THIS CAR POD! with Doug DeMuro & Friends! - The Future of the Collector Car Market, Flying Bentley Drones, and Worst Value Cars EP21

Episode Date: August 9, 2024

Have a question you want answered on the podcast next week? Ask HERE -- https://crsnbds.com/PODQUESTIONS Doug DeMuro & Friends offer weekly expert insight and opinion, on the breaking automotive stories, the car market, and audience Q&A. Welcome to THIS CAR POD! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hello and welcome to this car pod. I'm Kenan. I'm Felipe. And today we're going to talk about cars. Let's dive into it with the news. Yes, so there's been some leaks about the new M2CS is coming. This was the ultra-high-performance version of the M2 in the previous generation. They're going to do it again with this one.

Now, of course, details aren't official with this, as BMW hasn't said anything themselves, but a reported BMW insider who leaked the last one also talking about this car. And purportedly, it's going to have 520. 25 horsepower, which is insane. How much horsepower does the normal M2 have? So 473 thereabouts. So, but this car, this car, I believe, will slot below the M4 CSL, but above the M4 competition in terms of power

in like the BMW hierarchy of the smaller performance cars. Regardless, some other things that they've said is that this car will not have a manual transmission option. It will be automatic only which, you know, big surprise. BMW really does not want to put their manuals in cars. Now, they also have not released any, or they haven't leaked any power figures about this car, but Doug is just active,

very hard thumbs downing that, which... Well, because doesn't it pop up a thumbs down thing if I do it? Not always. Not always. No, but yeah, it does think that it won't have a mail.

Because of all of the cars in the BMW range that should have a manual, it's the M2 and M2CS. That's the driver-focused car. It's small-ish. And it's supposed to be like the most, like, enthusiast-focused car.

So it's surprising it doesn't get a manual, but, you know, again, none of this is really confirmed. We'll see it's supposed to come out next summer, believe it's when the car will be on it won't have a manual there's not like waiting for this i'm telling you this is the end i just did a video it's not live yet but i just

did a video on future classic new cars and the m3 stick and the m2 are it this is it everybody's like oh they're so ugly people complain about how cars are ugly and then 25 years later they think they're the coolest things in world yeah this is it i'm telling you the m2cs is the beginning of the end they're all going to be tip going forward they're all going to be plug in hybrid four cylinders going forward this is the end kennan you thought bmw turned its back on and when they came out with the X7X drive 40i. No, they're turning their back on enthusiasts when they come out with the next M4,

which has a turbo hybrid supercharged two cylinder with 964 horsepower and it weighs 11 million pounds. Yeah, well, okay, so they gave us a cold shoulder with the X7. This is turning the back. So, like, we're there. I totally agree with everything you said about the other cars too. The fact you can get manuals and those is really important and that's what will make them desirable in the future. I have a hunch, despite the fact they have beaver. nose-looking faces.

The M-2 and M-3 are the only cars in their segments that come with the manual, right? Cadillac. Cadillac is the, yeah, and the W-R-X as well. Technically exists in the same instrument as the M-3. Which W-R-X competes with the M-3? I don't disagree, but if you want a manual sedan, those are your options, basically. The segment is manual sedan. I mean, that's how water does become because you just can.

The Civic SI did that, then. Sure. Great. Well, wait, the Kia Forte still comes with it. famous M3 competitor. You're right. All right. We're moving on. All right. No, this is a great topic. I'm glad you pulled this up.

Felipe, you read about this? You're probably upset about this. I'm not upset about this. I'm excited to hear we have said. Okay. All right. Mazda has announced that the remote start feature, which is previously, and some other things, which were previously part of their remote services, is going to now charge a monthly subscription. Now, this headline, I don't know if you read the whole story. It's kind of an interesting story. The headline was this, and people are absolutely up in arms, Zangreva. this. However, the feature that we're talking about has always been subscription-based, but Mazda offered it for free. When you first bought your CX-9, you got three years for free,

and Mazda has extended that time for free. And finally, they've stopped making the extensions, and now you're going to have to pay for it. So it's actually, they've actually been very generous with the consumer here. I don't, I imagine that a lot of Deer did a bad job of communicating this to their customers for sure i don't find this objectionable it's like an extra feature that i've actually be okay with it being subscription based i would just purchase it when i cared about that service does this does this have a cost in my sequoia filippo i i don't know man also you live in southern california when have you ever had to remote start a vehicle it was the air conditioning quote right now let's see if i can remote start it i've never paid for anything did you download the toyota app yeah yeah i got

the app here. It's right here. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, right there. Yeah, let's find out. Oh, I can start it. Wow. This is great. Well, maybe you'll have to pay in like two years and six months. That's right. I don't, I, I imagine people are disappointed because they weren't informed of this. But I, like, okay. How much does it cost? I, right, that's a fair question. I cared more when everybody was up in arms about BMW, having heated seats to be a subscription. Yeah, that's kind of like, what is that? What is that? You purchase the feature on an expensive car already.

Right. But like a monthly subscription for something that is literally like you pay monthly subscription for everything else. This seems like a reasonable additional service that you're paying for if you care. Yes. It's also not that expensive. I just had a whole thing. You can get it.

It's like 13, 20 bucks. It's not crazy money. I had a whole thing. I wouldn't pay that. But like if I were going. But if it's a feature that is important to you, you could see it. Yeah. And like if you live somewhere where it's cold,

in the wintertime you want to start that car, you know, it's nice. I also get, like, I mean, people are used to, it's also just a way different feature than Remote Start used to be, where you have to be five feet away from the car and hold down that button in the key fob or have a separate key fob.

That's not that anymore, and like it makes sense of the model would have to change. Yeah, yeah. It is an interesting thing, though, because it's kind of the beginning. Like, Remote Start is maybe less objectionable than some of these things because it's kind of app

included anyway, but it is the beginning of what's coming. Pretty soon, Filippo, they're going to charge you extra for headlights. You know, but I don't talk about headlights, man. Bad day for headlights. We'll get to that. We'll get to that.

We'll get to that. Okay, move on to the next news story. All right. Oh, yes, this heinous thing. I have so much to say about this. Okay. Yeah. They've formally announced pricing for the electric version.

Before we go any further, Kenan, do you know what this car is called? Look at it. I mean, it looks like it wants to be a smooth challenger. Like, that's a challenger, right? It's a two-door. here's a crazy fact for you. Here's an unbelievable fact for you. Okay.

They have, they're now coming out with a charger. And you know how they have the charger, the four door and the challenger of the two door? Yes. They're all going to be called the charger now. Correct. Nope. I don't understand why. There's a two-door charger and a four-door charger.

