There Are No Girls on the Internet - Epstein files firestorm shows the power of online conspiracy

Episode Date: July 19, 2025

The Epstein story won’t die and in MAGA circles, it’s becoming a problem. This episode breaks down why the conspiracy has such staying power, who’s running with it now, and what it reveals about the fractures inside the far right.   Jeffrery Epstein, MIT and the Grad Student Who Spoke Up: https://omny.fm/shows/there-are-no-girls-on-the-internet/jeffrery-epstein-mit-and-the-grad-student-who-spok Remember Trump’s Influencers on the Epstein Files? They’re Pissed: https://www.yahoo.com/news/remember-trump-binder-influencers-epstein-203415282.html?guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmNvbS8&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAALE2eGyVYVuUQ7Iw3XlXK-4gRnbqSdJzXZ25_u0zYLgHcdvssTEXHrj7bNMZM_tlZtpkHkqfKXtoYpqHRsbODfjex4rE0acMyK2n76_-apXRlkREXs1EVL_Dtuxy_HLmIzt0xg-1YLaphFhSffgLJNE-ckWGgjWYy6Dk9NtkGR6c The FBI's Jeffrey Epstein Prison Video Had Nearly 3 Minutes Cut Out: https://www.wired.com/story/the-fbis-jeffrey-epstein-prison-video-had-nearly-3-minutes-cut-out/ These are the most significant allegations in Jeffrey Epstein accuser Virginia Giuffre's unsealed memoir: https://www.businessinsider.com/inside-jeffrey-epstein-accuser-virginia-roberts-unsealed-memoir-2019-8 I was abused by Jeffrey Epstein. Why is Trump silencing me?: https://www.thetimes.com/us/news-today/article/trump-jeffrey-epstein-victims-speak-out-silencing-l7ql9jn2b      If you’re listening on Spotify, you can leave a comment there or email us at [e-mail]! Follow Bridget and TANGOTI on social media! Many vids each week. instagram.com/bridgetmarieindc/ tiktok.com/@bridgetmarieindc youtube.com/@ThereAreNoGirlsOnTheInternetSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Just a quick heads up, today's episode mentions sex crimes against minors. There Are No Girls on the Internet as a production of IHeart Radio and Unbossed Creative. I'm Bridget Todd, and this is There Are No Girls on the Internet. We've talked a lot about online conspiracy theories on the podcast, but it's been a little while since we've talked about QAnani stuff. And with Jeffrey Epstein back in the news, I think it's time to dip back in a little bit. Because I honestly don't know if I believe what a lot of folks are saying, that this, and by this, I mean, Jeffrey Epstein, might be the thing that finally shakes up Trump Mago World. More on that in a moment. But I do think it is a very interesting example of what happens

when somebody who makes their entire thing about feeding conspiracy theories and builds up a loyal following and doing so tries to put that toothpaste back in the tube. Will it work? We will see. So here's what's going on for folks who don't know. First I'll start with a kind of quick and dirty crash chorus on who Epstein was with a few diversions, how we got here, and then I'll get into what I think it all means.

So first, who is this? Jeffrey Epstein. Jeffrey Epstein was a wealthy financier who really threw his money all over the place. It's not totally clear how he got his money and how much money he actually had. Some people call him a billionaire. I've heard that disputed. His background is kind of unbelievable. His first job was as a teacher at a high school despite that having any formal teaching credentials or formal teaching education. If you can believe that. And of course, while teaching, he had a reputation for inappropriate behavior with his students. He was first convicted of sex crimes against minors in 2008 and got off with a very lenient sentence, only about 13 months with work release. After serving his unbelievably short sentence,

