Theology in the Raw - S2 Ep1140: Looking Back on 2023 and Looking Forward to 2024: A Critical Evaluation of Theology in the Raw

Episode Date: January 1, 2024

Okay folks, it's 2024! Congratulations--you're still alive and it's 2024. I truly hope that Theology in the Raw has played some positive influence in your life this past year.  In this first episode of 2024, I take a stroll down memory lane, reflecting on theology in the raw 2023. I review some stats, discuss some reviews, highlight TITR's mission statement, and discuss the top 10 episodes of the year. I then cast a vision for what's in store for 2024. The Bible Recap: https://thebiblerecap.myshopify.com/products/the-bible-recap?utm_source=TITR-PODCAST&utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=q1TBR_TITR&utm_id=TITR-Q124 

If Theology in the Raw has blessed you or challenged you or encouraged you on some level, then I would like to invite you to consider supporting the show by visiting patreon.com forward slash theology in the raw. You can support the show for as little as five bucks a month and get access to various kinds of premium content like monthly Q&A podcasts, the ability to ask me questions and dialogue with other Patreon supporters. Gold level supporters are able to participate in monthly Zoom chats where we talk about pretty much everything. Those chats can get pretty wild sometimes and I absolutely love it. So join the Theology in Raw community by signing up at patreon.com forward slash Theology in Raw. Hello, friends. Welcome back to another episode

of Theology in Raw, the first of 2024. Happy New Year to you all. I hope you didn't miss us too much. We took a week off last week and we're going to start off with a bang here in this New Year's episode. What I want to do is give a raw review of 2023, kind of reflect on some things and then cast a vision for 2024, tell you about some exciting things coming up in the new year. So let's jump in. Okay, so first of all, a couple of years ago, I actually created a mission statement for Theology in a Raw. And it's funny, the podcast has been going since 2015. We have over a thousand episodes, 1200 maybe, 1100.

I forget, something like that. It's over a thousand. And for the first several years, I didn't have any kind of mission statement because I didn't have a mission. I didn't have a purpose. I just podcasted. I kind of woke up and said, hey, I'm going to talk to this person. I'd talk to that person and hit record and throw it up in the internet somewhere. And I've got some people that produce it into a podcast. And that's what Theology in Raw has been for many years. But two or three years ago, I was like, you know, maybe I need to

actually reflect more thoughtfully on what it is we're doing. So I developed a mission statement and it goes like this. The Theology in Raw podcast aims to help believers think Christianly about theological and cultural issues by engaging in curious conversations with a diverse range of thoughtful people. That's what Theology in Raw is all about. I think it was a couple of years ago when I unpacked every jot and tittle of that statement. I'm not going to do that again here. But I do want to just highlight the piece toward the end there that this is engaging in curious conversations. Theology in the raw is more like having conversations with a conversation with your neighbor, like your literal neighbor. Like you go out to get the mail, your neighbor's out getting the mail and you're like, hey, Frank, how are you doing?

And he's like, well, good, Bob, how are you doing? And like, wow, what's been going on? Well, I've been watching the news and I've been thinking about, but I'm like, oh, what do you think about that? And then you just, you know, you engage in that kind of mailbox conversation. Does anybody do that anymore? Is that a stupid, that ever happens? Has that happened since like 1978? I don't know. I actually haven't engaged in a mailbox conversation in probably five months. Anyway, you get the point. This is more, Theology in Raw is more like a curious conversation with your neighbor than a sermon from a polished, planned, biblically precise sermon from the stage of a church.

Okay. And I think that's important to understand. And some people that maybe important to understand. And some people that maybe have conflicted opinions on Theology of Narah, I think part of it is they maybe don't quite grasp what Theology of Narah is trying to do. So for instance, we often hear about the fear of platforming certain people, certain viewpoints that you don't agree with. Like the whole idea, it just doesn't... the whole fear of platforming doesn't even apply to the nature of what this particular podcast is. Now there's other podcasts to do, you know, they'll have,

you know, sermons, lots of podcasts are just, you know, sermons or it's straight up just biblical teaching. Like, I think this is what truth is. And here's my defense of that truth. And here's, I want you to believe that truth. Like, I do have some of those episodes where I say, okay, let's step back. Let's look at what scripture says about a certain topic or idea. But when I have guests on, it is typically people I find to be thoughtful and engaging and interesting. And sometimes I'll have people on that I'm like, man, I want to talk to this person because I really find their interpretation of scripture or their theological belief or viewpoints or even their perspective on a certain cultural or political issue. I find it accurate and I want to hear more about that. Or sometimes I just find it interesting, not necessarily accurate.

Like I'm not sure if I agree with it or not, but I want to have them on to have a conversation. Like, what better way to dive further into somebody else's perspective than to have a conversation with them? Sometimes it might be just a book or an idea or a person that is maybe created some waves in evangelicalism. And I'm like, ah, I'd like to have them on. Like, I don't know if I agree or disagree. In fact, I think I might even, ah, I'd like to have them on. I don't know if I agree or disagree. In fact, I think I might even disagree, but I'd like to get some maybe clarity on what their idea is. So Theology in the Rock, it is not all about just finding people that I fundamentally disagree with on almost everything and then have them on the podcast to kind of preach a sermon at you all. The whole nature of Theology in the Rock is different than that. If you want to uncritically just absorb what you think the

truth is, that's not what this podcast is all about. So I encourage you to, you know, if, if, if you don't want to critically and actively engage ideas that might be different from what you think is true than this podcast. If you're not into that, if that doesn't excite you, if that doesn't energize you, this podcast might be more frustrating than anything. With Theology in Raw, you have to be an active listener. You have to question both what I say and what my guests say. You have to cultivate your own reasons for agreeing or disagreeing with what is talked about. I sometimes, well, I do. I try to, as much as I can,

as much as it's not overly annoying for a conversation, I do try to represent sometimes a pushback to somebody's idea, even if I don't necessarily have that pushback. Sometimes like, okay, well, what would a critic say about this? Like, how can we, as I often say, steel man or steel person?

I think people just still say steel man. Anyway, steel man, kind of the alternative viewpoint. And so I do try to do that just to make for an interesting conversation, but I can't do that with every single sentence that comes out of the person's mouth. That is something I do try to navigate and I probably fail more than I succeed at that. I don't like debates. I'm not don't like debates that Mike, I'm not a debatey person, but I do, I also don't want to have just a passive conversation where I'm just absorbing everything or just like not pushing back at all. So I try to find that happy medium to, to not make this about a debate. Um, but still to, to try to represent even alternative viewpoints that the person might be presenting. I try to do that

as much as I can, but also not too much. And I'm trying to find that balance, you know, because again, I mean, I honestly, the way my mind works, like I can, I can push back on probably three or four words in every sentence that comes out of people's mouths. Like that, my mind naturally is going there. So I'm constantly pulling back in my own mind, like saying, you know, let the person talk, let the person talk and don't, you know, it could be annoying if I'm just constantly just like pushing back on stuff.

