Therapuss with Jake Shane - Session 130: Lisa Barlow

Episode Date: July 2, 2026

You're just... baby gorgeous... Thank you Poppi for sponsoring this episode! https://drinkpoppi.com/ Thank you to Booking.com for sponsoring today’s episode! Find exactly what you’re Booking for at https://www.booking.com Use my code for 10% off your next SeatGeek order*:⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠https://seatgeek.onelink.me/RrnK/THERAPUSS⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠  Sponsored by SeatGeek. *Restrictions apply. Max $25 discount Tell Me What's Wrong at ⁠ passthatpuss.com Follow Lisa! https://www.instagram.com/lisabarlow14/?hl=en Follow Me! Instagram | @passthatpuss TikTok | @octopusslover8 Listen to "THERAPUSS" Spotify: ⁠⁠⁠⁠https://open.spotify.com/show/1BHDdC0OVuHqZ706FobfOF ⁠⁠Apple Podcasts: ⁠⁠⁠⁠https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/therapuss-with-jake-shane/id1723626781⁠⁠ Amazon Podcasts: ⁠⁠⁠⁠https://music.amazon.com/podcasts/93117357-1f23-46e1-8f26-88f5182a68b8/therapuss-with-jake-shane⁠⁠ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Lisa Barlow is a queen. Manny and I have, Lisa Barlow for Manny and I is, talk about Lisa Barlow is important to God. Lisa Barlow is God for us. Lisa Barlow is God. I think she is one of the most important people in my life to me.

Me too. She inspires me. She motivates me. She really motivates me. Me too. And I, you know, some people stray from certain housewives when they do something that they don't like. And all I have to say is you need to watch episode one of the latest season where Lisa Barlow is not in it because she was doing big and important things. Yes.

And she was mentioned like how many times? Over 60 times in the episode was it? Mm-hmm. Because that's how important she is to the show. Yeah. No, and it felt like a big loss that episode. was something missing. There is no Salt Lake without Lisa Barlow.

I agree. I just think what I love about her is that she is so unapologetically herself. Yes. She could have six different housewives looking her dead in the eye saying you are wrong and she will look right back at you and say, I'm right. Nope. She believes everything she feels and says with such conviction and that's what's inspiring about her is that she's like, this is me, this is my truth.

This is how I feel. Take it or leave it. I don't care. And she's so funny. I know. And an amazing singer. And she's gotten so much better. She's gotten so much better.

We talk about this episode that she's done vocal lessons. We talk about her vocal warmups. Her debut single, Baby Gorgeous, is out now. Also, I don't know if you guys saw on my Instagram, but I'm doing a giveaway with headcount because voting is one of the most important rights we have in this country. So just click the link in my bio for a chance to win a FaceTime from me, like a little fun therapist session from me and a PR package from Kodch Once again, voting is vital and extremely important.

And Headcount is an organization that makes sure that we all have access to that. Also in the giveaway package is the Piss Casino Cottius merch that we wore in Vegas that I don't think we're ever going to sell. So you get to take action and have the chance to win fun things. And also be reminded that voting is extremely important. Thank you, Headcount, again, for working with me and getting the word out of how important it is to vote and making sure everybody can. And tonight on Therapus, we have Lisa Barlow. Hi Pussies.

Welcome back to Therapus. Tonight we have on the Queen of Salt Lake and New York, baby gorgeous, Lisa Barlow. Oh my gosh, I love that we're together. I love that we're together. You're like made to be together. We're like, kiss met. We're all the things. I miss you.

I miss you. How's life been? Tell me everything about this new single. Oh, my gosh. Do you love Baby gorgeous? Your just. Baby gorgeous. Your energy is magic, magic.

I mean, you have a... I haven't warmed up my voice yet, but I could do better. I promise. No, you sound amazing. What was it like recording? You know, it was... Okay, so this is so crazy. You're going to see this on season seven.

But my first time in the studio ever recording... anything musically related was on camera. So you're going to watch the whole thing. But it was like a little like, oh, I guess we're doing this. And there's cameras here. I can't really like mess up. You know, it was wild. Was Meredith like, was Meredith supportive of your musical journey?

Meredith is always supportive. I think, and like I'm supportive of her musical stylings by Meredith Marks too. We have some funny moments this season that you're going to like love. Let me just put this out there. Hypocrisy and bullshit. Bullshit. You're going to like want that in your head all the time through season seven. Because it becomes a thing.

What was season seven? What was filming season like? My favorite season I've ever filmed ever. I actually enjoyed the whole entire thing. I was sad when it ended because I loved it. And I loved it. It was like my favorite season. What did you love about it?

Our production crew were amazing. Oh my God. Well, I'm so happy because last time we saw, spoke after season six you were like yeah you were like I can't maybe I'm done no no I mean that's how I felt out oh oh oh it's like yeah yeah no but after season six I kind of was like I have a really nice life and why do I jack it up once a year and so you know like there's parts of me that loves it because it like makes you like see yourself in a different way you push yourself you create new boundaries, new guardrails.

So, like, that's what I've liked about doing the show. But then you watch the edits and you're like, who the fuck is that on TV? You know what I mean? And so this season, I felt like I was, like, 100% free in me. Like, I felt like a total sadge girl, like living my best life, having the best time. Yes. And I felt like I got to be free this year. And there's so much drama.

There's so much of, like, what people love from Salt Lake, but in such a different way. And it's so good. What's different about the drama this season than the other seasons? Listen, they're all still crazy. Like, who are you on good terms with right now? You know, it ebs and flows. I can mitigate any situation and any dynamic. I think me and Meredith are like going to be really solid forever and ever and ever.

I mean, it would take like so much. I mean. Like chainsaws and like crazy stuff to split us up. I love my dynamic with Meredith. but I can kind of like move through the group. How is your relationship with Angie? It's like the same. So not good.

Yeah. You know, like you'll have to see the journey of it, but it's like the same. Yeah. There's so many things they want to ask you about. Ask me everything. Can we just like, okay. Let's take it all the way back to season one.

Okay. When they were casting for the show, who were you closest with? You know, I helped bring the show to Salt Lake. Right. So I had already had a reality show, pilot filmed on me, and I, like, love the experience. We had our different restaurant. I think they were like, oh, she's like a young Lisa Vanderpump, and we're going to do this with her. And because of, like, my relationship with different, like, networks for Sundance, I think people,

And I don't just do Sundance. I do like so many other things too. But I think they were like, oh, there's like a TV show. We have to film her and do this. So I did the whole pilot. Henry was so little that we were up in Park City filming. And I could hear him upstairs with our nanny crying for me. And I finished the pilot.

And then I was like, I'm giving it to God. Like if it works out, it's meant to be if not, it's not. And the timing for sure wasn't right. So like I always kind of knew something was going to happen in that realm. and John and I were taking a walk by the golf course behind our house, and I'm like, I'm going to have a TV show this year, and he's like, okay, you're going to have a TV show this year, and I'm like, yeah, I am.

And then literally the stars aligned, and three people called me with the same person's number. Randomly, they didn't know each other, and they're like, you have to talk to Michaelene. And I'm like, this is so crazy. I keep being told I need to talk to Michaelene. I was in L.A. I was actually here for, like, the AFI Awards,

and she's like, can you meet me before? And I'm like, sure, but I ought to be ready to go. in a glam so I got like an hour and a half and we met and she's like we're doing this and I sent her like hundreds of names and like just go down the rabbit hole with each one of them but like I help kind of

assemble the cast too everybody's connected in some way or another through one of my friends or a friend and stuff so in the beginning it was Meredith that was your that was my girl so she moved to Park City from Chicago

her gay bestie was best friends with my gay bestie and now they're married. And they're like, yeah, they got married. Happy pride. Happy pride. And so we knew they had great taste when they tried to like pair us together. We're like, oh, it's fate. We're meant to be together.

So then me and Meredith were like, okay, we're doing this. And then she does not like to be tied down. Like Meredith does not like one zip code. It's just not. She's a Sagittarius too. So we like to fly. Like if I didn't have a cap moon sign, like I would. be out of Salt Lake.

Right. Yeah, I'd be like a Scalawhag or how do you say that Scalaug or, you know, like that word for people that just like go all over the place. Yeah, like a nomad. But I'm in high school like history. They're like, there's Scalawags. And so like she doesn't like to be tied down. So she was, you know, living.

