This Had Oscar Buzz - 198 – Divine Secrets of the Ya-Ya Sisterhood (with Christina Tucker)

Episode Date: June 13, 2022

YA-YA!! This week, Christina Tucker joins us once again to discuss popular literary adaptation and TNT staple, 2002′s Divine Secrets of the Ya-Ya Sisterhood. The directorial debut of Callie Khouri, the Oscar-winning screenwriter of Thelma and Louise, the film stars Ellen Burstyn and Sandra Bullock as mother and daughter feuding over the playwright daughter’s very public … Continue reading "198 – Divine Secrets of the Ya-Ya Sisterhood (with Christina Tucker)"

Uh-oh, wrong house. No, the right house. I didn't get that! We want to talk to Marilyn Hacks. I'm from Canada. I'm from Canada water. Hello, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah.

Yeah, yeah. I am so tired of her tantrums. Hello, and welcome to the This Had Oscar Buzz podcast, the only podcast that would leave the safety of a bunker for Hong Chow. Every week on this at Oscar Buzz, we'll be talking about a different movie that once upon a time had Lofty Academy Award aspirations, but for some reason or another, it all went wrong. The Oscar hopes died and we're here to perform the autopsy. I'm your host, Chris Fyle, and I'm here as always with my Eva Pickford, Joe Reed. You know, Chris, you sent me this outline yesterday

and I read that line and I was like, I must have forgotten the part in Yaya sisterhood where they mention, where Eva becomes something or whatever. I was like, where is he pulling this from this movie? I just got it. I just understood why Yahya makes sense with Eva. We weren't going to be talking about this movie and for me to not take the immediate opportunity to talk about Yaya da Costa. For you to show me the respiteau to refer to me as the Yaya da Costa to your Eva Pigford,

truly, it means a lot. It means a lot to me. I will carve a thank you note in a pan of brown. bounties to you, Chris, is that I love to do. Greatest television episode in history. I love it. Very momentistication for several reasons. The top of the list being,

it is the return of Christina Tucker to this head Oscar buzz. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Wait, what is your, what would your, like, yeah, yeah moniker be? Like, uh, uh, do they have monikers? Or they just like, the drunk one? Yeah, well, basically, yes.

Don't they all have like the, like the, um, oh yeah, they get like the witch of the woods or something like that. Yeah. Oh, okay. I know. Mine would be like the divine sorceress of lying down, like taking a nap. Empress of Naps, yes. Yeah. What a movie. Who, what a film. What a motion picture. Indeed. I had seen it before. Had, Chris, had you seen it before? Obviously. Oh, you had. Okay. Okay. I was wondering whether this would be anybody's first time watching this.

No, I mean, we're all gay here, so I feel like... Happy pride to everyone. That's true. That's true. We're going to give you a very gay episode for a not-so-gay movie, but... But come on. You, it's actually incredibly rude. I told many friends that I was doing this podcast and doing this film in particular,

and they were all like, eh, on brand. And I was like, okay, hold on. Okay, true, but also rude. It's like, yes, sure, I get it. We've made the mommy issues the brand. I understand that. It's fine. It's charming.

We're all doing it with fun. But for everybody to just be like, yeah, of course that's what you chose. There's a deep level of other titles that you can do when you come back, too. Oh, I know. I have my list. A through line. This is true. Yes.

And I love a brand. So here we go. Also, in many ways, Pride Month could just be called the Divine Secrets of the Yaya Sisterhood. we choose to celebrate every year again and again. I felt very prideful as my housemates went to the parade and I said, I simply will be staying home to watch the device you get to the I'm sister. I will be staying home to watch Ellen Burstyn throw a temper tantrum. And Ashley Judd's ride topless and a convertible.

Yes. I mean, honestly, when I put it like that. That's my parade. Yeah, yeah, truly. Keep kink in pride and by that, I mean a float that's just a mid-century, vehicle with Vanula Flanagan driving it. Wait, can we briefly talk about the coterie of women who play the younger versions, like the Ashley Judd era versions of the Yaya Sisterhood?

Because it's all like, it's the girl from Independence Day who stares up at the alien ship and says it's so pretty. It's the psychiatrist who gets killed at the very beginning of malignant. And, oh, the third. I remember from like a Seinfeld episode where like George tells her he loves her and she's can't hear out of one year. So she's maybe the least like fabulous of all of them. But my dear, dear, dear gay friend Joe Reed. Yes. You know, if I know one thing about you, you know what I know. What? I know you didn't have to look any of that up. Nope. I absolutely did not. Nope. Absolutely

not. I recognize them all on site. So yes. That is really amazing stuff. Well, you know, Can I make a confession? Can I be vulnerable with you both for a minute? If you can't be vulnerable with us, who can you be vulnerable with? My God. That's really true. Very true. For the first time ever, I decided I'm going to have a glass of wine with recording.

Wow. Can I be equally vulnerable? For the first time ever, I decided not to have a glass of wine while recording a podcast because I perhaps had a couple too many glasses of wine yesterday. Okay. I understand. you know in this way we are both we are really covering all aspects of the divine secrets of the guy you are the yin and yang of yaya in this episode and drunken lightly

hungover right and joe is the maggie smith we got him on oxygen tank that's true that's true i am here sucking on oxygen and uh and speaking ludicrously accented southern and saying pal she says pal so many times i love that i i'm bringing back Pal as a term of endearment. I love that. No, Pal is great as the term of aggression. Well, sure.

Oh, sure. Like, what the fuck you're looking at, pal? Yeah, yeah, that's true. That's very kind of like New England aggression. Yes. Yes.

Much in the way, you guys, is very Midwestern welcoming. Right. Yeah, and again, covering all the bases there. Yeah, yeah, we're all over the map here. This is good. I was very intrigued. that we were going to do this movie,

but I am extra intrigued as to what motivated the choice to have us watch this movie in the year of our Lord 2020. I truly have a note in my notes for this film that said, why did I do this to my friends? On the almost to the date 20 year anniversary of this movie. Like we are recording this on June 5th that opened wide June 7th, 2002. So we are really... Many of us will be celebrating.

the hours at the end of the year. That's true. The three of us are celebrating the 20th anniversary of the Yaya. This is the, is this, is this, is this, uh, what, what kind of mirror version of the hours is Divine Secrets of the Yaya Sisterhood? You know, there was some exec somewhere who was like, you know, Paramount Miramax had the hours, but we've got Divine Secrets of the Yaya Sisterhood and we're hearing great things and we're really, we have a lot of faith in it.

Some poor Warner Brothers flack had to sell that to somebody, I think, at some point. And God bless them for doing it, because this movie is just so bizarre. And I do think that is why I picked it, because it was such like a staple of, like, USA, TNT when I was in high school. It was just, like, always on TV. Like, if I was sick, I could almost guarantee that this movie was on one of those channels. And it's such a bonkers tone. It's like, is mental illness hilarious? quirky or is it like deeply, deeply troubling and something we should talk about? The movie doesn't

know and it doesn't really want to make that decision. And I just figured if anybody could talk about it, it would be the three of us to like burrow into this. This is a movie that watched fried green tomatoes on quailudes and was like, I got it. No, you know what? Say no more. I understand. I've got it. Like, I'll watch this. and just sort of took that ball and ran with it. And run it did. Yeah. Stumble even a couple of times.

Yeah, exactly. With a whipping belt in hand. Oof. Yeah. Yeah. This, it's so funny watching this, I remembered when I was younger, my dad's cousin, who was sort of like our, essentially functionally an aunt to me. would always sort of like be pressing books onto like myself and my mother in particular.

She would, you know, she would give me like Kurt Vonnegut books or whatever and she would give my mom these sort of like beach read types. And I remember one of the books that she gave my mom to read was Divine Secrets of the Yaya Sisterhood. And for like a solid year afterwards, every time we saw her, she would ask my mom, have you read Yaya Sisterhood yet? You got to read Yaya Sisterhood. It's the best book. It's, you know, all this sort of stuff. I believe my mother never did. And, but that's the only reason why I knew before this movie came out.

I had sort of this anticipation of like, oh, right, that's the book that Karen always gave my mom. So, yeah. I will say I was tempted as a bit to read it as I am famously unemployed at the moment. And I was like, oh, I could just like read it. Like, I'm a fast reader. How challenging is it going to be to read, really? And then I forgot.

So I do, but I did have that brilliant idea, and I thought it would be very funny if I sauntered in here. Like, well, I read the book, but I didn't think it would be funny enough to actually commit to doing it. So I forgot I apologize. It's officially based on two books. Yes. It's like a series. Yeah, apparently. Yeah.

I want to know where the split is. Same. Well, it's in, it's in. Because is there a modern day and a past book? Right. Yeah, I was wondering if, like, the first book, is it just, like, Vivi's life and then to, like, sit as, like, early childhood? It would sound, that sounds like it would not be particularly thrilling to read the other

book where it's, like, supposed to be mystery surrounding her mother and, you know, why she is the way she is. But if we already knew that as a reader, that would be weird. It would. Yeah, I don't know. That's true. Again, I didn't commit to the bit, so I cannot say. What if it was a series of, like, five books and, like, one book was the Vivi book, one was the teensy book.

One was, like, each, like, each character got their own novel from, uh... Okay, so then I would really regret not committing to the bit, because that actually does sound like it would whip. Because I do want to know more about all of the rest of the Yaya sisters. We all agree. We all agree that Phenola Flamigan's character is the best one of all of them. Yeah. It's the one we would most want to hang out with, even though she's the only one who doesn't. a drink in the present timeline of the... When she's standing in that road in front of her car

and then just, you know, leans down to make sure it didn't get a scratch on it, I said, that's an icon. Why was that not on the poster instead of the plane? Yeah, that's a good point. Just Phenola Flanagan and her convertible. If there was ever a movie that needed character posters and didn't get them. Yes. Just Maggie Smith and her oxygen tank. Boy, can you imagine a more like, A more campally perfect thing to have in your living room than a giant poster of a character

poster of Maggie Smith from Divine Secrets of the Yaya Sisterhood. Like, can I commission that? Like, can I get? I need that. Like, we all need that. Somebody out there used to work at Warner Brothers or whoever they, like, outsourced their marketing materials to back then. Like, somebody get back to us.

Because right now, this poster that I'm looking at, the like the sunflower, the sort of everything is illuminated sunflower that doesn't really go with it. I'm dissatisfied, I got to say. Like, I want, I want Shirley Knight's face and have it just say Nisi. And, like, that's, uh, that's all that's on. And Zendaya is Mici, and Shirley Knight is Nisi. God, damn it, Chris, that's going to be psyched by the rest of the day. Sorry.

You're not that sorry. I can hear it in your voice. I'm not. I'm not. I genuinely respect it. Um, also, apparently there were four of these books. I just want to let everybody now. Oh, okay.

Two of them after the movie. Yes. Yaya's in Bloom and the crowning glory of Calla Lily Ponder. So. Absolutely. Those two don't have Wikipedia articles about them. Because of Lynn Dixie walked so that the crowning glory of Calla Lily Ponder could sprint, I suppose. Bloom.

