The Zac Clark Show - NFL Executive Tim Schlittner Bravely Shares His Journey Through Alcoholism and Coming Out

Episode Date: June 26, 2024

Tim Schlittner is an expert communicator. The Director of Communications at the National Football League (NFL), serving as their Deputy Spokesperson, and the former Communications Director for the AFL-CIO, the largest federation of unions in the United States, he has built a hugely successful career managing perception, relationships and effective communications strategies. However, despite his professional prowess, his greatest challenge was crafting the narrative that mattered most – his own.  For years, Tim privately grappled with his sexuality and progressive alcoholism, each fueling the other on his painful journey to self-realization. Now, eight years sober and a proud member of the LGBTQ community, Tim has been named one of Outsports' Power 100 Most Influential LGBTQ People in Sports and is an active member of the Recovery Community. An NFL Executive, he continues to openly share about his sobriety and sexuality, providing a unique, inspiring and barrier-breaking perspective.  Brave and vulnerable, this conversation is about the journey of self-realization, the painful depths of self-denial, the freedom found in self-acceptance, and the healing power of sharing your story.  Connect with Zac https://www.instagram.com/zwclark/ https://www.linkedin.com/in/zac-c-746b96254/ https://www.tiktok.com/@zacwclark https://www.strava.com/athletes/55697553 https://twitter.com/zacwclark If you or anyone you know is struggling, please do not hesitate to contact Release: [phone] releaserecovery.com @releaserecovery

All right, so welcome back to the Zach Clark show. These conversations are getting better and better. And today is not going to let us down. We have with us, man, I was lucky to hear your story a couple months ago. And by happenstance, we were at an event or something together. And I heard you share it. Tim Schlittner, he's the director of communications for the National Football League, the NFL. And he's here to talk with us all about his story and his job and what he's seen in the

world when it comes to behavioral health care and everything else or tim thanks for being here Zach thanks so much excited to get into it yeah yeah man um I think the first like when I was when I was thinking about you and we reached out my first question is like you are successful you've done you've built a beautiful career for yourself why would you say yes to coming on this podcast to talk about the stuff that we're going to talk about. Because any success I've had, any sense of peace I've enjoyed has come from recovery. And the work that you do to promote recovery in your business and your podcast and your life is something I admire.

It's something I try to do as well to be open with my story because without recovery, I don't have anything that I'm enjoying today. It's the foundation. it's the center. It's the part of my life that makes everything else possible. So I want to share about it because a lot of people are struggling. I see it as I go about my daily life. I see it online. I see it in the news. And I feel like these conversations are critically important. We should be having more of them. And if I can contribute to helping one person, I'm going to do it. Well, I think you just did with that, that opener right there. I mean, I am too someone that

believes my recovery is my greatest asset so they say if you keep your recovery first like everything else kind of follows and we'll fall in the place and it sounds like for you that's the truth and for those of you listening like that's all you really need to hear from this episode we're going to get into it but director of communications for the NFL which is a pretty large organization have you heard of us yes yeah openly sober yes I mean that is the juice man and so when you say recovery so how long how long you've been sober how long you've been in recovery my sobriety date is December 20th of 2015 so going on eight and a half years and this chapter of my life has been unbelievable it's opened up so many doors it's given me a sense of self and it's now I was

telling someone that is looking to take this path today it's the new normal and so it's not something I spend all the time thinking about but it's It is something I practice. Yeah, I mean, I want to get into your story, but that's an interesting way to go here. It's like I do believe the world is ready. I think the world is ready for this shift. You're seeing so much more out there about wellness and sober curious. And for me, like I needed to get sober because I was a drug addict and an alcoholic.

But I do think we're starting to get some support from like the underbelly of people that are just realizing that alcohol is kind of poison. I mean, I don't know if that's what you're seeing. but it certainly is for an alcoholic and i think i was sharing with you offline i think i was born an alcoholic it runs straight through my family tree right down from ireland i can see it had thanksgiving at christmas at family events in our history if you look at 23 and me there's a lot of struggle and addiction there and i'm proud to say now some recovery and started with my aunt and some others who decided to get sober and I believe sobriety is a decision and um we've made the decision to move forward as a family and and embrace this way of life and

it's it's really been rewarding yeah yeah I mean there's this analogy that I always use and I love that you know that that sobriety or recovery is a is a decision I mean like anyone can go and make the decision to join a gym, right, and pay the monthly fee. But if you go into that gym and you kind of just look around and don't do anything, right, you're not going to get any stronger, faster, better looking, whatever you're trying to accomplish. And it's the same thing, you know, I believe in recovery. Like the membership here, what we do is anyone's welcome to do it. But once you are there and once you are in therapy or going to meetings or doing whatever it is,

whatever path you're following, you know, there's work to be done. And that's where I think the decision comes in. And that's where we lose a lot of people, is they're just not willing to do the work. You know, it's like the cancer patient gets their diagnosis and the doctor tells them what to do. They're like, yeah, I'm going to do that. Right.

The alcoholic gets their diagnosis and we tell them what to do. And they're like, yeah, no, I'm not doing that. It's crazy. And, you know, my dad at age 30 was diagnosed with type 1 diabetes. Yeah. You know, he found out that his pancreas did not produce insulin and was given a program of action to live a long healthy life. And I remember at the time he had said that his goal was to just make it to my high school graduation, which was in 1999.

