Therapuss with Jake Shane - Session 145: Carly Rae Jepsen

Episode Date: September 24, 2026

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Therapus, we have. Well, you know what, Manny? Let me let you do the introduction. Oh my God. Okay. Hi, Pussies. Tonight on Therapus, we have the wonderful, the amazing, the wickedly talented. Carly Ray Jepson.

Who! Whose new album, Day and Night, a double album. is out now. What does Carly Ray Jepson mean to you, Manny? Oh my God. She means everything to me. Like her music is just, one, it's like catchy as hell. It's so good.

It's like I dance for all the time. But also, like, I've gone through breakups. I've gone through friendship things, whatever. All her songs have something meaningful that, like, I relate to and they're fun. Most of them. Some of them are sad. But like. Even the sad ones are fun.

I know. I know. We are missing the writings on the wall. Your type. Oh, duh. Yeah, I know. I'm not the type of girl for you. And I'm not going to pretend.

That I'm the type of girl you call more than a friend. Oh, my God. That song is one of the most perfect pop songs ever. I know. And it just so happens to also exist on the album with another perfect pop song. Run away with me. I don't know that's part. Thinking tonight.

Everyone sleeping, sleeping. I run away. I'll run away with you. Because you make me feel like I could be driving you all night. And I'll find your lips in the streetlights. I want to be there with you. Oh, baby Take me to the feeling

I'll be your sinner in secret When the lights go out Run away with me Run away with me, baby Every single minute I'll be your sinner in secret When the lights go out, run away with me. Run away with me.

Ladies and gentlemen, Harley Ray Jepson. Her new album, Day and Night, is out now. And if you haven't heard it, please listen to it. She is one of the greatest pop stars of our life. I agree. Pussies, enjoy the episode.

I love you. Here to talk about her eighth studio album, Day and Night, Carly Ray Jepson. Hello. Hello. Thank you for being here. It's my pleasure. Thank you for having me.

I'm so excited. I am so excited. Emotion is like seriously, I know we're here to talk about your new album, but I have to touch on emotion, which is my favorite album of all time. I don't even know what to say to that. Thank you so, so much. And is it true that it was born? You wrote it while you were in Cinderella.

Yeah, that's how it started, at least. I was in the middle of singing really sweet, soft songs, being a princess, which was lovely. And then in the evening, I, like, late at night after that, or sometimes during the day, I needed some... I needed some percussion back in my life. I was listening to a lot of, like, Prince albums, and I thought, the 80s, man, there's something about the 80s that is just so hard on your sleeve, like, cut to, like, all of the feelings. and I actually just said that, didn't I? Yeah. Yeah, but I wanted, I wanted to go there.

That's my favorite song. Is it really? That is my favorite song. Hers is warm blood. Hey. I mean, yeah, no, I really wanted to do something different. I always wanted to do something different. Same with day and night.

It's just, it's really exciting to kind of go explore a different sonic world than you've been in before. Right. Yeah. And because I read that you were, initially wrote like a folk album and then you scrapped it and then. It was kind of folky. It was a little like grungy.

I don't know what it was. I think I was rebelling, call me maybe, when I went into the studio right away, which I think is a natural reaction. Looking back, I was like, oh, it was very, like, sweet and funny and cute with that song, but now I want to do something serious. So I was looking for, you know, all the other things that I loved about music, which I came from a very folk-influenced family. Like, we grew up on Joni Mitchell and Leonard Cohen and Kat Stevens.

and so it felt like my roots to find something a little fokey grungy. And I remember writing a lot with Tegan and Sarah. I met some New York people who got what I was going for. And I felt like that was an important time for me to get something out of my system. And yet I hadn't found it yet. And if you know me, I know when I find it. And the first song that I wrote from Emotion where I actually was like, okay, I know what it is I want to do and it's this was actually the song Emotion.

And I came home and I felt that sort of excitement of like, okay, I want to discover what this world feels like. And it's 80s pop. I want to live there and I want to figure out what my spin of that looks like. And did you, when you talk about writing and creating music, do you start with a beat? Like a track. Yeah, like a track. Or do you start with lyrics? Usually, I think there's no usually.

Actually, actually, I was going to start talking and I realized I had no idea where I was going. It's always different. Yeah. I think that's why it's like going to be like an art form that I'll never really fully understand or completely be, you know, a master of. I think it's something that you're constantly learning at. And what I love about approaching music from different angles is you'll get a completely different outcome. So when you're arriving with or when I'm arriving with like collaborators that I've been in the room with for a long time that know me well that I feel intimate with,

my favorite thing to do is just like play. And what that means is like someone grabs a guitar and I grab one of these and we just like riff and we sing and we talk about what's going on in each other's lives and something kind of just really naturally stands out to us. I more often than not love a kind of writing that I call almost like freeform writing

where you're just sort of singing without judging it too much and then like an idea or two will come out from that. That feels really exciting to me but every once in a while I'll get like a concept too, like a good old fashioned LA concept where I'm like, I really want to write about like the dating scene in LA or I really want to talk about, you know, something quite specific.

And then I'll like, I'll be talking with friends about it. I'll be like almost like collecting intel for my song for like months. Is that how like LA hallucinations started? Oh my gosh. LA hallucinations just came from like my deep confusion. And at the time, hate of Los Angeles. So it's just wild because I live here still now

and I've grown to love it. But at the time I did not. understand. It's somewhere you have to grow to love. Yes, it's a slow burn. Yeah, it is. And, I mean, we were touching on this before in the other room, but New York is like, I'm in immediately.

Whereas Los Angeles, I needed to find my people. I needed to understand the art of the, like, the poetry of the city. It's kind of hidden. Yeah. You have to like go digging. And it's also like you're at the mercy of a car. Yes. Whereas in New York, like you have this automatic like autonomy of just being able to like take

your body anywhere. want without a vehicle. 100%. And I don't know about you, but I'm a, like, it's hard for me to go out and be social. Like, I kind of am a little bit of like a home body. I like my comforts. And so with New York, I feel like I'm pushed into more socialness. Like I'll, I just walk on the street and all of a sudden there's a bookstore.