I think she was back in Chicago, still had a place in Park City. So I'm like, you should do this with me. Let's do this. And it just kind of worked out. So it was like really good. I mean, I feel like you guys are my family. Yes, we are. I think you are.

Well, you're my mother. We're related. Yeah, well, you're related. I gave birth to you. You know, you did. But. Later time in life. The show really kicked off when Jen was arrested.

Yeah, it was wild. Wild. Did you understand how big of a deal it was in that moment when the FBI surrounded the Sprintervan? You forget cameras are around. I always forgot, like, since season one. Like, I forgot a mic. That's why I had a hot mic moment. But you forget all of that stuff.

But I remember sitting in the van and I was like, she got up. Her energy was really off. And then when she got that phone call and was like, I have to leave. We're like, okay, what's going on? Like, nobody would have ever in a million years thought, like Homeland Security, the FBI, MIPD was going to show up.

And she had told me this. crazy story about this guy that got locked away on like, I mean, like, Alcatraz type of situation. Like, he was locked away. He was never going to see her again. And I was like, oh, my gosh, he got out of jail and he's coming to kill Jen. Like, that's the first thing that went through my head. Oh. It's like this guy that she helped lock up is free and her life is in danger.

I thought it was to protect her. Do you, would you be open to film me with her again or is everyone like, no, no? I think that Jen has a lot of charisma and she's really funny. And when you get around a great day, she's like the most fun person ever. We used to have long chats at night. We're like every, I got massages like every Sunday and Wednesday. So Jen would call me through all my massages. And like I'd put her on speakerphone and we'd laugh with her.

Like my massage therapist loves her. And it's like she's crazy, but she's so funny. So she has this charisma about her. And it's like, really natural innate. She's fun. But I don't know if it's a good thing for her or any of us. Right. Yeah. But no, I want her to be happy. I want her to be thriving.

I want her to be like, you know, with her children and her husband and her mother and everybody else. Like I think that's important. And I think she's, you know, if she's really sorry, she did restitution and she's paying for her mistake. So she's out, right? Yeah, she's out. She's a free woman. Have you seen her since? No, not at all. Has anyone in Salt Lake seen her?

No, I think she talks to Meredith every now and then. Wow. Yeah, I think they'll like, she'll call Meredith randomly or Meredith will check in with her. But I don't think anyone has like a deep friendship with her. Okay. You mentioned the hot mic moment. Yes. Did you know in that moment you were like, oh, fuck?

No. Oh my gosh. No. So I left the table because my feelings were so hurt. and I was like, you can see I'm like sitting next to Meredith and I'm like rolling my eyes. But I didn't like, you know, in my interview they asked me, did you make up all that stuff about Meredith or is it true? No, Jen almost beat me up on the van on the way down there. And Jen was saying the craziest things about Meredith.

She's like, your fucking best friend who does this, this and this. And then said all the same things at the table while we were eating dinner. And then Meredith and Jen were in a full on fight at dinner. So I didn't like come up with these things. I was so upset with Meredith that I was like, you're not my fucking friend. You can't even stand up for me. Like,

I'm always alone, but I always defend you. And so, and like I almost got beat up for her. And I don't think Meredith understood the magnitude. Yeah. For me, I just left that table.

I took my mic off. I'm really good at that. I know what to do. Uh-huh. So I took my mic off and they said they boomed my door. But I was walking around like a crazy person. So the next day is when I figured out like I ranted. And so that's when you realized like,

oh, yeah. And then I was like, what else did I say? And then I didn't. think about it and then I remember feeling really really hurt by her and then I went down to the room and like Meredith and I got into it and I'm like you're the fucking liar like because I'm like I didn't say anything about your dad because that was coming from two other girls but I thought she realized I thought

she only heard the hot mic when the episode aired oh that's the only time any of us heard it and what was that like when that came out were you like oh my god I don't know she was the night two nights before the reunion right I was sobbing. I couldn't even talk to Meredith. I called her and I said, go watch episode 18, you're going to hate me. And I just hung up. And she goes, let me go watch

and I'm like, you're going to hate me. And then I didn't hear from her. Right. Yeah. How did you guys make up? We had to have two years ago the hardest hitting conversation. I literally sat in a Walmart parking lot on the phone with her for like an hour

and a half and we just had the hardest hitting conversation. and then there were subsequent hard-hitting conversations where we just talk through everything and gave context to our feelings, the situation. You know, when you're in that situation too, like her feelings were obviously her. I think if it came from anyone else,

it wouldn't have bothered her as much. You'd been like, I just, you're whatever. Because it was me. It was like worse. But if you listen to the way things were being said, like it makes sense. Like, you know, her and Jen were going at it at the dinner table. And if you really hear what Jen was saying in the van at the dinner table at my Vita Tequila

Food Court party, it's all the stuff I said in my hot mic moment. It's just I kept hearing it and shutting it down, hearing it and shutting it down. And then I just was so hurt. I was like, well, maybe this is true and blah, blah, blah, blah. And, you know, just, you know, lost my mind. Right. I remember it. I mean, it made for great television.

And I'm happy that you and Meredith are now good. Oh, yeah, and I'm human. We all have those moments. about John Barlow on the daily. Like, I'll be walking to my room like, oh, I don't know. You're also from New York. People forget. Oh, yeah.

We verbalize all of our emotions and feelings. Like, when I moved to Utah to go to school, my mom's like, you have to leave here immediately. No one thinks you're pretty. They all think you're ugly because nobody did what they do in New York, where you walked down the streets and they're like, hey, girl, hey. My mom's like, no one even cares about you here.

You need to leave immediately. Uh-huh. And, like, I think when you come from a culture, where it is it's my DNA like all of New England the East Coast is very different than the West Coast where people just say exactly what they mean you get over it you move on

like I would say the bad truth is better than a good lie and oh I love that yeah my hot mic moment was not any there's no truth to it but like my feelings were raw I was hurt and I think you know that's just the way I grew up you say things you move on you say things you move on and I think it's way better to just like

get it out, then to like sit with it and then just give people bad vibes. Right. Yeah. Right. You can feel that. Yeah. No bad energy. How is Brittany been this season?

She's like butterflies and ladybugs. Yeah. I love, I mean, she's chasing rainbows in her head. Like, she's somewhere over the rainbow. So she's not here? She's here. She's here. I want to say physically, mentally, she's in a different place.

You know, and I think that, like, people are going to have to tune in to watch what happens with Brittany. But, like, she's, you know, part of me, like, I was, like, rooting for Brittany. And I think last year, with the whole plane incident, with them making up this ridiculous story about what happened on the plane, it really made me see people very. differently because I could never just boldly lie about somebody. What happened on the plane? Nothing. Meredith vented to me. Meredith sat by me the entire flight. So Heather was across the aisle.

We had Whitney, Mary here, Brittany in front of us. And then... Wait, so, wait, paint it for me. Okay. So here's me and Meredith on the looking, coming down the aisle if I were like, you know, the flight host. Right. I would be to the left. Heather was across the aisle from me. But if you're looking forward, like out of the plane, it's like me and Meredith, Heather here, Whitney, Mary, Britney, Stranger, Angie at front, production right behind me. And so what happened?

Meredith was really upset because Brittany on Below Deck came into our cabin and kept being like gassing Meredith up and being like, Meredith did look hot in her bikini. So she's like, you look so hot in your bikini. Oh my God, I'm in love like you. This looks so good. I just love you so much. So Meredith is like, just stop messing with me. She's like basically like stop fucking with me and we're fine.

And then when Brittany came out at dinner saying like, oh, your husband was in an Uber and I think he's cheating on you. But I'm just trying to be a good girl's girl. Meredith was like, we're done. And so I was in a villa with Meredith before we flew out. And she woke me up early the next morning. She's like, we've got to fly out. We've got to get ready to go.

And she's like, I'm still very upset about last night. And I'm like, I get it. I understand how you feel that way. and then we had to take this crazy like 1960s prop plane to another island to catch like a real flight to New York and on the flight because you know it's a faraway island it's not like an easy to get to if you have a super yacht if you're Jeff Bezos it's perfect right or Michael Jordan it's a great island to go to but like for us it was a little rough to get to and so she just vented to me the whole time she's like she's like um I got set up I'm

so upset. She was emotional. She was crying. On the plane. Yeah, she was just only talking to me. Brittany had headphones on and Gina behind us couldn't hear. So I got up during one part of the flight and said, hey, Gina, Meredith's really upset. I think you should call our showrunner and let her know.

