This American Life - 851: Try a Little Tenderness

Episode Date: January 12, 2025

In the new year, stories of people trying a radical approach to solving their problems. Visit thisamericanlife.org/lifepartners to sign up for our premium subscription.Prologue: Ira meets two sisters who got into a fight, and then learned a lesson in turning the other cheek. (8 minutes)Act One: A hardened PI works the toughest case of his very young life. (18 minutes)Act Two: Producer Aviva DeKornfeld talks to a man who finds himself the target of vengeful crows. (8 minutes)Act Three: Comedian Josh Johnson wonders if some people should’ve been spanked as kids. (10 minutes)Act Four: Writer Etgar Keret reads his story about a bus driver who refuses to open the doors for late passengers. (9 minutes)Transcripts are available at thisamericanlife.orgThis American Life privacy policy.Learn more about sponsor message choices.

May is six years old, in first grade. She's the kind of forthright kid who, when we sit down for an interview, before I can get to any of the things that I want to ask her, she launches into a few get-to-know-you questions of her own. Hi May. We discuss favorite colors, and then she moves on to... I'm glad you're asking me that. We move on to last names, and soon she's instructing me on the pronunciation of her last name. I'm glad you're asking me that. My middle name is Zmiel Jensky. We move on to last names and soon she's instructed me on the pronunciation of her last name. Can you say Zmiel Jensky? That's how you say it.

Zmiel Jensky. Zmiel Jensky. Z-M-U-D-C-Z-Y-N-S-K-I. The story I was there to talk to Ms. Jensky about happened this, at the beginning of the school year in St. Louis, where she lives. It was hot out. It's sort of a funny story. So my sister told me to wear long sleeves. I mean, short sleeves because it was like summer. And I wanted to wear long sleeves and I just got mad.

Yeah. And I also said, stop bossing me around. Though she really didn't like it and she has a very fiery temper. This is her older sister Johanna. Johanna's eight in third grade. Again, May, sixth, first grade. And Johanna, as the older sister, is very aware of the things that make May upset. Mostly when I tell her what to do. Especially she says when it comes to what May is wearing.

Like she thinks fashion disasters are like the worst thing ever to happen. So she gets really angry when I tell her what to wear and yeah. May gets very angry a lot. And her face turns red and yeah. May gets very angry a lot. And her face turns red and yeah. Who's May? I was like so frustrated. I had a big tantrum. What do you do when you have a tantrum?

I usually do this with my fist. You're scrunching your fist as tight as they can go? Yeah, mm-hmm. And I was like jumping and jumping and twitching my legs. Meanwhile, Mae and Johanna's mom, Megan, was trying to get them both dressed and ready for school. And I just remember she was screaming because I said, OK, Mae, you got to calm down so you can still

get ready and get out the door. And she was just screaming that the only way she could calm down was if she punched her sister in the face. I told my mom, that's the only way for me to calm down. And I said, well, that's not an option. So can you think of some other way to calm down? And then I had to get ready. So I just left and she was still kind of making quite a bit of noise. And then when I came back, kind of miraculously, the tears had dried. She was smiling. Johanna was smiling. What had happened? How'd these two little kids work this out so quickly? Well, May and Johanna explained and went down like this.

May marched herself to Johanna's room, banged on the door. Johanna opened the door. And May has been working on not giving into her anger, not taking the low road, but instead using words, saying what she wants, which she did now. I said, I wanna punch you in the face and that's the only way I can calm down. And then Johanna, what did you say? I wanna kind of think about that.

Um, I want to kind of think about that. Um, you can punch me in the butt instead. This caught me off guard. I was like, okay? And then I just tried it. When you punched her butt, did you punch her like you were super mad or did you punch her kind of soft by then because you were sort of half over it? I punched it hard because like so like to try to get all the anger out because if I punched it softly it sort of only lets a couple pieces of the madness out of you.

And did it work? Did you get all the anger out? Yes, because I punched it super hard. She definitely hit it very hard. How was that for you? I'm used to having a lot of siblings and I get beat up by them all the time. So it didn't really hurt me. Why did that work? I don't know.

It's funny, I wonder if it worked. Because she was sort of nice about it. Like you came to her all mad, and then she didn't get mad back. Instead, she greeted your anger with niceness. I don't really know why she acted nice to me when I was frustrated. Have you ever heard of this phrase, turn the other cheek? No. It's something that I think Jesus said. He said that if somebody slaps you on your right cheek,

like, you know, like slaps you on the cheek of your face, he says, turn the other cheek and offer the other cheek as well. Even if somebody's mad at you and does something unreasonable, you shouldn't get unreasonable yourself. Probably. You shouldn't get unreasonable yourself. Probably. And in this case, your sister turned the other cheek, but it was her butt cheek that she turned. That's funny.

