THIS CAR POD! with Doug DeMuro & Friends! - Why Hoonigan Went Bankrupt? The Lamborghini Gallardo is Cheaper Than a 911!

Episode Date: September 13, 2024

Have a question you want answered on the podcast next week? Ask HERE https://carsandbids.com/community/podcast Welcome to THIS CAR POD! Doug DeMuro & Friends offers weekly expert insight and opinion, on the breaking automotive stories, the car market, and audience Q&A. LISTEN HERE- Spotify - https://spotify.link/RHKZoB8ebIb Apple Podcasts - https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/this-car-pod-with-doug-demuro-friends/id1737487546 WEBSITE & MERCH! http://www.dougdemuro.com FOLLOW CARS & BIDS! YouTube - @carsandbids Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/carsandbids/ TikTok - https://www.tiktok.com/@cars_and_bids Twitter - https://twitter.com/carsandbids FOLLOW ME! Twitter - http://www.twitter.com/dougdemuro Instagram - http://www.instagram.com/dougdemuro Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/ddemuro Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hello and welcome to this car pod. I'm Kenan. I'm Felipe. And today we're joined by our crazy friend Nick. I killed Doug. No, no, he did not kill Doug. Doug is just fine, but he is driving back across the country in his Toyota, Sequoia, TRD Pro with all of his stuff and noodle. So he couldn't be here today, so we're going to carry on anyway.

Welcome, Nick, happy to have you. The show must go on. I'm excited to be here. Plus, we can't find Doug. All the camo on the car, really. That's right. It's hard to find them. Yeah, those camo fender flakes. Yeah, they had the car. But we're going to follow the same format as usual.

We're going to start with the news. Filippo, take it way. We're going to start by talking about the Hoonigan bankruptcy, which is kind of a misnomer because really they were purchased, in addition to being a private equity company by a company called Wheel Pros, that has a lot of other companies that now does business as Hoonigan. But Nick, tell us more about it.

This is interesting. I love modern cars, much of the chagrin of some of the group here. WheelProz owns pretty much every aftermarket wheel company could think of Rhodiform, Method, KMC, TSW, you name it. Like, if you have aftermarket wheels on your car, it's like an 80% chance that they produce them.

Wild. The Autopian had a great article about the bankruptcy, and they listed a lot of the brands. It is just a wild number of brands that they've acquired over the last however many years. It's not super surprising that they're filing for bankruptcy, given that. Like, they clearly, what ends up happening is you acquired these companies

with a bunch of private equity money, you make it work on paper by saying, if all of these brands grow X percent. If we somehow magically double sales for all of these, then we'll be profitable. Well, it turns out you can't, or it's not that easy, or they weren't successful at doing it,

and now you own Forge American Racing, Kancy Wheels, niche, performance replicas, rotiform like you said, Smitty Built, XD Wheels, which is on every questionably modified Wrangler, fuel off road.

They own all these companies. It's not super surprising. They weren't super, they weren't successful and that they have a ton of debt from all the purchases. Yeah, I mean, I think there were a lot of hot takes on Instagram that were pretty bad. Yeah. Like, people were surprised how does Hoonigan, who makes like hoodies and stickers get $1.5 billion in debt? But like Hoonigan probably wasn't even losing money as the brand.

Right? It's all, it's this portfolio of 40 brands. They also own a lot of like off-road lighting and lift kits and like, you name it. And I think like anytime you have a portfolio of brands, there's going to be winners and losers. And you just hope, like, hey, some of the brands are doing really hot and offset the ones that are not doing so well. But if you have a bad year and all of them do poorly, then it can get kind of dicey. Yeah. And it's, I want to repeat it because I think it's important.

It's WheelPro's LLC doing business as Hoonigan. They purchased the Hoonigan brand that we know that all this, and then rebranded their main holding company as Hoonigan. And that's who's filing for bankruptcy. And there's also two kinds of bankruptcy, right? And I think most people know this, but like, there's the, we're completely dissolving and going away. And there's the, hey, just like, give us a second to get our feet. We want to restructure our dad. And then, like, we're going to continue on.

This is more of like a paperwork thing to appease our creditors. So, like, they're not going away. Like, I think this is just, like, business as usual. And I think the other hot take was, like, oh, PE is terrible. We hate private equity. But, like, private equity also can, like, help some of these brands grow. Nick is coming out with a pro private. equity, which I mean, as a company that had a majority investment from a private equity company,

support it. We do a lot of marketing for PE back companies. And like in some circumstances is good, some it's bad. It's just like the hot take of like all PE is bad is like, yeah, as stupid as it sounds saying it aloud. Now, Wheel Pros or Hunigan and clearly capital, their private record company that invests in majority of money has done some questionable things, right? They've lost a lot of talent. Hunigan is the most visible branch of that. They've lost a lot of talent there.

They made a lot of decisions that don't tend to. do just make a lot of sense and frankly don't probably make a lot of sense in the market that they were competing. So it's not like they're blameless here certainly, but I do kind of agree. You won't really see a difference. Fuel is still going to sell you those wheels and parts. All the brands, I think, will continue to be around for at least a while. Yeah. Well, and remember, BBS and Ricaro have had bankruptcies this year, parts ID, which you might not know, but they make their car ID also had a bankruptcy. Like, really? For whatever reason, aftermarket automotive seems to be hurting.

You don't say. I actually don't know why. I mean, maybe you do. It's such a disposable income kind of thing, right? Like, you're only going to buy modifications for your car if you have money to buy modications for your car. Us VW Vortex OGs, all right? That last check, that last penny I have, our friend Sam, he once sold a, what was it,

a set of wheels to a guy who's like, I use my severance check to buy these wheels. I'm unemployed. And you're like, are you sure this is like what? you should be using your severance for, but us people who like to mod our cars, we're different kind of crazy. That's such a good point. Same tax returns are like a boon to the aftermarket because everyone's like, oh, I got like 800 bucks from the government.

That'll buy me a tune and an intake. I bet that half of their companies are waiting for April 15th. If I can make it until the middle of April, we'll be back in it. I wonder if they all got fat and happy off stimmy checks during COVID. And now they're like, oh, we're comping negative year over year because like there's no free government. They were also acquired during a time when everybody was really hard to buy a new car. You maybe wanted to keep your current car for longer, like change something by your current car. You maybe had the supposed to income. You couldn't really leave your house. And that was not the best time,

I think, to probably acquire a parts company. Well, the takeaway here, everyone, go mod your cars, support your favorite aftermarket manufacturers and... Or don't leave them alone. And buy a different car and sell your current car. Just leave your car alone. You spent $17,000 from replacing under body panels. Maintenance. Maintenance. That's maintenance that's not modifications. Modifications ruin cars. Maintenance keeps a car the way it's supposed to be. Do you want to go deep on the modifications on your M5, Kenon?

We can do it live. There are so, the reliability modifications. I recognize that there are some modifications that improve the reliability of cars, but they are far and few between, and I'm sure most of those companies are not the kind of modifications I would approve of. But we'll move on. Yeah, we can stop being a business podcast. Yeah, exactly, exactly.

Okay, we're moving on to my story next. This is the Hyundai NVision-704. Now, this was released in concept form, and the internet went crazy. For those of you who are unfamiliar with this car, it looks so cool. It looks very like a modern take on a group B car, is the way I would describe it. And it is cool. In theory, it was going to have, it was going to be a hydrogen turbo-powered car. I'm still not entirely sure exactly how that works.

But it was going to have 670 brake horsepower and 664 for pounds of torque. So it was going to be like a very serious car. Hyundai's idea with it was they were going to make a play for. or like a super car-ish. Like their idea of what a super car. They're LFA, if you will. Yeah. Yeah, exactly.