And there's like, I have this opportunity to be like romanced by a place and surprised by like the spontaneity of it. And it brings something out in my part. partner and I, too, where we're, like, more spontaneous together. We're like, should we go get ice cream in the rain? Yes, yes, yes, yes. Like, yes, we should. And, like, where else would I do that?

Where in, like, Los Angeles, you're like, should we go get ice cream in the rain? You're like, never raining. And actually, today it is. But generally, you're like, I mean, okay, like, get in the car. It's like a whole journey. Yeah, it's too much. Like, in New York, I'm like, I'm walking down the street the other week and I'm like, oh my God, there's a record store.

I don't even have a fucking record player. And I walk it. Have, whoa. Well, now I do. Now I do. Now I do. It's broken. But now I do.

Okay, but record players, they hit different. I was at my friend Will's house the other day and he like put on like a, like a, I think it was like a James Taylor record. And it was just like really set the mood and the vibe. And like, it was like, I was like, this is so different than just listening to music on TV. Well, in this day and age, I think it's a rare moment that you listen to an album. and it's completion. You're generally skipping. We have access to it all.

You're like, okay, James, it was a vibe, and now I want to, like, jump to this. But if you put on an album, you're committed for a second until that needle pops.

And I feel like that is nice to slow life down a little bit and, like, live in the world that the artist has created for you. James Taylor, I think you must know, but he's one of my biggest inspirations of all time.

Yeah, fire and rain is one of my favorite songs of all time. Think about how many times he sang that song, though. Like, it makes me feel better about calming, maybe. I'm like, he's like that song so many times. Like him and I should start a support group.

Be like, how many times did you sing your song? Do you get tired of singing Call Me maybe? I mean, no, because it does. It takes on quite a different, I mean, the answer is no now. There was a definite time when the answer was yes, when that's like all I had made. But I think enough albums have come by and enough shows have happened where it's now just sort of like a nostalgic moment.

And it doesn't feel like my moment. It feels sort of like the crowd takes over and you kind of feel people like, being like, oh, remember when and how this was a part of their lives. So it feels celebratory and it feels like a quick kind of moment in the set that sort of passes by sweetly. Yeah. It's also like I don't associate you as like with call me maybe as I do with as much with run away with me or your type or like, you know, like all these like it's like I there you are so much

more of an artist than that just that one song. That's wild. And thank you. It's true. Like, it really is true. Like, talking about listening to an album and completion,

emotion is one of those albums that I can literally listen to front to back without skipping a song because it just, like, takes me on this, like, masterful journey. It starts with run away with me. And, like, you know, and you're, like, basically asking the listener to run away with you. And it works. But before you released emotion, did you feel like this pressure to follow up, call me maybe, or, like, frustrate?

almost. You know, I felt a mixed bag of things. It's hard to like totally go back there and remember. But I do remember a really clear moment of just like an epiphany that someone gave to me. My guitarist gave to me actually Tavish Crow where we were walking in New York together. And he's sort of like my main man in terms of like adopted brother in a weird way. In my life, he's always been a support. And he sort of said with this song, you now have a.

a stage for the first time in your life to actually show the world what I already know about you, which is like all the other types of music that you have in you. And he's like, so if you stop thinking of like trying to follow that up, but instead just like know what you know and like now create what you want to, this could be an incredible opportunity. And it just like, like I was thinking, how am I going to keep doing the same thing? Because they like this. And that's one element of what I do, but it's not all of it. And I think ultimately if I had tried to keep making calming movies, I would have been really

deeply unsatisfied as an artist. So it was nice to honor that that's like one flavor of what I love. But he was right. It was a chance for me to kind of shake off any expectations and just do what I only know how to do, which is, you know, make music from a really honest place. But I wasn't able to go there right away. That's why I kind of took a detour and did like Cinderella. Right.

I just like needed a second to like get my bearings, figure out what it was next. And that's how emotion was born. Yeah. Do you, I must ask how the song run away with me was born, because that song, like that is one of the most cinematic songs of all time, in my opinion. Did it start with the horns? Did it start with the lyrics? It did.

So this is the one I went to Sweden and the land of pop. It is the land of pop. Right? And I met with Matthias and Robin and Noonie Bow. And I think the producer's names were Mattman and Robin. I was very excited to meet them. And it was our meet cute actually, and they showed me a couple of different tracks that I think they played me like eight different things. And when they played the riff for the day, da-da-da-da, I like stood up.

And I was like, this one. Let's play out with this today. And we didn't really know what we were going to make yet. In fact, I think the beginning of the song that actually you hear today, that was our entry point was the da-da-da-da-da-da. And it was to this line, oh, Dominica. Like it was a completely different lyric. It just started there. And I went home with a song about a guy named Dominique.

Yeah. And I was like, all right, there's something to it, though. And like a couple months later, we call again, and I was like, I think we need to go back to Sweden and finish this song. And we went back and we reworked it. They even challenged ideas of the song that I thought were right, and then we got them better. I think in that song, I learned about the art of reworking something.

Because I think it took on four different forms or three different forms before we got it right. And it sounds quite simple, but doing simple pop is more complicated, I think, than people realize. Because it's a lot about what you take out as much as what you keep in. And once we landed on it, I don't think we knew exactly how the world would respond, but we knew how we felt. And we were all, like, dancing while we were making that song. I always think that's a really good sign. When you released emotion, were you anticipating a call me maybe quick fire success?

Or were you ready for it to be more of like a, slow burn of people to find it and love it and make it theirs. You know, it's interesting having a partner now because he's really offered some perspective on my personality of like little blind spots that I didn't know. And I've become aware that I've always existed as like a little bit of a worst case scenario person. Like I do actually find comfort by thinking like what's the worst possible thing that could happen here and am I okay with it?

I don't know if that's like a dark quality about me or if it's just like how I've survived. It's just a quality. Yeah, okay, cool, cool. You're the same way. Oh, I'm the biggest catastrophist in the entire world. So when I say that I had no expectations, I had no expectations. Like, I was pretty sure the world had forgotten that this was just going to be like some little pet project for me and that, you know, I would hope that if somebody got it, at least somebody got it. And so, yeah, no, I, if anything, I was just more delighted, even at our first, like, little club show, I was like, they know the words.