But it wasn't just Johanna who got them to a quick, peaceful resolution. Both girls agreed that if May hadn't asked for what she wanted at the door, if she just punched Johanna, Johanna would have punched back and would have escalated. Johanna admits she's not always so calm and reasonable with May. But this time it was clear how to handle her and Johanna knew exactly what to do. And she got what she wanted so I think that made her happy. I think that's true, yeah.

Like, you didn't say no to her. Yeah, I've been here for six, I've been with her for six years of my life. I know her pretty well. I've known her for a whole life, so. I get to watch a whole entire movie about her in my mind. And so you know what to do. Yeah. Well today on our show in these noisy aggressive times where the people rising

to power in this world seem to come in hot, lots of fiery tempers and scrunched up fists and twitching legs, we pause for a moment to remember there is another path. We have stories of people turning the other cheek, pausing, trying against all odds to see the good in each other, giving themselves over to the feeling in that old Otis Redding song. Stay tuned for a hard-boiled detective, for crows with a vendetta, for righteous spankings and non-spankings, for John Mulaney, and for a bus driver who thought he was God. From WBEZ Chicago, this is American Life.

I'm Ira Glass. Stay with us. This is American Life, Act One. So there's an entire genre of movies and other stories where tough guys who've been through it all and seen the worst in people decided they're going to soften, try a little tenderness, help somebody out who needs the help. This happens in old westerns, sci-fi films, spy stories. And there's a story like that on stage right now on Broadway, New York. And I saw this a couple weeks ago and thought this story would be perfect for the radio. And the director and producers and writers said yes. The show is called All In.

And it stars John Bellini, Richard Kind, Fred Armisen, and Chloe Feynman. And what they're doing is they're performing a set of short stories on stage by the writer Simon Rich, who's been on our show a few times with his stories. And let's get right to it. This story is one of the stories in their show. It's called The Big Nap. Chapter One. I woke up just after dawn.

It was a typical morning. My knees were scraped and bruised. My clothes were damp and soiled. And my teeth felt like someone had socked me in the jaw. I reached for the bottle I kept under my pillow and took a sloppy swig. The taste was foul, but it did the trick. Now I could sit up and think. Now I could start to figure out how to somehow face another goddamn day. I stared at my reflection in the mirror. I wasn't getting any younger. I was two years old. Soon I would be three. Unless I stayed two. I wasn't sure if you stayed the age you were or if that changed. I wasn't sure about a lot of things. All I knew was I was tired.

Tired of this down and dirty life. Tired of trying to make some sense. Out of a world gone mad. The client was waiting for me in my nursery. I'd seen her around before. She'd come on the scene about a year ago, moving into the white bassinet down the hall. Some people called her sweetheart.

Others called her pumpkin. But most people knew her by her full name, Baby Zoe. ["Baby Zoe"] Sure, she looked innocent enough with her big wide eyes and her Princess Elsa onesie, but her past was murky. Some said she came from the hospital. But there was also a rumor she'd once lived inside Mummy's tummy.

It didn't add up. Still, a job's a job. So what brings you here to see me? It's Mumu. She's missing. I rolled my eyes. Mumu went missing all the time. It was just the kind of unicorn she was. Maybe she's under your bassinet.

I checked. She's not. Her eyes filled with tears. I handed her a tissue, but she didn't know what a tissue was. So she put it in her mouth and tried to eat it. Please. More is all that happened this whole wide world. Lost toys? A small time. Why should I bust my ass trying to find some unicorn, probably just turn up under the radiator. Because I can pay you upfront. I cocked my head doubtfully.

What kind of scratch could a baby like Zoe come up with? She didn't have a piggy bank. She wasn't old enough to have pockets. What do you got that's worth me getting up for? Stickers. I swallowed. Are they the fun kind? See for yourself.

They were fun, all right. I'd never seen so many Batmans in all my life. How do I know these aren't hot? Where'd you even get them? I don't remember. Sometimes things are just in my hand. I also don't remember how I got into this room or what we're talking about.

We're talking about how I'm gonna find your Moo Moo. You mean it? That's right, doll. I'm gonna find your Mumu. You mean it? That's right, doll. I'm on the case. Chapter two. So this is the rug where you last saw your Mumu. Yes, someone must have taken her. Have you seen any suspicious characters around lately?

Not that I can remember. Think hard. Well, now that you mention it, an old lady appeared out of nowhere yesterday and replaced my parents. Interesting. Describe her. Gray hair, glasses, smells like yogurt. Large wooden jewelry? Yeah.

Sounds like Nana. You know her? I've had run-ins with her before. She's from Florida. Where's Florida? It's in the sky. Really? Yeah.

How do you get there? You get in an airplane and you watch cartoons. And when you wake up, you're in her house and there's a turkey. If Nana's from Florida, what's she doing here? That's what I'm gonna find out. Chapter three. Nana was elusive. Sometimes she was lying in a recliner.

Sometimes she was small inside a phone. If I was gonna track her down, I needed good old fashioned shoe leather. First, I tried the playroom. Then I tried the room that has the chairs. I'd been at it for over ten seconds when I finally caught a break in the case. Nana picked me up and started carrying me. Before long, she was making a phone call. How's the Airbnb?

