This Had Oscar Buzz - 337 – To the Wonder

Episode Date: April 14, 2025

With the whispers and rumors that Terrence Malick’s Jesus film The Way of the Wind maybe possibly perhaps who knows could finally premiere this year after filming in 2019, we thought it was time to discuss his work. One year after The Tree of Life earned Oscar nominations and the Palme d’Or, Malick had perhaps … Continue reading "337 – To the Wonder"

Oh, oh, wrong house. No, the right house. We want to talk to Marilyn Hack, Merlin Hack and French. Dick Pooh. Speak with me. Love is not only a feeling. Love is a duty. To commit yourself is to run the risk of failure,

a risk of betrayal. But the man who makes a mistake can repent. You fear your love has died, he perhaps is waiting to be transformed into something higher. Hello and welcome to the This Had Oscar Buzz podcast, the only podcast taking the four-hour trek to Belfry to teach Marseley and Hugo educational law. Every week on This Had Oscar Buzz,

we'll be talking about a different movie that once upon a time had Lofty Academy Award aspirations, but for some reason or another, it all went wrong. The Oscar hopes died and we're here to perform the autopsy. I am your host, Chris Fyle,

and I'm here, as always, with the mother-father who always wrestles inside me, Joe Reed. Hello, Chris. I whisper, because my thoughts are so profound.

I don't know French. I can't even remember the word for hello in French. Bonjour, Chris. Bonjour. Oh, it's bonjour. Bonjour. Bonjour.

Bonjour. Oh, God, in heaven. I actually should probably know. Just we, baby. It literally opens with her saying newborn. I wrote this down. The first word in the movie is newborn. I opened my eyes.

Yeah, that makes sense. Can I make you really mad at me at the top of this episode? What? Kind of like this movie. Thank God one of us does. I was so worried that you were going to hate it. it and it was just going to be like two grumpy gay guys bitching about this movie. No, I need it.

I need you to like this movie because I super don't. There's limitations. We'll get into it. There's limitations. We'll get into it. I mean, I need to see song to song again because I think I was unfair when I saw that movie. And then like a year later, I was thinking about it a lot.

And it was one of the movies in my mind that strikes my memory that I turned around And I was like, you know what? I was wrong about that movie. Can I tell you I've maybe not seen a Malik since Tree of Life? Is that possible? Well, you just watch this. Well, but I mean, up until yesterday. Didn't see Night of Cups, didn't see Voyage of Time, didn't see Song to Song.

Night of Cubs, good movie. Didn't see A Hidden Life is good. I think you would like a Hidden Life. It's also just three hours long. And it's three hours long of Malik doing his thing. Yeah. So a Hidden Life, I think, is, I mean, We won't get too into that

Because that's a movie we could do The degree to which Everybody agreed that the Tree of Life was a masterpiece Like a best of the decade Best of the New Century All Time Classic masterpiece And I was like What?

Go watch it again It is a masterpiece Fucking make me Like absolutely not No But like no What I figured out was just like I don't have

the gene. I don't have, most, some people think that cilantro tastes like soap and I think that like Terrence Malick movies are just like not for me. Taste like soap. And, and that's fine. I love Badlands and I'm fine with that. That's good enough for me. Do you like Days of Heaven? I think Days of Heaven is beautiful. Days of Heaven doesn't like moves. It does. Thank God. It does that. The problem with to the wonder is that like it does not move. Days of Heaven looks and sounds. It just is there. beautiful and wonderful. And, like, that's often good enough for me. I just, like, I don't, I just don't know if I ever, like, think about, like, Days of Heaven as, like, a movie I love.

I will say, I'm leaving space for the new world, which I watched probably not paying it close enough attention the first time I saw it. And now that I have the criterion, I really want to, like, sit down, maybe take an edible and just sort of, like, watch it and sort of like let it you know wash over me um so i'm leaving space for that um but oh boy that criterion package is absolutely stunning did i ever not connect to this and this one reminded me so much of the it almost felt like the tree of life like uh b sides you know what i mean it almost felt like a b side to the well so much was uh did not make the final cut of this movie in particular that it's hard to tell what was and wasn't a B-side. Well, right.

It just feels, though, that's just like, it's very similar concepts, both sort of visually and, um, spiritually, I guess. I know the Tree of Life isn't about God as much as this movie is about God, but like, Tree of Life is quite a bit about God. It's quite a bit about God. See, every Terrence Malick movie is an attempt to commune with a higher power. Great. And, like, a Terrence Malick movie is never not going to be about God, which is, like, his new movie that theoretically could be showing up it can, could be in the lineup by the time this episode drops.

All right, Charlie Brown, take a nice running start at that football and tell me how that works out. It's Terrence Malick's movie about Jesus, and it's like, well, of course, of course, of course, eventually. Right. He's going to literally just make a movie. Right. about actual religion. But we'll see. What's interesting about that movie is I think it's the longest gap between shooting and release,

if it's even getting released this year. If it gets released this year, granted, it's Terrence Malick, so they always could, there could have been other bits of filming in the interim. But the movie filmed in 2019, pre-COVID. Oh, I know. It's been on my like movies to come out this year spreadsheet for fucking ever to the point where I refuse to put it on this year because I'm like, hmm, fool me four times. Shame on me. Fool me five times. Shame on you. I actually think you would really respond to a hidden life.

You'll probably respond to the new world. I heard good things. I'm hopeful. I just, I mean, I was hopeful about this one too, honestly. You know, if only because I love. Rachel McAdams so much, but... I'm Rachel McAdams for all that placement on the poster that, you know, we joke, everybody jokes about how there's only the one Killers of the Flower Moon still. There's only the one the whale still. This has been a thing for quite some time because to the wonder, only had that still with him and Rachel McAddolls.

And it was false advertising, false advertising about how much of the movie was actually going to feature Rachel McAdams. And Rachel McAdams will be getting into a six-timers quiz today. Indeed. Well, we should also say, when you say, we should say that at least Rachel McAdams is actually in the movie and is in more of the movie than like Adrian Brody is in The Thin Red Line. When you talk about Malik and you're talking about, you know, false advertising, it's a different scale. So the people in this movie who filmed to varying degrees that did. did not make the final cut include Jessica Chastain,

reuniting from Tree of Life, Rachel Weiss. Is that true? Yes. Really? Oh, God. And Jessica Chastain, if I remember correctly, did make comment that she was like, I didn't film for very long on that movie. I'm not surprised I was cut.

Rachel Weiss, though, I think was a little surprise. She didn't make the movie. Poor Amanda Pete. Like, imagine. Amanda Pete is. I imagine Amanda Pete being like, wow, Terrence Malick, like, that's a big break for me. That's like leveling up to a different level. And then to just, like, not be in it at all.

Michael Sheen as well, who was dating Rachel McAdams at that time. This is why Terrence Malick is a recluse. Because he can't, if he walked down the street in Hollywood, he'd just get pelted with fruit by all the people who he's cut out of his movies that over the years. Well, he works off the grid, basically, so that he can make the movies the way that he wants to. He's not, you know, in the Hollywood machine. Days of Heaven kind of robbed him of that, or, you know, maybe he was never meant to be making movies within studios.

I mean, the way of the wind, he's been figuring out what he wants to do with the movie for a while. And also I saw on the film stage today that there might be a longer cut of To the Wonder Coming. I think the movie would maybe be better if it was shorter. Yeah. Okay. Also, at this point, I have to imagine that he. He's in on the joke of the malloc thing, the fields of wheat, the, you know, the running water. To name your new movie, The Way of the Wind, he knows, he knows what we all say about him, right?

The Way of the Wind. He's supposed to be a very lovely man. Listen, I'm sure. I'm sure he is. But, like, as a professional, he's a pain in my ass. So a pain in your ass who you haven't seen half of his movie. Yeah, okay. but if you at some point have seen like three in a row where you're just like oh boy like at some point

I think you're being unfair to the tree of life you should give it another shot I don't know man I don't know to the wonder though I think to the wonder kind of stands to prove that at least in my opinion there are people who love this movie way more than I do and I'm I'm gonna stick up for this movie on this episode good I'm glad I think it's his most plot If not plotless movie, if not plotless, just kind of threadbare in terms of the main narrative is this basically love affair that Ben Affleck's character has with Olga Curlienko's character. In France, they come to America, immediately it doesn't start working. He has an affair with Rachel McAdams, and eventually he and Olga break up. And meanwhile, Javier Bardem is a priest who is also an immigrant.

I kind of want the version of this movie that is explicitly about Bardem. Well, the only way I think this movie is worse is if it's explicitly about Bardem. I mean, I kind of think that that was the stuff that was for me easier to, like hang on to that it feels like you're grappling with a theme and not just this kind of doomed love story that feels a little repetitive. But that theme is just so blatantly like hammered. Like I just, it's just Javier Bardem wandering the streets of Oklahoma speaking the theme and hushed

tones in a in voiceover. It's just like, oh my God. Like, God, where can I find? you. I look for you and I don't find you. It's like, look up your own butt. God forbid cinema be a little poetic, Joseph. Well, this is, okay, so this is my problem. This is why I'm glad. I do agree with you that it's like, in terms of obviousness, that is a fault of the movie. You know, like, these are these are similar themes for Malik that he has explored much more gracefully. Well, and this is also why. I'm glad that, again, I'm glad that you like this movie because I was worried that, like, if it was the two of us exactly on the same page, we don't need, like, two of us sounding, like, you know, at the risk of sounding like dumdums who can't appreciate, you know, non-narrative cinema or whatever. Like, I'm fine with one of us doing that. So I will, I will take it. I think this is a movie that makes a lot of sense that it frustrates people or that people reject.

I get that. I totally get that. I think, I mean, I think people are unfair to others of his movies because they're better than this. Like, Knights of Cup, Night of Cups is really good. I want to try song to song again. And it's just, this one feel, this is where you feel that he found the shape of this movie in the editorial process. And, you know, it also, in contrast to... Like, you read about the process of it.

It doesn't really have a script. His instructions to Affleck and Kurolenko in particular are just, like, just like, be constantly moving. And I'll follow you with the camera and, you know, we'll figure it out. And, like, don't really talk. Just sort of, like, move around. And I imagine, I mean, if you, like, all of the dialogue is done in voiceover. Yeah, there's basically no dialogue. And if you hear the people on screen speaking to each other, it's extraneous.