Bloom, yes. We're making fun of the book, but the book is part of the reason why. you know, because it's such a popular book, the era we're talking about, instant, like, awards prestige ahead of it before people saw this movie. And I also think the presence of Ellen Burstyn is part of the, like, conversation here.

It's a year after Requiem for a Dream. Two years. Also a very funny movie. Yeah, two hilarious movies. Yeah. Well, and we're still at that point, Now, we're getting into the decade where it's starting to, we're starting to wonder when Sandra Bullock is going to have that, like, dramatic breakthrough of a role.

I remember at some point, and I think this happens with all the sort of the actresses who become known for being romantic comedy queens, that because, you know, in other instances of those actresses, you know, Julia Roberts and whatnot, and, and you wonder, well, where's their Oscar nomination going to come from? When's the career turn going to come where they take a dramatic chance on something and get nominated? And I remember this was around the time where people started to wonder about Sandra Bullock. She had the same year, murder by numbers, which was never going to be an Oscar play, but it was definitely something darker. And I definitely remember when Crash came out, people being like, oh, is Sandra Bullock going to be like an against

against type Oscar nominee where all of a sudden she's stretching herself dramatically because she's playing a unpleasant stretching herself dramatically down a set of stairs

stretching all the way down those stairs exactly exactly and even like infamous we gotta do infamous one of these days Chris just to yeah yeah talk about the parallels between that

and Capote where she's playing the role that Catherine Keener played and got an Oscar nomination for so yeah and then who knew it would all come at the end of the decade when we were least expecting it when she was kind of at her most commercial with the proposal having just happened and then all of a sudden people were like oh we can we can do this we can make this work with the blind side we can sort of shove this Oscar nomination and Oscar win which and if we had just waited they could have given it to her for gravity I know right there. I know. We thought she had to stretch herself all the way to Texas. She could have stretched herself all the way to space. It would have been something. I am, I am sort of always a little bit contrarian about the blind side, not because I think it's a good movie, but because

I do sometimes feel like we undervalue the ability of movie stars to just sort of put a movie on their back and carry it over the finish line and have it, you know, succeed to the degree that it does because they're such a movie star. And that's what Sandra Bullock does with that movie, like for good or ill in terms of what that movie is doing and saying and condescending to that that movie made a lot of money. And it's pretty much just because Sandra Bullock is a goddamn star. And there are better things to... She knows how to chew out some dialogue. Yeah. There are better things to award somebody in Oscar for, but there are definitely worse things to award somebody

and ask her for as far as I'm concerned. It was also a little bit of like she turned that movie into the massive hit that it was and people on the back of her biggest success with the proposal and people were ready to be like, okay, we didn't appreciate

her the way we should have in the past because like she's good in Hope Floats. She's amazing and while you were sleeping. Oh, she's so good. Oh yeah. She's good in like in movies that don't deserve her. Like she's good in 28 days. She's good in

I'm sort of going down the list of like her. She's good in forces of nature. She's good in a time to kill. Like I think practical magic is a good movie, but like she's good in that. Like it's not like she's elevating a bad movie there, but like she's great in practical magic.

She rocks in the net. Hello. She is Angela Bennett. She is typing things on her computer. She is ordering pizza. But 2000, Sandra Bullock is an interesting stretch where you take it from essentially miscingeniality in 2000 through the blindside. So it's like these really great bookends for her. And then in the

middle, it's a lot of really curious projects. It's this. It's like it's highs and lows. Two weeks notice, which is like you're giving us everything we want from Sandra Bullock. Like this is, you know, this is peak, Sandra Bullock. And then it's like curious stuff like the lakehouse or infamous or and then it's you know taken a chance on crash and and it that movie succeeding and yet she doesn't really succeed in it in an odd way like that's a strange turn of events for all that went right for crash that it couldn't uh you know be more for her is appropriate when you watch the movie because it's like that's a really like that's not a great part of that movie. And yet, like, neither is Matt Dillon. And Matt Dillon got an Oscar nomination out of it.

I mean, we all took a chance on Crash as a nation. And it was a mistake. You know what I discovered? You know what I discovered the other day? I was looking up, uh, I believe this was on IMDB, but I could be thinking about letterbox. But I think it was IMD because I was, I would have been more impressed by this that I typed in crash and the Cronenberg crash now auto fills before the Paul Haggis crash. And I wondered. if that's Vigo's doing after Can that he got everybody talking about Crash and looking up

what that movie was on IMDB and now it's up ahead. But for whatever reason... I mean, at this point, that crash is more available than Best Picture Winner Crash because, like, it's in criterion. Best Picture winner. Crash.

Crash. Jack Nicholson putting up the two fingers, like, whoa, it's so good. I'm out. Yeah, I know. That's exactly what that gesture is. That's the like, got to go. Gotta go.

Oh, crash. But I think I jumped ahead of the train a little bit in talking about Sandra Bullock. We should. It's easy to jump to Sandy. Gotta love Sandy B. One and only. She likes to take breaks. This was a return from a break.

Yeah. What did she done right before the break, Chris? What was before the break? Miss Congeniality. I believe this is her first movie after Miss Congeniality. There we go. Yeah. What a...

We double check that. Huh. What a moment, Sanda. She sort of has a career, or at least during that decade, where she would be, like, take a year off and then have, like, a bunch of movies all in the same year. Because, like, 2002, it's Murder by Numbers, Divine Secrets of the Yaya Sisterhood, two weeks notice. Yeah, murder by numbers might have been first.

What's that? Murder by numbers might have been first. Sure, but probably, like, by a matter of, I would guess, weeks if... like a week and a half like right like because that was definitely she had to get the twink movie out first then it's the mom movie then it's the rom-com listen she did that movie and then she dated ryan gozzling like i respect the hell out of that that is a flex right there that i will uh definitely support so should we maybe just jump to the plot description we can get back into the movie let's do it oh boy this is this is going to be quite a task for

you, our guest, Christina. It really is. You can only blame yourself. And that's so true. Wow. I will go to sleep thinking about that. Very true fact. Once again, listeners, we are here to talk about the divine secrets of the Yaya sisterhood. Written and directed by Callie Cary, we will get into it. Also, adapted Strange Writers Guild required screen credit by Mark Andrus, adapted from the novel by Rebecca Wells, starring Sandra Bollick, Ellen Burstyn, Ashley Judd, Fenula Flanagan, Shirley Knight, Maggie Smith, James Garner, Angus McFadden, and Cherry Jones.

Movie opened the first week of June in 2002, Happy Pride. Exactly. Absolutely. Christina, are you ready to give the 60-second plot description of the Divine Secrets of the Yaya Sisterhood? I'm going to do my damnedest. All right. In that case, your time starts now. In 1937 Louisiana, four young girls are doing like a spooky ceremony, which ends with them taking a blood oath and declaring themselves the Yaya sisterhood. And then we cut to 90s New York where Sandy B. A.k.a. Siddalee Walker is talking to a reporter from time about her childhood in a way that is shockingly unvarnished and not at all press appropriate. And unsurprisingly, this does upset her mother, Ellen Burstyn, aka Vivy, and the two exchange passive aggressive and aggressive aggressive. aggressive jabs at one another until finally the other

yeah yeah sisters must go to New York to try to fix things. Citta takes 460 something women to the loudest club slash restaurant on earth where they drug her and drag her back to Louisiana hoping to force a reconciliation. They show Cidda's scrapbook and there are all these flashbacks from Vivis difficult family life to Cidda's difficult family life and then we see that Vivie had a breakdown where she like beat the crap out of her kids while out of her mind and drugs and then she was hospitalized and then Citta realizes her mother didn't abuse her and leave her voluntarily and then they reconcile and she's in the sisterhood.

Yeah, yeah. Yay. Very good. God, you're right about that club, though, Christina. Why? Take them there. The cut to that was so funny. So much of them said to her, take us to the club we saw on sex in the city, and she does.

It's very kind for you to say one of them and not Maggie Smith said to her. Take us to the club we saw in sex in the city, because that's absolutely who did it. Well, and the fact that she also gets roofied in that club by Maggie Smith is, like, it's, it's, it's very dark. I said aloud while watching it by myself, like, oh my God, right, they drug her. And then I had to just think about, like, how did they get her on a plane? So much of Cidda's existence in New York in this movie feels like air quotes New York, because like, nothing about that home that she and Angus McFadgin live in seems like a New York apartment. I don't know if they're supposed to live in like

Westchester. God, are we going to end up talking about Westchester? If I'm here, we're talking about upstate New York, baby. Apparently, that's the theme. But whatever it is, that does not feel

like New York to me. In fact, watching it again, I was like, oh, right. Like, I totally forgotten that she was a playwright. I totally forgot that, like, that was her whole thing. I guess because every time I've ever watched this movie, I've watched it on cable and I've started watching after that very first scene. Yeah, usually she's already in Louisiana when you catch it.

In the belasco and in tech or whatever. Yeah. What playwright in this era is getting a Time magazine profile? Tony Kushner, what plays are she writing? And this was my other note where I wrote, Cidda's play has to be bad, right? Oh, God, yes. Oh, God, yes.

Like, even just the set design was awful. Do we get the name or are we pontificating here? We do, because you see the marquee at the ballast. That's true. That's true, because I remember seeing the Belasco market. It's something stupid. It is. Yeah. It's like a glass of milk or something in the picture.

It's the straight woman version of that Terrence McNally play with Tyne Daily, where it was just like the mother. Masterclass. No, the other one that I told you about more recently. Oh, right, right, right. He wrote about the play about the disapproving mother. No, God, not Masterclass. class that's a whole other thing um but uh i would watch ellen burson in master but yeah the most new york thing about that was definitely we're like where else is she going to take these women but just like

what's on the block well it's this like hip new club or whatever that she's dragging maggie smith's oxygen tank through they're just screaming to hear one another honestly though that feels real that feels like your mom and her two best friends are in town i know that's not the real like obviously Ellen Burstyn's not part of that but like it's you know gay guys taking like their mom and their two aunts out to like well where are you going to go and we're just going to go to like flaming saddles for the night or whatever and you're just sort of just like this is my this is my world welcome to it. This is my world mom like take it or leave it and of course like they're the ones having the most fun and just sort of cutting up and all of that so yeah well

Joe the next time you take maggie smith to flaming saddles I'm absolutely coming yeah I'll they'll just be a cryptic tweet Maggie Smith is at Flaming Saddles I don't know God that might do her in that might be the thing Taylor Swift is at pieces

Maggie Smith is at flaming saddles God what an odd movie What an odd odd little movie It's so odd And the beginning is just so like Trying to be so like jazzy and quippy and funny and it doesn't really work

And then it's just so dark. Yeah. Well, the scene where she call or whatever, Ellen Burstyn, Vivi, calls up Sida to essentially just like yell at her, whatever, and she starts like slamming the phone down on the table, whatever, is in the trailer. And I remember it vividly, just like absolutely vividly. The two of them doing that phone bit is stamped into my mind. And that feels very like beach literature of the time, sort of like I'm trying to avoid the term chicklet because that is a, it's diminutive and dumb. But I feel like a lot of those books had this like tempestuous relationship between mother and daughter and they can't figure it out and whatever. And that felt very like of that, of that type.

