This Had Oscar Buzz - 233 – The Best Exotic Marigold Hotel

Episode Date: March 6, 2023

From Shakespeare in Love director John Madden and with a bursting prestige-y ensemble, The Best Exotic Marigold Hotel is one we have been saving. Led by Dames Judi Dench and Maggie Smith, who both had other films in the race in this season, the film follows several seniors who seek fulfillment and romance in India, … Continue reading "233 – The Best Exotic Marigold Hotel"

Uh-oh, wrong house. No, the right house. I didn't get that! We want to talk to Marilyn Hacks. I'm from Canada. I'm from Canada water. I got a job, my first ever. I'm about to make the first public speech in my life.

Imagine them naked. I'm afraid I gave that up several years ago. Ah, there you are. Good, isn't you? Really? No, of course not. Would you like me to not fix that chair? How can you bear this country?

What do you see that I don't? The light, colours, smiles. It teaches me something. She wants to thank you. for your kindness. I haven't been kind. You are the only one that acknowledges her. I'm not eating that.

Hello and welcome to the This Head Oscar Buzz podcast, the only big, dumb baby pie podcast. Every week on This Head Oscar Buzz, we'll be talking about a different movie that once upon a time had lofty Academy Award aspirations, but for some reason or another, it all went wrong. The Oscar hopes died, and we're here to perform the autopsy. I'm your host, Chris Fyle,

and I'm here, as always, with a telemarketer, interrupting my favorite television program, Joe Reed. But let's talk about what the program is, and let's get into your life. The program that she was talking about was like Mori Popovich or something. Jerry Springer. Yes, 100%. Yes. Judy Dench basically describing a TV, a talk show television program where somebody is having sex with a bunch of different people's moms or the moms. She also kind of predicted Miltz Manor, so that.

Her favorite show is Love Island, Miltz season. Exactly. Exactly. Chris, this was your first time watching the Best Exotic Marigold Hotel. That's very exciting for you. It was. I was excited to finally catch up to this movie, which I pointedly waited for us to do with, because I never saw it in theaters. Yeah.

Gotta say, I was a little disappointed. I get that. Watching it again, I was like, oh, I don't know if Chris is going to like this movie. I mean, spoiler alert, part of it was, like, Tom Wilkinson maybe dies too early in this movie? There's a lot of movie left after he dies. And he's such a dynamic part of the movie and the story. I think that's so far as saying the best part of the movie. I really like Judy Dench and Bill Nye in this movie.

Like, I think that both of them are very compelling, and I enjoy watching them sort of find their way to, And speaking of nilfs, she's, I mean, like, let's talk, let's have age discourse on this episode. Oh, what is the age gap between Judy and Bill Nye? She's, like, 15 years older than him. Good for you, Judy Densch. 100%. Go, girl.

100%. Yeah, I enjoyed them. I think this is, like, a low-key, fave Judy Dengch performance of mine, even though, like. She's good. She's, and it's not really asking the big sort of histrionic. of her. She has, you know, these emotional moments, but it's nothing that's terribly huge. But

I think she's funny. I think she's sort of like Riley funny in this, the part where she's flustered and she goes and grabs the glass in front of Celia Imory and downs it, and then she goes, that was gin, you know, and she goes, I realize that now. That's the part of this

in the trailer. I just think it's very funny. But yeah, I really was into the Tom Wilkinson storyline. very sort of emotionally affecting, and I think you're probably right that that sort of gets dispatched early, although I wonder if it had gone on longer, it would have been like, oh my God, we get it, he's going to die, and it's going to be very sad for everybody. Right, you know, because it's supposed to be the surprise that he's the one that dies, and I feel

like the movie only gets away. You're right, it only gets away with that because he's the one that we see less of than we would maybe like to up until the moment that he dies. Like, I do like, I do like the fact that immediately after that, Judy Densh's sort of voiceover is like, you had to know somebody was going to die in this like hotel full of old people. And it's like, fair play, Judy, fair play. Like, we were all thinking it. So that was good. It does put you somewhat at ease for the rest of the movie that none of the, and if the other

cast members are probably going to die. this is true um even though they tried to do the you know the fake out thing with um the horny old man who's the actor's name i can never remember um that you think he's going to like have a a viagra incident you know what i mean they they definitely sort of fake you out there a little bit but that thankfully doesn't happen i i remember seeing this movie in theaters this is a movie that a friend and former guest, Bobby Finger, and I would talk about a lot. He was very enthusiastic about this movie, and I shared him that enthusiasm with him. So whenever I think of this movie, I kind of think of Bobby,

and I'm probably going to text him after we're done talking about this and being like, guess what's coming up? But it also fits very neatly into a genre that I really like, which is this sort of old, especially old, characters sort of like finding a new gear in their life in a way that is not so like they're not like you know stealing you know gold or something like that you know what I mean it's not like you know one last heist or something like that for the last for the gang or whatever but it's there's sort of making these small changes in their lives that

end up affecting them profoundly watching this movie again this time which is probably the third time I've seen it um I think maybe watching it with a little more critical eye, I'm like, I can imagine where, like, people watch this movie and find the portrayal of the Indian characters, maybe a little condescending or thin in comparison to. Like, it's these sort of, like, old white Brits descend upon them and, like, learn something about their lives and, like, nobody loves that genre. I think this in particular, I think O'Parker in particular, with the screenplay to this, and O'L Parker ends up directing the second best Exotic Marigold Hotel in addition to right. I look that up. He does not. he doesn't no that's insane that also john madden why didn't my brain like you know what it is it's because old

parker directs the second mamma mia and so that's my brain is like old parker directed a second of something he's done so much for us um but he's uh he's the screenwriter for this it's surprising to me that this is a adaptation from a book because i so like associate this story with uh old parker but anyway um I think it does a very good job of sort of moving, making the story feel organic rather than touristy, even though like the tourism of it is kind of part of the point with a lot of the characters. But it feels... Especially Maggie Smith and Penelope Wilton, who are like full-blown racists arriving in India. Right.

And I kind of respect the fact that like Penelope Wilton makes it through the entire movie and like doesn't really change. And stays a racist, yeah. stays like mean old bag or whatever and then like gets back on that plane in first class and whatever and it's like yeah sometimes like not everybody like comes around yeah i always appreciate the the in you know these kind of ensemble pseudo romance or like ensemble multi-stories happening at once movies when there's one that doesn't end happily yes and i think that i mean even the fact that like tom wilkinson dies but that story ends well right where he gets his closure and the sort of the love of his life, we find out that he had never really forgotten him and all of that. So, like, even that storyline ends a little bit happily, whereas, like, the Penelope Wilton story is just like, yeah, she's going to go back to America and probably be happier there

because she doesn't have to, you know, confront anything foreign to her, and she's just going to live an embittered old life and whatever. And thankful that Bill Nye gets to sort of cut that anger off of his life a little bit, which is nice. What did you think of, and I guess this is something we'll get into even more specifically over the course,

or after we get through the plot description, but like in general, what did you think of like the Dev Patel parts of the movie? The sort of like, the, you know, wonder-kind entrepreneur who's the fuck-up really thing.

It's the part of the movie that felt to me the most like an actual romance or a romantic comedy in this, Because even though there's romantic and sexual dynamics to everybody else's characters, it feels like that is symptomatic or that is this like byproduct of what's actually going on with those characters, what their actual arcs are. I feel like I'm about to start arguing my way into liking this movie more.

Maybe you are. Maybe you are. But specifically the Dev Patel stuff, which felt most overtly like a typical rom-com to, type of setup and payoff, and the story beats are exactly like you would expect from a romantic comedy. It felt way more, like, kind of shoved into the movie, like, it felt like two movies kind of at odds sometimes, which is, of course, unfortunate because this is the non-white characters story.

Right. It doesn't ever feel like he is as integrated to the story as much. And granted, like, he interacts with the characters, but I feel like the, the- The way out of that is having them either interact more or interact more as a group with him so that it feels like he belongs with those stories too. Yeah. I do feel like you get the sense that he has like, he has affection for them and they have this sort of like odd affection for him. They're a little, they're a little sort of like, oh my God, this guy's like kind of a fuck up. but also, like, they, he endears himself to them in, uh, in interesting ways.

And, and I like the fact that that's the, that doesn't seem particularly condescending to me, that like that character sort of, it's not like they adopt him, right? You know what I mean? They sort of, you know, endure. Yeah, he's not the movie's pet. Exactly. Exactly. Um, and, and I like Def Patel in general. This was interesting. This was kind of a, a big post slum dog step for Dev Patel, I feel like, where he's the sort of like feature... Yet he's still firmly in twink territory and not yet in Hunk territory.

No, hunk doesn't come really until Lion, right? Yeah, when Lion happens, everyone's like, oh. Yeah, oh. Oh, I see. Got it. The Chai vendor has grown up finally. Dev Patel's not in the MCU, right? no

We must protect him at all costs then Well they keep talking about him for Bond Which I think would be like an interesting choice for Bond That would be so good But that is also sort of like You know hitching him to a franchise Also in that way And well yeah

I mean well and my thing about Bond Is I want Bond to get back to like frivolous fun again You know I Yeah I was never all in on the Craig Bonds in the way that everybody else was. Right, right. And maybe I liked no time to die because even though it is still serious

and is like all about bringing it close to those stories, I do think there is the most frivolous fun in that. We are forgetting the fact that like we are about to enter a decade of the Gawain Cinematic Universe where David Lowry's The Green Knight is going to have multiple sequels. Speaking of going, oh. Yeah. Yeah, exactly.

What a movie. Another movie with Surprise Gay Shit. Very true. Yes. God, what a film. What a fantastic film. Yeah, I'm excited to talk about this movie, though. This is one I've sort of had on the back burner for a while there, just because it is something that's just like,

it's one of those ones where I get to the end of it, and I just sort of like, what a nice movie. You know what I mean? And they don't mean that as a pejorative in any way. way. It's, yeah, what a nice movie. I don't know. I really like it.

Sure. Yeah. Do we want to do, do we want to subject me to the plot description? Should we throw you into this, I'm guessing, very difficult 60 second plot description? Yeah, and I haven't made notes once again. I'm in a very, like, wing it kind of a place in my life at this point. I've really freewheeled these last few plot descriptions, so we'll see how that goes. Myself as well.

I'm like 36 hours away from getting on a plane and a vacation that is so desperately needed. Oh, get there. Just get to that finish line and then... We'll both get there, buddy. But before we do so, we have an episode to deliver today. We have on deck for the Gary's The Best Exotic Marigold Hotel, directed by maybe secretly the this had Oscar Buzz director, John Madden. This is our fourth John Madden. Watch out Ridley Scott. Madden's coming.

See, what I'm saying is when we get a director that we've hit six times, we have to include the director in the Sixth Timers Club, too. We should. We haven't made it there yet, but we definitely should. Yeah. We'll look for avenues to get John Madden in there. Written by the aforementioned O'Parker, based on the novel, These Foolish Things by Deborah Bogick, not based on the song, Foolish Games by Jewel. But I would say a lot of these characters are. are brilliant in the morning, and I love that about them. Foolish games from the Batman and Robin soundtrack. I forgot that that was on the Batman and Robin soundtrack.

I thrived on the Batman. I always would sort of, like, raise a skeptical eyebrow at songs that made it on the soundtracks after they were already established as part of, like, a hit album or whatever, where it's like, you're just borrowing. This is just, you know, and not like, you know, you're pulling from like a back cattle. or something, or, like, pulling something that's, like, several years old, where it's, like, you know, Pieces of You was still, Pieces of You, Pieces of You, Pieces of Me, what was that?

Pieces of You. Pieces of me is Ashley Simpson. Okay. Damn it. The two genders. The two genders. Pieces of you are pieces of me. What are you?

Yeah, exactly. Right. And the players of these foolish games that are tearing we apart are Judy Tinch, Maggie Smith, Tom Wilkins. and Bill Nye, Penelope Wilton, Celia Emery, Ronald Pickup, and Dev Patel. The film was released in the UK in February of 2012, but didn't release in stateside until the beginning of May of 2012. Indeed. Mr. Joseph Reed, are you armed and ready with a 60-second plot description?

