THIS CAR POD! with Doug DeMuro & Friends! - The $30,000 Fun Sports Car Era is Over. Has China Already Won the Future of Cars? Ferrari V8s Ranked!

Episode Date: February 21, 2025

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And welcome to this car pop. I'm Kenan. I'm Philippo. And it's time for the news. Let's start with Dodge. Yes. Dodge's CEO said in an interview last week that he thought there was a market for an entry-level sub-30k-ish sports car. He also said there was a market for a high-end sports car by Dodge.

Right. Which we all could understand what that would be. Yeah. But cheap Dodge sports car. Yeah, I was surprised to see this. It was not a, this isn't like a publicly announced thing. It was in an interview and he was like, oh, I could see a market for it. I can't.

I think that Stalantis, though, is in a situation where they're kind of out from under old leadership and new leadership is trying to either win back old people or make a wave, make a splash. You know how a kid home alone for the first time just eat ice cream? The boring accountant parents are gone. The parents are gone. You want V8s again and you want. And last, you're... that they said V8s are coming back, and today we're reporting this.

There is a market. By the way, this is a concept car from Dodge 2007 Dodge Demon. I think this could come today. And you know who would buy it? No one. There's kind of a market. Mazda has created a market. But the Miata has 35 years of reputation.

It has tremendous dynamics, which I'm not sure Chrysler. And even then, the Miata sales are not what they used to be. And this current generation Miata has been on. for 10 years. Excellent point. Without a redesign because it's probably not cost effective to redesign. Every other sports car that comes out is paired up. Yeah.

You know, the BRZ and the FRS and the, et cetera, et cetera, the Supra and the... Right. And the next Supera will apparently be a collaboration with Mazda, apparently. Oh. They should call Dodge. I hear Dodges looking for a partner. They should call dogs. I get why they're saying some of these things, right?

If you see how you want to rebuild your brand with enthusiasts, especially because they're through the publications that are covering you as a brand that only sells chargers. And so you want to kind of throw them a bone here and there. I also see why it could be successful, not in sales, but in imaging, maybe. But who buys that? It won't. That's the thing. It just wouldn't.

Who want the Solis and the sky that didn't sell well? No. I want Belize to build one sports car, and you alluded to it before. It has a V-10 and a manual, and it's named after another snake. That's what I want them to build. They tried, you know, and they tried. You know, they had that car, and then they canceled it, and then they brought it back, and that second time they tried to do it. It didn't do well.

And so I have a hard time believing, honestly, in this day and age, that a man, like a sports car at this price point is like a really a big, I would like it'd be cool. I don't see the FRS as like a massive seller, whatever it's called now. You know what it sounds like to me? A great used car. That's what it sounds like. It doesn't sound like something that enthusiasts will want to buy new necessarily. Well, at that price point, I think it would, but I honestly have a hard time believing they could really actually hit that price point. and still be profitable and still selling any sort of volume.

I mean, this is a, you know, this is a company that's not exactly doing the best. Remember the Crossfire? We have a Crossfire parked behind the X-3. Yeah, the Crossfire was relatively successful. The price point was considerably high. Relatively successful? They sold few? No, they sold a ton.

I wrote it down. They sold like $100,000 or $200,000. All right, well, never mind. Remember it was a global car. What? They sold them in Europe. Every single part of the Senate. It's gotten more insane.

No, they sold the Crossfire globally. It was a global car. They were sold in Europe and everywhere else. So could this then? 76,000 crossfires over a decade? Over five years. Wow. Pretty good.

So maybe there is a market. They're a right-hand drive crossfires. Some would argue that what Dodds should build. They're right-hand drive SRT-6 crossfires. Oh, wow. But only 284 of them. Some would argue the Dodge should build, I don't know. Any cars?

Any SUVs? Anything? It would make more sense to platform share and try to figure out better ways to do this. I'll take those. Maybe even merge with Mercedes-Benz. Okay, give us our next news. Anyway, this is possible. We'll see what happens.

I have a hard time believing it. As do I. Next story, Camaro, Chevy Camero. An affordable small car. GM authority, which is a authority on GM products, as it were. Reported, and I was reading between the lines on their reporting. The reporting is that the next generation Camero is badly beaten but not dead. However, when I read the quotes in the article, it sounds like it's dead.

Their contract with the factory workers requires and build a car in Canada, it doesn't sound like it's going to, they see a business case for the next generation. They have said that this generation, they have either said or leaked that this generation hasn't necessarily sold like they were hoping it would. We already are hearing Mustang sales are not really great. We heard yesterday Z sales are not really great.

And amazing Dodgers sitting here going, yeah. Maybe we'll do two sports cars. Once again, FCA. Maybe not the best business decisions. Shame, it'd be a shame if it goes away. The Mustang became an electric crossover. Perhaps the Camero will meet a similar fate. Would it be

a shame if it left. Maybe not. I mean, the Camaro has, they've given us a great run with the current Camaro, which has been redesigned, but the same basic shape since it came out in 2009. And that was a great period. Like, 09 to now has been several amazing Camero models, some amazing high performance versions, fantastic power trains. Zero 1-1-E is one of the most impressive cars. There have been some great cars to come out of this Camero lineup. And if the market doesn't want it right now, maybe it goes away, and maybe it comes back at some point in the future like the Z always did. Be sad, but it wouldn't surprise me at all. Are we worried about what's going to happen to the, like,

enthusiastious class at Hertz or at Enterprise or at any rental car center? Because right now it's Mustangs and Camaros exclusively. What is the problem? What do they go to? Maki. I'm still a Mustang. Sir, you get a Mustang. Brilliant.

Yeah. You love that. You love leaning into that Mustang Maki controversy. Maybe they'll rent out dollars a $30,000, an enthusiast car. No. Right. That's what it would be. Anyway, so we'll see on next-gen-Kamaro, but I am not holding my breath on sports cars.

It's actually funny because in the last couple of pods, we've talked about how the EV is kind of not really as certain as it once was, and gas cars are making a comeback, and V8s are making a comeback. But the gas cars that are sticking around aren't the ones we necessarily want. No. That's an interesting prediction. The second-gen-comer came out in 15. Yeah, but the redesigned retro one came out in 2009. But that's what I was saying. 10 years.

Yeah, they got a long life out of it. Yeah. But I don't think a redesign would help. It's definitely time to think about the next thing, although the Challenger did well, and it came out to 08. Here's a question. Why did they never do a convertible challenger? I don't know.

I've seen the conversions, and they look. The conversions look good. They did convertibles back in the day. It was obvious. Ford and Chevy both had convertibles of their cars. The car then was in production for 16 years. It's not like they couldn't have made the money. You know why?

Because it's a purest precision. They didn't want the extra weight. The weight and the rigidity issue. That's right. structural rigidity. All right. Give us the next news story, please. Ooh, Volkswagen.

Ah, yes. So Volkswagen and Audi both have said that, like a lot of manufacturers we've discussed recently, they are going to be sticking with gasoline-powered cars. Kelle Suprize. But what does that mean? So it means that they're not, they will be doing EVs, but they're kind of pushing a lot of that development down the road to release those models. They saw sales decreases of two points.

Volkswagen saw sales decreases of 2.7% last year. Audi was even more sharp. They declined by 7.8%. So they're feeling it too that people just aren't buying their electric cars. I don't have any cars. I remember when the federal government as a penalty made Volkswagen to make electric cars? Yep. Yep.

