This Had Oscar Buzz - 359 – The Last Thing He Wanted

Episode Date: September 22, 2025

Pair the rising star director Dee Rees with a Joan Didion adaptation and the Oscar-winning Anne Hathaway and you have the kind of on-paper buzz we love talking about here on THOB. But The Last Thing He Wanted, following Hathaway as a journalist whose wayward father mires her in South American arms conflict, ended up being … Continue reading "359 – The Last Thing He Wanted"

Oh, oh, wrong house. No, the right house. I didn't get that. We want to talk to Marilyn Hack, Maryland Hack and French. Dick Poop. The reporter with a moral compass. Always a step ahead. Everything that happens.

She's sourced up and in print. These people are starting to move. Surplus arms to Contras. You can't just look away. In addition shipping crates for M16s, most likely. He's the old man. Dad. I got a big deal coming.

The big deal. Hello and welcome to the This Head Oscar Buzz podcast, the only podcast selling teeny tiny little silver rattles as merch. If we ever do merch. Every week on This Head Oscar Buzz, we'll be talking about a different movie that once upon a time had Lofty Academy Award aspirations, but for some reason or another, it all went wrong.

The Oscar hopes died, and we're here to perform the autopsy. I'm your host, Chris Fulner. and I'm here, as always, with the first thing I always want when I want to talk about a movie. My friend Joe Reed. Hi. Friend and co-house Joe Reed. Listener, the last thing he wanted.

The last episode we're recording before we leave for Tiff. The last thing I wanted to be doing today was talking about this movie. there were so many times when I was watching this movie last night that I was going to text you something ridiculous and I was like, nope, just save it, just save it. Well, just save it. Like I think I probably text you, it seems like the type of thing I text you

when I watch the movies that we do on this show. I get it. I get the reception, but I think there's enough to defend here. I think that's going to be an admirable effort on your part. Listen, this is one of these movies that we both very much want to like because it is from a director we both really like in D. Rees and an actress we really like in Anne Hathaway and an actor that one of us likes in Ben Affleck. and there, and, like, and it's based on, like, a Joan Didian novel.

Like, there are things about this that I feel like I, I want to be good. And I, I don't think I can make it there. But if you can make it there, then, like, all power to you. I can't make it to, this is good. Okay. It is not, it is not net good, but it is, I think, given the reception around this movie, the perception that remains if one does at all is overwhelmingly negative

and I don't think that that is fair this movie doesn't work the movie is not good but there is a lot defensible about it I can see the version of the movie they were trying to make and how they ultimately do not make that movie but I think there's also like interesting nuggets in this movie interesting stylistic choices

some of those stylistic choices that are interesting or compelling to watch are not necessarily serving the material or making us understand the material it's also like it's a little bit of a of a throwbacky, kind of like old-fashioned, like this is, I think, in its conception, and I imagine this would have existed on the page as well, wants to be this kind of, even though it takes place in the 80s, wants to be a kind of like 70s-style, you know, international intrigue,

constantly unfolding, who can you trust, who's, you know, a spy, almost like a spy, aren't even though she's not a spy and yet sort of suffused with a kind of modern day nihilistic sensibility do you know what I mean that I think you end up with a pretty sort of it just doesn't feel like it's comfortable in its skin a lot of the times there's there's a and I not having read the book, but there's so many moments in this movie where I'm just like, oh, this sounds very literary. Like this dialogue sounds very literary,

the like opening voiceover that gets repressed. That makes it the establishing information that you're given more interminable. You know, I think the opening stretch of the movie, feels like... Are you saying interminable? Well, I'm from Ohio. We say things wrong.

Okay. All right. No, I was just wanted to make sure I was getting the sentiment right. Yes. Yes, I agree with you. You know what I'm saying. I do. It makes it so much more confusing.

The opening, you know, passages of this movie, it feels like, okay, D. Reese is trying to do maybe a Pakula by way of Claire Denise. which both of those are interesting point of reference. I'm going to want you to explain the Claire Dene of it all because that's a reference I don't know as well, but I'm really interested to hear your thoughts on that. I thought so much of stars at noon in this movie, you know, a movie that is also about American imperialism in South America, or at least within Latin countries, that. You know, I also am a stark Stars at Noon defender. That is a good movie. People are unfair to that.

I've still never seen it. I get that people didn't get it. It is also very literary because it is a Dennis Johnson adaptation. And, you know, I think maybe reading that Dennis Johnson novella kind of helps you get the point of what Stars at Noon is really doing, the embodiment of, you know, know, America, the mindset of American intervention in things that they maybe shouldn't be meddling in and, you know, American imperialism that, you know, you can go to these other countries and, like, you were only seeing it from this American point of view. That's what Stars of Noon is representing in this character. And I think there's elements of that and last things he wanted, last thing he wanted. I'm going to make that mistake again, too, of like singular versus plural. Last things he wanted, last thing she wanted, last thing we wanted. Yeah, there's a lot of ways of misremembering. You know, not the easiest title to just slap on a poster.

But it's also one of those, like, very dangerous titles to give a movie where if it turns out bad, like, it really leans into headlines for your negative review of the movie. The last thing we wanted, like, the last thing D wanted. There's also a certain aspect of Claire Jee. Denise's career that is explicitly about colonialism and colonialist mindsets that I think, you know, if that was indeed a reference for D. Rees, it makes sense that it would be. I don't really think that that's her, you know, I don't think Denise is a filmmaker I would make a comparison to the two of them stylistically. So it's, you know, this movie always feels like it's reaching for something

it can't quite grasp and you see all of the pieces that it's trying to pull together and how it's trying to pull them all together. Yeah. But it never quite pulls it off and on top of that the way it misses the mark also makes this

movie incredibly incredibly confusing. It's incredibly confusing. I will say one of the best things about this movie is that whoever wrote the Wikipedia description was very detailed and thank goodness for that.

I think when you read a plot, we'll get into the 60 second plot description, but I think when you read a plot synopsis of this movie, it doesn't do it any favors because it's kind of like, well, she escapes this scenario and goes into like another, she's going from like place to place to place

without ever actually really doing much. This place, as best I could tell, this movie takes place in Elsel the United States, Costa Rica, Antigua, if it doesn't take place at all in Nicaragua, it's at least very much about Nicaragua. So like that is like, and what else am I missing? They talk about Haiti, but I don't think they're ever in Haiti. But it's just like it's all, it's, it's in a lot of different countries in a way in which like I'm not. sure it serves. Obviously, it serves the story in the fact that, like, it sort of underlines that America is sort of traipsing through Central America and the Caribbean kind of at will, right? And just sort of, you know, bounding through these places and shooting up

resort hotels and that kind of a thing. But it is hard to follow not only where everything is, but like why, why everything is where it is? I still don't kind of know why Ben Affleck traveled down to the Caribbean in the first place, other than, like, to kill her, but like, it feels like that could have gotten accomplished a lot sooner in the game. Why did this ambassador have to go? Ambassador at large, like ambassador, you know, for hire. Yes, just like, you know, a man about town kind of. Joe, if you're an ambassador at large, what are you ambassador at large for?

I'm ambassador at large for having a good time. Just having a good time? Yeah. Ambassador at large, comma, yacht rock. Vibes. Yes. I am in charge of making sure that there's yacht rock at every embassy, that there is, yes, that's what I'm, I'm ambassador at large for making sure that the DVD shelves at the embassies are stocked. So that if anybody has to like stay there for any like length of time, that they can go into, you know, the TV room there and they can have a good selection of DVD.

Yeah, not like Jack and Jill. You're making sure that, like, Aaron Brockovich is stocked. Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. Not the, like, not these bad movies. Not like Chris Pratt. A couple of 4Ks, maybe a criterion or two. Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon. Totally, totally, totally.

Yeah, not like, um, uh, what is like even a D-tier Liam Neeson movie? Oh, like a walk among the tombstones or something like that. Something, yeah, you're ambassador to that. I guess I'm ambassador at large telling you why you're wrong about Claire Deney. Unless you're right. Like, if you're talking about, like, Bo Travei, we can talk about Bochravai. But I guess if you're talking about Stars at Noon, I'm here to tell you you're wrong. Besides Bo Trowai, what are the best regarded, sort of widely best regarded Claire Deney movies?

Oh, that's an interesting question. Like, that is universally loved. I love that this is becoming our Claire Deney. episode. I mean, I think there's movies that are like net positive response, like, let the sunshine in, but like let the sunshine in, I think is even better. I think that's like one of her masterpieces. I mean, the answer is probably white material. I was going to say white material. I think people really respect white material. That's not one where people are like, what the fuck is where they, you know, just want a doggone. Well, what's its face? Thirty-five shots of rum ended up

on that times list, right? I don't think it did, but that's probably what I would say is the best Claire Denee movie, maybe even better than Bo Trivai. It's those two that are like interchangeable as the best for me, but like... Yeah, I thought it did. Maybe I could be wrong. And then

I feel like I hear about trouble every day. Which I just did an intro too, and that's a tough movie, gang. That's a divisive one though, right? Because I think some people really like it. It had a really, really rough can reception it was a can midnight movie and there was like a ton of walkouts people booed

um interesting they like she had a really hostile press reception for that movie where she's like this movie's not violent at all which is like okay the french are not like us but um you know did this new one play at um venice oh no i'll be seeing um seeing that first p and i the world premiere is at TIF, yes. Which again, that episode will have happened by now. I'm sure you can go find our opinions on anything we talk about related to Tiff. I won't. I don't think I'm going to be able to see it.

But Tom Blythe is in it, right? Tom Blythe is in it. Matt Dillon's in it. Sure. Yeah, it'll be interesting. Do we know what it's about? She's back to themes of colonialism. It's supposed to be more like chamberpiece.

We'll see. see another thing about like the buzz for the last thing he wanted is it filmed in 2018 so for the 2019 festivals like we were expecting to see this movie and around the festival times we started hearing bad things about this movie what do you feel like if you were to pinpoint it. And again, we're asking this question before we get into talking about the movie. If you were to pinpoint where this thing

went wrong, on what level? Do you think it's like, because my feeling is I think it's tough to make a good movie out of this screenplay. What it's trying to pull off, in the milieu it's trying to pull it off in, I think is really

hard to do in a sub two-hour feature length the movie such as this is. I think what D. Rees was going for might have worked better as a limited series, which is so interesting because she's kind of pivoted to TV, which to me is depressing, but... The problem with this as a limited series is, I feel like there are so many limited series that tell this kind of a story. It could be better than all of them. Sure, but like, I still feel like it would, you know, fade into... Taylor Sheridan coded something.