And maybe, you know, and I've erred on that side sometimes too. So I just want you to know that I'm aware of trying to find that balance of having a conversation, let the person talk, let the person explain their viewpoints. And sometimes I'll try to push back. Other times I'm like, you know what, I'm just going to let them finish their paragraph, let them finish their, you know, it might be a 10-minute

idea. And then I might have one or two things that I even remember in the moment saying, yeah, but what about this? You know, so I'm trying to find that happy medium. And I would be the first one to say, I probably fail more than I succeed about hitting that sweet spot. Yeah, so you have to be an active listener with theology in a raw. And sometimes people will say something that maybe I don't even have enough knowledge base to push back on. So maybe I'm just letting them present their viewpoint. And I assume, but maybe I should say this, like I assume that the listener should do their own homework. Like, I can't always think for you. Like, I'll do my best own, you know, I'll try to do my own like processing and thinking and push back where I can. And other times they might

say something that I just have no background on. And some people, I have gotten this critique, you know, like, well, you just let that, you know, piece of error, you know, just go and unchecked. And it's like, well, for one, I might not even know it is an error. Or maybe, maybe if I did do research, I would think like, no, actually, I think they're correct. I think you're an error, you know, but I mean, the whole nature of this is to encourage people to say, huh, I don't know if I think that's correct. Is that correct? I'm going to maybe do some of my own research. Before I say that's wrong, or that's right, I'm gonna? I'm going to maybe do some of my own research before I say that's wrong or that's right. I'm going to be like, oh, I need to do some more thinking on this. And if I don't have time to do that kind of thinking on it, then just let it sit

in the back of your mind as a viewpoint that needs to be considered at some point. One of the high values of Theology and Raw is diversity. I try to cultivate among my guests, a healthy theological and denominational diversity. Um, I don't get some of the, I don't have typically some of the more extreme viewpoints if they're super progressive or super fundamentalist or whatever, or if they just represent a position that I just don't find particularly interesting. Now I get some people saying, you should have this person on, you should have that person on. I can tell you which names that they've suggested. But part of me is like, I don't know. I just don't find that viewpoint interesting. Or maybe it's a viewpoint that I was like just bathed in as a

Christian growing up where it's like, I kind of have been there, done that. I just don't sit there and listen to something I've heard hours and hours and hours of that I either maybe fully agree with or fully disagree with. I'm like, I need to be personally interested in having a particular conversation to engage an idea, to engage a certain person. I'll have any kind of viewpoint on. It has to be within the realm of diversity, theological and denominational diversity. I have to have a kind of a personal interest in hearing more about that position. And there's also, there's limits. I'm not going to have the leader of the KKK on to talk about why he is the leader of the KKK or whatever. That's just not, for one, I don't find it interesting. For two, it's just so far outside of a viewpoint that I would even want to consider that, yeah, just not something I'm – there's many other people I'd want to have on ahead of some of these more extreme viewpoints.

So healthy theological denominational diversity. Sex diversity, I do try to get as close as I can to 50% male, 50% female guests. I still, I mean, if I went back, I didn't do the percentages on this. I'm probably at 60, 40, 60% male, 40% female, maybe 65, 35. No, I think it might be 60, 40. But I just want you to know that I am striving for, 60, 40. But I just want you to know that I am striving for, I'm aware the sex of my guests. And there was a time last fall when I kind of, I feel like every few weeks I kind of take inventory. I'll look back at the guests I've had on, the ones I have planned for the future. And if it's very heavy on one side or the other, typically it's going to err on the side of being more male heavy. And if it is, I just want you to know other, typically it's going to err on the side of being more male heavy.

And if it is, I just want you to know that I am aware of that. There was a time last fall when I looked and I'm like, oh my gosh, the last like five episodes were men and the next four I have planned are all men. And I'm like, I need to really work hard at making sure that the podcast isn't dominated by male voices, even if it is maybe slightly tipped heavier towards a male, male guests, just so you know, I am striving to get as close to that 50, 50 mark as, as I can. And by the way, it's not because I'm egalitarian. Okay. So, so some of you, this is fun. So a lot of you know that I'm on this journey of trying to figure out what I think scripture says about, uh, uh, women in positions of church leadership, pastors, teachers, elders, I get asked all the time.

So where are you at on that? I'm like, I'm still in the middle of my journey. And yeah, people think, didn't you solve that by now? And just so you know, I, yeah, let me give an update on that. So I, um, I am, you know, my research, my personal research project will end up being a book. And I think that book will probably be turned in, right now it's projected at, I think, summer of 2025. The manuscript will be turned in, which means the book will come out probably a year later. So that's still, I still have like a year and a half that I've given myself to spend as much time as I possibly can researching that topic. And I am, and it's

been a couple of years now since I've really started to dive deep into it. And even then, even if it takes me three and a half years, that's still, I could still spend, I could spend 10 years on this. I mean, I've spent the last three months researching one Greek word, kephale, the Greek word head, uh, blogging through that. If you're not aware on the Theology in Raw blog, anyway, I'm getting off track here, but, um, oh, oh yeah. What's funny is whenever, you know, cause I've been kind of like, Hey, I'm not, I don't know where I'm at. And even if I is leaning somewhere, I'm not going to voice that. I actually want to work out my thoughts before I start saying, okay, I think this view is correct. Was raised staunchly complementarian and sympathetic with arguments on the complementarian side and on the egalitarian side.

