THEMOVE - Are Rival Teams Fed Up With Visma's Dominance? | La Vuelta a España 2026 Stage 17 | THEMOVE

Episode Date: September 9, 2026

Johan Bruyneel and Spencer Martin break down yet another Visma stage win, with Matthew Brennan getting his fifth stage win of this Vuelta, and seventh for Visma on Wednesday's Stage 17 at the Vuelta. They also discuss why tensions with rival teams seem to be boiling over, and preview Thursday's Stage 18 individual time trial, which will be key to deciding the overall at this Vuelta. Become a WEDŪ Member Today to Unlock VIP Access & Benefits: https://access.wedu.team Ultra Pouches: Ultra is the ultimate guilt-free pouch — delivering instant focus and mental clarity, without nicotine or caffeine. New customers can use code THEMOVE to get 15% off at https://TakeUltra.com. After you purchase, they will ask you where you heard about them. PLEASE support our show and tell them our show sent you. Eight Sleep: Use code THEMOVE at https://eightsleep.com/themove for up to $350 off. 30 days to try it at home. Free returns if it's not for you.

Brennan, Vizma, but mainly Matthew Brennan this time. You know, he did have Walt Von Arth in the final. Walt Walt was for some reason not able to do the last leadout, but it was not really necessary. But yeah, I mean, listen, stage win number five for him, stagement number seven for Visma. So they did finally break their record, right, of more than six stagements in the ground tour.

And Brennan is now also the solo record holder of five stage wins in their first grand tour participation. We talked about that yesterday, right? Yeah. I mean, yeah, there has to be the move of the day, right? Brennan, unbeatable.

Everybody, welcome back to the move podcast. I'm Spencer Martin. I'm here with Johann Berniel. We are breaking on stage 17 of the Vuelta, and previewing tomorrow's stage 18 time trial. Finally giving us a break from sprint stages, Johan. Today stage, you guessed it. Anyone that, anyone that listened to the show today probably knew we were confident this would happen and it did Matthew Brennan from team. Vizma Lisa Bike wins over Jordi Mayos and second with Magnus Court, kind of a surprising result there.

And third, the day saw not a lot of action. The TV coverage comes on. The Pelotons really like moving slow. Vizma's offering some pace. Then there seemed to be a bit of a protest and everyone sat up and said, Visma, we don't want to work with you because you're mean and you beat us in every sprint. So why are we going to help you? The gap went really far out,

like over six minutes, which we don't really see in modern cycling that much. But then people came forward and they started to work. Who would have guessed? And then at the intermediate sprint, Johan,

I don't know if you notice this, Brian Kakard out sprints while up and art, then kind of starts yelling at them. I think there's bad blood between those two teams. I think it goes back to Sunday. Whether that's merited or not

is kind of beside the point because it's now costing the money. It's like the mafia. It's like it costs me money now. You know, this feud, it's gotten out hand. Brian Kakard's stealing, stealing points from out Bernard. And then Visma, they really had to haul, they had to haul behind. Red Bull did their thing.

Their daily ritual, they all gather at the front. Red Bull splits the peloton. For what? We're not quite sure what. It doesn't really work. They sit up. Vizma comes forward. It has to burn a lot of resources to pull this breakway back.

And then Uno X, the cavalry comes to, the bail vizma out when they're out of riders they closed the breakaway down in the last couple of kilometers coming to the final k uno x on the front looks like they fixed their leadout problems they launch magnus court perfectly the problem is matthew brennan was behind him and smoked him in the sprint jordy may i thought this was his cleanest run at a sprint yet i thought he had it to be honest with you if you gave me a lie detector test 150 k 150 meters to go i'd say meus was going to win He's just not as fast as Brennan. And then court, pretty impressive there and third.

But Johan, eight sleep is sponsoring our move of the day. If you want to sleep like Taday Pagachar, get an eight sleep mattress topper. Go to eight sleep.com slash the move to get $350 off through the end of the vaulta, which is running out soon. But Johan, what was your eight sleep move of the day? A sleep move of the day, Spencer, Brennan, Vizma, but mainly Matthew Brennan this time. You know, he did have Walt Von Hart in the final. Walt Walt was for some reason not able to do the last leadout, but it was not really necessary.

