THEMOVE - Why is Pogacar still attacking? | Tour De France 2024 Stage 17 | THEMOVE

Episode Date: July 17, 2024

THEMOVE team scratching our heads again when we saw Tadej Pogacar attack. Lance had some words for him on the political side of bike racing and things we wishes he had done differently. We also talk to Michael White, father of rising star Magus White who was tragically killed while cycling in Boulder a year ago. More info at http://www.thewhiteline.org KETONE-IQ: 30% off your first sub order + free 6 pack when you use the link: https://www.ketone.com/themove Momentous: There’s a reason why the world’s top athletes and experts use and help develop Momentous products. Support your brain and body with supplements made and used by the best, go to https://www.livemomentous.com/themove or use code THEMOVE for 20% off. ROKA: THEMOVE listeners get 20% off. Just go to https://www.ROKA.com and enter code THEMOVE at checkout. Eight Sleep: Head to https://www.eightsleep.com/themove and use code THEMOVE to get $350 off Pod 4 Ultra. They currently ship to the US, Canada, United Kingdom, Europe and Australia. WAHOO: Wahoo’s cycling products are trusted by the pro peloton. Now you can save 20% on select full-price products by using the coupon code THEMOVE2024 at checkout. During The Tour, go to https://www.wahoofitness.com/themove and enter THEMOVE2024 to save 20%. THE FEED: Get the Tour de France Pack. There are 11 products for $21. It's about 50% off and you get a Feed musette bag and a limited tour bottle Go to https://www.TheFeed.com Ventum: Listeners of The Move can save 20% off any Ventum bike using code TheMove20. Compete to win a Ventum NS1 road bike by playing Tour Trivia all race long — visit https://www.ventumracing.com/TheMove to answer today's question. Winner will be announced at the end of the Tour.

All the excitement we had about Jonas in the beginning, and we were also excited of the extreme high level he has, and he has now reached its maximum, I think. And, you know, we have seen the last three times that Pogacar attacked, instead of him focusing on Pogacar, he goes and he looks back. Three times he looks back.

Normally you don't do that, you know. So i think today he didn't lose a lot of time he got saved by his team great job by the team but i think it's just an indication of what we're going to see in the next few days all right everybody welcome back to the move, brought to you each and every day by Keytone IQ. We're talking about stage 17. Alain, what up? Stage 17 from Saint-Paul-Trois-Châteaux to Super-Devoluie. From Saint-Paul-Trois-Châteaux to Super-Devoluie. Now, that was one of the better ones.

That was one of the better ones. Special shout-out, Johan. By the way, folks, you know, it took us two and a half weeks uh but we got johan verneal on the show he's been busy obviously doing jb squared and doing outcomes which we're going to touch on later but johan thank you for being here great to be here guys i missed you i know we haven't seen you in like over a week missed you too johan you of course and george as well we'll remember this well the start town today saint paul tosh wash it that's why i don't try those pronunciations uh we would stay there uh every year the tour went through uh saint paul tosh ato and we'd stay in the same hotel remember y'all you guys remember claude the guy

that owned that hotel it was just the i'm. I'm guessing he had teams last night. He's such a lovely man. The best top and not in France. Oh, that top and not, bro? With a little toast? Oh, come on. Still crave that. No, and oftentimes they would have rest days there,

and either the tour would always put us there or he would ask that we stay there. He was just such a lovely man. I thought after a while we requested to stay there anytime we were near there. Johan? Yeah, we did. We did. Yeah.

But Claude would have cried a river had they given him another team. Like we were very, very close with him. So if you're ever in St. Paul, Trois Chateaux, then go. What is the name of the hotel? Les Plans? Les Plans. Les Plans. It's so lovely yeah great hotel today's show brought to you by hotel let's well richard carapaz saves uh team ef's tour de france now we know he had the yellow jersey in the race which is great that's i guess you don't leave empty-handed, but that was an exceptional ride. You've got to give it to him.

He's been trying. He was perfect today. It was a nasty day. It took 120 kilometers slash 75 miles for the group to finally go away. We can all, or the three of us, you, me, Johan, and George can tell you what that's like. It's just disgusting at the start. Just guys, everybody trying, everybody trying. Again, they're all getting yelled at last night

because so many teams haven't won a stage. It's miserable. And finally, they let 40 guys go up the road. Imagine that, like, oh, okay, it's cool. Now there's 40 guys we can sit up, and they do. 43, to be exact. 43. And they're four ahead of that. so that's not a breakaway anymore.

That's a peloton. Yeah, those are two pelotons. Before we get into all the action, today's show brought to you by Wahoo. Wahoo bike computers are proven in the peloton, used by eight world tour teams, more features than ever, including Wahoo's Summit feature, providing you with colored gradients detailed climb data and even helps you detect climbs nearby when you're not using a route now here's the deal after the show today george and i are going to go ride independence pass this is a perfect ouch and

i'm tired it's long it's like an hour and a half long it's a perfect climb for for the to see the route, to see the climb, to see the percentages. Huge advantage. It's 5% the whole way. I know, but it just drags on and on and on. Check this out. They also have a new favorite feature, music and GoPro control. Make every ride more engaging by controlling your music directly via your Element bike computer or capture epic footage via Wahoo's GoPro integration. Again, we will be out. bringing the the gopro today i ain't gotta save my weight bro you know one bottle there's one guy

coming on the ride that's absolutely going to destroy george also uh uh makers of speedplay pedals this has been my pedal of choice for the last 12 years, I switched over probably 2012 when I was doing triathlons. Very lightweight, very stiff, super aero. Wahoo cycling products are trusted by the Peloton. We do see those Wahoo computers on eight of the teams in the world tour. Now you can save 20% off on select full price products by using the coupon code THEMOVE2024 at checkout. Again, that's wahoof fitness dot com slash the move. And the code is the move to zero to four.

