THEMOVE - The Best Pogačar Ever? | Tour de Suisse Review | THEMOVE

Episode Date: June 22, 2026

Johan Bruyneel and Spencer Martin break down Tadej Pogačar's dominant overall win at the Tour de Suisse and what his back-to-back wins to close out the race tell us about his form, and whether we're watching the best version of Pogačar. They also go over what to make of the rest of the field, including Mathieu van der Poel's incredible TT ride, Mathias Vacek's breakout GC performance, and a quick take on Quinn Simmons' ride to win the US National Championships. Become a WEDŪ Member Today to Unlock VIP Access & Benefits: https://access.wedu.team Cheers: Take Cheers Restore after your last drink or before going to bed and wake up feeling at least 50% better — or your money back. For a limited time our listeners are getting 20% off their entire order at https://CheersHealth.com/THEMOVE  #Cheers #ad Shopify: Start your business today with the industry's best business partner, Shopify, and start hearing  SFX Sign up for your one-dollar-per-month trial today at https://shopify.com/themove Even Realities: To learn more about Even G2, go to https://evenrealities.com and see how everyday smart glasses keep helpful information in sight, so you can stay productive and hands-free throughout the day. And for our listeners, use promo code movepod at https://evenrealities.com to get 10% off Even Ring 1 and/or Even Clip when you add them to your Even G2 order HexClad: Don't go through another summer with cookware that makes every meal harder than it needs to be. For a limited time only our listeners get 10% off your order with our exclusive link. Just head to https://hexclad.com/THEMOVE. Support our show and check them out. Make sure to let them know we sent you! NOCD: If you're struggling with OCD or unrelenting intrusive thoughts, NOCD can help. Book a free 15-minute call to get started: https://NOCD.com Odoo: Stop paying for missing pieces. Go to https://Odoo.com Sheath Underwear: Sheath. The underwear of legends. Go to https://www.sheath.com/THEMOVE and use code THEMOVE for 20% off. NordVPN: EXCLUSIVE NordVPN Deal ➼ https://nordvpn.com/THEMOVE Try it risk-free now with a 30-day money-back guarantee  

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Thanks to Sheath for sponsoring this episode. What I take away from it, Spencer, it's not the numbers. It's what I've seen. And especially what Pogacar has said. He said, I'm better than last year. That's what I take away from it. And I think he is better. We've said it already a number of times, but I do think he's better than last year.

So everybody's going to have to step up their game for the tour. Everybody, welcome back to The Move. I'm Spencer Martin. I'm here with Johan Bernier. We are breaking down the final weekend of the tour de Swiss Tade Pagachar, continuing to dismantle his competition with Richard Carapest. coming in second six minutes and 32 seconds down after five stages of race in johan meaning he put more than a minute into his competition every stage matthias fidez fechek in third at six fifty three back

tobias fos and fourth at seven thirty four Elon van wilder in fifth seven fifty one down we'll also go into a few other races like tour of belgium tour slovenia and the national championship results with queen simmons dominating in the u.s men's race johan before we get into that how are you doing how's your drive back from northern spain when we last spoke to you yeah good good i mean better internet connection that's for sure uh you know last time we spoke we you could nobody could see me with the the the internet connection where i was was i liked it i like the challenging conditions but but yeah good good good i had uh four days of uh great uh see great racing supporting my son at Vuelta Vesaya,

met up with a few friends from the past. So, yeah, it was a good four days over there. Yeah, and it's a high-level race, and I'm jealous. It's actually that, I've been thinking about that race a lot. You said there's 180 starters in a junior stage race, which would be, I don't know if there's a single race for kids of that, people of that age in the U.S. where you would do that,

which shows you why you don't see a lot of great, American riders taking over the sport, apparently. No, it was good. It's the hardest stage rates in Spain, apparently. It was,

I mean, high level, you know, really all the best riders of Spain, plus a few, Amsoudal, Quickstep was there with a team. They won three stages,

I think. I think they, no, two stages they won. And they were on the podium. So Benjamin Neval, Jr., won, a son of ex-U.S. Postal writer,

Jim in Noval, who is miles ahead of everybody else. It's not even a competition. He just does whatever he wants. I think he won with over five minutes on the second rider. Yeah, that was a really hard climb. The last stage, I think, about seven, eight kilometers at nine percent, apparently, which is very unusual for junior racing. You know, I mean, that's not what they used to do.

And also racing four days in a row is also something that they're not usually doing. So it was a good race, it's a good race very well organized. I mean, the best organized race I've seen so far in Spain. So it was nice to see. Is it kind of funny to you? I don't have an answer for this, which means I probably shouldn't ask the question, that children can become so much better than their parents.

It's like similar and then they're just at a level that is so far ahead of their parent. Kind of like Bradley Wiggins. Like, how does this happen? I'm not a geneticist, so I don't understand it, I guess. Yeah, I mean, first of all, I think it goes, I mean, DNA is obviously an issue, you know, genetics. But I mean, I don't know. I mean, there's kids who had famous cycling parents who have never been.