Like, we put this out like four days ago and they know the words dead, not just one. song, but every song. And that to me was a victory. And then what happened after that was sort of wild beyond my wildest dreams, to be honest. Yeah. What do you love about pop music? Like, what is your, like, because.

How much time do you have? I have all the time in the world. Why do I just say that? I mean, the other thing is, though, there's so much that I hate about pop music. And, like, that's what I think is so interesting. And I've said this before. It's a genre that is like a love-hate genre for me. Like when it's done well, I love it.

And when it's done poorly, I cannot wait to turn it off. And I think just realizing, I think that we all have that reaction to pop music. Like, I think that's why it's so like cutthrow. Like, you know, like it's a hard genre to play him because you're going to, I think it's very rare you hear a pop song and you're like, I'm okay on it. People have like intense opinions about it. And so do I. I don't know. I think that what I love is its ability.

to transport you to a feeling that maybe you've had before or that you want to feel that you haven't had yet where you can kind of take on in a very cinematic way somebody else's emotion. I think its ability to connect people is very exciting. I love that part of it. I think that's the joy of my life of seeing the connections that happen and the way that it can kind of, I don't know, become somebody else's song and no longer yours. I think that that feels amazing to me when that happens. Well, when it's done badly, what do you think makes it bad?

By the way, I have written a lot of bad pop songs myself. And when it happens, I'm like, oh, God. And it haunts me to this day that I've like let some of those out. But it's just, I mean, you swing and you miss. That's part of beat and artist too. But I think when it's bad, to me, when it's bad as you can tell, even though when I say that the simplicity, almost like a jazz song, you only have so many lyrics that you can get in there.

So each one counts. I think when you're not actually buying what you're selling, like if you're talking about an emotion and you're just doing it for like the jingle sake of the jingle, but I don't know. I think there's a way to even do that well where it's like fun and playful and you know what you're doing. But when you're like half-heartedly in it,

I think sometimes that people are very intelligent and they can sniff that out really quickly. And you can't exactly put your finger on why, but it feels fake. Yeah. I think that is when I don't like a pop. where it just feels, yeah, inauthentic. Yeah, carbon copy. Like, just sort of something about it feels cardboard.

Yeah, and not, like, yeah, not, there's no depth there. Yeah. Do you know what I mean? Yeah, of course. I mean, that's why I resonate so much with your music. There is so much depth. It's so, it is, I keep saying it, but it's so cinematic. And, like, I, you know, it's real.

It's a tangible feeling. I think that's what's the beauty of pop music is, like, it creates this, like, tangible, like, movie in your head. And I was thinking. about being driven home by someone that I had a crush on. And I was like, oh my God, yeah. I want to hear more about your crush. Oh, my God.

Well, I don't think he wants anything to fucking do with me. So what do you mean? Like literally nothing to do with me. I'm just at this point. It's so past the point. I can't even, I can't. I can't. I love that I get to work with Seekek

because so many of my guests are musicians who get to go on tour. And if you end up, listening to them and loving them, or if you already love them, you can use my code therapist for 10% off your order on Seekkeek. The reason Seekek is the best place to get tickets for any live event, whether it be comedy, Broadway, music, sporting, is because it rates your tickets that you would buy on a scale from 1 to 10, one being not the best, and 10 being the best,

so you know if you're getting a good bang for your buck. Also, if you click the link in the description and download the app, it will automatically apply the code therapist for 10% off your order, so you can see every concert your heart desires, or every comedy show or every Broadway show or every sporting event you wish to see. Thank you again, Seekeek for sponsoring tonight's episode. What pop artists are you listening to right now that excite you?

Oh, so many. There's so many. I mean, I think that, speaking of perfect albums, I think Robin has been top of her game. I mean, she's so inspiring in the fact that I feel like she also kind of took a break, figured out what it was that she had to say about popping came back with such intention and then like blew the world away.

But I feel like that's a cop-out answer that everybody picks. However, I'm going to go with it anyways. No. There's a reason for it. There's a reason for it. And I think she's brought an artfulness to pop that excites me to. Because it can be thought of as like a frivolous genre, but I think there's such a thing as intelligent pop music.

That's what I'm interested in figuring out how to make, you know? And I think she's one of the first people who showed me a really cool flavor of how to do that in her own way. And I wanted to figure out my own as well. I mean, call your girlfriend's one of my favorite songs of all time. Dancy on my own. One of my favorite songs of all time. All of that.

It's just unbelievable. I mean, that whole album is insane. But yeah, I actually, she's coming to L.A. soon. I got a ticket. Are you going? Wait, when is she coming to L.A.? Like soon. We have to.

I've never seen Dancing on My Own live. We all must go. Let's go. Your 10-year anniversary show of emotion. And you're wearing the merch, man. Me and Manny were there. Very cute. Mani, we were like stuffed in a.

a group of people and Mandy said, excuse me. And she walked to the side because she had to dance so hard. I love it. It was, what did that feel like for you to do that 10 year? I mean, people knew every single lyric to that, to every single song. Like, what did it feel like for you? It was a wild night. Well, first of all, I mean, I hadn't really announced it yet, but I was four months

pregnant during that show. What? I know, which is wild. That's why we just did the one show. I was like, all right, this is going to be kind of crazy. And I remember both my, um, my, um, my, my, um, my, my, um, my, family came to town so my mother and my stepmother and my father my stepfather were all in the balcony at the back and every time i would kind of like be in the moment because the crowd was like

just it's just you know the best energy so you're kind of you know getting lost in it and i'd step on a speaker and my two mothers would be like get down you're in high heels and i'm like oh yeah sorry sorry but yeah it was it was incredible and i honestly i i don't i don't i can't explain the pain of sometimes putting out a body of work and then you only we get a short amount of time when you do a show. So you're kind of trying to like pick a couple from emotion and a couple from kissed and dedicated and lonely. And at this point, you're like, okay, well, I guess we can do like the hits off each one.

But when you actually like get to like go in and take your time with one album, I mean, we've played songs that I've never played live before. Like never get to hold you. I've never really done that one before. And we're like, okay. So it was not only was it like lovely from my band and I to revisit a body of work that we cared so much about, but to really get to like go into like the deep. cuts in a way with a room full of people who got it was just it was that was lovely i mean your type

like you know do you know that um i got to dm the other day because i was i think i posted something about oh yeah i posted like that i was listening to emotion and someone swiped up and said your type is like the anthem for gay guys who are in love with straight men have you heard that before yeah it's true and i read that i was like damn yeah it is true that that is that is that is When I heard that live, do you remember, I nearly fell to the floor. You were screaming it. Screaming every lyric. And then when you said, you introduced boy problems.

