This Is Woman's Work with Nicole Kalil - 133 / Making Friends As An Adult with Danielle McCombs

Episode Date: April 12, 2023

You might be wondering why we’re doing an episode on how to make new friends because it sounds like a topic for a younger audience, right? When we’re REALLY young, making friends just sort of happ...ens. But we grow and evolve, and sometimes our friends don’t grow and evolve in the same direction at the same time… and we discover that some relationships that used to fuel us, now drain us. On today’s episode of TIWW we’re going to talk about making friends. The truths, the challenges, and some strategies to help us.  I’ve asked Danielle McCombs to join me. Danielle is a Co-Active Training Institute Certified coach with her own Life Coaching practice, which she founded after a 20 year career in commercial real estate. She hosts the podcast “The Opposite of Small Talk,” with her friend Kristy Olinger where they explore topics about personal and professional development. She had reached out to me and suggested this topic and everything in my being screamed YES, we need to talk about this! Ok friends, it’s time to go make some new friends! And make sure you love on the ones you already have who have seen you through many, or even just a few, seasons in your life. Because I believe there’s no better thing to be, no greater success, no better achievement than being and having a great friend. To learn more about Danielle and her work go to: www.daniellemccombs.com You can follow her on IG @danimc23  Listen in to her podcast The Opposite Of Small Talk To learn more about what we are up to outside of this podcast, visit us at NicoleKalil.com.

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Starting point is 00:00:00 Here's a little appetizer to get you ready for the main course. If something were to happen right now, I have a group of people who will show up at my door to help me with whatever I need. And knowing that you have that like army at your back, but also that shoulder to cry on, that person to celebrate with you. And these are all the same and different people. You might be wondering why we're doing an episode on how to make new friends on the This Is Woman's Work podcast, because it sounds like a topic for a younger audience, right? I mean, when we're really young,
Starting point is 00:00:46 making friends just sort of happens. I can remember JJ being on playgrounds and making new friends left and right. And at nine years old, we've started talking about what it means to be a friend and how you can tell if a friend is a good fit for you and you're a good fit for them. As a teenager, my friends were the people I played sports with. And yes, I'm considering cheerleading and dance a sport. And I will fight you on that if you disagree with me. For many people, college is where you find your lifelong friends. And then you make some work friends. And then you start hanging out with your partner's friends and the parents of your kids' friends.
Starting point is 00:01:18 And for many of us, that's how it goes. And for many of us, that's not enough. Because here are a few things that happen, a few general truths about adult friendships. First, we grow and evolve. And sometimes our friends don't grow and evolve in the same direction at the same time. And we discover that some relationships that used to fuel us now drain us. We're super busy. So what used to be easy now requires proactive
Starting point is 00:01:47 outreach and planning. Like if I want to grab coffee with a friend, we book it three to four weeks out, often reschedule and end up finally seeing each other like three months later. And because of that, the list of people who feel worth all that effort gets shorter and shorter. We move in our adult lives. So sometimes our people are scattered across the world, making hangout time way more difficult than it used to be. And we also begin to realize that there is no one person who meets all of our needs. And we hopefully stop expecting perfection from the people around us. But that means we need a variety of people that help us fill our cup. For example, I believe
Starting point is 00:02:26 we all need blanket fort friends. These are the ones that always are our safe space, and they're so easy to be with, and they know the value of great snacks. We need hide-the-body friends, the ones that always have your back, even or maybe even especially during your not-so-great moments in life. We need front row friends who cheer us on and sing our praises in public and truth tellers who care enough to say what needs to be said, even if it hurts a little and they stick around to help you pick up any pieces. We need laugh till we pee friends because laughter heals the soul. We need opposite attract friends so we can see things in different ways. Let's do it friends that will pack a bag on a whim. Older friends for wisdom, younger friends for energy,
Starting point is 00:03:09 and same stage friends for commiserating on how to handle the stages we're in. In some cases, one person may cover a few of these things, but mostly we're looking for several different people to share our lives with. And don't even get me started on, if you're an introvert like me, how hard this can be because I basically rely on amazing extroverts to adopt me and not get upset when I don't feel like leaving my house. And finally, a universal truth that I've come to believe with every fiber of my being is that being friends with other women is necessary. It's life-giving. We're meant to be a community for each other. We're meant to trust and hold and love on each other. I love Jay with every fiber of my being,
Starting point is 00:03:53 and he is my absolute favorite person on the planet. And there's no other person I'd rather spend my days with. And I still need my girls. I require friends trips and women's retreats and coffee breaks and long phone calls. I'm blessed with an actual sister who is one of my best friends, a true front row friend who makes me laugh till I pee. And I know would help me hide a body if it came to that. She'd probably assume they deserved it. But some of my not blood related friends have also become my sisters. And I will share vulnerably that I have a hard time making new friends and I'm missing having more of those relationships in my life. So I am Nicole
