Theology in the Raw - A Raw Conversation about Manga and the Complex Life of a Creative: Street Hymns

Episode Date: August 21, 2025

Street Hymns is a musical & spoken word artist, writer, producer, & battle rapper. Street has been a regular performing artist at the Exiles in Babylon conferences and is one of the most creative and talented persons I've ever met. He's also working on a series of Manga books for David C. Cook publishers. Search "Street Hymns Battle Rap" on YouTube to see him in action! Join the Theology in the Raw community for as little as $5/month to get access to premium content.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Hey, friends, welcome back to another episode of Theology. My guest today is the one and only Street Hems, who is a musical and spoken word artist, writer, producer, and battle rapper. Street has been a regular performing artist at the Exiles and Babylon Conference, and he's literally one of the most creative and talented people I know. And he's become a good friend over the years. And this conversation is, well, you'll just have to wait and see. It's very, it's not linear.

It's very circular. Both Street and I have a habit of chasing shiny objects as they pop into our head. So that's kind of where we're going. Street is also working on an extensive manga series. And if you don't know what that is, you will soon find out. So please welcome back to the show. They wonder only Street Hems. All right, Street Hymns.

Good to have you back. on the podcast. I haven't seen you since Exiles, which you crushed it, by the way. Do you ever self-assess like your quote-unquote, I mean, performance? Maybe that's not the best, you know, term. But do you walk away from an event, say, man, I think that went really well. Because I think that your last performances, I mean, everything you've done at Exiles has been off the chart. But the last one was just really particularly special in my mind. Yeah. I gauge it off of the response of the audience a lot of times rather than my own, because I'm my biggest critic.

So for me, it's one of those moments where I'm reflecting on how I could have delivered that line better, how I could have performed that moment better and things like that. But, yeah, the overwhelming appreciation that I received after the conference was definitely something. I'm like, oh, wow. I love being able to be used in this way at this time. Because the first few days were easier, you know? And I remember you sent me an email and you addressed, you were having a conversation on church and transgenderism and transitioned. And you were like, hey, you don't have to do a spoken word on this. But if you feel led to, cool. And I didn't have that piece written until that morning.

For me, that used to make me so nervous, dude, when you're like, yeah, I'm, you know, 10 minutes to freaking out on stage, you're like, yeah, I'm almost done. I'm almost done wrapping up my thoughts. I was, hey, you like this line? And he, Chris, cut it over. Yeah, the first time when I didn't know you

that well, the first exiles, I did you write stuff the morning now, but I was so stressed out. But then... You're seeing me walk around practice. Yeah. Yeah, I'm like, I'm Like, what? Man, yeah, that was, I will say that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that's actually gave me the confidence. Mm. Mm.

Mm. to do this big event. I haven't gotten the inspiration to write. Could y'all just pray for me? I'm having people pray for me. I'm setting off times where I'm taking off work and I'm just locking in and attempting to write and nothing came. I didn't get what I was supposed to say until I got on a plane. And then I started writing. Then I met the people at exiles and I was like, oh, this is why. I didn't know what this audience needed. And so if I would have prepared something, rather than constructed something for the individual's high interactions with, I wouldn't have been able to deliver a message at the same potency.

And so it was actually me being able to interact that inspired the work. It was almost like you're getting a live canvas as somebody's preaching. And so that's what it was for me. You're like the eye sculptor that shows up as people are walking around. And you're seeing the art come to life. me having conversations with people that were transgender, me having conversation with people that were affirming, me having conversations with people that were, you know, thinking things through, that inspired it. And I didn't get that until the night before, you know. And so it was one

those things where as a person who definitely loves being able to create, but also being spoken ill of, because not everybody who books you will appreciate the fact that you're creating on the spot. Because that's not how they work. And they'll think that you're not taking it seriously or that you're not caring about it or that you're not prepared. When in reality, I've done the same thing with battle rap. And it actually gave me the confidence of like, you know what? I'm the way that I talk about it now, I plan to procrastinate. And it's like, I'm going to a lot this time near the closest time to the event to write rather than try to make myself do it a month ahead of time and not get the inspiration because the way that my mind works is

the not only the pressure but the intimacy like the social interaction really does fuel the art for me so yeah i've just been able i've been able to really really learn and grow as an artist and as a writer through doing exiles wow dude so so so Because you're, you're such a, I mean, gifted artist, your creativity, it seems to come from almost elsewhere. You know what I mean? Like, it's just, it's downloaded, right? It's not like you're grinding and grinding to create. It's almost like it's this supernatural experience.

It seems like, and this is, this is pretty true of like hardcore creatives, you know? Not people that can create. Everybody can create. But then there's those people that just have this all, like, six cents, you know, whether you're a writer or, you know, a painter or whatever or musician. So for you, so for you that it's not, see, procrastination is like a derogatory term, right? Yeah. But for you, is this how your art typically works?

It's not procrastination. Yeah. It's procrastination in the sense that it's for other people that looks last minute. It's timely, you know? And so I tell people when I, when I have projects with them or when people say, hey, let's work, I emphasize to help me out. Tell me the date. You know, remind me the date. Like, give me the date. And I don't do that because I am trying to, like, pester them. It's me saying, me knowing me and you not knowing me potentially, I need you to help. me out by holding me accountable to a time. Because when the time comes, I'll be ready. I just need to know when the time is. Because if it's just in the air, it's going to stay in the air for me. Because I have a million other things in my mind. And that's like, you know, actually, actually getting clinically diagnosed for ADHD, you know, and actually going through the motions of what that means

as an individual who grew up with this neurodivergent condition and being shamed. for forgetting things often and shaming myself for leaving the keys, leaving my license, me, you know, it's just like, I hate it. And I didn't understand it. And every time something like that would happen, I would be criticized. But the people closest to me gave grace. And it wasn't until I actually started to find out more that I wasn't number one alone. and that also there were tools and encouragements for people like me.