That means this year, 2024, the move 2024 gets you 20 percent off. Now, also today brought to you by Momentous. Most people know how important a healthy diet is for your brain and body to function at their best day in and day out. We're still often short on the most essential nutrients to be at our best, myself included. My go-tos are momentous creatine, omega-3, and protein each and every day to make sure I'm covering all my bases. Let's talk about creatine for a hot second.

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Gets you 20% off. Also from our hometown of Austin, Texas. Yahoo. What a stage. What a stage. I mean, I flicked it on, and it was one of these days. We've talked about this. This tour has been diabolical, and it's just catching up.

It was George and I commented as we were watching. We're like, this looks like a junior race. They're just people everywhere, disorganized. No offense to you juniors out there, but just disorganized. Attacks up the right, attacks up the left. You're like, what is going on here? Yeah, that's a director's worst nightmare. Worst nightmare.

Obviously, they have to have certain guys that they can't let go. Then you have the points classification going on, the team classification. I remember those days quite vividly, and they're very stressful for the riders, for the directors like Johan in the car. Just so much going on. And the moment you let a group of like five, six guys get 30 seconds and they might be dangerous, that's a disaster scenario for any team because then they have to burn some matches.

So a very stressful stage from the start, like you said. And what you saw too, and if you have any insight on this, Johan, chime in after this. But there were four guys away, right? Four very, very strong guys. So you could say, well, all right, why didn't they just let that go? But to our point yesterday, well, there were four guys there and four teams, one of which was Visma, which probably wasn't getting yelled at in the team bus to say,

you have to go on the break and you have to try and win a stage. So that four-man group, which was housed by great riders, had no chance because now these guys in the back, well, now you're still looking at 10 other teams that are getting barked at, saying, how did you miss this four-man group? And so that's why they were, you know, they bridged across and they created, you know, the larger group. But then you throw into the green jersey points.

And so they were motivated to get Guilherme and Philipson up there, which they did. Well, if you're Guilherme, you don't need to go. I mean, all you got to do is follow Philipson. I mean, if I can't recall how many total points are available for the intermediate sprints. But if you have 20 guys up the road you're you have nothing to worry about but johan what must it be and we talked about this yesterday just these teams that have that are not that not only have they uh thus far come away empty-handed they are leaving this tour de france empty-handed what you imagine a mark Matteo and the team meetings in the cars at Decathlon

it's it's very stressful for the riders you know they're desperate and today you could see you know once those four riders were gone they kept going they kept going and it was specifically all those teams that didn't

have a stage with you know like Movistar and Decathlon and, uh, well actually EF also. I mean, you have to give it to EF today. They, they absolutely, you know, they with Cara and especially with Cara Pass, I listened to an interview. I don't know if you have that same kind of footage, but I heard Adam Blight interview, uh, Andreas clear in the car and they had it all planned out. It was all for Carapaz.

They knew that he was strong, that he's growing in this tour, and they just wanted to put him in that group. They said specifically that kilometer zero is where the intermediate sprint was. That was kilometer zero for them. That's when the race started. They also said several times, we listened to nielsen palace's interview afterwards several times on the radio they kept saying the next 5k i want you to treat it like it's the last 5k because they weren't in the break so think about everything that went on and um they clearly

went into today's stage with the plan we're seeing the breakaway being composed of like guys that can win world cup races the guys that can win World Cup races, guys that can win stage races, one week long stage races. These are no panic cooking breakaways and none of that's going to happen for the rest of the tour. It's going to be super, super strong guys. So it's just going to, guys like

Carapaz, what he did today. And I actually just want to play something. Dave, are you ready for me or do I need to play from my phone? Bulchki? Phone, okay. So I got to play something back from, are you ready for me or do I need to play from my phone? Bolchki? Phone, okay. So I've got to play something back from stage 13 when our boy Wigo was here. And Johan, you're going to find this kind of funny?

I actually think that someone who will come to the fore in the third week here is Education First Carapace. We've seen him a little bit before. Let's hear what Lance has to say. I will give you anything you want on that. That's not happening that's not happening that's that's just not but i don't know it's looking good i agree with sir bradley here's i agree with sir bradley this okay you know what you know what i knew i knew i knew we gotta point out when he's wrong

okay i knew george wasn't even paying attention in the pre-show meeting but i knew i was getting set up but hey here's the thing and by the way chato sent me that so thank you chad thank you he like clipped it together for us and everything i appreciate that lord chad born uh so here's the deal uh i'm always wrong so and i will admit that i was wrong number one and number two hey great for I mean, he rode a fantastic race. That was, he deserved to win. Now, to Johan's point, there were times they were caught out. I mean, they let 30 guys go up the road at one point, and they had to put the whole team on the front

or what was left of the team that could pull to bring that back. Hey, fantastic ride. I mean, to ride away from a guy, simon yates went i thought this could work to then go across to that and drop him hey man hats off to him i mean when we were watching early last week you know how we kept we saw a couple times ben healy went back to help carapaz and i i kind of leaned over to wigo and said, why don't they focus on Healy? He seems to be the stronger rider. And he said the same thing on that clip.

He's like, wait until the third week. Carapaz is coming on strong. And by the way, typically in the last week, Johan, see if you agree with me on this. The guys that you saw in the breakaway today are the guys we're going to see pretty much every day moving forward in the breakaway. And these top 10 guys, now they're, they're in the momentum. A lot of these guys haven't won a stage, most of them, and they're going to be in pretty much every breakaway moving forward from now on.