Starting point is 00:04:34 Kalil and on today's episode of This Is Woman's Work, we're going to talk about making new friends. And I'm not going to do that alone. So I've asked Danielle McCombs to join me. Danielle is a Co-Active Training Institute certified coach with her own life coaching practice, which she founded after 20 years in commercial real estate. She hosts the podcast, The Opposite of Small Talk with Christy Olinger, where they explore topics about personal and professional development. She had reached out to me and suggested this topic and everything in my being screamed, yes, we need to be talking about this. So Danielle, let's talk about adult friendships. Thank you so much for having me here. And there's so much juicy stuff in the introduction that you
Starting point is 00:05:18 just gave that I'm so excited to talk about this. Clearly I have thoughts on the matter. Okay. So I laid out a few there, but why do you think it's so hard to make friends as an adult? So I want to start off in just letting you know who I am in this so that we can have the conversation. I am the extrovert who brings my introvert friends along with me. I have longstanding friendships in my life. I have friends that I've known since I was six or seven. And then I have friends from all stages of my life. There's a part that I think is innate in me where I'm just like one of those people who like collects people and I'm good at keeping in touch, but I found myself in a position. I moved to San Francisco. I was 36 years old, seven years ago. I knew no one here. And so I've always known that I'd been
Starting point is 00:06:13 good at like making friends, but I was put in a position where I had no choice. I like didn't have, you know, my friends from work and my friends from college around and, and all the network that I had created in New York. And so when I came here, it was like starting from ground zero and it was, it was overwhelming and daunting. And I will say, I am such an extrovert that then like living in this place by myself, not having that, that group to go out with, I had no choice but to put myself out there very vulnerably and work on making friends pretty aggressively. I love the idea of aggressive friend-making. So let's talk maybe about some of the tactics because I also moved across the country. Fortunately, Jay had, you know, this is where he's from. So we have friends through him, but I had to get a little out of my, a lot out of my
Starting point is 00:07:16 comfort zone and aggressively seek out some people. But I don't know that I had any tactical things to do. I just sort of winged it. So what are some tactical tips? So I would say you have to accept every invitation that is given to you. There was, you know, somebody would be like, oh, hey, I think we're going to brunch this weekend. And I was like, yep, I'm in. Right. Anything that was anything that there was an invitation, I was in. And what I did then was if you were invited to a party and there was other people there, right? You start mingling, talking to other people. At the end of
Starting point is 00:07:50 a conversation, I would say, you know, you're really cool. Can we hang out? And will you give me your number? And I literally was like picking people up at every place I went. And I don't know that I did it necessarily like, okay, I have a checklist and now today I need to make a new friend. But what I did was just made it my business to amplify everywhere that I was that like, okay, this one person invited me to this thing and there's other people here. How can I find another person that I like and just say, hey, do you want to go grab a drink?
Starting point is 00:08:21 Do you want to go grab a coffee? And then follow up, right? Not just say, hey, do you want to go grab a drink? Do you want to go grab a coffee? And then follow up, right? Not just say, hey, you're cool. Can we, you want to exchange numbers, but then actually do the work of following up and saying, let's go get a coffee on this date so that it actually happened, right? And then also the other part is once you actually meet and it's great, right? And you have a good time, follow up again. Don't assume that like, oh, we're friends now. And whatever happens is you need to be proactive in it. You
Starting point is 00:08:52 need to continuously follow up, right? It's like dating in a way, but I know a lot of times people dating will be like, well, it's his job to call. No, it is not anybody else's job to call here. You need to be the proactive one. So this might sound like a strange question, but do you go into these events with a dual purpose? Like, are you there for a business and you might meet somebody you like, or do you, you know, go to meet friends and go, oh, well, worst case scenario, maybe there's a connection that can be made on the work side, or do you, you know, go to meet friends and go, oh, well, worst case scenario, maybe there's a connection that can be made on the work side or, or do you kind of segment those things in your mind? I think they all go together. Good people. I believe that good people know good people. And so if somebody invites you to a party and you like them, most likely you're going to like the
Starting point is 00:09:42 other people at that party. Not everybody, right? There's always the people that you're are not going to meld with, but there's probably somebody else there that you're going to like. But the same is true of going to a networking event. Like you're probably, if you, there's probably someone else in that room that you align with in some way that's outside of the business purpose that's there. And so I think that just looking for the people who you align with, who you like, who you want to spend time with. And if that is in business, that's going to help you out because guess what? People want to do business with people that they like.