Are you both wearing sunscreen? Listen, I can't figure out the bosh. It was impossible to follow. Like all grownups, Nana spoke in a secret code designed to keep her operations hidden. What does smart cycle mean? Warm or cold? Hold on, I'm putting you on speaker.

And that's when a familiar voice rumbled out of Nana's phone. We're driving to the beach, just Google it, okay? There was no mistake in it. The voice belonged to Mama. And that could only mean one thing. This one went all the way to the top. Chapter four. I'm off the case.

What? But you said you'd help me. That was before I knew the score. If Mama's mixed up in this, I don't want anything to do with it. What's wrong with Mama? I like Mama. We all like Mama. She smells nice and is warm.

But that doesn't change the fact that she runs this whole goddamn town. What are you talking about? Look, you're just a kid, so I'll spell it out for you. Mama's the big boss around here. The doctor, the dentist, the gym-berry instructor. They're all on the tape. But I thought Dada wasn't charged. Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha. Dada.

Dada's just a bag man. He wears a shiny watch. It's Mama's the ones that's calling all the shots. What does this have to do with Mumu? Oh, don't you get it? This is bigger than Mumu. Something's going down here. And I'm not hanging around long enough to find out what it is. I was halfway to my crib when the girl began to sob.

It didn't take a detective to see she was frightened. Her eyes were bleary, her face pale and drawn, and at some point she had pooped big in her pants. Please, you've got to help me! I got enough problems of my own. Why should I risk my hide to help some dame I barely even know? Because you're the only one who cared! Chapter Five.

I shuffled down the hall trying to figure out why I'd gotten mixed up in this crazy case. Was it just for the Batmans? Or was it something else? There was something about that screwy kid. The world had done it dirty, but somehow it hadn't made her cynical. She still believed in justice. She still believed in hope.

She still believed that objects disappeared when you put a surface in front of them. And then reappeared by magic when you took away that surface. She even believed in me. No one ever had before. I decided to swing by the TV room. Classic grown-up hangout. The kind of after-hours joint

that doesn't get hoppin' till after bedtime. I slipped inside and got to work, opening drawers, taking things out, and then dropping them hard on the ground. It's an old detective tactic, a way to make sure that you touched everything and that everything got everywhere.

I'd gone through most of the cabinets when the door burst open. It was Nana. I spotted a closet and sprinted inside, but it turned out to be a dead end. How about a nap? I shook my head defiantly. If she thought I was going down that easy,

she had another thing coming. How about some yummy medicine? I ate the medicine. I liked to eat things that were yummy, and Nana had used that word when describing the medicine. I smiled as the sweet cherry capsule hit my tongue, but it was quickly followed by a different flavor. The bitter taste of betrayal.

Chapter six. It wasn't the first time I'd been drugged. Still you couldn't help but marvel at the grown-up's depravity. They never did you dirty to your face. No, they preferred to stab you in the back. They said you could skip your vegetables and snuck them in your mashed potatoes. They said you could sleep in their bed. Then they put you in your crib the second you fall asleep.

They said you could have a present and then brought you a potty with a bow on it and told you to poop in it in front of them. Like that's some kind of a gift. I stared at the bars in my crib. The grownups had taken my power and my freedom, but that just meant I had nothing left to lose. Chapter 7.

Where have you been? I looked everywhere, inside a cup, inside a shoe. I can't fit in any of those places. Why not? Because I'm too big. But when you're far away, you look small. Objects look big when they're close to you and small when they're far from you.

Oh, God, what's happening? Nana tried to kill me. She drugged me and left me to die inside my crib. Well, how did you escape? I said Nana up and then Nana came and picked me up. Why did she try to help you after trying to kill you? Why do you think? She's insane. So what do we do? We run. What? Let's run away together what do we do? We run.

What? Let's run away together, somewhere far, far away, where we can make a brand new start. Maybe the dead will never make it. Anything's better than hanging around here like a couple of sitting ducks. Look! She pointed across the room.

Nana was headed for the stairs, carrying a clear plastic bag. It's Mumu. She's in there. Oh, God! Where's Nana taking her? The garage. What's that? It's the car's bedroom where it sleeps. Also, there's a big door that goes up and down and is a monster. You can't go down there, you'll disappear. I won't disappear. Objects are permanent. Even when you can't see them, they are still there. Oh god, I can't lose you too!

You won't. I promise. Chapter 8. I climb down the stairs as silently as possible, while also still counting out loud to myself, because that's the game I do when I climb stairs. myself because that's the game I do when I climb stairs. As my eyes adjusted to the darkness, I realized Nana was not alone. Mama and Dada had returned.

What happened? It's not my fault. It's the damn boss. Why does it have to have so many settings? I was starting to lose the thread, but then I saw something that made my blood run cold. It was Mumu, just where Zoe had said she'd be in the plastic bag.