But this is, like, very anti-that type of thing, you know? I think it's commenting on that type of narrative or, you know, the type of thing. It is. The psychology and American culture that, you know, makes us, that, like, certain people wouldn't, that creates things like those shows and the mindset that, like, doesn't engage with the bulls. political context that those shows exist in, you know. Do you feel like, though, how much do you think this movie actually does engage with the political context beyond just like a very surface level? Because I get that like, it's mostly that she wants to like nail this story.

That is one of the problems is that like you can't really fully engage with any of the many, many, many, many things it's trying to incorporate it to. Like, it, it gets as... Like, it's only vaguely about, like, the specifics of a Rand Contra, you know what I mean? Just like it's only vaguely about, you know, what Hathaway's character has been through and motherhood and her relationship to her dad and... Those things get brought out, sort of, like, pulled out from a shelf when it's convenient, and then just kind of put away.

And mostly, the most consistent aspect of her... I think is this sort of thorny relationship with her father. But I still don't know if the movie makes a convincing case for why she so easily agrees to become like a substitute gunrunner for her dad. Like I don't get that. I don't think the movie like, like, and once we're past that point, I'm like, why is she doing any of this? Because like it does not feel like this is a pretext.

to get her story. It feels like anything that she's, that, that is advancing her story is kind of like coming through Rosie Perez doing shoe leather back in the States, right? Rosie Perez is not wife on phone in this movie. Rosie Perez is like co-worker on phone in this movie. Lesbian on phone. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

I mean, I do think that a lot of that is, you know, that it is this kind of lens to, view like Hathaway as like an American, even American who thinks that they're doing the right thing. It's representative of, well, you don't really know what the fuck you're doing

here. You're here for personal reasons that have nothing to do with what's actually going on, while also at the same time it wants to be this kind of character study of this person. And it's, I can respect the

you know, big canvas idea of that. I just don't think the movie pulls it off. Yeah, I think there's, there are things to respect in this movie. Yeah. Like, I think that there is an element that you're maybe not supposed to track all of the logistics of this story. That's not what D. Rees is interested in. And the idea that you can't even really follow the reasoning, the wise of things, could be partly the point. I just don't think it works.

Well, the other thing is, there's a way in which to do a movie like this that feels like, oh, you really respect your audience to sort of keep up, right? You're not going to, sometimes, you know, a movie like this feels good in that, like, it's not hand-holding you or whatever. And yet, I'm not ready to grant that to this movie because there are so many other occasions where it seems very obvious that the movie doesn't think, much of its audience or doesn't trust you. The fact that within one minute of being introduced to Willem Defoe, he says, uh, he lets loose with a faggots, a sissy, a queers. And I'm like,

oh, I, what are we trying to say about this character? Like, real subtle, you know what I mean? It's just like, it's, it lays so many things on so thick where it's just like, yeah, okay, we get it. Like, we, we, we, we, we know this guy is a scumbag, right? Like, like, And so little of it sticks. You can take your foot off the gas a little bit. Yeah, of like a lot of stuff, not just character detail, but like, you know, doesn't stick. The issue with this is, for me, is not the idea that maybe we're not supposed to follow everything or we're not even psychologically supposed to follow the reasoning for a character of doing some pretty outlandish things. But, like, there has to be a guiding light.

Right? Like, one of, like, the, the core thing that the movie, there has to be something that it is following. And maybe it is that it's the relationship with her father, but certain, I think, narrative happenings prevent that from, like, he's dead early in the movie, you know? Right. And it's not like we're seeing flashbacks that it's, you know, the grounding force of this story. You know, something has to be what is steering. what we're watching. And it's just like, it feels a bit at sea, feels a little bit like lost in the night. But I don't think it's a disaster the way that many people have pegged this movie.

It's not a disaster. I do think it's supremely irritating to watch at times. And there are times where you're just like, why am I, why am I still watching this movie? Why can this movie just be over? And it just does kind of keep going and going and going. And I want a better movie with Anne Hathaway sort of in this register, though, because I do feel like I like her in this register. Some of the dialogue is really over the top and overwrought and literary and, you know, probably should not have been, you know, gone from page to screen so exactly if that is what, that is exactly what it is. But I do like her in this register and would watch another movie. better movie. She's really good at playing an asshole. She doesn't get to do it that often. And maybe that's just because I'm doing a Hathaway watch right now. And I'm catching up to a lot of the, like, popcorn movies that I haven't seen, like Bride Wars and Valentine's Day, where it's like, she has to be so explicitly likable. And yet, because Anne Hathaway has never given

a bad performance, at least to my estimation at this point, maybe I'll find one. she's always doing something interesting even when it's just like you're going really hard on this movie that you just maybe need to get in and get out um she refuses to do that and i feel like in a better movie this is such a robust performance and so interesting and it's one of the few times she's gotten to play an asshole like rachel getting married it's not on the level of rachel getting married um Do you think there's a connection between Anne Hathaway playing an unlikable, not an unlikable character, but like an abrasive character and Anne Hathaway doing blonde streaks in her hair? Like there, she has, she has highlights in this movie that are like, we're almost at like two-tone territory. It's the highlights and it's the freckles. They give her a face full of freckles. They really do. The other thing that they do in this movie is. that she smokes constantly in this movie. And I was trying to make, like,

the Grand Unified, like, top five Anne Hathaway Smoking Movies. And I was like, I could do this on my own or I could, like, have Chris help me assemble this because obviously Rachel getting married is on that list. Obviously, Eileen is on that list.

And I obviously broke back mountains on that list. So, like, how do we round this act? I mean, that's a pretty solid list. What are we trying to get to five? Yeah, I feel like we only just need one more, right? Does she smoke and love in other drugs? Not memorably so, I don't think. If we have to ask the question, then I think it doesn't deserve to be top five.

Do you know what I mean? There has to be something where it's just like, yeah. There's no way she's not smoking in Armageddon time. True. Not Devil Wears Prada, obviously. That is not a smoking movie. You just saw Valentine's Day. I don't believe she smokes in that.

She does not smoke in that movie. Obviously, not Lee Mizz. She certainly smokes in Havoc, because that's the movie where she's, like, a bad girl. Well, and Colossal, too. Have you rewatched Colossil? No, but I plan to. That might be a, that might be a smoke. You know, you know, one of my Hathwatch movies that I caught up to,

that I would be fascinated to hear your thoughts on this movie. This is a wild movie, but it's a good movie. Goes to some places. Anne Hathaway, it is, like, to me, one of the epitome performances of Anne Hathaway will go wherever you ask her to go, even if it's a leap, and she makes her movies better for it.

Rebecca Miller's, she came to me. Never seen it. it's a fascinating movie and she is on one and she's really good in it what's that one about i didn't i guess i totally didge writes operas and he's married to hathaway who is not quite a clean freak um or like a full germaphobe but she She's a therapist, and Dinklage has an affair with Marissa Tomey, who, after having the affair with her, discovers that she was, like, prosecuted for stalking, and then it just, like, helps him create a whole new opera. Very unique, singular movie that I think is pretty good. But I imagine a lot of people, if this was a more widely seen movie, would not be kind to this movie. Sure.

But I think it's good. Okay, so we're going to put this one up to our utter listeners. Listeners, we need a fifth in the Anne Hathaway Smoking Top Five. To reiterate, we have Eileen, Brokeback Mountain, Rachel getting married, the last thing he wanted. And we need a fifth one. So, suggestions, welcome. and, you know, hit us up. One thing I will note about Hathaway's performance,

especially in relationship to the reception of this movie, is you read a lot of these reviews, even some of the most negative ones. And they are all complimentary to her in a way that I'm not sure they would have been even five years beforehand when, you know, people were still out on Hathaway. Backlash, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Reading some of that really did make me feel like, okay, we are, I think, firmly in the backlash is over for Hathaway, because I think still some people are too mean to her, mostly straight white men, and I think it is net causative for the culture that we are pro Hathaway firmly again.

So... You know what? Let's put a pin in Hathaway, do the plot description, and then resume with Hathaway. Because it's a longer conversation that by the time we get to the end of it, we're going to be like an hour into this thing. The last thing he wanted was to do a 60-second plot description, and guess who has to do it? Before you're doing that show, would you like to talk to our listeners about the Patreon? Yes, we have a Patreon. It's called This Had Oscar Buzz Turbulent Brilliance. It is a mere $5 a month. And for that $5 a month, you will get. get two bonus episodes every month.

First Friday of the month, you will get an episode that we are calling an exception. These are movies which fit the usual. This had Oscar Buzz Rubric. Great Oscar expectations, disappointing results. Even if those disappointing results resulted in an Oscar nomination or two or maybe sometimes three. We have very recently done an episode on the movie Contact. We have done, will our September episode have been a book?

A.I. will be up. Both of the September Patreon episodes will be up. Hey, baby. We've got an episode on Steven Spielberg's AI Artificial Intelligence, a movie that both of us, spoiler alert, really love. So that'll be a really fun conversation. But we've certainly had our share of movies we didn't love that we talk about on this had Oscar buzz, turbulent brilliance among them, things like Hitchcock and Madonna's W.E. And, you know, Charlie Wilson's War, even though I think that's a fascinating film. Charlie Wilson's War, an interesting comparison point to the last thing he wanted. I feel like that is Charlie Wilson's War is doing a little bit more of a silly, now do a silly one.

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Hold, please. $60 a year? No, I'm doing it the other way. $5 a month. $2.50 per episode if there's no bonus stuff over there. 17 cents a day. For 17 cents a day, would you sponsor these two...

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directed by D. Rees, written by Marco Villalobos and Derees, based on the Joan Didion novel. The film stars Anne Hathaway, Ben Affleck, Rosie Perez, Toby Jones, and Willem Defoe. It world premiered at the Sundance Film Festival, I believe it was, I tried to pull up the actual schedule because my memory was that this was fully the last movie to premiere. at that festival because when I was seeing the tweets and people were saying that and people were already speculating that this was bad and there was also bad word on the film from the

festival sphere. The rumor sphere, I should say. Caught COVID because they stayed an extra day at Sundance to see the last thing he wanted as a tough one. That's a tough pull. From the date that's listed it was the Monday after the weekend, which I guess is a day that

a lot of press leaves already. So they might have known what they were doing, burying it a little bit. But then it opened in limited release. I'm guessing that means just the Paris Theater in New York. Corwold, yeah, on Valentine's Day. Valentine's Day, 2020, as we're all starting to, if we weren't already the people scoping things out.

