This Is Woman's Work with Nicole Kalil - You Only Die Once with Jodi Wellman | 262

Starting point is 00:00:00 I'm Nicole Kalil, and I believe that the very best things in my life, the things that I love the most and am most proud of, were created by or stemmed from rejection. I also believe that my life's work, my understanding of my purpose, was created through pain. Everything I've ever wanted and achieved has required me to step through my fear, and I know that everything I desire today that I haven't received or generated yet lives on the other side of even more fear. I also believe that it's really easy to see that and say that now because of the benefit of hindsight. Because I know for sure that when I was experiencing those rejections, the pain and all that fear, I hated every second of it.

Starting point is 00:00:58 It fucking sucks. It has always sucked and it still sucks today because friend, I still get rejected, experience pain and feel fear. And yet every single one of those moments of suck has created the opportunity for something better for me. And in many cases with the benefit of hindsight, I can see all of those things very differently. I see how often I cared more that somebody actually had the audacity to reject me than I ever cared about the person doing the rejecting. I cared more about what people might think. I added embarrassment and shame into the mix, which made whatever pain

Starting point is 00:01:38 I was feeling even greater. I was afraid of fear. I turned it into a sign that I wasn't ready or some sort of cosmic message that I wasn't supposed to take this risk or chase that dream. I was so afraid of fear that I forgot about regret. And I let my fears and doubts kill more of my dreams than failure ever could. Ridiculous, right? But I don't think I'm the only person who holds on harder to rejection, pain, and fear than I do to the learning opportunity and growth that can come from it. I don't think I'm the only person who gets so stuck in their feelings that they forget that courage and confidence are always available options to choose instead. So on this episode of This Is Woman's Work, we're going to talk about fear and rejection and more importantly, how we face it, how we move through it, how we conquer it. Because I believe that everything we want lives on the other side of it and we need to build and cross bridges to get there. I've invited Jodi Wellman to join us. Like me, Jodi is a former corporate executive turned

Starting point is 00:02:45 executive coach. She has a master's in applied positive psychology from the University of Pennsylvania, where she is an instructor in the master's program and a trainer in the world renowned Penn Resilience Program. She is the author of You Only Die Once, has an inspirational TEDx talk on how death can bring you back to life, and is the owner of 4,000 Mondays, where she is in the business of making sure people live and die happy. Jodi, I feel so weird that I want and can't wait to dive into a conversation about fear, rejection, and even death, but I am. So let me start by asking you why you focus so much on death in your work and what it can teach us about living.

Starting point is 00:03:33 Well, first of all, I love your whole intro. And I'm with you about saying it does seem a little counterintuitive that talking about the Grim Reaper and fear, like the almighty F word, can be motivating, but I swear it is. So I have come to realize through research and personal experience and then working with clients that it is really only by focusing on the fact that we are temporary, that we're finite and it's all super shitty. But by doing that work, that's the very thing that can heighten our sense of urgency, our appreciation for the lives that we get to live. And it puts everything in the right kind of perspective. So we are inclined to take life for granted and just keep thinking we're going to have more time to do these things later. You know, basically kind of push fear back a little bit because we

Starting point is 00:04:26 think we'll do it later. But when we do the math and count, for example, how much time we have left, that's the thing that can wake us up. And so it has real benefit that we don't want to think about or talk about, but we're going to do it now. Okay. You talked about doing the math and doing my research, I realized that that's what 4,000 Mondays is about. So tell us a little bit about that. Yes. 4,000 weeks is roughly all we get in this one life we got to live right now. So with women, we luckily get a little bit more time.

Starting point is 00:04:55 We're roughly getting 83 years compared to men at 78. So score for us. But roughly, you know, on average, it's like 4,000 Mondays. And I want us to keep that in mind because even though it sounds admittedly like focusing on scarcity, and actually the science behind it is called temporal scarcity. It's this idea that like whenever we see an asset that it is temporary or it's rare or limited time only, like a pumpkin spice latte. We tend to take it so much more serious when we realize, oh, this is not going to be around forever. And so as much as it sounds dour to be focusing on the fact, wow, we only have this much time left, unfortunately,

Starting point is 00:05:35 that's the spark plugs we need in order to actually get on with things because otherwise we will drag it out. I think, I mean, that makes sense to my logical brain. And you said that you learned about this both from research and personal experience. Can you maybe start a little bit with the personal experience? I know your mom and her death really brought some of this home for you. So it sounds weird. I wouldn't love to hear about your mom's death. I would love to hear about what you learned from it. I get you. And I would love to share about my mom's death for the purposes of the lessons. Yes, I get you. And well, my mom died when she was 58 and the passing was obviously crappy earlier than expected, but it was not