But yeah, I mean, listen, stage win number five for him, stage win number seven for Visma. So they did finally break their record, right, of more than six stage wins in the grand tour. And Brennan is now also the solo record holder of five stage wins in their first grand tour. tour participation. We talked about that yesterday, right? Yeah. I mean, yeah, there has to be the move of the day, right? Brennan, unbeatable.

Again, Spencer, that's the only thing I, I mean, we've talked about it before. So Visma is down to six riders. They have to burn three of them before the leadout. But here they came again, man. you know X doing the lead out for Visma. Exactly the same thing. Even better actually.

They had four riders. It was the perfect lead out. It was the perfect. They did it perfect for Visma. So, but anyways, you know, you can also then ask yourself, what else can they do, right? The Yarneskort got third place. Not bad, right? The good result.

And you have to be realistic. Magnuskort is not going to beat Jordy Mills and Matthew Brennan in any sprint. you could say maybe if it's a bit more chaotic you could be lucky and win but but i think court prefers also to be led out and then be in a good position to start sprinting so uh it was perfect for for visma this lead out of uno x and yeah i mean it is really impressive vizma's down two riders and still happening uno x easy to clown on them because they keep leading out visma but as you say what are the other options this is as good as it was going to get they get maxed and his court, clean run at the line.

Remember last time we were in Seville? Seville. Seville. Do you remember who won, Johan? I do. Pavel Bittner. Beed Walt Von Art in a photo finish. Yes.

Shocking result. And so it shows you like, you know, you never know what's going to happen. Especially in the Volta. Take a guy to the line, see what happens. Third place is pretty good. What is with this Red Bull? What is going on with this?

Like every day now, they get to the front. They break it up. They kind of split it. And then they sit up. Like, why are they doing that? Again, you know, when it's nervous and when the, you go to the front with the team, he stay out of trouble. You know by now that you're not going to surprise any of the favorites.

I think Movistar was all around. And Rick Must today really perfectly. They kept him in a great position. Didn't spend too much energy or any energy almost. So you're not going to, you mean, maybe. Maybe you could surprise Felix Gall. I don't know. I didn't really check where he was.

When Red Bull went to the front, that could be one of the ideas behind, you know, accelerating, but still, it was still quite far to the finish. So, yeah, you know, you're going to come back. It's basically being, you know, cautious and staying out of trouble, in my opinion. Yeah. It starts to look, I mean, Pippa York was thinking, But I'm not even going to talk about it because what's going on here?

Commit or don't do it? Like, what are we doing? But, yeah, I mean, you know, I guess it's kind of psychological warfare too because then DeCathlon and Gaul are concerned about it. Maybe that takes energy out of their legs. Maybe Roglitch makes up a lot of time and the time trial tomorrow. And they look like geniuses. But let's take a quick break.

And then I have some questions for you on the stage, unless you have anything else on your mind, just spit off right now. Yeah. Let's take a break first. Okay, we'll be our back. Everybody, this episode is brought to by Ultra Pouches. With the Vuelta in its third week, let's take a little time to talk about our presenting sponsor

that made this all possible, ultra pouches. If you're someone who needs a coffee every couple hours just to feel normal, which I have during this WELTA, you know the tradeoffs, the racing heart, the crash, the wrecked sleep score. That's why I've been using Ultra Pouches. They're completely nicotine-free and caffeine-free as well. So you might ask, well, what's actually in them? Well, Ultra worked with neuroscientists to build around

clinically proven neutropics and adaptogens and the result is smooth, steady focus, and energy that lasts one to two hours with no crash and no withdrawal. You still get the pouch experience you like just without the nicotine. I keep them at my desk and when I sit down to work, I pop one in, better focus, better sleep, no jitters. They've got five flavors and the cool mint, that's going to quickly become your go-to, crisp, refreshing and exactly what you need every afternoon. Ultram is the ultimate guilt-free pouch.

instant focus and mental clarity without nicotine or caffeine. New customers get 15% off with code the move at take ultra.com. That's take ultra.com. Use code the move for 15% off. And when they ask where you heard about them, tell them we sent you. It does really help the show. So, Johan, we. Easy to call on.