And electrified. My the turntables. Because they killed people. And then the government said, all right, you got to make electric cars now. That's how I remember it. That's what's about it. That's pretty much how it went. But to get around, basically what they're doing is they're going to be investing more money into

facelifts of current models that exist. They're not going to be developing new internal combustion models necessarily. but they're going to kind of push this down the road a little bit and see what happens. It sounds like more of a wait-and-see plan than a we're sure what's going to happen. And I think that... That's probably the right idea. I think that is the right idea, I suspect. Because, I mean, when Lamborghini pushed it, they said they're going to...

They pushed it down the road, but they did push it down the road. They know that's where it's going, but I think that... And we all know that's coming. This is an 93? Yeah. What a cool car. Here's the thing. That is cool.

Driving around Europe last summer, you see trillions of ID3s, some ID-4s. A bunch of ID buzzes, short ones, all with German plates. But nonetheless, like, they've had success. This is a case where, Europe, which is where their base, has adopted these cars pretty nicely nicely. But nowhere else has. And in the U.S., they only sold the 84 and IDBuzz. They said they're not bringing the ID7 here. Asia doesn't buy these?

Or not Volkswagen. Maybe through some joint partnership. You know, I got to tell you, one of the comments we always get, we always get incredibly nasty comments whenever we talk about electric cars that were, don't they get that electric cars or they suck and we want gas? Nah. Let the economy sort it out. let capitalism sort it out is what they often say.

If capitalism were to sort this out, China would win. China would just straight win. If we want China to win, then we go out trying to win. I mean, that's how we want it to be. I don't know. In my America, we try to win. I'm serious. Like, I'm not trying to be Trump, but like in my America, we win. In my America?

The America that I've known and that I've seen over the last 200 years, like you try to win. You try to be at the forefront of technology and everything else. Man, 200 years? Christ, you look good for 200 years. Heck yeah. Yeah. But the point I'm making is like, if we let capitalism sort this out, China wins this game. All these automakers, and by the way, isn't ID4 is built in the States, right? The 84 is built in the...

All these automakers are pulling out of these, pulling back on these EVs. If that's the way we want to go, then that's the way we want to go. But the Chinese EVs, I've driven them. They're way ahead. They're way cheaper. And China's going to walk around and start selling these cars in the other markets and start gobbling up market share and all those places, too. And pretty soon our auto industry is going to be Ford selling cars to Americans.

Can we talk about how beautiful this photo is? There's 2.83s. You're not going to take this. There are no other electric cards in this shot. He's afraid of them. There's no other electric card in this shot whatsoever except for these two, which is fascinating. People just further listening. They're going to go from an EA triple eight to an EA4 quadruple eight that just keep going with their engine name instruction.

That's all he wants to. That's all I want to talk about. I'm not wrong about this. No, you're not wrong about this. Come on. Admit that, admit that there's an interesting story there, which is that if we continue to pull back on EVs, which is what's happening. and if we don't incentivize EVs, which might be the right move, it's certainly what the consumers seem to want right now.

But if we do that, China is not in that situation, and they are making these cars better and selling them better. And every week we report on a new automaker that is pushing back their EVs. I think the other thing that often gets missed in this is that we have over the years, the U.S. and Europe and other countries have heavily incentivized a lot of different things that we have kind of forgotten. The reason that diesels were so big in Europe is that diesel was heavily subsidized. or incentivized, right?

They were incentives to manufacturers building them. Diesel was a little bit subsidized by the U.S. government or by the European government. But for many years, those were successful products that European companies built. But with some benefits. And when they were first starting, I'm quite confident the U.S. government subsidized cars by building highways. There's a lot of things where we kind of accepted, accept it in retrospect. Now we're having that conversation with EVs and looking back at it, will we think if we keep going down that road of subsidizing them, I think we'll just view that as normal

because it kind of is in the bigger scheme. Right. It's an interesting question. If we don't, then EVs will probably walk away because Americans are not particularly interested in without subsidies. Maybe. Technology advances. You go to Mexico. You go to Latin America.

The Chinese cars are already there. They're already selling them there. They're going to continue to. You go to southern Europe. They're already there. Technology advances, though, on electric motors, on batteries. And that will also make it effect. Yeah, but the question is, when we eventually adopt it when we have to, will China have already succeeded.

Do you know what I'm saying? And they will have charging stations and better technology. And yes, 100%. And that's the fear. That's the fear with walking this back. That's the fear with the government walking it back. And that's why we can't just necessarily just let capitalism sort it out when we have the conversation because capitalism may sort it out in a way that is not favorable for us.

And our government has the, this isn't pure capitalism. Our government has the ability to kind of put their finger on the scales of what actually succeeded. This is not where I thought this conversation would go. I'm surprised to hear myself saying this too. But I've been thinking about this more and more over the last few weeks. And when you hear about what I drive these Chinese cars. I'm astonished.

They shouldn't have sent them to us. Now we know how good they are. Now we're like, crap, we got to catch up. Maybe there go. I mean, Ford CEO a few months ago had an interview where he said that he drove the Xiaomi SU7. He's been driving it around. And it's like, better than what we're building.

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Speaking of EVs, this is the BMW Neue class A-Fao or EV. What's interesting about this is that there is a... Is it the trunk lid? Because, yeah. There's a video that kit now. It's got a horn. They proposed this shape earlier. This is not the first time we've seen it.

But now it moves. It has actual engineering that has been done to make it a functional car. A car is shown by a real manufacturer eventually gets built. Maybe not. But the thing is, people are saying that this will become the new M3. That's what a lot of people are saying. That's what rumors are heavily circulating. But there is a video that came out of it driving, which you get to see these wheels in action, which are very cool.

They put a lot of effort into the regenerative braking. Oh, wow. It's a lot smoother. It's, yeah, it's something. But the big thing was they made the wheels light up, which is ridiculous. I had the new M5 last week, and people complained so much. BMW has embraced technology more than any other legacy automaker. It's so amazing.

They've got everything tech. You know the climate vents in order to make them a full blow or not blow, you have little screens that you tap? Each fan has a screen. And people look at BMW like that, enthusiast, the people who have E90s, are like, for BMW, screw those. People that have tried to tell their mother how to open a vent. But what BMW is saying is, our customer base has always been young people who get it, and it still is.

That's why they went for headlights to look like Kia Optima from two generations. Our producer said this and I kind of agree, which is more annoying this or a Burble to my wife, rather have this than Burble. The wheels are bad, but like maybe this is the future. I don't know, but I know BMW's leading us there. We got a new X3 behind us right now. That's leading us into the future. But I just took that to the DMV and let me tell you something it looked like.

the future in that parking lot. Yeah. A lot of Honda Odyssey's with three-year-old expired plates up there. Heavy body day. Once had to take my 355 to that DMV to register. The one in Claremont? Yeah. Boy, it was quite a sight there.

There were a lot of people very interested in that. I bet some cool stuff shows up at the DMV if you, if you, like, waited long enough. Right now, when you look, when you see a grill lit up at night, yeah, as the current BMWs do as every Mercedes seems to now with the star. Yeah. As I saw, like, a Lexus have yesterday. Yeah. What do you think?

I go every time. And when you see a wheel like that, drive it around, what do you say? I think that they're making fun of their customers. It seems like they're making fun of their customers. It seems like, oh, you're a lease shopper who's trying to, oh, how about this for you? How about this little carnival ride? People thought that even when Audi did the headlights, like on the R8, they thought that was tacky. I don't think anybody ever thought that was.

Well, people thought that. Regardless, this is a bit much for me to start. It won't come to production, of course. Give us our last news story. Really, not a production car. The wheels. The world. The U.S. won't allow laser headlights.