Well, I was going to say, I mean, any bit for those folks at home, you know, we've talked about riders in the past and talked about, or use this expression, which is a Flemish expression of panic. Panic. Panicooking is like aooking is like a shitty ride. Anybody that's at the front of this bike race either today or going forward is no panicooking. If you have survived these two and a half weeks and you still have the legs to influence the race and be in the front forever, you are not a panicooking.

Like this has just been, it's been that hard of a tour and it take it for guys to still be in the game and fighting for stage wins and breakaways and no panic hookers or how about cavendish just trying to get to knees to party yeah yeah we saw we saw guys like gavidia today um sam bennett they can't even hold on to the wheel on a two three percent grade i mean these guys are dead men walking. On the TV, when they showed the cars going by Sam Bennett, honestly, he might have been going 10 miles an hour.

He's that cooked. I was like, oh. You're not thinking about finishing. You can't finish within the time period if you're going 10 miles an hour. They're just crushed. Which is fun to sit on the couch and watch. Be terrible to be there.

I'm still trying to recover from that getting called out. The other thing Wiggle did highlight, and we'll talk about this after the commercial break, was is Jonas looking back or, you know, is this is now the real race between Jonas Wingegaard and Remco and Vannevar, which we saw play out today. I think that's just a preview of what's going to happen in the next four days. Keep in mind, last day is a really hard time trial. It perfectly suits Remco. There could be a show.

I mean, Jonasingergaard is not he had two minutes and i think nine seconds going into the stage i need to check where it sits now but getting second loses 15 seconds he loses 15 seconds but but he just you could see he's he's uh he's swinging a little bit uh something that came up on on jb squared that that johan should talk about and explain himself because i could not explain it well uh is how when you go through an injury like jonas has gone through you can um well you explain it johan but you can recover very quickly get fit very quickly but he needs the recovery desperately so So, Yon, please explain. Yeah, what I think is what happened is that Yon has had an accelerated program to get ready, the race against the clock.

You can do that, but you lack a bit of foundation. And usually when you get into that upward curve in your form and at some point you reach a plateau where normally under normal circumstances, you would need a little bit of recovery to then take it to the next level. Since he's in the tour, that's not possible. So we can see that all the excitement we had about Jonas in the beginning, and we were also excited of the extreme high level he has.

And he had, it has now reached its maximum, I think. And, you know, we have seen the last three times that Pogacar attacked, instead of him focusing on Pogacar, he goes and he looks back. Three times he looks back. Normally you don't do that, you know. So I think today he didn't lose a lot of time he got saved by his team great job by the team but it i think is just an indication of what we're going to see in the next few days uh the confidence must the confidence must be going down a bit

and obviously without charge confidence is skyrocketing uh i have my doubts about his attack today if he should have done that or not. I don't think it was, it was not necessary. I want to, I want to, I want to save that because I have, I have, when I watched that, I thought, Oh, I have thoughts on that. What I'm hearing you say is in none of us on this show are exercise physiologists, but this is a real thing, right? You, you have this and nobody should ever be put in a position where it's a crash course to try and get ready to win the Tour de France. I mean, that's, it's almost impossible to do. Um, but what, uh, but what is out there and what is known

is you have these huge training blocks. You take a little break, whether that, whatever that recovery period is, they call that super compensation, right? So then you get this recovery period and then you get this recovery period and then you get this and then you can go you know then you're you know whatever percentage uh uh stronger but he has not allowed this period of super compensation because he's in the tour de france and and he's having to dig every day and and he had this crash course before but uh yeah i i agree with you i think that's what we're seeing. Yeah. Yeah. We'll get into tomorrow's day.

And also, we do want to talk about Pogachar's attack because I have a little personal experience that I can speak from on that. So don't miss that. Today's show brought to you by Ketone IQ. We often hear that fasting and exercise are good for the brain. HVMN launched the world's first drinkable ketone in 2017. Ketone IQ is their latest innovation on ketones with improved effectiveness, taste, and cost. Ketone IQ delivers clean fuel that can cross the blood-brain barrier, supplying your brain and body sustained energy, focus, and sharpness.

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You know, on what, you want to talk about Pogatour's attack. I suspect you have, as you do on most things, strong feelings. When you're done, I want to just come over the top. Yeah, I was surprised to see him attack. Absolutely not necessary. I think the risk compared to the potential benefit is too high. He could distance Jonas a little bit. I think the advantage of this attack was the fact that we saw

a weakness in Jonas that we haven't seen in the fact that he was passed by Remco and he couldn't follow Remco. I think that was an indication of what we can see in the next few stages. But if you look at the potential gain, you know, you get to the top of that climb, you have to go to downhill, and then you still have to have that three kilometer climb. So, I mean, I think luckily for Pogacar,

he was reeled in. And then, you know, he had a teammate, and Jonas had two teammates, and Remco could attack. So, ultimately, it was a great situation for him, but it was absolutely not necessary. I would not have advised him to do that. Obviously it's great for the spectators. Yeah.

But I think we all were kind of shocked to see him attack. And like you said, you're on big downhill, so you got to take huge risks. And then, of course, you got a guy like Christian Laporte, Christophe Laporte, and Wout van Aert up the road. That, you know, if you put Christian Laporte, Christophe Laporte, and Wild Van Aert up the road. If you put those guys on the downhill in front of you, nobody can ride away from that. So I agree. None of us understood that attack.