I mean, first name that comes up to me is, for example, Axelmerch, right? I mean, how messed up it is to be the son of Eddie Merck's and wanting to be a cyclist. That's not very good. But he had a good career in his own. But, you know, if you look at, for example, Benjamin Noval, he is going to be way better. Yeah. I mean, I don't know the answer either. I mean, I hope my son gets better than me.

That would be great. I wish for that. But we'll see. I would take your career in a second. I don't think I need to be better than Johan Vernal. A couple tour stage wins. I'm good. But yeah, it is fascinating.

You see it in the NBA a lot, actually. A lot of guys. I mean, Axel, though, was a big, he was kind of a big talent. He was very talented rider. You see in the NBA, a lot of guys come in and they're quite a bit better than their fathers. I don't really understand what's going on there. So we're going to have someone on to break this down for us. But speaking of people that are better than their parents at riding a bike,

Teddy Pagacchar dominates the tour of Switzerland. Only five stages this year. So I was on the ground for some of it. What I could glean from, obviously, you're saving some money if you're doing five stages versus eight. But kind of the messaging from the organizers were that this allows riders to stay at altitude longer, come down for five days of racing, and even maybe stay at altitude during the race because you're in Switzerland. You can strategically pick hotels and then get back up to altitude before the tour de France. It kind of seemed to be it was almost like they've embraced their position as a tour de France training camp. And we saw guys like Pagachar and Vanderpull almost treating it like a training camp.

We talked about stage one through three where Pagachar wins stage one in super impressive fashion. I'm still in shock about that. Basically wins the overall on stage one. It gets a multi-minute lead. Stage two won by Roman Gregor from the breakaway with Bogotcha almost winning. Pulling Matais Fijek there who ended up finishing third. Stage three was Jonathan Narvae on UAE. So UAE ends up winning because Bagua wins stage four and five.

They win four out of the five stages. Stage four is a time trial. 23K long won by Pagachar by 0.3 of a second ahead of Matthew Vanderpull who Johan I don't think we mentioned one time in our no in our guesses about who would win that stage and then stage five was a tough mountain stage really tough mountain stage one by pagachar and he he had to mow down Lenny Martinez who we saw stay with and beat Jonas Vindigard earlier this year at peri knee so he's not he's no panakukin and daddy pulled two minutes back on him finished about two

minutes in front of the rest of the GC group. Pretty impressive performance over this final weekend. But yeah, let's just start with. How surprised were you with Matthew Vanderpull in that time trial? I did not. Actually, you know what? I mean, we shouldn't be surprised because it's Matthew Vanderpul. If he puts his, you know, his missions on something, he can always do really well.

There were not a lot of time trial specialists. But, man, that was close. 3,100th of a second. Yeah, I did not see that coming, honestly, especially also because I mean, and this is just a guess, right? I mean, I don't think Machiavonr-Rour Poole has focused a lot on time trailing, time trial position, wind tunnel testing, specific training for time trials. He just did, you know, an intense, super intense training block there in that time trial and almost won it. I would have loved it to see him win. But also, you know, seeing Pogacar winning that time trial,

I think it's just another confirmation of how good he is. Yeah, we said, we talked about Kavanaia. Kavanaugh actually DNFed the day before when we spoke. So he didn't even do the time trial. So many guys DNFed out of this race, like just quietly DNFed out. Yeah. But yeah, I mean, as you say, Spencer, it was already, I mean, if it was not sure before the race, who would win the tour of Switzerland, it was definitely, we definitely knew after stage one who would win the tour of Switzerland, especially knowing that the hardest stage was the last one. And then that last stage was just incredible.

I think once again, he went, I'm not going to say without trying, but without it being a goal, because I think was it. Deccatlon who was starting to pull for Matthew Riccatello. Yeah. And then there was one last guy who did this pull and Rickettello was not on the wheel anymore. And Pogaccia was on his wheel. Or was it another UAE guy? It was probably another UAE guy.

It was on the wheel. And then he just took over and left with eight and a half kilometers to go. Basically the entire final climb. It was like a nine kilometer climb. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And that effort was was impressive.

You know, if you look, I've seen some data somewhere. It's not a super steep climb. I would think it's not like 10% or anything. I think it's eight and a half, eight, eight and a half percent average. And he had 1,940 meters of VAM. That's crazy. VAM is the speed per hour, the climbing speed per hour. A climb like that is not ideal for, to have a high. M. So, so that's impressive. I also read somewhere another calculation, 27 minutes,

it was close to 7 watts per kilo. I saw a calculation that it was 7.2 watts per kilo. Yeah. I thought that's pretty high. Not for 20 minutes. I think that section was 3.6 kilometers at 7.1 watts per kilo. But what I take away from it, Spencer, is not the numbers. It's the, it's what I've seen. And especially what Bogachar has said. He said, I'm better than last year. That's what I take away from it. And I think he is better. We've said it already a number of times,

but I do think he's better than last year. So everybody's going to have to step up their game for the tour. Let's take a quick. That's a great place to take a break. Let's take a quick break. I got a question, a quick rebuttal on that when we get back. Everybody, this episode is brought you by Shopify. The move is a podcast, obviously, but what a lot of people don't know is that we have a merch store with clothing and accessories.