But the crazy thing is that they've said they're going to put this car into production by 2030, which is, if you haven't checked your calendars, as Doug said, tomorrow. And so it's like, wow. And I'm skeptical that they do build it. I think it would be cool. It would be difficult to sell. I mean, what Hyundai dealers should be sold this car at? I don't think, I think Hyundai is in a state right now where they are.

are willing to try things, especially, they say it's going to be hydrogen. It's be honest, it's going to be an electric car. You know, it's hydrogen fuel cells and electric motors. It's going to be one of the, right, like, when they actually build it. And by the way, they didn't say they were going to build it. It showed up in a dealer presentation. They have these, like, every manufacturer has these dealer meetings every year where they show off, like, upcoming inventory.

This was included. So we're all hoping. But they don't need to sell many, right? It would be very much a halo car for them, a couple hundred thousand dollars. But, like, it might work. as a halo car. But a couple hundred thousand dollars for a Hyundai. It might work as a halo car, though.

I mean, it's so cool. I just find it. But the people who like it are enthusiasts. Yeah. I don't know that enthusiasts. Yeah, Hyundai wants more of them. But I don't think that enthusiasts are going to spend a couple hundred thousand dollars on a Hyundai, admittedly. I think like the, I think their N-line is generally very good.

And those are accessible, cool cars. And we see them with frequency. You really? I haven't seen a, I didn't. I saw one next drive then yet. I haven't seen that on the road yet, but I've seen, I've seen a luncher ends around. and I've seen stuff like that. I think they just are trying to do that more.

Like I think they're they want that reputation and... Yeah. And this is just... It's damn cool. Their design is so good. Yeah, the design is really struck out of the park. So I don't know. I would love it if they make that.

We'll certainly see it's nebulous if it will actually come into existence. Again, I suspect not, but... I kind of love when manufacturers that otherwise sell a lot of Santa Fees and Tucson's, then come out with things like this. It shows that there's a lot of excitement. I think it shows that they're giving their engineer some room to explore. And I think that that's fun. Well, I like bold stuff like this.

I hope they build it. I hope we see them in our Hyundai showrooms and, you know, next to whatever lease is like good, you know, next to that car. The point of a Halo car is a marketing exercise, not necessarily to move units. So it's working. We're talking about it. It's working already. I can already picture it a car week, like just sitting there on, you know. I can see it.

I mean, you've got to think eventually with EVs, and they can share the skateboard, the underlying components. Like doing custom one-off bodies and throwing Brembo's on it won't actually require a $300,000 cost of manufacturing per... Unless they actually do the hydrogen thing they say they're going to do, which is... Questionable. It would be intense.

Renault, by the way, we don't have this as a new server. Renno last week, T's like... They're doing a bunch of one-off cars using an electric platform. One of them that they announced last week is a car from the late 70s that they sold very few of and only in Europe, but that they did not sell well then, but it looks cool now. So I think that they're not alone

and trying to figure out, like, how do we try something new here, now that we can do it without developing everything from scratch? Good luck to Renault. That sounds even crazier than that, so. Yeah, good luck. Well, it's really cool,

and I certainly hope that they build this car and we'll see it in Hyundai showrooms everywhere. Moving on. All right. Lucid has said that they're going to build a sub-50,000-dollar SUV. So they have the Lucid Air, which has been around for a couple years, and sells poorly, but it's really cool. They have over the last year been talking about the gravity, which is going to be their large SUV.

A few people have seen it in person. They've done reveals. We know that that's coming out later this year, in theory. Yes, we know that very well. I'm just learning this right now, but it's well-known fact. It's a new car, and you live in two, three. The automotive note has peaked in 2010. You know, I'm refreshing the Lucid website every day and just seeing what they're putting out.

So they are coming out with a larger SUV called the gravity. And then they just teased earlier this week that they're going to be making a sub-50,000, like small mid-sized SUV. And we know nothing else about it except that it'll be under $50,000. And they're clearly very proud of the design based on the... There have been questions for a long time about what else Lucid would build. They started out with a sedan, which was maybe the wrong call. Everybody wants SUVs, why lead with the sedan? although I had great, I mean, every review of the Lucid Air is generally positive, except for

from owners where it broke down. And the price in general. And the price is kind of hefty. The gravity will be like an EQS competitor, memory server, Model X-ish, Volvo EX90 competitor, and this will be smaller. Rivian R2 sized in theory and sub-50,000, which is where you get the mainstream folks actually may be interesting. Nick would buy a $50,000.

SUV once it's worth $10,000, which is a year. Yeah, I guess it comes out. It'll be interesting. I'm glad they're building more cars. They, in my head, Lucid has led the market in like electric motor development. They have the smallest motors, they have the size of their way once. They can do the most. The Lucid Air Sapphire is really cool.

I just want them to be successful and hopefully having a car that people actually might want to buy will help them with that. Yeah, it's kind of an important thing when you're a manufacturer. I want a car that people buy. Yeah. Yeah. You know, I'm, I don't, you know, I am surprised of the number of lucids that I see in general in San Diego, despite how expensive they are. I mean, I understand San Diego is a relatively wealthy place, but like, they're around.

I know because they use laser to scan the road, and my laser detector goes off. And if it's a place where it would not be likely with a police officer, I'm like, oh, must be a lucid. And boom, there it is. So seeing those around is encouraging in general in this market, because we see everything that's new here, and EVs in particular. And I suspect we'll see tons of these, as long as the price point's good, and they can be,

and they're, like, good to live with. And as long as they actually make them. And as long as they actually produce them. It is interesting. I mean, they're following the Tesla playbook identically, right? Start with the Model S luxury, then the Model Y luxury. I then do your Model X, or then go to the Model Y, yes, for the... Right.

The question is, like, charging 170 or whatever they do for the sedan. Like, they started as a luxury brand, and if they're going to go sub-50, are they still a luxury brand? Are they changing that positioning? Like, how does that work? I think there's still a luxury brand. I mean, every, Mercedes will try to sell you a GLA thing,

SUV thing for $35,000. Yeah, but I'd say $180 for a sedan. You're like a my box. Do you know how much a lucid air actually costs? Like the not Sapphire, the Sapphire is $200,000 or whatever it is. But do you know how much a base model air or lucid air cost? No.

$71,000. Do you know how much you can lease one for? $600 a month. I think I saw on Facebook. Without a single doubt. Yeah. Yeah. They've come down market.

That's reasonable. Yeah. 600 bucks. 50 grand for a small SUV or small mid-sized. That's, I'm sure where you live and where we live here and like the San Antonio Tendigo, you see a lot of new mid-sized luxury SUVs. The question will be EVs are softening. Ford can't move Machis to save their life despite it being basically the exact same

segment and price point. So is lucid? too late to the party with this. Like, can they copy Tesla's strategy seven years later and expect the same results? Right. And why would you go out? Like, what is the situation where somebody's recommending that you go by a lucid? It needs to be very much styling and experience-based. Maybe there's just a lot of big Aramco and Saudi fans out there. Like, I don't know. It's, they're beautiful. I will say the future of EVs is going to depend on design, because everything else is largely going to be identical. Lucid gets it. They're making beautiful cars. That's so gorgeous.

Everyone else is either making like garish ugly EVs or they're making them like the Ford Lightning where like, unless you know, you would just assume it's a regular car. Can you pull up a photo of a lucid gravity? I want to know whether Nick likes it or not. I thought it looked great from the image I saw thinking it was a concept car, not realizing it. It's not. Or rendering on Instagram. It's like out. The back's a little funky, but I can live with that.

The front looks just like the sedan only like you stretch and Photoshop to make it taller. Go to the side profile shot, Kenan. It came up for me on... Yeah. A little funky. Into it, not into it? Eh, not great. It's fine.