The challenger name, even though it was an absolute hero name to certain communities, now it's gone. So do you think this is because the must, like the mock E, or like the must- Mac E was a four-door and like the Mustang is a two-door and now they're like they're just using the strength of their stronger brand which is the challenge because they're not using Challenger which is no sense it is one of the craziest things I've ever seen done by any automaker here's the worst part of this you'd think oh just the EV version is called a charger because you charge it does you charge no the gas version is also called the charger okay so talk to us about pricing pricing has been announced there was a leak a day or two ago that it was going to and but now we have

formal pricing, it's going to start at just shy of $60,000 without destination, 615 with destination. That's about 15 grand more than the last charger. Yeah. Last equivalent. The SCAPAC, which is the upgraded model, will start around 73K. It is eligible for the EV tax credit. So that's $7,500 if you meet whatever phase out requirements. We don't know four-door pricing yet, and we don't know the gas version.

pricing yet. Yeah, well, the gas version isn't coming for a while. For another year, yeah. Another year, which is, I think, wild. 60 grand doesn't seem bad for the size of the car and, like, the EVs are still a little bit more expensive in this category. There are no other muscle car EVs, but I find the way there's... Wait, wait, wait, wait, excuse me?

There is the Ford Mustang Electric. Crossover, yes. Can I tell you guys about a few... I have a few things that this car has that I find fascinating. Yeah, one's fake sound. What? One is fake sound. What else?

Okay, fake sound, which is called the fratonic exhaust. God. There is a package or something that is standard. The standard engine battery motor, I don't know. The standard thing is called direct connection stage one. That is the base power train. Okay. It has 496 horsepower, 400 pound feet of torque, 4.7 seconds, 060s.

Okay. The upgraded one that you can buy as an option, or maybe just with a scat-back, unclear still. It's called Direct Connection Stage 2. You know what this reminds me of Filippo? It reminds me of Jeep four-wheel drive. Remember when I couldn't hear out all the different four-wheel drive terminology? What other company is naming their EVs direct connection stage one and direct connection stage two? You're missing the point.

It's got to stage one. That's what people in the tuner culture say. Yeah, if you are stage one, too. That's what we say. Me and Kenan know when we go to Volkswagen meets, which we do incognito, we always talk about how our GTI is a stage three, am I right? That's right. I always put on my flat bill hat, grab my box mod and head to one of those mates, you know?

Are you making fun of GTI people? You're over here spending 12 grand a second on your car and you're making fun of GTI people? Their car costs 12 grand. Can you go to the next photo? Yes. They also are the only EV that I can think of that advertises that they have a pistol grip shifter. And they're easy. Every other EV has gone to

Let's shift it's in the touchscreen Let's have a single button No We're going to have a pistol grip shift there Is it a bit of this is going to be a weird This is going to be a weird meeting of Electric and gas car people And Dodge is not a handle it yet

I will say There's going to be a gas version of this car too Despite early updates that there wouldn't be There's going to be a gas version of this car too And I have a suspicion that most people are just going to ignore this thing and just buy the gas Which is what I have to say Absolutely

Especially when you're pricing it at some of these 68, 81,000. I mean, scat pack at 82 before destination. And Chrysler's destination is like $24,000 too. The scat pack is a start at 73, including destination, believe. You get my point. Who are they going? I don't know.

It's cool. I think it's really interesting that they're doing this. And that they're trying so hard to still be Mussel Kari by naming it, the direct connection stage to Power Train. and having an exhaust that sounds vaguely V8-esque. But that's not. But who are they hoping will want that combination of things? They're hoping that they're going to convert people from V8 cars

because it's fast. I hope they do. Can we talk about the sound? Do we have the clip to play? If not, all acted out. It sounds like a... Please. We do have it.

I don't know if Kenan has it up. I do not. It's all right. can't hear honestly to be perfectly honest i think they posted it on instagram they're like check this out and it was like uh that really didn't sound like my um frat sonic exhaust it just i'm really intrigued to see who buys it whether they sell any i mean from like an evi perspective it has good power the scat pack 3.3 second zero to 60 which is more than a r1 s but like it's the top sell though at 70 whatever thousand dollars two of the kind of crowd that that want like the electric car buyer

and the muscle car buyer are not... Then again, maybe there are people that have a muscle car, want a muscle car, still want 300 miles of range, which does in theory has, but don't want it to look like an electric car and well? Do you, and are willing to spend 75, that... Do you know any of these people? Do you, Kenan?

I think they all live in Orange County. Nope. The muscle car people I know just want to do big fat burnouts. They can do that. Yeah, but they like the noise. The noise is such a huge part. They're rightfully, but they live in Orange County. It's like rich Republicans.

in states that are like eco-conc, you know, it's a, it's a small, it's Orange County. It is Orange County. That's where all the Hummery Vs are. Every time I see a Hummery V, it's up there. I think it's the same buyer. Ranch of Sanfay. I want to be a California.

Yeah, Orange County generally. Well, we'll include. And adjacent. Yeah, okay. We're off the rails like this car. They will sell four of these. Fortunately, they're going to come out with a gas version and Kenon's going to buy it. In line, sex.

Hurricane. All right. Okay. Next story is also FCA related I can't believe you put this as a This isn't a news story Sure it is

The RAM 1500 classic Which was the last generation RAM Maybe two generations ago now Now that they've had like a full facelift It's going out of production next year Oh no It will have been in production for 15 years But there is actual news here

Beyond it going out of production As in 15 years It's going to be the end of the Hemi V8 RAM All right All right Go back go back go back. Kenan, can you do something for me? Can you pull up a picture of a 2003 Dodge Ram? I think we'd probably pull a few of these on the site.

Filippa knows what I'm going to say. Of course. Go pull up a picture of an 03 RAM. We've sold a nice, we've sold a nice red one if you want to pull it up. Yeah, okay, fine. Oh, okay, all right. Oh, that's the wafer truck. Pull up that blue one. Yeah, that much, too. Can you tell the difference between that truck and the one that was purportedly just canceled? The real question is, can you tell the difference between the one that was just canceled and the one that came after it. That's the harder one.

I will say they did a major interior upgrade. I just find it annoying that the domestic manufacturers have just decided that like their pickups look like this and that's what they're going to look like. When I was a kid, when you redesigned a pickup, you redesigned a pickup. Do you remember in 97? No, you guys don't. But when I was a kid in 97, the F-150 was redesigned. Of course I do.

It was a wild thing. Of course. It went from being this square thing that like commercial truck people bought to this like crazy looking swoopy 90s thing that like. Like, divorced dads could buy. And it was great. And everybody, and with the worst crash test, rating, imaginable. Famously.

But here's the thing. In 1994, killed a few people. In 1994, Dodge came out with the second-gen, RAM. And they, that, the styling of that truck changed everything in the pickup truck world. In 1995, Dodge Ram is the best-looking pickup truck of all time. Yep. I remember watching Bill Paxton drive it.

through a house. Correct. And thinking to myself, this is the single coolest thing. And they've, they have stayed with that design language since. If I had that truck right now, I would run over Kennan and be like, yep,

I did it. I mean, what you're going to do? I get run over a lot by digging his pickup truck. Too bad that it's all rusted out or had banned transmission. But when you nail it, that, You really nail it 30 years ago.

Stick with it. Like Lamborghini. You develop a design and then you just kind of stay with it. Yes, looking truck of all time. Okay, give us, speaking of bizarre news stories, Kenneth, this has been the most bizarre news stories. And design that hasn't changed. This is the most insane news story I've ever heard in my life.