And he has worked so diligently and practiced and done reps of a healthy lifestyle, including taking injections and testing his blood sugar and having a healthy diet. and not getting outside of his comfort zone too much. And, you know, now he's 72 years old and still healthy. And that's because he practiced the program that was given to him. Yeah. And without that, without those reps every day of being a functional diabetic, he wouldn't be here today. Right.

So I want to get into the story. You're born in Jersey. I was born in Staten Island. Okay, you're born in Staten Island Hospital. Okay. And then at what you, but you grew up in Jersey? I did. Age five, my parents moved us from Staten Island to a town called Titton Falls, New Jersey.

Okay. It's on the Jersey Shore, Monmouth County. Love it. Yeah. And at what point in your adolescence or youth or adult, like, when do you have your first drink? Like, when do you start to see like, oh, wow, there's something going on here? So the first time I remember drinking was at. a cousin's wedding. I think I was probably 15. I brought a date to the wedding. We can get into that

later. I was 15. I had a date. It was a friend, this girl, Christine. We were there. It was in Queens, I believe. And we went to the bar at one point, and my uncle had given us a drink, like a vodka and tonic or something, each of us. the bartender kind of went along with it but we were 15 so we really shouldn't have been hanging around the bar right but we had two seats you know at our table and so we drank those two drinks ended up right on the dance floor immediately just going crazy on the dance floor and each time we would come back from the dance floor two new drinks would be at our seat and i don't know if that was the bartender taking care of us or my uncle hooking us up but

we would dance we would drink we would dance we would drink and then i just remember feeling for the first time that elation right of what it's like to to go big the freedom yeah and it was just always like to me alcohol always provided the extra that i wanted right you know for we don't want to go big we want to go huge right you know and it was just like it made the dance floor better it made the the date better it made the night better yeah i mean for me i chased that feeling for 15 years and until i learned learned about the actual brain, like what happens to the dopamine that first time that we drink and our brain lights up and we get to this level that you feel on the dance for, like the best ever, I'm drunk for the first time.

You know, it's hard to get back to that level. And that's why for me the drugs came in and the Coke and the hair, you know, because I was like doing anything to press the pedal to the metal to feel like that again. Yeah. And I, after that, I didn't do regular drinking really until my first. freshman year of college. No shit, okay. Yeah, so I hung around with people that weren't really drinking.

We drank, I think, on the last night of our senior year at a pool party. I remember drinking Bacardi there and jumping in the pool with my shirt on and looking up at the sky and saying this is the best night of my life and stuff like that. And what kind of kid were you in high school? I mean, were you like... I was like the editor-in-chief of the newspaper, the editor of the yearbook on the golf team. I had a column called Schlittner's Message where I would do like editorials

I was I was definitely an outgoing opinionated kid you know but also you know we can get into this I was I was struggling with a lack of identity right and compensating on many levels but I would say I was like popular but not in the popular crowd

right loved yeah like I won election as as student body vice president my campaign slogan was Schlittner is the schlitt. And that ended up like catching fire. Yeah. So stuff like that. I was, I was very political even then. Okay. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. And you end up working. I mean, like, look, it's an amazing story. Okay. So then you go to Syracuse, freshman year of college, you're thrown into, like, yeah, take me through. First night at Syracuse.

I mean, we went out. Yeah. And we went to a house party. And it was just a little group of guys from my floor, you know, what we, it was like a whole new world. We were exploring. And we ended up at a party. And there was bad beer and there was some jungle juice. And so, this is 2000? 1999. This is late August 1999. Was McNabb there? McNabb had just left, which was in a really unfortunate timing because I had to watch Troy Noon's my freshman year. So I missed him by one year, which but like how good he was in his senior year I remember over Thanksgiving weekend when I was senior in high school Syracuse beat the shit out of Miami like 66 to 10 and McNabb was unbelievable and like so it just got got me really psyched sports was a big reason why I wanted to head to Syracuse

and Syracuse football was a big reason too yeah yeah but I just missed on it yeah so but that night big time you know exploration partying, drinking, and really from that night on, every time I drank, it was to excess. There was no moderation. Okay. So just to like, you're 15, you have a couple cocktails at this wedding, party, elation, kind of put it down until senior prom last weekend, whatever, jump in the pool, Bacardi.

Freshment year, you show up at Syracuse, and it's go time. Like the 15 one, I didn't plan. Yeah. You know, that was like the, whoever, my uncle or the bartender decided that it'd be fun to see the two 15-year-old's drunk. You know, that. And then the senior year high school was like, that's what everyone was doing. So I was like, all right. And I think that's part of what people get confused about, too.

Like when I sit down with a young guy who's trying to get sober, it's like I drank normally in high school. I didn't, I wasn't like all my other friends. But then there's this moment in time I feel like where, like for you, showing up freshman year in college, where things get different and this thing activates in us and we have no control. You know what's one of the distinctions for me and this probably explains the gap

between 15 and the Bacardi night and the beginning of school? I could always not drink. That is something I had the ability to do. What I never had the ability to do was stop drinking once I started drinking. So like even in my 20s and early 30s, I was not someone who drank during the week.