It's not offensive or anything. It's fine. I'm excited to see what in person. There have been some first looks. A few YouTubers did early, early reviews last year, about a year ago. So I'm excited for them to, in theory, start deliveries soon. I'll just say I've warmed up to the new M3 and the giant So I think I can warm up to that rear three-quarter haunch thing that it has going on there.

If you can do that, you can do anything. That's right. That's right. That's right. You can do anything. It's so true. All right. Moving on to our next new story, Bentley.

Yeah. Bentley has a new flying spur. And yes, they do claim that this is a new generation of the flying spur. Well, there's evolution of a, like, a very subtle pace, and then there's just, like, couldn't tell you. They're calling this the fourth generation flying spur. And as you can tell, a lot of change. is full redesign. The only thing I can tell is on the fender,

there are two humps behind the headlights. And the headlights changed. Wow. They look the same, but they're different. For the listeners, we're looking at a 2014 or newer Bentley flying spur. Allegedly, it's a new version, but no one can tell. The reason that it's notable, and we're talking about it all, is, first of all, they released this with a video

where two different flying spurs were racing around a track. I watched this video for some reason. two people landed in helicopters on a track, got out. They had chauffeurs that were holding doors open for them, and they got in and said drove. They were racing drivers. I don't know who they are. Their chauffeurs raced them?

No, no, no. Their chauffeurs got on the back seat, and they drove the car around the racetrack, and we're doing a whole lot of slides. Huh. Because this is Bentley's ultra-performance hybrid that they just announced as part of this. So there's a plug-in hybrid V8,

uh, 4-liter twin turbo V8, and then a 26-k-0-25.9-kilobytes. watt hour battery pack. They'll give you 47 miles in the European range, so that's like 30 in the US range. And 771 horsepower, 738 pound feet of torque, and 3.3 seconds zero to 60 time. But it might be replacing the W12. So I think they're, my understanding is that there's not any more W12 flying spurs, but you can get a whole share of high performance, go racing, flying spur hybrid V8. That's going to do worse than that Hyundai we mentioned before. There's big sedans are dead.

They don't care, though. Sporty sedans are dead. Who's buying this? Nobody. Bentley doesn't care. They need like five people to buy it a year. They will. I guess.

I mean, they would be way better off developing their SUV range or doing any number of other models. Yeah, but they do. I mean, those sell, but when you think about, like, you know,

some car brands have to sell a small cars to make their super car. Bentley builds the Continental GT in cars like this. That's their version of a super car. Like, they don't. That's kind of the crowd. Yeah, I agree that. I also bet that in cities that have requirements where you need to have an EV or a plug-in hybrid to go into city centers without playing a specific tax

or where they need to meet a certain requirement, like emissions requirements, this helps them do that. And then you can pull up to your office in the Financial District of London in this, not have to pay the use tax in London because it's a plug-in hybrid you can do an EV mode. And then you can go out and do it's 3.3 seconds here at 60s. Look, the only people buying this are the private equity guys. A hundred percent. Putting Hunigans in a bankruptcy. So it is over. No one will buy this both because they can't tell the difference from the previous generation as well as like if you want a sedan, you want like a roll, something luxurious.

What do you think is this is a sporty car? You get a sports car. This is neither well. It's a flop. But imagine how it would look with some fuel off road wheels. Yes. Dead on arrival next story. Yep.

I don't think that you understand Bentley's demo. I was driving a 1939 Rolls-Royce race last week. Right. He kind of, well, he's Bentley, 2000. 2014's demo. Yeah, I actually, what's interesting is the first-gen Continental GT and Flying Spurs,

the Flying Spurs are cheaper, even though they have two extra doors and otherwise should be a better... I love how's good looking. If I were obscenely wealthy, I'd consider one. All right. Especially now that has a plug-in hybrid.

My requirement for the next car is that it's a plug-in hybrid. And if I had two wheels, I'd be a bicycle. But, you know, this isn't the case. One of the great moments of television. Exactly. Moving on to the next story, this one is mine. So we're talking about the Hennessy F5-M.

So this is Hennessy's supercar that they're building, and what's interesting about the F5-M-M is crucial. It's crucial because that stands for manual transmission. So these cars are going to have gated six-speed manual transmissions, and they're touting this car as the fastest gated manual transmission car in the world. What a specific set of rules. Yeah, what a really specific niche thing. to attempt to...

Yeah, and I'm the fastest guy in this office named Filippo. Like... Well, it's a shot at Pagani, I would assume, with the Utopia. Is that gated? The Utopia? It has the transmission they can do either, technically. You're thinking of the conning's egg, I believe.

Yeah, whatever. But anyway... Rich people toys. Right. But, so they're going to build 12 of these, allegedly. They're going to cost $2.65 million each, and it still makes 1,817 horsepower

from its 6.6-liter, twin-turbo-charge V8. Now, I love manual transmissions. I've never owned an automatic car. I'm very proud of this. John. That kind of power will be hard.

It will be difficult with a manual transmission. That's a lot to think about. And I believe it's real world drive as well. So like... I mean, remember when like the SMG and F1 and E-gear transmissions came out and they're like, oh, it's because the car is so much power that a manual really couldn't handle it.

Like, this is going to be, it'll be really fun. Like, I think it's the right move. but it might actually be one where the automatic is a better car to drive. Yeah. So you both are coming out against all current supercars having manuals ever. No. Because every supercar at this point has a thousand horsepower. Not 1800, though.

What's the difference? It's like a jet plane at this point. Once you're out 1,000, 800. I'm kind of against cars with that kind of power, generally speaking, because you just can't use it. It's not enjoyable. Like, it's fun to brag about to your other rich friends. that oh my car has, you know, my car's 1,800 horsepower.

But, like, the reality of it is, is that, like, I would just rather have a car with 500 horsepower in a manual transmission and have fun on the road. To me, that's way more appealing than something that is going to be terrifying. How fast do you think you can get in first? Like, if you really... Better have good traction control. Better have great traction control.

And I wonder how much... I wonder how wide the rear tires have to be. Yeah. Also, how long are these gears to... Well, and how robust is the clutch? I mean, it must be like, it must be just bulletproof. I mean, otherwise, or maybe it's like the end zone and it'll go through clutches in 1,500 miles, but or whatever. How much power does the Utopia have?

I don't remember, exactly. I wish them luck. I mean, American hypercar manufacturer. 852. They also tune GMT 800s and push superchargers on them. Like, I desperately want a Hennessy suburban. Yeah, yeah, you do. But, like, I hope eventually this trickles down to like a, they make a...

Hennessy Suburban with a manual, I would buy that. That would be cool. They should do that. I want a Hennessy Suburban dash M. That is so you. That is a perfect nickname. Can we just make like a $300,000 version of this with 600 horsepower that like is there like GT4 or like box or spider?

I love that that Nick drove into her office in a Lamborghini Mercilago and now is against expensive things. No, 300 grand still a lot of money. I'm just saying like it would be cool to see these around and like you will never see one. Other than car week where we sell like eight of them. Yeah. Right. That's the only place.

Do you think they're actually going to sell the eight? I mean, they'll sell the eight, but will they deliver the eight? 12. The 12, the people that buy it, it might be one person who buys 12. Will they ever leave the garage? I mean, probably not. I don't know. I mean, like, it's cool that they're doing it.

I applaud them for doing it. It's just going to be uncontrollable and difficult. And I think they're just doing it because they can and more power to them. I'm here for it, right? If you can. Sure, if you can do it. Why not? This is a weird parallel universe where Felipe's pro-manual.

And you and are like, oh, it's not practical. I know. What's happening today? We're in Bizarro Cars and Bids pod world now. And you're against Bentley's now? I just don't understand. People need to buy the flying spurs so that you can buy it for $10,000 in 10 years. Very true.