More or less, yes. All right. Then your 60-second plot description for The Best Exotic Miracle Hotel starts now. So dissatisfied with their lives or otherwise at odds and ends in Britain, a group of retirees decide to move to Jaipur, India, to live in what they believe is a retirement community that is called the Best Exotic Marigote Hotel. It is run by Sunny. He is basically getting this hotel up and running and off of the ground while these people are moving in. It's a very throw your hat over the wall and then know that you're going to have to chase it over there approach to. The hospitality industry. Oh, shit. Oh, fuck. Okay.

So Judy Densh is Evelyn. She's widowed. She gets a job there helping people at a call center sort of better relate to people. Bill Nye and Penelope Wilson are married. She's awful. He's awful. He's better. He eventually leaves his awful wife for Judy Densh.

Tom Wilkinson is Graham. He's gay. He has an old lover who, um, fuck. He, like, you knew decades ago. And then he comes back and he meets him and it's very nice. And then he dies. Celia Imrey is like a like hot to trot older lady, Blanche Devereotype. who's lost her mojo, and then Ronald Pickup is a horny old goat, and he doesn't die while

fucking a lady, which is good for everybody. The hotel is in dire financial straits, but Sonny pulls it together with the help of Maggie Smith, who plays Muriel, who has a hip replacement in India, and ultimately provides the money and expertise to help get the hotel go in again, and we'll have a sequel very soon in the end. And almost at 30 seconds, you forgot to mention Sonny is in. in a romantic relationship with a woman who works at the call center, but because she is of a lower class, his mother is, like, not supportive of their relationship, even more so unsupportive of Sonny running this hotel, and is trying to get him to marry off in an arranged marriage.

Yeah, there's a lot of characters, obviously. I think the ones that get focused on are mostly Judy Dench, Tom Wilkinson, Dev Patel. Even like Maggie Smith kind of like recedes for a while. She's sort of like, once she has her hip surgery, she's just sort of like sitting in her wheelchair in the courtyard. She has a small storyline. Becoming less racist, as the movie would like us to believe.

Right. I don't, so, okay, so you seem to not love that storyline. And like, I don't. It's okay. I mean, her storyline's okay because we really are just introduced to her as this. Like, huh? I think it's fine to have a story about somebody becoming less racist. I think ultimately that's not a sin. Well, she starts, I think the problem with why it is at least unpalatable, not wrong, not like that, but just like unpalatable and less fun to watch than I was expected is like that is her defining trait at the beginning. She's just this mean lady who then we eventually learn about and we're supposed to feel less bad about disliked.

liking her for being a racist lady. Sure. And, but, like, her story, I suppose, is interesting. It's just, I don't find her story incredibly satisfying because, like, everything we learn about her, we learn in one monologue that she just kind of is, you know, there's, there's this servicewoman in the hotel who, like, she'd been kind of giving tips to or trying to throughout and like we realized she might see some of herself in this person because she herself used to work in that type of service industry and she was a nanny for a while and

eventually was dispensed by this family as she aged and then she really had no life of her own to speak of and she could only afford this very small home and so she's stuck in these small quarters well there's also the sense that like if you have to go to a country so far away for a hip replacement operation because you can't afford to get that operation done in your hometown. That's scary. Like, I think it's one of those things where it's like, there's, there's a lot of ways to understand this woman's sort of harsh demeanor. And like, I'm not like excusing, you know, racist attitudes, of course. But there's, there's a harshness to this woman that you look at her circumstances and you're like, well, yeah, like that tracks. Like, that,

that makes some degree of sense. I also think, like, we are, we are not unfamiliar to Maggie Smith's mean old bag performances. And this one, I felt easily as, like, the least funny of them. Oh, definitely. Yeah. Like, the jokes don't land as much in this. And not, not for her fault, but, like, we've seen her give variations of this performance before and so much better. Yeah. It's interesting. There's a moment towards the end of the movie when she's kind of laying out her plan to help Sunny save the hotel. And she asks Evelyn, the Judy Dench character, if she's going to be staying around. And they kind of make mention of the fact that we haven't really talked much during our stay here. And it's like, yeah, they kind of haven't. And like, this is like Judy Dench Maggie Smith, you know, BFs. The movie comments on itself quite a bit.

It does kind of. But like they're like, you know, real life friends and have been in eight billion. movies together and whatever. It's like maybe the movie would have benefited from a little bit of another scene or two of these characters playing off of each other. I would like more group scenes to be honest. The movie is better when these characters are playing off of each other more. There's a scene where all of the like Tom Wilkinson, Judy Dench scenes, I think, are really good together. I think he has a brief scene with Maggie Smith that I really like. And yes, I think more interaction of the group would have been good. You get, like, Celia

Emory and Ronald Pickup are sort of, like, siloed off a little bit into the, like, horny category of this movie. And that would have been nice to sort of, like, even, but they have, they have some scenes, you know, with the other two. Celia in particular, has

a nice little, like, biting remark to Penelope Wilton's character at some point. Ronald Pickup has a nice little scene with Tom Wilkinson, like, right before he dies. Like, that's basically, like, Tom Wilkinson's last conversation in this movie is with a horny old man Norman. I liked, I just liked the moments where I felt like they were actually communicating or supporting for each other, even as simple as, like, the scene where Judy Dench and Bill Nye go with Tom Wilkinson to meet his former lover, you know,

to just, like, show that mutual support. And they don't even say anything. They don't. No, that's a really nice scene, though. It just kind of adds to the vibe, you know, that I feel like the movie was lacking a little bit of. Yeah, I can see that. This is one of those things where it's like, if this was like a BBC TV show that, like, I would come across on, like, you know, PBS or something like that, like, you know, it's like, oh, it's run for eight seasons and it's had 25 episodes. Do you know what I mean?

You say this like this isn't going to happen in 10 years. There will be a Best Exotic Marrigold Hotel limited series. And I will very much enjoy it. I will very much enjoy it. every bit of it. Yes. Yeah, yeah, yeah. This movie comes at during a fascinating Oscar year that I don't know if we talk about as often. I can't remember the last time we've had a 2012 movie where we've really talked about the 2012 Oscar race, and we do. We tend to sort of talk about the Argo of it all and the sort of affluent of it all. But I think I'd like to be able to talk about the

supporting categories at the 2012 Oscars because that's where any of these actors, I can't imagine they would have pushed anybody from this movie as a lead. I think anybody who... Judy Dentch. Well, yes, I think that's true. And everybody else is sort of supporting. And but like the supporting categories at the 2012 Academy Awards end up being sort of Anne Hathaway is sort of like March, March, Marching to that Oscar. and then the supporting actor category is this huge hodgepodge of who's going to win because they've all won before. And it ends up being, I think, kind of the least interesting option in that it's Christoph Valtz getting a second Oscar very soon after his first for a performance that doesn't really reveal too much more about him as an actor.

I think it's a good performance. I don't think it's a bad performance. One of the things I like more about that movie I don't like. Right. But I think it's, I think ultimately what it came down to is that he was in the movie that was gaining momentum as voting was happening. That's probably true. Everything else was kind of stagnant, even though Tommy Lee Jones won the sag for it. But at that point, I think voting had already happened.

And who won the BAFTA that year? because I feel like it was definitely... Philip Seymour Hoffman won critics' choice, right? And I feel like De Niro won something. I don't think he did. You don't think so? Unless maybe it's BAFTA. Maybe Christoph Waltz won BAFTA?

Let me look. Yeah. Shout up, by the way, to Barry Keogh who just won the BAFTA for supporting actor today. Surprisingly, hours ago. Yeah. Good for him. So 2012...

No, that was... Christopher Waltz did win, BAFTA. Maybe I'm just making it up. is not even nominated for the BAFTA that year. No. They went for... Javier Bredem is nominated. Havier Bordem for Skyfall.

Yeah. But, yeah, I guess we should maybe start with talking about Judy Dengch, though, because she is, if anyone, the lead in this movie. And she did get... The headliner. The headliner. Has sort of, like, I don't know, kind of a lovely story in this. I like the part where she's tutoring the people on...

call center best practices and I like watching a movie where somebody sort of like finds their niche, finds their thing that they are good at and she's somebody, the thing

in the story is, well, she's had so much experience with dealing with un-smpathetic call center people who call her and have no essentially bedside manner. And then she's trying to teach these people just like just talk to talk to old people like their people

old people are people too essentially is her message to this she basically gives a whole spiel and TED talk of just to have a conversation with them because chances are they're lonely which you know which is like here's how to better old people Dame Judy

are you know sitting around waiting for someone to call she is also maybe being disloyal to the tribe a little bit and teaching people how to better get old people to spend their money on telemarketing? Yeah, so maybe that. But whatever, she found a job that she likes,

and isn't that what we'll want? She's thriving. Good for this. We've got to talk about the Golden Globe nomination, though, because... She is Golden Globe nominated for Best Actress in a Comedy. The second time we've had occasion to talk about this particular category, because ages ago we covered salmon fishing in the Yemen on this podcast, Emily Blunt, one of the nominees.

But, of course, this is the year, and we're going to play the clip, as we always do, of Kristen Wigg and Will Farrell, reading the nominees for Best Actress in a Musical or Comedy, and essentially just, like, ruining the rest of the show, because, like, nothing in the rest of the show was going to ever, like, live up to how lovely and hilarious that whole moment was, I don't know. That you get out of here. You get out here, once they get to the part where, like, Merrill Streep is the sheriff atop the horse riding into Hope Springs. Like, that's fantastic. Also, I still have never seen quartet, but I will always call it the quartet now.

Like, there is no... Well, we could do an episode on the courtet. We should. And Maggie Smith, a co-star to Judy Dench is... I know. At first, I was wondering why Maggie Smith maybe didn't get a supporting nomination from the Globes for this movie, and it turns out they were already showing her love for the courtet.

Yes. And then, of course. Inescapable, the quartet. Like, you couldn't turn a corner without seeing two people on a street corner talking about quartet, yeah. Well, then you also follow this up with Jennifer Lawrence winning for Silver Linings Playbook. And people not understanding half of the bits that she did because she goes up there and says, look, it even says, I beat Merrill. Oh, what does it say?

I beat Merrill. I beat Merrill. And people immediately respond like she's just said some shitty comment and not like she was quoting the first Wise Club. Oh, you know what it says? It says, I beat Merrill.

It does not. This was before First Wise Club was on streaming and everybody re- Right. But that's how you knew Jennifer Lawrence was a real one, though. Jennifer Lawrence was a real one for knowing like, not even like a

like oft-quoted line from the First Wives Club. That was a little bit of like a, you know, if you know, you know, kind of a line. And Merrill was not there that year at the Golden Globes because she had the flu. So she wasn't there to, like, give her reaction, which would have been, I don't know if Merrill would have recognized the line, even though it's her dear friends, Goldie and Diane and Bet in that film. So I would have liked to have seen Merrill's. At the very least, even if Merrill thought she was just saying that, I think Merrill would have, you know, been a little bit delighted by it. Meryl's a good sport about these kinds of things.

So, yeah, no, I love that moment. That was one of, like, the whole Jennifer Lawrence roller coaster of her Silver Lining's playbook year, where it just went from, like, love to resentment, to rebounding to, like, maybe she's like, you know, no, she's still, she's cool. No, no, she's, she's fake, you know, all this sort of. She trips going up the stairs to her Oscar and people think that it's planned. Right, right. The thing about Jennifer Lawrence is whatever you want to say about liking her or not.

Mostly, I think some of the act is just she smokes that much weed. Yeah. And she's just stoned. Also, she's very clearly somebody who got very famous, very quick, and to me at least, was a little bit unsure of how to present herself. I think she really wanted to present herself in a way that made her seem like, all of this wasn't changing her. You know what I mean? I think

she seemed like somebody who really wanted to present a version of herself that was, and I don't even think it's a false version of herself. Right. I also feel like when you get that meteorically famous that quickly, because this is

like she wins the Oscar and starts the Hunger Games in the same year. And the X-Men also, I believe that was before Hunger Games. But they're happening. It's happening. What year was the first Hunger Games?