It was trying to advance a career. it was just not and I knew I had no shot if I was but once Friday and then increasingly Thursday showed up I was turning on the on switch and there was no off switch right so I net like I resisted the idea that I was an alcoholic for a long time because I thought it was only that first definition someone that couldn't stop at all right no like physically addicted mentally obsessed just tied to bottle but what I didn't know was that second definition is you start and you can't stop that is alcoholism and I have it yeah I mean dude I I I laugh to this day I mean I'll hopefully have 13 years in August and to this day I go out with

friends and I I will avoid dishes with alcohol right I'll get cooked with wine or the taramisu or whatever the fuck it is and they're like but it's cooked off or it's I'm like I don't want to tempt fate like when you you say the second I start I can't stop like I believe one drop one pellet of alcohol enters into my system who the fuck knows could activate yeah it could activate and I don't I don't want to risk that so people will frown and crinkle their eyebrows and say you're not going to eat this delicious meal because it's cooked with wine and I'll say it's not worth it there's 13 other things on the menu right the greatest meals probably don't have alcohol yeah but yeah so once

I got to Syracuse it was time I my plan was a drink. It was college. I'm going to go to college. I'm going to go to football and basketball games. I'm going to not have sex with girls. And I'm going to get drunk. Yeah. That was my plan. Right. Yeah. We'll get to the not having sex with girls part. Okay. So, are you out in four years? Or what is your college career? Yeah. Yeah. Good student. Involved in activities. Missing class? Like, or you're just here and there. Yeah. You know, it was, you know, morning classes I'd miss a couple that have a buddy get me the notes but no I mean

academically I held it together fraternity or like what is yeah I was in a fraternity I was resistant to the idea for a lot of reasons but my buddies all joined and really convinced me to do the same okay so you graduate college and what so that's 99 to 2003 yeah May 03, Syracuse wins the national championship in basketball. Okay, mellow? Mello. Freshman. He's a freshman, I'm a senior.

Okay. It's the greatest four-month stretch of my life. Still? Well, it's up there. I've got to be honest. Yeah, I'm with it. You've got to work here. I mean, the Syracuse thing is different.

It's the Orange Mafia. Yeah. Yeah. And so that happens. It's an unbelievable sort of four months. I still like am fighting identity stuff. I still am drinking too much but it's senior year of college

we just cut down the nets I was pretty happy and I was planning to move to Washington to work in politics so May 2003 the ride ended and I was ready to get on the next one okay so do you move to D.C.?

Yes All right and then let's just get the cat out of the bag in 05 I mean you're gay I am so what happens what what well give me the story leading up to that

because I feel like for me let me backtrack because I don't want to be insensitive to this right okay I don't I don't want to say like this happens but for me I've seen a lot of people struggle to get sober who eventually come to grift with their sexuality get honest about that first and then the sobriety quickly follows which isn't necessarily your story no it's not so I think it started for me probably around the time I had puberty 12 or 13 and you start to realize certain things about yourself what you're attracted to right what you're not attracted to and this is 1993 1994 I'm starting to realize about these things these are not subtle

pulls right these are clear signs right that I am gay at that point so humor like sitting in class looking at like yeah yes yeah like wow Joe, not Wow, Jane. Got it. Yeah, like, just realizations. And then, like, I always say the show Home Improvement came out, and the Sons on Home Improvement, like, confirmed it for me. Jonathan Taylor Thompson, yeah.

Yeah, he showed up on my screen, and that's, like, the jury came in. It's like, it's over. That was a show that just, like, it's... I was a Tiffany Amber Thiessen. 9-0-210-0 or Saved by the Bell, right? Well, she was both. You know, she came on as a character. Maybe I was both.

I think Saved by the Bell, though. What was the early? Kelly? Yeah, Kelly Kapowski. Right, I was Zach. Yeah, but I couldn't say it at the time. Yeah. But if you know, either you're Zach or Slater.

Right. I was Zach. Okay. But I was definitely, Jonathan Taylor Thomas. That was your guy. Oh, my God. Yeah. So the things are, but again, 1994, 1993,

there are no openly gay people in my family. There are no openly gay people on TV. There are no openly gay people in sports. There are no openly gay people in politics. There are no openly gay people in my neighborhood. I knew no one. Zero. Zero.

Not one person that I could, okay, do I talk to them? They're the role model. They're the model. And so I just said, this is not good. I don't want to be the other. I don't want to be the 0.5%. That's what I thought at the time. So I just pushed it down.

And I pushed it down for all of high school. And then when I got to college is when I really had to push it down. I mean, you know, I was joking about going to Syracuse and not pursuing women, but I was around friends that were doing it every weekend. Right. What would you do? Is that when you were drinking would pick up? Yeah, I would just then just really lean into alcohol. Like, and I'd be too, too wasted to do it. Did it work? Did the booze work? Because I would feel like in some ways that might get you the courage to go kiss a girl or, you know. Oh yeah, no, it did. Yeah, there were a couple of times where, where it worked.

You know, where I would end up making out with a girl in the bar kind of for show. Yeah. It's like a girl named Kelly, tall girl named Kelly. You know. I'm even your face. Well, it's just, it's like, it's like, and not because Kelly was fine. It was just like the mortification of what I'm doing. Like I'm a fraud, you know, I'm going around doing these things and it's just not who I am.

Right. So that was starting to eat away at me late in college. And then once I got into the real world, I really started to eat away at me because just there was no excuse anymore to not be living an adult life. And so I had this part of my identity that I was neglecting heavily. I was searching for sense of self for an outlet. You know, the closet is a dark place. it leads to a lot of pain it leads you to just do things that are not i think acts of integrity you know um would you say in 2024 the the closet is less scary or i would think so okay

i would think there's certainly more representation in our society than there was in 1994 we've seen a lot but then on the other hand we're seeing our society a lot of backlash right now, like, you know, if you see someone post on social media about pride and look at the comments, there's a lot of backlash, yeah, and just like really a lot of hate and stuff like that. So, you know, these things are pendulums, but I think we're in a much better place than we were in 1994. I don't think anyone can argue against that. So 2004 was, you know, my first year out of school in the real world in D.C. And then that brings us to the summer of 2005 where my parents sat me down and they had been visited by my cousins, two of my closest cousins

who were really worried about my drinking because my drinking had picked up and then I had started to become angry. I was always a happy drunk. Most of my drinking I was that that kid on the dance floor at age 15. Yeah. Like you know drinking vodka. Cool in the gang celebration is on middle of the circle, that type of stuff. But it just had gotten darker and I think they saw that. So my parents sat me down to talk about my drinking on August 5th, 2005. You remember. Yes. And we started to talk about it. And I was very defensive because I thought there were other people in my family that, you know, were better cases to be dealing with at the time. You know, I was like, I'm only 24 years old. You know, I was just very defensive.

