This Is Woman's Work with Nicole Kalil - 190 / Friends As Soulmates

Episode Date: February 14, 2024

I’m hijacking Valentine’s Day to celebrate our soulmates, specifically the ones that come in the form of friends. The older I get, the more I value friendship. I mean, these are the great love stories we should be talking about, right? And that’s what we’re going to do. I’ve invited three of my soulmates to join me on the show so we can talk about this great love – its value, what works and what doesn’t, and why we all need it.  Here’s what I know with absolute certainty, your FRIENDSHIPS matter at least as much as romantic love does. I’d argue, possibly more. Because it’s your friends that will go into the forest or the desert or wherever you might be lost and find you, and bring you home. Friends are the family you choose. Celebrate them, today on Valentine’s Day, sure. But EVERY day is better. Connect With Our Guests: Find and follow Kim Andrade, one of the very best leadership coaches I know, on LinkedIn!  For individual and organizational coaching, which includes an amazing self-awareness and development tool, you can find Lynn Casaletto and her team at Core Growth Consulting. Your premier talent partner, Forbes endorsed Claire Myers Consulting, led by the incomparable Claire Myers can also be found on LinkedIn.  Like what you heard? Please rate and review  Thanks to our This Is Woman’s Work Sponsor: Whether you are hiring your 1st employee or are looking for your 1,000th, have one role to fill or one hundred, reach out to Claire Myers Consulting! Your premier talent partner, CMC will work with you to find the next qualified candidate for your open position. They source, screen, interview, and manage the selection process for any role in the organization. Mention this podcast and get a FREE 15 minute hiring consultation call AND 10% off your first placement!

Every leader or business owner I've ever worked with says one of the hardest parts of running a business is finding great employees. It comes up all the time in my coaching conversations and many, many businesses are not large enough to have a full-time recruiter that's actually good at finding and selecting talent. Claire Myers Consulting is the premier talent partner to collaborate with your growing business to find your next most qualified candidate for your open position. They source, screen, interview, and manage the selection process for any role in many, many industries. If you need to recruit a single individual or scale your team by a hundred, Claire Myers Consulting is there to support you every step of the way.

To find your next best team member, visit clarimeyersconsulting.com forward slash T-I-W-W and mention this podcast to get a free 15-minute hiring consultation plus 10% off your first placement. I am Nicole Kalil, and if you're listening to this episode on its release day, then it's Valentine's Day, which is officially my least favorite holiday. My typical move is to ignore it because I hated it when I was young and dating. Too much pressure, and I read into what any gift or gesture actually meant, like the color of flowers was some sort of secret hidden message. Or did it mean something awful that he didn't send me flowers, even though I told him not to? I really, really hated it when I was young and single because nothing made me more aware of being lonely than this holiday.

I hated it when Jay and I started dating and I hate it even today for all the same reasons and many more. Our tradition, by the way, is to make pizza and hang out on the couch, which is exactly what I want to do on any day that I hate. On This Is Woman's work, my strategy has been to ignore and avoid and give the death stare to anyone who hints at this as a potential topic. And I have a really epically good death stare, by the way. You'll notice we've covered romantic love a few times, but in summer or fall and decidedly nowhere near February. We did do an episode on divorce one February, probably because I was annoyed, but we recently did an episode on romantic love with the Ariel Ford, where she said something about soulmates that just stuck with me. Episode 163,

if you want to hear it yourself. She basically confirmed that we can and possibly should have more than one soulmate, because a soulmate is anyone or anything that gives you the experience of coming home, who you can be completely yourself with and who demonstrates love as a behavior and a choice, not just a feeling. I'm grateful that I have that with Jay. And I think most of us who have children feel that way with them. And I know my pug Ove is also my soulmate. But what really stuck with me is if that is in fact the definition of a soulmate, then I've had soulmates all of my life. Only once romantically, but several times in friendship.