Meredith's super upset. Like, I feel horrible for her. And I think somebody needs to talk to her when we get back to Salt Lake. And she's like, okay. And I'm like, can you hear her? And she's like, not at all. Not even a little bit. But the only person Meredith talked to is me.

What about the shaking of the seat and the wine spilling? Didn't happen. Didn't happen? No. Not while I was awake. Right. Not at all. Okay.

Not that I saw, not that I experienced. I don't see Meredith doing that. Could you see it possibly happening while you were asleep? No. I just don't. Mareth, not that type. Okay. Meredith is just isn't even really, it takes it a lot to get her to yell.

So, like, you know, she said some, mean things about Brittany to me. You know, just some other stuff. She felt. Yeah, it just went on and on and on. And so, but like it was to me, and it's not like she was screaming it. Like, you'd have to try to listen to hear it. Got it. Got it. Okay. And so the plane was, well, the plane was like the crux of that season. Oh, yeah. And so, like, the fact that they all were like, okay, now we're going to use this as a chance to, like, fake rally around Britney, use this as an excuse to, like, treat me in Meredith badly.

that was the problem last year. And that's like it made me just totally shift my energy, how I felt about how they handle situations, how they treat me. Because I mean, like I was getting it pretty bad. The first half of the season, they were trying to convince Meredith that I'm this horrible human being and this bad friend and she shouldn't be friends with me. And it's just like the, you know, like incite divide kind of tactics. And so it just kind of got old. And so this season I went into it with like, okay, we have zero fucks now. Right. Like you're,

do you feel like you are, you've become immune to criticism from outside world? Because you're like, Oh, beyond, beyond immune. Yeah. Yeah. And when other people get upset when they're in a situation

where they have to just like answer simple questions, I'm like, you have no idea what I've gone through. Like, this is nothing. But I am so immune. I mean, the public can be really mean too. So you just get like,

you know, like I've always had thick skin and I have like an innate sense. of self. So, you know, last season something's got to me for the first time ever. Like, I didn't love it. I had a hard time. How did you bring yourself back to being like, I can do this? This is my job.

This is who I am. I'm here for a reason. I woke up and I was like, I'm just baby gorgeous. You are just baby gorgeous. It's magic. But, no, it kind of helped me to, like, remember, like, it's so cliche, but just, like, remember who I am. Like, you know, and then I get in the van and I tell the girls, I'm like, nobody's, like,

really real here. Like I was like, I don't really know that much about you guys. Like, I like depth and dimension in my relationships. Like, I want more. I give more. I'll give as much as you guys want me to give as long as like you're like hearing it. You're receiving it. And like we're all in this together. But like I, all my relationships are deep. I don't have shallow relationships. I'm friends with all my friends from kindergarten. I'm friends, best friends with all my friends from college. Like when Baby Gorgeous came out like my kindergarten friends were messaged. me. My sixth grade bestie was messaging me like all my mom's friends, you know? And so I'm like, I'm used to that. It's like so different for me to be around like such shallow relationship. So I wanted

more and I feel like I'm getting, I feel like I'm getting more of that. How was your relationship with Heather? Because at the beginning of season six, it was great. Complicated. And then at the end of season six it was not so great she complicated it i like was all in and she has you'll see coming up soon on ultimate girls trip and on housewives like i'm a very forgiving person and when i forgive i move on and i don't go backwards right she made it hard for me to want to do that why you'll see very soon oh i'm so excited it's amazing who's on it's you hether no me kyle richards jazelle porcia teresa Vicky, I'm missing somebody. Luann.

Did Alicia not do it from Rhode Island? No. But you know what? You're going to see, like, we get to meet all the Rhode Island girls along the way. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, that's what I'm thinking of up because we just spoke to Alicia. Yeah, she's really cool. They came out of the gate.

Like, when I met them for the first time, I'm like, oh my gosh, this is going to be epic to watch them because they have no filters. Have you been watching? Parts of it. I wish I could watch more of my schedule. nuts but I see a lot on social um you know I think like just with how crazy my schedule's been to sit down and watch a full episode has been hard but they're amazing they're amazing oh yeah they're really good I think they're so great I think it reminds me of home like it's how I'm used to like interacting with people you say what you mean you get over it there's so much history it cuts a

little deeper but then forgiveness is bigger because you've had such deep roots with these people you've known them your whole life. And I think that, that, like, the show creates one bond, but when you have, like, long-term relationships with people and you start doing something like this, you have a different kind of bond that doesn't ever go away. It probably, there's times where they'll probably think they're, like, never going to make up, but they all will. Right.

You can tell. Was there a moment for you where you're like, I am never making up with this person ever? Yeah. Oh my gosh, every season. And then somehow you do. Yeah, but I don't like to sit and. negativity either. I just think it's so harmful for our bodies, but I do have

guardrails. I do have like walls that I put up with certain people where like I can be fine with them but we'll never be friends. Not like the way we used to be. Right. Yeah. There's a couple of them that I'm like you will never know me. You'll know surface me. You'll never know me. Whitney. You know there was a time when I think Whitney was going through some really hard stuff and I'm glad that

like we could have a good friendship there, but I mean, I just, I just require different things than I did five, six, seven years ago. Thank you, SeatGeek, for sponsoring tonight's episode. You guys, it's the World Cup. It's the World Cup. And the World Cup is taking place in America. And the best place to get tickets for the World Cup is on Seat Geek.

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So Meredith's caviar. Oh, my gosh, I love her caviar. And then what? I love her caviar. And Meredith makes beautiful jewelry. Right, yes, yes, yes. Oh, you have a great stack going. I always have something Meredith marks on.

One of these is hers. And I thought this was hers. No, it's not. But normally I have it all the way up my arm. Yeah, I love a stack. How is John Barlow? John Barlow is amazing. Is he, you know, he's my favorite house husband.

Oh my gosh. And you're his favorite ever, ever, ever. I don't. for him. He loves you too. I love him. He's doing amazing. I think, you know, John never really gives a lot on the show because he's always been like, this is your thing and he'll be there to like, he brings like humor to the show and he's really witty and dry humor. But this season, I think like he opens up a lot more. He gave a lot last season too. Yeah. And I think you'll see like a continuation of that and like where he was coming from in like a way that was shocking to me. Right. Like literally like,

It's all over my face. You're like, yeah. We'll talk later. Yeah. Like I was like, oh my gosh, we need to talk later. Yeah. I'm going to take a week off. Right.

Yeah. I'm taking a week off, maybe a month. And we're going to have a conversation. Right. But it was like really good for both of us, I think. We've been married and together for a very long time. And has he, so you grew up Jewish. Yeah.

I'm Jewish by heritage. Kind of my dad was agnostic. and my mom was just always searching for faith. Like I think that was a big thing. So when the Mormon missionaries knocked on our door, she literally was like, I've been praying for you. We're all like two cute boys in suits. What?

Like this is wild. And it took my dad a long time to convert. Like he was not like, it wasn't his thing. I don't think it was something he didn't miss it. He never had it. He didn't, you know, his mom. mom died when he was seven and a half and I think that, you know, he kind of, like, found a way to, like, you know, my grandfather was amazing, and my dad had amazing family members that stepped in when his

mom died, but he didn't have, like, somebody that was like, we love God and, like, let's focus on faith and, like, structured religion. And my mom didn't really either, but, like, wanted it. And so that's when you converted to Mormonism. That's when we converted to Mormonism. And then how do you juxtapose? being Mormon and also doing things that are inherently not Mormon. Okay, like non-Orthodox. Like, you know, like you have- Seth Marx is the one that came up with Mormon 2.0.

Uh-huh. And, but I always say I'm non-Orthodox. So I've never had, like, I just live my life and I think that's what God wants. Like, from a religious standpoint, like, I love God, I give everything to God. Like, I have prayers answered every single day. like believe, I'm like a true believer in God. And I think that for me, I just don't think God judges me. I think, you know, church is an open door. Everyone's welcome. I've never put, I didn't grow up in Utah either, but I've never put religious pressure on myself. It's more like my,

I put pressure on myself to be, to show up in a good way. I, like God, like I just want to be myself. And I think, um, all faiths evolve, like the Mormon church. you know, it's like the restored gospel of Jesus Christ. Mormons is a nickname, but the name of the church is like the Church of Jesus Christ of Latterty Saints. Mormons love Jews, by the way. Mormons, I think, are very Jewish with the exception of like accepting Christ as like the Savior instead of a rebel rabbi.