It was only one problem. She'd been murdered. Her horn had been severed and her hooves ripped clean off her body. Nana had taken a life and now mama was back to run the cover up. I watched with disgust as Dada obediently tossed Mumu's corpse into the trash. Don't worry, she'll never know. I followed the grown-ups up the stairs.

I was almost at the top when I heard a disconcerting sound. Laughter. Look, Mama found Moo Moo. I broke out in a cold sweat as I watched Mama take a new unicorn out of a plastic case. Zoe, Zoe, listen to me. That's not the real Mumu. The real Mumu is dead.

But this looks like Mumu. No, I know, I can't explain it, but you gotta believe me. I saw them bury her body. I saw it with my own damn eyes. But Mama said this was Mumu. She used the word Mumu and poked it at it. I grabbed her by the shoulders. You can't trust Mama.

You can't trust any of them. They're all in on this together. Don't buy into their lies! Easy, sweetie, remember, we play gentle. The grown-ups were closing in on me. I didn't have much time. Zoe, baby, they're gonna nab me any second, but before they do, please, I need to hear you say something. I need to hear you say that you believe me.

I need to hear you say that this isn't Moo Moo. But Mama said it was. Whew. I thought we had something. Something real. I suppose I've been a fool. I'll just take my Batmans and go. Uh oh, looks like someone got into the Hanukkah drawer. I watch with silent rage as Mama snatched the stickers from my hand.

He's going through a phase, sneaking around, getting into everything. He thinks he's a little detective. Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha Something snapped inside my brain. Before I could stop myself, I was lunging at them. Arms flailing and legs kicking. Terrible twos! Ha ha ha ha ha ha! I punched and spat as the grown-ups tried to restrain me. But I was determined not to break this time.

No. This time, I wasn't going down without a fight. How about some yummy medicine? I woke hours later. My mind was so foggy it took me a second to realize I wasn't there alone. Staring up at me from the rug was baby Zoe. What the hell are you doing here? I brought this for you. She slid something to me through the bars of my crib. I couldn't make it out in the darkness, but I could feel. Soft cape, groovy

hooves, fun horn. Oh, don't be crazy, kid. This moomoos all you have. I want us to be square. Besides, it's not like it's the real moomo. What are you saying? I'm saying I believe you. Anyways, see you around. What are you saying? I'm saying I believe you. Anyways, see you around. She started to crawl away.

She was halfway across the very small rug she was on when I said, Wait, hey, hold on now. This case isn't closed. A lot remains unsolved. Like what? We still don't know why Mama and Dada went away this weekend, or where they went, or what they did there. We don't know why they go to work, or what work is, or why they both have glasses.

We don't know their penis and and Dada are their real names. That's a lot to crack. Sure, but I was thinking maybe it'd be easier if we cut a deal. What are you saying? I'm saying partners. You and me. Well, I don't have any experience. You'd have to train me. Won't take long. We can start right now. I handed her a crayon to take notes. Is this food?

Sort of. Okay, I'm completely lost. I don't know where I am and I forgot what time it is. I don't know if I'm awake or if this is a dream and also... I do not understand mirrors. Don't worry kiddo. We'll figure it all out. Together. out together. John Mulaney, Chloe Feynman, Richard Kind and Fred Armisen are the stars of all in comedy about love. But the cast is going to change soon

and start other great people. The show is written by Simon Rich. It runs through February 16th on Broadway, New York City at the Hudson Theater. Coming up, how to get a wild animal that hates your guts to turn the other cheek, especially if it doesn't have cheeks, that's in a minute on Chicago Public Radio when our program continues. This is American Life from Ira Glass. Today on our program, try a little tenderness. We have stories of people putting aside aggressiveness

and anger and disappointment in other human beings and reaching out in kindness instead. We've arrived at Act Two of our program, Act Two, The Gladiator starring Ruffold Crow. Aviva De Kornfeld brings us this story about a person who tried to be considerate and where it got him. This story starts with a little tenderness.

Alan Martin's a real nature lover, spends as much time as possible hiking around the mountains and birdwatching near his home in Vancouver. So it pained him when he had to cut a big tree down in his front yard because he didn't want to disturb any of the animals living in it. But the tree was starting to rot and he was afraid it would fall onto his house. And so, like the sensitive environmental scientist that he is, Alan waited until autumn, when he knew that nesting season was over. And then, just to be extra careful, he brought in an arborist to assess the tree, to make

sure he wouldn't be messing with any little critters homes. He got the okay and hired a couple guys to cut the tree down while he stood by directing them this way and that and then the next morning Alan stepped out of his house and there was this crow sitting in the front lawn and at a close distance to the steps and it's just staring right at me. That's very weird. It was a bit off-putting. I couldn't quite figure it out but I walked down my path and as soon as the crow was out of my sight, that's when I got this thump on the back of my head. Out of the corner of his eye, Alan saw the crow fly past him and he thought, did that