Let's quickly. Quickly, quickly. Another thing I wanted to talk about, Spencer. So Brennan wins, Jordy Meals, second, Magnus scored, third. Romilly again up there. He's hanging around. Rastana points. And then fifth is the Scheutener from Lotto.

I don't know if you ever heard that name. 21 years old, young rider, fast. And now when I saw him today in the sprint and I thought back, when I mean, you know, 2020 was COVID year, right? It was the COVID year. I remember going to Belgium. So this is six years ago. Going to Belgium to watch a race which was organized by a friend of mine in Wallonia.

And I actually gave the trophy to the winner who was Stefan de Scheuittner. He was Belgian champion. He was Belgian champion cadets. Cadets. So I was 16 years old. And I remember he, I mean, it was, I mean, like, you could see the guy was huge compared to the guy. took off. I think it was a circuit, like three, four kilometers circuit. He doubled the whole

palaton by himself. So he took one lap of three kilometers on the whole palaton and then went again by himself. So we're now six years later. This guy is in top five in the Vuelta at 21 years old. That's crazy that he's only 21. But he's at some good result. Like, you know, GP Marseille, the opening race that, I guess traditional opening race. He got second in that this year behind Brian Kacard. He got 17th at Kernbrussell's current. I know like 17th. But that's a pretty good result for a 21-year-old.

Up there in all the classics, ninth at Skelta Price. I mean, yeah, he is a guy that you notice him in these stages, like fourth the first day of the tour of Belgium. Yeah. I mean, Lano Intermerchre does have a lot of talented writers. But then they get third yesterday. Well, they do have, yeah, Vito Brat was third yesterday.

They do have a really good, you know, development program. The under 23 team of Lotto, they have really good riders. The problem they have is that the really, really good ones are also really in demand with other teams. And they struggle to keep the big talents. Because the professional team right now, I think, is struggling. You know, they, let's say, you know, if you're a big talent and you get all, offers from, let's say, Sudal or who else, Bahrain, you know, some of these teams or Deccatlan, they're going to go there because Lotto Intermarche right now is not the trendy team, you know?

And so, yeah, they're struggling with that. But, yeah, they have a lot of good young riders. Yes. And what did you think about this stage? So this was an unabridged stage, 185 kilometers. How did this compare, in your opinion, to the abridged stage we had on Sunday, taken down to 110? Well, I think it was hot again. It was less hot, though.

I did speak to somebody who was there on the spot. Yeah, it's kind of not that hot. Yeah, I spoke to somebody who's there commentating for TV. And he said, you know, it's hot, but it's not extremely hot today. The temperatures went down a bit, which is also, I mean, I think it's kind of the case in the whole Spain. Today, for example, here in Madrid also, it was also the days before, 34, 35, 36 degrees. Today was 27, 28. So, yeah, I mean, I think, I think, I think today was good, but apparently tomorrow it's going to be hot again.

I thought just from an entertainment product flies here, annoyingly. I had to buy an electric fly swatter because I'm having fly problems too. And that's my personality now is chasing these flies. It's all I think about. But I thought this like entertainment product wise, you couldn't be more different than Sunday and today. This was an ad basically for why maybe they should explore short and shortened stages at some points because why we needed three hours of slow riding through the middle of nowhere, a little unclear to me, especially when this was a loop. But Johan, easy, easy to clown on cycling. I don't know if you paid attention to this.

So the U.S. Open, big tennis tournament. An American beats Carlos Carlito Alcoraz last time. This is huge, huge. Like the biggest moment for American men's tennis in a long time. I might have said soccer. I'm at tennis. Huge. Happened at 4 a.m.

Like, what are we doing here? Why did that happen? So cycling, not the worst run sport in the world because tennis, you're on that spot. Also, right. 4 a.m. 4 a.m. where? Local time. It was in New York City. Finishes at 4 a.m. in New York City. What are you doing?

Are you kidding me? No. And they started it at midnight. Like, why? Why? Yeah. Okay. Wow. Crazy. Apparently they do four, they do four matches on the same court. And they all went maximum time. But still, you got to see that coming.

Like, you know, nobody, nobody saw this game, this match because it's the middle of the night. It's like a massive moment for U.S. tennis. But I don't know right after we recorded yesterday, did you see what happened? We were talking about a potential Saudi takeover of ASO. Did you see what happened with Liv, Golf, the PIF? I did not. No, I did not. So they pulled out and declared bankruptcy and all these golfers, you know, these guys like stuck their neck out to leave the PGA tour and go over to the PIF, the Saudi investment fund backed venture.