It's an accident. This is all about the visual language of the movie. Right, right. Like, Kurlanco has described it as more of, like, a dance piece than a film, which, like, from her perspective, you can sort of get where she's coming from with, like, especially her character, where it's just, like, constant moving to the... I mean, it's one of the things I find so frustrating about that character. where she's just sort of like constantly riving against everything.

And it's just, I feel so fucking edgy. There's people who are good in the Malick style of improvisation and people who aren't. People who are maybe not a fit. I mean, Chastain's incredible in Tree of Life. I think Chastain is good. And I think Pitt is good in Tree of Life. it's just like in service to what like ultimately like the bigger picture of tree of life

and everything involving like Sean Penn walking along the water and everything with like the fucking dinosaurs and like all that I was just like I have no patience for this and even the stuff with chastain and pit at some point I'm just like I get it you know what I mean I'm just I'm done I'm done you've worn me out Terence like congratulations to anybody who find something like genuinely if you find something in the tree of life that is like spiritually fulfilling or just like gets your rocks off cinematically rad i fucking love that for you i i there are things that i love that those people probably find fucking stupid and like that's cool like that's fine with me um and you know such as such as the you know the wonder of uh cinema

Joseph, how do you feel about the thin red line? Somewhat similar. I find the thin red line tedious. I find the thin red line over long, overly. Like, I don't, I don't vibe with the ponderousness. I just, I think it's tedious. I find it tedious. I mean, but like, what about as an aesthetic experience?

I mean, I would argue thin red line is Malick's best movie. A lot of people do. But, like, as an aestheticist. if we're if we're just going to call or if we're just going to focus on that just for a second of what Malik is what his whole vibe is and like can you get on the wavelength of that's a movie I'd be more the visual the sonic the structural experience of what his movie that's a movie I'd be more willing to go back and see again just because the first time I watched it I was 19 you know what I mean and I haven't seen it in full since then. So, like, that definitely feels more like something that I would benefit from rewatching, although I'm not guaranteeing just from, you know, my reaction to his other movies.

I'm not really hopeful that it'll click for me. But I am, it seems likely that I will find more in it to enjoy. It's just a matter of blocking out, you know, three and a half hours. hours with no distractions, um, which is not easy. How long is, thin red line? That's about right. Thin red line, I think, is less than three hours. Is it? God. I don't think he's made a movie over three hours long. Could not have told me. Could not, could have fooled me.

To the wonder, I mean, when I was like, oh, this is less than two hours, great. Doesn't, doesn't feel it. Days of Heaven is 90 minutes and that thing fucking flies. Yes, Days of Heaven moves. And like, and it's, I mean, I say Badlands is my favorite Terrence Malick movie, which to he says nothing because like Badlands is the least Terrence Malicky, Terrence Malick movie. So like it's almost just like saying I like 70s movie. It's a movie of its time more than it is a movie of its director. And that it makes a lot of sense to me that like that's my favorite Malik.

I don't know. I mean, while I think it's reductive to talk about Malik just in terms of aesthetics, I do think it's important because I find that that's kind of the access point. for how he can pull you in to a movie. You know, the visual storytelling, you know, the juxtaposition of where he's jumping to and from in various timelines, because of course nothing's linear. It's not even, like, on the same plane.

This movie is way more linear than I thought, though, actually. Yes, yes. Weirdly, like, this movie doesn't really jump around. I kept thinking, like, when is this happening? And then all of a sudden, I realized it, like, oh, no, this is just like one thing is just happening in chronology after another. It just doesn't seem like it should be. It's not like this happens and then this happens and this happens. It might be like, and then later.

Right. But like it doesn't ever go back on itself or it doesn't jump ahead of itself. It, you know, everything is in the line. Right. Not a thin red one. It's mostly gold and wheat. contaminated with groundwater from oil wells and whatnot. Joe, we have a Patreon before we get into a 60-second plot since we're kind of drifting towards the moon.

No, this is the one thing I want to talk about before we even get into talking about the Patreon. Okay. Can you remember the person that came up with the joke to the wonder to the walls? It's the only thing I ever think of when I see the title of this movie is To the Wonder, To the Wall. It's a great show. In my memory, it was Matt Patches on Fighting in the War Room. I was listening to a Fighting in the War Room episode, and I can't remember in what context it came up. But Patches, like, as an aside, was just like, to the wonder, to the wall. And I lost it.

But I have since, I think, mentioned it to him. And he doesn't remember saying that, but, like, that also doesn't surprise me, where he would just sort of, like, toss that off. But, like, I'm, like, 99% sure that that's where, uh, that is where it came from. And I have been stealing it ever since, gleefully. Do you think Terrence Malik has ever heard a little John song? God, I hope so. That's his next movie after the Jesus movie. He's making the little John movie.

But it's called like, you know, a breeze to the heavens or whatever. Something, a euphemism for sweat dropping down your balls. Dew drops of the morning. It's just the vulgarness of calling a Terence, like referencing a Liljohn's song's specifically that one for a Terrence Malick movie. It's just incredible. What a good, what a good line. Anyway.

To the wonder, to the walls. To the wall. To the Patreon. Tell our listeners about our Patreon. To the Turbulent Brilliance. Yeah, this had Oscar Buzz, Turbulent Brilliants, is our Patreon for $5 a month. You will get two bonus episodes every month from us right here. First of those episodes every month is what we call an exception episode.

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had Oscar buzz and sign up today. Joseph, to the wonder. To the wonder. To the wall. Maybe, perhaps even to the wall. Yes, perhaps. If you behave. A movie.

A movie from 23rd. Written and directed by Terrence Malick, starring perhaps. Perhaps for the only time ever. These four people. I don't know. I could see Bardem doing it again. No, I just mean all four of them together. Like, it just seems like as a quartet, like it's an odd quartet.

An odd quartet is the title of this movie. An odd quartet. I mean, what shitty movie would they be in otherwise? It would be something you don't want. And I think the you don't want the presence is Ben Affleck, like a C-grade thriller. I mean, that's probably the best case scenario. I think the worst case scenario is like they're all in a Pirates of the Caribbean sequel or something like that. I mean, you know, Bardem's already done that.

They wouldn't have to cover Ben Affleck's tattoos. We'll get into it. Well, there you go. Okay. His tattoos are up close and personal in this movie, and they are so fucking ugly. You can very much tell that this movie and Argo, where he also. made sure to gratuitously take his shirt off were around the same time. Gratuitously, I mean, he's with two actresses who are naked, and he refuses to take off those jeans.

Well, it's true. They were completely naked, and he's nailing his jeans. You wanted to compare to the gone girl, schlong girl. Oh, which I see. Why did nobody call it schlong girl in the headlines about Ben Affleck's piano? Why not? What is wrong with you? Missed opportunities from 2014, friends.

Again, my conspiracy theory is that is CGI. Well, but in your article, investigating that phenomenon, you should have called it Schlong Girl, is all I'm saying. Well, hire me to write that conspiracy theory, and I will call it Schlong Girl. All right, done. I'll give you 5% of my rate for that piece. That's your book. You're going to pitch it around town. It's going to be called Schlaug.

Long girl. And it's an examination of penises in cinema over the years. I would write that book. Honestly, you should. Publishers, get at my, get at my man here. My way to a publishing fee. Anyway, to the wonder stars Ben Affleck, Olga Curlenko, Rachel McAdams, and Javier Bardem, a bunch of other local actors in the Texas scene, and a lot of actors who got cut from a movie. The movie World premiered in competition at the Venice Film Festival, played Toronto. We will get into it because I do remember when those reviews hit. And then opened limited and day and date VOD April 12th, 2013 the next year. Joseph, are you ready to give a 60-second plot description for To the Wonder? Sure.

Let's just say sure. Okay. All right, then your 60-second plot description 4 to The Wonder starts now. Amid fields of wheat, literal, running water, literal, and whispers to God, seemingly also literal. Mute American Ben Affleck and low-key lunatic Olga Kurlenko, meet in Paris and fall silently in love as they traips around the city being chased by a mad Mexican with a paniflex camera. They move back to Oklahoma in the United States with her daughter, who was maybe 10 years old and overly impressed with American supermarkets. Ben has a job testing groundwater around oil wells for contamination, which is about as uplifting as it sounds. So he's no fun.

And then Olga Karolenko takes to like wandering around room. in their house and walking up and down the streets of Oklahoma until her daughter finally picks up on the bad vibes and goes all little count cake, you're not my dad on Ben Affleck, at which point mom and daughter moved back to France, and Sad Fleck moves on to his childhood crush Rachel McAdams, who works on her family's failing farm. And she has the most beautiful, shiny, voluminous blonde hair of anybody who's ever worked on a farm, like put her in an ad for Pantene Pro Farm Feed. And so she and Ben hook up for a while until that relationship also dies on the vine

after which point Olga returns to Oklahoma having dropped her kid off with their dad for forever, I guess. So this time she and Ben Tithin up for real, and they're happy for like three spins through the wheat fields before she again becomes restless, which in this movie equates to writhing theatrically whenever Ben touches her, and once again wandering the streets of Oklahoma at dusk. Only this time she catches the eye of Skinny Pete from Breaking

Bad, and his methy charms cannot be resisted, and they have sex in a motel, and then she confesses to Ben at the drive-through at infidelity fillet or wherever, and then Ben kicks her out of the car and then changes his mind, but they definitely get divorced, and she has a kid at some point who might be Ben's or might be Skinny Pete's, but who definitely needs to find a therapist as

soon as they're legally able. And I think Olga stays in Oklahoma, but she moves somewhere else where she can wander the fields and see visions of the French basilicas she left behind. Oh, and also Javier Bardem is there, too, playing a priest who talks to sick parishioners and also God. And he looks about as happy as someone who does that all day can look. Jesus Christ, this movie. 40 seconds over.

I think you should feel great shame about that because there is no plot. There is absolutely no plot in this movie. Okay, okay. As the defender of this movie, I have to say... Yes. You are wrong on no point. Yes. And yet I still think that it's better than that.

What I think is bad about this movie is the central relationship. There's no there, there. And I think... She goes off her rocker immediately for no reason. Like, she is just absolutely portrayed as a crazy woman who you have ended up in a relationship with. Like, truly. But he's even less of a character, though. Well, right.

he's just mopes around all the time. It's so strange. You literally feel like it takes like an hour and a half into the movie to get a good look at Ben Affleck's face. And he is the protagonist of the movie. Actually, that applies to her too. Like this movie like steadfastly avoids getting a good look at people's faces. I don't know if I agree about that with Olga, but because she's maybe the protagonist of the movie. but it isn't really...