It's important. Keep that of mind. Go support your local Bentley dealer, please. But yeah, anyway, so that's the Hennessy F-5M that goes click-clack. sounds, I'm sure, crazy and is really, really fast. So if you have $2.65 million and that's what you want, well, there's a car fee. I mean, it's objectively cool that they're doing it.

You guys are against it, but it's cool that somebody's doing it. I would do a golf clap, but we'll get comments about me making weird reverb noises, so I'll just applaud them in spirit. Where did they find a manual transmission that can handle that power? That's the real question. Because we'd heard for years that manual transmissions can't handle the power. That's why we have to switch to these other things. They took it out of a GMTA.

100 to bourbon. Things can handle anything, all right? Just the Nokia phone of transmissions. Exactly. But that was a reference just for you. I figured you like that. But yeah, I don't really know. I just don't have any, like, feelings one way or the other on it.

It's just not the kind of car I'm that interested in, to be honest with you. And that is the end of the news. Before we move on, let's take a moment to appreciate Lexus Racing, the sponsor of this podcast episode. Lexus Racing has been built on a foundation of precision, innovation, and an unwavering commitment to excellence, much like Kennan. Last year, these elements came together for Lexus Racing and with their team partners at Vassar Sullivan. They won the 23 IMSA GTD Pro class championship with the Lexus RCF GT3. Now, I love this type of racing because the cars that race actually look like road cars. And the engine in the RCF GT3 is actually based on the very same V8 that you get in the normal RCF that you can buy.

And it wins races in serious competition. We love cars with racing pedigrees. And while this was the first GT racing championship for Lexus, it won't be the last. The team is on track for title contention once again in 24 as they come into the final stretch of the season. You can't miss the day glow yellow and black Lexus RCF GT3 race cars. or the sound of the famous Lexus V8 engine roaring under the hood. Follow their journey every race weekend. Visit lexas.com slash motorsports to learn more about Lexus racing

and get all of the details on upcoming races. Now, Nick, you recently sold a car on cars and bits. Sure did. Yes, I'm going to pull it up because... Pull it up. So for those who didn't follow the series on YouTube, I bought a P-38 range roper for seven grand, including shipping fees, all that.

It sold for 19250. It is a record for P-38's by $250 or literally one bid. I did spend at least $7,000 refurbishing it. So I was in at like 14-15-ish. So I did actually turn a little profit here. Everyone doubted whether that was possible on a P-38. I barely eeked it out. The two of you are the only people to ever profited off of deeply notoriously unreliable cars.

Because Kennedy's cards. was that $355, which nobody ever had before, and nobody's ever made money on a P38. The cliche is what you make the money when you buy the car, not when you sell it, right? I bought it low. When I bought this car, I said, okay, it should go for mid-teens to high teens in good condition. This one was poorly represented. It had multiple error codes on. It didn't have any information, et cetera.

So I really just, I bought it well, and that's the only reason I turned a quote-unquote profit on it. But the seller, the selling process was great. Like the photos were good. The listing got up when we said it would. And like the comments were really, really positive. Like people enjoyed the YouTube series, which definitely helped here. Which you can find on the Cars and Bits chat. Yeah.

But the interesting, we were at Car Week while this went live. And the bidding was at like $9,000. I was like, okay, that's like a reasonable number. Like I'm sure it will go up. The action always happens at the end. And then this gentleman, Big Dog Andy, a new account comes in and doubles the bid from 9 to 18. And we're all like, oh, this has got to be like a fake bid.

Like maybe he's just like trolling or like, is this legitimate or not? And like, he actually messaged me. He reached out and he's like, hey, people are questioning me in the comments. I can assure you I'm legit. I actually really went this car and I was like, whew. Nice. And Big Dog Andy? Like, he is, he's been messaging me.

He's already like he's planning on a repaint. He's like, I want to. want to make the nicest P-38 in the world, and I love the backstory of this car. So, like, it's really fun. Like, I'm almost feel like, Big Dog Andy and I are going to, like, chat, and I already said, like, come to San Diego, I'll buy you a beer. But the process was like, it was just so, like, I'm so happy it found the right home. Yeah.

Because I was sad to lose it. Like, I, in an ideal world, I would have kept it another six, 12 months, but the whole point of the YouTube series was to sell it, so I couldn't just let you all linger, I guess. And God only knows what could have happened to the current six. Well, Big Dog Andy will know. Big Dog Andy will find out. You told me that this is your family's favorite car. Yeah.

They still talk about yellow car. And like, writer, my two-year-old asked to take the yellow car the other day somewhere. And I was like, it's in Spokane, Washington. Sorry. But, yeah, it was super great. Yeah. I really enjoyed it. Like, I think they're pretty cool cars.

They're slept on. I was stunned at, like, yeah, riding around in it was nice. I love the seating position's incredible. And it just like, and immediately the last time I wrote in it, which was the first time, the exhaust was, you know, kind of leaking. But actually, that's not true. I drove it for a little bit, and it drove great.

It was such a pleasure to, like, be, just be in when it works. For me, it was cool. It was like the summer project. Like, I got my hands dirty. I'm still, for those listening. I have, like, burn marks still from it. Yeah, he tattooed himself. Yeah.

But, like, I haven't had so much fun with a car in a long time. And, like, I love the Lamborghini, whatever. but like there's something about just having a project car you can wrench on and like make improvements on like I'm terrified of touching the lambo like I won't do anything on it other than detail it so I'm yeah it's this has enabled me to want to get more bad ideas and have a project car at all time so Nick what what bad idea are you working towards right now I've got three prospects I'm having I've almost got scammed twice I'll save that for next week because right now there may or may not be a title or it may just be an empty envelope that was overnighted on Saturday and still hasn't arrived on Thursday. For the record, these were not on cars and beds where you would have had a normal experience with normal humans. I'm buying poorly represented cars so that I can represent them well.

I know what it is. I'm not going to say that. He's buying a shady car from a shady person in a shady way. So of course. There's a reason we refer to you as Crazy Nick. Yeah, he's nuts. He just takes these risks. He was telling us about this before the podcast,

and no part of your story makes it any sense. When I found out the title wasn't in the seller's name, I was like, okay, this is, Carson bids vets all of these cars and make sure they have proof of title. And like, I'm starting to see the value in having a third party involved in these transactions. Because like, from the like, Zell me the entire amount up front request to several other things,

I'm like, if this is how car buying off Facebook marketplaces, I can see why no one wants to do it. Yeah. Can you go back quickly, though, to Nick's profile page? Yeah, of course. You want to see his bid history? No, I want to, like, I just, that explorer Saline XBA. Oh, yeah.

He previously sold on our site, Salyen XPA, which is the high-performance explorer that nobody knows exists. Also set a record. Also set a record. For a very, very small pool of cars. It's so cool. Hey, no, don't qualify my winner, right? Yeah, that was also a car I still missed to this day.

I did see another one for sale and thought, should I do another one? But no, it's one and done. I had it for two years. That was like one of the, the second most fun I've ever had up with the car. So again, like, you don't need a Lambo. You don't need a Hennessee dash M-600 T4S.

No, you're using a salient XPA. Buy a $7,000 hoopty, put some TLC into it and sell it on cars and bits. That's all you need to be happy. Now I'm just trying to figure out what, I know what you're buying, which is not, unfortunately, only a 2000 SUV, although it should be because you sold the 1998 and at 2002.

You've got to fill the gap. What could you get? I'll share with the listeners. We don't have to be cryptic here. Almost one of the three candidates is a Hummer H2SUT. So the one that has like the weird pickup up. You don't need that one says. You can buy those.

I got pretty far on one. And this clean title, H2SUT actually had a salvage title and four accidents. So I decided not to. pursue that further. I love that. Yeah. And some of the nice ones get good money. Most of them are modded, like repainted matte black and just like heinous wheels.