Starting point is 00:06:19 even so much that, that for me was the most profound part. It was that cleaning up after her. So she had this apartment and she just kept a ton of stuff. And it was this land of dormant intentions. So she died with so many dreams and hopes and goals that she did nothing with. So coulda, shoulda, wouldas is what I call them. And admittedly, it was more than just, oh, that's too bad. Here's another manuscript or here's another short story or here's another business idea that she didn't do anything about. That would be sad. But like most things in life, like, you know, the things that startle us are the things

Starting point is 00:06:55 that we see in ourselves. And I know my inclinations. Like I am a chicken shit. I'm afraid of failure and rejection and spiders, maybe in that order. I don't know. Depends on the day. And I do, I, I recognized, am I going to be the woman dying? Hopefully not early, but with my whole list of coulda, shoulda, wouldas. And I could see myself going down that path because I have lofty dreams and ambitions, but I recognized that I didn't have as much of the courage and confidence to execute. So that for me was a real wake up about not just the scarcity of time, but the,

Starting point is 00:07:33 oh, I do not want to die with regrets. It just to me would be just the worst fear ever. It feels to a certain extent like fear is being passed down and created in, you know, from generation to generation and maybe even more so to young girls and to, you know, future women. I feel like we live in a world where everybody's pointing out everything we have to be afraid of. Is this because I, you know, jump on social media every once in a while or watch the news or is this actually happening? Yeah. It's a great point about nature versus nurture. There's a role for both, but there is a component where when you're growing up under the careful gaze of, in my case, a mother who was, she was, she was, she had a lot of fears. And so you observe,

Starting point is 00:08:27 but then you also, you take it in. I'll give you a quick example. My mom was deathly afraid that my sister and I would break our necks. Just this random, like, you're going to break your neck. She didn't talk like that, but it sounds like a good mother voice, I guess. And so we were not allowed to learn how to do cartwheels. It was forbidden. And I was not even daring enough to go behind the shed and learn how to do a cartwheel on my own. I didn't even have the balls to do that. I was like, I guess I don't want to break my neck.

Starting point is 00:08:54 So all we did were somersaults, which was very sad. And so to this day, I don't know how to do a cartwheel. But I think we observe implicitly and explicitly what our role models do. And fear is passed down. It is potentially insidious and it means we need to override that default setting. Some of us have to do it far more deliberately than others. And so some of us need the scare of, you know, a dying mother who we recognize we don't want to end up like. And I'm going to be honest, like that is it's a bit of a sad tale, right? To have a cautionary tale of like, I don't want to end up like you.

Starting point is 00:09:33 It's like having a bad boss and learning when you become a leader. Here's how I don't want to be when I'm leading. But it's all poignant. I mean, it's all lessons learned, which we can grow from. So, yeah, that was a very vivid example in my childhood of if you don't send the manuscript out, you won't get rejected. And that's a safer way to live. But is it really a way to live?

Starting point is 00:09:54 Yeah. What I'm hearing is, you know, first, I agree completely is people learn most and best by experience and observation. And for those that are listening that have kids, our kids are watching whether we know it or not to the decisions we make or the risks we don't take or the dreams we don't chase or the conversations we don't have. And that sort of ingrained fear so many of us have. And even if you don't have kids, you probably have younger siblings that you care about or mentees or just people who are paying attention. And I don't think we should move through our fear for the sake of others. We should do it for ourselves,

Starting point is 00:10:36 but sometimes that's just the motivation we need, right? I think you're so right. Yeah. There's this whole idea around like living a life worth living requires courage. And I wish it didn't, but it does. So it's to pursue anything that feels new and exciting is often going to be, you know, like whether it's to sign up for the sketch class, your sketches are going to look stupid and that's going to maybe stop you from going. Well, that's going to require a little bit of courage to go and do. And so are you the person in your life that is demonstrating I'm willing to go out with this growth mindset and like be an idiot on the ice for a while if I'm learning how to skate

Starting point is 00:11:08 or to go and try Toastmasters and flub my lines for a while or to go and do the thing. We do set examples for people around us. We do set examples for our team if we're a leader and even just as a friend and as a sister and as someone, like, I think we can be the motivating force for other people to say, I want to live on purpose too. Like, I want to be the one who goes out and tries to learn Spanish, even though my brain doesn't work that way to try and learn new languages, so we can inspire other people. And for some of us that are not that, let's say we're super scared, sometimes having the excuse of doing it just so my daughter or son doesn't grow up to be a chicken shit also, that's enough. And I will

