This Had Oscar Buzz - 105 – Somewhere (with George Civeris)

Episode Date: August 3, 2020

After reaching Oscar success in 2003 with Lost in Transalation, Sofia Coppola has stayed mostly on the fringes of Oscar conversations with her distinct but understated filmography. This week, comedian and StraightioLab cohost George Civeris joins us to look back at perhaps her quietest film, 2010′s Somewhere. Starring Stephen Dorff as a B-movie star and Elle Fanning … Continue reading "105 – Somewhere (with George Civeris)"

Uh-oh, wrong house. No, the right house. I didn't get that! We want to talk to Marilyn Hacks. I'm from Canada. I'm from Canada water. Hi, Dad. Hey, Cleo.

Ten decisions shape your life. You'll be aware of five about. Seven ways to go to school. I need you to take Cleo. When are you coming back? I don't know. Seven ways to get ahead. Seven reasons to drop out.

Hello and welcome to the This Had Oscar Buzz podcast, the only podcast decked out floor to ceiling and Casa Zeta Jones. Every week on this had Oscar Buzz we'll be talking about a different movie that once upon a time had lofty Academy Award aspirations, but for some reason or another, it all went wrong. The Oscar hopes died, and we are here to perform the autopsy. I'm your host, Joe Reed. I'm here as always with my twin sister stripping sadly to the foo fighters. Chris File, hello, Chris. Hello, Joe. Sad news, my other twin sister stripper, Olivia de Havelin, is dead. Oh, no.

God, imagine if Olivia DeHavland and Joan Fontaine, maybe that was the source of their animosity all those years. I bring her up because she died today, and I'm positive we mentioned her last week, hashtag Calcissata Jones. I mean, Catherine can rest, easily on the lawsuit being over, I guess. Or is she suing right?

Who is she suing? Anyway, Olivia De Havillan, highly litigious, rest in peace. Maybe her state will still keep going after Catherine, though. We don't know. Like, she could have a clause in her last will and testament that the proceedings against Catherine Zeta Jones will continue. Who knows? I wouldn't put it past her.

I bring her up only because, like, I'm positive we mentioned her last episode, but we also have this habit of talking about people on Mike. And our episodes are like two weeks ahead of time, usually. Talking about people on Mike, and then I get off the call, check Twitter, and that person has died. Who was the last person this happened to? Because it was a thing, wasn't it? There's several. I will never forget that we talked about John Singleton, the day that John Singleton died.

Right. God. There was someone semi-recently. We got to be careful. We got to talk about no people because we are the curse that kills people. we'll redact everything yeah so well if we want to talk about very few things we've probably picked the right movie this week because this is a movie that sort of takes minimalist to the hilt i'm super excited to be talking about it because it's like low-key one of my favorite films by this director sometimes if you catch me on the right day i'll say it is my favorite film and we picked it because our guest picked it and we're very super super happy to have our guest this week uh he is is a stand-up comedian. He is the co-host of the Stradio Lab podcast, a really excellent podcast. Welcome our guest, George Severus. George, welcome.

Hello, thank you. I'm truly, I mean, I've told you both this, but this has been like a career goal of mine for quite some time. Oh, stop. Oh, please. It is especially now, the only two podcasts that are that bring me joy are this one and Who Weekly. They're the only things that actually reliably bring me joy every week. So who weekly puts in so much work. I'm so intimidated by their work ethic. I swear to God, they're just tireless. They are the marathon. I know, they're really like a two-person shop. I mean, it's crazy. And then I'm not a patron subscriber,

but they apparently do like two more episodes on Patreon every week. It's amazing. No, we love them. We love Bobby and Lindsay. But this is about you guys. Sorry to immediately start talking about another podcast. I was going to say, back to us. Back to us.

Thank you. How much you love us. No, we were, when I found out on Twitter, because you had been on Matt and Bowen's podcast, you had been on Las Culture Reefus. Yeah, yeah. Another, like, huge favorite podcast of ours. And I was like, God, like, your, I was like, his pop culture sensibilities line up so

closely to mine. I'm like, this is really fantastic. And I think I tweeted something about how much I love that episode. And you had mentioned, you had, like, responded. And you said that you were a fan of this had Oscar buzz. That's right. Yeah, from the, from the Tumblr days. And I was just like, okay, well, we've got to have him on.

Like, it was just like, I was determined. I was like, we got to have George on. And I think, I think initially. because I think I had like DM'd you and you were like you guys should do an episode on the beguiled so like you were already on the Sophia tip yeah yeah I mean honestly I would have because we when we chose this movie I it wasn't in your list that you sent me but I said we should do a Sophia Coppola and then you said do you want to do the beguiled or somewhere and I do think the beguiled is in some ways it's a more quintessential this had Oscar Buzz movie yeah I think that's right but it I just like I think the talking about about like the racial politics of that movie is just not something I have in me right now. I feel yeah. I feel that you know. You know. Yeah. And I think somewhere is somewhere's a fascinating little conversation and we're like we'll totally get to that. But I want to talk about you for a little bit. You're very recently we're recording that we only

record this about a week ahead of time. So like it's not going to be out of date by this point. But you had your Comedy Central set very recently went live. and sort of, I think there was like a two or three day span where, like, I was seeing it absolutely everywhere. Oh, good. I'm glad to hear that. Congratulations on that. I mean, that's got to be such a cool thing for you to be experiencing right now. It was, I have to say, I mean, that was recorded so long ago, but I do think it was, I'm very lucky that I got any kind of stand-up on tape before stand-up died altogether. like I think that was recorded in maybe November or December so truly I got in right right under the wire yeah I was watching that there is that sense of as I do with watching so many

things that were from the before times where I was just like oh God remember remember going indoors to places with like multiple people and like being entertained in a group yeah from the before times where it's like real people in a close enclosed setting together I know yeah got to get I mean I also like for that that set was filmed in Austin so I just that might have been the last time I was on a plane like it yeah it was a lot of lasts I think about lasts a lot I talked about I think I talked about on the podcast Chris recently about how my last movie that I saw in a theater was Palm Springs and just sort of the being able to pinpoint that is so sad and weird oh yeah totally I thought about that too yeah and my last movie which I think is such a common answer is Portrait of a Lady on Fire. I think so many people especially not people like you guys

who get advanced you know, get to go to advanced greetings and film festivals and stuff. But like for many of us pleads, I do think for a lot of people it was Portrait of a Lady on Fire. And then I remember like the last party I went to,

the last bar I went to and it's... I said I went to a karaoke thing like the week before everything started to shut down. And I was just like, That is such a, first of all, just, like, a thing that I'm going, that I super miss doing. But also, that's going to be, like, the last thing we're going to be allowed to do again. Like, that's going to be where it's just, like, closed room.

Everybody's sharing a thing that you, like, a microphone that you put up close to your mouth. And, like, it's such close. Yeah, I mean, that's how I feel about stand-up comedy. Yeah. Everybody's singing, which they say is, like, the most, like, aerosolizing of, like, anything you can do in close quarters. and I was just like, man, we're not going to be able to do karaoke for like five more years. It's so sad. Talk about the stress.

For me, though, the thing that like I just sit in my home and I brood in stress and I just like sit in a chair sweating, I'm surrounded by bars in my home. And on a Thursday goddamn night last week, loud-ass karaoke pouring into my house from the bar surrounding me. Oh, I would have been furious. Man. Oh, I was very, I was just. in my home very stressed out yeah um so george talk to our uh talk to us but also uh let our listeners know if they maybe don't know about stradio lab like what's the give them like the pitch it's such

a great idea for a well i mean the idea itself i mean i feel like there's two layers for the the pitch itself is like we have a guest every week me and sam taggart another comedian my co-host we have a guest every week and we talk about an element of straight culture so that can be something as obvious as fraternities or gender reveal parties, just like very straight things, or something a bit more avant-garde like the city of Denver. I mean, we had, and we do like kind of meta ones where we had an episode that was the straight topic was pride, which is like, oh, ha-ha, ha, pride is straight, you know. And so that's kind of like the baseline, but then we also, I feel like at all times we are trying to operate on a slightly meta-level and kind of like do commentary on the idea of having a

comedy podcast, which sometimes can be very funny. Other times it's like, what are we doing here? But, but we've had, I have to say, we've had, like, we've been very lucky with some of the guests we've had recently. I thought, like, the recent episode we had with Iyo, Adebri was, like, such a fun. I mean, she just brought such a great energy and was like, you know, and especially now more and more we'll, like, have people on that told us they have listened to it so that, so they know, like, you know, what to do, and they're not, like, caught off guard when

we start like yelling at them um so yeah please please subscribe and review yeah definitely subscribe definitely hit that five-star review for sure um one of the things we have when we have our guests on that we want to talk about especially with first-time guests is what was your we say or oscar origin story but like just you know your earliest experience with the oscars where you were like oh this is the thing I'm like into maybe more than like the passing interests that like regular people have yes of course um okay so I thought about this a little bit this morning I think I mean I guess there are three I would say from 1999 through 2001 was like when I had the slow realization that this was something that I was really into I think I mean the first big movie that I remember and

this is a very kind of like an original thing to say is titanic like i just i have such a distinct memory of like i mean at the time i was living in greece too so when i was um very young so it was such a global hit that i remember like you know getting like an ice cream that came with titanic playing cards and like it would like literally like the little cards i seriously would absolutely i mean and it's it was like it was like either some of them were like you know production stills or the cover of like what will become you know the poster or whatever and I I remember those photos so well but like if you if I Google image you know just Titanic movie I can so it's like this kind of visual memory that I the only other way I can describe it is like the way I remember

you know people I grew up with like I know that there was like a still you know the still of like them you know on the on the front of the boat and and you know when she's like I can fly or whatever then there's but there's like other distinct product like I know know the difference between, like, the poster for the American, like the American version of the poster versus the European version of the poster. The European version is like purple. Exactly. Yeah.

So, so that was Titanic. And also, I mean, for whatever reason, my parents didn't care about, you know, like nudity and things like that. So I did see it in theater as multiple times. I probably saw it maybe two or three times, but I remember like it was definitely once with my mom, definitely once with my aunt who I had like a very close relationship with. But I just remember, I also remember, like, someone saying like oh this person broke the record for how many times they'd seen

Titanic in theaters and it was like someone who was like in the local news that had seen it like 32 times in theaters or something I was gonna say you'd have to see it so many times to break a record because like that was such a multiple viewings kind of a movie like all the like the Leo girls or whatever would see it be seeing it with their friends like every week yeah so that was that was the first big movie I remember then the first I would say Oscar's moment that I really remember well is Roberto Benini walking on the chairs sure like that was and I didn't even know he was to be on I also I only later did I remember that I like you know when I had gotten into Oscars history did I realize he had won for best actor I was just like

an Italian man is like going insane like I didn't know what the movie you know whatever yeah um so that was the first memory and then the first time that I really remember like truly no you know having my choices and having my thoughts and stuff was, I guess it would be, and correct me if I'm wrong, I guess it would be the next year was Russell Crow and Julia Roberts, or is that wrong? That would have been two years later. Two years later. Okay. And yeah, Crow and Julia are 2000.