But like at the time where we're all like, yeah, I think I'm not going to do anything this weekend. I don't know what to. Here's the thing, though. I definitely went to Palm Springs that February. You know what I mean? So, like, people were still doing things, I think, up until March. I think March is when it really started to, like, settle in.

But, like, oh, maybe don't go anywhere this weekend. Well, it was, like, mid-March that things shut down. It was. Because by the time, by St. Patrick's Day, I was, I had gone back to Buffalo. Yeah. So, yes. Yeah. And then the motion picture premiered February 21st.

on Netflix, getting effectively buried. Buried. Fully buried. Like, you know, if there was, for a movie perceived, though I disagree, as a disaster to really get buried and people to forget about you very quickly, it should be on Netflix right before COVID. So, like, I feel like people have forgotten this movie. We've teased doing this movie for a long time just because we. hadn't seen it on its first release and wanted to

I guess revive the corpse Yes, yes It's a good way of putting it Revive the corpse So in order to do so Joe You are tasked with giving the 60 second plot description For the last thing he wanted A movie that is

Rather difficult to tell what is going on At any given moment The chances that I will Not get this in 602 seconds and also not do a good job at all of describing the plot are very high. Like, this is going to be, I'm going to take a lot of time to very inadequately describe what's going on in this movie. So let's get to it. All right. Then your 60 second plot description for the last thing he wanted starts now. Okay, so it's 1984. Ronald Reagan is on route to a landslide

re-election and the United States can't topple Central American regimes fast enough. Anne Hathaway is a reporter who has been covering these stories from the front lines, but the political climate has forced her editors to put her on the campaign beat, which she can't stand because she's still working on a story about the Americans supplying the Contras in Nicaragua with weapons. Meanwhile, Anne's quasi-estranged dad is Willem Defoe, who is an arms dealer who sometimes operates with the cooperation of the United States and sometimes not. He's also in the early to middle stages of dementia, and during one episode, he asked Anne to step in for him and complete a deal. So Anne Hathaway heads down to Costa Rica with the gun shipment only she's shorted

on payment and also paid in bricks of cocaine, neither of which was the plan. The buyer is Eddie Githegi from the Superman movie, and he's either trying to kill her or trying to help her. In trying to get back home, Hathaway discovers she's been given a false passport, and also that her father has died. Meanwhile, she's sending info back to her coworker, Rosie Perez is working, helping her report on the Nicaragua story. Meanwhile, Ben Affleck, who is kind of a waxy-faced State Department fixer type, shows up in Antigua, where Anne Hathaway now is, and they share a drink, and she gets way too

confessional, and they end up sleeping together, and he's going to help her out of this situation. But first, she has to go hide out under her assumed identity, working at a resort owned by gay Toby Jones. And then Hathaway discovers that this CIA boogeyman figure named Bob Weir is Toby Jones's benefactor. And I guess Jerry Garcia and Phil Lesh were too busy at Langley or whatever. But Hathaway realizes her life is in danger. So she runs and ends up on a bluff with Ben Affleck who shoots her with the tiniest little gun you've ever seen. And she falls for a hundred years into the middle of the Caribbean, propelled hundreds of feet clear of the shoreline by the

tiny little pellets that Affleck's lady chic razor of a gun shot at her. Anyway, epilogue Affleck claims in his congressional hearing that Hathway was trying to kill him, and we see the CIA has framed her posthumously as a weapons dealer and enemy of the state. But also, surprise assholes, Rosie Perez is filing a story that will blow the whole Nicaragua affair wide open. And as we all know, Iran-Contra definitely took down the Reagan administration and for sure taught the U.S. government that a president can't just do whatever he wants with impunity. And we were a stronger nation for at the end.

One minute and 10 seconds over. I was really prepared to be like, wow, he's going to get this with only like, 30 seconds over and it's going to be the most impressive achievement that has ever been done in a 60 second plot description. And then I think this happened the last time you did a 60 second plot description where it's like it's 30 seconds to describe the final four minutes of the movie. The scene where she gets shot is the most ridiculous thing I've ever seen in quite a while. the ocean is... Slow Mo falls into the ocean.

First of all, horrible, like, CGI, whatever, slow-mo falling into the ocean. And then when she finally hits the water, that's the cut to black to end the movie. She's so far clear of the shoreline, which, like, you... Even a fairly dumb person realizes that, like, to get that far clear of a shoreline,

you really have to, like, jump out far. She has to be really, like, projected off of this cliffside. teeny tiny gun, very large bullets. Tinty tiny, tiny little gun that can, like, bullets that would barely, like, pierce the skin? Like, it's crazy to me. Also, can we talk about Ben Affleck's face in this movie? Fresh off a round of the talks, like, fresh out of the, out of the surgeon's chair. This is also...

Immediately posed Batman, where he's like, okay, and I'm done. where he's not getting jacked anymore and so his body is changing a little bit respectfully he's currently cohabitating with Anadamus and a standy cutout of Anna Darmus Not in 2018 Oh yeah when they're filming this you're right you're right It's when this gets released that he's cohabitating with Anadamus

You're right you're right Who does not have a cardboard cut out of Anna da Armis, like she's doing Pose, like she's doing the secret challenge on America's Next Top Model. What's my secret? I'm made of cardboard. What's my secret?

But, like, his face has absolutely, like, you could, nothing, light can't stick to it. It's just, like, everything sort of, like, slips off of his face. He's so talksed out As good as Hathaway is No there's no other good Ben Affleck is not good in this movie He's really bad

He's not good in this movie I would even say this is maybe the first time I've seen Defoe not be good in a movie Well he's written so fucking ridiculously Holy shit Toby Jones is not Bad bad but Toby Jones is doing a Toby Jones thing I'd have watched a half an hour of Toby Jones talking about his life as owning a gay resort in Porta Prince.

Absolutely. It is definitely a nefarious gay guy showing up. But there is something to hang on to and you're like, oh, a gay guy is here. Great. We have a boss. What does he say? He's like, he's like, Porta Prince, I'll say. Or something like that.

You know what I mean? He's like, he has a, there's a lot of wordplay. For a movie that is very frequently overwritten, his stuff is at least overwritten. slash enjoyable slow so I enjoy that I like Rosie Perez in this movie Rosie Perez has absolutely nothing to do She is co-worker on phone

She's innocent though Like she's not the problem Absolutely and I'm always so happy To see her but like she doesn't have anything to do here She deserves more than this Eddie Gehagie is a good actor But like they give they keep his character At such an arm's length in terms of like you're not supposed to know

Whose side he's on that he doesn't really get the opportunity to, like, play a character. And the thing, one thing I forgot to mention in the plot description was at the end, we see his character, who turns out to be with French intelligence, talking about how he was essentially trying to, like, develop Hathaway as an asset or, like, something. Like, they were keeping tabs on her and, like, I guess, trying to keep her safe. Ultimately, in your estate, of this plot, was the whole gun-running thing in just a setup to get her back to South America

so they could kill her because they know she's working on this story, because she had interviewed the one general at the beginning. Remember that scene with the general where he's speaking in entirely like Heartland metaphors, where he's like, when the monkey starts driving the car, you just look for the banana peels. And she's like, what are you talking about, sir? I wrote down a couple of the shit. That sounds like some bullshit that I would string together. You let a monkey drive your car, you call it steering. Buckle up. You want to see how a monkey drives, follow the bananas. Sir, you are a United States General. Can you please just like talk about troop movements or something? Because holy fucking shit. Crazy ass. Absolutely crazy ass. So she's

poking around in that. And like, is that when they decide to drum up this fake weapons deal, knowing that she'll have to, I guess knowing that she would do it for her father. Yeah, who's dead. Which is a big old leap. And so that's how they lure her to Central America where they decide then they're going to try and then they'll just kill her down there. Is that the plan? Obviously, we need to be protecting journalists, especially those that are unearthing, you know, political wrongdoing. But like, I, I'm not.

going to say it would be just easier to just do that while she's at home but like it does seem like there was an easier way to have to pull that off but do I think that those plot moment those like

plot turns are connected what a great question again I think that this movie is defensible but like you cannot follow this if things are supposed to be connected at various different points. Yes.

Therefore, by the grace of God, maybe someone will... So we had put the pin in the Hathaway conversation. I'm going to unpin it now. Because you had broached the subject of, like, Hathaway backlash. And I wanted to sort of, like, track that because that obvious... We've talked about it in previous episodes, but, like, not recently. But, and also, I don't think we've talked about, like, what brought her out of it. Because, like, obviously, it reaches its peak, you know, with late.

miss and which is interesting because while it was reaching its peak I think a lot of people a lot of those same people who were like annoyed by her were like oh but she's really good in the dark night rises like even people who were like sort of exhausted by the dark night rises enjoyed her performance within it like I think that was a generally well regarded performance um but then post Oscar um it's it's sort of uh you know she's not in a a ton. She does the cameo in Don John. She's in that movie Song One that is utterly ignored, like absolutely ignored. And I don't think it even, even without the backlash, I don't think anybody would have really paid attention to that movie. It's a little weird that she's in that

movie. I think she got into that movie through the Demi connection, because he produced it. Okay. Yeah. But it's her and Johnny Flynn, right? Yeah. Yes, it is. Yeah. She's, you know, a voice in Rio, too. Like, nobody pays attention to that kind of thing. She's in Interstellar, which I think she's really good, but I think part and parcel of the backlash, nobody really wanted to talk about her. Well, she credits, because she's talked about this. And she said at that point, she couldn't get hired. She just won an Oscar and no one would hire her because people were so against her online.

And she credits Nolan casting her again in Interstellar. as like saving her career. Well, it's a big help because she's in this really big movie and she, you know, it proves that she's still, you know, relevant in the film landscape. She makes the intern then, which comes out in 2015, a movie that I do feel like if that had come out a few years later, it would have done better because that's a movie that I think suffers from Hathaway Backlash, where like people, were, you know, we're not super interested.