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That's NordvPN.com slash the move. So, Johan, I, yes, you're right. He looks great. He's probably better than last year. But is he better than last year? Would be my question. Because do we remember the dofinae last year when he did have a subpart time trial? So technically, yes, he's better.

But stage six of the dophine, how quick are we to forget? That was one of the more impressive performance as I've ever seen. I mean, it was to comb blue. That's the climb, right? That kind of tore to Mijev. I mean, I still don't know if this is correct, but I had him near like 490 watts for 20 minutes, which would be 7.5 watts per kilo.

And then he is good the next day. I don't actually don't think, no, then he won the next day, drop Jonas Venegard again, and then someone else won the final stage. Maybe it was Lenny Martinez, actually. Lenny Martinez, good rider. Someone should sign that guy. He's always there.

But technically, I mean, I don't actually know if he is better than last year. He looks good. Well, I mean, last year we knew he was amazing because he did these performances and he did it against his biggest rival. Yeah. Now, we don't know, right? But the way, I mean, a guy like Carapas, for example, he tried yesterday. I think he lost it's 50 meters on the wheel.

and then just rode away two minutes from him in 22 minutes wrote away two minutes from him that's crazy it's crazy you know so uh i think he's pretty good man i think he's pretty good well carapaz in the final weekend also that shows you why carapaz is who he is heads up rider takes two minutes on everybody else on the first day in the final weekend he lost like three and a half minutes to pagachar in two stages you know in finish a second, which is really impressive. Matais

Vajek really, he gained a lot of time on Carapaz in the final weekend, finish his third. 3.53 back. I think this is the best I've seen him ever climb, Vajek. Yes. That was a hard stage. Did a great time trial.

Was able to stay with Pogatja, no, on that stage that Romang Gregor won. Stage three, yeah. And yesterday, did a great last climb. did a great last climb yesterday. So yeah, I mean, that's an amazing performance.

To be in third place for Vajek on the Dura, Switzerland. I mean, he's not your typical rider you would think of that gets over those climbs and stays up there in G.C. So he must be on great form. He's 75 kilos or he's listed at that. So that's true. His power meter might be breaking. The numbers required to do that are somewhat staggering.

What's funny is another guy we didn't mention. at all is Tobias Foss, former time trial world champion, almost wins. Like he had the fastest time by far. He was taking tons of time back on Pagacchar in the second half of the time trial, finishes six seconds back on the stage, doesn't win.

But that, I guess that shows you. I mean, what do we make of that? Why was Pagatja losing so much time in the backup at the time trials? It's just that he's not as good as he is. He's not a pure time trialist. And a true pure time trialist will take time on a faster part of the

course. Did he so, but did he, did he lose time on Foss and on nobody and not on the rest though? Just on Foss. I don't know if it was just on Fuss. Let me let me look at my. Yeah. Well, Foss. Foss is a Dan Browse specialist, although we have as a world champion. So, yeah. Well, we haven't seen anything since that world championships, which was, you know, a surprise title, I would say. Uh, but still, you know, he's a great writer. Um, he also went tour to Lavinier, which I didn't know until I looked at a he went through the avenue, yeah. Which would explain why he can get forth at a tour of Switzerland.

So Pagacho last time to Tim Welland's Vanderpull and Foss in the back half of the course, which was fast like 56k an hour. Okay. Yeah. But if we're going to. Listen, I mean, it doesn't really have to worry. I mean, he did a great. He won the time trial, first of all.

If he wouldn't have won it, you know, nobody. I mean, he's always, Bogacha's always going to be within 10, 15 seconds of everybody else in any time trial unless it's like a pure specialist time trial of completely flat. So Bogacha doesn't have to worry about the time trailing in, in stage races at all, I think. I'd give Remko's here.

How much time does he take on Pagatjar? 15 seconds? Yeah, 15, 20 seconds max. Yeah. And then he gets that back easy. Um, any, and did anything else stick out for me at that time trial? I, I just couldn't. I was at the finish line with my son and he kept asking like, is that the, like, was, did you expect that? Like, no. I had not expect to see a photo finish between Vanderpull and Pagos and it was close. That was close. I mean, and then the other takeaway of the time trial is Matthew Vanderpoole sitting in the hot seat without his shirt on and then getting fined by the UCI for, what is it? Breaking the protocol or whatever it was. The nipple protocol. whatever. It was hot, no? It was super hot. Dude, it was so hot. And I guarantee you he was in an un-air-conditioned tent or room. It actually shows you how BS the UCI is at times. Because

they are based in Switzerland. They're in a probably nice air-conditioned building. Like it was probably 36, 37 degrees. It was close to 100 degrees Fahrenheit. And he's out there in an un-air-conditioned little room of course he's like of course he's going to take his shirt off i thought they should have found him maybe they found him for taking his socks off that was a little lewd he's got puppies on tv up there that's that's that's wild man behavior i thought they could probably could have let that slide matthew doesn't care about that you got 500 francs fine right i thought he should have sat in the river there was this beautiful cold river just they should have had him sitting in there for the hot seat while everybody else raised

It was definitely a real hot seat then. Yes, it was, it lived up to its name. I mean, it just shows you, A, how talented he is. I think you said it over text that two most talented riders in the sport, get first and second by less than a second. Like, kind of makes sense when you say it like that. But it's, he was real, like, he was carving the turns so wide, like taking every inch of road. If you want to go fast, watch Vanderpoles Tintrault performance. It was a clinic.

