This Is Woman's Work with Nicole Kalil - How To Get What You Want with Jenny Wood | 293

Episode Date: March 24, 2025

Getting what you want isn’t just about setting goals—it’s about taking risks, embracing fear, and stepping into uncertainty with courage. It requires trusting yourself, being okay with setbacks, and pushing forward even when people don’t understand or support you. Today’s guest, Jenny Wood, has built a career helping people go after what they want boldly and unapologetically. A former Google executive, career strategist, and author of Wild Courage: Go After What You Want and Get It, Jenny founded Own Your Career, one of Google’s largest career development programs. Her insights on personal growth, leadership, and career success have been featured in Harvard Business Review, Entrepreneur, Inc., The New York Times, and Forbes. She’s here to talk about what it really takes to stop waiting and start getting what you want. In This Episode, We Cover:  ✅ The 9 power traits that help you take action and achieve your goals ✅ How to build wild courage and make bold moves in your career and life ✅ Overcoming fear, self-doubt, and external resistance ✅ Why overthinking keeps you stuck—and how to break free ✅ The mindset shifts that turn aspirations into reality You don’t need permission—just a decision. Say YES to the things that matter, say NO to what doesn’t, and keep moving forward. The magic happens in the messy, uncertain, doubt-filled space where fear tells you to stop—so go there anyway. Connect with Jenny Wood:  Website: https://itsjennywood.com/  Book: https://itsjennywood.com/book  Sign Up For Jenny’s Newsletter: https://itsjennywood.com/newsletter  Free Downloadable Resources: https://itsjennywood.com/free  Related Podcast Episodes: How To Cultivate Audacity with Anne Marie Anderson | 276 How To Build Courage with Dr. Margie Warrell | 273 How To Chase Your Dream with Broadway's Mandy Gonzalez | 281 Share the Love: If you found this episode insightful, please share it with a friend, tag us on social media, and leave a review on your favorite podcast platform! 🔗 Subscribe & Review: Apple Podcasts | Spotify | Amazon Music

I'm Nicole Kahlil, your host of the This Is Women's Work podcast. And today we're going to make sure you know what you need to know to get whatever it is that you truly want. Because friend, I want you to get whatever that is. But if it were easy, we'd already have it, right? So for every one of us, I feel like there are internal and external, known and unknown, obvious and not so obvious things that are getting in our way. It could be money, it could be mindset, it could be lack of clarity or maybe lack of

confidence. Maybe you don't have the support that you need, or maybe you haven't given people the opportunity to support you. There are so many possibilities, but here's what I know to be true based on my experience. Worrying, overthinking, and obsessing has never gotten me what I want. Neither has being apologetic, overly cautious, or caring about what everybody thinks about what I want, or how I'm going about getting it.

Waiting for permission has never worked, and neither has people pleasing. Because getting what you want requires risk, and therefore lots of courage. It requires you to trust yourself and be okay with the fact that some people won't approve, appreciate, or even understand. And some plans won't work, some people won't approve, appreciate, or even understand. And some plans won't work, some people won't support, and sometimes you'll want to give up. And if all of that sounds terrifying, well then good, because being able to wade into that scary place is the difference maker between wanting something and getting it.

It's in that space, the messy, uncertain, doubt-filled space that fear tells you to avoid at all costs where the magic actually happens. It's in that space, the messy, uncertain, doubt-filled space that fear tells you to avoid at all costs where the magic actually happens. Yes, you do have to know what you want and why you want it, but most importantly, you have to be willing to go for it, even when the outcome isn't guaranteed. And while I've learned these lessons through my own experiences and mostly through trial and error and lots of mistakes, today's guest has built a career helping people figure out

not only how to go after what they want, but also how to actually get it, boldly, unapologetically, and with what she calls wild courage. Jenny Wood is a former executive at Google, a wife and mom, a private pilot, a daily hiker, an improv student, a tap dancer, and a zucchini bread connoisseur. In 2021, she started a passion project within Google called Own Your Career, which grew

to one of the largest career development programs in Google's history. Jenny's writing has been featured in Harvard Business Review, Entrepreneur Inc., The New York Times, and Forbes, and she's the author of Wild Courage. Go after what you want and get it. Jenny, thank you for being here. I want to make sure our listeners don't just get inspired, but also have practical and tangible actions that they can take to actually get what they want. I'm going to kick us off by asking, what are the most effective tools for getting what you want? Nicole, it's a pleasure to be here.