So this is a wild one. So recently Bentley Motors filed a patent for a drone that can be deployed from the car to help you find it. Now, this is to help you find your car. in the parking lot because, let's be honest, most Bentley customers are getting on an age and might forget where their cars. But also, allegedly, for emergency services, if there's a problem with the car, you can deploy the drone. It will be. Which is, like being a Bentley, it will break down at some point. And this is one of the patents that they filed that part of the car will fly away and will be a drone.

Now, I suspect that it won't look like a continental GT from years ago and a drone that it looks way bigger than the car. I don't think it will be as wide as the grill in this depiction, but this idea, Bentley, to get into, which I think is one of the most, if true, will be one of the most bizarre features that the Kirkland. Okay. So what we have here and depicted here, we have a UFO attacking in 2007 continental GTC. Correct. I'll tell you, it's tough.

This is bad news. It's really just aiming straight for the end of the day. This is a crazy news story. But let me tell you, can I, I have always theorized the following thing. And it's a brilliant theory, and I'm glad to see it coming to fruition. I have always theorized that when cars became electric, the automakers would have nothing to distinguish the cars from each other unless they had, they started just coming out with crazy features. And so this is a good example. Like the difference in power train and driving experience is all going to start to be pretty minimal.

And so automakers are going to have to start coming out with wild stuff. And I think you will see drones. You will see in-car basketball courts. You will see. I know, you think it's nuts. You're not going to think it's nuts in 20 years, buddy. How big is this car? You're over here like, oh, Doug's an idiot.

We'll be playing, we'll be playing. We'll be playing some horse inside of it. Long, long ago, Doug and I played ping pong in a Hummer. So maybe it's just in the national extension. In Monopoly. No, but I'm serious. Okay, here's my thinking, okay? You like to work out, like, right?

Like, you like to wake up, like, flip, but you wake up and pump on here. You know it. Yeah. Well, what if you could wake up and then while your self-driving electric car drives you to work, that's when you do your workout. Okay. Which in our, in Kenan in my case, involves a nice pickup game of basketball every morning. Can we, so this is also the most Bentley old school does not want to adapt to technology patent manageable. Tesla's vision for the same problem is we'll just have the car come to you because technology has advanced. There's cameras.

There's radar sonar. Bentley's like, no. We're going to have a drone flight. Well, to be clear, I think they put, from what I read, I have to walk to the car. From what I read, it is more, like, if you're stranded to help alert people to where you are, it is like their angle with it, but it will be used to find your car in the mall parking lot is exactly what it will. Why doesn't the drone pick you up?

Oh, I need go to. Let's say you're watching out to the car. The drone is big enough to pick up the car itself. That's a Bentley weighs more than the moon. The drone picks you up like a pterodactal and takes you to the car. Why don't they do that? I'm sorry, Kenan, you said that it weighs one in the moon. The perfect comparison is that I think it weighs more than a new M5.

Oh, nice. No, nothing is that heavy. That's true. Let's not be ridiculous. This is the Bentley drone. How wild. None of these news stories make any sense. Let's move on to other things.

Fleetport, tell me about your headlights. Yeah. All right. I have a 2014 Mercedes E-350 wagon. That's our family daily driver. My wife was coming home from a work trip north of L.A. and she called me and was like, hey, a warning came up in the gauge cluster that says check front left headlight. And then like subsequent ones came up said to check front left indicator light and then front right headlight, etc.

So she came home, fine, I looked at it and a fuse had had blown. And I ordered some fuses and place it and it just blew immediately. Yeah, that's not good. So yesterday I already had an appointment to bring it up to the shop. So they looked at it and they traced it back to the front left headlight. Something is wrong with it that's causing that circuit to just. some we don't know what um so looking into that can i get to try to fix that but that's why i'm frustrated with headlights well that now to be clear recently there was an incident in that car

was six months ago there was a small accident and and that headline was replaced so i'm a little suspicious and have have a call out to the the shop that did that repair work belippo's wife ran into a gardener yeah yeah actually i mean the trunk of a gardener uh but yes um By the way, we have the license plate on that car is a never, never forget 9-11 remembered's plate. And we really think that that gentleman was much friendlier to my wife as a result of that license plate. Well, that's actually the subject of one of the questions from our audience, which we'll get to momentarily.

But regardless, you have headlight problems. And I have a query for the group. On Saturday morning, I have to drive to Northern Arizona. and I will be coming back late late late Sunday night yeah I have three options do I drive a Mercedes where one headlight because the we just got the front left the right headlights so works do I drive a F500 a barth for a thousand miles oh which has horrible you got to run a car you got to run a car dude this is the problem it's exactly what I did this is the problem okay when you're already you're aging out of this and and this is where you're going to go but like people are always like

he doesn't drive beaters anymore, you know, he doesn't have the, that's a normal part. Because at some point, you get to a point in your life where, like, you don't have time to deal with like this kind of crap. With like 14-year-old cars that are worth six grand and the problems that they encounter. Yesterday, I was talking to my wife about leasing. Oh, my God, Philippo. Here we go. Wow, he's going to lose a mock-e. A mock-e, I assume is what you're talking about.

No, but there are some great leads to us right now. We'll talk about it on one of the upcoming podcast episodes. Okay. But I did book a Toyota camera similar, so that'll be exciting. No, it won't. Actually, that is literally the definition of unexcited. And I say that as the first person to have driven the new Toyota camera. Yes, person number 34, I believe.

But yeah, you know, first person. The first person outside of Toyota, okay? Right. And it was memorable. Right. One of the crown jewels in your automotive career. You know, on that subject, I was the first person to drive the new camera. And I remember when I would read magazine articles.

You do have a review of the camera. It hasn't come out yet. But you do. About yet. Yeah. I'm a little far with it. I remember when I used to read magazine articles and they would say, we drove this car long before it was released and the public response was huge.

And I was always kind of like, whoa, driving a car before it's released. wow, that must be so cool. And now that I've done this a bunch of times, I can assure you there is no public response. That was all lies. Those journalists in the 90s thought they were really cool driving like the new Pontiac Grand Am nine weeks before it went on sale. Nobody cared, actually.

Well, they were driving the restyled F-150. That was some real stuff, you know. Well, no, because all trucks now look how they looked in 2004. I only want to do one more talk cars topic because we have a special market report segment coming on momentarily. Kenon, we want to talk about Monterey. You're going to Monterey Car Week. Yes, very excited. Cannot wait.

You're not going with him? I'm not. But a lot of our obedient sales and then other members of our team are going to be there. Well, you should go. Kenon, what are you going to do? You spent two grand to go to the quail. No, so I did not get tickets to go to the quail, unfortunately. We were all, basically everybody I know, including Doug, although Doug was.

They didn't get them because he was lazy and forgot to apply for them. No, no, I just applied. I put the wrong request in. I put the wrong request in. Well, that's that. So. I signed up for an email list instead. Yes.

Yeah, like a complete, like it just, oh, my God, what enough. But yeah, so he's not going anyway. But yeah, no, I did not get tickets to the Quillus year. I did go last year. It was a lovely event. But they, I think they have realized that there is such a secondary market for tickets. They can charge a lot more for them. And they're going to do that.