I was upset that my cousins had gone to see them behind my back, even though they did it out of love. Yeah, exactly. Just the entire. We'll put your finger at anyone. It's the entire scapegoating playbook. and my dad and my dad and i have a very close relationship he just looked at me and said timmy are you happy and i don't know what came over me but i just i could i couldn't lie anymore i was just like no i'm not happy and then i started to talk and i i don't know exactly

what i was saying but i just started to just talk and talk about my life and myself and i was kind of circling around the reality and it was something I had never said nor did I feel like I could say to anyone. The words had never left my lips. And I'm kind of talking around in circles and then my dad just looks at me and he goes, Timmy, just say it. I know you want to say it. And then I said, I'm gay. And that was the first time I said it. And my dad, this is a story that I've told a couple of times my my dad looked at me he said I've never been more proud of you in my entire life now we're all crying me my mother my father yeah we're and then my mother as she gives me a hug and tells me she loves me she looks at me and she goes

do you even really like football and I was like yes mom I really like football that was sort of the moment that the question that came up in the moment but It was, the burden had been lifted and the truth was out. But simultaneously, I had tabled the entire discussion about alcohol. Alcohol was no longer the lead story. It was coming out. But was there some relief in that moment? I mean, the first time you say, I'm gay.

So much relief. And then I went on what I call a coming out tour. Like, I got in my car. And I was like, now that I said it, I'm going to tell the people in my life. and I just got in my Jeep Grand Cherokee and started driving around the tri-state area to tell people. Was anyone not cool?

No, but I was, I don't know if you remember the show Queer's Folk, but I was watching an episode recently and one of the characters said there are two kinds of straight people, the ones that hate you to your face and the ones that hate you behind your back. I don't believe that. But everyone that I talked to was very loving and supportive. But you never know what people say behind closed doors.

Where some people, you know, upset with it, surprise with it, you know. I'm not really sure. But it was a very big moment. It had opened a door to a life of possibilities. But the way I describe it is I opened the closet door and then I went nowhere. I never stepped out into a life of meaningful community self because I was still. a slave to alcohol yeah well 2005 to 2017 that's a long time it was so drinking i mean right 10 more years 5 to 15 oh you got sober yeah yeah so i you know it's uh something i referred to as the

lost decade and you didn't feel like okay you knew you were gay did you know you were alcoholic i knew i had a problem with alcohol alcoholic i wasn't willing to go there alcohol alcohol like I had a picture of what that was. So how are the feelings, I mean, I guess that's my question. How are the feelings similar, like the feeling between that conversation with your parents where you say, I'm gay, and the feeling for the first time acknowledging or saying to someone, I'm an alcoholic. Because I don't identify with the gay feelings, but I identify with the feelings that you're

sharing about being a fraud and whatever else like that. And that's my alcoholism. alcoholism and the closet are very similar they are prisons of my own making they are the results of bondage of self so the closet was my own prison i kept myself there i could have gotten out i could have sought relief i could have leaned into truth but i didn't took me a while took me about 10 years my alcoholism was a prison of my own making i was a slave to alcohol It was a bondage of self. I could have sought relief.

I could have gotten help. I could have learned about what people in my family who had gotten sober had done. But again, I made the decision to keep self-medicating and to keep alcohol in the picture. It took me 10 years to make that decision. So these 10-year periods of delaying freedom and relief, you know, it leads to a a life that lacks a lot when you turn 34, which is why the last eight years have been so special. Right.

Was it harder to say I'm an alcoholic than say I'm gay? It was harder to say I'm gay. It was. Yeah. It was just, it was unfathomable. So then that experience didn't fuel like your desire to get completely honest about the drinking? that's where I'm like

No that's the thing It's and then I You know I could like There's a big drinking culture In the LGBT community That I could You know I went to a lot of prides And just like leaned into the drinking

And the partying and And stuff like that And you know I didn't think the two Were I thought the two could work together Did you know anyone in that community That was sober? Had you met like through your travels now

No I had not I had not met anyone until later closer to the time I got sober and it was an LGBT person who suggested to me to seek help yeah and how and so like that next 10 years like what is your career path what are you doing I mean in kind of a cliff notes version of like is it affecting your life the drinking are you just so you know excited about this new found freedom That's the thing is, it was, I came out, I came out, but I went nowhere. You know, if you ever hear the phrase, a rhino, Republican in name only. Okay. I was like a, a Gino. I was a gay in name only. I didn't do anything about it.

I had made the statement, but I wasn't dating. I wasn't, I didn't have a real sense of, of gay friends or community. I still hadn't accepted myself and loved myself, that piece could only be found when I put alcohol down. The alcohol for me was a bat to beat myself with. And every time I drank to excess, and over those 10 years, it was every time I drank. And I drank every weekend and every vacation and every trip.