Starting point is 00:11:50 say ride that wave all the way to the sketch class. Yeah. I'm with you. I'm like, whatever gets me to do the right best thing. I often say to myself, what would I want JJ, my daughter, to do in this situation? Because I only ever want the best for her. And I wish I felt that way automatically about myself, but for whatever reason, putting it in that context can help. Now, I want to talk about regret. But before I do, I just want to get your sense on this. I think we hear expressions like, you know, live as if you're, if it's your last day. And I'm like, okay, if it were my last day, I would take all my money, fly all my friends and family to Italy, you know, drink all the wine. We can't, I like this concept,

Starting point is 00:12:40 but something about it falls a little short for me. So when you talk about, you know, we only have so much time left, how do we like live with that? Yeah, practically. Right. And not like draining the bank account or like going on a hedonistic binge. Yeah. Let's do it in small doses. Right. Right. Absolutely. Yeah. That, that question to me is annoying because it doesn't elicit usable ways to live moving forward. I agree. And I even think that the exercise of like a year left to live, Oh, I would drain the bank account in that time too. You know, like we're not, that's not, I think it could be mildly instructive if it helps us to go. All I would do would be to spend time with people I love. Well, then that might mean honey bunny, like social is way more important to you than anything else. And so are you doing enough of that in your life

Starting point is 00:13:27 right now? But realistically speaking, I am more of a fan of the good old fashioned deathbed regret exercise. And we've all heard it and done it, right? What if tonight was the night, sorry about your luck, but you are reclined and you are at the end, it's been a good life, but you're looking back on your life and inevitably we have things that we would feel pangs of about. And I want to be very clear because regrets fall into a couple of camps. And let's not talk today or ever about regrets of commission. Those are the regrets about things that we did that we wished we hadn't. That is water under the bridge. Most of us can already rationalize that we wished we hadn't cheated or bullied or gotten the DUI, whatever it is. That is not what we're here to discuss.

Starting point is 00:14:16 It's the more insidious regrets of omission that are the paths we didn't take, that we always wanted to do, like maybe going back to school or changing our career? Or what if we did move to London? Or what if we did make up with our friend from college? Or what if we did all the things, like try to learn how to do the triathlon? Those coulda, shoulda, wouldas are the things that eat away at us, especially during our older age and then on the proverbial deathbed. And my exercise is what would be the list of tiny little things, big things that you'd wished you'd done? And by the way, can I just get nosy right now and even ask, like, is there something that would stand out to you that you would wish you didn't you didn't make time for or just didn't do? were the realization that even though I am an introvert, I use it as a justification for

Starting point is 00:15:27 not spending as much time with the people I love, not putting myself out there to make new friends and create new relationships. And so I think that that's something that I am working on, but still could be a big regret. And then when you said, you know, move to London, it's funny. I've always wanted to live in another country, even just for a period of time, you know, six months or a year. And the story I make up right now is like, I can't do that. I have a child in elementary school. It'd be unfair to move her again. My husband's job is here. He's not really mobile. And so that would be a regret. Yeah. And there are also the things that I think I do to talk myself out of it. I like how you're onto yourself. This is, of course, what you do. You're onto the stories.

Starting point is 00:16:20 Sometimes there are valid reasons we don't do things. But back to your, like the things you already know to be true about yourself about, you'd wished you'd have that feeling of, I wished I had connected more, been more social. By the way, there's other regret research, which is interesting, that regrets can filter into different categories. And one of the categories is the connection category. Because a lot of people near the end do feel that wistfulness of like, oh, I let my friendships go, or I didn't go and do some more of those social things. By the way, I am an introvert also. And yet I also know that I never regret going and doing the thing with a friend

Starting point is 00:16:53 or doing something. I come home feeling like, I did it, you know, but come out. So that would be a connection regret for you. And then there's also like the experience, like opportunity regrets of like the adventure of living in another country that sounds like is an important value of yours. There are also boldness regrets, which is where I come in. And it's this germane to our conversation today about fear and overcoming it. It's many people feel like they'd wish that they had taken more risks and been gutsier to maybe apply for the big job or to try their hand at a new business, whatever the thing is, it requires some bravery. And so knowing and recognizing the thing that you would regret,