But like they're out there. They're cool. I love the thought of you having a Mercilago and a home ratio. Also the H3, there was an alpha version that had the upgraded engine. Those are really cool. Even the regular wagon version of this, for lack of better word, it had that like half third row seat in the back. Like these cars are quirky and they're weird. and I think like the P-38, they're slept on.

It is basically the American P-38. Only more reliable, because you've got a Tahoe Engine. It's an American. You could put a Hennessee, GMT-800 package on this thing. It's a thousand-horsepower manual. Why aren't people doing this? The market is so large for that. Right now this is not the car I'm pursuing.

I'm also looking at Bentley or Nage T and a Maserati-Quattroporte. So maybe next week I will know which way I'm going, because if the title doesn't come through on this car, I've already got a totally different car lined up that I'm going to just wire the money on and be done with it from a dealer. You're gonna like...

I'm panic buying right now. Like I'm so annoyed that this car isn't already in my driveway that I'm just... If anyone has a cool car, like just email me, I'm buying. I've never seen someone froth at the mouth so hard to buy. I miss my P-38 and I need to fill that... He's so... We've emboldened him and now he's just pursuing these insane views.

I'm here for it, but like... How are you considering from a dealer? If this doesn't... The Bentley Arnage. It's a Bentley or not. I would love it if you got that. It's got a ticket startup in an airbagged light, but it's priced accordingly.

Whatever that means, because it could just be a giant paperweight, but it's sub-20K, so it would be a fun gamble. Well, Nick, I'm excited to see what you get next. I'm terrified for you, but I am excited to see what you get next. Stay tuned. Hopefully next week I'll know. Oh, my God. God.

Kenan, I see you have a topic here about kind of fake news cars, if you will. Yes. Well, I want to talk about, yes, I'm calling them vaporware cars. Now, these are cars that have come up recently into, like, my, they're just around that I've seen on Instagram where, you know, like, whatever, I'm sure Supercar Blondie has reviewed them. I don't think exist. They're just like mockups. Now, of course, we love the Aspark Owl. Of course.

And I especially love one and then a roundabout in a rural part of it. Right, at a one-third scale of what one would actually be. Many people have found a real one, though, and claim it exists. There was one in Monaco that happened to be moving on a 9-volt battery coasting downhill. That's not something. And this car also, like, so this is called the Naran HyperCoop. And the recipe is all largely the same. They make, like, crazy power, like a thousand-whatever horsepower.

They'll cost a million dollars, and they're going to build nine of them. And it's not alone. The Hispanosuisza Carmen. however the hell that's pronounced thing. Haneous, San Diego. It just, it's heinous,

again, same thing. Cost a ton of money. This one, you know, it's electric. They showed at least one somewhere.

Right. And I'm convinced this is the same one that I saw on it and they painted it. I'm pretty convinced it's the same car. You just gave me

a lot of information about this car that I did not have before. Right. And that's all anybody needs to know. And then like the Kupra Dark Rebels is another thing. This makes a lot less power.

Wait, so this is actually a Cooper branded thing. Because I think the Cooper brand logo. Yeah, but it's like, it doesn't... Cooper is like a spin off of Seat. But it does not exist.

But the digital never exist. No. But to be clear, the other cars aren't concept cars. They're like going to exist and, you know, it's like trying to be exclusive. And it just upsets me. Why? Because... Art is art, Kenan. Because it's all fake.

It just seems fake. It's just like, I don't understand like why anybody would want these cars. I don't understand who they're supposed to get excited about. Now, when Remot's came out, I thought maybe that was going to be a vaporware car. But the reason that that car came out was to highlight the technology behind it as like a marketing ploy to then sell that technology of the companies. That makes sense. These cars don't offer any of that. They're just fake nonsense.

Yeah. They're fake nonsense that they hope somebody will put some deposits in for and that some very rich person in Dubai will eventually buy the only one they ever make. Right. Hey, business is business. I guess. I'm intrigued by your hatred of these, primarily because they won't exist. So why hate?

I don't know. It just really irks me to see these cars like, like, treat it as something also, like on social media. It's not something. And it's just like, if you're canon, the only cards that are something are Ferrari F40 and an E309-9-5. They have 50? Real super cards. Oh, you're giving the F-50 credit. Okay.

Of course. The F-50s is a true Formula One drive train, manual transmission. Doug's not here to refute that. And it's a very special car. Those cars are actually special. These cars are not special. No, they're not. And they're from brands that don't matter and just don't exist. Naran is not a brand, to my knowledge.

No. Well, and that's putting my marketing. And Hispanic Caesar was, for not anymore. Same with Hispanic Suiza. Yeah, putting my marketing hat on and taking off my automotive one, like, it's brand, right? Like, if you have the brand, you can do this. If you don't have the brand, then you just think, okay, this looks like a Transformers robot

that costs $3 million. Can I be honest? I'm just glad that they're no longer NFT cars. I at least prefer that they're pretending that they're a car they're going to build and not just, hey, here's the NFT car. But if they said a Lamborghini badge and they called it a Venano

or whatever random cars they did, it would actually be like, oh, I can't wait for this to come out and like 14-year-old kids would like sprint down the road trying to get a picture of it. It is strictly that these are no-name manufacturers, that there's no brand history, there's no brand connection. I don't have, like, Neuron, I'm not refreshing their website, hoping that they launch their new car.

The Aspark Al website is live, I'll tell you that much. Not a motorist completely AI generated. Yes. It's not consensical, but it's there. Trudence into the neuron, an authentic GT3-style hyper-coop. Yep. Right. What am I meant to do with that information?

It's just, it's not... I also have... It makes no sense. So on their website, it says built for performance, and then they have horsepower in horsepower and kilowatts. They have torque, for some reason, the opposite order of meters, and then foot pounds. And then they have all-wheel drive, rear-wheel drive.

What does that mean? It means that it's fake. It just seems... You are welcome, by the way, Naran executives. We've just delivered a lot of traffic that you've never seen before. Hopefully your site doesn't go down. Hopefully they can send you a presser to... Oh, that would be great.

You could compare that to like a Nissan Z and figure out if it's worth the extra money. They certainly don't have two, so we'll get one. It reminds me of my parents named me, this is a fun fact if you didn't know. My parents named me after Nicholas Cage. And Nick Cage, one of his famous quotes, is, and gone in 60 seconds. He says, there's, you know, I was at the Starbucks the other day and there were, yeah, there were three of these. that tells me just one thing. There's too many

self-indulgent weenies in this town. That's what self-indulgent weenies the town with too much bloody money. And that's what these cars are all catering to that market. So good luck to you all. Us car enthusiasts will be setting this one out.

Can I, can you go to their Instagram, top right corner? Sure. Maybe. Maybe. And then scroll down just like a little bit. Scroll down, yep, to that one. That's a human being.

presumably a woman with her legs out of the drivers. Yeah, who's like shoved the wrong way into a car. I think that was like an 80s Kuntash ad or something. It's, I think they're playing back to a pretty famous photo shoot there. But yeah, I mean, even at car week, you know, we went to the, and at Spanish Bay. And there was a few like the I.E. Apollo, whatever. And like, those cars, people weren't really checking out. They were going to the SC30 Diablo, maybe to the.

And Chirones, but like these cars aren't really like that exciting compared to, or like that CLK GTR Roadster. Like everyone was flocking to that. And then there would be like even the Hennesseys, which I like for the record, like they weren't quite the showstopper that they, you know, would be for the price point. People do care about the brand. But just a reality. It's really hard to be an upstart brand. And it's really hard to be an upstar brand that nobody's ever heard of. Well, Balianza and some of these designer brands will sell like a paperclip for $800.