But what do we really know about her, ultimately? Like, they're all sort of ciphers. I mean, a character is not, like, something we talk about when we talk about Malik, but I don't think he's necessarily bad at, like, developing these characters. Look at Tree of Life. Like, those are, like, clearly defined characters doing the things that turns out of us. It's like dad, mom, brother, brother. You know what I mean?

Like, they're definitely, like, playing archetypes there, but there is more of story. And it's easier to maybe dismiss to the wonder because the archetypes that you're dealing with, it's like, it's not even melodrama. It's a little bit like romantic cliches of this like basically breakup movie. It's the before trilogy in one movie, except what if they never talked instead of what if they always talked? Like that's sort of, they meet in Europe, they move, you know, they get breakup, they get back together, you don't know what's going on. things happen in the interim, except, like, in this movie, like, nobody talks ever. There's no real interesting dynamic there. And I understand that this is one of Malik's more personal movies. You know, people have basically interpreted this is one of his earlier, like,

it's basically his final two marriages. And then he ended up, he's still with the woman that basically, that, uh, Rachel McAdams. portrays or she's a version Yeah, oh that's interesting You know, Darren's Malik Who never gives interviews Would never speak specifically to this But it is my understanding

That it is the interpretation That he is representing A certain part of his life Gotcha But it's also just like As a divorce movie There's not I think, you know

The language that those movies Usually work under Is dialogue Rather than a visual language and then there is a lot of repetitiousness to the ebbs and flows of this relationship. But I think I hear you in the spirituality of this movie, you think it is obvious and basic.

I hear you, but I also, I think that's the strength of the movie. It's not his most interesting, like, spiritual examination that he's ever made. Sure. But I do think, like, that's the better substance of the movie. The Javier Bardem character, who's this priest who is in this, like, local community, he's trying to do good, trying to, like, have this type of spiritual connection and be this, you know, religious figure for the community that he serves. But he's also incredibly lonely, incredibly isolated while also going through this. this type of spiritual crisis. That, I think, is at least interesting.

I don't really get how, I guess it's supposed to be reflective of this relationship that is repeatedly falling apart, you know, that, you know. His relationship with God is paralleled with Affleck and Kurilenko's relationship. Right, like, what is a divorce, if not a spiritual crisis? Right, right. But it's like there are also this relationship that was kind of always doomed to fail, you know? they have this kind of, at least what we see, they're this whirlwind romance that can never really exist

outside of the whirlwind, you know. And you get this real juxtaposition between, you know, the European sequences where they're like wandering through Paris. They're on the bridge with the locks and all that stuff. And, you know, they're going around seeing beautiful things. and there's um they go to is it normandy that they're at where there's the castle i text you i love when they go to hoggworth with the basilica on the hill in the tide pool or whatever yeah yeah and i mean it's all stunning to look at it like it's very easy to buy this romance for these people who we

have no idea who they are yeah um but then when you get to america the immediate juxtaposition is that like every everything in Europe is old, you have these castles, and therefore it is romantic there. And literally the rest of the movie takes place in like a new housing development, surrounded by half built cookie cutter houses. I will say, like, I will give Malik and Lubitsky credit for the fact that they still make that look beautiful in its own way. Like, there is beauty in that photography. Yeah, beauty because, like, the way they see the world is beautiful. But I will say, you know, people who live in Texas love the shit out of Texas.

Yeah. Malik, for a Texas filmmaker, he makes Texas look fucking depressing. It's Oklahoma, though. It's Oklahoma. So maybe that's some shade. Oh, is it not set in Texas? I guess I assumed it's set in Texas because he lives in Texas. But, like...

At least it's filmed entirely in Oklahoma. I'm pretty sure it's canonically Oklahoma. Oh, there you go. But these, like, housing developments. It's all cookie cutter. The home that they live in, I was like, can these bitches buy some furniture at all? They like go like...

Put some shit on the wall. It's like without ever buying furniture. Like, what the fuck? It's literally like they walked into a just built home and started filming. It's so depressing. There's the scene after she has the trist with Skimmy Pete and then she leaves while she's in the shower or whatever. Another man with ugly tattoos.

And then she walks. out into like the parking lot of this Econo Lodge and has to like find her way home, which is when I sent you the photo of the old timey car that's in the shop for no reason. And all I could think of was like an old timey car in Oklahoma. Who's driving that

thing? I was like they just have cars like that. It's just De Niro with the goggles from fucking Killers of the Flower Moon. But yeah. Yeah. There's something about you know, what's more

interesting to me in this movie is not the relationship, is not the characters, but is just the environment that they exist in. And obviously the way that Lubeski and Malik are capturing this environment. Just a, juxtaposition he shows between the sites in France and, like, what is the thing the little girl loves in America is the fucking supermarket? Like, drag us, Terence. Jesus. You know what? I believe it. I believe it. I believe. that we have better supermarkets than Paris does. Eat at France. Our aisles are wide and pristinely clean.

They do go to a laundromat at one point in this movie. I was like, why are they in a laundromat? They definitely have appliances at home. They should at least, except they don't seem to have anything in their home. So maybe they don't yet. Affleck is not right for Malik. I would think Damon would be great For Matt.

More so, yes. Yeah. Affleck does it. Like, there's nothing on his face. You know what I mean? Like... Yeah. For something that's so reliant on, like, movement and spontaneity and expressiveness.

Yeah. He's not your guy. Why do you think then that Mallet casts him? Because he seems so careful in his casting. Funding, maybe? I mean, like, you could see how. But coming off of Tree of Life, maybe he wouldn't, like, I don't know, he's coming off of his biggest success. Right.

Well, they filmed this before Tree of Life premieres, shortly before it premieres, I thought. Or maybe it was between the Cannes premiere and, well, it arrived at audiences. But see, Tree of Life was, like, in the editing room for a long time. And then part of the lore around Tree of Life is in 2010. and they have a private screening just for buyers at the Telluride Festival. And, you know, that's how, like, whispers of the movie get around, searchlight picks up the movie,

then it shows up a can, has its summer run, and then, you know, it's Oscar history. But they film, I'm positive they either film this before Tree of Life opens or around the time. of its opening. Gotcha. Gotcha. So it's like it wasn't necessarily, like he didn't have a palm yet, you know. But that also then puts Affleck at sort of like the ebb of his time as a movie star, too.

You know what I mean? We're like this is sort of in between when he's just doing directing, like Argo hasn't happened yet, obviously. Yeah, it's interesting. He definitely doesn't bring much to. the movie. You can see why you might think Affleck could be a fit for what Malick goes for. I mean, look at some of the other actors he's had

before, like Christian Bale, Colin Farrell, the millions of guys that are in the red line. But like, the goods are not there. I think the same is true for Olga Karolenko.

I think... Olga Carlanco is one of these actresses, and I don't mean to slight her as much as it's going to sound. But for a while there, it really felt like she was sort of being pushed on American audiences and being like, no, this is like she's going to be the new sort of thing. She's, you know, she's in the Tom Cruise movie. She's in the Malik movie. Like, what else was she doing around this time? Movies that don't necessarily ask a lot of her. And now she still works a ton.

She's going to be in... She's going to be in Thunderbolts. She's going to be, you know, her character from Black Widow is one of the ones who's in Thunderbolts. But what is she in around this time, though? Because it's this oblivion... She's in seven psychopaths, speaking of Colin Farrell. What's the Melissa Leo Oblivion quote? You are a member of a success.

team, something like that. Oh, yes, yes. Essentially, yeah, you are no longer a successful team. I think Melissa Leo is a hoot in that movie. She's in Death of Stalin as, like, the least interesting, like, the unfunny one in the death of Stalin. Obviously, her character is, you know, you know, not one of a lot of fun, but, like, that's everything in Death of Stalin.

Like, everybody is able to, like, find something, you know, in that movie. But, like, she does the job. in these, like, kind of action environments or darker environments, but she's not... Well, she was in Quantum of Solace. That's probably... She's the female lead in Quantum of Salas, which is, like, real big step down from Ava Green. It's the one Bond of the... Shot during the writer's strike.

It's the one Daniel Craig Bond movie that I haven't seen, but it's supposed to be really bad. It's bad. I think that movie is partly to blame why I'm just out on the Craig Bond movie. bonds. And she kind of gets shown up by Gemma Arderton, who I think is like the more compelling, more magnetic agent who's playing Strawberry Fields, an MI6 agent, so there you go. So, there you go. And I think, you know, the stuff you're saying about how she's just like flailing like a madwoman throughout most of the movie. You know, having these two. performers who are maybe not the most naturally expressive people is not the fit for Malik.

I mean, Affleck has been good cast intentionally as non-expressive. Yes. Gone girl is his best performance, and he's supposed to be... Although I wouldn't call him non-expressive in that, in as much as he is, he's a person who other people are able to sort of write their own narratives onto. Um, because his public persona is so, um, not bland exactly, but sort of just like overly eager to please. And I think everybody sort of distrusts that. Um, that is, I mean, talk about a movie that knows what to do with him. Like Fincher, Fincher is almost just like, I got a new G.I. Joe doll. And I am going to just sort of just like, you know, bend and stretch and do whatever I need to do with this guy. Um. It's great. What a great movie. Javier Bardem, however, I would love to see him actually be the protagonist.

Sorry to interrupt you. I'm going to let you go back to that thought in a second. Could we get away with doing Gone Girl as an exception? Well, here's the thing about Gone Girl is people forget that it only got that best actress nomination. So, yes, we could get away with that. I think we should try. We'll save it for Valentine's Day. It's one of my favorite romantic comedies. All right. Go back to your point about Harvey I'm sorry to interrupt you.

I think he's a great fit for Malik. I mean, like, just Javier Bardem, a camera shows up and suddenly he has the weight of time and human suffering on his face. Like, he's, he's that guy and he's, you know, he's able to conjure an inner life from very little. And, like, that's one of the things that makes him one of the greats, right? Like, I think he takes me out of it a little bit is what I will say. Why? He's too famous to be a priest in small town, Oklahoma. I do kind of feel that way, where he just sort of like, it's like, oh, wow, did you know that your priest is Javier Berndham?

Like, um, which I know is sort of like an unfair thing to do with like, you have too much faith that like the Catholic Church isn't struggling to find priests. Well, God, if the Catholic Church could find Javier Bardam to, uh, to, to be a priest, they, their problems would be solved. The conclave would be over, honey. They'd have figured it out. Um, he's, he seems so extraneous if, like, if only to ever. serve as a mirror to this relationship. But, like, you know how there's one fast track to not get cut out of a Terrence Malick movie, play a priest. Yeah. He is not going to cut that character.