So I'm hijacking the holiday to celebrate our soulmates, specifically the ones that come in the form of friends. The older I get, the more I value friendship. I mean, these are the great love stories we should be talking about, right? And that's what we're going to do. I've invited three of my soulmates to join me on the show so we can talk about this great love, its value, what works and what doesn't, and why we all need it. Because while a life or a stage of life without romantic love might be challenging,

a life or a stage of life without friends is devastating. Before we dive into all of that, let me introduce our guests, these incredible loves of my life, these women I get to call friends. In the interest of time,, these women I get to call friends. In the interest of time, I'm going to attempt to keep it brief, but please know that I could fill multiple episodes telling you all the ways these women impress and inspire me. We're going to go oldest to newest. Notice I did not say oldest to youngest. Oldest friend is Kim Andrade.

She's been my friend since high school. She's seen me through all of it. From heartbreak to mean girls, running a business to raising kids, from the best moments to the most embarrassing ones, when life is good and when it's been painfully messy, Kim has been there. A former HR executive turned leadership coach, Kim is as smart as they come, will hop on a six-hour flight to spend 24 hours with you, is a truth teller and someone who would not only help me hide the body should the need arise, she'd assume they deserved it. She's also

been my longtime example of being career-driven while also being a great mom. And I adore her husband and kids like they're my own family, because they are. They're the family I chose before I created my own. Lynn Casaletto makes her third appearance on the podcast. She was one of my very first guests. She hosted the episode where Jay and I talked about our relationship, and she's here today because she started as a same-stage friend, meaning that she was somebody that I could commiserate with on the challenges of running a coaching business, and she evolved into a blanket fort friend, a safe space where I can be myself and bring all the bent or sometimes broken pieces, and I know she'll treat them with the same care and love and

appreciation as she does the polished ones. Owner of Core Growth Consulting, Lynn deeply understands and cares about her clients. I know this to be true because she coached Jay for many, many years and because she asks the best questions and somehow always finds a way to share messages and resources exactly when you need to hear them. And Clara Myers Vitale, who I knew in name and reputation before, but only recently built a friendship with. I'd say that she's all heart, but that's not true. She's so much more, but she leads with her heart in everything she does. From running her large Forbes endorsed recruiting firm, Claire Myers Consulting, and leading her team, to being a foster parent and soon to be adoptive parent to children and also to dogs. I marvel at the size

and depth of her heart constantly. Younger than me, she brings energy and is always up for a long walk or hike, which I will gladly go on with her anytime for the conversation more than the exercise because spending time with her is like coming home. A warm, comfortable, loving home with wine and snacks, which is my favorite kind of home. The worst thing that I can say about these

soulmates of mine is that they all live in California. So spending time together is tough, but we make it happen because we prioritize it. So now that I've introduced them, let's talk friendship. I have this belief that there is no one person who can or should meet all of our needs. So collecting different friends for different reasons at different seasons and all of that is of vital importance. So Lynn, I'm going to start with you. I'm sorry, I'm laughing because I see you cry. No pressure. I'm going to start with you. Let me ask you, what type of friend you think you are and what are a few of the qualities that must exist for somebody to be or become your friend? I am the friend that you want to call when you just landed your dream job, when you just found out you're pregnant, when you just got to

have a green light to adopt the baby girl who has been yours since day three of her life, when you find out you just sold your business. And I'm also the friend that you call when you just did something so freaking stupid or when you really screwed up or when you feel so embarrassed or when you're so freaking mad and hurt and you just need to cry or be so freaking petty and judgmental and all get like all the darkness out because there is no judgment. Um, there is only love. So I am the friend that you call when the highs are really high or the lows are really low and anything in between. Um, and I think that's where I know you're my true friend when I can do the same and not feel judged. I can come in all my glory and I can also come when I'm unraveled in all of my messiness. I really look for trust in a friend and just acceptance and the more I experience life and the deeper my friendships get, the one thing that I really appreciate is when I feel like our great friends ask us questions

and they help us get to our own truth. Instead of just showing up and giving suggestions, they just help us work through the noise, the fear, and they ask us questions that we really need to be asking ourselves. It reminds me of a quote that I saw recently that says, the only place I'm interested in leading people is back to themselves. And I think that that is a great quote that aligns with everything that you're saying. Couldn't agree more. And I love that sort of definition of friendship. Our appreciation or the value of having, and I'm going to say not just friendships, but friendships with other women has grown and evolved as we've gotten older. So Kim, how has how you valued your friendships, specifically with other women, changed as you've gotten older and of course wiser