But it's funny. People who are strongly egalitarian have told me, you're so obviously complementarian, so just get over yourself. And I've had people who are strongly complementarian who say, you're so obviously egalitarian, so get over yourself. So I don't know what to do with that. That's so funny. I mean, yeah, that's a whole other – I don't want to go too far into a rabbit trail here. I'm already down pretty deep in the rabbit hole, but that's just interesting that if people are strong on one side or the other, I think they see me as not, I don't know, reflecting that viewpoint in kind of how I'm going about this. Anyway,

all that to say, here's my point in even bringing that up. My desire to have as many female guests as male guests is not because I'm egalitarian. This is not a theology. I was not a church. My guests are not preaching sermons, sermons at you. So I, I'm having curious conversations with people. And so, um, I mean, honestly, complementarians like healthy biblical commentarians should eagerly want to talk with and learn from women. Like if I end up landing staunchly commentarian, like strongly commentarian, I won't change my mission, my desire to have half women, half men on the podcast. Because again, this is curious conversations with interesting people, thoughtful people. And I don't think the only interesting or thoughtful people are pastors at local churches and therefore should only be men. Since this is kind of like

having curious conversations with wise, intelligent, thoughtful neighbors, hopefully a biblical, an actual biblical, healthy complementarian should have no problem with that. I know some might, but that's not biblical. So yeah. So, so my passion, my desire, my value of trying to have as many women guests on as men is not because my, my secret egalitarian leanings are coming out or something like that. Like, I just think that's the Christian thing to do. Uh, I try to have diversity in terms of ethnicity, uh, age. I don't want to just have millennials or just have boomers. I like to have a mix of various age groups, various ethnicities. Not because I went through some podcast DEI training or something.

It's because I see in the Bible that the kingdom of God is diverse. My passion for diversity is richly theological, not political. And I think that most of you, I think, know that. But if you don't, if you hear me voice some passion for ethnic diversity on the podcast, yeah, it's for theological reasons, not political ones. One thing I do want to change or get better at is try to, if I'm having a guest on, and if we're primarily talking about a book that they wrote, I want to do better at being more familiar with the book. Even if I don't read the whole thing, there's no way at two podcasts a week on a whole range of different topics, it'd be impossible

for me to read, have guests on every episode, talk about a book. And I read the whole book. Like a podcast seems, it's like a side job for me. I don't know if you know that. Like I, my full-time job is a president of the Center for Face Sexuality and Gender. I also do a lot of independent speaking and writing and even theology in a rise. And I'll turn it into conferences and stuff that we'll get to in a second. So actual, my twice a week podcast occupies a stillness, a smaller portion of my quote unquote work week. It's getting bigger and I'm trying to carve out more and more space for it, but it's not like this is what I do full time. If it was full time, then maybe I could read two books a week and thoroughly

digest those books and have the guest on, but that's just unrealistic. And not every podcast is about an author's book, of course. But I do, all that to say, I do want to do better at being more familiar with a book if I'm going to have a guest on that's going to primarily focus on talking about the book. I can't promise y'all I'll do it every time. In fact, just recently, I had a guest on that'll come out in January. to see I'll do it every time. In fact, just recently I had a guest on that'll come out in January and, um, I, I scheduled the podcast a month out and I had the book and I had plans of reading it, but my, the stuff I had to get to prevented me from actually reading their book.

And ahead of time, I'm now currently reading the book after I interviewed them. So that was a case where like, I just, just the timing just didn't match up and I couldn't get to it. But I want you to know that I think in the past, I didn't even try to read the book. I didn't even think about it. I was like, I'll just have the guest on. Here, I'm going to do better at trying to be more familiar with as many books of guests that I'm talking about on the podcast as I can. Not perfectly, but better than I have been doing.

Okay, let's look at some stats. The company that helps me produce this thing sent me a year-end review. This is as of December 15th. As of December 15th in 2023, there were 5, six hundred and twenty two annual streams so let's see that's getting close to six million streams in 2023 that is up from let's see in 2022 yeah so that that's up almost two million maybe 18 1.8 million, an increase of 1.8 million from 2022. Sorry, I got all my notes in front of me. They're all kind of scattered around. 2022 total downloads estimated to be just over 4 million. And so in 2023, it came close to 6 million. The average monthly downloads in 2022 was 353,000. And I don't have an average here for 2023, but I can tell you, 2023, there were 456,000 downloads that dipped in February to

367. I don't know why. Maybe my podcast just absolutely sucked in February, but it really took a dive. And then for the rest of the year, it pretty much went up to where in October, 2023, we had just shy of 600,000 downloads. So in February, 376. By October, the monthly downloads was 590 and then 588 in November, December. We don't have the totals yet, but the trajectory is looking about the same. We don't have the totals yet, but the trajectory is looking about the same. So the Algenara has experienced a lot of growth in 2023, which is great. Yeah, I think I say this every year. I don't care.

That's cool. That's awesome. I don't even know what to compare that to, though, honestly. Those numbers, they seem all high, but I don't know. Like, is that? I don't know comparatively if that's good, average, bad, or whatever. I really don't know. Like, is that, I don't know comparatively if that's good, average, bad, or whatever. I really don't care. Like I enjoy, I truly from, from the time I started podcasting to, to now it's, you know, obviously the podcast has grown a ton since the beginning when it was just starting out, but I don't, I've never done this and nor do I do things primarily to grow the

audience. I want to do have the kinds of conversations that I want to have, that I find interesting, that I think are helpful for the church or the kingdom to think through and let the number chips fall where they may. Yeah. So I'm excited to lose numbers, but I don't, I don't know.

It's, it's, um, that's not why I do that. I'm like, I'm not, I'm not like, okay,

well, how can I get these numbers up for next year and next year go up? I just don't care. If they went down, I honestly wouldn't care. I would wonder, am I doing something that's ineffective for the kingdom if the numbers go down? Or maybe it'd be more effective. Maybe higher numbers mean I'm appealing to the masses more and I shouldn't be doing that. I don't know.

I'm thinking out loud here. I'm in a crisis of podcast faith. Anyway, those are the numbers. Take it for what they are. Let's see. Age demographic. The highest percentage of listeners are 35 to 44. So what is that? Older millennials, younger Gen Xers. The next highest, so that's like 25% of listeners are 35 to 44. The next demographic, highest demographic of listeners, 25 to 34, so millennials. The third highest demographic, 45 to 54, so we're getting older. And the next highest of one, two, three, oh, 45 to 54, the next highest, 55 to 64, the next highest, 65 and older.