Here's the deal. Big mistake. I'm speaking to this from experience. Now, my career, everybody knows my career, right? There's, there was plenty of stuff out there. Plenty of curiosity and speculation and accusation, fair play, right? It's not necessary. He does not this, this keep in mind, this isn't just a sporting event. This isn't, Hey, put the numbers on my back. Where's the start line? Show me the finish line. It is it. Yes, it is that. But it's not just that. It is also a political event. Right. If if there's no need to do that, it's just

going to bring more attention to him. And people will see that and say, come on, what are you doing? And if there's any speculator, which I don't follow this stuff, nor do I really care if there's any speculation out there about him, this will not help. It is not necessary. You're not going to get any friends either in the Peloton or in the press room. You're just not. I would advise him. And God love him.

You know, God bless him. Right. He's a racer. He's got the numbers on his back. He's like, what's the big deal? That's the finish line up the road. I want to get there first. You got to back up a little bit and say hang on i also have to manage this story and manage

this image it's when i saw him go i was like oh no like it's just i've been there man and i've had people yell at me and tap me on the shoulder before and say that wasn't necessary and i'm not talking about matches burned i'm talking about managing the political, the perception, right? And maybe this is a little too inside baseball, but I feel very strongly about this. No more of those. He's got the tour de France. All he's got to do is ride.

Stay on his bike. Stay within himself. He's got the tour de France. It's over. He can't help himself. I understand. I understand. And by the way, nor could I.

Right. Thank you. I couldn't either. I'm like, what are you talking about? Somebody put a number on my back. Somebody said the finish line is 32 kilometers up the road. Well, shouldn't we all race? It's more than that.

It's a political thing. And if that became a thing over time, you'll see. The people will turn. The people will look at that. I promise you. that it's a political thing and you'll see if that became a thing over time you'll see the people will turn the people will look at that well i promise you they will say all right you know what we've had enough of that they i just they just will and i don't i'm not nearly smart enough to know why or whatever but they will turn you don't need to do that let me ask you that story in 2005 when the race was over. Lance was leading by 10 minutes.

Johan and Lance were like, we're going to make these guys suffer on this climb. Right. Okay. And y'all still make fun of me about it, but now Lance just went on a 10-minute spiel about how this is not the right move. He's a different man now. He's a different man now. Johan, nobody's going to like us if we do this. But you know what? Okay. We're going gonna show them who's boss listen listen i'm not the smart i'm not very smart i mean i'm just a dumb kid from plano but here's the deal it took me 20 years or it took less than that but we're about 20 years on from

that day george yeah yeah it's sitting here today i look back on that and say, what did we do that for? That was a bad idea. George, being the sage voice and responsible and mature voice that he is, that was the right thing. It's like, yo, what are we doing? We got a 10-minute lead. Just let somebody go up there. Who cares? But the people are watching, and they will turn. And I don't want them to.

By the way, I like to kid. You've got to listen to those people that tap on your shoulder. Like, who doesn't look back? I know. But who doesn't look back on their career at times when I go, God, why did I act like, I do it. In my radio career, I was like, God, I was such an ass at that moment. I think everybody, maybe George doesn't, but everybody does that at some point. My question is, since Johan is on today,

was Johan ever tapping you on the shoulder or was he in it to crush too? No, he was my, no, no, no, no, no. Johan Bernal was my partner in crime. Some would say literally. And no, no, no. Johan and I were totally aligned and neither of us had a voice or reason. But but but both of us can sit here today. I mean, we just said it like, all right. Why don't do that? Right. And well, Lance, I'm going to correct you there. There were a few stages where I told you, don't do this. For example, I told you not to win an Alpe d'Huez in 99, which you wanted to win. I told you not to win. You listened.

I told you sometimes not to take the jersey yet because you wanted to take the jersey. I said, think about the team. You listened. So, you know, I took those decisions more in the sporting aspect because I see it as, and this is also why sometimes I don't like these things about Pogacar. It's a three-week effort.

It's not 21 one-day efforts. And you have to always look at it as a whole. And even though he has this advantage now, he has to be careful. Something can happen in those last three stages. You have to play it conservatively. And if you look at the whole, let's remind everyone, it's the double. He's been at it for a couple months. Yes.

And I don't think that's going to happen. I agree that the last four days are very, very difficult, especially Friday and Saturday. And Remco is coming. Remco's, look, I might eat my hat on Remco. He's riding a great tour, and he had a great day today. Yeah, I mean, the fact that. I think Tade's got it.

He just, but, yeah. John, it's a big sign there that after such a difficult stage, I mean, I was just chatting with Bob Youngles who made the breakaway, and I'm like, bro, was that tactics? Was that tactics or just, you know, pure legs? And it's obviously for people that don't understand the dynamics that go into making a breakaway like this, that everybody knows a breakaway is most likely going to make it there's like we said yesterday 10 teams ish that

haven't won a stage so they're going to go all in and they know they're going to go from the gun but the guys like bob youngles they're going to wait they're going to wait like an hour and just kind of flow and follow the wheels and after an hour when everybody's completely dead that's when they go and that's what he did today and he said you know we just didn't have the luck but he had good legs and made the the strong breakaway of the day but who would have thought a breakaway of 43 guys i mean we've rarely ever seen that a cycling go from behind and actually catch up to them it's just a super interesting tough stage well speaking of breakaways we're we're going to have another one tomorrow yes um so let's just look at tomorrow's profile because it just looks like a saw blade.

It really does. It's almost 180 kilometers, just up and down all day. It feels like it's getting hotter over there. What is it? One, two, three, four, five. Not big climbs, but five categorized climbs. Um, it's, I think it's a, what is 3,100 meters total climbing tomorrow? It's harder than today. The stage of tomorrow is 3,100 meters.