crow just hit me? It hurt. And then I did a few little experiments. I would turn away purposely and walk away and it would leave the power line attending another hit and I would turn around just in time and it would swoop away. And I did this a couple of times. It was just clearly waiting for me to turn away so that it could hit me in the back of the head. Alan thought, OK, maybe this crow didn't live in this tree, but it must have meant something to it. He knew that crows are really smart,

but they're also very vengeful birds and territorial. And so a short while later, when he walked out of his house. I came out and there was a crow sitting on the line, but it was a different crow. How could you tell? It was smaller. It was a bit smaller and it wasn't as bulky. This crow, when I came outside, it caught at me. It was as if it almost recognized me as if, oh, that's the guy. It cawed and then it left. It flew down the block and there's a green space at the end of the street.

And about a minute later, it came back with the enforcer crow. This smaller crow snitching on Alan to the bigger crow. This is a real thing. I ran Alan's story by a crow researcher named Loma Pendergraf. Loma said that if a crow sees something it deems dangerous, it'll sound an alarm to summon other crows. And if they agree there's a threat, they'll dive bomb. This whole routine is called mobbing.

Some people attacked by a murder of crows, they'd be angry. Not Alan, or his family. We felt bad because we'd realized we'd hurt these crows. Hmm. Well, that's a very nice reaction. Yeah, that was initially, but as the harassment persisted over the coming days, it became a source of anxiety just going outside. So the compassion for the crow I would say waned over time a little bit because of that. And my next questions were how long is this going to go on for? Science actually has an answer to this question.

It turns out crows can hold grudges for a very long time. Back in 2006, John Marsleff, who is a professor in wildlife science at the University of Washington, he set up an experiment to test this. He put on this ugly orange ogre mask and walked around an area where he knew crows lived. And then he captured a bunch of the crows while the rest of the flock looked on. Then he released them. The point was to distress the crows, but not hurt them. And then, for the next 17 years,

every time he put on his ogre mask and walked around the place where he first captured the birds, the crows would swarm him. For years, each time he returned, more and more crows would join in. Because crows not only remember their enemies, but pass their grievances onto their crow children and grandchildren. Alan was not aware of all of that. So for weeks, he'd leave his house every day, hoping the birds had finally forgotten about him.

No such luck. So he tried a new tactic. I put on a wig and a beard and the crow was looking hard. You know, it was kind of turning its head a bit side to side. You can tell it was trying to figure out who this was, but it didn't recognize me. Just a PSA, there are other ways to ward off an angry crow, should you not have a wig on hand. You can hide yourself under an umbrella so the crows can't see you.

Or you can wear sunglasses, backwards. Apparently crows understand that sunglasses go on your eyes, and they know that if you can see them, you can potentially hurt them. So they't attack the back of your sunglassed head because they think you have an extra set of eyes back there. Anyway, Alan's disguise it was working perfectly for him. And then I ripped off the beard and the wig and the crow flipped. It flipped out. Really? Did a back flip. What? Ew, it literally flipped out. It just literally kind of flipped back up into the air a little bit, but it was it was completely in shock and extremely pissed off. Like how dare you? It sounds like you're developing a whole kind of relationship with these birds, I must. Yeah, it's a relationship of antagonism, and it's not a rewarding one.

Alan decided he had to make amends with the crows. A real truce. But how do you do that? How do you make things right with a couple of birds? If you could have just sat down with them and I could have apologized and maybe they could have explained why those trees were so important and I could have shown some understanding for them. And maybe we could have worked things out that way. But because we're unable to do that, I just thought food is maybe the next best thing. Food. You know, the tool of every animal trainer that's ever lived.

And so I found this kind of brass gold-colored plate. It was shiny. And so I put some almonds on it and I walked outside with it above my head, kind of holding my arm straight above my head, and I laid it out on the lawn. The crows caught him loudly while he puts the plate down. He goes back inside, and a couple hours later, Alan sees the plate sitting there, empty. The almonds are gone. I did that for another three days.

And then it was on the fourth day, I came outside with the plate, but they weren't calling this time. They seemed more subdued, less aggressive. And I put the plate out, I went back inside, and that was the last time I saw them. I went back inside and that was the last time I saw them. The crow researcher told me that it seemed like since Alan had merely stressed the crows out

and not actually hurt them, it might've been easier for them to forget why they were mad at him in the first place. Alan said the whole thing, having a couple of birds angry at him, kind of hurt his feelings. It's not like he's naive. He knows nature doesn't care about his feelings. It's just that he loves nature so much, and his intentions were good.

He can't help but feel like it would have been nice if the crows had shown a little tenderness towards him. I've even a cornfield is producer of our program. Act three, you'll spank me later for this. So in this show today about tenderness, we turn now to comedian Josh Johnson, who's been thinking a lot lately about when tenderness is called for and when the opposite of tenderness may actually be the right way to go. Okay. This is like, this is like contentious thing.