So like that's, I mean, that's a big deal. Very big deal. But Mormons like are like love Jews. So I think for me, I'm like, I'm double blessed. Yeah, you are double blessed. I'm double blessed. But I think, you know, it's not hard for me. I just want to be myself.

And even with Jack going on a mission, we did our best raising Jack. Jack has to make his own decisions. The mission, we never talked to him about it. That was 100% his decision. He kept it so private. And we just had like a really, like, great mom's son talk three days ago where he's like, mom, you were done raising me a long time ago. I make decisions based on my beliefs, not yours.

I make decisions based on who I am, not based on who you are. And I was like, I love this so much. Like, you don't even understand. I love hearing this from you. It makes me feel resolved as a mother, like that you, like, feel so confident in your ability to make decisions for yourself and you're, like, you know, like how you're choosing to live your life. Like, that makes me so happy, you know.

How is his life post-mission? Amazing. Oh, you're going to be seeing a lot of Jack soon. I'm so excited. He's his own project without me and John, and it's so good. And he's happy. He's bilingual, like fluently, completely fluent. He works really, really hard.

He works. He moonslights at our lounge. Works his brand fresh wolf. He's shredded. He's so cute. How is the lounge? The lounge is amazing. We need to do your birthday party there.

I know. That's what I'm saying. I want to fly everyone out to Utah and I want to do my birthday party at the beach. We're making this happen. And it will be the best night of my life. The best night of our life. I don't know if you can top Europe. Your Europe trip looked pretty amazing.

It was amazing. It was amazing. It was amazing. I had so much promo. I wanted to be running down the streets of Monaco with you. We were running down the streets, clubs every night. I know. I felt it with you.

You were at, what's it called? Oh my gosh. What club did you go to? Went to Lily's and then we went to some other first name club. Oh my gosh. Like poppies or something. Yes, I know. And it's like the best one.

I know exactly. it is. I saw you guys running through the streets and I literally was like, I need to be there. Oh, it would have been perfect with you there. It looks so fun. Oh, my gosh. It looks so fun. I'm going to Paris for the first time this Sunday. I've never been to Paris. Oh, you're going to thrive in Paris. I'm so excited. Oh, gosh. You're going to thrive. What are you doing in Paris? I'm going to the Dior show.

Yeah, amazing. Thank you. Yes, you're amazing. You're amazing. Oh, my gosh. You know, you're my favorite housewise of all time. Oh, my gosh. Thank you. You know what's funny is like that's such a nice, sweet thing to say, and I love you so much for that. I forget I'm even on Housewives a lot of times. Wait, what do you mean?

Like, is that crazy? Oh, because you're just like, I'm her? Yeah, like, you know, oh my gosh, speaking of her, have you heard that country song, Be Her? Oh, yeah, by Ella Langley. Yes, are you obsessed with that? Can you sing it for me? She drinks wine by the glass.

I got to take a sip real quick. Okay, I love this song. We should turn it on and sing it. Uh-huh. Not by the bottle. I just got nervous and I never get nervous. No, no, no, don't be nervous. Here, I'll turn around.

But she drinks wine by the glass, not by the bottle. She ain't stuck in the past. Ain't worried about tomorrow. You know who she's singing that about? I'm convinced it's herself. Oh, what do you mean? I think that song is about her. When she's like, I just want to be her so bad, it hurts so bad.

to me, when Ella sings that song, it's really about herself. And she's like... Oh, yeah, it's like who she really is. Oh, I love that. So introspective. Yeah, I feel like when I listen to it, it reminds me of my mother, too. Like I called my mom and I'm like, this song is about you when I hear the song I think of you. Because she's so authentically herself.

And like, if she were on the show, people would be obsessed with her. She's so cool. Your mom? Yeah, she'll never do it. She wouldn't even let me stand next to her in public. Wait, why won't she do the show? She just loves her privacy. Okay.

But she is like 100% her. But when I heard Ella Langley singing that, I was like, she's singing this about herself. How, in what? It's like the way she sees herself to me. Right, right. Like when she sings that, I'm like, I feel it so strongly. I want to ask her someday. But like, I'm like, she has to be singing that about herself, the way she really sees herself.

What else are you listening to right now besides baby gorgeous? You know what? funny. We went to the AMAs and I was like, my nieces love Katzai and they are so hot and their outfits are the cutest thing ever. But like I kind of like I'm like, I never thought I would be into Katzai. I like love them. I like love country right now. Love country. Yeah, I like love country music right now. And like I love the way Ella Langley's doing it too because it's like a cross popovery kind of thing. But that song I scream sing in the car and I like love it so much. My favorite is choosing Texas.

Oh, yeah. She's from Texas. I can tell by the way. She's stepping down the room. That's like such a good one too. But all of our songs are so good. I haven't warmed up my voice where I would full on sing for you. I've been in vocal lessons for two years.

What? Yes. Yes. And I do this whole warm up thing. You know, if you blow bubbles and your drink, you can sing better. If you just warm up like this. like sing your favorite song with bubbles in your glass.

It'll open up your throat so much. I'm not kidding you. And then you'll be able to, when you start singing, you're going to sound so good. It like stretches the muscles in the back of your throat. It's so good. She's from, oh, wow, it's clearer. Yes.

Yeah. If you do that for, like, sing the song three times through and blow bubbles, it's, like, amazing. I do, I do blow bubbles every single morning, not this morning because I couldn't get Coke on fountain. Wait. I got it from a glass bottle at the hotel. And that you don't, you hate that.

No, I hated that. You need it from a fountain. I need it from 7-Eleven or similar. Yeah. Or Wendy's, die-hard Diet Coke. Oh, Wendy's sounds so good. It does. What's your Wendy's order for those that don't know?

Oh, my gosh. Well, I love the nuggets. They can't sound best nuggets ever. If you get your nuggets anywhere else, it's sad. Because then you're just getting grease balls with a little chicken inside, and that's gross. There's a difference. I like eating everywhere. I'm a connoisseur.

Dave's single burger is unbelievable. They have all the accoutrements on that burger. It's like the perfect mayo, lettuce, onion, everything blend that's like next level. So like the burger's so good. The tendies are amazing. Their cookies are supreme. How are you not the face of Wendy's? I am.

You're the face of Wendy's right now? Well, kind of. Yeah, five years I have like commercials with them four times a year. Oh, that's amazing. And you have your Wendy's cash? Um, yes. I like Love Wendy's. It's like my favorite place to go every single day I'm there.

Like they know me by name. Right. I don't even have to like I drive through. They know my order already. They hear our voice. They see our car roll up and they just know. Does John love Wendy's as much as you love Wendy's? Oh yeah. John's there too.

How did you and John meet? Um, okay. So John went on a Mormon mission and he, his dad went on one to, John's adopted. He has like a crazy like adoption story. and he was adopted by a great family. His dad went on a mission to Paris, where you're going. Yes. And missions were really long back then.

Now they're like two years. So I think it was like three years back then or two and a half. His dad's like 80. And John thought he was going to go to Paris. And so my sister, you know, we're in New York. We have no idea who this John Barlow guy is, obviously. Never met. And so she's dreaming of going to Paris on her mission.

And you don't get to pick where you go. So she gets called the Vegas. And I think she wanted to be like, I'm not going. And John got the same call. He got called because he grew up all over, like Germany, Florida, Texas, California, Chicago. Because his dad was an exec with IBM. So then when he got called to Vegas, he was like, are you kidding me?

Like, I think he was like, all my friends are going somewhere. Cool. I'm going to Vegas. So they met on their mission. And we would hear about John Barlow nonstop to the point where I was like, I hate John Barlow and I haven't even met him. Wait, why? Just like hearing like this cute guy, John Barlow. Oh, he's so cute and he's like perfect and he's amazing and blah, blah, blah, blah.

And so I was at BYU. She came out. She finished her mission, was at BYU. John was off his mission at BYU. And one night she's like, let's go over to John Barlow's house. I'm like, I hate John Barlow. Like I don't want to go. And she's like, he's a cute friend.

You should come. So I bought ice cream, brought it over. The friend annoyed me so bad. I literally got my ice cream out of the freezer and walked home. Because I was like, I can't stand being around this guy. and she was like crushing on John but he didn't like her. So they went on like one day and like I think they kissed once, like nothing like serious. And he was like not, we're not meant to be together.