But he's just not normally doing that. But why do you think he decided today was the day he was just going to turn into a time trialist? Well, I think, you know, he obviously was there with, you know, with the hope that he could win a stage. I think he was counting on stage one, maybe, and then definitely stage two and three. Yeah. And he didn't. So, you know, then let's do the next best thing. Try to win a TT.

It's so impressive. It's, yeah. Yeah. I almost can't say enough about it. was shocked. There are not many riders, Johan, that can say, well, that race didn't work out for me. Let me just try to win this time. We got a time trial coming up, right?

I'll try to win that one. I'm not a time trial specialist, but I think I could do it. Just incredibly, incredibly unique. And then stage five, some stats for this thing. This is really hard stage. It started up a climb, basically. So 4K at 9% was the first 4K of the race. And then they descend down and they just keep.

And that was the tippy top of the climb. They just keep doing it over and over. So it's the Cold de la Croix, 19% at, I guess the Croix, not the Croix, the Croix. Coldra, Coldra, Croix. I had it right. So 19K at 7%. And they just do that over and over. And they just go up to send down.

What they do? Three times or four times? They technically did it four times. But they did a half. The first and last time were a half. the different halves of it, you know? Okay. So they started and finished in the same spot,

but it was halfway up to climb. Okay, great. Even the halves are not easy. So it's 19K long climb. By the time they're doing the fourth climb of the day, it's a 9K long climb up to the where they started the stage. It's that's not, that's like true mountain test because you're never getting a rest.

Just up down, up down, up down. And for someone like Vachachuk to be there is really, really impressive. But it was kind of the, the Pagotcha show. Lenny Martinez was trying to pull off some of the Lenny Martinez magic. I saw that break and, you know, I was like, I don't like, this is impressive, but I don't think these guys are going to stay away. Like, why are they even bothering to do this? They're not going to stay away from them. Yeah, Lenny Martinez stage eight of the dofine last year won the mountain stage out of a breakaway.

So he apparently knows what he's doing. And he almost wins this thing, stays away. They had about, It was like a one, it was a 155 gap. By the time Pagacier finished his attack at the bottom of the final climb, it was 125. So he took 30 seconds out of Martinez with his attack. And it's still, I mean, uh, uh, Pippa York on the commentary, I believe with like five kid, he was like, yeah, he's, he's, he got, he gotcha's going to catch him. He doesn't stand a chance.

I, I didn't think it was a sure thing. But sure enough, forgotcha just mowed him down and blew by him like he, like he, like he, like he wasn't there. Pretty impressive clinic, but I would still say pretty impressive from Lenny Martinez. Like where he is right now going into the tour, he's got to feel pretty good about that. Yeah, I think, you know, his, obviously his goal is to win a stage and maybe go for the KOM. Martinez, he already did that last year. I don't think it's a writer for G.C. In a grand tour. But, but yeah, he's done it many times now, Spencer, you know, like pick out these stages in those, you know, in Padinese, in Romandie, if I'm not mistaken, he won a stage

last year also. You know, he almost, I mean, Dauphiné last year, now here, almost to win a stage. He's a class writer, you know, he's a pure climber. And he's a very smart, very smart writer. I hear from within the Peloton that he's not very liked because of his way of racing. He's, he's not a, you know, he only pushes when he really has to, but, you know, that's the way you win races. You know, he's very smart rider. But he's not very popular.

He's not very popular in breakaways, I hear. Yeah. I mean, what do you think about that? You would be more qualified to speak on it than me, but it's my opinion that if you're smart, if you race actually how you should to maximize your chance of winning, no one's going to like you. Right? No. No.

I mean, yeah. Listen, I guess one of the, one of the. best examples of the last decade was Ruy Costa. Same thing. Like Ru Costa was that kind of writer. He'd nobody liked to have him in the break, but when he was there, 50% of the time he won.

You know? So if you're, if everybody likes you, but you never win a race, then your boss is probably not going to like you that much. You know, everybody else likes you, but the guy who pays you will say, well, you know, everybody likes you, but I don't like you that much. Yeah. You know? People like you. you're probably not doing something right.

So, I mean, Lenny, like the way Lenny Martinez can just target these stages and, and go for him against, I mean, he did this last year against Jonas and Tate. Like you couldn't pick a harder handicap than that. And he still is able to pull him off at times.

He got close. Do you think there's anyone, I was just, I don't know why this has infected my brain. Are people sitting around saying, why did Pagachar chase him down? Why didn't he let him win? There must be people saying that, right?