That's when I actually got to actually walk in my strengths rather than focus on my weaknesses. So, yes, I am liable to forget a date because time and the concept of time just works differently in my mind. I understand that now. And I'm liable to forget somebody's name or forget that I have. But for me, experiences in social interaction. is a scary stinks. And so, yeah, man, I've just, as a creative, I'm understanding that the gift of what I'm able to do comes with burdens, but I'm focusing more on the strength of it rather than the things that hold me back. Because the things that hold me back, I have people that cover me in those things. You know, I'm not ashamed to ask for a reminder. And I'm not ashamed when somebody reminds me. Like, as somebody who's ADHD, Like, I cannot be offended when somebody's like, I kid you not. I've forgotten weddings.

And then my friends are like, hey, you're on your way, right? And I'm like, thank you. And I'm on my way at that moment, you know. And I've had the wedding on my reminder. I've gotten this four or five things. I can't. To the person who doesn't have the condition, it sounds like you don't care. But I'm like, I promise you I care.

My mind is elsewhere. Is that a symptom of ADHD or a symptom of you being hyper-creative? Or is it both? Because I know some friends with ADHD that aren't to that extreme, but they're not like hyper-creative either. Yeah. So it's more so hyper-focused. Okay.

And so it's tough to say, and this is the misconception about ADHD, it's like, oh, I'm focused on things I care about. necessarily. It's just what I'm focusing on I'm caring about. And so what the misconception is is that because I'm not focused on the wedding, I didn't care about it. When really I saw a beetle, it interests me. Now I spent 30 minutes researching beetles. And then I'm like, oh, snap, I forgot about this. I forgot to take the trash out. I forgot to do the dishes. And it's not until I focus on the dishes where I'm like, okay, now I'm locked in. But even that focus on something that is not currently stimulating me, not so much not interesting me, but stimulating me.

It's just hard, you know, sometimes like structuring things, ordering things, reordering things. So yeah, I think it looks different and different people, but the misconception is that it's a it's a care model of like, oh, because you missed out on this, you didn't care. It's like, I promise you, I cared. And that was the thing that I have the blessing of having friends who are gracious and loving of me to understand me that, like, if they really want me somewhere, they're going to remind me two or three times. And I never feel offended about it.

And I actually enjoy, I'm like, thank you so much for continuing to remind me about this, because I really did want to come. That's good to know, yeah. That's such a helpful distinction because I don't, I've experienced a little bit of what you're talking like I get that when I get law especially I mean for me writing okay when I when I there's been days just yesterday I got up at 6 a.m. and I was glued to my computer till 6 p.m. really I went to the I have to force myself well first of all that's terribly unhealthy at 49 years old to be sitting for that long and so my bad I have like major lower back problems because of

So I, um, they've been telling me like, every half hour, even if it's 15 seconds, just do some squats or something, just move. So I, I, I, I've had to force myself to, but if I did, if I, if I didn't like force myself to think of moving, you know, like I would literally be, and I've done that. I've been, I've been literally like not moved for like six hours straight, just like absorb in it. So I, um, but I don't have, but for you, it seems like it's all of life is like that. For me, it kind of just comes down to maybe writing, uh, but, but I've been misunderstood the same way. Like, what? You didn't care? Like, you know, my mom's like, you didn't call me back for like a week. You know, I'm like, oh, my gosh. Yeah. It's not because I didn't care. It's just

I was so absorbed in other things. Yeah. And I think about neurodivergence, too, because especially for older people, have it, just were never diagnosed. The couple of things come in to play. One thing is mirroring. I act like what people are acceptable of. So I, I, I shadow the self of me that's more natural. So people want me to show up this way. People need me to act like this. So I'm going to portray this so I'm more accepted in society. You know, you see this a lot with people with autism. They attempt to socialize and do what other people are doing when it's really not natural to them. They'd rather be doing something else. So I think, especially for older people, it's not the fact that you're weird.

It's just you're different. And that difference, being affirmed in that difference and actually putting a label to it and showing you that it's not just something where it's like, I'm emotionally off. It's no, you're chemically different. You have a actual, the way that your brain is functioning and wired. It's just literally different than how the average person's brain is. And that's okay. And I've been encouraging, like, a lot of my older friends to actually go get, you know,

see a psychiatrist and get clinically diagnosed for anything, you know, because at the end of the day, you know, not just for the aspect of medication, but just for the education of it and how, oh, wait, yeah, I realize now when I work out and I'm more consistent that my day goes better, you know, and that happens for most people anyways, but for me it's like starting out with the discipline of working out and that repetition, like I go to HotWorks every morning and they already have the video prepared for me and it's to the point where I can quote what the people are on the screen or saying because I'm so consistent with it, you know, and because of that consistency, it actually has helped other disciplines in my life as well. So yeah, man, I mean, I would have

thought you were a neurodivergent, honestly. Like, I'm not going to lie. I might, I've never, I've never I would have thought that just because like the way is that why is that I'm curiously yeah the way your mind works the way you're able to chase rabbits you know what I'm saying but also get back on topic um and and yeah just the it's it seems different you know but I also see how a lot of times you're talking for the sake of people understanding so it may not be a natural flow of what you want to do but you know so I don't know I always thought I always thought it maybe is dirt enough Well, I've got a couple of close friends that said, I'm pretty, two, I won't name them, but two really, really close friends who said, I'm pretty sure you have ADHD. They both do, and they're like, yeah, you're, it takes what? I would have assumed that with you, man. Maybe I do. I'm probably off the chart ADHD.