And it was taking a bat to myself every time over and over again. and I was getting beaten down. I was starting to have real sadness in those years. When do your parents come back to the drinking, or do they? Like, when do they circle back to the alcohol conversation? I think intermittently over the next 10 years, one of the things is that they lived in New Jersey and I lived in D.C. So they were able to have the luxury of not seeing how hammered I was getting.

But there were weddings. and family trips and cruises you know i just came off a cruise with my parents and we talked about one of the cruises where they had to come get me out of my room on the day that you leave the ship and my father does an impression of how i sounded and it was uh you know it was just it was just sad it was just out of control it was sad it was every time and so they would say what are you doing here right what are you doing but it wasn't they were never pressuring me, and my career was succeeding. So let's get to the hope, because I feel like if people are listening to this episode,

there's a ton of hope here. One, if you're sitting out there and you're questioning, you know, your sexuality, you're safe, right? Like, you just told your story and you're here and you're happy. And two, at some point you get sober. So what, how does that all come to light? so when I turned 30 I got a therapist okay because it was you know I'm big on therapy therapy it it was a decade birthday I was unhappy you know I was kind of six years into that lost decade

and I went to the therapist I said here's who I am here's my here's my story I'm not happy I want to be happy, let's get to work. I need to be happy. And within two sessions, he said, we've got to talk about your drinking. And I remember saying to him, I hear you. It sounds like a lot. I said, let's table the drinking. I want to do the happiness first. We get to happy. I'm fine. We'll do the drinking stuff. And every week, week after week, he just kept hammering away. What did you do this weekend? He would say things like, man, that sounds really sad. Right. You know, I'd tell him where I ended up, you know, McDonald's on 17th Street in D.C.

with a 20-piece chicken McNugget at 3 o'clock in the morning by myself. Hammered. Yeah, he'd say, that sounds pretty sad. And at this point, had you dated anyone? No. Okay. I've never been in a relationship. Still?

Still to this day. Really? Which is, you know, a discussion for therapists and people in my life. you know I don't know if I want it I don't but then sometimes I think I do want it but today at least it's a possibility for me yeah because I'm like ready I'm fully whole yeah to be with another person I just never have okay yeah so my mind's already running yeah I'm sure you've had a ton of people try to set you well you can I mean you can join a group of about a thousand people through you know up and down the East Coast who want me to have a boyfriend so

they gather regularly and put names forward and you can what was the newspaper or no what was your tagline's message oh no schlittner is a shit slits the shit schlittner is the schlitt yeah so so i that that i've never i haven't yet allowed myself to have that or found the right person have you have you dug in there at all yeah i've dug in um but probably not as deep as i need to you know and i'm eight and a half years into recovery And I think there's something to be said for single life. I think there's a lot of joy and freedom in setting your own schedule and surrounding yourself with a lot of people.

I agree, man. I've seen both sides of it. I mean, I've been in relationships, and obviously that's, you know, there's sacrifice, there's surrender, there's patience, there's love, there's all that that goes into that. And then there's, yeah, to your point, the single life. Like a buddy text me on a Wednesday and wants to meet in Charleston. on Friday I can I can do that right you know or I can choose to go to the game on Sunday and stay overnight because I don't have to rush back to you know so there are things about the

single life that I 100% and like you know I guess my heart's just saying like I want you to experience a relationship so you can really make your decision as to what way you want to live but that's just me being a people pleaser no I mean and and listen you're you're not alone in that feeling and I know my parents you know when I go on vacation with them they always say you know if you want to bring someone yeah it's it's sort of an express desire my mom wanted me to meet someone so bad that she submitted my application to a reality television show yeah you know so well there you go parents will do anything to get you you know there you go um I did watch the golden bachelor did you by the way yeah that was getting very emotional during that which is I don't know if there's

anything to read into there. So this therapist was on me, was on me, and he was like, you, you know, there's a community of sober people in D.C. There's a community of gay sober people in D.C. I think it'd be wonderful for you. And I just fought them off, fought them off, fought them off for another four years. We're good at that. Yeah. Just wanted to protect what I knew and what I had and what I was comfortable with. And, you know, it was a Halloween weekend, 2015. My cousin was visiting. He came down for Nick's Wizards. We were at the game.

Had a great weekend. The next day, we were watching football at a bar. He, him and I just got into a discussion. I don't know. I think I had said something snarky to him. Yeah. And, you know, he looked at me, and this is a cousin that I'm, this is my best friend. You know, I have no, I have no siblings.

Yeah. So this cousin is two years. You're an only child? I'm an only child. Okay. This cousin's like my brother. two years my junior, just a tremendous person. And he had said to me, you know, Tim, it's sad to see you settle like this,

because you're really settling in your life. And the next day, he was supposed to spend the night. But the next day, I woke up and he had left that night. He didn't even stay until the next day. Because... I think he had just had enough of my bullshit. And he was always babysitting me at bars. Always, like always, and I was someone who would chirp, I'd have a mouth at bars, but I couldn't fight for shit.

He was someone that was always cleaning, he had a beautiful look. I don't take you as a fighter. No, and he has a beautiful left hook. People can never see the left coming. So he had, it was just, I think he was just exhausted, just like I was. Yeah. And I remember waking up that next morning, he was gone. I was alone in bed, and it was worse than any hangover ever had, just the emotional bottom of,

you know what, he's right. And I just remember I went, I went to the bathroom, I looked in the mirror, I said out loud into the mirror, is this the best you've got? And then I went into my kitchen, I sat down, and I said, that's it. It's over. That's it. Was that the last time you drank? No.