Yeah. And then next year was Denzel and Halliberry? Yes. Yep. Okay. So yeah, that's what I remember, like, I remember because I thought, I guess I didn't know a lot about Russell Crow, whereas I really knew a lot about Tom Hanks, just because so many of his movies were more like kid-friendly. he was and I remember just thinking like obviously it's going to be Tom Hanks he's the famous one like he's the only one I know of the people nominated right and then I was so shocked when it was Russell Crow and then Julia Roberts was like I mean that was I it's also like Aaron Brockovich was like the quintessential adult movie like that was the movie like the parents got and you know whatever and then and then yeah yeah so I so I just I also remember like the concept this is so dumb but like the concept of like a cover of a movie saying Julia Roberts is

is Aaron Brockovich, I thought was so, like, such a fake, like, oh, like, I'm trying to think of, like, other examples of this, like, Denzel Washington is Malcolm X. You know, like, that to me was such a thing I'd never seen before. Anyway, so that was definitely the first year. And then, and then by the time it was the following year, I really, I mean, I wasn't allowed to watch Monsters Ball, but I, like, knew who Hallie Berry was was very, like, knew that it was. I also, like, distinctly remember like the how significant it was that both the winners were African American like I was like very you know I understood it as kind of like a cultural moment and then what I would do I mean I you know I I just thought the pageant

we have it all was very fun but I one memory I have is that my parents would get like the New York Times I I don't know if it was like the Saturday one or the Sunday one but or the Friday one but the the weekend section would always have like you know the ads for whatever movies were playing and it was very political obviously like you know based on how much money each company had or whatever like which movies got full page ads or which movies had like giant for your consideration ads basically and I would literally I wouldn't read any articles but I would just leave through the weekend section just to look at movie ads yeah and just like to clock like who's nominated for what like even though I didn't know what any of especially a lot

of the more adult movies, I would just kind of like look at kind of why they were significant Oscar-wise. When I was in college, I worked at the library there. I worked there when I was an undergrad and then also I got a job there after I graduated because I was not ready to move on to the real world. And so the whatever, the periodicals section downstairs got variety and the Hollywood Reporter, like the print editions of them. And I would go, I was just, that was the only way I would be able to get him because they're obviously, you know, trade publications and nobody gave a shit about, you know, Buffalo. But I would, I'm fascinated by them during award season and they would have like archives that would go back and I would look at these just

like incredibly elaborate ads, but also very insidery where they would be like explicitly being like, vote for this and vote for these people and whatever. And I was so fascinated. I was taking a course in public speaking as part of my communication studies degree. And our one assignment was we had to deliver an instructional speech, a speech that sort of like goes through the step by step of how to do something. And mine, because I was so fucking homosexual, I did how to, how to like essentially like run an Oscar campaign and like how to like do it before your consideration. How am I just learning this about you?

I don't know. but it's like deeply, deeply unwell of me, a piece of my history. And it went over like a lead balloon. Like it really did. Like nobody got it. My classmates didn't get it. My teacher was just sort of just like, oh, like good, good job. Like it was very, I got like a polite B plus and whatever.

But yeah, I was fascinated by those four year consideration ads back in the day. Yeah, the ads. And also just like when you saw just like a trailer. for a new movie or like a poster and you were like oh this is oscar like yes even and that's kind of why i thought when i first like had discovered the the tumbler why i thought it was it just brought back so big i like one that i remember and at this point i was older i wasn't like a child but like things we lost in the fire to me is such a quintessential like you see that poster and the and the specifically the people they chose to put in the

stark roles and like the title is like just weird enough that it's kind of memorable Holly Barry is sobbing in the trailer It's just like it is Movies like that just fascinated me so much Where they were almost there I mean it seemed like they did everything right And yet they just couldn't do it I remember when I realized

That movie trailers that specifically Told you which of the actors were Academy Award nominees Or letters that when I realized that Oh that means that this is going for Oscar Like I felt like it was such a light bulb over my head moment It was just like oh that's why because they don't do it for blockbusters. They don't tell you, like, Academy Award nominee Nicole Kidman in The Peacemaker or whatever.

Like, they don't do that. Like, it's, it's... You don't have Academy Award nominee Rachel McAdams for the Dr. Strange trailer. Right. Right. Right. Exactly. No, this...

It's always so nice to hear that other people experienced this kind of evolution growing up. Totally. Especially the newspaper ads thing. Because, like, that was such a huge, like, promoting. emotional thing that is like just absolutely not a concept anymore. I remember like that's how I learned what American Beauty was. I learned it from a full page newspaper ad where you're putting a page. And it's that of course the like belly poster.

And like it's it was obviously such a striking image and was such a huge part of like that campaign that they had this really successful image. But like that was even before the awards. And then you can kind of track it as like when golden globes come in. Right. tag comes in and it's like when you have like a number attached to it like five nominations it gives you this like especially as a young Oscar obsessive like this quantifiable idea of like prestige or quality yeah in a way that I don't really see now yeah it's funny that those ads that are meant to presumably get the attention of people who have power have the biggest effect on young gay

boys yeah yeah it's funny how that works out Speaking of things that appeal to young gay boys, what drew you to wanting to do a Sophia Coppola film for us? I just, well, she just is such a, I mean, to be honest, I was shocked that you guys hadn't done one before. So that's why I jumped in and I was like, oh, I would love to be like, you know, on the first, on the episode that, you know, that's the first time you guys discussed Sophia Coppola just because she is such a classic example of like, well, she's such an interesting person, Oscars-wise, because she had the huge success of Los Angeles. in translation and then could never in terms of oscars at least could never get back up to that height even though you could argue that i mean there's been there have been hits or misses but her movies in general still are still broadly speaking critically acclaimed she's still you know she works with very good actors she's still very respected it's not like she's an

m night shaman situation right um but but for whatever reason like she just hasn't gotten to that point after that. And it doesn't seem like, I don't know. I mean, I'm now, I know that she, you know, has that movie that at some point will come out with Bill Murray and Rashida Jones. I'm sure it will be just as good as all the other ones. Do I think it'll suddenly, you know, catapult her back to winning an Oscar? I don't think so. Like, it's kind of just like, I kind of think she got her Oscar. Yeah, I think that's right. I think one of the things, and we'll sort of will obviously go farther into the Sophia Coppola thing as we get into the episode. But one of the sort of theories I had had about that is just like her movies didn't get it's not that they got worse but

they never got bigger they she never really like leveled up in scale even I guess the beguiled is the closest that it comes to it but even the beguiled when you watch it maria and twinette too but maria twinette for like a mainstream Oscar audience is too weird it's probably still her weirdest movie yeah well and in terms of like emotional scope it's still pretty small right where It's like, it's the story of Marie Antoinette, but it's the story of, like, her little limited experience within Versailles and among her friends and palace intrigue and all that. And it never really, like, the revolution is very much on the fringes of that movie. And I think that's part of her aesthetic. And, like, I love, that's one of the things I really love about her.

It's, you know, it's one of the things I really love about somewhere is that it's so dedicated to being exactly what it is. And she never, like, moved up to doing the fantasy movie or the action movie or anything like that. She's stayed so concentrated on the kind of movie that she makes. And I think that's, I think when that is a breakthrough, as Lawston's translation was, it's new, it's interesting. She's obviously like Hollywood royalty. So that is going to be very attractive to the Oscars. but without the next movies being like a big leap forward in terms of the kind of movie she's making there's there isn't that like shininess to it anymore and it's tougher to um you know hang a campaign on

that i guess well and see i think this type of like specificity of like narrative or characters or perspective is why she hasn't really been back in the Oscars because it is kind of this she's making movies about very specific kind of people and I would say she is interrogating it more than I think some of her critics would say um but like the reason why she I think she's not welcome back to is because she makes these small movies about people in like small ways with small like lives basically or like very um isolated lives I guess you could say and that's even though the movies are different like she's a very very specific filmmaker and that's not necessarily what oscar is always going to leap towards well it's also like a form i mean one of her strengths as a director

is getting interesting performances out of actors and that's just something that isn't valued i mean i remember feeling this way about mariel heller last year or was it two years ago whatever um but uh both years you know yeah i guess both years but for me at least especially with um can you ever forgive me like that just isn't an element of directing that is valued by the Oscars is getting like really nuanced quiet performances out of Stephen Dorf and L fanning yeah yeah I'm excited to get into the specifics of the movie before we do George as our guest we are going to ask you if you are prepared to do a 60 second plot description I am I am I really hope I mean I have to say it not much plot so I yeah like

You can't do it. That'll be on me. One of the things that I saw when I was looking it up was like the script was 43 pages. I'm like, that tracks. That's about right. That's so funny. Wow. Yeah. All right. So before we kick it to that, I'll just give up the basics. So we're going to be talking about Somewhere, the 2010 film Somewhere, directed and written by Sophia Coppola, starring Steven Dorf, Elle Fanning, Michelle Monaghan, a few fun little cameo appearances by actors that we'll get into. It premiered on September 11th, 2010 at the Venice Film Festival, did not open in the United States until December 22nd, where it opened limited, and it didn't ever really expand that much, but we'll talk about that too. But George, I'm going to put 60 seconds on the clock, and if you are ready, I am ready.

All right, and begin. Okay, Johnny Marco is a recently divorced Hollywood actor who lives in the Chateau, Vermont, in L.A., he's kind of going through the motions of publicity for his new movie and also partying all the time and sleeping with various blonde women. His daughter, Cleo, visits him and he starts kind of taking her around with him to events, including an award show in Milan. At some point, his ex-wife calls him and tells him she has to go away for a while, and he has to take Cleo to camp. Then, on their way to camp, Cleo starts crying, saying she doesn't know when her mom will be back and that he is always away. Oh, sorry. Okay, they spent a night in Vegas kind of gambling and

bonding and then he puts her in a cab to go to camp on her own and then as she and then right before she leaves he apologizes to her for not being around but she can't hear him because of the sound of his helicopter then he goes back to L.A. by himself decides to move out of the Chateau Armand as and and and then as he's driving away he parks his car and starts walking by himself in the middle of nowhere and then the movie ends with a song by Phoenix. Yes it does. Good job. sorry thank you oh my god i can't oh wow just in time yes no you were perfect um yeah you kind of nailed it there's it's such an uh specifically structured movie that it does sort of like it moves along i think

pretty well it's not a long movie it's just a movie that has very long takes and very sort of like relaxed and leisurely scenes but it moves from like one thing to another thing to another thing and like the emotional beats i think track pretty clearly right yeah yeah no i think it's a classic example of like i if you're not in the right headspace you could watch something like this or if this is just not your thing you could watch it and be like okay nothing happens what's the point like literally she doesn't know how film works you know but but if you are slightly generally general you realize that like every single thing is so intentional and it's almost like this kind of um you know a plot based on emotions rather than events but if you kind of like accept that then