yes so as my priorities have evolved as a person over the years what and how I value friendships has definitely shifted my needs are different now than when I was in my 20s and 30s and how and what I can contribute to the friendships has changed and I'm very honest about that. I'm also a very loyal person and I'm an over-accommodator. So I easily feel guilty if I'm not, know in air quotes a good friend so now I value a friend who really gets me and supports me regardless of what how I'm showing up the good the bad the ugly and is there when I need them. I personally, I value loyalty and honesty in my friendships. I, I want you to tell me what I need to hear. Well, not what I want to hear, but what I need to hear. And I really value friends who challenge and inspire me. I think inspiration right now is really important in my life.

And I want to, I want to surround myself with friends who keep me becoming the best version of myself. Because I'm very, very independent and very resilient. I value the friendships that frankly don't need a lot of coddling. It's just the reality. It's the truth. And lastly, I really value the friends that know all my weaknesses and they love me anyway. Amen for that, for all of us, right? I mean, yeah.

Okay. We talk about red flags a lot in dating. And I wish we as women paid more attention to those red flags and didn't think of them as like cool orange drapey things or whatever we try to lie to ourselves about. What about red flags in friendship? Claire, what do you think are some of the red flags we should be keeping an eye out on when it comes to friends? I think you could look at it in two ways. So there's the external factors. What are you, what do you look for in the other person? So a major red flag to me is someone who talks shit all the time. Mean girl status is just not, you know, hey, there's a there's a level of like venting sometimes when it comes to friendships, but I'm talking about the person who their sole

purpose and what they're bringing to the conversation is talking badly about other people, specifically women is a complete turnoff for me. The second one is, if you see them turn into a different person with others, so if they're with you, and they're one person, and they're happy go lucky, and all the things, and then you see them out at a soccer practice, or PTA meeting, or in a professional setting, and they either ignore you, or they're completely different person, you know, who are you getting? What is, who is the authentic person and are they actually being authentic with you? And then the other one that I feel like externally that you can watch out for is somebody who goes through a lot of friends and not, not in a genuine way. I'm talking about like, oh, well, they were my friend, but we haven't talked for a couple of years and I probably won't ever talk to them again.

It's really figuring out who's going to drain your energy and then who's going to get some gain in that energy. And then there's internal factors, absolutely internal factors. There's a feeling when you're around the wrong people for sure. So bottom line is how easy is that relationship? Think about things like, are you worrying about what you're saying in front of these friends, quote unquote, nobody can see my air quotes, but I'm air quoting. Are you worried about what you're wearing? All of those kind of external things that we all used to be self-conscious about and

probably still are to a degree. I don't have time to be thinking about that at this point in my life. I want to be around people that I can throw up a messy bun or throw a hat on and nobody is going to care. And I don't want to wake up in the morning and think, oh my gosh, did I say something I shouldn't have in front of those people? That doesn't work. So there's a lot of internal factors that you can look at as well. All, I think, phenomenal examples. A lot in there. So when you talked about gossiping, I know you've said this before, it always sticks with me, is if they're talking about everybody else, they're talking about you too, right? 100%. Yeah. You're not the special one that they don't talk about. And I love the point too, of if you're laying awake at night, second guessing everything you say and do with somebody, I'm not saying it's not a healthy relationship or that it's a bad relationship, but it is not what we're talking about here. This is not that deep soulmate friendship. I probably should think a little bit more when I talk about

around you guys. It's like whatever is in my head flies out. And I love being able to do that. And one example, and we've all talked about this, One example that always pops up to me is I need to be able to speak freely because I can't think about, oh my gosh, how did that come across? I think too, there's an element of we're not saying that that means you don't ever say anything wrong or you don't ever hurt a friend's feelings or that you might not have to come back and apologize for something or that you might not lay awake at night thinking about something on occasion. I think, Kim, of an example where we were at a wedding and to make a long story short, I felt like I was experiencing some mean girl