Epstein continued to amass money, power, and influence until he was arrested again in 2019. Epstein died in jail in 2019 while awaiting trial on federal sex trafficking charges. The New York City medical examiner ruled his death of suicide, but conspiracy theories claiming that Epstein didn't kill himself, began to spread almost immediately in the aftermath of his death. The idea here is that Epstein did not actually die of suicide like we were told, but instead was taken out to avoid more details that might incriminate powerful people. And it's one of those theories that kind of works regardless of what side of the aisle you're on, because Epstein had deep ties with both political parties. The thing about Epstein is that part of his MO really was ingratiating himself

in lots of influential spaces with wealthy, powerful people. He gave him to be able to. He gave donations to a lot of influential spaces. We did an episode that I'll link to in the show notes about the contributions that he made to MIT's Media Lab and the Kenyan first-year MIT grad student who called this out and called for the head of the Media Lab to resign once his connections to Jeffrey Epstein were revealed. So it's one of those things where a lot of powerful, rich, and or famous people on all sides of the aisle had deep connections with Epstein at one time or another, and that is exactly the way that Epstein designed it. Now, obviously, just because somebody was connected to Epstein does not mean they did anything illegal. Rich and famous people

know other rich and famous people. So once Epstein was in some of those circles, I think a lot of people probably did just casually know them because they were all rich and powerful, not necessarily because they were all doing crimes together. Just to give you a sense of the diversity of people who were connected to Epstein's world, allow me two quick diversions. One is that I just finished the fantastic memoir called What Remains by Carol Radswell. formerly of the Real Housewives of New York City. And once I finished the book, I flipped the book around the back cover to see her author photo

and was shocked to see the photo credit because that photo was taken by none other than Galane Maxwell, who is currently incarcerated in connection with helping traffic women and girls for Epstein. The second diversion, if you'll allow me, is Epstein's connection to the creator of one of my favorite television shows, The Simpsons, Matt Groening.

One of the last accusers of Epstein to be public and not use a pseudonym like Jane Doe was Virginia Goufrey, who died by apparent suicide this April, who in court described being sexually abused by Epstein. She gave a detailed description of a foot massage that she said that she was asked to give Matt Groening when she was 16 years old on a private flight in California. This specific claim was made at an unpublished manuscript that she wrote called The Billionaire's Playboy Club, where she described how she was. talking to Matt Groening on a flight, telling him how much she loved the Simpsons when Epstein suggested that she give Matt Groening a foot massage. And she agrees. He takes off his shoes and his feet are so horrible that she's like, I can't do this. And she takes out a rag and washes them first because that's how bad they are. And as a show of thanks, Matt Groening gets her a little drawing of her two favorite Simpsons characters, Homer and Bart, as a thank you. Disgusting. So I wanted to share

that to illustrate the diversity of famous, powerful and wealthy people who have a connection to Epstein. And that is by design. He did this as a way of protecting himself and shielding himself from accountability for his many crimes. Kind of like we talked about in that episode that we did about Diddy. Really getting in tight with a lot of different powerful people across a lot of different industries and sectors and, of course, throwing around tons of money. Because how could a man who spend so much of his own money supporting charitable causes also be a serial abuser and trafficker, right? Also, very similar to Sean P. Dittie Combs, Epstein was known for having hidden cameras all around his property as part of a Compronaut strategy, where he would get evidence of these

powerful people doing things they shouldn't be doing, and then use that to extort or blackmail them later. And he apparently extorted people like Bill Gates, who was friendly with Epstein, and eventually Epstein tried to extort him. According to the the Wall Street Journal, before his arrest and death, Epstein extorted Bill Gates by threatening to release information about an extramarital affair that Gates had while he was married. Now, Gates is divorced now and has admitted that he had affairs while he was married. This is from The Guardian. Epstein found out about the Microsoft's co-founders affair with Russian bridge player Mila Antinova, and he threatened Gates into reimbursing him for tuition costs that Epstein had

initially covered for Antonova to attend Software Coding School. Epstein's threat to Gates came in the form of an email he sent in 2017. After he failed to convince Gates to join a multi-billion dollar charity fund, he attempted to set up. I looked into this story and it's kind of a very weird situation. Basically, this 20-year-old Russian bridge enthusiast Antenova wanted half a million dollars to start a business that would teach people to play bridge online. Epstein was like, oh, I bet Gates will give you the money. So connected her with Bill Gates.

Bill Gates declined to give her the money, but it sounds like they did start some kind of a relationship while Gates was married. Then Epstein paid for her to stay in an apartment and go to coding school. At the same time, Epstein was trying to start up this charitable fund with the bank J.P. Morgan. And this was meant to be a way for Epstein to kind of rebuild his reputation and polite society after he had to register as a sex offender because of his 2008 conviction for sex crimes against minors. But starting up this fund really relied on Epstein getting big money from Bill Gates. So, Eppstein. Epstein was kind of scamming.