you realize that everything is so seamlessly kind of you know one thing is put in front of uh the previous one in a way that honestly makes it maybe one of her most uh focused movies yeah yeah i would agree I think she's also presenting things in a way, specifically with, like, the details surrounding, like, Johnny and his stardom that are, like, not as, you know, like, it's not the type of, like, movie decisions or a bigger decision to, like, make you kind of write the movie off a little bit, or you could feel like it's something you've seen before where it's like, yeah, Johnny parties a lot, but he's not, like, getting obliterated, he's not doing a ton of crazy drugs. right he doesn't have a drug problem he doesn't have a drinking problem i really kind of liked that that it didn't rely on these crutches of him being in crisis oh my god there were so many places where it could i mean even i would say i mean for instance the twins dancing on the poles that could have been played so much more melodramatically or like could have been kind of like a sign of him being depraved and like obsessed with you know but it but even that was played just the right

amount for laughs in a way that was also weirdly not disrespectful to the women like it was it's all done very subtly and like so much so that when finally like when they're in the car and el fanning starts crying first of all even even the crying is is not done in a in a really kind of like hysterical way it's done it's done you know very subtly but like it almost then has so much more of a of an emotional impact because everything has been so muted it's also the only scene in the movie that feels to me like the actual dialogue matters yes yeah that's a really good point because then yeah i mean and and something as small as like he then says something's i mean he basically doesn't correct her when she's like everything sucks by parents are both like you know constantly gone and he basically

just has like it'll be okay honey or something and it's like so heartbreaking because he actually can't promise her something different it's kind of gutsy to have for on sophia Coppola's part to write this film where the protagonist, and I mean, everything from how he is on the page to how he is on the screen to the casting of it, is so built to resist any kind of audience sympathy where it's just like he's so disaffected. He's like, he's kind of a shit, but not in, as I mentioned, like, these big elaborate ways. So it's not even like, you can just be like, oh, this, you know, poor wayward soul or whatever. And it's just sort of just like. He never really like screws up as like a dad like it's not like he right you know abandons her to go snort coke or something like

he's just a general like fuck up who's probably not ever built to be a parent but like there's no grand way that he screws up in this movie right just the platonic ideal of a fuck boy you cast stephen dorf which is such perfect casting i like i kind of can't believe it and again because she makes her movies on such a small scale she's able to get away with that she's able to get away with that she's able to cast Steven Dorf is your lead in a movie and it's like and it's fine and she doesn't she manages to get his character to a point where he you spend enough time with him and cleo the daughter together that eventually it's not like you're like leaving with like warm and fuzzy feelings for johnny marco but you just you get the feeling that you like you get their dynamic you get their vibe

you understand what's going on with them. It is neither, you know, super laudable or super tragic. It just sort of is this story. And I think Coppola ends up really nailing it in a way that by the end of the movie, and I was watching this again, like I already knew that I'd seen this movie before and I liked it. But by the end of the movie, I was struck again by just like, oh, wow, she really just pulls it together. Yeah, no, it really is, it's honestly an incredible feat. And I have to say, I had watched it once before, and I watched it.

it literally like hours ago this morning for for this and I liked it even more the second time and it is I mean you're absolutely right that it just doesn't have a moralistic outlook I mean to make a movie literally about like you know fatherhood the emptiness of stardom all of these like big things and managed to not be moralistic about it is incredible yeah also I was so much more impressed this time with Al Fanning than I was the first time like me too I And I think it's because I've seen her perform as an older, you know, young woman now where it's, it's her career so fascinating because like we've talked about her before because we did an episode on the door on the floor when she was like really little. Seven years old or something like that. And it's just like, and so when that performance is just very naturalistic and very sort of like small and low key, you're just like, well, yeah, she's seven.

But also, like, knowing that her sister is Dakota Fanning, who is the absolute exact opposite of that, where it's just like she's so incredibly self-possessed and she's so sort of like straightforward with putting the character out there. Like, she's an actress, right? And I mean, Al Fanning, I think, is a really great actress, too. But it's such a different style that it's sometimes amazing that they're sisters. And they have just, like, completely separate different approaches. Yeah, it's very much like a Beyonce and Solange situation. Yeah, that's a really good point. But she's so incredibly good and effective in this movie and just, like, these small little parts,

watching her make those Eggs Benedict and just like that really, like, small little, like, look. I wanted the Mac and Cheese. Of, like, self-sufficiency and satisfaction on her face. Yeah. God, the Egg Benedict scene is, like, that's, like, one of those things. not to be one of these people that's like, oh, my God, these weird scenes and movies make me emotional. You know what I mean, though? I feel like that's something that I would have thought, like, when I was 12, being like, wow.

I'm one of those people where, like, when Meryl Streep cracks the egg in the hours, like, that to me is more impactful than her crying. Merrill Streep separating yokes in that movie is like maybe one of my top two or three scenes in that movie. Truly. I just want to be that yoke. Yeah. But the eggs Benedict was just like, it was such a well-done scene. I mean another example actually I was thinking about this this morning like with you know

Steven Dwarf's friend Sammy that he he's always hanging out with she could have so easily placed a scene of like them doing coke in front of her that would have like cheapened the whole thing but she chose not to do that you know even watching it again knowing what happens in this movie I'm watching those scenes and I'm just like don't let them be lewd to her anything like that like don't like have a lear at her or something like that because a it's also like the guy is from jackass right like he's one of the guys from jackass yeah chris pontius right and i'm watching the movie and i literally made a note of just like johnny don't make her hang out with you and your dumb friend like that's such a like i feel like that's all that's such a like a and i wouldn't know

specifically but like it feels like such a single dad move or it's just like you've got your daughter and you don't really know how to entertain for her so it's just like oh you're just going to invite your friend over to play video games and it's just like all right because she's 11 years old and they are functionally 11 years old, too. So it's like, of course they get along just great. They play fucking guitar hero or whatever. Well, it feels like he's outsourcing the job of having fun with his daughter to his friend who seems like much more easily, like has a much easier rapport with her.

And Johnny is a little bit more awkward for like a lot of reasons where like, you know, you understand he's got a lot of residual guilt about his lifestyle and his, and his, you know, the marriage breaking up. if they were ever even married, maybe they weren't ever even married. But, yeah, it's just sort of, he's, he's, he's not a bad dad, but he's, like, he just doesn't have his shit together just such a degree that it's just like. This is one of the things that I'm like, this, Sophia Coppola absolutely deserves so much credit for casting L fanning in this movie because, like, as is true of L. and the full sisters fanning

LLC, they're known for having this like air of maturity beyond their years or it's like been a joke where it's like they're eight years old and they seem like a 30 year old woman, you know, there's something about that that feels intentional in the casting of Elle Fanning where it's like she shows up on screen with Stephen Dorff and kind of like immediately exposes him in his immaturity and his inability to be a father that was, you know, just interesting just like putting those two performers together. Yeah. Yeah.

Watching the first big scene with her when she goes to her ice skating practice where we get to really, and again, Coppola just lets the scene play out so, like, intentionally, like, it feels like it's not quite a fuck you because I don't think there's a fuck you energy to Sophia Coppola, but there is this energy of just like, yes, I'm going to have this entire song play from start to finish. Gwen Stefani's cool. and we're going to see this entire practice and you're going to see it from a distance and Johnny's going to be like fucking around on his phone because he's like to whatever to pay attention and then all of a sudden he'll like slowly you know start paying attention to how like

gorgeous and accomplished and like I think one of the things that we can see through his eyes with her is like oh she's really dedicated to like whatever whatever he's lost in his ability to not enjoy like his career anymore she has that she has the love of skating she has the love of all her little hobbies she seems like really interested in like even like the ex benedict thing like she's you know her self-sufficiency brings her satisfaction and i think he's sort of looking at that with a little bit of like oh you know wistfulness and whatever yes yeah well she managed i mean again it's like it's the subtlety of like she is a precocious child but she is not a movie prococious like there is never a part where she's like you know you really need to take

control of your life like there is never a part where she suddenly starts speaking like an adult like she doesn't become chloe grace moretz at exactly exactly and wait i also wanted to say in terms of like what you're saying in terms of her like letting the song play from beginning to end what's was so interesting and um about that is that then there are other scenes that you would think in a different movie have so much meat to them like for instance the the press conference scene where there are all those like funny questions from the various international reporters or like the italian award show those are then kind of cut short like she doesn't let you have too much fun it's like there are little she will let the kind of like the ice skating scene or the scene

of the car just going around in circles those will go on quote unquote too long and then the scenes where you're like oh finally kind of like the slapstick humor is here like those will then end prematurely. Or like any of his hookups are shown so briefly. And so like once you, once the audience gets to the point where they know what's going on, she's like, okay,

well, you get it. You know what I mean? Like Eliza Coupe is just sort of like leering at him in the doorway of the, whatever, adjacent room. And, you know,

all you see is like the bedboard, the headboard like banging against the wall a couple times. But that's all really you need to see. Um, the biggest laugh I had in this movie was the second. second strip tease scene where the first one you get again the entire song of foo fighters my hero like front to back and it's just them doing this like and it's not even a sad striptees it's not titillating and it's not sad it's just it just it just is it's just middle of the road yeah and a dull whatever but then the second time and you realize that she's showing it again and i was just like i had to i just had to laugh i thought it was so funny because i'm imagining any audience whose patience was tested by that first scene. I'm just imagining them getting to this one,

and she's like, oh, she's fucking doing it again. Yep. Yeah. I want to talk about Sophia Coppola's music sense because the second scene, after it was Foo Fighters hero, the second time, it is one thing by Amory. Yeah.

One of the best songs of all time. Of all time. Truly. But, like, the soundtrack to this movie is incredible. It's so specific not just to, like, the world she's painting and, like, the place in time and, like, the late aughts. but also just like the emotional texture of what's going on and the way she like

can present something like hero by the food fighters or amory and it's like you can't really get into like the thrust of that song because what the scene is doing like I guess the contrast between the scene and the song that's being put in and like obviously like her biggest like musical, like, the thing that we talk about is probably Marie Antoinette, right? But, like, every single one of her movies, obviously, with the exception of the beguile, because of when it is set, has, like, a really incredible musical. Oh, her musical sensibility and Lost in Translation, and there are so many music cues in the version suicides that are just absolutely iconic.

Like, you know, the heart music cue, the, just any time that Josh Harton is on the screen, like she really she's one of those soundtrack filmmakers that like on one level you can just be like oh yeah you're like you're just indulging in the music you really like i think the fact that somewhere is bookended with phoenix songs i was just like oh sophia well also i didn't realize the score is by phoenix until that was like the big reveal at the end when the credits started rolling but also another great music choice was oh now i'm not remembering but there's a gwen Stefani song during the ice skating scene. Yeah, cool.

Yeah, yeah. It was cool. Yeah, yeah, which is such a, I don't know, it's like the fun song you would choose for ice skating when you're, like, allowed to choose a contemporary song if you're a 12-year-old girl. It's also the Sophia Coppolaists of Gwen Stefani's songs. Yes, yeah. But to like the indulgence of it, like I don't actually read her musical choices as

indulgent because they're not the choices that you would expect to be made, but they are exactly the right decision. Yeah. Using Azalea Banks and the bling ring. Yep. Brilliant. Brilliant. Yeah, it's really good.