So just just stick with me for a second. Because it's weird that people are weird about. OK. So my friends are having kids, right? A lot of them are starting to have kids. So they're all having the conversation about if they're going to spank their kids. And people have very strong feelings either way.

Some people think, oh, if you know, if it's rare, and it's warranted, then like a spanking here and there is not that bad. And then some people are like, no, this is like, this is full on abuse. This is like you're creating trauma and everything. And I'm not even telling anybody how to feel. Like I know that I was spanked when I was a kid, right?

And it made sense that I was spanked because we were poor. Do you understand what I mean? Like there was nothing to take away. You know, like there was a year that my mom and I shared a bedroom when I was when I was a little kid. What was she gonna take away?

The floor? It's like, rest of the month you float from now on. And if I catch you not floating, that's your ass, all right? Do you see what I mean? Because I was in a very weird position at one point, because I didn't have much money, but I got a scholarship, and my family pulled their money together to make the ends meet for me to go to this Catholic school,

right? So I was a kid with no money, going to school with kids with real money. Like, like... Like money where they don't need to read. You know what I'm talking about? You know that proper money that you can't mess up? You know that old money?

And so, you know, I remember, it was one time, we were, we were sitting around lunch table, and, and this one kid, I said something about my mom, you know, like spanking me for something, and we were still in junior high or whatever. So I was talking about a time from before, you know? And then this other kid was like, oh, don't worry about it, y'all, you know,

my dad still spanks me, right? And I was like, ooh. Um. Tyler, you have a pool, that's abuse. I feel like no matter your feelings on spanking, we've all met like a grown man that deserved to have their ass beat. And I think the thing for me, the thing for me is that when, when could it have happened earlier?

And I want to be clear here, I'm not blanketing, cosigning anything. I'm asking questions genuinely. I'm asking questions because people are very split on it. You know what I mean? But once again, we've all met a dude who like, damn, he really probably had it coming sooner than today. But then how do you, how do you gauge that? You know? Because I get what some people are saying.

Some people are like, look, we're all individuals, so even though you have your kids and your kids have a part of you in them, they're still going to be different people. So then how do you make sure that this kid doesn't walk away with the worst lesson possible, the worst feeling possible from this thing that like worked out for you, but it might not work out for them. That's a scary thing, you know? Like, okay, I used to be like very nervous about moving to New York.

I moved to New York years ago, and I remember when I got to Brooklyn, I saw a fight when I got there. And these were two kind of big guys. One guy was medium size, bigger-sized, bigger than me, and he was muscular. And he looked like he knew how to fight because he did all the stances.

He knew where to put his shoulders, where to put his fists, he could kick. He's either trained MMA in boxing or he's watched all the movies. Like, this guy... this guy really knows how to move, right? And then the big guy was just a big guy. Like, he was that, you know that type of big

where you can't tell if it's fat or muscle? You just know it's in the way, right? You know that he can move things where he wants them to go. Just a big guy, right? And I don't know exactly what they were fighting about, but it felt like one of those fights... It felt like one of those fights where they really wanted to fight their dad.

Yeah. Have you ever been... Okay, have you ever been in a bar and then you see a fight, like, you can smell it brewing, and then you're also like, I think if you see a fight, like you can smell it brewing. And then you're also like, I think if you would like punch your dad years ago, none of this would be happening right now. Like you just had one good row with him, this would be a quiet evening, right?

And they were going at each other, and some of it was punching, some of it was kicking. Now the guy that was on the bigger side and muscular, he really knew his way around. He was even doing the hop of someone who knows how to fight. You know that little light foot hop where you're like, they're about to get into it? Okay. And then there was one moment, because I walked out of this bar because I was doing a show, like a bar show with my friends, and then we were all walking out

and we all saw this happening. It was started on the sidewalk and it spilled into the street. And basically, he's doing the hops, and then he goes for a lunch. He goes for this big punch, right? And when he goes for the big punch, the big dude moves out of the way

and grabs his wrist. And they both look at it. They both look at it like... He grabs his wrist and looks at it, and then he looks at it like, uh-oh. And... And then... And then he grabs his wrist, and with his other hand,

he grabs the back of the dude's belt, right? Pulls him forward, knocks the guy pretty much off balance, lets go of the wrist, passes the belt to his other hand, lifts him up and then spanked him in public. And like... I had never seen somebody with a beer get spanked before. And he's really like floating and everything. And this guy is like letting them have it, right? Like one after the other.

This dude spanked him so much, he took a break. There was one point where he was holding him suspended in the air by his belt, but also like... Whoo. And then after like the 36 lick, let's go to the belt. Dude drops to the ground. He gets up and he sort of limps off. A lot of expletives and stuff, but it's kind of done.

And this guy goes back into the bar we were just in, because he wasn't watching the show. The show was in like a back room. This guy was just in the bar. And I had no idea like what the fight was about, because once again, we had already walked out and it was already happening. But he walked back in, and I'm like... I'm a curious duck, you know what I mean? Like...