And they do it to prove that they can and that their brand is so strong. And I think, like, cars are that same way. Lamborghini could sell me a paperclip or a bolt probably, and I would pay $100 for it if I had to. What kind of works for everything? Like, from cars to, like, politics. It doesn't Trump sell shoes or something like that? Or Maserati watches.

And the Lover T-shirt. Yeah, and Landerover T-shirt. Yeah, exactly. Like, kind of works on, like, all those different. Yeah. I have Maserati Watch for the listeners. If you're looking for a nice go on eBay, they're about 50 bucks, fell off his wrist earlier.

Very Maserati of them to appreciate it like that. I want to move on to the market report, but first, Kenon, last week, you really broke the internet, if you will, with your Donald Trump impression. You want another one? And you told me that you were, you had an impression ready to go. Yeah, on this very topic, I thought about, I thought about vaporware cars, so. Please. I look at these cars, and I say to myself, that's not real. My people look at these cars.

They've never seen anything like it. China is coming up with these fake cars. They're streaming illegally into this country, and we have to do something about it. We have to bring back the V-12s, bring back great Italian supercars, bring back German supercars, English supercars, maybe. But we have to do something about this.

We have to make supercars great again. That's what I promise we'll do. China. That was a beautifully done impression. Thank you. I hope you all enjoyed that. And also all of these vaporware cars. Excuse me.

Excuse me. Yeah. All they're going to do is stream because they're not real. Yep, exactly. Moving on. All right. Can we talk about, can we lead off the market report section by talking about GMT 800s? Because we have been talking about GMT 800s.

I'm always down to talk about GMT 800. We sold a Tahoe the other day. Scroll down a tiny bit more. Sorry, it's a suburban, which is the best suburban. Oh, yeah. Yeah. For real money. The Z-71 package looks, like it's a good upgrade.

It's a good upgrade. It's the best one. This is a one-owner or southern-owned. One is the one you want, although it had high-ish miles. Like, it's not super low miles. High-ish miles for GMT-800 is like over 200. Right, and doesn't have anywhere near that. 22 grand or 21 grand, seems like both a lot of money for a 22-year-old suburban.

And that interior. Kind of a deal, because I love GMT 800s. Yeah. Love GMT 800. Well, we all grew up in the Midwest. Yeah. And so this was, and I think that, and this was in that period of time, like, they're just around. I remember seeing these everywhere.

and they're, you know, they're iconic of like just people or like family haulers at that time. And it just, I'm glad that they're worth real money. How many miles did this have? 80,000? 80,000. That's low amount. That's a low monster really is.

And like, that seems like a lot of money, legitimately, because 20 grand buys you a really nice 2016 Kyan. It buys you like a lot of real SUV or this. And I'm glad they're worth money. I want one. You got to comp it against three row SUVs. that are that length and off-road capable.

Yeah, which is not. My dad's looking for a car in Wyoming, and it's like, this is a great candidate, because you could treat it like a farm truck, but also when all the grandkids are in town, like there's room for everyone. It's a visitor or an excursion, and diesel excursions are also worth real money.

Real money. I just love GMT 800s. Every time I think about a Tahoe or suburban from this generation, I just want one. Felipe and I now have two things in common. We both on 2014 Ford Focuses, and we love GMT. Mine was a 2012.

Thank you very much. Oh, is it? Oh. I'm final model year before the face left, so I was first model year, and also, let's talk about your Ford Focus. So please fill up a lot of God. Kenan a couple of weeks ago pulled up to my house to grab something in your car because his M5 was broken. My BMW loaner car for. Wasn't broken, it was voluntarily taken down for service.

It didn't break, though. I owned a 2012 Ford Focus for five years. You got rid of it? Yeah, yeah. I had the manual one so that was actually reliable. you for some reason have a DTT one it's my wife's car you also did some mods to this car

did you not well he Kenan pulled up and I was like that's not what these sound like well so I pulled up and it had a well I pulled away more specifically I took I told me about it's like Nick definitely did something

leave it to Nick you can't leave a car alone and I pulled away and it went you know got the great induction sound like exclose on an intake and so I texted him I said it's great the intake is really loud why'd you put that for a friggin't

and he was like, I didn't. Yeah, I don't. You haven't modified that car? I need to check it. Or somebody modified that car. I, uh, or something's quite broken. I did have LED headlights on it and they were starting to flicker really badly and I

might have knocked the air box off while I was. That could be it. So it could just be, it could just be like open inlet. It might be. Kevin also told me it was leaking oil. I don't know. Like I don't, I don't, it doesn't get driven a whole lot.

I love, by the way, that just for the narrative reason, you drove here in a Lambeergumich, you also have a really highly trimmed. Cayenne, GTS. Your wife drives around in a 2014 For focus with maybe some oil leaks and an air intake issue. The focus is, it's great to have a beater car. It's great. I get dented in every panel.

There's certain like grocery stores I know like I'm at high likelihood to get hit. And it gets 40 miles a gallon. Like I actually like if I ever have to commute to downtown and I'm not coming here, I take that car because it's like all right, I don't care, it can cruise. I got to say as somebody who

likes high performance cars And again, thank you for your generosity and letting me your focus. I loved it. It was such a good car. It's such an honest, like, it's a nice normal car. But it also drives race. It's really fun. Other than the clutch slipping.

Well, you buy a manual one and then you know the issue. But nonetheless, like, I've really enjoyed that little car. The other thing is, like, not only, it probably wouldn't be exciting enough to sell on cars and bids, but they maybe get five grand. And this is a one-owner, 60,000-mile car. So, like, I watch like the suburban. I keep a backup car, you know, it just doesn't make sense to spend. I bought mine for, we were moving across the country, and like, it just didn't need three cars at the time. But we, I bought mine for $8,600 in 2016.

It was four years old and had 60,000 miles and was worth $8,500. And then I sold it five years later for $6,000. Yeah. And like, for $6,000, it was the best $6,000 car of everyone round. Well, I've bailed out now both Kevin and Kennan with their broken BMWs needing a loaner car, and they drove the focus. So then my friends are putting more money. miles on the car than I am at this point, which it makes me happy. Yeah, that's aggravating for me. Would you split a suburban with me? Sure. You guys can make that packed. Let's do it. I'm out.

Well, that's, that is wild. I guess if you buy an H-2, close enough. I'd also like to buy a escalade and drive it to Tony Sopranos house in New Jersey for a picture if you want to do a road trip. I don't. Thank you. Okay. That's all you. Offers out there if you change my. That's all you. Maybe Sam will do that with me. He's from New Jersey. Okay. Nick, you wanted to talk about Lamborghini Garados staying on the topic of the other car. Mostly speaking of Sam, I'm trying to get him to buy one.

Our friend Sam, who you've seen on some cars and bids videos. The redheaded kid. We all like him. The Garados, you know, depends on the model in the very, and like a super leggera or STS, we'll go for more.

But you all recently sold a very nice, low mile one for under 100 grand. Well under 100 grand. It's 855. I think it is aging wonderfully. Like, that is just a beautiful car. I prefer.

the preface left. Now, 04s are known to be a little bit more high maintenance and less refined. Like in 05, they change some things, so they're more reliable. So I've heard mix things on 04s, but like for 85 grand, I mean, you can barely buy like a mid-trim used

9-11 for that. Like, in the E-gear, again, I think people hate on it too much. Yes, it was a bad idea when it came out. However, it's still really engaging to have a V-10 that you're shifting with your hands, not your feet. Like, I just, this This blows my mind that this car being 4,000 miles,

I know, went for $8,500. That's wild. It is a crazy value. I do have to say having driven early 04 eager garados, I found that it is not the best transmission to drive. Like, your eager and your mercy is substantially nicer to drive. But that said, for the money, 855, I mean, at that kind of money, you're looking at kind of 360s that are mild up

and maybe not in the nicest condition. But this is a mint 04. You can get a decent tip frog. But this one, like this is, I'm stunned. I just feel bad for our listener sometimes when you go from referred to by the name of the car, the Ferrari 360, to a tip frog. Well, I mean, you know, we call all automatics tiptronics, and it looks like a frog. Yeah, I mean, you're not wrong, but. It's a tip frog.