Sophia Coppola's career is even more interesting than I think I think everybody sort of like recognizes the fact of her career being kind of fascinating because she started off. Obviously, she's Francis Ford Coppola's daughter, but she was in a bunch of his movies when she was little. And then she got this like second lead essentially. in the godfather part three which was like such an anticipated movie such a big Hollywood deal and it's a bad performance like it is a bad it's one of those things where you want to go back and watch it and just be like it's not as bad as people say like it is like it's it's bad she's not an actress she's just yeah she's not well it's funny i was like looking at her wikipedia earlier and when it's under awards i mean this is so rude to her but under

awards it literally says the first award she ever won was a razi for her performance in the godfather part Three. Dad? Why are you doing this to me? I mean, I find some of her moments in Godfather Part 3, funny to the point of me being delighted by them. Like, her, it's no spoiler to say that she gets killed at the end of Godfather Part 3.

It was in 1990 for Pete's sake. But, like, I always think of that. She gets shot and she just sort of like drops, she just looks at Pacino and she just goes, Dad. And it's like the Californian-eist accent you've ever heard in your entire life. and but the fact that that movie it's not her fault that that movie decided to hang so much of its narrative on whether goddamn Mary decides to get into a relationship with her cousin Andy Garcia like it's just like that's you know she didn't write it whatever and so yeah yeah to have remind me what the Winona writerness of that story is because wasn't it originally supposed to be Winona or something and she dropped out Winona was supposed to play the part that Bridget Fonda ended up playing I'm pretty sure Oh, never mind. I don't think, I don't know if there's any could have beens in terms of Mary,

but I'm pretty sure that that was the thing, that Winona was supposed to play the Bridget Fonda role, which is pretty minor as it is anyway. So, I think, although now I want to see Winona Ryder in a Sophia Coppola movie. Oh, one thousand percent. Or, like, maybe that's one of those, like, time machine things where I want to see, like, 1994 Winona Ryder in a present-day Sophia Coppola movie. Like, I feel like that's the ideal.

but her sort of comeback as a director I remember when the virgin suicides came out there was a lot of incredulity of course because it's just like she was such like her name was so infamous among like movie circles and people I think it took a second for people to come around to the fact that like oh the virgin suicides is actually really really promising and it never quite made it into excuse me never quite made it into awards discussion but it was sort of on the fringes for a while I remember and It took a whole damn year for the movie to actually open after it played one of the sidebars in Cannes, if I remember correctly. Yeah, that sounds about right. Like it opened a whole year later. And then Lost in Translation was one of those movies that started building buzz early in that year. And I think that, like, whatever campaign focus decided to do for it was just, like, absolutely perfectly calibrated. And it capitalized on her narrative and Murray's narrative. and but it's also such a like that was the movie of hers that obviously i thought of most watching somewhere

because somewhere feels like not even an evolution of lost in translation but maybe like the other side of a coin like you can tell that those are probably the two movies of hers that draw most from her own experience yeah and they're the two that are most kind of like mood pieces basically yeah or is that the right term I remember, like, Lost in Translation, I had read in some review that, like, it captures the feeling of jet lag in a way, like, and I feel like with somewhere it's like, I mean, this is oversimplifying it, but it's like it captures the feeling of like a hangover at times or the feeling of like a, you know, it's all, it's all, it's very dreamlike and very, um, and, and of all her movies, those are probably the ones with the least plot. Yeah. Yeah. Would that be, I don't know. Yeah.

Yeah, no, I think, I think because I think those are movies where, like, the premise kind of is the plot. Exactly, yeah. And Lawson Translation is a little plot here because we have this relationship she forms with Murray's character, and there's a little bit of a will they or won't they kind of a sense to it as it goes along, and they have this kind of, like, you know, one night out or whatever. But I think, but with both of those movies, and I think it speaks to sort of the knock on Coppola for being sort of insular and privileged in her scope of things. But, like, both of those movies,

you're not going to find too many people in your audience who, like, know the experience of living out of a hotel to that degree, right? To the degree that, like, both of the Scarlett's character in Lawson Translation and Dorff's character and this. But she still manages to communicate more universal feelings from those specific situations where it's like, I don't know what it's like to be living out of the Chateau Marmont,

But like, I know what it's like to feel like a drift in my like life and career to a point where like, you know, I'm feeling lost like this guy. Yeah. Or to kind of have an imperfect relationship with a friend or family member or to to know that you have shortcomings and yet persist. Yeah. It's. Or to be in like a transitional period and not really have the full awareness that it's a transitional period. Or feel the power to, like, push it in one direction or another. This movie played the Venice Film Festival and ended up winning the Golden Lion at the Venice Film Festival. Not uncontroversial. I was going to say, that's the really interesting. It's probably the most interesting awards angle of this movie is everything that happened with Venice that year. Quentin Tarantino was the president of the jury.

I'm trying to remember who else was on that jury. I think Luca Guadino was on that. movie was on that jury and Danny Elfman right Danny Elfman's here I'm trying to think of yeah yeah yeah yes yes yes um so Tarantino had dated Coppola briefly at some point in their like whatever previous to 2010 and so there was a lot of there was a lot of dissatisfaction anytime Quentin Tarantino had to jury for something there's some kind of thing

he was the Cannes jury president when uh Fahrenheit 9-11 won the Palm Doric can but so there was a lot of controversy in the aftermath of that Venice Film Festival. One of the things was, oh, he's only giving awards to his friends. Coppola wins the Golden Lion. This other director friend of his won, I think, second place. And then he changed the rules of the Venice Film Festival so that movies could win two prizes so that this friend of his could win two prizes for his film. And this film that, like, had Vincent Gallo in it or something like that. And just like, God damn it, like, any, the things I would rather be doing than watching a Vincent Gallo movie at any point.

Yeah. Promises written in water. I think that's what it is. I'm literally like looking up the... No, because I remember the... I don't... I'm very much not as knowledgeable about the festival stuff as you guys are, but I remember there was a Greek movie called Attenberg that was a big deal this year. And it was kind of like a big post-dog tooth, like the next kind of weird Greek movie that people really liked. I think that was one of the movies that...

Or maybe that did win a prize. Now I'm looking at it up too. Sorry, I had the window open. It stars Jorgas Lantimos's partner. Jorgas Lantimos is in this movie. Stark naked. Yeah, Ariane Labed won Best Actress at the festival. There you go.

That's what it was. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, fucking Gallo won for Best Actor for a movie called Essential Killing, which I think, no, that wasn't even. He also, Gallo's in, like, one movie. and then directed another movie at this festival. The one that Tarantino's friend directed is called a sad trumpet ballad.

So that one for... That's the clown movie, right? Screenplay and director. Yeah, Alex de la Iglesia, one for that. That year, like Milakunis won for emerging actor for Black Swan, which at the time a lot of people thought was bullshity. I think now looks better.

I think we've all sort of, like, come around to the fact that, like, Milakunis is really fucking great in Black Swan. Yes. but I think one of the big controversies was the Italian press really went nuts because no Italian movie got any prizes and like

the Italian cultural minister came in and like brought up a whole like we're going to have to change the rules about who can be on juries and all the sort of stuff and well that's especially funny because she literally has that whole sequence where she like lampoon's Italian show business

yes oh I know that all right that whole scene in the movie where he goes to that award ceremony, I guess, right, in Milan, is wild, but also is just like kind of savage when it comes to the silliness of like the life of being an international movie star. But so like eventually like Berlusconi like weighed in on the Venice Film Festival that year was a whole fucking thing. And so that I think kind of, it didn't like taint the movie exactly, but it does give you the sense of just like, well, it won the Venice Film Festival Prize, but there was, you know, Quentin Tarantino bullshitiness or whatever.

But if you look at the lineup for that Venice Film Festival, it's not a bad lineup necessarily, but there's nothing on there where it's just like, oh, the, you know, the forever taint on this festival that such and such didn't win. Like Black Swans at that festival, which I think is great. Meeks cutoff by Kelly Riker is at that festival, which I think is great. But like, I don't know, there's a Pablo Lorraine there, but like there's a Francois O's zone movie there that like wasn't really reviewed super well there's a julian schnobble movie there that like was kind of under the radar and so it's like this idea that somewhere kind of like got away with something by winning at venice that year is i think a little overblown it is a little

surprising to me though that it wins like a top prize because the movie is so low key yes um so like you can understand how it would maybe catch the attentions of of Tarantino more because it's directed by his friend, but it's not the type of movie that wins a major prize like this at a festival. I think that's right, but I don't, I don't necessarily think that makes it bad, like, a bad development. And I know you don't think that either. Oh, no, I agree.

Yeah. But, yeah, you could see where that would, like, raise eyebrows, but it also feels like where, and I think this is something that she's encountered a lot in her career. And obviously, her being Francis Focopoulos' daughter gave her a leg up in her career that not anybody else really has. And that's been a huge privilege and advantage to her. But also, so many times in her career where it's stuff like this, where it's just like, oh, she only won Venice because she used to date the jury president. And she only became such and such because she's Francis Ford Coppola's daughter. And I think it's an easy way to dismiss her accomplishments as a director to be like, and it even goes to the fact of, like,

oh, she only makes movies about like poor little rich girls, which up until somewhere most, I think all of her protagonist had been female. And even this, it's just like, well, you know, Stephen Dorff is also kind of a poor little rich girl in this movie. And, but it's just like it's a, there are, I think there are very valid criticisms of her, the fact that Sophia Coppola makes movies about privileged rich people

sort of locked in their little towers and whatever. But I also feel like... I think it's worth saying, though, that it... To just say that that's just what she's making movies about and that's what her perspective is, it kind of... It shouldn't be disregarded that she is interrogating

a lot of those things. She's, like, talking about the vacuousness of it. She's making movies about a very specific world because maybe that is her experience. But also, she's not just saying in any way that it's... it's, like, great, or that it's not worth, you know, examining further, you know. Yeah, and also all of them, I mean, when you read, if you don't come in with a preconceived

notion of who this person is, if you read the synopsis of any of her movies and go into it thinking, okay, this is a Hollywood movie about X, Y, Z, it's always unexpected. It's not, I don't think she's as predictable as people make her out to be. I think that's right. yeah i i don't know i it's tough because you don't want to like i my instinct is to defend her recognizing all this you know all this stuff we're talking about i do think on some level it's like do i yes a lot of her movies are about privileged white girls do i actually want her to attempt to make you know uh a movie about poor uh non-white people i don't know um it it reminds me also of

the one scene in Lost in Translation that gets a lot of criticism, which is the scene where he's the, the, the rip my stocking scene with the, I guess, what is she, she's some sort of sex worker of some kind.

And I was reminded of that in the massage scene in this movie, where it's just like, she does have a tendency every once in a while, just sort of just like to default to the easy sort of based on not even stereotypes

but just sort of just like this very kind of easy joke and the easy joke in somewhere is oh Johnny's so repulsed at the idea of this like naked massage therapist who like gets the wrong idea about but also it's And also that massage therapist is so weird

Yes well that's the other thing is like and then it like almost like shortcuts out of that scene where it's just like oh he's not like a rub and tug massage therapist, he just has a weird philosophy of, like, I have to be naked, but it didn't even seem

like he was going to, like, jerk him off or anything like that, right? It was just sort of this, like, misunderstanding, like, weird, like, three's company at the Chateau Marmont. I mean, the way that it's shot does make it seem a little, if not nefarious, definitely, like, punchy when he, like, drops his shorts and... Yeah.