stuff going on and I was just pissed. And when I get pissed in a public environment, I shut down because I don't want to say anything that I regret. Kim being my friend picked up on the fact that I was pissed and she spent probably the entire night wondering what the hell was going on. But the very next morning when I woke up, the very first thing that happened was Kim called me and she's like, are you okay? Did I do something wrong? It was not this lingering question mark thing. It was, let's address this and deal with it head on. I want to know what's going on. And she didn't do anything wrong. I wasn't upset with her. And I was able to say that. This, like this is, this is what was my auto

response in that situation. And I'm sorry if it made you feel bad or that I was mad at you. So just an example of, I agree wholeheartedly with everything you're saying, but I don't want to send the message that that means that when you find your soulmate in friendship or in love or in any, that that means that it's perfect and that we can friendship or in love or in any, that that means it's perfect and that we can all be ourselves all the time. And that means no mistakes and no. Yeah. It's that the mistakes are okay because they know your heart. Just like with a romantic relationship, there's an apology, there's a recognition, then there's an apology, and then there's a forgiveness. And we have to move forward because the person knows who you are and where things are genuinely

coming from. Amen. And you're allowed to slip up. You have to be. Oh my gosh. Every relationship would be doomed from the start if that wasn't allowed, right? Yeah. Lynn, do you think that all friendships are meant to be long-term or some meant for stages? And then how do you know the difference?

And then a follow-up question, if you think about the friends that maybe were there for a season or a stage, does that make that friendship less than or bad or unhealthy in some way? I'm curious your thoughts about long-term relationships versus relationships for stages or seasons. Yes. I think it's and, right? Because it's so clear, like the enduring relationships and the friendships that just continue to just get richer. And you just, I mean, five minutes with them is like, you know, a full day.

And looking back, I think about my really good friend. Her name is Karen. We were really good friends right out of college. And we worked for the same company in Atlanta. And over time, we drifted apart just because of seasons and stages. And she got married. And then I remember when I got married, I didn't invite her to our wedding. She had never known my husband, Craig. And it was just always one of those things where, and I later on, she's like, oh my gosh, you got married. And it was like such a gut punch. So even though it,

because she was so close and like a sister to me and, but I was in a different season of life. So I'm sharing that as an example of, I think I still struggle with the people that I love dearly that came into my life for seasons or stages that if I were to see them on the street, I would like pick them up and hug them so tight. And now life is at a different stage and there's not enough time in the day. Sometimes I think I get hard on myself because there have been so many wonderful, deep friendships, but they're not in this state of life. So I think there's the and of, yes, people come in for seasons and stages, but I know,

I don't know if you guys beat yourself up about that, but sometimes I'm like hard on myself, like, oh, I should be a better friend. I should reach out more. And then I quickly kind of come to my own, maybe wisdom and say, Lynn, just trust. Trust that you are spending time with the right people for the right reasons in this chapter of life and give yourself grace. I also beat myself up and question, am I being a good enough friend? And the friendships that I had during some very pivotal times in my life that shaped me as who I am today. And those friends saw me through those times. And I don't talk to those friends on the daily. I don't talk to them regularly. I don't see them regularly. And there is a bit of guilt

and maybe even nostalgia because they did play such an important part in my life during some really difficult times. And so I do the same. I can relate to that as well. I definitely have the, I need to be a better friend or I wish I were as thoughtful as this person. I am surrounded by such wonderful people and they do these wonderful things. And I'm like, shit, I don't do those things, you know? But what I've kind of come to when the guilty feelings start popping up is replacing guilt with gratitude. So I have a friend like you were talking about Lynn and many friends like what you were talking about, Kim, that were an important part of my life. And I am so grateful they were there in that stage and for that time. And I can't put into words the part

they played in who I am. And I am forever, ever, ever grateful. And we still don't talk. I have to believe they were meant for that time or that stage. And that's wonderful. But for whatever reason, in some cases, there are people that I don't choose to be forever friends with because they're not the right fit for me to be friends with. Like, yeah, something did happen that was tough or bad or we can't overcome. But I think for a lot of those people where the guilt pops up and I go back to gratitude, it's just we evolved in different directions at different times, but that doesn't change the part they played when they played it. Any advice that you have for a friend who isn't acting like a friend or who isn't treating