So my audience, I have a good percentage of older listeners, which I find awesome. Because I always thought like I would appeal more to younger people. I guess the highest demographic is 25 to 34. But I'm impressed. There's a lot of older people that listen to this. The lowest demographic is Gen Z. Only like 4%, 5% of listeners are 18 to 24. I wonder if that's because,

I just don't know if Gen Z listens to a lot of podcasts. I think they do more YouTube. It seems like if I base it on anecdotally, like my kids and their friends and everything, like they know like some of the more YouTube stars. And my friend group, my kid's friend group isn't really into TikTok. Cause I think that might be the main kind of source of entertainment or, or news, um, education, uh, is TikTok. But, uh, my kid's friend group isn't as in a TikTok as maybe some other friend groups. I think they did, they do more YouTube. So some do podcasts, but I just, yeah, I don't,

other friend groups. I think they do more YouTube. Some do podcasts, but I just, yeah, I don't know if Gen Z is a podcast listener as much as older people. Let's see. Male-female breakdown. I got to get closer for this. Female, 40.8% are female. Male, 59.20% are male. I think that's pretty good for a male host. Typically, the sex breakdown is going to be heavily slated toward the sex of the host. And this one is 60-40. It's not too bad. Of course, I would love to be 50-50, but that's, that's, I'm, I'll take it. That's, I'm excited about that. Okay. Top 10 episodes of 2023. You ready? Drum roll, please make your guesses. If those you listeners who have been listening for a while, which episodes do you think got the most, uh, downloads? All right, here we go. This is gonna be fun. Okay. Um,. Okay. Number one, the highest downloaded episode, two years in a row now. Not the same episode, but the same couple.

A raw conversation about modesty and purity culture with Sheila Gregoire and Rebecca Lindenbach. is it March, April, received 65,833 podcast downloads and 4,663 YouTube video downloads. Download the YouTube video? I thought they were just streaming. Anyway, that was number one. A lot of you remember that episode that got a lot of, well, it got a lot of attention, I think, on social media. There was a lot of conversations after that episode on social media that got a lot of attention, I think, on social media. There was a lot of conversations after that episode on social media. They got a lot of attention. And Sheila Gregoire and Rebecca Lindenbach, in 2022, they were on the Israeli-Palestinian War with Daniel Benora, 57,943 podcast downloads and over 10,000 YouTube downloads. That one, because that one was only, what, a month ago? And the Gregoire Lindenbach episode was way back in spring, in a sense, because at the end of the day, I would imagine given the trajectory,

the, the Benora episode will, will surpass, it will become the most listened to episode because it's only been out for like a month and it's already gotten that much. Third highest, a raw conversation about sex and theology with Josh Ryan Butler, Dr. Sandy Richter and Brenna Blaine, 53,000 podcast downloads. That was one of my, I mean, all of these were interesting, super interesting. That one came at a really, uh, I, I, I was, I was really happy with how that turned out. I'm glad we had that conversation. Um, I don't know if you remember, but like Josh Ryan Butler wrote a book called a beautiful, a beautiful union that Beautiful Union that stirred up a lot of

controversy on social media. This is fascinating. I've been talking to my friends about this. How quickly things change given the news cycle and social media, the news cycle and social media, I don't know what term I want to use here, sustainable or just the lastingness of things that are driven, issues that are primarily driven by people that spend a lot of time on social media. It's fascinating that that, I mean, I feel like all hell broke loose when part of that book was released on the Gospel Coalition's website

prior to the release of the actual book. And a lot of people were really upset at that article. Do you remember? I mean, it's funny. It wasn't that long ago. It was like,

well, this is technically December 20th when I'm recording this. So yeah, eight months ago? That's nothing. It was like, well, this is technically December 20th when I'm recording this. So yeah, eight months ago, that's nothing like that's, but I mean, so many things have happened since then. I don't even think people even hardly remember that book. And then the book came out and people read it and people had to kind of mix feelings because the article they didn't like. And then some of the summaries of the article they really didn't like. And so there was a lot of, you know, flare up about that. And then the book came out and people read people that read the whole book in good faith were kind of like, Oh, this is not bad.

Some people were like, this is great. Um, and then other things flared up and then summer came and then the fall came and things broke out in Israel, Palestine, and you have presidential stuff and you have, you know, every five seconds on Twitter, somebody's yelling at somebody else. And so it just kind of moves on. I don't know. That's an interesting. I want to have a podcast discussing that. on how social media and the algorithms and just the whole genre of social media discourse

dictates the fleetingness of social issues. Is that making sense? I'm literally wording this on the fly. Anyway, there's been several things that are just like flare up and they're just like dominating. I mean, for the small percentage of people that are active on like Twitter or X or whatever, like they just seem to dominate the world. Like everybody's thinking about this. And then like within, you know, two days, like it's something else that comes up and like, what is that doing to our humanity? What is that doing

to our ecclesiology? What is that doing to our hearts, our minds, our passions, our concerns, our actual justice initiatives, or however you want to word it. Let's have that conversation this year. Number four, fourth highest. Do you want to go through top down? Let me go quickly. Okay. I'll just list the next several.

Number four, most downloaded episode, the podcast with Rick Warren on women pastors and Saddleback getting kicked out of the SBC. Number five, From Complimentarian to Egalitarian, a conversation about women and leadership with Nije Gupta. Well done, Nije. Number six, The Last 10 Years of the Church and the LGBTQ Conversation with Sam Alberry. Number seven, Good Sex, Bad Sex, Marriage with Julie Slattery. Number eight, Women in Leadership Part Two, my lengthy review of 1 Timothy 2. Slattery. Number eight, Women in Leadership Part Two, my lengthy review of 1 Timothy 2. Number nine, Neither Complimentary Nor Egalitarian with Dr. Michelle Lee Barnwall. And number 10, Dinosaurs, The Bible and the Age of the Earth with Dr. Jordan Mallon.

That's, of course, dinosaurs have got to be up there. That was a fun episode. Anyway, a lot of these, so this is interesting. At least half of these have to do with women, ministry. I guess purity culture would be up there. Yeah. So sex, sexuality, women. I guess half of them are on women in ministry. So it shows that there's a big interest there. interest there? This episode is sponsored by Biblingo. Biblingo is an incredibly effective and efficient way to actually learn the biblical languages of Greek and Hebrew. Okay, so as many of you guys know, I'm a huge advocate for learning the biblical languages and not just for pastors or

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to reading and understanding the entire Bible by Tara Lee Cobble, a friend of mine who I had on the podcast not too long ago, episode 1067. So the Bible recap takes you through the whole Bible, and then it explains each day's study in short two-page summaries of each portion of Scripture that you just read. And what I love most about the Bible recap is that it's focused on what each section of Scripture reveals to us about the person and work of God. So it doesn't fall into like human-centered moralism. It keeps the focus on what the Bible tells us about God. In fact, a couple of my kids are actually going to be trying to read through the whole Bible this next year, and they're going to also be going

through the Bible Recap alongside their yearly Bible reading. Tara Lee Cobble, the author of the Bible Recap, I mean, she's awesome. She's a relentless researcher when it comes to scripture and a super clear and engaging writer. And she's also the host of the super popular, the Bible recap podcast. So yeah, I would invite you to go check out Theology in Raw episode 1067, where I had an awesome conversation with Tara Lee Coble and you can hear her heart for God and scripture. So I highly recommend buying the Bible recap for yourself or for for someone you know that's wanting to wrap their mind and heart around the storyline of Scripture. Just go to thebiblerecap.com to find out more. That's thebiblerecap.com.