But it's, like, the fact that, like, that's the most animated we ever see Johnny Marco in that movie is also, like, kind of weird but it's to me mostly i was just like oh this is a like oddly cheap joke for a movie that didn't really have that kind of humor for the rest of it i don't know yeah there's another quip about like something about like afro-caribbean dance versus ballet do you know what i'm talking about it like that also was like so out of nowhere but i have to say like i don't know you forget just how much subtle things like that have changed even just in 10 years weirdly coincidentally, EZA was on TV

last night, and I watched like two-thirds of it, and there were even a couple, and that came out the same exact year, it came out in 2010, that's what I thought of it. And like, there were even a couple of jokes there in a movie I generally consider it be pretty inoffensive, where I was like, oh, right, we used to make just like, you know,

movies used to have these, like, weird, semi-ironic race or sexuality-related jokes that are not, you know, blatantly offensive, but just kind of were peppered in for flavor. Bring it on, was on right out. after the drag race finale this week. And that's 10 years even earlier than this. And that movie, watching it again, I'm like,

oh, I, like, this movie had kind of a lot of, like, just little moments that if this was, you know, happening today probably would have been, like, combed out and just sort of, you know, tweaked and, you know, maybe go back and rethink a couple of these jokes or a couple of it was, like, just like, real kind of free wheeling with throwing the word bag around or sort of just like we're making these kind of jokes.

And it's not like I think that Bring It On is bad at all. I think Bricking On is fantastic. And it has ultimately good politics. Yes. Like way better politics than most movies of its kind back then. Like actually actively resists being a white savior movie even as you can see the narrative like trying to push it towards that way and it pushes back. It's kind of cool in that way. Although I also get the feeling that and you if you ever watch the Bring It on trailer, you really can see that like, oh, there's a lot more about the Clovers in this screen.

probably that got kind of edited out and streamlined in a way. So, I don't know, justice for the Bring It On director. Release the Clover's cut of Bring It On, HBO Max. But, God, I really took us far afield, didn't I? Backtracking, backtracking. Oh, the Chateau Marmot. I wanted to talk about the Chateau Marmont. Obviously, it's annoying to say that whatever, a setting is a character in a movie.

Right, right, right, right. Coppola really, without being like, let me take you on a virtual tour of the Chateau Marmot. Like, it never quite becomes to the level of like what Versailles is for Marie Antoinette. And yet all these little moments, I'm always just like, God, what a nightmare. The Chateau Marmot sounds like, right? It looks like just a bunch of shitty apartment. Yes. Yeah, it does.

And just the fact that like... And I mean, maybe that's intentional, but like, it was like, what... Why? Or just the thing where, like, he's... he's like pigging out on some like gross little meal in the middle of the like whatever gathering area in the middle as like all these like fancy schmance people are like gathering for drinks or whatever and he's there with his like dumb wrist cast and like and just like making himself at home looking like a slob or whatever i'm just like the the mishmash of the kinds of people who

seem to congregate at the chateau mont like i would know because i've never fucking they'd never let me within whatever two miles of that place but I don't know It's just like she does a really good job Of setting the scene In a way that you just like you get If you've never even like heard of the Chateau Marmad Or like knew what like the vibe of that place was

You would get it watching this movie Yeah and it's always just enough Like she doesn't hit you over the head with it Like there's just one scene where like a young actor Like I mean two things that stick out Are the young actor being like Do you have any tips for acting or like Asting fucking

Asking Stephen Dwarf, do you do method acting? Alden Airbrake, who is not credited, by the way. I watched the end credits, and he is not there. Oh, really? Yeah. And then, of course, Benicio del Toro just being like, oh, yeah, I met Bono. Like, a different director. This is obviously such a different person.

But imagine, like, Judd Apatow having the task of showing you the depravity of the Chateau-Mermont. Like, it would just. I mean, just with that one elevator scene, that's all she needed Benicio del Toro for. I love that it was Benicio del Toro in an elevator, too, which almost seemed like inside joky, because do you ever remember hearing that story about... Him making out with Scarlett Johansson in an elevator? Yep, yep, after the, whatever, the O'3 Oscars.

Oh, yeah. Which is, like, Scarlett was at that Oscars because of Lost in Translation, and he was nominated for 21 grams that year. But yes, I remember hearing that story. I can't believe somebody else did, Chris, that's amazing. I will never forget that. Yeah, Benicio, always looking like a nightmare. Never stop.

Truly, truly. Do any of you have any kind of, like, feelings about Steven Dorf as, like, apart from this movie? Was he, like, an actor who, like, you guys, like, have any thoughts of? Stephen Dorf, for me, is the Everytime video. Okay, that's what I was going to bring up. He's in, like, two iconic music videos. He's in the Aerosmith Cryon video with Alicia Silverstone, which was, like, you know, huge for its moment. And then, yes, he's the guy in the Britney Spears every time video.

And for me, Stephen Dorff is in the Blade. He's Blade. Movie, not Movies. He's just in the first one, right? He's the villain in Blade. Yeah. Kind of is amazing. Yes, it is.

I think that's totally right. His career, though, is so fascinating because I think when you're looking at somewhere through an Oscar lens or an awards lens, you get the sense that this is the kind of performance that for an actor with any kind of history would have been like a comeback story or like it would have been a really good narrative and it kind of was a comeback movie for Steven Dorf but he had never gotten to the point in his career where anybody would have given a shit right where it's like yeah like he I actually I

would argue that he is one of the reasons that like this movie didn't get as much traction with Oscar for that kind of particular reason because I don't want to be so cruel as to say like no one cares that he gives this great performance in this movie that's kind of antithetical to what a lot of his like screen work has been but I mean like who was rushing out to reward Stephen Dorff for something yeah no it's so sad and he needs I mean he needs it more than any other person that they could have cast right like Bill Murray was fine in 2003 like his career was going to be fine whether he got an Oscar nomination or not And it's not like somebody with a whole lot of, you know, storied history, like that Oscar has, like, nominated, like, a Mickey Rourke or something. Exactly. I immediately thought of Mickey Rourke, yeah. Right, because Mickey Rourke had those, like, famous lows. So it's like you're coming back from really, like, bottoming out. And it's, like, Dorff has occupied this really middle level of, like, semi-anonymity.

But, like, he's an actor whose name you knew. you know what I mean it's like you knew that like you knew him by name at these people you know who follow movies like yeah isn't that weird though like I'm just playing an actor like a Stephen Dorff why yeah why why do I feel like oh Stephen Dorff is like a thing and it's just like why though like yeah I'm looking at his list of movie I'm looking at his filmography I literally haven't seen any of these movies and yet I know and yet I know him so well as though like because of blade baby I saw Sussle B. Dessle B Demented is a really weird lead role for him where he plays the title character, but like, that's such a, like, it's such a John Waters movie that, like, John Waters is the star of Cessle B demented, right? It's just like... Yeah, John

Waters is going to be the star of any John Waters movie. Well, also Melanie Griffith. It's like, I actually, it's funny that you say that because I'm now, oh, I guess I remember him, but to me that's Melanie Griffith. Of course. Yes, absolutely. And anybody who was interested enough to see Cessle Bemented, it's going to be Melanie Griffith

for them, too. Like, it's... The only other one would I really remember him in. And, like, I don't think anybody else saw this movie. He was in a movie called Cold Creek Manor in 2003 with Sharon Stone. Yes. And it's very much, like, a family moves into this, like, very, like, nice little house in the country and are terrorized by, like, locals. And he's one of the locals who terrorizes them.

But he's so fucking ripped in that movie. And, like, it's one of those things where it's a little, like, Billy's and, in dead calm where it's just like oh he's so villainous but like very sexy what's going on and of course the thing about stephen dorf that they actually do make fun of in somewhere is that like he's a little guy he's like he's a short little guy yeah yeah so it's so funny watching him in cold creek manner like sort of like sexually like menace um Sharon stone and it's just like where uh he's just like got his shirt off and he just like looks amazing but it's also like it's not hiding the fact that he's a wee little guy and it's a little wee baby

See, I was going to say the only other Stephen Dorff movie I remember him from is Fear.com. You saw Fear.com? Okay. Which is like late era, like the type of horror movie, like the Dark Castle movies where it was like ghost ship, 13 ghosts. 13 ghosts, yes, absolutely. Late era like type of movies where the internet was the plot, like this whole, but they turned it into a horror, whatever. Fear.com, it's absolutely terrible, but he's the lead in that movie. The other thing about Stephen Dorf is he's usually maybe at most fourth build in the things that he's in, unless they're just like schlock, right? He's been, the thing about him, though, is that, like, he'll be the lead in just movies that, like, nobody ever, like, sees or cares about.

The most ironic thing about his career is that his big sort of breakthrough movie was a movie called Backbeat in, like, 94. four around where he it's like it's the story of the Beatles and he plays the guy who was in the Beatles and then got left out when they became like big stars or whatever and it's just like oh wow that's such a parallel to what his career actually became where it was just like this was supposed to be this big breakthrough movie for him um Cheryl Lee is also in that movie and a couple other people but like that that was supposed to launch him and then his career just sort of like sort of gets away from him and it never happens for him it's it's a weird thing well he was also in a limp biscuit music video sure sure so the three he was in were crying then one called roland

by limp biscuit where he plays himself apparently and then every time and in crying and every time his role is boyfriend and enrolling it's himself yeah every time he's supposed to be Justin Timberlake right sort of I don't well or is that not it is that I don't think so yeah because it's because he I think it's like a fictionalized it's a it's a fictionalized thing where like Brittany is with some kind of like abusive boyfriend I don't think she's like accusing Justin Timberlake of being violent yeah yeah all right I guess I don't know that video as well as I think I know Oh, it's like, that, I have to say, I would highly recommend revisiting it. He gives a very unhinged performance, and then there's, like, the reveal at the end that

Britney is, like, in a bathtub and finds blood behind her head and she's been dead the whole time. That's the part I remember it. Yeah. I remember about that. Because I remember there being, like, a whole thing of just, like, is this a cry for help? Which, like, everything Britain's done from, like, 2002 on has been, is this a cry for help? We should, I don't think any of us watch this, but we should also mention that he was in the third season

of True Detective. And I think he might have been like lead or co-lead in that season. I think it was him in a rehearsal. Yeah. Which I remember people being like because the arc of True Detective

was much like sensation in the first season everybody despised the second season. And then I think there was a little bit of like that bounce for season three but like hardly anybody watched it. So who was to say? Oh Dorf. Indeed. Poor Dorf.

Also that name just sounds like kind of sad. It's just like Stephen Thorff. Like, oh, okay. And he kind of looks like, oh, God, what's his name, Josh Lucas? Yeah. Right? Yeah. Yeah.

Like, I kept, when we were thinking of movies he's been and I kept wanting to say Josh Lucas movies. I was like Poseidon, but no. That's funny. Wait, just a little spoiler. None of us picked him for our IMDV game, right? No. Okay.

Then I want to look at his known for because I want to see if it's any. Blade, obviously, somewhere, yes. A movie called Immortals that I think I saw, which was about like... Oh, I saw that. It's a Tarsum Singh movie. Yes, it's about Greek gods on Olympus or whatever, right? Yes. God, this cast.