The most effective tools for asking what you want are, first of all, recognizing that you are not always going to get it. I want to emphasize that there is a mindset shift that needs to happen first, that you will fail sometimes. You will fail sometimes, and that is okay. The mindset shift is a critical first step. And then after you have that mindset shift, a great tool to use is something I call Play to Win, W-I-N-N, what I need now. Because with so much change and no matter what company you're in, there's a good

chance that you've had a reorg this year, or maybe your company is even doing layoffs, or maybe you're excited to switch to a new role. Playing to win means understanding the changing dynamics and asking for what you want and not being shy. So let's say, for example, your company did layoffs and you are all of a sudden doing the role of three people. Your responsibilities have tripled, but you have no additional income. You haven't gotten a raise. You haven't gotten a promotion. You have the same title. Playing to win is putting together a couple

slides and going to your boss or your boss's boss and asking for a career development conversation, helping them see the value that you're driving for the company and asking for that to be compensated in a fair way. There's a story from this session singer, Claire Tory, a session singer, someone who's just hired as part of, not part of the band, but this was Pink Floyd's session singer, just this kind of freelance singer who came in and she ended up singing these legendary vocals on this Pink Floyd song. And the she collected like her 30 pound fee, right and went home like like peanuts. And then that album became like multi platinum.atinum. And Tori was like, wait a second, this does not seem appropriate. What I want, what I need is to be fairly compensated

for what created an incredible song for Pink Floyd. And so she went back to them and she said, I want a songwriting credit. And she just improvised these like, just vocals, no words, improvised, but it's really what made the song. And she went back to them, she said, I want a song writing credit and I want X amount of money.

And she sued them. And they were smart to think, well, what do I need now as Pink Floyd? And the smart move there was to settle out of court for an undisclosed sum of money that I'm guessing was pretty significant. So when the circumstances changed, right, in her cases, she did this song and it ended up going multi-platinum. In her case, once she realized that her circumstances had changed and she realized what I need now is more money and a credit. And so when your circumstances change, whether it's a reord or a layoff or some headwind, it takes courage to ask for what you want.

But that's how you get it. Yeah. It's really interesting. It's almost, I don't know, counterintuitive or a paradox or something like that. This idea that the way that you get what you want is a shift in mindset of going into it knowing that there's the possibility you won't get it. It's like this into it knowing that there's the possibility you won't get it, right? It's like this law of detachment type thing where it's like you have to sort of disconnect from the idea that it's all going to go smoothly, that you're going to get what you want easily or right away. I think of it as like wading into the muck because everything we want lives on the other side of it. And that's the part that I think is really hard for us to wrap our head around this sort of counterintuitive thing that we have to, in order to get what

we want, we have to be willing to let go of the idea that we're going to get it. Isn't that weird? Yeah. And I also personally struggle living in the muck. So like you're going into the muck, but to me it's creating clarity through the muck. Definitive information, and maybe this is just the economics major, the analyst in me, I was in an operations role for nearly 18 years at Google. To me, maybe it's just that analytical left-brained tendency I have, which is I just want an answer, even if the answer is no. So there's almost to me calmness in the definitive.