2012. Okay, so yeah, so X-Men was the year before that. Yeah, it's in March of 2012. So she gets X-Men off of Winter's Bone. Yes, I do believe. But either way, she's getting so super famous. But the thing about Jennifer Lawrence is, all of this, whatever you want to think about it, I do think she has always proved to be a complete class act.

Like, in her Oscar speech, she's like trying to think of what to say, and one of them is wishing Emmanuel Riva a happy birthday. Right, right. Yeah, I've always liked Jennifer Lawrence. What do we feel about that performance? What do we feel about her winning the Oscar for Silver Linings Playbook? Do we feel like she has the right Oscar for the right performance? Do I think, I think it's two separate things. I don't think she has the right Oscar for the right performance, but I am happy that her Oscar is for a performance.

that has the qualities that it has. Yeah. I agree with that. Like, I would rather her have an Oscar for something like this than, oh, say, Serena, one of our first offices. Or doing something like that. Or for American Hustle, which she probably does win if she doesn't win the Oscar for Silver Lining's Playbook the year before. And I think of the two, I would much rather her have the Oscar for Silver Lines Playbook.

That's a movie. We rewatched that one for our best actress, 20th century best actress, 21st century by Best Actress Winners draft for screen drafts and I ended up liking that movie I liked it the first time too but I sort of thought that in the

ensuing years that I would like it less and that was not the case I think it's a pretty good movie I like that movie I do think it holds up but nobody's ever going to revisit it I think people would be a lot more fair and would talk about that movie more if it never had even a toe in the Oscar race

that's probably true yeah that movie had an interesting where it was out of Toronto right where all of a sudden we're out of Toronto and everybody's like silver choice and everybody was like this movie is going to be a thing and and it was not a movie I don't think that a lot of people had on their radar because maybe I was just not it was a slow burn release wise if I'm remembering correctly they really measured out that release in like slowly building it wider and like trying to make a crowd pleaser out of it. Well, and the other thing was... Did it make like $100 million, or am I crazy? I mean, I think it probably did. American Hustle did. Yes.

Hold on. I've got it right here, so I can find it. And also, like, the fighter made a good amount of money. So, like, David O. Russell was on a really good streak. Yeah, box office wide. Worldwide, it was, like, $235 million. And, of course, box office mojo isn't working for me right now, so that's great. But, yeah, it's worldwide. box office was 236 so yeah it definitely made a lot of money and but it was also the fact that like

previous to the fighter david o russell had been in this like wilderness where he hadn't made a moving forever and nailed was you know on a shelf and allan smithied and all this sort of stuff and then all of a sudden it was like oh right after a fighter he's going to come up with you know the fact that he has like two more movies within three years of the fighter is you know was kind of crazy. But so Silver Lang's playbook, to me at least, kind of came out of nowhere, out of Toronto. And then all of a sudden, Jennifer Lawrence is the frontrunner and best actress, was really only challenged, I thought, initially by Jessica Chastain, which then stopped after Bigelow doesn't get, the controversy for that movie. Yeah, the controversy in Bigelow doesn't

get Best Director nomination. And then people were like, but Emmanuel Riva, she's so old. Like, that was, Emmanuel Riva gets a phenomenal. No, no, she. gives a phenomenal performance, but that was, I think, a little condescending nature of the campaign. There was a condescending nature to the physical nature of that performance, which she physically has to, like, go through. And they were like, but she's doing it while also old. This is the thing. I think an old person can do this. It's a great performance. Yes, you're right. It was condescending. But people were like, don't you want to vote for Emanuel Reva because she's old? And it's just like, no, maybe vote for Emmanuel Reva because you really like her performance. Like,

that's allowed. It's a wild best actress year because that was the year where Beast of the Southern Wild kept not showing up in precursors. Like, it was early on, people were like, oh, this is going to be one of those little films that could, and it's going to be a Best Picture nominee, and then it's kept like not showing up, and Kavanaugh-Wallis kept not showing up in Best Actress lineups. And people were like, well, I guess, like, you know, they're resistant to give it to a little kid and yad, yad, yad, it's not going to happen. And even Emmanuel Riva, I feel like was

um, or no, less, it was less Emmanuel Riva and more like a more in best picture and best director where people were like, yeah, it's maybe a little heavy for, you know, for it to show up in there. And then, uh, Oscar day, Oscar nomination day, Amor and Beast of the Southern Wild end up getting picture, director, actress nominations at a time when like, Argo falters a little bit and zero dark 30 falters and it's a year that really benefited from a usually only one movie with this type of narrative can push through but it's a this is a year where multiple movies that the narrative are like kind of a groundswell of support because an outsider movie yeah it's an outsider it's an unlikely case for Oscar etc. I still think that it is wild that that The entire season basically runs with Emmanuel Riva getting called out for Amour and not John Louis Trantignon. Who's so good. Opposite her, who is doing equally amazing work.

Yeah. No, he's so incredibly good in that. Are you all right? I just want a glass of water. That was a gin and tonic. I knew that now. Chris, put down that Viagra before you go out for your night on the town with the old horny goats of... You joke, but gay people do that.

People are so crazy. Listen, I can't talk about it right now. We can't talk about it. We're talking about the Vulture movie Fantasy League, which is going into its home stretch. We are now seven days away from the Academy Awards. We will have an update for this, and we will have one more update. Yeah, we will have one more update for next weekends as we actually. All of the people that have drafted everything everywhere all at once, your points are

finally coming in droves. This is what I want to talk about because now it, the BAFTA's kind of, between SAG and this. This is the thing. The BAFTA's kind of freaked people out because everything everywhere only won two awards at BAFTA and they got so overwhelmed by All Quiet on the Western Front. And already by that point, all quiet as the like the value behemoth of the Fantasy League, that was really, you had to have all quiet on the Western Front

on your roster if you wanted a prayer to win this league. But now, after SAG, which was a near sweep for everything everywhere all at once. It only lost in the categories. It was not nominated for it. Exactly. And it has just completed a very similar near sweep at the Independent Spirit Awards,

a thing I remember predicting the day of the nominations for the Indy Spirit Awards. I remember texting you and Katie and being like so everything everywhere all at once is winning everything it's nominated for and like that basically happened much like Cota like they they put

their award strategy around SAG in a lot of ways they've done so many Q&As and like everyone in that cast has got out in front of SAG especially everything everywhere was nominated for eight independent spirit awards at

1 7 the only loss it experienced was when Jamie Lee Curtis lost to Kiwi Kuan in supporting performance. So it won every category it had a nomination. And if there was a chance to award everything everywhere all at once, the Indy Spirit Awards sure did do it. So this, and like points-wise, indie spirits weren't like, certainly didn't have the heft that like the SAG points did.

But even still, my sort of long game strategy for picking my roster was I want to pick the movie that I think is going to be ultimately the big Oscar champ and then those dominoes will then fall into place however they may and that's worked out for me

I have made my way to the top of the vulture staff rankings and that's all I kind of care about so that's fine but I think also now we are seeing as we get into the nitty gritty of this week and then the Oscars next week I think looking at the

overall standings, we are ultimately going to get a champion. We have not had a first place team to date be a team that had everything everywhere all at once on its roster. And I think ultimately we will have a winner of the Fantasy League who does have everything everywhere all at once on the roster. I think that is ultimately where we are headed. There is a team who is named... I think we could be headed towards the biggest Oscar winner since Slumdog Millionaire. Which was what? Eight Eight wins? Which is wild to think of now. But like that movie, steam rolled throughout its whole season in a way.

That was one where I think it only lost in the song category to itself. Was that it? Yes. Which is... No. What else did it lose? Because I think that Slumdog Millionaire was a sound nominee. Hold, please, while I dip into that.

Slumdog Millionaire was nominated for 10 and it won eight. So yes, it lost. in sound editing to the Dark Night. Yes. And then it lost to itself, Osaya, the song nominee, lost to Jai Ho, of course, the song winner. So, yeah, you're, you are expecting that everything everywhere all at once, which has been nominated for 11, is that right?

10? 11, 11 nominations at the Oscars this year. How, what's your number? What's your number that you think everywhere all at once is going to clock it at? I think eight is possible. You do. I think it's winning all of the top categories that's nominated except supporting actress. So you think picture director...

This is coming out tomorrow, right? This is coming out tomorrow with the Exotic Miragold episode, yes. Yeah. We might have done... Yeah, we're not going to go through our, like, predictions or whatever, but, like, if you're tallying, picture director, actress, supporting actor, screenplay... That's five. And then... Not score, I don't think.

Not song, I don't think. Editing, I think. Editing is possible. Even if just that six happens, that's the largest winning best picture winner since then. I think it's a possible for costume. I think it's a possible for... Yeah, maybe that's it. I would imagine, my guess, if I was to pick a number,

I would probably say five. I think at some point it's going to shake out at five wins for everything everywhere, which will probably be the most wins for a best picture winner in a while, right? Because the tendency has been for the best picture winners to not win as many as others, right? Dune is the most awarded movie last year. It's not usually the largest winner of the night. I think even last year, when Dune won six, I think that was either the most wins since Slumdog Millionaire or tied something for the most wins in slumbole.

Nomad land won three. Parasite. Lala land won a bunch, but it didn't win best picture, but yes. Right, but it won six. Yes. Bohemian Rhapsody was the leader that year with four. Shape of Water, one four. Lala Land one six, as you mentioned.

Sorry, I'm just like paging through. Fury Road, one six. Four Oscars for both Humean Rhapsody. I know. It just never ceases to it. I know. Fury Road 1-6 Spotlight, the Pest Picture winner won two in

2015. Birdman tied Grand Budapest with four apiece for most awards that year. Gravity was the biggest winner of its year.

Twelve years of slave, won three. So yeah, it's been a while since a Best Picture winner won even as many as five. So that would be... As many as everything, is going to win. Yes, exactly.

So I think it's going to be, I think you're right. I think it's going to be a big night for everything everywhere all at once. So if that is, if you are in the top, say, 10 or so of the current standings in the Vulture Fantasy League and you have everything everywhere all at once on your roster, I think the future looks bright and start finding a place in your living room for that Roku television because you may be getting it. Um, but I want to talk about, we'll talk about the independent spirit awards and maybe like, uh, anything that happened outside of everything everywhere. And it wasn't too much. But, uh, best first feature is won by AfterSun. It was very nice to watch the team from AfterSun gathered on a stage. That was my number one movie of the year. I just recorded my Blanky's episode last week. So that came out actually today as we are recording this. So everybody will, uh, if you had, followed me on Twitter when I posted my

top movies of the year after Sun is my number one. I loved it so much. It was wonderful watching that team sort of up there on the stage together. They're all I like any of these awards where like the whole gang sort of gets up on stage.

It's been fun to watch the everything everywhere at once folks all up on stage together. I'm very much the part of me that watches the end credits of Saturday Night Live to watch people sort of of embracing and interacting with the host and the musical guest and whatnot really loves that part of award season. So what were the other winners?

Emily the Criminal won best first screenplay in a way I was sort of expecting that to be. I kind of was bracing for that to be Bodies, Bodies, Bodies, because that movie got a best director nomination at the Spirits, but I was happier that it was Emily the Criminal. I was, of course, rooting for Joel Kimbooster for Fire Island because I wanted to see Joel have a moment that would have been very nice. Fire Island was also, I thought, the best nominee in that category.

I liked Fire Island and I liked Emily the Criminal. I was happy with... Emily the Criminal became a Netflix hit at exactly the right time for Indy Spirit voting, considering you can just pay $100 and vote for the Indy Spirit Awards, and that's, you know, how our women... Winners are determined. Okay.

Have you seen this movie Joyland that won Best International film? Yes. Good movie. Okay. All right. Because I was, I was surprising, surprising to me that it won, I was expecting either Santomere or Corsage. And of course, I know people also really loved Return to Soul.

Yes. And I had, sorry, go ahead. Big fan of especially Return to Soul in Saint-Omer. Joyland is great, though. Yeah. It was the Oscar submission for Pakistan and, uh, It's had a really robust festival run. It started in Cannes, where it won the Queer Palm.