Christian von Kohn. Sig is going to be at the quail. I saw him waiting for the bathroom. You know, I saw last year. Saw Hirasho Pagani. Yeah, it is cool to be around people. I got to talk to Gordon, man. You're not going to be hobnobbing with Christian von Konigseg?

No, I know. You agree that if you were there, you and Christian would probably have a dinner. You know, the only thing that I would do if I were there would be to find the cars and bids K-car booth to get some photos taken. Yeah, but so, yeah, so the only events we have nailed down for sure, we're definitely doing Concorso Italiano. I've never done it, and I would very much like to. Can you define the events for our listeners or for Felipeo that don't know? Well, that's one where, based on the name, that's a Concord. Caliana was a wonderful Italian car show.

Is it all Fiat Panas? Because I would go. Yeah, no, they have everything. It's mostly sports cars. But if you register to Fiat Panda, they would take you and you could show up. Right. They have some weird stuff there. People bring like 600 multiplas and old 500s and all that stuff.

Yeah, very excited for that one, have never done it before. We're going to a lot of the auction previews is one of the big parts of the weekend. A lot of major auction houses also are there. So we're going to go do a lot of that stuff. We're going to an event that Avant is holding as well, which I'm very excited about. And really, we're spending just a lot of time in Carmel. We just want to be around Carmel and just like see. I think that's one of the great joys is seeing stuff just driving around.

Yes. Kenneth, we're going to the auction previews, but we, cars and bids, are an awesome. auction platform. I will be at some of the auctions as well, to be clear. And Kenan has the pre-deal of all the auctions. It's what you do when you're there. Kenan's going to be recruited away by RM to help them auction Fiat Topolinos. By the way, speaking of RM, they got like career GTs and stuff coming up.

And I'm behind me. We're good. Yep, seen it. Been there. Are you aware, Kenan, that RM is selling a mint green F-40? Yes, I am. Which is horrible. Absolutely horrific.

It's car. I mean, it is our color, admittedly. It's one of our colors. Maybe we should buy that, write that off as a company expense. Slap some cars and bids. It's one of our colors, but I wouldn't paint. I mean, I wouldn't paint. There's a lot of things I wouldn't paint that color that works for us.

That doesn't work for them. It's like how, you know, Felipe can wear his giraffe shirt, but when you put it on an actual giraffe, it doesn't really. It doesn't fit. Yeah. Okay. I want to move on to our next time. Do we have anything more to say about Carweek?

Well, what would you recommend doing? So, like, we're, we just, you like to walk around, go to, like, the parking lots of a lot of these events because they're yeah I don't go to any events I just like to walk around the parking lots and see the cars and what I really try to do this is the real key you try to see a Bugatti and you try to get a picture of it

not with any other special cars behind it you know like get a picture of it next to like an outback and a cord take a picture and then in like a month send the picture to people and be like look what I saw you know because if you send it right away they'll know you saw it car week but if you wait on it you're old people like whoa you saw

a Bugatti damn yeah wait wait to post on visit on Facebook until later on. Right. Yes, exactly. No, those are what you do. I would also suggest going to the racetrack on Saturday to see the old cars race. I'm not a racing fan and I'm not an old car fan but watching a 250

GTO drive in anger and those people really do drive them in anger. Because they're incredibly rich and they don't care. That's very special. Shelby Daytona Coups running. That's very cool. And I suggest going to the concours on Main Street or whatever in Carmel and then watching the tour Delegance because

The thing about one of the releases, I don't really go to the Concord elegance anymore, which is on Sunday because it's so hoity to hoity and stuff, you know what. But on Thursday or something, they do the tour delegance on 17 mile drive and all the cars drive. And if you want to win Pebble Beach, you want to accumulate as many points as possible for your car. And one of the things that adds points to you is if you go on the tour. And so almost every serious entrant goes on the tour. And so you can actually see some of the old cars moving, which in my opinion is almost even cooler than. it just sitting on the lawn next to people wearing cool hats. Can we give one piece of advice to people that are going?

17-mile drive, I find one of the weirdest situations because you have to go through a toll booth to enter. You don't have to go through a toll booth during the car week. Oh, you don't. Okay, I went right before car week. The door booth is still there, but you just lied to them. It's just so weird. Yeah, you just kind of wave.

If you just keep moving, just wave. Hey, man, nice to see you again. Yep, exactly. The year that I, the last year that I went, I had a Subaru press car for some reason. I don't even remember why. and I would just tell the guy I'm here with Subaru he was like all right go ahead go ahead

and at the last day of the event I discovered that Subaru did not have an official presence I never really they were even there they have so many cars like the the automotive community just descends on the peninsula like the whole world there's just so many people said yeah truly

but yeah the box aspires for use even the E339 and 5 just got let through that any issues what about the Jeep carmiganere driving around I'll say we're a Jeep yeah let's tell him you're with Okay, our next segment is the Market Report segment, and we have a special guest today in John Tamarian, who runs curated, one of the finest automotive dealerships in the history of the world with crazy, incredible, amazing cars. And he's here to talk about some cars he's selling on cars and bids and the market in general. Let's do it. Okay, let's start our market report by talking old AMG.

John Tamarian, you're here with us, your dealership curated, one of the finest collections of crazy. automobiles on the planet. You've got this listed with us right now, this 500 SEC AMG 6.0. Please tell us about it. So I am personally in love with this car. Just because we've, for 10 years now, we've been buying pre-merger AMGs.

We've been very lucky enough to own five or six of the original hammers. We've had now probably 10 SECs in different various variations, wide bodies and all these different cars. What I love about this car is you never really find these old tuner cars with their original documents. And I think we've seen one or two other pre-merger AMGs with original AMG paperwork. And we had the opportunity to buy this car from its original owner in Germany, and it came with everything. So he didn't just send it to AMG Germany once. He actually sent it twice.

And it's really cool because if you read through the paperwork, they even Dino tested the engine, which I didn't know was a thing at the time with AMG. And so I just fell in love with sort of the pedigree, you know. And these old tuner cars, I think in my history, in my career, I've seen one other Koenig Testerosa that had a book of paperwork. Because let's face it, these cars went to celebrities, drug dealers. They didn't go to the guy keeping all of his records. Right, right, right.

warrior. And so to see a car that's a real six-liter, documented six-liter. I know there's some questions in the auction about that. But it's documented. We've checked it. And also what's cool is, you know, so the hammer cars have the 32-valve engine. So the big heads, you know, they're called four-cam cars. And they're the higher horsepower. They're the more famous. They historically bring $600,000, $800,000 sometimes. But what I love about this car is, the single overhead cam with the six-liter is actually, it's very reliable. Whereas the hammers and the four-cam cars, they leak, they have issues, the heads are porous. So this is a car that has almost the same horsepower, almost the same experience as the bigger engines,

or I say as the cars with the different heads, but it has the very reliable single overhead cam. And it's a six-liter. So it revs quick, it's fast. And it's just, it's so good looking. You know, honestly, I'm in love. I've driven this car a lot. And I never drive inventory, but it's just so good and it's so cool. It's so cool.