Today was 2,800. I mean, it's a harder stage than today. And so for you folks at home who think in feet, right, just go out for a bike ride today it's 10 000 feet of climbing deep into the third that's hard so it's so it's so hard that you should technically see breakaway go earlier than it did today because of that first category three climb and you'll see some a lot of the same guys that were in that breakaway today will be there tomorrow i'm sure if you want to know who's going to win listen to outcomes yeah well that's right before we get to outcomes stay tuned because as we touched on yesterday uh here in a little bit we've got

michael white coming on to talk about uh his initiative uh that that he unfortunately uh was thrust into a non-profit called the white line um after the horrific death of his son magnus but we'll get to to michael in just a sec he's here in the studio by the way um but yes joan uh right quick you picked carapaz he was plus 600 uh for the stage today uh nice pick there i i heard a stat uh that you you and spencer's predictions over the course of the tour so far you're up 200 in two and a half weeks i mean i know y'all at home are like looking at your iras and you're and you're buying some t-bills and whatever else can we just talk about i mean plus 200 i mean that president of goldman sachs ought to be shaking in his boots throwing up returns like that.

Yeah, I mean, you know, Spencer and I, we do our research, and I have a few inside sources in the Peloton also. That's always good to have some information. But, I mean, some of those stages are difficult to predict. Now at the end of the tour, it's easier because, you know, I mean, there's only a few guys who can make the break. And even if there's 10 guys who make the break, you know that two or three of them.

If you look at today, for example, right? You have Carapaz, Grand Tour winner. Simon Yates, Grand Tour winner. Enric Mas, Grand Tour podium. You know, it's these kind of guys who can win the win these stages now because if you look at how all these other riders are after the finish i mean they're just dead they're crushed and uh the next three stages is going to be more of the same so give us a little we just looked at tomorrow's stage i mean we want people to listen to outcomes and i know

there's a lot and you may have a different opinion than Spencer, so you're going to have to listen, folks. Who is your pick for tomorrow? You won't like to hear it, but Ben Healy. Yes. I mean. Ben Healy. Hey, by the way, no, no, no. I don't like that team.

Is George just – I don't even want to say that. We're Germans. I don't want to. No, no, hold on. I don't like it either. I know. But listen, we're members of the media, believe it or not, folks, and we are not supposed to say that.

So I take that back. But I like this Ben Healy kid. I'm down with that kid winning the stage. Totally. He's aggressive. He's tough. He just never gives – I love him. So I'm down with that.

Yeah, it's a good pick. He's been riding really well, although I'm not sure he's climbing as good as the other breakaway specialists right now. But it's a good pick. They're all Cat 3s. They're all Cat 3s. Yeah, exactly. They're all Cat 3s. The five categorized climbs are all Cat 3s.

They're not that bad. Now, still 3,100 meters at the end of the day so you got to figure out a way to do some climbing but they're not is they're they're not cat twos or cat ones so all right johan thanks for coming on finally took us two and a half weeks to get you on what have you been doing you've been uh just big time in us i mean what well i'm doing jb squared just after you guys so basically i'm waiting until you guys are finished and so jb is that i'm doing JB squared just after you guys. So basically I'm waiting until you guys are finished. And so JB is that I'm doing outcomes and I'm doing La Movida. Oh, anyway.

And of course, Johan is responsible for hooking us up with Sir Bradley for the week. That's right. Which is also why we did not have him on last week. Like we normally check in, but that was quite a treat. Well, there for many, many months, Johan was the only person that Sir Bradley would respond to. Like I'd send him messages like, yeah, WhatsApp says he received it. I guess, I guess I'll just wait. Meanwhile, Johan was always getting the guy to respond.

And I, you know, Johan was our, kept telling him like, I'll believe it when I see it. And coming next week, you know, a good, just over an hour interview you did with Sir Bradley. And really understand his story. It's pretty powerful. Yep. All right, Johan, thank you.

Welcome, guys. Anytime. Yep. All right, coming right up, we got Michael White. Michael White, stick around for that. We got to do something real quick. I know you guys got a lot going on today. Camera's following you up the pass, right? I can't wait for that.

Put your best face on. Put your best face on. But we are going to give away an NS1 on Sunday to one lucky listener. You can enter every single day. The question yesterday was, Matthew Riccatello is a rising star in the pro peloton. His dad,immy was also an endurance athlete what notable event did he win during his triathlon racing career exterior world championships that's right he's won he won he won quite a few races

but i had a feeling the the winning answer would be the exterior world championships great he's good on the mountain bike for a travel yeah and today's question is what is egan bernal's nickname oh do you guys know that offhand look it up send your answer to ventumracing.com the move do you know anybody because bernal's columbian do you know anybody with with Columbian heritage who might know? I think I would know about his nickname. We'll just break? Yes, we're just going to take a break, reset here real quick, and come back with Michael White.

We'll hold on to these questions for tomorrow. Yep. And we'll be right back. Give us one sec. All right, thanks for sticking with us. This is very interesting, especially if you're going to be in the Boulder area and want to participate in something very, very moving. We'll give you details on that at the end of this. But we are now joined by Michael White, who is the father of Magnus White. And it was it was almost exactly a year ago. We're coming up on the anniversary of the unfortunate accident

and death of Michael's son, Magnus, a rising star in the sport of cycling. And we were all here, you know, it was right in between the men's and the women's and we were pretty floored and devastated. But Michael is here to share with us how you're turning it into a positive as best you can. So why don't you start out by telling us a bit about Magnus? You know, obviously a lot of people in this area, especially in Colorado, knew a lot about him, but we have listeners all over the world. So why don't we start with telling us about him and what's going on today? Yeah, well, thank you for having me on today. I listened to yesterday's podcast when I was driving up.