And so that's what we call it. And for clarity, too, this isn't an outlier. No, no, they're viable for 80 to 100, any gear, maybe 120 to 140 for a manual. For a night, for like a good manual, yeah. Are there conversions for this? I assume. There are because it's basically an R8. And like there's the guy in Alabama that does them all the time, but a handful of people have swapped these. It's going to maybe be 20 grand to do a swap on it. So yeah, you've got plenty of options here. RAV10s are also not that much more. They're more expensive if they're been newer. They're still what? 90s to 100 for the cheapest R8. I still miss my R8. I had a V8 and I love that car other than having to tell people all the time that it was a V8 and not a V10. They're the gated V10 good color for 9.825.

Agreed, but wouldn't you rather have the Garado? No. He wouldn't. I don't think the Garado looks that great. I must refer how an R.A. looks. I like them both. Angular. And again, like, growing up, this was the new Lamborghini.

It was such a huge deal when it came out. You know, they were going to offer an entry-level car, which was kind of crazy. It makes sense that all but the. very special versions are going to depreciate. Like, they should depreciate. There's no reason for... But even the very special... Even the very special versions aren't that crazy.

Like, the Garuda Super Lagera, I feel, is one of the most undervalued, like, performance car. I mean, that, $140,000, you know, almost $60,000, a lot of money. But when you consider that the scuderia, that was its competitor, costs, you know, a nice scuderia is almost a $300,000 car thereabouts. And so, like, $240 to $300 for that, whereas, 140 by zero guard or Supervisor or 16. I mean... They're deals.

They're deals. And the... Yeah, 22 horsepower. NAV-10. It'll look real good, and I see your mercy. Sure would. No, I'm not... I want more hoopties. I'm setting a budget of like 10 grand-ish for the next car. But I do think,

Sam, if you're listening, which you should be, you need to buy one. Just do it. You'll thank me later. Yeah. I'll bet you doesn't, though. I thought you does. Wait, since we were talking with this, Let's look at for our 360s really quickly, because we're talking about tip frogs. So let's go all in.

Tip frogs. Yeah. Cheap. Yeah, because this one was a six-speed. I think a factory six-speed wasn't. This one was a factory six-speed. But even even manual, sorry, it's a nice one, rather automatic ones or $60,000 for like okay ones. Yeah.

All day. This one with, this is kind of the one about like, that is T.D.F. Tour de France blue, which is exquisite, a late production car in 04, 360 Modena. mostly I'm modified, I assume it's got like an exhaust or something. Yeah, it's got, oh, countless headers. Yeah, but fine, but whatever. But nonetheless, like, yeah, for 63, register that in Montana, call it a day, man.

Yeah, well, California's making that pretty hard to live with that. So they say, that's all fear, uncertainty, and doubt. All right, Nick. I'm a proud business owner in Helena, Montana. Right, exactly. But nonetheless, yeah. The interesting cars from the mid-engine performance cars from the mid-2000s are becoming quite good buzz.

I do feel like COVID kept them elevated in a way that wasn't natural to some extent. But they're not anymore. Well, this is, Sam needs to buy the Garado. Sean, your producer needs to buy the 360. Without a doubt. You're welcome both of you. Yep. Great consumer advice from our crazy friend.

And I'm going to run them both over with an H-2SUT. I would watch that video. Yeah. Well, didn't Doug run over your all-rides? Wasn't that? I had the Kia Specter. Thank you very much. Oh, yeah, that's right.

That's right. But he was there for the all-run. We could destroy another one of your cars. Yeah, we could. That eight hard would probably crunch really well with the roof. It would be really hard to go on top of that car. It's too tall. Oh, I'm down.

Let's try it. Just need a little look at it. If you buy for me, 10 grand it's yours. Hit up wheel pros. We'll get some, we'll get some parts. We want to get to questions, but can we talk about one more car first? Sure. Briefly.

Yeah. Can you just go to Ranger's? Do you have any idea how cheap full-size last-gen-rangeers are? 20 grand. What? Bid to 20? Yeah, I mean you... Bid to 19.

20, 25, 20. It's almost like these cars have a reputation. 175 for a turbo diesel one. I feel like I've mentioned this recently. There is a new generation one, which looks frankly identical. Yeah. I've seen on other sites that they're in like the teens now, or like 15 to 20, pretty much, pretty consistently for nice ones. That's a deal.

And I think that the full-size renderers look incredible. They do look great. Scary when it breaks, because it is going to. How bad can it be? I mean, head gaskets and... How bad can it be?

There's a lot more... The problem is... Yeah, the P-38 has its... You want a 20-grand, three-row, off-row, capable SUV? Don't buy a GMT 800 and buy a Ranger. My neighbor has one of these and is texting me right now being like,

I can't get it out of park. Like the gear ship knob fell off and sending me eBay listing. They're cheap for a reason. That being said, like, buy it as long as you're mechanically inclined, but don't buy it for your like Porsche Pilates' mom who's just trying to pick up the kids from daycare. She might not make it home. Espreson-Almond interior, highly equipped.

Does the Supercharge v6 have the same issues, or is it just this V8? Nick, I look to you for depreciated 2015. That's too new. It's too new. It's past 2010. He knows. Ask Sam. He knows these.

I will. because I want one. All right. Questions. Questions. Questions? You can ask us questions on Cars and Bids community. We put out a post every single week,

and we answer the most ridiculous questions. This isn't true. Doug says that every time. It's not true. We answer very good questions. People ask good questions. But if you have questions for us, we will answer them live here on the podcast.

So, Felipe, take us away. All right. We have a question from Tailgate Tommy. Which is, what is the distinction between a classic car versus just an old car? Interesting. I assume that Nick has some pants. I'm not sure.

You posted the other day on Instagram. There probably is one, but I suppose it would just like... What defines, like you were driving around in 1935 Rolls Royce. Right. That's a classic. Definitely a classic. And a 67 Mustang That's a cultural classic. Yeah, I mean, I think the way that it's used in everyday speech, maybe not like how Webster's would define it.

To me, like a classic is one of those iconic cars of the period. One that like a non-car person would recognize and be like, oh, I remember a 63 Thunderbird. I remember a 65 Mustang. I remember the Hemikudas and the roadrunners. Like the cars that really stand out, like basically a car that a die cast model has been made of, probably classic. Oh, interesting. And if it was never a matchbox or a 118 scale Masto or whatever, then like, it's just an old car. So like they did make Matchbox Ford Explorer from the 90s. Is that a classic car? I mean to some people. Right. I agree with it. Three-time Explorer on it. No, I mean, there's probably been a

age cut off too, like it would at least have to be 1980. You think too old for cars and bits? You think 1980 and younger is old? I mean, that's now what's 40 plus years old? Yeah. I mean, we classify stuff like, there are also subsections to it. They're modern classics, which is what we

deal with, like a lot of times on cars and bits. What car from the 80s or 90s is like on the border for you between an old car and a classic car? Like, no, no, that's clearly a classic. Like, what is like the marginal car that's just barely a classic? or like cool enough to be considered a classic.

Yeah, but like barely. From the 80s. Kind of the, like the Grand National is definitely a classic, but the T-type is kind of a little bit more like an old car to me. We had a regal T-type, which is not. Which is a phone-wheel drive, T-6-powered car. A special car, dude, it's rarity. But like, that's kind of on the edge for me.