The 500 FCC, the Big Body 126 convertibles all looked pretty cool. But when you take the AMG stuff and you put that on it, it looks like the boss car that you really wanted it to be back then. Yeah, exactly. It's someone you don't want to cut off in traffic in that era. It's just a bad guy drives that car. Mad with that, though, seriously, in Germany in the 80s, I mean, there were all these trashy little hatchbacks driving around, and then some dude had this.

So this was a one-owner car, John? You bought it from the original owner? We bought it from the original owner. He had done some restoration work to the car, so he redid all the wood. He repainted the car. I mean, the car presents so nicely. It does not present, even as a, which 51,000 miles is,

51,000 kilometers is low, but it actually presents way better than that. And it just, it runs beautiful. I mean, it just, you know, that's what's cool about it as well. Yeah, it looks nice inside. The wood, I'm not surprised here has been redone. All these 124s and 126s is the wood would crack. You'd get these long cracks going on. It gets cloudy as well.

They're known for that. So, yeah, he did it. He actually did a very nice job of maintaining the car over the years. And it's honestly, I think someone's going to have a blast with this car. It's just, it looks the part. Yeah, it totally looks apart. So tell us this market, the pre-merger AMG market has kind of, as AMG has grown and become a bigger and bigger and bigger brand and entity and kind of like so many other things turned away from sort of the very early humble beginnings, the humble beginnings have become a lot more interesting and desirable to enthusiasts and collectors. Tell us about what that market is like.

Well, they are. I mean, when you think about it, when we first started, it will be hitting our 10th year this year. I'll never forget. One of my favorite magazine articles of all time was Road and Track. It's the cover. I think it's December 1987, and it's 280 GTO, Roof Yellowbird, AMG Hammer, Kuntash Downdraft. It's all these great cars.

And it's even a, is Dera is in the point. And you see this cover, and I read it as a kid. Now you fast forward and you think it's that, those covers. and it was the roof yellow bird and the AMG hammer that actually broke records at the time. Those cars, those moments that changed the world. You know, to think of the tuning industry, especially for European exotics, started at that moment. And then at that moment when you talk about 29 hammers in the world, you talk about maybe 50 of these SECs with a 6-liter in the world. And today, that same brand is selling thousands.

of cars. So you think of this really special moment. And at the time when we first started, I mean, there were AMG hammers in SECs like this for 20, 30 grand. When Roof Yellowbirds were trading a lot more, they were $500,000 at the time. So we bought our first AMG hammer.

I'll never forget. A young guy, Stephen Duncan Peters, who now works with us, taught me all of the little nuances. We call him AM Genius. And he taught me all the nuances. And, you know, I, it's funny because I grew up, my father's repair shop was down the street from Hartmoot file at Rentek. And Hartmute, if you know a little bit of story of Rentech, was one of the first engineers from AMG Germany to move over to the U.S.

to help the new AMG North America importer to basically bring these cars from Europe and make them popular in the U.S. So imagine as a young kid, here I am, my dad's servicing Lamborghini Kuntas. And I'm seeing these like German muscle cars fly down the street. And I became enamored by them. And it struck me as such a young guy. My dad's like, what are you looking at those stupid cars for? And it just occurred to me, you know, with Stephen's input, I'm like, wait, these cars are way too special. It's such a big impact in the world.

Why are they not being? There was no demand at the time for them. And our first AMG Hammer, we paid $100,000. I sold it for a small profit. I should have kept it. At that far recently, it was the AMG Hammer prototype. We found out afterwards, the silver car that was on the cover of the magazine. And the owner turned down a million dollars.

So, you know, I think these cars are being appreciated now. People are collecting them. There's massive AMG collections that's just so cool to see. But the world is looking at the tuner cars of the 80s. and 90s as now these are coach-built cars of the next generation. I mean, they really are. And they're, man, I could go on and on about this. And AMG is particularly special because then they got kind of absorbed into Mercedes-Benz.

And so there really is sort of this early, very trickle of cars kind of history that then became a gushing. And that's true of so many brands. I mean, you look at basically anything from Ferrari and Lamborghini that used to make a small number of cars and now make a big number. And that small number is very prized, the cars from that era. And it makes total sense that this has kind of started to become really special. One of the interesting things that I've, that always comes up,

whenever one of these cars comes up for sale is, um, provenance. Like it's hard to, there's people out there trying to fake these cars or there are people who in period put on body kits that were, and now it's hard to figure that stuff out. And so that's an important factor with a car like this.

I was looking at the docs and it's pretty incredible to see all that stuff totally agree. Um, but that's kind of a challenging thing. Like, you have to really prove it. It's terrifying. And even, you know, a lot of the cars that you see today are cars out of Japan. And the Japanese car culture was massive during this period in the late 80s and early 90s. Yeah.

And, you know, the question is what are what is how do you verify those cars? Now, today, most of those cars don't have any paperwork. So, so it's very, very difficult. You could fake a car if you wanted to. You could. You know, but something like this, it's just. Again, finding this provenance and documents, you know, we're lucky enough to be around enough experts. It's a cute story. We recently discovered an AMG hammer in Germany. We bought it. We sent it

back to HWA, who's basically AMG's race division. It's led by Mr. Offrecht, the A&AMG. And I said, guys, can you certify this for me? Can you check it out? So they call me back and they're like, well, we determined it's one of the first prototypes. I'm like, how did you do that? The car doesn't have paperwork. They're like, no, one of our employees remembers that he did something underneath the car and his part is still there.

It's just these little nuances today. We're lucky that these people are still with us, but they're still working. They're still in the industry. But beyond that, there's no way to determine what these cars are besides paperwork, besides the original employees. So now is an important time to document these things. I think our job as historians is so imperative for pre-merger AMGs.

Yeah, yeah, totally. And they really are such special cars, and this one is so cool. And it's been interesting to watch this market kind of rise, and these cars finally start to get some real appreciation. Yes. On the subject of cars, you're also selling a couple other cars with us. One of the more interesting ones is a, for Ferrari F-355 race car conversion that you have coming up.

Tell us about this thing. It's so insane. This is probably one of the most absurd cars that we've ever taken on trade. And you know what? Like you sometimes, we run a boutique dealership, but sometimes you just do things that are from your, you know, your gut and your heart. When I saw a video of this car running, I was like, okay, done, I'll take it. And it's probably one of the best sounding cars that I've,

ever heard. Basically years ago, someone took this street 355 car and wanted to go win, basically dominate this challenge series, not the original challenge series, but there was another challenge series that was created later by some really passionate Ferrari owners. And the car was actually owned by the gentleman that also owns the Cannonball Run Kuntash. So he owned it for a long time. And if you look at the records of this car, it is like this insane commitment to build the world's fastest NA 355. And that was the goal.

So carbon fiber door panels, carbon fiber hood. The engine was built with 430 parts. So they basically took this engine. They punched out to over 400 horsepower and changed the compression. I mean, the car is absolutely insane. And it's like the guy spent $300,000 into this car. So it's definitely not something anyone's going to, well, you could drive it on the road. But it's definitely not something, you know, I would recommend to drive on the road.

