This Had Oscar Buzz - 256 – Burnt

Episode Date: September 25, 2023

This week, we’re bringing you an episode to make you yell “YA BURNT!” Back in 2015, Bradley Cooper was to headline an ensemble dreamed about an unruly addict chef trying to earn his third Michelin star. Switching from the anonymously titled Adam Jones to the equally anonymous Burnt, the film had already earned a little bit of punchline … Continue reading "256 – Burnt"

Oh, oh, wrong house. No, the right house. I didn't get now in a minute. We want to talk to Marilyn Hack, Maryland Hack and friends. Dick Pooh. Adam Jones. Adam. Adam.

One hoped you were dead. Three years without a word. I used to run the best restaurant in Paris. What happened? Put everyone down. And now I'm back. So, not dead. Apparently not.

I mean, dead these days can mean barbecuing chicken wings on morning television. I'll never be that dead. Hello and welcome to the This Had Oscar Buzz podcast, the only podcast whose JBJ ankle tattoo stands for Jim Broadbent Jamboree. Every week on This Had Oscar Buzz will be talking about a different movie that once upon a time had Lofty Academy Award aspirations, but for some reason or another, it all went wrong. The Oscar hopes died, and we are here to perform the autopsy. I'm your host, Joe Reed. I'm here, as always, with my love-struck German benefactor. Chris Fyle.

Hello, Chris. First of all, Jim Broadbend. Jamboree is a spectacular, spectacular, but no one should be getting SS tattooed onto their body. Second of all, wasn't expecting gay shit in this movie. Well, gay shit with air quotes around it. I was not appreciative of the way that it was. I was not, I did not endorse what was happening in front.

of us of... Oh, we'll get into it, but jeepers, creepers. This fucking movie. This fucking guy, Adam Jones. This movie makes 15% more sense, maybe more, if it's set in a high school. Because it's totally like high school ending. What movie is it where it's like... It's not Billy Elliott, but there's like a movie about youths where there is a gay character

who is like second fiddle to... to, like, Dreamboat Lead, who is in love with Dreamboat Lead, and Dreamboat Lead as an act of penance and kindness at the end of the movie gives the love-struck gay character, even though Dreamboat Lead is fully heterosexual, a little smooch. And it's like, what? It's camp. You're describing Camp, the movie Camp.

No, because that's like, I might give you a beege. No, there is, like, sweet, there is a moment in some movie, listeners get at us, whatever, this movie, is where it's like, the heterosexual lead gives the gay sidekick a kiss. The love-struck gay sidekick. Aw, isn't that nice? It's not like, you know, entirely emotionally manipulative and bad. The moment in this movie, we're just going to jump to this moment.

The whole idea is that Daniel Brule's character is both, like, financially helpful to Brad the Cooper's character, but also we come to realize that he is, legitimately in gay love with him, to the point where, like, Emma Thompson as the drug tester slash pseudo-shrink. Yeah, Daniel Brule's like side drug tester therapist. Right. Who's like, you know, he's in love with you, which is, by the way, a wild violation of any kind of confidentiality or just like human decency.

but needs to point it out so that the audience needs to make sure they get it so something good happens near the end of the movie and Bradley Cooper in an act of gratitude not an act of gratitude in an act of sort of benevolence

kisses Daniel Brule on the mouth in one of those like Sienna Miller's in the room so it's not like there's any actual intimacy there doesn't it like cut to her giving like a little smile like she's the one telling

us like see isn't this sweet and it's okay but so but after he does this and it's this one thing you know it's like hands on either side of his face and like kiss him so there's like it's not like it's a real kiss but it's not a real kiss and then he pulls back and bradley cooper has the most irritating look of like you're welcome on his face where he's just like it didn't i just do something isn't that and then this movie has the fuck-ass nerve to have daniel brule be like, thank you. And it's like, fuck off movie.

Fuck off John Wells. Fuck off Stephen Knight. Jesus. H. Christ. This movie, Chris. I mean, this movie. Okay, the thing about this movie is, like, it exists as a punchline.

Just in and of itself with a punchline. And I maybe kind of forget why. It's because it changed its title from Adam Jones to Burt. Right. Because it was once titled Adam Jones. Jones. And it was just Bradley Cooper on a poster that said Adam Jones. It was literally the same poster, and they just changed it. And I remember the Adam Jones poster still being up at my multiplex as Burt was in the

theaters. Like, people didn't somehow realize while staffing this theater, they're two different Bradley Cooper standing with his arms crossed movies. Standing with his arms crossed, looking so, like, this movie has a really hard time differentiating between the moments when it's pretending to be critical of the Adam Jones character and the moments where it throws all that pretense to the side and just, like, basks in this, like, problematic man's genius. And it's the most dishonest. it's the most dishonest movie because it really does try and like make a head fake towards the idea of we know this guy's a bad guy and we know that he needs to just like no you don't you think this guy it fucking rules like this movie is so enamored of this main character and what's so special about adam jones adam jones is like basically just a guy adam jones what's special

about him is bradley cooper plays him like there's nothing yes unique about this man, even like his food sensibilities at the beginning get called into question because they say that like escargo is passe or something and that's what it's always I have, you have never met a man

who hates suvide who hates anything the way Adam Jones hates suvite. He hates suvied so much that he tries to kill himself later in the movie. With a suvade bag. Stephen Knight, I have to say, Stephen Knight is both with a gift and a curse to the culture.

I'll do respect to Stephen Knight because Stephen Knight... We'll get into the Stephen Knight of it all. Gave a simultaneous curse and gift serenity, which... We'll get into it. We'll get into it. We'll absolutely get it. We can't get too far ahead of ourselves. There's a lot to talk about in this terrible movie. But before we do, Chris, why don't you tell our listeners about why they should, if they haven't already, sign up for our Patreon. We are having so much fun over on...

We really are. We have launched our Patreon recently in the past two months as of this episode airing. We're calling it This Had Oscar Buzz Turbulent Brilliance. For $5 a month, you can join us. We'll be doing lots of fun stuff, but definitely two bonus episodes every month, first of which is what we're calling exceptions, movies, which fit that this had Oscar buzz rubric, great expectations, and disappointing results. But these are movies that actually did get Oscar nominations in the end.

at this point we got nine we got pleasantville we're going to be coming up with the gary's listeners choice episode uh by now you'll know what it is uh we're currently running the pole though there is a front runner we'll talk we'll talk about the metrics once we get to that episode yeah second episode every month we're doing what we call excursions which are breaks from the format but talking about very this had oscar buzz adjacent things we've got a magical Mike live episode. We've got a 2016 actress roundtable episode. We'll be doing things like recapping old awards shows, talking about EW movie

preview issues. We're going to be doing a patron only mailbag soon. So hop on over to This Had Oscar Buzz Turbulent Brilliance. Patreon.com slash this had Oscar Buzz. We will see you there. We're having a fun time. We're having a very fun time. Fun time had by all, especially the listeners. Exactly, exactly. All right.

So, back to burnt. You burnt. You burnt. That was your suggestion before we started recording that I just yell you burnt every few minutes. And honestly, Oh, no, come back. You burnt. It's what I want to do, because every time I see this title, that's all I can think of.

You burnt. I had to, when I sent you that. I feel like if you're going to go from this movie, though, I feel like if you're going to go from the most generic title to a different type of generic title, from Adam Jones to burnt. Well, before it was Adam Jones. In the movie where, like, things burn. I mean, maybe the Michelin people's taste buds burn. Yeah, well, Omar Sae made sure of that, yeah.

But this was initially titled chef back when it was first developed by the Weinstein Company in 2013. Company and John Wells. Stephen Knight wrote this, but John Wells directed it sort of coming off of August O'Sage County, which do we think August O'Sage County was viewed as a success or a failure within the Weinstein Company? Because clearly John Wells got a vote of confidence by like getting to turn around and make a movie with their at the time most prized star in Bradley Cooper. I mean, maybe some of that was a contractual thing, like, you know, terms of the contract for August Osage, but who kind of knows? They invested in John Wells, like, obviously, boo his Harvey Weinstein, et cetera. Yeah, et cetera.

That, you know, that really opens up to this discussion in this movie and that this is a movie about an abusive monster. So, like, it does feel curious that this is a movie that was fully developed by them. John Wells, because the company men was a Weinstein movie, correct? Which had big Oscar hopes and flopped. Right. Like flopped way worse than August Dosage County flopped. Right, right, right. But, you know, clearly was someone that they had...

a vision for in developing his career. And I all due respect to John Wells don't necessarily see why. Well, John Wells is a TV guy. John Wells was so successful with ER. Things like the West Wing. Well, he was the guy who was handed the West Wing after Aaron Sorkin quit slash was forced out because of his inability to get a script in on. time and also probably drug problems. I know there was a lot of rumors around then that he was

on crack. He's fully said that he wrote the entirety of the American president while addicted to cocaine. Yeah. So John Wells gets brought in, John Wells by this point has established himself as the ER guy. He was the guy who was sort of running that chip. ER was so successful on TV for a very long time. He gets brought in on the fifth season to do the West Wing. The West Wing flounders for a good season and a half. There are good, I don't know, it's a longer discussion than it needs to be in terms of like the post-sorking years of the West Wing. But I will always maintain that by that final season of the West Wing, Wells had pulled it around to something genuinely compelling with the Jimmy Smith's

Allen Alda presidential election. But he was a guy who just sort of like, he succeeded. He had that show Third Watch that was like, nobody talked about Third Watch a lot, but it lasted, I would guess that show lasted like six seasons. Let me see how six seasons exactly. 132 syndicatable episodes. So I think he was,

somebody who had the sort of the brush of success to him. And because of that, I think, you know, companies like the Weinstein company are like, well, we like success. And, you know, people like J.J. Abrams have been able to transfer their TV success to film. And the thing about Wells is, as a filmmaker, he's a cipher, right? He was, like, he was sort of that way with television, too, right? Like, he wasn't this big authorial voice that, like, that was sort of one of the things about the West Wing is that after Sorkin left, there wasn't really, you were sort of dealing with the echoes of Sorkin voice rather than the presence of a new voice.