Nice. And I believe it is coming out to theaters, I think, by oscilloscope, if I remember correctly. Nice. Currently, so look for that. Tarr won its one award in cinematography. Everything Everywhere was not nominated there, so that was why TAR was able to win. I would love to see that win repeat at the Oscars. Who do you think is going to win cinematography at the Oscars?

Elvis or Western Front. I think you're right. I'm hoping it would be Elvis. Me too. Mandy Walker certainly deserves it from her career's work. In addition to the fact that I think Elvis is filmed in a very sort of exciting and spectacular way. I'm saying if everything everywhere tops out at the five you're predicting, it's going to be a good night for Elvis. Yeah, I think that's probably true. Well, Everything Everywhere also not nominated at the Oscars in cinematography. So Elvis is going to win in a couple of categories that Everything Everywhere is not nominated because it's also production design. I think Elvis could be. win and um well uh nepo baby uh catherine martin uh doesn't miss mostly nepo baby because she is famously the daughter of a senator um wait is that true oh oh jesus christ katherine martin god damn

i missed a katherine martin joke i'm so mad this is how you know that i'm out of uh listeners take this thing back to baltimore collector honestly honestly this thing being my battered psyche at the end of a long oscar season um i am ready for the longest guys Damn nap. I swear to God. Okay. Independent Spirit Awards, though, there was one more that I wanted to mention. Oh, All of the Beauty and the Bloodshed wins Best Documentary Feature. I don't think that is being repeated at the Oscars. I do feel like Navalny is the odds-on-favor-to-win.

Happily, I really loved Navalny, so I'm fine with that. I think it's going to be Navalny as well. Yeah. I think it's very, very close. I feel like if it would be Fire of Love, we would have heard more heat around it, though it's just like, who dislikes that movie? He said heat. Fire of Love did win what?

It won the DGA. It won something. I thought it won the DGA first documentary feature. Sure. It won something. Good for Fire of Love. I'm happy with that. I like that movie quite a bit.

Good year for documentary features. I think I've mentioned that before on a previous update. But I think all five documentary feature nominees at the Oscars are really, really strong. And that's not always the case. So I was very happy. reads I think is also very good and at the like the worst of the five of them is I think a house made of splinters and like I have no ill will towards that movie exactly that movie is is very sensitively filmed it's probably better than any year I can think of for my least favorite of

the documentary that's exactly right certainly heads and shoulders above the worst nominee of that category of years so we don't really need to linger on this update too much like I said everything everywhere all it wants is just racking up points I think think ultimately anybody who played that long game strategy where it looked like, that's why not to pat myself on the back, because

honestly, like, whatever. It's not like I had perfect foresighted here. But like, that's why I made it so expensive to buy everything everywhere at once for your roster, is because I was like, this was a possibility. It was a possibility that, like, once a movie sort of gains that best picture

momentum, it starts to win everywhere. And so, So I needed people to have to, like, pay that premium to get there. And I think the alternate was to take, in conjunction, tar and banshees and, you know, Pinocchio and whatever, that you wouldn't be able to afford if you drafted everything everywhere. So I do feel like there was some, if we do this again next year, which I dearly hope that we do, and I think that we will, it'll be interesting to draw upon that strategy, right? Do you take the one big dog in the yard and try to surround that one with like really smart value picks? Or do you, you know, take a handful of the maybe like second tier ones that will get you enough points? And ultimately, it's going to end up being pretty close between those two strategies.

I imagine that the top five films will have a little mix of both of those strategies, maybe the top 10 by the time this is all said and done. So good job by me. If I do say so myself. This was very fun. Did you have a good time with this season of the fantasy? It gave us certainly an avenue to talk about the current race in like an isolated format in every episode. I hope listeners enjoyed that in addition to getting competitive in the game. Yes.

You know we love a game here. It's like the most official capacity we've had like a game game that listeners could also participate in. I know. I, like I said, I do anticipate, I'm saying this in nothing like official capacity, but I do anticipate that we are maybe going to do this again next year and we'll see what kind of tweaks and, you know, differences we can bring into the gameplay, but this was a really fun first year to do this. And I hope that all our listeners who have also been playing, I notice every time that like the new newsletter goes out and the new score. update goes out that I do see you know people sort of chirping and chattering about it which is very

gratifying to me people talking about where they their team stands and how they did and I'm hoping that it was just very fun for people so yeah we might have a little bit of a little bit of a check in next time by the time you hear from us though the Oscars will be done

and the champion of the Fantasy League will have been crowned so this is our last chance before the Oscars coming out tomorrow as of course. Right, but the next episode, right, but by the time the next episode happens, the Oscars will be done.

So this is our sort of last chance to, yeah, thanks for taking this ride with us. It was really fun. And we hope you had a good fun time with it, and we hope you'll be back with us next to if we do it. And we hope by the next time we have one of these updates next week, a friend, former guest,

and hopeful Oscar winner, Pamela Ribbon, has that statue in her. Sorry I didn't make My Year of Dix draftable. That would have been a very fun. I mean, it would have been such a high buy-in. Oh, I know. You would have had to spend all your budget on My Year of Dix.

But really. It's worth it. Worth it, absolutely. Also, I imagine so many, if we had known enough about My Year of Dix ahead of the drafting stage of this, so many team names would have been takeoffs on My Year of Dix instead of as it was so many team names punning off of tar in some way or another. So

that'll be fun. Listeners, if you haven't watched the shorts yet, please go watch my year of dicks now on Hulu. Yes. The three best shorts are in order about dicks and nuns and

walrises. So I'm rooting for, those are the ones that I'm rooting for in the short film categories. I'm rooting for the dicks, the nuns, and the walruses, and we'll see how it goes. So, um, yeah, thank you for joining us. And this was, this is your Vulture Fantasy League update. Now go back and, uh, enjoy Judy Dench and Bill Nyei falling sweetly, uh, in love with each other. See you next week. Welcome to the best exotic Marigold Hotel. We can't stop talking about best actress, though, before we talked about the other

nominee for this year, which is one of our patron saints, Naomi Watts, in the impossible. In the impossible. A movie no one talked about otherwise. I know. It's true. Even though I really I think I liked that movie more than a lot of critics did. I think a lot of critics found it maybe unnecessarily brutal and

also maybe emotionally manipulative. And while I can see that interpretation, it, I guess, worked on me and maybe that's the difference with me. I remember, it's not a movie I would be excited to revisit. But I do go back and

I watched the scene with Tom Holland and his brothers reuniting quite a bit. To abuse yourself, basically. Yes, essentially. Why would you go back and watch that? It's so sweet. It's so because it's a happy ending for them. Teeny tiny baby Tom Holland in this movie is very good. That was a child performance I would get behind as well, getting some support.

Somebody nominated him, I thought. I felt like he was either, like, BAFTA shortlisted or something. I think that's right. Um, this is us being like, didn't this happen and looking it up? That's what this episode is. Whatever. I'm fine with that. Tom Holland was nominated by the Broadcast Film Critics Association for Best Younger Actor, which is not like super... Yeah, you would expect. You would expect something like that. Otherwise... Reunited with his younger siblings, Sugar and Spice. Stop it. Stop it. National Board of Review gave him Best Breakthrough actor.

Um, the Saturn Awards nominated him for best younger actor. And yeah, it was a lot of like that. Like, you know, best, best, best, best, uh, I thought he got an actual mention somewhere. I thought so, too. Not that those aren't actual mentions. Maybe he was a, maybe he was a runner up somewhere. Um, it's possible. Yeah.

It's not impossible. It's not impossible. Like, the impossible is. Um, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Judy Dench, though, I feel like was probably second place for that globe. A very distant second, but probably second.

Because she's kind of on somewhat of a hot streak. Best Exotic Marigold Hotel was a box office success globally. The very next year she goes and does Philomena. Well, and also 2012 is Skyfall. And, like, people forget that, like, Skyfall made a conscious decision to center her character a lot more than, and her character normally was centered. And Skyfall was on the cusp of a Best Picture nomination. It came, I think, very close.

It probably came somewhat close to two supporting nominations. Oh, to Dench and Bardem. Yes. Is what you're talking about. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yes. Both nominated at Bafta. So that was, yeah, she was having a good year, even though she ends up not getting an Oscar nomination.

that year and comes back the next year Raring to go with Filomena. And yeah, I think you're right. I think you're right that she's probably the second place. It's not Emily Blunt for salmon fishing. It's not Maggie Smith for Quartet. And I love Hope Springs as a movie,

but I don't think, of the Merrill Globe nominations, I don't see that one as being one that is one of her higher ranking ones, probably. Right. Yeah. People didn't love Hope Springs. It kind of broke the Merrill, July, April, box office success run. And then Ricky and the Flash came back. But, you know, it wasn't making the money that the other summer movies were that she did.

Yeah. I liked it. Steve Carell is maybe the weak spot in that movie, but, like, I like all the streep Tommy Lee Jones stuff in that movie. Is that before or after Ricky in the Flash? I think it's before. It's before. Ricky in the Flash is 15, I want to say. I'm pretty sure.

Good movie. Listeners go back and listen to our episode. on that. Oh, I might do that later. Just calm my nerves and get a cup of tea and listen to our Ricky in the Flash episode. Don't listen to our, you don't listen to our old episodes. That does not sound, listening to myself doesn't sound relaxing. I sometimes go back. It's instructive to me, A, to see how far we've come and B, to sort of like what was sort of in the ether that we were talking about like several years ago. It's really interesting to listen to like our episodes from 2020 that we're doing like in the thick of pandemic and whatever and listening

to us sort of, I think we become very, I think we latched on to a lot of movies that we maybe wouldn't have otherwise, where we're just like, I just need something that's like a fun escape for me right now. Like, there was a lot of that coming from me specifically during our episodes in 2020. Yeah, I don't mind going back and listen, especially when we have a guest, because I can just like, you know, sure, sure, sure, spending time with a guest again. That's always fun. All right. Let's pivot to Maggie Smith, because Maggie Smith, however, was nominated in April pretty wild, a supporting actress race at SAG. Pretty wild, mostly because Nicole Kidman is nominated for the Paperboy.

You said early in this episode that we haven't talked about 2012 a lot. Maybe we just did it a lot early? I think we did. We haven't done it in a while, is my feeling. But yes. The Paper Boy is like top of my list when people are like, could you wish you could do an episode again. Really?

I, I, the, because I feel like we could talk for six hours about that movie and not run out of shit to say, because that movie's insane. When we kick off our Patreon, it'll be a redo of the Paperboy episode with like multiple guests. We will just, we will issue weekly episodes where we're talking about the Paperboy. We'll cold call our old guests and they won't know that we're calling and we'll just be like, talk about the Paperboy for five minutes. And then we're going to give us five minutes on the Paperboy. Five good minutes on the Paperboy. What do you think? what's going on. They're all going to mention

if anyone's going to pee on him, it's going to be me, and then that'll be great. We'll get a super cut of everybody saying it in Nicole's accent. This is part of the reason why last year I got on to the Nicole Kidman train for being the Ricardo's of she's going to win.

I'm like, they nominate her for the paper boy. Not the Oscars. Not the Oscar, but like the Oscar is never going to nominate if anybody's going to pee on him. It's going to be me. They just weren't going to do that. They probably were not going to do that now. God, I wish they did.

It would have been so great if I did. And yet everybody forgets the scene in Tar where Kate Blanchett pees all over her conductor rival. Yeah. Just everybody. She just pees all over like 12 people in a single scene. Right. And she's probably going to win the Oscar for it. So good for her.

No. You shall see. I think that it is not over. Oh, I think that Best Actress Race is neck and neck right now. I think it's Blanchett and Michelle Yo, and they are, I would probably lean to Michelle Yo, but then I immediately think, like, well, that's what I want to happen. And so is that way, is that why I'm leaning that way? Get it all out of your system, because while we are not recording this close to the Oscars, this is our last episode before the Oscars, which, by the way, that's what that means. Next week, we are cracking open the seal on 2021.