And, you know, when you mentioned, you know, George, your son Enzo, seeing these kids in the Tour de France, Magnus was first starting to talk about that. Right. You know, just recently because he was always focused on dirt. You know, he'd been in two cyclocross world championships, and he was getting ready for his first mountain bike world championship when he was killed.

So he's a special kid. He had best friends all over the world. He spent a lot of time all over the world. Last year when he was killed he only spent two months at home which was you know that's that's hard but for parents right to see your kid living his dream it's awesome you know and he was he was really moving into the road racing world he his last race was the junior tour of ireland finished fifth on the GC and just time bonuses. It was the only difference.

And, you know, he came home and he had, you know, he wanted to come home. You know, like he wanted to spend time with his friends, you know, because he's gone all the time. You know, the day that morning, actually, that he was killed, he was invited to go race the Cormesscy races in Belgium for three weeks after Worlds. And that was his last email was that. It was like, I'm going to take some time off. I need a break. I'm going to race cross season. All that stuff. So he was maturing and he was doing it all himself.

You know, so it was really, you know, see, you know, at that age, to see them really kind of become their own person is special. And just, you know, the nightmare we've been living since, you know, we're coming up on one year. We all know it's a criminal trial. It's a felony homicide trial. The trial is December 16th. It's expected to last five days right before Christmas. You know, and that'll be a year, almost a year and a half, you know, since he was killed.

And that's just grief is hard. And, you know, to have that criminal aspect over it, it just pauses everything. You know, Mags' death, though, was, I mean, it was covered by, I mean, his story was wide covered. Widely covered. Yeah, 3,300 news articles have been written about Magnus. It's mind-blowing. You know, as his parents, we asked ourselves, what do we do with this? We sit back and grieve.

The world would totally respect that. I don't know if Magnus would. That was his attitude. He wanted to get out there and fight. And so that's what, you know, we did. We decided to start this foundation. We didn't know what exactly it was going to be. We knew it was going to be something, but looking at specifically the cases or the aspects that contributed to his death and seeing a lot of the injustices of other cyclists that had been killed and other vulnerable road users that have been killed, it really kind of sparked our initiatives.

And so the first initiative is just simple, quick infrastructure changes. Of course, we're going to support the large infrastructure changes. Those take decades. The road that Magnus was killed on, there have been plans in the works for now 13 years. By the time it's done, it'll be 16 years. And the difference, just real quick, the difference between simple and sort of more complicated, and I don't know the answer to this, but I'm guessing like a more expensive, more elaborate, complicated fix would be elevated or isolated by Glains.

Exactly. We know that infrastructure-wise and expense-wise from either the city, the county, or the state, that's pricey. But even, and we've talked a lot, Michael, about this road, it's just rumble strips. By the way, those aren't free, but much simpler than isolated or elevated. And just a reminder to folks, whether you're whether you're veering in and look we live in 2024 right and and we all ride bikes that most people ride bikes who listen to the show um and and most people that listen to the show drive cars and in 2024 people are tiktok and email and and youtube and or whatever they're doing and And just a simple rumble strip is just, it's just a nudge, a reminder, like, oh, I'm veering

into the shoulder or, oh, I'm going into the other lane. It's just this, it gets people to wake up. That's, you know. And that would have directly affected. Of course. Magnus' case. Because the driver, you know, she fell asleep. There's reasons why she fell asleep and that's for the criminal trial, but she fell asleep.

And would have that woken her up? describe her as swerving you know what uh frightens me when i about this story because i come when i come out here for uh you know this month in aspen i have a very false sense of safety because cycling's so popular here you know i feel safer on the road than i do in austin texas and i think about in Boulder is very similar. It's a cycling Mecca and probably the only city with more infrastructure is Portland. Right. Uh, so these are, you know, I'm talking about three cities who figured it out for the most part and there's still a lot to do. Uh, it makes me think about our listeners and other parts of the country that it's even worse. It was very popular route. he was killed on it's a

two mile stretch that he has to ride back to get you know from one quiet road to the next quiet road just ride it outside of town and we know the the strava stats of people that ride it it's it's insane three percent of all um cycling users in that month rode on that in colorado rode on that stretch of highway but it's a straight road straight road so it's middle of the day 10 foot shoulder straight roads equal danger yeah right if it's if it's you know you're going down a mountain or up a mountain and there's switchbacks it's very difficult to fall asleep but straight roads just lull people into either in her sit in the in the driver's situation falling asleep or it even lulls them into getting distracted and so driving fast

yeah the road road design is terrible that's an absolutely contributing factor to this um i love the fact just i want to go back i love the fact you had a 4.2 gpa i mean we don't need to go around the horn and announce our gpas i will all i will say all of all i will say about gpas just a little light-hearted moment is and this will will probably tell you what my GPA was. I thought 4.0 was the most you could get. I mean, he got more than what I thought you could ever get. Yeah.

Like, I mean, smart kid. Yeah. He had to, his first two years of high school was in person, but since he was traveling so much, high school said,

no, you can't do that. But we have an online version. So he was online school, but he was taking AP courses, honors courses said, no, you can't do that. But we have an online version. So he was online school. But he was taking AP courses, honors courses, wherever they are, right? So he got that credit. So he was doing his school while he was in Europe. Well, and I think for us, and George, you can speak to this better, like having a son.

I mean, George is out here. Enzo is back home training every day. When you're at home, you train with him a lot so you can keep eyes on him. But when you're here, I mean, I would would be i don't have kids that ride like that and like like magnus right but uh if i did and you know max armstrong said dad i'm gonna go for a five-hour ride but i mean i would worry every minute of those five hours yeah for sure i mean yeah it's just uh it's it's part of our sport. I'm constantly concerned about it.