And his movies kind of reflect that, right? Like, the company men and August Osage County is an adaptation of a Tracy Let's Play. and they probably should have just let Tracy Letts, you know, work with, you know, like, Friedkin again, honestly. You know what I mean? Like somebody, a filmmaker who had a stronger sense of a stronger voice, you know what I mean? Yeah, because, I mean, even I would argue Tracy Letts' voice is really dulled in that movie. Like, that movie is the most generic version of that play. that you can imagine.

There's, like, no subtext, no context. It's just people acting. Yeah. And Burt feels that way, too. Burt feels like a Stephen Knight movie, and Stephen Knight has subsequently directed some of his movies, Serenity being one of them, Locke being the other one,

the Tom Hardy driving in a car movie, Locke. And say what you will about Stephen Knight. He has a vibe. He has a P-O-V. And Burt seems like that Stephen Knight vibe sort of sanded down by the professionalism of John Wells. And it's, you know, you feel bad sort of like docking somebody for being professional. But he's sort of like that's what John Wells is. He's sort of this like, you know, competent, good enough director that somehow the Weinstein company decided to invest these.

you know, big hopeful projects. I don't think this script, ultimately the Adam Jones of it all, was ever going to be something I would have really liked, but there are ways to approach this story that don't feel quite as intellectually dishonest as what I think this movie ultimately is, if that makes sense. Yeah, yeah. This movie should also be fun. Like, this movie so clearly wants to be like,

fun, rollicking, you know, you're supposed to maybe be more charmed than you ultimately are. Totally. Maybe the movie would work, question mark, a little bit more if it was. But one of the things I want to get into on the other side of the plot description is the ways that chef culture has been depicted better on television and even in film. Because, like, this is definitely a movie that is the product of a decades' worth of chef culture in our popular culture, sort of like building up a shorthand for how we know or think we know, you know, what big, genius level, Michelin Star, you know, chefs are like. And I think, you know, spoiler, I think it's been done better on television. But before we do that, Chris, why don't we put you through the paces of describing the plot of Burt?

You Burt in 60 seconds before we do that, I'm going to give out the basics. This is the 2015 film Bunt, directed by John Wells, as we have been mentioning, written by Stephen Knight from a story by Michael Kalesniko, is how I believe I'm going to pronounce that, starring Bradley Cooper, Siena Miller, Omar Sye, Daniel Bruill, Sam Keeley, Lily James for half a second, Jamie Dornan for zero seconds, because he was cut out of the movie, Alicia Vecander, Matthew Reese, with Uma Thurman, and Emma Thompson, as I sent you that still of David Letterman last night, because all I could think of was Uma, Emma, Emma, Emma, Uma. Well, and you also sent that before I had watched the movie, so I was like, what movie is this that you're talking about? that they were in together. How could you forget that Uma Thurman and Emma Thompson were in Burnt?

It is conceivable that Uma Thurman is in this movie. I had no idea Emma Thompson was in this. Granted, they both filmed for a day. A day. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, totally. They just dropped Uma in at like a food truck fair. And they were like, here's your lines. It's like, Uma, try a British accent.

Go! And then like, you're a lesbian. Go. Work with it. This film premiered on October 18th, 2015 at the New York City Wine and Food Festival. God, the Weinstein Company were so up their own asses. Because they could get it into any other festival. Before opening wide on October 30th, also a mistake.

We'll talk about it. Chris, I'm going to throw 60 seconds on my little stopwatch. Oh, geez, this is not going to go. Are you ready to deliver? the plot of Yabert. Hopefully I don't burn myself. Okay, ready and begin. All right, so Adam Jones

is a disgraced chef. He is bouncing back from drug addiction, and he's like, I'm going to get a third Michelin Star. So he starts recruiting like Ocean's Eleven style, all of these like new colleagues and past colleagues, including Daniel Brule, who is secretly gay and in love with him, and will basically finance everything Adam Jones needs, Umah Thurman, who is a lesbian critic who apparently had sex with Adam Jones and like now owes him or something. I don't know.

And Sienna Miller, who he gets fired from her restaurant so that she can be his sous chef in a new restaurant. There's also his rival played by Matthew Reese, who I don't understand why they're rivals so much this movie wants me to root against Matthew Reese. Fuck off. And Omar Sae, who he has a fight with. And then they're like, yeah, we'll work together again. Anyway, when they start up this restaurant, it totally fails. and he immediately blames Siena Miller, including physically assaulting her in front of the entire staff.

Anyway, he then meets Alicia V. Kander, who's his sister, and we learned, oh, his dad just died and was like a chef, too, anyway. He is also on the run from his previous drug lords because he owes them a bunch of money. They beat him up after he and Sienna Miller get together, and then he comes in, and they have, like, Omar Sall leaves. because he basically like sabotaged Adam with the Michelin people and then they all get it together

and Adam learns, hey, they're a family and Michelin comes and we presume that Michelin does give him his third star and then they all eat family dinner together and he is in a relationship with Sienna Miller who he previously assaulted. 40 seconds over, but you know what? Okay, so here's the thing about you burnt.

There is so much plot happening in this movie at all times and it's moving at such a breakneck pace that it doesn't allow you to sit and think about how crazy every single human relationship is in this movie and every development and it's like it's like four movies of plot in a hundred minutes by the time we get to the part where omar sigh after an hour and a half reveals that he's been lying in the tall grass the whole time waiting to sabotage Adam Jones. He's been working with him again for weeks, weeks, just like, and having these, like, little, like, heart-to-heart conversations or whatever, and all this time he has been waiting

to get back at Adam Jones, and certainly Adam Jones probably deserved it, and by, like, throwing a handful of cayenne pepper in the dish of these diners who they assume are the Michelin judges, which they are not. And it's this, like, completely implausible third-act twist that makes absolutely no sense and only exists to, like, really make you, A, feel bad for Adam Jones, and B. And then he tried to kill himself in front of Matthew Reese and then their friend. With a suede bag. Also, if there's any character in this movie who's, like, low-key secretly in love with Bradley Cooper,

it's Matthew Reese. Those two have like incredible chemistry together in this movie in a way that like God bless Sienna Miller. Like she and Cooper really don't. I'd rather watch the Matthew Reese movie where Bradley Cooper is the villain. 100%. It's it's it's two sides of the same coin. You could you could you would probably have a slightly easier time with, you know, rooting for Matthew Reese a little bit because like you feel a little bit of sympathy for him. There's absolutely no point in this movie. where I approached even a little bit feeling bad for Adam Jones because first of all, he looks like Bradley Cooper. Second of all, he acts like Bradley Cooper. And like, you know Bradley Cooper has this like,

he has a button, there's a switch on his back where you flip it and it goes to like cocky asshole. And like, because he plays a cocky asshole so well. And too well in this case where it's just like, I'm never going to root for you, dude. Certainly not after you like grab Sienna Miller by the lapels or whatever. and, like, shubber. Entire staff.

Like, granted, we've, everybody's heard horror stories about, like, the high-end, you know, cooking industry, whatever we call it. The restaurant industry, especially, like, the high-end. And, like, the egos and, like, the artistic mindset, you know, that, like, I, I am a genius so I can abuse my staff. We've all heard horror stories of it, but, like, I don't know. Maybe this is the last moment when we were meant to question this less, because, like, this movie does feel like it is, as ploddy as it is,

it is following a very familiar, like, rise and decline and rise again narrative that we've seen in genres of other movies, you know. So I think to... Sports movies, et cetera. Yes, it is definitely, or like, even like a music. biopic. You know, that very familiar art. I was going to say, this has the same narrative arc as nine. Kind of, yes, kind of. The thing about, so the thing I think to explain this is in 2000, Anthony Bourdain publishes Kitchen Confidential, which kind of kicks off this, this conception in culture of the bad boy chef, for lack of a better term, right? Where

I don't really know how, like, I mean, high-end chefs before this were, I think, conceived in the popular culture as egotistical and high-ended and maybe a little effete. You know what I mean? Right. And then Le Poisson from Little Mermaid. Some respect on Renéant-Mois' name. always. But I think after Anthony Bourdain publishes Kitchen Confidential, there is an understanding, at least in the popular culture, of high-end chefs now fitting this Bourdain mold, where they are, they are not these refined and, you know, delicate people. They are hard charging. They're on

drugs, they are, they yell, they are mean, they are incredibly exacting. They have an incredibly like, uh, defined protocol in the kitchen, right? It's yes, chef. It's, you know, it's, you know, down the line. It's everybody responding to the chef as the like master of the universe. These, you know, these people are the kind of like, you know, rock and roll Michael Voltajio kind of, uh, types of people. And so this kicks off, I would say, two decades' worth of kitchen culture and chef culture that includes things like Top Chef, which premieres in 2006. And in the beginning of Top Chef, Top Chef really leaned heavily into this idea of everybody in the kitchen is cutthroat. Everybody in the kitchen is aggressive.

And innovation in the culinary arts is all about. a like alpha personalities and you know you don't have to be a man but you have to be as agro as possible you know what I mean like you know whether the men the women whatever everybody is like incredibly aggressive and the backlash to the Marcel of it all I think proved a real pivot point for the show sort of except for the fact that like that show keeps going through these like through many, many seasons of like really casting incredibly agro people up until maybe only like five or six years ago, I would say. But it's like, it's a, it's a spectrum. Rarely rewarding those people. That's fair. That's fair. Although again, Michael Voltaugio does win season six. What season

is that? That was definitely after Marcel. But then you get stuff like Hell's Kitchen, which premieres in 2005, the Gordon Ramsey of it all, right? This sort of like exaggerated, almost like cartoonishly demanding a person who yells all the time, you know? And they're just like fighting for like what, a slot in like the cook line of his restaurant? And it's like, these are like Waffle House chefs. Right. Anthony Bourdain's No Reservations premieres in 2005. Bourdain, of course, is a really interesting figure in that he starts off with this kitchen confidential. Kitchen Confidential, by the way, I should mention, was turned into a very short-lived TV show on Fox where Bradley Cooper starred in the main role as the Anthony Bourdain analog, so that's interesting.