You know, it would have been great with that story. It would have been great if it was, you know. But I was going to be a groomsman in one of my good friends' weddings. I remember this, yeah, okay. In Key West. in December and I didn't want to go and be a groomsman and not drink

that's not fulfilling the role of groomsmen you know that requires you to drink to excess in Key West so I flew down for that and that was my that weekend lies we tell ourselves like I've been a groomsman

in a wedding sober and it's the best it's awesome I mean you feel great you remember things your tuxedo isn't doesn't need to be incinerated after right you can actually return it to men's warehouse yeah i remember so i uh i woke up at that wedding key west is just an alcoholics playground too i really love it yeah i've gone back sober the wall street yes yeah exactly so i woke up in the we had this rental tuxedo i was like my weight was definitely out of control at that point so it was like size z and i woke up in the

that tuxedo and it was it was just covered in urine like the whole thing was just disgusting and I remember you had to return it it was like it was like an offshoot of men's warehouse black tucks or something and you had to return it in a box it was like you there was like one of these boxes that you put it in the box and put it in the mail and I remember rolling it up stuffing it into the box and then I I just wrote on a posted note, like one of those hotel post-it notes, sorry, and put the sorry in there and sent it back. Wow. I barely got on the plane coming home.

A couple of my friends, well, friends of friends, who happened to be the anchors for Channel 4 in D.C. who were at the wedding, basically helped me onto the plane, got me situated, and then I remember the plane landed. I heard the wheels hit the tarmac at National Airport in D.C. when I heard that little screech of the plane, I said, it's over. And that's, that was it. That was it. That was it. And so how did you, how do you compare finding your way in recovery to finding your way as an openly gay man?

Like how do those two experiences, did the prior help the latter or? They, they can reinforce each other, either positive. positively or negatively. Sobriety, honesty, recovery, self, those are all characteristics that work together to create a fully authentic and whole human being. And that's at my best, I am that. I am myself. I am openly gay, but I'm also someone who works in football and someone who's family

oriented and someone who loves being in recovery and helping people. and that all the things about me I can lean into and that's that's one side of the coin the other is when I deny resent or hate who I am when I get casual about my addiction when I start to be complacent then that creates a person that is not fully authentic not fully healthy is easily resentful can become homophobic and can can hate myself and so though that's the danger of those sort of demons that I've been able to exercise. Those are very much in the past for me right now, but they're not too distant past.

So, you know, when I told my parents I was quitting drinking, the first thing I told them, I said, listen, this is my final announcement. I was like, after this, I have no more announcements. Because it was like, how many, like, another press conference, Tim, it's like, what are we doing? You know, I was just like, this is the final announcement. They were probably thrilled.

Elated. And my father says to this day, best decision you ever made, best decision you ever made. Yeah. Absolutely. So that was the way to bring together the two truths. The truths that I am a gay alcoholic. I am who I am. I'm happy.

I have a lot of good qualities. I have a lot of challenges, a lot of things to work on. But today I am who I am. And that freedom was hard earned. Dude, you're so inspiring. Cheers to you, man. Thank you. so you didn't go to rehab i mean you kind of just found your way with some supports and the

therapist probably helped guide you and gave you i mean there's obviously a litany of options that for for guys like you and i we find there's meetings out there's and support groups and things that you know we do that you know help us stay sober so you kind of got in the middle of that and and and got sober and stay sober i did after six months okay so i did between December and May, I just did it on my own without a community. And that was tough. I was starting to feel a lot better physically. I had gained a lot of weight in the latter part of my drinking. You know, so like, you know, when you see people get sober and their skin looks better and they look better and they feel better. So all that was happening. But I also, I felt alone. You know, it almost was like

back when I was 13, 14. Right. There was no gay people in my life. This was like, there was no people doing what I was doing. I needed to go find those people. Yeah. And finding those people has been the greatest gift of my life. They are my closest friends. They are my family. It is the sober brotherhood.

It is absolutely changed. Sober people are the best. And that community, our world could learn so much from the sober community. The way that we bring people in and hug and love and just accept one another. Right. It's next level. And accept people for who they are. Right.

You know, someone I really respect would always say to me, recovery is not about self-improvement. It's about self-acceptance. Yeah. And so now, you know, finding that community, and I was able to find that community with a lot of people like me, including a lot of gay people. Yeah. I was just able to really just have so much fun and so much freedom and just really lean into just being, an adolescent again right you know it had been so long since I was just myself and not calculating or or judging or hating and it was just you know this is just me and so that part you know it

almost was like I felt like a kid again yeah yeah for me it was like a built-in social life you know I didn't think I was actually going to meet anyone that was like cool or that I could actually hang out with and I had this experience one night where I went out out with a couple guys here in New York and I wrote my parents an email that night. I think I was like a year sober because I had been struggling to really find my community and I was I kind of said like hey I found this group of guys and a lot of them are still in my life today and so it's it's the best. I remember my first sober trip with gay men to Robith Beach Delaware Memorial Day weekend and there was a hundred guys on the trip and I was I was super scared and

intimidated and I got up there and it was magical it was everyone was kind accepting loving it was so much fun I had the idea of organizing a beach football game I wanted to kind of put my stamp on the weekend so organize this beach football game we were supposed to play to three the game ended in a one-to-one tie yeah it was you know we just kept playing but people showed up you know i showed up to drag night people showed up to the beach football game we supported each other we went out to incredible meals i got to make connections and i was like oh okay this is just me being myself and and not hating myself right wow this kind of works yeah do you love yourself today i do no no question no question i love myself i think um a child of god

and that God doesn't make mistakes, and that while imperfect, I believe that I'm a good person and worthy of my own love and the love of others. Yeah, I mean, I know you're a good person. I know the impact you've had on the recovery community here in New York City and beyond. I mean, you've only been living in New York for a couple years because you took this new job. And so I want to ask you a couple questions about that because I think it's fascinating, right? Like going back to what your mom said, like, Timmy, do you really like football? Like you do.