Starting point is 00:10:14 But also if your businesses don't align, you could also just really enjoy hanging out with each other. Mm-hmm. So what are your thoughts about, I kind of said in the intro, this idea that there is no one person that meets all of our needs. And I think I made that mistake at a younger age where I would have friends and they wouldn't show up for me in a certain way. And I would be disappointed and it might've fractured the friendship or whatever. And then now with the benefit of hindsight, I look back and I go, oh, I was expecting them to show up differently than who they were.
Starting point is 00:10:46 That expectation was me putting it on them. So, you know, I've had friends that I have so much fun going out with and make me laugh to LAP, but then, you know, got upset when they weren't there for me during really tough times. And I was like, now with benefit hindsight, I'm like, that wasn't our friendship. So all of that to say, any tips on how to accept people for who they are in your life and how to decide that? So I think part of it is one, getting to know yourself more, right? Once we can do that and we know, well, I can't show up for everyone for everything they need me to do. And once we can give that grace to ourselves, we can give that
Starting point is 00:11:32 grace to other people. And I definitely know that I have friends who I'm going to call up to go to a concert on a Saturday night and other people that I'm going to call to say, hey, I really need someone to talk to right now. You know, and sometimes they're the same people, but sometimes they're not. And I think when you say that, what I'm thinking, too, is I hear people all the time. And I am single, so I don't know this for sure. But right when people put on their partners that they're the person that has to be their everything. I'm thinking of, like, all the Esther Perel that I've consumed of you expect this one person to be your friend, your lover, your partner, your
Starting point is 00:12:09 everything that is there. And that's unfair to put on one person. And the same thing is true of your friends. Like they can't be, everyone can't be your everything. And so having the different people that, oh, this is the person I call for, you know, coffee on a Tuesday. And this is the person that I asked to come to a really fancy dinner with me or the one that I just want to say, like, can we just sit on the couch and watch a movie together? Like, we don't need to talk, but like, I just want you in my space. And so knowing that there's always, everybody has their different spots and the different things that they're good at, and you're probably not everything for everyone either.
Starting point is 00:12:51 Oh God, no. If somebody needs a like high touch friend, somebody who's going to talk to them like every day or like, I am not your person. I'm the person we won't talk for three months, but pick up right where we left off. So, you know, that's, that's always an example I give. Yeah. And those are, those are wonderful friends to have. I have friends who I have a friend from college who we talk maybe once every few years. And when we pick up the phone, it is like, nothing has changed. And so I think people also have to give those friendships a lot of credit because sometimes what will happen will be like, well, I haven't talked to her in three years. I'm not going to call. Call. That friendship doesn't go away just because you're not talking every day, because you're not in the minutia of their lives and they're not in yours.