But Bourdain's career and sort of like conception and popular culture begins as this very sort of this particular portrait of the chef. But of course, he wrote Kitchen Confidential from the other end of it, right? from the other side of this experience. And he kind of evolves into a kind of a benevolent figure, while still being like, you know, tetchy and, you know, his very, his particular own self, right? But he's somebody who defines this more expansive view of being a chef in the

culinary arts, and he's, you know, taking people through this show to all these different corners of the world and trying things out, and he has a very sort of kind of generous philosophy about food, ultimately gone too soon and took his own life a few years ago, which is very sad. And then you get movies like John Favreau's chef, which is the reason why this movie, Adam, or Burnt, is it called chef. culture. Right. Well, food truck culture, but also this idea of the burnout chef who comes back, which is very applicable to this movie, the guy who sort of, you know, has to rebound because he, he, uh, agroed his way out of a job, right? The beginning of, of John Favreau's chef, he gets so pissed off at a critic that he like makes this big old scene throw in plates and whatnot. And, and that is the culture. that burnt sort of, that's the bedrock that burnt kind of builds on top of. And so by the time we get to burnt, we're 15 years into the kitchen confidential era of this kind of thing. And what I think is really interesting, and I'm going to let you talk in a minute when I stop monologuing. Do you watch The Bear? I have not watched season two. Season two rules. I was very behind on season one and then watched it all.

a night, and that's just what I'm going to be with season two. Yeah, some people say season one was better. Some people like season two better. I think season two builds on season one in almost every way. I've heard of some cameos that I'm like, I'm going to hate this. It's one episode, and you take it with a grain of salt.

There are certain cameos, I think, that you'll really like. Anyway, but I think something like the bear represents an evolution past something like Byrne that knows that it's not enough just to be like this chef was on drugs, this chef is going to throw plates like this chef is going to like there are elements of that in the bear but the bear is sort of in conversation with that and being like

what you know how does a person who sort of falls into this like high end you know pressures of the kitchen trap crawl his way out of that to build something more fulfilling and, you know, no pun intended, nourishing and kind of how can this person go from this sort of New York City kitchen where it's every man for himself and you have to like this kind of Einrandian climb up a ladder to impress your, you know, the head chef. And the bear is like, what if you took those skills that you have honed and you're so talented with and built something that felt more like family, you know what I mean? And that's why I like that show so much.

And to me, lining up the bear and Burnt side by side, which I know that, like, they're seven years apart and whatever, but it really shows that, like, Burnt was at the tail end of one certain concept of this and the bear feels like it's if not at the beginning near the beginning of like our next conception of this this the bear fits in better with what top chef is now you know what i mean sure i also think the bear takes place on planet earth and burnt takes place on neptune also that yeah the bear never has someone uh in a sensible blouse saying i tell my myself, Simone, you're a lesbian. Why did you have sex with Adam Jones? Like, okay, we need to talk about that Umathurman scene entirely. So I love the way you put it that Adam Jones goes around like Ocean's 11 assembling his team where it's like, he just stops people at food trucks and is like, you, I'm going to bully you for a minute. Now you can be on my team. But let me sleep in your apartment first. It's both shocking that anyone was cut out of this movie. And also that more people weren't cut out of this movie.

Because it does definitely feel like a movie that was troubled in the editing room and they got it down to its bare bones to the point where the movie makes no sense. But then it's like you have Uma Thurman showing up for a scene who's significant later in a tangential way. Very tangential. But not really. So why is that scene in this movie, especially because it makes for even, and more weird gay stuff in this movie.

The scene exists in the movie, though, because all of those earlier scenes are about him recruiting a team, but they're also about burnishing this legend of him as this, like, every single person for the first 20 minutes of this movie who he talks to, he, like, essentially is like, here's why you're wrong about everything about cooking, why you don't have, you know, you don't have the right attitude. you need to have arrogance or you need to,

he tells the kid on the street with the street cart that he needs to have arrogance. He tells Sienna Miller that she needs to have humility. And he, as everything they, every way they answer him about his little like probing questions is like, here's what you should have said to me. You should have said, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Because like that's the cool way to answer these things.

And he's just, every one of those scenes is about how cool he is and how much of a, like, next-level genius, you know, culinary thinker he is. And how the people that he's meeting with buy into this legend, like, oh, my God, that's Adam Jones. It made me think of, like, it's the heterosexual reverse of all the, of the tweets you see where people are like, gay men on Twitter will be like, oh, my God, she's so mother, and post a photo, and girl, that's just Emily. Like, this movie, it felt like, oh, my God, he's a legend. He's, he's, uh, culinary genius. It's just Adam, like, it's, it's, it's, yeah, the movie, the first half of this,

the first half hour of this movie is so insufferable, where he is Ocean's Elevening, you know, his rivals and his kitchen. Yeah. Of, like, these repetitive scenes of, like, what you're describing, but mostly just constantly setting up his notoriety in a way that's like, we get it. But that's why the Uma Thurman scene is there. He's such a badass, like, kick-ass chef that he could even get this lesbian restaurant critic to sleep with him because he's that fucking hot.

And I'm genuinely surprised that Emma Thompson's character doesn't end up sleeping with him, too, because, like, that feels like, you know, everybody wants to fuck this guy. Emma Thompson, who is in the movie because Daniel Burel's like, yes, I will fund you, but you got to go to a therapist who will also manually, who will give you drug testing throughout. And Emma Thompson then is there to, uh, you know. Is she strictly speaking a therapist, though, or is she just like drug testing him and then like. I mean, she functions as one in their scenes. Right. But I don't know if she technically is one. Like going and giving blood or peeing in a cup or something.

Right. She functions narrative. as one, but I don't know if she's strictly speaking as one. The other thing is that, and we see this in the Matthew Reese scene, when he, Matthew Reese was this old rival who he used to work alongside, and this very sort of like once brothers kind of a thing, right? And this is where he gets to one of the many venues in which he gets to espouse his sort of culinary opinions. He hates suvid so much. He hates, of course, it's this very sort of pig thing, you know, the big, the big Nicholas Cage scene in the movie Pig, where he basically

like dismantles that one guy's entire sense of self because he's a pretentious chef who has no actual soul in his cooking. And Cooper sort of attempts to do that with the Matthew Reece character by, you know, talking about this. And of course, it's this like gleaming, white cafeteria-looking, you know, restaurant, everything seems plausibly pretentious. He wants to bring back these sort of, like, old-style cooking, you know, techniques. And, like, it's so annoying where, like, even the Sienna-Miller character will be, like, you know what we call the frying-pan drawer? The museum.

Like, nobody cooks with frying-pans. Nobody, like, cooks with, like, flame and fire, and, like, everybody wants to make you know, little sciencey dishes. Like it's very much that conception of Adam Jones wants to make real food and these little pansy asses want to like boil fish in bags. And who do you want to eat your food from?

Would you want to eat these little food and bag, little, you know, hoity-toity, whatever? Or do you want like Adam Jones to sizzle you up a steak? And I don't know. It's just... And eventually in one of the movies' 15 montages, we see that they do start doing suvied. Yeah. Yes.

The amount of B-roll in this movie, for this movie that clearly is like... A kitchen movie is always going to have so much B-roll, yeah. There is so much B-roll in this movie that I found it rather shocking. Here's what I want to ask you, Chris. And you, I'm pretty sure, have a more adventurous past. Taleth and me. But for a movie about cooking and a kitchen and a chef, and like, I don't want to eat any of this food. Did this movie make you, like, hungry at all? It did not. That's like the sole job of a food movie. Even the cake. I couldn't care about this food.

Wasn't filmed in a way that made me be like, oh my God, I got to have a piece of that cake. The cake that he makes to ingratiate himself into Santa Milled's daughters, good graces. Yeah, because he's a good guy now. He made her a cake. There's no, there's no moment in this movie that, like, shows off the food in a way where, like, like, even the menu. The menu is another movie, by the way, that, like, really, that plays into this, like, post-chef culture, where now at least that movie paints that kind of chef as, like, what if that person tried to kill everybody? So, we are definitely... Yeah, another movie that is very lucky to have the genius of Hong Chow in its presence to elevate it however it can.

But even the menu where he's trying to kill people, at many moments in that movie, I'm like, oh, I would eat that. You know what I mean? Like, oh, I would enjoy that. And just, Burt has none of that. Even Hannibal, like, the TV show where it's like, this is people. And you're like, that looks delicious. But he served them so appetizingly. Right.

All right, I want to take a quick break and get into this game that I have. made for us. Usually we wait too long to do the game, and then we end up doing, like, the mid-show game right before an IMDB game, and it's, like, game on game by the end. All right. We talked about how this movie was originally titled chef, and then John Favro made his chef, and so they're like, well, we'll title it Adam Jones, and then for a while it was untitled, and then it ended up as burnt, but it was Adam Jones long enough that

there were posters for it. And the funny thing about that was, it's very like, she's everything, he's just Adam Jones. You know what I mean? Like, it's, it's, it's just the most generic name. It genuinely is, so. I do maybe need an Adam Jones poster just for the- 100% I would like that. I would want that, yes.

But Jones is obviously a very generic surname, and I decided to go into the annals of movie history and pick out other movie characters whose last name was Jones and have you try and guess them from their quotes from the movie. So here's what this game. We're going to call this game. I don't know this Jones from Adam.

And there will be 11 questions. And with each question, you'll get one quote from the movie. If you can't guess who it is from that quote, you'll get a second quote. The second quote's usually more pointed than the other. If you can't get it from that, you'll get the performer.

So you have three chances to get this right, Chris. Do you know where the toilets are? It's Bridget Jones. I would like you to not get ahead of yourself here, Chris, all right? Just saying. I'm giving an example. It's a good example. Thank you.

All right. Question number one. The quote, your first quote is, Marion, don't look at it. Shut your eyes, Marion. Don't look at it, no matter what happens. This is Indiana Jones and Raiders from the last arc. Yes.