We are not saying anything further about that. Do we want to, wait, if that's the case. case, Chris, do we want to really quickly throw out predictions in the top eight categories? And since this is our last episode that we'll air before the Oscars and see how we do. Sure, sure, sure. If listeners are also keeping in mind that we're saying this before voting has actually opened, but... Before the SAG Awards has happened. Yeah, SAG is the only thing that hasn't really happened. Well, WGA hasn't. PGA also hasn't.

WGA isn't really... PGA, if Topkins gonna win anything, it'll be PGA. But we don't know. When that happens, all the Top Gun people are going to be like, see, it's going to be Top Gun. And it's like, no, you're just looking for something new to say because you're tired of saying the same things. Guess who is not tired of the same conversations? The Academy. All right. So let's quickly bounce our way through this.

Adapted screenplay, who's going to win? I think it's still Sarah Polly. Yeah, I do too. There's going to be a lot of people now talking about Alquite on the Western Front because it just won the BAFTA. I think it's a odd screenplay win, but they're odd. The nominees this year are

odd for screenplay. I still think it is going to be women talking, although again, that's the one that I want to win, and I always caution myself when I make that as a prediction. I mean, like, I don't think it's, you know, a complete done deal. There's obviously room. We've talked a little bit about this

previously. I don't think United Artists is the greatest at campaigning, period. But Sarah Polly's also been everywhere, like posting pictures at every lunch and all the stuff she's, yeah, she's my guess. Original screenplay, who's going to win?

This, I think, is harder than anything else. I do think that maybe this is, I think because, I wish we were guessing director first, but I'll just say, I think Martin McDonough is winning. I do too, but I do feel like I could make a credible case for any of the movies nominated except for Trianglow Sadness.

I think even Todd Field for Tar feels like a possibility along the lines of like Spike Jones winning for her or Charlie Kaufman winning for Eternal Sunshine. But the competition is... Or even Cameron Crowe winning for Almost Famous because that was relatively close as well. The only reason I'm not saying everything everywhere all at once is because it has. better chances to win elsewhere, and I think maybe voters will take a break from it in this category. But, like, if they, if the voters have not entirely abandoned the Fableman's, then the Fableman's does have a pretty good chance in this category, too, especially if they're going to say, well, we're not going to give Spielberg director a picture.

They've got to give Tony Cushner and Oscar at some point. Well, right. And it's Spielberg finally getting a screenplay nomination, and it's him telling his own story. And if, like, if they're going to award the Fableman's anywhere, it's maybe there. But I agree with you that if I were going to put money on anything, it's going to be Banshees of an as Sharon. So, all right, best supporting actor. I don't think we need to talk about this too terribly long. It's Khi Kuan.

Yeah, he's like, I, happy for Barry Kiyo. People are going to be, because of the banshees wins at Bafta, people are going to be thinking that there's more room for conversation for some of this stuff. Kikuan is safely winning. The most predictable win of the night. I'm happy, though. We're getting a little bit of variety in the precursor awards. I'm glad that, like, it's not the same people winning every single award. And if, like, the BAFTAs, the BAFTAs, and the BAFTAs, the BAFTAs, the BAFTAs.

The BAFTAs are coming for us all. Swinging from the BAFTAs. I'm glad, like, and it makes sense to me that something like the Banshees of Inneshaeran would, like, do better at the BAFTAs that they would at the Oscars in terms of the acting category. So happy for Barry Keogan. Love that guy. Love that performance. But I think you're right. It's Kiwi Kwan who's going to win the Oscar,

and I think it's going to be a lovely moment. Best Supporting Actress, I think we both have the same prediction, but I think I think Carrie Condon has more of a outsider shot than you do. I think Angela Bassett is winning just fine. I think there's a lot of factors there. I think they, as often as they can, want to reward. people's careers with Oscars and, you know, absent them doing it for Michelle Yo in, like, a safe bet kind of way, it's somewhat become this way for Angela Bassett.

And I think that that is a factor that people are underestimating with her chances in that, like, people like to reward a career. Do we like career Oscars? No, not necessarily. But it's something the Academy does. Certainly if she's going to win this, and I do feel like if I'm making a prediction it would be Angela Bassett, that's going to be, it is going to be as a career performance, especially because I don't think, obviously, like, Wakanda Forever doesn't get a Best Picture nomination the way that the first Black Panther did. I think there's a lot more mixed reaction to that movie in general. I think if she's going to win this Oscar, it's not going to be specifically for that particular performance, and that's fine. As you say, like, career Oscars happen, and why not have it be for a career as great as hers? But I do feel like I am, and again, I love Carrie Condon as an actress, and I love that performance.

And I think in a vacuum, I think I prefer that performance to Angela's performance in Black Panther Wakanda forever, but I don't want her to win because I, like, it's just going to be a mess if that happens, and I would rather not have that mess. I don't think she's, I think Angela Bassett is going to win. All right. Well, there we go. Best actor. This is interesting.

I think it's a three-way race. I mean, thank God because I think Brendan Fraser is going to win SAG and then people are going to be like, ooh. I don't know. I think it's neck and neck between Fraser and Butler, or Farrell and Butler at this point.

Do you feel like if Colin Farrell was going to win the Oscar that he probably would have won BAFTA, though? No. No. I think it's that close. I think it's tough. And also, you're also forgetting that, like, love for banshees of Inasharan is probably more likely to metastasize around Farrell at the Oscars where the movie is less likely to win other things. Clearly, there were more broadly cast votes for banshees of Inasharan across the board at BAFTA than there will be at the Oscars.

If Austin Butler does win the sag, do you feel like it's a... the bag for him then. Yes. At that point, yes. Yeah. I do agree with you. I don't think he's winning SAG, though. I agree with you that Brendan Fraser has probably a very good chance of winning the SAG.

I'm nervous that he's going to win the Oscar. If I'm going to make a prediction for anybody to win Best Actor, I think. So you're saying Colin Farrell. I'm going to stick to Colin Farrell for the time being. I think I'm going to say Austin Butler, but in my head, I'm like, oh, God, I think it might be Brendan Fraser. there. I think there, I mean, while for there was a time, I was thinking, you know, Elvis is going to walk away with five or six Oscars. I think that the people who love Elvis are going to have their chance to vote for Elvis and the people who love banshees of and Sharon are going to have less chances to vote for banshees of it and Sharon. All right. Best actress, I'm giving you no more than 20 seconds to talk about why Andrea Reisbrough is not winning best actress.

Because campaigns are our campaigns and narratives are already set. before the nomination, just because something can happen out of the nomination stages. I also watched that movie last night, so, like, that's partly why it's, like, top of mind for me. You did not, you did not like it. I didn't. I mean, she's a great actress, but, like,

I don't think that that material. She, full, like, entirely is elevating that material, but even so, it still makes her look. It, it, I don't know. The scenes that are just like, anyway, moving on. Kate Blanchett, right. It's Blanchet or Michelle Yo, where are you going? Michelle Yo.

I am too, but I'm worried it's because that's what I want to win. I am. It's not what I want to win. Interesting. So you're rooting for Kate Blanchett. There's so little that I feel like I'm actively rooting for. I'm probably rooting for Tar to win. You're rooting for everybody to have a good time and for everybody to play.

fair no injuries on the field yeah yeah yeah yeah rooting for no one to get slapped yeah um yes no like the shit that i'm rooting for this year i'm like i'm rooting for pam i'm rooting for tar to get those craft category wins i'm rooting for uh i'm rooting for nand golden and laura quattress but like in terms of like the major races like i don't feel like i have a pony in the race this year and like the i love tar and i adore kate blanched in that movie and the only way i feel that way. It's like she's won a shit ton already for this, you know. Yeah, I agree. All right. So we're both going with Michelle Yo in that. I'm going for Michelle Yo because I do think everything everywhere is going to have a great night. I do too. Speaking of which, Best Director, I think it's going to be

the Daniels winning for everything everywhere at once. I was surprised that when they won the DGA, a lot of people were like, well, I guess my predictions are out the window. Like, I think a lot of people were really still thinking that it was going to be Steven Spielberg winning the Oscar for Best Wild to me. Me too. DGA is a more mainstream group than the academy is. Well, but even so, I was surprised that people were predicting Spielberg to win best director at the Oscars, even before the DJAs happened. Which, like, I was definitely leaving some room for him to win the Oscars, even though I was saying the Daniels, but, like, understanding why people were still staying Spielberg.

Yeah. I think it's, I think it's done. I think it is, too. I think they've got it. I think they're more wrapped up in Best Director. even than Best Picture. But let's move on to Best Picture, where my prediction is

everything everywhere all at once, but I'm now going to be really worried about goddamn All-Quiet on the Western Front for the next month. No. No. No. All, like, there are, all the, all the stuff on paper says, it's not going to happen.

It doesn't have a Best Director nominee. It's not a PGA nominee. It's, you know, it would be an odd choice. I don't know, okay. You're letting these BAFTA wins, way you. It's not... It's not necessarily the BAFTA win, but Kyle Buchanan tweeted something after the BAFTA win that I was like, oh, God, where he's like, Oscar voters who don't like

everything everywhere all at once are going to be looking for a more traditional alternative. And what's more traditional than a war movie based on, you know, acclaimed novel that was already, you know, a hundred years ago, a best picture winning movie. Do you know what I mean? where it's like... Those people are probably already... I mean, it's not going to be because they were looking for it. Those people were probably already

like, all quiet on the Western front. Well, right, but that's what I mean. It's maybe this was lurking there all along and maybe this is, you know, maybe this Baftawin then, at least will have them coalesce around thinking it's got a shot so they're going to vote for it.

There's also a lot of people in the academy that, like, and this is shitty and awful, though, like, I'll allow it for this movie that I hate. there's a lot of people that like if something's an international they think that that's where it stays you know like movies can get nominated but like a lot of like it was a big deal that parasite broke through yes um because that is a very real very shitty thing but yeah i i need to talk you off this ledge i'm not on a ledge i don't think it's going to happen but i am worried about it like i am i am low key low key worried about it yes i think banshees have in a Aaron has a better shot at Best Picture. I don't see that, and I don't know if I've ever really seen that. I think your argument is solid.

It's going to be number two or three on a lot of people's ballots. I think that's a solid argument. My argument is more it's number 10 on nobody's ballot. Sure. I just don't. It's one of those things where maybe I'm just going too much on vibes, but like I can't envision the moment where, like, they say at the podium, the banshees of an Sharon. You know what I mean? That's just because of the movie.

It's just the movie does not seem. even though I love it. To be clear, everyone loves that movie. I love that movie. Wouldn't be my vote for Best Picture, but like, I love that movie. Do you think, okay, we only said the top eight categories, but do you think, because I'm very curious to talk to somebody about the documentary race, the director win for Fire of Love, do you think that that maybe pushes it ahead in a way that I've seen other people saying that that movie seems to have... I'd be more swayed by the fact that the BAFTA win for Navalny pushes Navalny up to the number

ones. Right. That was going to be my follow-up question. I think there's a lot of room for almost all of those movies to win. And I think that helps all the beauty in the bloodshed because if, you know, things are spread out in that way... It's had the momentum. Yeah. Otherwise, yeah. But anyway, well, listeners, by the time you listen to this, you may be... We could sound stupid. Exactly. Or very smart. I'll take that. So anyway, all right, thank you for indulge us with that little. We always sound stupid. All right, back to Maggie Smith.

Maggie Smith, supporting actress nominee at SAG this year opposite Oscar nominees, Anne Hathaway, Helen Hunt, and Sally Field. And if anybody's going to pee on me, it's me. If anyone's going to pee on me, it's me. I mean, technically speaking, if anyone's going to pee on me, it's me. I mean, that's the most likely culprit. Yeah. Like, Occam's Razor really. really comes into play in that one. So, yeah, I think so. It's not an episode about P. It's interesting that Maggie Smith is a six-time Oscar nominee, and yet, has she been nominated since Gosford Park? It's no, right? And it's interesting because her career... She was winning Emmys at those times.

Or she was getting Emmy nominated. Her career has boomed in the, you know, two decades since Gosford Park. most of it's been on television. She won a bunch of Emmys for playing the Dowager Countess on Dauton Abbey. Did she win an Emmy for that? She won several Emmys. She won at least two.