I really like the intern. And I know there are like pockets of people who like the intern. I like the intern for what it is. I think there are like some demonstrable flaws in that movie. Yeah. But I enjoyed it. Alice Through the Looking Glass is really, really pretty well ignored. Like for a movie that was that big and a sequel to a movie that made that much money,

that movie came and went. Like nobody really wanted to talk about Alice Through the Looking Glass. Then it starts to get interesting, though, because, She does colossal, which is this, like, indie movie with a really sort of like, you know, odd plot that kind of comes on, you know, comes at you by a little bit of a surprise. There's, you know, by, the movie doesn't explain it at all, which I kind of love. Halfaway is this sort of like alcoholic, you know, unemployed, you know, kind of a disaster who discovers that if she goes to a certain part of the park and she like moves around, she controls the movements of fucking kaiju in South Korea, which is a wild premise to begin with. And then it becomes even more wild when it's just like, yeah, that's not really what the movie is going to be about. The movie is going to be about. the movie is going to be about toxic masculinity and, like, awful men. But I really liked it. I can't remember whether you like the colossal or not.

I mean, she's great. It'd be an interesting one to do an episode on. She's very, like, loose in that movie, you know. And I think she got really good notices for that movie, I think. But it was pretty small. And then 2018, Oceans 8, I think for a movie that's so fucking good at the movie. There was tons of people who had problems with that movie, including me, I wanted that movie to be a lot better than what it was. I was so looking forward to all-female

Oceans 11. And I wanted more for that movie. But she's the best part of that movie. And I think everybody kind of agreed that she's the best part of that movie. She kind of like raises all ships and I think that's the turnaround moment. And like, Serenity is awful, but it's fun. Serenity, another great example though. Serenity, bad movie, she gives a great performance in that bad movie where part of what's great about her is like even if you know you have a premise like serenity where it's like a little out there and silly she commits so wholeheartedly to it that like at least what she does comes out the other end and is smart and good and thoughtful even when the movie isn't and maybe even the way even when the movie's conception of her character is not smart

and thoughtful, you know, her performance can be. And then I feel like by the time you hit 2019, I think people are just kind of tired of the backlash, which you can tell because she makes like three really bad movies in quick succession, which the hustle, last thing he wanted, and then the witches, the remake of the witches. Oh, four of them, because fucking locked down is the, is that awful, awful. I'm going to have to watch Locked Down. COVID movie, I know.

So she makes four really, really bad movies And ultimately people like let them all slide Mostly you know what I mean Like there's not this like new wave of backlash Well you also just mentioned a bunch of movies That were ultimately streaming movies at a time Where a lot of things just got thrown into the ether Like lockdown

Yeah How many people watch lockdown The Witches was like that I don't think people even High Profile Bad Like that was a bad I think that's a tough one. I think that probably has helps that movie to have been dumped on streaming, rather if that had been a theatrical

of release, it probably would have been more of a stain for all involved. Again, a performance I don't think she's bad in at all. Like, if anything, she's, again, raising all ships in that movie. Yeah, yeah. I think there's some dumb stuff in that movie, but like, none of it has to do with her. So, and then by the time we hit 2022, she's in that, uh, is it, was it an apple? series, we crashed? Yes. She was in the Apple series, we crashed. She's in Armageddon time, where she as a non-Jewish lady is playing a Jewish character, and there was a little bit of a dust-up, but it was, like, pretty minor, which, again, I feel like it would have been a bigger dust-up if people were still, like, hating Annie the way they used to.

And then, like, people really loved her and Eileen. I really loved her in Eileen. She's incredible in Eileen. Um, no, what's interesting about Mother's Instinct was everybody saw the trailer and got very excited to, like, see this very campy movie. And then nobody actually saw the movie, and I think that's probably... Because they didn't release it. Like... Right, right. Um, and then I thought she was really good in the idea of you.

The Michael Showalter, uh, movie The Idea of You. I didn't like that movie at all, but it's like, that's the type of movie that it's just like, okay, we're getting, we're getting the kind of movie star thing that she was doing a decade before and maybe doing it even better than she did it before even though that is a nothing movie.

Great movie about bangs. Great movie about having bangs. Talk about the five movies that are on their way for Man Hathaway. The least interesting of which is Devil Where's Prada 2, even though that's getting the most attention. And I could see a world in which Devil Wears Prada 2 makes good money.

But other than that, I'm super excited for these other things. We thought Mother Mary would be this fall. It probably is not. Oh, I think it's far too late for it to open this fall. Yeah. And it would probably mean that movie getting dumped, and we want good things for David Lowry. And like, when was the last time a movie got pushed back two full seasons? I don't think it was ever planned for last year, though.

It didn't finish filming until last year. But it was on people's radars, though. And I feel like that's enough to create this perception of, like, where the fuck is this movie? Why are we not getting this movie? What's the problem with this movie? That's where I think where it now is, people are starting to ask, what's the problem with this movie? And I'm really worried that this could be good. But I'm worried that it could be good, and people will say that it's not because it's stained in some way.

Yeah, yeah, yes, I worry. And you know I love David Lowell. and you know I love Anne Hathaway. Give us these other movies she's in. Well, she's in The Odyssey. She's one of the eight bagillion people who are in Christopher Nolan's. Presumably, her smallest role of all these films. I imagine she's playing Odysseus' wife, right?

Do we know? I think that's the thing with a lot of the people in that movie is we don't know yet. I think the only things we know are that Matt Damon is Odysseus. Tom Holland is his son, and that I think we know that Charlie's Theron is Searcy. I think we know whoever Bernthal is playing from the teaser, too. Sure, yes. But, like, the other women, besides Theron in the cast, are Anne Hathaway, Zendaya, Lupida, Nyango, and then you get down further, and it's like Samantha Morton, but like, and Mia Gough. But I think of those people, if you're going to have Matt Damon be married to, you know,

any of them. It makes sense that it would be Anne Hathaway. Do you know what I mean? And... It's the Odyssey going to be just like the biggest movie ever. I mean, that's the plan, I think. I think that's the idea.

And again, Nolan keeps going bigger and keeps scoring, so I'm going to keep having faith in him. She's in the new David Robert Mitchell movie called Flowervale Street. I've heard rumors what it's about. This movie, also got pushed, but apparently for

Warner Brothers has had a back and forth year. No, I don't think there's reshoots or anything, but there's going to be a lot of visual effects. So David Robert Mitchell is, of course, the guy who gave us It Follows, and I will always have a loyalty to him because of it follows. And remember, the plan was to do It Follows Part 2? Yes. It's in development. And I think that's not happened. Yeah, it's in development. But then he did Under the Silver Lake, which was a very divisive movie, that I wanted to love and I couldn't quite get there. I thought you would really like it.

I did too. I really did too. I was kind of nonplussed. But this new one stars Anne Hathaway, Ewan McGregor, Maisie Stella, from My Old Ass. And I'm super excited for it. It's a Warner Brothers movie. J.J. Abrams is producing. I've heard a rumor of what it's about. Well, Wikipedia description says it follows a family who starts to notice unusual happenings in their neighborhood, which gives you a wide, wide, wide canvas to, like, do stuff. What have you heard? I've heard those unusual happenings are dinosaurs.

Well, there is a, if you go to the IMDB page, there is not a poster for this, but the image there is a bunch of dinosaur skulls. Oh, well, then it's about dinosaurs. I'm excited, and there's one photo on there that is, I guess, a production photo, and it's a giant broadosaur. Well, then I guess it's not a rumor anymore. It's

dinosaurs. I guess. So, yeah, if it's on, if it's on, so this is expected to come out next summer. I'm super excited for it. So, and then otherwise, we have, sorry, one second, as I'm pacing back, she's going to be, obviously, Mother Mary, we mentioned. Oh, and she's supposedly, not supposedly, she is, in a movie called Verity, which is another Colleen Hoover adaptation. It ends with us. She's also got an adaptation coming out this year that, like, I think people are underestimating in terms of its whatever box office potential. It's this movie regretting you with Alison Williams and Dave Franco that comes out this year fall yeah it's supposed to come out in October it's a Josh Boone movie but I think I fear I fear book talk at this point so Lord knows what's

going to happen but Verity is a Michael Showalter another Michael Showalter directed movie starring Anne Hathaway Josh Hartnett Dakota Johnson you sold me you've already sold sure premise says well IMDB usually has a much more succinct premise, so let's see. A woman gets hired to ghost write novels for someone's bestselling author wife, Verity, who's unable to finish after an accident. The woman uncovers Verity's disturbing truths while residing at the woman's home to work. Anne Hathaway plays Verity. I imagine Dakota Johnson plays the writer, and Josh Hartnett plays the husband. You've sold me. You've sold me. My ticket is purchased. I am ready to go.

So, you know, 2026, the year of Anne Hathaway, and I am ready for it. This is an extremely pro-Hathaway podcast. Very, very much so. Very, very much so. So, all right, so the D rees of it all. Should we maybe do one of our, listener, we have two six-timers quizzes. Oh, I combine them into one. It is one quiz.

Wow. Fabulous. Well done. Yeah. then yes, let's talk about D. Rees. Let's talk about D. Rees. A director who we really, really love, a writer-director we really, really love, sort of burst onto the scene in 2011 with Pariah.

What about Pariah? I love Pariah. Pariah is a great movie. If you have not seen it, seek it out. We'll eventually do an episode on it, but... Coming of Age story about a black teenage lesbian played by Adipa. And it's really wonderful. It's really, you know, it's, it's, it's, um, very humane. It is very, you, sometimes, I think, when you are talking about a coming of age movie in sort of

challenging circumstances where it's like, you know, a young girl who's coming out as gay and, you know, uh, her, you know, she's living in, uh, in, uh, in a, uh, in a, environment that maybe wouldn't be very hospitable to that. Sometimes filmmakers feel like in order to, you know, express how hard it is for these people, they really sort of pile on strife and cruelty. And while there are challenges for this, there's a lot of grace in this movie and there's a lot of humanity. And I really like it.

I think it considers like, you know, especially. coming out narratives can be so just like focused on who this protagonist is their own concerns but one of the things that I think is so great about pariah is

how many you know how like it's not just her family it's obviously not just the protagonist but like it's a great gay friend movie as well you know it's and in that way it is it is a really

thoughtful movie about like basically the coming out process is you know you do it as a queer person of you know whatever alphabet mafia you know position you may land uh you may land in multiples but like we do that in an ecosystem so it's like that process is you know it's not just it's not this reductive thing you know you're bouncing off a lot of other person you're navigating other personalities, you're navigating. Well, I'm out to this person, but I'm not out to that, you know. And I feel like that is such an honest movie for that experience, you know? Yeah.