You see me FaceTiming him all the time, tracking him, where he's at. So I can't imagine everything you guys are going through. Yeah, I track him. I track him all the time. So parents do, right? And I actually saw where he was the minute before he was hit. And so let's talk about what we can do i know we've got the ride coming up i'm sure there's other events planned or other calls to

action i think this is a big deal ladies and gentlemen i i think again everybody listening to this show or most everybody uh rides bikes and and that means you're nuts if you're not scared of cars i'm scared i'm terrified of cars and i love it when i got a bike lane like here in aspen with the jb to your point like we have we have bike lanes everywhere and if they're right beside a road even if i've got to dodge strollers or runners or i don't care what i'm dodging if i'm not around cars on a bike lane i'm in like it's just a piece of mind and i go out on the bike to rest my mind and to just sort of wonder and cruise. And the last thing I want to do is be looking back the whole time.

So what other things? I want to talk about the ride because it's August 11th coming up in Boulder. Got the governor coming. We have a lot of folks coming. A lot of folks coming because that's one part we want to change. The second thing we want to change is increasing penalties for vehicular homicide or reckless incarceration driving for injuring or killing somebody. It's a Class 4 felony in Colorado, punishable by a maximum of two to six years.

That's all this driver is going to face, if it even goes to that level. I just made a quick list here of other Class 4 felonies in Colorado. Third degree burglary, identity theft, theft of property, second degree criminal trespass, filing a custody order, abuse of public records, forgery, fraud by check, indecent exposure, and this

one is the greatest one. Criminal tampering with a utility meter to evade payment. Wow. Same level as vehicular homicide. So we want to increase penalties for vehicular homicide. Yeah. Heads up.

Yeah. Not to put people in jail. It's a deterrent. Yeah. Give them a head. Right. Like if you're going to kill somebody. Yeah.

The stakes are high. Yeah. On both sides. Yeah. And the last thing that we're working on, this is Magnus got so much attention on his death. You know, there's documentary crew following our process since early on. And we've followed us throughout the trial.

But we've actually released two episodes now. One was just last week about other cyclists who were killed across the country. First one was about Christian and Michelle Deaton. The folks, the Nike folks. Nike folks out of Napa who were hit and killed. They both died instantly. And then we released one last week about a bicycle shop owner named Michael Ship. He was killed in Manning, South Carolina last year.

And his son had reached out to me on the one-year anniversary. So we released that last week. The injustices that family is facing, you can't even describe what they're facing and how they've been treated by the investigation and the police and the whole legal system. So yeah, a ride, right? Right for Magnus, right for your life. Um, we want this to be, you know, it's important to have this right on the first year. We were convinced of this. This was not initially our initiative. We were approached by, um, a lot of people have been helping us, a lot of organizations, a lot of approached by a lot of people have been helping us a lot of

organizations a lot of individuals our professionals um and we were initially hesitant because like it's emotional right well you're going but you're going past the site yeah i mean i i don't know i mean we're closing all the roads in boulder i'm just you know time just time out as a dad i could not i'm just telling you i just could not do that so kudos to you and strength to you that uh so i hear your uh i can imagine that you would be reluctant i used to go out there for the first two or three months every week every saturday 12 30 when he was hit then i realized it's not where he is right Right. And so now I just go out there to maintain it really like once every four to six weeks, um, just to make sure the bike and the flowers and whatever's out there is, is looking in the foot. We have American flag out

there cause he was killed in his team USA kit. Um, and we had a lot of people have sent, send us American flags, you know flags and really nice letters. So we make sure it just looks really nice. The ride, though, we want 4,000 people in person. I love hearing that. Yeah, it's awesome. That's what State Patrol says. We cap it at 4,000 in person.

We're like, great. Let's go bigger. That's miles and miles long. We're shutting down the whole city. The whole highway is being closed for this, complete closure. There's a virtual ride as well, so you can be anywhere in the country. We're mailing some stuff to Sweden, some number plates. Some people all over the world are doing this.

I think someone in the U.K. is registering to do it. Let's talk to our friends at Zwift. They're doing virtual rides all the time. Yeah. There's a walking option as well on the CU campus. But the ride is 13 and a half miles. So it's not short, but it's pretty flat. And at the end, there's a big, big rally for change.

And this is where we're introducing our legislative asks for coming up in 2025. And those are going to be around automatic emergency braking, national level ask, and all new cars in the next five years. They're doing it for pedestrians. They're not doing it for cyclists. And so we want them to do it for cyclists. We know cars are going to be much smarter than they are right now. So you're not going to get this weird phantom braking that you get now with some of that automatic driving stuff. So we want that in all cars.

And on a state level, we are going to ask for the increased penalties on a state level. That has cars and on a state level we are going to ask for the increased penalties on the state level that has to be on a state level first right um magnus really seems to be this he was the glue actually in our family he was a glue amongst his friends and he seems to be right now this glue amongst all sorts of groups, advocacy groups, national level, I don't even know what they're called, transportation agency, lawmakers, DAs. They all want to be a part of what we're doing because they want change as well. And so Governor Polis is speaking. We've done one press conference with him already.