So I go back in after him, and I'm like, hey, man, are you okay? Which is a weird thing to ask him, but... It's like, are you okay? What was all that about? And then he turns to me and goes, I look like a lot of dudes' dads. Because dude was like 30, and he looked like he could be a dad, right? And so he's like, no, I just look like a lot of dudes' dads.

And I was like, wow, how did you find that out? And he was like, oh yeah, you know, after the fourth or fifth fight, you just start to put things together. And he told me, he told me that sometimes he goes to the bar with his friends and you know, he's like, after a while I can just tell tell some guy starts looking at me, and then he comes and he starts jawing at me, and I can tell it's not about me, because I was just sitting here.

I wasn't doing anything. And then he wants to fight, and he either swings at me first, or he says, let's go outside, but this happens pretty often. And I was like, wow, are you a dad though? And he was like, yeah. I was like, do you spank your kid?

He was like, oh no, no, I would never. ["Jos Johnson Comedy Theme Song"] ["Jos Johnson Comedy Theme Song"] Josh Johnson. Check out his YouTube channel, Jos Johnson Comedy. Tour dates, videos, and albums are at joshjohnsoncomedy.com. Act four, the Feels on the Bus. There are, of course, so many people who believe that being tender-hearted is not a good way to live

in this tough and unforgiving world. For some people, it's a matter of principle. They think it works out better for everybody that way. Eckhart Carrette has this short story about someone like that. This is a story about a bus driver who would never open the door of the bus for people who were late.

Not for anyone. Not for repressed high school kids who'd run alongside the bus and stare at it longingly. And not for high-strung people in windbreakers who'd bang on the door as if they were actually on time and it was the driver who was out of line. And not even for little old ladies with brown paper bags full of groceries who struggled to flag him down with trembling hands.

And it wasn't because he was mean that he didn't open the door, because this driver didn't have a mean bone in his body. It was a matter of ideology. The driver's ideology said that even if the delay caused by opening the door for someone who came late was just under 30 seconds, and even if not opening the door meant that this person would wind up losing 15 minutes of his life, it would still be more fair to society to not open the door, because the 30 seconds would be lost by every single passenger on the bus and if there were say 60 people on the bus who hadn't done anything

wrong and had all arrived to the bus stop on time then together they'd be losing half an hour which is double 15 minutes hour which is double 15 minutes. This was the only reason why it never opened the door. He knew that the passengers hadn't the slightest idea what his reason was and that the people running after the bus and signaling him to stop had no idea either. He also knew that most of them thought he was just an ass**** and that personally it would have been much much easier for him to let them on and

receive their smiles and thanks. Except that when it came to choosing between smiles and thanks on the one hand and the good of society on the other, this driver knew what it had to be. had to be. The person who should have suffered the most from the driver's ideology was named Eddie. But unlike the other people in this story, he wouldn't even try to run for the bus. That's how lazy and out of it he was. Now Eddie was assistant cook at a restaurant called The Steakout, which was the best pan that the stupid owner of this place could come up with.

The food there was nothing to write home about, but Eddie himself was a really nice guy. So nice that sometimes when something he made didn't come out too great, he'd serve it to the table himself and apologize. It was during one of these apologies that he met happiness, or at least a shot at happiness, in the form of a girl that was so sweet that she tried to finish the entire portion of roast beef he brought her, just so he wouldn't feel bad. And this girl didn't want to tell him her name or give him her phone number, but she was sweet enough to agree to meet him the next day at 5, at a spot they decided on together, at a Dolphinarium, to be exact.

Now Eddie had this condition, one that had already caused him to miss out on all sorts of things in life. It wasn't one of those conditions where your adenoids get all swollen or anything like that, but still, it had already caused him a lot of damage. This sickness always made him oversleep, by 10 minutes, and no alarm clock did any good. That was why he was always late for work at the stakeout. That and our bus driver, the one who always chose the good of society over smiles and thanks.

Except that this time, since happiness was at stake, Eddie decided to beat the condition and instead of taking an afternoon nap nap he stayed awake and watched television. Just to be on the safe side he even lined up not one but three alarm clocks and ordered a wake up call to boot. But this sickness was insurable and Eddie fell asleep like a baby watching the kiddie channel. watching the kiddie channel. He woke up in a sweat to the screeching of a trillion million alarm clocks. Ten minutes too late. Rushed out of the house without stopping to change and ran toward the bus stop.

He barely remembered how to run anymore and his feet fumbled a bit every time they left the sidewalk. The last time he ran was before he discovered he could cut gym class, which was about in the 6th grade. Except that unlike in those gym classes, this time he ran like crazy, because now he had something to lose. And all the pain in his chest and his lucky strike wheezing weren't going to get in the way of his pursuit of happiness.