What do we think about Ellen Burstyn in this movie as Vivi? I feel like it's not fair to say that she is like bad because I do think she is given Like she's like cry alone in this kitchen now cry in this car now yell at this man now cry over here It's just like she's not given a ton to do but it is watching her is unsettling especially because Ashley Judd is like quite good Mm-hmm Ashley Judd's going through it in this yeah Ashley Judd is the best performance through. Ellen Burstyn got the character

Bible that just said total nightmare on it. And that was just sort of the notes that she was given to play in this. And can we say though that Ashley Judd cast as young Ellen Burstyn is alarmingly good. It's good. It's very good casting. It's really good casting. It's the

best thing this movie does. It's this movie's big masterstroke. It's and it's one of those things where you wouldn't off the top of your head think that it would work that well. And yet you're like you see them and it's it's perfect it's actually perfect yeah it really tracks she's good she's just damn good she's good yeah i just think especially those like couple scenes we get that like show that you know she was not always a nightmare and like very charming and charismatic

and like it was the kind of mom that you wanted to impress and like take care of the flying scene specifically and like the you know the doing the rescue at the at the lake yep i was just like man maybe more of this like would that help like i don't know what i mean i think the problem is the flashbacks are just like yeah again here we go flashing back why this was towards like a little bit of a little closer to the tail end of the great sort of ashley judd era where which started i always sort of peg it to start at kiss the girls because kiss the girls was such a big financial success, and that kind of set this template for her of this, like, mini genre of procedural slash thriller type things, where she's in Kiss the Girls. We did an episode long

ago on Double Jeopardy, which she's excellent in and actually got Oscar Buzz 4. But then it's stuff like, oh, God, Chris, we're going to be talking about Eye of the Beholder on screen draft, so I don't want to, like, get into that now. I will say, Chris, I did watch that trailer in Chris's fault and wow you guys are brief F Cinema Score Classic I have The Beholder What a weird movie And then she's like so like high crimes

Twisted those are all those sort of like thrillers And then while she's doing that She's also still doing Romcom slash comedy stuff Like where the heart is and Divine Secrets and someone like you Developing a fan base too And then she's getting into like these sort of

like prestige drama type things like Frida and DeLovely. And then all of a sudden, after 2004, she doesn't have anything come out again in 2006. And then it's that double, well, Bug doesn't come out until 2007, but that's a festival thing in 2006. But anyway, she's in that Sundance movie come early morning that I remember having like Sundance buzz. It was the Joey Lauren Adams directed movie that played at Sundance. And I remember Ashley Judd got very good notices out of that festival and got very sort of early Oscar buzz out of that. And that didn't come to anything later in the year.

I don't even remember what the distribution was for that movie. But it did seem like this kind of return to her acting beginnings because she was a little bit of an indie darling at first. Ruby in Paradise. Yeah, totally, totally. Yes, she got an indie spirit nomination long ago. And then Bug is so good, but Bug was so, I mean, we'll talk about that one too, Chris, another F-Cinima-score movie, that that was so

sort of mistreated. And I feel like it was never the same for her career after that. And obviously, there's also now we, you know, have to talk about, of course, the sexual assault, sexual harassment stuff that happened in her career that she came out with during the Me Too era, which informs all of this as well. Yeah. But after that sort of one-two punch of Come Early Morning and Bug, it never really seemed, it's astounding the drop-off in her career after that, and it's really too bad. Even the movies that make money, like she's in a Vin Diesel movie, she's in Olympus has fallen. She's the mom in the Divergent movies, which by then, that felt like, that was like comeback stuff, right? That was like, remember Ashley Judd by the time those movies

came out. And it was like, between Bug and the first Divergent movie, which, is a span of seven, eight years, she only made like six movies. She's like, and none of them are major and none of them are major roles. And it's like, I don't know, it's such a bummer because she's such a dynamic presence during that stretch run of hers where she was, you know, making good money. And you can't help but look at that and be like, you know, a man would have gotten a chance to rebound from that. A man wouldn't have had his entire career. mixed by two indie bombs you know yeah and then to have your revamp from that be like a divergent movie like yeah yeah it sucks this movie is a good example i think though of one of the

unique talents that she has that even very very talented performers do not possess is that she can spin silver from shit like she is very good in this movie. And especially when, like, the flashbacks are some of the worst portions of the movie. Just the way that it's, like, assembled. It's so, like, yeah, I mean, you were talking about the mental health stuff that it's, like, that first flashback. Yeah.

Oh, boy. Like, we, just to be clear, yes, it's, you know, the 30s. But guess what? We are the good whites, and we want that to be known. Oh, that's that flashback. We're never going to talk about this again. where the little girls avenge the the housekeeper for the racism of the

of the other characters. Yeah, that was It just like doesn't fit with the rest. It's just... This is again why I say this movie watched fried green tomatoes but on quailudes and just did not get the right notes from it. Like, because that's a kind of thing that... Yeah, at least fried green tomatoes has secrets in the sauce. That's what I mean.

Like, Sicily Tyson at least gets to like have some agency there And, like, brains Frank Bennett over the head with a frying pan or something like that. Like that, you know, this movie tried to, I don't know, have its cake and eat it to in some certain ways. Because, like, we're going to be incredibly southern, but we're not going to have to associate ourselves with any of the ugly aspects of that. Right. Like, exactly. Like, we're not like that, but, like, absolutely, these black people still work for us and, like, live in our house. rescue our children from our manic episodes.

And we love to play that they are our best friend. This woman is my best friend. Right. I'll just ask her for money if I need some. Girl, read the room. Though, in fairness to her, she probably could not do a ton of reading the room, given the amount of drugs she was on at that time. Fair.

Deeply fair. Yeah. But yeah, I'm glad we all are on the same page in liking Ashley Judge. of the other women in the Yaya Sisterhood, I want to sort of like go into all of them. We can't, I don't think we can get too far down the road in discussing them without discussing the accent question, which I love Maggie Smith. I love Fanola Flanagan. I think they're great actresses.

Obviously, Fanola Flanagan is coming off of the others where she's like incredibly effective and good. And Maggie Smith whips in that movie. Maggie Smith has just been sort of reintroduced to the American public via the Harry Potter movies. So, like, I get why they were cast. This is the same year as her Oscar nomination for Gosford Park. No. No, year after. But, like, she's hot right now.

Like, this is a good period for Maggie Smith. And yet, you don't have to cast non-American women in these roles, especially if they really, really can't get the accent. And, like, the struggle is deeply real with the both of them. And it's tough. I mean, Shirley Knight is also not Southern, and it's not great either. Hers is not great either. But, like, I think there's a difference between Shirley Knight sort of, like, failing quietly, and Finola Panagan and Maggie Smith failing very loudly with those accents.

And, like, it almost makes the movie in a way where, like, if it was a better movie, then I would have been, like, it's a shame those accents were so bad because whatever. But, like, the movie being so crazy. I'm like, why not? Just do it. Yeah, no, it is totally the, like, it's almost like the reason to see it. It's like, you have to hear Maggie Smith yell, like, you don't get scrappy with me and like this bonkers accent. Sonola Flanagan will sort of shape her mouth into these, like, weird contortions.

And all of a sudden, it's this like guttural sound that she's making where she's like, oh, kick y'all sorry ass on Thursday. And it's like, oh, my goodness. Where is that coming from? Honestly, Joe, that was incredibly good. You should be in the next movie. They will no doubt do, 20 years later. Yeah. I'm in Magnolia Thompson and the...

Yeah, you're Call-A-Lilly. I am Cali-Li-Lewing and blooming and whatever. God, yes. And yet, I want to spend all my time that I'm watching this movie with these three women. Not with Ellen Burson. I want to hang out with them without their toxic friends. That's true. It is very funny that so much of the movie is.

is, like, them hanging out and having these, like, you know, emotional, nice, like, you know, moments together. And then Ellen Burstyn is just, like, somewhere harassing James Garner for some reason. Okay, here's the other thing that I never, and this sort of goes back a little bit to, like, the fact that New York never feels like New York in this movie. I have zero sense of the geography of the terrain of this. How far away is that cabin from Ellen Burstyn's house? How far away is it from, like, they... Truly conceivably next door. Right.

Like, they just run it, like, they run into Ellen Burstyn driving down the street. Like, Fanola Flanagan, like, happens upon her. Like, it's so strange that, like, James Garner just sort of, like, hops on by at some point. And it's, like, how far away are you that, like, you took her all the way from New York and, like, are apparently just down the road from... Joe, I think what you're missing here is that, like, it's obviously very close distancedly, but it's, um, emotionally. It's very far apart. That's true. Yeah, so it's not so much like a dis, it's like miles so much, but it's miles of the heart, if you will.

It's what Vanessa Carlton was writing about when she wrote a thousand miles. Yes, yes, yes, exactly. They too were making their way downtown and it was to that club in New York where they went with Sandra Bullock. After they saw the Bridges of Madison County musical, which also is reflected in the emotional journey here, just one second, but a million miles to go. Exactly. Yes. So I think we all agree that the Lake House. is, like, in the backyard of that, like, plantation house that Ellen Burstyn lives in.

And once again, like, we don't, don't, don't focus on the plantation house aspect of it. Just like, he's a cotton farmer. No notes. Okay. Okay. Also, okay, here's the other thing. Half of this episode is just going to be me going into, like, uh, filmographies. But like, I, but there's so many, there's so many people to talk filmography. Yeah, it's stacked.

You know what I never realized. is how few movies James Garner made from, like, the 1990s onward. Right, because there's Maverick, because he was known for Maverick. But, like, so he's in, he, I believe, gets an Oscar nomination for Murphy's Romance in, like, 85, right? And then, like, it's only, like, two or three other movies between that and Maverick, which is in 94. So that's like a decade later. And then in the 90s, he does, it's Maverick, my fellow Americans, which is the movie with him and Jack Lemon, as like ex-presidents, I believe?

Which was like, what if grumpy old men, but with James Garner instead of Walter Mathout and their ex-presidents? That's like essentially the pitch there. There was a president. Right. He's in that Paul Newman, Susan Sarandon movie Twilight, that like, we got it. point do, Chris. The Reese Witherspins Twilight.

Right, Reese Witherspoon's in that one. That cast is kind of insane. Gene Hackman, Stalker Channing, like that's wow, that's a Robert Benton movie. And then that's his 90s. And then in the 2000s, it's Space Cowboys. He's a voice

in... You're going to have your space, cowboy. He's a voice in Atlantis the Lost Empire. Divine Secrets of the Yaya Sisterhood. The Notebook. Which fully, Yaya is his audition for The Notebook. Right. Yes.