When were you diagnosed just recently? Yeah, yeah. It was, it was in the peak of, um, an emotional irregulation season for me. I was in a relationship and what I realized was things that I naturally did

were beginning to become offensive. And so forgetting important dates, not acknowledging certain things, but never doing it intentionally. And I'm sitting here like, wow, like I hate that this is happening, but I

can't explain why it's happening without sounding like a lunatic yeah i'm just like man i i would actually love to have a covering medically you know and so i go in for a check engine light you know i'm saying of the oil change come to find out it's like five six other things on the charts i'm like what the world's going on i just i'm like i'm not going on i'm not going to lie your breaks shot, your traneity's an overhaul. I was mad at him too. I'm like, nah, do it. Take it again. Do it again. Do the brain test again. And they was like,

sir, this is the science. Like, where you? Do you, were you you, you don't need to say but are you on medication and does that help then with your Yeah, so I'll say this much. I, after being diagnosed

officially, I didn't go to the best physicians. And I actually thought about, you know, suing, but it was a very, very, very non-productive experience for me emotionally to the point where I have the people on staff that were like, yeah, this shouldn't have happened. I don't know why, but the person who diagnosed me, which was a nurse practitioner, they just had an issue with me personally.

And I was like, I'm just here to get well. you know, and it was a lot of runaround. So I never got to the point. I had the prescription ready, but I never bought the actual, I never bought the actual medicine. But what I did do was in the wake of that, I went and got some Elthianine drinks and supplements. And those have been helped me out a lot. So I've been actually replacing it with Elthianine. What's that? Ltheonine. I've never heard of that. Yeah, it's, I couldn't tell you what it is medically, but it's, it's all natural substance and I take some like if it might help you as well like it's just something it helps just lock in I take a I go to sprouts it's like a $15 bottle and or whole foods they got

like $15 bottles and I take like three of those pills and I'll be good to go man all natural L dash the anine and it's also in that focus gum that new focus gum the sugar free gum everybody's raving about oh really yeah really good for focus man so I try to do the natural way but I'm also not opposed to the medicinal. I've seen other people benefit greatly from it. Yeah. As a general approach to those things, I always try to say, is there a natural option first? I'm not opposed to medication, but I think our society is hypermedicated, right?

We just rush to synthetic stuff, which again, again, I'm not opposed that. It's just like, are there natural ways to do it? I mean, I mean, exercise is a huge one. People that struggle with depression, this, that. I'm like, all right, tell me about your exercise routine. It's like, yeah, I don't exercise. I'm like, that's probably where you should start, you know. Exercise is right, man.

Exercise is a guy. Man, so I don't know how. I don't know who would take this conversation specifically somewhere. Well, with, apparently, we're going to be chasing lots of shiny objects. So I hope our audience could hang on. So, yeah. So, man, so this last year. year, especially even during the time I did exiles, I was a substitute teacher. And I was a substitute

teacher for a middle school. And it actually was highly beneficial for me because I did it in the midst of needing to pay the bills and not being as booked as frequently as I was the year before. And I'm like, I love kids. And 13, 14 age group, that's been kind of my wheelhouse since I graduated high school. And so I was a substitute teacher at my local middle school. And number one, it was beneficial because I am writing a manga and this is literally the age group that will be reading it. It's like I'm in the class seeing other kids read other mangas and like being and joining that. And also just to understand the climate of where our culture is at and where it's going. And it was a beautiful experience.

I'll tell you this, Preston. I couldn't tell you what the counselor's office was for when I was in middle school or high school. Like it was for me, it was like the person to help. you schedule. These kids, they go to the counselor's office because they will literally say, I'm depressed. I have anxiety. I can't even. And then they get a pass to there and they're playing Uno in the counselor's office. You know what I'm saying? It's also, the counselor is like over, most middle school counselors are overwhelmed because students know how to communicate emotional trauma for the sake of getting out of class and going there. And so it's one of those

balances where, like, how do I affirm while also being logical to the fact that, okay, even though you may be anxious, I don't want you to develop a crutch of allowing this to be something that whenever I feel this, my immediate response is to isolate, is to run, is to not deal with it and actually involve myself in whatever I was going through before. And so it's a tough thing because for the average teacher that's dealing with a repetitive student who's emotionally regulated by what they're saying, it's easiest just to let them go rather than deal with them in the classroom. So I'm seeing a lot of teachers and a lot of educators that have been 20-plus year educators that typically retire in the field. They're just like, I'm done. I can't do this anymore, especially in Title I schools.

and being a black man in the education system in a Title I school, essentially, it was almost like I was a hot commodity. It was like, man, like, thank you so much for being here. Your presence alone has been impactful as a man, number one. And for me, I'm like, wow, I didn't even realize it to where when I go and do exiles, I come back, they're like, thank you so much, Mr. West. We missed you. And I'm like, let's go over four days, you know. The school felt it. Oh, my God.

So it definitely is one of those things that I feel as though I see this split between emotional intelligence and emotional knowledge. Emotional intelligence is defined by the ability to respond to emotions that are taking place. But I think people think they're emotionally intelligent, but really they're this emotional. knowledgeable. They're able to recognize what emotions are there or able to see what's happening inside themselves, but not actually deal with it. And so I think that split is causing a lot of people to be comfortable rather than actually go through and work through what they're dealing with. And I don't know, especially with the children, I love being able to be someone who is artistically or even abstract creatively challenging that concept just so we can help our kids grow

and also help our adults grow in that as well. I do worry about, and you're in this a lot more than I am, although I have four Gen Z kids and with friends and everything. So I'm in that world. And I am concerned about the, for lack of better terms, the sort of fragility. that seems to be accepted. So there's a famous book, famous in scholarly circles, called Anti-Fragile by Nassin Telab.

He's a, I don't know, philosopher, social, something. But he talks about just humans were anti-fragile, meaning we get stronger when we face what he calls stressors in life, resistance. And there's that famous analogy

of the trees in the dome, you hear about this, where they planted the trees in a dome with no wind to see how they would grow. I don't know what the purpose of it was, but they realized that trees were just fallen over because they need some wind. They need some stress to cause their roots to grow deep. And with no stress, the roots didn't go deep and they toppled over. And, you know, it's an analogy for human nature. You know, our muscles will atrophy if they're not have if they don't have pressure. Our immune system will be weak if it's not faced with challenges. And I do worry that, you know, younger people, if they face any kind of discomfort, they think something's wrong. Like, I need to get out. I need to get out of this discomfort. And I just think

it's producing, generally speaking, more fragile rather than anti-fragile people. And the other thing too is there you know if if everything's trauma then nothing's trauma you know so so if a kid you know receives a bad grade even though they thought they should have had a better grade you know I got a C minus and I should have it a B plus and I'm traumatized by that it's like well then what word you used of the kid who's being molested by his father you know like yeah yeah you can't have the same word for both so it is it is trauma is like the impact you know it's it's how it impacts you and the level to which, which is why those adjectives usually come ahead of it. You know, what type of trauma is it?