you well, like gossiping, or I mentioned there are a few people I've just chosen to move on from, um, or being an adult mean girl, which let's be really upfront about is not cool. Being a mean girl in high school is stupid, but being a mean girl as a grown ass adult is fucking ridiculous. But anyway, um, what do you do? Like, how do you know if a friendship is healthy or not? Anybody want to take that? Kim, maybe? Yeah. So I don't remember where or from whom I heard this phrase originally, but I try to follow

my own advice that I actually told my daughter Marina when she was at the age where the mean girl phase was hot and heavy. And that is, how does that friend make you feel? You know, how do they make you feel about yourself when you're spending time with them? Do you feel less than? Do you feel judged? Do you feel safe? And does that friendship ever get weaponized in any way? Like the friendship gets used, it can be used against you in certain situations. And so how you are treated and how you feel in that friendship are pretty accurate gauges for how healthy the friendship is. Of course, Nicole, as you said, we all make mistakes and we go through tough times with friendship. So letting those things that happen not all the time and minor hiccups that you get past, I'm not talking about those,

I'm talking about more on the regular. So what do you do about it? Of course, it depends on the situation and your age and stage, as I like to say. But I believe in honesty and saying things like, this doesn't feel good to me, or I feel left out and I don't want to feel that way. Or I feel judged and I don't want to feel that way. And if that honest sharing doesn't shift the friendship, if there isn't this response of, oh my gosh, I'm so sorry, that's not how I meant to, you know, and you see a shift, then I do believe that putting some distance between you and that other person is the wise thing to do. And invest your energy into other relationships that make you feel good about yourself. And Claire, you talked about that. Are your friendships energizing or are they energy depleting?

And just reflecting on that, you know, oftentimes will tell you what you need to do. It's easier said than done, of course. Always easier said than done. Lynn, anything to add on that? Again, I feel like communication, right? Just honoring yourself and sharing your heart and they can respond or continue to behave in the same way. And then that's probably a really good indicator that you guys aren't aligned, like Kim said earlier, in values and what you really desire from a friendship.

I have a dear friend and she recently, I don't want to say called me on it. It was coming from love. It was like, she was honoring herself and she's like, I need more regular check-ins. I need to know that you're thinking about me. And I, in that moment, I had to honor myself and say, and I am the type of friend that if I don't, if we don't talk for a year, for whatever reason, because you're traveling or this or that, like my hope is that we pick up the phone and we don't miss a beat. Like, you know, my heart. And if I'm in a busy season of life and you don't hear from me, that's because I may be going through my own stuff. So please know that I'm trying to honor myself in the best way. But

I don't know if that sounds confusing. I think it's still confusing for me as a friend when someone asks something of me and I don't know that I'm capable of giving it. So I actually think this is a really good point because yes, we are responsible for communicating our desires and our needs and what hurts and harms us and being truthful. And Kim, to your point, there should be a shift, even if the shift is listening and responding with your truth and your boundaries and whatever. That doesn't mean like, oh, I'm just going to give you exactly what you want whenever you want it. Because it's funny, it's like thoroughly ironic to me, Lynn, that somebody gave you that feedback. Because in my opinion, you are the friend who reaches out, who always,

you know, I'm always aware that you're thinking of me. And I think if that person were friends with me, I'd have to say, if that's part of what's important to you or what you need right now, then with all the love in the world, you're going to need to look to one of your other friends to get it for you because this is how I show up as a friend. This is what you can count on me for. This is how I am happy to meet what you're asking for. But outside of that, that's not me and the way I do friendship either. So how do we navigate through this? How do we

understand and appreciate both of our ways of being friends? I'm thinking out loud. Is that making any sense? Yeah. I think it's so healthy for both of you to have the courage to say, this is what I prefer. And then this is what I knew about myself. Because even since then, there's just been this new level of awareness and a little bit more effort. Just like now that I know that about her, I am in my own way trying to, and nothing over the top, but meet her where she is and also still honor myself. But Nicole, I love that too. Like, you know, I can't, I'm not going to go from 10 to 60 overnight, but I can do a little bit. I would add one thing to that.

And that would be if that was out of character for a close friend of mine that was out of character I I always flip to like empathetic and curiosity mode hey what is has something changed with me or how I show up that's leading you to share that with me or hey tell me more about why. Or I've noticed a shift in you and you've flipped over to mean girls a little. Or, hey, I've noticed this shift and now you're verbalizing it. Help me understand a little bit more. Because many times that's, yes, they're giving you feedback and helping set up a positive relationship. And if it's a sudden shift, to me, it's something going on internally with them.