A movie called The Ultimate Gift that, like, I've never heard of. What in the seven pounds is that about? I've no idea. He's got a couple, like, voice roles. And then, like, that's it. That's it for James Garner. That's a wrap. And, like, and, and, and then he died, of course, in 2014.

But, like, James Garner from, like, 1990 onward, makes probably, like, seven real movies, if we're really, like, telling him up. And one of them is this. A movie where he says four things and mostly just putters around by the truck or whatever. And it's, I don't know who called him up, whether it was Burstyn or whether it was like, somebody was like, you want to make a movie with Sandra Bullock? And he's like, yes, because I loved, uh, uh, Hope Float's. Noted Hope Float's Stan James Garner.

Right. paused while you were sleeping to say yes. I would love to call her Butterbean a billion times. But it's just such an odd thing when you think about how few movies he made and that this was one of them. Like, okay. Interesting. Real interesting.

Okay. Especially that one two punch of like Divine Secrets and then the notebook is just like, he said, yeah, I like doing that role. I can do that again. But at least in the notebook he had more to do and he got like, didn't he get like a sag nomination for that or something? Yeah. He's, like, carrying that part of the narrative.

Right, right. Whereas, like, in Yahya, he literally, the whole point of his character is like, yeah, like, my mom never really liked him all that much. I know. I kept waiting for, you know, the other sisters to be like, well, no, like, she, he knew Jack and that was helpful, but also, and they were just like, well, yeah, he was, you know, he was around. He was around. Also, the character that he's playing, that character's big scene is in the flashback.

Yeah. just him crying and we don't really see that actor that much. I will say the one good scene that I really did like out of him was him and Sandra Bullock, she gets the good line where she says, you know, did you get enough love or something like that or were you loved enough? And that's what it was. Were you loved enough? Because he says, what's enough? And I was like, that's a good, that's a good beat in this movie that felt like sort of emotionally true

in a movie that doesn't have a ton of those. So, good for that. But Speaking of missing people in this, she has other siblings, right? Right. Who are they? Yeah, the adult siblings. And they disappear. They don't matter.

It's alluded to the fact that, like, they have a worse relationship with Vivi than Sita does because she was like, I, Sidda was, she says early on, like, Sidda was the one who, like, still talks to me or something like that. Like, apparently the other ones have even, like, harder feelings about all of this, which, like, after seeing the Flash. back so you can sort of, you can see it. Yeah, especially if they have no memories of like the fun charming her and only this like one very formative, horrifying memory of her.

Yeah. But I just feel like it would have been perhaps more interesting to have this, you know, kind of revolve around like her and her siblings relationship. Like, would you not want to call your sister after this, I don't know, week and or six months? I have no long idea how long that she's down in Louisiana. Would you at least not want to gossip to be like, by the way, mom's friends, drugged me right

like maybe that's what one of the other sequels of that is about is about like Vivi's flamboyantly gay son who lives in Berlin now or something like that and what is the son's name it's something Baylor Baylor right yes

yeah it's pretty gay it's pretty gay I mean that that woman has a gay son no doubt oh like get out of here no doubt in my mind that woman has a gay son Like, that is, that's, that's... Like, she literally couldn't have it any other way. No, exactly, exactly. Yeah, I feel like there is a movie in here where it's just the three friends in

Sandra Bullock. If it's, if it's sort of like pushes sort of everything else out, I know you have to have the flashbacks to sort of have any kind of dramatic resolution to this, but like, all of the best parts of this are... Those three old ladies and Sandra sort of, you know, figure and shit out. And, you know, we really don't need Connor, I feel. Like, that fight they have where she's like, we're canceling the wedding. So much just feels like, well, it's this part of the movie now.

So there has to be an inciting incident. And it is this fight. They almost declare it as such in the movie. Yeah. Where, like, I think it's when Vivy's talking to him and she's just like, that seemed like an odd. Like it's odd that you like, you know, went from that to the assumption that this relationship is over or something like that. We're like basically like calling out how odd it was that this has now become this sort of make or break point in their, in their relationship. And especially as he's talking about it and he's like, it took us so long to get to this point.

And I'm like, well, then it feels like you have probably had fights like this before. Yeah. Why is this the one that is suddenly like, now you got to go to Louisiana. We've got to do all this stuff. It's just like very much like we needed this conflict for other things. happen. Let's keep it moving. Don't ask any questions. It's the type of movie where somebody has to end up

in a romantic relationship in the end, even if they already begin in one. Yes. Well, it's also he's presented as this sort of infinitely patient person who understands her relationship with her mom and has a little bit of clarity on it.

And yet, for reasons of plot and to raise the stakes for the third act or whatever, all of a sudden then he He has to become incredibly impatient. And, like, she's obviously the one who is, like, the driving force of putting the pause on that engagement. But even still, where he gets, like, I don't know, like, his character seems to take a little bit of a left turn at some point. Hers really does.

And I don't buy any of it, which is too bad because when they're in those scenes together early on, I do buy them as a couple. Like, I kind of like them as a couple. They seem functional and I don't know. Angus McFadgeon's an interesting actor who was like in a bunch of things for a while and it seemed like he was going to be a little bit of a thing. He was in that one television show that was sort of this like semi-supernatural thing called Miracles. Do you remember that at all? Is this the one that had the gay sex?

I don't think so because it was an ABC. Wasn't there a star show that had gay sex that was like? like mythic creatures or whatever. Oh, I don't know. The one I'm talking about is this sort of like X-Files-ish type thing called Miracles, where he was in it with Skeet Allrich, which was like the year after, it was David Greenwald, who was who had co-created Angel and had been one of the Buffy writers, and this was the show he kind of spun off of Angel to do.

And I remember it was really interesting. It only lasted like half a season. But that's sort of my big – he was also on, like, a few episodes, Alias. And he was just like – he bounced around from, like, a lot of TV shows for a while. And never really – it never really quite happened for him. And he'll still pop up in things or whatever. And it's just like, I'll spend half the episode being like, where do I know that guy from? And it's like, oh, it's the Miracles guy.

Okay. Yeah, I did a lot of like, oh, right, that guy. I guess that never really curled over all the way for him. And by that, I mean, like, his career, I suppose. It just feels like they're really putting him up as like, he's going to be a guy. And everyone said, like, pass. Like, we're all set actually on guys. The cast of this movie is really interesting.

There are a lot of people who sort of pop up. Obviously, I mentioned all of the younger versions of the yawas. But, like, Matthew Settle, the dad from Gossip Girl, is a teen C's brother who dies in war. and obviously Cherry Jones, who it's the object of... Shows up to be silently abused. The subject of the best joke in Fire Island, Cherry Jones. I was so delighted by that. Who else?

Gina McKee, this is our second Gina McKee movie in three weeks, Chris, after Notting Hill, who gets like half a scene, but she's TienC's mom. And, yeah, interesting cast. Gene McHugh is really going for it, acting-wise, in that scene. She really truly rending her garments in a way that I was like, Madam. Everybody, in a movie where everybody's kind of going for it, like, she drops to her knees, she's cursing the husband, you killed him, this, this Bayou accent that again, I know, like, the accents in this movie being crazy is sort of the thing, but like, where is it coming from?

For her to be randomly French It's very funny It's very like Straight out of an Anne Rice Something, I don't know It feels like she should be on a On a New Orleans sort of tour of the French quarter That you take tourists on or whatever

And it's just like here's the grieving woman And she's just like Ah, like Monschev She got lost on her way to True Blood And like ended up putting Kind of yes And also that they all refer to her as, like, the French lady, like the good French lady. I'm like, all right, guys, you get it.

This is weird. It's such a bonkers movie. I cannot believe I watched it so much as a T. Like, was I okay? Probably not. But, like, damn. I feel like this is probably a movie that seems less crazy once you have commercial breaks. Because it's, you know, you can, it's all split up.

you're not immediately accosted with Ellen Burson slamming a phone into some harrowing trauma flashback. Yeah, I did notice that as I was watching it, I kept wanting to create my own commercial breaks. I kept being like, maybe it's time for a snack now. Or like, I should refill my water. Like, I did feel the need to like break up the kind of unrelenting, like just absolute southern drama of it all. Uh, special, man, that Cherry Jones scene on like, Vivi's birthday or whatever is just such a bummer with a capital B. Okay, wow. Here's the other thing.

So the kind of movie that this is, which sort of dips into these flashbacks that sort of like brush up against the Southern Gothic of it all a little bit, that you, it took me so long to trust that even though the whole point of that scene was that Cherry Jones was falsely accusing Vivi. of sort of having this like inappropriate relationship with her father and that's why she got the ring because this was that kind of movie I was like yeah but like is there something going on because like I when I Joe I tell you I had the same no written okay I had the same no I couldn't trust it oh god please don't do that too it was like half an hour after the movie ended

where I was like okay I think it's fine like Maggie Smith wasn't going to burst in your house and tell you kind of it's just like pal I got bad news for you and this is like no But first, let me get my oxygen. Oh, God, yeah. But yes, it was a relief to find out. Because also it's David Rash, who's playing that guy, who is, like, in every, like, procedural movie, he's, like, the bastard, right? He's, like, the guy who's up to no good. So it's, like, that's maybe not great casting.

When, like, when you desperately need your audience to trust that there is no actual bad relationship happening between a father and his daughter, don't cast the guy who's, like, the son of a bitch and everything. Yeah, it's like putting Dylan Baker in something and being like, he didn't kill anybody. Right. And I'm like, come on. I'm going to need four sources on this. And like, even still.

Yeah. Ellen Burstyn, by the way, in the post-requium years. Pre-old Murph. Yes, this is quite pre-old Murph. But she's sort of settled into a real wild couple of decades. there where like Ellen will take a role that is out of like out of pocket a little bit right where she'll be like yes I will play the sort of dark cult leader in the wicker man and yes I will say the words astronaut dick has been making you soft yes I will play Barbara Bush for Oliver Stone like yeah that's yes I will play Elliot Stabler's mother on SVU oh every I not only I I will play everybody's mother on television for, like, for now until the foreseeable future. She's, um, she's Jean Triple Horn's mom in Big Love, right?

Am I speaking to a room with people who don't watch Big Love? I never got that far through Big Love. No, but I, I do think you're right. I do think that you're correct about that. Because Sissy Spac is also on Big Love, but I think it was Sissy Spac who was, like, the, like, business person who was, like, in casinos or whatever that had to deal with. Bill Paxton, and Ellen Burstyn was Triple Horn's mom, who, like, hated that her daughter was in this, like, plural marriage. She's in, she's Sigourney's mom in political animals.