It's so considerate of, you know, everybody in the sphere of that. Yeah. 2015, then she follows up a pariah with the HBO TV movie Bessie about Bessie Smith, starring Queen Latifah, wins the Emmy Award. Award for Outstanding TV Movie, Queen Latifah does not win Best Actress. Do you remember who she lost to? This is like a good lineup, though, right? Who does she do? It's a very good lineup. She loses to Francis McDormann for Olive Kidridge, which I think, you know, no shame in that. I love all of the Kidderidge. This lineup includes Maggie Gyllenhaal for the Honorable Woman,

which I fucking loved. I thought she was so good in that. Felicity Huffman for the first season of American crime. Jessica Lange for American Horror Story Freak Show, which if you recall, if you track these things by memes, that's the one where she sings Life on Mars in a German accent. And then Emma Thompson for the Live from Lincoln Center, Sweeney Todd, which I never saw. But she was supposed to be really, really good in. So yeah, that is a really good lineup. I mean, when Jessica Lange is clearly the deserving last place. You know, so that makes a good lineup. It's a very good lineup.

She does also direct, like, her fair share of television. She does an episode of Empire. She does a couple episodes of that ABC miniseries on the Queer Rights, the Fight for Queer Rights, called When We Rise, the Dustin Lance Black series. She directs a couple of those episodes. Who were the other directors on that? Gus Van Sant, her Thomas Schlamy, and then Dustin Lance Black directed the last four. So, yeah, kind of an all-star team of directors there, which is pretty cool.

She directs an episode of that Philip K. Dick adaptation series, Electric Dreams, that was on, was that Amazon? That sounds extremely Apple. It was Amazon. Well, it was Channel 4 in the UK, but it was United States on Amazon. And sort of an international cohort of directors for that. one. And then 20, she continues to like do a TV directing. She's got an upcoming series called Criminal that, oh, it's, I think it's an anthology series, perhaps. But anyway, that's another Amazon series. But 2017, her next feature film, her next theatrical feature, well, theatrical feature, it's a Netflix

movie, Mudbound, which got kind of mixed, mixed positive reviews, had a lot of Oscar buzz, got a couple of Oscar nominations, would be a good exceptions episode to do. I don't know. I think the context of that movie would not, we could do an exception on it. I feel like it would be. It did get four nominations. I forgot that it got that many. Yeah.

It would be a little, like, are we overdoing it? because I think the question there is I think mudbound if it wasn't really Netflix's first big push in the Oscar you know sphere that would be a best picture nominee but because

Netflix had pushed other movies like these are a nation but like that wasn't but I think that's what makes it an interesting conversation yeah yeah I suppose that's true but I also feel like as a movie I think the reaction was muted positive. I think there was a distinct lack of effusiveness in the praise for it. I think you got a lot fewer like this is a wonder of a movie. Like this is, you know, incredibly. And like, I was fairly positive on it. I thought it was quite a good

movie. It is a sort of, it's somewhat of an ensemble movie about post-world War II, rural Mississippi, where you have characters played by Garrett Headland and Jason Clark, who are, or Jason Mitchell, rather Jason Clark is also in the movie, who have very sort of obviously racially dictated, very different experiences post-war, but there is a bond between them, Carrie Mulligan plays Garrett Headland's wife, who I think gives an incredibly very good performance. And then Mary J. Blige plays Jason Mitchell's mother. She's, her husband is Rob Morgan, I want to say.

Like, if I'm going to pick the best performance in the movie, it's Rob Morgan for me. Yeah, he's quite good. Quite good. Mary J. Blige gets the Oscar nomination, which I always, I still find very fun. She's not bad in the movie. I think people were not bad. generous to her that season? I think if she wasn't Mary J. Blige, she doesn't get that nomination. You know what I mean? But I also think if she's not Mary J. Blige, people would have been more generous to that

performance. Because I think it was just like, she's there because she's famous. Yes. And I think it's because it's just one of those movies where everybody's good in it. And it's hard to have somebody surface. And I think her, the fact that she's, you know, she's, you know, she's. a musician who is sort of popping in this movie, I think got her that extra. We've talked about this.

To get an Oscar nomination, you need to have a hook, and that was her hook. Also, the tiny little sunglasses. That was a really, really big project. Also, the trend of being nominated in an acting category and original song is a lot of fun. Plus, this was the movie that finally got Rachel Morris and an Oscar nomination for cinematography, Did you see the fire inside last year? I did. She directed.

It's a good movie. That movie, it feels like just totally, you know, it was timed poorly at that TIF. And I feel like not a lot of people saw it there. And then it just kind of got buried when it got released. But it's a good movie. It opened too late in the year. It sort of opened. It did not, was not able to.

It needed to open at that stage of the game in December, it really needed to be a box. office hit, and it wasn't. And I think they were sort of depending on it being one. But yeah, good movie by Rachel Morrison. Really, really happy with that. So, and then the last thing he wanted, so, like, D. Rees at this point, has made three features. And after last thing he wanted, I think she's just been relegated to television. Which is a bummer. She had an interview with Entertainment Weekly with pal of the show David Campfield where she's like

yeah people hated that movie but I'm focusing on moving forward with my career which is like that's probably a great space to be in or not to be in but like that's a great way to just like deal with the reception around

this movie because I mean D. Rees is still very talented. I think that this is a movie that shows that like this is a talented director and something is going wrong. Well, I just think it's a very awkward adaptation. If you read, again, I'm going to do this thing that makes me sound like a dumb-dum. I read the Wikipedia page on the novel.

And it ends very differently. The conclusion of the movie is that the Affleck character gets shot. He doesn't shoot her. He gets shot by... Someone shoots him with an even tinier gun. An even tinier gun somehow. You don't pull out a tiny gun unless you have a tinier gun underneath it. But no, he gets shot by someone, and then there is a sort of a crossfire of security and whoever the assassins were.

And Hathaway's character gets killed in the crossfire. And it ends kind of that way. and let's see I'll read the On the day before he was arranged to escort her back to the United States She's waiting on the bluffs When a man shoots Treat is the Catholic character

Wooning him Oh okay, he doesn't get killed, he gets wounded And Elena is killed by the island's local police As the expected assassin Okay, so she's set up as an assassin Following her death is a deported by the Associated Press She was supplying arms to the Sandinistas So it ends

a lot less cleanly and a lot, maybe less satisfyingly. But I also, like, maybe I'm just sort of sight unseen giving Joan Didion credit because she's Joan Didion. But, like, I imagine it works a lot more, a lot better on the page here. So I just think... I don't know what the, what the purpose of changing that ending is if you're not going to really buttress that Affleck character better. He's so, I think, I think Reese, I think the idea maybe is to make him this kind of enigma, this kind of phantom who floats into and out of these, you know, situations and is kind of, of a pseudo Michael Clayton, you know, comes in, you know, fixes things and then leaves,

but also like Michael Clayton, if he was also willing to kill people. But there's just not enough there. Even when we see these scenes of him in Washington having these meetings with like the Secretary of State or with Rosie Perez or whatever, I think part of it really is, and I know that, like, I am more of an Affleck hater than most people, or more of an Affleck skeptic. I wouldn't say I hate the guy, but, like, I am more of an Affleck skeptic than most. But, like, even, even granting that, I do think he's legitimately bad in this movie, yeah. And I think it really, really, like, damages the movie as a whole to not have that character feel specific or comfortable. Yeah, we do. We

don't really understand even kind of the vibe of this guy, especially when she ultimately sleeps with him, too, which was a major point of contention for a lot of critics as well. Well, it just kind of comes out of nowhere, where it's just like, yeah. And that, like, he's a source, so. And that scene, of course, the sort of post-coital scene for them, where it's just, like, topless, you know, Hathaway is in bed, Toplas, and also she has, her character is a breast cancer survivor, so she has, you know, a mastectomy scar on the one side. And that's a thing that kind of comes up a couple of times in the movie and is, I don't know how I feel about the way that it is kind of used as like a supplemental, supplemental material to make her character more interesting.

to like, as a, like, oh, this is, you know, a personality trait of hers. She's a cancer survivor. And it sort of gets pulled out of, you know, the pocket for a couple of different scenes. I don't know. I don't know about that. It's kind of of a piece with the rest of the movie that any type of detail, because so little is sticking, that everything just feels like... You're tacking things on to a, you know, construction paper. or sort of like a pin the tail on the donkey kind of a thing.

Character detail as local color, you know, not like... Yeah, yes, yes, yeah. You know, at a certain point, it feels like either everything in this movie is essential or none of it is essential. Yeah. Talk a little bit more about your assertion that this is the movie where Willem Defoe finally goes too far. I don't think it's that he's going... I don't know. it's

something's not really working. It does feel a little bit like he's phoning it in, which it's like I never feel that way about him, even in that bad Patricia Hart-Cat movie where he plays, Hunter S. Thompson. Has that movie come out yet? No. No, she recut the movie.

And it still has a not a good movie. Sorry, Patty. Love you. I just don't think he's very good in this movie. Though, of course, one of my, I did write down when he slammed onto that. Well, it doesn't even slam onto the F slur, but he just kind of like spits it out. Well, and it's the first time we see him. And it is followed up, like I said, in quick succession, he then says cissy and then says queer.

And I'm like, I'm starting to wonder if this guy's casually homophobic. Like, if this guy just has like a really sort of rancid personality. Maybe he's hard to deal with. I wonder if maybe this person is a head. in Anne Hathaway's life. I do think casting him as the father of Anne Hathaway is a little cracked. Like, I don't know. He's played the father of a lot of different actresses.

So it's like maybe, you know, and it's like the man does not stop working. No, no. God, his filmography is really crazy. Which is then not a surprise then that he has made quite a few movies that we have talked about on this podcast. We have reached the sixth. Timers portion of this episode. It is the ultra rare occasion. We've talked recently about how we have so, so, so many actors and actresses on the precipice of six timers. This is why we have recently forgotten a couple. Kira Knightley, we'll get you back. And also, in the case of this week, where we have to double up because Willem Defoe and Toby Jones are both reaching the six timers. threshold at the same time. So to commemorate this, as always, I give a little quiz on the movies to Chris. Instead of doing two separate quizzes, I have combined them both into one

quiz. So Chris, the answers for these questions will be among the 11 movies, because the last thing he wanted counts for both, the 11 movies that I'm about to say. So Willem Defoe, we have, did not cover a Willem Defoe movie until episode 167. It took us a minute, but then we really got on board. So we did The Life Aquatic with Steve Zisou, murder on the Orient Express, Kenneth Brando's murder on the Orient Express, Spike Lee's Inside Man,

Mary Heron's American Psycho, back to Wes Anderson for the French Dispatch, and then the last thing he wanted. Toby Jones has a, more eclectic set of films. Toby Jones was in our ninth episode ever, Serena,

the Susanna Beer, Serena. Ladies and Lavender, written and directed by Charles Dance. Did not remember he was in that movie, great. Uh-huh, yep. The Painted Vale. Did not remember he was in that movie. Great. Infamous.