He was communicating with J.P. Morgan as if he was Bill Gates's financial advisor, but in reality, he wasn't. When this scam all blew up in Jeffrey Epstein's face, it sounded like Epstein thought, well, at least Bill Gates should be reimbursing me for this woman's coding school because he ended up having an affair with her. So in 2017, Epstein emailed Gates about Antinova after Gates's affair with her ended. In the email, Epstein demanded Gates reimburse him for her coding school costs. The tone of the message was that Epstein knew about the affair and could expose it, the Wall Street Journal reported. Bill Gates' ex-wife, Melinda, has given interviews to the effect that Bill Gates' relationship with Jeffrey Epstein was a contributing factor to their marriage falling apart.

You know, it was also widely reported that Bill had a friendship or business or some kind of contact with Jeffrey Epstein and that that was very upsetting to you. Did that play a role in the divorce at all in this process? Yeah, as I said, it's not one thing. It was many things. But I did not like that he'd had meetings with Jeffrey Epstein know. And you made that clear to him. I made that clear to him.

I also met Jeffrey Epstein exactly one time. Did you? Yes, because I wanted to see who this man was. And I regretted it from the second I stepped in the door. He was abhorrent. He was evil personified. I had nightmares about it afterwards. So, you know, my heart breaks for these young women

because that's how I felt, and here I'm an older woman. My God, I feel terrible for those young women. It was awful. You felt that the moment you walked in. I didn't realize it. Yeah. And you shared that with Bill, and he still continued to spend time with him? Any of the questions remaining about what Bill's relationship there was,

those are for Bill to answer. Okay. But I made it very clear how I felt about him. So Epstein was all mixed up with all kinds of wealthy, powerful people in tech and politics and notably had connections with both Democrats and Republicans. In 2024, a federal court in Manhattan unsealed the court documents associated from a 2015 civil lawsuit and revealed the names of numerous individuals described in the suit as associates, affiliates, or victims of Jeffrey Epstein. Those names include people like President Bill Clinton and President Donald Trump, magician David Copperfield, Prince Andrew, which like, no surprise there. The former Israeli Prime Minister, actor Kevin Spacey, lawyer, Alan Dershowitz.

Dershowitz was a member of the legal defense team for the criminal case against Epstein in 2008, the late New Mexico governor Bill Richardson, and former Vice President Al Gore, among others. And of course, Trump has his own documented connections to Epstein. Trump was known to have been friendly with Epstein telling New York Magazine in 2002, I've known Jeff for 15 years, terrific guy. He's a lot of fun to be with. It's even said that he likes beautiful women as much as I do, and many of them are on the younger side.

Now, these statements came before there were any public allegations of wrongdoing against Epstein. Epstein and Trump shared events at Mar-Lago and Palm Beach, where they both lived. There is lots of video and photos of them partying together at Trump's Mar-Lago in 1992, 1927, and 2000. They frequently traveled together. Epstein's private jet logs list Trump on multiple flights between Paul Beach and New York in the 90s. Epstein is on audio describing Trump as, quote, his closest friend for 10 years. But remember, Epstein is somebody who inflated his connections or representation with wealthy

and powerful people. So who knows? In any event, very conveniently in 2019, after Epstein's arrest, Trump said that he had a falling out with Epstein a long time ago. So during Trump's campaigns, he really fanned the flames of the kind of conspiracy theories adjacent to Epstein. but not necessarily Epstein specifically. This is all complicated by the fact that Epstein was a real convicted child sex criminal, but his whole saga kind of got lumped in with a mishmash of harm against children conspiracy theories that are not true, things like QAnon, Pizza Gate, and Save the Children. So the fact that Epstein really was an abuser of children and really was connected to powerful political leaders

kind of gets used as a proof point for a larger umbrella of often anti-Semitic false. narratives about harm being done to children by a cabal of global elites who control everything. And that is the set of conspiracy theories that Trump more openly flirted with. Even if he did not often evoke Epstein specifically, you can see how this was a useful message for Trump to have youth in his campaigning. Trump and his allies really harnessed the kind of simmering suspicion of establishment figures and cast Trump in opposition as this bold outsider and the only person brave enough to take on the deep state. Trump pretty old. openly evoked all of this while campaigning.