Yeah, I think there's a cut-off of both age and, like, desirability. And it's hard to define exactly where either of those would be, but it's some combination thereof. Is the first-gen-d-neon, a classic car? Probably just an old car. Really? What about an ACR, the first-gen, S-R-T-4 version? I feel like it's slightly too new.

Oh, it's totally too new, okay. Yeah. It's a mid-90s car. That's a 30-year-old car. Yeah. See, it's interesting because that's a car that a lot of people saw, and to see a well-preserved one is something. Like, we sold...

But it's just an old car. Yeah. I do think that preserves, preservation matters. A car that could be an old, just used car, if it's a really nice example, kind of becomes a classic. Doug, rest in peace, would know this, but in Ohio, to get a classic car license plate, it has to be, I think, 25 years old, probably. Great. So a 1999 Toyota Camry is a classic car would technically qualify, and you would have the classic car distinction. The rules with the plate is you can only drive it like so many miles. It's like a Montana plate

where it's a little sketch, but like largely... It's true in a lot of states, by the way, You can get a classic one. So the states would say it's a 25-year-old car and leave it that simple. But that's just an old car. I do think that, like, specialness and, like, I think there's, like, some, like, importance to the car market that matters. For example, I strongly consider early Saturn S series cars to be classics. Yeah, that's, that's an opinion. You're alone.

I'm sorry, you're alone on that one. I like the die-cast model thing. That kind of like is a poster. If you could buy it at a scholastic art fair when you were a kid maybe. Saturn S-Series die cast, it must exist. It must exist. Yes, it does. Only sold the dealers.

Oh, come on. There was also a Hot Wheels that was the Saturn Lightship Blimp. Fun fact. Fascinating. There was a Saturn ion hot wheels, and I'm not even claiming the ion as a classic. So I think, yeah, I think that this, but to his point, I think that, yeah, it has to be. something that people appreciated and look back fondly on with nostalgia, I guess.

Some level of rarity and yeah, desirability. But an interesting question, something to ponder. Let's do one more question, which is from I Cannot Drive 55. If you were asked to do a collaboration with an automaker on a special edition model, what make and model would you want to put your signature on? And what quirks or features would you add to the car?

Oh, man. how like does it have to be like current what I would like to do is approach Bentley say hey cancel the flying spur got a better idea we are going to do much like the Ineos Grenadier we're going to bring back the Bentley Dominator

but sell up to people other than the Sultan of Brunei I will personally sign up for the first five and I have probably 30 other buyers you know what the end result would be it'd be a slightly off rotified of Antigua fine Bentega was like a little bit cladding. Give me a Bentega Raptor edition.

Raptor R edition. Well, honestly, I'm a buyer. That would be a group. How have they not made one? How have they not made that? Yeah, that would be cool. I could see. It would have way more sales than a flying spur sedan

that no one can tell the difference of the previous job. Hyundai has an Ionic 5 XRT, which is their off-road trim. Why doesn't Bentley have an off-road trim? I support you. I would do it with an RIS II. Frankly, frankly, any of the Volkswagen Audi group, is it automotive group or Audi group? You would know this.

Mr. Active Fly. I don't remember. I'm so sorry. V-A-G cars. Make me a Raptor version. I'll put my signature on it. I want an H-2-S-U-T-I-T-I-T-Alian car, maybe. Something at this thing.

That's not going to manufacture and making a special edition. Give me an EURIS and cut off the trunk. Or do you remember the GMC-onvoy XUV? Of course. An Ur-S version of that or a Bent-Tega version of that would be great. I would like to ask our listeners, if you're good with Photoshop, please make and send to us. podcast at cars and bits.com

you're rendering of what a a Lamborghini or a pickup truck or XUV would look like. If you're a product planner at V-A-G, you can email me. I think it's Volkswagen Audi group. I will waive my usual consulting fee. Okay.

Perfect. Sorry, it is a Volkswagen AG. I apologize. For me, I don't really know. The first, for whatever reason, I talked about it a little longer, but it comes to mind is, I would love for Lamborghini to make a beautiful car again.

Like they make striking cars. You're taking an existing make model and just like, no, I want to make a modern interpretation. Jack Nicklaus did with the Lincoln Town car. You're adding leather, you're adding badges. No, I want to make a front-engined V-12 beautiful car, and I want to call it, I want to call it the 3,500 GT, like a new 350 GT. Like a new, a modern take on that car from Lamborghini.

Because you love Resto Mod 355s and 575s, don't you? Well, it's not taking an existing car and ruining it, which is what those companies have done. It's taking it, building a new car, a new platform. More like the Eric Clapton Ferrari, then. More like the one, well, that still was based on an existing car and also heinous. Are you aware of this car? No. Thankfully.

Oh, it's so bad. It's unique. It's the SP12. Maybe more like the P4-5 with Jim Glick and us. That's actually a really good look. Doug loves this car. there's a picture of it driving around London recently. It's supposed to look like his baroneta boxer was the idea.

I don't know. It's a little weird looking. I've never been a fan. I guess this is the question though, right? Like which Eric Clapton Ferrari one-off would you make? Right. Is it not? I can't drive 55.

I'm sorry. Yeah. But I don't, yeah. For me, it's like I want Lamborghini to do a new front engine beautiful car. Let me reframe the question. This is a car that already exists that they're currently making that you're making a special addition of Like putting like a Landau top on like the like the LLB in outback or the Orvis Explorer Yeah, I got that question way around

Or no you answered it fine But you were thinking like I was you wanted to do something that didn't exist But take an off-road version I'll accept as an answer I don't know I've suggested something along these lines already a car that should exist I'll answer while you think And the FF500 of BART, or FF500 had a few special editions. They had the GQ edition, which was basically in a Barth, but with some horrible badges and not that nice of gray,

and there a few others. I think there should be a Filippe one. There was also a Gucci one, but that was not the Barth engine, just the GQ one was. I think there should be a Filippo edition. I don't know what it has. Just a normal barth. It's like the work truck.

Somehow more base than it actually is right now. They're just going to rhino liner the interior or no carpet, could hose it out. That'd be great. Because you don't wash your car. though apparently you started. Look at how. It's not very clear anymore.

Didn't Kenan clean that for you? Yeah. But I washed my other car. I instructed him. I taught the man. He taught me everything I know. Yeah. Which means any mistakes I make are his fault.

All right, Kenon. Give us the answer before we sign off. I'm struggling with it, but I think that I would love to, I mean, I'd love for, I, personally, like a car to drive around, I'd love another trans-Siberia. Oh, nice. I think, like, a modern one of those would be so cool. It would be so cool. I think about that car, well, it's surprising.

You kind of copied my homework there and just... I did copy it a little bit, but like, that's one of the ones that sticks in my mind of, like, why don't they make that again? It was so cool. They make them out of the car, why don't they have a car on the car? Yeah, kind of, yeah. That may be probably pick a different off-road race or something like that. Right, right, plus it would be called the Kennan-Rolson.

The Baja. Yeah, it would be called the Kenroll. My name doesn't sound good on my car. The Porsche Kennan. Actually, it's good. It's good work. It's close. And that was our episode of the podcast. Thank you all so much for listening next week.

I will not be here, but Doug will be back. You will be back as well. What brand shirt are you going to wear? It depends on what's clean. Or maybe you should try to buy a shirt of whatever car you're actually going to buy. I do the trick where I add something to my wish list on eBay. Then I wait for the seller to create an offer. And I did get an 8% discount on a T-shirt.

But I'm waiting until the title shows up before I commit to the brand. Because I might have to buy a Hummer shirt. It might be a Bentley shirt. it might be a Maserati shirt. Well, that's the most... I will do some looking for a Hummer shirt for you regardless. I think you should buy a H2SU2. Okay, that's the most Nick thing I've ever heard.

Thank you so much for watching. We will see you in the next one. Goodbye. Goodbye. Goodbye.