Do you want to have a guess of what my second quote would have been? I hate snakes. Snakes, why did it have to be snakes? Yes. All right. Question number two. By the way, they're starting easy. That first one was easy on purpose.

Question two, the first quote is, I've got to leave my job because I shagged my boss. That is Bridget John. That is Bridget Jones. Would you like to guess what the second quote would have been on that one? And Lord Archer, yours aren't bad either. No, but that would have been a good one. If staying here means working within 10 yards of you, frankly, I'd rather have a job wiping Saddam Hussein's Oz. René Zelle, exactly. Then you would have started singing Aretha Franklin.

All right. All right, question number three. Your first quote is, is. The world's greatest terrorist running around with six kilos of weapons-grade plutonium can't be good. I got to get it back, or someone's going to have my ass. A terrorism movie. Weapons-grade plutonium only happens in comedies. So I think this is a comedy. Second quote. Second quote.

Is it about time to unwrap your present? Oh. That is definitely a clue. Is it about time to unwrap your present? Oh, is this like Santa Jones. It is not. Would you like the performer? Yes.

Denise Richards. Oh, this is Christmas. Dr. Christmas Jones. Dr. Christmas Jones. From what movie? The world is not enough. Not a comedy. There we go.

All right. Okay. Question four. Your first quote is, It's the only way to leave. I don't love you anymore. Goodbye. Oh.

Oh, I don't know. Next quote. Next quote. Lying's the most fun a girl can have without taking her clothes off, but it's better if you do. But it's more fun if you do. This is Madonna and Dick Tracy.

No, it's not Madonna and Dick Tracy. Tracy. No. She says something like that, I think. Hold on. She says something akin to that, but this is a different quote. This is, um, no, it's not Roger Rabbit.

Um, is it? It's not Roger Rabbit. No. Uh, um, okay. Who's the performer? Performer's Natalie Portman. Oh, it is, um, This is closer.

Closer. She has like four names in this movie. Jane Jones. Jane Jones. Plain Jane Jones. Yep. Yep. Very good.

All right. Next one. Not, not Jessica Rabbit. Right. Kind of. All right. Question number five. Quote one.

Study, when you grow up on the wrong side of the digestive track. You ain't got no money for no fancy schools. What? What? Wrong side of the digestive tract. This osmosis Jones? It is Osmosis Jones. Well done.

Good job. Who voices Osmosis Jones? Chris Rock. There you go. Chris Rock voices osmosis Jones. Okay. Next one. Question six, quote one, I'm not skin and bones.

In fact, I'm remarkably fat. I'm not skin in bones. I'm Jones. I don't know this. Next quote. No commonplace mouses have such well-cut trousers. Bustifer Jones. Bustopher Jones from...

Cats. From Cats, played by James Corden. Okay, next one. Quote number one, do you fear death? Um... Uh, grim reaper Jones. Uh, next quote. All right, next quote.

Ten years I looked after those who died at sea. And finally, when we could be together again, you weren't there. It's Davy Jones. This is Davy Jones from? Uh, dead man's chest. Uh, I got the quotes from at World's End, but yeah, Pirates of the Caribbean, uh, at World's End. Do you be in faith? Or played by?

Uh, Bill Nye. Bill Nye, yes. All right. Next one. How many times do I have to tell you there's no such thing as ghouls, ghosts, goblins, or monsters? Oh, this is like, not Casper. Next. Casper Jones.

Next quote. Look, I'm a man of substance. Dorky chicks like you turn me on, too. This is like, this is like a. crumholz character um so like someone horny trying to disprove the existence of ghosts or something uh beetle juice jones um who's the performer freddie prince junior oh is this from scooby do is he freddy jones i did not know that he had a last name Fred's last name and Scooby-Doo is Jones.

Fred Jones, yes. All right. Freddie Prince, Jr. from Scooby-Doo. Okay. Question number nine. Quote one. I mean, it's kind of obvious. What?

I mean, it's kind of obvious. Next quote. Next quote. You're telling us what to do, even though it was your spell that got screwed up, meaning that all of this is kind of your mess. You know, I know a couple of magic words myself, starting with the word please

Okay, so a witch movie, this isn't like Sandra Bullock Jones, this isn't Nicole Kidman Jones, is it Farooza, it's not Farooza Balch Jones. It's not. What other witch movie? Who's the performer?

Zendaya. Oh. She was a witch and something? Who was she a witch? I don't say she was a witch. I mean, it's kind of obvious, it's the first one. The second one is, you're telling us what to do,

even though it was your spell that got screwed up, meaning that all of this is kind of your mess. You know, I know a couple of magic words myself, starting with the word, please. Where are there spells in a Zendaya movie? It's not like Marie Jones. It's not, uh, Malcolm and Marie Jones.

what's her She's Chani in Dune Chani Jones Chani Jones Sounds like a TV judge The Jenny Jones

Show replaced by the Chani Jones show Um What of her You're missing a big chunk of her Of her career

What Is it Disney related Related Related? Like, why did she get that role in Dune? Because she slays? Well, yes, but what launched her to that level? I am legitimately blanking, and I know it's embarrassing.

Who's she dating? Who was she? Oh, oh, is this, oh, this is like Spider-Man. Yes, yes, she is. No, but she's Mary Jane. No, in those movies she's MJ, but the MJ stands for Michelle Jones. that's that's not even fair sorry sorry they changed her name god those yeah stupid um

all right question 10 uh those quotes by the way were from spider man homecoming and spider man no way home um or no way those were from spider man far from home and spider man no way home okay question 10 now that was a crime you purse grabbing pukes and this is the penalty Catwoman Jones Who's grabbing purses in movies Who's getting their purse grabbed? Who grabs purses nowadays?

Second quote God I hate punkers Especially bald ones with green makeup Who wear masks over ugly faces Is that what is What is Cameron Diaz's character name? Is it like Amber Jones? Sunshine Jones?

It's got it. It's the mask. It's Cameron Diaz is the mask. It's not the mask. Then who is bald and green? Who indeed. I don't know. Who's the performer?

Elias Coteas. Okay. So not Cameron Diaz. Bald and green. Mr. Cotias. There is a movie in theaters right now that definitely relates to this. Oh, so there's like some type of, oh, is it like, no, the Hulk isn't bald. Oh, Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles?

Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles. Who does he play in Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles? I haven't seen that movie since I was six years old. He plays Casey Jones in Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles. All right. Final question. Question 11. The first quote is, now why would Liza agree to this? Liza being, this is Samantha Jones. This is Samantha Jones from Sex and the City, too. Would you like to guess what my second quote was? Lawrence of My Labia. Of course it was Lawrence of My Labia. Yes. Kim Cottrell,

triumphant as Samantha Jones and Sex in the City. City, too. That was, I don't know this Jones from Adam. Well done. Christopher Fio. You burnt. Everybody stop what you're doing. Knives down. Hands up. What is Padma say when when time is up in the air? Hands up. Utensils down. Utensals down. Thank you. Thank you. I'm already missing Padma Lakshmi from the Top Chef Universe. What is Chef Melissa going to say? Chef Melissa is going to have to come up with their own. you know, catchphrases. Indeed. All right.

But anyway, take a pause from remembering the fantastic movie that is burnt because we're here to offer you one last reminder about the Vulture Movie Fantasy League before rosters lock down. You have until September 28th to draft your team. I who have been cautioning as much as anybody to, you know, hold your horses and wait for information before you draft your team. that time has passed you have all the information

you're going to have the fall festivals have revealed themselves to you what are the big what's the big news out of the fall festivals as far as the

fantasy league goes Chris American fiction American fiction big news winning the people's choice out of TIF that's a $5 by could be pretty attractive

could be attractive same thing with poor things I would say the Venice winner. $10 buy. $10 buy. These are, these are, I'm going to, I think one of my upcoming newsletters is just going to be like, here's everything that I got wrong when I did the pricing guide before we launched.

And listen, that was always going to happen. You know what I mean? I was doing as much guesswork as anybody else is. Poor things was originally a September release, which didn't bode well for its chances initially. Listen, we all had to make our guesses. is I overvalued things like Lee and fingernails and undervalued things like American fiction and poor things. But you can take advantage of that.

It's still without distribution Lee. Not a soul. Talked about that movie at Toronto, by the way. I did not hear a soul. I heard some people say that it was bad and not interesting. Anyway, you have until September 28th to draft your team. Do it. You should.

if you are listening to this, make your league All of Us Gary's, where you can play along with everybody who listens to our fine podcast. That's All of Us, Garys, all one word. Capitalize all the words in all of us, Gary's, and all one word. We'll figure it out. Do not worry, if you have entered your team and you put spaces in all of us, Gary's,

don't worry, we're going to fix it. All the fine people at Vulture are not here to disqualify ballots with hanging chads. We are seeing intent. This is a very timely reference that I am making right now. Despite us telling you every episode how to do it and what to end. Listen, sometimes you're in the heat of the moment. You're filling out a ballot.

Things get crazy. I get it. But anyway, if you are fretting about that, do not fret. We'll take care of everything. Everything will be fine. You'll be able to compete among your fellow Gary's. So, yeah, we also, I should say, in the efforts to include as many movies as possible as they arose during festival season, we did add Hitman last week as a $5 buy. I should say, before you all go running to draft Hitman, even though it's great.

We still don't know whether it's going to be released in 2023. Netflix bought it. Netflix has a lot of things going on between now and the end of the year. It seems just as likely that they'll release it in the spring. bring as it is that they'll release it by the end of the year. So buyer beware in that one. A little more certain is Netflix's American Symphony, which is the documentary about John Batiste, which they have pretty much declared their intention to campaign that for awards, for documentary awards. And Netflix does well when campaigning for documentary awards.

So we put that one. Well received out a telluride. That'll be a $3 buy. That's one to keep an eye on, I think, if I were you. And yeah, what else do we have to say, Chris, besides go and go and draft that team if you haven't already. This episode is dropping Monday. That leaves you until Thursday. Yes. To draft your team. We want to see punny, fun league names. Once, or not league names. That's, you know, your league name. Your display name. Your display name is where you have little individualized fun. I will relate. We'll tell you next week. what hours are? I'll relate the sad tale of punctuation because our fields do not allow special characters.