And then going into the muck is what allows me to get to that place of calm with a clear yes or a clear no. Like I really, I have, I'd say anxiety with a cat with a lowercase a. Really where I struggle is in the indecision, in the second guessing, in the living in fear, in the living in uncertainty, living, you know, with the idea of failure. But then once I can get to that place and it's like, okay, I failed, that almost gives me an unusual calm, which might be unique. I think it's unique, but I also think it's something that we hear about a lot,

especially in business or sales. I think about it in sales, there was an expression that we used to say all the time, which is, no is my second favorite answer. Obviously I want the yes, but no is my second favorite answer because it's the maybes that kill you, right? It's like the indecisiveness,

the person who's stringing you on, like that stuff will make you lose it all together. Whereas as you said, the no's, at least you have a definitive answer. And part of, I believe part of achieving what you want or success in any sense of the word is being willing to collect no's. You've got to collect a bunch of no's to get to the yeses, but I'm with you. I just want an answer.

That answer. It's the maybes and the indecisiveness that I think kills us the most. Yeah, I understand. Yes. Okay. I know in doing my research that you identify nine power traits. I think some of them might be surprising, but nine power traits that help us get what we want. Can you dive into what the nine are?

And maybe let's pick a few and talk a little bit about that. Yeah. So the nine traits are weird, selfish, shameless, nosy, obsessed, manipulative. That's a spicy one. Brutal, reckless, and bossy. And these traits all at first glance raise eyebrows, right? But I feel that they create the bars of an invisible cage that keeps you small. And for all of you listening, I want you to stop playing small and start playing smart. And if used in a sane and savvy way, these can supercharge your success, they can supercharge your opportunities, they can

supercharge your future. And of course, they're all it's reclaimed language, right? It's we don't want I don't actually want people to be manipulative with the intention of harming yourself or others. But I do want you to build influence through empathy and craft lasting relationships. So we can definitely dive into manipulative. I think that's probably the edgiest one. And as I wrote this book, I thought, I might get canceled the day this book comes out. But maybe not. And so far, people are responding really well to them. Or reckless, right? Reckless is simply air on the side of action and take healthy risks. Brutal is drawing lines and sticking to them and embracing the power of no,

being brutal about your calendar and recognizing that desire to people please, which plagues so, so many of us. Selfish is be your own champion, right? And that's, I think, a helpful one for us to keep in mind every day. The example I gave with Claire Tory from Pink Floyd, like she was being selfish, right? She was saying, hey, I need to stand up for what I need. I need to be my own champion. Pink Floyd's not going to come running to me being like, you know, we thought about this more and since it has gone multi-platinum, you probably deserve more than 30 pounds for this song. That's just become a global phenomenon. But she had to stand up for herself

and be a little bit selfish, or this could be as simple as, yes, it's 2.50 and my kids are getting out of school, but I wanna go to that yoga class because I am not going to be able to be the kind of mom I wanna be during dinnertime and bedtime tonight if I don't go take 55 minutes for myself and regroup. So that can be selfish also.

And that is not just okay. It's smart. Yeah. Well, I am a big fan of reclaiming and reframing words, especially words that have been misused and misinterpreted for so long. And what I love about your nine power traits is all of them are words that I think especially as women, we've sort of been taught to avoid. And you know, I love this idea of recapturing them, reframing them in a way that works and

helps us get what we want. So you're right, manipulative can be a really hard one. It's interesting though that that you honed in on that one because I use that a lot. Because if you look at the definition, there's at least one version of the word manipulate, or one definition of the word manipulate that is... I think of it as the artist's way, right?

The artist manipulates clay or paint or whatever to create this beautiful thing. The word in and of itself is not necessarily negative. So, let's dive into that a little bit more. You gave a quick example there, but what are some of the ways that we can use manipulation as a power tool and a positive tool to get what we want. Yeah, so at the end of the day, we're all manipulating all day long.