But, yeah, man, I think it's just a response to boomers, millennials. On the other side of the spectrum, we didn't feel. We didn't feel. We didn't deal with our stuff. We didn't have the luxury too. It's like, you get up, you go to work, you die. You know? And so the kids are like, I don't want to be that.

and instead of acting like, I don't feel, because imagine you being pressured to do all the work and just overcome your emotions and be more like me. And then the kids are looking at you and you're like, you don't even know how to feel. You're super unhealthy. I don't even have the example of what you're telling me. You're just telling me I'm not strong enough. You're just telling me I'm weak. You're just telling me.

And I'm like, at least I'm not you. you know what I'm saying like and and that's I think that's their response and talking to Gen Z you know I think that they're in a place where they're realizing that the template and the model that was given which was do it like us and do it like this yeah it's it's needed it worked but the results of where it worked towards they're not comfortable with it's like I can actually get everything you're talking about without going to college. I just got to make a lot of good content. And I can be from my house.

So I never actually got to leave the comfort of my own home so I can be comfortable and successful. Your version of success was uncomfortable success. Every person I'm watching on YouTube and the TikTok, they're comfortably successful. I want that. And so it's because it's accessible, we now, it's newly accessible too. Like, comfortable success is a very, very foreign concept to humanity. Yeah.

You know what I'm saying? Like, actually having the average person had the ability to, if I'm an 80-year-old grandma and I'm just funny enough, I can become a content creator. If I am a child or I'm a parent who has a funny child or an interesting child, I can become a content creator. I never have to leave the comfort of my home and I can actually inspire people. I can be a celebrity. Celebrityism is more accessible than it has ever been in any time in history of humanity.

And so with that capability, it almost incentivizes people to not have to deal with things. It's because it's comfortable. And those stressors being able to avoid the stress, you know, and I understand why people are avoiding of stress. stress, soft life promoting, you know, easy, breezy life, those concepts. And I'm like, man, I love that for you. I said, I just don't have that luxury. And people are confused when I say that. I'm like, I work with kids. I work with juveniles. I work in Title I work in urban settings. Like, you can't go into a juvenile detention center and think I'm going to live the soft life. These kids need help still. And I know that the moment I walk in, I'm going to be

rejected. I'm going to be cursed at. I'm going to be, I'm going to be stressed. And that's why I'm signing up because that's all that they know how to output. But when I go in there and I'm a foundation that is unwavering and my roots are deep, they then have something they can cling on to when things go bad. You know, and so I have, you know, been in this weird place of like, I get why people are the way that they are and I understand it, I'm just not for Christians to fall into that because this successful life apart from suffering is not what Jesus promoted. You know what I'm saying? Like there's a level of suffering that we all have to endure because that actually is what produces perseverance and endure. Like those things.

that we look at and it's like these are these are things that define the Christian for us to be able to persevere and endure we have to be able to go through something in the season we're in so that the next season we're going to we're able to overcome because of what we've already been prepared in and to say that I'm able to be comfortable and not actually have to endure anything yet I'm I'm still defining as a Christian and saying that I can actually have all these things without the suffering. Yeah. I think that is the American dream currently that a lot of Christians are falling for.

And so I think it's one of those things where, man, what if we're called to be in the places that people are now avoiding them in because it's uncomfortable? You know, and that's where we need to show up at because that's where people are needed. Because even in those comfortable spaces, people are still dealing with things that they now are afraid to even communicate online. Now they actually never had to be challenged in, and the moment they are challenged, their whole identity is shattered.

You know, and they had this crash out. And it's like, yeah, so, yeah, man, it's an interesting, it's an interesting place. But I'm more encouraged because I'm also seeing a lot of Gen Z creatives that are unabashedally ashamed and killing it for Christ right now. And those are who I'm like, I can't wait to promote.

can't wait to give the mic to. I can't wait to show off to the world. You know, so I'm, I'm encouraged by the next generation as well. Speaking of creative, let's, let's chase another shiny object. You mentioned in passing that you're, you're writing, I hope this is the right phrase, writing a manga. Is that? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay. For those who don't know what manga is, um, it's, it seems like everybody outside of America knows a manga, but even in America, it's a lot. It's kind of like either it is everything or you never heard of it, it seems Yeah, absolutely. Is that, is that, it's almost like to. You have a 14 year old, you know what it is. You know, okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Most kids are like, that's, that's life right now, man.

Manga, anime, people call manga as well, either one's right. It's just comic books. It's a Japanese style comic book. Yeah. Yeah. So it's a specific, is it the, is it the, simply the artistry that makes it manga versus not manga or is it the storytelling like oh for someone for the 40% listening that might have never heard of it go like we know nothing explain to us what manga yeah i'll use this analogy that they'll understand um the separation between a comic book and a manga is the same between a doll and an action figure you know okay it's just like hey don't call a doll. It's like, this is an action figure. It's like, cartoon and anime. It's like, to you, you just see a cartoon. It's like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, don't just talk with a cartoon. This is

anime. You know what I'm saying? Like, anime is like the final product or the end goal for a lot mangakas as manga creators, manga authors, which is my comic book has now become a anime. But a manga just means comic in Japanese. The manga culture, it's definitely a style and genre. It's definitely a style and genre, you know, and they've been doing it for as long as the culture's been alive. I actually had the opportunity to travel to Japan last year with the Amasins. And we did a whole tour of all Japanese art and in periods that were 500, 600 years ago. And these artists were doing manga. They were doing panels on boards. And even, um, uh, what? I got to go see what's called a kabuki.