Or Henry Cavill. Yeah. Henry Cavill, Mickey Rourke, Stephen Dorff, Frida Pinto, Luke Evans, John Hurd. Wow. It's terrible. Yeah, I remember being terrible. Kellyn Lutz as Poseidon. Really?

Who did not need Kellyn Lutz as Poseidon? You know, maybe this is just my own kind of Greek heritage, because I grew up with so much, like, ancient Greek imagery and every, like, picture book that we own. But, like, there is, to me, nothing more embarrassing than seeing Hollywood actors decked out as anything resembling, like, ancient Greeks or, like, Greek God. Like, there's a lot of those movies. There's so many. I mean, when you, even just something as simple as, you know, Alexander with Colin Farrell, every frame of that movie is so humiliating. and I understand that it has like a camp element and I understand you know like

I can get enjoyment out of it but it's just like it's too much my favorite thing about anytime anybody makes a movie about ancient Greeks is it's like Americans have this thing of just like we have this bucket of like three or four things we know about like every culture

and it's the only things we know about any culture and like the in that bucket for like what we know about ancient Greece is like that's the one ancient culture where like being gay was like canon kind of right and so it gives this like free pass for every single movie that's made about ancient greeks there's just like gayness cranked up to 11 like no matter what's going on and it's just like and everybody's sort of like all the photography is very much like lingering on

the men's bodies and whatever and it's like gayness cranked up to 11 but nobody's fucking right exactly that's exactly right exactly it's just like the imagery is very gay but like even in like Alexander where like a lot of the gayness was like in the director's cut and not the real part it was in Jared Lettow's gaze yeah well that's kind of I know this is like anathema to say but that's kind of why I don't mind 300 because it truly just cranks it up so much that you're like okay this is what everyone wants to do just do it right right but at some point like we just have to make the movie where it's just like it's just a thousand Greeks on screen and they're all fucking like just like get it out of your system yeah for real human centipede for

Oh, God. Greeks fucking. Yeah. The chain of fucking Greeks. Yeah. Can we also say a little bit for, like, what this best actor race was? It was, like, Stephen Dorf didn't really stand a chance because it's everybody doing, like, huge things where the most subtle performance you probably have is James Franco. Dear Christ.

Colin Firth wins for the King's speech. James Franco for 127 hours. Javier Bardem for beautiful. Jesse Eisenberg, Social Network. Jeff Bridge as true grit. Like, that's not a lot of room for somebody doing the type of subtlety that Stephen Dwarf is doing. No, I think that's right. But it is such a more compelling

performance in most of those, in my opinion. Yeah, exactly. It really, I mean... 2010 is so particular because that's one of those... Anytime anybody ever talks about how Oscars never nominate movies that make money anymore, I always point to the 2010 Best Picture Race where, like, everything was a blockbuster, and they're not even, like, movies made money that you wouldn't think would make money, like, the fighter or, you know, social network and stuff like that.

Black Swan making over a hundred million dollars. Right, exactly. And also, that year's best actress field is one of my favorites in my lifetime, maybe ever, where it's Portman for Black Swan, Benning for Kids Are All Right, Kidman for Rabbit Hole, Jennifer Lawrence for Winter's Bone, Michelle Williams for Blue Valentine. It's such a good lineup. up and then you look at best actor and you're just like oh yeah like someone it really is i'm i'm looking at it now again it's like this might be one of the least compelling best actor

races in for me personally in the last like 20 years and i genuinely generally think best actor is like almost always so much less impressive oh of course of course but this one specifically yeah i would should say i still never said that so i don't know i haven't either i would love beautiful. It's a lot of, like, I, I, I don't know. I don't like Inurito's, in Eurito's movies that are like this, that it's just like, it's a lot of despair and grimness and sobbing. That was peak in Euritu fatigue, too, where, like, that was sort of the, that was when everybody was just like, I can't go through another babble. I just really can't. And then, Bardam was like the underdog in that category. This was when, like, I think it was Julia Roberts was hosting, like, private screening

of the movie to get him nominated. It was a lot of like homegrown support among like the actors branch Javier Berndam is maybe one of the like more underrated Oscar campaigners of our era were like he'll work it and he will

and other people will work it on his behalf as you mentioned right there. He almost got the nomination for Skyfall which would have been like kind of shocking and amazing but yeah. I've forgotten about Jackie Weaver and Animal Kingdom being nominated. That's a fun nomination.

That's one of those really great ones where it's just like, it'll never happen. And then it doesn't happen. It's like super cool. Yeah. No, I love the 2010 Oscars. I just, uh, that's why I'm kind of,

I mean, whatever, like this Oscars is going to be bug nuts anyway, so who knows? But like, I'm excited about going back to 10 best pictures rather than this like fluctuating thing because like it did get them to nominate Winter's Bone. And I know a lot of people in Hollywood kind of like freaked out about that

because it was so small and nobody saw it and whatever. But it's just like, you know, stretch your boundaries a little bit, Oscars. Like, it's good for you. It's good for you. No, I agree. I agree. This is a good list. It is, I have to say, sorry, I know this is an obvious thing, but I'm looking at Inception.

I'm like, I forgot that was a serious Oscar. Like, I don't know. I just, you don't think of it as something that was. So many people for Christopher Nolan to not be nominated for Best Director for that movie. I mean, I watched that movie semi-recently when we thought that Tenet would be coming out any time before 2020. that is a good like I like that movie a lot that movie is very goofy it is very silly um just like I can't imagine having to learn the lines where they explain the logic of that movie and all of these Nolan terms that are just like I love it though I'm sorry no it's great it's great watching that

movie but like just sit back in the scenes where they explain the movie oh and it's so silly But I love that shit, though. I love where it's just like, all right, and then level three. And we all have to tip back in our chairs to enter level three. And then this one, we're going to drive off a bridge. And, no, I love all that shit. But, like, remember how much people argued about that movie that year where it was just, like, arguing not about, like,

about, like, minute things and whether it was just, like, it, like, held together internally or whatever. And it's just, like, guys, like, just. Well, same with interstellar. Like, it was the same thing. Yeah. But, like, I feel like, and I guess, I mean, no one kind of asks for it by making these sort of, like, intricate little things

and just sort of stepping back and being like, eh? That has such a boner for, like, process. But I also feel like the people who are just, like, like, nitpicking the plots of interstellar and inception. And I'm just like, guys, like. See, I'm not nitpicking. No, I don't think you are. The plot of inception. No.

I'm saying it's banana coconuts. it is, yes, what I'm saying. It is. I'm not disagreeing, yeah. It makes me chuckle. Back to somewhere for a second, though. The one thing I wanted to talk about briefly is the fact that, like, I think, and somewhere's not a poorly reviewed movie.

Like, it's a well-reviewed movie, although maybe not, like, enthusiastically so. Yeah. And its box office kind of, like, you know, cut it off at the ankles, like $1.7 million domestic. You're never going to get anything from that. But I also feel like, even if it was, like, reviewed. sparklingly, and even if it made like a surprising amount of money for an indie movie, I still feel like you're going to walk away with,

you're going to have a harder sell with something like somewhere because there's almost no way, and I think we saw it with the Venice jury, there's almost no way for anybody in Hollywood to praise a movie like somewhere and not look like they've traveled completely up their own asshole. Because it's so insidery. This is also like a very simple thing too, I mean, you saw it with 20th century women. You saw it with clemency where it's like it was released at exactly the wrong time of year

to get people to talk about a movie like this where it opens right at Christmas time. Right. Yeah, what were the big Christmas awards releases that year? I mean, the fighter, I think, was December. True Grit, I want to say, was December that year. True Grit was a Christmas release. Even like the Fighter and Black Swan were December. Black Swan was also December.

Yeah. But even still. I have a question about the good, not great reviews. Because I remember that too, but am I wrong to say that last year, when people were making best movies of the decade lists, suddenly it somewhere was everywhere? Or was that literally just like I saw it like. I think it was definitely more than some of the other couple of us. Okay. Because I just, I remember. And in fact, like, the first, I hadn't watched this movie

when it came out. And the first time I watched it was literally December of 2019 because of, I want to say at least like two or three people and or publications that I that did lists included it. And I was surprised because I didn't. I saw that it was on the New Yorkers list. Yeah. Yeah. And yeah, I think it became, I think it's on some level the cool pick for Coppola because it was one of her least Harold did. And I guess when you're talking about the decade, what are her 2010s movies?

It's this. It's blingering. It's Beguiled. Am I missing anything? No. Right. Those are the three. And so I think of those, I think somewhere is your sort of like your critics pick of those kind of.

Sure, sure, sure. That's probably true. I mean, like, I also from like the kind of middling positive reviews to like best of the decade type of conversations, like I get it because like that kind of upswing in favor for this movie, like I experienced it. I probably would have been like, yeah, it's good, but it's maybe my least favorite of her movie. just a few years ago, but, like, I've probably watched it now two or three times in the past two or three years. And, like, I definitely think it's one of her better movies. I just think this is a movie that you maybe don't appreciate it for what it is, or you can't really sit with it as much the first time. And, like, for me personally, this is a movie that's grown on me. So if anybody

else experiences like that with this movie, I get it. Yeah. That year is, It showed up on the National Border of Reviews, Year End Awards, of their top independent films. It did not make the list of their top ten movies, but their top, because NBR loves to spread that wealth and loves to give as many movies awards as possible. They put it on their top ten. Please show up to our luncheon. Yes, exactly. It's an interesting list I'm looking at now.

Animal Kingdom, we just mentioned a second ago, with Jackie Weaver, with also Animal Kingdom, a stealth-like... like star incubator kind of of the 2010s where Ben Mendelssohn's in that, Joel Edgerton's in that, Jackie Weaver, all of those people would be in a bunch of other Hollywood movies. They nominated buried the shit to Rion Reynolds movie where he's buried alive and I think is so fucking boring. I can't stand that movie. I don't know. Oh my God. I haven't thought of that. Wait, where do they nominate? Wait. Top 10 independent films. Top 10 independent films at the National Border Review. Yeah.

God. But critics really liked it. I think that was a Sundance movie. Chris, am I wrong? It was like Sundance or South by. Something like that. Yeah. Fish Tank, the Andrew Arnold movie that's fucking awesome with Michael Fastbender and a pair of jeans

hanging halfway off his ass throughout the entire movie, which nobody was mad about. Remember? It's, I don't, Fastbender's not the sex symbol that he was back then, right? Like, that's, it's. No, because all of his movies bombed. What is it that changed? I don't know. Is it maybe that he played Steve Jobs?

It may be that we, yeah, nobody wants to fuck Steve Jobs. Right. I think that might be it. Yes. Well, I don't know. That did it. I mean, for the record, I still, to me, I still want to fuck him. Sure, but it's mostly like when he's making you know, right?