Did she just never go? No, I don't think she ever went. No. Okay. There you go. But, yeah, I think she won two. This is the episode of us going back into IMDB, so I'm going to go look, but yes. This is also a Downton Abbey reunion movie because Penelope Wilton and Maggie Smith,

who sparred their way through the entirety of Downton Abbey are both in this movie. Can we also talk about how it's a room with a view reunion episode? Yeah. You just recently watched that movie for the first time. Fantastic movie. Judy Dench is a delight in that movie. Like everybody is. Like Maggie Smith is maybe my least favorite character just because she's a little bit of a, not a drip necessarily.

But it's just like, sometimes I'm in that movie and I'm just like, what are you doing, Maggie Smith? Like, why are you ratting out this girl? Why are you, you know, oh, I must protect her from, you know, hot men. And then Judy Dench has been on the sidelines being like, I'm just going to write a book about all of this. And I'm going to, like, you know, blow all your secrets out into the open. What a wonderful movie. Simon Callow's like, am I going to go skinny dipping? I think I'm going to go skinny dipping.

I'm going to put my penis on full display. Yes, I am. In fact, I am. I'm a priest. I can't show my jibbly bits. Okay, Maggie Smith won three Emmys for Downton Abbey in 2011, 2012, and then a late one in 2016. So she's also an Emmy winner in 2003 for the HBO film My House in Umbria, if you remember that one, which most people don't. She's an older lady who, you know, goes to Italy, and who doesn't love that.

I do remember that was during the like early Otts era of like I was very very. very, very fixated on all things HBO. That was like Sopranos and Sex in the City and Angels in America and that whole era. Anyway, so she is a four-time Emmy winner. She is a two-time Oscar winner. I've only seen one of her two Oscar-winning films. I've only seen The Prime of Miss Jean Brody. I've never seen California Suite.

California Suite, which is like, I believe Neil Simon, but it's all of these interconnected stories. and Maggie Smith leans into a full F-slur in this movie. She plays an actress, right? Who is the wife of a homosexual man. She is grappling with his homosexuality. I see. I believe her husband is Michael Cain. She calls him a full F-sler.

Like the two-syllable F-sler or the one-syllable? The two-syllable F-sler. Interesting. Fascinating. Okay. I will try to find a clip to put it on the Tumblr. Nice. Prime of Miss Jean Brody, she's very good in, though, I will say.

I saw that movie a few years ago. She beats out Jane Fonda in They Shoot Horses, Don't They? One of my, like, all time, I got to see that movie in movies. Even though everything I hear about that movie is like, this is why, this is maybe why I haven't seen it yet. Because every time I say that, somebody else goes, it's so bleak. Like, beats out Genevieve Bujold in Anne of the Thousand. Daze, Gene Simmons in a movie called The Happy Ending, and then Liza Minnelli in a movie called The Sterile Cuckoo, which...

Which I want to see these other, because I think Liza has two other nominations besides Cabaret, but I want to see at least the sterile cuckoo, because it just sounds like... It's an Alan Pakula film. It's fully a movie that doesn't exist. But it's an Alan Pakula film with an Alvin Sargent screenplay, so like... Exactly. That's not bad. That's not fucking bad. The California Sweet Win is...

It is strange. I think it's probably one of those cases of a very prestigious movie and, like, the support for it metastasize around her because I think there were other nominations for that movie. Who was she up against for that? Look that up. For what? For California Suite? Yeah. Because California Suite is another movie with Jane Fonda in it.

It's a very famous cast. Yeah. You know, this was at a time, you know, before people, you know, were looking askance at Neil Simon. Well, if it's 78, she definitely beat. out Merrill for the Deer Hunter. Yes. Yeah, Merrill for the Deer Hunter. Maureen Stapleton for Interior is a movie I've seen very recently.

Maureen Stapleton, a low-key four-time Oscar nominee. Like, you don't always realize it, but like, yeah. No filler, too. Her Oscar nominations are all, she's incredible in all of them. Penelope Milford for Coming Home, which won actor and actress that year for John Voight and Jane Fonda. And then Diane Cannon for Heaven Can Wait, which I believe is Diane Canon's only Oscar nomination. I love Diane Cannon. I've never seen Heaven Can

Wait, but I love Diane Cannon. I haven't seen Heaven Can wait either. I should maybe do that soon. Maybe we'll do a project and get on that together. Maybe. That's an interesting lineup though. That's a Maggie and Maureen and Merrill and Diane Cannon and that's a that's a group right there. So yeah. And then her four other nominations, we mentioned Gosford Park, of course. She loses to Jennifer Connolly in a beautiful mind that year, A Room of the View in 85, she loses to Angelica Houston for Pritzie's honor. She's nominated for Best Actress in 1972 for Travels with My Aunt, which she loses to Liza Minnelli for Cabaret.

And then she's nominated for a supporting actress in 1965 for Othello. That would mean she lost to Julie Andrews, I say, with a question at the end of my sentence. She lost, no, I think. That was the sound of music. So Julie Andrews was nominated but doesn't win. She lost to Julie Christie for darling. Wait, no, that's actress. I'm thinking supporting actress.

Supporting actress that year was Shelly Winters for a patch of blue. A movie that I have not seen, but I have heard. It sounds insane. Yeah, I've heard. That's the, the, the young woman is blind and calls in love with a black man because she's blind. Only in the 1960s. Yes. Actually, probably not.

They would maybe make that movie now. That's the new Peter Farrell movie. Green book, but the book is Braille. Shut the fuck away. Oh, my God. That's going to throw me off for the rest of this. Yes. There are some bad nominations.

Her California suite win, I don't love it. I mean, like the best thing about it that I can say is that she says the F-sler. Wow, yeah. The only thing I've ever seen from California Suite is I was at a trivia thing one time at videology, and it was the clip round. So they show clips from movies, and the clip they showed from California Suite. I forget what the theme was, but it might have been like actors in movies or something. But it's Robert Culp and Bill Cosby. No.

Yes. Yes. And I was like, that's interesting. I had no idea that this movie that won Maggie Smith, her second Oscar, also stars Bill Cosby. It's a bad movie. Yeah, okay. I also feel like this episode is kind of a tour through an entire precursor season

because we could quickly talk about BAFTA and Critics' choice because it's one BAFTA nomination is for Best British Film, loses to Skyfall, other nominees are Les Mizz. Okay. In terms of being a British movie. Tom Hooper is Tom Hooper, you know what I mean? Like, what are you going to do? I guess it counts if it's a British director.

Probably made by an American. But filmed it in London, maybe? I don't know. Maybe, but like it looks like Budapest or something. Sure, it sure, it sure does. Anna Karenina should have one. Oh, Joe writes Anna Karenina, a tremendous film. And so psychopaths.

Now that people have come around on Aaron Taylor Johnson a little bit, I think they have. I think they have. Look at the reaction to him on the Vanity Fair cover. I think it's all thirst and no guilt in a way that, like, a few years ago, there would have been a lot of guilt. I think Tenet turned it around for a lot of people, genuinely. He's barely in Tenet. He's good in it, though. I've always liked Aaron Taylor Johnson, though, and I've always liked his performance in Anna Corinna, which a lot of people, even the people who liked that movie, sort of tossed off as bad, and I think he's odious in a way that that character needs to be and also alluring in a way, like maddeningly alluring in a way that character

needs to be, and I think it works, and I love that movie, and that's how I'm going to say about that. Looping back to SAG really quickly. It was also a cast nominee. Yes. Opposite what? Argo, which won? Best Picture winner, kind of.

I actually think it's somewhat surprising that Argo won that, but it definitely showed that Chris, was still there for that movie. There are so many character actors in Argo, though, is the thing. Like, you remember the closing credits, the one I always make fun of. But it's not the character. or movies that win that prize. But sometimes it's the movies with the big casts, though. And, like, the fact that, like, Arkin's the only acting nominee, but, like, you could have

definitely seen people go for John Goodman in that movie. Affleck is an actor-director, which I think helps in that case. But, like, Scoot McNary and Clea Duval and Victor Garber and all those other people who are in Argo. That doesn't super surprise me that that won. The other nominees are Les Mis. Lincoln Silver Lining's Playbook. This is also an episode about the dripping to stain off on my voice when I say the words

Les Miz. That's the thing. Le Miz gets the cast nomination. More than half of those performances are bad. More than 90% of those performances are bad. I'm maybe a little bit more generous than you are. What were the ones that... I'll be generous to Anne Hathaway.

I don't think her less... I don't think that that's a performance that is ever going to. to represent what is amazing about her as a performer. Do they say who was singled out for the nomination? It does. I will read this off. Hugh Jackman, Russell Crow, Oye, Anne Hathaway, Amanda Seifred, Eddie Redmayne, Samantha Barks, Aaron Tevate, Helena Bonham Carter, Sasha Baron Cohen, Isabel Allen, Natalia, Angel Wallace, Daniel Huddlestone, and Combe Wilkinson.

All right, we're going to go through these very quickly. Um, Isabel Allen plays the young Cosette, maybe? I don't care. Maybe. Samantha Barks, Samantha Barks, I think, is good.

I like her on my own in that movie. I think she's good. She gets a pass from that. Bad. Okay. Sasha Baron Cohen, annoying, don't like. Helen Abonam Carter, love her. Don't think she's very good in that movie.

Fine. Okay. Wow. I zig, you zag. All right. Russell Crow, bad. Horrible. Yeah.

Anne Hathaway, great. Fine. Okay. Is Daniel Huddlestone fucking Gavroche? Oh, the Wii one. Yeah. No, because that actor is some, I feel like he maybe didn't show up in here. Well, look him up because I think that that actor who plays Gavroche is in something else.

Hold on. Gavroche in... Is it Oaks Fegley? It's not Oaks Fegley. No, Daniel Huddstone was the one who plays Gavroche, yes. Okay. Good. Bad. No. No. Bad. So bad. So bad. Oh, my God.

Hugh Jackman. Bad. Bad. Yeah. Yeah. I want to give him credit for, it's a lot of work. Yeah, probably bad. Eddie Redmayne. Horrible. Really? Okay. I thought it was okay. I thought Eddie Redmayne was okay. Amanda Seifred, I think, is bad. Amanda Seifred, I think, is the best performance. I know. You've said this before. I think, I think, I don't. I don't like, I don't love her in this.

Aaron Tivate, good. Fine. You motherfucker. I think Aaron Tivate's great in this movie. I think of the, like, of the better performances, I put him, Hathaway, I put Hathaway, and then him and Samantha Barks are my favorite. And then Colm Wilkinson, Wilkinson, almost unfair, you know what I mean? He's the, you know, the Broadway guy who they get to do the cameo as the priest, something.

Anyway. Yes. Yeah, it is mostly bad. I agree. I will say, best exotic miracle at hotel, not my winning choice, but probably my second place. Probably my runner up in this category. Lincoln is your winner, I imagine? Lincoln is my winner.

Lincoln is the ultimate. And that's a movie that only nominate, like, there's only, like, eight people in that sag ensemble nominated. James Spader deserves an award for its performance in that movie. James Spader is so good. But like so many people are not included in that nomination, which is a bummer because there's like a hundred actors. In fairness, Lincoln has 9,000 people in it.

Where's Elizabeth Marvel? Where's Julie White? Where's Escapathamercerson? Where's, oh, who's the Angels in America guy who's in that? Ben Shankman. No, but the one who's in Angels, the America, the stage production, who played prior Walter on Broadway. What's his name?

Andrew Garfield played him on Broadway. Oh, you mean Stephen. Spinella. I mean Stephen Spinella. Yes. There's multiple angels in America people. There really are. Because they know how to do Cushner speak. Yeah, yeah, exactly. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, Lincoln's probably my number one. I like the Argo cast

nomination. I like the Silver linings playbook cast nomination. I think this is a strong category, except for Les Miserables. Yeah, so there we go. Yeah, not a bad lineup. All right. At Critics' Choice, it was a best comedy

nominee. Or no, it was the best acting ensemble nominee. So again, a ensemble nomination for this. It's one Critics Choice nomination.