Yeah, but, you know, I mean, nowadays cycling, that's the way it is. And on top of that, you know, it always comes down to the same. Of course, they have a goal. You know, they wanted to win the tour of Switzerland. They won. They had one already three stages. But if you have your team right the whole day with the purpose to, you know, keep the breakaway within check to have a chance for the stage win, then as a leader,

you are not in a position to make the call. Oh, you know, by the way, I'm just going to let that guy out. there, you know, just give him the stage. Those times are over, you know, it's like if you have, if your team has worked all day as a leader, you need to finish off the job whenever you can. Yeah. I actually would say this is one of the things being at the race really makes you respect because you see like everyone is physically miserable. Yeah. Especially when it's hot. And if they're all doing that, not just the riders, Johan, like, you know, the, the day bulsches of these teams are out there like five in the morning, packing the,

cars up to get them ready for the feed zones. And when they went, like when Pagotcha won that time trial, you could feel there was like, it's like a physical euphoria that's lifting up the winner and then the losers. It's a theme effort. It's a theme effort. Yeah. So it's very important to grab these wins, like not just for Pagotcha, but for the whole team. And I probably would be a little disrespectful if you went back to Niels Pollitt and said,

you see how hard Niels Pollitt worked yesterday. The guy was suffering on the front. Like, sorry, Niels. I let Lenny win, you know. letting like wins all the time. He doesn't need someone to let him win. But if you're going to let somebody win, it's going to be,

should be a teammate. Yeah. Like advice, for example. You know? Yeah. I stopped just looking at Inric Moss in the result sheet, remembering when he tried to get,

Joe, made it to let him win and he said, no, thanks. But, I mean, I had, I had Bogotcher calculated at,

for the 24 minutes since his attack at 468 was. at 468 watts 7.2 watts per kilo which is quite good quite good actually you might say but actually is on par with you know if you go back to the tour last year like the the t t is actually probably a little bit is a 17 minute long effort so it's a little shorter but it was like above that but 24 minutes it's a t it's not the same you don't have the fatigue of you know the clans the whole day. Yeah. I mean, I'm still, I don't know, maybe I need to go back and revisit these dofine numbers last year, but still, I mean, I guess it's longer. 24 minutes, I don't think people understand, like 24 in change is significant longer than 20. Like, your mind thinks it's the same,

but it's quite a bit longer than a 19 to 20 minute effort. So he's, he's fit. He's fit going into the tour. How do you think everybody else? Like, if you're Jonas Finnegard, watching this, how are you feeling? There's nobody close, I think. There's nobody close to this. Spencer, even if he's not better than last year, you know, even if he's the same, he was so far ahead of everybody else.

Yeah, people still got problems. It's like Jonas may say, I mean, listen, I mean, at this point, we keep saying it over and over again, but we have to say it again. It is only Jonas Wingergart who can maybe come. come close to Bogachar and beat him if something happens to him. That's the situation we're going to see again. And with this team now that he has around him and all these guys who are super strong,

some guys were injured, they came back, they're stronger now. Let's not forget Narvaise. I don't know if Narvaise is going to do the tour or not. I don't think so. I don't know if they need them. And then on the other side, you know, we haven't talked about that. But, you know, we, in the Dauphinet, Walt Vonart dropped out with an injury on his elbow, an infection, has since decided that he is not fit for the tour. And he's not going to be racing the tour for Jonas and for Vizma.

You're burning. You're burning our third segment here. Yeah. Well, that's, I'm sorry. That's, that's, that's a big one. You know, that's a real big one for Visma. You know, we say always, yeah, you know, Van Arte, he's a spring, spring classics writer. You know, but historically, Van Arth has been at his best always in the summer in the month of July.

Yeah. Yep. You know, for personal results and also as the unbelievable teammate he has been. So they're going to miss him, man, in the tour. I don't know if there's, I mean, there's nobody who can. take that place for sure there there is nobody there so I don't know how they're going to make that selection now

to fill up that gap I agree I think this is devastating I heard a take from someone who was like I don't know is losing Van Art that much important than losing Bart Lemon what Van Art does is almost impossible almost nobody can do that that is it is devastating

that he's also you called this because you got remember he got dropped in the team time trial and you said this is really weird. And it was, it must have, because he had this infection. Like, they could have gone septic, they said. Impressively won the stage in retrospect. I didn't, I didn't, when I said that, I said, you know, it looks like it's more going on. I initially when I saw it was an infection, I said, you know, the infection can be, can be okay.

You know, you get a with a heavy treatment of antibiotics. it's not good for the condition, but I thought that if it was just the infection that he could, I was thinking more about something else, maybe a hairline fracture or something that caused him to withdraw, but it seems that this infection is more serious than we could have foreseen. We're seeing, I mean, we saw a guy, former UAE writer died of this recently. A lot of these infections now can't be treated with antibiotics. And they get, they get out of. control before you can deal with it and then that's not good for you yeah i guess that happened to

kyle bush as well in the u.s got he got sepsis a couple days after winning a race and passed away but oh well let's take another ad break and then i'm gonna have a game that i've come up with on the trip back from switzerland for you to play this episode is brought to you by hex glad listen up summer cooking season it's officially here you're gonna be cooking for for the crew out back and while people love talking about their grill. The real MVP of your setup, that's your pants. They're doing all the heavy lifting. And sometimes, guys, you know this, guys and girls and everybody. Your cookware can stick, can burn, it can heat unevenly, and it can turn cleanup into a full contact sport. It's not making you a better cook. It's making your life harder. Summer meals should be simple. That's where

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Okay, Johan, we are back. The game is I'm going to name riders and you tell me if this rider was at this race or not. So, Nairo Gantana. Yes. Yeah. I didn't know. I didn't know he was here until I saw him physically at the race. Did he do better than you thought?