Let me, okay, so let's go back. So, yeah, in summary, it's been a good year in terms of numbers, I think, you know, but again, that's not the main reason why I do this. Let's look at some reviews. I don't, every now and then I'll go read some reviews on Theology in a Raw. Not that I'm not interested in getting critical feedback, but most of the time, reviews I don't find, sometimes are helpful, you know, but they're also very anecdotal. Like I, I try to, there's other ways in which I try to get a pulse on, um, how did this episode land? What could I have done better? What kind of follow-up episode should I have based on the response to this episode? Um, and, and so on and so forth. I do think through every time, um, how could I have done better? Should I have done that? But I'm willing to roll the

dice too. I mean, I did that recently, as many of you know, with a certain episode that was different than most Theology in the Raw episodes. I'm willing to roll the dice and say, hey, I don't know, let's try this. And if I look back and say, wouldn't have done that again, I'm fine with that. So I hope you're okay with that. So if there's episodes you're like, how dare you? I can't believe you did. I might even agree with you. I might be like, yeah, I probably wouldn't do that again. But I would rather err on the side of trying things out, rolling the dice, pushing the envelope, thinking outside the box, doing different things, pushing into conversations and areas that I'm

interested in that I think other people are interested in. And I would rather do that than to simply play it safe, just to have a bunch of safe conversations, safe guests on Theology in a Raw is not a safe podcast. Okay. So if there's an episode or two you really didn't like, maybe I didn't either. I don't know. And maybe I wouldn't have that person on again. Most of the reviews are very positive. Just a couple of samples. This person says, this is one of the best in a world of hostility. Preston is a thoughtful conversation partner who embodies in similar long form conversations, the grace and truth that Jesus was known for. Really appreciate that review.

Really encouraging. That is something I strive to do. Another review, positive reviews says, these are important, honest perspectives. Preston's podcast is a very valuable part of my mix. I appreciate his willingness and ability to engage tough subjects directly, honestly, and graciously. I hate even reading these almost because it sounds like I'm patting myself on the back. It's not, I'll stop with the positive reviews. How's that? I guess I read these and it's like, this is encouraging because this is what I'm striving

to do. So with the other people are receiving that or hearing that, that's encouraging. Okay. I, as you might know, I actually love the one-star reviews. I do. It's weird. I don't know. It's something in a way I'm wired. I love, like I typically skip over the five-star or read them quickly. And then I go to the one-star reviews. I fascinating, like, like it's genuinely interesting. So here, here's, I don't know. I actually copied a bunch of one-star reviews. I'm proud I can get through all these, but this one, okay. This title is weak, watered down, liberal, pro-alphabet soup. Do you remember alphabet soup? I grew up on Campbell's alphabet

soup. And I, when I read this comment, I feel like I started like Pavlov's dog, Pavlov, Pavlov, Pavlov's dog. I started salivating because I just saw alphabet soup and I was craving soup all of a sudden. He says, this is from Seraphim. This guy is so afraid to be disagreeable to every worldview on earth. Softball, weak sauce, minister. I received that. I guess the one thing I would push back on is i'm not a minister i'm just a podcaster no i i received that that's that's i've you know uh seraphim's not the only one who would say um that i'm a watered down liberal um what's funny is something like a lot of the critiques they'll flip flop flip flop from like flip flop, they'll flip-flop from me being a watered-down liberal to a raging fundie.

It's almost like back and forth. Boom, boom, boom. Different guests. I mean, different reviewers. Let's see. Oh, this next one openly anti-trans and expanding platforms i platform anti-trans speakers who expand the scope of hatred to anyone who use contraception that one threw me for a loop like i wasn't you know how your mind like when you start reading something your mind kind of

almost subconsciously jumps ahead to what they're going to say, especially when they use phrases like anti-trans, like you can almost fill in what is going to come next. But anyone who, hatred towards people who use contraception, I was like, oh, I wasn't expecting that. I mean, even now I'm trying to figure out the connection there. Is that a thing? Like are anti-trans people also anti-contraception?

Anyway, that kind of threw me for a loop. I think I might have to blame Matthew Lee Anderson on that one. Do you remember Matt Anderson's podcast where he defended the position that contraception is immoral? Yeah. Actually, I was wondering how that episode was going to land with people. I actually got a lot of really positive feedback. I was wondering how that episode was going to land with people. I actually got a lot of really positive feedback.

People really enjoy just his thoughtfulness and just his ability to kind of provoke us to think about things that we typically don't think about. So that review came right up close to this other review that said, not biblical is the title. I find Sprinkles approach to be heretical. Eh, I'll take a number. His views and many of his guests coddle sexual immorality. So one person says I'm anti-trans. The other one says I'm coddling sexual immorality. Christians should reject the subtle lies of the enemy disguised as kindness and grace. I agree. You should just, yeah, you should. I've encouraged everybody to reject subtle lies of the enemy that are disguised as kindness and grace.

I would love to see a curious conversation between these two reviewers. Oh, this one, I got to admit, this one was a little discouraging. The title is Sexist. The review is, God if he hates women as much as you do. You treat women like cattle and just want us to be barefoot and pregnant. The one part that was discouraging with this is why would I worship your God if he hates women so much? Which I assume, I assume this person is not or no longer a Christian. And so that's discouraging. whatever validity there is to this complaint, they walked away with this impression. And, um, that's a hard thing, guys and girls. Like I, um, you know,

like you have the curious conversations and people hear certain things, they feel certain things and people bring certain stories to the conversation and they, they hear the conversation through those, that lens. And, um, you know, if I don't push back on a point, they take that as I'm, I'm promoting that point. Or if I do push back on a point, they take it as a disagree with that point. I don't know. Like when you have open, honest, as a disagree with that point. I don't know. Like when you have open, honest, curious conversations, there's going to be some people that are just going to really be offended by that, you know?