In 2022, he reposted an image of himself wearing a cue for QAnon lapel pen overlaid with the words, the storm is coming. In QAnon lore, the storm refers to what people think will be Trump's final victory, when there will be mass arrests and maybe even mass executions of Democrat sex criminals in the street. In 2020, Trump was asked about QAnon directly in an interview. Now, he could have dismissed this as a baseless conspiracy theory. but instead he praised the movement as people that love our country. He basically was like, oh, QAnon says that I'm against pedophiles.

I'm an enemy to pedophiles. If that's a good thing, I'll take it. And he more or less reinforced their belief that he was exposing a satanic pedophile ring. So we saw Trump really lean into this idea too, posting images referring to himself as a martyr, fighting bad guys and criminals and psychopaths and the so-called deep state. Trump didn't often mention QAnon himself, but he was more than happy to boost people who did. Media Matters actually did an analysis of how often he would repost outright, obvious, explicit QAnon supporters on social media, and that happened a ton. So he gets to signal to these people, hey, I see you, I get you, I'm one of you, wink, wink, while keeping this kind of plausible deniability cover of not having to have said so directly, which we know by now is a Trump classic.

Let's take a quick break. Another podcast from some SNL late-night comedy guide. Not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Jim Gaffigan to Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman, help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter.

There's the worst singer in the group. The worst? Yeah. Me. Is there anything to the idea that because you're from Harvard, you only got in because your parents made a huge donation. The yard birds, right? That's the name.

The Harvard Yardt. They're open. Do you have a name suggestion? We're open. Since you guys are middle-aged, one erection. Listen to Humor Me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Humor me. I need some jokes to make me seem funny.

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Casting. Call 844-844-I-Hart to get started. That's 844-8-4-8-4-I-Hart. What's up, fam? It's Isaiah Thomas. And I'm C.J. Toledano, and our podcast, Point Game is about defining the odds. Like LeBron heading into the playoffs without Luca and Austin Reed. And finding ways to win no matter what. He's the smartest player to ever play the game. His IQ is at a level that we've never seen before. And he knows. Without Luca and Austin Reeves, I got to manipulate the game. We get a player's perspective on the challenges of the playoffs. I think Joker's going to be exhausted this series because when they don't have Rudy in the lineup, he has to really guard guys like Nas Reid. He has to guard Julius Randall. And then he has to

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You can have opinions. You can have like a strong stance. And then there's your body having its own program. I'm Dr. Maya Shunker, a cognitive scientist and host of the podcast, a slight change of plans, a show about who we are and who we become when life makes other people. plans. We share stories and scientific insights to help us all better navigate these periods of turbulence and transformation. There is one finding that is consistent, and that is that our resilience rests on our relationships. I wish that I hadn't resisted for so long the need to change.

We have to be willing to live with a kind of uncertainty that none of us likes. Listen to a slight change of plans on the IHeart Radio app, Apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. At our back. So the big point of contention here is what is often called Epstein's client list, a supposed list of powerful elites that Epstein and Galane Maxwell might have trafficked women and girls to slash with. I should add that Gawker, rest in peace, published Epstein's address book maybe 10 years ago,

and New York Magazine published an annotated version back in 2019. Business Insider released a searchable version the next year, along with flight logs from Epstein's private plane, which were released in 2015. So Trump himself has spoken directly about this client list since he got back into office, telling supporters that he does intend to look into Epstein's client list. He talked about it on his appearance on Lex Friedman's podcast. I was going to put the audio here, but honestly, y'all don't want to hear Trump's voice, y'all don't want to hear Lex Friedman's voice, and frankly, neither do I.

But the exchange went like this. Friedman says, it's just very strange for a lot of people that that list of clients that went to the island has not been made public. And Trump responds, it's very interesting, isn't it? It probably will be, by the way. Friedman responds, if you're able, you'll be,

and then Trump interjects and says, yeah, I'd certainly take a look at it. Now, Kennedy's interesting because it's so many years ago. They do that for danger because it endanger certain people, et cetera, et cetera. So Kennedy is very different from the Epstein thing, but I'd be inclined to do the Epstein. I'd have no problem with it.