He actually got married to somebody else. And I remember like he sent an like an announcement to like our house. And I remember opening it and thinking I could have married him and just throwing the announcement like on the bed. And like, you know, seven years later I run into John. in Utah and my sister's like, you guys, we should all go to a baseball game. And I'm like, I'm not, I didn't want to go because I didn't like him because he didn't like my sister. Some weird, I don't know, loyalty thing, you know, with your family.

Yeah. So we ended up going to a baseball game and we started hanging out when we were just like platonic best friends. And one day I'm like, I love you. And he's like, I love you too. And now, we've done together for 25 years. Wow. Yeah, it's been a long time.

So what was BYU like? Amazing. When I was there, it was like. like the best school on earth. Like the best school on earth. Could you break the rules and drink? Everybody broke the rules. Okay, right?

Yeah. Like, everybody broke the rules. Like, all, like, I lived off campus. I lived in, like, the most killer townhouse, and then moved into the sickest condo. We went to Vegas every weekend. Some girl had a hookup down there, so we'd drive this guy, Jordan's, like, sick cars down on Friday night,

come back Sunday night before school, and, like, spend, like, the weekend, and laying out by the pool. Like, I don't even know what my friends were doing. I still don't want to know what they were doing. We'd go to other frat parties for other colleges and, like... Would anyone else try to, like, get you guys in trouble with the school? No, never.

Okay. No. I mean, I didn't hang out with any of the Utah kids. Like, all of my friends were from, like, Boston, Connecticut, New York, L.A., like, San Francisco, Texas. Like, none of my friends were born and raised in Utah. It was like such a separation between like the born and raised kids and then the like kids from out of town. Lisa, what are you therapist about today?

Oh my gosh, so many things. Tell me everything. I hate showers that don't have really good wands. Like water pressure? No, like you know the wand to like, like if you stay like the first thing I do when I check into a hotel is I check to make sure the shower has like really good wand system and like jets. Do you? Like a, what do you mean in jet? Like, you know how they have the sprayers?

Like for your body? Like on the side of the shit? Yeah, and the side. Yeah, and like a wand. So, like. Oh, yeah. I'm not a wand person. I care about water pressure.

My water pressure and my shower is atrocious. Is it bad? So bad. Wait, what? Like, it's like sprinkling. I don't know. I need help. Like, I don't know what you should do.

I think we can get you help today. Somebody like, Opper Jake showerhead with the pressure. Like, it's like sprinkling down. You have to call a plumber. Okay, the plumber? Yeah, you have to call a plumber. Like, immediately, you need a new showerhead

and they need to, like, check your hot water heaters. Okay. You need multiple. Okay. So you're, like, with showers as Meredith is to baths. Oh, yeah. I'm neurotic about my showers. Like, if they don't have a wand, I'd, like, want to check out immediately.

I don't get, like, you know, like, some Ritz Carlton's don't even have a wand. And you're like, who's not updating your bathrooms? Right. Like, that kind of stuff makes me really mad. I 100% get that. Yeah. This episode. of therapist is brought to you by booking.com.

Booking dot, yeah! The other day I was on my phone and I was talking to my best friend Alice and we were looking at old photos of when we were in Santa Barbara together and it made me really, really, really, really want to go back. So Alice and I are now planning a trip to go back to Santa Barbara with booking.com.

We both have very, very, very specific needs. We like to make sure that we're able to walk because I can't drive, so it's always nice to be able to walk into town. I need air conditioning. We both need air conditioning, a lot of it. And so these are things that we are able to put into booking.com to help us find the best place to stay. We can also rent a car on booking.com.

We can make the trip full-rounded. And Alice and I need all the help we can get. Every trip Alice and I take, we always use booking.com because it makes it the easiest possible way to book the trip. It helps us really get from the idea to the actual destination, which is. is sometimes difficult. So we are going to go on booking.com and find the perfect place to stay at in Santa Barbara because we are not just letting this be an idea.

Go on, book that trip, it's easy. At booking.com. Booking dot, yeah! Book today on the site or in the app. You know, I went into the season and I'm like, this is what I did for myself that I think made me feel so good. I was so enabled.

They just let us do what we needed to do. to like tell our story and that for me was the best thing that could have ever happened to me. I'm so excited to see this season. I loved it. And you know, people might hate me and I don't care. I just was like I've never cared but like now I really genuinely don't. And I just feel like, you know, I got accused of doing so many things I've never done. I wouldn't even think to do.

Like my brain doesn't even work that way. And then to like have the freedom to just be me, be her. You know, Ella Langley said a best, just be her. Felt so good. Take me back to that boat trip when everyone was accusing you of shit and you went out on the deck and called John and now one of the most famous scenes in Salt Lake history. I was so hurt. Yeah.

Like those were such genuine feelings and cries of hurt. And I talked about it at the reunion. It didn't make it into the show. I mean, there's only so much time. But we, you know, to get to a destination like Kenwin, we were there early. So you stay on the island for two days before you got on the boat. So Heather was having a hard time. We took Heather to the tiki bar.

I got a golf cart, picked her up, snuck her out of her room. We were like doing karaoke and having the time of our life before we got on the boat. So I was shocked when she's like, you're the source. I'm like, I'm the source. You're the one that has all the issues. Not me. I have issues, but I don't care enough about them to raise them. Like, you're the one that cares more.

You're the one that was crying. You're the one we took out of your bedroom. And like, so how am I the source? And when Bronwyn actually got on the boat, she accused Whitney of being the one that leaked the stuff about her. She's like, I was told by some blogger. It's like a well-known blogger that it's Whitney. And so I was defending Whitney.

And then Whitney turned it on me, and then Heather turned it on me that night. And that trip was awful for me. Like I was literally by myself. Like I felt so isolated. How do you deal with the fact that Meredith doesn't defend you in that situation? Meredith, I understand her. So she, it's not like we grew up so differently that like I do what I need to do

and Meredith can do what she needs to do. I'm like, I said it at the reunion. and I'm like, I can, I can go fucking solo. Like, I can. Lisa Barlow, yeah, I can take, I can speak for myself. I can take care of myself. I'm fine. And, you know, sometimes my feeling, you know,

there have been times when my feeling gets hurt and I talk through them. But I think for me, I have just learned to do this in a way that feels so comfortable for me now. And like, so, like, I'm at peace with so much that. You know, I can interact the way I want to interact and get what I need from it. Yeah. Yeah. Does that make sense?

That makes sense. Yeah. But you can't put, I can't put expectations on people where, like, it's like when people are like, you get so defensive and I'm like, well, I'm defensive because I'm mad and because that's offensive. You know? And so for me, I've just like, you know, just figured things out and stuff. but I can't, Meredith is going to always be Meredith

and I'm always going to be me. And I think, and I think I like, you know, one thing that I told John last week in the car that I really need from the show more is individuality because I value individuality. Like I think it's so fun to have our fans that are individuals that align with us and feel us. And like, you know, like you and I have like a natural, like,

connection and like we get each other in such a natural way. And I'm like when you have that with someone, it's so great, but I don't want to skin you and wear you. I just love you for you. And same with me. And I think like on the show when you're in a smaller group, I think like for me, one thing I've really craved and like work really hard at is just like seeing how people are real individuals and like what I love about them as an individual, if we're getting along

or not getting along. And I just really want to just be me. Yeah. Like that's my power is like just being. me. Be her. Yeah, be her. And I think when I feel like that's jeopardized, that's when I'm, like, the most defensive. Yeah. And then the show gets hard. Yeah. Well, I'm so grateful that you had such a good experience during season seven. I mean, I don't know how that it's going to be, but I had so much fun doing it. So who fucking cares? I never, I never get mad at the edits because you can fix it at the reunion.

And like, I don't prep for the reunion. I just have to show up and remember, either to remember how I felt or how I would feel and I'm fine. Right. I have a really good memory, too. Yeah. Oh, you do? Helps. Oh, yeah. What's something you can memorize that, like, other people can't. I don't know if I can remember things, but, like, Meredith is always like, if you want to know what happened, just ask Lisa, because she'll remember it in detail. And I pick up on weird details, too. Right.

Like, interesting details, things I think are interesting, so. Mani is the number one fan of this show besides me. Do you have any questions for Lisa before we get into the tummy what's wrongs? Every time I hear you speak in any interview or, like, any thing. little clip I see online, you have, or you seem like you have such self-love and, like, such confidence. And I know this is, like, kind of, like, a broad question and also I feel like a very, like, common question, but I really, like, feel it from you. How did you, like, cultivate that? How do you have such self-love and, like, do you have any advice for someone that doesn't?