Yes. We talk about football all the time. And, you know, we've gotten to know each other a little bit. I was doing some research before the episode. And I found something recently where there was a list of the 100 most powerful LGBT members of the LGBTQIA plus community in sports. And you were on this list. I don't know if you know about this. Yeah, out sports power 100.

My dad was very proud that I think I was in. 94. Yeah, 94 and 95, but you were on it. Right. But I'm on the same list as Billy Jean King. Yeah. That ain't nothing. I was blown away because I started to do my research. And I found this. And I said, how cool is this, man? Like, how cool is it? Because I know you more through your recovery. Right. Right. And so that's one of the things that I think people struggle with when they're newly sober. How am I going to build a life? How am I going to build a career? This is going to hold me back. I'm going to get stepped over for job opportunities because they're going to know that. I'm a fraud, right? And the truth is, here you are, being very open and honest about all the

things, and you're leading a really damn successful career. So your work at the NFL, I mean, I've been impressed recently. I think a lot of the leagues and organizations are starting to pay attention to mental health. I think the substance abuse will be hopefully shortly behind it, because I think that's, I mean, I don't know, what are you saying? You're the guy kind of. You know, we have incredible people that work on this at the league, trained clinicians, people that have a background in mental health and substance abuse. And from what they've told me, the mental health work and the substance abuse work really can't be separated.

Great. That they are one and the same, that it's something that we have to deal with. Players are being more outspoken in their own journeys, in their mental health journeys. You know, Darren, obviously. Crosby. Yeah. are two examples who have been out there sharing their recovery. And, you know, Darren Waller wore number 12 last year for the 12 steps,

which I thought was really cool. And it's something that is, it's a reality. And it's football is not immune to it. I think it was in 2020 when the NFL and the NFLPA, which is the players union, were negotiating a country. contract, a collective bargaining agreement, they came to agreement on a mandate that every team has a mental health clinician full-time on staff. Okay.

And so that is- Full-time, no, not consulting. I mean, they are there in the building or somewhere near the team where. Right. So that's been, I think, a big step forward. Do you have any idea how, if I'm a player, if I'm on the 53-man roster or whatever it is, if I start to feel a certain kind of way, how I tap into that, is that just me? I put my hand up and then the team will set me up with it, or is it mandated to actually see that clinician?

I don't know exactly how that works, but a team, you would talk to your position coach, you would talk to maybe your player rep, you would talk to someone you trust in the building, and then they would get you connected with the person that can provide the help. Yeah, because we know, I mean, you and I know enough, like typically the hardest person to reach

is the one that needs to help the most, right? So I don't think a lot of people are jumping up and down saying, like, I need therapy, right? And so especially an NFL player who probably has certain thoughts and ideas about who they're supposed to be rooted into them from a young age. And so I've always kind of thought, like for these teams and leagues and organizations or whatever it is, even businesses, right? Like there almost needs to be this checklist or assessment that they can kind of run through weekly, You know, and then if something flags, then they kind of say, hey, we want you to talk to the team clinician. Yeah, I think those conversations are happening in locker rooms, and they're happening in meeting rooms. Pure to peer, yeah.

And they're happening on social media, and players are being open. And those who aren't speaking up might be listening and considering, you know, and same goes for people being open about who they are. you know, when Carl Nassib came out of the closet as an active player just a couple of years ago. Has there been anyone since or has it? There hasn't, yeah. So, but I think, you know, what he did, he was a hell of a player. Yeah. He's a hell of a player.

And open the door for others who were considering, you know, it's not only who's talking, it's who's listening. Right. And who might be the next guy. Yeah. No, I mean, it's, to my point earlier on, it was, you know, I've seen it hold a lot. of people back just in their recovery journeys and journeys in life. I mean, especially here in New York City, we're exposed to so many different beautiful humans, right? That all, I think it's a place where you can really live your truth. I mean, if you can't find your tribe here,

you're, you're in trouble. But, you know, well, that's just it. Like, you know, and for me, the, the most dangerous place was inside myself. That's the place where that was, that was the place that was unaccepting. That was the place that was not ready. to be free you know it wasn't it was never someone in my life holding me back or a job or a city or a church you know the homophobia was in here do your co-workers know i mean do people in your light i mean they all know you're sober is that a lot of them do yeah you know um just working in the nfl you're at you go to a lot of open bar events super bowl parties you know christmas stuff like that so you enjoy that stuff so i mean you go and have yeah

Absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah. If there's a DJ and a dance floor, I'm there. I love it. No vodka necessary. Yeah. I agree.

I mean, look, and that's, you're kind of like smashing all these ideas that I think are built into people in recovery, right? You can't have fun. You can't dance. You can't go to dinners. You can't go to football games. You can't go to tailgates. And it's all bullshit. When I was three months sober, Syracuse made the Final Four.

It was in Houston. and I was like, I really want to go, but I don't drink. Right. So I can't go. I was like, man, but I really want to go. All my friends were going. Yeah. There was 15 of us, 14 were going to drink, and then I was considering it.