Because it's like a weapon. It sounds like a sport bike. I mean, it revs quick. It's insanely visceral. And it's just so cool. And it's one of those pieces that I just, you know, when you hear it, you're like, okay I got to have that. That's the ultimate toy. Probably the most absurd toy.

When someone comes to you with a vehicle like this and they want to trade it on something else, how the hell do you put a number on this car? You almost can't. You have to go with your gun. There's no comps and the guy's in it for way more. I mean, he's in it for an insert amount of money. And so that's every 355 to be clear. I mean, if you see how long enough, you get to $300,000 in it one way or another.

You said it. Yeah, you said it. No, so, I mean, it's, I mean, he took a massive loss, obviously. And I was, I think I was very sensitive to that. So I think I did give him a lot for the car. We'll see what it does. I am taking a little bit of, you know, going to Vegas and putting it all on block. But, you know, I think there's someone out there that's as passionate as myself.

That's, you know, I don't need a toy like this right now. But, man, just the sounds this thing makes. and the way it drives is insane. And, you know, if you were crazy enough to put it on the street, you would have the most absurd street car ever. I've never seen it. How do you find all these cars? People come to you because you now have a reputation of having insane cars.

And so you end up with just the, I mean, I follow you on Instagram. And every week you're posting some crazy new car that has come in that my friends all just send each other around. That's true. We do. Thank you. That means a lot coming from you guys. I'm a massive fan of everything you guys do. I'm just a car nerd at the end of the day. And I just sort of let my heart determine what comes to us.

You know, when we first started, no one knew who we were. You know, we had a very small floor plan. And at that time, it was purely chasing. I had to dig and dig and dig. And I was dedicated to just finding really special pieces. That DNA has never changed. I only buy what I love. I only buy what I would own.

I'm not a rich guy. I do have a few cars myself. But at the end of the day, at any given point, we have 30, 40 cars in inventory. Whatever I've paid for, I'm in love with. And that's how I think,

that's the reason we've been successful. I've manifested cars by, you know, saying, I've got to find this. No one's seen it in 20 years. Where is it? and going on a wild goose chase. And through that process, I think the automotive community,

I'm very blessed to say that I think we've been supported enough where now people call us and say, hey, I've got this unicorn. And are you guys interested? So today we have a lot of great things that are coming to us, but I still have a wish list of about 150 cars in the world. Most haven't been seen in 10, 20, 30. 40, 40 years.

Yeah. And when you say, when you say you have a whistle list, you don't mean like Lamborghini Murat. You're talking about that you have VIN, you have specific. Yes. And that's how we started the business. I put a list together of things, pieces that I thought were important and unloved.

And I think it's a big part of our DNA of like, we're a big supporter of the underdog. And one of the reasons why I love you, Doug, is you've done such a great thing in talking about kuntashism, and believing in the kuntash. and and listen kuntashes do not make sense to me the price they are today

the price they were five years ago I mean this is one of the most important cars to ever grace this planet and I just think the way they've impacted people in society I mean whatever you believe or whatnot I mean it embodies the American spirit the American you know dream maker entrepreneurs

I mean I can't tell you how many clients I've met that come to me and say, you know, the reason I went and became a doctor or the reason I went to college was because I had a kuntash on my wall and somebody told me, I couldn't mind. And, you know, I think that the spirit around that car, the magic that was happening at Lamborghini at the time inspired me years ago to say, okay, I need to, I need to like save these cars and we need to get behind special pieces. And that's what I try to do every day when I wake up is say, what's unloved, what's the future, where is the future of collecting going? Yeah. And how can I help?

That's it. Well, it's so cool that you've done that. Like, you were looking at that magazine cover and you ended up having the AMG hammer that was on it. I mean, that's full circle. Right. So I wish I knew that it was that exact bar at the time. So cool. But now, but yes, it is full circle.

Let's talk market because that's, that's, that's, that's. kind of just in general, even beyond the cars that you've got listed with us. What do you think? I mean, the economy, there's been talk now for it's gone on for several years. All the economy's slowing. This is the end. The recession is coming. The car, the craziness in the car market that we all saw in 2021-22 has certainly cooled off. But do you think, what do you think's coming? I mean, for all these cars, where do you think we're going in the next two, five years? What's going to happen in the value of my career, GT? There it is. The real question. here's my opinion i might sound crazy for a second uh and and i'm not i'm i'm this is coming from the

heart so it's not a you know and i'm not a financial analyst uh you know i don't have a crystal ball um but i see a future of this world like we've never seen before um and the reason i say that is when i was a kid my dad was servicing an f50 and we went to a test drive we were at a gas station. We actually picked me up from school that same week and no one knew what this car was. There wasn't a soul. It was a red car. It was very loud. And today, the same effect at a car show, at anywhere you go, there are young people from 16 to 40 years old that can tell you, oh, that's one of 349. Oh, you know, I'll never forget about three years ago. We own. four years ago, we owned a green LP640 manual.

The only coop that was made for the U.S., it was actually Ed Bolian's car. And we had bought it, not from Ed, we'd bought it from the gentleman that he sold it to. And think about this for a second. We had a 12-year-old or 13-year-old walk in our showroom and say, oh, that's one of 32 manual LP640s. That's Ed Bullion's car.

And I'm like, what? Right. I know, so. There is. Instagram has given us, all these things have given us the ability to really learn about all these cars more than the past. And education is everything. Knowledge is everything. And I think we have a younger generation today that looks at these cars, you know, go back 20 years.

The way we looked at assets and wealth was totally different than today. And I don't care where you're at in your life, whether it's a family office that's calling me for an investment advice. Really? Yes, and it's happening today. I never had that 10 years ago. I think you have a massive group of younger individuals that are interested in owning these cars out of passion, but they also love the idea that this is a good asset. You know, you can touch it. You can feel it.

You know, hopefully it's not going to go to zero. And I think people are confident today that they can drive and enjoy a car. If it goes up in value, great. if it doesn't, they still got the experience, and it's a secure asset. And I hate to even use that term because I never really looked at them in that sense, but it is an accepted alternative asset today because of platforms like yours. You see the liquidity, whether the market's going up or down, it's accepted. And you have one factor that most alternative assets do not have, which is passion.

And that cannot be duplicated, replicated, the passion in this community today. You have 80 million users of Grand Turismo from years ago. You have social media. You have YouTube. You have all these different things. The events, we never had these events. Cars and coffees everywhere. So I just think we are in a trend where the 80s and 90s cars that appealed in the early 2000s cars that appealed to the younger generation.

Today, I see three generations chasing the same grouping of cars. and I think that will exponentially grow as time goes on, unless manufacturers completely change the future. But I see a younger generation that are interested in this last generation of analog cars. I think you really hit the nail on the head there. It all comes together, especially with the uncertainty about what the future for automotive enthusiasts are going to look like in terms of electric electrification. They're going to hybrid or the complexities of then owning those cars for long periods of time versus the simplicity of working on a Diablo like we were talking about kind of off-channel. but yeah, it is a perfect confluence of all of those things.