Well, and I also feel like at the time they made this movie, I think he's a different Javier Bardem than he is now. I feel like something in the sort of post-Skyfall era of his career. And Skyfall comes right around the time of To the Wonder, where it's like... But he'd already had the beauty. beautiful nomination too. Right. But what I, but I think what I'm thinking of is like, it's the, it's the Javier Bardem of the counselor and Pirates of the Caribbean and Mother and, and you know, I love Mother, but you know what I mean? And, like, and Dune and being the Ricardo's. This movie is five years removed from Mother. And do, like, it's the Javier Bardem who is King Triton and the Little Mermaid and who is in Laila L'Ill Crocodile. And I think he's great in Laila, crocodile. But you know what I mean? It's a different. He's more of a, he's more. He's more. Hollywood now. He's very Hollywood now in a way that he wasn't maybe back to bed. He's in being the Ricardo's. I get it. I get what you're saying. I just don't think this performance is like those performances. I agree with it. I think it's just, but I think that's, I think it's just in explaining why he kind of takes me out now. I think it's of no fault of the movie at the time. I think the movie didn't know that in 10 years he would be playing King Triton and The Little Mermaid. And it's a, it's, you know, not.

Ned Affleck would be playing Batman. Yeah, well, yeah, exactly. But anyway, I think I... I think I may be a little bit... I was a little bit unfairly dismissive of your notion that the bar-dum stuff is the more successful thing because I think the one area in which this movie, I think, could have grabbed me is

every once in a while, it's sort of headfakes towards... Where it's seemingly going to become a little bit about the community that they live in, the sort of, then it's going to, you know, they show these, you know, short little scenes of Affleck doing his job and he's testing the groundwater and all this sort of stuff. But he's also, like, interacting with the community members who, you know, from- Are unhappy about- And you can't ever really hear it because, of course, like, the dialogue is intentionally sort of, like, muted. But they're having problems and their children are getting sick. And it's very sort of, you know, the Hinkley, California for PG&E and whatnot. But it's clearly like these communities are suffering because of this company.

And he's a member of a regulatory agency who is ultimately not empowered to do much, but just sort of confirm the thing that everybody. knows, which is this environment, this land is toxic, and we can't sell our homes because nobody will buy them because it's on toxic land. And what are we supposed to do? And I think for Malik, Malik is content to just sort of show us that and be like, think about that for a while. And I see that stuff. And I'm like, no, make the movie. Make this more part of the movie. Make this, you know, a little bit more of, you know, Affleck having to, like, interact with this, or reckon with this, or

Bardem having to do this. Or, like, what does these people's plight ultimately, like, ultimately dovetail with Kurlenko's character? Does she ever sort of look beyond herself at any point to see that other people are suffering, too? Because, like, what we get of her character seems incredibly selfish and seems incredibly self-involved and my malaise. Or it's like, girl, just, my malaise is the only thing that matters. Why'd you move back to Oklahoma? Like, don't move back to Oklahoma then. Like, it's, but it just feels like Malik is not interested in doing anything with that character besides sort of showing that she's impossible. Like, she could never be reached. You know what I mean? That kind of a thing. I do think that this, I mean, everything to do with like the spiritual compass of the movie, the socioeconomics, stuff of this movie is the better substance of this movie, and, like, the relationship stuff is weak, and it's just kind of supposed to be a reflection of that, you know, this home is on poison ground is both literal meaning and, you know, metaphorical meaning.

And I think if you asked Malik, he'd be like, that's enough. Like, that's, you know, I've given you that sort of poetic juxtaposition. he's like what I imagine he'd be like what more do you want from me from this and I think where I come at it I'm like well a story and I imagine he's like I'm not I don't do that and well and like the you know we we can make jokes about the whisper narration and like can and Williski's sweeping character just has emblematic of the Malick thing but the other thing about the Malick thing is you know know, all of the movies in that poetry are basically reaching out to a higher power begging for salvation. That's what his movies are doing. And if anything, the pieces are not all in place and to the wonder for that to really connect in a way that I think it does connect in like the new world or in Night of Cups or Thin Red Line. Or Tree of Life, I guess, if that works for you. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Um, I can see that. I can

understand that. So, like, ultimately, it's his most, this is his most despairing movie, for sure. Well, I'm glad I picked up on that correctly at least, because it definitely does feel despairing. Like, no, I'm not even joking. Like, you know, I, yes, I was despairing, but I'm mostly talking about the actual characters in the movie who all definitely feel like they're despairing. I did keep thinking of

first reformed whenever I saw Bardem's character, where I was just like, you know, movies about priests who like, whose worldview Who maybe shouldn't be pretty... Well, whose worldview has been absolutely just sort of like battered and beaten because of the things they have to see every day.

Because of their job. Well, I just, I mean, in First Reformed, it's a lot more dramatic. He's obsessed with the end of the world and environmental collapse and whatever. But in this movie, I was just like, what must it be like? Because, like, that is a lot of the day to day

for priests is they just sort of go around their community and they visit people who are dying, they give last rights and they visit people who are dying and they visit people who are sick and they visit people who don't maybe have family members to come see them. And I imagine that must, like, weigh on somebody quite significantly. And, like, that must really impact somebody's worldview to sort of like, this is the part of the world you see all the time. And, like, and not to be like, you know,

you know, do you ever experience any joy, Father Flanagan or whatever, but it's like... But there's that fabulous scene with, I think it's the church janitor who's like trying to get him to see the joy in, for lack of a better phrase, binding God's light. Like, he's truly just like, he's having him. He's like, I see the actual light and I see spiritual light in this light. That seems... I love that. It's, I mean, I do think it's interesting, having grown up Catholic, and like, I grew up Catholic in an era where, like, there were already dwindling numbers of priests, but, like, definitely, like, had come across plenty of priests in my lifetime, whether that be just like parish priests at the various churches around here, I grew up in an area with just like, I mean, Buffalo in general just has like a lot of churches. And so, and I had friends who went to different parishes in. Of course, every time there's a christening or a First Communion or whatever in the family, you're going to a different church. So, like, you sort of, like, there's a lot of, you know, you end up, you know, seeing a lot of priests around. And, of course, the dominant narrative in the last 20 years or so has been the absolute sort of amorality of the Catholic Church when it comes to bad actors in the church, which I've also, like... Not experienced, but, like, one of the priests who, like, came and ministered to my grandma while she was dying ended up getting accused of, you know, misconduct and whatever.

It's just like, and it's one of those things where you almost, you know, you're just sort of just like, yeah, well, yeah. And that's, it's fucked up. But it also does make you appreciate, I think, what strength of character good. goes into being a good priest. Like, what does, like, what does, what does that even entail? And, like, there's the argument of, like, is there such a thing as a good priest? If you, if you have to imagine that they, like, are the one priest who has, like, no knowledge of anything bad going on anywhere ever or, like, you know, but I just imagine that, like, to sort of have this be your job, not just sort of, like, you know, doing the liturgy every week or whatever, but, like, ministering to people.

Like, as I said, you want Aaron Priestovich. Not even Aaron Priestovic, although there are priests who, like, get into, like, social justice causes and stuff like that. Absolutely. Like, that's, you know, but I just mean, like, the ones who literally, like, and again, I sort of go back to, you know, my family, like, when my grandparents, I, you know, when all of my grandparents were sort of reaching their end. And, like, they all were sort of active enough in the church.

or, you know, where they had, you know, priests come over and they just sort of like come over and they sit with, you know, your relative and they'll sit with you. And it depends. Like some of them are more sort of personable than others and some of them are more aloof. Um, but it just, it's a, it takes, I imagine it takes a lot of a person to sort of be there for people in that capacity. all the time so well yes um and i know various clergy who are in therapy even in good uh i imagine you know because that's just that's just like smart yeah self-care probably yeah i don't know i i think it's interesting to just like pull back on us as a show uh or as people that like You are so stooped in the Catholicism, and none of the, the religious stuff in this movie doesn't work for you and feels basic and obvious. And I am the one who has finally settled into my comfy shoes of atheism. Right. I've finally accepted that. And yet the religious stuff in Malik's movies, or I guess the reach for that spiritualism that I think his work does, does work for me. It hits you on whatever level.

Yeah. It hits you on whatever level works for you, and I think that's great. And I think that's interesting. It is interesting, yeah. But, yeah, Bardem, I appreciate it. To take it back a little bit to what you were saying about how he's like, well, he's playing fucking King Triton now. He's pirates, you know, like. Ricky Ricardo.

He's not playing a pirate. He's playing a fucking pirate these days. I don't know. I guess I'd maybe maybe taking him a little bit for granted, though. I do think he's great in the Dune movies. Oh, I love him. He's so funny. Yeah.

I'm not even like necessarily giving a blanket criticism to all of that. Because, again, he's like, he's the most Hollywood bar dem of all of them in Lyle Lyle Crockadale. And I think he's great in that movie. I'm definitely on the- I was happy to see him in this mode, and maybe that made me appreciate him all the more, that it's just like, he can just show up and be, like, fun the feet up a full, like, fleshed you and with various internal sufferings. And, like, he, he just appears on screen and you believe him as that guy. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. What do we think of McAdams in this movie in terms of the character she's given to play?

how I feel about her performance and the character she's given to play are two different things because I think the character as she's asked to play it is just like pure suffering like she's been through horrible things and goes through this heartache as well and I feel like her character is basically

kind of just asked to suffer McAdams however I think is the best performance in the movie. She also looks goddamn beautiful I mean, like, Garnier Fructice, honey. I'm saying, I'm saying, what are you, what kind of treatments are you? I mean, she's a damn star. Yeah. She's a character actor who is also a star, which is why I kind of feel like she's perfect to be in a Malik movie.

And this is kind of an odd point in her career, too, I think, where she's, because, It's before her Oscar nomination. It's before her Oscar nomination for Spotlight. And that... Speaking of... And that comes in a real weird year for her. Because, like, people forget that, like, Spotlight comes towards the end of the year

and that Oscar nomination sort of is a late-breaking one. But, like, that's the same year she has both Aloha and Southpaw. So it's just like, ooh. But, like... But neither of those were her problem. No, of course not.

Like, those movies never got pinned to her. But they don't do anything for her either. You know what I mean? No. But you look at, so she has this, like, great breakthrough year, a couple of breakthrough years in 04 and 05, where it's like mean girls, the notebook, wedding crashers, which say what you will about wedding crashers, it was a giant hit. So it really increases her star power. And I imagine her quote. It's great in that movie.