She's, um, uh, oh, who else? She's got to be somebody's mom in, uh, House of Cards. I never got to the point. Isn't she Robin Wright's mom in House of Cards? I mean, it would make all the sense in the world, right? I would kind of be, like, disappointed if she wasn't. Yes. yeah that was her that's been her gig now for a while is like showing up two-seasoned a thing and it's like oh she's the main character's mom like okay that's where we're at yeah she is somehow inexplicably venisa kirby's mom and pieces of a woman oh boy oh that's not a great and and a movie that like really kind of hangs that character out to dry and really leaves her to try and try and set

an impossible character with not a whole... Like, I do not like that performance, unfortunately. I think... Critics' choice, non. People thought that that was going to happen, but it's just Alan Burstyn screaming of Vanessa Kirby. I'm not a fan of that movie. Yeah.

Vanessa Kirby, I think, is very, very good in that movie, but otherwise, it's a movie that maybe doesn't deserve her a little bit, is my feeling about that movie. I do think Ellen Burstyn is great, in Todd Salon's weiner dog, where she shows up towards the end of the movie as just, like, truly the meanest, grumpiest old lady. Right. To, like, who, again, is the grandmother to Zosha Mamet.

So it's, like, she's some random person's, you know, maternal figure. I'm just always happy, every time I see her, I'm like, oh, she's going to do something probably, like, a little unhinged. And, like, I'm going to have a good time looking at it. Like, let's go. Yep. I was kind of disappointed to be like, oh, this one is kind of a bummer for you, though, Ellen. Like, this one, this one's rough.

Well, and by the time we get to the resolution, the resolution kind of happens without her, which is sort of a bummer is, is the sort of emotional climax happens when Sida learns of the flashback. And, like, Vivi's not there. Like, we get the, we get the sort of, like, falling action Danumont at the end where they're, like, before they all decide to, like, jump into the New Orleans. Jazz Parade that happens at the end of the movie, because of course this movie has to end with the New Orleans Jazz Parade. But not a racist New Orleans Jazz Parade.

No, I ask me why later, and I'll think of a reason why it's not, but like, yes. The movie has to remind you. But. Well, that's one of the frustrating things I think about Vivi, is that, like, we as the audience just get the backstory along with Sit up. So it's more about the emotional arc is Sida forgiving and understanding her mother. But that leaves Vivie really nothing to do. I mean, like, her character arc is to maybe think about trying to drink less.

By the time they have that scene together on that porch. By the time they finally have that scene together, things are already settled between them. It's weird, you know what I mean? Like they're sort of, they kind of put the bow on it and sort of like make it official. But there's no catharsis through that scene at all. Yeah, it's like Citha is just coming to her and saying, like, well, I've already done the hard work of like understanding what you went through. And here I am to just say like, word, I hear you and I see you and like maybe I'll get married here. And again, you've gone to the effort of casting both Sandra Bullock and Ellen Burstyn.

Like it's kind of even if you could point to like, well in the book, like, you know, screw the book, I guess if that's the case. Like, you've got these two actresses, like, put them to work. Put them, you know, make them go through it in the scene together. Yeah, when they are together for that brief moment, I am like, oh, I really would have liked to see more of this in this movie. Like, the two of them as adults interacting, like, they do work well together. Although they do dress. They do dress Vivie in this sort of, like, funeral doily, even though it's white, but it's like, it's the sort of like. Funeral doily meets Forrest's nymph.

Yeah, yeah. Maybe that was sort of presaging her wicker man role a little bit. Yeah. Okay, but can we, okay, since we're talking about the outfits in this last scene of them together, can we talk about the 2001 Anne Taylor Loft of what they've done to Sida in this scene? It's like simple, black, whatever dress, and then the scarf fully wrapped around her neck, like that one character in the scary stories you tell in the dark. I wrote in all caps.

it off of Sandra Bullock's neck. Her head falls off. Yeah. No, I wrote in all caps, not a scarf. And then Anne Frosted lipstick. It's just so exactly of its time. 9-11 had just happened. We're all struggling to cope.

We're all trying to figure out a way to rebound. Well, and not for nothing. But I did think when they smuggled her onto that plane, I was like, guys, 9-11 literally just happened. How are you doing this? That's true. Like, literally how. are you putting a fully comatose adult woman on a plane moments after 9-11 in New York

of all places? And everyone's like, yep, definitely keep going. Right on through. Yeah, exactly. I just want the scene where they like weekends of Bernie, weekends that Bernie's her onto a plane. Yeah, we needed at least one shot of her like on the plane. We definitely could have had more. We could have had so much more. That's totally true. Yeah. More hijacks. Like, who's carrying her? Who's doing that. Like, Maggie Smith's not doing that. She's got a whole oxygen tank to worry about. Phanola Flanagan's a hearty woman. Like, she, like, just throw her on her shoulders.

Throw on her back. Yeah, exactly. She's taking her. Yeah, exactly. Like a bag of flour. Here you go, Sandy. Well, so, okay, here's my thing with the yas, right? It's sort of, Fanola Flanagan's obviously like the dynamo, right? She's the one who, like, if there's something to get done, she's going to get it done.

Maggie Smith is the one with the oxygen tank. She's the firecracker, pal. What's Shirley Knight's niche in this group? She's nice. She's the nice one, I guess. She's sort of the... She's like worried all the time. Yeah.

It never really pays off with anything. I wanted her to have one sort of triumph or like give her a W in some way where like... No, her payoff is like that she was worried about the blood oath when they were kids and she is again worried about doing a blood oath as adults. Like that's her through life. Which, listen, like, staff infections are real and I don't want to mess with that. And she's not wrong. I do think part of this is the problem of having less recognizable people in these roles, for reasons, in the flashbacks, because in the flashbacks, I did have a hard time telling which we switch. Well, it underlines the fact that something could have happened in a flashback.

It underlines the fact that they haven't really differentiated these women from each other in any sort of fundamental way. It's very much dependent on the performance. of those older actresses in the present-day storyline. Yeah, their childhood storyline was confusing. I was like, whose house are we at and why? If we're doing a proper... Who has the money? Who's got the car?

Like, what's going on here? Whose family are we visiting? That's horribly racist. It was just like all very muddled. If we're doing a proper now and then, I need to know which one's the tomboy, which one's patting their bra, which one has like a crush on somebody. Like, these are fundamental answers that I need. need to be able to tell a group of four childhood girlfriends apart from each other.

Like, the movies have taught me, and I need that info. Right. We need to take one of them obviously gay, because then I was, like, very lost otherwise. One of them needs to punch a boy in the face. Like, they had that racist little kid, like, have one of them just be like, one, like, instead they all pie him. Right. But again, right.

Yaya. One of them needs to be, like, my thing is that I hit men with pies. and like not all of them because then again there's no differentiation Shirley Knight's thing could have been hitting people with pies no even a really funny gag

to just keep carrying through her life just like pying Cherry Jones in the face and running away actually I'm wrong though Maggie Smith should be the pie one because then it would like track with her having to put the oxygen mask over her mouth

and like it's the same sort of like you know motion it's I don't know dramatic irony for shadowing for shadowing there we go yeah that's really gorgeous stuff. That's the stuff that screenplays are made of, my friend.

Listen, when we do the Paramount Plus series, eight episodes Defined Secrets of the Yaya Sisterhood, we will add these I'm getting the rights. We're getting the rights. We're taking it all back. We're taking the rights back. We're doing this again. Yeah.

Yeah, it's just a, it's a bizarre film that should be something different. And I don't know what it should have been, but I don't think it's this. It was also deeply savaged by critics. Like, this was a very easy bag. Oh, yeah. And Roger Ebert really went in on this one. I was like, wow.

It's one of those things where it's like, the title really does like serve itself up for ridicule because then you can like make your little puns and it just divine secrets of the ha-ha sisterhood. Got them. Nailed it. I want to look up though. You guys keep talking, I want to look up some of the, some of the poll quotes, because I imagine they would be quite bad. Another note I have is, my mother was hot and it was hard, so, you know, that's, that's something, that's something that we can absolutely discuss. Just, that seems like a real struggle.

Though I also was, as, you know, we get to this, you know, final realization of this horrible thing that Vivi had done, I was like, now, Sida, as an adult talking to your adult therapist. No one brought up the fact that she like might have had some sort of psychotic break. Like this was all just, everybody heard this story and was like, yeah, that tracks. That sounds absolutely like what has happened in your Southern Gothic childhood and we're moving on. No one was like, maybe. And people just really don't say, yeah. I mean, there's definite like trauma in my family that nobody talks about. So I guess that is believable, but

I don't know. It had that kind of like 90s of like, well, you know, a therapist, who could? Who could talk to a therapist? A shrink? Get out of here. All right. Lisa Schwartzbaum, the great Lisa Schwartzbaum

from Entertainment Weekly. There is nothing like a Lisa Schwartzbaum pan. I'm so glad you have it because I was mad that the link was broken. Gave it a C. The pull quote that I got on Rotten Tomatoes is not one character in this ovarian jungle is particularly likable. Not an ovarian jungle, Lisa. I'm going to have to ask her if I could have the rights for that for my future replay.

That's the title. Ovarian jungle. Wow. Usual pushover Peter Travers says, except for Ashley Judd, who shows true grit as Vivi in her babe days, Iroll. The effect is like being buried in molasses. Not untrue. What else?

Who's else got some good quote? I'm surprised that the Peter Travers quote isn't something like an excellent wonderful root-tooting time at the movies. Like, that's Peter Travers. Roger Ebert said, there is not a character in the movie with a shred of plausibility, not an event that is believable, not a confrontation that is not staged,

not a moment that is not false, 1.5 stars out of four. Yoakes. Yeah, he really went in. He said, I have time today. He said, Ellen Burstyn, you're on notice, my friend. So, yeah. I'm retiring.

I'm not going to come up with something like ovarian. Yeah, we should all really pack it in. Yeah, that's it on this team, I guess. Happy pride to us all. Oh, boy. Did this get any like Razies or anything like that, Chris? No. That's surprising.

For as much as they hate women at the Razzies, it's very surprising that they didn't go. I think Sandy until all about Steve, is that the name of that movie? Yes, it is. Because it's all about Eve, but it's Steve. But it's Steve. Oh, wow. That's what that is. Okay.

They, I think, gave her not as tough of a break as a female movie star as they would with anyone else. Yeah, they were definitely, they had their people that they hated. Maybe they were, like, still mad at Madonna. She's too respectable. Or, like, Demi Moore. She's nominated for Demolition Man and Speed 2 cruise control before then. Okay. All right.

Not like we need to keep giving them airspace. No, but, you know, whatever. We shame- Gaging the reception of this movie. It was ultimately, I think, kind of forgotten. And why wouldn't it be, given what both of the actress races were this year? Wait, can I just tell you who they were busy being mean to instead of Divine Secrets

of the Yaya Sisterhood. It's the most predictable thing. In both worst picture and worst actress, Madonna in Swept Away and Britney Spears and Crossroads. Like, the Razis were razzieing their own way. Who watched Swept Away? They also gave Madonna

worst supporting actress and die another day. It's the bitchiest thing. They're the bitchiest people. Crossroads whips. Written by Shonda Ryan I just said told somebody that literally yesterday And they were shocked I love springing that information on people

It's such a gag It's such a fun gag to do Such a fun gag Yeah But anyway yeah So they were busy punching their usual punching bags Of Madonna and Britney Spears at that point So yeah

Sorry Chris I interrupted you You were saying something Oh no the both actress races Sporting and lead actress races are such iconic heavy-hitting races. This is my year, frankly. I made a letterbox list for 2002 earlier today just because I was sort of in the mood of this year after looking at that, Chris.