You better remember that he's an infamous, because he stars. Oh, no, wait. He's great in the Painted Vale. Yeah. yes he is um infamous uh definitely remembered he's in that movie uh kelly rikert's first cow and then uh the last thing he wanted again so 11 films are you ready for the quiz let's do it all right of those 11 films which is the longest spiritually or realistically realistically.

Is it murder on the Orion Express? It's not. That movie is too long, though. Feels long. That's another one that feels long, yeah. Painted veil. No. Wow.

Serena? No, think of the filmmakers. Who tends to make decently long movies? Or at least often does. Is it inside? Man? It's Inside Man, 129 minutes of Inside Man. Oh, I don't remember.

See, I thought Murder on the Orient Express was like two and a half hours. Murder on the Orient Express is, give me a second, unless I'm wrong, 114 minutes by my research. So, okay. Spiritually. Yes, shortest. I will tell you they're... French dispatch?

They're all over 100 minutes, not French dispatch. Okay. It's got to be life aquatic then. No. Wow. Infamous? Nope. So straight.

Ladies and Lavender. Nope. All right. Four strikes and I am just going to give an answer. It's American Psycho. Oh, that is a short movie. That's right. 102.

102 minutes. Best Rotten Tomato score. Give yourself a second and you'll get this. You'll get it on your first cow. Yes, it's first cow. 96%. Worst Rastewst Rotten Tomatoes. worst Rotten Tomato score.

Last thing he wanted, single digits, baby. By a mile, last thing he wanted, 5% on Rotten Tomatoes. 5% is a lot for this movie. It's a lot. I put a pin in this. I want to loop back. We will. Biggest box office. I was surprised by this. I did not remember this,

but domestic box office, I should say. It's inside, man. It's not. Close, but it's not. Okay. One of these movies, made $100 million. Oh, murder on the Orrin Express did, yeah. $102 million, murder on the Oriane Express.

Yes. Lowest box office, and once again, I will say, give yourself a, not counting less thing you wanted, which wouldn't have been reported. Right. It's got to be, well, see, first cow would have box office because it has like a week's worth of pre-shutown COVID box office. But then there's Serena, which like really didn't get a release

between those two I'm gonna say first cow it is first cow by a matter of like $74 million or $74,000 rather

Serena was like 176,000 first cow was 101,000 so yeah wild okay which movie was

written by the same screenwriter as freeheld oh Freeheld was written by Ron Niswater? Yes, Rod Niswana. Who wrote the painted veil? Yes, he wrote the adaptation for the painted veil.

Very good. Which movie was written by the same screenwriter as the 1993 Melanie Griffith starring Born Yesterday. Ooh, that I'm not sure. So I have to imagine these are going to overlap some. Is it like Ron Bass, who I believe wrote Serena? It's not Ron Bass, who I don't think wrote Serena.

Serena was written by Christopher Kyle. Great. Yeah. But probably in the same ballpark as Ron Bass in terms of, like, screenwriter. Inside Man? Nope, not Inside Man. I'll give you one more guess. Ladies and Lavender.

No, it's infamous. Douglas McGrath did the script for Born Yesterday. Which of these movies has the same cinematographer as Josie and the Pussy Cats, Gothica, and Mother. Well, Mother exclamation point? Yes. Matthew Libetique, who shot... Oh, Inside Man. Inside Man, yes.

Yeah. I just wanted to point out that Josie and the Pussycats gothica and mother exclamation point are all the same cinematographer. That's really good. Which of these movies has the same cinematographer as Pulp Fiction? Did Richardson do Pulp Fiction? Oh, I don't know. So that's going to be... I'll just say murder on the Orient Express. Not murder on the Orient Express.

Murder on the Orient Express was Harris Zumberlocus Zumberlocus I'll say infamous Based on Vives alone Not infamous Infamous was Bruno Delbeno

Actually One more guess And then I'll give it to you Painted Vale Not painted veil Painted Vale was Stuart Dryberg. American Psycho was a cinematography by Andres Secula, if I'm pronouncing Eastern European. Not even in the ballpark.

I realized when I was coming up with that question, I never knew who did the cinematography for Pulp Fiction, which is crazy. Which movie was released in Pice's season? Um, well, the last thing he wanted on Netflix, right? That's not Aquarius season. I think that Valentine's Day, I think, is still in Aquarius. You're still in Aquarius. Um, Inside Man. No.

Inside Man, I think, is Ares. Yeah, I couldn't remember if it was April or March. Um, infamous. No. Infamous came out in October. Inphemous is a Libra. So ladies in lavender? No, ladies in lavender is a late April, which makes it a Taurus. So then it has to be Serena. No, no. Serena. It's American Psycho? It's, hold on a second. Serena is late March, which makes it an Aries, just like American Psycho. Inside Man, wow. Also in Aries.

Inside Man, yeah, so there are three movies that are Ares. That's really interesting. But it's American Psycho then. No, American Psycho is another one. Oh, first cow. First cow. First cow. God.

Yeah. I just talked about how it was released during COVID. March. Early March. Yes. which movie has the same composer as the Lego movie and a Minecraft movie? How interesting. So the last thing he wanted?

No. Okay. Murder on the Orient Express. No, that's Patrick Doyle. Okay. Patrick Doyle doing the score for a Minecraft movie would be very interesting. there. Infamous. Not infamous. One more guess and then I'll give it to you. Damn, I did, I'm doing horrible in this one.

Look at the list of movies. Look at, no, I'm not going to let you guess inside man. That's an insane guess. Terrence Blancher did not do the mind. Oh, well, of course. That's Terrence Blancher. I'm just like, what is, it's not going to be first cow, even though it's most recent. You know, you're basing enough of when people are working. Look at the list of movies. It's the movie with the vibe that like most vibes with. I guess you would say one of the West Andersons, but I don't think that's going to be right. Diplah? No. Deplah did French dispatch, but De Plau did not do... Then is it Life Aquatic?

It is. It's Mark Mothersbaugh for Life Aquatic. Okay. Which two movies have the same composer as Guillermo del Toro's Frankenstein. Oh, so it's coming up. That is not... Is it De Plaa? So French Dispatch and Painted Veil?

Yes. Yes, exactly right. There you go. Redemption. Okay. Which two movies played the Sundance Film Festival? Last Thing He Wanted. Yep.

And American Psycho. Yes. Which two movies play the Telluride Film Festival? First Cow and the Painted Veil. No. Not Painted Veil. You got First Cow. French Dispatch?

No. I think it did play Telluride. Did it? It was like at it. It was there like. Like sneak preview, whatever. Infamous. Infamous did, because both Capote's movies play Tell You Right.

Yes. Which four movies, this is a funny question. Which four movies feature two or more characters wearing hats on the poster? Murder on the Oriane Express. No, that's the upset of the decade. I'm leaving. It's not. Right?

Isn't that not the craziest? That it's not that? Yeah. Two people wearing hats on the poster, not murder. At least. Life Aquatic. Life Aquatic, of course. Yes, of course. Now you're playing a numbers game. Oh, infamous. Infamous. Infamous. Because it's Capote and then inside Capote's face, there are other people.

And one of them has a hat. Ladies and Lavender. Yes, iconically, ladies and lavender. They both have hats. French Dispatch. There's a lot of characters on that French Dispatch. Not as many as you would think wearing hats, but at least at least a few. So, all right. Which movie was filmed at locations in the Czech Republic? Serena. Serena.

Which movie was filmed at locations in China? Painnevale. Yes. Which movie was filmed at locations in Italy? Life Aquatic. Yes, very good. Which two movies feature soundtrack titles by David Bowie? Life Aquatic.

Yes. Yes. Inter... Uh... American Psycho? Yes, American Psycho. Very good. Which movie has IMDB keywords that include shipwreck, chamber pot, and gramophone? Ladies and Lavender.

Yes, very good. Which movie has IMDB keywords that include illegitimate sun, blackmail, and talking to an eagle? Life Aquatic. No. Although illegitimate son, good one. but illegitimate son blackmail and talking to an eagle When do they talk to an eagle in one of these?

Oh, you've forgotten a subplot to one of these movies. Oh, murder on the Orient Express? No. French dispatch. No, one more guess. Serena. Serena. Remember?

She's an eagle trainer? Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Which movie got three teen choice award nominations? Uh... Was it Serena? It wasn't. Murder on the Orient Express.

Murder on the Orient Express. Three teen choice nominations. Um, which of, which two of these movies were NBR, National Border Review, top ten movies? Ladies and Lavender. No. No, that was a special record. for achievement of filmmaking. Painted veil.

Painted veil, yes. First cow. Yes, it was just those two. Yes, painted veil and first cow. Which one of these movies got a National Board of Review special recognition for excellence in filmmaking. Ladies and Lavender. It's not Ladies and Lavender. I just double-checked it to be short because you sounded so confident.

It's not that. Paint of Vail. No. Painted Vail was the top ten. American Psycho? Yes, American Psycho. There we go. Which two of these movies were Golden Globe nominees for score?

Painter Vail. Yes, that won. And French Dispatch? French Dispatch. There we go. Which three of these movies were AARP movies for grown-ups nominees. Ladies in Lavender. Yes.

This is kind of tough, because, like, you think of the acting nominees first, and then I guess, would they have nominated murder on the Oriane Express for something? I'll say murder on the Oriane Express. How dare you doubt that they would nominate a Kenneth Branagh thing for AARP? Of course they did. Of course they did. And first cow. No, but that's a very good guess. infamous

No I'll give you one more guess Pain and Vale Yes paint and veil very good Which of these movies got a Razzie nomination Last thing he wanted We'll talk about it We'll talk about it

Which two films feature stars of Casino Royale Um Interesting Ladies and Lavender No That Daniel Craig was on that Um, you mean Daniel Bruel. Yeah.