And so I genuinely, like I am, as much as I work extremely hard not to self-censor myself, meaning like something comes in my mind and I want to say it or And it's so, or something I'm really thinking through. I'm like, I don't want to say this because it might be offensive to some people. There's a place for that. Right. I mean, I don't think I just want like an open door to my brain. Nobody wants that. Trust me. I mean, I have to live with myself and that's, that's hard enough. So yeah, I think there is a place for like, not just deriving some filter,

but I also don't want to self-censor where you're just, you're not even engaging in a curious conversation because you're so worried by how every single person is going to be offended at this, offended at that. But I would say I have been extra, the one thing I do, I feel like try to, like when I have female guests on, I'm constantly nervous about like cutting them off or talking over. Or I'm constantly thinking, am I talking too much?

Am I letting them talk enough? Is it going to look like I'm just mansplaining or talking over women guests or whatever? So I'm extra cautious at that, just so you know. And it's comments like this sometimes. I don't know how they got some of these barefoot and pregnant and cattle comments, whatever. But this is how a human being felt by listening to something I said.

So I do have that in the back of my mind where I'm like, especially with female guests, I'm extra cautious about making sure I'm not talking over them. Or sometimes I'm like, do I want to push back on this? Is it going to look like I'm, I'm a man, a man kind of dominating a woman or something like that. But I don't know, like, I don't know if that,

I think women are insanely powerful and incredibly wise and intelligent. And it almost dehumanizes women. If you'd sort of take, take the gloves off and, and are afraid to like push back on a point they're making. Cause it's like, wait a minute, that's just in a, in a, in a weird roundabout way, you're suggesting that they're actually too weak that they can't handle and intellectual counter argument. Like that's actually very dehumanizing to women if you do take the gloves off. So this is the dilemma I sometimes find myself in, you know, not

wanting to come off as this male dominating person. Um, but also like not, yeah, take, taking the gloves off. That's a bad amount of metaphor, but like not, not challenging a point simply because it's a female making it like that's actually dehumanizing towards women. It actually doesn't accredit them with agency. Um, the agency that they have is equally created in God's image, equally as intelligent as men, equally as capable of giving a profound argument, equally capable of handling a pushback and being able to push back towards me, you know? So anyway, that's the small window into what's going on in my head with some of these things. Adds to the next comment, adds to cultural confusion. His response to my response to

Andy Stanley's stance on LGBT issues is discouraging. If listeners want a biblically aligned worldview concerning the sin of homosexuality, seek out stand to reason Rosaria Butterfield and Christopher Yuan. I'm not sure that critique age too well. That was from a three, three months ago. I think, um,

there's a bunch of others here that I can go through, but I, I I'll save, I'll save you. I just, I enjoyed going through these myself. And do I want to, nah, I'll skip the rest of these. You can, you can go read some of these, uh, reviews. All that to say, I really do value. I truly mean this from the bottom of my heart. I really value honest reviews. I would encourage everybody to leave a review. It actually does help, uh, the podcast become more known. It's something with the algorithms. I don't know, but like the more reviews the podcast has, the more it's going to pop up in other people's feeds. So if you want, um, if you want people to be aware of Theology in a Raw, whether it's because it's a horrible podcast and you want people to see how horrible it is, or if it's a helpful podcast and you want people to, um, engage the podcast, um, leaving a review, even if it's a one-star review, three-star review, five, whatever, that does help the podcast. Although I think if it just gets a ton of

one-star reviews, it might get canceled. I don't know. I don't know how it works, but I just know like leaving reviews do help. Okay. My women in ministry journey. I've already kind of spoken to this a little bit that, uh, I I'm still, I, I am trying to go is absolutely deep as I possibly can on every jot and tip tiddle. Like I really want to not leave any stones unturned as I possibly can in the three and a half years I'm devoting to these questions. So I'm going to do more podcasts on this. I think in the last year, because I was working on two other book projects, which I'll talk about in a second, I took a break from podcasting on women in ministry. I still had guests on to talk about it, but I haven't given any kind of updates on my own research. But I've spent the last six months, especially really digging back into

the question of women, and specifically women in leadership. Like I said, I spent the last three months doing a really extensive study on the Greek word kephale. And right now, I spent the last month researching Ephesians 5, 21 to 33, or 22 to 33, depending on how you break down the passage there. So I'm going to be continuing to blog through that. Yeah, I don't know if you know, I've sort of dusted off the Theology in Raw blog, and I have written already four or five lengthy blogs on the Greek word kephale. What does Paul mean when he says that man is ahead of a woman? Man is ahead of woman. And the blog is not your traditional blog where it's like 800 words. They're more like lengthy. Yeah. Some of them are like 5,000 word books with like

heavy footnotes. Like it is me just trying to air out my research, my current thoughts. They are not written in stone. Before it's a book, it's a blog. I like to blog when I'm like 70, 80% leaning in a certain direction and try to make that argument and invite people to critique it. So the comment section is open on a blog. Some people have said it's really hard to find or do. I don't think it is, but just so you know, you can drop a comment. I would highly encourage you. Drop a comment. Push back. Play devil's advocate.

Like I'm blogging through my current research in women and leadership in order to invite as much critical feedback as I possibly can. Because I don't have a position I'm defending, I'm trying to discover what I think the biblical authors 2000 years ago, uh, wrote on the, and, and believe wrote and believe about the topic. I'm trying to air out my thoughts and I'm trying to arrive at the truth, not defend a position. So I know some people like roller eyes. No, no, you're a closeted egalitarian or closeted commentary or whatever. I don't, I'm not, but I would love to, I truly want as much critical feedback as I can. So if you have done research in this area, you have thoughts on it, maybe preach several sermons on Ephesians 5 and you have some insight, I would love, love, love for you to leave a comment on the blog series.

What I think I'm going to do is continue blogging through my current research area within this question of women in leadership. And then I'll probably do some podcast reviews, updates on that same area of research. But again, the place where you can leave comments is on the blog, theologyandraw.com, go to, might be forward slash blog, or just go to the dropdown box and you can find the blog. And yeah, so I'm going to, yeah, in 2024, you'll, you'll see some more solo podcast episodes where I'll, um, give an overview of kind of where I'm at on, on particular passages and themes, uh, exiles in Babylon conference, uh, April 20, April 18th through

the 20th. Uh, that is coming up, uh, in a few months, this conference, I, I, I, yeah, I, I'm so excited about this. I've been excited about the first two. I really want to blow the roof off of this next one, tackling all the topics that are challenging and debated and volatile and make people angry and everything. We're just going to go after all of them. We're going to be talking about deconstruction, reconstruction, and the gospel. You're going to hear from people who

deconstructed. And this also kind of goes against the whole platforming thing. Like there was somebody who kind of was critiquing me for like, well, you have these speakers at your conference that don't agree with you or whatever. I'm like, exactly. That's what the algebra is. I want to hear from the proverbial horse's mouth what people actually believe. Like instead of hearing from people who talk about people who deconstructed, I want to hear from people who have deconstructed. Because this is the rub, right? You have people who haven't deconstructed who say, here's why people deconstruct. And maybe there's a place for that.