I'm assuming you didn't know he was coming to this race. But assuming you knew, did he do better than you would have expected or worse? I'm not expecting that much anymore of NIDO. I knew he was in the race because I saw him in the breakaway the last day. Otherwise, I wouldn't have known he was in the race. Yeah, me neither. Another writer that I actually was really impressed with, Enric Moss.

Did you know he was here? Not until the last stage. What was, whose call was this? Because he did the Gero. And then the, like, hey, man, you ready, you ready to roll at Swiss? Do you think he decided that at the team? I don't know.

I don't know. There was quite a few guys who did the Gero. There's a lot of guys. Yeah. You know, they obviously not going to do the tour. So they have a big break now and then most likely going to, you know, show up for the Vuelta. It's doable. It's doable.

Yeah. Ollalo. Yeah, our best friend Ollalio was here as well. I mean, I mean, maybe they just need him to fill a gap and he's not, he's not a big enough star to say no. Another writer, this one pains me. This is, this is, this was actually, I struggled with my mortality this week a lot. Primos Roglidge. Yeah.

He was at the race, yeah. He was at the race, but invisible. What is going on there? Are we worried yet? I mean, yeah, worried. Listen, I mean, it's been a while since we've seen the primos from, you know, two, three years ago, was a winning machine. You know, when all those one-week stage races that, you know, Valta winner, four-time Valta winner, no? Yeah.

That's his big goal. That's his big goal. He goes to the Valta to try win it again. I have doubts if he can, you know, if this Primo's Rogner, of this year can win it. But I think that, you know, Primal's Robbis being at the Tour of Switzerland was definitely not an objective.

It's just, I mean, his team will probably have said, hey, you know what, hey, you need to race. You know, you do the Switzerland. You're paying you these millions. You're not going to be. We're not paying you just to stay at home. I don't think that was Primos's decision to race the Tour of Switzerland.

That's just me, that's just me thinking out loud. That's kind of a trend, too. right it seems like he's getting thrown in some races that he doesn't want to do and he's like physically almost visibly pouting to tour de france last year think about that where he just didn't ever seem fully bought in and tour of romandy this year yeah it's just i don't know if he i guess if he wins de valto we say wow the signs were there look he was pretty good on the final stage of switzerland but i just could the time trial i found shocking because he was i remember him as he would he was just a blaze in the time trial.

And he just looked hard for him. He was Olympic champion. He was Olympic champion time trial. Yeah, he beat our good friend Tom Dumilan in the Olympics. Yeah. And he just looked late. He actually, his time was in that, he's 37 seconds back, which in that time trial, and he's not awful.

But, you know, he's with Michael Matthews. He shouldn't be with Michael Matthews in the time trial. Here's the hardest one, Johan. And I only know this person was there because they were in the same room as me for dinner after stage four. Mika Landa. Did you know he was at his race? No, I did not know he was there.

I have not seen him. No. And is it? Because it like sent me for a loop. It's like Landa, like I kind of thought he retired. But remember he was actually on good form and he crashed first stage of the 2025 Giro de Talia. He did.

Yeah. Yeah. He's never quite been the same since then. Then I think he crashed again. in was it Catalonia? He crashed. Oh,

you're right. Basque Country. One of those two, either Catalonia or Basque Country had a pretty bad crash. Like a really bad crash. You're right. It must be Bass Country.

After coming back, yeah, comes back from a bad crash. 19th at Lombardia and then crashes again. And then now he's on the rebuild again. It's also funny to me he's on. I can't get over him being on Stoke quick step.

It's like seeing a shirt. shark on a mountain top. Like, what? Like he doesn't really fit the, I guess, I think, Ben Wilder, especially, especially now that there's, you know, no, no real leader for the G.C. races. He's like probably sometimes the best climber of the team.

Yeah. Van Wilder's very good, we should say. Yeah, he's good, but, you know, it's not, it's not a writer who, who needs this super domestic in the mountains to stay next to him, you know, I mean, Van Wilder can, you know, him being there and following, trying to follow the good guys, that's enough for fourth, fifth or sixth play. What does Van Wilder finally finish fifth? Fifth. Is he see?

Actually, good little result there. Yeah. Yeah. Top five at a major. What's funny is so Tobias Foss finishes fourth, Van Wilder, fifth. When Foss won the Tour de Labanier, second place was, or sorry, third place was Van Wilder. Oh, wow. Second place was Eliati.

