresser of the NBA, but we are part of their health and wellness platform and influencing the content and making sure that it's balanced

both physically and mentally to both players and to staff. But we have, you know, we've got some really exciting things around the corner. Some of the best product we've ever made is coming out this year. And, yeah, I'm super passionate about what we're doing. also looking to put together a first ever of its kind mental health festival, because mental health doesn't have to be so serious and heavy all the time. It can be fun. It can be light. It can be exciting. We want to be able to... You better call me for that. If you don't, then I'll be resentful. You're first on the list. You're pretty first on the list. So, yeah, we've got some

really exciting things ahead and could not be more grateful to have great friends of the brand like you. I am here to lift you up however I possibly can. We'll certainly tag Nate. and you can find him and follow Roan and the journey that he's on with them. It's just, it's been inspiring. Hi, Ben. Sorry you're not here. We love you too.

You missed the better half. I mean, certainly Dana, my better half, but my partnership, Ben, he's the best. He's the best. I mean, 10 years later, people are like, oh, man, do you still like your brother? I'm like, he's the greatest human. The greatest.

He's just the best. But it's R-H-O-N-E.com. If you want to pick up some gear, I think I still have a code active, which I'll share so you guys can go I'll bully you not bully

but I will ask you very nicely if you have room in your heart to support this brand that I love so much get rid of that word bullying and Nate dude I love you man I really do thanks for coming

love you too brother appreciate it