There may be some truth to that. But why not ask people who deconstructed why they deconstructed? So that's what we're going to do. Uh, we're going to get various kinds of deconstruction. Not every deconstruction is like Christian or non-Christian. We're going to get, um, various perspectives from like, um, um, do you want to know the details on this? So, so, uh, uh, Tim Whitaker is, is there, he's going to share about why he went from kind of a very conservative evangelical perspective to a more, he doesn't like to term progressive. He likes to term new evangelical, but he would line up with many beliefs held in common with other Christians who would say they're more progressively Christian. And we're going to

hear from Abigail Favali, who was a conservative evangelical, went to a third wave postmodern feminist, back to a more conservative Catholic position. So her deconstruction journey, you just can't make up, right? I mean, just went in all various directions. We're going to hear from Amin Hudson, who is solidly evangelical gospel centered Christian, but kind of deconstructed from a white-dominated form of evangelicalism. And there's a lot of black evangelicals who kind of were nurtured in this kind of reformed brand of Christianity 10 years ago, who kind of, once they started talking a little bit too much about race, they kind of weren't... Well, I'll let him,

I don't want to put words in his mouth, but, uh, I mean, has, has been become a friend from a distance. I love his podcast, Southside Rabbi podcast. So he's going to share his deconstruction, which has more to do with race. And then, uh, Evan Wickham's going to talk about why he should have deconstructed in a sense. He has all, he checks off a lot of boxes on people who did get deconstruct, you know, like the politicalization of the church and some of the problems with conservative evangelicalism, this and that. But he's not. He's more committed to Orthodox theology than, not the church Orthodox church, but like Orthodoxy than he ever has been. We're also going to talk about women, power, and abuse in the church. We're going to hear from four women about,

yeah, women, power, and abuse in the church. I mean, that one's going to be incredibly important. And I'm nervous and excited about it. I'm nervous because as a guy leading the conference and kind of managing that conversation or like, you know, being the host of that conversation, yeah, I'm just, I want to, I want the church to do insanely better than it has done in how it treats women. And again, not because, not to defend a complementarian egalitarian position, but because wherever you land on the complementarian egalitarian question, we can all agree that women have not been treated historically, have not been treated well in the church. They have been a victim of the abuse of power and power and abuse. We're going to have women, gospel-centered women help coaches through that. How can the church be more inclusive for LGBTQ people, for same-sex attracted or LGBTQ Christians who believe in a

historically Christian view of marriage and sexuality, who are going to help us understand here from, again, from the actual people, rather than having a straight pastor say, here's how we can be more inclusive. Let's hear from the very people we're trying to include. Like what are some blind spots the church has? I shouldn't, I learned last year, I'm supposed to use the term blind spots. What are some areas of growth that we are, that we need to understand what are some things that the, that, that, that the church does sometimes subconscious or, um, intentionally or unintentionally that makes the church a really hard place for gay and lesbian, same-sex attracted Christians who believe in a

historic Christian ethic that still makes it hard for them to flourish and contribute and follow Jesus. Um, that session, that session is going to be, I think that session honestly is going to be worth the price of the conference as a whole. Um, but all the, I mean, all these, I don't want to prioritize one or the other. Um, the final session is on three Christian views of politics. I have a left-leaning Christian, a right-leaning Christian, and then a sort of anti-partisan Christian, namely Brian Zahn, who's going to, uh, who they're going to give their perspective. I think they're going to overlap a bit and then they're going to diverge a bit. Um, and then we're going to engage in not a, this isn't a really good debate,

but it is going to be a, um, a healthy critical dialogue, uh, about Christians and politics. And then we have some special events that are going to happen. We've got, um, yeah, I mean, Hudson's from the South side rabbi podcast and, and Ruslan YouTube sensation, sensation, sensation. What'd he call himself? I don't know if he Rabbi podcast and Ruslan, YouTube sensation. What did he call himself? I don't know if you – sorry, Ruslan, if I'm calling you a YouTube sensation and you're like, I don't like that phrase. But he is. He's super popular on YouTube and he's a great, great, great interviewer.

They're going to do a live podcast. And I don't want to give too much away. There's going to be lots of fun stuff there and a great time to connect with other believers who are also passionate about having curious conversations. If you are in Boise, so the first two years of the conference, almost everybody that comes to the conference is from out of state or from at least out of Boise. Yeah, out of state, really. I've tried.

I've like. Every year I email probably 50 pastors in town to let them know about the conference. I can give you promo material. Can you let your people know that this is happening? I don't feel like, I don't like that conference. It's totally fine. But it's unfortunate that there's 100,000 Christians in the Treasure Valley, the greater kind of Boise area that, and almost all of them don't even know about the conference. And at least some of them might be excited to come. So I email pastors every year. And I think last year I sent 50 emails out

to pastors. I think I got one response, maybe two. There's a couple of churches I'm thinking in particular that encouraged some people to come. But yeah, if you're, I don't know what else to do locally. So, uh, we'll love to get more Boise people, um, in the Boise conference at the Algenra. So, um, if you are, uh, one of the few Algenra listeners who lives in the Boise area, um, would, I need your help. Like I would love for you to help spread the word about, um, the conference, um, tell your leaders about it, or if you are a leader, tell your people about it. At least let them know that these are very important conversations that are happening. We've got lots of churches around the country that would love, love to host this event.

We've got requests from all over the country saying, can we please host this? So there's a lot of interest outside of Boise. I think Christians in Boise, I think, need to engage these conversations. And again, because they don't need to agree with everybody on stage because they can't, because there's diversity of viewpoints on the stage. But it is a place to come and be challenged in what you think about these conversations. And I think it's a very gospel-centered conference. So anyway, if you are in Boise, I need your help to help promote this.