But you'll recall that backer During Elon Musk and Donald Trump's big breakup earlier this summer, Musk claimed that Trump will never release the Epstein client list because, dun, dun, done, Trump is on the Epstein client list. So this is a big issue because I simply cannot express to you how much some of his deepest supporters truly did expect mass arrests of Democrats and hundreds of Democratic lawmakers being perped walk through the streets in connection with sex crimes against children and Epstein.

And Trump kind of low-key hyped them up for this, too, even if he never came out and said it directly. Trump further leaned into that whole conspiracy theory mindset when he appointed to senior positions, folks who have similarly used the same kind of conspiracy theories to make broad accusations of corruption and abuse, most notably FBI director Cash Patel and FBI deputy director, Dan Bongino. Before they joined government, both Patel and Bongino spent years on podcasts after podcast and TV appearance after TV appearance, kind of winking at Q&on on Epstein conspiracy theories and demanding the files released, even going so far as to suggest the Biden administration was intentionally withholding the Epstein client list to protect its own. So these picks to the FBI

were men who are deep, deep in conspiracy world. When they came on board, I think it gave Trump supporters this sense that, like, yes, the people in charge of the FBI, they are one of us. All of these theories are going to be taken seriously and all of these theories are going to be acted upon because Patel and Bungino believe them to and they are now in charge. So now the White House knows they've got these people frothing at the mouths. And back in February, they were like, let's throw on a little bit of red meat, shall we? Which brings us to the binder stunt. In a presentation at the White House on February 27, 2025, Attorney General Pam Bondi personally handed out these like big white, oversized binders labeled the Epstein Files colon phase one to about 15 right wing influencers inside the

West Wing. If you have not seen an image or video of this event, I really do implore you to take a look. I'll put the link down on the show notes because I don't think I've ever seen an event that was more clearly a photo op stunt. The binders are massive. And the type face on the front of the binders that say the Epstein Files face, one. It's so big that it could be seen from practically across the street. I could see it in my apartment in Columbia Heights, fucking miles away from the White House, right? And so they're photographed like holding these big binders that say Epstein Files phase one above their heads. And even calling them Epstein Files phase one kind of gave the impression that this was just the beginning. There was

going to be more Epstein information being released to the public to come. The event, which Trump, Bondi, FBI Director Cash Patel, and J.D. Vance all attended, was meant to showcase these newly declassified documents. But then these influencers get home, open the binders, and realize that all that's in them is previously public information, like public flight logs, publicly available redacted contact lists, and old evidence lists that were already public. The big thing was a letdown for them, and it was obviously just a stunt. And mind you, these are MAGA people. They were like, scamming their own people. These were the worst of the worst.

People like Chaya Racheck of Libs of TikTok. So when they get home and find out that these binders have nothing in them and they've basically been scammed, it prompted instant criticism of Pam Bondi and the DOJ. Jack Pesobiak reportedly left the event early and later posted, they flew us to D.C. for this? This is PR, not justice. Chia Rachik of Libs of TikTok posted on telegram, we were promised transparency.

Instead, we got a whitewax. version of the truth. D.C. Drano publicly called for AG Pam Bondi's resignation and accused her of quote, running cover for elite pedophiles. What's kind of funny is that Pam Bondi essentially blame this whole thing on Cash Patel. Bondi released a letter to Patel accusing the FBI of inappropriately withholding thousands of pages of files related to Epstein from the DOJ and demanded the FBI turnover the material by 8 a.m. the following day. But no additional information ever came. Bondi said in a response to a question from a Fox News host about Epstein's client list that the client list is, quote, sitting on my desk right now to review. So get out those handcuffs

and get ready for those perp walks because there's about to be a mass wave of arrests, right? This is going to invigorate the MAGA base, right? Well, no, because now they're saying, actually are bad. There is no Epstein client list. They announced this on 4th of July holiday weekend, which is a classic time to drop information you kind of don't want people to see because everybody's on vacation. In a memo, they said that after a systematic review of the Epstein files, the Justice Department officials revealed no incriminating client list, nor did they find evidence that Epstein had blackmailed any powerful figures, and the memo reaffirmed that Epstein died by suicide in his Brooklyn jail cell while awaiting trial on sex trafficking charges in 2019.