You said, you were like, does anyone have boy problems? And everyone screamed? It was just. It was a very sweaty fun night. I mean, I always leave a show feeling like I need a shower. And I come home and there's like some new glitter somewhere on my body that I didn't find. And I'm like, that's how I want to leave that for sure. You know, like, and so it was, it was really fun.

You know who's doing their albums front to back right now is Lily Allen. She's on the. I saw her. Yeah. How was it? It was really good. It was like an art piece. Like, I mean, I really, I read while I listened to that album because it was so salacious.

It was so salacious. I know. And I loved it. I feel like it was bold. And I almost think it played it like a musical. Yeah. And so I was just, I really, chef's guess. Good job, Lily.

Well, speaking of musicals. Yes. you and Lena Dunham are working on the ten things I'm making one you're making one the ten things I hate about you musical what is the process of that looking like

it is incredible it's incredible it's been like the dream of all dream project I mean you can't really think of a better script to get your hands on I mean that story is iconic for a reason and I think has a cult following for a reason and our whole team is really

from day one it was good and then it's just got more and more stacked. So Ethan Greska is my writing partner. We're doing the music. Lena is working with Jessica Wong on the script. And we have Christopher Whelden, who's like choreographer slash director, ballerina extraordinaire, Tom Kitt, who's like, you know, music director of my dream.

So it just, it just like keeps getting kind of like blow your mind wild. And I know I just like name dropped a bunch of people, but these are like the Wizard of Oz people to me. So I'm very, very proud. Well, you're a theater kid. I am a theater nerd for sure. Sure. You were Annie and Annie.

How did you know that? You were Sandy and Greece. Oh my gosh. Yes. Because I love you. I guess the internet does exist. Yes, I was. Oh, God.

I mean, I joke because I was in a very small community theater in Mission BC, which is close to Vancouver in Canada. And on the night that Annie closed, I said to my parents, what if I'm just this child star? And were they like? And they were like, no one knows who you are, relaxed. But, you know, yeah. But when you auditioned for Canadian Idol, was it, was Canadian Idol as big in Canada as American Idol was here? I mean, at the time it felt big to me, but I was in it.

Like, it felt all encompassing because it was my whole little wild world at the time. But yeah, what a, what a training and just like brutal takedowns publicly. you got to do a Canadian Idol or an American Idol run to see if you've got that like alligator's skin for what the music business in. And I was happy to report that I kind of did. Yeah. I was like, this is wild, but I can like take it with a grain of salt. And then where was Calmie maybe born after that? Well, it's actually an interesting like point to say, to ask that question because I really don't think CalMe maybe would have had its life without Canadian Idol.

And what I mean by that is it was like my. first exposure on TV and I got third. So I actually had a pretty lucky run because I had like the notoriety but no contract. Right. So it was like a beautiful place to start. And I was just looking for my way in and my way into a management deal to a label to anything that could kind of help me be able to get these songs I was writing heard. And even like on Canadian Idol, I think in the auditions, they had one rule which was just like sing a song but not your own. And I was like, well, I'm going to sing my own. because I was like, this is my one chance on TV. I was excited.

But it ended up being really helpful in terms of securing those things. So I had a management team after that. I got signed to my first label deal. And there's this, you know, amazing thing that happened where I got to start making an album. And I met sort of like-minded creators, Ryan Stewart, Josh Ramsey. And these producers helped me put together a body of work. And Comey, maybe he was born with Josh and Tavish. And yeah, I don't think anybody expected it to take off the way they did.

But that was just one of those lucky lightning moments that happened in life where you look back and you're like, I don't think we could have curated all that magic had we tried our hardest. It was just sort of being hit with, you know, some lightning, really. And Twitter kind of being at the beginning of what Twitter was. So it was just the stars aligning in a beautiful way. Yeah. Yeah. Do you have a favorite song off this upcoming album?

I think I don't actually, which it makes me happy because I feel like it changes depending on my mood. Is that a lame answer? No. It kind of does, though. That's the sign of a great album, by the way. I always say the sign of a perfect album is one where everybody has a different answer for their favorite song. I love that. Emotion, you will say, what's your favorite song?

Someone will say, run away with me. Someone will say, L.A. hallucinations. Or, like, Norman fucking Rockwell with Lana Del Rey. Everybody has a different favorite song. And, like, that's the sign of, like, a 10 out of 10 album. Oh, well, here's hoping. I think my best answer is that right now for day, I like blue skies. It's sort of my, like, attempt at trying to honor mini Ripperchin, like, with some psychedelic folk.

And then for nighttime, right now, I'm going to be. going to say near or far. And I say near or far because it was the most like experimental track. And it almost didn't make the album because I got slightly in my head that it was too weird. And then I decided that that's exactly why it needed to make the album at the end of the day. So I went for it and I'm really glad I did. Yeah. Yeah.

Where did the concept for this double album come to be? Quite simply, I couldn't decide what I wanted to do because I wanted to do two things so passionately. I really wanted to make like a synth-based intense nighttime album that felt like you're in your emotions, you're okay to like go there. It's a little bit less like a story song and a bit more like an experience. So a lot of like free form writing in there where like little poems put to music kind of thing. And I loved that idea. And then I really also felt like something was calling me maybe from a little bit of my childhood and my upbringing too

about these like kind of good old fashion story songs. But my spin on like what I loved about the James Taylor's and stuff was like how to like play with you know something that felt a little bit more psychedelic than that something that felt a little dreamy yeah a little bit um like what i'd want to listen to in my life moving through the house and they they didn't start with the title day at night it was just these two kind of lanes i was writing in and when i would put something like um wild child which is quite like a stripped down acoustic number next to something like don't leave me on the dance floor it was looking like i was having an identity crisis and so i was like i just need to like

choose and luckily it was again my guitarist my little adopted brother to have who like came and to new york heard what i was making and quite frankly was like why don't we make it like a house party like there's an upstairs it's a downstairs oh i love that and i was like yes and then later on when i was driving in los angeles i was like day and night and as soon as i knew that that's what i was doing And I kind of showed up with so much intention and excitement at every session after that. And then 12 and 12 was quite simply because I was like 24 hours in a day. Get it? Ah, day and night.