You can, if you need, let's see, promo material, we do have lots of social media graphics. I would say you can email, let's see, chris at theologyandraw.com, C-H-R-I-S at theologyandraw.com. Gosh, I hope that's my wife, not my brother, my wife. I hope she doesn't get flooded with too many emails, but yeah, if you want, we can give you some graphics to pass out, to hand out, maybe even some QR codes if people just need some quick info on it. Oh, also, if you're not in Boise and you're not planning to come to the conference in Boise live, we do have churches doing watch parties. So again, you can email chris at theologyintheraw.com and inquire about a church watch party. There's several churches

that are doing that. They said, man, we got like 50 people on staff. We don't want to fly everybody out there, but we want to engage the conference and do it well and have, you know, like, uh, we want to talk through it. We want to discuss the topic. So, um, I highly encourage you if you're, if you're a church leader and you're just like, man, we can't get all our people there. Yeah. You can inquire about hosting a watch party. That's kind of the next best thing I would say for me personally, like, I totally understand that people can't make it out here. It's expensive to fly and stay in a hotel and stuff. There's just, there is something unique about the live venue, I think. I think you would agree with me, those of you who have been. The space holds about 1,100 people, but it's very – it's hard to describe.

It's like a giant living room. It feels like a room of 500. It's Calvary Chapel Boise where I go to church, and I'm shocked when I look. Like I'm sure you just, it's Calvary Chapel Boise where I go to church. And, and I'm shocked when I look around, I'm like a thousand people can fit in here. Like, it just seems like small and intimate. And I just, I love, I love that feel that everything is very close and intimate, kind of raw and gritty. Like it's an older building, you know? And, and yeah,, can't wait. Sign up soon and later tickets are starting to sell pretty quickly. Now it's usually after the first one, lots of people

start signing up. So if you do plan on attending live in Boise, highly encourage you to sign up very soon. So you don't miss out. Okay. Looking forward to 2024, we're going to land this plane here in a second. I am redoing my, not me, my daughter, Aubrey, and with some help from some other people, they're redoing the Theology and Ross studio. So if you're watching on YouTube right now, this is the traditional studio, which is an absolute mess because you see all this junk laying on the floor and stuff. My books are all out of whack. But I'm going to take you over. I'm going to take you on a little tour.

So if you're not on YouTube, you can check this out. So yeah, when I say new studio, basically I'm just, I've cleaned out the opposite corner of my unfinished basement. That's, that's quote unquote, the new studio. So here's what's happening over here. You can see that nice light there. Some other lights, my new chair, my desk, the background is going to be, I can't really see it, but yeah, shoot. Anyway, that's what's happening. It's under construction right now. And it's going to, it's going to look better than that. Like the, the, the, yeah, it's going to have a cool little background. Here's my, yeah, I put that bookcase in a few months ago, hanging from the ceiling.

Those are all my women in ministry books behind me. So nobody here has ever seen what's what I look at. I've put in this bookcase above me. These are all my kind in ministry books behind me. So nobody here has ever seen what's what I look at. I've put in this bookcase above me. These are all my kind of sexuality books above that. Got books in politics, transgender, kind of the stuff I'm constantly researching. Got my Malcolm X poster behind that light there. My MLK, Cody Bellinger, some family members there. Anyway.

So yeah, that's going to be the new studio over there. It's going to look great. I think hopefully, um, the audio is probably not going to change. I do have a new mic and a whole new interface. So the audio may be, it'll probably sound a little better, but I think it sounds pretty good now. Um, but the visual will be a little more aesthetically pleasing unless you really like the books behind me that we're, that background is going to be, to be leaving us very soon. I have a couple books coming out in 2024. Exiles, The Church and the Shadow of Empire is kind of a biblical theology of a Christian political identity is the most concise way I can put it.

Is it a book about politics? Well, kind of. Yeah, it's a book about a Christian political identity. I'm not going to tell you who to vote for. I'm not going to address head on all the political debates that we often engage in. I just want to go back to the first century and say, how can we let scripture inform our modern day political identity? Very excited for that book to come out March 4th, I believe. So you'll be hearing more about that in the next several weeks. Also, some of you, I don't know if I'm allowed to announce this yet, but I'm going to just go ahead and do it. I'll let my publisher get angry later. No, I think you're fine. So over the last

few years, I've served as a general editor of a new study Bible coming out called the Upside Down Kingdom Study Bible. Oh my word. I am so, yeah, oh my word. Literally, like, oh my Bible. Oh my word of God. I'm so excited about this study Bible. It was a three, four year project in the making. I was able to enlist 40 or so different authors. One of the big values of the study Bible is I wanted the authors to reflect the kingdom of God. So we have authors that represent different denominations, different theological viewpoints within healthy evangelical thoughts. We have ethnic diversity

among the authors. We have almost half of the authors are women because half of the members of the kingdom of God are women. And the focus of the study Bible is letting scripture speak to not just our private faith, but our public faith. How can, well, what does scripture say about political questions, social questions, cultural questions, other theological questions? What does it say about sexuality? What does it say about immigration? What does it say about race relations? What does it say about trauma and abuse in the church? What does it say about technology? What does it say? You know, a lot of these public questions that we have, a lot of these public questions that we have, a lot of these

political questions that we have, this Study Bible is focused on not bending scripture in a direction that it's not designed to go, but unleashing the profoundly political nature and social nature of scripture. So very excited for that Study Bible to come out. It's supposed to release in August 2024. So be on the lookout for that. I'll be talking about that in due time. Very excited for some upcoming guests. We've got John Mark Comer coming on the show. That'll drop in mid-January. Munther Isaac, Palestinian pastor and theologian. Evan Wickham's coming up here soon to talk about what it would look like for the church to be inclusive of LGBT people within the historically Christian sexual ethic. Julia Sadesky is talking about how do we talk to our kids? When do we talk to our kids about sex? And lots of other engaging questions coming up. Long-term, I'm

going to keep pushing into challenging topics, women in church leadership, politics, especially given it's a very politically charged year. More episodes on Israel-Palestine. I will not play into the fear of platforming people that certain people disagree with. And did you know 2024 is going to be increasingly polarizing? We all know that, right? Things are getting more and more polarized. So I want Theology in a Raw to not shy away from the tough topics, but to dive deeper into them in a manner that will not add to the polarization, but can hopefully model a better way to have curious conversations. So final thoughts, sign up for Exiles 24, go to TheologyNRaw.com where you can register. Consider becoming a

supporter through Patreon. We have almost just over a thousand people in the Patreon TheologyNRaw community. We would invite you to join that community. Lots of interesting things, conversations break out in the community. It's one of my favorite things about podcasting has become my, my Patreon community. It's just so many awesome people in there that I just would not have otherwise met.

So very thankful for all of you who support the show. So, okay. Coming up next, a Moonter Isaac, a Palestinian Christian perspective on the war in Gaza. We will see you in a couple of days. This show is part of the Converge Podcast Network.