So Bondi basically said, there is no client list. Epstein died of suicide. nothing to see here. The administration also released what they called raw video of surveillance footage of Epstein's death by suicide. However, Wired recently reported that newly uncovered metadata reveals that nearly three minutes of footage were cut out from what the FBI and the DOJ described as full raw surveillance video from the only functioning camera near Jeffrey Epstein's prison cell the night before he was found dead. The Trump administration said that releasing this full, full, this quote, full raw surveillance video was part of their commitment to fully investigate his death. But given that almost three minutes of that footage was not released, it only raised new questions about how that footage was edited and assembled. Now, Wired had previously reported that that video had been stitched together in Adobe Premiere Pro from two different video files, contradicting the Justice Department's claim that it was, quote, raw footage. And now, further analysis

shows that one of the source clips was approximately two minutes and 53 seconds longer than the segment included in the final video, suggesting that that footage appears to have been trimmed before release. But to be super clear, it is unclear what, if anything at all, the minutes cut from that first clip showed? Attorney General Pambondi has attributed it to a nightly system reset. So, as you can imagine, just even just hearing that, as you can imagine, being told, like, oh, that missing footage, oh, just a normal glitch in the same thing.

system that happens every night. None of this went down super well for Trump's Cuban-on, true believers. Because remember, these are people. They are Trump's own supporters who have made their entire personality this stuff. Their entire personalities and identities, in some cases, are about getting justice for kids. Some of these people have alienated their entire families and lost lots of money because of this pursuit. And they were told by Trump that they could not trust elected officials because all the elected officials are implicated. in this and lying, and now those same people are just saying, trust us and his supporters are not having it. Here's some of what they had to say. Right-wing commentator, Benny Johnson,

this is the worst response I've ever seen from President Trump. Disgraced former general Michael Flynn, considered a hero by the Qaeda movement, said, Donald Trump, please understand the all-caps-Ebstein affair is not going away. Right-wing commentator Matt Walsh called Trump's extremely obtuse saying, we don't accept obvious bullshit from our political leaders. Wara Lumer, the far-right conspiracy theorist and pundit and influential Trump advisor, accused Pam Bondi of lying and called for her to be fired. And former Fox News host, Tucker Carlson, accused Bondi of covering up crimes, very serious crime by their own description.

It seems like a lot of the heat and ire has really been aimed at Pam Bondi, even though it's pretty clear that she is acting on behalf of Trump. Trump defended her saying, Attorney General Pam Bondi, who is doing a fantastic job, all caps. We're on one team, MAGA, and I don't like what's happening. We have a all caps, perfect administration. All caps, talk of the world. And weirdly in quotes for some reason, selfish people are trying to hurt it. All over a guy who never dies. Jeffrey Epstein, for years, it's Epstein over and over again. Why are we giving publicity to files written by Obama, crooked Hillary, Comey, Brennan? and the losers and criminals of the Biden administration.

Even though, side note, the DOJ files were largely written in 2019 when Trump was president, but okay. More after a quick break. Another podcast from some SNL late night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Jim Gaffigan to Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman, help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and head writer Streeter Seidel,

help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. There's that worst singer in the group? The worst? Yeah. Me. Is there anything to the idea that because you're from Harvard, you only got in because your parents made a huge donation. The group.

The yard birds, right? That's the name. The Harvard yard, but they're open. Do you have a name suggestion? We're open. Since you guys are middle aged. One erection. Listen to you.

Humor me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the IHart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Humor me. I need some jokes to make me seem funny. Run a business and not thinking about podcasting, think again. More Americans listen to podcasts than ads supported streaming music from Spotify and Pandora. And as the number one podcaster, IHearts twice as large as the next two combined. So whatever your customers listen to, they'll hear your message. Plus, only IHeart can extend your message to audiences across broadcast radio.

Think podcasting can help your business. Think IHart. Streaming, radio, and podcasting. Call 844-844-I-Hart to get started. That's 844-8-4-I-Hart. What's up, fam? It's Isaiah Thomas. And I'm C.J. Toledano, and our podcast Point Game is about defining the odds.