Starting point is 00:13:38 There's still a bond there. And I think that that's something that is really important to recognize. And a lot of people let those friendships fall apart or fall away because you think, well, we haven't talked in so long, we must have nothing to talk about. Right. I want to talk about making new friends because that is the title of the episode. You said earlier that friendships or making new friends was a little bit or maybe a lot like dating. So I think back to dating and by the way, I would not want to do that again. It's not the highlight of my life, but I think one of the mistakes I made is I spent a lot of energy when dating worrying about whether or not they liked me or whether or not they were going
Starting point is 00:14:22 to choose me and very little energy on what I was looking for in a partner. So is that something to consider when making new friends? Like, do you have in mind what types of friends you're looking for or what values or am I overthinking this? Is it a little bit more simple? Is it more of a feeling? What are your thoughts about how you decide if somebody is somebody you want to go to coffee with or want to follow up with? Well, I'll also preface this with, um, Christy that I do the opposite of small talk with will say to me, every time I meet somebody, she's like, you want to be everybody's friend. And because every time I meet somebody, I'm like,
Starting point is 00:15:00 oh my God, I love them. And I want to be their friend. And that's part of who I am. And I believe when we met, I called Christy immediately and was like, I met this new person, Nicole, and I want to be her friend. So I might be not as, not as, let's see. Picky? Finicky? Picky. And I don't think that's true though, because I have, right. So I have such good people in my life. And I think that there's a part of me that when you're putting out in the world, like I'm open to new friendships, I'm open to new things. You're putting out or so I could be a part of this club. That's not it. I'm looking for genuine human connection. And if you're looking for that and can enjoy that in some way, you're going to find the right people. And I don't go out saying, okay, I need somebody for coffee on Tuesdays and somebody to go to yoga with me on Fridays. No, it's you meet people, you see where they fit in and see what they like to do. How does that work? And then where does that connection go? So I think it's not necessarily looking for
Starting point is 00:16:12 who, you know, a specific person. I think that's also happens in dating, right? People can be like, well, I, he needs to make this much money. He needs to be this tall and look this way and that way and all of these things. And you put yourself in a very small box of what's available to you. Meanwhile, you know, somebody who's 5'6 and works in a warehouse could be the person you really want to spend your life with. I think that's the thing that is really different here is just being open to different people, being open to what everyone has to offer. This just reminds me having a conversation the other day with a group of my girlfriends and was talking about another friend and was like, well, do you ever tell her that she
Starting point is 00:16:58 does this thing that annoys you? And I was like, it's just her. And I'm accepting her for her. Like I've accepted that not everyone's going to fit into the thing that I want. And there's a point where if it becomes a problem, like that you want to confront that, but I think accepting people for who they are and enjoying that, that like, yeah, she makes these quirky comments all the time that I, yeah, I don't get all the time, but it's part of who she is. And I love her for that. Yeah. Yeah. I'm sure, you know, Jay or some of my friends would tell you, like, I have no filter. And so sometimes things fly out of my mouth and they're like, oh, and I'm like, oh, I'm so glad
Starting point is 00:17:38 you love me anyway. Okay. So you said good people know good people. I love that. Where do we find good people? Where do good people hang out? Like where should we be going or spending our time? Yeah. Well, what are the places you like to go? See, that's the problem. My house. Nobody has broken into my house yet to become my friend. To become your friend. Yeah. No, I'm joking around, but yes, I mean, I'm charitably inclined. I, you know, do go to a lot of women's events, women's retreats. And I meet a lot of people through like how we met, like through work, you know, under the work umbrella, but meet people that are like, Oh, I kind of like this person. But so that's the thing is the things that you
Starting point is 00:18:23 like to do the places you like to be. And then I would also say it's the same thing as networking for a job. So ask your friends, like, who do you know? And I've created a group of friends here in San Francisco that is really like a mishmash of different people and, and people who then say like, oh, so-and-so just moved here. Do you, do you want to hang out there? And I'm always like, yeah, yes, absolutely. Because I know what it's like to be in a new city and know no one. And if you know them, right. One of my good friends from New York was like, hey, do you want to meet my friend, Erin?
Starting point is 00:18:56 She just moved to San Francisco. I said, absolutely. She's become one of my closest friends here. And she came with a really great recommendation. She was from one of my closest friends in New York. And so I think being able to put that out there of like, I'm open for friendships too. And I think as adults, we don't do that. We assume while everybody already has their friends. And one of the things that I keep seeing this quote places is like, you haven't met all of the people you're going to love in your life yet. Right. All of
Starting point is 00:19:25 the people who are going to make a difference, you haven't met them yet. And so if we could keep that mentality of like, nope, it's not just our people now. Cause I'm in my forties and I can't let anybody else in. We have the capacity for that. And I look to my parents who now, you know, they've split their time between New York and Florida and they moved into this community in Florida. And it's not, it's just a condo building. It's not like an over 55 or whatever, but it's a lot of people who retired there. And my parents in the last 10 years have made friends that are so close to them. And to know that you can do that when you're older, right? You're in a different stage of life. You need different things, but have met these people who are incredible and so close to them that it's not an, you know,
Starting point is 00:20:09 you don't get to a certain age and you stop making new friends. Like there is opportunities everywhere you go. Yeah. That's a good point. And what kind of jumped into my head too is that loving reminder. It's never too late. I think sometimes when we think we're too old or it's too late and I wish I would have, and it's like, well, no, just do now out of curiosity. Do you agree? And if you do, why do you agree with me that having friendships with other women is of vital importance? Cause I was one of these people when I was younger, where I was like, oh, most of my friends are men and there's nothing wrong with being friends with men, but my God, I wish I could go back and knock the younger me upside the head because I was surrounded by incredible women. I just didn't value it.