And that kind of ruined my joke, but it's fine. Anti-oomelot. It's fine. I can live without a numelot. Yeah, I would say if you're anything like me, maybe don't even wait till the 28th because like I am a forgetful queen. And sometimes when I leave things to the last minute, that deadline passes me by. Do it right now.

Do it now, in fact. Burnt will be back for you. How do you think it's getting burnt? Because it's left on the stove, in the pan, while you draft your team, and now it's burnt. Don't get burnt. You burnt. Don't have us texting you the Jane Krakowski, a clip from 30 Rock, that I had to crop because on one side of her was Tucker Carlson and on the other side was Chris Matthews.

So I had to crop that screenshot very tightly. So it was just Jenna Maroney saying, you burnt. don't get burnt back to burns you're burnt should we talk about Bradley Cooper how was that way how was that game how did you that was hard that was a very hard game good I was worried it was going to be too easy in parts

so I'm glad there were hard things as well I love that I immediately got osmosis Jones Bustifer Jones and Samantha Jones yeah the only Jones is three people who haven't been in your kitchen yet

um Let's talk about Bradley Cooper. So, uh, Burt already had four Oscar nominations at this point, which is kind of wild because you would think at this point in his career, unless, you know, he thought that this would be some type of, you know, comedy mid-sized hit potential. Yeah. This, this feels beneath him at this stage in his career. Well, he signs on to this movie, like, between Silver Linings Playbook and American Hustle.

he's I think still making American hustle when he signs on to this movie but he was he was already lined up for American Sniper although at that point American Sniper was going to be directed by Stephen Spielberg and so he's sort of in the midst of this like crazy run he was also lined up to make Aloha which at that point was an untitled Cameron Crow movie so like he was working a lot he was also trying to put together what would ultimately be

his performance of the Elephant Man on Broadway. So like Bradley's working. Bradley is acting like somebody who spent the aughts trudging through like trying to break out of TV shows like alias and trying to find a career for himself and he's the heavy in wedding crashers

and he's in the hangover and all of a sudden the hangover happens and he's like, now all of a sudden he's a hot property. And he's acting like somebody who sort of like Amy Adams. Remember when Amy Adams just took every role because like it finally happened for me. Like I got a. And Bradley Cooper, I think, is going through. Bradley Cooper and Amy Adams's careers are actually a really interesting thing to compare to each other because it feels like they both had a similar thing of like spending a decade in these really mid-level things. And, like, there was really not much of an expectation that they were going

to break out of that, despite the fact that, like, they're so talented and so beautiful. You know what I mean? Like, it's, it's kind of amazing. I got to say, the picket pictures of Amy Adams with the human sign that are happening this week. I got to say, I know, I would have been this way if Nightbitch was opening this year. But, like, let's get these things out of the way. And Next year, she's back. It's all about... She's back, baby. She's back next year.

Cannot wait for Nightbitch. Are they going to release that theatrical? Are they going to release that theatrical? Heller being to, you know, collaborating on a movie is something I think we all want and suspect will be good for the culture. Yes, I can't wait for Amy Adams. Will they release Nightbitch theatrically? I mean, I hope so. The Andrew Hed.

they've been moving in the direction towards doing more of that and like doing fewer movies that just like premiere on, although they did that with fucking Boston Strangler, but maybe they only do that. Maybe it's like maybe direct to streaming will just become what direct to video

was, which is we think this movie's not very good. We're going to put it direct to streaming. Unless you're like Netflix, obviously. Who doesn't do theatrical? But so Bradley Cooper. Yes. Bradley Cooper at this point, he was nominated in 2012 for Best Actor for Silver Linings Playbook.

Where do you think he finished? Somewhat surprisingly, because people thought that he would be just on the outside of that nomination. And when it happened, I thought he really deserved it. But people were a little surprised. Well, because he had never been nominated before, and he was not somebody who people really thought of as an Oscar caliber actor by that point. Daniel J. Lewis was never not going to win that Oscar for Lincoln, even though he had already won two, but it was undeniable. I kind of think Cooper

may have finished second in the voting that year. What do you think? Okay, so it's those two, who were the other three? I've got it in the outline, but it's Hugh Jackman and Le Miz, Joaquin Phoenix and the Master, and Denzel Washington in flight.

I think it's possible he was second. I mean, there was a lot of heat around Hugh Jackman. It was him or Hugh Jackman, but I'm inclined to believe it was Hugh Jackman. My thinking is, there was a while there where it felt like Silver Linings Playbook was going to make an end run for Best Picture. And because it was Argo's nominated, but Affleck wasn't nominated, so it was Argo weaker. Lincoln had its Lincoln problems, which was essentially, we knew this was going to be good, so we're not surprised that's good.

You know, that was basically the big Lincoln problem, was that, like, there was no way to impress people because the expectations were so high. And an acting nomination in every category for Sylvinger Linings Playbook looks like a lot of support for that movie. Ang Lee was a big contender for Life of Pie and Best Director, but they were never going to give Life of Pie Best Picture. So it felt for a second that, like, and people were like, oh, here comes Harvey again. Harvey is going to make it happen for Silver Linings Playbook, and it's going to be. this sort of like late-breaking winner and that didn't happen but I feel like because of that I would imagine that Cooper's vote totals were probably jacked up by that point possibly yeah that was a hundred million dollar movie it was yes yeah it won Jennifer Lawrence and Oscar um got four

acting nominations in all four categories like that's amazing all right speaking of acting nominations in all four categories. American Hustle comes along the very next year and gets 10 nominations. Doesn't win any, but it gets 10 nominations. He loses best supporting actor to,

and that's one of those borderline supporting actors where like, he's kind of a co-lead. There's like three leads in that movie. It's Bale and Adams and Cooper, as far as I'm concerned. But he gets sort of pushed down to supporting, and he loses to Jared Leto

in Dallas Buyers Club. Where would you imagine that Cooper finished in that lineup? Fifth. I think so? Yeah. Where would you, so rank them? My guess would probably be Fastbender second, Barkad Obdi, third, Jonah Hill fourth, and then... Fastbender nominated for 12 years of slave, Barkad Abdi nominated for Captain Phillips, Jonah Hill nominated for Wolf of Wall Street.

Why did I do that? Sorry, I put the wrong person in there. Jonah Hill, I feel like, was fourth place because Jonah Hill was the kind of late arrival, but had a lot of support for that performance. I guess so. I guess that's right. He was definitely the late arrival. I mean, that's another one where, like, Jared Leto was kind of the assumed winner for that whole season,

kind of once it happened. It's funny. Those are the funny ones where you look back and you're like, huh, that just kind of sailed right through, huh? Just Jared Leto winning an Oscar. All right. I think Cooper's good in The American Hustle. That's a movie that I run very hot and cold on. And he's not one of my favorite performances in that movie, but he's not one of my least favorite performances in that movie, if that makes sense.

I don't understand. I was never really on board with Christian Bale getting award nominations for that movie, but I think maybe Christian Bale I like better than Bradley Cooper in that movie, though I do think Bradley Cooper is very funny in that movie. He is funny. That's, I mean, that's such a weird movie. Maybe I owe it a rewatch. I just, I still stand by thinking Amy Adams is great, even though people think she's bad because they have access. issues, which I think the accent is intentional.

Yeah, it's baked in. That's, you know... Yeah. I... It's about the, you know, mutability or, you know, transformation of identity and persona and, like... Yes. Yeah, I think she is so good as to head and shoulders elevate that movie. I have been on the record saying, I think Jennifer Lawrence is kind of...

embarrassing in that movie, but she does have like one or two scenes that are so entertaining like Science Oven that it sort of makes up for it. I don't think she's embarrassing. I feel like... I think she's given a task that she shouldn't have been given. That's probably true. I'm sure that there's a character actress who could give a performance even better than that, who is, you know, the right age, but...

Let Catherine Hahn play that role and see it sing. But Science Oven is a legitimately hilarious scene. And I say thank God for me all the time. So that's not for nothing. I also think Jeremy Renner is really good in that movie, I have to say, in his little role. Weird movie. Didn't really like it. And then he's nominated for the third straight year for not only producing American sniper, but starring in it as well.

loses to Eddie Redmayne in the theory of everything. Everybody assumes, and I do as well, that Michael Keaton was a close second place for Birdman. And yet, I do think if American sniper had another week or two in its campaign, I stand by saying Bradley Cooper would probably have an acting Oscar. You think so? I do, because that movie made so much money. Yes, it did.

And was a phenomenon. was finally the time that, like, Bradley Cooper is amassing these acting nominations. And I think even people, myself included, who really didn't like that movie, have very positive things to say about his performance. Do you think it's that by the time that movie became such a financial success that the conversation in Best Actor had so calcified around Redmayne versus Keaton, that there was, that people didn't have time to change their conception of it? Maybe. And I maybe, perhaps wrongly question if Michael Keaton was in second place at all because Birdman was winning so much and it's like part of the reason why I think Bradley Cooper was second place and could have you know given more time in the campaign uh won that award because like yeah they gave American sniper like what one of the sound Oscars and it just feels like they would have if that campaign had had more time to cook they would have been the looking to reward that movie elsewhere, and I think

Bradley Cooper is the... I just think the fact that Birdman won best picture means that there would probably have been a lot of people voting for Michael Keaton, because they just would have voted for both of them. I think there are some people... I mean, there should have been. He deserved it. There are some people who spread the wealth with their Oscar votes, but there are a lot of people who just, like,

I like this movie, I'm going to vote for all of this movie. Who knows? But yeah, so that's... Career-wise, he's got how many producing nominations for Best Picture. It's American Sniper, it's Nightmare Alley, it's... Star is Born. Star is Born, right. A prolific producer, I imagine he's a producer on Maestro as well, because he's directing it.