Silver Linings Playbook wins there. And it's fellow nominees are Argo, Les Mis, Lincoln, and the perennially screwed over

the entire season, Moonrise Kingdom. Yeah. Moonrise Kingdom is my vote there. I would vote for Monrise Kingdom over Lincoln. That's a good ensemble.

A lot of people are really good in that movie. Both of those kids are good. All the kids are good. Unilaterally, every kid performance in that movie is stellar. Including Lucas Hedges. Schwartzman's great in that movie. Bruce Willis is actually pretty good in that movie. Can we talk about this for a second?

It is so sad what's happening to Bruce Willis. And, like, there was this golden opportunity, like, for, there are so many people that, you know, they're not typically actor or Oscar performers. and they do one slightly Oscar-y thing, and they get nominated for it. They had a golden opportunity to do it for Bruce Willis, and they didn't. And what's happening to him right now is just so sad. It's very sad, yeah.

Talk a little bit about it, though, in case our listeners don't know, because... He is going through aphasia. It is a type of front lobe dementia. He's basically... losing his faculties. They've said he's never going to work again. It's just really sad.

It is. It's sad. We talked about in our last episode about how neither one of us are super high on the Grand Budapest Hotel. Speaking of grandly named hotels in movies. But I would have, to me, it would have made more sense if Moonrise Kingdom had gotten the kind of reception that... A million percent. Grand Budapest had.

The other thing is, we didn't mention. with regards to Grand Budapest, but we'll say it here, is I think that movie's Oscar attention makes much more sense to me if Ray Fines also gets the best actor nomination. The fact that he doesn't... The best thing about that movie. Makes it all the more inexplicable, but anyway. Yeah. Yeah. All right. Anything else we want to talk about precursor-wise for... Obviously, the precursors that matter the most. The ones that, like, if it was not a... You know, nomination leader, which I believe it was. Yeah.

There is something wrong in the universe. Say the name. It's the AARP Movies for Grownup Awards. Why? M4G's went. Cuckoo Bananazes crazy. Cuccoe Man is crazy for the Best Exotic Marigold Hotel. M4Gs went Cuckoo Bananas crazy for the Best Exxotic Miracle Hotel, as they probably should have.

Wins' Best Movie for Grownups over not the best lineup. Lincoln accepted. Hitchcock. He would think Lincoln would win. You would think Lincoln would win. Listen, who's more of a grown-up than Abraham Lincoln? He's been around forever. He's been around forever.

He's well past retirement age. Hitchcock is nominated. Le Mizz is nominated. The Sessions, which I like the performances. Go off AARP because I like that movie. I think I like the performances in that movie, maybe more than I like the movie. but not a bad nomination there.

And then Judy... They also kind of went wild for Hitchcock, too. Yeah. Well, I mean, you can understand that too, right? It's like hearkening back to a filmmaker that they all, you know... I don't know. Like his movies?

I don't know. It's not the movie being what it is. It's Helen Mirren. They can't deny Helen Mirren. Right. It's also Anthony Hopkins. Helen Mirren almost nominated for that movie. Yeah.

Let's talk about Judy's win, though. She beats Helen Mirren for Hitchcock. She does. also beats Merrill again for Hope Springs. She beats also the self-funded campaign by Ann Dowd for compliance. People don't talk about this anymore, which is interesting. I feel like we should, especially in light of the two Leslie thing, because it feels like Ann Dowd did everything by the book for compliance in the way that...

How close do you think she came to getting a supporting actress nomination? Not at all. You don't think so. Yeah, I tend to agree with you. I tend to agree with you. But I appreciate the effort. honestly. Yes.

Yeah. Yes. And then Emmanuel Riva for Amor, which I think is maybe a little bit. No, I'm not even going to finish that sentence. It's not surprising that she didn't be Judy Dench for the best. Yeah, I think that's the thing. It's Judy Dench. Yeah.

Also nominated for Best Grown Up Love Story. Yes, I love, as I said, I love the Judy Dench Bill Nye's story in this. Best Comedy. Or maybe it's Tom Wilkinson and his former love. I mean, also wonderful, yes. The worst thing about best grown-up love story is what is the winner? Hitchcock. Hitchcock, yeah.

Hitchcock. Yeah. Who wins Best Supporting actor that year? Supporting actor goes to, why is I, how, okay, this is actually rad. This is why we need to consider the AARP movie for grown-ups a major precursor. Who wins none other than my beloved John Goodman. for flight. Oh, people hated that performance, though, I remember.

People, like, thought that character... Yeah, but John Goodman needs an Oscar nomination. No, I agree with that, but, like, people really... People who thought that the flight... People hated that movie. People didn't hate the movie. I think the aspects of that people hated were, like, wrapped up in... Like, I think that movie is not a super well-written movie.

I think that movie gets by on the visuals of that plane crash scene, which, like, speaking of, like, scenes that I go back and watch out of a sense of masochism. I watched the plane crash scene in flight. And then also Denzel's performance in that. Incredible. I think Goodman is often wrapped up in the parts of the movie that are not super well written. I think his character's more than a little bit of a caricature.

But yes, I'm always happy that John Goodman. But like, have him win for Argo. Once again, like kind of inexplicable from a lot of angles. He has to play second fiddle to Alan Arkin, though. Alan Arkin, who's not nominated here, by the way. The other Oscar nominees are Tommy Lee Jones and Lincoln and Robert De Niro for Silver Lines playbook. Do you have this pulled up right now? I do. I'm looking at it. I can't guess. Okay. I was going to try to gag you. Yeah. The other nominee, Gary's listeners,

beloveds, is Mr. Thomas Cruz for Rock of Ages. We're going on a decade now of certain people out there trying to convince the rest of us that Tom Cruise is good in Rock of Ages, and I will not have it. I'm sorry. I understand. Who's out there watching Rock of Ages? Nobody. That's the thing. They watched it once back then, but it's a fun idea that Tom Cruise was great in Rock of Ages, actually. And it's just not true. I know it would be fun if it were true, but it's just not true. It is absolutely on the same level of his performance in Tropic Thunder.

And I feel like even the Tom Cruise people don't like to talk about the Tropic Thunder performance anymore. His Golden Globe-Nove nominated Tropic Thunder performance. As Scott Ruden in Tropic Thunder. In this category, I might have voted for Tom Wilkinson for Best Exotic Marigold Hotel, even though I love Tommy Lee Jones and Lincoln so much. Right, right. But Wilkinson's very good in exotic Marathon. The further you get in hindsight, I think the stranger it is, because we talked a little bit

about that supporting actor race, the more surprising it is that Tommy Lee Jones didn't win because Tommy Lee Jones is of the stature of someone who you would believe, would need a second acting Oscar. He had gone the long. He had two. Right. Well, right. De Niro already had two.

Of the people who only had won, Tommy Lee Jones had gone the longest without winning one. And Lincoln had what, 12 nominations? But what I think it says, what it says very clearly is how, like, even though Lincoln was widely nominated, nobody was hot for it. Right. Right. Well, I think the fact. that Lincoln doesn't win... Because it should have been easy for...

The fact that Lincoln gets beat out by Argo for screenplay is really what tells that tale. Like, if there was love for Lincoln, Lincoln absolutely walks to a screenplay win. And it doesn't. And it wins for... A script for Argo... I get if you like Argo, then you would naturally like the script for Argo. But, like, I think Argo gets by on its cast and, you know... I think it's a well-directed movie. I like Argo. I don't love Argo. Well assembled movie to

Like that movie runs like a machine Yeah, yeah But anyway But not because the screenplay got it there Right, yeah, I agree I agree Anything else we want to talk about Miscellaneous wise for Best Exotic

Hmm We didn't talk much about Penelope Wilton Who always seems to be playing The like Least fun role In fun movies. What else are you thinking of?

I'm thinking of Sean of the Dead where she's like... Oh, sure, she's the mom. Yeah. Yeah. With Bill Nye. Also, like, in a couple with Bill Nye, once again. So, yeah. Bill Nye, by the way. I'll finish talking about Penelope Bolton, but then I want to talk about Bill Nye for half a second. I don't know.

She, like, we both already said we like that this is a movie that allows that story to not, you know, have a happy ending. But she really does. just play so much of a monster in a way that feels like the movie isn't even

really giving her a chance to be the full person, that even like Maggie Smith, who is introduced as being a virulent racist, and gets to have humanity throughout, I don't think she really gets to in the movie. Here's my question to you, as I want

to switch gears to Bill and I for half a second, though. Were you aware of him as an actor before Love Actually? Um, stir crazy, I think, was that, was he in that rock and roll movie? Uh, I believe. Yeah, still crazy. Not stir crazy. Still crazy.

Right. I think I knew of him being in that without having seen the movie. Okay. I wasn't aware of him before Love Actually. And so that was... I think if he was a bigger name, like, I think if that Love Actually performance happens today, and we don't already think of him as, like, that character, basically. Yeah.

I think that's, like, an Oscar-winning performance. I think that's very possible. It's, I do, I think he came probably pretty close to a nomination in 03 for Love Actually. He got a BAFTA nomination, I think, for that movie. But so by this point in his career, by 2012, he's sort of moved on to, like, he's in all those underworld movies, right? He's in, uh, had he showed up in Harry Potter by then? I think Harry Potter, yes, he had, 2010. He's in the first Harry Potter in the Deathly Hallows.

But he sort of becomes that guy, right? He sort of is the guy you bring in for a small role in something. He's in The Constant Gardner. He's in The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy. He's in, he's of course, Judy Dench's, or not Judy Dench's, Kate Blanchett's husband in Notes on a Scandal, who she cheats on. He's in, oh, he plays Davy Jones in. Pirates of the Caribbean at World's End, my least favorite of the ones of those that I have seen. But I think it was nice to see him. I like when a movie gives him a little bit of

something to chew on. That's why I love about time so much. That's why I love pride so much. I'm so happy that Living Nomination happened. I feel like there is an alternate universe where he would have had a shot at winning an Oscar for that. And instead, he's kind of just an also ran. I also, we don't talk about this movie. because it really did get released right before the pandemic. I really liked his Mr. Woodhouse in Emma, in the Emma with a period movie that came out. Yeah, Emma Period.

On the eve of pandemic. I wonder if he was doing, because he had done TV stuff too. He won a Golden Globe, is that right, for Gideon's daughter. Yeah, did he end? Along with Emily Plunt. Right, yes. He was in that same year, the girl in the cafe. which was another British TV movie

with Kelly MacDonald. He is in... Oh, right, that page 8, I believe it was a mini-series, the David Hare British series with him and Rachel Weiss that was about, I imagine, a newspaper of some sort,

given that title. I haven't seen it. Or no, he's an MI5 officer. Okay, there we go. So spy, thrill. stuff. I may be thinking of what was the one with Ben Washaw that was about the newspaper around that time?

Anyway, anyway, anyway. I love that. Oh, that's going to drive me crazy because I watched that movie. What was it called? I don't know. I don't know either. Listen, we got a great year of Ben Washaw ahead. You think there's going to be wait, what else do we have ahead? I mean,

we're going to watch passages 200 times. Yeah, but it's not like he's going to be like in the awards conversation. He might be on my sporting actor ballad by the end of the year. You don't know. Ours, yes. I just mean the greater landscape. Anyway. All right. Do we want

to move on to the IMDB game? Yeah. Or do you have anything else to say about Best Exotic? Good movie. Nice people. Love that, Judy Dench. Good job on writing it, Oll Parker. Decent job, John Madden, even though I don't credit you with this film or its

sequel at all. I don't know. John Mann's the invisible director. It's part of the old Parker universe for us. Genuinely, yes. I feel like I'm the one who's bringing up so many bummers this episode, but I do kind of want to talk about what's happening with Judy Dench because she was just on Graham Norton talking about her. She's been dealing with diminished eyesight for some time. Yes, she has. There was a thought for a while there that she was going to have to retire about it, but that was like five years ago, I feel like, even at least. Yeah.