Like LeBron heading into the playoffs without Luca and Austin Reed. And finding ways to win no matter what. He's the smartest player to ever play the game. His IQ is at a level that we've never seen before. And he knows without Luca and Austin Reeves, I got to manipulate the game. We get a player's perspective on the challenges of the playoffs. I think Joker's going to be exhausted this series

because when they don't have Rudy in the lineup, he has to really guard guys like Nas Reid. He has to guard Julius Randall. And then he has to give us everything he gives us on the night-to-night basis on offense. And when IT's friends stop by, like Quentin Richardson, we dive into some playoff history too. But get that thing.

That man, hell get the flying. He running up the court, licking his fingers while he got the ball. Like, after you go through a training camp with that, Isaiah, you figure it out real quick. Get your ass up and down the court, and you're going to get the ball. So listen to Point Game on the IHeart Radio app,

Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. You can have opinions. You can have like a strong stance. And then there's your body having its own program. I'm Dr. Maya Shunker, a cognitive scientist and hosts of the podcast, a slight change of plans, a show about who we are and who we become when life makes other plans. We share stories and scientific insights to help us all better navigate these periods of turbulence and transformation. There is one finding that is consistent, and that is that our resilience rests on our relationships.

I wish that I hadn't resisted for so long the need to change. We have to be willing to live with a kind of uncertainty that none of us likes. Listen to a slight change of plans on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Let's get right back into it. So do you know that phrase hoisted by his own potard, the idea of becoming ensnared in the very trap that you were setting for someone else? I think that is kind of what's going on here because Trump has been exploiting all of these conspiracy theories. for years and using them to sow distrust in government officials. Russell Muirhead, a professor at Dartmouth College, was written on the online intersection of conspiracy

theories and politics puts it this way. Nobody exploited these questions more than Donald Trump, and he did that because, as always, he wanted to paint government officials as liars, as self-serving, as people who just deserve to be fired. Well, now the government officials are people he appointed, and now he's saying there's nothing to see here. And Trump really leaned in hard to those Epstein rumors when it suited him. even so far as retweeting a post in 2019 that alleged that Bill Clinton was somehow connected to Epstein's death.

And now he is just trying to abandon all that, tell everybody, stop doing that, stop asking these questions, and have us all go along with that even after he was the one who kicked up all this dirt and dust around it. And I think the fact that some of his supporters are so caught up and this really shows how much Epstein and QAnon and conspiracy theories in general have become intertwined with today's Republican Party. Like, these are not fringe attitudes or beliefs. Marjorie Taylor Green is an open Q&ON supporter, and she's not just some cuck posting on a random message board. She's in Congress with the president's endorsement. And in many cases, I really think that conspiracy theories like this are the glue that

holds everything together. So now that they're saying, oh, no, this conspiracy theory, it's not real, doesn't exist, get over it. What will be the glue that holds this whole thing together in its absence? And I think that's one of the reasons we're not seeing this go. away as quickly as Trump, which is that it would, because Trump is now finding out just how powerful and what a grip conspiracy theories can have on people. You know, live by the sword, die by the sword. Trump completely melted down about this on his truth social account, basically saying

that he can't believe that anybody wants to talk about abstin, a hoax by Biden. Here's a bit of what he had to say. What's going on with my, quote, boys, and in some cases, gals, they're all going after Attorney General Pam Bondi, who was doing an all-caps fantastic job, ellipsies for some reason. Let's keep it that way and not waste any capital T time and capital E energy on Jeffrey Epstein, somebody that no one cares about. Their new all-caps scam is what we will forever call the Jeffrey Epstein hoax. And my past supporters have bought into this bullshit hook, line, and sinker. Let these weaklings continue forward and do the Democrats work. Don't even, even think about talking about our incredible and unprecedented success because I don't even want

their support anymore, which I have to say, fucking all-time truth social posts from Trump, and that is really saying something. And him basically coming out and saying that if you are still asking questions about Epstein, I don't even want your support, I think is really something. Now, people have been saying a lot that they think that this is going to be the thing that pulls Mago rolled apart. Can you believe it? Jeffrey Epstein. And you, you know, you might be thinking if I think that as well, do I think this is going to have a lasting impact in Mago World, considering that Trump has been telling his supporters that he wants him to shut up about it and they have not shut off about it? Honestly, I really don't think so. I don't know if this