They all got stiffed. Like, you're not getting paid. Like that, I think that's probably going to kill any, like any breakaway because it's too risky now. Yeah. Everyone's going to point to this and be like, uh, like, I don't know. Maybe I won't do that because I don't want to have two years of my contract, just avoided because PIF decides they don't want to spend any money.

Also, UCI and ASO are going to be, they're going to be saying, okay, that's great news for us. It is huge news for them. It also shows that there might not be an appetite from. Saudi to invest in big, big, big sports projects at the moment that don't turn a profit. What do you think is going on with Kofidis and Visma? Nothing. Nothing. Why did Kovarh sprint for those points?

He did. I mean, he sprinted for the points. I think he's still in the running for, is he still running for second place? And I think, I think, I think, I think, I think he's in fourth place. He's over 100 points behind second place. Okay. But he's close to Romilly, no? I mean, he's 50 points.

behind Romolet. So he does need points to get close to him. He's not going to get he's not going to he's not going to because he was not top five today. Was he top 10? Was he even top 10? He was 10th. Okay. It's a little weird. I mean, since when his third place in the points classification, a thing that no one fights for.

But also, I mean, listen, it's his right to sprint. And I don't think Van Arte, I don't think they were shouting at each other, especially. I think there was just, you know. I don't think it's very difficult to get Bernard angry. He definitely was explaining. If they were not shouting, there was some complex theory he was explaining to him. He was explaining why he's printed.

Which I would love to know why. So wow, like you got to imagine if you get sick and Matthew gets sick and Romolae gets lost, I'm winning the points. I mean, it could be something like that, I guess. Yeah,

because he is close to Jordy May. you know so if if you imagine the top three guys are out of the race and you left those points on the table maybe it'd feel silly i mean is is it for prize money could be could it could be honestly like was that 1500 or something i don't know put that in kitty how much i mean yeah i don't know i mean if it was let's say it's 3 000 euros it's not like you know it's not nothing Yeah. Especially if you're, you know, you got to go back and face the bottom, like the bottom line people, the people that do all the work. And you're like, hey, how's the price?

It's better to have them than to not have them, right? True. Did probably hurt his sprint, though, in the end. Then he gets 10th. And then he's going backwards in the green. But anything else on the day before we take off. Sorry, not take off. Go preview.

No, not really. Okay. So we'll be right back to preview tomorrow's time trial. which is super important. Okay, Johan, we are back previewing tomorrow's stage 18. We finally leave our bunch of bunch fronts behind us. We're switching gears. Time trial, 32 kilometer long, pretty flat individual time trial, like 214 meters of elevation gain, I believe. It's also funny these time trials, you think they're super short. You're like 32K, what, that's going to be 45 minutes. And then you go and ride them, you're like, that's kind of a long ride. That's a harder course than I

thought it was. But for these guys, they're going to be ripping through this thing. There's two time checks, no categorized climbs, just some hills, pretty untechnical course, you could say, which goes from town to town through the countryside, and is going to be key, key for the G.C. Because we have Enric Mas leading. We have, in second, we have, I don't know why I'm blanking in his name, Phyllis Gall in second. He is 204, 206 back. Primus Roglitch, 210 back. Best time trial is in this bunch. Carapaz and fourth at 424. Oscar Anley and fifth at 544.

Jacob Ormazel, 6th at 614. I guess him Mattis Scalmos. We got to mention him because he had such a good time trial at the tour. He's 7th at 649. So that time he took the other day and the breakaway could actually come into play if he has another good time trial. But how do you think this time trial is going to play out? And who do you think is going to win?

And if you don't want to pick one, like who are the time? top contenders for it. Yeah. There's not many prior time trials specialists, or at least there's not many left. In theory, you would say historically, I mean, okay, Primos Roglitz, let's not forget, ex-Olympic champion time trial. It's been a while since he's been winning time trials. He's been always top 10, but never really close to winning. You would say, Stefan Kuhn has the best Paul Maris in time trials, I think, from all the guys who are here. He's a pure specialist. He's been invisible the whole race.