Starting point is 00:20:54 I 100% agree. And I think that, and I'm, I've been surrounded by very strong women my entire life. And my really here, my network has, since I've started my own business and I'm working from home, I did have the realization the other day that I was like, I'm never around men because my close group here is all women and I work by myself. So it like the men that were in my life was, and I always worked in a very male dominated field. So I think that that was why I always sought out women relationships was because that was kind of my getting out of that maybe I need to shift back in a different way too and have other, have men to hang out with. But I think strong female relationships give us something like it gives you a place of refuge. It gives you a place of inspiration. It, you know, I just posted this on my Instagram the other day was Jane Fonda talking about how her women relationships are her everything, right? My female friendships are my
Starting point is 00:22:05 everything. They course correct me. They tell me when I'm doing something wrong. They're there to cheer me on. And I think sometimes we don't give enough credit to that, of that also that the only thing in life isn't just having a partner. Like you need other people in your life to do that. And I don't have a partner. I'm, I'm single, but I have so much support and love in my life from the relationships I have around me. And that is my female friendships. Like I know that I have an, if something were to happen right now, I have a group of people who will show up at my door to help me with whatever I need. And knowing that you have that like army at your back, but also that shoulder to cry on that person to celebrate with you. And these are all the same
Starting point is 00:22:57 and different people. Right. And so we need to do that. One of the things I also love about being with a group of women is how deep we will go so quickly. Like I thought that was just, you know, most of my friends have been my friends like forever. Right. And so when we do a girl's trip or something like that, we'll walk in the door and within like 30 minutes, you know, we're talking about deep, personal, intimate issues. And I just thought that was because we knew each other for so long and so well, but I went to a women's retreat a couple of years ago. It was the first time I'd gone where I literally knew not a single person at the event, which was like fear inducing for me. But anyway, and the same thing happened.
Starting point is 00:23:40 Like I started crying with this other woman in the introductions to each other. So like I just, and then like my husband will go out and it'd be like, you know, what'd you guys talk about? And it's nothing of substance. I'll be like, how's so-and-so's wife doing or how's their kid? And he's like, I don't know. It's just wild to me. And, and I value that so much with women and our relationships, how quickly we're willing to just go there. And I think that's such a huge benefit that women have. And it's a disadvantage that men have. And I'm going to go back.
Starting point is 00:24:14 Jane Fonda has been talking a lot about her female friendships lately. And so follow her on Instagram, go back and look at all of her stuff. But one of the other things she said was that, you know, men, when they go out and they go, they watch sports or they play video games. They're talking about cars, right? They're, they're sitting next to each other. They're not looking at each other and they're talking about looking at a screen, right? Or they're looking at a car, whatever it is, the thing that they're talking about. And that's where their relationships are. And they're very side to side where women sit down and look at each other
Starting point is 00:24:46 and share their feelings and share the things that are going on, share the hard things. And that it like being vulnerable is in front of a group of women is a lot easier for people than men doing that to, you know, on that scale. And so I think that it's something that is like, there's a richness there of the, that we are really lucky to have and allows us to open up in a way and then allows us to be those more open and vulnerable people who feel our feelings and all of that stuff where men don't really get that. And, you know, and boys don't really get that, you know, there's a, there's a point where that shuts off, I think. And I think that's really unfortunate.