Good point. Kim, are you going to add something? Yeah, what I would add is being honest when what someone expects of you is not realistic. And Nicole, you mentioned this and you're good about that. And Lynn, you said it's about honoring yourself. And so oftentimes I have found that if we let go of the expectations we have of people for the way we want them to be, the way we want them to show up, if that's not them, you're only going to disappoint yourself. So adjusting those expectations based on the conversation, right? Based on this exchange of like, here's what I'm needing. I can't show up for you

like that right now. Or I'm not the friend that's going to call you every day and, you know, check in on you every weekend or, you know, send a birthday card every year. We joke about that, Nicole. You're like, that's not who I am. Doesn't mean I don't love you. Yeah. I will remember your birthday if Facebook reminds me or like I just, but I mean, if you're going through something tough or like I will drop everything and be there at a moment's notice, but I probably am never going to remember your birthday. Yep. 100%. I fall into that same category. All of you know. Okay. So I think what we're getting at is this belief that I know we all share in our romantic relationships too, which is it's not healthy to expect everything from everyone, which is why

it's so important that yes, we have our soulmates, maybe our forever friends, but maybe to reiterate the importance of having same stage or I'm going to put in air quotes, easy friends, like the people you're just around, work friends. They're not meant to be soulmates. They're not meant to be in your life forever, but they serve a valuable and wonderful purpose, as do you during those stages. So Claire, let me ask you, what are your thoughts about having different friends for different reasons, like mom friends or work friends or old friends or new friends? What's the value of that from the context of we can't expect one person to be everything for us? Yeah. And like I was saying earlier, I mean, you have friends that you call and they make you laugh and that you can be spontaneous with and go out and grab a glass of wine. And you have friends that you can call for a serious conversation and you can also have

friends. And I will argue that all of you are this to me, you have friends that you may not say something directly, but you know, you want specific feedback, or you want them to say something to you. You know that they're going to give you very direct feedback and very direct coaching, if you will, or be a very direct friend when you need it the most. And you seek that out, even though you might not need to. And so I absolutely think having different friends for different reasons. And I think very practically, having friends specifically business-wise, especially if you're an entrepreneur, having friends that serve as your board of advisors in a way, and those friends can develop

into like true deep, deep, deep friendships, which I feel all of us have have done. But they really started as a business as a business, we were business friends. And and it was that phase of life. Now, do I think it's turned into a lot more than that? Yes. But it started as that phase of life type of type of relationship. As you were talking, I thought about something you said earlier about how being curious about what might be going on in somebody's life if they express a need that's out of the norm. And then talking about different friends. I think the reality is we all go through stages and phases of life. And there are times, whether you're in a romantic relationship or not, where you might feel lonelier than others, or where life might feel heavier than

others, or where you might feel like you need more love or nurturing than others, and where you might need more truth telling and like, get your shit together, lady. Yeah, like friend. If you're looking to a friend to give you more of that asking and then giving them the opportunity to respond, but also there's that element of acknowledging I have a need right now. And if this person can't or won't, or isn't the right person to meet it, then it's still my responsibility to go get that need met, whether it's through someone else or something else or giving it to myself. But that, I'm not saying that that's a bad thing. I think it's, it's a, an awareness thing of like, holy crap, I'm at a heavy stage of life right now, which means I need more love.

And these people are giving me the same love they've always given me. And I'm asking them if they're willing to give me more. But if they're not going to, if I'm not still getting what I need, then I need to go figure out how to get it from someone else or something else. Thoughts? Yeah, I think that it goes back to the reasons and situational. I have two friends that whenever something happens in regards to foster care, which is a whole different ballgame, in my my opinion just there's like a whole different

set of emotions as an empath and all the things I have two friends that I every single time I something happens with foster care I voice text them or call them every time and it's because they understand they can't understand in that they go through it but they know the whole story from day one and And they're, they're just the people that I need to, like, some things are so wild that I like have to almost say them out loud to make them real. Cause I'm like, Oh my gosh, did that just happen? Or did that conversation just happen? Like, wow. Um, and I have friends for that. Well, and that's also one of the values of like old friends or longtime friends is you don't have to like provide the context. You don't have to go back to the beginning and be like, again, I know a lot of your audience, I believe, is entrepreneurs and women in business.