Yes, yes, yes. The ghost writer, the, the Polanski movie, the ghost writer, that people really liked that year with you and McGregor. Greenberg, the Noah Bomback movie, that I, really liked but I have no interest to watch again which like says a lot because it's a Greta Gerwig and I fucking yeah of course love Greta Gerwig but it's so like sour I watched that recently it's yeah it's like it's a tough one you want to I don't know I mean honestly it probably the way some people feel about Sophia Coppola where you're like I'm 80% of the way to to being like on board with this but it's so sour and so unpleasant and Ben

Stiller really is just like a fucking asshole in that movie that it left me with a bad taste in my mouth. And it's not like full, like, swan diving into unpleasantness, like Margo at the wedding, or the Noah Bomback that I love. I love Margo at the wedding. I want to see that shit again. We also probably should admit, though,

that, like, three gay men as we are, we find that kind of sourness a lot more palatable coming out of Nicole Kidman than we do out of Ben Stiller. Of course, yeah. I'm fine with admitting that. And also, though, Greenberg's always the movie I point to when I talk about how sort of Greta Gerwig's leavening influence

on Noah Baumbach's movies where like once she starts like co-writing them with Frances Haugh and Mistress America they just get so much better also but also just like so much more watchable like I could watch those two movies like a billion times and Greenberg it's like once was definitely enough Greenberg is also when Greta Gerwig still had like a toe

in the waters of mumblecore so like Greenberg kind of got lumped into mumblecoreness as well. I think that's right. Which is really not like those got off of movies. And that was also the like the transition movie where Bomback starts the relationship with her and, you know, leaves Jennifer Gis and Lee. So like there's not a whole lot of like residual good feeling for Greenberg actually. What's the rest of this list?

Let me in the Let the Right One in remake that I think people ended up liking surprisingly so. a lot of people despised it at the time and I really like that movie at one point I might have said that it was better than the other I feel like that's an opinion that I've heard more and more recently as the years have gone on If you've read the book I think you would like this one more than the original I have to say I had no idea this movie was well reviewed

I'm looking at it and I thought I just thought like because it was a I mean when did the right one didn't come out like the year before yeah not too long before that they were they were very very similar um i think to the point where this one when it was greenlit or maybe when they were even filming the other one hadn't come out because matt reeves who i think wrote and directed it um based it entirely on the book oh yeah okay yeah um monsters was on this list the garth edwards movie that was sort of his kind of proof of concept for him being a uh blockbuster director it's good uh what's his name scoot mcnary's in it and it's got big sort of like lovecraftian monsters

sort of stomping around at one point and there's like one really good scene where the two monsters like essentially like mate and it's kind of fascinating but the rest of it it's kind of tedious i think has anybody else seen it but me i have not yeah it's fine i wouldn't go rushing out i would say go if you've seen it see it again and if you haven't see please give the Nicole Hall of senior movie my favorite Nicole Hollif Center is it okay I that's actually one of the few maybe the only one that I haven't seen well she's another filmmaker that is someone like you know people talk about it like she's up her own ass she only makes these movies about these privileged white ladies but I think even maybe more so than

Sophia Coppola really kind of interrogates it and I think that please give is the one that's maybe the most explicitly doing so. Interesting, okay. Yeah. Specifically with the Catherine Keener character. Yeah. Because I just rewatched Friends with Money, which I remember finding okay and I actually loved it the second time around. And I want to see it again for that reason.

I remember seeing people being like, oh, it like it really holds up. And I was also sort of like I was okay with it, I think, the first time I saw. Yeah. Yeah. I definitely liked it more rewatching it recently than I did initially. but like I still think that's maybe my least favorite of her movies mostly because and this I mean like I say this says a gay guy but like it's the one that spends the most time with the male characters and I just yeah no it's true wait friends with money is yeah like it has that whole thing with Francis McDormon's husband and like is he gay and he develops a friendship with I Borell and it's like I this I don't I always think of please give as as centering more on the Oliver Platt character than I want it to. Well, and enough said also has a lot of James Gandalfini, I feel.

Oh, yeah. But he's so good. But he's so good. He's so good, of course. But please give. I think Oliver Platt's really great, too. Yes. Oh, yeah. Like, I think everybody in that movie is actually really great.

What's Her Face from the Good Wife and the Good Fight? Sir Steele. So good in that movie. Somewhere then, I'm sorry, rounding out this list. Somewhere was on this list. And then Youth and Revolt, which I'm just never. I'm never going to be on the same page. Everyone loved that.

Everybody did, and I watched it, and I was just like, eh, go off National Board of Review. Yeah, yeah. So, weird list, but, you know, good for them. One of the few awards that somewhere would get after Venice, Al Fanning got a broadcast film critics association nomination for Best Younger Actor, and Good for Her. It's kind of too bad you couldn't find more occasions

to get her a nomination, she really is just wonderful in this movie. When do we think she will actually be Oscar nominated? It's a really good question. It seems inevitable, right? And she, like, works with a lot of autours, you know. It just seems like she will absolutely be in something that could get her nominated. It feels like also she will be nominated for one of her least interesting performances,

but she's just in the right movie, right? Oh, totally, totally. I mean, she's still doing that thing where she's giving these great performance, in sort of smaller supporting roles. I'm thinking of, like, 20th century women when I say that, and even the Beguiled is on that list. And her lead performances are still pretty off the beaten path and strange. Like, how to, wait, is she leading how to talk to girls at parties,

or is she the... Yes. Right? Very strange movie. I like that movie a lot. And, like, Teen Spirit, the Max Mangela movie, movie is also just like... She's like, she takes these really kind of, like, weirdo movies which I really like

but it is going to be when she ends up sort of taking a more traditional kind of like leading lady role and she's still like wildly infuriatingly young she's 22 years old like this is sorry to ask a problematic question but has anyone seen a rainy day in New York I heard Woody Allen movie

I don't think it's available in the States well you know it's funny it's one of those movies that like when I visit family in Greece sometimes all see as i mean this is a special case because of woody allen's like uh history obviously but like with lesser with movies that are just like that people want to put under the rug because they're not good they will only be playing in like random countries of and grace is like included like i remember the charlie's thoreone like gillian flin adaptation was one of these movies oh right that one yeah like i saw that in theaters with my mom because she was like i love charlie's throne it was

terrible um but like but i i i rana day new york was playing last time i was or not last time but whatever two years ago when i was home and i didn't watch it because i didn't want to support woody allen but i have to say i have heard through the grapevine that it's actually very good and i wonder if that if things had been different um if maybe that would have been a big role for her because she's the lead right or is selina gomez the lead i thought it was selina gomez but now i could be wrong. In the poster, she's listed right after Timothy Shalemi, but maybe that's an alphabetical order?

No, I think you might be right, because also, yeah. Or it could be who shows up first on screen. Yeah, if it's a Woody Allen movie, then, like, I'm sure it's Timothy Shalame, and he has, like, a relationship with El Fanning, and the relationship with Selena Gomez, and he's you know, torn between them and whatnot.

It's the Jason Biggs, Christina Ricci movie all over again. Right. Well, I mean, it's the thing about Woody Allen movies is, like, even when they're shitty, the casts are so good that you're just like, I shouldn't, and yet, you know, I want to see all these actors. I will say the one

El Fanning movie that I feel like is under the radar enough that nobody really talks about it is Ginger and Rosa. Have any of you seen the Sally Potter movie? I've never even heard of it. I haven't seen that. Should I watch it? Yeah, I think you should. It's really it's her and Alice Englert, who is Jane Campion's daughter. She was the

female lead in that movie Beautiful Creatures that I really like, the Alden and right movie beautiful creatures that nobody saw and crashed and burned um but it's her and alice angler and they're like best friends and it's england oh it's sally potter yeah it's sally potter yeah yeah yeah it's like it's it's england in the 60s and there's sort of like political sort of enlightenment happening and al fanning sort of like getting into the counterculture and alice angler starts uh or aless under navola plays alfanning's father and he starts to have a relationship with alice angler with her like best friend and it's a whole whole whole

thing and Annette Benning's in it playing this sort of like activist woman who sort of like takes El Fanning under her wing. It's a really interesting movie. I really, really liked it. It was an incredibly small release. I saw it at the New York Film Festival the one year, but it never really like made it too far past the festival stage. And I think Christina Hendricks... It's like one of the first two or three A-24 movies, right? Yes. Yes, it absolutely is. Christina Hendricks plays offanning's mom It's a really interesting movie It's not like you know phenomenal

But it's like it's worth watching for sure So that's my recommendation Anything else about somewhere Before we sort of like Close the book on it Not that I don't know I mean I am I'm now a newly sad about Stephen Dorf not having a career

I know it's too bad And it's you get the sense He always seems like the kind of actor where you're just like, oh, he had like a whole big scandal, didn't he? And it's like, no, he didn't. But it's just sort of always kind of feels like he did, right? Where it's just like, what happened? Why did he have to go away?

Because he has like this scummy air to him, right? And he's probably a perfectly nice guy. Oh, we never talked about the plaster scene. Oh, such a good scene. The scene where his face is encased in plaster, which is such a perfectly filmed scene of like low-key stress. A moment most soothing to me in my career where it's like very placid but also stressful. I'm just like you, I'm very comforting to me in these times.

It's just like I want to have my head encased in something where it's like fully sensory deprived. Yeah. But it's that the thing where once they like carve out the little nose holes for him and you sort of you get to linger on the fact of just like how little breathing room he has and how just sort of long he's going to have to be in that for it to set. and it's such a well it's such a cool scene I really love it oh and Harris Savitas we didn't talk about speaking of like things that are filmed

perfectly oh yeah we've talked about Harris Savitas before cinematographer he did the cinematography for Zodiac which we talked about semi recently this was his second to last film that he was able to complete he did um or no wait he completed the bling ring

it just wasn't released until after he died right I don't think he did complete it because I think there's a second person credited to the bling ring. Yeah, so then the only other complete film he did after somewhere is the Gus Van Sant movie Restless that nobody saw it, including me. I don't know if any of you saw it.

It was like one of his teen romance as done by Gus Van Zant. It's Mia Vasikowska and some boy who looks very sort of like. Well, he also did Greenberg. Oh, yeah. Like Savitas is an interesting one where he really sort of like, lingers on just kind of a few filmmakers where it's Coppola, it's Gus Van Sant, and it's Noah Bomback to a degree. But like he does Zodiac for Fincher. He does the yards for James Gray and stuff like that. But like it's mostly he sticks with Gus Van Sant and he does a couple Copelas and he does

a few Noah bombbacks. Oh, and also birth, which is like cinematography in the movie kind of And it's like for a relatively short career and relatively like maybe, you know, less than two dozen movies, they're all really like gorgeously shot movies. Like all his Van Sant's are these very sort of like assembled sort of like it's elephant and Jerry and this sort of like that phase of Van Sant's career where everything was just these like, again, sort of like somewhere like these very long shots that lingered and sort of slowed the movie. movie down and stuff like that but um really beautiful stuff god elephant is one of those movies that is like haunting for years it's so upsetting and yet i think it's really really well done like it was very controversial i remember at the time is it exploitative is is whatever and um i think it's so upsetting but like it should be you know it yeah yeah so yeah oh here's Savitas, may he rest.