So it's a really interesting time to live through as a car enthusiast. I agree. I agree. And you have more knowledge available today. And knowledge is key. Education is key. Yeah. Totally.

On the subject of passion and purchases, can we talk about Ed for a second? And he's in Sandy. So Ed Bolian, a friend of ours. I lived in Atlanta when Ed was like just the Lamborghini sales. You knew him back then, too, I guess. but none of us were anything, you know. And but now he's, he's been wiki, he's killing it and I'm doing this. And he just bought a Bugatti, which is, in my opinion, one of the craziest things.

I've looked into those cars. I thought about getting one of those when I got my career GT and I looked into the servicing cost and it's just unbelievably terrifying. But Ed has actually taken, I mean, he drove, I watch his video. He took it to your place and stored it there for a couple of days. You saw this thing. Is he as crazy as I think he is? No. I mean, to a certain extent.

I think he knows he's slightly crazy and we can all agree that Ed is slightly crazy. But that's part of his genius. And I think that, I think that, listen, the Veyron, US cars are very rare. Then you have the fact that it was, for a generation, that is the most impressive and significant car.

I think when you think about the prices of Ferrari hypercars and supercars, it doesn't make sense that a Veyron can still be bought less than $2 million. I agree. I think that Veyron is undervalued, but I am terrified by the ownership cost. And I think that's the reason it's undervalue. Yeah, and 100%. And I think anybody should be terrified by the ownership cost of the Vaghan.

Bugatti recognizes that, too. I mean, like, with the Shiron they came after, part of the point was they want to make it a lot easier to live with. And, like, that's the reality. When I went to the Shiron launch, that's one of the first things they told me. They said, we wanted this car. because some of those the reputation had kind of grown online about this cost this much and it really has scared people away on the secondary market and I think they were sensitive to that.

I think you're 100% right. I think Bugatti continues needs to continue to support those cars and come up with better plans. I mean, it'll only help the value of the newer cars as well. They have to create a network. You know, Ferrari's done an incredible job of creating a community and a network. But again, I think the Veyron is a titan from that generation. I think they're super cool. They're probably terrifying to own.

I'm sure every time Ed opens the door and turns on the key, he says a, you know, he says a prayer. But, you know, the reality is, listen, I think they're super undervalue. I mean, that's relative saying. And listen, any of those cars in that, let's just say, in that category. are going to be somewhat expensive to maintain. You know, the Bugatti is, it does set a precedent, but nothing is going to be, you know, affordable at this point to maintain, you know, with the exception of honesty, the Lambo

product I love, because a Mercilago and a Diablo is, it's not that expensive to maintain. I agree. And I'm surprised that the Kuntosh is not crazier than it is, too. In fact, I have a suspicion that my career GT is going to cost me more to own than my Kuntash well. It was contrary to the reputation of those cars. We'll see. You're good with the clutch. The clutch is set. You've done the suspension stuff. We'll see. I think you're set for a while, but I have a buddy who, just by chance, who also just bought a Veyron, just some guy I know, not a YouTube or anything. He bought it a month ago. And he told me that the four-year maintenance

plan is $55,000 and a four-year warranty is $240,000. They will sell it to you, but it's $240,000 if the car is deemed certifiable. God, it's a 360 challenge Gerdaali. It's a really, really nice car to get a day running. Right. Yeah. What are ridiculous thing. Where do you see that market?

You think those things are going to are going to go up as long as Bugatti continue to support them? Yes. I think as long as Bugatti supports it, I think as long as, you know, you look at the price of the new car, I mean, I think it's a $5 million. Um, you know, so I think that doesn't hurt it. Um, you know, I mean, that sounds so insane to even say. Yeah.

Um, and, and I think again, you know, the Veyron started the hypercar movement. It did. I don't care what you say. Um, so I think just as a pure collectability, um, and it is actually, besides the maintenance costs, it's actually pretty usable. Um, yeah, they're easy to drive. You know, you could go to dinner with your wife in it. It's not, you know, it's not going to give you any. pickups or anything like that. So that's the party piece of that car is that it is it is ultimately it can do the performance, but it can also be a Bentley around town.

And that's that's what makes it so special. And I always compare it to an Enzo. I mean, there's 399 Enzo's in the world. Ferrari did produce more. I think it's like 500 or 550. But when you do the numbers, an Enzo today is 3.5 to 5.5. So how is a Varon not the same? It doesn't make sense.

No, I agree. Like to your point. point, like we were discussing, I've said it many times when I stand by, that it is the concord of our generation. In terms of automotive engineering, it represents a zenith, and also it brought Bugatti back into the cultural zeitgeist. The EB-110 is really obscure, and the pre-war cars are a whole other thing. But, like, people know what a Bugatti is because of that car. Totally. Kenan, we're going to regret. We should be hoarding Veyrons. We should sell all the cars that are such useful consumer advice from you yet again. Just everybody hoard your Veyrons.

Well, because let me tell you something. You go on, here's a story. sorry for you, John. I went on, I subscribed sports car market, and I was reading back through McLarenf 1 sales in sports car market. And in like 2013, there was a sale of one at Monterey, and a guy paid three and a half. And sports car market analyzed the sale and said, this was the highest price ever paid. And 2008, I don't know what it was, highest price ever paid. And and it's a really a lot of money, but it's a very special car. Maybe this guy, maybe the buyer knows something that the rest of us don't. And he did. He did. He did. And now I'm sitting here like, am I going to have the same regrets about not just hoarding

Vance? Because how do you know? I mean, Veyron, why is Veyron not like the McLaren F1? It didn't win Lamont, but it is the fastest car in the world. It did start the hypercar thing. It was the coolest thing for an entire generation of people, much like the McLaren F1. How does it become a $20 million car someday? I could see that happening.

Listen, if there's any car that it's possible, it's definitely a special variant of the Bayron. I completely agree. I think it's a it's you guys nailed it. Concord of a generation. It is. I mean, it's completely, uh, it was a game changer. It really was. And just like the Concord ludicrously expensive to take care. Out of commission. Out of commission. That's right. All right. Well, John, I really appreciate you coming on our podcast and I appreciate you talking car market with us and selling some very cool cars on cars and bids. Thank you so much for being here. Thank you so, so much.

It's an honor to be here. I'm a massive fan of everything you do. Thank you. And the entire car community, thanks, you guys. And you. And all your crazy inventory and reminding us that some of these crazy cars still exist. Thanks, guys. Bye, John.

Have a good one. Bye, guys. Okay, next up, time for the Q&A. Questions, questions. Remember that you too can ask questions by going to Cars and Bids.com. Click on the community tab, and then there's a post that says, Here is where you post your questions for the podcast. Now, this week, because our market report segment ran long,

we're only going to do a couple questions, but we have, we're going to do more questions next week, even more, a larger number. So we're going to start with some questions. Why are you confused, Filippo? My audio is cut out fully, but then it's back. Filippo's confused about time. All right, there's 60 seconds in a minute. Okay, so we're going to do three questions.