It was a long time ago before we're talking about that. The thing is, she doesn't sound super optimistic about working, but she doesn't also sound, you know. Yeah. It doesn't feel like she's dire about it, but she is rather upfront that, you know, it's affecting her ability to just, like, learn lines. Yeah. And, um...

Speaking of Judy on Graham Norton, though, the clip was making the rounds the other day of her previous appearance on Graham Norton, where she's talking about how she doesn't think she's ever been in a gay bar, and Graham's like, yes, you have, I've been in one with you. And she's like, that's right. She's like, I don't remember why I was there, though. And he's like, I do.

And he's like, we were both there to see Cher. She's like, yes, I was. It was lovely, as always, lovely Graham Norton clips. One of our finest. Truly. We love Dame Judy. All right. Yeah, so let's talk about the IMDB game then.

Every week we end our episodes with the IMDB game, where we challenge each other with an actor or actress and try and guess the top four titles that IMDB says they are most known for. If any of those titles are television, voice-only performances, or non-acting credits, we mention that up front. And after two wrong guesses, we get the remaining titles, release years as a clue. If that is not enough, it just becomes a free-for-all-of-hince. IMDB game.

All right, do you want to give or guess first? Why don't I give first? All right. Homs do you have for me? So this movie, The Best Exotic Marigold Hotel, got a sequel called the Second Best Exotic Marigote Hotel. One of the better, finally a movie

does what now you see me didn't do and does the logical choice for naming its sequel. It's a fantastic title, the second best

exotic Marigote Hotel. One of the newer cast members that they brought into that film was one Mr. David Strithaeran, who we somehow have never done an IMDB game for it. Richard Gear and David Stritheron

are the are the cast members. I guess I maybe just forgot the trailers for that or something, but... It's possible. You know how I feel about David St. There. I do. That's why I want to make you guess his known for. Okay. Good night and good luck. Good night and good luck. His Oscar nomination, yes. Yes. Dolores Claiborne. No, not. And... Thank God. The role that scarred me for years. Um, is the River Wild on there? No. And it... should be he's wonderful in that movie iconically married to merrill in that movie all right

that is your second strike so you get years your years are 1997 2012 and 2014 97 is L.A. Confidential. It sure is also playing a Creepo in that movie. The thin little Creepo mustache oh 2012 is Lincoln 22 is Lincoln speaking of Lincoln and what was the last year 2014 oh okay um I bet that this is something Oscar adjacent, but for 2014, what would that be? Interesting. There... 2014, what year is that?

It's the year before Spotlight, so that... It's between... What's between... Oh, that sounds... so stupid, but what is between that's Birdman. No, Birdman is 2015. Birdman is 2014.

Okay, so it's the Birdman year. Stratharine only has the one nomination. Yes. Um, uh, it says only film credit

from 2014. That's interesting. Interesting. Um, is it like the Monuments Men? Isn't that that year? It might be, but it's not. I don't believe he's in the Monuments Men. I think he's been in other movies Clooney has directed is the only thing. That could be. Huh. I mean, he doesn't really do franchise movies. He does, but not that I think would show up on his IMDB.

give me some hints it's a franchise movie oh it's a great great is it a Transformers movie it's not although I would have probably guessed that I think he is in one of he's in a Transformers yes I think that's right is it it's not the MCU

it's not the MCU although this movie all right two things about this movie one it's Marvel but not MCU no but it it's two leads were Marvel people who have been in who have been

connected in Marvel together. Like their characters are connected in Marvel. They're both Avengers. Adjacent. Yes. There's an asterisk on that one, but yeah, more or less. It's a very well-cast movie. I really like this movie, but for what it is,

for the genre that it is, it's like, oh, you got some really high-end actors in this thing, didn't you? A franchise. Okay, but it's... One of the two Marvel people that I'm talking about was somebody who I referenced earlier in this episode, who we kind of disagree on. We kind of disagreed on Hugh Jackman? No. I like this actor.

You don't like this actor. Oh. Who was that? I noted that the culture was coming around on this actor, and you were like, eh, maybe not. I'm so fried after this weekend that... Well, we also talk about 8 billion people in these episodes. I can't remember an hour ago. Okay, but it's a well-cast franchise movie.

Was this a summer franchise movie? Okay, so it is probably like an action-adventure franchise type of movie. Two people who are somehow connected in the MCU leading it. it wouldn't be Hunger Games because those weren't summer. Right. It's also like, technically there are actors who are the leads of this movie, but like this movie is about a non-human. Right.

A non-human. But not a transformer. Right. What were non-human franchise? A titular, non-human phenomenon. Chappie. No, not chappy. organic rather than mechanical oh organic plant character no is it the ugi loves organic in that like it's alive

right as opposed to a living animal yeahish yeah beast yeah monster you might say a monster a monster Um Monsters University No No but like a very famous movie monster Oh Okay Like part of the

Like universal Slate of monsters No But um Like an iconic Movie monster huge, like, massive incise originated, not in the United States.

Godzilla. Oh, he's in the Gareth Edwards Godzilla. There it is. Yeah. Good movie. Good movie. Really like it. The MCU thing is that it's Elizabeth Olson and Aaron Taylor Johnson who played brother and sister in Avengers Age of Ultron. I don't know if Aaron Taylor Johnson ever quite made it to Avenger status is why I was sort of like, maybe. He's the villain in God. No, he's the guy. He's the like, he's the, I mean, David Stratharin is always the guy. Oh, David Stratharine is the, he's the admiral. He's the military guy. So like, in as much as like, the military is the villain. Yeah, yeah, yeah, probably. Yeah. God, that Godzilla movie rules and the sequels are just such dog shit.

I didn't see the sequels just because I wanted to preserve the, the first one. Yeah, I like that 2014 Godzilla quite a bit. All right, hit me. For you, sir, prescribing this movie only to Oll Parker when there is a whole John Madden's cinematic universe, and I have gone through the John Madden archives of his performers, and I have pulled for you one of his performers from one of the movies that we have done, Mr. Mark Strong. Oh, from Miss Sloan? Yeah. Is he in Miss Sloan? Yeah, okay. Oh, see, this is the thing. You know that I have professed to have had previously Mark Strong facial blankets.

And you know that I have in recent episodes professed that I am going to do something bitchy and difficult for you. Oh, is this it? Is this my chickens coming home to roost? I get fucking Mark Strong. You fucking made it. Mark Strong, you know, we've unpacked. There's still so much of tar left to be unpacked. You think that we haven't, that we have unpacked everything there is.

is to talk about tar but we haven't talked enough about mark strong yeah we haven't had a full conversation as a culture about mark strong's wig in tar yeah yep yep yep you're right you're right we haven't we should i mean we're times running out we're going to have to have that conversation soon um anyway mark strong i'm going to guess kingsman the secret service kingsman the secret service correct is it the other kingsman the gold circle or whatever incorrect incorrect not Kingsman the Gold Circle. Okay. I don't even know if he's in that one.

I think he is. And the other one is like a prequel, so probably not. Okay. Mark Strong. God damn, I'm so mad at you for this. Genuinely. Mr. Marcus Strong. Kickass?

Incorrect, not kickass. Speaking of a Taylor Johnson. Your years are 2012, the year we're talking about. and two movies from 2019 Jesus Christ 2019 the year that's lost in my memory hole, okay 2012

Mark Strong Skyfall, is he in Skyfall? He could be in Skyfall, but that is not correct. Doesn't it seem like a movie that he would be in? That feels like a movie that's... This is the problem with Mark Strong is I end up going on like that sounds like a movie that Mark Strong

would have been in. Any of the Born movies feel like... Two of these three are definitely those kinds of of movies. Okay. All right. So like... The third one I have not seen. So like political thrillers that have like a blue-gray color palette, like that kind of a thing?

Is he in a born movie? Is he in... He could be in a born movie, but none of those are correct. Okay. Political thriller... 2012 and 2019. Right. None of those years are state of point. play, although I don't think he's in state of play, but I'm trying to go for, like, political thriller.

I imagine he plays, like, bureaucrat slash senator slash something. I'm going to need some hints. General. Yeah. I'm going to need some hints. Okay. Two of these three, the two that I've seen, are Best Picture Nominees. Whoa.

Okay. Bombshell? No. Was Bombshell a Best Picture Nomini? I don't even think it was. God. I don't think it was. Okay.

How dare you bring it up if it was? 2019 Best Picture nominee. Not Parasite. Not... Wait, he's in 1917. 1917, correct.

It's one of his 2019 movies. 2012 best picture nominee. Is he also in Lincoln? He could be in Lincoln, but Lincoln is not correct. Okay. It would have been wild if we were. We both picked actors who had Lincoln on their IMDVs. No, it wouldn't.

There's 9,000 people. But even still, the coincidence. All right. I don't think he's in Django. I don't think he's in Silver Linney's playbook. Is he in Argo? Maybe, but that's not it. You're going to get there eventually if you keep going this route.

He's not in Amor. He's not in Beasts of the Southern Wild. Not in Lincoln, as we said. All right. Not in Le Miz. Not in Le Miz. Fuck. Is it just like the one?

Have I mentioned it? Have I ruled it out? We've talked about it this episode. Okay. What did I say? Lincoln? No. Argo?

No. Silver linings? No. Amor? No. Beasts of the Southern Wild. No. Lism is no.

I know listeners are laughing. Probably. Fuck all you if you're laughing at me. Well, because I said a bitchy thing, too. The master is not a best picture nominee. Extra nominee, sadly. He's not in Django. He said that, so that's seven.

There's like two more. That was a nineer. You're going to get there even. He's in zero dark 30. Why were you going to get there eventually? Yeah. Because it's the last alphabetical. Oh, I wasn't going alphabetically, but yes.

Yes, I would have. All right, so another 2019 movie. Another 2019 movie. This is a franchise movie. I haven't seen this movie. Franchise movie, 2019. Superhero or otherwise? Superhero.

D.C.? Superhero? Yes. Aquaman. No. Nobody gives a shit about this movie. Okay. It made a lot of money.

No one gives off fuck. Oh, that's very funny. It was after Justice League, but before Snyder cut, it was between the Wonder Woman's, Wonderwomen. not Aquaman Come on DC Let's get sickening DC Shoeber oh Shazam

Shazam I saw and liked Shazam but don't remember Mark Strong being in Shazam I'm sure he is I'll probably see the sequel even though I don't like Zachary Levi But yes And Zachary Levi is

is anti-axon. Yes. I think people like Shazam. People don't really, it did really like, it had a fast favorite. I have not encountered a single human being having a conversation about the motion picture of Shazam. I've had multiple conversations about the motion picture Shazam. So I'm apparently hogging all of the Shazam fans.

I mean, how recently have you had a personal conversation about the motion picture? I saw the trailer for the upcoming one with a friend of mine and we were talking about it. You were like, remember that movie Shazam? I forgot it existed. No. we both liked Shazam defying you, defying your sense of the film Shazam.

Garry's get in our mentions. Do you care about Shazam or do you not care about Shazam? We're listening. Shazaminators, get in our mentions. Come talk to us. Shazaminators. I don't know. What's a good one? Shazam and Cheezers.

I don't know. Less Shazam, more Kazam with Shakil O'Neill. No, also not that. A movie I definitely care more about. All right, let's wrap this up. All right. Listeners, that is our episode. If you want more of this head Oscar Buzz, you can check out our Tumblr at this had oscarbuzz.com.

Please also follow us on Twitter at had underscore Oscar Buzz and also on Instagram at this had Oscar Buzz. Joe, where can our listeners find more of you? Twitter and letterboxed at Joe Reed, read spelled R-E-I-I-D. I am also on Twitter and letterboxed at Krispy File. That's F-E-I-L. we'd like to thank Kyle Cummings for his fantastic artwork and Dave Gonzalez and Kevin Mievious for their technical guidance. Please remember to rate, like, and review us on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, Google Play, Stitcher,

or wherever else you get those podcasts. Five-star review in particular really helps us out with Apple Podcast visibility. So tell everyone, we are the best exotic Marigold podcast. That's all for this week. We hope you'll be back next week for more buzz. And our first 2021 movie. Whoa. Everyone's a winner, baby, that's no lie.

You never fail to satisfy. It's no. Thank you.