Anything else, though, about somewhere before we move on to the MDB game. Ellie Kemper, any thoughts on Ellie Kemper? Ellie Kemper playing Ellie Kemper. Yes, for real. Michelle Monaghan in a little cameo? You kept thinking that she was going to be a more prominent character, right? You kept sort of expecting that that was going to be, oh, this is going to be his sort

of like tortured romance kind of storyline, and it resists going there. I think to the film's benefit, but you definitely feel like it might go there. Just like fully underlines how great Michelle Monaghan is because you get this whole sense of a history and whatever it could possibly be. Like, you know that it is fully fleshed out in that actresses' mind and, like, it registers in all of her body language, but, like, we never find out. And, like, is just this fully composed performance in a scene that barely says any words. but like yeah she can make you think that like it could suddenly just become her movie

I would like to see her do a Sophia Copeland movie in the future where she gets you know more time to to operate I feel like that would be good for her yeah she really she she was on the verge for so long and yes and I mean settled into you know a career it's not like she's nowhere but it she there were a couple years we were like is she the next big yeah star and she just didn't yeah it did feel that way. She was in the One Mission Impossible movie, or maybe even a couple of them. I think she, like, her character sort of lingers, right? Yeah.

Yeah. She was also sort of ill-served by True Detective, I guess that long list of people in Hollywood who were. Yeah, she had that remember, didn't she have that movie where she played, like, a trucker, and it was supposed to be her sort of, like, D-Glam. You mean the movie literally called? It was called trucker, yeah. That was supposed to be her, like, D-Glam

awards play or whatever, and it just, like, did not happen. Yeah, it was her cake Right, it was her cake And at least cake got that SAG nomination So good for cake What was she in with Shia LeBoff? This is a very obvious question Eagle Eye, baby

Eagle Eye, yes Eagle Eye, yes I have such a memory of watching that movie And could not even tell you Its title today, I guess, but My one memory of Eagle Eye Is me, the sense of satisfaction I got from clocking

that it was Julianne Moore's voice as the voice on the phone sort of terrorizing him in Eagle Eye. I was, again, things that homosexuals do that people don't. Clocking Julianne Moore's voice from 100 paces. I was very proud of that. Remember that weird little subgenre where it was just like Shia LaBuff, DJ Caruso, like money in the bank, can't miss, where it was Disturbia the one year and then Eagle Eye the next year

and just like making money hand over fist. Do we want to play the IMDB game? Let's do it. Chris, how about the rules to the IMDB game? All right, y'all, every week we end our episodes with the IMDB game where we challenge each other with an actor or actress to try to guess the top four titles that IMDB says they are most known for. If any of these titles are television or voiceover work,

we mention that up front. After two wrong guesses, we get the remaining titles released years as a clue. If that's not enough, it just becomes a free-for-all of hints. That's the IMD-B game. I'm realizing now I should have translated that into Italian, so it could be like the whatever... So we could continue our streak. of doing ridiculous accents in our episodes?

Yeah, the previous month was like kind of an accidental month on major directors and goofy dialects. Yeah, we really could have continued that. Ah, well, George, since you are our guest, we will give you the option of A, whether you want to go first or last, and then B, whether you want to quiz Chris or quiz me. okay um oh i only i only quiz one of you yeah yeah you're yeah yes we'll go sort of in a circle right right okay oh i see i see i see i can i can go first and then i will quiz uh you okay sounds good so then i will quiz uh chris and then he will quiz you okay great sounds fine all right um mine is someone i was very surprised i mean it's a it's a big star but there's one random movie in here so let i look forward to talk about it but jane fonda oh this is fun okay oh jane

fonda's got such a wide-ranging career too it's it's a tough it's a tough one yeah all right i'm gonna try and start with her oscar movie so i'll go clout yes yes okay clute is so god damn good like one of the best best actress wins fucking ever i'm gonna maybe stray away away from and I'm not going to guess coming home quite yet because that seems to have faded more than clue it has nine to five no damn homophobia exists well the devil continues to find work okay see it's kind of end up being something like like one of her modern it's going to be at least one modern movie and it's going to be weird uh monster in law no Damn it. Okay. All right. So what are the years? So the years. Okay. So the years are 1968, 1978, and 2015. But it's, I'm not going to say to it. One of them is like really an insane choice. Okay. So 78 is coming home, I'm guessing that. Yes. Okay. Both of our Oscar movies. Is 68? Is 68 too early for Barbarella or is that Barbara? That is it. That's Barbara Ler. Okay. So the 2015 one's the weird.

one yeah okay it's very upsetting oh no it is right all right see she started making a lot more movies though after um monster in law so oh god i know what it is i hated this movie it's youth right yeah it's youth okay see i didn't even know she was in it she got like a golden globe nomination for it yeah okay then i'm i thinking of something different this is the one where like it's like two older men at like a retreat in Italy or whatever right it's like Michael Kane yeah okay yeah yes it treats her fully ghoulishly it's upsetting yeah her makeup is really really garish it's a whole thing it makes her look like the thing about Jane Fonda is she's in her she's like 80 at this point right like she's like but looks

20 years younger like she looks amazing and that movie is just like we're gonna make her look a hundred and ten years old and just like so craggy it's so weird uh all right treat her so poorly is that movie just bad should i not watch it because it's garbage don't okay because that's what i because i mean even the way it was advertised it was just like a picture of an ass and then like michael cain smiling like yeah i will say it's got a good rachel vice performance but it's not nearly in the movie enough to like be worth it yeah rachel vice is probably the best thing about that movie yeah she plays which kane's daughter Right? That would make sense.

Yes. Yeah. All right. Chris, I'm going to, well chosen, George. Thank you. Very infuriating and challenging, which is how we like. My second choice was, which is very different, was Ellen Page, but then it literally was the four movies. She's known for. Yeah, right.

Right, right, right. Okay. Chris, so one little tidbit, I went through the sort of Sophia Coppola route for this, and I kind of thought that Godfather, part. three was Coppola's only like screen performance beyond like being a baby in the other two godfather movies but she had shown up in a bunch of her dad's other movies she was in uh peggy sue got married which also sort of like gave her that kathleen turner connection that kathleen turner ended up being in the virgin suicides playing the mom in the version suicides

kathleen turner and james woods if those are your parents i'm just saying like maybe you know your kids would be fucked up too um But I'm going to have you guess the known for for Kathleen Turner. Kathleen Turner, amazing. Love her. Well, I'll say Peggy Sue got married. She's Oscar nominated for that. Yep, yep, correct.

Romancing the Stone. Yep. Okay. I wonder if any more of the Michael Douglases will be there. I'm going to say the War of the Roses. Yep. Okay. Three for three.

Ooh, I can't screw this up. Okay. Kathleen Turner, I don't think the Virgin suicides is in there. I wonder if the fourth one is going to be something like fundamentally embarrassing, like baby geniuses or something. Oh, boy. Okay. It can't be Jewel of the Nile. That's the one that people forget about.

maybe it's serial mom I'm stalling because I'm trying to get a perfect score I know that means a lot to you and it should it really does I'll tell you it's not V.I. Warshowski and I'm incensed that it's not the seminal 1991 film VA Warshowski I don't remember if you mentioned this or not is it a voice performance? No it's not

it's not who framed Roger over that. God damn it should be a voice performance with Jessica Rabbit absolutely should be on there iconic was she nominated for pretsy's honor I don't think so but don't quote me on that I think she got like a golden globe nomination for that but I don't know if she got an Oscar I'm just gonna go with the one that I think she's first build on and say it's cereal mom it's serial mom congratulations perfect score baby yes well done well done you zigged when when I thought you were going to I thought you might have gone with body heat. Oh, I didn't even think of body heat.

It should maybe be body heat. I should have steered you in that direction. Now I want to see if she was nominated for Pritzie's honor. She's definitely probably Globe nominated for body heat, right? Let's see. Let's go to the old Kathleen Turner. She drags William Hurt by the dick in that movie. All right, Kathleen Turner Awards' Zez, Oscar nominated.

only for Peggy Sue got married, so not Pritzie's honor. She was Golden Globe nominated for Body Heat, Romancing the Stone, Pritzie's honor, Peggy Sue got married, and the War of the Roses. So, clearly, the IMDB game is borrowing heavily on her Golden Globe successes. Well done. Good job. Thank you. All right. So, George, for you, I have dug into past Sophia Coppola stars. I was trying to look for somebody that people might forget. of Sophia Coppola star and from

Marie Antoinette I have for you Rose Byrne. Wow. Okay. Wait, do you say if one of them's a, if it's a TV show or just if it's a voice performance? There's no TV, no voice, so no

damages. Oh, wow, it's not damages. Wow, okay. That was going to be like my first guess. That's surprise. Okay, bridesmaids. Yes. Spy? Yes. Um Neighbors?

Neighbors? Is this going to be two perfect scores in one episode? You don't have any wrong answers yet. Okay. Well, now I'm trying to think what are the other big Roseburn? Oh, um, okay. Is it get him to the Greek? No. Unfortunately, it's not get him to the Greek, which she sings, like, fully unwell songs in that movie.

She sings a song about her butthole in that movie. It's so, it's, it's, I have to say, Roseburn, I know I don't want to say she's underrated because she is, you know, people know she's good. She's rated. But that's something you don't even think about. Like, the fact that she literally sings an entire song about her butthole. got a pretty face and a pretty fanny too is she's supposed to be like a kind of a thing or she's exactly supposed to be Katie Perry kind of a thing or

she's exactly supposed to be Katie Perry yeah okay um okay is oh is it Annie no it's not Annie okay thank God your year though is 2010 oh so the year of somewhere

and also well I think the year of getting with the Greek is 2010 but um okay I oh uh 2010 if I can steer you along towards a hint I don't think the year is really going to help you she does have multiple franchises that people forget about,

and this is one of them. Of a very different genre than the movies we've done. She's not in, like, randomly in, like, X-Men or something, is she? She actually is in X-Men first class, but it is not that. Okay. Well, I give up. It's a horror movie. it's actually like a horror movie that nobody kind of talks about but was incredibly popular is it insidious yes insidious wow okay wow

yeah insidious and like the conjuring sort of like piggybacked on one another to kind of set that kind of like that was evaporated into their sequels right but like that was like then that was just like the horror movie that existed in the 2010s like that's what every horror movie in the 2010s was just going to be was um like wispy scary lady ghosts hiding in your basement or whatever yeah yes good job george well that was great you know actually speaking of last the last uh play i went to before quarantine was roseburn and bobby kennival in um oh no kidding media wow she's supposed to be great right she i mean listen the like the actual play itself it depends on if you like that's which i honestly am undecided i mean it was like all it was very evo van hove like it was all in a white background uh-huh uh literally no props

no nothing um and then there's like weird camera work where like her face is projected behind her and stuff um which you know can be distracting i do think she was very good in it but like it as a play you know i'm i'm not sure um george thank you so much this was a really really fun episode we had such a good time talking about sophia copla about minimalist movies that we love. Thank you so much for having me. Of course. It was an utter pleasure

for having you here today. Oh, I'm so glad. That's our episode. If you want more, This Had Oscar Buzz. You can check out the Tumblr at this had oscarbuzz.tumlr.com. You should also follow our Twitter account

at Had underscore Oscar underscore Buzz. George, where can the listeners find you and your stuff? Yes. At George Severus on I think every platform. And StradioLab is, you know, wherever you listen to podcast. subscribe everybody

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