Yes. Not me, a friend. Yeah, no, yes. Me. Um, you know, when I wrote Baby Gorgeous, you're going to see the process on the show. And like I cried throughout it because, oh, I don't want to get emotional. Hold on. I always bite the inside of my cheeks so I don't. I used to think emotion and crying was weakness.

It's a superpower. It's a superpower. All of our most successful friends, like billionaire friends that have sold, and I'm not bragging, I'm not dropping names, I could. But my closest friends, they all cry when they talk about something they care about because, and you can't be successful if you can't feel.

Like, I don't want to be around someone that doesn't have feelings. Like, just done. We're, like, if you have no, if you're on a permanent beta blocker, like, not one you need, but, like, one that you just don't feel. It's sad and it's, like, draining. But when I was writing Baby Gorgeous, I sat with Jed and Jake, and I'm like, I'm going to give you a pep talk because everybody goes through it. Like, you're going to see John goes through it, and John is, like, handsome and bold and strong

and witty, everybody goes through something where they're like jarred, like where their self-confidence is jarred, right? Or their like ability to see who they actually are is jarred. And so I'm like, I'm going to give you a pep talk. And I just started talking and it became the lyrics of the song. And I was like, you know, giving it to my two friends, like that I'm co-writing this song with. And I'm like, your energy is magic. If you feel it happens, you have the power to like make anything happen. And we turned it into a song. But I think since, I was a little girl. I'll never forget going to this girl, Michelle's house,

and her mom had me over, I swear, just to tell me how ugly I was. And, like, just to be mean, I was in fourth grade. And, like, I'll never forget it. I remember being that little, what dress I had on, what her mother was wearing, what room we were in, the yellow, ugly pillows on the couch,

and feeling sorry for her mother. That she felt like she had to put a little, like I knew I was a kid. and I knew she should know better. I felt sorry for her mom, and I still feel it to this day, that the only way she could feel good about her child was to make me feel like shit. And I had another girl, Tina in high school. Her mom did the same thing in ninth grade.

We were all at their summer house, and she was, the mom relentlessly, every chance she got. And I just put up a wall and was like, I am better than this. Like, for real, and not better than people. I'm better than this. Like, and it just doesn't impact me. And I think like, you know, I give a lot of it to God. I'm like seriously, like love God.

I have like such a good relationship with God. Like when I said I'm important to God, like everyone should feel important to God. Like you should feel that. You should 100% feel it like I matter. What I think matters, how I feel matters. I matter. And I think when people get so caught in the chaos of like life in the world, you forget that.

Like it's easy to forget like, oh my gosh, I matter. You know, even with Baby Gorgeous, it's so fun. Like one girl's like sent me a video and she's like, I'm crying, listening to like the lyrics. It makes me like a little emotional because I'm like, and I'm like, people should feel good about themselves. Like, do you know what I mean? It's like, you should wake up and feel good. Like it's special. You know what I follow a lot of on TikTok?

My nephew has. He has their cerebral palsy and it's not bad. And I watch all these kids with cerebral palsy, like talking about their story. And my nephews isn't like, yeah, thanks, Jake. You're like, what do I do with these? But I watch, like, my nephew and, like, the struggles he's had, like, I remember him saying, like, oh, my gosh, no one's ever going to love me. And I'm like, and he's so gorgeous.

And it didn't affect his speech. it affected his arm when he's born and he's so cute. And I watch all these kids on TikTok talking about their cerebral palsy and like how it's hard for them to talk and they're like, I'm brilliant inside, but I have a hard way expressing it. And I'm like, that's so beautiful. And like they find beauty and everything. And I think you said to find like, you know, God made all of us like,

some people have harder hardships. They have health issues. They have physical impairments or deformities and stuff. But there's beauty in everybody and everything. everything. And I think, like, when you start to feel that about yourself, it's hard. You have to remind yourself. Like, it's a beautiful thing. And I've just, like, never allowed other people's thoughts about me when I know me to change that. That's why, like, in my song, it's like, people think you're lost out in the dark, but you're just shining, like, in the stars. Like,

it's really powerful. And I really wanted people to hear that. And, like, just get that in your head because even if you don't really hear the words at first it's just like a catchy bob then you really start to hear the lyrics and it's like no like you are like people that judge you on line chain they don't know you they don't know your magic they don't know your energy they don't get to experience what we all get to experience with you that you're like funny and witty and charming and cool and like everything they just like want to take from you and then it's like easy when you learn like no you don't get to take from me i i i this is very big i i this is very good you're not you're not you beautiful and special about me.

And we all, like, the weirdest things make some of us the coolest people. Right. And I think it's just, like, embracing all of that and, like, understanding that. And, like, I am so much more accepting of other people because of that. Like, I feel like, I, you know, I don't really look at other people's weaknesses as weaknesses. I just am like, oh, that's, like, that's rough. I'm sad for you or, like, you know, or, like, you're never going to get a piece of me again. Like, you know what I mean?

But I think it's, I think it's a, I think it's a. think some people have to work harder on it but it's also like allowing your mind to open up to the point where you're just like that doesn't matter it doesn't matter yeah i matter i matter to me i know who i am and everyone has special gifts too like not everyone gets the same ones we all get special ones wow that makes me think of the song in such a different light yeah like it really has so much it's like a good pride song too you know what i mean and it's like don't let anyone tell you who you Don't let anyone mess with your what you're like entitled to and what you deserve, you know. And people are going to judge you, but it doesn't matter.

And like this way it's like we don't walk with straw, you know, like you can go your own way if you have something bad to say. And just remember that. If you read something negative, you just be like, go your own way. And you're just baby gorgeous. Yeah, you don't belong here. Baby gorgeous is just. Some people write mean things to me and I'm like, ooh, you have bad energy. Bad energy.

You're not baby gorgeous. Your energy is really bad. Thank you for sharing that. Yeah. And I just like, and like I hate being like a crybaby about it. But I think like so many people need to be reminded. Like I want to write a book for kids on confidence.

Oh my God. That would be amazing. Just like a little cool book. That would be amazing. That would be amazing. About like how to build your confidence and like where to be confident, you know, because I think like it's like something we all need to remind of. Our world is mean.

It used to not be this mean because you didn't have to hide behind Cheetos Stained fingers in like a kid. keyboard. Like you had to say things to people's faces. You had to see the reactions. You had to see the hurt on their faces. You had to deal with the repercussions to your actions. So you would feel bad. Like I remember everyone I was mean to. Right. And like I regret it and like feel bad. I mean, 10 years ago I made apologies to people where I'm like, I said this. I don't know if you remember, but I'll never forget it and I feel bad, you know. You like, you took ownership of it. Oh yeah, because I'm like it was wrong. Because you remember their reaction. And now everyone can just hit

said and forgot about it. But they don't like the way it makes them feel when someone's mean to them, but they have no problem doing it to somebody else. But I just think, like, I like love. John will always tell me, he's like, you'll always come home and say, oh my gosh, I met this person, and I'm obsessed with them. You're going to be obsessed with them. And he's like, you find all these, like, crazy unique things about them.

And then when I meet him, I'm like, I see them differently. Or, like, I'm like, oh, I would have never picked up on that. And I think it's just like finding that in other people. And then it makes you love yourself more in the process. I really, and I know you said that like you didn't want to cry, but I think when you cry, like it makes you human. It makes you so much more human. Because like a lot of people like see reality.

I always feel like people see reality television stars as characters. But it's like at the end of the day, it's real television. And that's what you were saying. It's real life. It's real life. Yeah. And so I, like, every time when I see you cry on television, like, I feel it. And I know that's real.

Oh, yeah. And it's, and like, like, like I said, too, it's like, I used to think it was such a weakness. I'd be so embarrassed if I cried. And I'm like, no, it's like feeling your, being in tune with, like, you know, your feelings about yourself. But I think it's like, I think people, I think you guys are going to love watching John's story this year, too. I'm excited. He's never been this involved. They like this yell.

And it was like so good for us, I think, as individuals and for our marriage. I think it was so good. Are you nervous for his, how he is going to, like, receive? I think he's going to hate it. He's going to hate it. But I'm, but I'm like, we're so, like, obsessed. We're, like, in our own little bubble. Like, last night I had to sleep at the hotel without him.