Day and night. Do you, are you planning on touring the album? Can you imagine if I made all of this body of work and then I was just like, no. You know what? I could because Bonnie Vera just put out this whole thing and was like, I'm not touring it. Wow. And I was like. No, touring's the most fun part.

Are you kidding me? The whole reason I make the music is so I can go to it. Absolutely. I mean, I haven't officially announced anything yet, and I don't know if I'm allowed to give this away, but we will 100% go and celebrate the album for sure. Are you struggling right now with, like, picking which tracks to do?

Because there's so many, and then you also have stuff from emotion. You know, it becomes quite clear in rehearsals, which songs translate, in the cleanest, like, clearest way. And what I mean by that is, Sometimes, like, even a stripped-down moment can be just as powerful as, like, a dancing moment, but you can't, like, know it until you put it on its feet.

And that's what rehearsals for is kind of figuring out how do these exist in real life outside from the studio. Because even the way you sing in a studio is a completely different thing than the way you sing live. Like, it all changes. Well, I mean, with headphones in a small little box, with your eyes closed, feeling a thing in a soft way, It's a very different thing than sharing it in a room, even if it's the same song. And so I feel like if you can't capture that same intimacy with something, and there's some songs you can do that with, and there's other songs where it becomes a little bit more challenging than it's best to keep that for the record and do something different on stage or change it up.

That's always an option, too. But I've come to really love the strip-down moments. Like one of my favorite songs live actually has been collage, which I would have thought it was only a studio song, but actually translates really well to stage. because I feel like by the time we played in the set, we're usually we've sweated enough and we need to come down together anyway. You know what you mean?

Yeah. Do you ever like doing festival shows? Festivals are my favorite, actually. I mean, I really do love my own show as well because you get more to play with in terms of production. And like, really, I mean, with the loneliest and loveliest time, I got very indulgent with my moon. And I was like, the moon will talk.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And it'll tell everyone to forget their worries. And then we'll start to play, you know. And that's like, you know, that's part of the fun. But I think a festival is fun because it's a lot of new energy. I think everyone you come to a festival, you're showing up to surrender your life for like a moment of being really present. And I think when you show up with that energy, it's like a contagious thing.

And so there's a lot of opportunity for really blissful moments to happen at festivals, I think. I agree. It's one of those things where it's just like everybody is like, it's a real moment of like being present. No one comes to a festival to be like, I'm in the mood to have a bad time. Right? Right. Yeah.

And if you have, go home. Drugs and the wind is in your hair. And like it's just like, you feel like you're watching like superstardom. Like, you know what I mean? Like that's what it feels like a sunset set at like Coachella or something. Like I recently went to Daisy Chain and we saw Chapel Row. How was that?

I heard good things. It was awesome. And we saw Chapel Rhone and I was. just like so enamored and the sun was setting and the wind was in her hair and I was like this it's a moment it's a moment and I think in my own history of like discovering other artists that's always the most magical place to discover a new artist like like it's one thing to be like oh if a friend sent me this link to Spotify or my friend sent me this like little i don't know right youtube video to watch but like when you're like walking around and then you're like who's playing that and you just

gravitate to like i remember that's how i saw feist for the first time in van And she was like in a little like white trench coat and her white guitar. And she was just playing up like, who is this? And that's how I discovered her. And it was like potent in my mind. It's like, wow.

Yeah, that I always say that's the best feeling on planet earth is discovering a song or an artist through a live performance. Because it will never be better. Absolutely. Tegan and Sarah too. That's how I learned. Really?

Well, well, what are you watching on television right now or movie wise? If anything. I'm watching a very, long, drawn out, but interesting show called My Brilliant Friend. Am I getting that right? My Brilliant Friend.

It's based off of a novel in Italy and Naples. These two... I think it is My Brilliant Friend. My Brilliant Friend. Yeah. And when I say I'm slow watching it, I have a six-month-old son, so it's been years. Yeah. No.

I actually just stopped watching it for a while, and I just started again, like, two nights ago. I was like, oh, okay, he's asleep. Let me give it a go. It's good. Do you, have you ever written a song based off of something you've seen in a movie or a television show? Versailles. Really? Yeah.

Versailles. That's my favorite song off the new album. I'm so happy to hear that. So I was, I was staying at the Grand Hotel in Sweden, in Stockholm, which is, like, my spot. And they didn't really have, like, movie rents the spot. So you're just watching whatever is, like, on the TV. And Sophia Coppola's version of Versa, or Mary Antoinette was on. And I mean, like the actual history of that is quite, quite heavy.

But I was like this version, this fantasy version, which is so indulgent on all about pleasure, is really exciting to me. And I'm in this place where when I write recently where I just am like kind of collecting whatever is being thrown at me in the day. So when I went into this session the next day, I was like, you know, the idea of Versailles is like almost like a metaphor for what it is to like slow down and like live your best life. Like that's interesting to me. And we even like slow the music. You do. The chorus slows. Yeah.

Yeah. And I was just about to embark on this like month-long vacation, maybe almost turned into two months with my partner at the time. He was my boyfriend. And he proposed on this trip. But we were about to like go venture into like a new era of like pleasure seeking the two of us. And Versailles was on the list of places we were going to go. So it was like front of the brain. But that is definitely a song that came from a movie.

Wow. Yeah. That's so cool. Yeah. Also, do you prefer people call it? you Carly or Carly Rye? I think I neither. I'll answer to both, but Carly's totally fine.

Right? Because when I was watching your, because I watched your Canadian Idol audition and you were Carly Jepson. Yeah. Okay, fun fact. Do you want to know how Carly Ray was born? I've never told this story. It is my full real name, Carly Way Jepson. And my mother's always called me Carly Ray. But no one else did.