And a kabuki is basically a Japanese play. And the actors within the play, they have some lines here and there, but mostly it's narrated. And the narrator's next to an instrumentalist who's like, you know, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, d' ding, d' ding, d'oy. You know, and then in the background, you have people making certain noises and playing certain instruments as well. but what's interesting is is that as the kabuki's going on and this play's happening

the people are doing movements that are very almost robotic and they're doing lines and I was wondering why it's because they're essentially doing panels. Each movement itself, if you go see that play 20 times it'll be done exactly the same

20 times because what they're doing is they're almost doing thumbnails of each movement that you can capture and that's the moment. So it's like they're creating manga even in like the movement of their plays. Like that's how their, that's how their culture is. So to, to know that a lot of the animas and manga are still involving those same cultural concepts that are thousand years old, it's just so cool just to kind of see their history of things that I grew up watching. I heard these

sounds. I heard these, I heard narrators. Like the common, every, every manga and anime has a narrator in it. And I'm just thinking, oh, that's just something that. cartoons. It's like, no, like, that's something their culture does. So it's just pretty cool. But essentially, I'm working on a manga. It's not traditional in the Japanese style because Japanese script is written right to left. And so mongas are read right to left. And so we would call the book backwards, but really it's frontwords for them. We're going to do a manga, but it's going to be left to right. I'm not an illustrator. So I'm a manga author. Like, I'm just a storyteller. So I have an illustrator.

But it's been a joy just to be able to learn fantasy writing, delve into the world of creative writing, and find discipline and consistency in the writing process. It's something that as someone who has a heart for Gen Z and Gen Alpha, I see what common mongas are being promoted. Very few kids I meet don't know what manga. is. And most of them own something. Yet, never do the parents actually vet what the kids are reading or vet what the kids are watching. Yet every single manga that's out right now typically has over-sexualization, vulgar content, very, very gruesome content as well. And this isn't a diss to Japanese culture, but when we don't understand where, you're we're getting our information from and things that they are finally acceptable that we may find

different. For example, Japan just raised their age of consent to 16 years old. Really? Two years ago. They raised it to 16 years old. Because it was at 13 years old. The age of consent. Age of consent for sexual relationships, is you saying? Or 13? Look it up. Wow. Yeah. So this is, so. So, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, it's, so, it's, it's, it's, it's okay to have sexualization.

So there's a, there's a, there's a popular manga called chain, so. all man. And it's really just about a kid. He's like 15 years old. And his whole mindset and his whole ideology is, I want to grope women. And so his whole thing is like, I'm willing to fight demons. I'm willing to, because I know at the end of the road, I'll be able to cop a feel. That's literally the, it's very, very popular. Is manga always directed towards kids? Or is there like adult manga? So essentially, so there's different. So there's Semen, which is adult. there is Shonin, S-H-O-N-E-N, which is the genre I'm in, which is young boys. Shon-N-N- is young boys.

And then you have Sho-Joe. So it's one of those things where there's something for young girls, something for young boys, and there's something for adults. But it's mainly teenage, young teenagers. The most popular manga are Shonin. Yep. So most of the manga you're going to know about or hear about are all Shonan, which is young boys promoted boys yeah but it within most girls love shonen but there are um designed for like you have things like sailor moon which is a classic um uh manga that or anime that was created for young women

and it's like the mostly female cast of superheroes and in people that are you know very talented and so um typically but the most popular genre amongst all of them is shown in. And so because of this, what is being promoted to young boys, in my opinion, I didn't have the mindset or filter of, oh, what I'm watching may not be appropriate for my age right now. When I started watching it at the age, I was watching it. It's just, oh, yeah, every now and again, a kid will run, fall down the stairs, and end up

in a woman's bosom. And then next you know, his nose is bleeding because he's like, like infatuated withers, like, you know, like that's, for me, it happens in every almost every single. Oh, yeah. But it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's not to say that I, I'm not, I'm not, I'm against exploring what sexuality is, um, happening within young boys or young women. I'm not, I'm not anti that, like what, what it means to have conversations about this because that's something that also. those kids are thinking about. But I think to have it in a way that has been commonly

over-sexualizing the female and the male at that age without any filter or parental advisory and being called Shonen to where it's like, oh, this is 14 plus. When a parent sees that, I don't have to read it. I can just trust the label. This is 14 plus in Japan. And we don't have the same standards as them, but we don't change the label. You know, so. Is it something of it can some of it be not just overly sexualized but overtly pornographic or is that not oh yeah that's that's called hentai yes it's just a that's not going to be shown in that's called hentai it's it's yeah it's just porn yeah there's i mean obviously yeah there's a there's a lot of that as well but that's not marketed to kids or is it kids get a hold of it i'm sure

obviously it's a little harder in japan yes i think it's easier uh yeah 16 you can before I guess 13 you'd be able to. But yeah, I think it's one of those things where it's accessible, you know. I knew about it back then. I wasn't my thing, but I knew about it back then as well. And if you want to find it, you can. But there are moments that are sexualized and overly sexual within even just regular Shonen. And yeah, so it's one of those things where you just have to understand the culture

while also, in my opinion, I'm like, I would love to be able to offer the beauty of a character finding himself in identity and struggle and the joy and the pain of friendships and adversity and overcoming an enemy that is literally trying to destroy you and having these biblical themes and biblical foundations of storytelling similar to a token or a Lewis. I wanted to do that without having all the other things that would. be flagged within my own conscience and within, you know, just regular parental advisory standards. So I wanted to give Gen Z a gift of a manga that they could enjoy. That's awesome. So the over-sexualized piece, is it mainly heterosexual or does it, is it also the same sex? Yeah, I forgot what the genre is called for male-on-male and girl-on-girl. but that's actually a very, very popular and growing genre right now, man. It's called Splice of Life.

It's a slice of life, I'm sorry, slice of life. And it's, it's a, what's funny is it's literally just almost like watching a streamer. It's not so much different than just seeing somebody live an average life. And a lot of people are using that as escapism because it's either affirming them in their reality or affirming them in reality that they would like to enjoy. You know, seeing a kid fall in love with somebody who doesn't love them back and having to fight through that. And it's not any superpowers.