Manipulating to me is just the courage to seek influence over others. And when we open our mouths, we oftentimes want something to happen, right? You're opening your mouth and you hope that the words that come out encourage your listeners to gain something from the episode or maybe tell a friend about the episode. I'm talking, also hoping to help people, but also hoping that people will go check out the book, right? Like,

everyone's got an agenda and it's okay to have an agenda. You can also be a good person and build meaningful relationships. Or one example of an agenda I had where I was being a little crafty, right? If we're talking artistry, I was being a bit of an artist is when I was first starting out writing this book, I was going to Austin for work travel and Vanessa Van Enwerds, who's just this amazing author that I am so impressed by. She lived in Austin and I said,

Hey, Vanessa, it would be so great. We'd never met, but someone had connected us. It'd be so great to meet up for coffee when I'm in Austin. And she said, oh my gosh, I told her the dates I was gonna be there. She's like, oh, such a bummer. I'm out of town, those exact same dates. I happen to be leaving the day that you come in.

And I said, well, what time does your flight leave? Maybe we could meet up at the airport for coffee. And she said, I get in at three and I was like, perfect. Sorry, I'm leaving. I'm departing at three. And I was like, perfect, I land at one. That is perfect time to grab coffee. But I wasn't landing at one. I was like, perfect. I landed one. That is perfect time to grab coffee. But I wasn't landing at one.

I was landing at four or five PM. So when I said that like, sure, a white lie, liar, liar, pants on fire. But for 60 bucks, I changed my flight. She didn't have to be the wiser. I didn't have to include her and how the sausage was being made on the back end. I didn't want her to feel extra burden

if she had to flip her flight or something that I'd gone through all this trouble. So did I manipulate that situation to make it a very smooth way to meet her and build that relationship and now we're friends in an easy breezy way? Yeah, and there's no harm in that. But I think the vast majority of people would not have changed their flight, would not have manipulated that situation in a way that would ultimately be productive for them, their future and their future opportunities and relationships. So all good examples.

That to me is just, like you said, sane and savvy, right? If I have this opportunity and there are small tweaks that I can make to have it happen, somebody else doesn't need to know all the details. You just make it work, right? Like you manipulate the circumstances so that it works out as a win-win for everybody involved. Totally. And it was a win-win. And we can also talk about a specific tool that is useful at work. There's a tool I call Fluent in Influence, which is really about

360 degree management. You've heard of Managing up, and this is really beyond managing up to your boss. This is what I call managing higher, managing diagonally and managing outside. So managing higher is when was the last time you met with your boss's boss, right? If you work at a big corporation, chances are that's encouraged in this day and age to keep your manager in the loop,

but every six months, set up 30 minutes with your boss's boss and let them know what you're working on or get nosy, right? That's another power trait and ask them, what are their most important priorities and how you could maybe help add talent to them, right? What and how questions are always great. Best kind of nosy is a what and how question. So that's manage higher.

Manage diagonally is build a relationship with your boss's peers, right? So if you think about an org chart up above you is your boss and then to the right or left are their peers. So that's managed diagonally. Find an opportunity to present in a leads meeting where you'll be able to expose your project for some amount of time to your boss's peers

and ask for feedback. And then rather than when promotion time comes around, you're scrambling trying to make sure everybody knows your name because promotions at big companies or medium companies are often decided by committee, not unilaterally, everybody knows what you're up to. And manage outside is,

it's never a bad idea to build relationships outside your company, even if you are the happiest camper ever. And this is frankly something I never did in 18 years. I had this awesome boss and he said, you should have at least one or two meetings with somebody outside the organization, sorry, outside of your company, outside of Google.

It's just good to pressure test. Do you still wanna be a Google? What's going on outside? What kind of comp might be available outside? Does that make you psych to still be a Google or does that make you think, huh, I've been here a long time and I've never thought about what the outside world looks like? Which can be very common when you get insularly focused in your current company. So that's manage higher,

manage diagonally and manage outside. It's how you become fluent in influence. And I consider all of this healthy manipulation. Okay. So let's talk about weird. I just love that one. Yeah. It reminds me, we had a guest on a few months back, maybe about a year ago actually now, on her book is called Good Awkward. And it's this idea of, you know, being fully and totally authentically you, but also the power of the awkward moments and the things that we do that