I didn't even remember. I don't even know that he was still in the race. Could be a good thing, right? He's here just for this. Comes back from a very difficult season. You know, he did win the time trial in Tour of Poland. Yep. So that means something.

And then we have also. Ethan Hater. In good shape, it was very close. It was very close in Monaco. Has been showing some good form on specific days.

It's known to be a good time trial list. As far as I know, still writing for a contract. That could be, you know, like if he wins the time trial tomorrow, that we could be huge for him. I think the two other guys are Primoz Roglidge. Let's not count him out. And then Walt Van Art, Walt Van Art is, you know, has won time trials, even in the Tour de France. Lately, I don't think he has shown that he has been close to time trials, winning time trials, although I think he was top five in Monaco, right?

He was eight in Monaco. Oh, he was less than 10 seconds behind Pagachar. Okay, yeah. Definitely, I mean, listen, Walt Von Ard definitely has amazing legs. of the whole bunch I think he probably has the best legs except maybe Enrique Mas. So I'm going to

go either Stefan Kuhn or Ethan Hater specifically also because these guys have been prepping for this saving themselves. You know, Roglidge has been going hard in the mountain stages and Walt Vonart has been going hard every stage basically. Even today

in the lead. out and stuff. So either Stefan Kung or Ethan Hatcher. What do you think? Yeah, I mean, those are good picks. We should almost like reverse picks. People that you're going to hear their names and are very good, I don't think we'll win. Like even Romeo. A number one is Finn Fisher Black. That would be the obvious dark horse. Like, this guy's going to win. He's strong. Good time trials. He isn't really win a lot of European time trials. That's a red fly to me. Ivan Romeo, another guy he'd think wow he could win he's uh he's won two time trials is a under 23 and a junior doesn't win a lot of senior time trials he was four seconds behind kung at poland but as you mentioned in the

pre-show moby star should not have him ride all out tomorrow because they're going to need him in the next few days i think they have to i mean i don't know if they're going to do it or not but they have to specifically tell him he cannot go full gas because they need him on stage 19 and 20 He's a strong rider. It's critical that they have the majority of their team as fresh as possible. Romeo is one of them. It's one of those cases where I think you have to tell a young ambitious rider because I'm sure Romeo would love to do a good performance.

But you know what? I mean, fourth or fifth or sixth in the tantral is not really something that Movistar needs right now. They just need to save as much possible energy tomorrow. There's only one guy on Movistar who was allowed to go full gas tomorrow. That's Enric Maas. Everybody else needs to take it easy. If Movistar won this Welta would, when would the, would this would be the biggest victory in team history since what?

Like, when's the last time they won a grand tour? Naira Quintana. What grand tour was that? Was it like one, he won the Vuelta and the Giro. It's not that long ago. A long time ago, though. It's like 10 years ago. Is it?

Is it 10 years ago? I don't think he's won a grand tour in a decade. Let me check, though. Because this is big, my point being that this is like huge for them. They cannot mess around with this. Yeah, he won the Vuelta 10 years ago and he won the Gero 12 years ago. It's been a minute since that team has won a grand tour. Yeah.

10 and 12 years ago. It's so crazy that Nairo canton is still racing for Malbe Star. Well, he's about to do his last race ever as the world championships. Okay. Yeah. And he was, you know, he was hoping to be selected for this race, but finally didn't make the selection. We'll see. We'll see if that's probably the right choice.

But he's another example of you stop being competitive for grand tours, but you just keep racing for seemingly ever. I think Stefan Kuhn, I think if you're going to pick someone to win this, pick someone who wins time trials, number one. The guys who win time trials tend to win time trials because it's not just about your engine or your ability to time trial. Like Stefan Kuhn spends a million dollars a year probably on time trial preparation. Like he's got a six figure cockpit that's 3D printed all this time in the wind tunnel, all the time on the skin suits. You don't just roll out of bed and be like, I'm going to win a time trial today. Like Larry Warbo has tried to win the U.S. time trial champs and he talked about how hard it was to go from not really competing in time trials to try to to win one. Like, there's a lot to do. And it's hard to make up that ground. So Stefan Kuhn,

everything's up. When was Larry Warbos ever a time trialist? Well, I think, like, is like a young pro, you know, like when, like is a probably a U-23. I bet he was a very good time trialist. But then you stop working on it, right? Because if you're not going to win a time trial, what's the point? And so usually the guys that are dialed have their setup dialed, like they're at such an advantage. So Stefan Kung would be number one. and Hater, like he just won the European, he's not European. He just won the UK national champs on a 38 kilometer long course and crushed everybody. And obviously he was really good on stage one.