Daniel Craig is not in Ladies and Ladies and Light. I don't remember much of that movie. Um, I remember the Lavender. And then the Ladies. Uh, this one goes out to the ladies and also. The Lavender. Um, Murder on the Oriane Express. No, surprisingly.

Okay. Oh, Mads Mikkelson is in one of these for sure. Because he's the bad guy in that, right? He is, but he's not in any of these. movie. Okay. I will say you're, you're overlooking the major star of Cassano. Oh, Judy Dench is in Ladies and Lavender. Oh, shit. You're right. So it's three. Sorry. And murder on the Orient Express. Then it's four, because I forgot Judy Dutch entirely. It's two other actors. So there's four fucking movies. Sorry about that. Daniel Craig is in one of these movies. Oh, he's an

infamous. Yes. The Just for Men, I couldn't remember. Who's James Bond's friend? Ava Green. No, friend, like, platonic friend. American friend. American friend. There's an American in that movie? There's an American spy who sometimes shows up as James Bond's friend.

I don't remember this at all. Jeffrey Wright. Oh, who is in the French dispatch? There you go. Okay, yes. I've always been kind of out on the Craig Bonds. I understand. I understand.

I think I've seen. casino royale once. I don't like any other bonds besides the Daniel Craig fans. Which two films feature stars of Burt? You Burt? Well, Serena obviously. There's so many people in Burt.

Isn't Daniel Broll in Burt? So it's Ladies and Lavender. Yes, there you go. Thank you for the double assist. Which two films feature stars of The Counselor? The Counselor. So Um, that's Fastbender, that's Cruz, that's Cameron Diaz, that's Bardem, um, Brad Pitt, if I didn't say that. It would make a lot of sense if someone in American Psycho is in the counselor.

It would, but no, as far as I can tell, no. One of those people you mentioned is definitely one of the answers. Oh, Murder on the Orient Express has Penelope Cruz in it. You would not remember that because she gets fuck all to do in that movie. There's also somebody who is fairly deep down the cast list of the counselor, but I know you love that movie, so I thought there was a chance you might be able to get that. I'm trying to remember anybody who's not on the poster. She's in like one scene.

Maybe I don't remember. I've only seen the counselor when we did it for the show. I think that one scene takes place in, in a prison, in a prison interaction. Okay. Where somebody goes to, like, speak to somebody who's in prison. Who would that conceivably be? Be great if it was Isabella Rossellini. It's not.

It's an actress. It's not, it's not Tilda. No. It's not Blanchet. No. It's not Gwyneth. Where is the action in the counselor kind of mostly taking place? Poolside.

In cars. No, but like geographically in the United States. On the coast. No. Florida. Is it Florida? I don't know. It's in the Florida of the mind.

That's true. I thought it was like the American Southwest. Think of like the American South. Who would make sense in the American Southwest? Southwest. Is it Rosie Perez? It's Rosie Perez. Wow. Do you not remember Rose Perez in the counselor? I don't remember her in the counselor. About which of these films did Slates David Edelstein say, why is it that so many people think this filmmaker is the voice of their generation? Is their generation that vacuous? It's one of the Wes Anderson's life aquatic? Life aquatic, yes.

Shut up, David Edelstein. Shut up. About which of these films did the observers Rex Reed say? the terrible script by Redacted is more wooden than the tree stumps the lumberjacks leave behind. When are there... Is this the first cow? Which movie deals with lumber as like a main plot point?

Vaguely, multiple? Ladies and Lavender, is there lumber? No, that's like seaside. Painted veil? No. Nope. First cow. No, once again, you're...

Oh, Serena, Serena. Rex Reed, even when you're wrong and offensive, keep talking. Don't shut up. Please keep telling on yourself. And about which film did our friend, Jordan Hoffman, for TV Guide, say, Disorienting, phony, and impossible to follow, and makes for two very uncomfortable hours. The last thing he wanted. The last thing he wanted.

Well done with that epic. and long six-timers quiz. Not wrong, Jordan, but... Oh, so right. Five percent Rotten Tomatoes score. Yeah, I mean... I almost want to... When you look at the Metacritic

and most people are in like the 40s range on Metacritic scale, that makes so much more sense. That makes so much more sense. But it also makes sense that the way that Rotten Tomatoes does it, that it would be a five, because I would find it very hard to be, like thumbs up to this movie. You can see a lot of

I mean there were a lot of pans for this movie but like negative non-pans being the universally accepted opinion for this movie. I've heard a lot of people be like that movie sucks and then but like

but then also a lot of that of that kind of like well you know there are some good things and whatever. It is interesting that Hathaway was mostly regarded as the best part of it and yet she gets a Razzie nomination for this because it gets all wrapped up in the witches, which I do feel like is a more just of, I mean, whatever, the Razzie suck. But like, if you were going to name a bad performance that Hathaway gives in 2020,

the witches would at least be more justifiable. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, she's over the top and whatever, and that movie doesn't fail because of her. Like, not to do the Miriam Arles. It's not a good one, though. Yeah. It's for children.

Yes, but just because it's for children doesn't mean it can be bad. But it doesn't mean, I don't think it, she's not bad in that movie. The movie is not good, but, like, it's not her fault. None of these things are ever her fault. It's not Anne Hathaway's fault. This is my, like, ongoing thing I'm saying. None of these things are ever her fault. None of these things are Anne Hathaway's fault, that's for sure.

Yeah. What else is there to discuss? I'm going to go through my little, I'm glad we talked about Anne Hathaway smoking. Oh, this movie fully. blows up a dog. Are you one of those people who like tell me if this movie harms a dog or else I don't like to see

animals in peril, but I'm not like... Well, you don't get a whole lot of time to feel like nervous for this dog. Because they just like fully blow up a dog. Oh, there's a sequence where she like fully cusses out her editor could not be me. Would never be me. There's a moment in when Affleck

meeting with the, I believe it's the Secretary of State, where they're talking about, that scene goes on for fucking ever, where the guy's talking about how some people have congressional ambitions, but some people have ambitions that are hiring that. And, um, and the guy goes, you're an executive branch kind of man, treat. And I'm just like, some of the lines in this movie need to be shot into space, never to return. Um, Affleck's face is so smooth. oh god not the very cliched car chase that encounters the ethnic

parade so you have to stop for the ethnic parade like that is I do love I do love a thriller cliche thriller cliche is very funny but once that happened I was just like oh my God like of course it's some sort of

Catholic feast day in Antigua and there is a parade that is stopping Anne Hathaway from getting away. Maybe the most damning thing I have to say about this movie is I was so, you know, and it's like you're in the Iran contra of the mind sometimes, and you don't know what's going on, to the point that when she's on the phone with her daughter and, like, is monologuing to her daughter,

I did question, is she talking to her younger self? Like, is this going to be some type of twist where she's talking to her younger self? That's how, like, un-defined some of these relationships are that I was even confused by her speaking to her daughter. Something that should just not be that difficult to follow. The daughter is another sort of thing like the breast cancer, where they sort of like haul her out of moth balls. when they need to, you know, have a plot, have an emotional beat. I think maybe this movie, I understand that, like, I understand that the movie decides it needs to hang its hat on the idea that, like, why does she go into these dangerous

circumstances or wherever, which to me is, like, the least interesting, like, the whole thing of just, like, I thought I was losing myself, and, you know, I would have nothing left or whatever. And I'm just like, first of all, vague. second of all, uninteresting. Like, I'm sorry, I'm not interested in. And this very well may come from the book because I know that, like, knowing what you know about Joan Didion, there's a lot of sort of mother, daughter, stuff that very much weighs on her with her personal story and whatnot. But I think in the context of this story, I could not care less about why she's chasing this story down.

just be enough that it's a story about, like, ungodly corruption. And also, she was in El Salvador when, like, they shot up the journalist's office. You know what I mean? Like, they're, like, that's enough. That's enough motivation. She doesn't also have to be, like, well, I was losing touch with my daughter. Like, stop it. Well, but you also mentioned at the beginning, you misspoke and called her a spy.

But I also think there's definitely viewers of this movie who can't. can't tell if she's a journalist or a spy. Right, right, right, yeah. Ayah, aye, aye, Chris. You know, lots to defend, even if I didn't really say much positive about the movie. It's so clearly a movie that when you watch it, you're like, the people who made this movie had a clear vision. They knew what they were making.

and I just don't see it with what I'm watching but it is so confidently made that you know they knew what they were doing it just didn't translate like there's some really visually impressive stuff in this movie and some really visually cringy stuff in this movie sure like this is this is definitely

like a transitional Netflix era where they gave this movie $100 million to film But then there's certain shots in this movie that look like a shitty Netflix movie. It's wild. I think one of the problems with Netflix and being able to throw around money is I think they are, it's very easy for them sometimes to cut their losses. And to say that there's no sense of, well, we've already invested $100 million into this movie. We better fucking make it work.

We better fucking sell this movie somehow. And for a lot of movies with theirs, they're just like, well, it'll go in the library, and it'll go on a carousel, and maybe we'll pretend that it's the number one movie in the country this week. What was the number they used to trot around of, like, it was always the same number. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's how you knew it was bullshitty of how much the movie was viewed. I want to, were I writing a show? like the studio or something like that that satirizes Hollywood. I would

like somebody to make a scene that takes place in the boardroom of one of these streamers where they have one of those lottery ping pong ball machines and every time one comes up, they're like, this is the number 10 movie. You know what I

mean? Because I do feel in my bones that those things are just like creative fiction, that they are that those top tens are just like, what do you think would be an interesting number four movie this week? Let's put that in number four. Listen,

Deserves. A copycat deserves to be number four in the country. All right, let's do the IMDB game because I am ready to not be talking about this and I have so much shit to do, you guys. Yep, yep, let's do it. This is the day before I go to Toronto. So my schedule is bursting at the seams with shit to do. Every week, we end our episodes with the IMDB game

where we challenge each other with an actor, actress to try to guess the top four titles that IMDB says they are most known for. If any of those titles are television, voice-only performances, or non-acting credits, we'll mention that up front. After two wrong guesses, we get the remaining titles release years as a clue.

If that's not enough, it just becomes a free-for-all of hints. That is the IMDB game. Yeah, it is. Oh, I'm very excited. I actually should have done that, though, because you are the host. You should have made me do that. But anyway.