are a little quirky and all of that. So I don't know if that ties into Weird, but what do you see as a power trait behind Weird? Yeah. So Weird is win as you or lose as who, Nicole, because we're just trying to follow along and be like everybody else and sit quietly and blending in with the masses, you're just not gonna get noticed. So weird could be as simple as playing it hot and playing it hot is sitting in the front row in your VP's 200 person town hall

when your company has that offsite or diplomatically disagreeing with your boss or it could also be putting a document together company has that offsite or diplomatically disagreeing with your boss. Or it could also be putting a document together and putting your picture and your name at the top or your name and your title so that if that document gets floated around the company, people know where to find you. It's it's making your mark. It's having your voice heard. It's not just nodding along.

It's being the first to ask a question if something comes to you and not thinking, oh, nobody would really think this is a good question. Right. It's just it's being the first to ask a question if something comes to you and not thinking, oh, nobody would really think this is a good question, right? It's just, it's being bold. Being weird is about being bold. And being weird isn't like saying something outlandish. Okay, so here, can I also talk about trait traps with all of these traits? And trait traps are when you take this, the trait too far.

So, you know, for example, obsess is push, perform, persist. It's not about grinding yourself into a pulp and burning out. So a trait trap in weird is be your best self, like be yourself, but be your best self. So let's, let's roll it back to seventh grade, Jenny. And I was new to the school first day of school. Uh, my teacher, Ms. Howard said, does anybody have any questions? The first period language arts first day of school, my teacher, Miss Howard said, does anybody have any questions?

The first period language arts, first day of seventh grade. And I raised my hand desperate for a laugh, completely insecure. And the question I asked in front of my entire 30 something person class was, I have a question, Miss Howard, are you a virgin? That is not the word we're looking for. Yeah, that's not the word we're looking for. Not the word we're looking for, not the word we're looking for at work. I was mortified, nobody laughed. We're not going for shock factor like I was trying to and failed to that day. Sometimes it's just being memorably used.

So one of the best resumes I ever got was from this person named Carly. And the 50 resumes in my stack, hers really stood out because she had this line at the bottom that said, in constant pursuit of the perfect oatmeal raisin cookie recipe. And within that one sentence, she told me that she was weird, right? Like she was authentically being her. She was obsessed, right?

She like wanted to find the best. She was nosy. She was curious about like which one this would be. And she was just like revealing an authentic piece of her. And then of course, when I interviewed her and she had all the skills, but sort of all the other people I was interviewing, but then the personality like that pop of color matched when she interviewed with me, the person on the resume. So, you know, it's just how do you stand out in a way that sets you apart? I love the idea of this trait trap, right?

Because there is though, you can take it too far when you're doing it just for the sake of doing it or trying to push the envelope. I often think of it as bumper bowling, right? There are guard rails on either side, right? You can't be too far this way or not enough this way, but there's a lot of room to play in between. But the trait trap, make sure you don't end up in the gutter. Yeah, by the way, we decided to call these trait traps

at the end, they were called guardrails for about two years. Oh my gosh, how fun. So we're spot on. Okay, good. My next question is about this idea, this concept of getting what we want. I sometimes wonder if the reason we feel

like we don't get what we want, or we don't get what we want or we don't have what we want is because we've been socialized and sort of conditioned to always want more. Right? And so where does celebration or appreciation come into play when it comes to getting what you want? So let me give an example. Let's say I want to accomplish this big thing. There are lots of steps between where I am and accomplishing the big thing.

And I've found from my experience that it's important to acknowledge, appreciate, and celebrate the little milestone moments along the way. Because if you don't, if you're always on to the next and never, it's like you never actually get the satisfaction or the feeling of getting what you want even when you get it. Am I making any sense? And what are your thoughts on this? You are making so much sense. And this, this plagues me. Like this is, this is really hard for me because I am a high achiever. I am a go getter. I am type A, I am a let's do it. Nothing is too big. Let's make those impossible dreams likely.