You think they're going to start allowing wheel lights? I don't think they have any dictation on the wheel. The U.S. allows laser headlights. They don't allow the auto high beams. They have to either be on or off. They can't choose. Do they allow laser headlights? Yeah, there were BMWs with laser headlights.

But they stopped offering it because they decided it wasn't cost effective. Because you can do the cool things. Well, you can do the cool things, but it's more expensive and it doesn't really benefit. What the U.S. doesn't allow, the greatest feature I ever seen in my life, I drove a Mercedes in Italy like this. You get the high beams on. It turns on the high beams, but then a car is coming, and instead of turning them off,

it blocks out the high beam only where that car is in the beam sweep. So you still get the full effect of the high beams, but the driver's coming from where you isn't, it's incredible. It's obviously safer, but our regulations are far behind. Disappointingly. Thankfully, we- dive into that political point that he's making there.

Everything's fine. We got to delete, what does Trump say about regular? I don't know. We got to, this though, I think, is going to come. I wouldn't be surprised, to be honest with you. But to be clear, there's a lot more to it than this. They've done a lot of work in terms of... Through the real engineering, this car creates an incredible amount of downforce.

It's 2,645 pounds of down force. That's different, the pounds of downforce? Maybe that's why it has the more on the bat. I understand what... That is why it has that, which also has a lot of vents through it and stuff. It's pretty... Why do they have four people in this car? Sorry?

Why do they have four people in this car? Because it's a four-seater-cress. Four doors. We were trying to show that off. Yes, that right. Yes, you see, we put four people in this in the Neuze. It's a very impressive car. It makes 13,000 foot pounds of torque.

They did claim that, by the way. They said 18,000 Newton meters to put to the road, which we looked into, it's some gearing technicality where they say it's 18,000 newt meters. Multiply the gear of the electric motors by the, I don't remember. And like the number of wheels, maybe because they feel the wheel has a motor. Because I'll tell you what, that equates to 13, 276 foot pounds of torque. Sure. Doesn't seem realistic to me.

But nonetheless, if this does become what the M3 will be, I still don't know because BMW did say they want to make six cylinders and eight-cylinder engines still. Who knows? This might be an M3, but an electric version of an I-M-3. I-3M, something like that. I think it looks cool. They keep showing it to us, so they're going to do it. Yeah, I'm kind of into, to be honest, just the wheels are a bit much.

I-3M. Give us the-3-M. As he works this out, give us the next news story. Ah, yes, you go. Here's some very excited people around a U-Go. I go? No. Everybody needs a Ugo.

Ugo. Noted Eastern European car company that failed is apparently going to come back and build a new car. That was the report

this week. We looked into it and it seemed like a guy drew one. A guy from Serbia, I believe, drew one. It looks great. It looks like a combination

like a GTI and an Ionic 5 and a old Ugo. No real production plans. The description was such a dude got an interview and said, I want to do these things.

I want to do it. I'm going to draw a Hugo for you. It's a new car now. Right. Headline is, Hugo is coming back. Reality is man draws car on paper wishes he had a factor. Although apparently they're going to do a tour. And engineering.

Yeah. They're going to do a tour of the world in the old Ugo. So somehow advertised the new Ugo. I saw that. Good luck. All right. Let's move on to our talk cars segment, which of course is sponsored by Felipe.

Of course, personally. Philippo. An employee of cars. Cleop. Avoiding politics at all costs. Okay. Let's talk about the Lake Tahoe Stratto. Can you pull it up, please?

Yes. You know what I'm talking about, right? I do. This week, every person that I've ever met sent me a picture of this. There was a Lamborghini Storado in Lake Tahoe. Go to images. Oh, there it is. There it is.

Darcy blows. There was a, some guy got a bad photo of a Storado that had clearly slid off in Lake Tahoe. I don't even know that it stuck, but that was the implication. Yes. And everybody posted it everywhere, and it was a big deal. And I got sent this picture by everybody being like, I can't believe people. People are taking a Lambo to Lake Tahoe. And I had to be like...

Folks. Folks. That's what it's for. This is a off-road car. And you know what happened? Every time I literally 10 people who I barely speak to in my entire 10 people sent me this. Really? Said this.

I replied and was like, that's an off-road version. And like nine of them didn't reply after that. They were like, they must have been like, he's clearly an idiot. Like, it's not an off-road car. But it is, people. We're on, no, you're the idiot. My friend is great. My friend Ben, who lives in New Hampshire, sent me a picture of a strato in the snow.

And this came out the next day and went, that's nothing. Look at this. The Sterato can handle that. In fact, I'm not even entirely convinced that it stuck here. The implication was that it was stuck. And it might be, but there's also a cross trek sitting in front of it that's off the road. And an 18 wheeler. Yeah, that's more likely to get stuck.

Yeah, that right. I think it'll be fun. My point is, the Sterato is built for this. more built for it than a LMO two. But it is hard to explain this to regular people. People see an orange Lambo, and the Storado is such a weird car. That's why it's cool. That's why it's the cool hurricane.

No, I've got a Lambo, but it's for off-roading. What do you mean? For off-roading. What are you talking about? What do you mean for off-roading? It's got seven inches of ground fares. What do you got? Personally, zero.

You walk right on a group. That is two inches more-ish than my fish wagon has, but. Is that true? Think about that. Five-something, five-point-four. But less than an outback. I can answer you. The point is,

so. This poor Sterado is now shamed everywhere, even though it, it's what it's for. I would have taken my Cerrado to the, I probably would put chains on it or true winter tires. Maybe it has them. Well,

chains. Do you think they have like a rating for chains for how fast you can go? There are parts of Lake Tahoe where they require chains. Yeah. Oh, because studs, it can't have stuff. You could probably do,

if you had metal studs, they'd probably allow that. Maybe winter tires, but there are, there are snowy roads in Lake Tahoe. There is still to this day require chains. Yep. I would put, let's put chains on them.

No big deal. That looks so cool in the snow. Imagine driving that around. Man, but also, kudos to this person for actually using it. I feel bad they have to suffer the embarrassment of seemingly being stuck in all over the internet. But good for them for actually driving the things in them. I'm so sad that they got shamed when they did what they were supposed to. Honestly, screw it.

You got stuck, fine. Get out of it. Keep going. That's what it's for. It's a light card they can push. Yeah. It is a light card. That's right.

Okay. Give us our next talk car segment, Felipe. All right. A few weeks ago, a month ago, yeah, my station wagon got hit while it was part that said in my house. Okay, and I see, okay, I'm worried about where this is going to go. It got fixed at a good body shop. They've been generally good.

Generally good. I went to pick it up. My wife offered to go pick it up. I was like, no, I have a feeling I'm going to be a little thicker than you are. And there are a few things that I'm not happy with that they're very kindly going to fix. There's a color match issue. No, the color match is actually okay. But there's a few finishing things where I'm just unhappy with how it looks.

There's some. And there's some panels that didn't land. Some trims. There's like a body, like a side skirt that got broken in the process that they're going to. But you, this car has been hit multiple times under your ownership. Twice ever. Both of them are my ownership, yes. And it's worth maybe $15,000.

Right. What do you? But like. Every day he turns more into me. What do you picky about? Tell us specifically. That's the debate. Like, what is specific?

Do you pictures? I don't have pictures with it. There's a side skirt that got broken in the process. There's a few spots for the bumper. They need to redo the liner to actually hook it up correctly. It's a little bit mismounted. All things that don't really matter on a $115,000 mile, $15,000 car that gets driven every day. Right.