So that's another producing nomination that's on the board for him. I'm pulling this up, because I think there's another one we're not mentioning, and it might be a movie he wasn't in. I love what actors are nominated for producing movies. not in. It's genuinely one of my most... Oh, yes. Yes, it's Joker. Yes, you're totally right because of him and Todd Phillips their professional

relationship. Yes. The abysmal and embarrassing Joker. Yeah. So a lot of nominations for Bradley Cooper. He's got Maestro coming out. We've seen the teaser. I loved the teaser. What did you think of the Meister teaser? I don't think we've talked about

this. I thought it was good and I think we need to bring back the teaser. One million percent we do. Absolutely. I loved it. I think it's incredibly intriguing. I am very excited to see the movie. It just feels like a real contender from this state.

I would say so, and partly because the controversy around that movie, any movie, like, right or wrong that stirs up that much controversy, especially that quickly, this is over the nose, Like, I'm not a Jewish person. I don't feel like I can necessarily contribute much to this conversation. But, like, any movie that garners that level of controversy does always feel like a frontrunner. Because there are many movies often that have, like, rightful things for people to be upset about, but people don't necessarily pile on. And it's because, like, nobody really sees them as worthy of, you know.

I have two thoughts on this. One of which is, if you're not subscribed to Fran Hoffner's newsletter, you should do that. She gave an assessment of the Maestro trailer that is second to none. I will accept no commentary on Bradley Cooper from anybody except for Fran Hoffner for the rest of this Oscar season. God bless Fran Mag. Everybody goes subscribe to Fran Magazine. 100%. Second of all, I think it's very beneficial for Maestro that their controversy played out.

at the teaser stage so that by the time the movie actually opens that controversy probably but that one at least is old news and nobody's going to want to talk about it anymore so I also don't think I know you're bracing for

queer controversy I don't know if it's necessarily going to be as much queer controversy as I mean you can always kind of anticipate it at least from queer critics and queer viewers So it may not be the mainstream controversy for this movie, but I do think it's probably coming. But, like, there is a certain thing of, like, there are legitimately bad and toxic things about some movies that it's like people either just accept or don't want to talk about because they think that that movie's just going to die and go away anyway.

Well, but I also feel like, I think with queer controversies, my conception of them is you get them much more, much more, fervently on movies that are at the level of red, white, and royal blue, then you would get them at the level of maestro. I would even say that, like, you'll get more queer controversy in a movie like Saltburn, if Saltburn has, like, homo eroticism, but, like, you know, plays around with it. I don't know. I feel like there are, I think a movie, like, call me by your name, attracts controversy because like Timi Sholome then becomes

like the hot young thing you know what I mean whereas like... Or age gap discourse type of things but like I also think that straight culture, straight people are more willing to just accept something

on its face when it's queer or queer adjacent in especially like an awardsy movie and it's you know gay people who actually want to like talk about it and dissect things i yes my hope maybe i'm being a little naive my hope is that the people who end up talking about maestro are smart and that the people

who you know what i mean that like there's that maybe it'll this is why everybody is away a little bit lady gaga's not in this movie so like maybe like some of the like dumb dums will stay away do you know what i mean mean? Like, I don't know. I don't know. Prove me wrong. People. You know what I mean, though. You know what I mean? I do. I do. I do. All right. So what else can we talk? We talked about chef culture. We talked about Bradley Cooper. Let's talk about Stephen Knight. Okay. Yes, Stephen Knight. Creator of cultural menace and gift to those of us who love smooth brain insanity, serenity. Okay. You're just going to jump right to serenity. I'm going to give you your

your Serenity Corner, and then I'm going to do a more like timeliney thing about Stephen Knight. Listeners, I am not prone to telling you to stop listening to an episode and go jump on something. If you do, please come back and listen to the rest of the conversation. If you haven't seen Serenity, or whether or not you've had Serenity spoiled for you, you have to see it. Serenity, it feels like we don't really get many of these anymore, though I hear Hypnotic is like. this, the Ben Affleck, Robert Rodriguez movie, Hypnotic, is of this variety. Serenity, you kind of watch it on its face as the movie is playing out. It's very strange. It's very clear that there's something going on in terms of the reality of this movie. That's

not all that it appears to be. But there's like weird graphic sex in this movie. Matthew McConaughey is naked quite a bit. It plays out like this weird noir happening. on, like, a beach island's setting. There is a side quest where Matthew McConaughey has sex with Diane Lane, Diane Lane, who is, like, perpetually a woman in a window, but, like, seaside. And there's, like, mystery involved. And then when you get to the twist of what is happening in this movie, which I believe, if I remember correctly, is delivered via Jeremy Strong. Or Jeremy Strong is in this movie. Jeremy Strong, whose function in that movie, is to enforce the rules of the very highly structured.

Is he his character, The Rules? Like, his name is The Rules or something like that? At some point, he says, like, I am. Like, he has, like, he has a, I think he has, like, a moniker he goes by, but, yes, he is essentially the rules. And the twist basically turns out, like, that thing in your brain where you were like, this is, like, watching X. and at the end you turn out, oh, no, it's X. Yeah. It is so...

By which you mean, it feels like you're on drugs while you're watching it, is why you're saying, this feels like X. It is so stupid. It is absolutely stupid, but created with everyone involved, with complete emotional investment and conviction, It is the reason why I say that Anne Hathaway is the greatest camp performer of our lifetime, and I mean it. Yes. Because Anne Hathaway is tasked with doing the stupidest shit in this movie and saying the stupidest shit. It's so good. And she turns it into gold.

I mean, I, listen, I will forever stump for Annie Hathaway. I will be stumping for her this year for her performance in Eileen, which I think is a tremendous performance on her part. Speaking of Annie going to the extreme for her performance. She's so good. She's perfect in that movie. Written and directed by Stephen Knight was like... Okay, so when that movie came out,

that movie came out in like spring of 2019? It's early. It's like I even want to say like maybe even February. January. It's a January film, my friend. Yeah. And it it had this kind of immediate bomb and then like creeping boost of people being like, oh no. And that turnaround happened kind of quickly. It was like two

weeks of people being like, that movie sucks. And then like pretty quickly people were like, or it's brilliant. Like, you know what I mean? It is both the worst thing and a brilliant thing at the same time. And, of course, it was like us, all of the, like, weirdos who swarmed around collateral beauty swarmed around this movie. This is, like, Galaxy Brain Collateral Beauty. Yeah. Yeah.

Stephen Knight will forever have forgiveness from me because of this. Stephen, you will always be famous. Yeah. That being said, I do think that Burt is on a degree of insanity that Serenity is. And that, like, everything takes place on Neptune. none of these people are real, like, they do not behave with normal human behavior. Even the guy who's like a monster, it's like... But I think in Serenity, there's some intention to that.

Whereas, like, burnt, that's the case just because it's bad. Right. You know what I mean? Right. And I think there's a certain adherence to formula in this that, like, there's a romance in there because there has to be a romance, but the romance, he, like, fully assaults her in front of people, and then we're expect to believe that the romance happens after all of this, it's just like, it feels like what is dumb and crazy about burnt is because, well,

this is what has to happen in a movie like this, you know? And it makes, the Alicia V. Kander character is the one that I'm almost most surprised wasn't completely excised because it's like, oh, we learn through her in two scenes that, that he has these half-siblings, and he didn't go to his father's funeral because of his addiction, so might have some guilt because of that. This guy who we never thought was his father, we just assumed that it was his, like, mentor, the way he talked about this guy. Right, right. And in the next Alicia V. Kander scene, she's like, well, I paid off your drug dealers, so you can be safe now. Yeah.

And it's just wild. Alicia Vekander, who... This was her big year. This was her big year, and having seen Burt Now, I think it's even more hilarious that when, like, you know, body of work prizes or people were mentioning multiple performances for her in this year, they mentioned this one, which is like, could not be more monotone. Oh, and she's like barely in this movie. Yeah. It was very go-girl. Give us nothing.

She could have been excised from this movie. 100%. Yeah. I would love to know who Jamie Dornan. was supposed to have been in this movie. His father mentor. Oh, was it in flashbacks? No, I'm making that.

Oh, okay, okay, you're being an asshole. Because for the lulls. For the lulls. So Stephen Knight's career is interesting, though. He's sort of, he's this kind of son of a blacksmith, and he writes these things, kind of not exclusively, but a lot of the things that he writes are from this kind of, like, grungy, underbelly perspective, right? his first and at this point

only Oscar nomination comes very early in his career. He does the script for Dirty Pretty Things, which is a Stephen Freer's movie from, it was released in festivals in 2002, but it hits the awards circuit in 2003, and Stephen

Knight gets an original screenplay nomination for Dirty Pretty Things, which was pretty, like that movie was pretty low profile. So that was that was just the writer's branch really sort of getting behind that script. Have you seen Dirty Pretty Things? Not in a long time.

I saw it when it very first came out. Audrey Tattoo and Chihuatl Edgiafore are the main. I remember that might have been the first thing I'd ever seen Sophia Okinaido in as well. But it's this like, there's like murder and she's. a sex worker, I want to say, right? And there's a hotel and she's not a sex worker. There's somebody else who is, Sophia Kineto is a sex worker. But it's like there's, you know, crime and violence and something goes down in a hotel. I really should see that thing again. I remember enjoying it. He does the script for the 2006 Michael Appetead movie Amazing Grace, which is

The one about the person who wrote the song, Amazing Grace, that's Yohan Griffith, plays the guy who wrote the song Amazing Grace. I never saw that one. Did you see that movie? No. He did this movie, I know you saw. He did the script for David Cronenberg's Eastern Promises, which very much fits in the sort of dirty, pretty things, grungy underbelly way. Kind of surprising that that didn't get more screenplay attention, because. Vigo gets the Oscar nomination for that one.

Somewhat surprise, Oscar nomination. Somewhat surprise. That's the weird lineup that also has somewhat surprised Tommy Lee Jones nomination. Yes. It also comes the year after Cronenberg and Vigo had done a history of violence together. So the Eastern Promise nomination almost feels like a two for one, where it's like you did two in a row and they were really good and we're going to give it to you for this second one. It's not like a makeup nomination because, like, people liked Eastern Promises quite well, too. But Eastern Promises is, like, grungy and violent, you know what I mean?