But then being a person like that, and my guess is that with your success, you already articulated it, you feel this also sometimes. It isn't this is a trait trap. I mean, this is this is what I would call is the juice worth the squeeze. And I talk about this research by Swarthmore Professor Barry Schwartz. And by the way, if you have never seen his Ted Talk, The Paradox of Choice, I think it is the best 17, 18 minute Ted Talk out there. So he has this other research about maximizers and satisfizers. Maximizers want more, more, more, and we'll put in every ounce of effort to achieve that, that thing. Satisfizers tend to be kind of like, okay, good enough. And the research suggests that while maximizers get slightly

more of what they want in life, they are less happy. And so satisfizers get a slightly less optimized outcome. So maybe slightly less of what they want to get in life, but they are happier. And so, you always have to think about that trade-off of where are you on that spectrum? Like I'm an absolute maximizer and I need to remind myself to rein it in

and to think about what can I satisfy today, right? Not every project has to be a 10 out of 10. In fact, some projects should be a three out of 10 because otherwise I'm not prioritizing appropriately and I just have to be a satisficer on certain projects. So then my follow-up question is sort of this, okay, knowing what you want and having clarity around that I think is important to getting what you want, right?

You have to know what it is that you're trying to accomplish. But how important is it to know why you want it? And the reason I ask is that sometimes I've found myself wanting things or striving for things because I see other people doing them, or I thought I was, and I put an air quote, supposed to, or I got caught up in somebody else's thoughts or opinions or journey.

And I guess my question is, how important is it when we think about what it is that we want for us to do some reflection and thinking about why it is that we want it, or what the experience is that we're looking for or how badly we really want it. How important is that part? It's really important.

And this also falls into is the juice worth the squeeze, because no professional effort is worth depleting your physical or your mental reserve. So don't proceed unless you're confident that it deserves your bandwidth and that you have the bandwidth to spare, right? So I am caught up in one right now. I so badly, deeply want this book

to hit the New York Times bestseller list. And Nicole, it's kind of a shitty goal, okay? Like, I know you've got the explicit rating on your podcast, so I'm gonna say it's a shitty goal. And it's a total mind fuck And it's a total mind fuck. It's a total mind fuck. It is a total mind fuck. It's a fuck.

It's an editorialized list. And there's a lot, a ton of rhyme or reason for, why you do or do not get on. And the volume of US hardcover books you have to sell to get on it is just like gargantuan and potentially not even realistic for me as a debut author with some, you know, 50,000 person newsletter list, 87,000 people in LinkedIn, but like we're talking to like people with millions and millions of followers who are more likely to get it. So I'm really like pushing a giant boulder up a very, very steep hill. And

I'm always asking myself like, why do I want this? And it's really two parts. It is part ego. It would feel really good. And I recognize that, like, yeah, I want to be a New York Times bestseller. And there's nothing else for the ego part. There's nothing else behind it for me. Like, it's just for that side of it. It's just, I want it. I love superlatives. I want to be the best. And like this might make me sound, you know, selfish or shameless or right or obsessed or weird, but honest, honest, right? Like, I just want it. And, and that's the ego part is like, yeah, I would love to have that label. Think about the labels for all of you listening, like the label, the PhD or the, you know, or the MBA or the VP or the promotion or whatever level it is that you're trying to get to

or whatever number it is that you want to earn each year. Sometimes you just want it. And by the way, I think sometimes that's okay. It's just being honest with yourself. And then for me, aside from the ego, there's the business side of it. There's a very practical application where if I do hit the New York Times,