Red Eye, which I don't think you can call it underrated anymore because there's a critical mass of people calling it underrated. There's so many gay guys who love Red Eye. Rightfully so, it fucking rules. and then Family Stone. And so, like, those five movies in those two years really, like, establish her. And then from that point, I'm like, Rachel McAdams is going to win an Oscar soon. And then from there, she's in that movie The Lucky Ones, which is the movie about the Iraq War slash Afghanistan veterans. It's her and Michael Peña and Tim Robbins.

And it's directed by Neil Berger, who was just coming. like directly coming off of the illusionist. And I remember being like, oh, that's, that's promising. And it just got. Wasn't that a TIF, Gala? I think I, all I remember about that movie is it was delayed. I remember it was like delayed significantly. And by the time it came out, like all of the, the air had gone out of the balloon.

Delayed more than to the wonder a fucking Terrence Malick movie. And then, of course, like, we've done the episode on state of play. And like that obviously doesn't, you know, land. the way she, you'd want it to. The time traveler's wife is another sort of deflated balloon, right? Which, like, people had hopes for that because of the novel and whatever. Sherlock Holmes is another one where it's just like, it's a hit, but she's like the girl. Like, her role in that movie is the girl.

So she's got two Sherlock Holmes movies, which at least makes money. And then it's just like a series of movies which either we have higher hopes than what they deliver, which is something like morning glory or it's something where it's like it is a hit but her character isn't good in it which is midnight in paris which is like she gets to play the woody allen hates women character um she's in the vow but the vow doesn't really do anything she's in um it makes a lot of money she's in the de palma movie passion which her and numie repas which all that movie's fun there is a that movie's weird dumb and fun that movie i always um twin with, is it Chloe that came out around that same time?

Yes. Right. Yes, because they're both like erotic thrillers. Right, right. And then To the Wonder comes out around that time, but then also about time, which is another great movie, but she probably has the least interesting part in it because she's kind of, her character's kind of underwritten. She's more of an object than a subject.

she's in Anton Corbyn's A Most Wanted Man, which I think had a lot of... Good movie. It is a good movie, but it didn't really hit. And which is too bad because it's one of, you know, Philip Seymour Hoffman's final performances. So it's just a lot of almost but not quite there, right? Where it's like, I don't even know what movie in there you point to as like, well, she should have maybe gotten nominated for that.

I don't know if anything in that little... Yeah, she's in a lot of movies that she's kind of actively elevating them by the quality of her performance. But, like, it's not always giving her enough to really do that it singles out that performance. And so by the time you get to Spotlight, you're a decade past her breakthrough era. You know what I mean? So then the Spotlight nomination almost feels like a soft comeback, even though she had never gone away. She had been working actually quite a lot. but it did feel sort of like, oh, you know, Rachel McAdams is sort of getting her due.

I was really glad she got that nomination. And then since then, she's, you know, she's thankless role in the Doctor Strange movies, but that's kind of a whatever, and I'm glad she's making money. But when she's doing other stuff, I think she's really very impressive. I think she's very impressive in disobedience, her and Rachel Vise. I was going to say, we're going to do a six-timers for Rachel McAdams. and we haven't done disobedience or are you there, God, it's me, Margaret. I'm saying, disobedience is great.

Game Night, which is not an awards movie, but, like, everybody I know who's seen that movie loves her in that movie. She's really, really funny. Right. I think she's great in Eurovision Song Contest, which was like... Oh, my God. People talk about Barb and Star as being on the, like, Mount Rushmore of COVID movies, but I think Eurovision Song Contest also belongs on that Mount Rushmore.

I don't love the movie as much as I love her in that movie. I think it's a fun movie. I do. I think it's a very fun movie. Should have won Best Original Song. Her is holding Eurovision's Oscar for Best Original Song. And then you mentioned, Are You There?

It's Me, Margaret, where she was robbed. Like, this is the movie where she was robbed of an Oscar nomination. She's so fucking good in that movie. Her next thing is Sam Ramey's next movie. Send help if this is actually getting made. I know it's on her Wikipedia. Wikipedia is usually more circumspect than

IMDB is. Yeah, because, like, IMDB has, like, every single Scorsese movie that he said, maybe I'll make this someday. Right. A woman and her boss struggled to stay alive on a remote island after a plane crash. Come on, Rachel. I'm into it. You know what?

I'm down for it. I mean, I'll show up for her for anything. Yeah. And Ramey, like, Ramey's going to do an interesting movie. I'm glad that, like, he sort of brought her with him from Multiverse of Madden. And he's just like, all right, let's do a movie together. And then, of course, she's done TV, True Detective. She's in the, like, sort of misbegotten season of True Detective.

I kind of want to watch that season because I love her. Some people stick up for it, but the people who stick up for it stick up for the Colin Farrell parts of it. She's in, what else is she in TV-wise? I think that's kind of it. Well, she started with Slings and Arrows, which is a Canadian show about the theater, about the Stratz. Yes, we should mention Rachel. McAdams his Canadian excellence. She has Canadian excellence, absolutely. But she hasn't really like done TV in like the sort of everybody gets a streaming series era. Like True Detective was

still when that was, you know, HBO and before streaming really boomed. But she does seem like the kind of actress who, if you told me she has a eight episode, you know, FX on Hulu series coming up, I would not be surprised. And I would probably be excited for her, although I like when people stay and remain movie stars. And she is definitely that. So, as you mentioned, we are at our six-timers juncture with Rachel McAdams. I texted you the other day that we have 40 actors who are on the precipice of six-timers. If you hate when we do this quiz, sorry about it. First of all, why are you here? Second of all, buckle up because we're probably going to have a lot of them this year. Because it's unavoidable.

Yeah. Yeah, we're reaching that point. So anyway, we've done six Rachel McAdams movies. It's stretching from our first, you know, few months to to now. We have, and again, Chris, as always, I encourage you to write these down because they will be your answer bank for this quiz. The Family Stone was our 27th episode. Morning Glory, about time, state of play, the notebook, and now to the wonder. So her films, have spanned 300 episodes on this podcast, and isn't that excited? So, as always, when we reach the sixth movie from a certain movie star, I give Chris a little quiz, where the answers are one or more of those six movies. Chris, are you ready? Yeah. Okay. So, the very first question, we do our basics, which was the longest? Um, the notebook?

No. Ooh. State of play? State of play. 127 minutes. I will say all of her movies are generally within like a very, there's not a wide range of running times in these six days. I thought the notebook was like 215.

The notebook is 124. So two hours and four minutes. So very close. Shortest. One of these has to be like 90 minutes. No, maybe they're all about the same. Is it morning glory? It's not morning glory, although morning glory, I believe, comes close.

Family Stone. Family Stone, by three minutes, actually. Family Stone is 104 minutes and morning glory is 107. Best Rotten Tomato score. Huh. Is it a... Oh. I think it's about time.

It's not. I kind of probably would have guessed that as well. Morning Glory. It is not Morning Glory either. Is it the notebook? It's not the notebook. The notebook was only 54%. State of play, 84% on Rotten Tomatoes. That's insane.

Isn't it? That movie, I do not remember a damn thing about that movie. And that movie is definitely not that good. Worst Rotten Tomatoes percentage. To the wonder. To the wonder, 48%. Yes. Biggest box office domestically.

Notebook? $81 million. Lowest box office domestically. To the wonder. Oh, by quite a bit. $587,000. Yes. Day and date, as you mentioned, it opened day and date.

Which we had a question about that. Day and date, meaning that when it was released in theaters, it was also on that same day released on VOD. Yeah, it's a term that's not used anymore. Yeah. All right. Which three of these movies were written by their directors? To the Wonder.

Yes. Family Stone. Yes, Thomas Bazooka. And no, I don't think it's the notebook. State of play? No, not state of play. About, oh, it's about time. Richard Curtis, yes.

Which movie was written by multiple Oscar nominees? State of play. State of play had three writers, Matthew Michael Carnahan, who has never been nominated, but Tony Gilroy and Billy Ray were also credited writers, and they have both been Oscar nominated. Which two movies were released in the month of November? About time. Yes. And Family Stones, December. Yes.

Morning glory? Morning glory, which I would have always thought was a spring movie, but that's a November movie. No, that's why it was in the Oscar. Which two movies were released in April? State of Play. Yes. And to the wonder. And to the wonder.

Yes, very good. Which movie has the same composer as Jupiter ascending? Oh, who did that score? Um. I'm going to guess the notebook because those are both the same corporation. Not a bad guess, but no. Morning glory No

Is it about time? No, this is a hard one It's honestly like It's the last movie you would expect To the wonder? No Okay fine, family stone Family Stone Michael Giacchino

Did the score for both Jupiter ascending Interesting And the family stone Is that not interesting? Which two movies had Or which movie had Which movie had the same composer As Independence Day?

Oh, I don't think I remember who did Independence Day. Which is kind of surprising because it's a very memorable score. But I don't remember who did it. He's not really a name that jumps out at you, I will say. It's not like a Henrik Gregson Williams. I think I've, much respect to Mr. Gregson Williams, I think I've used that multiple times on that lovely man. Morning Glory. It is Morning Glory.

David Arnold did the scores for both Independence Day and Morning Glory. Which movie has the same cinematographer as Barbie? That's Rodrigo Prieto. Yes. Who shot Morning Glory? No. About time? State of play.

Rodrigo Prieto shot State of play. Which movie has the same cinematographer as Reality Bites? Oh, no, wait, this is to the wonder. It's Emmanuel Lebeske, did the cinematography for Reality Bites, one of my favorite facts. Which movie has the same screenwriter as I don't know how she does it? To write the answer. Is that Thomas Basuja? Is that the Family Stone?

No. Morning glory. Morning glory, Alien Broch McKenna. Wouldn't it be wild if it was Terrence Malin? It would be wild. Terrence Malix, I don't know how she does it. She walks by. I don't know how she does it.

Morning. I open my eye. Which movie played at the New York Film Festival? About time. Yes, that's where I saw it. Which movie was filmed at locations in Connecticut and New Jersey? Family Stone. Family Stone.

Which movie was filmed primarily in South Carolina. The Notebook. Yes. Which movie was filmed primarily in Oklahoma and France? To the Wonder. Which of these movies was a Golden Globe nominee? Family Stone. Family Stone, Sarah Jessica Parker.