And I was like, talk to my dad. I was like, what do I do? He goes, please tell me. He said, go. He said, here's a thought. Why don't you go and watch the basketball? That's what the event is. the drinking is not the event the drinking is just something you used to do the basketball will

go and watch the basketball see how you like it and he was dead on i went yeah yeah it was awesome i ended up you know syracuse got eliminated on on saturday night by north carolina and then we like the 15 of us ended up at this bar called twin peaks and everyone was drinking and you know at that point i was like hmm this is this is not great did nova win that year at the buzzer yeah christian at the buzzer and I flew home on Sunday okay because I was pissed and I regret it because I you know best games of all time one of the best games of all time you know Jay Wright going bang and Villanova has also brought a lot of joy to my life through the Knicks yeah so this is really tough for the fandom keep going yeah yeah yeah we can

do a whole thing on the Knicks if you want but like I I had the tickets to both sessions that when you when you buy for the final four you get both sessions and then Sunday I was like I'm at it I don't want to watch Philanova North Carolina I'm out of here right so gave up my ticket to the greatest the greatest championship game I mean I'm a maybe NC State but I'd have a distaste in my mouth because of Josh Hart and Jalen Brunson and everything that's happening you know like it's just the next were so tough I mean they beat the shit out of the Sixers this year oh that series was yeah they just manhandled them that was rough they couldn't walk afterwards so they think they got kind of

smoke in the next round. But anyway, I think that's such a valuable lesson and thing that your dad said because therapists and the field, the behavior of healthcare field at large, I feel like we do ourselves a disservice at times

with these bullshit rules that we make, like don't date in the first year, don't travel, don't be around old friends, it's like, well, why the fuck am I getting sober? Right? Like at three months, you go, you have that experience. I mean, in the absolute knockdown, worst case scenario, you drink again you drink again and like you would hope to get back to your sobriety when you

yeah that would have been the best case scenario exactly what happens happens you go you see that i can go to an event sober i can watch the basketball i can be there for the reason i'm supposed to be there and enjoy it best case scenario was we won the title well yeah okay but yes it was it was just something i you know was able to learn about myself and also it just demystified a lot of like drinking to me has really lost its luster yeah when i see people you know and and then that was that weekend was an example just hammered in a stadium or at a bar or at a wedding i just it's just kind of it's off-putting yeah and and i and i see like myself i'm like wow like god so i also am like cut that person some slack i like being around it every once in a while like i call like the

but not hammered yeah not the not the black yeah the people that are enjoying themselves but then the person on a plane that is like you know yelling for the flight attendant to get a drink and it's like she's doing the safety announcement why are you we don't need to get you a scotch right now right we need to hear about what happens if this plane lands in water right you know this is not your moment but you know it's just for me it's not even a second thought anymore yeah so anything so the NFL so you're saying that they're they're paying i mean like that's good to hear man yeah no I think it's a priority for the league. I know it's a priority for the players, for the players union.

Are you, so would you say that you're proud as someone who is in recovery, proud of the way, like, the steps of the NFL is taking to, you know, acknowledge, I mean, like, it's no secret. The opium, I mean, like, 100,000 people died last year and we'll die again this year because of overdose. And, you know, like, I think historically people just assume in the NFL locker room, and they're just handing out opiates like skittles. Yeah.

No, that's definitely not the case. Right. I'm very proud of working at the NFL, the force for good that the NFL is one of the real unifying organizations in a country today that's bitterly divided, toxicly polarized. A lot of people have become really tribal, and the NFL is a place that, you know, has a big platform to do good, to bring people together. and I think I'm extremely proud of all the areas where the NFL is making a positive impact on society. Yeah. I'm proud of the impact that you're making on society. There's a lot of hope in this conversation. There's a lot of joy.

I have a lot of takeaway thoughts. And I just think, like for me, Tim, I, as I sit here and we kind of wrap up a little bit, I just think, like, I just want. you to be happy right and that's anyone that i know in my life like someone might listen to this episode and say like how is he not dated someone and you know like but like man fuck if you're happy like that's that's all truly what matters and i think guys like us believe that when it's supposed to happen it will if it's supposed to happen right yeah so i i you know thank you so much that's all i want for you and for every person in my life every person in recovery is is happiness

peace, freedom, the joys, the good things, the good times, the good moments, the good vibes. But I am happy. I am happy. I'm the happiest I've ever been in my life. If there's a special someone out there for me and then the next chapter or the chapter after that, I'm open to it. I'm around. I'm available. But as for right now, I'm good. anything else you feel like you want to say before we sign off or well just i guess i'd want to say that i'm very grateful to release um who's helping uh people that are important to me in my life right now and i'm sure will in the future and i feel like they're in good hands and i'm uh i'm grateful I'm grateful they are.

There are people that are very important to me that I love and that I want to see achieve the best. So, you know, I'm a fan. Amazing. Well, this is a really courageous step you just took. I know you've publicly shared your story so it wasn't the first time, but I feel really

honored to have the seat next to you and listen to you, share those special moments at the kitchen table with your mom and dad. I mean, I'll never forget that moment that picture you painted you know where your dad says just kind of like say it you know and that's a lot about for me like when i when i finally admitted that i was an alcoholic there was that moment where i was just like i just had to say it it's like that asking for help and then once i was able to do that everything kind of turned around but 42 years old dream job working for the

NFL director of human communications openly sober tim schlittner what an episode thank you so so so much for common man thanks for the invitation it was awesome great to talk to you really good thank you Thank you.