At the same time, here are components that are all replaced and repainted by a very professional body shop. And so my expectations are high-ish because they're doing the work that they should do it well. I don't- Are my standards unreasonable? No, but- But like a little bit. When it cuts, cars that age, like, what do you, now it's gone again? You got another two weeks?

No, I mean, they're going to do it all in one day, a couple weeks. Sure. A couple of weeks. But I, and I will say, I want to be very clear, it was quite a nice conversation where I said, hey, like, I know that these don't really matter. But what can we do? So let me ask you a quick. Now, it's been gone for a while. Yeah.

Does that mean you're thinking of maybe it permanently being gone out of your life for a while? We were driving it all week because I had family visiting and we were going six people in the car because it's done made for that. got seven seats, seven seat belts. You're where rental cars exist. And I like the wagon, but yeah, the more I drive our GTI, which is basically a new car, the more it becomes very evident that that station wagon is 11 years old and has done 150,000 miles. Yeah, that's. And so now, yeah.

You're thinking about a new body. You're thinking about mine. I can't afford that. What do you mean? The 17s aren't that expensive. I don't want. You only want an altering. I can do prefer the altering.

I don't know. I don't know. They got them. I can't justify a different car, but I'm thinking about it because it's feeling more worn. It is. It is. These cars start to get old. They start to feel old.

Should I still be picky about bodywork on a car where nobody will ever care because it's worth nothing? You would be picky. Well, obviously. You're right. The job should be done well if, yeah, no offense. But even you looked at and you're like, this is not right. It must be pretty bad. One of the downsides of working at cars and bids for the last four and a half years is they get really good at.

pointing at flaws. Yep. You get quite good at looking at a photo and being like, that doesn't match or this looks wrong. And unfortunately, I've internalized those skills.

Yes. You wouldn't care about any of this. I wouldn't care, especially on a car like that. That's, in fact, the benefit of a car like that is that you can not care.

But it just got fixed. That cars were 12, and you're going to have... No, it's worth 15 to 17. Okay, we were 12 and six weeks. You can, the fun of that car

is that you can drive it and really not worry that much about it. That's how I've heard of my cars. Damaged on his... He always... He also wasn't involved with either of these incidents that happened, just to say. But you are, yeah, look, I understand what you're saying. I don't think it's unreasonable, but like, it should probably go.

Well, I don't know that it should go. I disagree with that. I think the car is an enormous amount of utility. A $15,000 car that is practical and runs and drives, that's a car you keep. The depreciation curve is really minimal. It's a reliable car. You put a lot of money into it. It's safe.

Just have it and use it. Yeah, I did notice you drove you a bar through. today though, which is interesting to me because you have, yeah, you have that car, you have your new GTI. I thought we were selling the bar. The bar that is going to be sold soon. Okay, next topic. Go to the site real quick.

I want to talk about a car that neither of you have ever heard of. Type in A8. You ever heard of the Audi A8? I have. Every generation. Check out this one. Click on that. You know what's special about this one?

Take a look. It seems like a nice one's been one owner for the last 26 years. See if you can decide what's special about this one? One owner's for the last 26 years. When the D2, Audi A8 came out. in 1997, it was offered in two versions. There was the 4.2 quadro. The we all know.

And there was a 3.7 front wheel drive. What? This is a front wheel drive. Audi A8 from an early model. What? What? Now, the 3-7 you never saw it. And this one's in New York.

You especially never saw them in the Northeast. Why would you buy one? When I was a kid in Colorado, I never actually laid eyes on one. I went to Atlanta for college years after finding out about it and finally saw one. The giveaways are there's no quattro badge in the front group. And if you go to the exterior, there should have been a 3.7 badge. What someone did on this car is they tried to disguise. I mean, they're not trying to cover it up, but they're like embarrassed about the.

So they took out the 3.7 badge, which didn't say quattro underneath. It just said 3.7. And they switched out the wheels for S wheels. But I always thought that the base wheels were actually kind of charming. I had no. This is a front wheel drive. Audi A8. To this day, the A8 platform is a front wheel drive platform, but obviously they don't sell a front wheel drive version.

And this is a front wheel drive Audi A8. I'm like that. With the 3.7. It's not a 4.2 car. There were two motor options, which also nobody knows. Who knows? Maybe you're joking. How did I never know that?

Maybe it's more alive. How much power? 230 horsepower. It wasn't big power. It was incredibly rare. It was like probably 5% of sales. Obviously, in retrospect, they shouldn't have even offered it. And in subsequent generations, they didn't.

Right. But in this generation, and I think only for the first couple of years, there was a front-wheel drive, Audi A8, and we got one on the side right now. That's 230 horsepower, 235, 5, pine foot of torque. First of all, from a V8 is how. And secondly, who... To be fair, for a while, Mercedes-Benz with the S-Class offered a small six-cylinder.

There wasn't... Well, yeah, over the years, I mean, in the W-126, is a lot of M-26-1-6-cylilers. Well, no, in that generation of S-class... There was a 320. There was a S-3-20. And so that's probably why Audi did it. They were like, well, they're selling a base model.

We'll try a base model to... Wow. From... That is... I never knew that. It's also worth pointing out, by the way, the 97 Audi is... go to the interior photo.

The 97 Audi's didn't have Tiptronic. They only had a straight gearbox. In 98, they switched to Tiptronic, and so the 97s, the A8 came out in 97. The only way you could get a non-tipronic A8 was if you got a 97. Sadly, they didn't want to... Oh, there we go.

Unusual. The A4 came out in 96, and so there were two years of no Tiptronic. But this is a really, really, really, really uncommon car. I don't consider it to be more valuable, but it's uncommon. I saw it come through, and I actually saw it in the thing

in Audi 8, 3.7, and I thought to myself, that must be wrong. I haven't seen one of these in so long. There it is. Wow. Yeah. I'm right and saying that the passenger mirror is smaller than the driver mirror, like, substantially. Yeah?

It looks pretty tight. I can't believe this car was in the Northeast. Massachusetts Windows said. I know. This is crazy. But with one-odice is 99. Why do you buy this and not a four-wheel drive? It was probably five grand more for a four-wheel drive and the bigger motor.

With the headlights and tail lights different? Or is that just 97? I don't think so. I think this is a pre-fas-lifted car, and they facelifted it like 98-99. So they face-lifted it a year later? D-Choos are rare to begin with. Yeah. Yeah.

Wow. It wasn't long before they facelifted it. Because the orange side marker was also on the A4s in 96, 97, and 98-based shifted. That's such a Euro-looking A-Class. But this is a U.S. car that's sold new in the U.S. Wow. Pull up the other interesting Euro. Please go to the R-5 turbo.

A-8? R-5. Ooh. Yeah. Oh, look at that. I don't have anything to say. Just like, look at this. Do you ever drive one of these?

No. I never read either. What an obscure? Cleo. What if he said yes? No, but I drove a Cleo. The Cleo was dangerous. Yes.

The Cleo is so light up front. Yeah. What do you think this is? This must be even sketchy. So sketchy. In a good way. Look at that. Like the rear is so wide.

The engine is in the back for reasons. The whole concept of this car is ridiculous out of its mind. And these bring massive money. They're rare. I mean, you know, it's funny because the regular. was just a trashy little European hatchback. And then there's this, the turbo, which was like a legit

bar. Turbo 2. Turbo 2. This is the most legit card that we've ever sold or Kennan has ever seen. I'm not even wrong. I have seen them in person. You know what this is? He likes his little European hatchbacks, and this was kind of the final form of the European hatchback, and he likes his obscure cars, and it does everything Felipeo needs it to do.