And like 2002 is not a year that is heralded for being one of the great movie years. It's not like a 1999 or 2007 or anything like that. But like 2002 fucking rules. That is a deep well of really good movies. that year. And I think the Oscar nominations, which don't always reflect good years in cinema, do in this particular one, even if they are very heavily weighted towards the prestige releases of December.

I think they're good lineups in general. Yeah, 2002 is one of those years I look at. And I'm like, well, of course I'm gay. Like, what else was I going to do? Like, you're telling me I'm going to watch the hours and Chicago and Frida and be like, And, yeah, definitely straight. That would not have to. And far from heaven and kissing Jessica Stein.

And, like, and I'm just going through all the, like, you know, queer lady triggers, white oleander, like, bang. Don't get me started on white oleander. Banger sisters. Like, you got it all, man. It's all there. It's absolutely all there. Yeah. Meanwhile, I, too, like, also, like, it's so funny because, like, my gay touchstones are also the hours and far from heaven.

Yes, I know I'm among my people. But I also had like Itumama Tomien, which was like giving it to me every ball. And what else are the other like good queer touchstones for this year for me? For me, I'm in here like I didn't have it at that time. But now I'm like 2002 queer movies, the piano teacher. It's true though. Yeah. It is.

Again, I must say happy bride to us all to this Oscars race specifically. Yeah. Okay. Okay, so Oscar didn't love Yaya, Razzis didn't recognize Yaya, can we talk about the fine institution that did? I know it's that AARP. AARP movies for grownups. I've never seen more movies for grownups. Yeah.

This was a softball down the middle of the plate for those folks. I really want to unpack one of these because I feel like we said we would regroup on this category. best breakaway performance what does that mean what does that mean okay well it goes to the win is for richard gear in chicago other nominees are catch me if you can Christopher walk in one hour photo robin williams and from yaya maggie smith i don't understand from that context what breakaway means that made it actually more confusing about this but i think i can break this down Richard Gere singing and dancing

That was the big deal about Richard Gere Okay I'm with you Robin Williams creepy he's breaking away from his mold Oh so they're like doing something different Okay I think so Maggie Smith what is she doing that's different That accent

It's the accent I guess she's cussing Sure Maybe she's prim and proper but she's cussing Christopher Walken feels like maybe shady because they're like, oh, he's good. Yeah, that is how that one feels for sure.

Maybe it's like Christopher Walken doesn't usually tell a story about a mouse falling in a vatic cream in a movie, and yet, in this movie, he does. And does it very well. It does it very well. Wrote it all the way to an Oscar nomination. Yeah, that's a very deeply strange category.

It is. The other nomination that they gave, it, which should be best buddy picture. Yes. But I don't think they have this category yet. They gave it a nomination for Best Grown-up Love Story between Ellen Burson and James Garner.

They talk like two times. Even the movie is very upfront about the fact that it's like kind of not a great love story. The movie doesn't really contradict itself there. That's a very... That's a very like...

They're being like, if you are not close with your spouse it's fine we recognize right also the winter in that category is the gathering storm which is Albert finney and Vanessa Redgrave as Winston and I can't remember Churchill Clementine Winston and Clementine Churchill which was an HBO TV movie that was not a theatrically released movie correct so like what are we doing movies for grownups are wild wild they really just go off I will tell you love them. We talked, we must have talked about this when we talked about Moonlight Mile though, Chris, because I do

like that nomination for Sarandon and Dustin Hoffman. I know you don't like Dustin Hoffman in that movie, but like, I like that couple. I think that's a good nomination for that. That is a very grown-up love story. That does make sense to me. Yeah. That's what I like AARP best,

where it's just like they will really, like when they pull out a well-observed nomination like that. And then this fourth one for this Jill Clay Jeffrey Tambor movie that just sounds cursed called never again never again Jeffrey Tamber like that's perfect wait wait wait wait the log line for this movie two people who have pledged never to fall in love ever again then discover each other in a gay bar listening

to the Robin song never again okay oh wait okay supporting cast for this movie Jeffrey Tamberg Jill Clayberg meet in a gay bar right supporting cast Caroline Aaron, Bill Duke, Sandy Duncan, Michael McKeon. I imagine Caroline Aaron and Sandy Duncan are her friends. Like, is Jeffrey Tambor gay in this movie? And they decide to just like, like be life partners, like non-sexual life partners?

Never again is he going to sleep with a man. See, I really played myself because now I'm interested in this movie. Yeah, Joe, you have no one to blame but yourself. I mean, I love Joe Clayberg so much, and I have been trying to get my hands on as much of her movies as possible. Maybe I'll watch this movie, and it will be very interesting watching her have no romantic co-star because that person is not in that movie. Well, now I'm interested, so great, yeah. Maybe we need to start our actual festival programming of the movies that only we talk about. We'll watch Never Again

A Month by the Lake Uh-huh What else is on this list? Um Uh, what was the, the, um, Joan Plowright movie? Oh,

Mrs. Palfrey at the Claremont or something? I think that's right. Candle movie. Uh, right. Yes, candle. Posa looks like a candle. Candle movie.

Is that... Okay, what, what is, what is, okay, based off of the poster for Yaya Sisterhood, which we've talked about this poster. Uh-huh. What has the curse discount been name for this candle.

Oh, for Divine Secrets of the Yaya Sisterhood? Yeah, yeah. Okay, it's got to be something. Manic Mondays. Hangover Sunday. I don't know, it's like something about a bayou. It's like... Yeah, it's got to be something like that.

Blissful bayou. Yeah, blissful bayou or like swampy. Grandmas gumbo, something like that. Yeah. Grandma's basement. No, it's got to be like, it's got to be like, like, old lady okra or something like that. Like something with like a, like a real southern ingredient to it or something. What does okra smell like?

Does okra have like a distinctive smell? I can't even, I can't picture it. Not really. Right? No. I don't know. In terms of like root vegetables, it's not. really distinct.

It's not. It has a strain. It has the texture is like the thing. Right. That's the thing. Yeah. It's not the smell thing. Yeah.

Do you think at the AARP AARP movie for grownups awards, they play Kelly Clarkson's breakaway when whoever wins, best breakaway performance wins? Because I have been thinking about that. Literally nonstop. And I hope that's true.

Kelly Clarkson hosts. And if they don't, free idea. Kelly Clarkson hosts the 2023 AARP Movies for Grownups Awards Challenge. Like, do that challenge please host everything Kelly yes oh my god

we desperately need it we do we do we do do Kelly Okee for I don't know what music do 60 year olds love I mean at this point 60 year olds were Kelly Clark said I was saying like 60 year olds were 40 when Kelly won American Idol

like you know I think she could probably just sing the trouble with love is like on her key and they'd be like perfect Yeah, they'd be, like, sold, you got me, yeah. I mean, and I would say same. Yeah, they're not wrong. They're not, you know, yeah, exactly. What else?

What else do we have to say about the divine secrets of the Yaya sisterhood? We haven't talked about Callie Curie, which is also part of the reason I think, why this is so, yeah, obviously wins the Oscar for Thelman Louise, her first screen credit. And then writes something to talk about. Yes. We've talked about this. Who directed it? It's Lassa Halsstrom. Lassa Halsstrom.

Yeah. That's right. Yeah. It's a Halstrom. Which I feel like that was a financially successful movie at least, right? Oh, definitely. I mean, not like, mega hit on the Julia Roberts scale, but it, you know, nobody was angry at that. I feel like given the way that people would always have their, like, claws out ready for Julia to have, like, a career flop.

Like, if that movie was any worse, like they would, like, we would, we would have heard about it. So it made whatever, 77 million worldwide, how much of that was domestic? I imagine most of that was domestic. So, yeah, it feels like a domestic winner for sure. Yeah, $50 million domestic in 1995 is pretty good. Like, that's fine. Callie Curry's big rebound is doing Nashville. Oh, it is.

Oh, boy. Were you in Nashville? Were you a Nashville viewer, Christina? Oh, yeah. Those first, like, two seasons. I was a steady and faithful servant. Hayden Panetteer is incredible, frankly. And then it just got, like, we got to stop this, guys.

I think we all know this is not working. How many seasons did that show go without Connie Britton? Oh, that's actually a good question. Because they killed her off at some point. They did kill her at some point. But I think there was maybe only a season after her. She was gone. It was sick.

long. It went six whole seasons. Not all of them were on ABC. ABC only aired the first four. No, because it got switched to like CMT or somewhere. Yeah. CMT for two seasons. Why do I know that? I could know so many other things. Good Lord. But I also have a feeling that like if it's, you know, still the Nashville I know and loved, like she probably appeared a lot in flashback. So there's probably like a lot of Nashville re-appearing co-starred

my big childhood boy crush from soap operas when I was a little kid which was Joshua Jackson

from General Hospital or Jonathan Jackson not Joshua Jackson Jonathan Jackson from General Hospital so I was always sort of curious

as to what his character was like on Nashville but I would never watch it I would always sort of like dip in and out and I never really

got a sense of this was like a character everybody hated a character everybody loved but like whatever he kind of went back he started as very like annoying boyfriend and like obvious obvious in the way to like the couple who should be together and then he just like wouldn't go away and he was just like always found a reason to be around but that was also the energy of Nashville was like find a way to put this person back at this plot for some reason he was the boyfriend of that ingenue who had like the very she was very obviously Australian but playing southern? Yeah. Yes.

Yeah. I think her love interest was also Australian. I think that or like English. Like they both were other accented and doing Wild. Yeah. Maybe it's something that Kelly Cohery just really likes people to do. You know, be from somewhere else and pretend to do a southern accent. Right.

A movie that I am very curious about the accents of and I do need to see this movie because it is maybe my favorite film poster of time. She also directed another critical bomb, Mad money. Mad money. That's Diane Keaton. Currently free on freebie.

Diane Keaton, Katie Holmes, and Queen Latifah? Queen Latifah. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Look at that poster. They're throwing money around. Oh, Chris, you need this poster. Real fake looking money, too, man. How many bodies do you think constitute the Photoshop of

Diane Keaton in this post? Like, those are Yeah, I mean, the... 17. 17 at least. Like, there might be a different joint. Like, between each joint, someone might be different. Did these people never see a real dollar bill in their entire life?

Like, this does not... Like, this is a wild poster. I'm absolutely buying you this poster, Chris, for your home. Like... What boots are Katie... Is Katie Holmes wearing? The shoe wear. How tiny are Katie Holmes' feet?

Look at dying of shoes. Speaking of shoes. Like, those are, like... Eight-inch stilettos, like, what is going on? And then Coimeless Hufa's just in a boot-cut genie and a sandal? Like, what is happening here? Am I actively hallucinating this? I'm telling you, it's the best poster.