These guys, if you look at a lot of Foss's results, Van Wilder always finishes like right behind him in the GC. But so I'm just going to speed around through this. Like another rider that says I'm not saying this rider. We didn't know he's in this race. Just another rider I want to call out who's not going to be remembered. So Pagachar wins the stage yesterday. Bartlemon 3rd.

They were from the breakaway. The next best rider from the Peloton is Yarno Weidar. Daniel Wido. Okay. Yeah. Very good a ride. 20 years old, very good climber. Just started racing again.

He raced in the beginning of the season, had a knee problem, had a knee surgery, and started again in Gippingen, which is the race just before Tour Switzerland. That was his first race back after months being out of competition. So, yeah, that's a good result. And then Rickettselow, fifth on the stage. I talked to Rickettello.

He wasn't too impressed with the lack of mountain stages here. didn't think that was setting him up for great success. Enric Moss sixth, really, like, really good result there from Inric Moss. In the stage, right? In the stage, yeah. Yeah. Like building toward the end. Also shows not, not pouting like Primos, you know, like he's there, given his best.

He was laughing coming over the finish line. He was sprinting against Rickettello. But the big question, let's take a break. And then I want to ask you about Richard Carapass's race. Because this is one of the strangest second places you could ever map up because he loses buckets of time through the final weekend on a five-stage race and somehow ends up second. But we'll be right back to talk about Carapaz. Okay, Johan, we are back.

So Carapaz gets second, 632 back. He loses minutes to not only Pagacra, but Mattias Vacek in the final two stages, mainly just from the time trial. But really, it goes back to his decision on stage one when everything is Fubar and Pagachas up the road. He just attacks. takes minutes. He takes a few seconds on Baggioli, but Badgioli was 13 minutes back on the final stage. So he's kind of irrelevant from GC.

But he takes almost two minutes on Van Welder and Vachek and McNulty on that first stage. And that kind of proves to be how he gets second. But if you're a writer like Richard Carapas, how do they feel about this second place coming out of this race? Like he's losing time where he should be taking time and get second from taking time on a, expected stage.

Yeah, I think Carapace feels good. Also, let's not forget, this is his first race back also. He was supposed to ride the Gero. And then he was out with some kind of infection. It was a bad infection. It was a cyst on his in between two important areas where you sit on the bike. Yeah, not good. How to get a surgery.

Yeah. Yeah. So I think he's pretty happy with that. that result, you know, and obviously he's going to race the tour now. So, I mean, I think Carapas did a solid race. You know, time trailing has never been his forte and it will never be. He's always lost a lot of time in time trials. It was again the case.

And then other than that, I think he, you know, he was very consistent. Did that really good ride individually on stage one. And that's what basically cemented his second place already there. And then I heard an interview from him after the race. And he sounded really satisfied with the performance and with the result. And he's going to the tour. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, for sure.

Yeah. If he's at the zero, does anything change or no? No. No. I mean, he would have been in contention for the podium. You know, together with with Gull and. Hintley but no I mean we don't have changed anything else how do you think he's going to do with the tour he's going to go for stages I think you got a carapass is

not a writer anymore for GC in the Tour de France in my it's hard it's hard for guys like that though on teams like that because they kind of need the they need the appearance that he is going for GC but he wants to go for stages and it keeps him too high up in GC and then it's hard to get in the break but I mean he He did it, what, two years ago, right? He pulled the rabbit out of the hat, made it work. So clearly he can do it. I'm not, he lost.

Yeah, he won a stage and got the car. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, so he's capable of that at least. I mean, he's even the second place, it's just like witchcraft. How is he doing this? Like, where's he taking time on people? But other, just other things to call out.

We have not mentioned this man for a long time. and it is relevant for the tour to fronts. Florian Lipowitz gets first at the Tour of Slovenia, which Tour Slovenia, not normally, I don't remember this many hard stages. They went up the Raseka Pass, which is the biggest climb in Slovenia. I don't ever remember them doing that.

Maybe I just don't watch Tour of Slovenia closely enough. But Florian Lipowitz beats Giulio Pellizari for in the final G.C. by 42 seconds, taking like a chunk of time on a non-mountain stage and winning solo on stage 5, which shows you he's in incredibly good shape. So Lipowitz, last year's third place going.

There was a hard climb, 1.4 kilometer climb, where he just attacked with 200 meters from the top and just left everybody, like, standing still. And then it was, it shows you Pelazari is not fully recovered. I mean, that's another guy. Like, why is this guy racing now?

Maybe this is the trend, I guess. Well, I mean, you know, there's so many. races that at the end of the day, you need to, you need to file a team of seven riders everywhere. Yeah. Obviously, Pellizadezati is not going to the tour. So they said, you know, just come to the tour of Slovenia and see how it goes. That's usually what happens. You know, we just, we just want you there at the start.

We're not expecting anything from you. Just be there. And let's see what happens. And yeah, finally he got second. Get second. I mean, he was in the mix until that final day, too. Just to, he was like four seconds back. Was, uh, our friend of the show.

show Berwick in front again. I think he was top five, top six. Seb Berwick finished fifth, moved up one spot on the final stage. Once again, a pretty good result. Yeah. Good climber. Another guy like him that I saw and got two star

stark to say anything is Paul double. But like Seb Berwick, like if Paul double and sub berwick... I think Paul, I think Berwick is better in Paul double. Which is funny that Berwick is like fighting for, I mean, now like maybe he's fine, but he's like fighting for a contract for a long time.