Except that it's French. I'm okay with that. You know what's weird about this car is the hood is in the trunk. Yep. And I want to be clear, the hood isn't the trunk. Like in the Lotus Elise, the hood is the trunk. No, there is a trunk. It's like a spacious trunk too.

If you go to want that interior for them? That's the other thing about what's weird. The hood is carpeted. Not a lot of cars you have a carpeted hood, but in this car you do have a carpeted hood. How many hatchbacks do you have a frunk? That's true. Look, like, that's not, if you go to one, would they close? That's not a tiny hatchet.

Actually, the top part opens up. In the Clio, there was a carpeted part, and then there was a part under it as well. That is so ridiculous. What do you think is with that hump? Like, there's such... Exhaust. This is such 1980s French engineers.

It's exhaust for sure. Yeah. You're lucky they carpeted it, man. Yeah, exactly. What a cool... This closes the day this podcast comes out. And it's such a cool car. Kenan, give us your experience with the M5.

Yes. So, Darkpad on Tesla, as he alluded to, the G-9 D.M5D. That's what they call it? New, yes. De Noia. Lofom. G. And this car, so you know, a lot of talk about how much it weighs. Everybody talks about that it weighs

more than the solar system. And that it is not an M5 and da-da-da-da-da-all. You know, it doesn't weigh more than the Charger V, which I think is my new benchmark. Yeah, but American cars can be heavy. German car. It's like, it's an M-5. It's supposed to be like, light-E-V is mine. Anyway, so.

That's all high watermark. Low watermark? I don't know. So I drove this car. Perfectly acceptable. It is monstrously powerful. I mean, it's just the torque was insane. Like on the highway, you just breathe on it and just like an pressure. Or that it's slower to 0 to 60 and quarter miles than the last one.

Yeah. The last one was really fast. He said it, and I'll say it again. All performance cars are the same fast. They might be off by a 10th or even a half. You don't notice it in the real world in reality. Your Fiat's not a performance car. Let me tell you something.

Let me tell you what this comes from. Okay, I want to know more about them. Let me tell you where this comes from. Everybody argues over zero to 60 times in the tenth of a second race. Cars are all the same. They're all the same. I used to drag race. I used to do quarter mile drag racing for years and years they did quarter mile drag race.

Probably been to the drag strip 100 times. You know what I learned? Every car is as fast as every other car. I'm not screwed with you. You'd get two cars that were like should be pretty far apart. They would end the race like a third of a second apart. And that was kind of that. It was like, okay, that one was faster.

in real world applications, that doesn't matter. Anyway, so the point I'm making about the M5 is that it does everything an M5 is supposed to do. It's pretty, it's very comfortable on the highway. It handles surprisingly well. It hides its weight very nicely. I've found on tight roads it didn't feel that out of place. It felt like pretty manageable. It's very comfortable.

It's nicely put together. I have to admit the lights and the screens are a bit much. Like it's really bright and kind of irritating inside the car. But that's the modern way. and the M5 is, as Harry Mac have put it, it's the emblematic of how cars are now. That M5 is a modern M5. Plus, I would say that BMW sells cars to like young, well-kept, dark-haired guys who'd shoot on their wives, rich. Do you agree?

The M-5s, anyway. So specific. But it's kind of right, right? Like, I think. Like, that's who buys new M-5s, right? Come up, am I wrong? No. Okay.

Never owned a new one. And so I would argue that, like, the screens and the tech is even, part of it too. Like, they're on the forefront. These young guys who buy the car want, like, the latest and greatest stuff. We've been an expression. If you're, if you're a manager, you're coming up, you buy the M3, but the boss buys the M5. That was always

kind of the way, but it is like a tech thing. Well, I'm not putting that on my M5 brethren. But it just, it is a very competent car. Is it necessarily, what I went from M5? Not necessarily. It's like,

I do, but you're not. But I'm not. But I'm not. demo. Right, I'm not the demo. Right. Exactly. I'm not the cheating demographic. That's, I suppose. But a very impressive car, the torque. I'll be thinking about the torque for a long time.

I think it's impressive. I think also the type of people who buy that car, everybody online complains, guys with modern D90s complain. But the type of people who buy that car, they like everything being new and modern, the design is modern and aggressive. The design is fresh and new and cool, et cetera. And I think that's what people are looking for.

even kind of coming around in the way it looks. It doesn't bother me. I don't love it, but it's like, it's fine. I like how it looks. I think it's cool. I think it's fine. I think the new five in general is a really attractive car, and I think in 20 years people are going to come around to that point. I'm just 20 years early. As awesome as the case. Okay. But a good car. Thank you for letting me drive it. Yeah, I'm glad you did drive it. You've now driven every generation of the M5. I was sure. That's not true. Which one have it you driven? I haven't driven original E28. No way? I haven't driven E34, but I have driven everything. You drove E-34 M540, right?

You haven't driven an E-34? No. Well, it's a letdown compared to your car, so. I actually, I love the E-28th. I drove an E-28 in Al-Tadena. The day before that guy bought the winning lottery ticket. You know the guy. Yeah, in Ultadena.

It was actually the day of. Wow. I was driving me. He was buying a lottery ticket at the shop and save. I actually broke down in that M-5 while I was filming it. So, you know, who had the better day? You're both winners. You had a real M-5 experience, and he'd won a lottery ticket.

And now he's got a lot of M5 experiences because he's bought all these cars. Was this Edwin Castro? Was that his name? Wasn't it? I think it's something like that. Edwin Castro, yeah. You don't know this story? Can we move?

He bought like every Porsche. Yeah, he went to like, remember when they auction all those white like portions? He went there and like bought loads of them. He bought every Porsche. He bought it. He went to the dealers and said, I want all the Kians. They said, I don't know. They said, all of them.

And of course, we now respect him heavily. Some people do. Some people only respect people if they have money. or, and that's the only reason to respect people. A lot of Porsches. Okay, next up, market report. Time for the market report. Brought to you by Carsandbids.com.

Net. Oh, com. Right. Dot com. Sorry. You got anything else to say about cars and bits? Yeah, you can buy or sell your dream car on Cars and Bids. You can sell your dream car.

It would be tragic if you did. I get it. Maybe you're ready for a new dream. Maybe you can find. You can sell your dream car and then buy your new dream car. Like you dream to the 500 of Barth and now you're selling. I will sell it. And I now dream of the car I,

bought on the site, which is a GTI. Was that a dream or more of a nightmare? Which one? Okay. The apart. No, it's been great. It's a GTI, I guess, since you mentioned it. It's been great.

All right, market report. Philippo, what do you got for us? This past week, we sold a B8S4. That's an Audi S4. Yes. It was a really nice, right? Stick, red interior, sport differential. It also went...

8.5. Yeah. It also went for what I thought, based on looking at some comps, it was a really strong number. Yeah. And it makes me wonder if people are finally recognizing that, like, here is a really great driver sports stands. Yeah. For a long time, the Audi sports cars, especially the ones based on regular cars, have not gotten much love.

They're just depreciating German luxury cars. But maybe the special ones are starting to get appreciation in the same way that an M3 or C63 does. And here's one with a stick that did really well. Yeah, this is an unusual situation, though. This car is port differential from the factory and it had a manual. I agree with you that B8s are possibly in the right situation getting a little bit of recognition

but this particular car was a really desirable one. Had pretty low miles. Sixty-two thousand miles is low. A lot of these cars get driven hard. And the sticks are rare. The sticks are rare. And B8. at a half, it's especially rare. But I think if you're going to get one, this is one to have.