My, like, High School was just Carly, Carly, Carly. And then on Canadian Idol, they said, write your full name. And I took it very literally, and I wrote Carly Ray Jetson. And the next day they said, Carly Ray. And I was like, all right, maybe it's more memorable because it's a competition. Maybe they will remember. And then it stayed. And it's been that way ever since.

Wow. It's not that interesting, but that's how it happened. It wasn't like a really big choice. It was just kind of a coincidence. Yeah. Wow. Well, Shane, you know, Shane isn't my last name. It's my middle name.

There you go. And it came because I wasn't allowed to put my last name on Facebook in seventh grade. Oh, because your parents were being protected. Yeah. That's so sweet. And I wanted to make it, my last name was Roscoe. And I was like, I wanted to make it Rochko so bad. And my mom was like, no, shame.

That's so sweet. Yeah. I love that you have protected parents like that. That's cute. What do you, when, do you ever think about like what the world, now that you have a kid? I don't think about the world. Like, like, like, social media and phones and like how you're going to deal with that with, like, your kid? Oh my gosh.

It's terrifying. Yeah. I mean, I try not to stay up in the night thinking about it, but it definitely comes to mind. It's something my husband and I consider. I mean, we are wondering about this idea of just, like, taking him, hiding away somewhere in a cabin in Canada and just, like, telling him that this little bubble we create is real life,

but probably not the best way to go at it. So I think we're just going to be careful about making sure that, you know, we're there for him and that we're being careful about how early he gets access to all of it. Yeah, my parents made me wait. That's good. I agree with that tactic. Yeah. I think they did.

Look at you now. Thank you. They did great. They did great. Well, Carly Ray. Hey. What are you therapist about today? Today specifically?

It could be this week, this month. What are you angry about? Oh. What am I angry about? It could be something like for me, what I was angry about, um, is I have a horrible deviated septum. And it sucks and I need to get surgery. That does suck.

And I know I have a deviated septum and I went to a doctor. He said, no, you don't have one. I said, no, I do have one. Okay, okay. Okay, mine's very specific because I just had a child recently. Okay. But I was watching this, Jesse Ware is a podcast actually, about being pregnant.

And the whole time, it's called, Is It Normal? And the whole time, you read all of these sort of like, or you hear all these women talk about all these crazy sort of things that happen during their pregnancy. And at the end, a doctor or a nurse comes on and says, yes, it is normal. But we don't know why, because it's women's health. And that pisses me off, that there isn't more information and education about women's health, especially when we're out here just popping out babies left right and center. Making the world go around. So that pisses me off.

Yeah. It's a very valid thing to be pissed off about. Thank you. Pisses me off, not just today, but all of the day. What are some of your favorite lyrics you've ever written? On my own? Yeah. I don't know.

Gosh. Maybe that you're most proud of. On emotion. I think I liked to run away with me. I'll be your sinner in secret. I liked that moment. I think that there is something I'd like to play with in terms of like the coyness of like being sort of the person who's the pursuer. But also like being like, I want to do however I'm not going to.

you know, make it too aggressive. Right. You know, it's trying to find that nice little balance. I think that's why I resonate with it so much because it's like, it's almost like this like shyness a bit, but it's like, please pursue me. Like, do you know what I mean? It's like, please just come with me and be in love with me. But like, I'm not going to try too hard.

Like, you know what I mean? I actually, I've been, I've been like curious about what it is that makes you feel so alive when you are the person who is the pursuer. It's something that I've been talking about a little bit. But do you know what I mean? When you put yourself out there and you tell the person that you want them and it's kind of a little scary and you don't know what the reaction is going to be. It's like one of the times to be alive. I'm like I'm actually like dealing with that right now.

Talk about my crush. I'm so glad we're back here. It's really why I came as I just wanted to know. Because I'm like, do I say to that? Because we're like having this back and forth. But then he's like, but my first. friend will come to dinner and I'm like, but I don't want your friend to come to dinner. And I'm like, do I just ask him out or do I get to know him more?

Like, do you know what I mean? It's like, it's, I don't know. I definitely don't have all the answers, but I do think that it's confident to know what you wanted to say it. Right? Yeah, I do. That's what I think too. I think so.

Oh, also, another question, this sword thing. Oh, yeah. How did this begin? For those that don't know, you were given a sword at almost every one of your shows now. Mm-hmm. Yeah. And it started... I mean, you're asking me, but I also am just as confused as everybody.

But basically, I've been told that there was a campaign that was started by somebody online. And it was like, I want to give her a sword. And the answer was like, just because I think she deserves one. And somehow it got signed by a couple of people or something. You're going to have to do a fact check on this, but it caught wind. Yeah. And then lo and behold, I was like, at a show and a couple of people decided. I did to see it through and gave me like an inflatable sword or like a wooden sword or like concerned about how that got in.

But still got a sword. And then I was handed one on stage and I was just as confused as everybody. I was like, oh, a sword. And then that caught wind. And now I've given swords left right and center. I can like make one of those little chairs from the Game of Thrones. I mean, you should. You should.

Yeah. Yeah, I should. Yeah, I should. I should. What inspired you to start putting out like B sides of your records? I didn't want to. I knew I had. overwritten for emotion and I was not the only person who was aware of that fact so my A&R at the time was

named John Eamon and he was like can we do something with these like other songs I think that there's some potential here and I was really nervous about it I was like I fluctuated I was excited and then I was nervous and then I think the night before the release I called him and I was like I want to bail I don't want to do it it's a bad idea and he was like can you just trust me it's a B size people will understand that it's like allowed to be a bit more experimental or songs that you're like a little less sure of and I'm really glad that he talked me into it because it became this place where now I look forward to it where it's like oh the B-sides is where I go to play it's like the time where I'm getting a little weirder and a little bit more experimental and so with dedicated I knew