He's got a really good setup. I would think he's a good pick. I would pick Coon. I would say Hater second. My wild card would be not Woutvinard and watch Wattvinard win now. Bruno Amaral. What do you think about him on Visma? Yeah.

Really good time to us. Yeah, he's a good time. time trialist has to have to do a lot of work though already. Yeah. Compared to these two other guys, I mean, Bruno Amiral has been pulling like crazy. Is that good? Or not?

Well, it's, I mean, it's not good so close to the time trial. You know, it's, it's empty. You know, he's still going to be good, but it's not, you know, you don't train in a ground tour. You know, you just, you just try to stay where you are condition-wise. So I think, I mean, it's going to be good time probably. I think he's going to lack that little bit of freshness that Coom and Hater have. I mean, with Kung, we don't know.

You know, we don't know. I mean, he's been invisible. Is it because he just doesn't have the shape? Has he been struggling? You know, he hasn't gone in any breakaways either. So I don't know. That is a little weird that you mention it. Like Ethan Hater's been really active, you know?

Yeah. And then Kung, why no breakaways at all? I'll pick Ethan Hater, actually. I think that's a good pick, actually. Yeah. You know, wow, there aren't better time trials than you think, actually. So you look at his results, he finished third at the Olympics in Paris in the time trial. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Ultra special specialist, Ben. He got third at the time trial at the 2024, Volta. Yeah, I don't think he'll win, though. I'm because he's been doing a lot of work too and this is not his special he does he does have incredibly incredible incredible legs though it's well that would be the case for him to win right he just goes out and crushes everybody with the legs yeah yeah let's not let's not count him out i i i mean i listen i would i would hope he wins i mean if there's you know he just want this guy to win races you know he's been so unlucky so many times would be it would be great for his

I mean, and for his, for his confidence and his motivation for the world championships, you know? Do you know the last time trial he won? Individual about team. Was it in through the France? No. Well, he won the, you know, I guess he wasn't on that team. It was 2023 Belgian national championships. Okay.

Okay. I'd forgotten about that. That is a while ago, though. You know, you're talking about winning time trials. I mean, I would love if he won. I just, the more I think about it, the more Ethan Hater seems like, I think you pick Ethan Hater, I'll pick Stefan Kuhn. I think it's probably one of those two guys. But Ethan Hater would be who, and then in terms of G.C, I don't think any of the G.C. guys are going to win.

I think maybe a prime Primos Raghlich wins this, but we're not seeing prime primos right now. Time trialing's the first thing to go and to show. What do you think that G.C. looks like after tomorrow's time trial? Enric Mas, second, Primus Roglich, third. Roglich and Felix Gall switch places tomorrow. Okay. Yes. For sure.

And how far back is Roglitch on Maas? I think Enric Maas is going to be, I think tomorrow Enric Maas loses a minute, not more. So, yeah, let's say Maas first, Roglich 110 and second. Less than a minute. Less than a minute. Okay. Let's just say 120 in second. Gall could be he could be a minute behind Roglinson third right oh yeah like it maybe more but then

he's kind of safe because I'm just going to read to you fourth fifth and sixth carapaz onli or mazel and he has a two and a half minute gap on carapaz okay let's let's have a look there how much does carapas have on on he's a only minute 20 on only Okay, that should be enough. Yeah. Carapas is not a great time trialist, but Only's good, but, you know, I don't think only... The thing is, Anli's team has a way faster setup than EF.

That's the only thing that could swing that in my opinion. By the way, by the way, Spencer, just as a side note, you know, I think at the beginning of this Vuelta, I said that Carapas was moving teams, right? I think. Did I say that? You didn't say what team? I'm not going to say.

I'm not going to say. I said it's it's there's a rumor. You did say that though. Yes. Yeah, likely. And then I saw some journalists saying, you know, that's not true. You know, I have information that, you know, he has a contract. I'm going to say today.