Nothing was going to get in his way, except our bus driver, who had just closed the door and was beginning to pull away. The driver saw Eddie in the rearview mirror, but as we've already explained, he had an ideology that more than anything relied on love of justice and on simple arithmetic, except that Eddie didn't care about the driver's arithmetic. For the first time in his life, he really wanted to get somewhere on time. And that's why he went right on chasing the bus, even though he didn't have a chance.

chance. At the end, Eddie's luck turned. But only halfway, 100 yards past the bus stop, there was a traffic light, and just a second before the bus reached it, the traffic light turned red. Eddie managed to catch up with the bus and to drag himself all the way to the driver's door. He didn't even bang on the glass he was so weak. He just looked at the driver with moist eyes and fell to his knees panting and wheezing. And this reminded the driver of something. Something from out of the past. From a time before he wanted to become a bus driver. something from out of the past, from a time before he wanted to become a bus driver,

when he still wanted to become God. It was kind of a sad memory because the driver didn't become God at the end, but it was a happy one too, because he became a bus driver, which was his second choice. And suddenly the driver remembered how he once promised himself that if he became God in the end, he'd be merciful and kind, and would listen to all his creatures. So when he saw Eddie from way up in his driver's seat kneeling on the asphalt, he simply couldn't go through with it. And in spite of all his ideology and his simple arithmetic, And in spite of all his ideology and his simple arithmetic, he opened the door and Eddie got on and didn't even say thank you. He was so out of breath. Okay, maybe the best thing would be to stop listening right now. Because even though Eddie did get to the Dauphinarium one time, happiness didn't come.

Because happiness already had a boyfriend. It's just she was so sweet that she couldn't bring herself to tell Eddie, so she preferred to stand him up. Eddie waited for her on the bench they'd agreed on for almost two hours. While he sat there, he kept thinking all sorts of depressing thoughts about his life. And while he was at it, he watched the sunset, which was a pretty good one, and thought about how cramped his legs were going to be later on. When he was really desperate to get home, he saw his bus in the distance, pulling in at the bus stop

and letting off passengers. And he knew that even if he'd had the strength to run, he'd never catch up with it anyway. So he just kept on walking slowly, feeling about a million tired muscles with every step. And when he finally reached the bus stop, he saw that the bus was still there, waiting for him. And even though the passengers were shouting and grumbling to get a move on, the driver waited for Eddy and he didn't touch the accelerator till Eddy was seated. And when they started moving, he looked in the rear view mirror and gave Eddy a sad wink, which somehow made the whole thing almost burble. If you want to get a short story in your email from Edgar once a week, you can sign up for

that at his sub stack at Edgar Carrot. That's Carrot, K-E-R-E-T dot sub stack dot com. She may be wary, women do get wary, wearing that same old shabby dress. When she gets wary, try a little tenderness. She may be wary, women do get wary, Kondaraja and Henry Larson. The people put together today's show include Jindayi Bonds, Angela Gervasi, Tobin Lohs, Don Nelson, Nadia Raymond, Anthony Roman, Ryan Rumory, Frances Swanson, Christopher Sotala, Matt Tierney and Julie Whitaker. Our managing editor, Sara Abdur-Rabin, our senior editors, David Kestenbaum, our executive editor is Emanuel Barry.

Special thanks today to the team at All In on Broadway, Director Alex Timbers, producers Micah Frank and Greg Noble, also Scott Rowan and Alison Ebling, Wagner-Johnson Productions, O&M, and everybody else at the Hudson Theater. Also thanks today to Emily Woodbury and Grefin Dunn. This American Life is delivered to public radio stations

by PRX, the Public Radio Exchange, to become a This American Life partner, which gives you bonus content, ad-free listening, and hundreds of our favorite episodes of the show that'll show up right in your podcast feed. Go to thisamericanlife.org slash life partners. It's a great deal, it helps us out. That link is also in the show notes.

Thanks this week to life partners, Stacy Dixon, Dan Evans III, Matthew Ratz, Sarah Reen, Elon Saratowski, and Joe Thorne. Thanks as always to our program's co-founder, Mr. Tory Malatya. You know, he's been throwing out all of his old CDs, every single one, but he is such a Bono fan. He looks at the package, Joshua Tree, Octon Baby, and screams. Oh, God, I can't lose you, too! I'm Her Glass. Back next week, more stories of this American life. Try a little tindernail.

Oh, man, you've got to do the things that you want to do. You've got to love me, squeeze me, tease me, please me. You've got to, got to, gotta, now, now, now You gotta try a little tingly Oh man, you gotta do the things that you wanna do You gotta love me, squeeze me, tease me, tease me Talk it to me, whoop it on me, put it to me Try a little tingly You gotta do the things that you wanna do.

You gotta love me, please me, please. Next week on the podcast of This American Life. Seduna's 29, never had a boyfriend, and she has a theory about why. Then she meets somebody who tells her she doesn't know what she's talking about. She needs to rethink the entire thing from the ground up. What she tells her, and can you change your whole life in one conversation?

We find out next week on the podcast on your local public radio station. Public Radio Station.