Oh, my God. Well, I guess if we can't have our character posters for Divine Secrets, we'll always have Mad Money. Can I say, though, the Mad Money poster does do one thing, right? it aligns the star billing with their placement on the post. Doesn't that drive you crazy when it doesn't? Yaya doesn't count because Yaya does it,

but Yaya has floating heads. You know that short story, the yellow wallpaper, where it's like the woman drives herself insane staring at the wallpaper on the wall or whatever? That's me, but were I in a room with a movie poster that misaligned the stars and the placement of the actors who play them?

Like, that would be my... I'm pretty sure every screen poster does it. Yeah, probably true. Probably true. So many posters do it, I feel. Also, like, if that... If the actor name placement is contractual, which we know it is, get that note to your graphics design people and have them Photoshop accordingly.

Because otherwise, you're just going to, like, send people to mental institutions. And I don't want that to happen to us. We're good people. Yeah. And thankfully, that's not going to be the thing that sent us to a mental institution. No, we've got plenty of other things. Yeah. For me, it will be the shoes. I literally just can't understand what kind of boots Katie Holmes is wearing.

Are her jeans tucked into them? This is going to be a thought that fester is, unfortunately. I will say, all that I, credit to Divine Secrets of the Yaya Sisterhood, their poster also correctly aligns. the their one is like has yeah i said that they have the boxes though which like right they're floating heads it does guys it's a scrapbook because of the scrapbook oh the scrapbook which just to return to that for a second i do not believe that woman has ever scrapbooked a day in her life certainly not like that with that like attention to detail and craft i don't believe that she's not going that woman doesn't go to michael's i can assure you

Fantastic. Yeah. Sorry, Chris. I missed. I was wrapped up in the mad money poster while you were talking about that. I'm still wrapped up in the mad money poster. Forever enough. Because I was going to mention Katie Holmes's pose. Okay, good. I'm glad that we are talking about that because it's the single finger with a ring on it. That's really just throw me for a loop there. I mean, me tweeting. That's the thing. Me reading your tweets is Diane Keaton, kind of looking at her.

kind of not. But actually, in truth, not being in the same room, yeah. None of them are in the same room. Are they even in this movie? Not being in the same plane of existence. Not different parts of her body are in different dimensions. Okay, but was this movie released in theaters? Yes, this was like iconic January cinema.

Oh, got it. Wait, gone in a week. That's why I never saw it. I'm watching it this week. Can we talk about the producers credited on Divine Secrets of the Yaya Sisterhood, which include both Bet Midland. and Bonnie Bruckheimer, ex-wife of Jerry Bruckheimer? What?

Uh-huh. Do we think Bette was a long for, like, development of this movie? Like, she was going to be Vivy at some point? I mean, it seems like that's a very Bette Midler character, right? I mean, did Bette read the book and say? And she's like, I can't do that accent, so I don't know about any of you. Wow. Imagine Bette trying to do that accent, though, for like one moment.

I mean, if you move this movie to, I don't know, maybe perhaps a location like Westchester. You do solve a lot of its problems. We're back again. Amazing. I'm just saying, R. Yaya Sisterhood P-plus miniseries in Westchester. Well, they don't say anything about it in the IMDB trivia, which I feel the trade by. My source for all my facts. Okay.

Was it one of her production? companies? Could have been. You know what? In many ways, we'll never know. Can we talk about a small little pet peeve of mine, which is present in the IMDB trivia for this movie, which notes that Cherry Jones, who plays Ashley Judd's mother, was born in 1956. Judd was born in 1968. It's like, yeah, they play mother and daughter not in the same scenes, like in different timelines. What is your complaint here, IMDB? What trouble you're trying to cause well can i ask you how many out of how many found that interesting yeah i'm gonna say

you know what right now i'm clicking no i don't find it interesting so oh no i don't have an i mdb pro fuck you i was gonna say okay brag i mdb pro oh i forgot that you need to be special in order to do that well you know what seven of 13 found it interesting so those seven people i just want to talk I don't want to yell. I just want to talk because... Oh, wow. I forgot that Ellen Burstyn was in How to Make an American Quilt

a movie that we talked about. You didn't forget that, Chris. It's there in your brain somewhere. It would have resurfaced. No, it's right here in front of me on my computer screen saying? No, I'm saying you didn't really forget it. It's just, it's, it was,

it existed somewhere in your subconscious, ready to reemerge at the most opportunity. Good movie. Good movie. Yeah. Good movie. One of the IMDB facts is several of the cast were born outside of the U.S. Although they were supposed to be portraying Americans from the American South.

Can you click? Yes, found that interesting. 21 of 27 found that interesting. And that ratio I like a lot better because, yes. Also, filmed in Wilmington, North Carolina at the same time as a walk to remember. Personally, that's my favorite. it. I wonder if those castes, like, feuded with each other. And we're just

like, you know, Mandy Moore and Phenola Flanagan walked down the street and, like, stink-eyed each other as they passed. All right, Ryan, get, someone get Ryan Murphy on the line. We have a new series of feud. Fude. Fude, Mandy versus Finola. That would send

gay Twitter into, like, that would actually shut down gay Twitter. Like, we would not be able to tweet. It would be, wow. We actually deserve that. Please give me that. Wait, Adam Shankman directed a walk to remember. And there's no dance in it whatsoever as far as I can remember?

She sings that song. Slow dance. Slow dance. That doesn't count. He does get at least a musical moment. I want full choreography, full, you can't stop the beat, choreography in the middle of a walk to remember.

That would have made it better for me. And she dies at the end of the number. Exactly. But she would have lived before she died. She would at last have lived for a moment. So it should have been a, a dance to remember, I don't know, something. God, I'm looking at the press or whatever,

the still from the trailer and walk to remember, and like half of these boys are wearing that long sleeve, sort of long sleeve, not quite a Henley, but not at, like, pre-Henley. You know what I'm talking about? Oh, yeah, where it's like one button. That, like, a sweatshirt sweater combo that, like, everybody was wearing, that, like, Freddie Prince is wearing

in every movie he ever did in the 90s, that thing. Yeah. I owned several of them. I did not look nearly as good. So there. Can we talk about how the Yaya Sisterhood IMDB photos are definitely attached to the wrong movie because this is definitely supposed to be here for possession, because it's a photo of Gwyneth Paltrow and Neil LaBute.

Oh. Wait, what are we looking at? The photos on Yaya Sisterhood. Oh, God. Yeah. I don't know, man. Sometimes I do want to talk about, like, who showed up to the premiere for the movies that we talk about? Because sometimes it is very funny.

Like, here's a photo of Jack Valenti, head of the MPA. Boy, that whore. He would show up to everything. George Lopez. I mean, yeah, George Lopez. It was 2002. George Lopez was there. Okay, I did actually just scan through the movie quickly because I was going to die

if I didn't figure out what Sita's play is called. And boy, is it absolutely called Dark Waters. Oh, that's right, that's right, that's right. And the image is just a martini glass that looks like it's in, like, some sort of southern, like, lake formation. It's honestly what art is. And I actually take it back and she's absolutely getting a Tony. Wait, Chris, now you've made me obsessed with looking who was at the premiere.

So Caroline Ray, Danica McKellar, Debbie Mazar, who is pregnant, like quite pregnant, actually, and wearing the craziest maternity outfit I've ever seen in my entire life. It's amazing. Debbie Mazur should be at every premiere. I think that's just science. These are the premiere photos from Dark Waters. Yes. Debbie Mazar was like I'm a Tony voter.

Oh, and like Ashley Judd and her race car driving husband or whatever. God, Ashley Judd looks so pretty in these. Go check them out, listeners. Go check out the IMDB photos for... It's my hot take for the day. Ashley Judd, pretty. Ashley Judd, quite pretty, yes. Quite pretty.

Yeah. Good work going on there face-wise. She did a good job with that face. Exactly. Before we move into the IMDB game, what do we think we're putting on our Yaw? not helmets, but... I thought you were just going to stop there.

What do we think we're putting on our yayas? Happy pride. Put it on your yaya. You better go put that on your yaya. Sorry, what was the rest of your? It's actually a great question. Oh, our little like headdresses? Yeah.

Well... I don't feel called to some of the headdresses in kind of manner, I guess it would have to be some sort of like dangly jewels. It would have to be something jewely. Yeah. Sure. I guess in the way that that Sita had the Time magazine banner on hers, I guess I would have to have like an entertainment weekly on mine with like my preferred like five floating heads from a fall movie preview on there. Chris would obviously just be the mad money poster. Mine is just the mad money poster. Everything that's dangling from my headdress is just dollar bills.

Dollar bills. Perfect. I would have, like, Merrill's dishwashing gloves from the hours, sort of, like, fancally displayed, sort of, like, the fingers. So remember in Beatlejuice how Catherine O'Hara has the, like, opera gloves that are tied? The glove as a headwrap or whatever, and it's like a fashion statement. That, but with Merrill's. powder blue

dishwashing gloves from the hours is what I would have. Yeah. Does anybody else remember in Beetlejuice how Rooney Mara is one of their house guests?

The woman that looks like Rune Mara. What? Oh, she is. That's... She looks exactly like her. I was having this conversation today. She looks exactly like Rune Mara, though.

I'm never going to watch that scene again. That's amazing. Is that what we're calling your kind these days? Don't mind her. Somebody dropped a house on her sister. What a great movie. All right. IMDB game?

I think it's time. Let's do it. Joe, why don't you tell us what the IMDB games? Sure. Every week we end our episodes with the IMDB game, where we challenge each other with an actor or actress to try and guess the top four titles that IMDB says they are most known for. If any of those titles are television, voice-only performances, or non-acting credits,

we mention that up front. after two wrong guesses we get the remaining titles release years as a clue and if that's not enough it just becomes a free for all of hints that's the i and be vegan sure is all right so christina as our guest you get the illustrious honor of deciding if you want to give or guess first and who you want to give or guests to slash from i think i'm going to give first because i am uh hashtag giving and I think I want to give to Chris, why not? All right. Whomst do you have for me?

Okay, so I genuinely couldn't believe this. And when I saw that this was a hole in your IMDB game log, I checked. You're lucky if you can find them at this point. I know. I checked a trillion times. But you know who is? And I literally just checked again, Maggie Smith herself. Oh, wow.

is a whole. My guess is for a while it was all Harry Potter. That's my guess. That's probably why. Why she has been so rudely ignored, but I'm happy to report that it is not that now. So. Okay. The dame herself. Marigold Hotel, the first one. The best one, I should say. The best one. Not the second best one. Um, Gosford Park. Mm-hmm. Two for two. I am actually going to guess a Harry Potter and say the last Harry Potter. So Deathly Hall is Part 2. Damn.

In that case, I think it's no Harry Potter. Wait, did you already say there was no Harry Potter? I said it wasn't all Harry Potter, but I will agree with you saying that there is no Harry Potter. Because I was thinking I was about to be stupid and not have been paying enough attention. No TV? No TV? Do I think the Downton Abbey movie is there, though? And if you do, like, which one?