Starting point is 00:17:33 obviously the good news is we're not on our deathbeds. So these are, I call them, I know it's corny, but I call them pre-grets. These are regrets in the making. So, well, holy shit, there's still time, you know? And so for some things, that's our opportunity to evaluate and be like, I could go and book that trip, for example. Or I could, in your case, find like, what would be an example of someone I could just say, put in the schedule for July the 7th. Good. We're going to go for brunch. And then that way you're like, good. Not only do you have something to look forward to, but July 7th is going to feel pretty good, even though, well, if you're anything like me, you're going to wish you hadn't made the plans the morning of July 7th. And then you're

Starting point is 00:18:11 going to go and then feel glad you went. Do you feel like that? So social connection and working out fall in the exact same category for me. I loathe it. I don't want to do it. I convinced myself that there are many reasons why I could get out of it. Then I do it. I don't want to do it. I convinced myself that there are many reasons why I could get out of it. Then I do it and I'm so glad I did it and I feel great. And then like, you know, four hours later, I forget and start the whole cycle over again. Totally. I think we were twins separated at birth. I totally get you. And so much of this comes down to like the regret question can be useful at every moment in our lives. It's like, would I, the question about whether or not to go to do the workout, for example, or to go

Starting point is 00:18:50 to do the thing with a friend is would I regret going or would I regret not going? And like the, the, the best part of ourselves does know the answer. It's like, I guess I would regret not going. And then you just, you go. And my litmus, like the thing I do that admittedly is a little bit of that cattle prod for me is like, life is fucking short. Like, is this the life you want to live? Do you want to get to the end and feel like you didn't participate? And believe me, I'm not participating in everything that's exhausting to even talk about. No. But judiciously stopping and saying like, I know the dose that is right for me to have social interactions. And I work with other people

Starting point is 00:19:30 in workshops and we're like, what is your right dose for adventure? What is your right dose for learning new things? Because for some people, learning about a new topic is like, that's their oxygen. And it's like, well, what is that for you? Oh, every month I've got to look, okay. Calendaring it. And then you're living a life that feels like life got lived around here versus again. And maybe I'm just driven by that intro. Like I do not want to get to the end with that feeling. Now, the truth is the minute I die, I won't give a shit about anything anyway. But I'm actually more concerned, not about the feeling I'll have at the end about, am I going to give my life a nine out of 10 or whatever the score is? I'm actually more concerned, not about the feeling I'll have at the end about, am I going to give my life a nine out of 10 or whatever the score is? I'm just super concerned about, am I living it today? Like it's all about this experience. I talk about death to animate life today.

Starting point is 00:20:15 And I'm very aware that my tendency might be to play it small in ways. And I just have to like, this is the way to override it. This is the way to say, okay, no, go do the book, the course go, you know, plan the brunch, plan the family fricking reunion, even though that might not feel so hot to plan. But anyway, do the thing because if we don't, will you regret not doing it? The answer is, oh yeah, I think I would. That's, that's, that's the prompt. I, I, you said this, but I'm going to sort of re-say it in a different way. I think for me, one of the things that has really come out is this concept of deeper, but not wider. And what I mean by that, and you said is like, it's not about doing everything, right? So on the friendships or the social interaction side, there are people that I am thoroughly

Starting point is 00:21:07 excited to spend time with. And then there are people that I'm not excited to spend time with. And then there are people that is unknown. And what I realized is I want to really ratchet up spending way more time and being way more conscious and deliberate about the people I really want to spend time with. I want to stop feeling guilt or all the crap about the people I don't want to spend time with. And you know what? Let's give myself a little bit of an opportunity to get some new contacts going. And for me, it was like not about going out more or seeing more people or making more friends. It was about going deeper

Starting point is 00:21:47 into the relationships that matter. Yep. Not wider. And I think that that could be true in business or in travel or in relation. I mean, all the things. What are your thoughts on that? Oh, I have so many thoughts. I'm so excited. Life is funny because we're often just not aware. We have all the answers to the test right in front of us. And if we stop and do the work and say, what is the stuff that lights me up? And we could start with the social domain because you brought up that great example. Holy shit, there are people I know that when I'm around them, I just feel so alive. We laugh. It's such a great time. Then that is the how to maximize and do more of it. If your schedules allow you, we look at other pockets