It's also a pretty cleanly modified car. Already titled in California. It's got some nice... If you're interested in mods, it's got some nice... I agree with you the number was strong for this car. comments agreed, but also, like, it makes sense. But it is a fine, another type car. B8S4 is with a sticker, not around. It gives me hope that people, I think they're really cool cars.

I think they're a great actual fun sports sedan that was a little underappreciated. It gives me hope that people are recognizing them. The B5, B6, and B7 S4 has never really been beloved by the market. Nope. We got a B6 here in the office. It's actually behind this X3. I don't know if you can see the X3. It's camouflaged.

It's still. It's very dark. It's stealth. And we got a B6S4 back there. And it's so good. I have fallen in love with the B6 Audi S4. I always wanted one. You driven that one yet?

No, I got to find a video to make it. Drive the car. It's your car but B6 here. Which is to say worse. But, you know, the engine's mounted in front of the front wheels, which is not great. And it's not, and the engine grenades. But it's so cool. Well, yeah, so it blows up.

I mean, who's engine doesn't, you know? I've always liked them. I always thought there is a group of people who appreciate them. And when I see a B5 S4, I have incredible respect for the person who owns that because to go through that pain, that Klova car is really impressive. And to see a nice one now is unheard of. And the same thing sort of applies to the B6.

The B7S4 is awesome, but the B7 RS4 exists. And so everybody would rather that. That's a really, really special car. Plus, the timing chain issues didn't affect the B7. And in my opinion, much. And in my mind, if you're not living on the edge, like the B6 is, like any moment you could start that car and need a motor, then what are you really doing? Okay. Next one is manual cayenne.

Can you pull up this manual cayenne? That was wild. Talk about cars that bring money. Kenon's been looking for a cayenne. Yeah, I'm still still on it. Kenon's been looking for a cayon. It's this one here. And we've been looking at turbos, and they're like 20.

Yeah. Yeah. You can get a, they're hard to find. With great off. But 2012. But yeah, 2025, 30 in that range. This manual comes up, a six-cylinder, black-black, pretty basic car. It can mean it's a pretty basic car.

And it sells for 33-5 with miles. It wasn't, it was like 87,000. To go back a paint-down. To keep that in perspective, we just sold a turbo S for 32. It's the same model you're by this. It's actually a newer car. What is the mileage on the turbo S? Turbo S 93.

Same miles. So for the same money, you could have a turbo S. This is 550 horsepower, and I'm sure it has crazy. options because they all did. Or you could have a six-cylinder stick, base car, Nikki Minaj, same money. Or a four-year newer GTS.

No, we do a 3-year-less. That's a good point, actually. But that's a facelved car. That's the next body. Yeah, you have V-6 anyway. This is a V-6. So if you've already gotten yourself in a V-6 mindset, you could have,

I mean, this is, it's crazy what these manuals go for. I would, someone's, I think I'd rather have you. I mean, the V-6 for life. is cool, but it's like, I've been told not very good to drive. Like, you don't really want that.

They're not sporty manual, but it's still a manual. And it's cool. I mean, in the Porsche world, listen, listen, the cars, the 9-11s and boxters

that are turquoise over turquoise are ugly. But they're big money because they're cool. And it's the same here. Yeah, it's not the best to drive. He's tuned me out. Well, I want to see that boxster.

We sold one. We sold more than one. He's going to trick. He's going to go through 100. 150 listings. My point is in the Porsche world, people don't care as much about whether it's actually good and more about whether the perception of it being interested. And it is interesting.

That's what sells in the Porsche world. This sold for 19 gram. It's a base boxster with miles, 19 grand. But it was green. It was turquoise on turquoise with a turquoise parking brake handle. And you ain't go find that again. The manual kinds always bring money. During the peak of COVID, we sold some for really quite astronomical numbers.

Yeah. No, I mean, look, it is an incredibly cool car. Would I take a TurboS over it? You know what's surprising, though? Well, you say, duh, but I think that a lot of people would disagree. TurboS is just a car that, like, a rich dude buys and it depreciates and whatever. A manual kind is like a special car. I mean.

Who bought the manuals new? It was crazy people. I remember it. I was there. It was crazy people. I want an automata. I want 500 to 550 horsepower. And that's comfort.

That's what I want. It depends what you want out of your Kyan. You want a car that is a usable, practical, luxury SUV that you can drive fast. This person wants a car they can throw around the corners. And do you blow, you know, drop a gear. They don't care about that. They want to just shift gears. They want to do something with their hands.

They want to sit with their hands. Can I, okay. I do. I do have a question. Zoom back out. Because manual second-gen kion, which is what we'll call it, are way more desirable than GTS from the first-gen. Scroll back up.

We have a GTS, a first-gen-gen-GTS live, right? right now with a stick because in the first gen Kyan, the the GTS was the only one of the little with a stick. That's not true. There was a six-slend there. You will never see them. They're very rare.

They are not viewed with the same belovedness as the second-in-stitch. In my mind, a V8-powered Kion with a stick should be more and sporty pretensions. Should be more desirable than the V-6 second-gen. Yeah. And they're desirable. These are higher-mile ones for 8-17.

These still bring money. Low-mile ones are these. still bring money. About the same money. The prices are too close. Very similar. Yeah, especially because the V8, even though it was the first jet, had a lot more power to, is 420 horse versus 300. We have seven Cyanes live right now. Seven Cyanes, dude. This is Cyan Clearing House. And you know what? I don't even mind. Cuyans are great and they're great deals and they're great cars to buy. We did. We're going to sell it too. We're going to sell it very soon. Okay. It's time for the questions. The questions are bought to you by Kennan. Kenan, he answers your

questions. I do. The questions this week were interesting. Okay. Oh, first time, let me tell you to do them. You go to cars and bids.com. You know the website. You click on the community tab. And then there's a post there that says like, hey, let's answer your questions. Flipo, you see this? Look at that. That is your dream. They're off the market. How sad. That is your dream. Anyway, there's a post with the questions. That's reanswered question. Now, this week we got a bunch of questions. The best questions were not the top ones. I'm going to breeze through a couple topies. And then we're going to go on to the gradyest. There's a great e for you coming. Oh, man. I'm braced for impact. Okay. Question from Mr. B. Sean B. Doug, I really missed the more Doug videos like the Vegas Artelroom Tour, etc. Can you open a Google spreadsheet with

the unlisted video links. Yeah, I guess, I don't know. Can we do that? He looked at me. He doesn't like me. It's like 5 o'clock. He's done. Maybe, I don't know.

Find the link somewhere else. Which ones do you like best? We'll open those. Right now, I will say they're all private for a bunch of like channel related reasons. They're unlisted, aren't they? It doesn't matter. We have to do a bunch of things to come to have the channels work the way we wanted

them to. We can consider. We'll talk about it. I do the house tours and the hotel room to I'm particularly fond of because that was when I started a cars and bids. you called me when you were driving there and then driving back. That was, you reviewed that day. That's true.

I remember that call. And then COVID happened. I was on the Vegas strip. Wow. Had to have a million dollar line of credit to have that hotel room. Next question also from Mr. B. Sean B. Doug, you say the company is no longer yours since you sold it. I assume you still have a considerable amount of shares.

What about a decision where the higher ups make decisions you disagree with out of your control? How do you handle it? The ownership structure is weird because, yeah, I do have a lot of shares. And I'm also like in the face. Like, look at me. Yeah, that's your face. So it's weird that I'm a minority, but also like the, the, the, the, the person.