Starting point is 00:25:28 Agreed, because it's cathartic. Like I feel lighter after those. And I just wonder like if men don't get those experiences, where do all those feelings go? Like I refuse to believe they're not having them. They're not experiencing life in a similar way. There isn't that wonderful supportive outlet. And that makes me sad for, and I do think by the way, there are
Starting point is 00:25:51 some things that men do a little bit better in relationships, but this is not one of them. But I wanted to talk about that too. Let's talk a little bit about maybe the dark side of female friendships. What isn't working? Where do we make mistakes as women friends? So I think there's a lot that comes down to, I would say comparison. One is a huge part of it. And I think that's a problem in so many parts of our lives. But when we start doing that in friendships, she has this, I don't, or, or that there's a judgment that comes along with that, that puts us in a place that you're on the defensive in a way. And then you can't be that open and vulnerable self where you're really sharing who you are because you feel as though
Starting point is 00:26:35 you're being judged in a way. And that is just, I think that's something that judgment, right? This goes into a million different places, but if you can judge yourself less and then you judge the people you're around less and know that everyone's here just trying to do their best and you give them the benefit of the doubt of that. And if you can have those conversations when the, you know, uncomfortable things come up and you can actually say like, Hey, this is how I'm feeling and feel comfortable in that. Like it gives you such a much of a deeper relationship. But when you don't do that and you avoid this subject or you start getting gossipy, talking behind people's backs,
Starting point is 00:27:16 that creates, it creates a culture of not also trusting the other. Because if we have a group of five or six people and when three people are together, you know that they're talking about the other three people. Well, when you're in that other group, like, or you're not there, who are they talking about? And so I think there's a way in which we're going to talk about the people who are around us, but there's a way to do it that is in a loving, caring way and not a judgmental way and a gossipy way. So I think that's part of having that almost as a, almost like a covenant of that sounds really kind of crazy, but like, right. Like that's like an agreement of what your friendships are. Yeah. I'm not going to gossip about someone else. I'm not going to talk bad about someone else.
Starting point is 00:28:01 I might say, Hey, do you think maybe we should give Nicole a call? Like what's going on? I'm a little concerned about, or I'm concerned about her, or, you know, she said this thing and it really hurt my feelings. And having those conversations in that way is a lot different than calling Nicole a bitch behind her back and talking to everybody else about it. Right. And so it's part of the way you carry yourself is going to set the tone for that. Yes. The gossiping and backstabbing and jealousy and envy. Like I understand the inclination.
Starting point is 00:28:34 Do not get me wrong. I have moments, but I don't understand following through on it. I don't understand as grown adults, we can't just shut our pie holes or like you said, have it in a responsible way or have it directly with the person. I do think that that is a way, this sort of mean girl thing that we carry forward into adulthood. And I think we should try to squash a little bit in teenagers and younger girls as well. I would add to, and I'm curious your thoughts on this. I think in some ways we expect both too much and too little from our women friends. So we just talked about some things that are too little. Like, I don't think it's too much to expect trust and honesty, but the too much thing, like I was just on a trip where a bunch of the women that were there are engaged,
Starting point is 00:29:27 getting married themselves. And like, they were talking about, you know, I have this shower and this, you know, blah, blah, blah. And I have to go on this and blah, blah. And I'm like, you're asking adult women with jobs and lives, in some cases, kids and variety of degrees of financial resources to literally leave their lives for days, spends thousands of dollars. And they were, they were talking about how hard it is. And I'm like, why do we do this? And then why do we only do it when women are having children or getting married? I mean, women are out there doing at least equally as big of things when they're starting a business or running a marathon or leaving a toxic relationship or blah, blah, blah. Why the fuck are we not celebrating that shit?
Starting point is 00:30:16 Sorry. Got a little heated on that one. I mean, as a single woman in her forties who has been a bridesmaid 11 times and has been to, you know, a million weddings, baby showers, all the things. And it's not, I'm more than happy for all of my friends. Right. And are happy to show up for all of those things. But yeah, there's a part of it was like, yeah, I quit my job and started my own business. Like where, where's my shower? Right. Where's my thing? Um, but that's a whole other topic of like, I think right there, there is, where's my shower, right? Where's my thing. Um, but that's a whole other topic of like, I think right there, there is, that's like a society thing that we need to correct of like celebrate. And I don't want to take away from celebrating for your wedding and your baby,
Starting point is 00:30:55 but also celebrate people for the things that they're doing, the hard things that they're doing, you know? And I will say, actually, I had a friend who, after I quit my job last year, started my own business, she goes, okay, when are we going to celebrate? What is the thing you want to celebrate? Is it when you get your certification? Is it when you get your 10th client? Is it, what is the thing we're going to celebrate? And I really appreciated that of, no, this is a big deal, but you let me know what's the moment you want to celebrate? What is the thing we're going to do? And so I think having people realize that, and that's also part being a part of a group of
Starting point is 00:31:30 single women in their forties and fifties, right. That like they are aware of that. They're aware of all of those things, but I will say, yeah, sometimes we do expect a lot of our friends. And what I've come to is you have to do what's right for you. And also when you invite people know that, that it's not going to be right for everyone. It's not doable for everyone because everybody has different resources. They have different commitments. They have different wants. Like, I don't want to say to my friend, I need you to come here for four days because we're going to go and we're going to go wine tasting in Napa.