Yeah. Yeah. If Sebber, if, I think, I think a guy like this will get noticed and get, uh, get a better deal on another team, probably. If his name was Sebian, Sebian, Sebian, Sebian, Sebian, and he was Italian, is it easier for him to get a contract, you think? I don't know. I don't know.

I think people who follow cycling obviously know that this guy is a good climber and looks to me like he can still get better. He can still improve. He was on Israel in the past, I think. Yeah. And it's not totally clear to me why he's not still on that team. It seems like that's exactly the type of rider they could use. I got to say the rebrand NSN looks fantastic. I was down on the jerseys at the start.

It looks in person. Wow. It's impressive, actually. But I also joke with Matthew Ricotelo. Like if his name was Luigi Ricotelo and he was Italian, I'd be like, you got to see. This guy is going to win the Tour de France someday. Like I'm just a sucker for young Italian cyclist. Let's just call him Mateo instead of Mattio.

Mateo Riccielo. We have to say Matteo Richiello. Yeah, because he says his name wrong. And then before we go, we got to talk about. Quinn Simmons. Holy smokes. We said he would probably win nationals, but it would be tough for him.

Because he has no teammates. It's not easy to win a race when you have no teammates and you're the favorite. And everyone's marking you. And there's George Hank Gapie's mean team trying to beat you. If I'm not mistaken, Spencer, I just had a quick look at the results. I mean, I think the top three had no teammates. There's nobody else from UAE and nobody else from Tudor. Do you notice?

So the top three were Quinn Simmons, Kevin Vermarka, Larry Warbuss. Do you notice anything about them that's different from the rest of of the race. I guess Larry technically is not World Tour, but World Tour first, World Tour Second, former World Tour Rider 3rd. I got to say to Tudor, oh man, that team just oozes money. When you see their bus and their cars, it is. Yeah. It is impressive. Same thing with your friend Pinarello, Key 36.5. Tudor needs to probably spend a little bit less money and have some better results. My wife goes, what? She's like, what does the deal with this? Like, who is even the best rider on Tudor? Why? I was like, I don't know, but they look great. Look at these cars.

Look at, look at Pinterello. I mean, that's, you see, that's the team you want to be on. You go there, you're living the good life. But yeah, these guys are the three best riders in the race. I mean, it's Quinn Simmons. It's a hard course and it's perfect if you are isolated as a world tour rider because you have a 2K long 6% climb every lap to bail you out because modern adventure Georgia's team was really doing all the right stuff. They got riders up the road. They had numerical advantage against these guys, but Quinn could just wait until the climb. And it was like, this was almost a five hour long race, not really a functioning

peloton and just attacks the entire time, which. That's hard racing. That's hard racing. Hard racing. And we'll fatigue everybody, which helps Quinn and Kevin and Larry, because when everyone gets fatigued, they're going to be best. also fourth place was taken by an 18 year old Ashland Barry who won the U-23 race as an 18 year old

so shout out Ashland Barry on Team Beesma Lisa Bike Development so he won he won the it was mixed no it was a different race it was the day before so he did two races he did two races one of them being almost five hours long that's impressive so I had race the day before the 153 race.

That's crazy. Yeah, it was a three hour long race and he wins it by two seconds. You know, it's like he's in a, he's in a dog fight in this race. He's not cruising a victory. And then he comes back in a, I can't. And also a new American champion, Enzo Hinkapie, Jr. Yeah, and the junior. Junior, congrats to the Hinkapie family and George, proud dad.

So George, yes, congrats George. George's son wins junior. Michael Barry's son wins U-23, both postal riders, if I'm not mistaken. And then Quinn Simmons, Quinn Simmons dad, apparently the best pedigree of them all, wins the senior race. But did you see his dad at the finish line with the beard? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah.

I love it. Yeah. I can't wait until I get a father's son matching facial hair situation. It's going to be great. Yeah, they look like. They kind of look like brothers. Like his dad is an incredibly good shape. Yeah, he's in great shape.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, I was doing this. There's a famous race in Durango called the Iron Horse. And I'll never forget this. The first client comes up and this guy comes from the back and he's like yelling like, I didn't know what was going on. Like if there was an emergency and you just start screaming and then just attacks so hard off the top of the front.

And I thought it was a joke. like he was going to stop. And we just never saw him again. And it was Quinn Simmons' dad. Oh. Just like let out a battle cry and ripped off the front at full speed and was never to be seen again. That's how that's how strong he is. But I got to run, Johan.

Thanks for joining us. And we're actually going to take a break until the tour fronts. So we will not be back next week. Enjoy your week off. Okay. Good, Spencer. My altitude camp? Yeah, we got to go to altitude camp before the tour.

or so. Okay. I'll see you in Tanya later this week. Okay. All right. Okay. Bye. All right.