It's not, it's just literally just a kid living in their life. That's a very, very popular and growing genre right now. But you also do have your same-sex attracted and explorative within the identities manga as well. And those, I think, are doing well, but not, like, blowing up. like Slice of Life is doing very well during this time period. And what's funny is the culture of manga is very, very interesting because everyone watches the anime already and we know what happens, we know how it ends, we know what's going on,

yet we'll still go by the manga because it's something that we're a part of the culture and we need to take something back with us so we can have in our house. And so even though you've probably never even read the manga or you do, you just want to have it your hand, though you already saw the episode, and it's just the same thing, because you can relive it yourself. It's something special about, it's like the culture is truly beautiful, and for America to be so enticed by it and delving into it the way it has, for me, I have been that person myself. I am that person myself. I love anime. And I see the impact it has on people. And I see the impact it had on me as an individual searching for identity and trying

to find himself. And seeing this young kid named Narutu overcome all the stuff he did while also being rejected by everyone, yet still never giving up. For me, that was like, that was my identity. Like I was doing Roshang guns in youth ministry. Like, you know what are you doing? Like this kid's weird. I'm like, you know, you don't know, man. I'm Noro. Who's in my team? You know, believe it. So just so to understand So it is a physical comic book primarily.

There's also movies that When the physical copy of the book is translated, it's almost like a book to screen. It's just the anime

is the animation version of a manga. I mean, similar to Marvel, right? Or Marvel, whatever these are comics. They started as a physical comic book, now they're a movie.

But there still is this like the physical copy is actually still seems primary. You're saying Oh, they're high selling books right now. Really? Yes. And it's the, out of every genre,

they're scaled, I think, to have like a 20% increase in the next five years. It's wild, man. So for believers, I'm like, this is a wide open, you know what I'm saying? A net of people

and kids that want something. the company I'm signed to is David C. Cook, their highest selling asset within their company is their action Bible. Yeah. Is that their Bible that has comics in it? Is that, that's not manga, right? No, not at all. But it's, it's, it's comic. I mean, it's, it's not manga. It's not manga. It has, it has comic strips in it and they had an amazing artist do it. But it's one of those things where kids want to see the pages move. They want to feel it. Like, what did David look like?

What did his face look like when he threw the sling back? And, you know, what did Goliath? You know what I'm saying? Like, to be able to feel it, it's truly is a, it's a beautiful genre, man. And you'll see the difference as you kind of study what a comic book is and what a manga is. You'll see the difference in how the flow is. It's very, very, not as dynamic at times, but it's more allowing the story to fluidly go through each panel, from one panel to the next so that it just feels like a fluid, a fluid, like you're almost, you can picture the anime in your head, you know, and so, yeah, I truly love the genre and I can't, I can't wait to actually give what we've been working on to the world, man.

Are there other, so if this is this popular, are there other Christians producing not necessarily Christian manga, but just not overly sexualized and, you know. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. There's, I mean, there's a lot of good, there's a lot of good anime and manga out there that doesn't have any of that, you know. But also, I think people can be overly critical, for example, like, if you saw, if a parent walked in on a child watching a scene of a manga or anime and they see a bunch of men. in a bathtub naked, they'll be like, turn this off. Yet when I went to Japan and I was in my hotel, that's what we did. We were all naked and we all hopped in a bath together. Really? Like a bathtub or a hot tub? Culturally, it's like you think it's a bathtub. It's like a pool. It's like a warm pool. And it's a bathhouse. And so the men bathed together and the

women babe together. And so when I was there, went in Rome. I'm like, all right, why not, man? And nobody's, it wasn't weird. It was just like, it was culture. And just seeing like all these, all these men, you know what I'm saying, like just be able to just take the shower, go to the bathhouse, chill for a little bit, go to the son and then go back to their rooms. It's just, that's culture for them. So I also see how something that we're not familiar with can be overly sexualized from our perspective. But, Yes, there's actually Christian Mongaka. There's Christian manga creators. Ink for Saints, Tharo, the kid, he's dropping some really, really great stuff. My original illustrator, crazed Kai, she's killing it. Yeah, it's a lot of people that are actually taking faith foundational concepts or even outwardly expressive faith-based manga and doing amazing stuff with it, man. I just think that the issue, is, in my opinion, and I'm pretty sure you've seen this as well, there are very, very talented

writers. And specifically, this is my issue with Christian media. When it comes to fantasy, I don't think that they would have signed C.S. Lewis if he didn't have a following today. you know so it's a lot of people that are great content creators and even great creators within the fantasy realm or the or the or the mythical realm or the manga anime realm or whatever may be but they wouldn't get their opportunity from most companies that are Christian media because they don't already have a prior following and so I think it's a lot of people that are missing out on being signed missing out on being funded missing out on being promoted because they aren't vival. But here's the thing. You can't name me a single fantasy creator that wants to

actually do stuff online because they're socially awkward. That's what you get with fantasy creators. They were rejected in the real world so they had to create their own world. So no, they're not going to like social media. George R. Martin just happens to do stuff. So yes, he'll show up to do stuff because he's getting paid. He doesn't want to be out. He doesn't care about that? You know what I'm saying? J.K. Rowland doesn't want to be on social media like that. It's just so happy that this is where people are at. So he has something to say. Most people that are great fantasy authors are weird in real life. And they don't really care about people like that. But I think because we're missing on that aspect and seeing that in the church, these people who are

neurodivergent, the people who are socially awkward, the people who are nerds, If they present you with this script, if they present you with this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, like, it's, bro, I'm telling you, man, I am so blessed to be able to be with David C. Cook. And, like, I do have a general following, but they're taking a lot of chances and risk with me, you know. And it's been a blessing, man, to work with them and what's called Crux Studios, C-U-R-X. It has been truly something that I've become a better writer. I've become a better man. I've become a better disciplined person through the process of writing and just the ability to really, really delve into the story.