Which of these movies was a SAG Award nominee? About Time. No. Um... Oh, the notebook. The Notebook. The Notebook, James Garner. Of these six movies, only two were not.

nominated at the casting Society of America What to? To the wonder. Yes. State of play. No. Oh, wow.

Casting Society nominees, state of play. About time? Yeah, about time. Casting Society loves them from Rachel McAdams. If you have cast Rachel McAdams, casting Society of America said,

you have done a good job. I bet they nominated. Are you there, God? It's me, my friend. They should have. Which of these moves? Abby Ryder-Fortson, by the way, shows up in the pit uh season one and is great so uh are you there god it's me margaret

supremacy uh trucks on all right which of these movies was a nominee with the editors guild because they i think they do genre so i'm gonna guess about time was a no but good guess very good guess Was it Family Stone? It was the Family Stone. It was like contemporary comedy or something like that. Which of these movies had 11 teen choice nominations? The Notebook. Yes.

Three wins, 11 teen choice nominations. Which movie has IMDB keywords that include pregnant wife, terminal illness, and giving a toast? Family Stone. No. But that all counts? It does. About time. About time, yes.

First, I normally don't fool you with those, so I'm glad that I fooled you with that one. Which movie has IMDB keywords that include ex-beauty Queen, employer-employee relationship, and scoop? Morning Glory. Morning Glory. Very good. Which two movies feature stars of Blade Runner 2049? Well, Harrison Ford. Who is in?

uh morning glory yes gosling is in the notebook yep very good morning glory on the notebook oh here we go uh which two movies features stars of mother um to the wonder harvia brought em yep and is ed harrison one of these no oh no it's um It's Donald Gleason in about time. Very good, very good. Which two movies... As Cain.

As Cain, right. Which two movies feature stars of young adult? Patrick Wilson's in Morning Glory. Yep. And Elizabeth Razors in Reiser. Someone yelled at me. It is Reiser. Whichever it is.

Family Stone. Yes. Which movie opened the same weekend as Unstoppable? A movie about an unstoppable train. Was that a December or a November release? I'm going to say it's about time. Not about time. Morning glory.

Yes, morning glory. Which movie opened the same weekend as the three burials of Melchiatus Estrada? Uh, state of play? No. To the Wonder. No. The notebook. No.

Damn. Why did I think that this was earlier in the calendar? year. Family Stone. Family Stone. Yes. Which movie opened the same weekend as Fahrenheit 9-11? The notebook. The notebook. I can't believe we didn't discuss that when we did our episode on the notebook. You know, it was a moment in time. Which movie opened the same weekend as 42? That's an April movie state of play. No. To the Wonder. To the Wonder. To the Wonder. Open the same weekend as 42. That is our Rachel McAdams quiz. Very well done, Chris.

We love you, Rachel. We love you, Rachel. All right. Rachel, Rachel, Rachel. Of the actors... Sidney, Sydney, Sydney. Wait, what is that? That's Rachel getting married. Oh, yes.

I prayed for you, Rachel. What a great movie that is. Of the actors who were left on the cutting room floor, Jessica Chastain, Rachel Vice, Amanda Pete, Barry Pepper, Michael Sheen, Which of those are you most sad we didn't get to see in this movie? Rachel Weiss, because I would love to see what she does in a Malik movie. Yeah, I think that's same. I think that's same.

I really wonder who all of these people would have been, like, in this. Like, where do they fit in? Where is their room for other characters? Is this just like... Olga's female friends that she needs. That she desperately needs, right, exactly. Like her Jessica Chastain and Rachel Weiss Okay, how wild would this movie be

If all of a sudden it just cuts To like the local Applebee's And it's Olga, Jessica Chastain, Rachel Weiss and Amanda Pete Just like having like Martini's or whatever Martini's and Half off apps Boneless apps

Honestly it would improve her mood She'd be a more well-adjusted She'd learn to love Oklahoma If she could just get into apps and desserts At Applebee's I mean this is a movie that does at least address that somewhat because there's that other mom who's like, you know, my daughter's a little bit older than yours, but like, you know, you know how it is

and tries to be your friend. And Olga's like, no. Is there ever any lead up to the daughter just sort of like turning on Affleck? The most French daughter ever. Truly the most French daughter. Absolutely no rhyme or reason to her. One thing I wanted to bring up, this gets nominated, well, nominated. This shows up on the Village Voice film poll at the end of the year.

Number five, Worst Movie of the Year. Fifth Worst Movie of the Year. Did you look and see what the other ones were? It's a nice little survey. It's a nice little survey of what was awful that year. The worst film of the year, according to the Village Voice Film Poll, was Only God Forgives. Nicholas Vending Refins, Only God Forgives, followed by a Good Day to Die Hard, Grownups to, pain and gain, a movie that I know

a lot of people stick up for, including our friend Katie Rich, and to the wonder there in Fifth. So... A lot of mailness. Yes, it's true. It is true. Yeah, I guess the only woman on a poster there are the wives

and grownups too, which I'm going to click on the poster and tell you. I know one of them, Salma Hayek. It is Salma Hayek. Maya Rudolph, and who is this blonde woman? Who are you? Maria Bello, Jesus. It's Maria, God is, that is a horribly airbrushed Maria Bello.

Yeah. So the poster for grownups, too, is literally Adam Sandler, Kevin, James, Chris Rock, David Spade are like living it up on a roller coaster because they're crazy guys. And it's literally their wives on the bottom half of the poster, like looking up at them with expressions that read from. Fists on their hips Like crossed arms Disgusted Salma Hayek Just Maya Rudolph rolling her eyes And then Maria Bello

Sort of like These guys I'm gonna make these guys Some Totinos The pizza rolls Like that's the That's the look on her face With a

With a weapon You would have to force me To watch the grownups movies I feel like With some sort of threat of violence That's what would get me to watch those movies I'll take the knife please Yeah, no.

If given a choice between grown-ups two and the Tree of Life, again, I would watch the Tree of Life again. See, that would be a good decision. That would be the right decision. Okay. What else? What else? I think one of the significant things that this movie does hold its place in time is that it's the last movie reviewed by Roger Eber before his death. Yes.

The review is published a few days after he died. I actually... That man was reviewing movies literally up until the day he died. Like, that's really incredible. I mean... It was what he loved to do, West. Like, you know...

God willing. Yeah. Let me have that life. Yeah. I pulled some of the review because I... I just because it was his final review, but also I think kind of got

at what I've been trying to... All right. Some of this, I agree with some of it. I don't, but I just wanted to read some of Roger's final words. As the film opened, I wondered if I was missing something. As it continued, I realize many films could miss a great deal.

Although he uses established stars, Malik employs them in the sense that the French director Robert Bresson intended when he called actors models. Ben Affleck here isn't the star of Argo but a man, often silent, intoxicated by love and then by loss. Bardem, as a priest far from home, made me realize as never before the loneliness of the unmarried clergy. Wondering in his empty church in the middle of the day, he is a forlorned, figure, crying out in prayer, and need to commune with his Jesus. A more conventional film would have assigned a plot to these characters and made their motivations more clear. Malik, who is surely one of the most romantic and spiritual of filmmakers, appears almost naked here before his audience, a man not able to conceal the

depth of his vision. Well, I ask myself, why not? Why must a film explain everything? Why must every motivation be spelled out? Aren't many films fundamentally the same? film only with the specifics change, aren't many of them telling the same story. Seeking perfection, we see what our dreams and hopes might look like. We realize they come as a gift through no power of our own, and if we lose them, isn't that almost worse than never having had them in the first place? What incredibly powerful words to basically leave us with, and just kind of a core philosophy that I also kind of align myself with. I have some quick, I have some, I don't know if Affleck is quite the Brassonian model that Ebert sees.

Well, and I also don't know if I, I ever truly, you know, track with that sense of movie making anyway. That's all, it's, I don't, it's not what I go to movies for. I don't know if I track with Versaun as a Malik reference, you know, Brisson's movies are, like, still And Malik kind of can't fucking sit still in this movie. No, it's always moving. Like that's, I mean, as I sort of said, you know, what Karolenko had said about, you know, she always had to be moving. Like, that was her one direction was just like, don't ever stop moving. And like, you can tell, like, it shows.

The opioid crisis hitter. I don't know. I mean, that also feels like it's, you know, sort of there's a lot of things sort of lurking at the periphery of this movie. I don't know. Like, I, in, you know, talking about this movie with you, I definitely am more willing to grant it, you know. I'm certainly, certainly my plot description is the most glib I'm willing to be on this movie. Well, it demands so much patience.

And that's why this as an Oscar prospect, when it showed up on the 2012 festival season. Yeah. It's just one of those lessons that, like, well, just because. one movie hits doesn't mean another one will because this is him, I think even pushing in a certain direction further than Tree of Life, though Tree of Life has like mysticism and, you know, history of the earth elements tying into this very personal, you know, memory play, basically. Chris, I'm going to ask you, I'm going to ask you to sort of go with me on an exercise very quickly. I would love this.

Close your eyes and imagine yourself. I know where you're taking it. Actually, close your eyes. Imagine yourself. It's the evening. You are seated at the Princess of Wales Theater. You have seen, let's say, three movies already today. You're on your fourth movie.

You've sort of stood in line for a while waiting for them. Like the movie before this had gone long. The talkback had gone long. So you're loading into the movie theater late. Then you have to, you know, I don't know if Malick. would have shown up there for a, you know, He did not. But, you know, one of the festival programmers

talked for a while about why they love Terrence Malick. And then, you know, 15 minutes of pre-roll. And then there you are, finally. Caroleenko and McAdams were there. So you're watching to the wonder. In this particular environment, how are you feeling? I, whose decision was it to put this movie

in the biggest venue. Because I understand, yes, a festival needs to sell tickets. And like after Tree of Life, you know, this is the thing of this movie in terms of awards. It's like, this is his movie that he follows up Tree of Life with and Tree of Life, you know, as much as, you know, he had that 20-year gap between Days of Heaven and Thin Red Line.

It really felt like Tree of Life was the... the homecoming for Terrence Malick at that time. And not really the fully predicted Oscar nominee leading into nomination morning. Then he gets the picture nomination, the director nomination. Yeah. And then this movie, which is you have to work with this movie. Like you have to get on this movie's level. And you want to put it in this huge venue when I saw that,

Like, I can feel the air leaving that room. It's not going to do the movie any favors. Where do you put it? What kind of a theater do you put it in? You put it in the light box. Yeah, but I don't know if... Did the lightbox exist then? I'm not sure.