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, well, those are both two very violent. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. He makes his directorial debut in 2013 with the Jason Statham movie called Hummingbird. And then he also directs the Tom Hardy pretty much one-man show, Locke Which All the other actors are heard

Over the phone Over the phone Lock is he's a guy driving a car Tom Hardy Decided to fuck around And just do a Welsh accent Just for the fun of it And

I think it's a really good movie I don't know What are your feelings on Locke? It was oversold to me Okay I can see that I saw it pretty early I saw it pretty early So yeah that makes sense

Around this time too He creates the net Well, I think it's, he creates it maybe for British television, but it is certainly picked up by Netflix. Peeky Blinders, which runs for six seasons, all of 36 episodes, but it's six whole seasons, with Killian Murphy sort of in the news a lot now for his Oppenheimer performances.

I think people, Peeky Blinders was one of those shows that, like, was secretly super popular on Netflix before people ever really started talking about it. It was very niche, but like it was this, like, pretty significant niche. And it turned out people

really liked Peaky Blinders, so I never watched that. But it's, again, this, like, grungy, you know, UK sort of, I don't know, or is it Ireland? I'm going to do it again. See, in my defense, I've never seen Peaky Blinders,

but English-Irish sort of violence. That's another show where, like, any UK or Irish actor you've ever heard of probably passed through that show at one point or another where it's like you look at the cast list and it's like Tom Hardy was in it at one point and Joe Cole and Noah Taylor of course and Patty Considine naturally and Adrian Brody was on it

and Anya Taylor Joy of course and Kingsley Benadier naturally and Katie Dickie and you know Stephen Graham could not have not been on Hottie, Stephen Graham. Stephen Graham's so funny that he's like your new Hottie of choice. When I, I, because I've been watching Scorsese stuff and of course, like I'd watch the Irishman and he's like, you know, I just want to dress like that

when I'm his age, fuck it, I'll dress like it now at all times. When he shows up in the scene where he's late and it's perfect scene, so funny. But then he's in Gangs of New York as like baby Stephen Graham. Very snacky in that movie with like a scar and yeah. Fantastic. Other Stephen Knight scripts that he wrote before Burnt, he wrote the script for the 100-foot journey. And for that movie, Seventh Son, which is the long-delated fantasy.

Yeah, Julianne Moore and Alicia Vecander, I think, is in that one. I think Ben Barnes is the main guy there. Jeff Bridges is in that movie. Pawn Sacrifice, which is the Bobby Fisher movie that starred. It's an Ed's a Wick joint. Toby McGuire, right? Played Bobby Fisher in that one. And then after Burt, he does the script for the Ron Howard movie,

Allied with Brad Pitt and Marion Cotillard. Woman Walks Ahead, the Jessica Chastain in the Dakota's movie that played Tiff that I did not see. Did you see Woman Walks Ahead? I did not. He did the script for the Claire Foy. He was one of the screenwriters, actually, on the Claire Foy-Lisbeth Salander movie, The Girl in the Spider's Web. We cared so little about this Lisbeth Salander. movie that last year during

women talking, nobody really acknowledged that there's multiple Elizabeth Salander's in that movie. That's true. Nobody mentioned that. That's absolutely true. Because nobody cared about the Clairvoy one. Right. And then one thing I'd never really quite clocked, actually, in 2021's Oscar race

was that Stephen Knight wrote the script for Spencer, which gets the nomination for Kristen Stewart. So it's a really interesting... What's that? What did you think of Spencer? I enjoyed myself. I thought it was halfway good and halfway kind of like

puzzling and maybe a little bit embarrassing. But it's real interesting. It's like not, here's the thing. I will grant a lot of rope to a biopic that really tries to not be a typical biopic. And Spencer surely did that. You know what I mean? Best thing about it is it made me want KFC. Best thing about it is it got that fucking Mike in the Mechanics song

stuck in my head for the subsequent, like, three years. I love Kristen Stewart, but even that performance, I was like, it's okay. You know, it's not bad, but it's okay. I just thought that was a movie that the people who loved it were doing the most. I will say, I'm really glad that that movie exists in the way that exists, even if I think it's not perfect. I would much rather that than whatever the Grace of Monaco version of Spencer, of, you know, or like, Diana.

You know what I mean? The Naomi Watts, Diana. Like, it's, like, much rather this. It got us a case due nomination, and I think she's just going to be one of those performers that her best work is not going to get Oscar nominations. And that's fine. Good that it made that happen. Yeah, I think that's right. He's a real interesting screenwriter, Stephen Knight.

I don't always love what he does. he doesn't always do, like, he's a work-for-hire guy in a lot of ways, you know what I mean? But every once in a while, he'll put together a Serenity or a Locke or, you know, or a Spencer. And it's like, all right, I'm into this. Things we're talking about. Yeah, exactly. So, good for him. Now that Peeky Blinders is done, it's interesting to see.

He did that, we talked about last week the Apple TV Plus of it all and how some of those shows exist and some of those shows don't and he did the one of the shows that launched with Apple TV's launch was that show C which was Jason Mamoa and Alfre Woodard in this fantasy post-apocalyptic thing

where like everybody is blind that's one of the ones that nobody watched and he's got coming up him and Sean Levy developed the adaptation of all the light we cannot see which is a lot of people love that book a lot of people love that book it's being uh developed by

netflix it's screening at tiff ahead of a i want to say november premiere so like they're really really like rolling out the the the the carpet for this movie mark ruffalo's in it who lor is in it i don't know if i'm excited to watch it it feels very um what was the other movie um from a few years ago where oh fuck it was the little girl in the holocaust and the bice the book thief i've said the yeah yeah yeah yeah it feels very book thief to me just in concept i don't know we shall see we shall see all right um so yeah uh uh stepan knight interesting what else do we want to talk about in terms of uh adam jones slash you burnt uh it bombed it bombed at the box office as in

you're undercooked? Can we talk about when it opened wide instead of platforming and absolutely fucking tank? Halloween weekend, 2015, opened in sixth place, was the highest ranking of the new movies that weekend, but it opened, I didn't also realize it opened on the same weekend as our brand is crisis. Both of those movies opened wide in ways that they should not have. Like, our brand, I guess Burt is the type of movie that you should be able to open wide and it's just like tanked. Right. This movie wouldn't have platformed well because the reviews were so bad for it. It's wild that our brand is crisis opened on 2,000 screens.

I've never seen that movie. It's not bad. It's just, it's mid. I hate to say mid. Makes me sound like an asshole. Punch me the next time I say mid. But, like, that's what it was. movies can be allowed to be mid

I know I just hate the term I just hate the term it sounds so genzy I hate it It opens in sixth place Behind the fifth week of the Martian The third week of goosebumps The third week of Bridge of Spies The sixth week of Hotel Transylvania 2

And the second week of the last witch hunter Not the last witch hunter Yes which I remember seeing in theaters Because my friends and I were like Let's just see something dumb. So we decided, we took an edible and we saw the last witch hunt turn. It was very fun. So, like, you know, it couldn't muster enough to beat the sixth weekend of Hotel Transylvania, too.

So that says something. A lot. A lot. A lot. Nobody wanted to see Burt, and it, like, fell off a cliff from there, but it opened on 3,000 screens. And, yeah, I'm trying to look. movies that had better per-screen averages than burnt in its opening weekend include paranormal activity, the ghost dimension, which opened on half as many screens.

Let's see. The Witness, which was a Chinese movie, Room, which is at that point on 49 screens, had a better per screen. Suffragette had a better per screen. than Burnt did let's see what else anything interesting

nasty baby remember nasty baby Sebastian Silva's nasty baby exactly all better per screen averages than burnt what were you going to say I just forgotten that the Martian

did that well but it was still the number one movie in its fifth weekend. Yeah. This was also a bad year for one of many bad years for the Weinstein Company. This was one of the years where they're like, we're not going to make as many movies as we used to. And they sort of actively downsized from producing around 18 movies a year to somewhere between 8 and 10. So this was their Oscar's success. This year is Carol. Right. Yes. Not even a Best Picture nominee. Yeah. But did well. Six nominations. I still say six nominations for Carol.

Anything else you want to say before we move into the IMDB game? Go watch Serenity. Yeah, yeah, very fair. Where do you think Uma's accent and this stacks up against her red, white, and royal blue accent? I... Have you not seen clips of her? Have you not seen clips of the accent from red, white, and royal blue? Her Texas accent?

That movie is none of my business. You're such a snob. That's a good book, I will say. bad movie, but it's a good book. And, and I... You know, I know a lot of people that love the book. I celebrate them loving the book. That movie, however... It's not good. It's not good. But in a way that, like, I did not regret the time I spent watching it, because even when it was not good, I had fun with the not goodness of it.

I think people were being a little extra about how bad it was. Just a little bit. Not much, but a little bit. Not much, but a little bit. But it was watching it because it was the thing that everyone watched, not because they won't. But I like that, but that's fine. To me, that's fine. I hate that, though. I'm not going to watch something just because everyone's watching it. But then you get to have conversations with people about it and, like, make jokes with people. But I want to have conversations about things that are interesting and good. Not things that everybody's watching just because they're watching it. I don't know. I think that's good and fine. This is why I don't watch a lot of TV. Okay, fair. It's the same thing. You should watch season two of the bear. It's really good, though. All right. I'll eventually watch it. I'll eventually watch it. Why don't you explain to our listeners what the IMDB game? is. Every week we end our episodes with the IMDB game, where we challenge each other with an actor or actress to try to get the top four titles that IMDB says they are most known for. If any of those titles are television, voice only performances, or non-acting credits, we'll mention that up front after two wrong guesses. We'll get the remaining

titles release years as a clue, and if that's not enough, it just becomes a free for all of hints. Free for all of hints. All right, Chris, would you like to guess first or give first? going to give first this week. All right. We've talked a bit about the work of Stephen Knight, including one of his films he wrote and directed, which is Locke, starring the one and only Tom Hardy. Have we not done Tom Hardy? Apparently not. Fascinating.