Oh, I'm hosting this episode. See, this is how confused. this movie has us. This is maybe the worst thing to try to watch and talk about right before it's like we're in scheduling. Our brains are not here with us right now. Okay. So I guess it's my choice whether I want to give or guess. I'll give. Okay. So I followed the D. Reese path and one of the things that she's going to be doing soon on television was that show criminal that I mentioned. An intergenerational story of families

connected through a shared criminal history. You don't say. Seemingly, the star of this show is an actor I very much enjoy. One Charlie Hunnam, who we've never done. Charlie Hunnam offers you three films and one television series.

Isn't he on that lioness show? No, I don't want to guess that yet oh no his tv show is sons of anarchy sons of anarchy i was like oh no does chris not remember sons of anarchy okay i mean i never watched it no i wouldn't imagine you would not really for me um okay so his movies um interesting fully almost just blurted out of garrett headland movie proving our episode correct one of our great moments what if one is like

Triple Frontier um see this is hard because now I'm like Garrett Headland movie Garrett Headland movie um Mm-hmm So Charlie Hunum I'll just guess movies that I know

that he's in Cold Mountain. No, but a good guess, but no. Strike one. Because again, my brain is shutting down and I'll just say Oh, Triple Frontier. No, another good guess, another Netflix movie, but no. Okay, so your years are 2006,

2013, and 2017. Okay, so 06 would be the time that he's either right before Sons of Anarchy or is in Sons of Anarchy. I can tell you Sons of Anarchy runs from 2008 to 2014. Okay, so right before. So this is maybe like a character role. What are the other years?

13 and 17. 13 and 17. Okay. Um, uh, uh, uh, one of the,

oh, is, um, No, I guess Crimson Peak is neither. Yeah, Crimson Peak is... Yes. So... Your 2006-1, you are sort of on the right track with Cold Mountain.

That's sort of, I would say, analogous to the space he holds in that movie. He's like a villain. He's like a... Not the big villain, but he's like in the villain's crew. Yeah, that's exactly what it is. So it's 2000, you said 13 or 14? 13. Is that Pacific Rim?

Pacific Rim. There we go. So an 06 movie with like villains. It's not the departed. Is this an Oscar movie? It got nominated for an Oscar. Okay. Is it, no, that's not the year of the town.

nominated probably below the line in 06. Well, no. No. So it's nominated for an acting award? No. A screenplay. Well, they actually got nominated for three. I always forget that.

Yes, screenplay, and then two below the lines. Okay. So what even were the... We just talked about 06, too. We've talked about this movie. Oh, it's an episode we've done. Fantastic. Oh, so we would have talked about it as an exception.

Oh, six would be... With villains in it. And he is a villain. He's, yes, he's a villain. He's part of a cohort of... Australia wasn't nominated for screenplay. That was 08. That was also 08. Right.

He's responsible, he and his little group, for the death of a major character that happens early in the movie. During an especially famous scene. that ties into one of the below-the-line nominations that has got for a specific scene yes and he kills a main character oh is this a is he like a Batman goon no no no no not Batman Batman wouldn't have gotten a screenplay nomination no it would have adapted screenplay I'm just I'm trying to think of, like, famous death seat. Oh, 6. My brain really is not working.

It was one of those things which is like, we did not expect that character to die that early. We kind of thought that that character would be the main character, one of the main characters of this whole movie. Oh, man, I'm struggling today. And they die during a scene where people are like, that scene, we should give the person So cinematography? What kinds of scenes are

bravourous cinematography scenes? Car chases. Oh, so it's a car chase movie. And it's perhaps that's not a car chase movie. But there is a car chase, there's cinematography. And like what's a really showy what's a really showy

aspect of like cinematography what's like stunty no what's like it's like a single take oh it's children of men there we go we did do an episode on children of men

we did yes known for sure um for Charlie Hunnam Okay, one more movie. He's the lead. He's the titular character.

He's the only one on the poster. It is not a movie that anybody talks about. It's not a Robin Hood, but it's the other thing. It's a Pinocchio. No, you're getting farther. It's not Peter Pan. not pan. Nope. Bring it back, bring it closer back to Robin Hood.

It's sheriff of Nottingham. No. No. But it's like, it's the same idea of like a, you know, an oft-adapted story. And it's not Shakespeare. No. But I bet you a really dumb person. person might think it was.

But it's in the Robin Hood vein. What else could it be? This is how you know I'm struggling, struggling. Oh, when there was an animated Disney movie about this general milieu around the same time as there was a Disney Robin Hood in that same era. That's not going to help you. That's maybe too confusing. It is from a famous. Junkie director, who I often like.

Guy Ritchie. There you are. Right away. Guy Ritchie, who, if I recall correctly, has done a Robin Hood. It's not those gentlemen or Kingsmen, whatever they're called, movies. No, but it's a, again, it's a very prestigious story. I don't think he's done a Robin Hood, but you are maybe thinking he did a Robin Hood because it's this movie. Yeah.

Oh, it's King Arthur? Yes. I'm not going to make you say the subtitle, but do you remember the subtitle? King Arthur, Legend of the, whatever the fuck. You're so close! Legend of what? Man, Legend of the Sword. There you go.

King Arthur, Legend of the Sword. Have never seen that movie. I mean, it's at least a movie that, like, he's the lead of, and you don't have too many of that. Yeah. Have never seen that. I also went into the, D-Ree's television sphere.

We talked about Masters of Air as one of the examples. From Masters of Air, I have chosen Callum Turner. Oh, okay. This is famously rude. I can, even I'm normally good at telling these people apart.

You know that I have famously in the past have had Callum Turner face blindness. Callum Turner, who is still with Duolipa, yes? I have no idea. Romantically? There is one television show.

Is one of them... Oh, is Masters of the Air, the television show? Yes, I wish you would have named another TV show. It would have been very funny. Famously, I, for a long time, I couldn't tell him and Josh O'Connor apart. I now can't because Joshua O'Connor's gotten a lot more famous. But the movie that they were both in together was Emma, period.

Emma period is correct. Okay. Is one of them... That only living boy in New York? Incorrect. Okay. Beach Rats was Harris Dickinson. Correct.

God's own country was Josh O'Connor. Callum Turner. He's, like, of them, he, like, is the one who you'll most often cast as, like, an English, like, brough, you know what I mean? Like, track suit wearing, like, you know, whatever. How many do I have left, two? You have one incorrect guess left, but you have to guess two more times. I have to guess two more titles. Yes. Okay. Um, Callant Turner, Calum Turner, Callum Turner. Is he in, is he in a Saftees movie? Why am I thinking that he's in a Saffty's movie? You're thinking of Caleb Landry Jones. Well, no, I would never confuse anybody else for

Caleb Landry Jones. How could you? He's one of a kind. He's unique. Um, Oh, I'm just going to throw something out to get guesses, so, or to get a clue. So I'm going to say the personal history of David Copperfield. That is incorrect. Your years are 2015 and 2013. I believe this 2015 just premiered in 2015. I'm looking this up. It's a 2016 movie.

Okay. 2013, though. Yes, it premiered in 2015, hit American Theater's 2016. So 2013, he's pretty young, I would imagine. No, but you said there's a 2013 movie. 2023. What are my years? 2023 and 2015.

Okay, so you, because you did originally say 2013. Well, again, I'm fading. Yes, well. All right, that makes more sense. So, 2023 is merely two years ago. Was that an Oscar movie? We would definitely do an episode on this movie. Okay.

Is he the lead or is it an ensemble? I believe he is the lead. I never saw this movie because I know I will have to watch it for the show at some point. He is second build, but I would believe that he is a co-lead, at least. With an actress? With an actor. With an actor. Are they enemies?

Um, no, but I would see them at odds. This is a movie that, because of its director, we were like, well, I guess we have to keep this on the Oscar horizon. Uh-huh. And then it made good money, but never got a nomination. Made good money. With Callum Turner as the co-le-ed. It made good money at Christmas. is it the movie where they um um um with the george michael song no do you know what i'm talking about

baby girl no last christmas is what i was thinking of um who i think is henry golding um it is henry golding christmas 2023 what was going on at christmas 2023 that wasn't avatar year that was Oppenheimer year. This may be a director who is back in the current Oscar conversation, not as a director. So not Cooper, the opposite direction of Cooper. A director, but not as a director, alone, yet not alone. Would it be the first... Oscar conversation or the awards conversation?

The Oscar conversation. As an actor or as an... As an actor. This director is like the only reason this... And because it was a Christmas release, the only reason that this was in an Oscar conversation. Brana? No.

We like this person more as an actor than a director. Clooney, Clooney. What's the film? Is it the tender bar? It is not the tender bar. Cluny burned us multiple times. It's the rowing movie. It's the rowing movie.

What's the name of the movie? The rowers. No. It's an easy title. The boys in the boat. Boys, you know exactly what you did in my boat. The boys in the boat, correct? Your last movie,

2015 festival premiere, 2016 release. I think we both like this movie. I don't think I would get any enjoyment out of watching it right now. Oh, because of politics? Just because the world we live in, like, it loses its fun. Any fun that can be glossed from this movie. This is a director that I think a lot of people are rooting for. Um

Steve McQueen A director who I think is about to have an Emmy Oh, Jeremy Solnier Yes So the 2015 Jeremy Salonet was Green Room Green Room Yes, of course He's really good in Green Room

He's the one I think that like Pulls that guy's arm until it breaks I think that's right He's very hot in Green Room also Yes, good movie um yeah okay good clues good clues very good good game struggling today all right let's wrap this shit up and then we'll see each other very soon oh right i'm hosting so you are hosting let's do it all right that's our episode if you want more at this head oscar buzz you can check out the tumbler at

this head oscarbuzz at tumbler.com you should also follow us on instagram at this had oscarbuzz and on our patreon at patreon.com slash this hat oscar buzz joe where can the listeners find more of you? Letterboxed and Blue Sky at Joe Reed. Read spelled R-E-I-D. I also host a Patreon-exclusive podcast on the films of Demi Moore called Demi Myself and I. You can follow that, find that, subscribe to that at Patreon.com slash Demi-Pod.

That is spelled D-E-M-I-P-O-D. And I am on Letterbox and Blue Sky at Christi-File. That's F-E-I-L. We would like to thank Kyle Cummings for his fantastic artwork, Dave Gonzalez and Gavin Medius for technical guidance when we need it. And Taylor Cole for our theme music. please remember to rate, like, and review us on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, wherever else you get your podcast. Five-star review in particular really helps us out with that Apple podcast visibility.

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