This would have been the year right before... No, two years before I did Toronto. Or you put it in one of the smaller venues that are still fancy, you know? Yeah. But, like, that's like two. thousand people at one time watching this movie. Was that a gala? I imagine it was a gala. Like, it wasn't. It wasn't. It wasn't. But I looked up the premiere. It was in Princess of Wales. And I just think, you know, as far as programming goes, you can understand, yes, they could probably sell that many tickets to this after Tree of Life. But, like, I remember waiting for those reviews because I was, like, excited to hear about this after Tree of Life. And, like, it was a thud. Yeah. You know. And, and. I think certain environmental considerations do go into...

Oh, absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah. Responses like that. Where did Tree of Life premiere Venice? Or can? Can. It won the palm.

Of course. Of course, yes. Yeah, I think that's... I mean, maybe that's just... Maybe Toronto in and of itself is maybe just not a great venue for Malik. Well, and yeah, generally. It played at... It was in competition at Venice.

this was like kind of a notoriously it won a prize but not one of the like official prizes it was sort of one of the off brand no it wasn't it wasn't like the the competition jury that it got one of those sidebar prizes we make fun of um and not even the for presky prize it was the signus the signus award Chris what does the signus do since I was so glibly like we make you're down with the Cygnus you are um Podcasts over. Thank you. This has been actually the Lander episode. Hold on a second. No, let me find it. All right. Venice Film Festival. Wait, Cygnus Award. Come on. That's a pretty good joke. Come on. You got to give me that. Cygnus Award. World Catholic Association of Communications. A Roman Catholic. This movie won a Catholic Award? I tell you I am shocked. There you go. Okay. So that makes a ton of sense then. There we go. What are the other movies that won? The Master was the big movie. in competition this year. It won two prizes. The rumor was they also wanted to give it the Golden Lion, but they were like, you can't just award that movie. The Golden Lion winner is Piataw, Kim Keduck's film. This is a few years before Kim Kuduk would have rape and assault charges brought against him. Oh, I didn't know that. Ooh, God. Yeah. Jeez. Well, and then died of COVID, right? Yes. God. That's just sorted all around.

isn't it um okay Cygnus Award it's not giving me I want a list of just Cygnus award winners it's just sending me to the Cygnus page um did that award get they only do it when there's

So the award this past year was the Cygnus Award went to I'm still here Walter Sal's I'm still here sure the year before went to Yo Capitano Matea Garoni's You know, Capiton. Sure.

The year before that, I'm just going to do these for a little bit, and then we'll be done. I suppose this is Italy we're talking about and, you know. Listen. Catholicism. Catholicism is big in Italy. They love it. What's another notable one? Heard of it.

Oh, De Palma's Passion was also in this competition lineup. You can see why a jury wouldn't give that movie prizes, but it's a lot of fun. I will say the master is the movie that sort of like stands out, obviously. from this lineup. It won Did it win? It won the Silver Lion, which is basically Best Director, and then it won

Best Actor as well, in a shared prize. Roma won Signet. My favorite Paul Thomas Anderson. Is it really your favorite Paul Thomas Anderson? We'll have to figure out, wait, is there Paul Thomas Anderson we can do? Punch Run Club, baby.

Oh, then we'll, and I think we have that on the schedule for whenever this spoiler alert to the listener. you know, whatever. Let's, we, I feel like we'll give a little tease, but uh, around September time when, uh, when that movie finally comes out, which I think we can settle on like, this is going to be the title, right? One battle after another. Yeah, that's on a trailer. Yeah. Um, which is exciting. I thought that was a very exciting trailer. I'm, I'm, I'm excited. I'm, I'm, I'm always excited for Paul Thomas Anderson movies. And then there's always something when I watch them. And I'm just like, everybody. shut up. You don't like the people who like Paul Thomas Anderson. I don't not know because a lot of my great friends like Paul Thomas Anderson movies. I sometimes don't like the, um, the extraness with which people sometimes talk about the Paul Thomas Anderson. I don't love, but if I loved the movie, I would be absolutely like down with it. So it's always like a movie that like I like, I'm not fully on board with. And then all of a sudden everybody's like, great. Greatest thing ever. And I'm just like, or it's just like, good. I act, I mean, I thought Lickrish Pizza was a flawed movie. I thought inherent vice is a super flawed movie. But you'll get people being like inherent vice masterpiece. And I'm like, okay. There's a lot of people that that's their favorite. Yeah. But like, what am I supposed to do with that? What, what, what am I supposed to do with that? I have no place to go. So, you know, whatever. I mean, I probably have the most divisive as my favorite. It's the master. Yeah. I mean, I mean, but see, I have to be. be like boring old boring and be like boogie nights is my favorite paul thomas anderson but

boogie nights rips it's the best i love it all right um what else i didn't really take notes on this one um besides my my plot description notes there's a there's a shot where they go to sonic and no one has ever fully captured the majesty of sonic better than lebeske and um malick listen Emmanuel Lobesky, follow me next time I go to Palm Springs and I hit up the Sonic in Palm Springs. Is there a Sonic in Palm Springs? Well, yeah. Oh, yeah, there is.

I've never gone to that. Get some cherry lime aids and then bring them back to your pool at your Airbnb and live the life. I get a cranberry lime aid because I like to just like sour myself out of all these buds. Keep your urinary tract infections at bay. I get it. Um, I did write that this movie was catatotically heterosexual. Absolutely no reaction to me mentioning urinary traction infections to Chris File. Absolutely not.

I wash. No, but you didn't, I wanted, I wanted you to like yell at me or something like that. And you just absolutely just stonefaced it. I was, I was enthralled by my own notes. I was saying I wrote down that this movie is catatonicly heterosexual. Well, you're right in both of those terms. Oh. Yeah.

No, this is one of my last notes because it's in one of the final sequences of the movie. Okay. Ben Afflex tattoos are the ugliest thing that are in any Terrence Malick movie. You don't even get the back one. Well, I don't think he had the, he didn't get the back one. No, right. They were still married. Right.

They were still married at this point. Yeah. He has the ugly shoulder one that's just like, what do you do it, my guy? Like, the absolute roller coaster that this culture has gone along with wanting to like Ben Affleck so much. And, like, he makes it so easy sometimes, then he makes it so hard. My, like, whatever, I have a whole complicated thing about Ben Affleck. And it will continue to evolve. My newest obsession is just, like, how often he, like, sets up a photo op for himself

looking beleaguered. Like, remember how, like, the one time he spilled Duncan at the doorstep? And, like, that was fine. But then he kept doing it. And I'm like, well, now you're doing it on purpose. Like, no one person has, ever attempted to, like, carry that much Duncan into their home. So, like, clearly, like, this is a bit now. But I mean, that was COVID entertainment for us. So you can't fault the guy

for keeping us entertained. Listen, Barb and Star, Eurovision Song Contest, they're on the Mount Rushmore of COVID. I refuse to put Ben Affleck and Anna da Armis and their photo bombing or whatever as, uh, okay, the Anna da Armis cardboard cutout sandy being thrown away by a guy who at one point people thought was Casey Affleck in a mask and turned out was not Casey Affleck and a mask. That was great. But again, it all just feels set up. Like, none of it feels genuine anymore. And I just, the romance, the romance of Ben Affleck spilling Duncan on his doorstep has left me and will never come back, I feel like.

Like, now that he's making ads, Super Bowl ads for Duncan or whatever, I'm just like, it's, we're over. I've said it before. I'll say it again. I'm not a Duncan person. Duncan hits when you do it sometimes. Bland. Well, as coffee, if you're like a coffee person, I will absolutely grant that to you because like I don't care about coffee. I don't even think the donuts are that good.

If you get them fresh, this is the thing. Duncan donuts don't stay fresh for very long. Tim Hortons have better donuts. Certainly like a crispy cream. You can't really compare. Like comparing... I'm maybe just spoiled for good local donuts and pastries. Well, of course, but like good local...

I'll take you on a tour. Good local fill-in-the-blank is always going to be better than, like, chain. I really think you have to compare chain-to-chain. Chain-to-chain, my favorite Terrence Malick movie that happened right after Song to Song, where it's just him filming at different national chains. Wow, that's the new way of the wind title. How did you get to see that movie? Chain to chain, yes.

If that movie comes out this year, if it doesn't come out this year, whenever it comes out, we're going to get the whole hand-wringing of Terence Malick is a recluse. Yada, yada, yada. And it's not that he's a recluse. It's just that he doesn't do interviews. He doesn't do... More and more, the idea of the recluse is really appealing. So I'm less and less apt to, you know, dunk on anybody for being a recluse.

Be a recluse, man. Live your life. But, like, I think he teaches. Where? I don't know. Texas? Wonders around Texas. Through the weed fields, arrives at a school, gives a lecture.

Good for him. Should we move on to the IMDB game? Yeah, why not? Every week we under episodes with the IMDB game where we challenge each other with an actor or actress and try and guess the top four titles that the IMDB says they're most known for. If any of those titles are television shows, voice-only performances, perhaps a non-acting credit. We mentioned that up front. After two wrong guesses, we get the remaining titles release series as a clue,

and if that is not enough, it just becomes a free-for-all of hints. All right, how are we doing this today? Are you giving or are you guessing for us? I'll guess first. All right, so you mentioned obliq, just early when we were talking about Ms. Olga, her role in Oblivion. From Oblivion, I chose her co-star, Andrea Reisbrough. Oh, love it. Okay. I feel like we've done her before, but I completely forgot what her known for would be.

She's not on the spreadsheet. Um... Is W.E. one of them? Incorrect. Is to Leslie one of them? To Leslie is correct. Amazing. That movie would otherwise never be there.

Yep, yep, yep. Is Battle of the Sexes there? Battle of the Sexes is also incorrect. So you look at your years. Okay. Your years are 2013, 2014, and 2020. So not Death of Stalin either. Her best performance.

I say is her best performance. So is Oblivion? I genuinely like her as a performer. I do, too. Leslie's a bad movie. No, I think she's a great performer. That's the thing. I just think she's so funny in Death of Stalin.

What does she say? Like, are there no flowers? Are we just, are there no flowers in words? It's just weeds. Oblivion is Oblivion one of them? Oblivion is 2013, correct. 2014 and 2020?

Yeah. What was she doing in 2020? 2014. Let's see. Is it a movie I like? I don't. Don't think so. It's a movie that I like. Oh, no. Oh, no. Generally, people don't like this movie. Oh, is she in Birdman? Birdman is correct. Who is she in Birdman again? His new girlfriend? She's one of the ensemble members. She's the one who like makes out with him in the hallway and then slaps him. And I think says she's pregnant. Right, right. All right. Her character is definitely not one of the things I like about the movie.