Starting point is 00:22:29 of life and say like, I just know I come so alive when I'm walking around the block at this time of day. And then, okay, are you doing that then daily? You know, is there something I know that when I am working, there's like working on a strategy for the business and dreaming ahead and doing my mind map. I love it. I get like, how often are you doing that? Is that just a once a year thing or can we do more of it? Identify what lights you up and live a life that is lit on fire by that already. It's like we have so much evidence already. If we just stop and notice and pay attention to those things, do more of those. That to me is the lowest hanging fruit that I think many of us miss because we wrongly think, well, there's got to be something new out there

Starting point is 00:23:08 that I need to find for myself, a new solution, a new way to love my life. But meanwhile, like excavate what's already going well and do more of that. Number one, I think that's crucial. I mean, another opportunity is to diagnose the dead zones. So just as much as it's going to flip on the head, like do more of the stuff that's lighting you up, it's really get clear on what is the stuff that is draining you of energy. And for your example, back to the people thing, see you later. That to me is now an example of life is too short. And I'll just give you a quick example. One of the chapters in my book is about wake up calls. And I'm fascinated by the research around people who've had brushes

Starting point is 00:23:44 with death because holy shit, they know things that we don't. They've seen the light and they know how to live in a way more intentional way. So maybe they are in remission from a diagnosis or maybe they, you know, escaped a really nasty car accident. And they've now, they approach life in a way where they're so clear about the stuff that matters. And more importantly, sometimes they're more clear about the shit that doesn't matter anymore. Like, like, okay, here's an example. There's a woman that I know in Palm Springs, she runs a Shays Warriors. It is a nonprofit for breast cancer survivors. She went through 24 rounds of chemo herself in her own treatment. And while she was there, she kept a journal. She opened up a new fresh page and she drew a circle. She just intuitively had this instinct to, I'm going to draw a circle.

Starting point is 00:24:29 And she said, when I make my way through this, what do I want in my life? Who do I want? What do I want? And she wrote names and she wrote things. And then she said, what do I want outside of the circle? And she wrote names of people that were like toxic relationships and things that she didn't want in her life. And she's held true to that. And I think, I don't want to have to have breast cancer in order to have that wake up call. So this is a lot of the work I do. It's like, guys, let's just use and try and leverage like, what if you just came out of the hospital after your 24th chemo treatment? Or what if you just narrowly escaped death? Or what if maybe just back to the easier route, you counted your Mondays like me and I have 1,817 left and you go, this life is so precious and short. Why am I hanging out with these people who

Starting point is 00:25:15 actually kind of annoy me because all they do is talk about themselves? Or why am I doing this thing at work, which is really draining me because it's not using my strengths or, or, or. And so we have that ability. I think diagnosing where life is feeling flat and using that as the motivation to say, okay, you know what? I am going to pick up maybe my recreation because that feels like I let that go because I was really busy with work. Well, good.

Starting point is 00:25:42 Now you see that and now you know. And what might be one thing you can do to feel more like you're using your leisure time living like you mean it rather than like, oh, I'd get to the end and regret that I kind of didn't do much for fun. Right. Okay. So I'm loving all of this. I love the circle idea, by the way. And I think part of the battle, and I don't know if it's about, but it is the identifying what the regrets are or the pre-grits or what they would be and then deciding to do something about it. But what I've always found is once the knowledge is there, then the next step is I got to do something about it.

Starting point is 00:26:16 And that's like the second that fear and doubt and potential failure and people getting upset and all the things that, you know, we're afraid of show up. Yeah. Any tips about how to navigate through those inevitable feelings to do these things that really matter and that we really want? Totally. Yeah. I think we're going to go on a scale from starting really just soft and gentle into nuclear. Okay. So the soft and gentle is like build the muscle by doing little simple, sweet things that are easy to demonstrate to you that I can prioritize stuff that matters to me in my life. Literally, it could be just the simplest thing. Like if you think I might regret that, um, that I didn't like make like cooler dinners, I just kind of got into the rut of like salmon and broccoli. Well, like, okay. One thing you can do by the end of the week is like use a new spice

Starting point is 00:27:06 in the back of your spice drawer, just to be very basic. But like, that's an example. And then you start showing yourself, I'm the kind of person who, because that's the story we tell you, you refer to stories earlier. It's like, I'm the kind of person who tries new things, or I'm the kind of person who's willing to shake up my routine, or I'm the kind of person who is willing to casually put off saying yes to a lunch date with a friend who just kind of is average up my routine. Or I'm the kind of person who is willing to casually put off saying yes to a lunch date with a friend who just kind of is average in my life. That's the kind of

Starting point is 00:27:30 person. And so you start gradually showing yourself that you could live the kind of life you want to live. And it's just by being small and intentional along the way. Well, and can I say too, I think women have the tendency to undervalue these small steps. And I have found that they are the game changers. Like I always say, how do you climb out Everest? One step at a time, right? And so it's like one foot in front of the other. Take the small things. And I agree, and it aligns with my research on confidence, is it builds trust in ourselves.