and here's the best part, Preston. In my entire time writing, they have never challenged me on story. Oh, that's so great. Like, for me, that's gold. To know that I can, this isn't a Christian manga, it's a faith, it's a faith foundational manga. That's what I call it. You know, to know that I can talk about sorcery, I can talk about witchcraft, I can talk about, you know, transhumanism, and address these things.

in a manga about a young tentmaker who's been chosen to lead his tribe and everyone doubts him including himself, that's so beneficial to me because I'm like, I have the freedom to write knowing that I'm trusted from a theological standpoint that I'm not going to do something anti-church or against the church. But I do want to allow my manga to be on the shelf next to popular manga, not on the Christian section. You know, I want to be in the school system being sold in schools and certain things can't be sold in schools based on their religious perspective. So I'm like, I want to be able to impact the world, the marketplace. And so, yeah, man, I do think that I know some amazing creatives. But I also think that the reason they

haven't, they're not known yet is because they're not being supported yet. And they're not being supported yet because they're not being supported yet. Publishers are, they're in a tough spot. Yeah. You know, and David, Maybe, like, I would affirm that because I'm on my, I don't know how many books with David C. Cook, by third of a three-book contract. And they- I've heard of some cool stuff, man. I know I can't talk about it, but I heard you're working on some good stuff, man.

I'm working on, no, everybody knows. I'm working on, I'm a couple weeks away from submitting my final draft of my book on women of leadership, which is. Oh, okay, you can talk about it. Okay, cool. Oh, yeah, yeah. No, I don't tell people where I've landed. they'll have to read the book to find out.

And that's not, I just, I don't, I want people to pay attention to the content and argument and not be so absorbed with the conclusion before they open the book. It's going to get out before the, you know, I'm not, I'm not so adamant about keeping it as. Well, yeah, I'm going to try to keep it a secret. But, but, yeah, Davy C. Cook, they've been, they've, they've given me such a long leash on everything I've written. My books don't fit their typical genre. Like right now, I probably have 500 footnotes in this manuscript. I used to have a thousand. I cut about 20,000. No, I probably cut almost 30,000 words, but they still allow me to write a fairly long, heavily footnoted book.

You know, my writing style is still very conversational, but I'm dealing with like some nitty, gritty, exegetical stuff that's not what they typically produce they let they allow me to bring my own personal editor in like he's built into the contract they they work with me on all i mean such a long leash because they have said and i believe them they've demonstrated it they're like we believe in who you are you don't need to fit into this box of you know a typical author because you don't fit that box so we want you to be you and they have repeatedly said you you be you we want to support what you are doing. So that's, but you know, publishers are, they do have to sell books to keep the lights on. How do you sell books? Well, when you get a proposal from somebody with

100,000 followers in Instagram, you know you're going to sell thousands of books without putting a dime toward your own publicity. And yet, just because somebody has a big following on social Media doesn't mean they're necessarily a gifted writer with a really amazing argument or content that the church needs to embrace. So I've heard publishers say, you know, they have these kind of three tiers of authors. You have your top, top, top tier that pay the bills, the Francis Chan's, the Andy Stanleys. Then you've got a whole range of mid-level authors. I would probably belong somewhere in there. You know, they're going to sell 10,000,000 copies maybe. They're not going to keep you afloat, but they're, you know, they're going to sell something.

Then they do have this lower tier people with little to no following. Maybe they're a first time author, but they've got a really good idea. And I think most publishers will say we do, you know, we want to kind of roll a dice with these. We don't know. They might sell 500 copies. Maybe it'll take off. Maybe it'll be like the shack, which nobody wanted, you know. And it became, you know, sold millions of copies or whatever.

Or Wild at heart, John Eldridge, you know. that book sold millions of copies and it was like I think all through word about nobody thought it would do anything so even from a financial standpoint those those that lower tier first time authors people with no previous following little previous following you know they could end up

paying the bills but I just the system I don't know how else to do it because they do have to pay the bill they have to they have to sell books but I think that exploring fantasy man. Like, it really does shock me to think that Christian publishers probably wouldn't have worked with Tolkien, you know? I think cook would. I think cook would. And also, I don't know if

you know this, but I'm partially signed to cook because of you. Well, yeah, I do. I connected you with them. Yeah, yeah. Well, more so me doing exiles and me being asked to do exiles is how the people that cook knew me. So when I pitched my book to them, they were like, we won't even need to see anything just bring them on it was just like we told i think i i i know i told them about you i don't know if that was before they heard you or after i think it was before oh wow you told you told me that you're working on something and i you know i i remember again i made they might have been after it might have been before but i told michael the publisher there i was like hey you got to keep an eye on this guy this guy is doing really good stuff hey man okay hey next time we go off wings and beer

man. I didn't know it. I was like, man, getting signed is easy. Within an hour they hit us back. It was like, oh yeah, we're in. I think once they heard you, they're like, this guy is on to something here, you know? Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'll say, man, like I said, exiles prepared me for the long writing journey because before exiles, I wouldn't even call myself a spoken word artist. so funny. I didn't know that. I thought you did a spoken word. Yeah. You saw me new battle rap. I was like, oh, he can, he can do poetry, so let's bring him on. And I was like, okay. I think this might have been a, a white boy blunder. I probably didn't know the

difference between batter rap and spoken word. Like, oh, look at him fighting spoken battle words and stuff. Can you do a spoken something in my conference? Yeah, but now, man, like I, now I've, I don't limit myself anymore, man. Like, through, through music, I started doing battle rap. Through battle rap, I started doing spoken word. The spoken word, I became an author. You know, it's just one of those things. I'm like, all right, Lord, like, where do you need me?

Send me, I'll go. You know, but to the point, I do believe that fantasy is something that Christians, I don't believe we stopped in. I just don't even know of the Christian content creators or the Christian creators of fantasy that really need to be heard right now. And I would love to know them. You know, I just think that the tough part about being a fantasy author is you get so caught up in the world you create that you forget to even push it to the world sometimes. You know, and I had the blessing of having a team around me.