All right. Venom. Incorrect. Oh, bitch. Okay. All right. Inception. Inception, correct.

All right. Lock. Lock, correct. Okay. I knew you were going to be tricky. I don't do that to be tricky. You have this paranoia that, like, I do that to be tricky, and that's genuinely not something I don't. I don't trust you in the IMDB game.

You have too many times stated your intention to mess me up in this, to trust you. Mad Max Fury Road. Correct. Mad Max Fiery Road, where he plays Mac, Rocketonsky. All right, one more. One more Tommy Hardy movie. It's got to be Batman or the Dark Night Rises. Yes, Joe. That is the correct answer. But his role is pain. Bob Hardy's performance in the Dark Night Rises is correct. The Bills played their preseason game last week against the Steelers in Pittsburgh, and I did my same dumb joke I do every time I see that field, where I talk about how amazing it is that that field was able to be rebuilt after Bain blew it up.

Never forget. All right. That's because Bain is also a Buffalo Bills fan. He writes for the Buffalo Bills. Go Josh Allen. Immediately, the thing that I saw, because it was going around with Oppenheimer, that Christopher Nolan doesn't do ADR, and I was like, yeah, we've all heard Tom Hardy and Dark Night Rise. Girl, we know, he doesn't do ADR. Honestly, here's what I will say.

It's true. You watch Tenet, and you really can't understand what they're saying for a lot of scenes. But that's why Tenet is such a good vibes movie, because, like, you just let go and let God in that movie. The movie literally tells you not to think about it. Exactly. Tenet is one of the stupidest movies I've ever seen. It's so good. Not, brackets, not necessarily derogatory.

Tenet rules. There are moments in that movie where I'm like, this is so stupid. And then there's moments in that movie where I'm like, Jesus Christ, this is so fucking stupid. Tenet rules. Okay. So for you, I pulled from your favorite film Serenity. One of the cast members of that film, I pulled, Mr. Speaking of the recent Christopher Nolan movies, Mr. Jason Clark. Jason Clark, good actor.

Good actor. In a lot of, indecernal, like, Jason Clark was in just kind of a soup of very similar movies for a period. Indeed. Also, like, there was a year or two where he's indistinguishable from Joel Edgerton. zero dark 30 Correct Yeah I was going to say

You're describing one movie in particular With all of those observations Is he the bad guy in Serenity? He's the husband He's the abusive husband Yeah he's the abusive husband They have a wild sex scene Yes they do

That's right Because she has the yes daddy scene Yep I'm gonna go watch Okay Jason Clark Yes when did I first ever notice Jason Clark He's in

No, that's Joel Edgerton I was going to say Animal Kingdom When I first noticed Jason Clark Is an idea worth Exploring for me I'll do that while you try and guess I feel like Zero Dark 30 Was the first time I was like, Jason Clark

It's very possible Um I mean Oppenheimer's not there yet, but he's one of the people I could see Oppenheimer eventually showing up on their known for. Has he been in other Nolan movies? I feel like... What's the other movie that I stuck up for...

I stuck up for Jason Clark being good and not a good movie? Fine, I'll just say Serenity. Not Serenity. Not Serenity, yeah. there's like a bunch of genre stuff that he's done i feel like he has a weird franchise that like there's no television right no because he's not a game of thrones person is he no if he was if he was english then i would say uh yes but he is australian but like if he has part of the reason why we confuse him with joel edgerton yes i feel like there's some black

mass, because he's in something with Joel Edgerton? I don't think it's Black Mass. Well, it's Zero Dark 30. Yes, Zero Dark Trinity. He's in Zero Dark Trinity. But they're opposite ends of the movie. It's true. But anyway, not Black Mass. So your years are 2014, 2015, 2017. That's not any help. That's what you like to call the Jason Clark era. I'm in my Jason Clark era. Exactly.

Okay. So these are all after Zero Dark 30. They're also after The Great Gatsby, and I think for me it was the one-two of Zero Dark 30 and the Great Gatsby that made me take notice. That's the other one, by the way, that he's in with Joel Edgerton. Right, right, right. I'm going to check and see how many movies he and Joel Edgerton together, because what if it's like 12?

It's really silly that they maybe haven't ever played brothers? It is silly. It's true. Make another Kelly Gang movie and let Jason Clark and Jill Etcherton play brothers. Is he in Lawless? He is in Lawless. It's not one of them,

but he's definitely in Lawless. Is he... I've done so bad in recent IMTV games. I think my brain is cooked. I'll give you some clues in a second I just want to look up and see how many movies he's in with Joel Etcherton. Midnight Special is another one

that's conceivable that they're both in. But I don't think Jason Clark is in that. Okay, so it's actually only three movies. It's Gatsby, Zero Dark 30, and then a movie from 1998 called Praise. Let me see if they're both acting in it. It's a John Curran movie. Is it the Fat Boy Slim?

praise you video. Yes, it's the praise you video. Um, Joel Edgerton is Jason Clark in this movie? Sometimes they'll give you a collaboration and it's like one of them is in like special thanks and I really think that should be illegal to do that.

Nope, they're both acting in it. It's a John Curran movie, John Curran who directed um, oh something. What did he direct? Oh, he directed another Oh, he directed

We Don't Live Here Anymore I'm like, why do I know the name John Carr? He directed, we don't live here anymore And The Painted Vale He directed a movie in 1998 With Joel Edgerton and Jason Clark. Anyway, that's not one of his known for. All right, so clues, you want some clues.

I literally almost said Master Gardner. That is Joel Edgerton. That is 100% Joel Edgerton. That movie might have been better with Jason Clark. Okay, two of these are franchise movies. This is where I was like, Like, he's in franchises. I just don't know.

I can't remember what his franchises are because they're like, it's like Godzilla versus Kong. It's like movies where it's franchises where no one talks about their actors. Like, yes, that is true about it. Yes, definitely one of them. He's in the least well regarded installment of one particular franchise. It's the one that like everybody has decided to pretend never happened. They sort of rebooted things. Is it an X-Men movie?

Is it like X-Men apocalypse? No, it's not an X-Men. He plays a character who has been played by a lot of different actors over the years. They keep casting this character with a different actor every time. Is it a Star Trek movie? No. At different ages, in different, maybe timelines, I guess. Is it one of the Batman movies?

Not a Batman. The DC stuff, okay. Not a Batman. Well, I meant Superman. It's not a superhero franchise. And it's not like Transformers because none of those movies are well regarded. Right. It's a franchise that started in the 80s.

Not Back to the Future. It had one movie in the 80s, one movie in the 90s, one movie in the 90s, one. movie in the aughts and then three movies no maybe one movie around the end of the aughts so two movies in the aughts i guess and then two movies in the teens 80s and wow what is this this is the bad one um it's a terminator movie it's genesis it's terminator genesis he plays john connor in terminator genesis all right your other franchise he's in this is a well-regarded movie this is part of a trio of well-regarded movies. A trio of well-regarded movies, but not a franchise?

No, it's a franchise. It's a continuation of a franchise that was like a couple decades old by this point. Okay. I like this movie. I remember almost none of it. I think it's the middle portion. It's the middle one of this tree. they were all directed by the same guy who...

It's not the Hobbit movies. No. It's one of those where it's like, God, I wish these titles were not so similar because I can never remember which movie each title pertains to. And it's a basically rebooted franchise or extended franchise from something that was

years and years ago if we can consider like Terrence Malick a cinematic universe he's definitely in one of the like Night of Cups or song to song movies um okay all three of the titles are like

slight variations on each other so it's really hard to know what happens what each title what movie Is it a horror franchise? No, not horror. But action. Super, like, you know,

sci-fi action. Sci-fi action, not Star Trek. Right. No, it takes place on Earth. Basically a reboot Earth. The Planet of the Apes movies? Uh-huh. Okay.

I mean, I could ask you which one of the three that he's in, but that would, maybe I could get it from that. He's in the most kind of actor-intensive of the three. The most actor-intensive, that's the first one, which is Rise. Well, no, that's, you're actually right, and I don't mean that. I mean the one where the performances are the best. Yes, it's Don. It's the one where the performances are the best.

I think Don is the best of those three. Yes, okay, so one more, not a franchise. 2017 an Oscar nominee Oh, okay In a couple different categories In a couple different categories Does that mean not Best Picture?

Right Acting nominations Uh-huh, one Mudbound It's Mudbound He is the lead in Mudbound Very good He and Garrett Headland

Yes, he and Garrett Headland. Good movie. Good movie. Yes. All right. Well done, Chris. You finally got it. Jason Clark. An interesting known for, and that they're four very well-known movies, and yet it's very hard to pick them out as his own for. And to pin them as, you know. And not Joel Edgerton movies. All right. I think that's everything, Chris. I think we covered it. We did it. We burned it. Soup to nuts with burnt. Yeah, we burned. it. Didn't we? We burned it to the guy. You burnt. All right. That is our episode, everybody. If you want more, This Had Oscar Buzz, you can check out the Tumblr at This Had OscarBuzz.com. You should also follow our Twitter account at Had underscore Oscar Buzz and our Instagram at This Had Oscar Buzz. A reminder to go to Patreon.com slash This Had Oscar Buzz to sign up for This Had Oscar Buzz Turbulant Brilliance.

Our Patreon membership for $5 a month where you can get two extra episodes every month. It's going to be fun. Chris, where can the listeners find more of you? You can find me on Twitter and Letterboxed at Crispy File. That is F-E-I-L. I am on Twitter and letterboxed at Joe Reed, Reed-spelled REID. We would like to thank Kyle Cummings for his fantastic artwork, Dave Gonzalez, and Gavin Mevious for their technical guidance, and Taylor Cole for our theme music. Please remember to rate, like, and review us on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, Google Play, wherever else you get your podcasts. A five-star review in particular really helps us out with Apple Podcasts visibility. So send back that cayenne pepper, cake, inedible dish. And while you're waiting for a new one,

write us up a nice review, won't you? That is all for this week. But we hope you'll be back next week for more buzz. You're part? Thank you.