Starting point is 00:28:04 Yes. We begin to create proof that we can with the little things and then the little things become bigger and bigger and bigger. And then all of a sudden we're doing the big things and we didn't even really notice it. So I'm on board with you for sure. We're totally aligned. And I even recommend for some people, if you know that you're going to just poo-poo everything along the way, start like a little tiny triumph list.

Starting point is 00:28:26 And I'm a fan of doing this where you just start tracking like little tiny little things that normally you would have overlooked, but like I cooked with saffron or, you know, I, I, I looked at the sunset, even though I would have rather been on the couch or, you know, I went and I walked around the art museum in town, just cause like doing tracking the little things where you're like evidence of a life lived do that it helps to reinforce so that is it I think the second thing is to acknowledge that fear is just going to be a part of it like I think we wait for fear to go away and or we wait for courage to arrive on the silver platter and we all know and you talk about

Starting point is 00:29:00 this like it only comes from doing so that's why I think the building of the muscle is key. It's like gradually start to do things that have higher and higher stakes. Like you might not want to start with the big bold version of quitting your job and opening your Etsy shop on the same day. But you might want to do is just gradually start to do things and say, okay, this feels like a three out of 10 on the shit to my pants scale. And I'm going to do that one and show myself that I can do it. And again, courage is just this, like, it's a resource that starts to grow and you are the one who's fueling it. So that is key. And then the nuclear option, if I just go all the way to the other end of the spectrum is what do you have to lose? And I just want to get aggressive here and say, like,

Starting point is 00:29:43 we are all dying. What are we waiting for? We are waiting for the luxury of someone to hand something. And it is fear. And I see this. I do this. This is personal. This is through everybody I work with. It's that we tell ourselves that we'll have time later to do the thing.

Starting point is 00:29:58 And all we know is we're just being convenient. Just like how you said we can conveniently sometimes use introversion to put something on. We conveniently say, oh, I'm busy. Or I'll do that when I retire. And it's a bunch of bullshit. Because all we're doing is letting fear win. And if we say to ourselves, I might not even have 1,817 Mondays left.

Starting point is 00:30:18 I might, like, joke could be on me tomorrow. And do I want that to be my story? Is that I put off all these cool things that I thought would make my life feel pretty astonishing? No. And so that's the key almost. It's like, we need constant reminders because we will habituate. Life is too short to not do the stuff that you long to do. You're worth too much more than that. Yeah. It reminds me of a meme that I love that says, the second you decide to do anything that matters, fear will show up, nod, and keep walking. And there's almost an expectation of it.

Starting point is 00:30:56 I'm not saying I like fear or that I enjoy it any more than I used to, but I've begun to expect it as a sign that I'm up to something big, something that matters. Yes. So I mean, whether it's the smallest thing or the nuclear option, I think all of those are great for all of us. And I cannot believe that we are out of time. Jodi, thank you so much for your great work in our conversation today. And I know people are going to want to learn more about you. So 4000mondays.com is Jodi's website. And the book is You Only Die Once. You can buy it on Amazon or wherever you buy books. But yes, we have got to set aside some of the fear in order to do what we want and not live lives where we look back with so many regrets. Thank you, Jodi. Oh, love it. Thank you, Nicole. Okay. As Jodi says, we are all dying. We are all temporary. And rather than being depressed about that, we have other options available to us.

Starting point is 00:31:58 We can choose courage, kindness to others and to ourselves, purpose and love. We get to choose to create regret-free lives. We get to choose to let go of the things that just don't matter at the end of the day. The weight of other people's opinions, the worry about rejection, the fear of failure, the shoulda, coulda, wouldas. We get to remember that regret is much scarier than all of those things anyway. And we regret the things that we don't do more than the things that we do. There's a quote that I love that says something like, when I stand before God, I want to be able to say that I used all the gifts that I was given, that I have not a bit of talent or love left, that I used it all up. What I love

Starting point is 00:32:43 about that quote is it reminds us to live, to love, and to give it all away. I don't know about you, but that feels like woman's work to me.

This Is Woman's Work with Nicole Kalil - You Only Die Once with Jodi Wellman | 262

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