And we cross legs when we sleep. Like, we're locked. And it was like, I'm like, oh, my gosh. missed your leg on mine. And we don't have a perfect marriage. I mean, we fight. Like, last season, I thought when I watched that one scene of us having lunch, when we filmed it, it didn't bother me at all.

I didn't think twice about it. When I watched it, I was like, do you love me? Right. Like, I literally was like, you don't love me anymore. You would have never quipped at me if you love me. I'm like, John, you don't love me anymore. He's like, what are you talking about? I always talked to you like that.

And I'm like, no, but it felt different when I watched it back. It like broke my heart. Like, I cried for three weeks. What's it like watching yourself back like that? Like do you come out of your own body and like view yourself as... When I watch, that's the only scene. My hot mic moment took me out. Yeah.

Like, I mean, I... You were like, oh shit. There's no. I mean, for like six months after, when Ray Fines was me and Watch What Happens Live, quoting the whole thing, I died. I was like, do I laugh? Do I cry? What do I do?

Is this like an honor? Like, it's Ray Fines. It is an honor. It's an honor and a great television. It was raw and human and we all vent. That's the best way to get it all out and move on. Yeah. Yeah.

That's why when I saw that hot mic moment, I was like, fuck. Now I'm glad it happens because I think me and Meredith are in such a better place and like such a real authentic place. And so that was good. I mean, like I would never want to hurt her, but like we got to like a really deep level of friendship because of that. Right. And then like last season when I watched that scene with John, like I, I,

At the reunion when I'm talking about it, and I'm like, no, I cried for like three weeks, and everyone's like, it didn't seem that bad. And I'm like, no, but I know my partner. Right. Yeah, so, yeah, it was bad. That was horrible. Did you feel gaslit by like the woman at the reunion? Yeah, when they were telling me how I felt?

Yeah. Yeah, beyond. I was like, I'm not saying, I mean, you guys can't hear everything I say because it gets edited down, but I kept saying, I'm not talking. I'm not saying another word. You guys are telling me how I feel. I'm telling you what's real and you're telling me how I feel. Well, we saw Meredith say to you, you said what you needed to say.

You're good. You don't need to keep fighting back against everyone. Yeah, all of them. Yeah. So it was wild. Wild. Wild. Wild.

I kind of miss when it was you, Meredith, and Heather, though. Do you remember that you guys had that? Am I wrong? Didn't they have like a threesome? Well, we were good for like a few months. But I just think it's like, I think some, no, I don't. I'm totally good. Yeah.

Yeah, I'm totally good. I know where, I know how I'm friends with Heather. I know how I'm friends with everybody. Like, I know. Like, yeah. Okay, you ready to do the tell me what's wrongs? These are just the pussies right in and they tell us what's wrong and we give them advice. Okay, I love this.

And I think you'll give some really good advice. I hope so. I have fallen in love with my roommate and don't know what to do. We're both gay and she knows I have feelings for her but says I would make things, but says it would make things complicated. How do I go about living with her? Do I keep pretending that everything she does is a sign or do I have to disassociate and neglect these feelings.

It's not a sign. Like everything she does is her just being kind. It's not a sign. You need to get a new roommate because this is painful for you. Yeah. Yeah, this is so painful. You have to move. Right.

Get a new roommate. I kind of agree. It's like you said you're in love with her and there's no coming back from that. No. No. She knows and it's not reciprocated. And it's only going to hurt you. Yeah, it's going to.

And you know what? It's a blessing in disguise. because that means it's not your person. You'll find your person. We all have to have one big heartbreak before we can find, like, the love of our life. Like, for sure. Maybe even two big heartbreaks

so that you can really appreciate, like, the person you end up with. I remember sitting at a nail salon and this girl was, like, trying to find a sign in everything with this guy, to the point where I finally turned around. I'm like, he doesn't like you. He's not calling you because he doesn't like you.

Like, you need to move on. Like, I'm listening to the whole thing. Your friend is trying to be nice to you. right now, he does not like you. Right. Men that like girls or girls that like girls or guys that like guys, show it. Yeah. Yeah.

If they like you back, you'd be together. Yeah, and you wouldn't have to question it. And there's somebody amazing waiting for you that's going to appreciate your love, want to reciprocate your love, and you're going to be like, thank God that didn't work out. Right. Yes. It's always thank God that didn't work out. Thank God it didn't work out.

Thank God for unanswered prayers. Right. Yes, for sure. It's part of a country song. Yes. I can't remember which one, but I know it is. I want to make like a. Knicks in Five rhyme with Baby Gorgeous.

Oh, let's do it. Like, Lisa Barlow Hive, Baby Gorgeous vibe. Nix in five. Ooh, I love it. Right? I just came up with that right now. That was good. Yeah, I just knew that just.

Yes. Lisa Barlow Hive, Baby Gorgeous Vive, Nix in Five. Yes. Are you a Knicks fan? Love the Knicks. Our friend Jordan Clarkson plays for the Knicks. I'm obsessed with him. He played for Utah.

He is such a good human. being I love his whole entire family and great dad like love them and when he went to the Knicks I was like if we were going to lose you from the Jaws to anyone thank God you went home right die hard Knicks fan die hard I mean being in the city for the nix with jazz yeah it's your it's who you are I cannot believe you were there I like literally you've had the best few weeks it was like Jake I know Jake I know that's why you have haters but I had a great fucking time I loved watching you have a great time. I had a great fucking time.

I lived vicariously through you in Europe and New York. You deserve all of this. Thank you. Yeah, when you're front row at the Dior show. I've never been to Paris, so I'm like. Log every fucking second of this trip. Right? Every fucking second.

I would be like, I'm at D.R. Hi, bitches. Yeah. For everything. They're going to hate either way. So. My boyfriend loves his mom almost to an overbearing degree. Weird.

Done. Rick up. I've just started to notice this, and it's all fine for now. But what if we're to get married and I'm his second favorite woman in his life? Like what? They have a great relationship and their best friends, so it's just weird for me when they spend more time together than with me. I mean, red flag all over the place. I love my children more than my.

I would give them my organs. You need my kidneys. They're yours. No, weird. Yeah. Say goodbye. Goodbye. Yes.

Just break up. We're done. We're done. Yeah. My family misplaced my birth certificate. Like they just fucking lost it. I needed it recently and my mom was like, oh, you know what? Where is that?

And it's just gone. So I technically have no real proof of citizenship. I looked it up and you can replace it. But my real issue is how the fuck were they so careless with something so important? Like it feels like I'm invisible. Okay, you're not invisible. How many kids does your mom have? Maybe you're the only one.

You know what? Maybe my mom misplaces stuff on the regular. On the regular. And my mom literally when I was 17. gave me my social security card, my birth certificate, and said, it's no longer my responsibility, because if it's mine, it's going to disappear. Right. Yes, and she's an organized, neat, free, and my house smells like bleach when you walk into it.

So we're super clean, super organized, and she could barely keep track of my birth certificate. You're not invisible, that you're in your head about this. Everybody loves you. You know what? It's so cool. Something good is going to come from this. Like, the journey to get your birth certificate is going to open some other crazy door that you're going to be like, oh thank God I lost my birth certificate.

Right. Because stuff like that happens to me all day. I'll be like, where is my one goyard wallet? And then I'll be looking for it and I'll find five other good things. Right. Yes, this is like a little magic thing that's happening for you. My parents lose shit all the time for me. Like my dad forgets my birthday all the time.

My dad calls me my brother's name all the time. Like I feel like we're in like this era where people are like helicopter parenting their kids hard and like they know where everything is and da-da-da-da-da. If I called my parents right now and said, where's my birth certificate, they'd be like, I don't know. They're like, I don't know. Because I don't know when I would need that. And you're very visible. Yes.

Yes. Yes. Everyone loves you, honey. You're good. Well, you know what? If no one loves me, at least Lisa Barlow loves me. And that's what's the most important. I love, love you.

I love you. Cheers. Loved. Loved. Love. My best friend from childhood and I used to talk every single day, even after I moved away years and years ago. We've completely drifted, which happens.

I got busy with college and my career. and he stayed in the town. He always said he wanted to do that. I've tried calling him a couple of times recently, and he isn't picking up, which is very unlike him. I just learned through a mutual friend recently that apparently he thinks I became this asshole, New York City, New York hot shot,

and I'm icing him out. How do I tell him? I've just been busy. Will you pick up the phone and call him or text him? If he's not picking up, I think you should write him a letter. Like handwritten? Yeah, handwrite a letter and just be like, I miss you, bitch, or something.