And there's sometimes I genuinely do not want to talk about work, the business, the team, not because I don't love all of those things, because I do. I do tremendously. But there are friends in my life that I've had since college that don't, they know what I do. They know I run a recruiting company. That's pretty much it. I don't, we don't talk about work. We don't talk about any of those things. And a lot of the times I'll call them specifically for that situation. Hey, just tell

me about your life. I just want you to talk about you. And that seems to work. I love it. Okay. Are we all introverts? I know Kim is. I'm very much an introvert. Yes. I think I'm on the line. I think my younger self was very extroverted, but the older I get, I think I'm very much on the line. I very much need alone time. Yeah. So in preparation, I was thinking about that and I knew Kim and I was pretty sure about Claire and I was a little unsure with you, Lynn. And what it kept going back to is the human design and how we're similar. And like, I am on the hermit side of introversion and there was an element of that for you too. So anyways, all of that to say, you might be listening and going, okay, I have some

friendships that have run their course, or I have some people that I need to communicate with, or, you know, I want to find myself some of these soulmates or whatever the case may be. I'm leading to this thing of making and finding new friends, which is freaking hard when you're an adult. And I think maybe I'm making this up, but it feels extra hard when you're introverted or so my question is any tips for making new friends as an adult uh claire oh my goodness it's so hard to meet friends as an adult so hard so let's just throw that on the table right now but my knee jerk to that is kind of the most obvious is meet people doing the things you like to do. One example of that is business.

And so your business friends slash entrepreneur friends, if you own a business, there's a level of understanding and an already common theme that you can have there. And some of my closest friends fall into that category. There's community, right? Are you on a board? Are you normally people on boards are typically pretty like-minded or are you volunteering at an organization and friends are popping up from that because of your common love for something?

School parents, right? That's a pretty common one. So that to me is how you meet friends. I think then it's how to foster the relationship and continue to keep them as friends and determine who's going to be kind of a longer term friend versus who's just the person that you see in a meeting or see when you're volunteering or see at a school event that you say hi to. And keeping friends, I think is all about being genuine, showing up as the same person every time, good, bad or ugly, right? Good, bad, or I guess in the middle. Making sure again, I'm going with my 2024 theme, which is ease, right?

Making sure it's not hard. There just should not be a time where you are around people that you just meet or that you've known for 10 years that it should be hard. And so being really intentional about that in your mind. Being vulnerable. Closest friends that I have, and I would probably argue that most of us have, have been able to have really vulnerable, honest conversations. Once we got to know each other, the wall has been broken down. And if somebody breaks down their wall for me, I,

I can do it for them. But somebody has got to do that typically first. And you know, you know, when you meet that person that you can have a really honest conversation. I mean, Nicole, before we knew each other, we were on a call and I will never forget this moment. It was one of your confidence building webinars. And you asked, what do you know to be true about yourself? And this was years ago. And I said, I know I'm going to be a mom.

And I remember I didn't say that because we were in a group. I said that because of you. And that was before we were actually really close friends. Like I already knew that you were somebody that I could be really vulnerable with. And then I think you keep friends by staying really curious. So thanks, Lynn, because that's one of your big things. I think staying really curious is what is going to keep and build friends. So meet them by doing things that you love and keep them by doing all the other things. All great advice. I have two thoughts that popped in my head. If you're introverted like me, like extremely, and you're like, but I don't like doing things. So how would I meet people? You like doing things, maybe reading books. There are book clubs or puzzle clubs

or things like that. So let's not buy into our own bullshit. We do like doing things and we can figure out a way to meet other people who like doing those things. And it sort of reminds me of participating in things like I'm calling it for myself a hive mind, whether that's a study group or a mastermind or a retreat, whatever, doing something that gets in your schedule that's designed to pull you out of your day-to-day and your environment and the distractions and all the shit you got to do and throws you in a space and a place with like-minded or similar stage people. I've met some of the most wonderful people in that way. And I think specifically for the four of us, we, close growing relationships individually, but when we have been able to

get together physically, it took everything to a completely different, deeper, lasting. It's hard to feel like you're coming home to somebody over a Zoom call. There's something about being in person. So I want to close us out by asking, and each of you can weigh in if you'd like, but I suggested that having deep friendship is like having a soulmate. That feeling of coming home. What does that mean for each of you? To me, I feel like our deepest friendships that are our soulmates and the loves of our lives, Nicole, like you said in the beginning, there is something about being in sweats with a messy bun and no makeup, or there's just this, like, I just want to hug you. I want to hug you and thank you.