Right. 2020, is it an Oscar movie? Absolutely not. Um, is it a dumb, dumb, dumb, dumb movie? I wouldn't say that. This is a, uh, this is a NEPO director. Oh. Who I enjoyed this movie.

Hated the other movie I saw from this director. Is it a, um, what's his face? Malcolm and Murray? Sam Levinson? No. I do not believe that she has worked with Sam Levinson. Well, there's nobody else in Malcolm and Marie, except for Malcolm and Marie, so I don't even know. Okay, NEPO director, Reitman?

No. You like this movie. Okay, so it's not on the rocks. Nepo director. You're reaching for the, you're reaching for the, you're reaching for the, like, top shelf Nepo directors. Oh, okay. I like this movie, 2020.

Um, what was happening in 2020? You know, both a lot and not a lot. My favorite Oscar nominated song that got disqualified a lot and got, not a lot. Um, okay, so this premiered, I imagine, on a streaming platform. Sundance. Oh, Sundance. Yeah.

Well. I think it was a Sundance Midnight movie. Oh, is it the Elizabeth Moss, um, Invisible Man? No. That just opened wide right before Kobe. Yeah. Oh, so this didn't open for a while, but it premiered at Sundance. Um, yes, it premiered at Sundance.

at Sundance, but it definitely... Is it, is it an Oz Perkins? No. But you're getting very warm. It's horror, obviously, if it's midnight. Yes. Okay. Is it the one with Riley Keo and she's the stepmother?

No, because Reisborough's not in that. Grosser than that. Oh, it's... Oh, I love this movie. I love this movie. It's a Brandon Cronenberg. It's, um... Oh, what the fuck is it called?

Um, not necromanical. or whatever. It's something er, right? It's... It sure is. Oh, fuck. What is it called? L lobotomizer. Think simpler. Think other very famous horror movies. Controller. No, what is it? Very famous horror movies. What happens in The Exorcist? Possessor, yes. Possessor. Good movie Possessor. Good performance. Brisebrose is great in that movie.

Everybody's great in that movie. J. J. J.L. is great in that movie. Christopher Abbott is great in that movie. Good movie. Enjoy it. All right. Interesting known for. I love Possessor. All right. I hate that, too, Leslie is on there. I hate it. I know. I know. And she has so many other things that could be on there. She has so many other interesting. Like, even something like Battle of the Sexes. She is interesting and very compelling. I think she's good in that movie. Yes. All right. All right. For you, I went into the Malik filmography. I went into Night of Cups, one of the stars of that movie, down the cast list a little bit, is Cherry Jones. Cherry Jones, Aaron Brockavitt. No. Wow.

Pamela Duncan did not make it onto, she did not sign that petition, and she did not make it onto the known for. They called children's services because they thought the children were being abused. Can we talk very briefly? No, no TV performances, so no Nan Pierce from Succession. What a phenomenal character Nan Pierce was on Succession. Just absolutely incredible.

I got to tell you, I really want to do a Succession rewatch already. When there's all this TV that I haven't seen that I should watch. Nothing's going to be that good. That's so good. Nothing on TV right now is going to be that good. It's just not. Although I do think you would love the Pit, as I love the Pit. Well, I will say, I mean, it's ended.

as of this recording in a few days. I'm willing to hold out hope that after the finale, this is the best White Lotus season. Oh. I like this season way more than everybody. You are very against consensus. I don't hate this season, but I do think of the three seasons that's my least favorite. I don't think Mike White needs to be doing eight episodes on these seasons.

Because I understand, I think White Lotus is always like, putting its chips in place so that when, like, all the cards are on the table, it's just like, bam, bam, bam, bam. I think that's been true of every season, but, like, maybe it has been a little bit slower, but... I just feel like my disappointment with the three girls on the girls' trip storyline has been so profound that it's really dragging me down with the rest. Because, like, nothing has happened there.

I think that's a pretty entertaining storyline. I think, I think just thematically, um, I think this is the strongest as the show's ever been. But that could fall apart or really come together with the final. Let's have that conversation offline because I think

that'll be a very good one. I'm just now realizing we have not talked about White Lotus really at all, which is kind of interesting. All right. Cherry Jones. Signs.

Yes. She's so good in signs. Oh, my God. Really? No TV because she's been another TV show. Emmy winner for 24. That's interesting.

Yeah. And it's just like theater actors always get TV on there. There is definitely another horror movie. I guess maybe I'm just being thrown by it. I'm like, boom, solid with a bullet. And if it's not there, I get completely thrown. Because all I can think about is Pamela Duncan. Pamela Duncan won't even get on the phone with me.

Aaron Brockovich has great character names. Kurt Potter, Pamela Duncan, fucking... I don't even know. They're so good. Okay. It's not Pamela Duncan. It's obviously not doubt, though. I saw her on Broadway.

Who else was it? Brianna Foburn, her... Adrian Lennox. And then who was the Amy Adams? I forget her name. Interesting. All right, anyway. I feel like it's very close to Sarah Gettlefinger, but it's not Sarah Gettlefinger.

Gettlefinger. All apologies to that actress. What in the other horror movie that Cherry Jones is in? Is it Jerry Jones in? Man, I'm sucking. Go back to first principles, Dr. Lecter. where did you begin? What do you already know?

What do you know is correct? We covet what we see every day. Yeah, what did you, what do you know is correct already? Signs. Right. It's another shaman. Is it another, is she in the happening? The happening.

Not the happening. No, the village. The village. There we go. Okay, so, yeah. But I still get my years. Mrs. Clack. All right, so your years are 2000 and 2004.

Okay. So, wow, the same year is Aaron Brockovich? She's a character actor in one, and she's kind of a soft cameo in the other, in that, like, she has a cameo. It's like, it's a legit cameo. It's just interesting that, like, her star power at the time, you wouldn't think she would have the star power for a cameo. Is the cameo of four? Yeah. Is it, is she in, like, Stepford Wives, or is it something like Stepford Wives?

Nope. Not Stepford Wives. But it's like, it's a comedy. Yeah. It's that ilk of comedy. It's like studio broad comedy. No, it's, um, it's, uh, a tourist blank check comedy. In a four.

Yeah. Okay. What is, what are O4 movies that were comedies from a big name director who's cashing in? And directly following up. Right. It's not O3, they're following up from, okay, who would it be, not from O3, from O2 is maybe like, Oh, you know what the connection is? Huh.

Again, go back to first principles. Where did you begin on this journey? Aaron Brockovich, Sotomberg. Is it a Soderberg? Is it Oceans 12? It is Oceans 12. Okay. Do you remember her in Oceans 12 where she shows up?

I don't. I think I've only seen. She's Matt Damon's mom. She poses as a federal agent to get Matt Damon out of custody, and then you find out that she's his mom, who is also a con artist. Okay, 2000 Yes

She's definitely an ensemble player in this But like this movie has a really good bench of ensemble players It's not traffic, is it? No She makes sense in traffic I really liked this movie I haven't seen it in a while But like if you put it in front of me today

I would probably just like sit and watch the whole thing Yeah 2000 It's one of those movies with a good bench of character actresses, and there's a, like, plot reason for that. Ensemble comedy. No. Ensemble drama. Yeah.

Drama slash, um... It's not... I mean, action, yes, but it's like a... Is it miscongeniality? No, no, no, no, no, no. Different tone. Not a comedy. It's not like Casa Delos Babies, is it? No, no, no, no, no. Nothing quite so snoozy.

Okay, but there's a reason that there's so many actresses. Does it take place in like a women's school? No, no. It's not a movie with only actresses, but like the actors and the actresses are in separate. Haves of the movie. Not even halves, just like scenes. Like, for a plot reason.

The men are over here doing this. The women are over here doing this. Yes. And it's maybe an action comedy? It's not a comedy. It's a drama. Action drama. Like, thriller.

Not really thriller. Like, if I give you the specific genre, it'll be too easy. But, like, um... There's a lot of... of like big setpiece you know um it's not like national treasure is it no i wonder if i've seen this i would be surprised if you haven't um stars uh a big big a list star um Like, Brad Pitt.

Yeah, but not, but not Brad Pitt. But like that level. Matt Damon. No, but like you're in the ballpark. George Clooney. Yes. George Clooney in 2000. So between out of sight and Ocean's 11.

Yep. Snottto, brother, where art thou? Nope, same year, though. What else was he doing in 2000? This is going to drive me. People kind of forget this as a Clooney movie, even though it obviously is. He's the headliner. Yeah.

Like, the cast is insane full of people who, like, were great character actors then and would, like, become more of a name value even after, while also having, like, people who were, like, you know. Is it a some type of heist movie? It's not a heist. A crime movie? What other types of dramas have, like, the stakes are so huge. A courtroom drama. No. A presidential drama.

No. Oh, gosh. You're a lot of outdoors, like, there's a lot of action takes place. A disaster movie? Yes, a disaster movie. What is George Clooney's disaster? It's based on a true story. Is it like a plane crash?

Nope. Nope. Oh, it's the perfect storm. It's the perfect storm. Who is she in the perfect storm? She's one of the women who are back on shore. She's like shanty lady number seven. Well, it's her and Karen Allen and Mary Elizabeth Mastrontonio.

Right, but like, but like, so I, listen to this cast list. So the men are Clooney, Walberg, John C. Riley, William Fickner, John Hawks, fucking Bob Gunton, Christopher McDonald, Michael Ironside, Dash Mahawk, Josh Hopkins. The women are Diane Lane, Mary Elizabeth Master Antonio, Karen Allen, Cherry Jones, Rusty Swimmer. It's just like absolute bangor after bangor after banger after banger. What a cast. I want to go watch this movie right now. I don't think I've seen that since the theater.

Same. Did not remember Cherry Jones was in it. Yeah, she is, man. She's great. I remember my dad being like, why would you watch that movie? You know these people die. Oh, it's so good, though.

Oh, it's so good. I remember it because it went head to head with Mel Gibson's The Patriot back. Yes. And I remember being so invested in the perfect storm beating out the Patriot, which it did in the long run. and I was very happy about that. Whoever wins we lose. Well, no, whoever wins we win.

I'm into Clooney. I know Walberg sucks, but like Clooney's good. I like Wolfgang Peterson, right? I mean, Troy's trashy fun. Yeah. All right, that's our episode. If you want more ThisHad Oscar Buzz, you can check out the Tumblr at thisheadoscarbuzz.com.

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