We get out of beard. And so I, the, the, but the thing about it is, I'm not a business person. Everybody blames me for everything that happens on cars and bids. But like, I don't know what, I don't know what the hell's going on. I make YouTube videos as a profession. It's what I do. When, when the investors came and said, hey, we're going to, we're going to buy this thing. I was like, oh, my God.

Thank God. Somebody's going to do this because I can't anymore. I really, really, truly mean that. There are decisions that are made here every day that I'm in awe of. that I wouldn't have done myself and that I'm surprised by and some of them don't work and some of them do work

but regardless like I wouldn't have taken this to where it is now and so I try to lay my I try to leave my hands off for the executives and the investors to govern and that's kind of that next question

from Big Ultima Hater 6 which car offers the most exotic and beautiful looks for the money in other words which car provides the best looks per dollar value I have thoughts on that one V8 Vantage Vantage Vantage Vantage is very good

You mean sports cars specifically or anything? You're talking Kyan now. No, the Kyan's a very good looking car. You won't like this. Uh-oh. You won't like this either. You're going to say, Grands Rasm? It's going to be an ether and item 5.

The Fisker Karma, in my mind, is an extraordinarily attractive car, and they're pretty inexpensive. This one is a nice one sold for 36, 6, but you can get them for 17. The problem that I have. I think they're really pretty. When I see one, I think, like, orphan brand, laughable car, barely keeping it on the road. Like this is the DeLorean of the modern era. Now, DeLoreans are cool now, but there was a long time where people thought. When I look at it, see, I remember in 2012, I came to San Diego for the very first time, and Fisker was a brand that existed.

They had a showroom in San Diego, and I went and pictures in the Fisker showroom. But if I saw it. So they're cool at the time. Right. But as they've aged, I still think they're cool. And they had the plug-in hybrid idea. It was a good idea. It was just, it was a little bit ahead of its time because now it's the new.

Well, and they use the GM EcoTech engine. Right. Not a great. Chevy Cobalt Power. But I think they are, especially that rear haunch, I just think it is extraordinarily beautiful. It says striking car. Is it a beautiful car? I don't know.

I think it's beautiful. But V. What is that color? Well, they put, so they put glass in their paint as their metagint, which is why it's so poppy. The, uh, I agree that this car is pretty cool, but I don't think it's the most. I mean, Austin Martin is an Astin. Another one you'll disagree with, but the, yeah, the, yeah, the Mazved Reddy How about one of those old rolls is?

Like a... Is that a beautiful car? It's a... Like a... Like a... State Lee car. Is it a beautiful car? Well, it says exotic and beautiful.

It's... You drive you on those. I was filming that today and everybody's staring at me. And I'm like, the same is true if you're driving a G-Wagon. Well, if beautiful and exotic looks are what you want... This is a good one.

You hate the way it looks, which you're wrong about. I think it's ugly, but I do think it looks exotic and people... It does look into it. Okay, look at that. You can agree. That is a beautiful car. And for $15,000, I mean,

more value than the Aston. Yeah, I agree. Yeah. That is an exotic looking car, even if it's... Aston's better. I would, I'd heartbe, take the Aston of this, but nonetheless, that is a beautiful car. Our producer had somebody, one of his friends who's a non-car person,

saw a Grand Treasbilt, a modded one with the, like, lip broken off and, like, took a self because she was like, it's a Maserati. It's like, normal car people still have that, or normal non-car people still have that reaction. Okay. I agree with all those. Do you have any? Jaguar X-K. Yeah, that's a good one.

It is beautiful. People think it's expensive. it is not. Yep. Yeah. Those are 12. Wow. That's a $13,000 car.

That is a beautiful car for that. It's a gorgeous car. Oh, I didn't realize that they're that cheap. I think you're going for $10. I mean, but... Get an 07. 5.07. I bet they're 10.

Here's a no, 7.15. Keep going to. Wow. Just go for the cheapest price. No, no. Lowest price. Oh, yeah. Lowest prices.

Well, the cheapest ones are 10, 11, 12. Wow, that is an... I did not know that cheap. That's a beautiful car for that. Crazy. You know, in 07. they had the antenna. You remember this? No.

Click on that one. 07. 07. Jack hadn't figured out how to do the antenna yet. Oh, you're right. They did. So in only 07, they had an antenna off the back.

Do I have one? Which screwed up the whole look of the car. It's beautiful design. They didn't figure out how to bury the antenna in the windshield, like everybody else, or put the aerial on the center. I can't. You want one of these? How good or bad are they?

I don't know. They're not sports guards, but like, they get mild up. We get them submitted. How many miles does this thing have? They get submitted with some miles. But don't they have that AJV8 that's problematic that was in all the rangeover?

Probably. Although with 07, it doesn't. It has the V8 that was in my rangeover that was really reliable. I don't know that the mouth. Your next car. Interesting. That is appealing.

Yep. Okay. Here are some great ones. There's some great questions this week, some of the very best. Don't look at them. Don't look at them ahead of time. I apologize.

Be surprised. From Ranger 224445, can you share the YouTube analytics for the Grand National video after the Kendrick Lamar song released? He actually means after the Super Bowl halftime. Because Kendrick Lamar has already been all grand nationally. He had an album entitled GNX where the GNX was on the cover.

Okay, I looked. And you want to know something? No effect. There was a slight effect. So it went from maybe 800 views per hour to like a thousand. Not huge. But you know what I noticed, if you look at him? In December, it spiked to like 22,000 views per hour.

Maybe the album gives me out that. What the hell? So like the spike for the Super Bowl was like this to this. But the spike in December was like way up here. Who's looking at Grand National? Content back. Plus, we should have titled that video, GNX. No, it wasn't a GNX just to get the clicks.

Just to get the clicks. That's so true, honestly. I'm going to add GNX for the search for terms. No, I won't actually. Okay, from oh yes, yes, Kenan, this one's for you. And all of us, except him. Can you rank the mid-engine V8 Ferrari cars from least to most favorite? Okay.

Okay, so we're assuming, is the 3-8 GT4 included in that? No, I think, 308. 308 through F8. Oh, okay. Wow. He said V8. Well, yeah, no, but the two. Okay, fine.

You don't put the two and six in there. Six. I know, but in purity, it's, okay, fine. Well, but he said eight owners. He wants to know. He doesn't think that it qualifies. That's a good point. So 308, 328, 328.

I'm going to write him down here. Yep, 348. 308, 3255. 3455, 360, 430, F430, F430, 458. 8, 488. 488 and F8. Okay. So, I've driven... We agree the worst is the 348, which is not a negative on the 348, but it's the worst off.

I will track these for you. I don't know if it's quite the... I mean, because like a two-valve 308, like the one GTSI that you drove... That car was amazing. Yeah, but it's... You're going to throw the 308 under the bus, that wedgy car? That's the problem because the QV is amazing. The Verozina is correct.

And the GTSI is fun. I think 348 goes first because it was... It was unreliable. It was not particularly attractive. The interior's not great. It's not fast. It has attributes that are good. It does.

Steering. It has great steering. Best of way better than the 355. It's pretty quick. It's good looking. I think it's of its time. I think it looks really... But the 3-8 looks better.

3-8 is prettier. 348 is more striking. Oh, that's crazy. The wedge 308? The 38 is a wedge. The 348 is a wedge. I can tell them. If he saw those two cars, he didn't know who what he's looking at.