Yeah. For real. Just write him a letter. And I just think people, it's probably his, it sounds like it's his own insecurities. I think he's projecting. He's projecting. He's projecting. He's projecting.

Because he stayed in the town. You went out and did other things and like moved on. And instead of being like, like, I love this life for you and joy that I like kept like, you know, stayed true to what I wanted. It's just a projection. Yeah. Most things are. You guys got to bump into each other.

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, if you. If the friendship is real, it'll come back around. There's no way that friendship's not real. Like when you're friends that long, you just have to see each other. Right. That's what I always say about me and my best friend, Julia, fight all the time.

And then you just need to see each other. All we do, we see each other and it's like, oh, we're fine. Yeah, we love each other. Why were we mad? Right, why were we mad? Like, we've literally screamed, cried. That's why I'm like, I love housewives so much. I'm like, I fit this in my life.

Hi, Jake and special guest. It feels like I'm the only one in my life who is trying to keep relationships. I'm alive. When I stop trying or don't show initiative, the relationship dies. Am I the problem or just unlucky with friends? No, you're special. I think that people that are so amazing usually have one to three friends. It's not you.

Just keep vibing, keep being you. You're not the problem. They're not meant for you. You're rejecting them energetically. You know, quality is better than quantity and you're not the problem. haven't found your people yet. Yes. Yes.

Enough said. Like the most special people have very small circles. I completely agree. Yeah, you don't have a big circle if you're like to have the biggest fucking circle and I was so run ragged and I'm like I literally. They were sucking you dry. I'm like I need my body was like literally giving up on me. Yes.

My best friend and I have a lot of fun together but she will randomly make negative comments about me like bringing up my ex or things I am insecure about to people we hang out with. You're not your friend. Right? Yeah, bye. Bye. I don't have a ton of friends, so I don't know whether to drop her or not, and it sucks

because she's really fucking funny, but always uses me as the butt of the joke. Nope. Nope. Bye. Not your friend. Not your friend. Not your friends. Nope.

Yeah. I mean, there's like a million quotes I could send that girl. Right. Or whoever wrote that is. I have a quote above my bed, my favorite quote. Manny painted it for me. She's a painter. Yeah.

Do I need one too? No, she's very talented. She painted a painting for my parents. Yes. Yeah, she's very talented. It says, but yeah, it's, you need a quote. And Lisa can send you quotes. Yes.

What's a quote you would give her right now? Mani or this girl. This girl. Oh, I was like, one to paint or one to live off. You know, I think it's the thing about the eagle flying, you know, like when, you know, like when, you know, know, the only way to take out an eagle, there's another bird that, like, what is it, the crow will attach itself to the eagle, and the eagle doesn't react. It just flies higher, and then the crow like falls off, you know, like just fly higher. Just keep being yourself, like, you know,

don't worry about other people. But someone that's being passive, aggressive to you under the guise of humor does not like you. They're jealous of you. It's a trigger. and I think that person needs to figure out what you trigger in them, but you need to know that you are a trigger for this person because if you weren't, they wouldn't be being passive aggressive with nasty comments about you. Right. I don't know what the quote is right now,

but just keep flying higher and find new friends. Yeah, don't let the crow bring you down. I had been best friends with this guy for four years. We hung out all the time, FaceTime to every night and told each other everything. But a few months ago, everything changed when he started dating this girl. he would spend all of his time texting and calling her well that makes sense because they're dating

and he didn't tell me that they were dating until I confronted him about it oh so you're in love with him now he ignores me doesn't tell me anything and I've turned to the evil girl best friend he's moved on I think she has a new best friend respectfully she was a little in love with him they don't want to admit it and right am I what do you guys think no 100% yeah I think you have a crush your Twitter pated by him And Twitter-pated, like, you know when you get those butterflies in your stomach?

Oh, I love that word. Like you're Twitter-pated. I love that Twitter-pated feeling. I saw it with John. Oh. But, like, I think she probably crushing hard. Yeah. Move on.

Move on. Yeah. I'm bad at sex, and it's becoming a real issue. I was a little bit of a late bloomer, but I'm 25 and should maybe have a better handle on this. During one-night stand or hookups, I never know what to say or what to do after, and I'm just really uncoordinated in general. I have an active sex life too

So is it just like practice makes perfect? No No practice is not make perfect Wait so what do you think she should do? I think you need to just find your person And get into a rhythm Okay You need a better rhythm and you'll find it with your person

But practice doesn't make perfect Because then you're just having sex You're not having sex because you want to Listen I tell my kids this all the time Like not all the time But like when we talk about like sex and stuff I'm like there is nothing better than having intimacy with your person. When you love someone, everything's so much better.

Like I'm probably going to sound weird right now. I'm so anti-pornography. I've told my kids since they were little. I told Jack, pornography is bad. It'll ruin your brain. It's worse than drugs. And it does. And as he got older, I'm like, Jack, you don't ever want to look at porn or get addicted

to porn because you will never have great sex if you watch porn or anything. And I think it's not about with this girl in her situation. It's not about quantity and, like, being like, I need to be good at sex. You can't be great at sex with someone you're just meeting and practicing on. Like, great sex comes from having a rhythm and being in love and, like, feeling someone and knowing their body and appreciating their body and, like, the energy you guys have together. That's, like, great. Like, that's when you know you're great at sex.

Like, you're not bad. This person is not bad. You're not bad at sex. Right. You're having sex with the wrong people. Like save yourself for the right one. And then it will just work. Yes.

It'll just work. You get great advice. I hope so. You should have like an advice podcast. Call them one day. The new Dr. Ruth. Yes. No, but it's true though.

It works. And like I think a lot of people put crazy pressures on themselves. I'm like, what is good sex? Like what is bad sex? If you're having drunk sex, like it's probably, it might be. good for in the moment and then you might wake up and you hate it like but having that quality person and saving yourself for like someone where it's like that intense like euphoric like twitter-pated amazing feeling is so much better than randos you're not going to have good sex and you're

going to think you suck but you don't suck you do not suck you just need to find your person yeah it's impossible to suck at sex really yeah I think so okay I think if you're into the person if it's like a stranger and you're like don't care I think I think it's like there's so many extraneous factors that I think when you and your person are together, it's impossible to have bad sex. Love that. When it's your person. Agreed. I haven't had my person yet, but I will.

Okay. I will. Do we like anybody crushing? I want to find a Paris lover. You're just, it's going to be kissment. Okay. Please put it out there for me. Put it out there for me.

Do you know what I told my friend Julia? She got married. We were at Chaconis like four years ago. Oh, best restaurant in the world. Yeah. And she was like, I'm never going to find anyone. I'm like, I don't even know what's going on. And she's so gorgeous.

She's so smart and successful. I go, just talk openly to God all the way home. She was living in Santa Monica. I'm like, tell God what you want. She did the whole way home. And I'm like, just keep telling God every day until he gives you your person. She had her person. It was like six weeks later.

So you just need to put it out there. Yeah, just put it out there. All you have to do is keep saying, I'm going to find my person. I'm going to find who I should be with. In Paris. Yes, in Paris. Okay. Paris, right?

Yep. Yes. Yes. We need a Parisian. I'm going to text you updates. I'm going to FaceTime you with updates. Oh, I'm going to face it. Oh, my gosh.

We don't text enough. We need to text more. I know. Send me video messages. I will. We'll send video messages every day. Oh, you have to. I love getting, sometimes I get video messages from Lisa and I feel really special.

I mean, that's how I send you messages. Yes. And one time, Mandy and I were watching Salt Lake and I was like, should I just call Lisa? Yes. And Minnie was like, no way. And I was like, swear I think she'll pick up. And I did. You did.

I did. And, man, he was freaking now. I will always pick up for you unless I'm in a position where I can't. Yes. I will always pick up. Lisa, what did we learn today? That we love each other so much. Yes, we do.

And Baby Gorgeous is Loki a Pride anthem. Yeah, it is. It's a pride anthem. It's an anthem for self. Yeah. Yeah. And I think it's a mantra that everyone should live by. And that you're going to be having the time.

You are having the summer of your life. Do you realize this? No, I don't. And I need to. Wait, do you realize this? like think about it you were at the Knicks game right the most epic game of all time of art like generation yeah you were there a week before that where were you and a super yacht in the Mediterranean yeah your life is good go ahead we learn that your life is great and you deserve it all

thank you yes you deserve it all and you deserve it all thank you I love you bye pussies I'm going to be able to