Starting point is 00:32:01 And this is blah, blah, blah. I mean, it's a great invitation, but if she would, you know, rather go to Disney world with her kids and that's splitting her resources. I understand that. And I think it's, it's under, it's, it's not something against me. It's not personal. It's not taking that personally. And so I think when we have these large events and when we have these things, you just kind of have to understand like, this isn't for everyone, right? Because I want to do this and I want it like, this'll be fun and exciting for me. It's not for everyone. And so I think that just comes back to like giving people grace and also understanding just because, you know, this, my best friend
Starting point is 00:32:41 from growing up, like she couldn't swing it. That's okay. You know? And so it doesn't mean she's not my best friend. It just means that like, we're at different places in our lives and we have different things that are going to happen and different interests. Like ask me to go to Disney world. I'm going to say no to. Absolutely. My intention wasn't to say we shouldn't celebrate when women have babies or when they get married. I just think we need to take a step back and ask ourselves, what is it that we want? What's the experience we're looking for? And then the people we're inviting, what's going on in their world and what are they
Starting point is 00:33:16 capable of? And then of course, if they decide that they're not able or willing, that it's not this huge, like, you're not my friend, you're a bad friend. And it's like, no, let's- Right. If you want to go spend a week in Cabo, that's amazing, but not everyone can do that. So it could also be like, okay, but we can also just do brunch on Saturday. If you can't make it to Cabo, we can go to brunch. And just understanding that that's not, I think there's like a mentality, right? Like this is all about me all the time. That's not. And hopefully a lot of us will get to adulthood and understand that, but knowing like, you know, making sacrifices for other people, I don't know. Like, I think it's like, you have to show up in the way that you can.
Starting point is 00:33:58 And I think that is true with both new friends and old friends. I feel like I took us off on a little tangent there, but I obviously had some thoughts on it and we're running out of time. Crazy enough. Danielle, anything I didn't ask you as it relates to making new friends that you just would want to, you know, throw out and have our listeners be thinking about. I would say don't put so much pressure on yourself. When you meet somebody and you know, like, oh, I'd like to hang out with them again. Also tell them that. I think that too many times we get in our head, we get worried that like, well, they're not going to want to hang out with
Starting point is 00:34:33 me or, oh, just make the plan. Ask the question, ask, say, do you want to go grab a cup of coffee? And if they say no, not right now, also follow up again. It's not like a one and done thing. And I will say I have friends, right? Like we've tried to get together a whole bunch of times and it took a really long time for it to happen. And now they're one of those people that's just like in your back pocket of like, hey, you want to go grab, you want to go grab dinner and they were 10 and all of a sudden your best friend appeared and then you just did everything together because you were together all the time. Like that's not how it works. We all do have very busy lives. And so you have to make the effort to do those things and not always be the person that cancels. Sometimes you got to go. And so making the effort and really putting that in is important because then that's how you show somebody that you're willing to show up for them. And that's how they're going to be willing to show up for you. So I think one, don't get to, you know, don't put more pressure on it than it needs to be, but to do the work to really create that relationship. Yeah. Well said. If you are listening and want to learn more about Danielle and her work, or if you're just looking for somebody who's going to fall in love with you instantly, go to her website, daniellemacombs.com. I love that about you.
Starting point is 00:35:55 Or catch her and her friend on the Opposite of Small Talk podcast. Thank you, Danielle, for being here and talking friendship. I loved it. Thank you so much, Nicole. Okay, friends, it's time to go make some new friends and make sure you love on the ones you already have, who've seen you through many, or maybe even just a few seasons of your life. Because I believe there's no better thing to be, no greater success, no better achievement than being and having a great friend. I'll leave you with a funny but accurate quote. Friends may come and go like waves in the ocean, but the true ones stick like an octopus to your face. Good one, right? That's a great one. And if you're a regular listener, you know, I always close out with some version of this is woman's work. So here's a
Starting point is 00:36:42 closing I never thought I'd say. Be and find your octopus. And that is woman's work.

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