I was going to make one with the loneliest and loveliest time I kind of knew that was going to happen and with this project I would say that the whole thing is like a mix of of just me playing and being weird. So it's like not really like a distinguishing A and B sides. They're both kind of equally important to me and I wanted to show it all at once because I showed up with that kind of intention. Yeah. Yeah. Do you want to, I know this is a stupid question, but do you want to make music forever? I can't imagine a world where I don't create music in a part of my life, but I don't know. I think that it depends. I don't want to force it. I think what's been really lucky so far is it kind of just visits me in my day like i'll be playing with my son in the morning

and like a melody will come and i like need to like record it and i like hope that i can like look at it later when i have time or um a lot of times there's certain people who i just have that sort of spark with and on this project nate cipherd and uh kyle shirer were two of those people where we'd get in a room and it was really effortless and like we'd leave and we'd have like a week of that and we're like we were at like five songs for the album in five days and it was just it was easy and they were all very different. And I think when I have those connections and friendships, it would be hard to ever want to give it up because it really feels like magic. It's like the part of life that feels quite like my favorite, my favorite part of it. And so, yeah, I can't imagine, I can't imagine

not, but I don't know that it always would be something that I would share in such a big way. Right now feels like a really fun time to share because it's been a really prolific season, but we'll see. Yeah. Do you remember a studio session that you, you felt like just was like one of your favorite of all the time, like one of your favorite memories in the studio? Well, it's funny that you talk about Runaway with me because that was really a special day. And I was meeting like Noonie,

who became like a lifelong friend and Matthias and Robin. We worked together on a few other things. And so that was really special. But I would say for like this day and night album, what was really cool was getting to work on some of the songs with my partner. and it's a really strange thing to write with your partner because you have like no filters. So in other spaces where you would be like, like someone would say an idea and maybe you don't like it and you'd be like, okay. Like that's interesting.

Let's like, let's try it. And then you like try it and then you kind of try something else and then you like gently get to like a place for your happy again. And you're like, ah, okay. You know, sorry. With your partner, you're just like, I hate that so much. I hate it so. And you just like cut straight to, and you move on fast. And it's like cutthroat and real and like sexy and fun.

And like, I don't know. I think him and I got to a place where like we know each other really, really well. And we can write in a really honest way. And actually have learned to carve out space for what each other does. So I know what he does and he knows what I do. And we kind of just like move around each other a little bit. Just a little walk on the moon is a good example of a song that we wrote together in the Philippines, actually, in our.

hotel room and I think I was in the bath and he was like in the living room and I was like singing it to him and he was playing it on the guitar and like I just I'm like I would have never thought that I wanted to date another musician but now that I'm like married to one I'm like it's the best like it it just allows for music to kind of throw like braid its way through our lives and a really natural way and I think him and tavish crow like I talked about are two of my like soulmate writers and it's it's such a delight to be married to one of them that's so beautiful How did you guys meet? We met, we were set up on a session.

Oh, no way. Yeah, we were set up on a session. And it was, it was an interesting little meat cute, actually. I thought he was like a dance producer at first, but it turns out, no, he was, he was not. He was, I actually, yeah, it took me a second. We both had kind of a friendship brewing at the very beginning. We were. Okay, so you were friends first.

We were friends for like a year first. Fuck. Okay. I think I need to do that with my crush. But that's how I've always actually landed in relationships. Fun fact is I will generally like watch them from a friendship distance for a year until I decide and realize that we might be in love. But it's like it's like a nice vetting system because you get to know them a bit more honestly when they're not presenting as a date and they're just being your friend. Yeah.

And I think that that's like a really cool way to observe somebody. Yeah. I don't know. No, it's patience, which I don't have. Yeah. Well, I mean, I have a lot of fear, so that's where my tactic comes from. I'm scared to step into something until I know it's a good idea. Are you scared?

Like, do you have, like, rejection sensitivity? Are you, like, sensitive to rejection? Not that. I would very happily get in a relationship for a wild experience, knowing that it will be a fun time and a couple good songs. But I think that that's also maturity of realizing that that burns out pretty fast. I think it's more that I, I'm careful who I let into my circle.

And I want to make sure that it's good people, even if it's a for a brief encounter. Yeah. Yeah. Are you ready to tell me what's wrong? I'm excited. I'll get it. My boyfriend insisted on wearing shorts to my friend's wedding.

He wouldn't budge either because of the heat wave, and he got word that some of the other men were doing it too. I'm so embarrassed and cannot get the image out of my head. Help. I don't know, I think. I think it's kind of sweet, but maybe I'm just like romanticizing it, but like I think it's sweet to be embarrassed of your partner sometimes. Okay.

Like, because if they're so themselves, am I wrong? Like, I like it. It's a fun. I don't know if I agree. Really? I think it's sweet that he, it was so embarrassed and it's so dorky. Yeah, well, I guess because then that means they care. No, my thing is just like, oh, it's so embarrassing, but like, I love him.

Yeah, okay. If you land with that. If you circle back with so embarrassed, but I love you, great. Yeah. And also, if other people are wearing shorts, then what's, it's fine. If other people are wearing shorts, then whatever. And who cares? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Yeah. I got into business with my close friend, oh, yeah, and it's a disaster. He is unorganized, does not hit deadlines, and leaves the majority of the work up to me. However, he has great ideas and we build this together. I don't know how to proceed. I just wish I had it mixed business. with friendship. Any advice? That's tricky.

I think except the guy's not going to change and figure out what he's good at and give him more of those jobs. And if you need to bring in a third party because you feel overwhelmed by carrying the weight of the rest, then bring in a third so that it doesn't land all on you. Was it hard for, oh, I guess no. I guess you and your partner initially met via work. We did. So it's much different.

We did. But he also is a very hard worker. So it's good, you know. But also, yeah, people, do you believe that people change? If they want to, but not if you want them to. I think people are very capable of change, but it has to come from them. Now I'm realizing that I think people can. I think it's the whole point of life.

I think that we're on a journey to change and grow. And hopefully, if we're doing it right, you get better. Right. I was thinking about another guy I work with while being intimate with my boyfriend of three. I literally feel like the worst person ever. It only happened once before this, but what do I do? I'm so gross like I'd be sick if roles were reversed. Help.

They were just thinking about them? Yeah. Oh, give yourself a break. Right? You're a human being. You're thinking about a person. You're allowed to do that? Yeah.

I feel like people are much harsher on themselves these days than they used to be. I mean, I would say I agree if that's how everyone's feeling. You're allowed to have a little fantasy here and there. No, no. Yeah. What do you think, Manny? I always like to say, well, how do I phrase this? I don't know.

Anytime I'm in love with someone else, like, I have a huge... I just saw a movie last night. I was in love with the lead. Literally texted him. I'm in love with this person. What movie? Finding Emily. Okay.