And if I need to cry with you, if I need to laugh with you, if I need to go for a walk, whatever it is, it's so much less about thinking and so much more about feeling and just being, just being together. I think of like when we're together, I don't know why this visual popped in my head, but I know I've had this feeling. It's like, I don't want to sit in the same room as you. I don't want to sit on the couch with you. I literally want to sit in one corner of the couch, like cuddled up. Like I want to fucking sit on the same chair as you. I know that's weird, but that's just how it's

supposed to be. And we're going to be curled up and there's going to be fucking snacks and drinks and I'm going to be on top of you. And that's soulmate to me. I'm going to sit in your lap. I love it so much. Yes. And braid my hair, please. Play with my hair. Braid my hair. That is part of, I feel like a little girl. Like there is, when I am with you guys, when I am with the soulmates, I am back to my younger, like inner child. There is something so free and beautiful and playful and liberating. What I can say a soulmate friend is I'm going to go back to like the way it makes me feel. And so spending time with or talking with that person, I feel safe. And then after we've spent that time together, I usually say my cup is full. Soulmates fill the soul. They do. So whether that's a romantic relationship or a friendship, walking away or being there and your soul being full is the feeling.

And from an external perspective in my own life, I will tell you, my husband will say, if I'm having a hard time or grappling with a decision or feeling like the weight of the world is on my shoulders, which we all have been there for various reasons, he'll actually say, I think you need some Lynn time, or I think you need some girl business group time or and he calls it that because that's how he names it. Or I think you need. I think you need some Emma and Jenny time, which are our neighbors, and we're all super close. And he'll kind of push me to do that, because he knows that I'll come back and my cup will be full. I'm sure there's probably a small selfish reason in there too. I'm like, I'm like, you don't vent to me about this stuff.

He's like, that's not my area. Yeah, totally. But, but he's like, Hey, I think you need some. These people time because he knows by name, the people who do fill my cup. And who fill my soul. All right. Thank you to each of you for the gift that I treasure beyond what I could ever possibly put into words, your friendship. My gratitude is literally endless.

And if you're listening and want to learn more about these fucking magical humans and their genius, we'll put all the ways to find them in show notes, but you can find and follow Kim Andrade, who is among the very best leadership coaches I know on LinkedIn. Lynn Casaletto, executive business coach, yes, but making you a better human coach can be found at coregrowthconsulting.com. And if you're even thinking about hiring an employee and looking for a talent to grow your team, visit ClaireMyersConsulting.com and mention this podcast and you'll get 10% off your first placement, which is a huge fucking deal. Okay.

So my friends, happy love day, which we can celebrate every day because you are loved every single day. Maybe it's romantic love. Maybe it's not. Either way, I'd submit to you that we are all wired for connection. We all have different needs and desires that require different people to meet them. There are potential soulmates everywhere. You'll know when you find them because it'll feel like coming home. And here's what I know with absolute certainty, and there's not a lot I know

with absolute certainty, your friendships matter at least as much as romantic love does. I'd argue possibly more because it's your friends that will go into the forest or the desert or wherever you might be lost and find you and bring you home. Friends are the family you choose and being friends with other women is necessary. It's life-giving. We're meant to be a community for each other. We're meant to trust and hold and love on each other. So collect your Blanket Fort friends, your Front Row friends, your Hide the Body friends, your Let's Do It friends, your encouragers, your truth-tellers, your funny people, your mom friends, your work friends, all the friends, and be grateful that some of them will be your forever

friends. Celebrate them today on Valentine's Day, sure, but every day is better. Be and have great friends. That is woman's work.