I'm not going to say the team. I'm going to say that Carapas is not on EF next year. Here, you heard it first here. I think you're, I read these articles refuting you and they did not convince me. I was not convinced by the arguments. They're going to retract that. Yeah, I think he's on the move as well. There's one particular journalist specialist with a lot of information apparently.

Well, he's going to, he's going to eat his words. One of the reasons that I believe your. right so strongly is care the money carapaz is on and even the money that they would demand for a transfer fee is not a lot just think of riders that when it's not even that's not even that's not even the case spencer it's not even the case it's it's it's financial problems at ef huge budget cut at the idf and they're not able to pay what carapas has signed for well then that's that's answering your prayers right because you get to sell them you get a little cash you don't have to pay them and then i don't think they're going to be able to sell them you know if they if

they if they can't pay what they what what carapas has signed then there's no deal the contract is void they could have until you said that now they can't yeah no i've heard the same thing it's uh complicated situation over there at ef financially for next year because yeah we know we'll get into it it in the off season. But yeah, I think you're right. I think he's on the move. Do you want to guess what team he's going to?

Or can you not say? I know which team he's going to go, but I'm not saying it. Okay. All right. Well, that will give us plenty to talk about in the off season.

Yeah. I mean, yeah. So the other big question, what do you think happens in this white jersey race? Onley is 30 seconds over Ormzel. Ormzel? Ormizel.

Yeah. Man, I loved what Omersel was doing the other day, man. I mean, it's like huge performance. Also didn't lose almost no time to these favorites. I know. I know. I'd like that I haven't checked, but I think, I think that Omersel actually, to Oscar only,

didn't lose any time. And he was out there for a long time in front, you know? Yeah, they finished in the same group on the 50 years ago, the last time we had a mountain stage. They were on the same time, I believe. Yeah, that's what that was on up on there. But, you know, the stage he won on Calar Alto. Omersel was in a breakaway.

Okay, didn't have to do a lot of work because he had, you know, he had Peio Bilbao doing a lot of work. And then we travel also, I think. Yeah, he did roast everybody. I mean, it put out a lot of power when he attacked. Yeah. But, yeah, it was a great performance. Didn't lose almost no time on the favorites. So that's still a battle.

It's still a battle. tomorrow is going to be interesting. I think they're both pretty good at time for all. It's going to be really interesting. I mean, tight, tight race for that. It's actually it's a return to the, like the platonic ideal of the white jersey, right? Because you have the GC over here and it's old guys, old AF. And then you have a white jersey competition going on almost completely separate from that.

And it is two riders that you would be looking forward to. few years. And one of them being extremely young and you're thinking, man, if he can pull off this, what's he capable of? It's like actually what the white jersey is intended for and why we probably need to lower the age of the white jersey going forward. Because this is exciting and it'd be fun if we had this at other grand tours. Yeah. All right, Johan, anything else? No, I think we've covered everything that was going on, not much going on today. So yeah, and tomorrow it's a time trial. also there's not a lot to talk about in terms of what happens in the race, no strategies, no tactics, but I'm sure we'll have plenty of talking points about tomorrow and then

whatever it's going to come in the next three days. Oh, you didn't remind me. So I guess one of the directors at Vizma now has to do something humiliating. This was from Brennan said this in his interview, has to do something at dinner tonight. And then we'll all see it on social media, he said. So we'll have that to talk about tomorrow. I did not know. I mean, who are the directors?

Let's see. And I. Franz Masson is one. Franz Marsan is one. Let's see. So, Vismar, Franz Masson and Martin Weissan. It's probably going to be Franz Masson. He's from my generation, man.

Poor guy. He's 60s. I got to say, though, would you take that? I think I would take that as a director. Give me seven stage wins in a grand tour. It depends what it is. I would do almost anything. You don't want to be sitting there stage 17 and you haven't won a stage.

That's the true humanization. Hey, seven stages, man. That's pretty good. Whatever the guys want you to do. Okay. Well, let's see how he shows up tomorrow. Yeah. Well, we'll be back tomorrow to talk about this time trial.

It's going to be pretty interesting to watch. and then we'll preview the Big Mountain Stage on Friday as well. Talk to you later. Okay. Thanks, Spencer. Okay, bye.