Three is it, Filippo. You ready? Ready. Question number one. from C-R-A-D-D-A-T-Z-M, what's the best, what would be the best place for a road trip and which car would you choose, Kenan? In the U.S. or just internationally or whatever?

No, globally. Anywhere you want. Oh, I've, like you, I've always jumped of driving my own car in Europe. I think that would be incredibly cool, doing a grand tour in my own car. But really, I think my friend Jeff came up with this idea. I'd love to buy a Ferrari 550 modernello in Europe, a European one. Drive it around Europe for a month and then send it back. That would be like my ultimate dream in C.

Italy and southern France and like all the beautiful places and I think that would be the dream. I'm going to also go with Italy. A tour of Italy has so many incredible roads and beautiful places. And what car would I choose? I feel like I'm inclined to go for like something hot hatchy for that. Wow, we take very different from just to Italy. I think about it, especially the places I like to go, which are a lot of smaller towns. There's lots of really tight technical roads where a small, nimble, fun car would do really well.

But I'm going to pull up in front of a restaurant, and the restaurant was going to come out to take pictures with my car because I thought out. I don't go to restaurants where I can just pull up in front. You go to small town, you park, you go to a pretend. It's a pretend question. You don't have to be practical. Kenan answered the question correctly. There's no other answer.

Felipe's wrong. It's a pretend. I don't go to restaurants. In this scenario, you can eat cheese. If I were able to park outside the restaurant, I would choose somewhere else. I like, no. Okay, all right. Have fun in your jeans.

Oh, my God. Okay, next question from Big Ultima Hater 6. What is the best car from an underwhelming brand? Either is an obvious answer. Go ahead, give yours. Cadillac CT5V Blackwing. Yeah, that's a great answer for Liefeld. Thank you.

That is a great. There's a lot of these, actually, I can come up with, but I'm going to give you the best if you want to hear it. I don't know. Sure. What's the best? XJ220. Oh, that is pretty exciting.

Hard to argue that. Oh, well, no, not nearly on the same level, but bubbling. A Buick Grand National. That was a car that was like stood out so much. Grand National is a good one. NSX, to be honest. Yeah, great. Hey, hey, don't call the Accura MDX underwhelming.

The Accura MDX is so deeply and raucously underwhelming that I have already forgotten what car we're talking about. If it were hybrid and it had a great lease deal, I would lease it. Hey, dude, there's an MDX type S. There is. You can even get it in Tiger Eye. That's a color, Kenan. Thank you. I figured that out.

It's like a goldish, orangeish situation. Yeah, it's a kind of thing Philippo would like. What other GMC Typhoon? That's another good one. I'm trying to look for underwhelming brands. Oh, Kenan, here's a good one that Felipe has never heard of. Nissan R390 G2. Great choice.

Actually, R34 Skyline is a pretty good one. Oh, yeah, yeah, that was true. I don't know why this falls in my head, Renault Turbo 5. That was probably a good one. an underwhelming brand. Remember the fluence? Right, right, right. But the mid-engine rally brand.

By the way, Ken, you know, Filippo screwed me over on the European Car Challenge. He told me the fluence was all electric. And he said, what engine's in it? And I was like, I don't know, a front-mill drive four-cylinder. And he was like, no, it's electric. And guess who was actually correct? It wasn't the guy given the questions.

It was the guy answering them. No, now I'm looking at this up. The fluence, I swear, was all-electric in Europe, maybe? It was an electric version, but like most of them were front-mill-wheel-drive-hane four cylinders like every car in your house. I apologize. Okay. Last question, and this one is from Noodle the Dog.

What do you think is the worst value car on sale today? Not the worst car on sale, but the car that makes you go, how does this thing cost this much money? The infinity QX80. Actually, infinity. That's a great one. It's not correct. Kenan.

It's not the best example, but our friend Kevin had an I4 recently an I4E drop. 30 is the 30 I was the $65,000 car and I tell you it felt like the best 30,000 well like nice 30,000 dollar car it's 65 I like the effort great and I think you need to change your perception of what cars cost because 30 grand ain't buying me 540 more are you gonna go for the BMW xm is the worst night on see out today the BMW xm given its performance and quality and styling should cost 64,000 dollars and instead it costs like 1904,000 it's three XM overpriced. That car is utter

trash. Yeah, I've been sealing it in a while, which is a blessing. Do you remember, though, some of the specs, like red with gold? Of course. Yeah, the red is the worst. Gold is bad, but the red is egregious. That's really aggressively bad. Absolutely hang.

But isn't that the correct to answer? Yeah, XM. I stand by mine. Well, at least it won something, huh? You know what's another good answer? Audi A8. here's a question for you that's not one of the Q&A questions question for you Felipe do you think Audi redesigns the AA

is a question whether they will redesign or whether they will claim that their minor facelift is a redesign because they already have done that that's a thing I know so so they're on I mean again right so the question is like at this point they're not going to get away with it again do they just cancel it outright because no one's buying it here's the thing they will get away with it again because they just re-faceded the Q7 and call it the new Q7 It's been around for 10 years. It came out in 2016.

Hey man, if it ain't broke, don't fix it. Look at the Challenger. That thing was on sale for 25 years and Kenan still's trying to buy one with this. I don't think there's a next generation. Unless,

actually no, I'm going to take that back. EVs change everything in like manufacturer economics. It's so much cheaper to develop a different car on the same like skateboard. Yep. Maybe.

That's a good point. How many do they sell in China? What's that? How many do they sell in China? Well, just because they sell in China doesn't mean they have to still sell anywhere else. I mean, if the U.S. market is decided, we want SUVs. We want SUV. Which is why they've kept the Q7 going for eight years without a single redesign.

I don't buy that for a second. There was a new Q7. I reviewed the new Q7 when it came out. Which I generally think was 2016. Is that true? The second generation. 27, yeah, 2016. Yikes on a stick.

But they're still selling them, dude. They're still selling them. Yeah, and they just refreshed it or redesigned it or wherever they're climbing. I'm going to pull up Q7 sales figures. Let's see how they're doing. I think they're probably still doing pretty well. Our producers, I think, thrilled by this talk of a conversation. No, they're not doing all that well.

They need to sell more. You don't happen. They came out with that Q8, and that Q8 was really desirable. The Q1 came out six years ago, too, and they haven't redesigned it. And the Q5 came out 30. 13 years ago or something like that. And they haven't read it. The Q5 came out for like 09 and I swear it's the same.

It's not, but it really feels like it. Okay. We're on Audi crossovers. Eventually Emily will own a Q5 because I think. No, she will know no Audi's. She either will have owned a Q5 or will currently own a Q5 when you meet her. So you always be allowed to be around it. I'm not wrong.

Or a Tigwan or a Tigwan. It's one of the two. The Tigwan is what people who later buy a Q5 have before they get married. There is a stunning amount of truth of that sentence. That, that or Jeep Renegade. Yeah, that's true. Okay, we're over time. Kenan is over us.

It's time to end the best podcast we've ever done. Goodbye, everyone. Goodbye.