He'd look to 308 and be like, oh, a kutosh. I'm telling them. So your least favorite is... No, I think that... I love my 348. A late one. Okay, we agree 308 and 348 are the worst two, right? Yes.

Oh, am I going to count the 208? The 208 turbo? No, I'm not going to count the 208. Okay, so 308 and 348 are the worst two, right? I'm doing the opposite. I don't know. I got this for you, Doug. Okay.

So, I don't know if you're going to go, I don't like the 488 at all, to be honest with you. The 488 feels like a normal car that you would just use. There's nothing exciting about it. There's nothing, it's not thrilling. Yikes. It's, it's, it's, it's, what do we think is the best? 355. I don't.

Looks the best or is the best? Because this is, that's a question. No, I mean, but then the problem is, like, you mean, because like, the 360. Favorite. The challenge stradala exists, but if I compare a challenge stradale, you're to a 301. No, I think you're, I think just the base car. The car has to be like the normal one. The base car.

Yeah, like, because we could, we could also put the 360, the windshield list 360 that they gave to Luke as a wedding president. And that would win, obviously, be number one. It's also your favorite. What is your favorite? I think we may have to move on, but what's your favorite? The windshield, the windshield of the normal ones. No, we're not going to move on. We're going to get to this.

I'm going to, okay, I'll tell you the, I'm going to look at them right now. I'm going to tell you. Here's the order. Number one. That's worst or better? Best. Best. 430.

430 is the best. Better than the 4.5. Number 2.45. It had a stick, dude. It had a stick. 4.5. Oh, the base car technically did. Generally, it had a stick.

430. Generally, 7% of them have sticks. They're like 12 in the world. Number one. No, that is outrageous. 430 because a stick was available. I'm talking about the car in general. 430.

Yeah, in generally they're F1s. It's an F1 car. It's an F1 car. No, but it's available. 430. Number 2, 458. Yeah. Okay.

Number 3.355. Okay. Number four, F8. Wow. Jeez. Number five, 360. Number six, 328, number 748, number 748, number 8, 308, number 9, 348. Boom, I did it.

Dude, it's hard. They're all good. They are, that is true. They are all good. I don't like I don't like the F8 I don't like this 488 So give us your list

Or best to worst BAM it up It's really hard to think Um That's really hard Look dude there are a nine car Just go for it This is hypothetical again

Kenon I know it's really hard I think that I think that I still think the F355 Rains Supreme Like it is more of a Ferrari driving Experience than the other ones

Like the 3555 Is exciting at all speeds And the car you decided to sell after owning it for died months. Yeah, and I still... Because, guess what? After all of that pain, I still want one. 355, over 430 and 458?

355 over 430? Let me ask you a question. They were both parked in a parking lot. Which one would you go look at first? I would look at a 3-55. It's the most beautiful. There's no question. Except maybe 4-5-is.

It's the most beautiful. I guess the question was my pain in the best. Your favorite. My favorite. Your favorite is a question. No. Yeah, at least the most favorite. Favorite.

Ha! But it should be that. So F-355 is my favorite. I think that the... you gotta go 430 4358 just say 4558 choose an order those two He's gonna say like 348 now

Because it was a pre-cursor of a 355 All the wedge cars I like way more than like stuff They came later but I do 3-28 should be up there then Because that's the one I think 328 is probably third But I think that I think I would probably

I think the 430s would probably be second I'd rather have that than a 4-5-8 Tab probably the 328 slash 308 They are kind of they are very very similar part then I would say probably the 4-5-8 after that oh wow the 4-36 3-0 over the 458

what the 308 over the 458 I'd way rather have a I think to own I'd way rather have a thing 3-8 is so cool lights go up fit the category but the horn goes beep and it's just and they were all manuals 100% of them are manuals not 7%

with your 430s yeah but then yeah I think yeah 4-58 then then you're stuck on F8, 48, 488, 360, and 348. You're not going to like this, but it's probably say 360, then, then

4, then F8, then no, then 48, no, yeah, F8, then 48 at the bottom. Well, then 348 at the bottom. 3, 3,348 at the bottom? Yeah. You guys are aligned on, I barely put it above. Two things. You're aligned to the

348 is the worst. Yeah. And that is no, we're aligned on some more than that. 360s and basically the same spot for both of us, kind of mid-pack. 430s near the top for both of. us. And I love 355. 35 is number three for me, number one for you. I love it too. I think it's great. I think, yep. That's a tough one. They're all good. It's different from 9-11s, where it'd be very easy.

Okay, next question from AWGRBR. This is our last good one, our last question, and it's a very good one. You leave that up for the rest of them. Yeah, thank you. What car do you consider to be the baseline for special enough to take out your phone and snap a picture? I recently saw a storado on the road, and as an adult man, I felt silly for snapping a pick. But there are definitely cars I would, where is your line? First off, I would snap a pick of every starrato. I took a pick of everything. I took a pick yesterday.

What was it? You don't send me this? I got to send it to you. It was something to... Oh, it was an XM. And I was in the CareerJJT. With a template. And I wanted to be like,

last time I saw an XM, which is also the template. I took a picture. Sent it to you? I'm offended. Well, I apologize. I send... I think if I see a Dodge stealth,

I saw SVT contour. And I was in the Career GT and I took a picture. Nobody in our group chat, by the way, seemed to care about my SVT contour signing. I'll be honest, blue right past it didn't even do like that. I agree that one with a little borderline.

But I will often take a picture or ask my wife to take a picture. And she'll be like, why is that special? Like, I'm not bother explaining why this. Right. Bukes Skylark is special. Right. Oh, you saw a Skylark. Right. I had a buddy when it's.

That's all to say that my line is low. No, no. The 90s one. Yeah. Right. He would think that the original one was a 20s car. Filippo has like cut off our old cars. Like built in the 60s before.

Before 1981 or built the 20s. So my line is real low and peculiar. So I can't answer the question. I take, I will take a picture of a car if I know it's important to somebody who I know, like a friend of mine, like if, you know, that I would do. Yeah. Like for you, I might not, I don't know if I'd take a picture of an Abarth for you because.

Yeah, I wouldn't hope that you do. Any, but if I saw, like a, if I saw, I don't know, if I saw someone imported a panda and I saw it, I would take a picture. Concourse of Taliano, I took that. picture of that um pana four by four yeah you better leave on that phone number next time because I knew he'd like it I shoot I take pictures of everything I've uh

I love seeing the vehicles stuff in context yeah I'm a press photographer and I take pictures of everything and I I really enjoy seeing the pictures I love setting the pictures I take pictures for the right people and uh that's that um are you okay we will uh move on that's the end of our segment today

uh Kenan has any parting thoughts for us. Canon? 355. Yeah. Gorsalorvina. That's Rosso Barquetta. Filippa.

You got any thoughts for us? Panda 4x4. Panda 4x4 is your thought. Imagine a Panda 4x4 squared. Oh. Oh. Oh. Portal axles.

Somebody's done one. I have no doubt. Dude, that would be legit. Yeah, there are guys in Italy right now wearing suspenders and no shirt who have one of those. You know what I'm talking about. It feels a little race. If you have Panda 4AX4A. No, do not.

These are the hill folk. Philippo knows exactly what I'm talking about. I didn't say no. Look at that. Oh, wow. That's useful, Filippa. No.

We'll overlay it. Okay, everyone. Thank you so much for watching, for participating. Honestly, for sending us your questions, which were excellent this week. The most chaotic podcast yet. It was the best podcast we've ever done. Thanks primarily to Filippo and Kennan. Thank you.

And to you, Doug. Goodbye, everyone. Goodbye.