I'm in love with a lead. Okay. I went home to visit my parents. I was the last child to leave the house. And since I've been here, they've been low-key slipping up saying their lives are so great and that they feel so refreshed lately. It's so clear that they needed me the fuck out of there. My feelings are really hurt by this.

I thought we all got along great. I think that's amazing. I mean, explain more. So. So they were the last child to leave the house. And now their parents are empty nesters and the parents are like loving their lives. Okay. And now this kid is feeling bad that their parents are enjoying their life.

But I think that's the point of life. Well, I would say that it's pretty amazing that the parents are like having this new lease on life and you should be happy for them. I would say it also hurts a lot more to see your parents upset that you've gone and not have a fulfilled life without. Is that what happened for you? Were your parents? Did they mourn your lot? Like you're reading? All the time.

My dad calls me like 10 times a day. I love him very much. But like I think he misses. He needs to move on. I think he misses having me home. Oh, that's very sweet, though. It's very sweet, but it's very sad. Like, I wish that he was like, this is the best thing ever.

Like, you know, like, I would prefer my parents to be like, we are so happy that you're out of the house. Okay. I think that would make me feel good because I'd want to see them happy. You want to see them having a hobby. Yeah. A new lease online. Yeah, I think my mom is happy.

She's always, like, traveling, like, doing whatever. But, like, my dad is definitely, like, misses having me home. I think that's very sweet. Yeah. I feel like, I mean, that should give you a little confidence post. People are achieving so many things at such a young age. What am I doing wrong? Why did it become something negative to do the traditional way of life, you know, like school, then job, etc.

Oh. I don't know. I think that the feeling I feel there is just don't compare. I think social media. Keep your eye on the prize. There's no wrong way at it. And it's very, yeah, social media does allow that. Even my, my, I think everyone is able to.

succumb to the comparison thing. My mother makes jewelry and everyone said, well, she'd be like, I saw this other woman, was wearing really funky hats when she was. And I was like, the hats aren't, first of all, why are we talking about another woman's hats? Like, just do your thing. I think, I think that's like the way to

live a good life, to make a good art, is just kind of stick to the path that feels like yours, and don't worry about the outside noise or what other people are doing. Did you ever find yourself, comparing yourself to other acts when you first came out to the sea? I felt it was really important to define what it was that I was contributing.

So I thought a lot about like, who am I? What am I doing? What does that mean in terms of what clothes I wear and how I present myself? And I think I thought about it too hard where I was just sort of more open and sponging to anybody else who might have an idea. So I think when I was 26 and first came to Los Angeles and everyone was like, we think it's like this in the market. I'm like, okay, well, if you've got an idea because I don't yet. But once I started to realize that no one was going to have a better idea of what works for me rather than me, I kind of took the reins back on that. But I wasn't looking like, oh, that girl's doing this and I should copy her.

I was very actually uninterested in doing anything that felt like copycadding to me. That felt like if I didn't know what to do, I knew I didn't want to do that. And what made you from after Calmie maybe want to go back to your theater routes? I, I, I, I, it sounds like I was smart and had a strategy. It wasn't like that. I just got a phone call and I just said, yes. Like it was just like, yes, that sounds like relief right now. Yes, that sounds like the right choice.

And sometimes I feel like the best decisions that I've made have been ones where I don't overthink it too much and I just sort of try it on and feel it and jump. Yeah. And I, I, I remember getting, I got the offer when I was on a plane and I thought, I want to do this. And I feel really happy that I took that. left turn. It's like actually brought so much, you know, even with 10 things now. I'm like, I don't think 10 things would have happened had I not said yes to Cinderella back then, you know? Oh, I'm so excited to see 10 things. That's going to be amazing. It's wild. I mean,

I mean, you, like you and Lena Dunham together, it just feels like pure magic. Thank you. Did you watch girls? Are you kidding me? I like rewatched it recently after her book came out because I was like kind of watching in tandem with reading and God. It's just like brilliant. That book is really, really incredible. Yeah. I mean, she's an incredible woman. It's,

yeah. I think it is my, I think it's time that I, I rewatched girls again. I rewatched it when I was like 23 fresh out of college and I think I need to watch it again with new eyes. So,

so, so good. Yeah. Yeah. So good. My boyfriend uses Shazam in public constantly. And I've gotten the ick. I use Shazam every day.

I used Shazam yesterday. I know this is silly, but it's like every time we're at the mall and it's playing the most generic music ever. He pulls out his phone. standing in the middle of everyone walking around him holding it to the sky, is this valid? No.

Yeah. I think if you're getting the ick over something like that, there's deeper issues going on. Thousand percent. Yeah. I was watching Penn 15 yesterday and there was like a needle drop at the end and I shazamed it. And it's my favorite thing in the world to Shazam a song that I love and be like, oh, this is my new favorite song. That's an, we're talking about festivals earlier, but that's a beautiful way to discover music.

I think. Yeah. Agreed. Yeah. Also, like, it's easy. That is a strange. That's one of the strangest icks I've ever heard. It's a really strange one.

Yeah. Sorry to call you out, whoever you are. Before we end, it is Mani's birthday. Oh, my goodness. Happy birthday, girl. And I was just wondering, we have a cupcake if you could sing happy birthday to her. Only if we all do it together. Of course.

Okay. But you're her favorite artist, and this would be her dream from true. Louise, do you have the cupcake? Are we starting? Happy birthday to you. Happy birthday to you. Happy birthday, dear manny. Happy birthday to you.

Make a wish. Yay! This is the best thing, this is like the best birthday ever actually. This is one of the best moments of my life. Oh, Minnie. I love you. Oh. Amazing.

What are your birthday plans tonight? I'm getting a massage. Oh, good. And then I'm just hanging out with my family and getting Thai food. Well, Carly Ray, what did we learn today? We learned that Shazamming is controversial. Apparently so. I said that.

Why is that a hard word? Controversial. My brain is mush at this point. What else did we learn? We learned. We learned that it's Mani's birthday. We learned that it's Mani's birthday. and we learned that your new album, Day and Night, is out now.

It's out now. It's out now. And it is your eighth studio album. We're counting the B-sides. We're counting the B-sides. Five pussies.