Because there are famously two now. There are now two of those. Sister Act. No. Damn. Sadly. So now you get your years. Your years are 1985 and 2015. 85's a room with a view.

Bang on. Did you say 2015? I did. Okay, 2015. It's going to be post-Oscar nomination. Mid-Harry... No, that's post-Hary Potter, right? No. No, it's post, because Harry Potter ended in 2011. Okay. It's got to be the lady in the van. It is the lady in the van, and that is why I picked it, because I did forget entirely about that film.

A movie that we haven't done yet, and we really need to. The thing is, we have a couple. Maggie Smiths that we could do. We have to do the Marigold Hotel. We do. We should do the quartet. You should do the quartet, yes. Nobody knows. The lady in the van poster is also quite good.

Oh, God, yes. She's just, that's a van and that's a lady. I get it. Yep, you got me. What is this that's floating around? Oh, it's leaves. Leaves. It's because it's money.

It's, you put it right next to the mad, Money Buster, baby. In many circles, the lady in the van is actually mad money, too. Oh, no. Too mad, too money. Yes.

All right. Okay, so that means... Joe, thank you very much. Thank you. So, Joe, for you, I went back looking, I thought we hadn't done Jenna Rollins, we had.

Then I found out, because, you know, the whole James Garner connection. Right. Married to James Garner in movies. But turns out She and Ellen Burson were nominated at the same time that Ellen Burson won for Alice doesn't live here anymore.

So from that same best actress lineup, if you can believe, you little homosexual boy, we have not done Faye Dunaway. Wow. Two gay gasps. My favorite homophobic woman. So she would have been nominated that year for Chinatown. Chinatown is one of my guesses. Chinatown is correct. Network is one of my guesses.

Network. Her Oscar win is correct. Mommy dearest. Mommy dearest, much to her chagrin probably, is correct. All right. Now, there's a very good chance that the fourth one of these is going to be real wild. I'm trying to think of something like slightly more contemporary, perhaps. What are you up to? in the 90s, Faye, or even like the early 2000s. What can I remember her from?

She was in an episode of alias that probably doesn't count, but, you know. There's no television. She was in that episode of alias. She says game theory to Vincent Carper in that episode. And I think about it, not infrequently. She's like the head of an agency or something like that, right? Like, all of a sudden, she's, I mean, at a certain point, who isn't the head of 51% of this agency.

She owes 51% of this government. Uh, yeah, okay. Faye Dunaway. I can't give you hands to. No, I know. I want a perfect score.

You want a perfect. Um, right, maybe it is... If you get a perfect score, I'm sure she'll, like, slap you in the face and call you... It's got to be Bonnie and Clyde. It's Bonnie and Clyde. Yeah, do I. Yeah, okay. All right.

I was expecting it to be... unwell and it is in fact quite well so good to answer your previous question in the 90s she was busy being in dunstan checks in okay thank you i'm glad i didn't guess dunstan checks in when bonnie and clide was out there i would have felt real bad about myself roasted absolutely oh that's my first perfect score in a while i'm happy all right congratulations buddy thank you all right christina nervous as ever i i i search I searched far and wide for a good one to give you. I ultimately delved into the Cali-Coree filmography.

We talked about her writing and just writing. She wrote something to talk about for director, Lassa Hallstrom. I was going to say, mad money, mad money, no way. One of the more celebrated performances in that film was given by one Ms. Kira Sedgwick, whose IMDB known for has one television show and three films. Okay. Well, that television show simply must be The Closer. Emmy-winning performance as Brenda Lee Johnson in The Closer, yes.

And that is her one TV. Okay, that's good to know. Man, Kira Sedgwick. Yeah, they didn't include the recently canceled ABC sitcom Call Your Mother. It wasn't canceled recently, but it was her most recent TV credit. Call your mother. Screaming that out of every window at Pride. What has Kira Sedgwick been in?

All right, there's no way this is on there, but I do just have to say it, because when I think of Kira Sedgwick, the first thing I think of is what's cooking, the 2000 film where she and Juliana Margulies are lesbians. What? And as it is Pride, I do have to say. that allowed. It's not one of those, but that's fantastic. I'm looking that up right now. I do

find a homophobic, however, that it's called What's Cooking, not Hey Good Looking, what you got cooking. Mercedes Rule looks so psychotic on the poster for What's Cooking. I can't even deal. Wait, it's a... I'm going to try to find it. Okay. A rather lunatic film,

I'll say. Joan Chen, Julietta Margulies, Mercedes Rule, Kira Sedgwick, Alfrey Woodard, not one of them looks like themselves. on the poster for this movie that has a turkey it's okay picture all right

so this week I'm watching what's cooking and mad money they are both on freebie picture those five women the whole time through both those five women have just shoved you into the back of an oven and then into that oven

they have placed a turkey like a fully trussed up turkey with a cartoonish looking stick a dime couple sticks of dynamite shoved up its, uh, cavity. Um, and they're all smiling.

Mercedes-Rul is looking very threatening right in your face and being like, yeah, motherfucker, you're going to die. Like that's, that's what's happening with, like a haunted painting or a photo of Jesus. Her eyes follow you around the room. Juliana Margulies is, does not look like Julietina Margulies in this poster. Not at all. It is not at all. It is like, everything is like, it's, remember that, uh, woman in Spain who airbring

the portrait of Jesus so much that it looked like a cartoon of like a snow owl or whatever, like that's what this is. It's the movie poster equivalent of that. The thing about the What's Cooking poster is like if you told me John Waters directed this just based on the poster, I'd be like, yeah, sure, that tracks. Like that could be a thing. There's a weird stick of dynamite and I'm in an oven. That sounds right. My friends and I for a while would get together and we would sort of like do like a like Sunday in and we would try and find the worst possible movie to watch um like red box or something like that and like not not saying that this is necessarily I don't want to demean this this movie Christina that you that you came to but like we would

have absolutely chosen this just based on that poster like we would have gobbled this is a girandered shot a film I like I wish I could say like I remember it being bad or I remember it being good I literally just remember them being gay and like that That was all I got. I'm just saying, if this is a good movie, this poster is lying to you then, because this is a poster for a bad movie. This is the Mulesh-Forman. Your poster is a bad movie, but this is a good movie. All right, okay.

All right. I still have to guess other things. You do. I'm so sorry. I'm so sorry. Yeah, one strike now. What's cooking? Is something to talk about on there?

It is. Okay, that does track. That really tracks. Okay. What I think of Kyrgyzegov films, what do I think of? Aside from Giuliana Margulies, we're moving past that in the brain space. I'll never be past it. And in many ways, I think I won't either.

There was that scary. Was it scary, that scary movie? Oh, shit. Was it that? that hello like hello guys that scary movie why is no one saying i'm winning something like why am i not getting like absolutely slammed with applause right now this is really deeply rude um no but that one going back to it that one scary movie that she is in with um her ding dang husband Kevin Bacon what is that movie called it's like the the the next to the next to the forest

Oh, you're so close. You're so close. It's not like a horror movie, but like the subject of it. Not the woods, but perhaps up. Oh, the woodsman. The woodsman. There you go. All right.

A lot of a movie. Okay. Okay. So what we have really rather quickly reached is the end of my knowledge of Kira Sedgwick movies. Something near the woods and something gay. It was kind of my big two. So this one, if you would like a hint.

I would love, I would simply love a hint. She's the love interest of a very big movie star who is sort of, sort of supernaturally gifted in this film. Okay, that's certainly something that people can do, bravely. I shan't sing you the very popular original song from this movie that I won't curse you by getting it an earworm in your brain for the next few weeks. But it's like one of those annoying mid-90s songs from a movie. Also, the title- That narrowed things down more. The title shares its name with an unrelated LL Cool J song that was. like one of his like big hits i love y'all's hints they are so unwell

they're just like every time i listen to this podcast like in some ways that's a hit and in some ways that is more confusing that is anti-helpful right right it's like if you're not the reference it'll be that definitely helps to think about ll cool j hits for sure um yeah i guys i don't know i'm get this i think i might be a three for three on this i don't think i'm ever going to find a movie that has an annoying song from the 90s and is also an LLJ song. Okay, so somebody had a major comeback in the 90s that included an Oscar nomination, and this was like one of maybe two or three immediate follow-up.

He also might be a very famous Scientologist. Okay, so we're talking Travolta. Yeah. Yes. Oh, crap, that weird movie. Yep. This is how I think about movies. That weird movie.

that weird movie But it wasn't It was it's like It does have a dumb Like it has like a what like a dumb one name Yeah Yep oh it is Eric Clapton Okay

God directed by John Turtletop I didn't know that that's interesting It's it's not premonition but it's close to that It's very close to that It's same first and last It's, I, is it phenomenon? It's phenomenal.

It's phenomenal. Yes. You got there. You're Sedgwick. I've bested you almost. We got you through it. I am going to be angry on your behalf that heart and souls was not one of those for because I agree.

I agree. It should have been. But, you know, we can't have everything. Have you seen heart and souls, Christina? I think, like, definitely, but not in a way that I was absolutely like paying attention. I feel like someone like had it on. And I was like, that is a movie that's on. And then I.

like did not pay attention An absolutely insane movie That is also probably 1,000% gonna make me cry anytime I watch it Oh I love to know that Yeah, that's fair I absolutely love that

Wow I hope Kira's doing well Yeah Guys Yeah yeah Yeah yeah We went some places With this discussion

Man I expected nothing less Yeah I always have the best time with y'all just rambling about movies. We love having you on. Come back anytime. Pick another movie about mothers and daughters and come on by. I absolutely will, and it's always a pleasure every time. Thank you.

All right. That is our episode. If you want more, This Had Oscar Buzz. You can check out the Tumblr at this had oscarbuzz.com. You should also follow us on Twitter. It had underscore Oscar underscore Buzz. Christina, my friend, tell our listeners where they can find more of you. You can find more of me at Twitter.com, the website.

I am at C underscore Grace T. And my own podcast, wait, is this a date? We'll be returning soon. So get excited. We're talking about dating. I'm not doing it bravely, but we're talking about it. And it's going to be a good time, I think. All right.

And Joe, where can our listeners find more of you and your yaya? Oh, you know, my yaya's hanging out wherever it feels like, God, I hate that sentence. Twitter letterboxed At Joe Reed. Reed spelled R-E-I-D. You can also find me on Twitter and letterbox at Crispy File. That's F-E-I-L. We would like to thank Kyle Cummings for his fantastic artwork

and David and Gonzales and Gavin Meevius for their technical guidance. Please remember to rate, like, and review us on Spotify, Apple Podcast, Google Play, Stitcher, wherever else you get your podcast. Five-star review in particular really helps us out with Apple Podcasts visibility. So put something nice in your own words, instead of having time, magazine, twist them. That's all for this week. We hope you'll be back next week for more buzz.

Thank you.