I can charge X thousands of dollars more per speaking gig. And that means that now that I've left Google to basically speak and do corporate training I can charge X thousands of dollars more per speaking gig. And that means that now that I've left Google to basically speak and do corporate training and workshops full-time, which requires a lot of being on a plane, it means that rather than as the breadwinner to pay the mortgage and all of our family's expenses, I need to do 40% fewer trips on a plane each year

to make the money my family needs to make to live. Because in New York Times, bestselling author would command a higher speaking fee or consulting fee. And that is a very practical application that is better for my kids. My son is nine, my daughter is seven. They have a lot of needs of mommy right now. And so there's a practical application as well. So to me, it's part ego and part business sense. And what I have to constantly do is ask myself, which one is taking over? Does this feel more ego today

or does it feel more practical today? Jenny, and interrogate, interrogate those theories, right? Like, well, and I can get real caught up in my story, Nicole, real caught up in my story. Well, the only way that I could be on a plane 40% less of the time is if I hit the New York times, well, then I talked to amazing mentors like Kim Scott, who wrote radical candor and she's like, Jenny, you can have a thriving business

as an author speaker consultant trainer without ever getting remotely close to the New York times. And she encouraged me that I will probably be that anyway, because I've got a lot of drive and I've got a good buck. I really do believe in this book. I'm so proud of it. And so then you have to interrogate that story that you're telling yourself to see is it true? Is it useful? Is it productive? But it's tricky. And I have a little sticky note on my monitor that says I'm holding the New York Times lightly, meaning sure, I can want it because I can't not want it. I can't change who I am.

I can't change how my brain is wired, but I can hold it lightly, like holding a pine cone in your hand and not letting it stick you with the pricklies, right? Just like holding it lightly. Yes, I love that concept of holding it lightly. My last question is around the title of your book. So obviously our episode is about how to get what you want, which is the subtitle of your book. So obviously our episode is about how to get what you want,

which is the subtitle of your book, but your title is Wild Courage. What does wild courage mean and why is it so important to getting what we want? Yeah, wild courage is A, believing that you deserve something. Like this even goes back to your last question is like, sometimes it's okay to just say like,

it's okay to want something, right? Even if, especially for women who oftentimes don't see them in the leadership position or oftentimes don't see them as like, if you look at the New York Times bestsellers every 10 each week, like it's not a ton of women on there and it's okay to want to get there. So wild courage is saying, yes, I deserve this. Yes, I can achieve this. Wild courage is asking to lead the project when you're not necessarily the leader on the team. Mild courage is asking to help out with the project, even if you're not part of the team. So wild courage is taking it that next step.

And the wild piece to me is like, these words are kind of wild, manipulative, selfish, shameless, reckless, like those words all to me instill a bit of a, wow, this feels uncomfortable. This feels a little bit wild. And the courage piece is that it does take confidence. It does take what I would call a little healthy chutzpah. take the ability to settle into your own abilities and to believe deeply in yourself and what you're able to accomplish if you put your mind to it and get over that fear of people pleasing and fear failure and fear of uncertainty. So that to me is wild courage. Yeah. All right. Well, to help you get what you want

and also to help Jenny get what she wants, go and get the book, Wild Courage. You can order it on Amazon or anywhere you buy books. Let's keep those local bookstores in business. So start there. Jenny, thank you so much for being a guest. And also, I forgot to mention the website is itsjenniewood.com and there

are a handful of free downloadable resources as well as more information on the book on her website. Jenny, thank you so much for being our guest and for helping us get what we want. Thanks so much, Nicole. And thank you to all of you listening. Thank you for giving us an opportunity to contribute to your goals. Absolutely. All right.

Here's the thing about going after what you want. It is not for the faint of heart. It's not easy. It's not always pretty. And it's not guaranteed to work the first or even 10th time that you try. So get clear on what it is that you want and honest about why you want it. Take the risk, embrace the messy, the scary and the uncertain. And remember, even when the path is hard, even when others don't get it, and even when you doubt yourself, it's not mild courage, it's wild courage that changes lives, especially your own. So here is your invitation, not permission because you don't need that from me or anyone else, but your invitation to step up and step out. Let go of the overthinking and stop listening to

the voices that say that you can't. Say yes to the big things that matter and no to the small things that don't. Celebrate your wins, learn from your mistakes, and above all, keep going. One foot in front of the other toward what you want most. Because getting what you want? Well, that is absolutely woman's work.