is just my own cynicism and sort of resigned status to what's happening. But I think that a lot of these people have built up so much of their identities and their personalities around this. Like, where else would they go? Who else would enable that? Where would all that energy go. One of my favorite journalists who focuses on conspiracy for NBC, Brandy's Ardroni, put it very well on the blue sky. She writes, we're about to find out if get over it from a trusted leader can pull people away from a conspiracy theory. I'm skeptical, but you never know. That really sums up how I feel about it too. And maybe we will never know because House Republicans just voted down another Democratic procedural maneuver aimed at forcing the DOJ to release documents related

to Epstein. Republicans in the House voted against attaching a Democratic amendment to another piece of legislation that would have forced the DOJ to release the Epstein files. This would have had it gone through, it would have forced Pam Bondi to publish all documents related to Epstein within 30 days. So Trump officials were trying really hard to put this whole thing to bed, but it is not been put to bed at all because the Wall Street Journal released a report that Trump may have sent Epstein kind of a gross, crude birthday card for his 15. birthday back in 2003 with a hand-drawn picture of some boobs, and it ends with the words, A pal is a wonderful thing.

Happy birthday. And may every day be another wonderful secret. Trump says he never wrote it, doesn't draw pictures, doesn't talk like that, and filed a suit against the Wall Street Journal, News Corp, Rupert Murdoch, and the two journalists responsible for the article. And on Thursday night, Trump suddenly reversed course and instructed Pam Bondi to release pertinent files on the criminal investigation into Epstein subject to court approval. And on Friday, Bondi filed a motion in New York to release grand jury transcripts associated with the Epstein case. Now, keep in mind that

the Department of Justice and the FBI still retain the bulk of what those who are calling for transparency are really wanting to see. And it's not even clear what, if anything, would be potentially released in that. Meanwhile, Senate Democrat sent a letter to Bondi asking why exactly it took an additional three months to release a summary of the findings related to Epstein. And importantly, why agents were instructed to flag any mention of Trump and whatever they found. Curious, right? This is obviously a developing story, and no doubt there will be more twists and turns as it continues. And I think it's really important to note that amidst all this noise and all this chaos are actual voices of actual victims and survivors, and it is incredibly important to me

that those voices do not go unheard. Danielle Bensky, who was abused by Epstein when she was a teenager in 2004, said that the decision to close this case left her feeling like she was on a first-class flight on a refurbished Lolita Express, which was the nickname for Epstein's private jet. Her story is deeply heartbreaking. Her mom had a brain tumor when she was a teenager

and an aspiring ballerina. And once she got mixed up with Epstein, Epstein told her that he knew the best surgeons in New York City, but that if she wanted Epstein to help her mother, who was dying of cancer, she would have to recruit other girls for him, her lawyer is alleged in a lawsuit. She told the Times,

it feels like the current cabinet is essentially erasing our voices after years of bravery and work to find our way out of silence. It's actually worse than silencing. It's rewriting a narrative as if none of us existed in the first place. What does it teach our children?

That if you are wealthy and powerful enough, you can make anything disappear, or play the blame. game and create conspiracy theories. And I think it's a good reminder that that truly is who matters here and that truly is who we are failing. The actual victims and survivors who went through something horrible and might not ever get a sense of closure or justice.

And they deserve both. Got a story about an interesting thing in tech or just want to say hi? You can reach us at hello at tangoody.com. You can also find transcripts for today's episode at tangoody.com. There are no girls on the internet was created by me, Bridget Todd. It's a production of IHeart Radio and unbossed creative. Jonathan Strickland is our executive producer. Tari Harrison is our producer and sound engineer.

Michael Amato is our contributing producer. I'm your host, Bridget Todd. If you want to help us grow, write and review us on Apple Podcasts. For more podcasts from IHeartRadio, check out the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Another podcast from some SNL, late-night comedy guy. Not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends.

Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to Dave. David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, S&L's Mikey Day and headwriter, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the I-Heart Radio app,

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