The head of federal highways is coming in to speak, Shailene Bott. And Trek President John Burke is coming in. And I know he's very much on the advocacy front. But real quick on the films, I just want to make sure people know where to go also to watch the films. The films are all on our website, thewhiteline.org. Whiteline.org. We also all post. Thewhiteline.org. Yes, thewhiteline.org. I.org we also all post the white line.org

yes the white line.org the white line.org if you want to see those two films and our instagram is where we post post all our updates you know about what we're doing and that that handle is the white line.foundation at the white line.foundation yes okay i'm gonna give that a follow somebody had a follow and i'm assuming for our listeners who are not going to be able to participate in Boulder, but would like to contribute, thewhiteline.org is the place to do that. Absolutely. Right. And they can register too.

And do the virtual. Do the virtual. We send them everything that the in-person riders get. And it's free. That's the biggest thing. We're putting this on. We're covering all the costs. It is free.

Right. So there's no reason for people not to do it. Yeah. So this is biggest thing. We're putting this on. We're covering all the costs. It is free. Right. So there's no reason for people not to do it. Yeah, so this is a rally. This is important. Yeah. This is not, yeah, folks, we're not going out and field sprinting here. This is a rally. This is a somber ride.

Yeah. Oh, yeah. But we don't want it to be a sad ride, if that makes sense, right? Yes. Because we want a clear call to action to come out of this for people to get on the phone with their legislatures. Because we have now until the end of the year to get all these legislatures behind us because the cycle and the legislation starts January 1 to May 1.

You know, we get so many questions. It's every year. We get a lot of questions about Americansicans racing in europe americans in the tour where's the americans where's the americans how many americans three americans in this summer's tour which is low for us but with three good ones it's low but hey we got three good ones um and this is you know magnus was was a huge talent right so for those who say well where's the young man? Now we're starting to see them come up and come through.

But he was going to be on this stage, right? I mean, you have to imagine. I mean, you look at his pal Maris, it speaks for itself. Yeah, he was national champion on the U.S. national team. And he was a good kid. Because you can have all the talent in the world and be a bad kid, you don't make it. Yeah.

And you can be a great kid with no talent and you also don't make it. But he had the. He had it up here, too. Yes. Right. So you got to be clever to find your way to the top of the sport. So for those folks at home, like wondering where the Americans are, this should resonate. Right.

And it should also remind you that we see it when the roads are closed, right? It's a dangerous sport. But that's 1% or 2% of people's time, guys' and gals' times when they're in the races that we see on TV or read about in the press. The rest of the time is spent out there on the open roads. It's a big deal. I'm just speaking personally. It can happen to anybody of course and we're talking milliseconds i know we talked about this in boulder yeah i mean if it just quarter second

difference hangs would be 11 feet ahead he was on 30 miles an hour and he was hit yeah and we're all mine whatever it is right like he would be alive we all know how collectively this cycling community all across the country takes their training and their performance so seriously. Why can't we all just put a little bit more time into safety and advocate safety? So it's great what you're doing. And I'm all for it. And if anything I could do personally with my circles, I'd love to help. Thank you.

And we want to do things differently. You know, we are partnering with all the big advocacy groups. Go for Rikes, Bicycle Colorado, League of we are partnering with all the big advocacy groups, go for bikes, bicycle, Colorado, leave American cyclists, all that. They're our partners, but, um, we are parents of Magnus and we're,

we can say things and do things that those groups can't. Of course. Right. And basically it's like, we're not, we're not here to fuck around. Right. We're going to,

you're going to drive in, you're fitting right into the show. We want to drive. Welcome. You've got some move DNA in there. You know, we want to channel the anger of people. Yeah. Right. Like, cause this is not just about cyclists. This is pedestrians too. Right. Like this is all vulnerable road users. I mean, there's 46,000 site, uh, cyclists were hit last year. 46,000. Yeah. So yeah. What does that divide by three 65? Yeah. Come on. Yeah. What is that, divided by 365?

Yeah. That's in the U.S., right? I can't do that math, but let me do it weekly. That's close to 1,000 a week. Any one of those could be a death.

Of course. Dear God. Approximately 67,000 pedestrians were hit. 7,000 pedestrians were killed. That's almost 18% of all

car-related deaths. So it includes cyclists. 20% of all car related deaths so include cyclists 20 of all car car related deaths include vulnerable road users like we have to change this we have to change our culture well let's get after it yeah let's do it starts uh well i'm telling you it's gonna start it's gonna start august 11th yeah 4 000 riders ride for magnus ride for your life august 11th in boulder the white line. That's where registration is, yep. Yep. Or otherwise on the IG at thewhiteline.foundation.

Yeah, thewhiteline. There's somebody else. You know what? Yeah. Y'all use social media experts out there. First of all, put down your social media when you're driving. And when you're done, when you put your car in park, then just search in Instagram or all these things, just search the white line. You'll find it. So Michael, thank you. Can't be, cannot be easy. Uh, to, uh,

I can only imagine, or rather I can't like to, to come on and talk about it. So thanks for making the journey. It's been cool to connect with you, with you and just hear your story. And you're so passionate, which, yeah, you've got some tough days coming up. As your new friend, you've got the 11th, you've got the trial, then you've got, think about that, the ride, the trial, and then Christmas. Holidays are always rough for the most And, and this is a compromised situation. So, um, Godspeed and, uh, we'll do anything we can do to help the white line.org. Thank you guys. Yeah. Thanks for coming. Thank you, Mike. All right, everybody. Well, that was heavy. And it, it was man. I did it. We're all, we're all parents here, right? The three of us.

How many have we got? Tell me. The three? We had nine kids up here, right? So no grandkids, but it's tough. We love bikes. We love kids. We love American talent. This story touched on all of them.

So thanks for listening to that. Thanks for tuning in. And we will see you all tomorrow. This Tour de uh, thanks for listening to that. Thanks for tuning in and we will see y'all tomorrow. This tour de France is almost over.