It's like, hey, deadlines. Hey, how far are we in this? Hey, check in. Hey, quick touch to the manuscript. That's illegal. My bad, man. I thought this would be a better thing to say that this. And I was like, sorry, y'all.

It's a learning process, man. That's funny. Do you think, I mean, the common critique is Christian fantasy writers or even Christian, you know, fiction writers and stuff. Their stuff is too on the nose. It's more Christian than art. You know, Christian movies and these. things and um but there's got to be christians who are actually jk raleigh and level creative writers right um yes i like i would i would be remiss to not think that it's not it's not like

somebody's doing it right now it's just it anybody who work with them will be taking a major risk and that and that's the issue because um as much, I will never dis any type, and I'm not even going to start naming names, like, Christian media, because whether I like it or not, or whether it is high, creative, or whether it's even well produced, somebody's benefiting from it somewhere in the world. Yeah. And it's being watched in mass. So, yeah, I would never limit how God can use any form of media. as far as, like, media that can go toe to toe. Now we're talking about something different.

We're talking about I have atheist friends or friends that are non-believers or friends that grew up Christian. It's like, oh, Chronicles and Arnie is Christian? Oh, man, I always watched that growing up. Yeah. They love it as art, not knowing that it was symbolism inside of it.

And even that symbolism, Tolkien was like, hey, man, you're doing too much. Like, it's, why you got to be so blatant, lying? Come on. Resurrection, yeah. But I do think that they're out there. And, I mean, anybody listening, if you're that person, like, man, I'd love to hear what you got, you know. It's just, I get it.

I understand what it's like because I had my idea for my manga six years before I was signed, you know. And for me, it was one of those things. I'm like, I know that. this isn't just a whim. I know it's not just something that just happened. And even the story of how I got signed is truly a divine, miraculous moment. But for me, it's something where I truly was supported and funded and affirmed in what I'm doing. And I know that if the next person who's also doing something similar, but also better, you know, that actually actually has the season aspect behind it, because I'm becoming a season writer. You know what I'm saying? There's people

who have been doing this for years that are already on their fifth or tenth book and they're doing fantasy that I know are Christians and I know have something to offer, but they just don't know, we don't know who they are. I can't wait until those people come up. Did you happen to read Greg Coles' book, Limits of My World, his fantasy book? I got, I haven't finished it. I have I haven't finished it yet. I keep telling myself I'm going to like I haven't delve into any fantasy books because I'm in my own world right now. Yeah, the only thing I'm doing is like watching anime's I've already watched and this has been the last year and a half. So I talk about when I finish. I'm going to write it, but I'm just like, I'm going to read it, but I haven't finished it because I'm here we are a year later after transitioning from one artist to the next and finally having a new artist as of four weeks ago. You know, I'm I'm just now comfortable with my, first volume being actually accepted, you know, after this, after a year and a half of writing. So you're doing a multi, you're doing a multi-volume series, right? Yeah, we're, you know, I'm going to keep going until I can't go anymore.

Oh, you don't have a set like, all right, I'm going to write my books. It's kind of like, I could finish in 20 or so. I could potentially be 20. 20, yeah. Is that normal to have that many books? Because they're short, right? You want to have typically maybe like 50 plus. Yes.

Oh, gosh. Yeah, yeah, manga? Oh, my gosh. Yeah, because think of it like this. Most manga's nowadays are going to have two or three, three or four seasons of 12 to 24 episodes. Each volume is like maybe three episodes, four episodes worth of a book. Each anime episode is probably worth three episodes of a book. Oh, okay, okay.

You know what I'm saying? So, like, one book you can squeeze out two or three episodes. per book. Do you release them all at the same time if you do 20? I mean, or no, okay. When will your first one come out then? Do you have a target date for that? Yeah. So now that we have our new artist and our new artist is really, really talented. His name is a shango, Shangomola. He's from London. And man, the guy is just crisp, man. He's, what I love about him is he's a storyteller as well. And so he's been able to see my story and amplify it, if anything. But essentially, we're looking at maybe another year before release

or maybe like another half for promotion, just because it takes a while for things to be drawn. So the thing I can do on my end is make sure I'm ahead of the writing so he doesn't catch up to me. So I'm essentially working on three different volumes right now, apart from volume one. I've worked on the second volume, which now has been splitting it two, so the second and third, and then I'm working on volume zero as well, which is like the preceding events before the first volume, you know. So, yeah, it's very manga-esque. But yeah, man, I'm excited, man, like, given the climate of manga, given the climate of the world, I think that my manga will do really well. It's called The Fallen, by the way. You know, yes, you know, these beings have

fell from the sky and now have, are offering mankind, all types of things like immortality in exchange for the humanity, you know, and now you have this kid who's like been chosen to lead his entire tribe in a fight against the fallen. So yeah, yeah. It's like the Nephilem of Genesis 6. Absolutely. Absolutely. Absolutely. You see the biblical themes in there as well if you're tapped in. I'm excited to see it, man. Yeah, The Fallen. That sounds awesome. I can't wait to see it. I can't wait until he works on other fantasy work too because I think he's guys who can create high high fantasy art as well.

Yeah, and he's able to do a Tolkien level, like playing with theological themes without having it so overt to where it's almost... Unenjoyable. Well, I think there's something powerful. about the subtleness of themes that invites the viewer, reader into the story so that they are forced to wrestle and play with it and figure things out on their own. If it's two on the nose, two in your face, it's like the, I feel like that that almost fosters passivity among the reader, you know, like isn't good art is supposed to like invite

you in and maybe it's this, maybe it's that. I don't know. Like, come join me in the journey and figure it out together. So, yeah, more Lord of the Rings than Chronicles of Narnia. All right, man, hey, love you, bro, and super excited to do exiles again with you. I don't know if I, the audience knows, but we are doing exiles next year in Minneapolis, April 30th, the May 2nd, save the date, and come listen to Street Hymns and a few as friends. Catch me at the right time I'll be writing in front of you.

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